WRFH/Radio Free Hillsdale 101.7 FM - The WRFH Interview: Tod Warner

Episode Date: April 29, 2026

Tod Worner is a practicing internal medicine physician and is Editor-in-Chief of Evangelization & Culture—the journal of the Word on Fire Institute—and Evangelization & Culture Online. He also hosts the Evangelization & Culture Podcast. He joins James Joski on WRFH for a conversation. From 04/24/26.

This is Radio Free Hillsdale 101.7 FM. I'm James Josky, and with me today is Tom Warner, a practicing internal medicine physician, editor-in-chief of evangelization and culture for the journal of the Word on Fire Institute, and host of the evangelization and culture podcast. Well, thanks for coming onto the station, Todd. It's so nice to have you. James is so great to be with you.

Thanks for inviting me. Yeah, and could you start by just telling the audience a little bit about yourself where you come from, your background. Yeah, you know, I'm a native Minnesotan who I moved a lot of time a lot when I was growing up. My dad was a school administrator who was kind of rising in the ranks. And so we were everywhere from Chicago to West Virginia to Iowa to Minneapolis. I'm happily married. I have two daughters, one in college, one is looking at colleges.

I practice internal medicine. I'm a Catholic and I write a lot for a lot of different outfits. but especially in my role as the editor-in-chief for Bishop Robert Barron's evangelization and culture, the journal, the online space, and hosting the podcast as you've just introduced me. And I was pleased to be able to visit Hillsdale recently and give a couple talks because you guys have a very special school there. Yeah, and on that topic, so you came and gave a lecture titled How to Cheat in College and Med School, the Art of Being Formed and Not Educated. now that's a little bit of a inflammatory title but could you explain you know what that lecture was

all about yeah it was funny because uh the professor who was my who was my liaison and wonderful um person to meet when she saw the title she she sent me an email back and said you know could you elaborate a little bit more on what you're planning on saying so um i didn't mean to be overly provocative you know basically it's the story of what i did in college which was wrong um in that I decided I was going to go into medicine. And in the process of going into medicine, first of all, I jettisoned a lot of the literature and the humanities in the name of just kind of making a really robust science-oriented undergraduate education.

Because I thought I needed that to have every advantage to get into medical school. I've come to realize that by jettisoning that in college, I shortchange myself. And especially because we're students of human nature as much as we are of the human body, if we're practicing medicine correctly. So the whole point of the talk was to pass on to a younger generation of very bright students at Hillsdale the difference between being educated,

which is to have information conveyed to you and being formed, which is to be, yes, taking in information, but striving to become wise. And that comes not just with facts and data, but it comes with experience. And what gets formed in the process is intuition, common sense, gestalt,

instinct and the ability to read the room and so on. And so there's a lot of bricks that come out of our college education and our medical school education. But the mortar is how do you think about this stuff? And that's really rooted in the ineffable process of experiencing life and taking as much out of that experience as possible. And I'll listen to your talk. Of course, it feels very fitting that you come to Hillsdale College. of course you weren't a Hillsdale student but how did you first find out about Hillsdale? Yeah, you know, it was getting the imprimus in the in the mail with these incredibly compelling

articles that spoke to issues of the culture. And I think, you know, I've always been a fan of history and especially I've been a fan of kind of the ideological movements of the 20th century and before, you know, everything from the French Revolution and the Jacobins and so on. But moving in the 20th century, you know, the ideological movements of the, fascism, national socialism, communism, and so on. And what I've always been drawn to are people or entities that stood up to the ideological movements of the day. And to my way of thinking, Hillsdale has been a beacon of light in what has often been culturally dark and ideological times. And so in reading what Hillsdale has put out in Imprimus, following Dr.

Larry Arne's work, reading the works of so many of the great performance. that are there. And obviously, I'm a huge Churchill fan in knowing that your site, Hillsdale carries so much of the archives for, I think, the compendia of the Churchill works, the biography, and so on and so forth. It just seemed like this is a place I have to get to know more about. And I was honored to come and speak last year, and I was invited back this year. And it's just, it's been lovely.

Every time I visit Hillsdale, the faculty blow me away and the students blow me away. And I'm better for it. Now, Todd, listening to talk, you are definitely. very well-rounded person, you're referencing things from, you know, all over the liberal arts. Is that something that, you know, you were always kind of a jack-of-all-trades, or is that something you kind of grew a love for after med school? You know, it's a great question. I think I went through a bottleneck in a med school, but I will say I was raised in a house that had books upon books upon books. My parents were either teachers or school administrators, my older sisters, before they

decided not to go into medicine. They were thinking about medicine, decided to go in and teach. We were taught to look at the world with wonder. And our faith inspired us to appreciate the beauty of the world and the truths therein and beyond the world. And just to read and to learn and to strive and, yes, to make ourselves better and to make the world a better place. The bottom neck of medical school was just a matter of, you know, again, just kind of keeping your head down and just trying to get through it because there was so much to do. It was really after medical school, a little bit during medical school and in the residency and beyond that I started kind of reclaiming the reading of great works like Robert Frost, Jane Austen, Dostoevsky, Shakespeare, and others.

And what's interesting is not only was it a salve for me in the midst of kind of some dry academic times, but it also reminded me how very important it is to be a student of human nature as much as we are of the student body. He keeps saying the student body. Human nature as much as we are of the human body if you're going to be a physician. I love the notion of the complete person. We live in a world that's highly reductive. We live in a world of high specialization. And I think the general person, the complete person that lets their sciences be edified by the humanities, lets their faith be edified by reason, that's the complete person. And anybody's going to navigate their way through the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the,

travails of the world, they need to have a certain completeness in the way that they think. So not only that they can make it through, but they can help others to make it through as well. And now the med school bottleneck that you were talking about is that, you know, when you were going through that, did you say to yourself before med school like, okay, I'm going to have to kind of put all the other books away and put my head down? Or was it kind of a gradual loss of these other things you were passionate about? And there was a moment where you realize like, wow, like how did I get here? Yeah, yeah, it's a great, great question.

It was kind of a gradual loss. I mean, I, you know, I pride to myself like so many people going to medical school and many people, you know, going through other graduate programs and so on, you pride yourself in being well-rounded. And so you think, well, I'm going to kind of maintain that well-roundedness. Well, you know, all of a sudden you realize there's only 24 hours in a day. My dad always told me that med school was where you tried to put 10 pounds of manure in a five-pound can.

I mean, you just did not have enough time to get everything done. And so things just fell to the wayside. And it was literally my sister that was saying to me at one point, you know, you're drying up. You know, you're becoming, not inhuman, but less human. And I was burning out. And so it was literally, again, a reinvestment in my faith, but also a diving deep into the great works of literature and history that brought me out of the dark. And I could just, all I would say it to everybody, and it kills deal, all you students know this already. But this is a needless stuff that you're learning when it comes to literature and history.

theology and philosophy, it is the nectar of life that informs whatever profession you're going into. So I would just say to people who are, when you find yourself in that bottleneck, drink deep from the drafts that are out there from your theology, from philosophy, from history and literature, and you'll be made anew. This is Radio Free Hillsdale 101.7 FM. I'm James Jasky and I'm talking with Todd Warner. Now, Todd, when we were talking about the, you know, how, how there's such a time crunch in med school, I mean, even for students here or even people in their daily lives, do you have any, you know, practical advice for trying to find time to focus on these higher things of life?

Yeah. You know, the first thing I guess I would say is abandon the all or nothing approach. You know, some people, and I'm using a lot of certain cliches, but don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good. If you're in medical school or you're in law school or you're going to a graduate program or you've got a job that's incredibly demanding and it's just taking everything out of you. Don't be upset that you're not reading 100 pages of Dostoyeski every night. Sometimes during those real, real tight bottlenecks, read three. Read three pages or go, you know, go for an hour on a Saturday morning to your local museum and just walk around for an hour. You can go online. You have a phone in your pocket or in your hand.

Open up a website to read a poem from Frost or from Emily Dickinson or Blake or whoever it may be. It's sort of like intentionality I tell my students. You know, we have busy, busy schedules. And they sometimes, they just burn through their patients and they're losing the sense of vocation. And you're becoming saddled by a job. And I said the secret is that intentionality, engagement with your patient.

The thing that gives you the sense of meaning in your work beyond the problem you're solving, the secret is that doesn't have to require you holding somebody's hand for an hour. It can come in three minutes. Ask them what they're reading. Ask about their kids. Talk to them about the dog that they have. Or why do they name it this? What's the last film that you watch?

Something that makes that human point of contact. If you spend three minutes of patient each day, your day's going to be just a touch longer, but it's going to be that much more meaningful. So what I would say is don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good. find deep intentionality in your interior space, but also in your engagement with other people. And it'll make sure that you're living a vocational life. And now you started talking about the patient, of course, your doctor of internal medicine. Why is this approach to the completeness of, you know, the human nature so important in medicine for you?

Yeah, I mean, look, I went to medicine knowing the number one reason, I mean, there's a lot of reasons going to medicine, right? It's intellectually stimulating. You'll always be challenged. There's a certain amount of detective work that goes into it. You're going to be well paid. There's a certain amount of respect that comes to all that kind of stuff. But the bottom one is that, you know, I wanted to have a meaningful career. And the one thing I'll say about medicine is that you wake up in the morning, you go to bed every night.

All you're trying to do is help people all day long. And it's really, it really dawns upon you that there you are in your late 20s. And you're helping somebody who's three times as old as you are. And they're looking at you telling you things they haven't told their own spouse of 60 years. I've told their own family. They're scared about something. They're uncertain about another thing. And you're explaining it to them.

They're relying on you. That's a big charge on your shoulders. What I can say is when you see the brow become unfurrowed and their shoulders slack and the smile come back to their face, you come to realize, you know what? I helped a life today in ways bigger or in ways small. So at the end of the day, I just think medicine, it's a wonderful vocation. it's not just a job. And I think being the complete person, it's so important in the field of medicine because you're

not an anatomist dealing with a dead body unless you're a pathologist. You're not a chemist dealing with a chemical equation in a lab. This is flesh and blood, you know, brokenness, you know, feet of clay, just like mine. And that requires a certain sensitivity and understanding that transcends the biology and biochemistry you learn. It requires you to know the depths of the soul. And that's that's that's that's that's that's that's bottomless. How do you get to know all that? Practice your faith and dive deep into the greatest literature and history, theology and philosophy.

There is and and that's a great start. So you beat me to the punch. I was actually going to try segueing into how faith relates to work. But you kind of got there. So that that's my next question is how does your faith, you know, you work for culture, for Word on Fire Institute. How does your faith inform what you do not only in medicine, but also in your own? other jobs. Yeah, I mean, it's everything. I mean, it's everything. And, you know, once upon a time, I had a list of my priorities, you know, and I'd say, well, my faith and my family, my fitness, you know, my, my academic work, my, my, you know, fulfillment, you know, you make a list. How am I living my life? Then you say, I got to make sure I'm attending to this list of

priorities every day. Could I put a checkbox, a checkmark by each one of these things every day? But then it came to realize that my faith shouldn't be the top of my priorities. It should be the priority through which I look at all other priorities. And so the bottom line is to my way of thinking, my faith has informed my sensibility. It's crafted my lens by which I look at things and by which I practice. And again, I just think that, you know, it's sad because nowadays people step away from the permanent things, the deep meanings of life and they're pursuing all the surrogates, you know, honor, power, pleasure, and wealth. And you may find out now, you may find out 20 years from now or 40 years from now, it's empty unless you go to the, go to the actual source. So to my way

of thinking, faith, and that's what led me ultimately to working with Word on Fire is that I just thought it was an extraordinary ministry by which you can pass on this wonderful Catholic faith that I believe in. And it's been incredibly instrumental. And I will say one last thing about that, if I made James, patients bring up faith all the time. Now, the medical school say, oh, you don't want to go talking about it's like they want to talk about it they bring it up it's it's part it's intertwined in the trials and struggles they also know that i write and all this stuff so they ask me questions and so on but the bottom line is you don't you don't have to proselytize nor should you be proselytizing in the clinic room but you but you can have your faith be reflected in the care that you give

to people and if they want to talk about it then you can you can talk about it yeah that's awesome so I have another question here for you what work do you do exactly for word on fire then i know that you're editor-in-chief or evangelization and culture apart from you know what we're talking about now what do you what do you do for them yeah so so word on fire's primary outface outward facing um uh entity is evangelization and culture online which is you go to wordonfire dot org not to shamelessly plug but word on fire dot org and you'll see evangelization and culture which is effectively the essays and articles that we're putting out the podcast Cass, Bishop Barron, Bishop Robert Barron's homilies, and also works of the Institute, the Word

on Fire Institute. So I work in partnership with Caroline Foreman, a phenomenal person, but she's a senior digital editor. She helps with the overseeing of the online space. I'm the editor of the journal, which is from within the Institute, the quarterly journal evangelization of culture, which we've strived to make it the most beautiful, most substantive Catholic journal in print. and it has a theme with every issue.

So this recent theme is social media. The summer's theme is Cardinal Virtues. This fall's theme is literature with great writers, including some of Hillsdale's very own professors and some of the students as well. And then finally, the evangelization culture podcast, which is offered every two weeks. And it ranges from the academics to the priests to baseball players like Mike Piazza, to actors, to students, you name it. The whole point is to like Chesterton, G.K. Chesterton talks about,

You know, Catholicism touches everything. I mean, it's engaging everything. And so we should be looking at things, our faith should craft our lens. And so we should be able to comment on things and see the seeds of God's word and everything that we do. And so that's a word on fire tries to do. And I'm honored enough and privileged enough to have been entrusted with some of these responsibilities to make it happen. This is Radio Free Hillsdale 101.7 FM. I'm James Joskey and I'm talking with Todd Warner.

Now, Todd, everything you do, I'm very impressed by. It's very beautiful. How do you manage to balance all these things with also being a family and having children? And did you struggle in that balance? What have you learned from it? So I like to joke and say that I had a midlife crisis like every six months up until a couple years ago. And I tease my friend, a fellow physician who was my mentor and he's about older than me by about 16 years. What I want to say to people, and this has been helpful to me is that just because you get your degree and arrive at your first job does not mean you are defined. It does not mean you have arrived at who you are going to be in totality. You're going to be different as a parent. You're going to be different as a spouse. You're going to be different as you climb the ranks and you pivot that way. When you go through medical problems or you have a lose a parents or whatever the case may be, you're going to continue to grow and grow and grow. And what you want to do is you want to strive to fully blossom. And part of it is is getting a sense as to who you are. and what your skill sets are, and what do you think scratches the itch to make the difference you

want to make in this world? And so it's been a very organic process by which I started writing. That's a whole other episode, but started writing and then started giving lectures and so on and so forth. All I can say is I've arrived at this place where, and this is not bragging, because this is completely providential. I don't miss my kids things. We have dinner every night together. I go to all their games and their concerts and we help them with homework and one of them is obviously in college now. So we keep in close contact. We're very close family. So you don't have to give up, nor should you give up the depth of devotion to your family or your faith in the name of professional success. And I would just simply say honestly, honestly, honestly, James, this is all

happened because God just enlarge the pie for me. I can't explain how the efficiency has arrived at, how I arrived at the efficiency and didn't have to sacrifice a lot of other things. The one thing I'll say to you, though, is I love every facet of what I'm doing. I love being with my family. I love being married to my wife. I married up a thousand times over. I love being a doctor. I love writing and teaching and lecturing.

I love talking to you. So part of it is if you're feeling like you're just loving, it doesn't mean there's there aren't grinds and drudgery and all this. Of course there is. But you need to be, have a high standard for yourself. know what your skill sets are, know what you're discern your calling. You want to have a vocation and not a job and work towards it, organically develop it and open doors, knock on doors, open windows, crawl through them, whatever the case may be. And you'll be stunned at how you will ultimately arrive

at where you were hoping to arrive and even maybe more. But you'll be surprised because I never thought I was, I wasn't a Catholic in 2010. I was Lutheran. And I wasn't with word on fire years ago. So all these things have changed only because, you know, God led me on this path. Yeah, I'm just smiling, listen to you. It's just, it's such a, you have such a great way of putting things in perspective. Now, Tom, we have about a minute left. Are there any things that we did not talk about that you would like to add? No, I just want to tell you, James.

I mean, I met you when I gave my talk recently in the Hillsdale. I'm just so impressed with you as a person. I'm so impressed with your fellow students. I know, I know everybody worries about whether, you know, they're going to get into this school, they're going to get this job and, you know, it's going to work out with this relationship and so forth, so forth. I just want to tell all of you, you're achieving at such high levels, but don't confuse your achievement with your value. You are going to make it, but it's more because it's not only because of what you've achieved, but it's who you are.

So don't ever confuse your value with your achievements. Your achievements inform your value, but your value is simply because your child God, you're dignified. And so remember, if you're remember one thing from this talk, you're going to be okay. You're going to be okay. Whatever your worries are, work hard, yes, trust, pray, but it's going to be okay and enjoy life. There's so much to be enjoyed. That means a lot, Todd, and I hope it means a lot to our viewers and our listeners here at the station. Thank you so much for coming on. It's a pleasure being here. James is keep in touch, okay? Awesome. Our guest has been Todd Warner, a practicing internal medicine physician, an editor-in-chief of evangelization and culture for the journal The Word on Fire Institute

and host of Evangelization and Culture podcast. I'm James Josky, and you've been listening to Radio Free Hillsdale, 101.7 FM.