Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Trade Targets + 4 Nations Forecast

Episode Date: February 10, 2025

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee share some thoughts on the Super Bowl before looking back on the Leafs' 2-1 loss to the Vancouver Canucks on Saturday as they head into the 4 Nations Face-Off break. Then, they discuss whether now is the right time to make a trade, the Leafs' biggest need and who they should target at centre. Next, they share takeaways on the loaded-up second line, Max Domi's struggles and Morgan Rielly's strong road trip. Later, Gord Stellick (32:43) joins the show to weigh in on how the 4 Nations tournament can help participating Leafs, the lineup's tradeable pieces and Craig Berube's postseason outlook in Toronto.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Welcome into the real Kipper and show after a super weekend. Nick Kipper, Justin Bourne, Sammy McKee, Derek Brandeo, Jake Schultz with you. Schultz, Jake the snake. Am I choking or is that just Kansas City? Oh, a lot of Kansas City choke job jokes today. Yeah, yeah. Well, listen, well, plenty to get into. This is a two hour program. We'll continue on our Leaf edition this hour.

Wherever you're watching, listening Sportsnet 590, the fans, Sportsnet 360, Sportsnet Plus. Glad you are aboard. And then we'll go into our national hour. 90 the fans, Sportsnet 360, Sportsnet Plus. Glad you are aboard. And then we'll go into our national hour. We'll welcome in Jason Buchla. Always great to have him and his scouting expertise. Plenty to get into as we go into Four Nations this week. That's exciting.

Yeah, I'm pumped. In the meantime, we should clean up clean up so far the Toronto Maple Leafs Season up until this point more specifically Saturday night against a Vancouver Canuck hockey club where They could have found themselves still With a point or two not saying that they deserved, because I certainly didn't think that they did, did not like their game in particular, but leaving yourself on the fourth game of a Western road trip,

where you could still manage to squeeze something out was not bad. Not bad. Yeah, well, we'll give it a hard not bad on that. Yeah. There's plenty to go through in terms of who you liked, who you didn't like and all that, but you zoom out, four game road trip,

get some pretty good teams, you get six points. I think a lot of people looking towards the break at that point. I don't know, the last couple of games of that trip, not exactly the most thrilling hockey. Maybe that was just me but Yeah, I think you Pair the fact that a lot of these guys realize that they were about to go on a long break

With it being the last game of a four game Western Road trip That you maybe saw the result of that a little bit throughout that game especially with maybe some of the least stars that were potentially looking forward to Four Nations face-off game where I didn't think any of them were particularly good So maybe that had something to do with it, but even that Sammy It's one one yeah And Willie has a breakaway of seven minutes left in the game like it could have buckles off his stick for sure They were they were in the game. They you know played hard

I guess whatever But I think I think a lot of them were kind of looking ahead a little bit. Didn't you get that feeling? Little bit, little bit. Yeah. Wanna go to Craig Borubi's assessment of the road trip? Yeah.

Yeah. All right, let's go, we'll start that on our first Kippers Clipper of the week. Yeah, very satisfied. I thought that we played really good hockey tonight again. It was a competitive game. I thought they're a little bit better than us in the first, but I thought we were the better team in the second and even was pretty third was pretty even. But you know, they're a good team over there. They work extremely hard and I thought our guys were very competitive tonight and the effort was there.

Yeah, I didn't see the same hockey game he saw. No? No. What do you disagree with? I just thought... You do not agree. I thought Vancouver was better, harder on pucks, spent more time cycling, just hungrier. And, you know, if it's the end of a road trip to, you know, your point or Sammy's point that big picture stuff okay I get that

but I didn't particularly like their game Saturday. Best player on the rink might have been Elias Patterson guy who's much maligned old EP 40 I thought he had the puck a lot for the Canucks you know and the top guys on Toronto weren't top guys you know we. We've been saying that a lot. Think so? Yeah. So one of those things where it's like,

they need them to score, they don't win. Yeah. And they had a night where I didn't think they were great that Tavarez, Willie, Marner combo. Totally. Didn't work. No, no, didn't. And you have to put it, take into account

that the Leafs literally never win this game They've lost eight straight at Vancouver. Yeah It's bigger than that too. Sammy. It's like 17 of 19 or something way back They've been terrible they played a few extra obviously during the code during the code that you even brought that up It didn't just never be there because it's not the this team isn't the same team is the one that's lost Sure six times before that. So what you're going through is more of a fan energy crapple excuse. There are certain things in sports that are trends that just happen.

Like, I mean, the Leafs have won every game at Edmonton for however many years. But I'm with Kip. Typically, one of my least favorite stats is historic record versus the team Okay, and what was the last time they went in and had the type of goal-tenning that wall or stole ours has given them The whole year. Yeah, I've also had different players. Totally. I'm just pointing out that they have lost eight straight games Yeah, that's a long they don't lose like their record against pretty much Everybody is pretty good in the regular season like they have long winning streaks against a lot Of franchises for them over this era to have eight straight losses in a barn. It is a noteworthy It is it's it's wow

It's only smoking Joe's anyway, it's talking with the game and it's the the worst thing in the world is if you continually thinking that you're gonna have conversations like They could have easily lost if it wasn't for Joseph Wall. It could easily lost if it wasn't for stole ours They weren't better Saturday night if it wasn't for Stolarz. They weren't better Saturday night. They deserved to lose, and they lost. That's supposed to be the way it should work.

So I'm kind of glad for them that they're not having another way to go back and say, wow, Joseph Wall was unbelievable and saved the game. Like, they're going to come out of this four nations. Joseph Wall was unbelievable and Saved saved the game like They're gonna come out of this for nations Don't know whether or not the roster will be Completely the same as the one you have now who knows what happens between now and I don't know February 22nd second first game backs against Carolina against Carolina. Will they have a new look? Will there be a centerman in

The lineup or not? Yeah, I know they technically can trade kit But it sounds like they don't want them to trade the league right? This is the NHL's baby. They want the attention on it So if there's a deal that I want to make now or I don't want to give a team much longer than 24 48 hours to think about it or shop or like they're talking. Yeah, they're going to talk every day and you want to get someone in and set up and you can do it part of making an NHL trade and a big part is respecting the opposition to have some time to think about it, but not a ton of time to think about it. And then moving on, I believe that someone's going to put so many teams in it and the competition

to get players with so many teams in it. I can see one of them going, Gary, I'm sorry. I apologize. I want that player. one of them going Gary I'm sorry. I apologize. I apologize. But I needed to I needed to make this trade and I needed to make it now. And I wonder if now is not the right time like Monday today or Tuesday tomorrow like the tournament gets going Wednesday. Could do it now. Yes. Right this second. Scott Lawton. Rumors circling. What's that all saying swirling if you will begging for forgiveness Don't ask for permission. Yeah, yes permission and forgiveness

Beg for forgiveness and ask for permission. I'll stop correct that you nailed it on your final thing you did so so and so They've they've got you know, tree living worked at Walmart. He'd have a cleanup in aisle seven. We know that. And the cleanup is? The roster.

Oh, how much of a mess? Well, yeah. You need carton eggs on the floor? You can't score. You either score six like you did the other night or you scored two. Or one. Or one. You know, watching that game on Saturday night

and the scoring clearly has been something where it's been really up and down like you mentioned. But outside of the top four guys, if you go into the playoffs with the way your decor looks right now, you're gonna have 12 to 13 minutes of either Benoit, Timmons, Myers, whoever it is playing on your bottom pair. And I know you shouldn't get too bent

out of shape about the bottom, but I got to tell you, like that bottom pair on Saturday night with Benoit and Myers and just having to overplay these other guys. I know they need scoring, but that decor to me, it really, and you mentioned this before the show, but one of your top four guys goes down. You're immediately got Myers in the top half of your decor. It's just, they really do to me need an upgrade on the decor, like quite badly, in fact.

I think what's interesting is because they don't have a number one D, because they don't have that top dog, they really need to be great by committee. Morgan playing better, which we'll talk about, I'm sure. McCabe, OEL, Tanev, any of them go down all of a sudden. It's too many seat fillers and not enough guys. So they need and they, they need another threat back there. And Morgan's starting to come along, right? Offensive threat. Yes. Morgan's starting to come along right offensive threat. Yes Yeah, Morgan's starting to come along you could see him more involved great trip for him. He's he's

Thinking quicker. He's moving quicker. He looks quicker. He looks like he's anticipating where to be Better timing just starting to skate and then figure it out the first step is happening, but outside of that now and then figure it out. The first step is happening. But outside of that now, who's your second biggest threat? OEL, I'm watching OEL take some bad penalties this year. I think he leads the team in minors. You know what's stunk about that play is that

he has a great play. He was good on Saturday. For the bad penalty. I thought he was good. And somehow they find a way to score when he's in the box Yeah, I was it's gonna be some stat on that. Although it would just be randomness as well. No, there's about there's a he's taking at least a five or six penalties where I've seen him with a

shameful skate across When they drop the puck at center ice, so, you know the the really easy Drop the puck at center ice. So, you know, the really easy trade to talk about, and you know, there's rumors swirling over the weekend about Scott Lawton, and the guy that a lot of people are throwing into that conversation, naturally on the flyers is Wristeleinon, right? Who's going to be, I think he's missing the Four Nations due to injury, so I'm not sure but like is that the threat

you're looking for? Has he ever scored 10 goals in his career? That's not the threat you're looking for. I think he scored 18 two years ago. Really? So many. 18 two years ago and no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no Oh I'm on I'm on Scott lot yeah lot and right now That's not high enough for me, okay, you need to go get a guy that can Push John Tavares potentially out of that second slot Who's that going to be? Shen, Cousins. That's a high end, high end move. Scott Lawton has scored 18 goals once in 10, 12 years.

The rest of the time it's 10 goals, 11 goals. He had 13 and 82 games last year. 13. He's got 11 this year though. He's on pace for 19. It's not high enough for me. I'm with you. I mean, if you're watching, I guess it depends on what you're trying to do, but this team

has been running out Pontus Holmberg at second line center and third line center. You're better. You're better when you play he plays like can you picture yourself in the playoffs running a line at some point? You're gonna move Willie up and down I understand that but with Willie McMahon or Scott Lawton or Tavares McMahon, you know, like I just I think you get bogged down And trying to find somebody who's better than Tavares I mean put Tavares is a point-per-game player who's been shooting in the net a ton He's got over 20 goals like happens if you're not cars gets hurt well happens if he twists the knee who's stepping in You've lost confidence in Max. Yeah, so who who I don't know I

Right oh wow yeah, you know addition of our? Oh, wow. Yeah, you eat. Owl edition of our show. Yeah. Now, that's a very real issue that needs addressing. That's an issue here, right? You're talking about a 34-year-old center man who's okay, right? We're not sure. He's not a great playoff performer.

Yeah. Never been out of the first. Yeah, he once. Never been out of the second round. Correct. Let me ask you a question. You need back up there long term for the Leafs You like cousins more than Shen. I think for sure you'd say yes Yeah, what their ten years difference right an age short term this year Yeah, which guy gives them a better chance to win the Stanley Cup?

Shen But crap, but I don't think Shen is better than Tavares is right now. Like I think we're underrating Tavares. I think you're talking about different occupations. I'm talking about style of play in the playoffs. That guy, Sammy, that guy goes against Bennett. I understand. I completely understand what you're saying here, but like, I think you're a better team

if you have John Tavares as your second line center than Braden Schenn at his age too. Like I think they're very, it's a different conversation I guess. A proven playoff. For sure, for sure. Stanley Cup champion, the other guy I told you has never seen the light of day of a third round.

I understand what you're saying. I just, you know, I really do think that Tavares is being underrated in this conversation. And you're talking about him not, he's been the most durable guy in the Leafs over this whole time. He's played almost every game they've had. And if you need to start Shen at the third line.

Yes, sure, now we're talking. And you want to put him on the left side, I'm okay with that too, but I'm saying that if it falters, if you need to change things up, you need to slide a guy right into that second hole And I'm not sure Scott log Blotten does it for you. Mm-hmm. That's fair. Yeah, I think Shin is the short-term solution. He's you know, also on pace to be just under 20 goals this year

But we know he gives you a different type of minutes than most guys The other thing too and that listen not I'm not firing John Tavares, okay? I'm not telling you how to get rid of him before the season's over, but if you also get a guy like Shen or Cousins, it gives you tremendous flexibility to say to John, if you want to come back, here's the number and here's your role, but you're not second line centerman next year either As you turn what 35? It's time to move on

So yeah, I just okay. I don't Just feel good. It's really like I don't think next year of Braden Shen is your second-line center versus John DeVere is your better team Like I mean Braden Shen's old to is Shen your better team. Okay, he's almost 30 Disagree, I do Stylistic preference. Yeah, like, you know shocking playoff stats Tavares has 23 playoff goals in 20 in 62 games Shen has 11 and 70 games, you know, they're very different offensive very different, but I know what you're talking Yeah, anyways, alright, so Thoughts on Marner Tavares and Willy while we're at it.

Yeah, nothing there. Nothing there. Did they have any moments where you're like, ooh? Like, just, I know they barely played together. It was like five periods or something like that. But there was no moment where it seemed like we got something here. We have a clip from the coach on it.

Would you play clip two please, Derek? You know, I don't know, it's two games, or not even full two games, but I think just for me, you know, a lot of it is a guy getting in there in a four-check and getting to the net and just being that kind of rock, you know? They all want the puck a lot. It's a lot, you know, but it wasn't a big sample size.

So I made the switch right at the end of the second period and just kind of juggled some lines in the third a little bit. If these three cannot play together and look good, then you're really limited. Really limited. Well, I actually disagree. I just feel like at least you can spread them out. Like they're no better as a line than they are with two of them and whoever. Where you're spreading them?

Well, I mean, take any one of them and put that guy in the third line. And the second line is no worse than the third line is better. Like they give you nothing out of that. So could Willie play with the third line is better. Like they give you nothing out of that. So could Willie play with third line? Yeah. Can Willie play with no McMahon and Domi can maybe short term but like Marner play with them. It won't be enough. No, it won't be enough. No, I agree. It's not enough. But there's nothing there for them to get. Like I said, it limits you. Yeah. But did you option you can't use? So yeah. Did you see anything out

of them that would be like, No, no, no, I did not. Yeah. But did you? It's an option you can't use, so yeah. Did you see anything out of them that would be like, yeah, no, me neither. I did not. Nothing. It's a really good point, just like who, you gotta tell them not to dump the puck, cause no one can go get it. And then you're right back to Matthews and Marner.

I know you wrote that article last week on how it's either this look or you gotta go find another look. Yeah, last year going into playoffs, who was it with Matthews, Domi and who? Bertuzzi. Bertuzzi. You know, can you do pairs of Willie and Matthews, Marner and Tavares again and, you know, go from there?

Or can you try three lines? We've only been saying that for five years, can you try three lines? We've only been saying that for five years. Can we try three lines? But you go to jail if you do that. I think, and I'm not going back, but I am gonna go back. If you have another highly skilled kind of guy in the middle, wow, it opens up way more options now. That's where they're just handcuffed a little bit. Yeah, it opens up way more options now That's where they're just

Handcuffed a little bit. Yeah, it would be awesome. Yeah, totally on board. Everyone's a yes on that. Yeah. Yeah So yeah, I just will they try the line again. Should we listen to him? That's a great clip. Why don't we play that Ruby? Yeah Would I try it again? Maybe Who knows right? We'll see up down the road what happens and where it goes. I mean, you're always kind of moving guys around a little bit and trying to find a little more offense. We just couldn't find it back in the net enough tonight. Remember when somebody asked Keef about playing, they played Sandine and Morgan Reilly together. He's like, will that be a look that you'll go back to?

No. And he literally never did it ever again. No. I've seen enough. Matthews, Tavares, and Willie, like they're really highly skilled guys. Like they should be able to kind of figure it out, but I

think it was Just before Willie's breakaway. Mm-hmm They gave up a 140 foot three on two, you know Yeah, it could easily have been in the leaf net and and Willie doesn't get an opportunity to hang back and and and poach. Yeah, it does change things. I don't know. Maybe Matthews, if they're doing a super line, Matthews at center changes that and one of

those other guys plays with the other. Best two guys, I don't know, but doesn't seem like super lines are a great option. No, they're trying their best to make the Dome thing happen with Knives and like I think he's looked somewhat better I guess because he's playing with good players he ends up with an assist but like it's just not It's not in power play. It's not it's not undeniably great where you have to keep going back to it So you guys remember the play against the flames where he got the puck in the slot and turned away from the open slot Yeah, it's just like Kip in all these guys you're talking about,

these big salary guys, Max is in trouble here. Like, he makes, was it 3.75? You gotta move some money? You can't go and you can't go get a big name centerman without moving money out. Someone has to go. And I don't know, were they showcasing Max a little bit? Playing on the top line? Or if not showcasing him, just being like, this worked last year with

Matthews, can we find out if we can use it? And I'm not saying, you know, it needs to happen. I'm saying that if you're looking at a big name and money has to go out, it doesn't take long until you end up there. Yeah. Like just do the math. That's all. It's not even an opinion. Yeah. Just do the math. That's all. It's not that's barely it's not even opinion. Yeah, just do the math. It might still not be enough to get his three and a half out. You might have to tack on another home burger. I tell you what, if I was any team and Toronto's knocking on my door, I'm asking for McMahon. Yeah. I mean, they're just doing that. No, they're not doing that. They're not.

How about you? But when you start talking about anything past Easton Cowan or Minton, you're like, I want something that I like. I'm not taking your trying to get rid of guys. Yeah. It gets a little of guys. Yeah, it Gets a little tricky I mean it would be so easy for them to trade literally the only guy they've ever won a contract on with McMahon

I'm just saying we're getting way too much value in it right now McMahon and knives have almost combined for 40 goals They've got 53 games. I think it's 21 and 17 Respectively, you know those are I would say going into playoffs they haven't had a fifth guy, let alone two other guys who are scoring options like that in the past. You know, so this is they're already ahead of the game with those two but lose one that's true. You give up Cowan you give up Minton in the first round or it doesn't solve your crap or your your cap crunch. Well, it doesn't. Well first rounder. It doesn't solve your crap your your cap crunch

Well, right it doesn't well It depends it depends if you're giving those guys up for retention as well like are you know depending on what the contract is? I don't think you're getting retention on Dylan cousins because he has so many years left But but I mean who like yarn crocs a number camps a number Yeah, like a point Like Yarn and Croc's a number Camps a number Yeah Dolmy's a number. It's like those are the three Yes numbers outside of your core guys

Yarn and Croc's gonna be interesting cuz I think is he gonna have any games to play before they have to make a decision on No, no. Well, I think I've seen it. We all know what you're gonna get. I don't think you can bring him back At all? Well at the end of the year playoffs Well, I mean, what if he's healthy? No, you're not? No, you're not. Oh, no, no, no, no, you're not. What's Nick Robertson make? 825? Nothing. Yes, 875. There's a little bit of failure in the contract. Morgan Reilly? Yeah, you want to get to Barubey's thoughts on Morgan Reilly? Yeah, I'd love to. He's been really good.

I think tonight again, he had an earlier chance in the second two, going in back door. So he's definitely moving better and activating more and looking to produce more. Great. Very encouraging. He's playing faster. Yeah. Very encouraging. He was too slow before but it's crazy that this is a

Tangible change that he just made that they were just like we need you to do this more and he's doing it more and it Looks way better. It's nice that there seems to be a fix Well, it took him so long I think out of the trip the most encouraging things for me or six points at eight, which is great And then number two is Morgan Riley looking somewhat like Morgan Riley still ours back and looks good Yeah, but I still think I mean, you know You're not pulling your hair out if it's just wall and you got to work stole ours back in but like Morgan Riley playing The way he was before this trip was definitely a big issue for the team

So hopefully I mean if there's one guy that didn't want to break right like you finally get your mojo going back you're finally feeling good and then it's like you're Morgan wants a sure but like you know what I'm saying yes I do yeah someone tweeted you know everyone's been making big fuss about him having a newborn or whatever and they're like let's see if he's better on the road when he gets to sleep without the the kid you know hotel room and just see if he plays any better it's like oh played way better can anyone defend the kid we don't even know if the kids like super quiet or screaming up all night is he turning butter at home like maybe the kids knocking back eight hours a day

you know I don't have it listen I don't a kid I have no leg to stand on but like you're making seven and a half million dollars Can't you get like some help with this like you can I don't know I don't know I Couldn't gotta feel to me. It's not like having it. Let's get a bigger house. Doesn't everybody have a room. That's quiet Are all the memory? I don't want to speak at a turn. I already yeah I I'm not one that goes to a screaming baby as an excuse for having a poor half season But he did look good on the road. I mean those hotel beds rock So maybe just getting really good night's sleep. It's pretty good. Did you guys want to touch on the Leafs? Four Nations related things. Oh, sure. What did you want? What's a brew?

We want to work on coming out of the break penalty kill He mentioned we can play it, let's play it. We want to just kind of keep focusing on our play without the puck for sure. Now there's areas our power plays improved dramatically in my opinion. They're creating momentum even if they're not scoring. So our PK has got to, well it was pretty good on the PK this trip, but we've kind of given up a little bit goals lately on our PK and we've got to tighten that up for sure.

Like I said, there's, you know, for me, it's, uh, we get back playing again, it's going to be a grind. March is a real busy month and it's going to be a grind. It's going to be a hard push cause it's a very competitive league and there's a lot of teams in it. They go right into a back toto-back I think Carolina, Chicago. Yeah looking around the league LA has it the toughest. LA has played the fewest games in the NHL so they've got they've played 53 times so they have almost 30 games to go once to come back.

That's hard Leafs are at 55 most teams are 56 57 so Leafs will have a fairly compact End-of-season schedule and just to mention the penalty penalty kill thing for the first time this year The power play is ahead of the penalty kill. Is that right? Yeah, the penalty kill is now sort of the power plays up to 12th and I believe the penalty kill is 13th Power play since January's flip it around over 30% Yeah, and the penalty kill has leaking cool leaking oil a little bit. I Notice the lines from the four nations are kipper thought you might notice the first. Yeah, I did. It's like I told you guys Nobody listens to me

Marner Mcdavid got Marner Mcdavid Reinhardt Marner. That's what I told you guys for Canada Yeah, Mcdavid got Marner. I gotta say here Kipper. This is high stakes for you. This is high stakes I'm sorry. This is high stakes for you because this is a massive massive opportunity for Mitch Marner and We've had a lot of conversations on this show where it's been contentious at times, which is great for radio. But like, he needs to have a great tournament

for like a lot of people in this market. Like if he goes out there, it's not looking good. He gets bumped down. Like it's gonna be a massive inferno. Not just- If he gets bumped down, they're not even playing against the US in the final. But not in Toronto.

This is turning into a country-wide story. Like, we talk about Marner all the time here, but him being on that top line, the eyeballs are on. This line is going to be so good. So good. So good. I agree. Should be great.

Should be really great. The one takeaway I have for these lines. High stakes for Kippy. That's all. But he could poop the bed and he's still gonna make like 13 million bucks next year. I mean, maybe in another uniform. Well, yeah. But like, I don't.

You don't think there's pressure to play on the top line for Team Canada. So how is that any different from anyone else right now? Well, because not everybody else is Mitch Marner. Well, that's just. And the superstar of the most popular team. It just proves my point that like, else right now. Well, because not everybody else is Mitch Marger. Well, that is a superstar. Just kind of popular team. It just proves my point that like that's what that's the scrutiny this guy's been on that that that no one else has.

But that's what the money is for playing in the biggest market in the country. Yeah, but it should be the same for Matthews and and Willie and it's going to be well no it's not because it's not Canadian. But if they were Canadian, it would be. They're not Canadian. They play for the States. They play for Sweden. It's a totally different thing.

I don't know what it is. I don't know if it's birth certificate related or just people just- But you can't sit here and say that him on the top line of Team Canada with Mick David is not way added pressure and way added stakes for a guy that's sometimes under pressure and hasn't gone great. That's it. That's all I'm saying, buddy. Listen, uh, I, who knows how it's going to look.

I have no idea. And maybe, maybe it's going to look really good. Maybe Ryan Hart and McDavid get sent down to the second line. And then a couple of guys get moved up to Mitch Marner's first line. I don't know how it's going to shape up. I love you, buddy that one I want to read these lines I read the lines over yeah we'll get more to this it's Reinhardt McDavid Marner decent Stone Crosby McKinnon Jarvis who was in for connect me who was sick today

but Jarvis point and Marshawn and your fourth line of Hagel, Sorelli and Bennett. Your top pair is Taves McCarr, Shea Theodore, Drew Doughty, Morrissey and Colton Pareco as your bottom pair. Sandheim is the seventh. It feels great to see Drew Doughty in there. Yeah, McCarr didn't give his number for him. McCarr didn't give his number to Doughty. Why would McCarr have it first? He's Drew Doughty. No, because he's a late ad. my date Dowdy's weren't 89 and mccarr's running eight Anyways we should go to break to get the gordo but there you go. There's the lights Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, I should probably It's true dowdy. No worries trophy Stanley cups. Let's Hall of Fame comment Yeah, let's give it up should have given it up. Um, I'm sorry Is that a closed thing now or is that can still be done by Wednesday? No, I don't think so

I think he was wearing 89. I betcha doubt he was like a I'm happy to be here. I'm late edition I'm not there's no way they maybe offered it needs and he said no, I'm gonna wear another night I guess it happened. Yep How about throwing a puck in the corner and you throw in Jarvis Koneckny, Pointe Marchand, Hagel, Sorelli, Bennett. Like I'm not going to that corner. Just an absolute rabid ferocious group of four checkers there. Love it.

Lots to look forward to Wednesday. It's Sweden. Canada, Sweden. Game one. Is it APM? APM. Sneaky one for Canada. Tough game.

That Sweden team. Like I've seen it laid out. Good mix of players on that team. Anyways. Okay, let's take a quick break. We'll bring in Stellectricity. Always great to have Gord Stellic join us when we return to Real Kipper and Born. Hey, it's Blake Murphy. And I'm Matt Bonner. Join us weekday mornings at 11 as we break down all things Toronto Raptors. It's the Raptor show on Sportsnet 590 The Fan and wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome back to The Real Kipper and Boran Show. Nick Kiprios, Justin Boran, Sammy McKee. All right. Let's not hesitate because he's like must see TV podcasts slash YouTube slash whatever

we have. Gord Stalick joining us now. Sportsnet.ca does it all. Well, no, not really. You don't do anything on sportsnet.ca. Forget that. Scratch that. So I'm trying to build them up. Okay. No, not really you don't do anything on sports.ca forget that scratch that So I'm trying to build them up

Okay Now you guys are out justin's on sports.ca the last I did write for sports.ca was mostly obituaries There were tributes that they were well done well written but anyway, hey kippy you and I still with the Toronto Star, so I do a little bit of writing. My last article was about how I thought Four Nations could come into play for particularly Austin and Mitch and Willie and someone should be coming back with some juice, right? Do you like the fact that the Leafs have gotten, what, six out of eight points on this road trip and they're shutting down now?

Or how do you view this break overall for the Toronto Maple Leafs and the three stars? Yeah, well, I'm still from that era where there was no such break, so I just feel you wind it down, is it hard to wind it back up? I know it's been part of, and it should be, you know, the whole thing about rest

and getting breaks and what have you. Bruce Boudreau would talk about 2010. His Washington capital team never really got going again after the long Olympic break. So I guess every team is kind of equal in this boat. I look at it more, Kipii and Justin about, as you mentioned, what a great challenge for three players, Auston Matthews, Willie Nylander and Mitch Marner, you know, to have playoff style success. Like one of them should be coming back with a gold medal.

None of them have any have had any substantive playoff success with the Maple Leaf team, as we well know. So I'm viewing that particular part as a real positive. I think this Four Nations is a real positive for the Toronto Maple Leafs compared to probably most of the 31 other teams. The only thing I do consider about it Gord is like they rely so much on their top guys. Is it a disadvantage that their top guys all have to go play hyper competitive hockey while other teams who are maybe less top heavy are resting there guys does the rest factor going to come back to bite the leafs here having them all involved? Yeah what's interesting is Washington's one team maybe the

only team that has nobody none yeah in the foreign and you know in the in the four nations and and they're as good a team as there is in the NHL right now I just think like like I think this is different than the all-star game I think the all-star game's a pain in the NHL right now. I just think, like, I think this is different than the All-Star game. I think the All-Star game is a pain in the ass to appear to if you're among the elite players and you do that every year. So I just think, and because this is so quick, I mean, this is like a kid's hockey tournament, right? And you're all of a sudden showing up and you've checked into the hotel, then you lose your first game and you already start saying, we better consume all those beers tonight. Cause I think we're going to be checking out early tomorrow and driving back

because what team will be doing that quite early in this or that kind of mentality? So I just think and I talk about it. They all want to play best on best, whether you're Sidney Crosby, a veteran, where the younger guys like Matthews, Marner, Connor McDavid, I mean, they always have wanted to. So this to me is a great hors d'oeuvre, a cocktail party getting ready for the Olympics next year. So I really look at the positives of this. Our boy Sammy here has declared Mitch Marner tradable

if he doesn't look good with Connor McDavid here in the next week and a half. So in saying that, where is this style of play gonna be different for you? What's it gonna look like for Mitch Marder playing with a guy like Connor McDavid compared to Auston Matthews for you? Think pretty much the same.

I mean, geez, you're playing, and then they get to play with a two-time first team winger as well. I mean, great on great. It's more for a guy like Dulland being able to play for a country, elite country coming from the Buffalo Sabres to get that kind of experience. I mean, that's the thing.

I mean, the Toronto Maple East, the Edmonton Orders have incredibly skilled players. So I guess it'll be another experience, but a lot of times guys like Mitch don't get enough credit for what they bring to Evers on the line as well. So I just think it's a chance. Be the star, be one of the stars. Whether you're Willie Nylander,

not wearing a shirt post game, or whether you're Mitch Martin for Canada, or you're Auston Matthews, one of them is going to win it, unless Finland's a big surprise, like Team them is going to win it, unless Finland's a big surprise, like Team Europe was getting to the final in 2016. And hopefully they're one of the stars of that particular thing. And for the other two, hopefully, whether it's, you know, Mick Canada doesn't win, Mitch

Marder the chance to play with Mick David. And I don't like, I don't know, what do you get off playing with a guy who made it to game seven of the Stanley Cup final? That intangible. We're looking for so many intangibles and how it will factor in I Could I can oh I can't quantify it, but I can only think it'll be a positive The funny thing about being on Canada is like if you get if the lines get shuffled who you're gonna get Crosby McKinnon, you know, like yes, there's no demotions. You're playing with unbelievable players no matter what so

Those guys are gonna be a big part of the Leafs push for a Stanley Cup this season. It seems like there's probably another player too who currently aren't on the roster who are going to be a part of it. Gord, you know, how desperate are they to go big? We talked before we had you on earlier on today about getting a Cousins or a Shen. Do you think there's enough there that they could avoid getting the big name or are they gonna have to pay a steep price to get quite a bit better here? Yeah, I don't know what the market is. I think it's the time, you know, if you're gonna have a first round pick, the time of doing it for a higher gun is done. Okay, the Ryan O'Reilly Nick Foligno era of making that kind of trade is over and losing the player at the end. And you know, you guys have written about in Sportsnet, just even Carolina now kind of looking at if they have no guarantees on Mikko Rand,

and he could possibly be in play again, because it's just a lot to give up for a hired gun. So even like when they got McCabe, he had term, and then he decided to re-up. And I just think those are the more positive kind of deals to make. There's no question they need more secondary scoring. There's no question whether, you know, Max Domi does a great role.

He can play any position on any line. That's a real positive. He played center last year in the playoffs, but those kind of guys have to give you more secondary scoring. The D-Core has to give you more secondary scoring and a new player or two. You hope that's something that that could add. So I know that Braden Schenn's got term left. So that makes it attractive that kind of player to have in Toronto. So, you know, and, you know, let's face it, Brad for living, looking to probably make more of a mark this year in what he goes out to do, you know, it's the Vegas model. They're always

aggressive and they're aggressive and their guys stay, you know, and that, and I think that's one of the things you want to try to find. Of late, the best way to get a new contract is to get traded, because it seems like it's in the works before you get traded one or two days later, whether you're Marcus Pederson in Vancouver or Borgen in New York, you know, you get a new contract. The catch-22, Gord, is that even if they were going to go get a significant name, the cap won't allow it unless you move some money out. You mentioned Max Domi, he's just under $4 million. David Camp is out there as well at $2.5 million, if I'm not mistaken.

Are you okay losing these depth players to go get maybe a bigger fish at center ice? Well, it'd be the kind of thing that you'd be to your point, Kippy. It'd be the again. Are you able to get somebody in on the deal to be a banker that helps you do that? Because no, I'd rather like to keep the deaf pieces, you know, better than anybody. Well, that's one thing. First of all, your ranger team, the depth you had 94, but even look at Barubi's team, you know, just in 2019, like there were 15 different forwards that played the 12 spots, like they moved in and out.

So ideally, if you do the Bank of Chicago or the Bank of whatever, that would be a positive thing on my wish list, because you want to try to keep the role players that could play a role and hopefully play a significant role or a positive role in the playoffs. As they, you know, gear up for the other side of this, Craig Berube, this will be his first playoff push with the Leafs. What impact do you think new coaches, obviously Savard new as well, and Lambert, what impact will new coaches have in giving it, I

don't know, make it feel different than past years, maybe? Well, not as big a role as the new goal tenning. Like the new goal tenning, you know, plays like they have played and seen Stoller's comeback was maybe as encouraging as anything the first game back. So as you know, Justin, you know, the coaches will say that, you know, find it, find me a great coach, and more than likely, you got great goal tenning. And, and right

now that that's a huge, huge plus for the Maple Leafs. So the side, because the subtleties are intriguing because there's this magic that Borubi worked in 2019 as a coach, but the St. Louis Blues did as a team, but they only won one playoff round after that. So, you know, you had five years where it's not like it worked every particular year, but the newness seems to quite often hit on the first year. So all the subtleties, you know, I'm not aware of. Certainly, you know about the fact that there's more, seems to be accountability when you talk about

the North-South game, the two-way game. It's not like Sheldon Keefe totally ignored it. Is there more of a buy-in? There seems to be, it seems that the players alone, just by birthsage of maturity, becoming veteran players, are learning to be more and more complete players. So I've seen all those particular things, but the best thing I've seen is the goaltending and when healthy, not elite defencemen, but the depth of the core 4D as being the biggest positives. Gordon, a few weeks ago I wrote, maybe even further back, I wrote an article about how

the Leafs should really go for winning the Atlantic or winning number one in the league. They were that close. Now we look at it and although the Leafs were able to win three out of four on the road, I think the Tampa Bay Lightning ended up or Florida Panthers, sorry, ended up winning I think five or six in the last little while here. How important is the last 30 games here, 28 games to go out there and still push for an Atlantic division championship regular season. Yeah, Kipy, I have all your articles in a scrapbook, so I'll check later on and text you back what day

you wrote that article. They're not pinned in your bedroom? Well, no, no, let's not go there. No, no, it's in respect to a reading place. I have my Ascot and my Sifter, Brandy, and my pipe, and I sit back and just look at scrapbooks. I love that. But you know just see that that's a funny animal. What does it mean? Like you know the two best regular seasons Boston a couple years ago Tampa Bay years before that they got eliminated upset in the first round of the playoffs you know so but I do think in the Toronto situation Kippy you wrote about it we've discussed with Justin and I've maintained like, make a difference, go out and kick ass again.

Like go out, go out. Like show you're the top team in the Atlantic division. Florida doesn't need to do that as much, but go out and set a message that we're going to get home ice advantage. We're going to kick ass at home as well. We're going to have it. It's going to be a difference maker in the playoffs. So I really subscribe to that. And the one downside of late is they

started sliding back and you're right. Florida went on a run boy Tampa based on on a run again. All of a sudden. I know the Leafs eliminated Tampa Bay a couple of years ago, but man, I don't like them being around either. So that I maybe the last through the season, they can pick that up again. You know, they've gotten rid of a lot of the most difficult travel and, and, you know, really hone, really hone it in instead of worrying about Auston Matthews getting 60 or 70 goals. That's not a shot against Austin.

They just mean last year became kind of a strict distraction. Let's just get whatever that Craig Barubey style he wants you to play, whichever coach wants you to win. That's the style they play. The idea is to win and do that and possibly get back where you are first in the Atlantic division. I think that's an important goal this year. All right, Gordon, last one for me before we let you go.

Focus back on the four nations if we can. I want to get your thought on where this tournament will matter, rank, how it'll feel compared to historical, best on best. I was trying to imagine when the final buzzer goes, are gloves going in the air? Is it a championship to that level? What do you think this tournament is going to mean historically for hockey fans? Well, maybe kind of like the Challenge Cup was, best two out of three in 1979. You know, granted, Soviet Union won the last game against Team Canada, so it's not a good memory

for those of us that remember it. I think it's going to be kind of a one-off that it's gonna be bigger and better. I think it's a start to get every two years some big international event, one being the Olympics, then two years later, at least the Six Nations Cup, and you know, maybe have a bit more of the, maybe we'll find out you don't need the round robin.

Maybe this will be the one that you said, actually not having the round robin made a special. Otherwise it's awfully quick. You know, it's like, you know, for, but, so it's like I said, it's the hors d'oeuvre. Like the Olympics, we know you've got the round robin and you can have a clunker like they did in 02 against Sweden, for example, and go on and that's kind of what

we're used to in the world juniors as well. So time will tell, but I don't think it'll it'll resonate with big big lights. I think the 2026 Olympics, particularly with the absence, you know, the last couple of times of NHL players will be much, much bigger when you look back. So it's an adorav but it's not a Dante's Fiesta. It's not it's not right. No no it's not and I could have used one of those yesterday or a Super Bowl Sunday as well you know I I was just focused on I'm eating better but man that football game you kept going seeing what's

left in the kitchen. Needed a little something extra yesterday yeah Yeah. Yeah, the Dante's Fiesta is next year, Kiffy. That's for sure Gordo you always give us a little extra on this show. I Appreciate it. So Eddie will talk soon. Enjoy enjoy that what the four nations face off, right? We're sports Enjoy the FFF when when the three of us show up on your doorstep for Wednesday night 8 p.m. Puck drop. Is there anything we can bring? Maybe a Dante's Fiesta Yeah, looking forward to it and FFF I think that's the marks we got in school as well So that's why we're on the broadcast side so fresh off their Dante's Fiesta

with extra peppers Thanks for doing this buddy. See you guys. Thanks Gordo. That is Gord Stalek, Toronto Maple Leaf Analyst for Sportsnet 590, the fan and former general manager of the Toronto Maple Leafs and provides nothing for Sportsnet.ca.

The four nations schedule for those who don't know. Canada plays Wednesday, US plays Thursday, everyone plays Saturday night, which is going to be really cool. And guess what? Canada plays at 1pm on Family Day. So anybody that goes one and two is basically out. Yeah, yeah, that's no, literally, that's it. Basically out out. So if you lose on Wednesday, that's a little pressure

Yeah, you lose on Wednesday, then it's immediately must win USA Canada on Saturday night at the Bell Center. Oh, they go over to that's a disaster summit the US Presum it USS Finland Thursday at 8. It's going to be awesome. Did you hear that? They called up some kid I'd literally never heard of for their decore. Well, it's funny because... Who's that, Finland?

Yeah. Well, how... I don't think they have enough NHLers. No. How good can they be, really? But didn't that make it best on best? They can call in non-NHLers. Didn't we have this conversation?

Their four-record is great, by the way. Their four-record is amazing. Finland, but their decore... They records amazing yeah finland but their decore looking like the zigzags uh also just looking at the standings quickly before go leafs last least thing right there two points back looking like a leaf stamp of first round all of a sudden totally have written off ottawa now right oh yeah hang the banner they were once two points behind the leaves hang the banner They've written off Ottawa now, right? Oh, yeah. Hang the banner. They were once two points behind the Leafs. Hang the banner.

You take great joy. I was sticking it to Ottawa fans. And Vancouver. We got in trouble on Saturday. Well, not we. No, me. Me and Vankas are in trouble. Oh, did you? Oh, yeah. OK. They're not fans. Good to hear. All right. We'll take a quick break when we come back. Jason Buchla Pro Hockey Group, former NHL scout.

Well, join us. don't go away!