Why Won't You Date Me? with Nicole Byer - DIVORCED!!! (w/ Jackie Johnson)

Episode Date: April 18, 2025

Comedian and friend Jackie Johnson was terrified to do this podcast… until she got a divorce. She joins Nicole to talk about dating a record number of canceled UCB comedians, surviving a nightmare marriage, and only realizing she was unhappy after it ended (plus how to spot signs of abuse in your own relationship). Jackie shares how therapy—and a witch’s spell—helped her find true love. Plus, they discuss the red flags they missed in past relationships, why getting married on Valentine’s Day was a HUGE mistake, the secret to getting out of jury duty, and Jackie’s genius advice on when to swoop in and land a man.Chicago! Catch Jackie’s show How to Get a Second Husband live on June 1st! Get tickets here.WATCH this episode on YouTube here: https://youtu.be/AjfNgx1xM5cWrite Nicole a dirty message! Send it to [e-mail] with the subject line "Dirty Message" and Nicole may read it in a future episode.Support this podcast an get discounts by checking out our sponsors:» SquareSpace: Head to squarespace.com/DATEME to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain using code DATEME.» Mint Mobile: Don’t overpay for mobile data. Shop data plans at mintmobile.com/DATEME.» Wayfair: Every Style, Every Home. Shop the best selection of home improvement online. Head to Wayfair.com.View all of our sponsors and discounts codes at wwydm.notion.site/sponsors.Follow:YouTube: @WhyWontYouDateMePodcastTikTok: @whywontyoudatemepod Instagram: @nicolebyerX: @nicolebyerNicole's book, #VERYFAT #VERYBRAVE: indiebound.org/book/9781524850746This is a Headgum podcast. Follow Headgum on Twitter, Instagram, and Tiktok. Advertise on Why Won't You Date Me? via Gumball.fm.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This is a HeadGum Podcast. Wanna watch this episode? Catch the full video on YouTube. Just hit the link in the episode description. Why won't you date me? Why won't you date me? Why won't you date me? Please tell me why.

Why won't you date me? Why won't you date me? Please tell me why! Oh baby! Welcome to another episode of Why Won't You Date Me? A podcast where me, Nicole Byer, was trying to figure out why I was so single even though you could come on the ceiling and tell me it was a light. My guess today... hahahaha hahahaha why I was so single even though you could come on the ceiling and tell me it was a light. My guest today is a comedian, actress, and host of the podcast, Nat Butte. Wait, is it still a podcast?

No, it ended. You can still find it? You can still find it. You can give her all them streams. Streams equals dollars. I still make $300 a month sometimes. That's nice! Yeah! Ooh,a! Check it out! She also has a one-woman show called How to Get a Second Husband. And also when I first moved to LA, had my favorite series of Instagram videos where it was just Jackie

jacking her mail. It's Jackie Johnson! We've known each other for so long. For a very long time. And I was so terrified to come on the show for a long time. But then you got divorced. That's right! We've got material now! We've got material now! But can you imagine if I'd come in here and been like,

I love my improv coach husband. He's so great, Nicole. Be like me. How embarrassing. That wouldn't have held up. No, it really wouldn't have held up. Boy, oh boy. So you guys met doing improv.

He was your coach? No, thank God. Cause I was like, that's a layer. Have I dated some of the teachers? Maybe. But no, no no no Where did we meet we met oh you know we met at the Fredonia house Oh yes had that party house. I went to one party, and I was like it's dirty in here. Oh, it was disgusting

I was like this is not for me. Yeah, it was it was nasty, and I think I moved at the end of it I think they were losing boys The boys needed to come in. They did. They did boys, come in. But it was fun. It was fun to go party at. It was super, are we talking about my first husband?

Yeah. Yeah, okay. I met him in the basement of the Fredonia house and we were singing and partying all night. Like everyone was playing music. Armin was on the drums, RIP. I mean, it was, I'm sorry, no, not Armin, Harris. I nodded at you and knew exactly who you meant, and I didn't correct you.

That was really wild. I was like, mm-hmm. And I was like, she means Harris. Armin is alive and well. He's doing great. RIP Harris, Harris was on the drums. Y'all, I'm 40, my brain stopped working. And you have a child?

Yes, and that's really the real. The cutest little baby. You held him. My God. You held him, and you go, do I want a baby? He's so cute, and he's good, and he's well behaved. No, he's so nice. He's such a nice guy. He's so nice. Which is funny to say about a baby,

but I've met mean babies. No, there are demon children. I've asked everyone in the childcare profession, and I'm like, he's nice, right? And they're like, no, no, no, he's amazing. I feel like you shouldn't have another. No, of course I'm not. Because the second one will be a demon.

Awful. Just a gremlin. I had the most angelic, amazing dog, the best behaved, nice child. The third one will be a demon. What have I done to deserve this already went through a bad marriage? I guess She's divorced you haven't asked me yet. You're supposed to say are you in a relationship or whatever? No, I look at there Okay, I know you're in a relationship. You're married

That's right To a very sweet man who's so nice to you. I know. And like cares and you guys are so cute together. Wait, how did you guys meet? We met at, okay, so Catherine Burns, my bestie. She should come on here. Oh, I should have her on here.

Mom, will you write that down? I'm trying to get her a man. This won't help her get a man. This only helps straight men in the gaze. Okay. So just men. Damn it. Well, anyway.

I don't know why I said straight men in the gaze. It's just men. At least it's helping someone. It is. That's great. It is. So in 2013, Katherine dragged me to a weird party. She was like, I'm going to this great Gatsby theme party

on Colorado Boulevard. And I was like, oh God. And And I get there, and we're chatting, and we're dressed in wigs. I have this little wig on and this crazy boa. And this guy sees her out of the corner of her eye and is like, hey, we just worked together funny or die. And we chatted, and he was lovely. And that was my second husband, many years later.

But I do like that he met you at Full Jackie, like in a wig and a costume. Yes, yes, yes. Having a nice time. Yes, yes, yes. And he was like, I want more of that. Well, you know, I was with my ex at that point. But it was one of those things where we just,

I felt like I knew him. I felt like I knew my whole life. And we definitely had a vibe. But it was one of those things where I was just kinda like, well that was nice, and then like moved on. And then I worked with him on a, he used to produce Funnier Die, and he produced this video called Glitter and Ribs,

which is like Billy Eicher's like fake Taylor Swift song. And he produced it and he cast me in it, and while we were on set, we were chatting and laughing. And I was just like, I told Catherine, I was like, I can't be around Ben Shan because I just like him and I feel weird about it. And so I knew him for years, but it was just, oh, hi, how are you? Bye.

You know what I mean? Like we never got to really hang out. But I will say that when my first husband walked out of my life, I screamed, I'll be remarried in a year. And when I screamed that in his face, I swear I saw Ben's face in my head. I didn't know if he had a girlfriend, I didn't know, but there was also a witch involved that did a spell on me,

which that might have caused it, I don't know. You need to come see my one-woman show! But... I do, I do actually need to see it. I keep happening, like, I'm out of town every time it's up. I know, I know. But do actually need to see it. I keep happening like I'm like out of town every time it's up. I know. But I do need to see it. I do have a tape I could send you. Yeah send it to me. I'll watch it. I'll watch it in the comfort of my home.

But a witch was involved come see my show. That's the best promo for a show I've ever heard. A witch was involved. Come see my one-minute show. No, but I I don't know if it was meant to be, if it was the stars aligning, if it was the witch. I'm not sure exactly what it was, but it was just a battle cry in that moment where I realized like, I deserve better than this.

And I finally dated somebody better than me. Out of all these years, dating improv coaches that were mean to me. Out of all these years, dating improv coaches that were mean to me. Or do you think you're dating someone equal to you? Maybe, Nicole. But either way, I got a divorce! She's divorced! And that's all that matters.

Were you married within a year after your divorce? I was, not quite. I was engaged about a little over a year later and then married another year after that but close all things considered. I love that that's what you screamed at him. I would be married within a year. I know but again this all comes down, I desperately thought that being married would make me feel like a whole person. And this goes back to childhood. You know, my parents got divorced when I was seven

and they had a disgusting divorce. They hate each other to this day. They've made it extremely difficult on me and my sister our whole lives. And we were the pariahs of the neighborhood when they got their divorce. Like we was all Christian, wholesome, Catholic, Texas families.

It was like a thing that doesn't happen here. Exactly, and so there were kids who wouldn't let me come over. Their parents were like, she has divorced parents, don't let her in our house. I mean, it was bad. Wait, that's wild. Yeah, it's crazy.

And so I grew up with this stench on me. And I just said, you know what, I'm never gonna do that. I'm gonna get married and I'm gonna stay married. No matter what, I'm gonna, you know, this is what you do. And to me, I equated success with like being in a long-term relationship. And so also like, nobody wanted to fuck me in high school. I graduated virgin, which is fine now, but at the time it was a little bit of, again, a stigma. And I was just like, nobody likes me. As soon as I find somebody that likes me, I'm gonna date them forever.

And I'm not gonna ever be single again, because I was single when most kids were getting fingered and going out and having fun. Nobody fingered me, Nicole. Not one person. I was not fingered in high school either. And look at us! I'm getting fingered.

That's right. That's right. It's nice. I don't even know what's in there. Lalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalallalalalalalal Oh, cool. When you were in high school and girls were like, so-and-so fucked or so-and-so got fingered, were you like, what?

How do you... The time. I was just like at home watching Buffy. I know, I was playing The Sims a lot. I don't understand The Sims. I don't get it. What is The Sims? I'm... You know I've been playing for 25 years. Yes. It's like one of my weird, deep, like, nerdy tendencies

that I love to talk about because it's just kind of a secret. Here's the thing. It's not nerdy. Everyone has interests. When people are like, oh, that's nerdy, I'm like, no, it's your interest. And that's okay. It's okay to have an interest. That's right. It's good to have hobbies. Yes. So you've never played? No. Oh, shit, we have a podcast on our hands. Not that you need another one. Listen, times are tough.

Yeah, yeah. Times are tough. Why do you think I stopped mine? Listen. Stack them up. Truly. You really don't know what it is? I know you make people,

and then you make them do things, or they just live? Is it like animal crossing, except people? Similar, yeah. They call them sandbox games, because there's really no set path. It's like you decide what you want to focus on and what you want to do.

It's a simulation. Oh. That's why it's the sims. OK. So yes, you make a person, you build their house, you choose their relationships, their jobs. Do I need to like, OK, so in Animal Crossing, Tom Nook starts you in debt

Okay, and then you have to get acorns or apples or something You gotta pay back Tim Nook and then I never got a house who's Tim Nook he's the man in charge What is he like an alligator or like a I don't know okay? You never see him. He's pretty ominous interesting wait Mars you played it Yeah, he's a tanuki a tanuki yes, that didn't clear up anything Oh, is that like a mythical creature? I think it's like a Japanese sort of like raccoon fox. Oh! That's nice. I don't think I ever met him. Did I?

You probably did, yes. Oh. So wait, he just throws you into a town homeless and dead? Yes, in the forest. And then you have to like build a house and everyone around me had houses and I couldn't figure it out. Can you like give BJs for money or can you do that in the sims? I

Think you can actually Sims is more my speed. Oh, it would totally be your speed Maybe I'll get into it. They can definitely fucking suck They can't 100% wait real. Oh, yeah, they get free K to they can fuck in the hot tub They can fucking bed sometimes. They just fuck standing up in the middle living room. Wait, it's called woohoo. You choose woohoo and they'll just do it And sometimes babies pop out Yeah, yeah, all of a sudden they're they're doing it and there's like little hearts coming out of bed and you hear like Like noises and then I was in a little baby crib shoots out and it goes there's a baby and you have to name it And you can't get rid of it

You can't get rid of it. There's no abortion. I don't remember there being that option That's really that'd be funny if the crib popped out and then like a tennis racket hit it. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, or a big vacuum Oh, that's even better. That's better. That means you like know what an abortion is and I'm like A tennis racket! You just bat the baby away! That's what we do. You go to Planned Parenthood, they pull the racket out They just bat it away! WAPA! Maybe I'll play The Sims, that sounds like fun.

No, I think you would get into it. I'm not a game gal. I don't think you would leave for a long time. But it sounds like fun. Oh yeah. I played this morning. For how long? 20 minutes. I just checked in, collected my money,

sent everybody to work, and then got off. Sent everybody to work. I know. Well, everybody has a flourishing career. Everybody has, all the kids have good grades. So do you have a family? Yes. Yes.

I have me, and then I have my real husband, my real son, and then everyone else in the town's made up. I have Avril Lavigne. I have real celebrities in the town. I love that Avril Lavigne is the first person you said. I kind of have a pop, I have all the Blink 182 guys. Oh, that's fun.

This is my weird, this is the weirdest thing-182 guys. Oh, that's fun. This is my weird, like, this is the weirdest thing about me. I don't think it's weird. I think it's interesting. I'm 40 years old. I don't know, we've been talking about it for a while and I have questions. Oh yeah.

And I like it, I think it's fun. It's my thing. And we should all have a thing. We should all have a thing. What is my thing? It's healthy and fun. I guess like pole dancing and then. Oh, that's your thing. We should all have a thing. What is my thing? It's healthy and fun. Oh, I guess like pole dancing and then... Oh, that's your thing.

I like decorating. Yes. That's fun. My thing was going to say home design. Could be your thing. I love it. I know. You're very good.

I love it. Oh, it's so fun. I see your photos. I know. It's like my dream house. Oh, thank you. That's the one thing about having to like be in sharing a home with a man is that like you can't go fully. But why not?

I mean, there's a lot of pink in my house. Yeah, don't you have a pink bathroom? Yeah, but I have pink couch, I have pink tile in my kitchen, like he let me go pretty hard. But I'm not like Nicole Hard. I don't have like leopard walls and pink rug and purple couch, you know.

Yup, those are all the things I have. I know, and they're amazing. They're amazing. But why don't you just ask Ben, like, can I do leopard print here? I mean, he probably honestly would let me, but I was like, listen, we'll divide, we'll put it to a level where we both feel zen in our home.

Actually, Ben hates leopard print. He says it reminds him of the Jewish moms of all his friends growing up, wearing swimsuits and having, holding a cigarette. That's so funny. I'm like, iconic. Those are the divas. I'm like, that's my goal in life. I love that.

Yes. He's like, no. Yeah. No, that's the one thing is he's, and I, because I'm the same as you. I love an animal print, obviously. I love animal print. I love colors.

Yes. When people do gray, I hate that millenn print, obviously. I love animal print. I love colors. Yes. Like, when people do gray, I hate that, like, millennial gray is a term, because it's like, I'm a millennial. I don't like gray. But that's what everyone does now. Like, the Airbnb I was just staying at, it's like white, white countertops, white,

and then, like, the black finishes on everything. On everything. The shower has the black. And then, you know those, like, sliding barn doors on those? I hate that. Yes. I don't like them. You don't get quite enough privacy. No, no, the light comes through. I simply don't like it. That's a millennial thing too. And I think it's cuz of HGTV, which I love.

Exactly. But they don't have enough diversity in their programming. Joanna Gaines, can you stop with the barn door system? Well now she's got the Magnolia Network. And I will say, I do like some of her stuff at Target. I have gotten a couple of her candles and whatnot. When they're pink. I like this brand called Jungle-O. Oh yeah. That is, oh shit.

I can't remember the woman's name, but her Instagram's great. Yes, I've had a few pillows from that collection. Yeah, it's so good. There's also this man named Brett Watterson. Brett Watterson. Waterson? Brett Waterson? Can you look him up? HGTV Brett Waters something.

I don't know. He's a preservationist. Ooh! And he only renovates older homes and then renovates them in the style of what the home was. Ooh, I love that. So if it's like a craftsman,

he's only doing craftsman stuff. If it's like a Spanish revival, he's only doing Spanish revival shit in there. That's fun. And I love him so much. And he's got a funny accent, and he wears a hat and boots, and I love it. Wait, Jackie, his name's Brett Waterman. Oh, Waterman, Brett Waterman. I'm going to look him up.

Get involved. He's great. I love him so much. Wait, I want to ask you about your first marriage. How long did you date before getting married? Forever. Five years. Oh my God.

Yeah. Sign number one. Sign number one. Did he propose after five years or was it like a long engagement or were you like, I'm leaving? This was a point of contention, which again, red flag.

Yes. When you beg a person to marry you, that's usually a sign that you probably shouldn't marry them. But to me again, I was like, I wanna be married, I wanna be married, this is gonna make me feel whole, like whatever, so I was just like begging him, he would always have an excuse, like I'm not, you know, I don't have the finances, although all he did was go to escape rooms every five seconds and blow his money like whatever

So we got engaged in the Bahamas And he proposed to me with no ring. He hadn't asked my dad yet like all this stuff, huh and And I'm like, what are you doing? You know And so he went to the hotel room to call my dad, which was like $700. We were in the Bahamas, like whatever, and like asked him, and I don't even remember what time it was, and then he came back and proposed me again with the ring.

Now the ring, now I'm not a mature... Wait, he had the ring? Yeah, he like chose not, I don't know. Listen, Nicole, listen, this is what happened. We went to the antique mall and I go, I'd like something like that. And he just went and got that one. And he hadn't sized it.

Like, it's a fair minimum effort. What a fucking dummy. Like it was just so, I put it on and I'm like. And then again, it's not about money. It's not about monetary. But when I did want to get rid of it, I DM'd this like antique jewelry person. She goes, that ring's not even worth me trying to sell.

Just give it away. I know, so I gave it to my niece. Who loves purple like you, because it was an amethyst. I do love purple. And I did love that ring, but you know, bad juju. Yeah, bad juju. That's, I mean, I'm blown away. But let's talk about the second one now. Yes!

Let's just do contrast. So first of all, Ben was begging me to marry him. Like begging me. And I was just like, what is going on here? Maybe it was the spell. Maybe the witch did really do her job. Wait, I want this witch's info. We'll go back to that.

I'll give it to you. Okay. She'd love you. So begging me, and I'm like, I don't know if I'm ready yet. Like, come on. And he's like, no, I need to be with you. Ugh.

So I was like, okay, if I'm getting married a second time, I want a pot paratchi sapphire, okay? They're the rarest of the sapphires. They are the most beautiful color you've ever seen. They are the best pink. Like, there's pink sapphires and then there's rubies, but there's paparazzi sapphires

are like peach sunset gradient gorgeous, which they're still cheaper than diamonds, but they're rare. And I said, I want a paparazzi and I want to pick it out and like all this stuff. So we go down to the jewelry district and we literally go to a guy who specializes in them and he finds me the biggest one they have

and he puts it on my finger and I start sobbing. And before I'm even cleaning up my snot, Ben goes, you want this one? And just slaps the card down. You know, just slaps the card down. And I design it where some people might then be like, oh, that's not romantic, no bitch, it's what I want. You're wearing it.

Yes. I think you should design what you're wearing. And I know friends who like just said, I don't want to tell him, I want him to just choose. No. If your man has taste, okay, good for you, but like, I wasn't gonna fuck around the second time. I said, if I have to stare at this shit

for the rest of my life, I'm not trying to do this a third. No, I agree. I said, give me that damn ring. I agree, yes. I agree. So I was like, this, I want this, I want this setting, put this size, all that. Let me see it.

I didn't clean it, but. It looks clean, it's really pretty. I mean, this is like, if I were a ring, this would be the ring. I think it's stunning. I love it. I think that's how it should be. But imagine the difference.

Oh, and also, he called my dad without me telling him, and my dad grilled him for a long time. And Ben was like, that was one of the most intense, scary conversations I've ever had in my life. And the last time I had him, I was like, yeah, sure, I guess. I guess he just, you know. It was the second time around. He was like, I guess I'll do better.

I can't do it this again. Yeah, so he did, you know, that's just a difference. The effort. And you got married on Valentine's Day? Yes, which wasn't mistake Why was that a mistake? It was a mistake. Why? I cheated myself out of a holiday Number one number two I can't get fucking reservations. No, no you simply can't. I fucked up. I'm gonna be paying prefix for mediocre meals my entire life Prefixed mediocre meals my entire life

What was I thinking and our wedding got ruined by the apocalypse ice storm in Texas? Oh happened So literally it was just a bad choice It was just a bad choice. Yeah, but now you have a fun memory. I know and I think I am a Charlotte We were talking about sex. I realized through this whole process that I am a Charlotte I didn't think I ever was a Charlotte. I thought I was a Samantha or at least a Carrie, but no No, you don't want to be Carrie. I know but I really think I was I think a lot of women are Carries yeah age out of it. Yes, unless you're like a full-blown narcissist, right then you stay right right right? I think I'm a Samantha. You're a Samantha. Are you joking? I think I'm course you are. Yeah. Yes But I'm a Charlotte and I didn't know I think you'm a Samantha. You're a Samantha, are you joking? I think I'm- Of course you are. Yeah. Yes.

But I'm a Charlotte and I didn't know. I think you're a Charlotte. I didn't know. But my first wedding, stunning, gorgeous, the best weather- And it was here. Yes, amazing, it got all these write-ups and magazines, like it was beautiful and then my second wedding was a disaster, which is what happened to Charlotte

and I converted to Judaism like Charlotte did. Yes you did. So, you know, I'm a Charlotte. Yeah, you really are. Literally. Two marriages, second Yes, you did. So, you know, I'm a Charlotte. Yeah, you really are. Literally. You have two marriages, second one, a Jew. And then, oh wait, no, she's a daughter.

I was like, and a son? No, but she's got a girl and a non-binary. What a wild way to say that. A girl and a non-binary. Two kids. Yep, that's how you say that. Yep. And she loves dogs.

She does love dogs. Although she did have that one dog and then got rid of it. Anyway. We don't like that. No, that's not nice. When you get a dog, you get it for life. Yeah, whether you like it or not.

That's right. That's right. Put a muzzle on that thing and let it run around the yard. I mean, my aunt had this little chihuahua named Killer. It had a different name, but it became Killer because it dug up her floor. And that dog was awful. She kept it until it passed away.

Yeah, you know, I used to... Princess, that was its name. And then it was renamed Killer. You know, I used to be a celebrity dog walker. No. This was, I mean, that's what I did probably when we met. No, you did lashes. Oh, okay, so, oh, oh, so okay right before I did lashes

I was a celebrity dog walker for like five years. I'm like you I've had all these jobs I know you and like your Lane Bryan and your nanny I used to be a celebrity dog walker, and I saw both I saw people give their dogs away all the time And then I saw people who like deeply committed even though the dogs were like bad Yes, because you, like a child, you can love a bad dog to be good for you. Yes.

Yes, yes. And I learned you can love a psychopath child and teach them empathy. And they'll have to like think about it before they do things, but like you can teach them to be good. Yeah. Which I think is interesting.

Nature versus nurture. Mm-hmm. Okay, so when your first marriage Yes. Crembled. Yes. What, were you the one who was like, I need out Or was he like I need out? No, I I was the one who like triumphantly said get the fuck out Mm-hmm, and he was like no, please no, please take me back. Oh, please and I almost did

I almost did. Oh, yeah. I almost did. Well, you know, to me again, vows are vows. And my biggest fear in life was that I would be divorced. It was to me that was like the ultimate personal failure because of everything I had been through. And I also just want to say at this point in my life, I had not been to therapy once. Oh! Not one time.

And I really think that probably would have course corrected a lot. You'd be surprised. I stayed in a bad thing and I was in therapy. Yeah, that's true. It's hard. I just didn't tell her everything. Oh, that's the secret.

I would leave things out. Keep it to yourself. Keep it to yourself. And now when I tell her the bad things, she pauses and goes, let's take some space for that That is so funny to just not be honest with the therapist because then you're never actually gonna solve the issue That's so funny. Well, she did say this is me not telling her a hundred percent of things She was like, I was maybe we should go to couples counseling

She goes, why would you put a bandaid on the Titanic? Maybe we should go to couples counseling. She goes, why would you put a bandaid on the Titanic? And I was like, oh man, okay. And I reminded her that she said that the other day and she laughed real hard and she was like, I was right. And I was like, yep, double down, you were right. But you know, the thing I was actually telling them this earlier, your producers, I think there's no one else

on the list of like, upright citizens, brigade, people who have had more cancel Xs than me. Like there's a list else on the list of like, upright citizens, brigade, people who have had more cancel Xs than me. Like, there's a list in the lobby that are like, these are the guys you don't let in here, and I really think I've dated more of them than anyone. And that's not something I'm proud of, it's just fact. Because I dated arguably the most problematic guy, and I literally walked into this next relationship.

And once you date a monster, a wolf in sheep's clothing doesn't look like a wolf. So I was like, this guy has an apartment? Wow, he wears a belt? He's great. When really what I should have done as a 25 year old with a lot of unhealed, un-fed shit I probably should have gone and got a little trauma recovery therapy. That might have been a good idea

but I did. I think your ex is a narcissist and I think when You date a narcissist they like love bomb you and then you're like, oh my god This person's treated me so much better than the last person and then when it changes you're like well the beginning was really good so maybe I'll get back to the beginning yes and then you like gaslight yourself yes the dude I dated before the guy I'm dating now I would screenshot when he said nice things so when he said mean things to me I I would look at the screenshots to be like, he was nice to me.

No, but that's exactly what they do. You nailed it exactly. And then at that point also, I had already moved in with him. I had like sold all my furniture, all our books are combined on the shelf. And that's tough. And I was like, which book is mine? Exactly.

No, I'm kidding. I don't know which one of these CDs. I see that we don't know. Which Amy Poehler, yes please, is mine. Which girl boss copy is mine. I'll never know. But it is hard when you're like... Yeah.

But also, but that was the thing, I was like, no, we're gonna make it work. We're gonna make it work. I said that I'm married, I said I'm gonna do this, and so I'm gonna make it work, but it gets to the point where like, first of all, trust is shattered. I mean, get it back, get it not back. But to me, I'm like, no, thanks. And then you just were like, I was like, you know what, I think I'm fucking great.

Mm-hmm. And I didn't... He had whittled me down to where I literally thought, nobody liked me, I wasn't funny, I was getting old, nobody was gonna go out with me wild I know you're one of the funniest people Naturally that I've ever met like you just saying hello is funny sometimes like I just think you're so funny You got me my god you could

I'm gonna slay with that at my state farm audition after this. I'm gonna walk in and go, hello. You know what they say, be natural. Thank you. That's what I'm saying though. These narcissists whittle you down and whittle you down. And also the little voice in your head of instinct, it gets gas lit out of you.

That little voice was like a quiet whisper. It was like going, Jackie, get out. You're not happy. We're like, that's not nice. And like, this is gonna happen again. And I just kept not listening to it. And then finally I was like, you know what? That's when I go, I'll be remarried in a year. Because I was like, I am fucking worthy of a nice, good person.

I'm lovable. Like, I deserve what I want. And fuck you. And that's what in that moment. I was like no I I'm gonna get help I'm gonna I'm gonna figure out why keep dating improv coaches. They're rude to me It's like funny in the second beat, but I will fuck you and you're like, okay, and they all have horrible pants None of us know worst fitting of pants you've ever seen. No one knows how to get a right fit on the pants. No, no. They're too big, they're too small, they're too short.

They don't know that there's different styles. You can get a real wax, and you straight leg. There's so many different cuts available. Do you need a tissue? Probably, because I have my audition, and I don't want to fuck it up. I like how we looked around like I'd find a tissue. You should get tissues for this.

I should. Because you were crying. I was listening to your Sarah Silverman episode. You were tearing up. Yes. I think it would be a good prop. Thank you. For this room.

Or like if you know Mitch eats something spicy in the Doughboys, they need to have something ready to go. Anyway, I knew I would cry, but no, but that's the thing. I was like, you know what? No, I am fucking great. And I'm gonna go to therapy. I'm gonna figure out why I only date improv coaches that are mean to me.

And I'm gonna find somebody who deserves my love and who wants what I want, because I wanted a family. I wanted to be a mommy. And I, again, kept getting excuses, kept getting excuses, and thank God! Yeah. I think that's like a huge fucking blessing in disguise that you're not permanently attached to this person. Where you have to like co-parent, shuttle them back and forth. Oh my God. But I do love that you met Ben, and Ben was like, oh no, I want to marry you.

I want to give you this thing that you want, and I want to have a child with you. No, it's wild. And I wanna have a house with you, and live with you, and this, Nicole, is the key. Ben was tired. He had dated and dated and dated, and eventually these men get tired,

and they say, it's time to rest my knees and find me a wife. And it happens after a while. George Clooney finally, John Hamm, he finally got married like last year. He got tired too. This is what you do. You get them when they're tired. And that was it. Our stars aligned in this moment. If I had met Ben at that party and went home and broke up with my ex and started dating Ben, we wouldn't have worked out. I needed to go to therapy. He needed to keep tasting the flavors of the ice cream.

He wasn't tired yet. He needed to get sick of the ice cream. That's what I'm saying. He needed to sit down, crack his knuckles, and say, I'm ready. That's funny. My boyfriend, I think, was tired. Yeah.

He was like, you have no idea how many dates I've been on. I was like, see what I mean? Okay. This is what I'm talking about. Timing is everything. Mm-hmm. Get them when they're tired.

And it worked out because I was, and this was so stupid, I was 34, and I was like, my eggs are drying up, I'm old news! Which is like, I would kill to be 34 again now. Take me back to 34 before I was on thyroid medication and my fucking back hurt every day. Like, take me back. But I was like, I'm 34, I don't have much time left. Just to prevent anyone listening, if you're 34, you've got plenty of time.

I think my mother had me at 39 or 40. Something like that. Late. You have time. Everyone has time. Yes, you have time to heal. You have time to take time for yourself. You have time to be picky.

Like, you do. You have time. Being picky is a hard thing, because you're like, well, if I'm too picky, I'm going to weed out so many different people. And it's like, well, that's, yes. You're only looking for one. Well, I think it's just knowing red flags

and calling them out. Yes. That's it. And that I obviously had a problem doing, but now I completely do. Or did. Real quick. We have to take a break.

["Square Space"] This podcast is brought to you by Squarespace. Whether you're freelancing, running a biz, selling feet pics, I don't know, whatever your hustle is, it's way easier to take it seriously when you've got a real website. Squarespace makes that part easy. You don't need to know how to code or design or any of that. You just go in, answer a few questions about what you're doing, and guess what? A boom! It sets up a website for you that already looks great.

From there, you can customize truly everything. Drag stuff around, change the fonts, the colors, whatever you need to make it feel like you. And if you're offering services, selling anything, or you need people to book you, they've got a built-in tool for that. Send out invoices, you can take payments, you can schedule appointments. It's all in one place. So if you've got something you want to put out into the world, start with Squarespace.

Go to squarespace.com slash date me for a free trial. And when you're ready to launch, use offer code DATEME to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. That's squarespace.com slash date me! Code DATEME! If you're tackling a home project this spring, big or small, Wayfair's got everything you need in one place, from pendant lights to vanities to outdoor planters and sheds, they've got it all.

And now Mars, you just signed a new lease and you've been shopping for furniture. What has been your experience with Wayfair? Yes, I just moved into a new studio, and what's great about Wayfair is that I could put in the exact dimensions I need and all the features I'm looking for and it will narrow down from like 10,000 different kitchen islands to 25. It gets me exactly what I want fast. Yes, yes, yes. Wayfair makes it so easy to find exactly

what works for your space. And they've got options for every price point. The selection is massive and the shipping, it's fast, it's free, even for big stuff. And they'll help set it up too. That's a win. Shop the best selection of home improvement online. Get renovating with Wayfair.

Head to wayfair.com right now. That's W-A-Y-F-A-I-R.com, Wayfair. Every style, every home. Bebop, boopop, we're back, Jackie. Can I ask you a question? Yes. Did your ex ever say things like you're too good for me or like I'm gonna hurt you or like Like did he ever tell you the truth and then do those things? Do you know what I mean? Um, no. No, no, I don't know what you mean. Oh, okay. Well, I dated a man who was like I don't want to hurt you and I said, oh you can't hurt me

You won't hurt me and then he did or he'd be like, oh, I don't know if I like really want to be in a relationship But then we do like relationship things but like refuse to put a label on it I haven't had that happen. But is this the one person I know that you dated or is this somebody different? I know like your old one. Well I dated somebody who was like the blueprint to him. Yeah. Like right after him. Or no, like a couple years after him. The patterns, patterns sometimes.

But he would do things like that. That's what I mean. I remember that. He did this one insane thing where we went to a movie and it was late and I said something and he got mad at me so then he wouldn't stop at red lights and I thought I was going to die. I never told that story. So I... My... the problematic acts number one, he would do scary shit like that and I remember one time

we were in the car and he didn't even have a license. So he was driving my car. Oh no. And I remember in that moment I was like, I'm never gonna let a man scare me again. Because this is definitely not okay. So yeah, that's a thing they do. That's a thing. And it's one of those things where like, you're such a strong person.

And it feels wild every time I let something like that happen. I'm like, okay. I remember like the M&M years of like, Chris Anguilera was like, I would never let a man do that. And then he'd talk shit about her on the track. Do you remember, like, and I remember just being a little kid and being like,

I'm never gonna let a guy do anything like that to me. Like, of course I'm not. If he does, I'm gonna call the police. And then I found myself in those situations. And you're like, fuck, I'm here. And I'm not calling the police. I think it's one of those things that you're like, oh, from the outside I can see that that's crazy

and I don't want that to happen. But when you're in it, you're like, but they said they loved me or they said something nice. And it'll get nice again. Oh boy, this got dark. Jackie! I knew it would, honey. There's too much to discuss.

But it's real, it's good to bring that up because there's definitely people listening who are in situations like that right now. And we can both tell you as wiser, successful whimp... Yes, whammy. That that's not okay. What did Queen Latifah say? Love doesn't hurt. I didn't know Queen Latifah say? Love doesn't hurt.

I didn't know Queen Latifah said that. That's so sad. I saw her at the Indian restaurant once. I did not know Dana Owens said that. That's her government name. I saw her at the Indian restaurant once. The Indian restaurant. I'm not gonna say which one.

I don't wanna project her privacy. That is very kind of you. Yes, of course. Was she beautiful in person? Yes. I think she's so stunning. So gorgeous. Oh my God. Is she very tall? She's very tall.

Ugh. I love a big tall woman. Me too. You're a big tall woman. Yes, 5'10", baby. Ugh, that's so nice. And you're 5'5". I know.

Which, why did I never knew that? Maybe because you're wearing heels every time I'm around you? No. I was shocked when I heard that. No, I just read tall. Yeah. And I have a very big butt. Why did I never knew that? Maybe because you're wearing heels every time I'm around you? I was shocked when I heard that. No, I just read tall. And I have a very big butt.

So when I'm sitting. Yeah, it brings the height. Well, that's a blessing though. Yeah, my mom was, she was five two. But when she sat down, it was as if she was six eight. That woman had a fat fucking ass. It was wild. You bring all new meaning to shake

what your mother gave you. Yes. That's right. Gotta shake it. Wait, tell me about being a mom. Okay. Is it, you like it? Yes, it's a lot. Is it hard? I underestimated. Oh yeah. I underestimated.

Especially because my son, I was so neurotic about being bonded with him Yeah, I underestimated. Especially because my son, I was so neurotic about being bonded with him that I'm not gonna say over bonded with him, but the bond definitely worked. He loves me. I've never known a love like this. A man has never looked at me like this.

Man looks at me. But he's obsessed with me to the point where it is physically and mentally draining to me to like nothing ever has been. Does he cry when you leave? Cries when I leave, screams my name, even if I get up to pee, Mommy! Mommy! I'm like, Jesus, like it's like the possessive boyfriend from college

that wouldn't let me wear my hair a certain way. Wait, really? He'll be like, Mommy, take that out. Like he doesn't like when I have scrunchies in. Like he doesn't like when I wear certain things So it's so funny. It's intense. You like that. He has opinions. Oh, yeah. He's a he's a true Gemini He's oh, he's a Gemini. When's his birthday June 14th. Oh But no, I love being a mom but it's a lot and I don't know how anyone has more than one I

Really really don't except I get it because than one. I really, really don't. Except I get it because he wants me to play Paw Patrol with him 24-7, and I always go, can somebody just drop a kid off here? Like, I don't wanna have to have another one raise it, have it suck my titties for a year. Like, I don't wanna do any of that. Can we just have like a post-mate drop me

like a three-year-old or something? Because I get it, then they play with each other and you can breathe a little bit Unless the second one is like me. I was like my sister simply won't do yeah I would annoy my mother so much. Yeah, anytime they went into the bedroom together I'd knock maybe like what are you doing in there? Okay. Yeah, I mean, maybe they were fucking or maybe they were trying to escape They were probably just had their eyes closed just breathing Yes, that's what I do. No, no, no gotta get in there. What are you doing? Can you come out and play with me? Yeah

So that's good to know again. Yeah, cuz I keep being like I'm not gonna have another one But I'm like god if I could just have another one right here then they could play and then I could go look at my phone All I want to do is go look at my fucking phone and then I could go look at my phone. All I wanna do is go, look at my fucking phone! Did pay! But no phone for me. Soon. Soon he'll be in school. He's in school, but it doesn't, it goes by like that.

It goes by so fast. I'm like, it's already four? Have you seen Night, Bitch? No, I need to. Everyone, I've gotten so many texts. Haven't finished it. But the beginning feels like a PSA to not have children. No, I need to. Everyone, I've gotten so many texts. Haven't finished it. Yeah. But the beginning feels like a PSA to not have children.

I was like, oh my God, this lady's life is miserable. But also she has a husband who's like, who doesn't help. And I was like, oh my God, to be in a marriage like that and to have a kid, ugh, I feel like that's horrific. It's really, really hard. And again, I had a quote unquote easy baby, and it still was, it's just a huge gauntlet of a change from your life before. And again, I think when you do start a little later,

you've had all these years to be selfish, do whatever you want. And so it's like, oh fuck, I have to get up every two hours and have somebody suck my titties? It's not fun. It might sound fun, it's not. Yeah, yeah. I mean, if it was an adult man that I loved

who wanted to suck on my titties every couple hours, okay, but a baby that I can't understand sucking on them? No, thank you. And he just went to town. It was intense. I would look down and he's just going... -"Nyeh-nyeh-nyeh-nyeh!" -"Nyeh-nyeh-nyeh!" And I mean, it's wild. Like, you know, he only had my milk until whatever,

like, seven months when they started eating solid food. And he was gigantic. And I was like, he's literally sucking the life out of me every three hours. And... But you and Ben are tall people. Yeah. But I'm just saying, he was like a good, healthy baby.

So he was, like, sucking the life out of me. And it was great and it worked, but it was just really depleting for me. No I could imagine. And it's a lot. Me and a mommy is a lot. Yeah because you got to talk to them all the time. All the time. And you have to like actually answer them otherwise they don't learn language. Oh my kid is full verbal. Full sentences. I mean he's like two and a half. No, he's a genius. Which again, I married a very smart person. And that was good DNA choice. I love that. Yeah.

But it's a lot. Dogs are way easier. Dogs are so much easier. I can leave my dog in the house without a person for a couple hours. I potty trained Chooch when I was 25, and I lived in a shitty little apartment. I had to go down the elevator all day and stuff, and I remember being... I don't even remember that being hard and being annoying. I'm trying to potty train a kid, and I'm like, I want to pull all my hair out.

I'm like, why can't you be more like Chooch, your sister, my dog, for those who don't know, my passed away dog? Well, I mean, because like he's..., your baby's a person and you're like, why can't this person get it? Yes. But I also get it, it's like, well, why go to the bathroom and I can just dump in here? I know.

And then the bigger person will clean it up. I know. It's, there's a lot of emotional stuff involved too, like the doodooing is really like, and there's a whole chapter in the book about like, they might not want to use the pot. Why are we talking about this? Let's talk about my eggs more, I'm just kidding. Wait, but I do wanna hear about the chapter about doodooing. Basically, there's a lot of kids for some reason

peeing in the potty's fine. Like, oh, just, yeah, I peed, but then they really don't wanna doodoo in the potty. They like really don't want to. It's some kind of mental block. I think they're scared of like how far it falls. I think that's part of it. Interesting. Or maybe it's like...

Poop is like a solidified thing and it's like, well, I want to keep my things. Well, they're used to... I don't know if that's it, Nicole. I don't know if that's it. Those are my things in there. But to your point, I don't know if that's it Nicole. I don't know if that's it. Those are my things in there! But to your point, to your point though, when you wear a diaper you feel it come out and you feel it up against you and that is a comfort.

Those are my things. So having it exit and not having that sense of security is hard for some kids. What is on this straw? What the fuck? I guess you're gonna have to tune into the YouTube to find out. So this is one of those, they're like anti-aging straws. It's so dumb.

Mm-hmm. But you're not supposed to, yeah, you're not supposed to like pucker your mouth. And so I got one of those straws that you literally look like an idiot when you drink because you just like rest your mouth on of those straws that you literally look like an idiot when you drink because you just like rest your mouth on it. I don't think you'd look like an idiot. I think you look like a person

who wants to have a conversation. Like if you were in Starbucks or something and you did that, I'd be like, hey ma'am, what's going on? I should start selling these. I should go to Starbucks. You just came up with my next business adventure. You walking into Starbucks. I'm just gonna walk around sipping and when somebody asks me, I'm gonna go,

actually sell these. And then I pull out all the colors and they buy one. I think you should. I need a job. I need a job. I'm gonna do this. I think you should buy them wholesale. Why not? Like, can you buy them?

Put my link in the bio. And by the way, Jackie's now selling the straws. I'm gonna buy them on Alibaba, get them wholesale. Every time I hear Alibaba out loud, I'm like, I cannot believe that's the name of the company. It's such a fun name. I've never bought anything. I've never bought Teemu either.

Have you bought anything from Teemu? No, because I bought stuff from Shein. I haven't done that either. And it's not good. And every time I buy it, I'm like, never again. So I'm just not buying anything from those places Yeah, also, I've been trying to buy Just secondhand. Yeah, just trying to like you know I'm doing a no buy

I'm doing a no buy 2025 even though I'm wearing pants I bought yesterday. So it's not going well, but I'm trying We've been under a lot of stress in LA lately, okay? Give me a break. I did try to do a no-buy January. Oh yeah. But I've already bought things. Yeah. It's just so hard, I love things. That's also, again, our hobbies, our interests.

I love shopping. Yes, me too. It makes me happy. Shopping is my cardio, as the shirt says. It kind of is. As the mug says. I was recently on Michael's, truly zooming around, having the nicest time. It kind of is. As the mug says. I was recently on Michael's, truly zooming around,

having the nicest time. I love Michael's. They had a lipstick vase that I bought. Oh, I want that! A little Jeep Wrangler vase. Huge! A little ducky vase. I bought so many things.

Yeah. I bought a tiny miniature piano for someone who plays piano, because I was like, in that barn, they have a piano on a piano. So you were thinking of someone else. Jackie, every time I go shopping, I'm always thinking of people. That's nice. Every time I see pink I'm like no Jackie but I don't send it to you because I'm

like everybody sends you the pink thing. Sometimes there are days in my DMs where I will get the same DM like 50 times and it's like oh the L'Eau-Crusais pink I'm like yes. Do you have it? Yeah. I have the purple or the shallot. Oh yeah yeah. I don't cook. That's a great color for you yeah but they're nice to have in case. I don're nice to have in case but they're nice to have in case does your man cook? He does. There you go Which is so nice somebody in the relationship has to. It's wonderful. Does Ben cook or do you cook? I was the cook but now he has become the cook because I'm tired. Is Ben vegan too? No So does he make two meals? Yes, so he will grill steak and grill tofu.

Or he will eat vegan with me. So yeah, we have a system. That's nice. And you don't mind that he's a meat eater? I don't love it, but beggars can't be choosers. You're not a beggar! When I first was single again,

I was like, I'm only gonna date vegans. And then that went out the window pretty fast. Because it's just so limiting. But it is, to me, it is like a belief system. And there's lots of people with like, what's it called when people have two different religions? Intersect? Intersect? Interfaith? Interfaith?

Yeah, sure. Interfaith. I still am over here and shook that I called Armin Weisman Harris whittles. I mean, we're gonna keep it in. Sorry. We could cut it out. Sorry to all those involved. We could cut it out.

No, I think we should keep it. Okay. Let's be organic. Let's be fun. Yes, I'm sure Armin wouldn't mind. And Harris would think it's funny. I think so. Yes, I think so too.

I don't know Armin very well, but I think he would think it was funny. I think, I would hope so. Hopefully. If you get a cease and desist. I think so. And I don't know Armin very well, but I think he would think it was funny. I would hope so. Hopefully. If you get a cease and desist. I hope I do. Sorry. What a fun thing to get a cease and desist. Yeah, that would be fun.

You can just rip them up. They don't mean anything. Oh, you can? They don't mean anything. It's kind of like with jury duty. I won't do it. Oh, I just had it. Was it fun? I didn't do it.

Yeah. I have a secret. I've already said this on a Bridger's podcast, so I'll say it again. Just move it to Christmas week. And then every time you report, they're like, no, you don't have to come, no, you don't have to come. Your jury's complete. Wow. Yeah.

I've done it twice now successfully, but now we're all gonna do it. They're gonna catch on. Don't worry, I'll never respond. Okay, great. I don't, you don't want me on a jury. What are you gonna do, arrest me? They legally cannot prove that you got the notice.

Yes, ding ding. But I will say that it is important for our country. You know, it is our right as citizens to have a jury of our peers. No, you don't want this peer. I'm so easily swayed. You could be like, he did it. I'd be like, he didn't.

Someone else would be like, he did it. And I'd be like, he didn't. I went once and actually had a really good experience. Oh really? I learned a lot, yeah. They ended up went once and actually had a really good experience. Oh really? I learned a lot, yeah. They ended up settling two days after, but they said that because of everything they heard us say, they actually reached a settlement.

Oh. Yeah, and I recently went through some crazy identity theft stuff. Oh no. And it like forever changed me as a person, so I feel like if I ever did go on a jury. Wait, what happened with identity theft? I don't even wanna talk about it.

Okay. It's like a security issue. It was bad, I'll tell go on a jury. What happened with identity theft? I don't even want to talk about it. Okay. It's like a security issue. It was bad. I'll tell you after. Okay. I haven't publicly discussed it. It was really bad. I'm scared of that.

Somebody's in jail now, bitch. In jail! Diva, that's wild! Oh yeah. I was warned that if you have a really common name, that you're like a target for identity theft. And I'm like, I'm Jackie Johnson. I've been Jackie Johnson my whole life. Like, nobody's ever, you know, and then all of a sudden,

oh, oh. Is Nicole Byer common? And Barbados Byers common. But see, you're a known person, so it would be a little bit harder to steal your identity, you know what I mean? I guess. Did you hear about that man who scammed a lady

out of almost a million dollars by saying that he was Brad Pitt in the hospital? Yeah, I just saw that. His head on just people in the hospital. There's a lot of, I heard about that on Howard Stern, there's a lot of people who fool old people on Facebook and my dad was like, you'll never believe this, Angelina Jolie just friend requested me.

And I was like, dad, no, she didn't. And he said, no, it's real, it's real. I don't understand the disconnect with some people. I just think their media literacy is just not there. My friend John's mom sent a video of the Hollywood sign on fire, and I was like, there's three L's. It also doesn't look real.

And then she was like, Rodeo drives on fire. And it was clearly AI. The AI is scary. But this AI was not. I didn't see that. I have a friend who lives up there, and she was clearly AI. The AI is scary. But this AI was not. I didn't see that. I have a friend who lives up there, and she was like, I woke up to that and was so terrified, and then looked out my window and was like, oh, it's fine. But well, yesterday Griffith Park was on fire, and I was like, I, this can't, we have to

stop. I know. Really, someone set that one? I don't know. I'm just like, we got to it see this is why everyone needs a hobby And that's why it's not nerdy. We got a destigmatized hobby. Yes, and fire can't be one of them. Yes You can't have a fire. I'm too scared to even light a candle in my house at this point Jackie I lit a candle in my home the other day walked away and said what if and then blew it out

Yeah, and I was like I have a dip teak candle that I got for my 40th. Oh, that's nice Oh, honey, it's the final boss andth. Oh, that's nice. Oh, honey It's the final boss and candles. Yes, and it's like honey. This is the life I am now and it's the pink one obviously the one that comes in the pink vase And I haven't even lit it, I'm too scared. What about one of those lights that goes over it? What is that? Do you know what those are? Oh yeah, like a candle warmer. What does that do? That just melts the wax? Yeah, it makes the smell, but I'm not fucking around with that either. No, I don't want it.

Nothing hot. Nothing heat producing. No, no, we can't be doing that. No, we're gonna be cold. Just freezing. Freezing over here, but safe. No fire for me. No, no, no. Cold and safe over here. Yes, cold and safe. [♪ for the longest time, I thought paying

a small fortune for it every month was just how phone plans worked. But it turns out it doesn't have to be like that. Mitmobile has premium wireless plans starting at just $15 a month. That's it, $15 with high-speed data and unlimited talk and text all on the nation's largest 5G network. You get the same quality you'd expect from those big wireless companies, clear calls, fast internet, zero drama, but without the jaw-dropping monthly bills or surprise overages. It's reliable, affordable, and just makes sense.

You can even keep your own phone and number. Just pop in a Mint Mobile SIM card or use eSIM and you're good to go in minutes. No store visits, no weird fees, just easy setup from home. And the best part, you're not locked into anything long-term. Mint gives you the flexibility to try it out with their three-month plan. So if you're even a little curious, it's worth checking out. No matter how you say it, don't overpay for it. Shop data plans at mintmobile.com slash date me. That's mintmobile.com slash date me. Upfront payment of $45 for three-month,

five-gigabyte plan required. Equivalent to $15 a month. New customer offer for first three months only, then full price plan options available. Taxes and fees extra. See Mint Mobile for details. Wait, let's go back to your ex. Okay.

So, before you got divorced, what were the things that you liked about him? That's a wild question. No, no, no. But it's because I know him. But here's what's crazy. I truly didn't know I wasn't happy. Oh.

I really, really didn't. Would I fantasize about getting a call that he was dead? Yes. I did. But you didn't know you weren't happy. No. That's really interesting to me. I know. And I've heard several other interviews with people who have said they did the same thing.

And I remember telling my therapist about that. Like, it was a revelation later, and she was like, that means you wanted out. But you didn't want to leave. Like, you did, it was like, that's an easy way to get out, is that I get a call that he's dead, or whatever. Dark. But I just was like, you know, you watch sitcoms and like, they hate each other.

And I was like, and again, that was really my only model each other. And I was like, and again, that was really my only model for marriage. And I was like, this is what all marriages are like. Every marriage, the wife hates the husband and the husband hates the wife. This is what, and I would talk to my friends who were married and they bitch about their husbands and the husbands would bitch about the wife.

I was like, this is what it is. Part of being married is being unhappy. Like I literally thought that. That is so interesting. Have you seen Kevin Can F Himself? No, should I? Yes. Because it's a very interesting way

to dissect that, uh, that trope that like, oh, marriages is about like, arguing and making fun of each other because from his point of view, it is fun in games and he is being malicious, but like, it's just under the guise of a joke. And then her point of view is like, oh, he like threw his plate on the floor as like a joke,

and now I have to clean it up, and it's grim, and it's sad. It's a really- I don't know if I can handle that. Maybe not. No, I can. This was a long time ago. Like, I got divorced in 2019. We're sitting here in our Lord, the year of 2025.

2025. So it's been a good long time. I can reflect now and see it for what it is. I've done a ton of work around it. So I could probably enjoy that movie or learn something from it or whatever. It's a TV show. Hour long. No, listen, we, what I also realized was that

we just had no intimacy. We had zero real intimacy. We would get stoned and laugh our asses off and eat and watch movies and go to Disneyland. And like just fuck around and that's all we did. But we had no real, like real deep intimate connection. And I don't think I've ever had one until then. Just because I had never done the work to have that.

And by intimate connection, what do you mean? I just mean like vulnerability, real trust. And just like a connection, a real emotional connection. Mm-hmm. I thought I had one a million times, but I didn't. That is interesting. Like, when you actually genuinely think about intimacy. Like, I'm a people pleaser, and I do not like telling people

when something is wrong. Same. And my boyfriend, I feel very comfortable. It takes me a minute. And I'll be like, why am I upset? Oh, it's not something he did. It's something that happened. And it's worth telling him.

So then I'll tell him. And then he'll always be like, I'm really sorry that you feel that way. I won't invalidate your feelings. Let's figure it out so we're both happy. But he always says, thank you for telling me. And I'm always like, that blows me away. He didn't start a fight.

He wasn't defensive. You probably used to not tell, right? I wouldn't tell. And if I told any of the people I dated, they would instantly get defensive or be like, well, you're not my girlfriend. So like, why would you be mad about that? And I'm like, I don't know, I guess I am. And I guess like, well, you're not my girlfriend, so like, why are you... Why would you be mad about that? And I'm like, I don't know, I guess I am,

and I guess I'll just... I'm not your girlfriend. I'll shut up and I'll never speak again. I'll never speak again, I'll put a pillow on my head. I have no knees, I don't need knees. Go ahead, put the mat over me, walk right on me. I don't mind. Yes, don't even put a mat on me. Just put your dirty feet on my face.

Yeah, bare feet right on my face. No, that was so me as well. And it comes... For me, it goes back to like childhood stuff, you know. We all end up in LA for a reason. We're all fucked up in some way. Yes, we want attention, please. They get funny and nice. Pleasant.

But yeah, I completely relate to that. And I remember like, I was like, I'm gonna break this pattern. I'm not gonna do that anymore. And I would work on it in therapy. And I remember like, Ben would say something or something that anymore. And I would work on it in therapy, and I remember like Ben would say something or something would happen, and I would literally be like, crying just like walking up to approach him. Because why are we so scared?

We deserve to take up space and have our needs met. And like... And I'm fine taking up space professionally. Yes. In a bar with my friends. But I think I like wanted to be loved so much that I was afraid of taking up space because if I take up the space,

will there be room for you to love me? Will I push you away because I'm taking up space? But it's like, no, the person who's gonna love me is gonna love all of me and is gonna want to understand when I'm upset and want to work on things. And you deserve that. Yes. And that's a hard thing. That is such a hard thing.

My therapist on Sunday just sent me a screenshot of, hold on, I'll just read it to you because it was really, really sweet. I love my therapist. I love that y'all text each other. I never crossed that with mine and I kind of wish I had. She's one of my, not my favorite people. I don't know, she might listen to this.

Do you know much about her? No. Yeah, that's how mine is. I literally know nothing. I don't know anything. Every once in a while she'll give me a little something. Like I'll reference friends and she'll be like, well yeah, like Phoebe. And I go, she watches friends. You know, I'll get a little something.

I don't even know what kind of TV she watches. But she sent me this thing that said, you deserve to be loved without having to hide the parts of yourself that you think are unlovable. And I burst into tears. And then the second one is, you will never speak to anyone more than you speak to yourself in your head,

so be kind to yourself always. And then again, I cried and I was like, oh my God. It's really good. It's really good. But yeah, sometimes you just like need to hear that a lot. Yes. And sometimes I'll catch myself speaking badly to me and I'm like, wait, I like me. Why am I... And you're also such a complimenting, like same with me,

like we definitely verbally love language people and then we're so mean to ourselves inside. It's like, why am I so nice and genuine to everyone else that I love and let them know, but then to myself. It's just like so mean for no reason. Sometimes I'll get dressed and be like, oh, you look stupid. And I'm like, wait a minute.

You don't look stupid. Maybe you're just not having a nice time right now. So what can you do to have a better time? Maybe you need a little water, sweetie. Yeah, just, oh my god. Hydrate that brain. There, I never know when I'm dehydrated until I start drinking water and I'm like,

oh, this is the ticket. This is what I needed Sometimes I like won't pee for like five hours and then the pee's like dark yellow You're like, kid, I swear all I eat are his scraps Like he'll finish, he'll be like I'm done and there's like a tiny corner of a waffle and I'm over going It's like the only calories I get for like a couple hours When I nannied I ate after that child. Yeah, you have to, it's all you get. God I'm hungry. I don't know Nannying was so hard. I know I can't God. I can only do one and I can hardly do that. I mean, I only had one. Oh, the second family I had two. But one was he he was pretty easy.

Yeah. He was like he didn't talk. He was nonverbal. Yeah. And I remember once they were like, he doesn't respond to his name. He's he's I think they thought he was autistic. I don't know. But I remember I said his name once and he looked at me and I said, you do know your name. And then he smiled at me and I was like, okay, mister.

They're not giving you enough credit over here. Okay, mister, we're gonna work on things. Yes. Like, I'm gonna eat Cheerios and shit. Cause I was like, no, you're gonna eat these Cheerios. You're gonna do it, I don't wanna feed you anymore. He's like a famous Goodwill ambassador now. He was like, my nanny believed in me.

Wait, how did Ben propose to you? So it was unfortunately a little bit of a pandemic thing. He wanted to do this whole elaborate thing because our first date was at the ArcLight. He was going to take me to a movie and then he was going to be playing a movie on the screen. It was a whole thing, but it didn't work out. But I woke up, we flew to Delaware over the pandemic and like took his parents' house basically.

Because I was, we were living in a one bedroom and that was not very fun. So I woke up, I hadn't even brushed my teeth. I was disgusting. And he was like, I have to watch this gerrymandering, gerrymandering documentary for work. And I'm like, okay, fine. So he puts it on and then all of a sudden it like cuts out

and it's a video of like us and stuff. And I still didn't get it because this was actually the day we met at that party. The one I was telling about the boa. But like a hundred years later. That it was gerrymandering. And then this nice white couple. Because gerrymandering.

Yeah, yeah. It's just really funny to me. Yeah. And then, and so, yeah, he hid it in a gerrymandering. Yeah, yeah. It's just really funny to me. Yeah, and so yeah, he hid it in a gerrymandering documentary and then we went outside and he proposed to me and his parents and his brother, they all had masks on and signs. And looking back, I kind of wish they hadn't been there to be honest because it was a little weird to have an audience.

I always thought I wanted one of those mob, flash mob things. But yeah, and I was like a little weird to have like an audience. I always thought I wanted one of those like mob, flash mob things. But yeah, and I was like, but I was like, I literally haven't brushed my teeth. Like this is not okay. But I said yes. It's still very sweet.

And Choochoo was there, my dog, so you know, she approved. Choochoo is just the sweetest. I know. Just the cutest. I know she loved you. Most little stinky breath, little cutie. She loved you and she loved purple like you. Her tail was purple Just the cutest. I know, she loved you. Most little stinky breath, little cutie. She loved you, and she loved purple like you. Her tail was purple all the time, I know.

Clyde's tail is purple all the time. They are very similar looking. Yes. She's like kind of like the white version. Yes. Yeah. I know, she's a good girl. Charli's getting so old. Jackie, do you have advice for single people?

I have an entire part of my show about this. So yes, my best advice is the oldest advice in the book, which is to be yourself, which can sometimes be the hardest. But as we were discussing, if you want your second husband, which is what my specialty is, you have to go in with nothing to hide and you have to be your full self. However, do not overshare. So there is an asterisk there. You can't start crying on the first date

over your trauma with your sister. You know, so there is a little bit of a nuance, but what I always say is first date, all the pressure's off. Have fun. Second date, get to business. So I want children. Do you want children someday?

Like, what's your timeline on that? What are you looking for? Are you just trying to fucking suck or you want a partner? Like these are, first date, none of that. Second date, where we at? Where we at? That's my advice for that. And then my other one, if you're looking for your husband slash second husband,

you might already know them. We're always so fixated on new and shiny and swipe, swipe, swipe who's out there. Honey, go through your Facebook, go through your old coworkers, go through people you may have long forgotten, because your second husband could be somebody you already know.

I mean, that's good advice. My boyfriend is somebody that I have friends in common with, Your second husband could be somebody you already know. I mean, that's good advice. My boyfriend is somebody that I have friends in common with, to the point where I like, ask the one friend, I was like, why didn't you introduce us before now? And he's like, I don't know, I just didn't think of it. And I was like, yeah, men, they don't think about these things. I've been single for so fucking long, the whole time you know me.

The whole time. The whole time. But that's good that you can vet. That's good. Because it can be hard to meet a complete stranger. That's hard. I've only dated one guy who was a complete stranger and it was a guy I met at the dog park. I've dated... It's even scarier for you because again, you're a public figure.

Yes, but I do date straight men most of the time and they love to tell me they don't know who I am. And I gotta say, feels good. Wait, Jackie, here's a question. Would you date me? Of course. I've been wanting you to ask me that for so long. We would have so much fun.

I genuinely think so. We would have dogs everywhere. We would have dogs everywhere. Our house would look insane. Oh, but it would be so fun. Oh my God, it would look wild. We would come down the stairs in our feather boas every morning.

With? All the dogs just like behind us like a sea as we run. It would be like just a glamorous gray garden. Like I feel like we would just find so many things to do inside. All we would do, I would show you the Sims. You would teach me how to pole dance. Yes. Yes.

I think you'd be good at pole dancing. Oh, I don't know. I'm very long. You look very length. I am long. So the heels would look so good on you. Well, you know, Courtney Perusso is like really good. Yes. Yeah. She's great. Yeah.

Ugh, she looks great. I love a heel. I know, I barely ever wear those. I don't really wear them, because I have a hard time walking Yeah, but you don't fall down a lot. Sure don't I slud it up Jackie? I do want to come over and look at the pole. You can yeah, you can come over and look at the pole. Yeah Yeah, I redid that room and it's a my little office and it's all fun Yeah, two different patterns of wallpaper two different shades of wallpaper. That's right two different shades of purple That's what I'm talking about. We do have to wrap up. Okay, but Jackie. Yes. Thank you so much for doing this

I want you to do this for so long. It was finally time. It was really time And when are you doing how to get a second husband again? Well as of while you're listening to this I don't know. It'll be in the bio Nicole. Do we know when this comes this comes out the April 18th, so we don't know right now I am gonna go to Edinburgh friends. So in August if anyone's in Scotland, right? How many shows are you doing? I don't know it right now McCall in the past as we're recording this we don't know Okay, I'm gonna be hitting up various cities and the East Coast Look at the old be in the notes. It'll be a little be in the notes. It'll be in the notes, okay? I'm gonna be hitting up various cities in the East Coast. Look at the notes. It'll be in the notes.

It'll be in the notes. It'll be in the notes. It'll be in the notes. All right. Jackie, thank you. Do you have anything else you want to promote? How to get a second husband, baby. I love it.

Check it out. Come see me in Anamoro. Hopefully, I'm shooting it as a special end of this year, so just be on the lookout. Oh my god, this is exciting. It is exciting. Jackie! Yeah! Well, if you like this episode of Why Won't You Date Me,

you could like it, you could rate it, you could subscribe, you could write me something nasty to whywon'tyoudatemepodcast at gmail.com. It has to be nasty. And I'll read it. In lieu of a dirty message, okay, I'd like to read your fortune. A wealthy relative you've never heard of will pass,

leaving you some priceless art. You're also gonna win a poker tournament that you enter on a whim, and I'm seeing a lot of white in your future. Maybe that's the cum light. Is that a wedding dress? No, it's cum. And that wasn't a poker tournament.

It was a strip poker tournament, and it wasn't just any art, it was by Georgia O'Keeffe. That would look sick in your house. I would love a Georgia O'Keeffe. A big purple pussy flower? I would, I would, okay, so there's this like space that's very long. There you go. And I want like a thin, long pussy.

Yes. That's what I want. But I also want to continue to make my house inviting for a man. Yeah. That's... What's more inviting for a man. Yeah. What's more inviting than a pussy? You know what? Jackie, you right.

Yes. I'm gonna get that. I'm gonna get that pussy. It's literally in the email. It is. The fortune has been told. I do have a lot of dicks around my house. I don't have enough pussies. You can balance it out. There you go.

I have an actual dildo on display in my house because I ordered a charger and Amazon sent me a black dildo. I wonder if they googled you. Like a brown skinned dildo. Maybe someone in the warehouse is like, I know what will be funny. That's the one regret I have of not coming on the show earlier is when you used to shower when you're dating pictures and like figure them out. I never got to see the dildo pic of you holding the dildo. I will find it. I'll send it to you. Okay, perfect. I need to see it. Many years later. Many, many, many years later. And husbands later. Divorce!

Divorce! All right, Jackie, thank you for being here. Thanks for having me. Goodbye! Bye! You've been listening to Why Won't You Date Me with me, Nicole Byer. This show is produced and edited by Mars with executive producer Anya Kenovskaya.

It's engineered by Casey Donahue, with guest research by Lindsay Kemp. Our VP of content at Headgum is Katie Moose, and our theme music is arranged by Mike Komete. Ah, thanks for listening. We'll be back next week with a brand new episode. See you then. Okay, bye-bye. next week with a brand new episode. See you then. Okay. Bye bye.

That was a head gum podcast. Hey, I'm Jake Johnson and I host the head gum podcast. We're here to help with my partner Gareth Reynolds. We're here to help as a call and advice show. Think car talk from back in the day. We're determined to help fix life's dumbest problems. We also have guest helpers join us from the entire cast of New Girl to Michael Cera, Andy Samberg, Jimmy Kimmel, just to name a few. So do me a favor and come check out an episode and then bounce around our catalog. We're over 150 episodes so far, so there's plenty of stories for you to discover.

Subscribe to We're Here to Help on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Pocket Casts, or wherever you get your podcasts. New episodes drop every Monday, and bonus episodes drop on Wednesdays. Hi, I'm Rachel Dillson. And I'm Olivia Allen. And we host the podcast. Broad Ideas.

Yes, that's now on HeadGum. On our show, we chat with people like Brittany Snow, Lucy Hale, Kristen Bell, Margaret Cho, Jake Johnson, and so much more. And we talk about all the things you would talk about with your best friend. Like your periods. And mental illness.

And the food you ate for lunch. Most importantly. Listen to Broad Ideas on Spotify, Apple podcasts, YouTube, or wherever you listen to your podcasts.