The Liz Moody Podcast - How To Simplify Your Life (And Become Way Happier!)—An Inside Look at Van Life with @courtandnate

Episode Date: September 29, 2021

I’m so excited to welcome Courtnie from @courtandnate to the pod to talk all about van life! I discovered Court and Nate’s page on TikTok during quarantine and became completely fascinated with the idea of living in a van, traveling between all of these beautiful places. And while this episode will answer all of your voyeuristic questions about van life, like how they deal with pooping and how much it costs and if it’s actually as aesthetic as it looks on social media, it ended up really being about the ideas behind van life. Namely: simplifying things. Scaling back, paring down. Living with intention. Not working a ton of hours just to get a promotion to get more money you don’t have time to spend. Not filling a house with things that stop bringing you joy after having them for a few weeks. Thinking about what life you REALLY want, and what makes you ACTUALLY happy. On this episode, we talk about: why they decided to do van life and how they got started her advice to anyone who wants to make a life change or take a big risk what a normal work day looks like while living in a van relationship lessons from living in a van how to separate your worth from what society deems fiscally valuable exactly how to simplify your life (and become way happier in the process!) the surprising benefits of NOT striving for wealth or professional success all the dirty deets of peeing and pooping in a van the most beautiful places she’s been in her van life the best and worst parts of van life the one diet that completely changed her relationship with food and helped her heal her disordered eating her healthy morning and evening routines how to be who YOU are, outside of other people and society’s expectations I’ve been thinking about a lot of what we discussed in this episode for weeks, and I’d LOVE to hear your thoughts, so definitely tag me on social media—I’m @lizmoody, and Courtnie is @courtandnate. PS: My Patreon is live! You can join Green Smoothie Society and get access to ALL of my green smoothie recipes and advice! Get all the deets at patreon.com/lizmoody. This episode is sponsored by Paleovalley, who make incredibly high quality supplements. If you’d like to check out their Turmeric Complex, Vitamin C, Neuroeffect, or any of Paleovalley’s other amazing products, head over to paleovalley.com and use the code LIZM for 15% off. This episode is sponsored by Seed, the makers of one of my all-time favorite supplements. Their Seed Daily Synbiotic is a game changer—it contains both pre- and probiotics, survives INTACT all the way into your gut, AND contains the most studied and powerful strains of probiotics out there. You can get 15% off of your first month’s supply of Seed’s Daily Synbiotic by going to seed.com and using the code LIZMOODY. This episode is sponsored by Garden of Life, the only collagen I’ve trusted for years. To try it for yourself and let them know you found them through me, use this link to check it out (it won’t cost you anything extra): https://amzn.to/3hkzfnF This episode is sponsored by GoMacro, and you MUST try their Oatmeal Chocolate Chip bars. You can get a whopping 30% off your order of $50 or more PLUS free shipping by going to gomacro.com and using the code healthiertogether. Healthier Together cover art by Zack. Healthier Together music by Alex Ruimy. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

So friends, and welcome back to the Healthier Together podcast. I'm your host, Liz Moody, and I am a cookbook author and long-time journalist. Today, I am so excited to welcome Courtney from at Courtney Nate to the pod to talk all about van life. I discovered Courtney Nate's page on TikTok during quarantine, and I became completely fascinated with the idea of living in a van, traveling between all of these beautiful places, and while this episode will answer all of your voyeuristic questions about van life like how they deal with pooping.

We talk a lot about pooping. And how much it costs and if it's actually as aesthetic as it looks on social media, it ended up really being about the ideas behind van life. Namely, simplifying things. Scaling back, paring down, living with intention. Not working a ton of hours just to get a promotion to get more money that you don't actually have time to spend. Not filling a house with things that stop bringing you joy after having them for a few weeks.

thinking about what life you really want and what makes you actually happy. I've been thinking a lot about what we discussed in this episode ever since we recorded it, and I would love to hear your thought, so definitely tag me on social media. I am at Liz Moody, and Courtney is at court and Nate. Court is with a C. And if this episode bites you with that adventure bug, definitely go check out my summer episode with Renee Roaming, which is all about traveling, camping and hiking for newbies,

and going after your dreams, whatever they may be. And if you love what you're listening to and you are new here, do not forget to subscribe. New episodes drop every single Wednesday, and we have a ton of good ones coming up, including an interview all about lasers and dermatology procedures, a stylist sharing how to look cute. I'm very excited about that one.

A new episode of our morning and evening routine series featuring some very special guests and more. And if you are an old hat member of the fam, thank you for being here. I love you and I love spending this time together. All right, without further ado, let's get into the episode featuring Courtney from at Court and Nate. Okay, Courtney, thank you so much for joining me on the podcast today. Of course. Thank you for having me, Liz. I love your podcast. I listen to every episode. Oh, that makes me

really happy. Well, then you shouldn't be surprised by anywhere we go with this episode. You knew what you were getting into when you signed up for this. Absolutely. I'm excited. We were just talking about sleep. So you're staying in a hotel right now to have Wi-Fi and just to like check out this hotel. And we were talking about how there are seals outside. And you might hear seals during the episode, which is, I think, very, very peaceful and natureish. But you're, I'm curious about the sleep thing in the van life. Because I have a big phobia. Like, not phobia. It's like, we move every month, right? And it's my biggest fear when we book these Airbnb is that I won't be able to sleep in them. And people are always like, well, why don't you stay longer than a month?

And I'm like, well, that's the longest if something was really weird and wrong that I can picture handling it. Like, is the sleep thing harder or easier in a van? Like, is it hard to get away from roads and people and traffic noises? You know, that's a good question. I think, I feel like it'll be different for everyone. But we went from an apartment that was right in the middle of downtown Huntington Beach on a super busy street, like right by PCH. by the highway. And when we'd sleep with our windows open, there'd be cars racing up and down the street all the time. So it was already pretty loud. And I feel like that prepared us for the van.

We don't really have a hard time sleeping. Our bed's pretty comfortable. And there will be times where we're kind of on the side of a busier road. And it's more noisy. But I think we're just used to it at this point. So we sleep really good in the van. All right. Well, that's like my, it's like my biggest fear with van life, honestly, is I just feel like I need like my and the of work, which we'll get into. Okay, let's go back to the beginning. Can you talk to me about where, like, the whole thing started? Like, how long had you and Nate been together? Who was like, let's do van life? Yeah. So, Nate and I met, we worked together. We worked valet at a restaurant in Huntington Beach. And he was actually my manager. And that's where we met. And we got together,

we've been together for six years now. And we lived, we like moved in together right. away like a month and a half of dating we moved in together and we shared a super small room in a house that we shared with two other girls so we already were kind of like used to being in super close quarters and then we got an apartment just the two of us like a year and a half into our relationship we live there for a while and we're kind of just just working living paycheck to paycheck, that kind of thing. And we're like, we love going on adventures, not necessarily doing super long travels, but kind of getting out of town for a day or two. And we basically spend all of the rest of our money on, you know, doing little trips here and there. So the idea of van life

kind of came around just when we felt kind of stuck. We didn't know where to go, what to do. we wanted to be able to kind of save money and get on a better path for ourselves because we're just not being good at managing our money. So we kind of had the idea. And it's one of those things where you think about it and it's like, oh, no way. We can't do that. But then you keep thinking about it more and more and more and you start doing more and more research. And I think this is how it is for a lot of people. And then it becomes like more tangible. And then one day we just decided to pull the trigger. And I think we were both equally on board. We're so when you say it pulls the trigger, is that buying a van? Yeah, so we, I mean, it's kind of a long story, but we did it in a more,

basically when we get an idea, we really just want to go for it and find any way to make it happen. And at that time, we had really no money saved up at all and we didn't know how we were going to make it happen. So we got really good at working on our credit score and we got a loan for the van, which was kind of hard in itself to get alone, but that was really the only way we were going to make it happen. And so we got the van itself and then we're like, okay, now we have the van. How are we going to pay to build it out?

Because that's a whole separate process and a whole expense in itself. So we decided just to move out of our apartment as soon as we got the van and it was empty. There was nothing in it. It was just a cargo van. So we sold basically all of our stuff. And we moved into the van with just a mattress on the ground and no electricity, no nothing. And we basically used the next eight months. We took all that money that we would have been paying in rent and we put it towards our build.

So it took quite a while to do it. And it was a pretty uncomfortable process. But that's kind of the way that we were able to make it happen. And one of the big plans with the van was to kind of save money to get out of debt, etc., right? Yeah. Yeah. that was like our main goal. We wanted to be able to still live our life and have fun. And I think it's just if you want to get ahead, especially with what we were doing,

we weren't making a ton of money, but we were making enough to live fairly comfortably. But it was just like the idea of saving enough money to maybe buy a house one day. It just seemed so far out of reach with our lifestyle and our job. So this was just kind of the idea that we had. And I think it's really hard. to get to the point where you're actually saving money with the van because there is that initial cost. Yeah, I's going to ask like, did it work to say? Yeah. Because it feels so phenomenally, like Zach and I have talked about not doing van life full time, but adding a van into our ability to have adventures. And it seems so phenomenally expensive. Totally. Well, first of all, you can do it for

a lot cheaper. Like our van has all the bills and whistles. It's kind of, you know, we really put everything into it to make it feel like a home. So you can do a lot, like you can do a much more basic build with just the necessities or not even the necessities. Some people don't even have a full electrical system or running water. They kind of just make it work. I think for us, we knew that in order to make it worth it or to make to get to that point that we would be saving money, we'd have to be living in it for a substantial amount of time. So we wanted it to be comfortable. We wanted to to have some of those luxury items like hot water and a big refrigerator and a good electrical system. So that was kind of part of our plan was to do the initial cost and make it happen.

And then hopefully we would be comfortable enough to live in it for multiple years. So that was really scary in the beginning, like not knowing if we were going to like it and just knowing that we would have to be doing it for quite a while, especially since we got the loan. So yeah, I mean, it's not as easy as move into a van and you're saving money. There's definitely that initial cost. Well, and I think it's, there's something interesting to be said for this like changing your whole life and taking a big risk and leaping in in this way. Like, is there anything that you feel like you learned or you would tell somebody else who's looking to make a big life leap in that way, even if it wasn't, you know, from an apartment to a van?

anything like that? I think, well, first, it's important to think about why you're doing it. And especially with the van, I think people see it as an escape and maybe as a way to fix something. But I feel like it's things only get more challenging when you move into a van. So I think you have to be in a good place to start because it is a huge undertaking. But I also feel like if there's something, you can't stop thinking about, I feel like you should just try it because it's, you'll never know unless you try. And that's, that was the case for us. We didn't know if we were going to love it. We didn't know if we were going to hate it. But we couldn't stop thinking about it. So we thought we might as well just go for it. And, you know, we have the privilege to be able to choose to do that

and feel, you know, safe and secure in making that decision. So we figured we should just go for it. I love the can't stop thinking about it test. Like I think that's a really, It's a good litmus test. It works like for little things too. Like there's like a something you want to buy like a cute piece of clothing and you just don't, you know, you can't stop thinking about it for like a week or two weeks or three weeks and you're finally like, all right, maybe maybe I should add that into my repertoire of clothing, you know? Totally. Yeah. And I think just thinking about it and weighing out the pros and cons and kind of just sitting on it for a while. And if you really just can't stop thinking about it, just. go for it. And the thing with the van is they're pretty easy to resell. So if we hated it, we could have just sold it at some point. So the risk wasn't super huge. What do you, were you guys, what were you guys thinking you would do for work? Like, did you think you'd become full-time content creators? No. It wasn't in the plan. I think there is a misconception that if you live in a van,

that you're just like off the grid. And I know a lot of people save up so that they can, travel and not have to work on the road. And a lot of people have remote jobs. There's a lot of different ways to go about it. But for us, we just thought we would keep our valet jobs, just keep doing what we were doing. And we would just have a little bit more flexibility to travel more on our off days and put aside a little bit of money. But for the first year and a half, we were just still working valet five days a week. And then we would travel on our off days. And it wasn't until the pandemic that we had to make a change. Okay, so when you're saying, like, was the van parked in like, like, I always picture vans only

kind of working if you're in like a national park or, you know, like in the middle of nature somewhere, but were you parked it like on a driveway? Well, so we were in Huntington Beach and so when you're in a city, it's called stealth camping. So you're kind of like, we would go to work and then to park for the. the night we would go to like a neighborhood, get there super late so that no one really noticed us and then leave first thing in the morning. So we'd kind of just park in neighborhoods, residential areas. And that's kind of, that's a part of van life too. If you're still working or you're in a city, you kind of have to fly under the radar and just, it's definitely not all

beautiful views. That sounds so stressful to have to like wake up early and creep out of a neighborhood before people notice that you're there? Yeah, I mean, it's just kind of part of the lifestyle. For us, at least, I can't speak for everyone, but I know for us we try to be super responsible about it and be courteous to people, you know, homeowners and people were parking by their house. We try not to park directly in front of someone's home, but we realize that not everyone is going to appreciate people living in their cars or in vans. in their neighborhood. So that's just part of our routine

and part of the way that we try to stay responsible about it. So then the pandemic hit and you guys, I assume wherever you were valet and was just no longer open. Yeah, yeah. So we got laid off in March. And were you guys like, we can do this band thing full time? Like, did you have an Instagram, TikTok presence at that point? Yeah.

So I actually, I've had my Instagram for quite a while. I think it's been like, like four or five years now. I started it when I did my yoga teacher training. I'm a yoga teacher as well. So I just started it randomly as a way to kind of share my yoga and my teaching schedule. And then I've always been super passionate about wellness and eating healthy and making, you know, healthy recipes and stuff like that. So I started posting some of that stuff. And people seem really interested in that. And that's kind of where I started. And I did did that for quite a while. I used to just post lots of recipes.

And it was just a side thing. It wasn't, I was doing a little bit of brand work like here and there, but it wasn't substantial enough to support us at all. And that's where we were at when the pandemic started. So when we got laid off from our valet jobs, we were kind of like, okay, we don't know what we're going to do. Okay. So then walk me through how that transition happened to where you guys are now.

Yeah. So I think, well, we were lucky enough that because when you're in a van and at that time, it was like people who are living in vehicles or wherever need to get to a place where they can quarantine. And we were fortunate enough that my dad had space in his driveway. So we went up north so that we had kind of a place where we would be able to shower because we don't have a shower in our van. And since all the gyms were closing where we normally shower, we needed just a place to

be able to hunker down. So we went there and I just had nothing else to do. We were kind of just both wondering what to do with ourselves. So I started posting a little bit more, a little bit more about the van, still doing my recipes. And I don't know. I think just a lot of people were online at that time and things just picked up a little bit for me. And I started TikTok at that time. It was, or actually started much, much earlier. I think I started in November of 2019. So I got on there pretty early and I just was making kind of random videos about the van and talking about it.

People seemed super interested in that. And then a few of those videos kind of blew up and then that transferred over to Instagram and my following grew through that. And then, you know, obviously with that comes more opportunity. for working with brands and stuff. So yeah, I guess I just really took that time to create good content. And then it turned into something else. And it also turned, Nate builds vans too.

So during that time, we just decided that we weren't going to work LA because we were going to go back. But then we're like, this is our chance to try something new. And we got the opportunity to build someone else's van. So Nate was able to kind of get going with that. And yeah, we've built two vans since then. And now I'm able to make a living full time just doing content creation and working with brands. So it all, we got really lucky, basically.

Can I ask, it's kind of a weird question. But like, I originally kind of developed my following from my recipes from my cookbooks. And I was like, all food all the time. And I'd go on podcasts and people would ask me about food. and I'd go on Instagram and I'd have to talk about recipes and food. And for a really long time, I felt really like boxed in in that world. And I was like, oh, I'm like a whole person. I'm not just here to feed you, even though I did like that part.

But like having it be so constantly and only what people were interested in about me almost ruined it. Are you ever like, I'm more than the van life girl. Stop pegging me into the van life hole. Yeah. Well, I actually was the same way. with food. I only posted recipes and those were the only, that's all that anyone seemed interested in. I was actually just the same as you. And then I think people just became more interested in the van as well. And that kind of was like, I mean, because it is interesting. It is very different. So I think people just gravitated towards that. And I kind of slowly made the transition. I didn't intend for my page to become

dedicated to van life. It just, that's what people were interested in and just getting those kinds of questions and it kind of just evolved over time. But yeah, I don't like that feeling, a feeling like I can only post a certain thing or only talk about a certain thing. And I think it's a little more broad now since I still have some of those people following along that like the recipes and like the wellness stuff. And then there are some people who only like the van stuff. And I'm sure I've lost people and gained people along the way, but I'm kind of just trying to stay true to myself now and just post whatever I feel is like whatever I'm feeling in the moment.

So do you identify as like a full-time content creator at this point? I do now. Yeah. I mean, I would be lying if I wasn't. But for some reason, I struggle with that a little bit just because I feel like it's hard to explain. and not a lot of people really understand it. And I never really, I liked having my valet job.

I liked having somewhere I would go, work, get off, and then having Instagram as like a fun side thing. So it's been an interesting transition and I'm obviously so grateful for it. But yeah, when people ask what I do, I'm always like, oh, well, I'm a yoga teacher and I also have, you know, like that kind of thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So how does a workday look for you guys in the VALA? van like is it are you working 40 hours a week like how does it fit in yeah i mean right now we've been really we've been really busy because i do kind of the brand work in instagram and then nate does our website and does more of the van stuff so we're both kind of working on

different things all the time but yeah we've been really really busy and we work quite a bit like oh get up in the morning get right on my computer which is not great. I hate that I do this. But yeah, just start emails right away and then, you know, whatever content I have to do for that day, we have to plan to shoot it. And it's really, it's fun. And I feel super lucky that we're able to kind of like make an adventure out of our projects. And when we're working with brands, we try to make it really fun and go out and do something cool or interesting or go to a cool location. And I feel like it lends itself well to our lifestyle because we're always kind of traveling around and going different places so we can

make it kind of interesting. And if we're doing something that's sponsored, I try to make it fun and I try to put a lot of thought into it so that our followers like it. And yeah, you all already know that I'm obsessed with these. They have been my trail and life companion for literally years. I honestly don't think that I have taken a single hike in the last maybe three years without a go macro bar. I also have one in my purse at all times. They are so delicious and they're one of the only bars out there that actually makes me feel full and not all sugar high jittery. We'll get into my favorite flavors in a second and I have some very strong feelings about this. But first, a bit about go macro. They are a mother-daughter own company, which I love and all of their products

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Like this is obviously a podcast, so you need a little bit stronger internet. Is that why you got at the hotel or do you just have no internet in the van? No, we have, we have internet. We just use a hotspot from our phones. Okay. So you can do like emails and stuff like that. Yeah, we do emails and we can even stream like Netflix and stuff. But there is a cap.

There's a cap on it. So I think it's towards the end of our cycle. So at a certain point, it slows down a little bit, which is what I was worried about with this. But it's pretty reliable. The thing that's tough is just being, because we're in Oregon right now and the service isn't great. We have T-Mobile and we're finding that it's not great.

We kind of have to rush around like yesterday. I had a call and we were driving all around and it was like two minutes from the call and we couldn't find service. And that part of it is definitely stressful when it comes to, you know, working online when you're always on the move. you don't know when you're going to have service or where you're going to be. So there's definitely a lot of challenges that come with it. Let's talk about your guys's relationship.

I would love to hear like anything that you've learned or ways that you've grown by living in a van together. And also anything that's been really challenging about living in a van with your partner. Yeah. Well, I think if you're going to do something like this, you have to have really, really good communication. You have to not hold anything back. You have to be, I think it's important to be in a good place in your relationship if you want to do Van Life or, I mean, Nate and I work together. We live together. We pretty much spend all of our time together. So I think it's important that you get along with your partner, first of all. And I think just the dynamic of our relationship

works well. I'm a little bit more of the fiery one. Nate's extremely. extremely laid back and very, I mean, willing to let things go so easily, willing to forgive and just move on for the sake of, he just wants to be happy all the time. He wants everything to be fun and enjoyable. So I think being with a person like that makes it really easy because even if I'm in a bad mood, I can, I know that he's not going to be triggered by it and it's not going to upset him. And the situation will be kind of diffused if that makes sense. So I think that's just the dynamic of our relationship and it works well because it's hard to escape. Like we don't have a lot of huge blowouts, but there are times where it's like if we're in an argument and there's nowhere to go. There's nowhere to run and hide and you just have to work it out right then and there. So it definitely can be challenging. Yeah, that's interesting. So is that like have you learned how to fight better than before you live?

lived in a van? You know, I think so because I think when we had our apartment, I would just run away. I would go hide in my room. I would go walk. I think I would run away a little bit more. And now it's like we just have to confront it and talk through it. And I'm more of, I hold on to things a little bit more than he does. And I want to be mad and hold a grudge. And I just have to let it go. because there's nowhere to hide. And I think that's a good thing. It's like realizing that you can let go and that you don't have to hold on to anger is a skill that I've developed a little bit more because of the van. Yeah, I mean, it definitely sounds like I do the same thing.

I like, we'll just be like, no, I'm angry now. And then I'll be like, I'm working on this in therapy is the idea that like Zach and I aren't in like a bad place or a good place. And it's not this like sort of black and white thing. And I tend to do that with my mood too where I'm like, I'm in a good mood or a bad mood. And if I'm in that, I'm kind of stuck in that. And it's hard for me to get out of that. You know, so it's like, I'm like, that sounds really nice, but I don't know if I'd be able to do it, you know? No, totally. It is hard. It's, it's a challenge for sure. Is there, do you have any, like, hot tips? Oh, good question. I mean, I feel like it's just easier for us because of the dynamic and that Nate is so easygoing that it's just, it's hard to say because I feel like if he were like me, it would be an explosion and it would not be good. So it's hard to say like what you could do to, I think just creating more boundaries and more time for yourself would be important.

in this situation, which, to be honest, we don't do and we're not good at. But I think just creating time and your own hobbies to do for yourself that don't involve the other person would be probably the most helpful thing. Yeah, well, because it's interesting the idea. Like, not only did you guys smush your living lives together, but you also smush your work lives together, like your court and Nate, you know? Yeah, before, I mean, we've always worked. together so it's kind of we were used to it going into it but it has that's been challenging for sure I think just the expectations that we're going to be I'm more of the creative one to be to be honest Nate doesn't really have a whole lot of interest in being on social media he did

I'm the one who's posting everything I'm kind of the one who's kind of just rowing the boat on that and he he loves building bands he loves using his hand He's a super hard worker. So that's more his thing. And right now we're kind of just in the season of most of our stuff is online. And it's a challenge because I like working online, but he doesn't really. So I may have expectations for things that I wish that he was doing, but it's just not in his nature to be oversharing and doing this kind of stuff.

So the tides will turn and we'll get back to a point where he's building bands. So he's working on stuff. and I'm more taking a backseat, but it kind of like ebbs and flows in that way where I'm more busy now and he may be more busy in the future. Is he always down to like, you know, post for picks or like to stop and wait while you create the content and, you know, create the environment that you need to do that? Oh yeah. He's, he's very helpful. He'll help me do whatever it is that I need to do. He always takes, you know, he helps me. up the technical stuff. He's really good with that. He's really good at editing. I think the thing

that he doesn't really like is like talking. I always talk over him. Like if we're doing a YouTube video or something like that, I'm just the one going on and on and on. And he's kind of more quiet and can't always get a word in. And I think that's kind of where we struggle a little bit, which is totally fine. And we just kind of accept that I'm more of the creative person. and he's more of the hands-on person. Does it impact the relationship dynamic at all from like the financial perspective then, that like most of your income is coming from this thing that you're sort of taking the lead on at this moment?

Yeah. I think it probably does. I think it goes back to that expectation thing that I want him to be like as excited about what I'm doing as I am. and I just have to kind of realize that he's not passionate about what I'm doing. He's passionate about what he's interested in and he's very, very good at it. So I think just reframing it and realizing that right now, this is my season of doing what I'm doing. And the tides will probably turn and he'll pick up, you know, when my time is over, he'll pick up and be kind of more of the lead and be the more busy one.

It's also an interesting thing, I think, just from a societal perspective of what society deems worth what, you know what I mean? Like, I think it creates a really interesting dynamic in a lot of relationships that society values, for instance, like the entertainment provided by social media and somebody else might have a job that's equally important, but just isn't deemed fiscally valuable in the same way by society. And I think it's just like an interesting thing of like, do we value these things in the same way? Like, does that fiscal judgment from society impact? Does that mean like my job is more important because society says that I should make more money and it is more important? Or how do you kind of move through that element, you know? Totally. That's something that I've always kind of been because I didn't go to college.

I had no idea what I wanted to do. with my life. And I did, Nate and I both did ballet for 10 years. So I was kind of stuck in that, just working in the service industry. But the thing is that I was really happy. I liked what I was doing. I felt like I had freedom. And I think for all those years, I accepted that I would never be rich. I would maybe never be able to even have a family, like raise a family or buy a house. I think I kind of accepted that, but just was fine with it because I was just happy. And I would talk about that a lot, actually, when I first started my Instagram, just how it doesn't really matter what you do.

It doesn't matter how much money you make. And we would get, I mean, anyone who works in the service industry probably knows this. But, I mean, I would have people tell us, get a real job, do something with your life. Like I've had the people make those comments at work. And they never bothered me because I just felt like I was happy. And so it was, it's never been, I never really let society get to me in that way. But I feel like now that with everything we're doing, we're making a little bit more money, some of those things feel more possible and now I feel like I'm more in that rat race to kind of like keep going and keep growing. Oh, that's interesting. Yeah, whereas before I never really cared. And I honestly,

it's really hard to say, oh, I'm just going to go back to doing ballet and living my very simple, happy life. But some days I miss that and want to, even though I, what society would deem as successful like I wasn't there at all then, but I feel like I may have been slightly happier. That's so interesting. I mean, and it's interesting that you pointed out that it like, it feeds on itself, like having a little bit of success begets wanting more success, wanting more success. And to the point where I do think sometimes you're like, well, for what? You know what I mean? We have this thing society where we put growth, period, and growth for the sake of growth up on a pedestal.

And I think in sometimes that's really beautiful and good and can lead to a lot of evolution. And sometimes it's just like keeps us running when we're tired and could benefit from sitting still. Totally. Yeah. And especially with what we're doing with, you know, living in the van and being in all these beautiful places. And I find myself not present most of the time. I find myself stressed. I find myself stressed. I find myself like thinking, I got to do more. I got to do more. Create more. And then I think about it and I'm like, wait, but why?

I never wanted any of this before. But now that I have the possibility of having it, it's really hard to say no. Yeah. Yeah. I resonate with that a lot. In a totally similar and equally deep and important note, you guys poop in front of each other, right? Oh, yes. Well, so we have a composting toilet in our van and it's very controversial, but I could not imagine not having it. It's kind of right in the middle of everything and seems super weird. I was very weirded out by it at first. But so we have kind of a system where I do have Nate go outside when I poop. Yeah. Number one's fine. But that's, I, it's such.

That's where Zach and I draw the line too. I will pee in front of him until the end of time. But I, I can't, I have, like, friends who will, like, poop when one person's in the shower and the other person just needs to use the toilet. And I'm just like, what? I have one girlfriend who, like, likes company while she poops because she's just like, it gets lonely. And I'm like, that's what our phones are for.

Like, what issues? She should, like, invite people into the bathroom to watch her poop, which I can't get my head around. Totally. Yeah. I mean, hey, everyone's. different. But yeah, I'll have Nate step out and it's easy. I mean, he just takes our, our pup for a walk. And then he doesn't care as much. So a lot of sometimes I'll go out, but other times, like if the weather's bad, I'll just hide under a blanket while he does his thing and

just go to a different place while he, you know, does his thing. And then it's, but yeah, it's, we're on a little system and it works. And I know it seems super weird and people are always like very confused about it, but you know, you get used to it. You adapt. Yeah, I feel like there can't, there can't really be any, like, secrets or hidden, like, things you won't, wouldn't be willing to talk about when you're living in a van together. No, you got to be, you got to be open. There is very limited privacy, very limited personal space. You're really, you're really close. And you, I think I read on an Instagram post that you have to, like, I don't know how, like, the dumping or like you said you have to be comfortable handling pee and poop and that's like

one of the downsides of van life so are you like taking the how does that I don't need like a detailed explanation but like where does the poop go so we have a composting toilet so it goes down into this little area with this compost material it's like a coconut fiber and it it just looks like soil so the poop is actually less gross than the pee it's number one and two separate So pee goes into this jug that needs to be dumped more frequently. I would say it's like every few days. And then the poop is composted and it only needs to be changed like once a month. And when you change it, it just looks like soil.

It doesn't smell. It doesn't. It's not really that gross because the way the toilet works is that it's vented and it has a little fan in there. So it dries it out and it becomes just like a soil that can be used as compost. and it's kind of hard to find somewhere to give your composted poop to when you're on the road. So it can be a little bit tough to figure out where is appropriate to dispose of it. But ideally it would be at a place where it could be fully decomposed and then used as fertilizer. But yeah, I mean, not everyone who lives in a van has a toilet.

Some people just use public restrooms and rely on that. But for us, we knew we didn't want to have to do that. So wait, wait. So then where does the pee go? Because you said the pee's the gross part. Oh, yeah. So preferably it would go down into the sewer. So via dump station, we have to go dump.

Because we have a big gray water tank. All of our sink water goes into a tank that's underneath our van. And gray water is just like water that's been dirtied in some way. Yeah. So like from our sink. So anything that comes from our sink. or if you had a shower, it would go into that tank. So we find places to, there's a lot of campgrounds or national parks.

We have on our website a whole list of places, but where you can go and dump it, and it's like a little dump station. And so that's where we usually try to dump our pea jug. But you can also do it. You want to be like responsible about it. And we have like a whole thing on our website with like disclaimers about where it's appropriate to dump it. But sometimes at like state beaches, they have restrooms and you can dump it there. And yeah, it's, it's fairly easy to do. But it's just kind of like, gross. Yeah, it's not

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And if you have any questions, feel free to hit me up on Instagram. I love chatting about this stuff. Now let's get back to the episode. How much of your time would you say you have to like think about, logistics of van life. Like on an average week, do you spend 20 hours like making and unmaking your bed, dealing with the poop? Like how much extra work is van life adding to your life? Yeah. It's, I mean, I would say it's quite a bit because you have to figure out where you're going to park every day, every night, where you're going to be able to get water, fill up your water

tank where you're going to how you're going to be able to have Wi-Fi or if there's service where you're going. There's quite a bit of planning. It can be easier. Like when we were just stationed in Huntington, we knew where to go. We knew where we could get water. We knew where we could dump. So it becomes easier. It's harder when you're traveling and constantly going new places, which hasn't totally been the case for us. So if you're on a routine in an area that you know, it's pretty easy. And I'd say, gosh, I mean, making our bed is super easy. It only takes a couple minutes. But it's hard to say how many hours per week, maybe five total.

It's not a ton, but it's like a daily thing you have to think about. Do you think that you gain back logistical, like, just like the boring, annoying parts of being a human and like living an adult life? Do you think there's more of them with band life? or do you think there's less of them because you get away from all of the annoying parts of, like, stocking a big kitchen and, like, I don't know, like the stuff, cleaning a whole big apartment and stuff like that? Yeah. There's a lot.

I mean, we clean a ton because we like to keep our space pretty clutter-free and we have a dog. So we're cleaning throughout the day, but it takes no time at all. It's super quick. So I think it's pretty easy. it's pretty manageable. But as far as like the little tasks that need to be done, I would say there's more when you live in a van than it would be, say if you lived in an apartment, then you don't really have to worry about anything because if something breaks, someone comes and fixes it for you. But if you live in a van, there's a good chance that something's going to break,

something may go wrong. One of your systems might stop working. And you're going to have to figure out how to fix it yourself because it's not super easy to go and bring it somewhere, especially if you built your van yourself or if it's DIY, you might be the only one who knows how to fix it. So yeah, there's a lot of things to consider there. I know you guys haven't traveled like as much as you would like to in the van, but have you, what would be like the most magical, beautiful spot that you've found so far in your van life? We love Big Sur. We've done Big Sur quite a bit. Let's see. Crater Lake was really beautiful. Anywhere we can go and just have our doors open and have a really beautiful view always feels very special. When like watching the sunset over the ocean and just being like in your bed or just in your house and having, you know, eating dinner and just being able to like enjoy a beautiful moment in a beautiful location. It's like, wow, this is really cool. And that doesn't happen all day, every day.

But the times that it does happen, it feels worth it. And you feel like almost recharge to keep going. I was going to ask, like, that does really happen, though, because I feel like it's, that is what people picture when they picture van life is like those back doors open and like a beautiful view and you're like hanging out in bed and there's like waves crashing in the distance. And I'm like, is that, do you just like drive to that area, get that photo and then, you know, end up in a. a concrete camping ground or but you it that does happen yeah i mean most of the time it is kind of what you just described for for us at least not just going and getting a picture although that is part of it but we're usually not because at those really beautiful places you're usually not allowed to park there overnight and it i feel like it may seem and i always try to talk about the fact that

it seems like we're parking here and we're staying here, but we're actually enjoying the sunset and then leaving and going and parking in a neighborhood or an industrial complex or somewhere that's not beautiful. And then in the morning, we're moving back to the nice spot. So there is some moving around that goes on and you're not just, you know, camped out in these beautiful locations for multiple days. Although there are areas where you can do that, but for us, especially like near beaches and in California, it's not as easy to do that. What's your favorite part of van life? Some of my favorite things are probably just never having to pack anything, having all your stuff with you at all times has become extremely convenient if we're, especially because I love my food and I love all my things. So being able to like make a macha or make a healthy meal wherever we go.

Or we, there was a landslide on our way up to Oregon and we were stuck in like two hour wait. And we just made dinner. And like it was fine for us. We watched a show while we were waiting and everyone else was like pissed in their car. And we were just having a grand old time and things like that. It's like, oh, this is so cool. And gosh, having a toilet, I know not everyone is, is, into this, but not having to use public restrooms ever is really awesome. And you can't like use it

while you're driving though, right? Or can you? Well, you shouldn't. Okay. We have. Yeah, I mean, I'd be lying if we, if I said we haven't, but yeah, you should pull over. But it is there and it is a, we are able to use it when we're in transit. So what's your least favorite part of van life? I think I was talking, I talked about this on my story yesterday, I think, but not having enough space first thing in the morning to just roll out my yoga mat and like move around or dance around or I'm in a bad habit right now of waking up and getting on my phone and doing emails and not really moving around since it's so small, especially if the weather's bad or we're in a city where we can't just open all our doors and get out and roll out my yoga mat.

It's hard and it feels a little bit constricting first thing in the morning where I really like to get up and move around and stretch and I miss that. That's probably one of the things I miss the most about not having a bigger space. But that's kind of one of the only things for me. And obviously, lack of personal space and just being crammed all the time gets to you. But it's not a huge issue for us personally. Yeah, it's funny. I think because you see so many photos of like, the beautiful yoga mat in nature with like the van in the background. I'm just like, of course you

would have so much ability to work out because you have nature. But it's like any day that it rains or any day that you don't have like space around your van, where would you, yeah, where would you work out or do anything like that? Totally. Yeah. It's a challenge for sure. And I mean, you think about it in an apartment or a house. You get up. You walk to the bathroom. You walk to the kitchen. You walk wherever. and you're walking around, you're moving around, but for us, everything is right there. So we're not really moving around as much as we should. So you're not even doing that like in between what I just did a podcast with the doctor for my asked the doctor stress edition.

And she thinks that the research supports the fact that those little movements all day long are actually way better for our health and particularly our mental health than like even doing one solid workout is. Yeah. Well, I think we do walk around a lot because we have our dog and we take him out a whole bunch. So we definitely, we're not sitting all day long or anything like that. We're still fairly active, but we're not, I think it's that first thing in the morning where I like to get up and stretch and put my yoga mat out and dance around. Like we can't really do that as much.

But I do prioritize going on walks or going and playing fetch at the beach and that kind of stuff. What about the community element? Like that's something that we've struggled with a lot in our nomad life is not feeling like, like we have friends come visit now that it's safe to do so. But like other than that, we're pretty isolated from our community now that you're traveling around more. You can't have people like over for dinner and stuff like that. So how do you keep those community bonds tight? Yeah.

Well, I mean, the van community is actually really awesome. and there are a ton of people who are doing it and who are out on the road. And a lot of people meet up. And it's actually fairly easy to have community in Van Life, I feel like. I think I'm super introverted. I'm very shy. And like it's hard for me to branch out and meet new people or meet up with people. Wait, I thought you were the talkative one.

And Nate was like the not talkative one. Well, I talkative. I think when I'm like on camera or doing something like this, I'm more talkative, but in front of people, like if we were in a big group, I would be silent. Like I would not. I'm actually, that's so interesting. Yeah, I'm actually very, very shy and socially awkward. I feel like I have a little bit of social anxiety, I think. I always have. I think it's funny, like how many content creators do and people assume because people have like a big social media presence that they are really gregarious and really social and that they would like love to entertain a room of like

200,000 people or how many people they have following them and like 99% of the time those people are so shy and so reserved which is why they even started doing stuff like online versus in person in the first place yeah totally no I I feel comfortable on camera for the most part and and just doing stuff like this. But yeah, in front of people that I'm not super comfortable with, I'm pretty quiet. But once I open up, it's a different story. But that initial group type thing I get really nervous about.

So we haven't met up with as many people as we'd like to. But there's definitely a really great community aspect to Van Life. And I think it's pretty easy to make friends and meet up with people on the road. That's cool. I didn't know about that, like, at all. Yeah. Okay, so you're, you were into wellness, like, way before you were into Van Life. Did that come from having, like, gut issues or anxiety or, like, a problem you're trying to solve?

Or were you just, like, I love yoga. I love wellness. I'm going to get into this stuff. Yeah, I got into well. I mean, when I got into it, it wasn't really, I didn't, wasn't wellness. I don't think anyone called. I just, like, I was in probably a sophomore in high school. school. So this is like years and years ago. I'm 33 now. So I got into it really early. And I was a

cheerleader, a competitive cheerleader. And so I did like lots of tumbling and like lots of really active stuff. And I actually got into it because I wanted to be better. I wanted to perform better. I wanted to have more energy. And I started, it was very minimal information about this back then. but I kind of like read a couple books and found a couple things online. And I started using my allowance money to shop in like the very, very small health section at the grocery store and just kind of like got into it. And I felt so much better. And I felt my like I improved a lot in my athletics.

And I just was like, wow, this is so cool. And it just kind of grew from there. And I mean, there were periods of time. where it was more unhealthy and I don't I guess this isn't something I really talk about on my platform really anymore because I feel like it's such a thing of the past but I definitely had like a bad relationship with food and like a bad binge eating restricting cycle that I went through for a long time but now I'm in like a really healthy place and have found balance and so I guess I just naturally don't think to talk about it as much but that was definitely I mean I see a lot

of people still struggling with that. And I definitely struggled with that when I was younger. How did you end up moving through that? So I think what happened was I got, I tore my Achilles tendon when I was like 22 or 23. And I was on crutches for like six months and I couldn't move. And I was used to eating, you know, quite a bit just to sustain myself because I was super active and and did a lot of, you know, athletic things. And when that happened, I kind of started to gain a lot of weight because I was eating as if I was still being super active, but I was sitting on a couch all day because I was on crutches. And I started to gain weight and I started to eat to comfort myself and, you know, that kind

of thing. I just didn't know what else to do. And I turned to food, not having that outlet to be able to work out and move. It was really hard for me. And so I gained, yeah, I gained quite a bit of weight. And it was probably five years that I struggled with that, just fluctuating. And so we did the whole 30. And I know this is kind of like some people say this is really restrictive.

And I definitely see that. Nate and I both did it. Nate was super unhealthy when we got together. He would eat just like donuts and pizza all day. So we did the whole 30 together. and it like completely changed my relationship with food because although it is a small amount or there are a lot of things that you can't eat, there's no restriction on how much you can eat. And I was eating like all these healthy fats and all these things that I thought that I had to

count calories and I couldn't eat because they had too many calories. And I just felt so good and I naturally, you know, got to a healthy weight that I felt really good in. And I feel like that really helped my relationship with food. Just seeing it as like I can eat all these things and still feel good and not gain a bunch of weight because that's what I thought, you know, eating a lot of calories that I would gain weight. And it just helped me stop counting calories basically to get to the point. I know that doesn't work for everyone and it can be kind of triggering for some people. But for me, I had the opposite experience with it. Yeah, that totally makes sense.

It's an interesting way to think about it that you can feel. feel really good without counting calories at all, basically. I think that's a strong benefit of the program that people don't talk about. Yeah. Yeah, I think I just started eating more whole foods and just eating until I felt full. And yeah, I don't know. It just I haven't since then. I haven't had that like craving to eat more or like that urge to binge on food. I haven't had that and I feel so, so lucky that that happened to me because I know that that can be a really, really hard cycle to break. You all know that I love smoothies.

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to support this podcast is to click the link in the show notes. It won't cost you anything extra, but it helps let Garden of Life know how you found them, and I massively appreciate it. If you have any questions about protein or collagen or Garden of Life, hit me up on Instagram. I am always happy to chat. All right, let's get back into the episode. Do you think it's easier or harder to stay healthy when you're living in a van? I think cooking has been more of a challenge for sure.

I was, we built our little kitchen area with lots of counterspace and we have a two-burner stove and we have a fairly decent size fridge, but our sink is really small. So doing dishes is a pain. So we try to make meals that don't require a lot of dishes. I think eating healthy actually is slightly easier because we have all of our food with us all the time. We have all of our snacks. And we're kind of, we try to be in close proximity to some kind of health food store or places we can stock up on healthy food or go to farmers market. So I think in that aspect, it's a lot easier because we always can grab four things we know that will make us feel good. But as far as cooking and making these kind of more elaborate dishes, that's more challenging. Are there any, you mentioned

the whole 30, like helped with the getting you out of that binge eating in cycle. Are there any other wellness practices that you feel like have really transformed your life? I think, well, I just got back into Bulletproof Coffee. I think when we first did the whole 30, that was something we were doing a lot. And that makes me feel really good for some reason. I know it's not for everyone. But I just started drinking that again. I was having a hard time with caffeine. And I love macha too. That's one of my like staples making my macho with collagen. But Bulletproof coffee I've really been loving lately. And what else? I'm like, I will try all the wellness things. But I think at the end of the I like to keep it really simple and just make sure I'm getting really good sleep, staying hydrated.

We have a burkey in the van, so we make sure we have all of our clean water and just trying to get some movement in every day and just eating whole foods and keep just the basics, you know, but obviously I love to sauna and I love to do some of the more, you know, luxury wellness things from time to time. But I think at the end of the day, it's the basics that make the biggest difference. I think it's probably like that in a nutshell is what is most appealing to at least me about band life, the idea of simplifying everything. Like I feel like we're told in so many ways via the media we consume, via our friends and

watching their lives on social and stuff like that, that we need more and more and more to be healthy, to be happy, to be successful like we talked about earlier in regards to money and jobs and careers. And van life feels like it's telling you the opposite, like you don't need much. And even you're describing like your wellness or taint, like you don't need much. And you can strip it down to your basics. And that just feels so like a breath of fresh air. Yeah, absolutely.

I mean, I can feel when we're just eating, we're focusing on eating whole foods and walking or getting some exercise in and staying hydrated. it's like, oh, I feel really good. And I feel like it's easy to get caught up and like, oh, I need this supplement or this supplement or I need this fancy thing. And like, those things are great. I love to try them. I love to talk about them. But at the end of the day, it really is those basics that make the biggest difference. Do you have like a morning or an evening routine that kind of helps you stay grounded and stay feeling good? Yeah. So I'm not going to lie and say that I do this every day. I know. what I could do to make myself feel really good in the morning. And that would be to stay off my phone.

I like to light a candle. It's one of the little treats that I do in the van. And then I have this like CBD essential oil roller that I'll use. And I'll do like a meditation on calm, the calm app. And I can do some little stretches in our bed. And I love to do that like first thing in the morning, put on some music. And then I'll usually make my macha. And that's kind of like, I don't know, a peaceful thing that I do. And then I'll usually try to get outside and walk the dog and do some stretching outside. That would be my ideal morning. It's not always like that. And then I just started reading more too. I'm not a big reader. But I've been finding that that's been making me feel really good. So just trying to replace some of that scrolling and consuming with reading or just doing some breathing

exercises in the morning helps a lot. Reading in the morning is the most decadent and amazing feeling in the world. I think, like, even if you just take 15 minutes and read, I used to read nonfiction in the morning, but now I've started reading a novel because I read my nonfiction at night time because it puts me to sleep. I'm like, this is boring and my novel is interesting. And it feels like, I can only describe it. It's like the same as like when I get like a fancy massage. Like I feel so pampered and so luxurious. And it's crazy that just reading a book in the morning has that impact. Do you know? It feels almost like you're subverting the way the day is supposed to go by leisureing first thing. Yeah. I'm just now experiencing this feeling. I've never been a big reader, but I'm definitely liking it and feeling exactly what you're explaining there.

And it's so much better. What are you reading right now? I'm reading Jen Atkins' book. Oh, I've heard that's great. Yeah. It's really good. Yeah. Blow it or something.

Blowing my way to the top. Yes. Yeah. I was like, I know there's a double untadra. Yeah, I'm relating to it a lot and it's been really nice. Yeah, I've heard it's like somebody described it as like it doesn't sound like you're going to get a lot of big life lessons, but actually you do get like a lot of really profound life lessons.

out of her book. Definitely. Heard good things. Okay, what about evening routine? Do you have anything that kind of makes you feel grounded and calm in the evening? Yeah. Well, once we get to our spot that we're going to sleep, we'll usually watch the sunset and then go drive somewhere and we have to put all of our window covers up and kind of get into

stealth mode. And once we get to our spot, I love to end the day with the show. Just one episode of something good that I, that's like signifying that it's night time. It's time to relax. And maybe I should try reading during this time. But I really love just like having a guilty pleasure show. And Nate and I are really into Survivor right now. So we've been watching that.

Oh my God. We got into Survivor so much during quarantine. And we like, there was one season that somebody, I like looked up the best seasons of Survivor. So I'd know where to start. And there was one, I think it was Gabon or something. And somebody was like, this isn't a good season. But they're in Africa and they don't have access to like most of the time. they're by an ocean and they can go and like dip off in the ocean and get clean. And the best part of the season is you just watch how progressively dirtier and more disgusting they get throughout the entire season. And so we decided to watch it just to like watch how gross they got. And it was so satisfying for some reason. We're like this is the most entertaining thing in the world just to watch these people get progressively like more miserable, more disgusting. There's also something satisfying, I think, during quarantine about like watching people whose lives are

definitively worse than even like what was my hardest days, you know? Totally. Yeah, we love Survivor. I actually want to apply to go on there. What? Yeah. Do you think you could handle it? I think so, yeah. I feel like I watched the whole time and I'm like, I couldn't do that. I couldn't do that. I couldn't do that. I think the lack of sleep would get to me, but I really just want to try the challenges. I feel like I would get really into that. Every time I'm doing something hard, I try to imagine that I'm on Survivor and then I'm in a challenge and then I push myself so much harder to do it.

So I'm like, yeah. What about like the, so I think Zach would do really well in it just because like it's hard to find stuff he doesn't do well at when he like wants to do well at it. And but we're worried about this, this is how far we've gone down this rabbit hole is like the long term health effects that challenge or the contestants talk about because like you're not brushing your teeth the whole time. So they all come back with a ton of cavities, which I think is in. They let you bring tampons, but they don't let you bring toothbrushes, which I'm like, why, whatever.

It just like, it feels like a basic hygiene necessity, but they don't let you do that. And then people come back with like parasites. Are you worried about that as like a person who's very into your health? Yeah, that's true. No, I am. But I mean, I'd root for you. I want you to do it. No, for sure.

That's something. I think that and the lack of sleep. And then also just pushing my body really hard without proper nutrients. That worries me a little bit, but I don't know. Maybe I'll do it. Maybe I'll, I don't know, maybe I'll apply and it's not likely that I'll get on there. But you never know. I really want you to now. Like I think it'd be so, I never would do it myself, but I think it'd be so fun to like know somebody and be able to root for them doing it. And then for you to come back and I could grill you about all the stuff that you don't see on TV. It's such a fascinating show. Oh, yeah. I love when people talk about

that. So what is your guys' long-term plan? Are you guys like, wait, actually, never mind. I just interrupted you because I wanted to talk about Survivor. Do you have other evening routine stuff? Yeah. Okay. So watching a show and then just eating a chocolate. We love chocolate. We love the evolved cups, the eating evolved coconut cups. Have you tried those? I have. They're really good. Yeah, so we we love to do some kind of chocolate or the Hugh Kitchen and have just a dessert every night. And then I'm good. Well, I usually do my skincare routine and all that. I still do those kind of things even though we live in a van, do my guasha.

And if I have time and I'm feeling like it, I'll do that. And then just go to bed. It's pretty basic. But those two things, just watching a show and eating a chocolate is like my way to wind down. I also love, I think there is a time. Like you even said, like, maybe I should be reading instead of doing the show or whatever. But I do think there's a tendency sometimes to be like, TV is not healthy and reading is healthy. But I actually think that rituals are healthy in general.

And you've ritualized this like watching of a show as a way to put a cap on your day. And I think that that can make television like a really healthy part of a routine. Totally. It feels like it is healthy. It doesn't feel like it's a bad habit or anything. So what is the long term plan? Like are you guys going to be van life people forever? You were saying earlier that you kind of thought about the possibilities of your life,

even including like having children in a different way now that you are making a different amount of money. So how does that all sort of play out when you're picturing your future? Yeah. So when it comes to having kids, I can't imagine having them now, but I also can't imagine being 60 and not having them. So that's kind of something we're still trying to figure out. But our goal, our big goal is that we're probably going to build another van for ourselves

and then use the one that we have now as a rental so that people can experience van life. We want to do like an accessible rental so not like super expensive so that people in our community can try it out. And then our big long term goal is to buy property and have like a wellness type retreat with like a yoga studio and sauna. and all the fun things, but also like a lot of space for people to come and park if they're traveling so they can have a safe spot to park overnight and get water and do all that kind of stuff. So like a big property with just like a community, I don't know, type idea.

It's very still in the beginning stages of thought, but that's kind of our long-term goal. That sounds so fun. Do you have any idea where you would put it? Not yet. We're still, we've looked at property. We've kind of. have been around the West Coast looking at property here and there. And nothing has felt like it's a possibility. After this, we're probably going to go to Wyoming and Montana and go to some more places like that and check out what's over there and see how we feel. We're not in a rush to do anything and we're still saving and putting money aside. And we want to be smart about it and not get ourselves into debt or anything like that. But we're kind of just going with the flow. And if we

come across the place that's calling our name, we may, you know, try to pursue it. But yeah, we'll see. I mean, we would love to do California, but it's just so hard and so expensive. California is so expensive. I know. And I love like, we're in Montana right now and I love it so much, but I'm just like how I don't think I could handle winter here. Like these people are stronger than me. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not good in the cold or the snow. So yeah, that would definitely be hard. We love talking about our gut health here on the the Healthy Together podcast, which is why I'm so excited to share the life-changing Seed Daily Symbiotic. I actually discovered Seed back when I was working as an editor full-time. A bottle

came across my desk and I was instantly taken by how cute the green glass packaging is. Then I found out that that packaging was actually refillable so that Seed could share its products as sustainably as possible. And then I actually looked into the research behind Seed and, well, I was blown away. First of all, seed is not just a probiotic. It is a symbiotic. That means it contains both pre and probiotics, which is super important. In fact, if you remember my Ask the Doctor gut health edition, we talked about how prebiotics are one of the most important and often underlooked components of great gut health. Let me break it down for you. Probiotics are the live bacteria that are so beneficial to our gut health. But prebiotics

are the food that those probiotics need to thrive. If you don't have ample prebiotics, the probiotics you're consuming will be undernourished and not be able to help your health in the way that you want. Speaking of your health, there's also a common misconception that probiotics or symbiotics are for people with gut issues, which is so not true. Like, yes, the seed symbiotic is amazing for your gut health, but your gut health impacts everything in your entire body. Your skin, your mental health, your cardiovascular health, your ability to actually assimilate the maximum amount of nutrients from all that healthy food you're eating, having a happy gut is critical for all of it. It is hard to narrow down everything else that I love about seed. I am extremely particular with my supplements,

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part of my own anxiety journey, and Seed has been a vital part of that, so feel free to reach out with any questions. And if you like learning about gut health and how probiotics and prebiotics actually function, I highly recommend heading over to Seed.com. They have a whole whole, whole educational section that breaks down the science behind your microbiome and some of the easiest to understand ways that I have ever seen. And if you would like to try seed for yourself and pretty much change your life forever, you can go to seed.com and use the code Liz Moody for 15% off your first month supply of seeds daily symbiotic. Again, that's code Liz Moody on seed.com. Now, let's get back to the episode. Going back to like the idea of

being happier in a simpler life. If that idea resonated with somebody and they were like, I want to simplify my life, I think I would be happier without all this stuff or maybe not do something as extreme as van life. But is there any advice you would give to somebody who feels caught up in the pull of everything we're told we need to be happy? But that concept resonated with them. Yeah, I think just getting out of your head, getting offline, tuning out the opinions of other people, not letting those. I try to think of myself as, I try to put up a shield around myself, like think I have a moat around myself. And like, think about what I, when I feel the best and who I really am and what really makes me happy, like to my core, without anyone getting a

across the moat or the barrier. And then I just try to remember that and use that to make decisions instead of letting those other things like ping on to me if that makes sense. And it's really hard to do because obviously with the internet and just people around, maybe you have family members who want you to do a certain thing. But at the end of the day, it's your life and only you know what makes you happy and what fulfills you. And whatever it is that fulfills you is, is okay. If it's something super simple, if it's working at a restaurant or being a bartender, it does not matter if there's no, people say there's no future in that or there's no moving up. It doesn't matter as long as you're happy. Yeah, like the point of life isn't to move up or to

have a random person that you might never see again think you're cool. You know, I think it's like It's a very obvious thing, but it's hard to remember that like that's not the thing when we're like 90, that we're going to be like, oh, I wish that like Bob from accounting had thought I lived a cooler life, you know? Totally. Yeah, it's like I remember someone said, I saw this somewhere, but it's good to, you should focus on feeling like your life is good and you feel happy versus portraying that you're happy or showing that you're happy so that people on the outside can. see because you know when you're sharing yourself online and it seems from the outside more exciting than it really is and you may not actually feel that. And then you can have those moments where you feel so happy and so fulfilled. And it just doesn't feel worth it to try to express that because you just feel it. I don't know if that makes sense. No, it definitely makes sense.

Searching for that feeling of just being whole and not feeling the need to try. to like put it into words to share with people, but just feeling it instead on the inside and around the people that you love is like what is most important. Well, and I think we can do that even outside of being content creators and trying to portray stories online. I think that we do that with like trying to show up a certain way for our family, for our coworkers, for our friends. I think that there's so many faces that we put on during the day.

And I think all of them are part of ourselves, but. maybe not all of ourselves, but sometimes those can chip away at knowing what the full self is underneath all of that. Totally. Yeah. All right. Quick fires for you. What do you think is the best way to spend 20 minutes every day in terms of living a

healthier or happier life? Being outside in nature, taking deep breaths. All right. I support that. And my Ask the Doctor Stress Edition podcast supported that as well. She thinks nature is like the most underrated way to try. transform your mental health. Yeah, or listening to music and going for a walk. That helps a lot, too. What's one thing that you've bought recently that's made your life healthier or happier?

Well, this hotel room, because it has a bathtub, and I was really wanting to take a bath. Yeah, baths are great. I've become such, we have like a bath, a really nice bath in this Airbnb, and I did not think I like baths. And then I've taken like 15 baths since we got here. And I'm like, oh, I guess I like best. This is a new information about myself. Yeah, they're great. They're amazing. Have you ever been anywhere in the world where you've thought the people here really got it right in terms of living a healthier, happier life? And if so, where was it? Hmm. Well, Bali. I love Bali and the people there are so, so nice, and there's so much good food there. And everyone seems very happy just living that really beautiful, simple life there. So I would say

Bali. Do you feel successful and why or why not? At this current moment, I feel successful on paper, but I think there have been times that I felt more successful just being fulfilled in happiness. Like we were talking about earlier with just like the shape of your life. Yeah, basically. And that's all on me to like figure out how to reframe everything to get to that place. But yeah. I'm excited. I'm excited to watch that journey for you. I think it'll be interesting to see you marry your life now with some of those values and principles. And I think it'll be really inspiring for people if you can somehow like articulate that for your audience. Yeah, totally. What is one big mistake you've made and what's something that you feel like you really got right? I feel like nothing pops into mind so much as a mistake because I feel. like everything that I've done has led me to this place where I feel that I've always kind of

followed my own intuition and my own gut. I feel like I could have tried harder in school and I could have just taken what I was interested in and used it a little bit earlier to get to where I wanted to be. But at the same time, I feel like I got it right by not letting that societal pressure get to me and not making decisions based on other people's opinions, I feel like I got it right and just going with my own gut. I love that. If people wanted to follow yours and Nate's journey, where is the best place to do that?

So we're on Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, or Cortinate. And then we have our website, Cortinate.com, where there's like a bunch of information about VanLife, how to build vans, how to, just basically everything, how-to van life. It's good that your guys' relationship is so good, because if you guys broke up, you'd need to get, like, a lot of new handles. I know. I changed my handle. It was wellness with Courtney, and I changed it to Courtney. I was like, wait, should I do this? But we're going to get married, so we're engaged. I didn't know you guys were engaged. Yeah, we got engaged

last year, last June. But we haven't planned anything because everything's just too up in the year right now. But yeah, we've been engaged for a while. Wait, do you have like one second to tell, was there like a cute proposal story? I just, if there is one, I can't not hear it. Yeah, well, I always knew that when Nate was going to propose that I would know because I just know him too well and we're just, I knew that I would be able to pick up on some things, which I did. And it was our six year anniversary or a five year anniversary when he did it.

And I didn't know he was going to do it, but I knew right before because he, he like put on a shirt that he normally wouldn't have put on and and I'm normally the one to be like, oh, let's go take a picture. Let's set up the tripod, take a family photo. Like he literally never says that. And that day he said it. And I was like, okay, I know what's happening here. There were a couple things where I, he was acting a little bit funny and I knew, but it was still super cute. We went to this really beautiful beach up on the northern California coast. And we had our dog there and we were just taking photos. And then he got down on his knee. And it was cute. I love that you say that like you knew because I feel like a lot of people like kind of do know, but then they don't want to

like admit that they knew. They're like, oh, I was like totally surprised. I like, they were like, no, no. He like he put on his cute shirt. I was aware. Yeah, I always knew that would be the case. So it was cute. Amazing. Well, congratulations on that and congratulations on your beautiful life. And I really appreciate you taking your time to share your wisdom with all of us. Of course. Thank you so much, Liz.

It was great chatting. I hope you loved this episode. I've been thinking about it ever since we recorded. And I would just love to hear thoughts on what makes a good life and when and how can we be satisfied. And how does all that differ from what society tells us that we should want and need and go after and always be achieving and attaining and acquiring. So if you would like to share,

I would love to hear just screenshot the episode and tag me on social media. I am at Liz Moody and Courtney is at court and Nate. We would love to continue the conversation over there. And if you loved this episode, I would so appreciate a quick rating or review on Apple Podcasts or whatever podcast platform that you listen on. It really helps other people find the podcast

and it is immensely appreciated by me. I read every single review. I appreciate them so, so much. So if you have done that in the past, thank you so much. And if you would be willing to do it now, I would just appreciate it from the bottom of my heart. All right. I am so excited for weekly episodes. We just started them this month. I am loving them so much. I'm loving getting to have more conversations and to bring you more incredible guests. If you have so many of you have shared the podcast and I really, really appreciate it, I kind of said, this is the year of the podcast.

And I really appreciated anybody who is willing to jump in there and share it with a friend, share it with a family member, share it on social media, just kind of help more listeners, find the podcast so I can get even better guests and bring you even more conversations that you love. So everybody who has done that, I've seen it, I appreciate you immensely.

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