PHLY Philadelphia Eagles Podcast - Jalen Hurts Gets STRONG DEFENSE From Former Eagles QBs Coach Scot Loeffler | PHLY Eagles Podcast

Episode Date: May 18, 2026

Has the narrative around Jalen Hurts already flipped this offseason? Former Eagles QBs coach Scot Loeffler defended Hurts in a story by Dave Briggs of The Toledo Blade, calling Hurts “a super coachable, championship-type of guy.” Briggs’ story comes a week or so after ESPN’s Jeremy Fowler reported Hurts has been receptive to new offensive coordinator Sean Mannion’s system during OTAs as well. Bo Wulf and EJ Smith discuss the latest Hurts news and go through the Eagles depth chart to compare this year’s team to last year’s going into training camp. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hello, everyone. Welcome to the P.H.O.Y. Eagles podcast on a sweaty Monday, live from the Xfinity Mobile studio and presented by Ashley Bull Wolf, E.J. Smith. And we're here. Now, here's the deal. Not yet, not less than an hour ago. E.J. and I arrive at the studio. Lindsay's there. And we get there and we hear some, we hear some sirens, some alarms blaring. Lindsay's out front. The whole building is out front. There's a fire alarm going on.

The fire truck comes down the street and we go, all right, got to get home. Got to show to do it at 2 o'clock. It's not going to happen in the studio. So E.J. gets in his car and he's going, Lord knows how fast, 140 miles an hour just to get home.

No, no, no, don't incriminate me. In time. And he pulled in about four minutes ago just in time for this dynamic episode that we can't wait to do. How are you, E.J.? I'm doing great. I just had a nice two-hour jaunt around the Chester County, Delaware County area, and then the greater Philadelphia region. And I'm excited for the show.

I'm excited to have some Eagles chats with you. And yeah, looking forward to it. I need to say, I need to shout out my wife early in the early in the show because I called her. I was like, I'm on my way home. I'm getting home like four minutes before the show starts. And I get home, I got an iced vanilla latte and some apple slices. Like, I mean, lucky guy. Lucky guy. Yeah.

And Lindsay said that Mr. Lindsay was home as well. She got no such treatment. So Julia is just significant other mocking him. Yeah, Julia wins the power rankings today. I think that that's fair to say. Wow. What a guy. Would you have done the same for her?

I mean, I make Julia coffee every single day. So I think it's yeah, I would make her the coffee at least if she asked for the apple slices. I'd do that. But you wouldn't anticipate her needs. Yeah, you know, sometimes that's a thing. It's like you got to know, you know, it's not just doing it. It's knowing that it needs to get done. So you're right.

I got to be better. There you go. All right. Let's get into it today. The A block, as it were, EJ, starting with a little bit of an interesting article from Dave Briggs. Dave Briggs covering his conversation with Scott Leffler last year's quarterback's coach. And you tell me what kind of impassioned defense Scott Leffler gave for Jalen Hertz,

who was so kind as to post an Instagram picture of the two of them together. Yeah. So Scott Leffler talking to Dave Briggs of the Toledo Blade. Shout out to Dave, I enjoyed the story. Scott Leffler on his time with the Eagles said, I love the people, really loved working with Jalen Hertz and the rest of the quarterbacks. We've got a great relationship still to this day,

and I wish him nothing but the best. He's a super coachable championship type of guy, and being able to work with him for a year was awesome. He's a champion in every aspect of the word. He's a hardworking, smart, and he's a great competitor. So pretty strong defense of Jalen Hertz, and I'm sure Scott Leffler is aware

of some of the conversations, both internally and externally about Jalen Hertz. And I do, I find this quote very interesting on a multitude of levels. And yeah, I think it's going to, I think I will tell you the first thing I want to say before we get into this quote, which is I know some people will say like, oh, well, he's talking to a reporter. Like, of course he's going to say nice things about Jalen Hertz.

I've been in these types of settings where you're interviewing a coach like by yourself. You know, it's just like a one-on-one with a person and it's a profile. I think if Scott Leffler didn't feel this way, he could have said something else. and he could have just said off the record or I don't really want that to be in the story like he had off ramps instead of just saying like Jalen's great this isn't like he's at like a press conference

and there's a bunch of cameras in his face and he has to say the right thing. You know what I mean? I think you're more right than wrong but I don't think that you are 100%. I think there's listen we weren't there I'm going to trust the writer to

represent it accurately but there is a world where he is saying this and he doesn't fully believe it sure there's definitely a world but again like i he doesn't have to say this if he had said this like at a press conference at his next job and you know he's like you know really enjoyed working with jalen he's a you know competitor ultimate champion player like whatever if he had said that i would have said like sure yeah like that's just what what else is he going to say but i don't know this is a profile about like what's going on in scott leifler's life he doesn't have to answer

a question about he don't look at all scott life or what's going on in his left and it's Scott with one T. How would you, is that SCOT? I love how much you enjoyed that. I guess I should have known you were going to enjoy that that much. Scoat Loeffler. No, I think it's Scott. We're off the rails early then. No, but I do think we talked about last year that there was a red flag. it was s co t i'm i'm no longer in the game but telling people how to spell their names yes dan is he

close to scot him you said it not me um you want to hear my next my next thought when i saw this quote yes yes okay so i wonder how has got leftler not the eagles quarterback's coach anymore No, we can't keep doing this. My thought is that this does show you. All right, I'm going to reset. Loopy Monday. I love it. I only have myself to blame, too.

This was my doing. All right. We good? No. I like the idea if we start having a really good conversation about this. somebody's going to clip it and you're just going to be crying. Why is that guy crying? All right.

So my second takeaway from it, I think it is very telling that Jalen Hertz has lost some influence in the in the building. The like the fact that Scott Leffler is no longer his quarterback's coach, I think shows you that. We're not that far removed from a world where the Eagles were hiring Brian Johnson as a quarterback's coach. And I think it's overstated to say Brian Johnson's relationship with Jalen Hertz is the only reason he got that job. But at the same time, like, you know, having a good, even Doug Nussmeyer, like, had a good relationship with Jalen Hertz before, before he took that quarterback's coach job. So for them to, like, have Scott Leffler in the building, have Jalen and him, clearly have a very

strong relationship and choose Parks Frazier over him as a quarterback's coach, to me does tell you a lot. You know, if it was a Sean Mannion, you know, a coach that had worked with Sean Mannion or had worked in a McVeigh-Shannahan system extensively at quarterbacks coach, like if it was Greg Olson at Greg Olson, I would have said, okay, yeah, sure, that makes sense that they went with somebody who's familiar with the scheme. But for it to be Parks Frazier to me, that does show you. I think that's a fair point. Yeah, that does show you like how far things have changed since, again, they hired guys like Brian Johnson. And I would even put Doug Nussmeier in that,

in that camp as like somebody who was familiar with Jalen. I think that's fair. The fact that they didn't, you know, it's not, it's not a surprise that Scott Leffler's no longer the quarterbacks coach, but it's a mild, it's at least interesting that it's someone who was in the building, and it's not Scott Leffler. Yeah. I mean, listen, this is all part of the kind of frustrating and very nuanced Jalen Hertz conversation and his standing with the organization.

And it's one where we will talk about Jalen Hertz, and there will be people who say that we hate Jailen Hertz, and we're like, these guys are always so tough on him. And then there's these. same amount of people who are saying that we're simping for him and like this guy is a terrible quarterback, right? The people who think that Jillen Hertz can't run an NFL offense and the Eagles need to replace him, they are wrong.

He's won the Super Bowl. He has been a good quarterback and we have seen that. And the people who think that he can do no wrong and is immune from criticism because he won a Super Bowl are also wrong. Yeah. And I think that you are right. that his influence in the organization and the way the organization feels about him, two things.

Number one, it is not unanimous. And it is why you can have articles being written after last season about how Jillen Hertz is not super coachable and stood in the way of some progress being made with the offense. And then you can have someone on the coaching staff saying the opposite, right? Not everybody in the building feels the same way about Jill and Hertz. It's the same thing in a locker room, which you have talked about, EJ. Like some guys in the corners of the locker room think that Jailen has made huge strides as a leader and has been much more personable. And another handful of guys think that he is unapproachable and not really like one of the guys.

Yeah. So that is number one. Number two, there is no doubt that his like importance in the organization and power and, the degree to which his longevity is penned in has changed. And that is no longer, like three years ago after the first Super Bowl, I think Harry Roseman and Jeffrey Lurie would have thought that Jalen Hertz is going to be here for the next 10 years, something like that. You know, this is our guy.

And I don't think that they, Roseman especially, feels that way right now about Jalen Hertz. I think they are flirting with the idea that if this season doesn't go well, it might not last forever. And that's part of the reason that it is so interesting that they have set up this offense this way, especially in a post-A.J. Brown world, where in theory, we're going to get a lot of answers about J.L.N. Hertz. and I will tell you that my my guess is having been around Jalen Hertz and the fact that he is being sort of publicly and privately questioned like this is I expect him to respond very well to that. I think that is the way that he is wired. And so there is no doubt that the stakes are very high this season for Jalen Hertz and for the Eagles. And I think he's going to respond well.

Yeah, I completely agree. That was going to be my optimistic view of this. And obviously, this is a microcosm into a bigger picture here. But I was just, if you look at Jalen's career, he has always responded well to adversity. And if you talk to people who are close with him, they talk about that. They talk about how he has been so consistent in his response to the down parts of his career. Any, you know, struggles, dating back to his time in college, honestly, probably even dating back to high school, he has been able to respond to adversity. it seems like he plays his best when people doubt him.

And I actually, you know, to get philosophical with you for a minute here, like I think Jalen sometimes hearing him talk when the team has been successful, I think sometimes it's like he almost short circuits when the team is doing really well, you know, because it's kind of like the standard and, you know, the standard only rises, but the only thing that matters is winning. And, you know, he kind of talks himself in circles a lot when they succeed. So, yeah, I do. I think that, you know, the early, like there's,

the ESPN report from Jeremy Fowler last week that Jalen is more receptive, or has been very receptive to, you know, Sean Mannion's new system and, you know, kind of, you know, the changes that will come with that system. And I do. I think that you're starting to see, I think you're starting to see two things with Jalen. The first one being that he is, you know, typically, he knows that he's responding to adversity and doubters both internally and externally. And you're also seeing, you know, like him playing the game more, you know, we've talked about

that, him being a little bit more aware of the discourse around him. So I don't think any of the Scott Leffler stuff has been a coincidence this off season. I mean, I'm sure this story kind of stands on its own. I don't think that Jalen, you know, set up Dave Briggs with Scott Leffler for this story. But I think, you know, that the fact they have that strong relationship and that it's become a public thing now, especially on Jalen's Instagram where he posted it, I don't think that that's a coincidence. I think that that's Jalen again, playing the game a little bit more than he probably would have a few years ago. I also think like, you know, Jalen has lived so much life. Yeah.

As a football player, there have been so many different cycles of Jalen Hertz. He's still, he's not even 28 years old yet. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, there's still a lot of Jailen Hertz's story to be written. Yeah, it's just like me. You know, it's like I'm not even 32 yet. You know, it's like crazy when you think about it.

I'm kidding. The other thing I wanted to say is Jalen's influence, like, I want to make sure I make clear, like, I'm not saying that's right or wrong, you know, like, I think you could probably make an argument that it is wrong. I, that's probably if I had to choose, I'd say the fact that like, the organization has gotten so frustrated with him, it's probably a reflection of the organization just as much as it is Jalen. So I don't want to, yeah, I don't want to sit here and act like, oh my God, like, you know, Jalen is, you know, Jalen is losing influence in the building and this is all his fault. No, I think that this is more just reading the terrain. Oh, I mean,

if we get to a place where the Eagles are parting ways with Jalen Hertz and it's not, you know, in some superstar trade for like an elite quarterback or whatever it is. Yeah. It is going to be a really, really bad reflection on the Eagles organization and their inability to maintain consistency at that position. It will be like a healthy ecosystem for a quarterback. Yeah. Especially do this.

How many times have we heard? like Jalen is the perfect quarterback for Philadelphia because he can deal with that type of stuff. So and I think that that's true. And I think that's why I'm optimistic about how this year will look for Jalen. But yeah, if it does come to that conclusion, it's going to be, you know, contradictory to that to that sentiment. Now how great of a name is the Toledo blade to the Toledo blade? Yeah, that is strong.

It goes hard. It goes hard. Yeah, I'll be honest, I wasn't familiar with the blade. They call themselves the blade. I'm telling the story. Shout out to them. I mean, it was a good story. Yeah.

Now, did you subscribe to the blade? How did you read this article? Yeah, how are you going to ask me that? You're being the feds today. You came on here. Oh, he was driving 140 miles an hour on the Schuylkill Expressway. You were really trying to put me out there. I didn't actually drive on the Scooble.

But you put me out there for speeding. Now you're trying to say that I was, you know, that trying to, what, pirate the yard? I'm just asking you. subscribe. You got to support local journalism. You can, I was talking my wife about our subscriptions last day. What did you do? Did you do that? Did you do that 99 cent for eight weeks deal that you're going to cancel?

Yeah, it's a good deal. Okay. And I mean, I who's to say I'm going to cancel? Maybe I'll keep up with Toledo. That's how they get you. They get that blade. Once the tip of that blade is in, it's never coming out. I don't like that. I don't like that at all. Now they got to, no, you know what? They just got to keep an eye on your subscriptions.

Use one of the many great sponsors that we have for this show to keep an eyeing your subscriptions. Okay. Sage advice from E.J. Smith. I canceled some subscriptions last night. Yeah. What did you cancel? I canceled Netflix because I wanted to get Disney Plus. I canceled my calendar app, which is probably why I was late to that meeting this morning.

I got to get to do a better job with that. And I canceled something I didn't know I had, which is like a sleep tracking app. It's like I didn't know I need I didn't need that. So you know, always got to keep an eye on your subscriptions. You know, it's important. Wow. Netflix, get in the boot. Well, I got Disney Plus now.

Eat that. And I'm watching. I'm watching Andor. So are you an air, are you an indoor guy? No, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I've heard great things. But I have not, I have not yet watched. I watched the first six episodes like a year. ago and I just couldn't get into it but sometimes that's like more of a reflection of what's

going on in my life and so I'm coming back to it now that things are a little bit slower you know are you are you a star wars guy in general um I'd say I'm like a six out of ten on the sky the star wars spectrum like I am not like someone who knows all of the lore I might even be like a four or five if I'm being honest I'm not like Game of Thrones six out of ten in the general pop but a four out of ten among Star Wars fans yeah I think that's perfectly stated Yeah, I am like, like, Game of Thrones, I can tell you like, you know, the great houses. I can tell you the map. Like, I can point out places on the map.

I'm that much of a nerd with that. But with Star Wars, I'm more, yeah, just kind of a casual Star Wars fan. Okay. They say Andor holds up outside of Star Wars. But I mean, I watched. Yeah, it's, it was good. Yeah, I just, give me a couple more episodes to rewatch. Julia's watching it with me this time.

So I think I'll be incentivized to pay more. attention to it. She'll yell at me if I go on my phone. So there you go. They'll do it for the first block here on P.H.O.I. Eagles. We'll be back on the other side. A little depth chart comparison versus the roster at this point

last year. E.J. Stay tuned. Find out if the scope returns. Pum-bum-pum-bada-bom bum-pum-pum-pum-pum-pum-pum-pum-pum-pum-pum-pum-pum-pum. That's right. If you're thinking about London for week five for the Eagles Jaguars game, Philly sports trips has you covered from flights and hotels to game tickets and exclusive fan events. Everything is taken care of for you.

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Visit ACE HardwareHomeservices.com today to get started. Tell me, Jay, sent you. Back on the P.H.O.I.I.G.O.I.I.G. How are you? I was doing better until I heard barbecue freaks. I didn't like that. Well, we have to shoot fits. I don't know if that fits, but all right. If the gloves. I appreciate that.

What is going on here? Get out of here. It's our show. All right, there we go. All right, let's settle in for a little roster talk here, EJ. You want to go position by position? Is that how you feel about this? I think that's probably the right way to do it.

for the sake of really getting into each position. Otherwise, yeah, we might skip over some important spots like blocking tight end or 10th offensive linemen. All right. So quarterback. We know how it stands right now. You got top two guys, Jalen Hertz and Tanner McKee. You got Cole Payton coming in to compete for a spot and you got Andy Dalton. That's up against what it was last year, which was Tanner McKee and Jailen Hertz.

Kyle McCord. and I guess we're not including Sam Howell because this was pre-Sam Howell. Yeah, I figured we'd do 53 versus 53, right? Oh, you want to do 53 versus 53? Oh, I see. I thought we were doing 90 versus 90. We can if you want.

I was looking more at it like the players that I projected to be on the 53 last year. Okay. Or this year versus the players that made last year's. All right. Well, then you go ahead. Okay. I mean, it's pretty much what you said.

It's a, yeah, I had Jalen Hertz, Tanner McKee, and Andy Dalton. Did you not have Tanner McKee on yours? No, I did. And then I also had Cole Payton. Last year was Sam Hal. Well, I don't know why I did it in that order. Jalen Hurts, Sam Hal on Tanner McKay. So I would, I'd probably, well, not probably.

I would take this year's group, not just because of the additional, you know, like variable of Cole Payton. But I feel a little bit better about Andy Dalton as your third quarterback compared to Sam Hal. Like Sam Hal was like kind of a mercenary last year. You know, he was kind of, you could tell when you talked to him. He felt like last year was kind of like take your medicine, you know, and then find something in next, you know, the following year. I feel like Andy Dalton will probably be more of a resource as that third quarterback. What do you think about the possibility that Andy Dalton gets flipped?

Yeah. I mean, because Joe Flacco, you know. I would be surprised. I think I would be surprised. I think they have a reason for wanting him in the building. I don't think that they made that trade just checking a box for another backup quarterback. Is it possible, though, that purpose in mind for Andy Dalton? Is it possible that that reason could be less important in August, you know, if a team needs a backup quarterback?

I feel like he's here in case, in case a starting quarterback gets injured and Tanner McKee is the one who gets flipped. Yeah, I would be surprised. I mean, it's not impossible, obviously, but I would be surprised if Dalton gets flipped to become someone else's number two quarterback in August for another six-round pick or whatever it is. Okay, but what about this scenario where Tanner McKee doesn't get traded and the Eagles are going to. go, okay, like we had Andy Dalton on the roster, in part because of the fact that he was like insurance if Tanner McKee got traded. And then you're looking at the roster math. Maybe you had a couple of undrafted guys stand out in training camp. And it's like, you know, we really prefer to go with three quarterbacks there. Can we get something for Andy Dalton? Can we get, you know,

can we flip it basically, you know, flip Andy Dalton for, you know, some kind of draft compensation. Yeah, that would surprise me. Yeah, I think that's fair. But it's not impossible. All right, running back, basically the same, except that there's no AJ Dillon, and this year, last year at this time, there was no Tank Biggsby. Yeah. Yeah, so Tank Biggsby counts on this year's. You got to remember, Ben Van Sumerun was also a part of the initial 53 last year. Yeah. I feel better about this year's group by a wide margin, though, and that's really the Tank Biggsby effect.

No doubt about it. Yeah. now do you feel differently about Sequin and Barclay? Yeah, you know, I thought about that when I was thinking, when we were doing the quarterbacks, because it's like, how differently do I feel about Jalen? I don't feel a great, I don't feel enough differently about Jalen to take last year's group. I don't feel any different about Sequin either, if I'm being honest. I still, like, maybe like, you know, 2% worse than you felt last year.

But for me, I really do. Like watching it all season, I chalked the run game struggles up almost entirely to the offensive line being being banged up. Now, you could say that Sequin like had some bad habits creep up and, you know, maybe sometimes like compounded on that. But that's less about his physical capability and more about, you know, just reading things out and, you know, being in a good rhythm. Yeah, if you told me that Seekwan was, I mean, obviously not exactly the player he was in 2024. because that production was so historic. But if you told me that he led the league in rushing, from a talent perspective at the very least,

I wouldn't be surprised. I would be more like, oh, man, that means that the Eagles offensive line really got their act together. They were healthy, you know? I think I probably feel a touch better about Sequin this year than last year because he's not coming off the same level of workload that he had in 2024

and there's more time to recover. And he wasn't on the, like the media circuit, you know, grabbing every little opportunity he could. Well, yeah, that's fair. That's a good take, though. I really like that take from you that, you know, he doesn't have the same wear and tear that he had last year.

Could you extend that to the offensive line? Probably not. Yeah, probably. Yeah, and they played less, but in terms of like the physical toll, I like that from you. I like that Sequin might even be, you know, better going into this season than he was last year.

But I just I don't know how much scale one to ten how much credence did you give Sequan's like physical decline you know the idea that he was not the same player 10 being like you really think that he's on the down down slope and one being you don't believe it at all I think he looked less explosive last year I think the I think it stands to be decided whether that was a beginning of a trend or just a one-year blip because of how deep and how much work he got he got in 2024 yeah i just don't i think i think i think i think blaming it only on the offensive line is is a little bit unfair yeah i just didn't think he looked less explosive i mean like he wasn't jumping over guys but

it's a matter of opportunity to me more than his physical you know decline i don't know i'm not worried about him looking worse you know but could be wrong i mean okay history would suggest that it's going to come eventually. All right. Wide receiver, obviously. Yeah. AJ Brown, likely to be the big difference here. But AJ Brown, Devante Smith,

Jahan Donson, Darius Cooper, Johnny Wilson got injured. Who else? Who was the other? John Mechie. John Mechie. That's right, the John Mechie trade, which, of course, changed the course of all of our lives.

Now, deeper, but not as, good at the top with Devante Smith Mackay-Lemon, Hollywood Brown, Tontavian Wix, presumably Darius Cooper. Yeah, and then Elijah Moore, maybe. Yeah. 50-50. Yeah, it's a...

1585. It's still probably, well, not probably. It's worse, one through four, but like it's better three through four. You know, that makes sense. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know. I think that this is if you're,

I think your high high outcome is that you've got like a what a top eight receiving core in the NFL with this group. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think it's impossible to feel better about this group than last year's group. That would be silly. Yeah. But I mean, unless you're baking in the scheme change and the potential for the offense to just look a lot more functional, obviously. But yeah, we talked before about like if Mackay Lemon is like, you know, 10 out of 10 in his rookie season, he's probably,

another Devante Smith and then where does two Devante Smith's rank in the you know in terms of receiving talent or receiving duos and yeah you're probably looking lightest. Yeah for sure. You're probably looking at what like a top yeah top eight probably maybe just outside

that top five so yeah I think this is a pretty obvious you feel worse about it but that's where your coaching staff is going to have to be able to bridge the gap and I think you know there's a reason to feel optimistic about that All right, so better quarterback, better running back, worst wide receiver. Yeah, I think that's fair. Tight end. Dallas Goddard, Grant Calcutera, Cameron Lott, who was, they were missing somebody.

Oh, John Munt, Kyle and Granson. Oh, from last year. Last year versus Johnny Munt and Eli Stowers added to that mix. Yeah, we should mention, by the way, the Eagles announced that they officially signed Eli Stowers to his rookie contract today. So, you know, really good job working that deal. All right. I mean, you got to feel better about this group.

Yeah, I mean, no doubt about it. You have to. Even if you don't feel good about Eli Stowers, at least the presence of Johnny Munt makes you feel better about them being able to, you know, hold up in multiple tight-end sets when they need to run the ball. Although, you know, we'll see if Kam Latu's on there. I won't feel bad.

better about it if Cam Latz who's not on there. That's true. All right, offensive line, the big one. The same five starters. Backups added. You've got Markel Bell in the mix. You've got another year from Drew Kendall, and this is opposed to basically having Matt Pryor as your backup guard and Brett Toh as your backup center.

The big difference is the coaching. And so I think, I think the real question here is, does expected better health outweigh an expected dip in the level of coaching? Yeah, and to me, I'm not as bullish on the expected better health as you. I was going to say the big difference is that you don't feel 100%

about the health of Landon, Dickerson, and Cam Juergens. Now, last year, this time last year, it should have probably been a bigger topic of conversation, the fact that both of those guys ended the postseason in the shape that they were in and the fact that it lingered all the way through the season. I think we spent a good amount of time last summer talking about being overwhelmed by the backups and how there didn't seem to be a pipeline of backup offensive linemen as there had been in years past. I mean, they had to make the trade for Fred Johnson.

Absolutely. It was Matt Pryor. Yeah. You know, that felt overwhelming at the time. Yeah, that's like, it's funny. That's one of my early memories of working at P.H.O.I is, I just felt like I talked about swing tackles like every day on multiple shows a day. I was like, you know, beating a dead horse.

It's like they don't have a swing tackle. Usually they have a swing tackle. They got Fred Johnson. To me, I feel significantly worse about this group than I usually would. And I'd been the way that I felt last year. And again, that's acknowledging, maybe it's an overcorrection, acknowledging the fact that last year we talked about the lack of depth, but we didn't necessarily talk about it in light of, you know,

how are Landon Dickerson's, How are Landon Dickerson and Cam Juergens going to look? You know, I feel like we spent more time talking about Tyler Steen. So for that reason, I feel better about the depth, actually, this year, compared to last year, even if you account for Fred Johnson eventually being a part of that group. But I just, I mean, we probably, you and me probably haven't talked enough about how much of a swing, you know, circumstances is going to be for the Eagles, whether or not Landon Dickerson and Cam Jurgens look good in training camp, look good in week one, and then look good in

week 10 you know that might be the defining that might be the the the same thing of lane johnson yeah right like yeah yeah it's it's the most important it is they're about to lose arguably the best player on the team in a j brown and yet this is the most important position uh in terms of how well they do this year yeah because it's i think every eagles fan knows the offensive line is what matters yeah and it's just it's so easy to envision what the offense can fall back on even if things don't go smoothly with the scheme change if Landon Dickerson and Cam Juergens are playing at a true like pro bowl all pro level. And, you know, this is something that I believe she'll mentioned on the ringers Philly special that I thought was a great point is like we've gotten used to in

in Philadelphia seeing backup offensive linemen come in and play at a high level and like they're, you know, like the Brett Tooths of the world come in and like not see a massive drop off when those players come in. That's not a guarantee anymore. You know, like that, I think that is a reflection of Jeff Stoutland and you hear from backup offensive lineman like, oh, my goodness, you know, you'll be in the back of the meeting room. You won't be paying attention. And Stout will shout out your name. And, you know, you have to be prepared to answer the question.

You have to be prepared to play different positions during practice. Like there's a lot that goes into making sure that those backups are ready to come in if those guys aren't healthy. If Landon Dickerson and Cam Juergens aren't healthy, you can't feel quite as good about, you know, who's going to come off the bench and are they going to be 100% prepared. Not saying they won't be, but it's not going to. to be as foregone a conclusion as it was under Jeff Soutland. And then the other major question is,

so let's say there are five position groups we just went through and three of them you feel better about, two of them you feel worse about? Do you feel like the changes in the coaching staff make you feel better about the usage of the talent and how it's all going to be put into effect? Yeah, it's funny, like just looking at it without knowing these guys that well,

without seeing how the product is going to look on the field, I feel better about the receiving core. Like as crazy as it sounds, like you subtract AJ Brown. I feel like that's where if you're the coaching staff, you should be able to make up that gap so you can still have an effective pass game without a player like AJ Brown. Like AJ Brown makes it easier. You don't need a sophisticated scheme to just get the ball to AJ outside the numbers

against single high coverages. You know, that is a pretty straightforward formula. To me, the offensive line is the one where it's like that I've not confident that the coaching staff is just going to be able to hand wave or, you know, wave a wand and be like, it doesn't matter that Landon Dickerson or Cam Juergens aren't quite the same player. I think that that's probably just more matchup dependent. It's just a more matchup dependent position. It's harder to scheme around.

And with that said, again, like the backup part of it, it's like we just don't know if Chris Cooper's got the same track record of getting the most out of a group the same way that Jeff Stalind has. All right. Time to take a break back and talking about the defense on the other side of the PHA. why he goes podcast. Stay with us. Starting something new, can be terrifying. It makes you nervous. So many what ifs. But if you're starting a new business, one way to make sure that those worries fade away is to use our friends at Shopify. Shopify is the commerce platform behind

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have a chance to win a $100 Amazon gift card. So we appreciate you. Head to all phtly.com slash contest and let your voice be heard. Tell us a little bit more about how you use our product. Back on the page of my Eagles podcast, Bowen, EJ, time now for EJ to take a manly sip of something. There's nothing manly about that sip. The right people presented by our friends at True Mark Financial. Let's talk about whether the Eagles have the right people on defense, E.J.

And you compare last year's Edge Group. I think we want to do this for the start of the season. So there's no Jalen Phillips. There's not even a Brandon Graham. It's Nolan Smith, Jalick, Hunt, and then Aziz Ojalari, Josh Ushay, and Agbo Ocaronquo, going up against this group, which has the same two young guys, but Jonathan Grenard at the top of that list to go along with Arnold Deppucati,

Joe Tryon Shaiyanka, Keishon James Newby. A couple dart throws there. but what looks like a much improved top four yeah you can feel a lot better about this year's group and the lack of a need to eventually address it in the middle of the season you know the jonathan granard trade the thing that i just as i've like we've sat with the jonathan granard trade for a few weeks it is it is funny to me like how much the compensatory picks kind of just keep fueling the midseason additions you know what i mean like it's like a oh, they can trade the third-down pick because of that.

I have an appreciation for that. I do think it's a sign of an organization that I don't know if I go so far. It's like, oh, it's a perfectly run organization or anything like that. But I do think that it's reflective of good business. So, yeah, for that reason, I think you can feel better about the group. You know, Jonathan Grenard and Jalick's hunt at the top of it. And maybe Nolan Smith is like a, maybe we're sleeping on Nolan Smith a little bit more this year. You know, I understand the injuries are a big part of it,

but it wouldn't shock me if he had a great year. Yeah, I mean, Nolan Smith, at his best, is an awesome player. The stretch that he had at the end of the 2024 season from sort of like, you know, week 15 through the end of the playoffs, he looked like a star and like a game wrecking star, one of the most physical guys in the league. The problem is the way that he plays with that body,

it's hard to believe he's going to last. And I will continue to pound the table that Jailix Hunt's season last year was extremely underapperated. I mean, he was fifth in the league and quarterback hits per pass rush snap with like the most elite group among them. I think there's a chance that Jallex Hunt turns into a star. Yeah, I completely agree. I mean, he has the physical traits necessary to do it. I think he has been probably one of the biggest beneficiaries of working with Vic Fangio and also Jeremiah Washburn and Clinton Hurt as an extension of that. But still, like, to me, I do think that he's got an incredibly high ceiling.

And I think that he, like, it's funny because the interceptions that he had last year, like, you can sort of overstate those. But, I mean, it's still a valuable thing you can do. But even just as a pass rusher, like, I think he has levels to still go through. And there's a reason to believe he's going to hit that. because he's like, he does have like that Eagles like, oh, he's got the character, whatever his ceiling is, he's going to hit it, especially since, you know, he has like that late position change in college. So yeah, I'm excited to see what Jaylux Hunt can do.

I just, yeah, I think that Nolan Smith, we sometimes maybe discount that like, you know, if he is healthy, I was trying to look through like to find some players that maybe miss some time early in their career, a high motor guy that's like injury prone. I mean, Trey Hendrickson missed some time early in his career. Like is that maybe a decent comparison? Like it wouldn't stun me if Nolan Smith became a guy who's like, figures it out, stays healthy, and then therefore becomes a very productive pass rusher

because he's healthy, you know? I think that Nolan Smith's like upside case is, is not like a 15 sack guy. I think he's more of a more along the Brennan Graham lines where he's an He is an elite edge rusher, I mean, an elite run defender and havoc creator. But he's he's never going to be like, well, not never, but I don't expect him to be, you know, like the pass rush craftsman. He's he's winning with violence. Yeah, I think that's why I like the Hendrickson comp, because it is like Hendrickson is high motor.

Like it shouldn't work, but it does. But yeah, I agree. I think Nolan is more. Nolan's like best case scenario right is a guy who is like man he's every down just like a total wrecking ball And that is why he's been hurt a lot. It's a big part of it. So yeah, and that was that's the reason that the Eagles got him at the end of the first round. Yeah, it's because of the concerns there. So yeah, yeah, we'll see how it goes for him. I would say I would say this group arguably the biggest improvement from last year based on new the week one roster. Yeah, now I have a question for you. If you added jalen Phillips to last year's group just for the sake of the exercise. Yeah. I still feel better about this year's group. I feel a little bit better about this year's group. Yeah.

Yeah. I did too. Just a touch. Yeah. I could because I think, I think Phillips and Grenard are kind of a wash, different types of players. I probably like Grenard a little bit more. I like Granard a little bit more.

I think you feel worse about Nolan. You feel much better about Jalix. And then the fourth spot being Evacati versus the, I mean, last year, the fourth, no, with those guys, the fourth spot was BG by the end of the season. Yeah. I think he'd feel pretty good about that. Yeah.

No, I think I probably would also take Gronard a little bit more forcefully than just saying it to wash, you know, especially like early down, you know? Like the Eagles did have like that little blip where they were struggling against the run. I feel like you're less likely to have that blip with Jonathan Grinard than you are with Jalen Phillips. Maybe. splitting hairs yeah all right so the eagles seem to have the right people at defensive end thank you we're friends at true mark uh defensive tackle is an interesting one because i think you probably feel a little bit worse about jalen carter but you could argue that now that he's entering a contract year you

have like even higher expectations you certainly feel much better about jordan davis yeah i think you feel about the same about morrow even though you probably feel a little bit better about morrow because you saw it in action last year. But then the depth, like I think you feel worse about Ty Robinson after him being a non-impact player last season. And then it's, you know, Byron Young and Gabe Hall, but you can be excited about UR. Bernard three years down the road.

Yeah, I was going to say Jordan Davis makes up that gap that you feel about Jalen Carter, you know. I think I feel significantly better about Jordan Davis than I feel worse about Jalen Carter, if that makes sense. and then OJMO Contractor OJamo is going to be interesting He's going to be an interesting Watch

You know I think that guy He's like he knows what this means By you know He's he's he's business savvy enough That he's going to be trying to take advantage of it So yeah I mean Past Rush in general

I think probably the most significant improvement Year over year Quickly a linebacker I think you certainly feel worse about just because it's the exact same group without Nacobi D. Now, I think at the beginning of last season, you didn't have those expectations for Nacobi Dean, given what he was coming off.

But having seen it in action, you know, it's a little bit more of an unknown. But I don't think you feel bad about this group necessarily. Yeah, I actually am excited to see Vic Fangio in year two with Jihad Campbell, like use more of that versatility that we saw them starting to take advantage of. You know, like Nekobi was awesome, but he didn't have that same versatility to like,

flex to the edge or just wear different hats the way that Jahad Campbell did. So I think that's going to be fun to watch this year. You know, I think that it's hard to say that the ceiling is going to be higher with those guys, but I do actually think that that's fair, you know, to say, is that the ceiling is higher with Zach Bonn and Jahad Campbell because they are more interchangeable than Zach Bonn and the Kovina. Let's do the last two quickly here. I think very clearly you feel better about Corner with Rick Wullen as opposed to Adori Jackson and Kili Ringo at the time.

No doubt about that. And you also have now seen Quignan and Cooper DeGine do it for a second season. So I think you feel way better about that group. Yeah. And then I think right now you clearly feel worse about safety with no read blankenship, Drew McCuba unproven still. And, you know, Marcus Epps and Michael Carter penciled in and probably the expectation that another move is to come.

Yeah, it feels like there's a trade there. Yep, I agree. But for the record, Shea, I was saying that Nolan Smith was a high motor player. I think he fits that description perfectly. I don't think it's just for white guys. Okay. WPT, white people tackles. Might need some WPTs coming up tomorrow.

All right, time for our last break here on the PHA Eagle Show. Back with more on the other side. Stay tuned. Upgrade your home for less during Ashley's Memorial Day event, right? now save up to 20% off beautifully crafted Ashley furniture or take advantage of 60 months no interest financing with no minimum purchase. If you're looking to sleep better, you can get free upgrades on select adjustable bases plus king size comfort for queen size pricing on select Ashley mattresses. These Memorial Day deals won't last, so don't wait, shop in store or online at Ashley today.

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select Ashley mattresses. These Memorial Day deals won't last, so don't wait, shop in store or online at Ashley today. Back in the PhD's podcast, Bowen, E.J. How was your weekend, E.J.? It was good. Yeah, we, uh, We had like a sneaky busy weekend. You know, we had a birthday party on Saturday. Shout out to Dan Lonsdale. He's a sicko.

He's a good friend of mine. He listens to the show. He'll enjoy the shout out. D.L. Yeah. Yeah, his daughter's birthday. So we went there. We ran around yesterday.

We ended up gifting one of our friends, some baby stuff that were like kind of loaning them preemptively because, oh, shoot. Oh, man, I did it. Anyway. What are you talking about? Nobody knows. Yeah, we gave them some baby stuff.

You know, one friend to another. They have a baby on the way. You're loaning them. Yeah, that's fine. Yeah, that's what we did. Yeah, it was a good weekend. How was your weekend? It was good.

I went to a wedding in California. I'm not allowed to talk about it. You were doing this. It was what, Thursday show that you said this? Wow. I think I knew you were going to a wedding, but you didn't tell me that. I heard it on a show that I wasn't on.

I'm not allowed to talk about the wedding. I signed it NDA. Is this a joke that's flying over my head? No. I'm nervous. There were some pictures in TMC about it. Oh, okay, yes. I believed you.

That's, I'm so gullible, man. All right, so you were at AJ Brown's wedding is what you're saying. Cannot confirm nor deny. Well, let me just ask you this. Did you see Jalen Hertz this weekend? Cannot confirm nor deny. Well, that doesn't answer anything, even if you said no. Yeah, AJ Brown's wedding.

I saw a couple pictures. Happy for him. If I had been there, I would say that I would have expected that I had a really good time. And I'm, and I'm, I would theoretically be very grateful to AJ for the invite. I mean, it would have been a great invite for me, get some, get some content out of that. That's why I wasn't invited probably. So did you see yet?

And yet, I can neither confirm nor deny that I saw Slay there. I can neither confirm nor deny that Isaiah Rogers was there and we had a good time. I will tell you that. unlike when I was at Lane Johnson's wedding, nobody had hair quite as good as Isaac Sam Malos. So you can confirm that you were at Lane's wedding? Yeah, there was no NDA there. No NDA?

Yeah. Are, is this, did you actually read somewhere that there was an NDA for the wedding? Can either confirm or deny. Yeah, I've, I saw some speculation online. I think Devante Smith was at least there, probably a groomsman if I had to guess. No, no. comment. So when did you get home from California?

I got in this morning and boy, my arms tired. Oh my God. Claire says they saw you in Philly on Saturday. Well, I flew out right after that. That was a, that was Chevy Chase, a young Chevy Chase. Yeah, it must have been someone else.

You know what else I want to talk about? Have you seen the list of the people at the NFL's accelerator program? I haven't, no. Would you like to guess the one eagle who was represented at the NFL's accelerator program? This is for coaches or front office members who the idea is to get them in front of NFL owners and, you know, teach them the ropes, I guess, about like, help give them a bit of a leg up as they look to move up in their careers.

I feel like Amina Soleiman has already done it. Chuck Walls did it one year so can you do it twice I don't know if there are any rules against doing it twice but it is neither of them those two would have been my guess well I think that is a good

reflection of how this has changed because it it used to be much more of a from my understanding like an opportunity for mid-career people to get those front-facing opportunities and get

them into the pipeline. The list of people here now is kind of pathetic. Now, for the egos, it's Adam Barry, which that's fine. He's already assistant GM. Mike McDaniel. Mike McDaniel is in there. I mean, David Shaw isn't, does David Shaw need a leg up? This guy was like a Stanford coach for a long time. You know, Jeff Ulbric just going down the list. Like, that's fine. Has it been a defensive coordinator. Does he need, does he need that help? Like, Mike Kafka, Mike Kafka, Eric Bienimi, Grant Udinski, these guys who are already in all of the, like,

Nate Schillhouse, who was basically offered a job already last year. So did they change the rules? Like literally, did they change the rule? They must have, right? John McKay, the son of like the longtime guy, Rich McKay. Like, it feels like they have completely lost the plot here. Yeah, I mean, it was, it seemed like a good operational. for like mid-level people in front offices not and I wouldn't say mid-level in a condescending way like people who were on the way up and needed to network and meet people it's it's like jarring to look at the list and see every like not every team but so many teams immediately turning to like just like performative nonsense with this like Josh McCown is on this is on this thing like so it's just like a hob-nob now yeah it's really disappointing it's really yeah it's kind of gross yeah I'm happy

to see Kat Hickman there. Yeah. You know, I think that's, I think that's the only woman on this list. Yeah. Brandon Brown also there.

Was with the Eagles front office. He's the Giants assistant GM now. But, I mean, 80% of these people do not need this. Yeah. That's crazy.

I can't believe I didn't see this. But now I'm disappointed. I want to look into the rule change here. because that. I mean, even like, there are so many people on this list who have already been interviewed or have had the jobs that you would be thinking they're being groomed is the wrong word, but being like prepped for here. Yeah.

Even a guy like Mike Bradway, who by all accounts, is a really good front office person. You know, used to be with Eagles a long time ago. I've heard nothing but good things about Mike Bradway. He was interviewing for the Falcons GM job last year. Like, yeah, I don't know. even like if I'm like Brian Tyson from the CL Cucks he was in he's already interviewed for the Vikings

GM job like yeah even if I was Brian Johnson I'd be disappointed that the Ramset Nate Shieldhouse instead of me like that guy is going to be a head coach no matter what happens this weekend you know it is almost as if they put this list together so that they can in the future point to this list and be like look at all the people

who we got hired because these are all people who are already in the pipeline to be hired for their next job that's a great point yeah they want like a success rate instead of trying to just help people. That's sad. Yeah. It's crazy. Kind of weak.

Oh, it's very weak. Yeah. Again, I usually I enjoy seeing the accelerator program stuff because it's a way to learn who in the Eagles organization they feel is going to be, you know, on a fast track. And obviously Adam Barry. Very funny. What's that? Mike McDaniel is very funny.

Yeah. He really needs help getting a little. name out there. And I do want to say, like, Adam Berry is that for the Eagles, somebody who I think they expect to be a GM. But yeah, a lot of the names on here. It's like, I don't know, like, what's Josh McCown? What is, what is it?

He really needs more. I mean, truly, half the people on this list have already been interviewed for jobs that would be their next job. Yeah. Yeah. It's crazy. Clayton Adams. Clayton Adams isn't, like, terrible.

But still. Clayton Adams did. have a beard. Hmm? E.J. If you're watching on Fast, I had my wife out there. Yeah.

My life. If you're watching on Fast, make sure to head on over to all pHon.com to catch the rest of this episode in Overtop. We get to hear from some coordinators this week. Maybe we'll get to meet Sean May for the first time we hear. And rumblings, possibilities, maybe later this week,

hopefully, fingers crossed. So it'd be nice, be nice to hear from him. Find out if Sean Boynian has turned into a man. Your first question going to be about AJ. Sean Mannion? Yeah, I'm joking. I'm not allowed to talk about AJ. Sean Manning's going to ask you about AJ.

Yeah, and you're going to look at the wedding list. I can't talk about it. What do you mean? If you are not able to talk to Sean minion, what is the question that you would like to ask him? It's a bad reporter that I'm like not, I'm flat-footed here. I would, I just, I would like to hear his philosophy and vision for the Eagles offense. That's, you know, that's what stands out.

I don't have something specific, you know, I'm not asking him about Cam Latu. I'll save that for training camp. Okay. And then at some point, over the next few weeks, we're going to get to see a little on-field action. with the OTAs. Yeah. It's a fun time. I like OTAs.

Obviously, I like training camp the most, would like to fast forward to training camp. As I said last week, I got a text from Jimmy Kempski about that. About what? You want to fast forward to the training camp? Yeah, you said like, he kind of,

the energy of the text was like, I remember my first training camp. OTAs are like, it is like giving like a couple crumbs of stale toast to a starving person like we'll take it like we'll get to watch them actual football

but like you know once you're in training camp you'll think back to OTAs and be like man that was pathetic I mean I like OTAs I like this is why I like training camp so much

I like being outside at football practice it is and I always like I don't lose appreciation like that I get to do that you know as a 31 year old okay well that's enough 30 mugging

I mean listen 31 30 interchangeable 32 also interchangeable 32 39 basically the same is it yeah that'll do it for this episode of PHA Y equals podcast back in studio tomorrow no EJ yeah

not a lunch pill guy no listen it's my wife and will be there got out to Julia I'm going to be spending time with Julia. I'll probably be working. It's a new version of birthday uncle. Fran and the professor will be in studio.

So it'll be a nice, three-hander son ZJ. Looking forward to it. For all of us here. We thank you for watching. Thank you for listening. Hit the like button. Oh, you know what?

Very end of the show, I'm going to tell you, you know what else tomorrow is? Fran's diehard breakdown, Fran's draft session. So if you just can get it in under the wire, go to all-PHLY.com to get your tickets for diehards only. Watch Fran break down every draft pick and Johnny Granard. For E.J. and Lindsay, I'm Bo. We'll talk to you tomorrow at 2 o'clock.

And as always, we love you.