The Liz Moody Podcast - Danielle Walker—The Foods That Helped Her Heal, Secrets To A Long, Successful Marriage & How She Built Her Mega-Popular Brand

Episode Date: September 18, 2019

I have an amazing guest for you today—Danielle Walker. Danielle is the New York Times best-selling author of four amazing cookbooks, the Against All Grain series (my favorite is Eat What You Love, but they’re all delish!). She started eating paleo after being diagnosed with ulcerative colitis in her twenties, an autoimmune disease that would leave her bed ridden for months. We talk a lot about her diagnosis on this episode, including how she came to decide that the paleo diet was the best one for her, if she’s ever tried other diets, if she thinks everyone should eat paleo, and a ton of other food stuff. We also talk about the emotional impact of having a chronic illness—how it impacts her life as a mom, as a spouse, and more. Danielle has also built an incredible, thriving business, so talk about building a brand, including how much you should spend at the beginning — and if you can still achieve Danielle’s level of success today or if the market is too saturated. If you’ve ever struggled with any type of chronic disease, whether it’s physical or mental, I think you’ll really enjoy this episode, and if you’re at all interested in building your own wellness brand, it’s a must listen. I also love our conversations about parenting—I’m so impressed with Danielle’s approach to being a mom, but also taking care of herself. I hope you find Danielle as inspiring as I do. You can find Danielle on Instagram @daniellewalker, or on her website, AgainstAllGrain.com. Definitely tag us both (@lizmoody & @daniellewalker) with your feedback or thoughts on the episode, and any other questions you’d like us to answer! Enjoy! PS: Healthier Together is officially a number one best-seller! You can get your copy right here or at lizmoody.com/cookbook. Please keep sending me your creations on Instagram—they make me so happy! This episode is also brought to you by one of my all time favorite brands, Garden of Life. I’ve been taking Garden of Life probiotics for more than four years. Their Mood Plus probiotic is formulated specifically to help with stress and anxiety, and it’s made a huge difference in my mental health. Zack also takes their Once Daily Men’s probiotic, and their RAW Vaginal Care line is an amazing secret weapon against any UTIs or yeast infections. I also love their prebiotic, which has five clean, organic ingredients and provides food for the probiotics in your gut. I never travel without the Oil of Oregano and the Turmeric Gummies are truly addictive and so good for helping with chronic or acute pain. You can check out all of my Garden of Life picks at lizmoody.com/shop. If you need recommendations for specific products, please DM me and I’ll help you figure it out! I can’t wait to hear how they change the health of your whole body and mind! This episode is also sponsored by Natural Cycles, the first hormone-free contraception app that’s FDA approved and CE marked in Europe. Natural Cycles has been shown to have effectiveness rate of 93% with typical use and 98% effective with perfect use—for reference, the efficacy of the pill is 91% with typical use. I’ve partnered with Natural Cycles to do a little mini-diary of my experience with it on the Healthier Together podcast. Every episode, I’ll give you an update of how it’s going and what I’m learning about my body and my cycle, as I explore the app in real time. Have questions you want answered? Hit me up @lizmoody on Instagram and I’ll share in future episodes. You can find out more info at NaturalCycles.com. Healthier Together cover art by Zack. Healthier Together music by Alex Ruimy. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hello, friends, and welcome back to the Healthier Together podcast. I am your host, Liz Moody, and I'm a cookbook author and writer living in Brooklyn, but I'm actually currently coming to you from an airport hotel just outside of Edinburgh. Zach and I flew from New York to Paris on Thursday night to visit some friends for the weekend, and we basically walked all around the city eating croissants and crepes, and now we're about to head off with my dad on what's basically his dream trip. He's like wanted to do this trip for his entire life, And now he's finally retired and we can do it.

But it's hiking and scotch tasting in rural Scotland. He actually wanted to hike between the distilleries and just hike all day and drink scotch all night. But I put the kibosh on that. So we are doing day hikes and then hitting up some distilleries and going on lots of hikes and all of that. So I am so excited to be out of the city and fall is just starting up here and the leaves are starting to get that sort of golden tinge. And it's just glorious. It's also my first actual vacation that I've taken since my book came out. I've been traveling a ton, but it's all been for work.

So I am, you know, I do like my little fun trips mixed in with the work, but it's usually like me with my laptop in the car trying to write an article really fast before I can like fit in a hike or something. And it's, it's so fun. And I feel really grateful that I can do all of that. But it's nice to take a real vacation. So I'm trying. I got a bunch of my articles done ahead of time.

I'm going to try to actually unplug. and not be on the internet for at least a week of this trip. And I'm so excited to read books and, I don't know, just slow down. I have been struggling a little bit with my anxiety recently, which you might have seen me talking about on Instagram. So I just have felt really overwhelmed. And I had a huge panic attack the other day. So I definitely need it.

And I'm very grateful for this time. All right. Well, I have an amazing guest for you all today. Her name is Danielle Walker. Danielle is a New York Times bestselling author. She's actually written four amazing cookbooks, including my favorite, her most recent, which is called Eat What You Love, which is all sorts of grain-free comfort food like pizza and sloppy joes and all of the stuff that I really like to eat personally.

So Danielle started eating paleo after being diagnosed with ulcerative colitis in her 20s, and that's an autoimmune disease. It's really terrible. She would be bedridden for literally months at a time. She was in and out of the hospital. We talk a lot about her diagnosis on this episode, including how she came to decide that the paleo diet was the best one for her. And if she ever tried other diets and if she thinks that everyone should eat paleo and a ton of other different sort of like, what should you eat and why for different types of diagnoses and that type of stuff. We also talk about the emotional impact of having a chronic illness, how it impacts her life as a mom and as a spouse and more. We actually got into a really long talk about the partner thing particularly because I have a lot of guilt about my anxiety in the context of my relationship with Zach, my husband.

Like when I need to leave a party earlier, I can't sleep in a hotel room or I take forever to book plane tickets because I'm nervous about the flight. It all definitely impacts his life a lot and all these little ways, but they add up. And I know he loves me and he's so, so great about everything. He doesn't like make me feel bad about it, but I really struggle with it. So I asked Danielle for her advice about all of that. And I thought it was really helpful. So I hope that it's helpful to all of you as well. Danielle has also built a really incredible thriving business.

So we get into that. We talk about building a brand and how much money you should spend. building a brand and if it's even honestly possible to achieve Danielle's level of success today or if the market's too saturated, which I was really interested in her thoughts on. If you have ever struggled with any type of chronic disease, whether it's physical or mental, I think you will really, really enjoy this episode. And if you're all interested in building your own wellness brand, I think you'll really like this as well for that type of thing.

I also loved all of our conversations about parenting. I am so impressed with Danielle's approach to being a mom, but also taking care of herself and keeping her own identity and all of that. But beyond all that, even if you're not interested in any of that type of stuff, I just think Danielle is one of those incredibly likable people. You can hear it in her voice. She has this quality in her voice where you just want to keep listening to it. And her story is so captivating and honestly kind of terrifying. The stuff that she's gone through with her health and her life is insane to me, but she took all of those hurdles and she built them into such a beautiful life. And I just think it's such a lesson in how to turn adversity into

this beautiful experience, something that you're happy you went through in the long run, which Danielle says that she is. And I'm so inspired by that. So I hope you find her as inspiring as I do. you can find her on Instagram. Danielle is at Danielle Walker. And her website is against all grain.com. She has tons of recipes. She has fun cooking show with friends. And you can find out more information about all of her books there as well.

And definitely screenshot and tag us both as you're listening to this episode. I'm at Liz Moody. And tell us what you're loving, what you're thinking about. Any questions you have. I love, love to hear. I love to continue the conversation over on Instagram. So definitely please do that.

All right. I hope you enjoy the episode. All right. Danielle, thank you for sitting down with me. Thanks for having me. Yeah, this is fun. I love talking to you because I feel like you have so many like you're, there's not a huge group of people who marry food and health, I think. And I'm always interested in people who have that really interesting health story. And then they're strong on the food side of the recipe development and all of that. I'm constantly actually getting questions about like I bought your cookbook and I learned so

much about health from it. Who else should I buy? So I always recommend you. Thank you. I appreciate that. Always, always. So let's start with your health story. You have a really interesting story to your autoimmune diagnosis. Can you just walk us through that briefly? Yeah. Yeah. So I was 22 and had just gotten married to my husband, my high school sweetheart. We just graduated college. And right before our wedding, like maybe a month or so, I just had started having a ton of digestive symptoms that I had never experienced before. And I kind of chalked it up to

like wedding jitters. And we just had moved. And he just had moved. And he, He started law school. It was like a big, just transitionary kind of phase in our life. And it did go away after we got married. It was like maybe two months after that I still was experiencing symptoms and then ended up in the ER and was just like having a really bad digestive distress is kind of the easiest way to put it. And how did you know is like time to go to the ER versus I don't know. I feel like. Yeah. It's hard to tell layers of it. It is. I think because I had been experiencing it for so long and then specifically. I can remember that night, like, we were watching a football game over at my in-laws' house, and I got up from the couch and just, like, could barely stand up and was just really dizzy. And so that was finally, I think we kind of, like, we hadn't seen doctors for it, to be honest, like, because we just kind of kept thinking it would go away.

Yeah. And I think it was late at night, so that wasn't really even an option. And my husband was like, we need to take you to the yard. So it was just one of those, like, kind of our, we didn't really have another choice. I think looking back, I probably should have gone to get something checked out early on, but I just didn't know. And I was young and didn't like realize that it could be serious. I mean, how many somethings are taking immaculate care of their health? Like, they're just like, well.

Yeah. I'm like, yeah, you kind of live with that mentality of like, oh, it'll pass or like, I don't know. And I think I did. I remember talking to my mom and maybe a couple other people and just kind of saying, like, telling them that I wasn't feeling well and maybe explaining a couple of symptoms. And I feel like they said that. They were like, oh, it'll probably pass. And a lot of people said kind of what I thought of like, just wait for the wedding to be over.

Like stress. Yeah. Yeah. And they're like, you know, you're just getting settled into your new place. And, you know, so they're like, just wait and it should pass. So we went to the ER and they performed a bunch of different tests. But really were like non-conclusive and kind of referred me to a specialist that, you know, we couldn't get into for like, I feel like it was like four or five weeks. We called the next day and they were like, we don't have any openings.

And so we finally saw somebody and he didn't diagnose me. So then, like, still kind of the same thing, like, sent me out the door with some prescriptions and a couple other, like, he told me to put a cup of, like, oat brand in my smoothies every day, like, for fiber. He just thought it was, like, stress, something. Yeah, he thought it was stress. And then he think, I think he gave me, like, some over-the-counter, like, things for constipation or something like that. And I just, so I took everything. Like, I think I bought, like, metamusel. I don't know, just all these, like, over-the-counter things.

And it made me so much more sick. I was, like, in a ball on my couch. in so much pain from all of that stuff, just taking it and, like, creating more distress in my, in my gut. And so finally, we saw another specialist, another gastroenterologist who, like, I'm looking back now, I'm so surprised that after, like, three or four, nobody suggested getting a colonoscopy done. And he was finally the first person. And that was probably, like, maybe three or four months later, down the line from our wedding, that finally he was like, let's do a colonoscopy. And at that point, I don't think I had ever heard of a colonoscopy,

but I was just, like, relieved that somebody was going to do some tests rather than just kind of, like, listening to my symptoms and just being like, you're good, you know, take this. And so that wasn't fun. But, like, he checked me into the hospital immediately. And I did all my colonoscopy prep, like, in the hospital because I was just so sick at that point. Oh, I feel like I'd actually prefer that. It might be. Yeah. Versus, I get nervous when I don't eat for long periods of time.

Right. And so, like, doing the liquid thing at home, I'd like, I'd like to be in a hospital where they're like, we got you. Yeah. digger. I'm like, I'm done it both ways and being in the comfort of your own home with that. I mean, that's a nasty prep process. Like, it's just not being in like your own toilet and you're like laying on your own couch and like, you know, a hospital gown and it's cold. And it's, I have, I want my home to be in a hospital. Yes, there you go. Just so we can take care of you. I get that side of things. But then like, I was so sick and they're like, you know,

trying to force this, that stuff down you. And it just was a pretty, like, traumatic experience. But all that to say, they finally did the test and came out. When I woke up, they said you might have ulcerative colitis or Crohn's disease. And they had to wait for some biopsies to come back. But it was somewhat of a relief just to finally feel like we had an answer. But the crazy part was that they didn't give me any information about it. I mean, not even like a pamphlet. You had an ulcerative colitis.

Yeah, ended up being diagnosed with ulcerative colitis like a few hours later. And the doctor just was like, here's a prescription. you'll live a normal life. Like literally that was his words. What are you supposed to take that prescription every day for the rest of your life? Yeah. And at that point, actually, I think I was on two. So he put me on a prednisone steroid and then like an anti-inflammatory prescription

that people go on for UCN Crohn's. And but yeah, I asked him even like when he said you'll live a normal life. And I'm like a newlywed, you know? And so I'm like, can I have kids? And he was like, yep, like people live a normal life with this medication. And I was like, okay. And he told me it's not curable. but he didn't ever say, like, autoimmune disease.

He didn't talk about, you know, why I might have, like, had that first flare up or why I got it or anything like that. And so we kind of left the hospital just feeling like, like, relieved that I had a diagnosis, but really confused at the same time. I mean, like, we weren't super young. We have no idea, like, what to do next. And so I started, you know, like, I wasn't feeling better. And the medications were actually causing a ton of side effects. And so I started asking my doctors just kind of intuitively. just because I knew that the disease was in my colon, I was like, can food, you know, like,

what can I do? What can I do to change my diet to help me? What were you eating at the time? I mean, I was fresh out of college, so let's say, like, no judgment. No, I don't know. I know. But when I think about it, like, I wasn't, I wasn't eating that poorly, you know, like, I mean, definitely drive through every once in a while, although I had just, I remember I had watched a super-sized-me documentary in college, so I had already given up McDonald's, but was still doing some, like, fast food, but then, I mean, I grew up in an Italian family. So I was cooking with, like, white flour and white sugar and, I mean, a very standard American diet, but I wouldn't say I was, like, overly unhealthy.

I wasn't, like, you know, eating out all the time or putting, like, packaged food. I mean, here and there. But, I mean, I liked to cook a bit, but I was still really young and we were, I mean, we were newlywed. So it was like, I remember, like, yeah, I would make pasta out of a box with, like, a jar of spaghetti sauce and, like, break up ground beef, you know. It wasn't anything, like, crazy special. but also wasn't, you know, like on the opposite spectrum of like just eating junk, like candy and chips and stuff all day long. So did the doctors say that food could help with it?

No. Every single specialist that I saw, like it's almost like they had a script. They said food, food didn't cause it, food can't cure it, and food can't help it. What did they say did cause it? They don't know. Just like random chance? Yeah. Yeah.

They, you know, I mean, they said it could be hereditary, but I didn't know anybody in my family that had it. And then they kind of speculated, like stress, maybe all the stress of just everything we were going through could have brought it out. But they really didn't know and they still, like, they don't, they don't really know. Do you know, like from your research, do you have an idea of what could have triggered it? I have a few, a few ideas. One was I was diagnosed with like gastroenteritis in like my last couple months of college. So it would have been maybe like six months before my UC diagnosis, which it's like gastrointuritis. is just like a technical word for like the stomach bug. But nothing ever really felt the same after that. And part of me wonders if my just like microbiome and like everything got so off from having that stomach virus that maybe I was already susceptible to UC.

Like maybe it was dormant or I don't know what that would be. And that it just kind of came out because of that. Because I've learned so much over the years just about how important it is to have that balance in your, you know, gut bacteria. And so I think I was put on. antibiotics at that point for that virus and, you know, obviously just everything else that comes along with the stomach virus, like everything was cleared out and then probably wasn't properly restored in terms of like I wasn't doing anything, you know, fermented or any probiotics at the time

and all that kind of stuff. So part of me wonders if it was a little bit of that. I do think, as I've learned over the years of having the disease, like stress 100% is a huge factor in flare-up. So I don't really recall being that stressed at that time. I'm like, come on, I mean, a 22-year-old doesn't have that much stress in their life. I mean, especially compared to- They always think they do. Oh, yeah, sure. I know.

I mean, I probably thought like, you know, yeah, every. But now I look at my life now and I'm like, well, I had no, you know, no stress. I mean, I definitely was like planning a wedding and moving and stuff. But maybe just those life events, like just the kind of life-changing events. And then, yeah, I mean, those would be probably, those would be the things that I kind of point to. I don't really know for sure. But at this point, I'm like, well, I know it happened. And that's all, you know, it doesn't matter at this point.

Yeah. It's because, like, immediately my brain is like, if somebody wanted to not have something like that happened, like, what could they do? Right. You know? But, like, it feels, it feels both random and unrandom, I guess. Yeah. I mean, yeah, I definitely think there is, like, genetic side to it.

Yeah. Do any of your kids have you seen? Mm-mm. I mean, not yet. Yeah. Word willing, they don't. We, they eat. I mean, if you're, if we're talking.

prevention for me, the best thing I can do for them is to have them eat like I do, just because I feel like it's inherently anti-inflammatory. And I think that some of what I ate probably made it worse or at least, you know, could have caused it to flare. I mean, I know that what I ate causes it to be worse. So I'm kind of keeping them gluten-free and mostly grain-free and dairy-free now just as trying to prevent. And then also supplementation, like we started seeing a really awesome functional pediatrician, which I wish they all were that way because she's amazing and she runs all of these different tests on them to see what they're deficient in or if they have any, you know, like predispositions to things and if they have any weird like, you know,

genetic mutation, not mutations, but like, I mean, like, for instance, they check for the MTHR. Yeah. So like just kind of getting ahead of things for me for my kids. It feels like at least I, you know, I can't completely prevent stuff from happening. But at least, you know, I can't completely prevent stuff from happening, but at least I feel like I'll have some of the puzzle pieces to put together if in their later years they do get diagnosed with it. But my hope is that they don't because it's just awful. And I can't, like, I have a lot of followers who have kids that have Crohn's or colitis or other autoimmune conditions. And I, like, cannot imagine how horrible that must be for a mom to have, like, your eight-year-old, you know, going through, like, what I went through

as a young child. So my hope is that they're not ever diagnosed with it. And then I'm wanting to kind of start to like a habit yet because they're still young but I because stress is such a huge part of it and not just stress like physically but emotional stress and mental like I think all of it is is so important of just your whole like body wellness and I've learned that if I'm not handling my stress well and I'm not taking care of myself or not getting enough sleep or I've had like a particularly like emotionally traumatizing period of my life like I can still have flare ups no matter how well I eat and how like strict I adhere to kind of my my way of eating, which is like a paleo style diet. So as they grow up, I would like to try to instill some of that in them of like you are really, like your body is

really important and your mind is really important, you know, like make sure that they've got good mental health and emotional health and that they can talk about things that they're going through or, you know, so that they're not like manifesting stress in a different way too because I think so much of that has to be learned. What do you do when you are, we'll get back to like your, food and your diet they used to heal. But what do you do when you are stressed? Like you just, you're in New York City, you just had this like no night of sleep because there was construction outside of your hotel. So when you have things that are sort of out of your control, how do you mitigate that? Putting myself first, which is like become something I've had to really learn.

Like I just wrapped up a book tour in January and I see people I know in the cities, you know, and they'll be like, let's go out to dinner. Let's do this. And I have to just say no to a lot of that. So like last night, I wrapped my meetings at four, I think, and I crawled to bed in my hotel and just like laid there and read a little bit and watched some TV like just to kind of like completely decompress and kind of check out. And then I went to bed. I think it was like 930. I went to bed and I got up at 8.30, which is really great. All my friends who are moms whenever they travel, they're like, the best part of travel is you get to sleep. Yeah. Yes. I know. I always say I'm like it's the blackout drapes, the ear plugs. And like when you're a mom,

you just listen. Like you can be sleeping, but you're always. on, like in case there's a noise down the hallway or a noise on the monitor. And so I don't feel like you really get, like, deep sleep at home because you're just always like, is somebody going to get up? Even when they're like fully sleeping through the night, you still don't because you're just like the one-offs or, I don't know. So, yeah, when you're in a hotel, like you have no cares in the world, you know, it's like you have no responsibilities. So you, I close the blackout drapes. I put your plugs in. I put white noise on. It's like, I'm out to the world. How do you deal with the, like, I think a lot of people would like to put themselves first in theory.

Yeah. But then they're like, oh, I'm being a bad mom or, oh, I'm being a bad friend or, oh, I'm being a bad partner. How do you deal with that? It's a good question. And it took a long, I mean, I'm still learning how to do this and still trying to make it a priority because I'm definitely like a people pleaser and a type A. And I'm like, I don't want to let people down.

And so a lot of my life before and even after like being diagnosed and when I was sick, I would run myself into the ground kind of with that mentality of like, I have to do this and I have to do this and I would put myself second. And I learned that I'm not a good mom if I end up getting sick and I'm in bed for two months, which is what happens, you know, or maybe more. So it's like I have to kind of choose that. And it's definitely like a daily choice. But it's like I can run myself into the ground to be like quote unquote good mom or good,

you know, life or whatever and then end up sick and be completely incapacitated and then really let them down. or I can try to really prioritize giving myself. And it's not like, you know, I mean, I'm not like kidding. I'm not like, I'm going to go get a two-hour massage every single day. But it's like little things like I'm going to schedule a 45-minute nap into my afternoon. You know, and so whether that's like working with my husband to make sure that works or a babysitter or whatever it is, like, if I know I need it. And especially in like a sick kind of period of time, then I have to do it. And it took me a while to realize that.

Like, because especially with my disease and a lot of autoimmune diseases, it's like, sometimes you get to a point where it just dips super fast and you cannot bring it, you can't get it back up without like serious medications or just laying in bed doing nothing for a few months. So my thought process on it is like if I can get ahead of it, you know, then I will ultimately be a better mom because I'm not laying in bed for months at a time. And what about with your partner? Like, so I, my sort of struggle has been anxiety and it's been really interesting in my relationship because I feel like I almost need more in the relationship. Like we both bring different things to the table, but when I need to do something because I might have a panic attack or because it might trigger my anxiety in some way, it's much different than his preference.

And sometimes I feel very like guilty about it. But also sometimes I'm like, well, I have to deal with my anxiety internally, which is much worse. So like the little bits that you deal with it externally is not hard. And I just think it's a really tricky relationship dynamic. Yeah, it is. It definitely is. I wish my husband was here because I feel like that's a little bit. such a great conversation to have with like the caretaker, the partner. I mean, I think in one aspect,

we were fortunate that we, we like grew up together. I mean, we started dating when we were 16. And while I was 16, he was 17 and got diagnosed as like newlyweds. And I think for a lot of couples, it does tear him apart because it's a lot of stress on the relationship. And I mean, he was having to, like, take care of our young babies every time I would have a postpartum flare. And I definitely, like, dealt with a lot of like guilt about that too of just like gosh you know I feel bad that he's having to like lay down his like life or his wants or his dreams to help take care of us and I'm grateful that he's like an incredibly supportive person and loves our family enough to do that but I also had to well there's a few things um I think one was realizing that he needed to have like time you know

so like he likes to run and he likes to like work out and so I had to really like make sure that I was giving him that time of like this is really important to him. And, you know, he's doing so much else that, like, I can't ever give him a hard time if he wants to go out for, like, an hour and a half run or whatever it was, like, trying to see what his priorities were and supporting him in that. And then showing how grateful I was, I think also for how much he, like, took care of us. And then just encouraging, like, discussion. There were a couple years, like, in our earlier years of getting diagnosed where I just didn't even know that he was, like, having trouble with everything, like, emotionally, because he was so strong from the outside and all. never forget he did like an interview for TV somewhere and told somebody that like he would leave my room and cry. And I was like, I had no idea. And I just, so after that, it was like we started really talking because I think when you are the person who's sick, you're so overwhelmed with everything that you sometimes don't stop to think about how the person that is helping you feels. And so it was really important for us to like start to have really open communication just about all

the emotions on both sides. Like I told him, I was like, I want you to tell me if like you get resentful or if you're mad or if you're, you know, like feeling. overwhelmed or whatever it is so that we can try to figure it out together and we can try to like bring in outside help or take help from, you know, like my parents or neighbors or whatever it was because he's totally a type of person that will just like forge through and like try to try to take it on himself. So it's an interesting dynamic for sure. And I feel like the caretaker quote unquote if you will like for people who have chronic illness oftentimes feel really like overlooked and kind of like on their own. And so I've really tried to

see where he's at and try to help him for that too. Do you feel like you're like make up for the fact that you have you see? Like do you feel like I should be making up for the fact that I have anxiety in other ways? Like being better at the rest of the ways of being a partner? No, I mean, not necessarily, but I guess because I do go through like periods where I really can be sick for like multiple like a long time, which I guess might be different in like an anxiety situation. And I guess because I am sometimes incapacitated for a certain amount of time, sometimes I try to like make the other months like really great. So I guess in a way, yeah. But it's also like sometimes I'm like, well, I just missed three months of my life. Like I do want to make up for it in a sense. So maybe in that way. Yeah. Yeah. And be grateful for like the time that I'm feeling well. I'm like I want to make the most of this. You know, like I remember what it was like to feel sick. But no, I mean, it's kind of just become a part of my life in a way. Like I know I have. it and I know that there are going to be times where I still might get sick and where, you know,

but I, but I'm grateful for like the healthy times and that the times where I do still have flare ups occasionally, like are not nearly as severe as they used to be. So trying to just kind of live in like that grateful mentality, I guess from day to day. But yeah, I don't know if I try to make, I don't know if I'm like, that's a good question. I don't know if I've ever been asked for that. I asked that before. Um, if I try to make up for it or not. I mean, especially with him, I guess. Like, yeah. But, but, I mean, like, after I've had periods of sick, like we'll go and take like two nights away in nap books. It's like a 40 minute drive for us. And it's more of like a we've basically been apart for like three months because I've been sick and

you've been helping take care of the kids. So now we need some like reconnection time and like kind of try to make up for lost time, I guess. So I guess I do try to make up for it. I don't know. Is that a good answer? It's just it's such an interesting. I mean, partnerships are already so complicated, period. And then anything you add on top of that I think makes it more complicated. It's true. You know. What is the state of your UC now? Like, how often do you have flare-ups?

Yeah. So it's typically I only get them after I've had a baby, which is kind of crazy. And I'm in almost this, like, kind of unknown state right now because I have had lots of pregnancies over the past. What, like, my oldest is almost nine. So I do really, really well. My UC, like, goes into complete remission when I'm pregnant. And then typically, like, eight or nine months after. I, postpartum, I end up having a flare-up. And thankfully, for the most part, like, we, I still,

they're not great, but they're much better. Like, I haven't been hospitalized and I haven't had to go on any of the, like, serious, severe medications for it. So we're kind of in the state now of, like, okay, if we're done with our family, which I think we are, like, done having kids, then now I'm curious to kind of see where it goes, because I feel like I can newly manage it with food, but there's the things that are kind of those outside factors that I can't control with, like, postpartum with like hormonal shifts and not sleeping and the stress of like just on your body of having a child. And so, you know, it's like those felt like outside factors that there's just nothing I could do about it to prevent it. And now I'm kind of like, okay, what will this be like?

So it's interesting. I feel like I'm in a little bit of like an unknown kind of phase at this point. How old is your youngest? My youngest is two. Okay. So it's been two years. Yeah, yeah. And I had a flare up when she was like nine months old. But it's crazy. because it's like when I had the one when my oldest son was nine months, that's the last time that I was like seriously hospitalized, had to have blood transfusions. This was pre-food. And so I've still gotten sick, but I feel like so much more hopeful when I have them because I feel like I know that it'll pass and that it won't be as severe. What does it feel like now? Like if you're not in the hospital getting blood transfusions, like what was the most recent one like? Well, I get really

anemic. As part of you see is like internal bleeding. So just like super tired. And, needing to sleep and rest all the time. And then just like really malnourished because I just can't tolerate a lot of food and super like, I'm just trying to like thinking what else. And that's kind of the biggest thing. I just end up having to be in bed for a long time and just to recover from all of that. For like weeks, the last when she was little, I think it ended up, gosh, they all blend together.

I think with that, I think I might have been in bed for a couple months with her with that one. Yeah. And how do you deal with that psychologically? Like they did a really interesting study where it was like about bed rest and pregnancy. And one of the biggest conclusions of it was how hard it was psychologically on the women. Like so many women had literal PTSD just from being on bed rest. And you were essentially on bed rest numerous times in your life, not during your pregnancy, but because of your studies. It's tough.

And especially as a new mom when like you've got a baby who's depending on you. So it's really difficult to be laying in bed this time around like I knew. I needed to just kind of stop everything and get into bed and just stop because that's like it won't get better if I'm just like trying to go about my normal day. So it was almost like somewhat of a conscious decision but also like I just couldn't go on anymore. And so this time around like I really tried to be better. I don't it's a bad word to say because it wasn't like up to me but tried to be a little bit different in that like I would try to have my kids come into bed with me and like read books. And I tried to kind of like do things from where. I had to be at and know that I couldn't do it all. But it's definitely depressing and it's really

lonely when you're like sitting there all day long by yourself and you can like hear things going on. Do you like watch so much Netflix? I watch like I watch like I watch so much TV because I'm like I would love to say like I read it all day long and researched and like you know like grew as a human and it's like you're so sick and just don't feel good. You don't have the energy. No. So I watch I'm a big I'm like, I don't know why. I'm a big fan of like British royalty, like, like, um, like history type shows. Like all. So I watched like all of the like Victoria and all of, I mean, just like way back.

Like I forget all the names of them. The Tudor. All of that. Like I'm super fascinated with all of that. Have you seen, um, Rame? Yes. I watched that too, but I was like in. It's like for teenagers.

But I like really is like my guilty pleasure show for a while. I watched it all. But I realized as I was watching it because I was like, this all can't. I was like research. searching next to it. I was watching it. And so much of it is not true. It's like not historically correct. But that's interesting too. I love like getting the fiction entry point and then sitting there with my computer and trying to figure out like what's factually accurate. Yeah, yeah. Totally. And trying to like. And she was really hot. Mary Queen of Scott. She was like the hottest

queen ever apparently. But like all over the, what was it? Like there was like a brother who was not real and I don't know anyways. But it was very entertaining. So I liked it. I watched all of those. Yeah. I mean, like, oh, and, um, uh, what was that? There's like a something midwife show on called the midwife. I'm totally like that was like in tears most of the day watching that. But yeah, lots and lots of TV. What do you do about your business when you're incapacitated for long great's time? Well, so thankfully a lot of my business is online, which is great. So I could do some of it still. I couldn't be like testing and developing recipes, but it kind of goes a little bit goes on hold. I'm not, you know, I'm not like doing stories from bed and like being on Instagram all the time.

I mean, I do have, I have a little bit of a team now, which has been helpful for just kind of keeping some things going behind the scenes. And, um, but yeah, a lot of times it kind of just stalls for a bit, which do you get nervous about it? I mean, I just, I feel like in these days, it's like if you're not growing on Instagram, right, you might as well be dead. Right. I mean, gosh, I don't really recall being too nervous about it, to be honest, just because it's like,

I don't really have a choice. It's like, it is what it is. Yeah. And I am grateful that I do have the type of job I have where I can be in bed for a couple of months. Yeah, what? God, what do people can lose their jobs? When they take, well, I mean, when I was newly diagnosed, I was on med, I took medical leave.

And it's like you get paid like a fraction of, you know, what you get paid. And my husband was in law school, but it was like our only option, you know. So that is something that I mean, I'm grateful that I have that flexibility to be able to do that. And to be able to prioritize, like, I mean, I'm sitting here saying, like, you know, I take a nap and it's like, yeah, if you're working a nine to five, you know, job. I mean, I do remember early on when I was doing a desk job, I would take my lunch break and go take a nap in my car. And that was like, that was what I would do, you know, because I had to do it or also I would just like crash by the end of the day. I have a friend who goes and meditates in the toilet and her job because she like needs it to get through the day. Yeah. I mean, yeah, you have to kind of figure out those ways and make it work. it's like whether it's going for a walk or like, yeah, going down to your car or my, I mean, I worked in like a smaller office and my boss would travel all the time and had this like awesome, like zero gravity chair in his office. And I asked him, I was like, when you're out of town,

do you mind if I take my lunch break in your chair? And I would like take a nap in his chair. It's kind of embarrassing. But I'm grateful that he said, yeah. Yes. I also think that's a huge lesson to just like ask people when you need stuff. I'm constantly telling. I'm like, my life motto is never be the one to say no to yourself. And I think that works really well for careers. But it also works for stuff like naps. Totally. Like when you just, you or you need your partner to do something and just ask first. And then they might say no, but like they might not. Yeah, no, totally. It is good to ask. And I mean, I think a lot of people like, I feel like even when I say it sometimes, I'm like, gosh, that sounds so lazy that I'm like, I need to take a nap, you know? I'm like,

but it's really important. And I'll notice like a total difference in my symptoms with a day where I don't have get a lot of sleep from a day that I do get a lot of sleep. So it's really interesting to think about how your UC in general would, um, have impacted yourself. Like you just said it, you sometimes are like, oh, I feel really lazy.

But then also your UC in some ways has led you to have this incredible career and all of these books and stuff like that. And it's just, it must be an interesting, like do you feel grateful to it at this point? Yeah, I do. I do. Um,

I would not be doing what I'm doing if I wouldn't, you know, if I wouldn't have had it. And I don't know, you know, how many people that follow me and that have found healing through food. I don't know if they would have heard that message from a different avenue. I mean, I hope that they would have, but there's something about my story and knowing suffering in like a very real way that has, that has really led people to like come and hear

what I have to say. So I am grateful for it because I feel like I've been able to impact so many people. And then of course on like the other side of it's become a career and it's become a career and it's become a provider for our family and something that like I saw no hope in at the beginning when I'm laying in hospital beds and like being told it's incurable. I mean, I would have never dreamt of it becoming something that was like such a huge part of our life and that also was like a income, you know, provider for our family. Like just not even never crossed my mind. Even when I started my blog, I just like figured I would be giving free recipes

and advice forever. I mean, I like, I dragged my feet even like with getting sidebar advertising because my husband was like, you got to monetize, you got to monetize. And I was like, I don't want to. I just want to give people, you know, free content forever. So I never looked at it as a business. Until when? Probably like, well, I mean, when I got my first book contract, I asked the publisher if we could sell it for $9.99 because I was like so worried about charging people for anything. I was like, I don't want to charge people money. Like, I just want to share this message and share the story and like give them good food. And I realized that I was starting to put so much time into it. it. I think that was probably the shift. I probably was running maybe about a year on my blog and

realizing, like, I'm spending every free minute I have developing these recipes and writing them up and, like, promoting them and publishing them. And I started, I think my first, like, advertising on the blog was probably the first thing. And it was like pretty subtle. And then Amazon affiliates was like the second thing. I'm like, all right, well, if I'm going to be recommending this almond flower, I may as well get like a little percentage and not charged. And that was also part of it. I was like, well, I'm not charging my people anything more. Like, they don't get charged. It's the company that pays, right? So I'm like, okay, this is okay. And then I was thinking about putting out, like, an e-book finally, because I was like, I've got like 300 recipes on my site. And I now feel

like I'm putting so much time that I might, I need to make something for this, like, not only to pay for the ingredients, but then like my time, right? So were you still working full time at that point? No, not at that time. I had left my job to be stay-at-home mom. Okay. So my husband was working. And I just thought I was going to just do the mom life fully. And I was kind of blogging, just like as a little side thing while he would nap. And it was an outlet for me that I really enjoyed. And, and then, yeah, no. So I didn't realize that it would be a business. But that was kind of the first, you know, like turning point for me. And then I think really when I saw like my first book take off so much and that people would be willing to pay something for that material and something

that was like supporting their health choices, I was like, okay, they see value in this. And I get that and I need to start to value myself. But it was definitely like a process to remember. me. I mean, I already mentioned I'm like, I'm a total people pleaser and I was so worried about like offending somebody that I was going to be charging money for stuff. You're listening to the Healthier Together podcast. People are always asking me what supplements I recommend. So I wanted to walk you guys through a few that have made a real difference in my life. All of these are from Garden of Life, one of today's sponsors and a brand that I've been using for years long before we started working together. Their oil of oregano is one of my go-toes for

travel. It's a tincture and you only need a few drops of it, but it's including incredibly antiviral and antibacterial. Whenever I start feeling a bit off or sick, I put about eight drops in a glass of water and chug it down. It tastes super spicy, but it makes me feel better by the next day, whether I felt like I was getting a flu or a cold or a stomach bug or food poisoning. I use it at home, of course, but it saved me so many times on the road that I never go on a trip without it. The prebiotic fiber is also huge for me. A lot of gut issues are caused by not passing waste through your intestines quickly or thoroughly enough. And beyond that, while we focus so much on probiotics, those good bugs need food in the form of prebiotics to thrive and

populate your stomach so they can have all of their positive effects. The doctor formulated organic fiber is a super fine powder. They have an unflavored and an orange. I like both of them. And it's made from acacia, orange peel, baobab fruit, apple peel, and organic cranberry fruit. It dissolves really well in water and it also blends well in smoothies and it can make such a difference in your bathroom habits. It's been so hugely helpful when I travel and I can't eat as well as I do at home. And also travel makes me like really constipated. I don't know if that's just me, but I will also have it three times a week when I'm at home just to provide enough food for the probiotics to keep my gut healthy and happy. Finally, I love, love, love, the maximum strength from their

my kind organics line. I take this if I'm having any sort of pain issue. I have like a chronic knee pain on my left knee, so when that's acting up, I'll add this to my daily routine. It contains turmeric and ginger that have both been fermented to be super bioavailable. And as you likely know, turmeric is hugely helpful for inflammation-based issues, whether it's chronic pain or something autoimmune. I have a friend who takes these for migraines, and they've helped her a ton. And I have another friend who has endometriosis who's found a lot of relief from her painful periods. Also have a turmeric gummy that has no added sugar and it basically tastes like heaven. And I'll keep these around, but honestly, I love them so much. They taste so good that it's like a little

dangerous for me to have them in my cabinet. I have direct links to all of these items and my other Garden of Life picks in my shop at Liz Moody.com slash shop, and it really helps the podcast if you buy them through there. It'll take you directly to the lowest price item on Amazon. Again, that's lizmoody.com slash shop. And if you want any recommendations or have any questions, definitely hit me up on Instagram at Liz Moody. I would love to help you find the perfect probiotic or herbal blend for you. Now, let's get back to the episode. That's so interesting. And does your husband work on your brand now? Okay, so he's full time. I've been trying to get him to be full time for like years. He refuses. He does his own thing. He started Lincoln profile on Instagram.

That was like his company. We talked about this. I think this is fascinating. Yeah. Because it's such a like prevalent thing, but I don't ever like, I didn't know idea that was your husband who did that. Yeah. And that was because you were just like, I wish I had this thing, right? Yeah, I was like laying in bed at 10 o'clock at night one night. And this was back when people used to change the link in their bio every single time they'd post, right? And I think I had posted a recipe and I said like, you know, recipe link in bio. And I got like hundreds of comments that were like, wait, that's taking me to brownies. And you said it.

And I was like, shoot, I forgot to change the link. And I'm laying there with him in bed. And I showed him this thing that like some of the big retailers had. And I was like, can we get this? Like it was, I forget which one it was like to buy. I don't know. Anyways, I was seeing like William Sonoma in anthropology, and they were having this thing that was like a grid of all their pictures. And you could you could tap on them. And I was like, can we get this? And he was like, well, let me look into it tomorrow. And he looked into it. And he's like, it's really just for big retailers. I think it costs like $2,000 a month or something ridiculous. And he's like, but I can just build you that. And he's like, okay. And so. Was he a coder? Uh-huh. Yeah. So not really by like, like, he's actually an attorney by trade. But he taught himself. Yeah. He really liked. He did mechanical engineering and some computer like engineering in college. And he really liked. computer programming. And so he did like online courses. Anyways, so he had it built in like a week. And we just

put it in my profile and it was working really well. And then we never marketed it or promoted it anywhere. And people just started seeing it and really liking it and started using it. And now, I mean, it has a lot of users and like all sometimes stumble on this. Do they pay every month? Yeah, but it's like super cheap. I mean, it's like a few bucks. It's so cheap. A few bucks every month from a lot of people at them, you know. Yeah. Well, yeah. And they have now taken Lincoln profile and turned it into something a little bigger called Tapio. And that's like kind of their new. They like took everything that they made from Lincoln profile and put it into developing Tapio. Which is similar, but it has more options. It was kind of similar for me. So I was like going on tour and was like I just really want to be able to promote my tour. But you know, like not have to link every single picture. And so it's almost like a mini website in your Instagram bio. So you tap the link and you can choose and customize like your own little like car. It kind of looks like Instagram stories. Yeah, yeah. It kind of looks like Instagram stories, but it's like everything is linked and, you know,

like can send you out to everything you want. So it's like I can, you know, have one card that like sends, it's my Instagram grid still. But then I can have, you know, one that's like all my tour, you know, dates and tickets. And they can tap on them and like go buy the tickets or they have, they have, well, my favorite thing now is they have a YouTube integration card. So it's like people can watch all my YouTube videos in my Instagram bio, which is really nice. Yeah. So it's cool.

But anyways, yeah. So he's super techy. How much percentage and how much? It's like 50-50 right now. I've been trying to get him to come on like 100% forever and he just won't, which is fine. I mean, it's like we work, we still work. We work next to each other. He worked for Apple for a couple years and was commuting.

But now he's home. So we're sitting next to each other all day. And he's involved in like every business decision that I make. I think like the only thing he doesn't do is test recipes and write my cookbooks. Well, he eats all the recipes. So he's definitely, he's testing them. But yeah, he. he, it's just like not technology and startups are so much more his passion. And so I think I'd be doing a

disservice to him if I made him work with me full time. It's more of like a selfish thing. I'm like, I just want you to be around all the time and I want you to make my decisions with me. And I do think he could like grow my business with me a lot faster than I can by myself. But it's not his passion. So I'm like, okay, you don't have to just stay involved though because I love his involvement in the business. Is it weird at all when he works on your business? Because it's like you have the vision and It's your company. And he's sort of like, I know, Isaac, I'm always like, he'll design something because he has his own startup so he can design and he can code and all that.

And he'll, like, design my website and I'll be like, oh, like, that color is not right. And he's like, I'm doing you a freaking favor. And I'm like, well, yeah, but also I'm like bringing in a sort of amount of money. And it's like, it's a complicated dynamic, you know? Yeah. I mean, I think for us, because we built it from the ground up, like, I mean, we used our savings to like buy my first digital camera. and to buy, like, my domain.

And, I mean, we, like, emptied out our newlywed savings to build up my brand. And I think because he's been so involved from day one, it kind of feels like it's a joint effort. I think, well, I think I say that more than I show it. Sometimes he's like, you take all the credit. Because I think because I'm, like, the face of it. Yeah. But, I mean, I tell him this when I really stop to think about it.

I'm like, there's a reason why people, like, trust and follow me. And that's because of, like, us as a couple and as, as, as a couple. and as like everything we've gone through and I wouldn't probably have gotten through most of my flare-ups if it wasn't for him. Like he was my advocate with doctors and he was the one that told me to start a blog. And so, I mean, it's like he's been there the whole time.

He sounds like too good to be true. He's kind of too good to be true. The only thing that we couldn't do together that we had to stop was he used to film on my YouTube videos. And I think if you were to watch all like the cut B-roll, we'd be bickering most of the time about like, I don't like that shot or don't tell me to say this. Or he'd be like, you're not pausing enough in between what you're saying.

I can't cut it, like, because he would cut them too. Or I'd be like, I need that video like yesterday. And he's like, I still need to cut it. That's what kills me is when I'm on a deadline of any sort and Zach's like, this is not my deadline. Right. And they've got their other like business and other things they're doing. That's the worst thing.

For the sake of our marriage, we stopped doing my YouTube videos together. And I started hiring those out. But yeah, I mean, I feel like we've been partners the whole time. But I do think him having his thing that he's doing and that he's doing and that he's, he's really passionate about and that he's really good at. He could come and work with me full time, but, like, that's not his, that's not like his awesome skill set, right? So I think that's kind of what helps keep it, keep it, like, working is that is that we are kind of doing 50, 50. How did you know, like, how much money was okay to put into your brand at the beginning or even now?

Like, I think these days, everybody, a lot of people, like, are like, oh, I want to start a brand. And then they go on Instagram and there's, like, already 14 courses you can take about how to do Pinterest and how to do Instagram and like do you need to go by this camera. And I think a lot of the more famous people are like, just use your phone and like don't invest in anything. But then all the famous people are using all, like they have somebody shooting their YouTube and all of that stuff. So how does that work? I started super scrappy. I mean, my, you go back on my blog and it is, I found photos and I like, I didn't actually teach, I had to teach myself how to photograph food. And I didn't do that until I got my first book contract. And they were like, we want you to

Photograph. Did you shoot your books? Uh-huh. Yeah. All of them? No, my first two. I styled and shot my first two. Oh my God.

I'm so impressed with people who shoot there. No. Books for me are like a respite from having to do photography. Yes. It's amazing. Yeah. And I'm just like, yeah, no, it was kind of a necessity. I mean, my first two books were with a smaller publisher.

There was no advance. They weren't with 10 speed? No. No. Yeah. Celebrations and Eat What You Love are with 10 speed. I don't know. I finally got a photographer because photographing those books.

I mean, and I do a photo. for every single recipe. So it was like 160 plus for each book. And it about killed me. I can't believe you did that. That's insane. So I flew down to L.A. I took a one day like food photography intensive.

I didn't even have a very, I had a Canon Rebel. And I remember going into the class being like, I probably have like the nicest camera in here. And I like everybody has their like, you know, Canon like Mark twos or I don't know. Anyways, so I was like learning how to shoot on this little like DSLR, you know, camera and then realized at the end of that class that I was like,

oh, I can't even do half the things she's telling me to do. Like, it can barely change, you know, whatever. I still don't know that much about photography, but couldn't change, like, the stop and my photo. I don't know. So, but, but honestly, like, we invested money as we saw things grow and we just, but we just would do it a little bits at a time. I mean, like, I had a dot WordPress blog for probably a whole, like a couple years.

And then finally, when we started seeing more traffic and kind of, you know, getting to make a little bit is when we were like, all right, like we can, you know, buy our own domain. And we did use some of our savings, which when I say that, it's like, I mean, we were newlyweds. We didn't have a ton of savings. It's not like we, like, emptied out hundreds of thousands of dollars or anything like that. But we realize, like, we have to invest a little bit. And then I think you kind of wait. Like, you do a little bit and you wait to see if you get any return on it and if people are, like,

interested in it. But, I mean, especially these days, I mean, most of the stuff that I put on my Instagram is shot on my phone and I can edit it now. It's like you can use, you know, like this go and you can, I mean, you can do so much. And lightroom for your phone is free. Which is crazy. You can do so much to make them look more like professional images than you used to be able to. And I mean, yeah, I just, I don't feel like you have to like dive, you know, full in and, like, throw a whole bunch of money at something until you know if it's going to stick.

I think, you know, I mean, if I was starting out now. But I mean, I think it's interesting because, yes, you can do so much more to make stuff look professional. But also, like, because of that, nothing looks janky anymore. It's true. A lot of people are like, gosh, you should have seen my blog in the old days. I was like, well, that wouldn't fly anymore. Yeah, no, it's true. You look at my, I was actually, I did a podcast the other day who she, like her first thing that she does is goes back and looks at your first two posts of your blog.

And I was like, oh, no. I'm like, what did I say? What did I say? What was your first blog post? So she said it was a muffin recipe. I'm pretty sure it was this like turkey soup. I can see the photo in my head. It's like, yeah, I'll have to give it to you for like your page afterwards.

It's like this yellow. toned photo that I took on my phone. The vegetables were all like grossly, like overcooked and like brown. And there's a bottle of wine in the back. And it's like, sit like up against this like red back. It was just bad. But it was like a turkey soup. I think I posted it around Thanksgiving. But yeah, I mean, it wasn't like nothing was perfect. And I think I mean, I recorded my own YouTube videos for a long time and, um, photographed everything on my own. And I mean, even from like the side, my first book came out and like I had no marketing or publicity at all. all. And I was like cold calling, you know, different producers and different magazines and trying to get on things and trying to get it out there. And so I think like having that kind of scrappy nature from the start, even if you do have capital to put into something, it's all about that mentality of like working to promote what you're spending time on and putting so much of your heart into and that it's not just going to like sell itself. Do you think that people can still become like you these days? Or do you think it's sort of sat down?

It's a great question. I do think I got in at a very good time. Like bloggers and cookbooks were not as big back then. And so I think I have like a pretty good foot in that space. And it is a lot harder these days to do it. I think especially with like the nature of people putting full recipes into their Instagram captions and like there's just so much out there right now. And there's so many cookbooks and there's so many blogs that I do think unless you have like a really. powerful story or position or something that's like very different that it would be hard to grow. I think like you can get Instagram famous. But like my thought on that is what is the longevity of that and like where else, you know, like I see all these people like there's people that started later than me that have a bigger Instagram following. But part of me is kind of like, okay, what, but what do you have outside of that? Like what do you have? What is it for? Yeah. Well like and if Instagram closed down, what would you have? Like there's no, you don't have products. You don't have books. You don't like, you know, so it's like they're making money, you know, doing probably advertising and doing like, you know, sponsored type stuff.

But to me, it feels like the people that are kind of coming into it right now are kind of looking for like a quick fame and not and like or like a quick success and not really kind of having like a heart or like a reason behind what they're doing. And then they're also just kind of focusing on one area. And a lot of like people don't even have blogs. And I always kind of like go back to that question. I'm like, what if Facebook and Instagram just shut down? I'm like, what would you do? You know, so I don't, yeah, I mean, I don't know. Like, to be able to kind of get the full, like, brand kind of success is definitely harder.

Like, I'm grateful that I'm not coming into it right now because there's a lot of competition. Well, I also struggle with how much free content you essentially need to give to keep the beast alive. Like, I'm like, okay, so I need to do recipes, you know, several times a week to keep people interested in my recipes. Totally. And what do I have left from my books? Right. No, I know. I struggled with that a lot, too.

I ended up doing a lot of like guest posters. Like I had people come on and share their recipes. And then I would like recycle old content. And then I would sometimes share sneak peeks from the books. But that was definitely like a struggle with me too because especially when my first book came out. Like I was still really small, was still trying to grow, was still trying to like give people stuff. So they wouldn't just like go away. Because if you just have a stagnant like blog or Instagram people don't want to keep following you.

So it was a struggle too for me that I was like, how do I keep this all up? And it's a lot of work books. Books people don't realize. But, like, writing a book is, I mean, it's a full-time job. I mean, it can take, and it's, like, two-year process, and it's a lot of work. And it's, like, really hard to, like, be able to do other stuff while you're writing and editing and putting and, like, promoting a cookbook. But, like, you have to because otherwise you get the call from your publisher, like, well, that's, yeah. We, like, we wanted you do the book because your brand.

Right, right, right. You can just let it go away. No, totally. And you can't neglect, like, your people, you know? I mean, like, they're there. And they don't want to just not hear from you for two years while you're writing a book. So that was my biggest thing was I was like, they're here and they're wanting stuff and they're needing stuff.

So it's like, I can't just disappear. Right. All right. So let's go back to the food. Yeah. Everybody's like, no, no, no. You can't heal you see with food. And then you were like, I'm going to go paleo.

Yeah. Didn't really start that way, actually. It started with the gaps and SCD. Have you heard of those? So specific carbohydrate diet and gaps. And it was what I first stumbled upon when I really started like really. researching diet and you see an autoimmune disease. And it's really similar to paleo, but it still allows a couple things that paleo doesn't. And so I was seeing improvement,

but it wasn't like seeing the full improvement that I was hoping for. Dairy's cool. Dairy's cool. I mean, it's like certain dairy. They focus on like fermented dairy. And then I kind of their whole thing is like nothing with lactose. So they allow cheese that's been like aged that doesn't have lactose. And they allow like making your own yogurt. But I think there were a couple things about it that were just not working for me. Like there was no focus on at the time because it's a pretty old protocol. There was no focus on, you know, like grass-fed dairy or organic dairy. And so like I'm still- It was like the 1900s and everything was grass-fed.

It was like, yeah. Go get the cow from your neighbor. And so there were just some things in like legumes, beans were still allowed as long as they were like soaked and sprouted. I'm trying to think if there was anything else. I think that was it. And so after my oldest was born when I went through that really bad flare-up, I worked with a functional medicine practitioner. And we did an elimination diet and then also kind of did like a food sensitivity type testing. And so I actually like stumbled upon paleo just based on my own body needs, which, you know, it wasn't big.

Like I always joke and say like I think at the time CrossFit gyms were still using Zone diet, which is like that just tells like CrossFit is sometimes kind of given like. like the, you know, like they kind of made paleo a little bit more popular, I think, in a way. And so it wasn't really, I think there were probably maybe two or three books out at the time about paleo. There wasn't really much out there, like maybe one blog. And so I hadn't really even never heard of it. But my, what came back on my, like, food allergy slash elimination diet was like almost like paleo to a tea. It was like no more dairy, definitely no grains, which I had already been off of, no legumes, nothing refined, you know, in like process. So it ended up just looking kind of like paleo.

So, but I didn't really know the word at the time. And this was just like internet researching, internet researching, internet researching? This was no, this was mostly with my functional, like we did a mass of like we did a full elimination diet. And it was like no legumes for you. Yeah. Yeah. It was like no legumes, no dairy, no grains.

And then quite a bit other stuff. Like we cut out eggs at the time and night shades and nuts. I mean, nuts and seeds. It was pretty strict. but I saw finally like the improvement that I was hoping for. I mean, within 48 hours. Like it was pretty miraculous and like so so correlated to what I wasn't eating. I feel like that'd be so annoying because I would be like, oh, there's a solution.

And then I'd be like, oh, the solution like involves not eating all of these foods that are really delicious. You know what? At that point because I was so desperate and I was so sick. I mean, I had just come out of two weeks in the hospital and probably three months bed rest with a nine-month-old baby. like who I couldn't take care of. So at that point, and then like the medications were just making me, I mean, 100 milligrams of prednisone steroids like makes you not yourself, like just a total basket case. And you just feel like you just don't feel like yourself.

So I think at that point, as hard as it was to cut out all the food, it almost was like the most relief I had ever felt. Because I mean, noticing your symptoms decrease in like 48 hours and maybe by like 80% decrease in my symptoms. when I had been on all these medications and in the hospital and nothing was getting better with everything they were doing. I was like, oh, you know, and I had like seen food work, but I'd never really stuck with it. So I never saw that drastic of an improvement because when you do an elimination diet, like you can't eat. You know, it's like you're not supposed to like cut it out and then start eating it like the next day. It's like you're off of it for a while. So do you think anybody with an autoimmune disease or with UC would benefit from a paleo diet or was it just like those take out whatever particularly irritates your body?

and you'll be fine. I think anybody can benefit from it. I think grains and dairy specifically are, they're inherently inflammatory and a lot of people's bodies just can't process them. So I think that's a great place to start. I also, like, I mean, I think the whole 30 program is a really great program. And just, for more than anything, it's like what I suggest people to just give it a shot with because it's like such clear guidelines that you don't feel like you're just kind of like going into it, like completely, you know, like blind. But then there's also the, if you're, if you're not finding relief from just kind of like more simply grain and dairy-free, there's the autoimmune protocol that's kind of, yeah, AIP. And that is almost like what I ended up on

with my elimination diet. It is crazy strict, but I think for like a 30 day, just to cut all the things out that could potentially be like inflammatory. And then you start to add those back in one at a time. And then that's really when you can see, like, you might, you know, you might be be able to eat dairy, but it might be the grains that are, like, causing you havoc, right? Or could be the legumes. So, yeah, I mean, I think it's a great, a really great place to start with food. What about people who aren't having any symptoms? Like, do you think totally healthy people, like your husband maybe should be eating this way too? So he's a good example. He started eating this way with me because I wouldn't stick to it. Like, he'd be eating bread or

french fries or something on his plate. And he'd be like, delicious. And he looked at me one day, which again, it's like, he's too good to be true. But he was like, do you need me to do this with you so that you stick to it. I know. He's like a one of a kind. I really, really lucked out with him. I mean, I chased him for a while in high school. So I guess you really? Yes. Yes, I did. I picture. I think because you are, you're very like pretty and you're also pretty and like a, you know, you're blonde. And I picture you as like the pretty popular girl in school with all the boys like fawning over you in No, not at all. What were you like in high school?

Just a quick side note. Yeah, a total quick side note. I mean, I guess I don't know. I had a couple guys, but no, I was really quiet. I played lacrosse. I just, like, I moved to California when I was a sophomore in high school. Oh, that's. It was a hard few years from me from Colorado Springs.

So, like, a small, yeah. Yeah. Kind of like, so I really wasn't. I was kind of like a little bit more awkward and, like, kind of quiet. And I don't know. And then you, like, saw him and you were like, him. Yeah, he actually went to a different high school. He'd be a good high school.

husband. 16. I'm like, I want to marry you. I kind of did. Yeah, no, I chased him for like almost a year. I mean, we were friends. Like, we were good friends, but I was like, you're going to be mine after this year. And he finally came to his census after like, I think about a year.

We dated for like two weeks in the middle, like in summer between his senior year anyways. And then it was after his senior year and I was going into my senior year that he finally like wore down and was like, all right. I love you. Pretty young. We got married right after college. So we were dating for about five years before we got married and got married when I was 22. Did you feel young? No, I've always felt like an old soul.

I mean, my roommate in college was 30 because I was so sick of like the young immature. Like, I mean, my first two roommates in college, like one of them burned a hole in the carpet with an iron and left like stoves on and everything was always messy. And they were the ones like, I can't do this. I literally like, like I found an older person to live with. because she was in grad school and I was like, this is going to be so much easier. I just have always kind of been, I've always been an older soul. I mean, I was like dreaming about being married and having kids when I was like 12. I just, it's just always been who I've been.

So, yeah, no, I didn't feel young at all. I wanted to be married like yesterday when we got married. I was like, I wanted to get married all through college. I'm glad we didn't because we were so young. And we had a lot of like growing up to do. But, but yeah, we were definitely, yeah, we were young. I think I was, I was 22 and he was. 23. Were you the first of your friends? Oh, by like a long day. Yeah. Yeah, much, much younger than any of our

friends. Well, I also know you, you're sort of involved in the religious and the church community as well, right? And people tend to get married younger in that world. My parents got married when they were like 19 and 20 and they're still together. That's insane. Which is pretty crazy. Yeah. And then, yeah. My husband's family is not like religious, I guess I would say, but they're still together too. And they were a little bit older, I want to say maybe like 27, 28 type of thing. But yeah, I mean, I think we had a lot of people around us that did get married kind of young. And just because we met so young, it was like, we've already been together for so long. Yeah, I've already together for like five years. It was kind of like, you know, why, why did we wait to like, I don't know. It was kind of like at this point, we were just

ready to like start our life together. I think that's funny now because I have friends who are in their early 30s and they date somebody for like a year. And then they're like, okay, getting married. And Zach and I dated for eight years because we met when we were 22, you know. Right. So just, okay, so he feels like he's totally healthy, but then he's like, I'm a perfect human. That was a very simple. So I will do your diet with you. Yes. Yeah.

It's, and then so he would eat with me the way I needed to eat at home. And then like he was working at an office. So when they, you know, he'd go out to lunch and get a burger with a bun or whatever. And he would come home on the days where he ate, you know, off and be like, I just don't really feel good. Or he'd be like, I'm kind of tired or, you know, like brain fog or just don't. Yeah. They just said like he just wouldn't feel himself. as much. And so he kind of like self-diagnosed himself with like a gluten intolerance. Like

nothing serious. And he could still, if he wanted to have it, you know, here and there. He still does every once in a while. But he just doesn't feel like 100%. He just feels better eating this way. And I've seen that with a lot of just my followers or even like my parents. Or I got my mother-in-law to start eating this way because she had psoriasis and it like went away when she went gluten and dairy. Well, she's not dairy-free. I can keep trying to get her to go dairy-free. But it's gotten a lot better. And like my, my parents kind of did, they didn't do like paleo, but they were pretty close. And they both are like in their, well, I'm like, I'm going to make them older than they are. They're pretty young still. They're like in their early 60s. But they were like still

running and biking and like just they said they slept better and, you know, just like all those things that I think when you say like a normal healthy person, I feel like there's probably not anybody that's living in this country that can say like they feel good 100% of the time. Like they're either really tired, not sleeping well, like have maybe migraines or joint pain or foggy, you know, like just kind of foggy. And so what, like, maybe they don't have anything serious diagnosed or they don't have like a chronic illness, but they may not be feeling like what they should feel like. Right. And so what I hear from when people, when they do it, you know, they do either a whole 30 or they do like a 30 day elimination, they just like they feel so much more like they should feel like they feel like they have more energy and they're sleeping better like just the kind of joint like, you know, pain. and aches that they just live with day to day or that they might pop Advil for, just go away.

And it's like, I think a lot of that is just the food that we're waiting. So where does the like feeling good of that of waking up and like feeling like you have energy and you're not achy and you have headaches, where does the feeling good of that run up against the feeling good of like having a glass of wine at happy hour and French fries with your friends? And like sort of food is a huge source of nourishment for us, but it's also a huge source of psychological pleasure. Totally. Yeah, I mean, that's one thing that I feel like I've been a bit on the outside of the public opinion in my space since I started.

Like, I would in the early days get, like, ridiculed for recreating cookies or cakes or things like that. And like more of like, well, if you're eating healthy, you don't need that kind of stuff. And I'm like, no, you do. Like, you do need. You always need that. Yeah, you always need it. I mean, I'm not telling you to go sit down and eat a grain-free cake five times a day. But like, when you have a birthday party that you want to celebrate somebody, it's like you can.

can still make a cake and you don't feel like you have to just be eating like carrots, you know? I'm like, it's not, I don't feel like that's a sustainable way to live. So, I mean, I still have a glass of wine. I can still do tequila sometimes. I'm like the, like, the not plant base. I don't know what I would call it, but I can't do grain based alcohols. So I know beer, of course, because a lot of that has gluten, wheat in it. But I, um, I, a glass of wine, I'm like, it's made from grapes. Um, I do try. And I've recently more tried to do more of the like natural kind of wines and organic and like biodynamic. And I don't know. Anyways. It's crazy.

This is like a quick mini lecture, but I think people think organic wine is just the grapes aren't sprayed with pesticides or whatever. But people actually, winemakers very, very, very commonly, unless they're saying that they don't do it, will add chemicals to increase the tannin. They'll add chemicals to increase the fermentation flavors. They're literally adding chemicals into the bottle, which I think is crazy. Yeah, it doesn't have to be listed. No, there's 88 types of chemicals added to like every,

average bottle of wine. Right. It's crazy. And then not to mention like the sugar and the the sulf. Like I mean, it's like, yeah, there's so much that's added into it. So I've been learning. And we live right near Napa. It's like one of our favorite little quick getaways. I didn't know. I mean, like, we just go visit any winery. And I just am like, oh, it's fine, you know, because it's not listed on the bottle. I'm like, it's great. And I've been learning a lot. And it's still like, it's kind of crazy. It's not. It's crazy. You don't have to list on the bottle. Like that blows my mind. Because if it was a food product, you would have to. Right. Yeah. I think it's so interesting. I do too. I mean, I mean, even like, yeah,

it's like you'll see that line that's like less than 2% of right but I'm like you maybe they should put that on wine like less than 2% of this chemical or this you know yeah it is a little crazy but yeah no I mean in that side of things like I do 100% agree that there's a huge emotional tie to food I mean I think there's a difference between like emotional eating and eating that has like ties to you know traditions and that foods that are nostalgic and foods that like are you know like in terms of like your heritage that are passed down or things like that. And so I don't ever want, I don't ever want to feel deprived. I don't want my kids to feel deprived. I don't want other people that are needing to eat this way to feel deprived. So that's

why I've created all the recipes that I have. But I think you can. I mean, it depends what you can tolerate, right? But I mean, yeah, a glass of wine or whatever you can do to go out and still get to like socialize and, you know, be with people and or have them over to your house and like get to make things for them. But I do think that's super important. And I think there's so much life that happens around food and in so many, like, relationships. And I don't, I don't feel like you have to, like, abstain from that type of stuff just because you have to eat a certain way. What do you think about the conversation that's happening in the wellness world now about wellness sort of being a new type of orthorexia or a new way to sort of limit yourself?

Yeah. Gosh, I mean, I'm just, I'm like, I haven't been asked that that much and I'm kind of still trying to like process everything in my brain about it too because it's I come from such a different perspective and like a reason for doing it like it's a necessity for me it's completely healed me and I do think like and I've always kind of said this and I think it might be I guess the best way I can answer I do agree like I think it's gotten I think it's gotten kind of crazy and a little bit out of hand and it's like especially with social media it's like it can just go off you know and like it can just yeah it can get really really crazy but um I think my person perspective in the way that I'd like to keep things in a way that I kind of wish it would go more is like I don't villainize the foods that I can't have even though technically I could because they could make me really really sick but I try to like celebrate the food that is really healing and like nourishing for me and I think that's a really good perspective to have on it. And then like I mean yeah to look at it to look at food positively I think is probably the biggest thing. But I mean yeah I can see it and I think unfortunately with things like you know I mean keto is one one thing.

that I feel like has gotten, like, way too, not saturate. I don't know, like, it's got, it's blown up and people are going to it for the wrong reasons of us. So it's like, that's one example that. Well, and the media is like part of that too. Oh, totally. Like, oh, people are searching for media. Media has clicks.

Like, we need to come up with keto articles and then it just feeds the cycle. Absolutely. And the people that are putting stuff out there, like, are not, they're first of all, they're not doing it for like, I hate the right reasons. That's like such a dumb thing to say. But they're coming to it for like a quick weight loss or because, they saw it on Pinterest or they saw it on Instagram and like, oh, she looks good and she does it. So I'm going to do it. But they're not like researching what it is or why. And, you know,

like, I think that's what I've loved about the paleo community since it started. And I feel like it's really not. I mean, there's definitely like the odd like Pinterest, you know, or like Instagram account that just jumps on it like as a bandwagon that doesn't really like know what they're doing. But for the most part, I feel like it's really stayed true to kind of why people started it in the first place of trying to find healing and health rather than like trying to lose weight. or jump on whatever, like, the most, you know, popular, like, diet is. And it also really focuses on, like, nutrient-dense foods and not, you know, like, I don't know, throwing, like, a stick of cream cheese into something.

But, yeah, it's a tough. I mean, the social media world has made it really difficult, I think, with all of the different special diets. And everybody believes that theirs is the right one. And they're, like, really, you know, it can get really intense. And I think it can definitely cause a lot of, like, disorder, like, disorder. like disordered eating. You're listening to the Healthier Together podcast. I want to take a quick break from this episode to talk about a special partnership I'm doing with a company I'm obsessed with, natural cycles. If you didn't hear on my earlier episodes, I'm sharing a mini diary entry on

each podcast about using the app as a non-hormonal way to prevent pregnancy. It has an efficacy of 93% with typical use and it's 98% effective with perfect use. You essentially take your temperature with a basal thermometer and then the app tells you whether you're on a red day, which means you should avoid sex or use protection to prevent pregnancy or a green day when you're good to go. Because I'm doing all of this in real time, I've been able to answer your questions as you send them through and you guys have so many good ones. One of you asked about how it works when you have an inconsistent schedule, like if you travel a lot or if you're a shift worker. This was super important to me in choosing a birth control method since, as many of you know, I've been traveling basically nonstop since my book came out in April, crisscrossing the country, and changing time zones. and I'm all the way over in Scotland right now.

So there are two main conditions that you need to make the temperature-taking element work. One is that you've gotten at least four hours of uninterrupted sleep, and the second is that you have to take it within a two-hour window in either direction every morning. So if you normally take your temperature at 8 a.m., you can take it any time after 6 a.m. or any time before 10 a.m., and that's still totally fine. So what happens if you don't get four hours of sleep or if it's outside that 2-hour window? because the people in natural cycles are super smart, they've created a system for that too. You take your temperature as normal, but then you mark it as deviating when you input it into the app.

This is put into the algorithm, and again, you might get more red days, but you still have that 98% efficacy rate. So if I travel and I cross more than a two-hour time zone, which I did right now, I'm a five-hour time difference in Scotland, I mark my temperature as deviating on the first night, and then after I've had a full night sleep, I take my temperature as normal. Like I said, I have been traveling a ton since using the app, and I haven't had any problems. I just mark it as deviating for night one, and then after that, I am good to go. Shift workers are a bit more complicated, but the good news is that you only need to measure temperature five times a week for natural cycles to work at its full capacity. So if you work shifts, or there are a few nights that you sleep different hours, it'll still work great for you, as long as there are five nights out of every seven that you wake up at the same time, whatever time that is. after sleeping at least four hours.

They also have a great article about dealing with different shift working situations, just going through all of the different scenarios. I will share a link to that in the show notes if you would like to check it out. I hope that helps. I am absolutely loving natural cycle so far, and I'm really passionate about spreading the word about it to everyone I can, since it's such an amazing non-hormonal birth control option. I'll be answering more of your questions on my next mini-dairy entry.

So if you have anything else you'd like to know, definitely hit me up on Instagram at Liz Moody. And definitely check out natural cycles.com. There's a ton of great information there and you can sign up and try it out for yourself. Now, let's get back to the episode. Have you ever been interested in experimenting with other types of diets that come out as like anti-inflammatory? I have. I've occasionally thought about being vegan, but because I can't tolerate any grains or beans. I'm like, I don't know what I would eat.

And I really know for fact that I cannot tolerate grains or legumes. So I'm like, well, that's not really an option. I also really feel like grass-fed meats and are like nourishing to me. Like I notice like I need the, I don't know, like the iron and the protein and I do really well on it. I'm very interested and I need to just like actually sit down. I'm super interested in all of Dr. Gundry's stuff with the plant paradox. Like I think a lot of the things that you're cutting out on paleo are. are, you know, like lower, no lectins.

But, like, I really am curious to hear even more about everything he does. Well, have you tried? So I don't, like, I'm not super anal about lectins. Yeah. I will buy pressure-cooked legumes so they don't have lectins. Have you, can you tolerate pressure-cooked? No. No.

I mean, I used to soak and sprout and do all the stuff. Like, and I just never have been able. They still just don't sit well with me. Do you do other sort of wellness-y stuff? wellnessy stuff. Like just, do you mean like, what do you put any weird powders in your smoothies? Do you take supplements? Do you meditate? What's your workout? Yeah, yeah. Okay. So that stuff has become, I'm trying to do more of it. I think at the beginning, food was like all I could handle. And it was kind of like, okay, I got to just get this like grasp this and then maybe kind of start. So I'm learning more. I mean, I definitely, I do collagen like in my coffee. And I haven't gotten into any of the, like all the. with mush, not mushroom, but like all the, I don't know, like the powders. Yeah, like all the powders.

I try. I'm like, I want to try it because I'm super curious about it all. I do supplements that are all like prescribed by my functional medicine doctor for sure. I've just realized that like food is huge, but I still need a little bit of help like on the supplementation side of things just with some like, I mean, I do like a liposomal carcumin, like just stuff for like anti-inflammatory, a few things that are kind of like gut healing. What's got what are just, I think a lot. lot of people listening are like, oh, super great. I could go to my functional doctor, but they don't

have one. Right. I know. And I'm always pretty hesitant to talk about the supplement side of things, honestly, just because there have been so many times where I've taken like a list that somebody else gave and gone on them and ended up actually having like reactions to some of them or it may be not helping. And so I'm always like, I know it's really hard. And a lot of those, like, I think there's a lot of websites that have some of the functional medicine doctors have put their kind of list out there. So I think it's really important to, like, work with somebody because even dosages can be so different, you know? But like, I mean, I do. Oh, my gosh.

Now I'm not going to even be able to remember any of the stuff that I do now that you just ask me, of course. But do you do a probiotic? Yes, I do a probiotic. Okay. That is. I'm like, yes. And then I eat a lot of fermented foods too. Is there a brand of probiotic you like?

Not right now because the one that I used to use is not in production anymore. I used to, well, and I used to use one called VSL3 that's like kind of specific. for crimes. Didn't they get recall? Yeah. Well, they like went through. That was the one I like, I recommended to everybody who needed like serious. Serious line. And then my editor, my book editor actually texted me and was like, this pill you recommended me is going to recall. No, I don't know that it was recalled. There went through some like legal thing between the two partners. And so I think they they did like an offshoot into another one. But the new one and maybe VSL had it too and I just didn't notice. But the new one does have a little bit of dairy in it. So it just kind of depends. So anyways,

I'm kind of on the search for a new one. I also used to use, um, Gosh, there were quite a few that I've been on over the years. But if just like storebought brand, the best one I think is ultimate flora. It's like a super high potency, no dairy, no gluten, no soy, like that, no corn, I think. And you can just like get that at Whole Foods. So that's kind of like the one that I'm going to take in the interim. I'm going to think about the other things that I take because it's like, you know, Dr. Gundry takes over 100 supplements every day.

Does he really? Yeah. A hundred? Yeah. Holy. I'm like, that's a lot. When I was still full time at MBGA, I wanted to get. get the entire list from him. But I also feel like a lot of them might be like his brand.

Sure. Of course. Right, right, right. But he takes a hundred a day, which is like really insane. A lot. It is a lot. You also kind of wonder like, can you find the full healing without all of those or not? You know, I don't know. I think that's always the question. I think people are always like, am I taking this? Like, do you know, when people ask me like, what of those cool new things should they try? I'm like, I always am like, what is your issue you're trying to solve? Right. And if you're just doing it because it's like cool and interesting, then don't do it. But if you're like, like, I don't eat fish. I don't eat seafood at all. It makes me projectile vomit. So I take omega-3s because I'm not getting them in the same quantity. I take a fish oil, like a coddiver fish oil or something like that. Yeah. But I think just like you should know everything you look at in your cabinet. You should or like you were like, oh, I take this bioavailable curcumin because I need something that's anti-inflammatory. Like I think you should be able to tie a direct one-to-one correlation for everything. Which is another reason why I hesitate to say that. sometimes because like I know why I'm taking them because my doctor helped me like figure out

why I needed them and ran tests and like you know so that's where I'm always like there I mean supplements like people don't they're like medications in a way right it's like but people don't always look at them like that because they can get them readily and I just think it's it's super important to like know why you're taking it what you're taking how much you're taking um because I've definitely like there's been times where I've reverted to like an old supplementation protocol when I've started like having symptoms that was from like a couple years ago and not gotten back. better or had things get worse. And I've realized like something that I was taking was like making things worse for some reason. I don't know why and I don't quite get it. But like that's what I'm

always hesitant of recommending. I'm like, I just don't want somebody to like think like this is the this is like the answer or the fix, you know, and then for them not to see like that maybe something's not sitting right with their body or maybe the brand that I'm taking is like I've changed, you know, different brands here and there that have different additives or whatever and like everybody's body is a little bit different. But yeah, there's one that I was going to think of that I'm going to remember what it is. You can tell me later. Yeah, I can tell you later.

The magical supplement. Yeah, you're right, right. The best supplement ever. Okay, so what other wellness-y stuff? I mean, I've put priority on exercise lately, which I've not done in the past mostly, I think, because I've, like, been pregnant or postpartum. So I'm really enjoying that. And it's mostly like, it's a mental thing, I think, for me. Like, I just feel accomplished, but I also just feel better about myself and the decisions that I make.

I've been doing orange theory. It's intense. And I've always... I know what orange theory, like I've seen it. Yeah. But what do you do in there? So it's funny because I was like always like a yoga bar method, walk like very low impact. And my husband got me to go in December and I've kind of like become like addicted to us.

I'm like, I like it. It's an hour and that's my other. I've just always hated exercise and the fact that the hour passes before like I noticed to me is huge. The music's really fun and like the instructors are usually really fun. But it's a combination of like three. So there's like the weight floor and then rowing and then treadmill. And the nice thing that I like is you can kind of go at like your own speed. So like for the first, I'm not, I've never been a runner.

So for the first like six months that I went, you can do power walking like on an incline, which I felt like was really great. And it still got my heart rate up. And then like on the weight floor, you can do like eight pound weights if you want. Right. So it's like it's nice because it's kind of like it's not pushing you to, I don't know, to like be all like, you know, like yoked. So I like it.

And I felt, so it's like, I mean, it's all about like getting into the orange zone, which is like, I don't, don't, don't ask me the science between it. But it's raising and like getting your heart rate to kind of come back down and go back up a lot. I don't, I'm probably not explaining it. It's like an intensity interval training. Exactly. Yes. Okay. Yes.

So I like it. It's been good for me. And I've noticed like difference in my body and just everything. So. And then I am terrible at meditating. My functional practitioner keeps telling me that I have to do it. and I've like tried so many times and I'm working on it. I understand.

Is it just like fitting it into your day? Yes. And like, are you bored? A both. All of it. All of it. And I'm so distracted so easily. My brain's constantly running and I know you're supposed to like let your brain go and

then bring it back. And I'm just like it's just and it's more of just like getting to be a habit. It's like I'll do it. I'll do it for like a day. And then I won't do it for like six months. And then I'll do know. So I'm, but I would love to because I know how good it can be for people. But then I,

I would say, like when I, I mean, I talked about like mental health, I think is super important. Like, I started seeing a counselor, like, maybe a year ago, which I have never done before. And we've gone through some, like, emotional trauma and loss. And then I think even just, like, from my disease and everything we've gone through and getting to, like, actually talk about that to somebody and really not just like, I'm definitely like a, not a, like, a harbor. Like, I would keep stuff in. Like, I just wouldn't be super open about emotions and, like, talking through things. And so I think that, like mental health, I think, is huge. So switching gears a little bit.

I have a few questions that I ask everybody. And these are fun and easy. Okay. So one is if you have 20 minutes every day, what's the best way to spend that to live a healthier, happier life? Take a nap. Take a nap. Okay.

Can you just like lay down and nap? I mean, like, I can, like, sleep in the plane and in the car. Oh, I mean, I'm, yeah. I guess, yeah, I would just, yeah, or take a good, nice walk. You're like, have a number of kids and then you'll also be able to know. True, true. Yeah, take an app or just go like silently, like take a walk. Like, no podcasts, no social media, like just you out in nature.

Like, just by yourself. That's my dad's number one pet peeve is when we go hiking and people have headphones on. And I also like get mad at that. But then I lost my headphones three days ago and I was like unwilling to walk to the grocery store because I was like, how will I listen to my music or my podcast? And my husband was like, just walked to the grocery store. And it was crazy to me how I thought of myself was all high and mighty because my dad and I would make fun of people.

But I was that person, like very much. I noticed that in New York, like everybody has their headphones on. And a part of that I think is like when we're talking about connecting with people and community, it's like headphones mean like don't talk to me. And at work you especially sit in an office environment, headphones on means don't talk to me. And headphones off means like I'm available. Right. Or like on the airplane.

It's like if you don't want to talk to your neighbor. Yeah. Headphones on. But I mean, when I'm here, because I don't know my way around, I don't put headphones in usually. And I think it's fascinating. Just like walk the street and be walking where you're supposed to going. But you're just like hearing people's conversations and the noises and like, I don't know. I just, I prefer to not have them in because you really don't hear anything else.

I love little bits of people's conversations because I'm always like, oh my gosh, that person has like a whole life. Yeah. I just find that so like they're going home to like fight with their party. partner, like have hot sex or like eat weird. And I just find it so weird. It is. It's really interesting. Because you have these one second interactions in New York 400,000 times a day, you know? Right. Um, okay. So what else? I'm like distracted. Oh, sorry. 20 minutes. Yeah, 20 minutes. And what does success mean like mean to you? And do you feel like you are successful? Oh. Success. Well, I'll start with saying yes. I feel like I am successful. And that is because I'm staying like I'm, like I'm, I'm constantly. constantly achieving what I set out to do, which was to share my story in hopes of helping people. So I feel like I've, I mean, there's like the tangible success of my books and all that kind of stuff. But honestly, that's like not what's important.

Like everything I do is to try to help somebody else not suffer and not be as sick and not, like, go through the many years that I had to go through to like find food as healing. So, so yes, I think I've succeeded in that. Are you motivated by money? Like, and if so, how much? How much money or like how much in my mother? How much does money drive your decisions? And does the idea of being like wealthy appeal to you?

I mean, I want my kids and our family to like be comfortable and I don't want to have to worry. Like I worried about money all through college and like in our newlywed years. So yes, in a way like I want to feel stable. I do like, I'm like I do like, I'm not going to lie and be like, I don't care about nice things or anything. I've always had a little bit of like champagne taste on like a beer budget back. in the day. Like, I mean, I'm like, classic will, like, go to a rack and see something and, like, immediately my hand touch is, like, the most expensive thing. It's just a bad thing. But I'm not motivated in, like, what I do by money. I mean, literally, I would consider myself very business savvy

at the same time. And I definitely, like, have grown to see what I'm worth and will negotiate and get more than, like, somebody originally offers. So in that way, like, I mean, this is, this is a business now, if you will, and I run it like a business. So I guess, I mean, definitely there's like finances involved in that. But, um, but like I would never do something that wasn't like, like, kind of part of like my true north just because somebody offered me like a bunch of money. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm constantly astonished by how much I can ask for more money and people are just like, sure. And I'm like, so if I hadn't asked, I would just have a thousand dollars less right now. And they're like, yep. And I'm just like, what? Yeah. They try to, I mean, gosh, then why not? Like if you're

the business owner, like you try to get away with the lowest you can. I know, but they don't even negotiate when I ask. They're just like, okay. And I was like, cool. That's great. Yeah, no, it's really, it's like, it makes me want to tell all of my friends, like, just try it. And when people do say, no, they're not like, oh, I don't want to work with you. They're like, no, we can only do this much. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's kind of like asking for a raise. Like, I have employees, you know, that, and like, you, it's like, you go in and you prove your worth and then you ask type of a thing. And I think it's kind of like the same thing when you're negotiating a contract or whatever. It's like, you know, you show them why you're worth it and then you ask.

And if they say no, then you're like, all right, well, let me think about it, you know, and let me come back to you or you accept it or whatever. But yeah, no, I mean, it is true. Like, I think I'll never forget when I finally started working with a literary agent and just how she, like, oh, like, valued me so much more than I would have ever valued myself. And I was like, oh, like, wow, okay, you know, like, it was great for me to see because I didn't have that confidence at first. And I've realized now, like, okay, like, I've got, you know,

I've built something and I can ask for a certain amount. And again, it's like if they say no, they say no. And we kind of try to come meet in the middle. Well, and I think you really can sometimes other people are necessary to value you more. So I actually think it'd be interesting to be like to ask your friend what you think something. Like ask as many questions as you can from other people because sometimes other people will tell you that you should be valuing yourself more than you are. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

Yeah. What is something that you've bought that's made your life healthier or happier? Oh. Gosh. I mean, all the food. I'm trying to think, like, you mean like a contraption or like a gadget or something? Like anything that you can think of a specific thing where you're just like, I spend money in this. I'm going to say my Apple Watch. All right. I was like a late adopter. My husband obviously had like all the first like, you know, versions of it from like the minute it came out. And he talked me to getting one around Christmas time. And there's a couple reasons. First of all, it has totally made me healthier like physically because of the rings that you close. Like getting you see if there's like three rings. It's like standing, exercise, and moving, or I don't know what it is.

Anyways. And so it makes, like, because I do sit at a desk a lot of the day, like, so it makes sure that it, it pings you to, like, stand up. And then at the end of the day, it basically, like, if you don't close the blue ring, it means you didn't stand up enough. Oh, it like gamifies it. Yeah, a little bit. And so, and then, like, in terms of just exercising and steps and stuff, like, it, it'll

like, you know, like the rings. Basically, so you want to, like, have all the rings closed. Is it 10,000 for steps? I don't know what it. Actually, I think you can. set. Like you can set based on like, I don't know, what age you are, female mail, that kind of a thing. So that, like, just physically wise, like, I mean, it's kind of embarrassing, but like if it's almost closed at the end of the day, I'll, like, run in place by my bed. It's like totally become,

like, it's a little bit unhealthy, but also healthier. But, like, honestly, if I'm, like, looking at the middle of the day and I've been in my office all day and it's, like, not even close, I'll be like, I need to go out for a walk. And we've got this great trail by in our house and I'll go out for 30 minutes, you know? Or, like, take my phone calls on a walk instead of, like, sitting at my desk. So that's been great. And then on a, like mental like just lifestyle side of things. The biggest reason why I got it was because my work is so attached to my phone and to social media and to everything that I was on it so much. And I was, I've been really trying to set it aside when I'm with my kids. And like I'd come,

you know, finish work at the end of the day at like four usually is kind of when I wrap up. But if I'd get a text from somebody, I would end up on Instagram or like I end up checking my email and it's just this terrible impulse that like as soon as my phone opens for something else. I do that too. I end up on this terrible rabbit trail of like scrolling Instagram or whatever. And so with this, it's like I can get a text. I can come at the end of day. The phone can go like way high up like on a shelf or I don't even see it. And then if I get a text, then I can check it and respond, but I can't get onto Instagram or Instagram or email on the little. You can do email, but it's like so poorly set up that I don't ever use it on there because it's like you can't really respond very easily. So it's been really

helpful for me in that, that I can kind of like set work aside and personal. And like if somebody really needs me, I know they can get me on it. I mean, it's totally like a splurge, but I feel like in terms of like it's made me healthier in a lot of different ways. So plug for Apple. We should get them to sponsor this podcast. I feel like they are like, we don't need to. Yeah. No, they don't. They don't need to sponsor anybody. Is there anywhere in the world that you've been where you're like, these people really got it right in terms of living a good life? Yes. Two places. I need to travel more because it's been since having kids. We haven't. Kona, Hawaii. We lived there, not lived, but we were there for like nine weeks. We actually did. We moved everything over there

with my son. Why? My husband was working for a nonprofit over there that was like tied to triathlons and they do the Iron Man there every year or something like that. I don't know how often it is. So we went over there actually with the intention of like we might stay here and we went for four weeks, ended up staying for nine and then went home. because it was just a little too, like, slow and landlocked and it just wasn't working for, like, our business or my business and his anyways. But their pace of life is so slow. Uh, they value community, like living with people, not living in the house with people, but like living life with people. Like, they will get to, like, the friends that we had there. It's like, you could call

them at four and be like, come over for dinner and they would come for dinner or like your kids could just play. Um, so that to us was like a huge. This was like, my son was two, so this was like seven years ago. And it has completely changed us as like a family and how we do things and how we value things and like the priorities we put on friendships and on life and just everything. And honestly, like a lot of times we'll be like, I just wish we could live back in Kona. Because California is pretty fast pace. It's like very much driven. Like it's so expensive to live there that it's very much driven, you know, by people like overworking and over scheduling themselves. And so that. Which is so funny though, because I live in New York and I'm constantly like, I want to move to. California because it's such a slower pace. I'm sure it's way slower than it is here. Yeah. I should just like, oh, that's where it's relaxing. I mean, it's still, well, I live in the Bay Area. So it's like this overachieving, like, I mean, it's got, we've got like Silicon Valley. And so it's very like, everybody needs to be, you know, like, you know, I'm like, I just remember even in high school. It was like everybody's taking AP courses and they needed like a 4.5, you know, like GPA. And so it's

just very kind of like high pace. A lot of households are dual, dual working. And so it's like people are just very, very busy. And I think they pride themselves also in being busy. It's like busy these days can be like, people are like, I'm just so busy, you know. It's a badge of honor. Yeah. Yeah. So Cona, it's like just super slow and really like, I don't know. It was just like, it was a very like eye-opening time for us of like, oh, wow. Like this is, you know. And so we've seen something similar in Nashville. Like I have a lot of friends that live in Nashville. And it was kind of that same thing. Like there's no fences between like people's yards and my friends' neighborhood and the kids literally are just like running in between each other's houses like we used to do when we were kids and

riding their bikes to the pool and neighbors are still borrowing sugar from each other. And like it's just, I don't know, there's definitely like a slower pace of life and a much more kind of like emphasis on spending time with people. The community in Nashville seems insane. Yeah, we've tried to move there quite a few times, but like our whole family's in California. And we can't leave grandparents and my brother. And like we just, it's beautiful in California too. but we've talked about moving there for like years and just feel like...

Do you just go back now? I do. I go back and visit a lot, like at least like four or five times a year. But yeah, there's something kind of special there too, just about like people and that they all still like have block parties. And like it just, it feels like the way I grew up. Yeah. So those two places.

But yes, that and I'm sure anywhere in like Europe and small towns would probably be the same. What is one big mistake you've made and what's something you really got right? And this is the last one so you can like bring us home. One big mistake I've made. Mistakes that I've learned from frequently actually happen often with my kids where like I say something out of like emotion or not having enough patience with them and like or disciplining like without really thinking through like as a parent. A lot of times you're like and no TV for a week. And then you're like, oh crap. Like now I don't have any time for myself and I can't even cook dinner.

I don't know. But I think I feel like I've had to really learn to like just because I'm the mom doesn't mean that I can't apologize to them as a kid. And I think it's really good for them to see of like me being humble in that way and being like, hey, I'm sorry for the way that I said that. Or I'm sorry I raised my voice. Or, you know, like I should have stopped for a minute to think about that before I said that. Or I mean, even with like the device thing, like that's one thing.

I feel like I've actually had to try to be, like, honest with them. I'm like, hey, I'm sorry. You just pretend to talk to me and I was on my phone. Like, so kind of just like trying to to like be honest and open with them about mistakes that I make as a mom too. That's so cool. What a cool thing to like say I'm fallible and like it's okay to be foul. Yeah. Like to give permission for that.

Yeah. That's like such a gift. Yeah. Well, I think like as a parent you want to just look like, you know, you always want to like have the authority and be in charge. So it's hard for, I think, as a parent to like tell your child that you were wrong. But then you're probably raising. these children who are like, it's okay to be wrong. And when I'm wrong, I can tell people.

And it's okay to say sorry. Like, I think, I mean, I'll, like the face that they'll get when you say sorry is kind of huge. Like, it's like, oh, wow. So, and I've learned a lot of that. Like, my, my husband is very, I've learned from him more about, like, having patience and, like, kind of being more. I'm definitely a little more emotional and, like, raise my voice. And he's usually, like, he handles them in a really great way. So I kind of watch him to, like, model that after.

one accomplishment. To me, you really got right. Something I really got right. I nailed that. Oh, gosh. Well, I mean, I think aside from my books, which I'm really proud of, my cookbooks, I'm going to go back to my kids because we recently, and I just because I was talking about it last night on Instagram,

but I think the way that we've chosen to like, I'm far from a perfect parent, as you just saw, because my biggest mistake is also with my kids. But we have chosen, like, on the technology side of things, like, we've just never allowed them to, like, watch phones or iPads when we go out to dinner. And even more recently have, like, taken away all screens besides TV in our house just because, like, I'm noticing how it's affecting them. And it's definitely something that I'm, like, super fearful of as a parent growing, like, raising kids and something that's so new from when I was growing up. So I feel like we've gotten that right, honestly, because, like, they can sit at dinner and color. and have a conversation and not, like, have to be watching a show or playing a game.

I mean, we are, like, on, like, long plane rides and stuff like that. Like, we totally allow it. But it's always been really important for us to, like, feel like they can have a conversation with each other, with, with, like, us, with other adults. And I'm proud of that. Like, and it's hard. Like, it's not something, like, a lot of times we'll be out to dinner. And my husband and are, like, we could have such a better dinner right now if they were

just, like, watching a show, right? Like, that's why parents do it because they're quiet and they don't, like, scream. and, you know, complain or whatever. And I'm like, but we have date nights instead where we leave them home. We get our time. And I'm like, if we're going to go out to dinner as a family, I would like to be as a family and not them watching something and us sitting and chatting. And that's something that's, like, it's hard to enforce, especially when lots of other kids

around them are on it. But I feel like we're proud. I'm kind of proud of that. Yeah, I love that. Yeah. I was going to say the one that you really got right was chasing down your husband. Totally. That was the best decision I ever made.

It was chasing my husband down. Yeah. I feel like you should listen as part of it. I guess is like a love letter. He knows. I'm like, I hope he knows. He used to joke and like say I was a stalker, but I'm like, he called and texted me like every day. So I'm like, you. Money. He ended up pretty well lost. He's like, I like to think so. I'm like, he benefited from my chasing. Yes. Very much. I'm all about, I hit on my husband. I'm all about like a strong, powerful woman making the first, the first stuff. I'm nothing wrong with it. That's a good one. I will

remember that in the future. My best decision I've ever made is choosing Ryan. Well, thank you so much for taking the time to chat with me. Thank you. This was a great conversation. I hope you loved this episode with Danielle, and you found her as inspiring and lovely and just fun to hang out with as I did. I would love to hear if you love the episode, definitely let me know on Instagram. And if you wouldn't mind, I would obviously appreciate an iTunes review.

It's actually really useful for me to get the reviews and kind of see who's loving what type of episode because then I can do more of those types of episodes in the future. So if you do an iTunes review and you're like, oh, I love the episode with Danielle. It was one of my favorites. Or I love this, this and this episode. I'm like, okay, got it. I can do more of exactly that type of thing in the future. So I can keep giving you guys episodes that you love and that you love to listen to.

I will be back in two weeks with a really fun episode that I'm very excited to share with you all. And I can't wait to talk to you then. Have a great one. I'm genuinely confused how Masterclass gets literally the absolute top people in every single field to teach every single one of their classes. I use it when I want to learn things directly, like the cooking class from Thomas Keller has all of the wisdom that you would normally have to go to culinary school for. But also, I'm being honest, this is like a use case I don't hear a lot of people talking about. I'll just watch it for entertainment when I want to do something that's far more interesting than scrolling.

Christina Aguilera taught me to sing. Shan Boudrum's Art of Mastering Confidence and Sex Appeal class is 10 out of 10. There's menopause classes with leading doctors. There's script writing with Mindy Kaling. literally, you name it, they're on Masterclass, and it is such a good way to get off your phone, but have something that's like not quite as long or hard to get into as a TV show or a movie, and that it just keeps you entertained and interested. And you are learning. There are over 200 classes from the world's best, all for just $10 a month when billed annually. And you get unlimited access to every class on the platform so you can learn at your own pace

whenever you want on your phone, your computer, or even in audio mode, like a podcast. If you're looking to stop scrolling and start consuming entertaining content that makes you feel excited and helps you learn, Masterclass is it. And the best part, every membership comes with a 30-day money-back guarantee so you can start learning risk-free. Right now, our listeners get an additional 15% off any annual membership at Masterclass.com slash Liz Moody. That's 15% off at Masterclass.com slash Liz Moody, Masterclass.com slash Liz Moody.

When it comes to wellness, you're going to get the best results by focusing on the big needle movers. A lot of us spend a lot of time trying to optimize that last 1%, which creates a ton of stress, and it actually doesn't help our health that much. At the top of the needle mover list, sleep. And one of the best ways to optimize your sleep is to optimize your mattress, which is why I love avocado green mattress so much. First of all, this mattress is so comfortable. I have the one with the pillow top, which is medium firm, and it's just a dream. I miss it when I travel. It's better than even the fanciest hotel beds.

Having a mattress that supports your joints and your body and feels good is going to help you get more sleep and better quality sleep. But then, on top of that, avocado mattresses are made with certified organic cotton, wool, and latex, and they are made safe and green guard gold certified. They're also Okotech certified, which is the gold standard. I look for it in any mattresses, sheets, or towels that I buy, which means the materials have been rigorously tested for harmful substances. You can actually look for the Okotech standard 100 label right on the product, and I love this part. It includes a traceable certificate number and the name of the testing lab so you know exactly what you're getting. There are no toxic chemicals. There's no harmful off gassing. It does not smell like it's going to kill you when you unbox it. This is what I mean. I'm not going to swap out all of my clothing, which is that top 1% of optimization. But by making sure that my mattress and my bedding are as good for me as possible, I literally reduce my exposure during a third of.

of my life, which is a huge needle mover for a one-time swap. I will also note, and this is a me thing, but I sleep super hot and avocado's materials are really breathable and it makes me sweat the least of any mattress that I have slept on. And avocado is a certified B-Corp and a 1% for the planet member because caring for yourself and caring for the planet do not have to be separate things. You can get up to 20% off organic mattresses and more by shopping Avocados President's Day sale right now at avocado green mattress.com. That is avocado green mattress.com, no code needed.