The Ben and Ashley I Almost Famous Podcast - Why You MUST Advocate For Your Health with Clare Crawley & Michelle Young: Will You Accept This Advice?

Episode Date: May 9, 2026

Former Bachelorettes Clare and Michelle have been privately battling their own health issues and publicly sharing their unique and difficult journeys to find answers. They discuss with Trista why it's important for people to advocate for themselves in the doctor's office, seek out multiple medical opinions, and most importantly...trust your gut when you know something isn't right in your body. The women also discuss how seeking a medical diagnosis while being a newlywed also added another layer of complexity to both of their experiences. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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or the practicality and corporate business sense of the Sith rule of two. Listen to stuff to blow your mind on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. This is the Almost Famous Podcast with IHartRadio. Hi, everybody. This is your host, Trista Sutter. I am here with the Almost Famous Will You Accept This Advice podcast. And I'm really excited about this. It's just a little mini-series that I'm doing right now. Hopefully it'll turn into more, but it's a little bit.

mini series where I'm talking to women that we know and love from Bachelor Nation who have been through different things, experienced different things, or at different seasons of their lives, and they're sharing their advice with us, with me. My gosh, I'm gaining so much knowledge from all of these women. And today I'm really excited because I've got Michelle Young and Claire Crawley, and they have both been through some very significant health battles recently. My heart just goes out to them and their families. They are both newly married. And so I wanted to have them on to talk about going through those health battles, especially in the beginning of a marriage, advocating for yourself and any advice they can give all of us on how. And how,

to really manage life with a long-term health condition. So I'm really excited to welcome Michelle and Claire to the podcast. Hi. Thank you so much for being here today. I know it's just hard, please, in life to get anything scheduled. I mean, it's just crazy in my world. I know, like, just with the three of us, it's just hard. So I really appreciate your time, especially with all that both of you have been going through lately.

I'd love to start by having both of you kind of explain to everyone what's going on. You can take the platform and talk to everyone about what you've been experiencing, what it's called, and what it looks like kind of on a daily basis for everybody. Michelle, if you want to go first. Yeah. So this all kind of started, actually, now that I have answers and kind of know a little bit more about what's going on with my body, we can kind of track back the symptoms. And this was happening like as I was filming the Bachelorette, like years ago. And it was just kind of building on each other. But so it kind of just all started with my symptoms started to get really bad. And I was really lethargic. I was having really bad panic attacks. my blood sugar kept dipping below, like an okay number consistently, like while I was sleeping. And, you know, that whole thing where you go in and you start trying to look for answers and you get so many different things and you go through the whole talking to doctors and some are dismissive or some lead you in this direction in this direction.

So it was back in like November where I ended up posting a little bit about my symptoms. And through that, I was able to find the doctor who I'm with now. And that was like, this is like the doctor that I'm with now is probably like my sixth or seventh doctor I've worked with through the past year. And that's where I was diagnosed with desotonomia, specifically pots, which is just basically a malfunction in the autonomic nervous system. And it comes with a whole array of symptoms. And you can kind of have a range of, I specifically struggle with pots, but there's, you know, disautonomia is an umbrella term. So there's a lot of different disorders underneath there that all have to do with your nervous system and how it malfunctions. And it's not necessarily like a new

diagnosis to the science world, but there's not a lot of information on it. So there's a lot of discrepancies of like, how can you handle it? How should it be handled in a lot of different treatments? But there's a lot of us that are still struggling and like don't have help. So, So it's just been battling with that and finding the right treatment plan. And life has looked a lot different from someone who used to run around a lot and bounce from one thing to the next to, you know, being able to like get up and even walk to the fridge at times during pretty intense flares where your body is just kind of really fighting against itself. And for me, my symptoms really are like extreme lethargy out of breath as you can probably like hear as I'm speaking at times. because I'm working on coming off of a flare. But dizziness, a lot of people pass out,

and it doesn't look the same for one person, but it definitely fits into that invisible illness category. So I can look normal, and if I'm sitting down, a lot of times I can pretend to be normal, but on the inside, you just really are, like, fighting, and you don't feel great. So it's like you wake up at 20% battery, and that's what you got to use to get through the day and, you know, hope for the best.

So it's been a learning process and it's definitely given me a lot of perspective. But that's the short explanation of things. Yeah, yeah. I'm sure you could talk for hours and hours about it with all that you've been through and learned. It sounds very similar to what Ryan, my husband went through and trying to get his diagnosis for Lyme disease and very similar in ways to Lyme disease in that it's different for everybody, like the symptoms are different for everybody. So I'm sure we'll get into it, but I'm wondering if Lyme was one of the things that they were crossing off the list for you.

We'll talk about it. Yeah. So, okay, so Claire, tell us about your topical steroid withdrawal. Yes. So I, it's one of those things exactly like Michelle was talking about. Like mine started right around when I was on The Bachelor, or Bachelorette, sorry, Bachelorette. And that's a whole other topic, I feel like because something with like fight or flight and your body just constantly having to be in protective mode for yourself, that it just depletes you internally more than anybody would ever understand, you know? And so I have my thoughts on that, but mine right now, I have topical steroid withdrawal. all, I'm on the upswing end of it, but it still is one of those things that I deal with on a

daily, daily basis, because while my skin is probably looking better than it was, it was, I looked like for probably a good two years, a full on, like I had been burned in a fire. And not only did it look like that, but it feels like that internally. And you can escape your skin. You cannot, no matter what you do, there's not a medication, there's not sleep, there's not, there is nothing you can do. There's no coal plans. There's no sauna.

There's nothing. There's no medication. Whether it's a supplement or a pill or anything, there's nothing you can do to escape it. And with topical steroid withdrawal, it is one of those things that is still new with doctors kind of like researching it. And I, thankfully, it recently just got like a medical diagnostic code to be recognized. Like within the last couple weeks, it's a new thing, which is why. Wow.

Yeah, people have been suffering with this forever for such a long time. But it is caused from an overprescribing slash overuse of topical steroids. And so where as. with topical steroids, no doctor in my world had ever told me how dangerous they can be and how potent they are and how if they are used slightly in the wrong space for the wrong amount of time, it can wreck your entire mitochondria. And so what it does is essentially it's caused from overuse of the steroids, overprescribing of it. And then your skin doesn't know how to be skin anymore. you don't have a skin barrier.

And so anything that would normally not put you into like an allergic reaction does. So it's like I used to not be allergic to cats, dogs, I used to have no allergies. My skin was like flawless, right? And then now it's like I go into a room with somebody with tied detergent and like downy, as good as it smells, like downy beads refresher. And my body, I'm out for two weeks. And it's like it is something that is so frustrating. Yeah, because now I went to Thailand because that's how far I had to go to get the proper treatment in one modality.

But it's like a combination of things right now for me that's working. But still, I'm around one person. I go see a friend that wears Sol de Janeiro and I'm done for a couple weeks a month and it just is crushing. You know, and it's like it's the balance of like, do I go? go to Easter dinner and see everybody I love, who is normal people who, you know, it's such a risk. And so I've become such like a hermit. And not only that, it's like the extra hard thing is being a mom on top of it. And so throw that up in the mix and then being a wife. And it's just, it's one of those things where it's like the perfect storm a lot of the time for healing is very

challenging. Yeah. I'm sure you can relate. Michelle on very much yeah oh I'm glad we're getting I'm glad I'm getting you two together have you connected before this no no no when I say I'm a hermit like I fully I actually don't even want to talk to most people on a regular basis because I I don't want somebody to look at me and go like have this pay and it's hard for me because the second somebody does I start crying because I'm like if only you knew, like it takes a lot to even hold it together, even still, to like have a positive attitude and get through the day. The energy to explain.

Yes, yes, the energy to connect. And it's so hard to even explain sometimes to like just your friends, you're trying to explain what's going on, your, you know, extended family. And then to have to use the energy to explain, it's just, it's hard to find. Absolutely, absolutely. So I feel bad. haven't connected sooner because I have known something's going on with you. I kind of heard, you know, through the great bind of things that you're struggling. So I wish I could have been

here for you sooner too because I can take care of yourself, girls. Anyone's going to understand if somebody who's going through their own health struggles, there is literally no burden. We get it. It's just, yeah, it's a lot. It's, it's, you really just don't understand until you're put in the position to actually, you know, have to heal yourself and how much that takes and how much it, everything like you said, around you controls it. So you could be doing everything in your power to stay healthy or to get back on the correct track. But one little thing can throw it off. And it's something that you don't have control over. Absolutely. And the throw this up in the mix, too. And I know you can understand this, Tristo, with Ryan, it's like with a diagnosis that you don't

just it's not like diabetes where you get here's insulin and you're going to be okay you know you have to find you know it's trial and error it's being the biggest thing in the entire world is being your own advocate which when you are struggling and it you are you are just at your wit's end and just at a low low having to fight for yourself and having to be believed and to be seen and to be understood is just like oh my god it's that extra. fighting you where you're like, I just, I will do anything it takes, but man, it is testing, you know? It's hard to know what to believe, too.

Just when you're learning about yourself, you know, honestly, never thought I would say this, but like, social media can be such a double-edged sword, but like, thank goodness for TikTok. Yeah. And there's a lot of times you can really diagnose yourself with everything. Like, you go on and you're like, well, maybe I have that as well. I feel like we've all done that. Making all the boxes.

Right. But like there is a certain piece of it that people go on and share what they're struggling with and do find other people who are like, okay, well, I went on this path and they can kind of like set you on the right track to what type of doctor to look at. Or, you know, it's also hard to because people offer all of their advice. And you're like, that's not what I'm going through and taking the energy to respond to that. You have to really be able to be ready to understand like which energy you're going to accept and which ones you're like, nope, not for me. But it's allowed me to like understand what was going on enough in my body to then go to the doctor and be able to advocate for it. And then, you know, that doctor who is like, nope, you don't, you know, doesn't even like look your direction. You're able to be like, okay, nope, not for me. Let me try somebody else and not look at what they're saying as that's correct always. Because, you know, you seem almost like an authority, right?

Like they, it's their area of study. It's, it's, it's, it's, there is supposed to be the expert, but it's so crazy how you can walk in and they can just instantly label you. Oh my gosh. Or not listen to you. Right. Or tell you to go a certain route and you're like, no, that's not what I should be doing. Experience Harry Styles live in London, England at Wembley Stadium.

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There's millions of doctors out there, right? There's millions of doctors. It can be a very long road to finding the people who are going to treat you, how you deserve to be treated and actually listen to you and be a compassionate provider and a knowledgeable provider and someone who has the ideas and the belief that you're going to be able to find something. But when you are dealing with something like Lyme disease, everything that you guys are dealing with. and it's not a mainstream like diabetes, like you said, condition that people deal with, and it's not just an easy fix like, oh, let's test your blood, this is what you've got,

this is what I've got to give you, and you're going to be all, right, it's not cut and dry, and I hate that that you guys have gone through that because I know firsthand going to all of Ryan's doctor's appointments and advocating for him because not only did he not have the energy really to talk to the doctors, but also, and I think

you're both a little bit like this, maybe have a little bit of it in you, is the humility. Like, he wasn't going to sit in a doctor's office and be like, oh, like complaining. Do you know what I mean? He wasn't going to be like, eh, I just had this really horrible day where I almost passed out. He's not going to share all of those details because he's such like a strong. strong man that I feel like talking about that kind of stuff is maybe makes him feel even worse like talking about it. So it was good for me like from a caretaker to be able to be there in all of his appointments and advocate for him and say, you know what? He's got this brain fog going

on. I'm going to fill you in on what actually was happening in those moments. And then he can fill in the in the cracks of like the specifics, you know. Do you guys have, like, obviously, you have wonderful husbands and Jack and Ryan. You've been married a short time, both of you, but do you feel like you have that support and the caretakers who are with you in your journey and can advocate for you too? Oh, deeply, deeply. And it's, I think, I think, because they're the ones that when the light shut out at the end of the day and everybody's gone. Like, and I'm rocking myself sobbing and snot and just shaking and sweating. Like Ryan would see that every single night for a long time. And he just was like, like, this is, you know, this is so hardcore. That's why, I mean, when I went to Thailand for

treatment, it was like the end all kind of like I, my Hail Mary of like, I'm so desperate for healing and to go to the ends of the earth to fix this when it was it was the hardest decision in life because I have a two-year-old and my husband and who has a 13 hour a day job and seven days a week and it's like and I'm putting everything on his shoulders he that's how bad he knows it is that he was like go for as long as you need to go for whatever it takes like go do it go do it. Amazing. You know, and and it wasn't without like, I mean, I sobbed every day and watched the baby monitor every single hour that she was sleeping and I was gone. But, oh, you watched it from Thailand. Oh, my God, don't make her eye. Yes. That's so nice. Wow. It's 12 hours different. It's 12 hours

difference. And so when I was awake, she was sleeping and I literally would just wait for her. I would watch the baby camera like a psycho and just wait for her to, I would watch her sleep. And, make sure she was good and safe and wait for her to wake up and she knew she'd be like mama's on the camera mama and i'd be oh yeah because she makes it so early that i would just talk to her for an hour before Ryan wakes up and that's so comforting just to be able to have her on the screen right there oh my god be on and she would just wake up so yeah but it's like we they know our husbands get it and our partners get it and thankfully that's why like I married Ryan and I'm not saying even like I'm sure you guys can understand.

It tests you. It tests your marriage. It tests every relationship you have to be so sick and to try to be who you are to be who the person they married, you know? But it is, you know, when you have the right partner, it's in sickness and health. And one thing I, not to keep talking, but one thing I told Ryan before we got married was I want a partner that if I don't care if you're here for like the good, vacation, fun stuff, like great.

I'm a dozen type of men, you know? Yeah. And I told him this so long ago, but I was like, I want you, I want to marry the type of man that if I'm sick in the hospital, you are there brushing my hair for me. Yeah. And if you're not that type of guy who won't be there doing that, I don't want you for the good times either.

Yeah. Good for you. Yeah. I really tested like the in sickness and in health with getting married. And then we're like, here you go. So it's been, like you said, it really does test your relationship. And I mean, Jack and I just got married back in June. And I was dealing with these symptoms, trying to actually get through the wedding.

We didn't know what it was at that point. And so I think it was a little bit of relief once we got a diagnosis and once we knew what we were working with. But it's been, I wish there was a group, which I'm sure there are groups. But, you know, for the people who are going through it and how to hand it. handle it. And you really are fighting that battle, like front on. And then also something for the men or for like the partners that also are with somebody who is either chronically ill or just dealing with any type of illness for a longer period of time. It's hard. And we're a young married couple want to start a family and then want to travel. And we had to come back from our honeymoon

early. We had to, you know, really kind of lock in and fix this before we even would be able to start a family. Thank goodness. We don't have kids right now. Oh, my goodness, Claire. Like, the fact that you're able to, like, I cannot even imagine doing this with kids. So I truly commend you on that. That's so difficult to think of. But yeah, it's just been almost like a rude awakening. But it's also like challenging it right up front, you know, because we both very much are still in love and we talk about it and the communication is what gets you through and there's hard days and you agree what kind of relationship or what kind of times you wish you had right when you're in that honeymoon phase you just got married and everything and it's like we're going to doctor

appointments we can't do much we've had to cancel so many plans we've had to leave so many plans early because of flare-ups and and these panic attacks or just adrenaline surges and and all of that but I think also it's just a beautiful thing too because that was always my biggest fear is is somebody going to stick around when times get tough. And that was like the biggest question. And I think that's what I really went through with The Bachelorette. And then, you know, obviously when I married Jack, I knew he would stick around. But life was like, prove it. I guess I was like prove it. Yeah, right? He's really having to. But it's, it's been like really challenging. but it also, you know, if you can get through it, it's going to make you way stronger.

I don't know what else you can go through possibly to make you stronger. Is there anything that you can tell people, like advice you can share about caretakers? Like, how can people be there for, obviously it's a very individual thing, but for both of you, how can people be there for their loved ones in ways that maybe you've seen that aren't like the mainstream? dream. Yeah. Okay. The biggest thing for me is when that is like the ultimate comfort is when he just holds me. And it's half the time he doesn't have to say anything at all. It's just I'm not going anywhere. It's that reminder of I'm not going anywhere because I, in the lowest of lows, if I'm being honest, like I have looked him in the face and said, if you need to go.

You make me cry. Oh, my God. I know. We're all going to be sobbing here in a second. Me too. Me too. It just affects our entire lives. And I just, you know, Ryan's an Ironman.

He's running every day and cycling and he is so active. And his whole life he has been. And that's what we do together. And for me not to be able to do it, I literally have looked at him and said, like, if you don't want to be married to me or if you want a different life, like I completely understand. And I do. I do understand that. But what helps is when he will sit with me and just hold me and like remind me, even though I know he's not that type of man to ever do that. Like, and I know he loves me to the ends of this earth. Like, he'll just sit there and remind me. And I just need that reminder

sometimes because I don't even want to be around myself when I'm in such a bad space. I'm like, get me out of my body. I don't want to be around when I'm grumpy or struggling or in pain. It's not pleasant to be around. And I was like, I get it. But he'll just sit with me and hold me and make me feel like I'm normal. Seen, seen and heard. And I feel like that's so powerful.

Yeah. And not wanting to fix it. I think is what I'm hearing from you is that the biggest thing. When Ryan and I get in arguments and not to like compare it to that, but like there are times when I'm like, I just want you to listen to me. I don't need you to come up with the solution right now. I just want you to hear me and see me and listen and give me a hug. So I get that. Right. I think you said it too with just, I don't think people realize how much guilt comes with when you're that person. who is sick in a relationship and feeling like you're holding them back.

And I've given Jack that same out, especially with just having gotten married of like, okay, like, here's your out. You know, like, it's okay to take it. Like, this is not what either of us signed up for, but I guess it is within sickness and health. And I think he's just had these moments where he's really, you know, sat me down and just said, you do not, you don't have to feel guilty. Like I want to be here. I want to be here helping you through this. I don't want to be anywhere else. It's okay that I canceled, you know, whatever trip he was going to go on or if he missed something else. Like he wanted to be home with me and handling it. And I think for me, I just had so much guilt with feeling like I was holding somebody else back. And, you know, you want them to be there. You don't want to do with it by yourself. But at the same time, you're just like, okay, you love them so you want them to be able to go and enjoy different things. And we've been able to find

a balance because I think it's important too for, you know, we don't want both of us down. So please, like, take care of your mental health. But just like that release of guilt that he's given me of like, we are getting through this together. This is not just your, like this is not your fault. This is whatever this is, we're going to figure it out. And I think that, you know, I'm not used to sitting down and resting. That's probably why I'm in this position. because I was just so go, go, go, and never got out of fight or flight. And then, you know, he'll be like, it's okay to rest, Michelle. Like, it's okay to rest.

It's okay to sit down and you don't need to get anything done today. You are doing something productive by resting. You are literally trying to heal your body. That is very productive and that's very hard. And you don't need to feel guilty. You don't need to be up cleaning. You don't need to be, you know, taking care of the dogs. Like, he's like, I got everything.

Just rest and don't feel guilty about it because, you know, if you're sitting there and you feel, bad about it the whole time you're not actually recharging. And so I think that's been the biggest piece is not that I need, but I guess I did need that permission and I didn't realize I needed that to just hear that from anybody. It's okay to stop and take care of yourself and really genuinely do that without feeling guilty for saying no or having to miss out on something or having to cancel something. And that's a really hard thing to do. Yes, for sure. I mean, as a mom, I feel like there's massive mom guilt whenever you are sick, you know, one day and you can't be there for your

kids. So, Claire, I bet you feel that with being a mom, you know, I'm sure. Dang. Still every day. And I love my girl to death, you know, like I love my, and I would, if I could do, I mean, it's so much guilt, so much guilt. It might at my peak worst. I remember like rocking her was painful to me and her little fingers and her trying her little razor blade nails and just always trying to touch me and which babies do you know and it just was so I couldn't bend my neck I couldn't bend my arms like because it was so like raw my skin was so raw it just hurts so bad and I just was I remember just feeling so guilty of like I want to rock her longer or I want a rocker more or all the things, all the things that would, you know, that I've been held back for doing or go with her everywhere or take her everywhere and, you know, play with her at the park when it's 100 degrees out. And I'm, you know, I can't sweat. And so I'm like, but you know what? I've learned through everybody. It's like, that is taking care of her. You know, caring enough to care is like, that's what makes me a good mom is that I want, you know, I will have our nanny come. And I'm like, I wish you weren't doing it than I was doing it. And she's like, you hiring me is taking care of her. You know? You're right. You're right. You know that saying when you get on the airplane and they say, if the oxygen mask drops, then be sure to put it on your face before you do so for a child.

And that has always resonated with me. And it is true. You cannot feel, even though we can tell you, you can tell yourself that you don't need to feel guilty. You're still probably going to feel it, but I feel like, you know, I'm not going through what you're going through, but making sure you ask for help when you need it is really important for anyone who is going through chronic illness, is going through just a tough day, like ask for help. When Ryan was at his worst, I feel like he's like, you're Ryan, always going, you know, that triathlet, triathlete mentality is just, you know, go, go, go. Same with you, Michelle, as an athlete. Like, just go, go, go. You're going to do everything for everybody. And I feel like the advice I would like to give people who are struggling

with chronic illness themselves is to ask for help. Because there are, if you are hopefully blessed with people around you who are willing to support you and be there for you, let them, let them help you. That is the one thing that is so hard for me is accepting help and asking for help. Like, I still am like, I don't want to ask for help. Like, I can do myself. I can do it. I can do it.

I still, I don't know if that will ever leave me. But I'll tell you, the people that don't guilt you or that don't go, why didn't you come to this event or why did you keep? cancel or, you know, people that just show up for you. Oh, there is a special place in heaven people because I can't make plans with those other people anymore. I'm like, I can't do it. Yeah. Yeah. See, and that's good for you too. I feel like as another little snippet is choosing people to surround yourself with because if there, if you have realized that there are certain people that just are energy depleters and are not going to feed you and your energy and your

Yeah, good for you. Good for you. Yeah. For advocating and standing up for yourself in terms of like choosing your people. Yeah. And almost being okay with something I've had to learn of not explaining because that does take so much energy. And I think that we, you know, you say no to something or you, because you feel that guilt, you want to give this explanation and like getting to this point where just it's okay to save your energy. and you're choosing your piece and you don't need to explain.

And I think that has been something that I've really needed or have done a lot. Your circle definitely gets smaller when you go through something like this. But then, you know, those are the people that you really want around you, though, that are still around. But it's not fun. It's not fun, that's for sure. It's hard, especially when you've been friends with someone for so long and you don't want to have that change, it's also like a, like a loss, like a death. And you have to grieve that, too. Oh, is throwing it back.

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A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way,

this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for Raw, filtered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations,

stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and a TikTok podcast network on TikTok. How do you both deal with the grief and the guilt? Are there any mechanisms, coping mechanisms that you've discovered that are helping you? I think I'm still learning. I think I'm in that middle piece where I'm just really learning to not feel guilty for

the situation that I'm in. And I kind of bob in and out of it because I realize, like, if I sit in that mindset for too long, that's going to take away energy and that's just going to delay me and getting healthy. And so you really have to choose to be all in, on what side you're going to be all in. And so, like, if I'm really going to heal myself and, you know, move that direction, then I have to let those things go. And so that's the reminder. I think I have Jack around to remind me with that, too, but it's still like a learning process because I feel it. I catch myself in, you know, that mind cycle all the time still where I just need to like stop, wait a second, this is not a healthy train of thought or, you know, it's just hard.

Yeah. It's hard. I think for the same thing. Like I'm with all the years of being like this, I still go through the cycles of it of like sometimes I'm ultra motivated and I'm like, no, I'm not going to let it get me down. and like we do what we can and the season we are in like with what we have like I just you know I have the positive mindset and I try to keep that but there's days where I deeply struggle like deeply struggle and I think the acceptance of both of those being okay is is where I feel

like I get the most healing is the days where I need to sit and cry and get it out I do and the days where I need to grieve the life that I have wanted or even when it comes to like how physically I look like I was there are so many times where I'm like I don't even recognize myself at all and grieving that and instead of just ignoring it being like well I'm tough and I'm going to put on a brave face just what I want to do most of the time I will sit and go yeah this does suck but still having hope for it's not always going to be this way. And every day, it's going to be different. And tomorrow, later today, it's going to be better. I'll, you know, I'll have a different attitude. But just

allowing myself to feel all of it. And it's the same thing like you say, Trista, with grief. Doesn't matter what kind of grief it is, whether you've lost somebody, whether you've lost yourself, whether you've lost a friendship or somebody to death. Like grief is grief is grief. And being able to sit in the uncomfortable. And just feeling the feels of it does help you get through it. Yeah. Not pushing it away and putting on a brave face. That doesn't help you like that's just, you know, it'll still, the grief and the loss will

still be there. So witnessing it and just honoring that, that is the moment for it. Like, for me, it helps me get through it. It's like, this is what life is and it does suck right now. But it's not always going to be this way. Do either of you write or like journal or talk to therapists or anything along those lines? All the above. I actually wrote a book.

I wrote a book for myself on this because I'm like, I need. Clear! You read a book? I didn't know that. About like to yourself, that's insane. I know. I mean, I literally, though, what do you do when you can't, you're sleeping two hours a night and in the middle of the night?

I just, I needed to write it down and to be able to look back. God, I always want to cry to. Sorry. As we were just saying, like, if you need a cry, then you cry. It's okay. We're going to be crying with you. I just wanted a documentation for my daughter when she was a baby, like what I was going through and what I would do for her and what, you know, I, like, I just wanted

her to be like, damn, that's my mom, you know, like, she's a survivor. she is resilient. And that's like the biggest thing I could ever want for my daughter is to be resilient. And I want to teach her what that looks like. And so just writing down everything because I can't possibly sit there and be like, remember everything that, you know, the darkest moments and the heaviest, hardest moments. Like I want her to see that and be able to read it and go or not even my daughter,

but maybe one day other people to look at as a guide of like, you're not crazy for no you're not crazy you're not crazy you know can you codel up you know one day maybe it's more of like a journal i guess but it's got chapters so it's a long one that's a book that's a book that's a book it's a novel at this point but it's like a silent witness to the pain and the struggle and the heaviness and like the experiences, the ups and downs of it all, like, I want to remember it for myself, too, as like, damn, I survived that. I got through that for you.

We'll see. I think I'm like just getting to that stage of wanting to write about it. I think I was in a point of like denial when I first had the diagnosis and then, you know, you have to kind of go through that period yourself and also just figure out, okay, well, how are we going to do this? How are we treating this? You're just trying to get through it, right? You're literally just trying to survive and figure out what's going on.

And then on the good days, you're trying to just enjoy the good days. So the days where I maybe had enough energy to journal, like I didn't want to go back into a mindset and, you know, get emotional or expend that energy. So I think the further out that I get from, not that there's not going to be really hard days, but just there's some really, really, really sick, sick days. and there still are here and there, but being able to talk about it where I can talk about it and it's okay to get emotional about it. But I think right now for me with my nervous system, it's just that is taking up so much energy to just sit and write and write and write and write and write about it. And so there's times where when it comes, I embrace it. I've, you know, started posting more about it on social media. I was very much like to show up, happy, positive.

if it wasn't that, I can't put it out there. I think I cried like maybe once on my season of The Bachelorette, just because when the cameras were around, I didn't. I was just so uncomfortable with showing emotion. Like, they, they clipped someone else crying over me because I wouldn't, like, cry. And show that emotion. They did? Yeah.

I think it was Katie Thurston crying. I think I talked about it. And they, like, what's called the Franken bit? And there's one moment where, like, they had, I had been done. like this and they like clipped someone else's crying from their season and put it over because I don't know I guess I wasn't crying enough I wasn't emotional enough but but yeah I think now obviously I'm really in those fields and in those difficult times and learning how to just like it's okay to show that and so I think with like social media that has been my outlet to to show up and be like

okay you know let me just hopefully putting this out here will at least help somebody or help you know, someone else not feel so alone. And I think I've kind of used that as a reason, which I don't know if that's good or bad. I don't think there's a good or bad. I think it's just you. Like, you just do you. That's hard too, though, because then you, you know, you want to show up and then be real. Because if I, if I snap a picture and throw it up there and it looks like I'm happy and I'm like, this crazy because I'm over here sitting on my couch sobbing because I have, I haven't been able to go do this and this. And I've been so sick and can't even, you know, take care of dogs, like all these things. But like a picture of me is something.

smiling on social media. Like, you can't even tell that I'm going through anything. So I think I, like, came to that understanding of, of wanting to share. Let's just be real with where we're at. Um, so I don't have to like fake a smile. But then you worry about, okay, well, then, you know, people are going to see me as negative or like, I'm always complaining or, you know, am I one of those people who is having a hard time? And then I turn on the camera just so that I can like, you know, video it and then victimize it. Like, like, it's so hard. It's like you want people to receive it correctly and you're so worried about that where I've kind of started to let that go and that's been really healing too of just the others' opinions on your illness or what you are,

what you aren't or what you look like or all of that. But again, like it comes and goes because there's days where it's really difficult too, but it's just illness is isolating. It's really, really hard and I think it's to talk to somebody. I mean, right now I'm not in therapy. I think eventually I'll get there. I just have like appointments every single day right now. So I don't have time to do that. And that is honestly my therapy with kind of the treatment that I'm doing. But of course. Yeah. Yeah. It's it's been doing different types of therapy, I think for me. And that's okay. I just didn't know if that was like something that has helped. either of you. And honestly, I'm kind of asking for myself because I'm not going through chronic

illness, but if you consider menopause chronic illness. Oh, 100%. Oh, my God. Yes. I think therapy is helpful for everyone. I think therapy is, I think everyone to go to therapy, whether, regardless of what you're going, you know, it's helpful. You have to find the right therapist and be okay shopping around for a therapist. I will say that. Yeah, true, true. You know, but I think it's. there's no wrong time to do to do therapy. Yeah, no, I just connected with somebody. We're going to

chat next week. And so much of what you're saying, I feel like people can relate to in their own individual ways about like posting on Instagram and showing up because, gosh, I, the imposter syndrome right now is like, I, I am struggling. I'm in a part where, or a space where I'm struggling,

just having two teenagers. majors having to like launch my kids off into their futures very soon. Max is a senior and Blake's a junior. And like my purpose of being a mom is changing. Emptiness just is not something that I've looked forward to because I've wanted to be a mom my whole life. And I know I'm always going to be a mom. But then you add the menopause and then you add just self-doubt and the brain fog and the memory and the lack of energy and no motivation to get to the gym. So I don't fit in my clothes. And you know, all of these things just compound on each other and the irritability and all of it. So I feel those, like what you were saying about social media so much because so many times I have

recorded videos like explaining it. And then I'm like, nope, there's people who are going through so much worse. I have a good friend who just lost her daughter. I, you know, like people like you guys are going through significant battles in your lives. And I feel like, Who am I? Like, why should I just be complaining about like, I have a great life. I have a great husband. I have great kids. And I'm not struggling every day with pain and doctor's appointments. So it always like puts me back in like, no, you can't share this. But then on the flip side, I'm like, but I should share because there are people out there. I know, I know. So that's the battle that goes on in my mind. So I totally relate to what you're saying about that. And I think we all

should just freaking not care about what anyone else thinks and just share our truth. Yeah, I was talking to Caroline Lundy. She was on, I believe, Ari's season of the Bachelor. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. She is one of my soul humans that I just love to death. But I was talking to her the other day about how it is hard to share. And, you know, I'm like, there's things that are so challenging. Exactly, exactly everything you guys say of like, somebody's got a worse than you. You know what I'm saying? Like somebody's worse than you.

And like you don't want to sit here and come off as too depressing or this or that. But and I was like I want to share. I just don't know how to share or if people even want to hear it or whatever. Like I don't want to be woe is me or whatever. But it's raw and it's real and it's authentic. But she was saying she's like, you have to share. And her point was she said, imagine if I didn't share about because she went through a lot of fertility, like she went through saving her eggs and a lot of fertility struggles in regards

to her her fertility. And she was like, imagine if I didn't share about that publicly, because that was my struggle at the time. And she's like, I was struggling and I didn't know if I wanted to share or not, but I shared. And I thought, oh, my gosh, if she wouldn't have shared her struggle with her fertility, I wouldn't have known who her doctor was and I wouldn't have connected with her doctor and my daughter who would have known if I have had my daughter if it wasn't for her connecting me and mentioning that doctor, Dr. Amy. Is that crazy how that always works? Totally.

And it was the greatest point of like this is like the reason to share is because there's always going to be the crazies out there that are like, but then there's people who are like, I am going through menopause too. And I have those symptoms too. maybe it is menopause or I have those symptoms too that you have Michelle and like, God, it's all making sense and I'm not the only one going through this or, you know, like sharing is who is it Robin Roberts? Like make your mess your message.

Yeah. Whatever you're going to. Like there is the right person and the right audience for that. That's all that it matters who it hits with. And it's your truth. Right. There's nothing in sharing your story. There's nothing wrong with sharing your story.

Absolutely. And in a way, I feel like it's very cathartic. and healing in itself to say like, this is my life and this is what I'm going through. And like, and, you know, like, this is me. If you want the polished, curled hair, makeup, perfect person, you know, that, sorry. Can you put that out there or that, you know, like social media. It could be like, that's not me. Those aren't the people that I want to, like, connect with.

The people I want to connect with are the people that are like, hell yeah, I get it. Yeah. Yep. Yeah. Totally. Yeah. So what does today look like in your bodies and what is the road ahead looking like for both of you? Different every day for me.

It's different every day. Like, I wish I did. And that's okay. I said, I did my hair today. Yay. And you look beautiful. You guys. I got up today.

That is a win. That is a win. Okay. Do you guys know there's a book? And maybe this could be something you could do, Michelle. I am not an expert, obviously, but maybe it's something you could do. There's a book that I have that's like you write down three, I think it's called three things, something like that, or you write three things that you're grateful for in that day.

And even if it's like not writing, if you feel like you don't have the energy, grab your phone and create a note or a voice memo or whatever, just of, and you could just say one word. I mean, it could be Jack, it could be today. It could be my hair. brushing your hair. Brushing your teeth. Gratitude can get you through a lot. Yeah.

I truly can. Agreed. I think I've seen that book at like Bronte Noble or wherever I was the other day. And just even seeing it just brings perspective of like, okay, I can always find three things to be grateful for, you know. Yes. I feel like that is really important. Even though you're living in this right now, like probably like a big flare, you know, moment. your life, not day, but moment in your life, I feel like focusing on the light, the positivity

is really important. And then just keeping up with your doctor's appointments. Yeah. It teaches you to be grateful, though, for like the small things. Wouldn't you say, Claire, just even everything you went through. And then you as well with just your husband, it's just life had to get so simple again at one point to even like rebuild. I feel like when you're going through those really hard moments because you do go back into like you're surviving. And so, you know, we used to be walking red carpets and doing all these things and, you know, cameras and all this stuff. And then now it's like I told you, I'm like I had trouble like even going to the fridge or whatever. And so there was a moment where it was like, you know, I did my hair today or

I got up and I was able to shower today without, you know, having to like lie down afterwards or I was able to walk down and grab the mail and come back up and then, you know, take my shoes off without doing, like, such simple things that we used to take for granted. And now I am like appreciating them. And it was so hard at first because I was frustrated by it. Like, I can't even do that. I can't believe I can't do this. Like this is something so simple. And now I, in my head, I'm noticing that I'm like, awesome. Like, we got to go do this today. Like, I'll talk to my mom in the phone and be like, oh, hey, mom, I was able to go get my mail today without. being out of breath or whatever it is. But it really doesn't make you appreciate and slow down a little bit and almost just embrace the time that you're going through. And I never used to do that. I used to like, what's the next thing on the list? What's, you know, what's the next trip that's planned?

Like I was always, you know, setting goals are great, but I was always looking in the future. And it was so hard to live in, you know, the present time. And this is literally forced me. And my body's like saying slow down. Like you have to learn how to slow down. And so I'm definitely learning how to live in the present. And I think that I actually appreciate that about this because I am able to enjoy the small things. And it's hard when you get to a point where you've done so many cool things.

And, you know, you go to like this movie premiere and you go to all this other stuff. And then sometimes you'll be doing something and you're realizing like you're not enjoying it as much as you used to. Or life is just kind of gray and blah. And when you have to slow down for something like an illness, you really learn how to. to appreciate the really, really small things. And so I'm just learning to love the small things again. And I do love that part about it. Obviously, don't love that I had to get sick. But it's just kind of a glass half full is small things are becoming beautiful again. And I think that's worth noting. I would say, for sure.

Hey, I'm Tori Webster, and I host That Digital Take. If you've ever wondered how the internet really works. From influencer culture to digital marketing and pop culture, this is your inside look. Each week, I share what's actually working online, the behind the scenes of building a career as a creator, and real conversations with people shaping the industry. Think of it like your big sister guide to the digital world. Follow that digital take on IHeart Radio or wherever you get your podcasts. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guide, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends, me and hilarious guests from Jim Gaffigan, to Bob Odenkirk, to David Letterman, help make you funnier.

This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and headwriter, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. There's the worst singer in the group. The worst? Yeah. Me. Is there anything to the idea that because you're from Harvard, you only got in because your parents made a huge donation.

The group. The yard birds, right? That's the name. The Harvard Yard. They're open. Do you have a name suggestion? We're open. Since you guys are middle-aged,

one erection. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Humor me. I need some jokes to make me seem funny. Imagine an Olympics where doping is not only legal, but encouraged. It's the enhanced games.

Some call it grotesque. Others say it's unleashing human potential. Either way, the podcast's Superhuman documented it all, embedded in the games and with the athletes for a full year. Within probably 10 days, I put on 10 pounds. I was having trouble stopping the muscle growth. Listen to Superhuman on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Clever Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show.

This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment. And the next, we'll talk about life, mental health, personal health, personal health, personal. purpose and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger.

So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Okay, Claire, what about you?

I know that you obviously, we're just in Thailand. We communicated while you were there because I saw Ryan in the airport, which was so random. I was like, wait, is your husband? Where was I? In Orange County, or wherever I was. And I was like, is he in the airport? She's like, actually he is. That's so funny. And it happened to when he was going to Colorado. Yes, exactly. And he ended up being on the plane in front of me, Michelle, two seats in front of me, which was so crazy. I, I, I know. I didn't get the chance to say hi because he went off and running after. I'm sure he had somewhere to be, but after we landed. But it was just so random. But I know you were just in

Thailand. Tell us how your diagnosis is looking like after your treatment and how you're feeling and what that road ahead looks like for you. So one thing I realized with like an invisible illness and something that is not crazy studied all the time and doesn't have like a quick easy fix is that it doesn't take just one thing to I guess quote unquote heal it. It's it's finding different modalities and for everybody it's different because no it never looks the same for two people right. So it's finding different modalities to support my life right now and kind of like day by day. Going to Thailand, it definitely, I, it was, this is a wild thing is that my skin, the second I got there, my skin started getting crazy better. Like, I was glowing. I was feeling

good. I was sleeping 10 hours a night. Like, it was heaven on earth. But you're also living in, like, a dorm room with nothing that can collect dust. And it's just bare bones. I think I took four, four outfits, like for a couple months. And I just lived in that in pajamas, you know, same thing. But I, I, it was humid. It was, there wasn't crazy pollens. And I just would go to treatment every week. And it was very simple. I was getting amazing sleep. I don't have a, I didn't have a two year old to wake up four times a night still. Yeah. They came out, they actually came out part of the time. But, um, oh, I love it. Yeah, it was great. But the, so when I was,

was there. My body, you know, I did, I was doing amazing and I'm like, oh, I'm better. You know, this is great. And then I came home and, you know, Northern California, a ton of allergies, a ton of irritants in my environment's different. And they say with what I have with topical steroid withdrawal, your environment is like 90% of your healing. And so it's impossible here to not be around irritants. I mean, bless Ryan's soul. We got. of every single carpet and every single thing in our house that would all our amazing pillows and our bed frame that was all, but everything was collecting dust. And dust is a big trigger for my body. Really? I did not know that. How do you not live around dust, right? I have like 20 humid,

or not humidifiers, purifiers in our house. Like it just is, it's impossible. So my body kind of rebound flared, but like I said, different modalities help support it. So one thing that's huge for me, and Trista, we can talk about this too, um, is, peptides. Tell me more. Tell me all. Oh, my God. It is heaven, heaven, heaven.

And they support my body so much. And I know there's... Oh, good. Do it, don't do it. Believe in it, don't believe in it. But for me and for what I've been going through, it is a game changer for me. Not only for my skin, but for menopause and perimenopause, it has been a game changer for me. So in...

Are they oral? No, injectable. Okay. Yeah. There's also nasal ones too. Yep. There's nasal ones for sure. Mm-hmm.

I know which one you're talking about. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So it's been a big thing. And I also like nervous system regulation is a huge thing with, I think with most ever, I mean, when is it not a big thing, right? But it, for one reason or another, my body still is fight or flight. And it's got this like protective shell on it that I just day. I mean, not even daily.

Like hourly have to remind myself. And that's why, you know, sleep is tough not only from pain still, but like being a mom and stress and menopause. And, you know, it's the combo of everything. So there's not one thing that's wrong with me and there's not one modality that helps me. I just kind of like incorporate what I need to as I need to and what works. And every day it's different.

but sleep is the main thing for me. Nervous system regulation, like not a lot of stress is a big thing for me. And then from there, I can keep my flares under control. My skin isn't crazy bad anymore. But, you know, like I said, I go hug a friend who smells amazing and delicious and has great perfume on and I'm set back. So it's brutal, but it's like I know our bodies are. amazing and our bodies want to heal. And so it's just giving my body what it needs,

when it needs it, and adjusting that daily because it's different all the time. And I know you both have dealt with lots of doctors. Have you both found doctors that you trust? Yeah? And they're helping you. Good. Multiple doctors. Yeah. You kind of have to find just somebody has an experience in a different area and a little bit of everything. But I was lucky enough to find it's a nervous system-based chiropractor. And so they're a doctor, but they have a specialty in just neurology, and nervous system in general. And with me, it was really, you know, I was having all these different symptoms. And so that's why I got into, okay, well, we see that you have been exposed to mold. And I could go through and I could detox from mold. But the issue with that is, is that my

system was still in flight or flight. So if I were to get exposed to mold again, which mold is everywhere, my body was for some reason not detoxing on its own. So I'm like, okay, well, then we need to obviously fix the system. And that's what this doctor really focuses on. And we do something called Insight Scanning, where it's these three different scans in every 12 appointments. I go and I redo the scans and they're able to see where my nervous system is at and my in flight or flight, all these different, like, so, so many different numbers and cues and HRV and all this other, but basically numbers telling them exactly where my nervous system is at. And when I go in for adjustments, basically Monday through Friday, you know, when you go into a chiropractor,

you can get adjusted for like 30 things. Like our body just is constantly moving, right? And if you have like pain, you know, tell them where it's hurting and they can see, like, maybe you have a rib out or whatever. but when you go into a nervous system-based chiropractor, they focus solely on that. So there's certain points in your body that they can adjust so that your nervous system is basically like rewiring itself and like rebuilding and detoxing. So my body has now moved to where I am out of fighter flight and I will, I'm at the point,

we'll bounce back and forth. So like, you know, but we want to get to the point where eventually I'll stay out of fight or flight. And it's like retraining my body, how to handle emotions, how to process things. That book, like, The Body Keeps Score. I've been reading of just, you know, everything you go through. You can process it, right, but your body holds onto it. So a lot of, like, different things have happened as I'm detoxing. Like, I go through a huge period where I'm, like, actively talking in my sleep, like,

poor Jack. But, like, I am saying the craziest stuff in my sleep, talking to him, having conversations. but my body is just detoxing and then I'll go through, you know, all these other phases while I'm going through it. So I can kind of feel everything like not moving around because like different symptoms pop up, but it's not a bad thing because it's just basically my nervous system showing that it's resetting itself because like you said, it's super smart. Our bodies are meant to get rid of this stuff on its own and whether it was like a traumatic event, mine they think came from a concussion that really set it off.

and then my body wasn't able to handle stressors. And so now from there, right, your body is not talking to each other correctly. And so you're having symptoms. Another stressful event happens. You're not able to process that correctly because it's already, you know, offset. And all these things just build and build and build and build. And then eventually it got so bad that it crashed and then pots to sad anonia. So basically we're like rebuilding from the ground up.

But it's been crazy to just like see my and feel my body work through these things. because when I first talked to them, I'm like, yeah, maybe, okay, like going to a chiropractor, but I've been to a chiropractor several times before. How is this going to fix it? But they really can key in on exactly what is going on, all these different points. I wasn't able to work out when I first started this. Every time I worked out, I'd get sick, brutally sick, because my body would think me being fatigued is me getting sick. So it would start, like, my mucus would start, production would start going.

my lymph nodes would swell, all these things. My temperature, I'd get a fever. But what was actually happening is I was just tired. And so they'd go in, they adjust me, and my body would go back to, oh, like, sending the correct signal. Oh, she's just tired. She's not getting sick. So we're going to calm her lymph nodes. We're not going to, you know, we're going to stop the mucus production.

It would stop within like 10 minutes of them adjusting. So it's just been like amazing working with them and learning stuff from them and the fact that they can just actually use these scans to track where I'm at. and help get like a really precise adjustment that has been like really fixing a lot of the pot symptoms and it's been amazing because like you said so many things are pretty much everything is based off the nervous system so yeah yeah Claire we'll have to talk because if there is I like highly believe in it it was something that I was like so skeptical at before and it just changed in front of my eyes it's it's pretty cool how they can teach your body how to pull itself out of fight or flight you just got to show up to the appointment I mean I can do that I can do that but this

Exactly what we circle back of like the point in talking about this all is that I would have never known about that. Like I still don't. We will definitely have to talk because I don't know about that at all. Same. You guys, I was writing notes down because, sorry, I was looking down on my phone, but I was literally writing notes. So Ryan just recently was talking to someone about the fact that firefighters live in fighter flight. Like they are, because they're trained at their job, they have to be ready for the bell to ring and for them to go to a call. And then when you get home, even when they're sleeping, but then they get home and they are still in fight or flight.

So like all of the, you said it was insight therapy is what it's called. Those are the, it's a nervous system based chiropractor. And I can text you the information too. But the insight scans are what they look at. Thank you. Thank you. Where, like, your nervous system is. It looks at your spine, how basically your two different, like, systems are

talking to each other, how they're aligned and everything. And, like, they lower down when they, like, tell me what's happening. They are so great about talking about it because it's, there's a lot of different high terminology and everything like that, but they definitely know what they're doing. But it's, I guess it's what chiropractic care used to be. and then it got away to the, into the, you know, like, let's crack the neck as hard as we can. And you know what I mean? You go on social media and you see those people who are like doing all the cracks and it's like satisfying.

I love to watch those, by the way. I do. I really do too and I still do. But, but yeah, I love this because it's like you correct the nervous system. And then, you know, the body is meant to handle all of this. So if we can get it back on track, then it will, you know, be able to detox the mold by itself or be able to get rid of, the autoimmune disease that's going on. So it's been, it's been unreal.

Like, literally has changed my life. So it's not a quick fix. No, and that's okay. That's okay. It doesn't need to be a quick fix. But it's a foundational fix for sure. Yeah, foundational fix. Also, I know we're talking about, like, me going to Thailand and, like,

your doctor, your carpenter doctor. And, like, it, for people listening, I'm sure it can sound like money, this is insane. Like, I can't afford that. I want truly deeply everybody also to know whoever is listening and if you are struggling to know that there are just as many things that you can do that are free that can regulate your nervous system. It might not be, I mean, obviously not the same thing we're doing.

Yeah. But don't underestimate the power of things that are free, which is like sunlight, vitamin D, grounding, like things that do regulate your nervous. system that will absolutely move the needle and help. Yep. There's like a lot of somatic care videos and therapy. Almatic care videos. Yeah.

Videos and I mean, I mean, so many things people can do. Even the power, like I said, the power of regulating your sleep and just focusing on that type of thing. But, um, and like books and things like that. But I, I want people to, if people are struggling to also understand that like, you can absolutely work on things that you have control over, you know, um, even they don't involve money too, which is sometimes you have to go to the ends of the earth for what you need.

And in the same token, there are those power moves that anybody can do, right? Every single day you can walk out, you can touch grass and not saying that's going to heal everything, but they help regulate our nervous systems. And that's at the root of it, like what we need, right? Yeah. Oh my gosh. Yes. I love all of this.

You guys, you're amazing. And I am not pitying you. I'm here along with you for your journey. I'm here for you. I don't want you to feel like you can't share because you're going to be judged. I want you to be able to share and be vulnerable and talk about what's going on. So hopefully this has helped a little bit in that way and connecting you too. I'm glad that you have each other now and you can connect and relate to what you're going through.

I am just so appreciative for you guys coming on and sharing this because I guarantee you there is someone out there who is struggling with, you know, something. And they heard something that we talked about today that you guys talked about today that will help them. So thank you. Thank you for giving us the platform in the space to talk about this kind of stuff because it's not always fun to hear and uplifting and, you know, Bachelorette Goss, but this is real life stuff, which in my world, it's more important. I put way more value on.

So thank you for having us, the space for us to talk about it. Of course. Another podcast from some SNL, late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group?

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