20/20 - Devil in the Desert Bonus: The Third Man

Episode Date: August 29, 2025

In this bonus episode of "Devil in the Desert," we look back at the perspective of the elusive third man involved in the crime of violent kidnapping and torture: Ryan Kevorkian. Matt Gutman and "Start Here" host Brad Mielke tell the story of the one person willing to share a first-hand account from the night of the crime, using never-before-heard police interview tape of Kevorkian himself. All episodes of "Devil in the Desert" are out now. Catch the whole series for free on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Apple Podcasts⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Amazon Music⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, or wherever you listen to podcasts. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, just a quick warning here. This episode contains very graphic descriptions that may not be suitable for all listeners. In a story like Devil in the Desert, sometimes there are a bunch of details that don't make it into the final version of the series. Entire sidebars and plot twists that are so interesting, but we just can't quite fit them into six episodes. I'm Brad Milkey. I'm host of ABC's Start Here podcast, and as someone who was gasping with each twist and turn of Devil in the Desert, I'm glad that we get to bring you one of these today in a special bonus episode. Join me today is the host himself, Matt Gutman, ABC's chief national correspondent,

who first learned to the story of Jose Nairi more than 10 years ago. He's been following it ever since. Matt, great to have you here. Hey, Brad, good to be back. I think I've told you this before. I'm from Orange County in California where so much of this story takes place. So I grew up around Newport Beach. I grew up around Balboa Island.

I made the drives out to the desert. So I was just transfixed by how unsettling. these locations became because of the depravity of this story. Obviously, Nairi is the centerpiece of this series. His name is the one that's most often associated with it, especially after you escape from jail. But there are still other characters in the story that we haven't dwelled on as much. So what I'd like to do here today for the true obsessives among us is ask you,

who else needs to be talked about here? Okay. I mean, obviously there is a main cast of three perpetrators. And the first one is the man that I spent. Years speaking to and exchanging letters with and finally meeting in jail. And that's Jose Nairi. He's the man investigators called the mastermind of the whole plan. The other guy's Kyle Handley, who was given almost an identical sentence to Nairi for his role in the crime. This man, Michael, who was a dispensary owner, they believed he had a million dollars buried somewhere in the desert, took him out to the desert, tased, beat him, and eventually zip tied his penis and cut it off. And the penis was never found. So an extraordinary act, an extraordinarily heinous crime. And the third man, this is Ryan Kovorkian. And in the series, Brad, he's known as Mr. Brown.

And we don't talk a lot about him. But what's so interesting about Ryan Kovorkian is that he actually gave a very detailed and long interview with investigators that proffer. Remind me what a proffer is. I know you guys mentioned this with the other proffer in here, but just as a refresher. Basically, a suspect or defendant sits down with prosecutors and investigators. It's supposed to be a no-holds-barred interview. And what they say can't be used against them in court. Now, they can use stuff tangentially and they can also use the information against other suspects or co-conspirators.

And in that interview, he was pretty detailed about how the crime unfolded that night. he gave some shocking details that I actually hadn't heard before. We also have to remember it's his perspective. He is very likely self-serving as almost any defendant or suspect would be. But it does give us some insight both into exactly how that night went down, who did what, and what their thinking was. Yeah. And so, you know, the story that you've been describing is all in 2012, but this interview that happens in 2017, I guess what do we learn from his, again, from his perspective.

So remember, this is happening not long after Hossei Nairi masterminds this insane escape, which Absolutely insane. Everybody in Southern California is terrorized, especially anybody who would ever said anything against him. So, you know, Ryan Kvorkin is a little bit afraid of this guy. And you can hear it in the interview. And I just want to set the scene of what this interview is like. Okay, it's September 14th.

Approximately 9.07 in the morning. So you can hear them sort of setting up the conversation. And one of the things investigators want to know as they start is what Nairi's relationship was like with Ryan Kavorkin. I met Hussein in high school, on a wrestling team, things like that, you know. What high school? Close west. Okay. Remember, Nairi was this high school wrestler.

Kavorkian was on the wrestling team with him. They even went to the Marines around the same time. In early 2011, Nairi was already deeply involved in the medical marijuana business. These two guys had a fight. And we're talking like two bears wrestling type of fight, like a huge knockdown, fist-throwing, knuckle-dragging fight. And they completely stopped talking after being friends for, you know, almost. well over a decade. And then at some point, in the late summer of 2012,

just a few weeks before the attack, Nairi reappeared in Ryan Kavorkin's life. And he asked Kavorkin, hey man, you know, do you want to go out to lunch with me? And so I get in a call with them. We go to a little Mexican restaurant. I can't remember what's called, Don Wants or something on the main boulevard or something like that.

I can't remember. And we sit down and have lunch. He says, so you look like you're telling me you look like crap. And I'm like, well, thanks. seeing you two out to all these years what do you want pretty much you know what do you want leave me alone you know like I'm not bothering you not bothering knowing what you want he's like I need your help I said what's going on he says uh I have a little hit I want to do in Newport area and so he's talking about this house on the beach on that palm-lined street

where Michael lived and where Mary had just moved in like a couple of days before he told me he needed money a guy owed him some money whatever And pretty much you wanted me to be the weight and stuff. He said, so we're just going to surprise him at his house. I'm going to get the money. If any issues, I have you there with me. If not, we're jamming. The thing with Nayiri is that he gets these people back in his orbit.

And even though everything in the, every fiber in their being screams, don't do it. They do it. And so, like, he eventually agrees to this deal to basically act as, the muscle in whatever robbery it is that Nairi has concocted. Nairi offered him a thousand bucks plus a cut of whatever money they steal. And Kavorkin agrees. He said, if anything, worst case scenario, you'll get a thousand no matter what. If there's more money involved this guy owes me, then I'll give you more.

I said, okay. Now remember, in Nairi's head, Michael has a million bucks buried somewhere in the desert. This is a big deal for them. And so a week before the crime, Kavorkin says that he moved into Kyle Handley's house. Like everything is starting to pick up. And he ends up helping with the surveillance that Nairi and Hanley have been doing on Michael's house and Newport. And as part of the surveillance, they're not just tracking his car. They're not just following him.

Nairi's gotten inside the house. He's gotten video from inside the victim's house in Newport just days before the attack. He showed me a videotape. He had a videotape. showing me what the house looked like and stuff. Yes, he had a videotape. From the inside? Yes, from the inside. He showed me actually what the house looked like from the rooms, the rooftop,

things like that, what we're going to hide, things like that. He showed me that. And they make a plan. They pretend to be construction workers. They're going to sneak in through an unlocked balcony door, hide inside in the attic, until their target, this guy, Michael, came home. So you got there in the late afternoon. You thought you were going to spend a couple of hours.

hours are, yeah. And then when he got home... So, like, in his mind, the plan is they creep in, they hide in the attic, they wait for Michael, Michael comes home, they threaten him, maybe they have to rough him up a bit. They get the money, they get out. Obviously, that is not even remotely what ends up panning out. He had the backpack, but I didn't... He took the backpack, but I didn't know what he had in there, too, we got to the upstairs.

And so what is in that backpack is what changed. as Ryan Kavorkian's understanding of what this is about entirely. This is not just about muscle, and this night is going to be a lot longer than he or anyone else ended up expected. And we're already hearing stuff just in this proffer interview that we haven't heard so far in this entire series so far. And when we come back, there's even more of these previously unheard details. So we'll be back right after the break. Wendy's most important deal of the day has a fresh lineup. Pick any two breakfast items for $4.

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So, Matt, in the first episode of the series, we heard from one of the victims of the crime, Mary Barnes. She's telling the story from her perspective of being awoken in the middle of the night with a gun digging into her neck. There's also another way to tell this story from a different perspective, the perspective of one of the attackers in the room. And that's what you guys sort of get here. Right. So Kavorkian sort of adds the other side of that that we didn't know.

They're doing this in the middle or early afternoon, and they hide in this, like, attic, crawl-like space at the top of the house. It's super hot there, and they're waiting for hours, night falls. And Nairi, of course, is prepared. Kavorkian realizes that he's got this big backpack, and not only does he have snacks and whatever they need for the hours, but Nairi has also packed guns, a pistol and a pump. action shotgun. And at this point, Kavorkin's like, dude, I'm not shooting someone. Nayri was prepared to shoot.

He told me about the bat. He said, don't worry, I'll get you out of here. You know, you just run. I said, well, yeah. Someone's shooting, I'm going to run. That's common sense. And so Nairi doesn't just have guns in that backpack. He's got some other equipment that Kavorkin says continues to ring alarm bells for him.

So he brought food and water. Food and water. He and zip ties. I asked them. In ski masks. And ski masks. I asked them, what, zip ties? I asked him, what's that?

You know? Like, you know, he said, well, just in case it's not here. And I said, what's not here? He said, the money. I said, well, you told me the money was here, you know? He told me, shut up, don't worry about it. You know? You argued a little bit and stuff.

Pretty much, I was just like, you know, I shouldn't have trusted you, you know, what's really going on here? You know what I mean? as it is, I'm stupid of being this out to begin with. What are we going to zip tie the guy and then leave him here? What's what's going on? He said, if it's not here, that's why I have him.

And what does that mean to you? I'm thinking, oh, crap. I'm thinking this guy, they're going to take this guy somewhere. I was just about to say, Matt, when you hear, like, there's zip ties and then also, like, snacks, you're planning on being there for a much longer time. And again, I guess Kavorkin has a reason to say, like, I didn't know anything in this session. But that, yeah, it would sound like a very concerning. Yeah, I mean, I think what you just said is really critical.

Ryan Kavorkin has to be self-serving to some degree in this proffer, right? He is trying to minimize his role in this as much as possible. I mean, I don't think it's so outlandish that in a home invasion that somebody would bring zip ties, if you're trying to tie people down and keep them from using their phones or running away. I mean, I don't find it that surprising. I'm sure the officers didn't either. But there is a problem that they didn't quite anticipate. And that problem is a blonde woman and yoga pants named Mary Barnes.

The girl comes home first. How did you know that? I can hear her. She comes home from work. She eats dinner in her room. She gets ready for bed. And this is something that Kavorkian simply did not expect. I said, I want a part of it and stuff.

Then he starts getting kind of mad calling me workplace. You know what I mean? I said, you should have told me this from the get-go. You should have told me this from the get-go. Kvorken's like, hey, man, I didn't sign up for this. I don't want to hurt a woman. It's a big red line for me. He continues to say it in the interview with police.

But now Mary's in her bedroom downstairs, and Kavorkian realizes that she has to be part of the attack. Everybody in the house is part of the attack. What's about to happen is such a horror. But there is something kind of comic, Brad. in seeing these two, like, muscle-bound wrestler, you know, heavies crouched in this attic with, you know, the litter of their snacks and some water bottles, sweaty and arguing about this crime that they're about to perpetrate

and, you know, kind of bickering yet again. And remember, they'd had, like, a knock-down, bloody fistfight barely a year earlier. So this is not going great for them. obviously they're in it a few hours later they come down from the attic it's the dead of night kovorkian says it's nairi who wakes up mary and points the gun at her head and zip ties her but again according to kovorkian it's him who whispers in mary's ear don't worry this is not about you and i remember telling her this is nothing to do with you i'm sorry i felt horrible to be honest with you i really have my mind

I felt horrible. He felt badly. He's about to feel a little bit worse when he hears Nairi go into Michael's room, wake him up, and just start beating him senseless. He alleges that it was Nairi who then drags Michael

down the stairs. And then it takes a turn, right? They're beating Michael. He says he doesn't have the money. And so Nairi decides, well, they've got to get loaded into the van and driven out to the desert where he believes that

Michael has stashed a million dollars in cash. We now know that not to be true. We know that Michael never had that kind of cash on him or anywhere near him, but that's where they're headed. And the whole ride out there, they're in the back of the van, and Kavorkian says he's watching Nairi beat and tase and torture Michael. And finally, they get out to the desert and Kavorkin's able to tell police that the story that Mary couldn't tell him. You know, she had that blindfold on her face and he describes sort of laying michael out on the ground and you know the torture is continuing and the threats are continuing what the saying goes and tells uh kyle you're going to cut his thing off he says thing tell me the exact one i think you told him i'm going to cut

we're going to cut since you didn't give us the money we're going to cut your dick off i think he told Kyle that I wore him talking. And Kyle's like, really? You know, like, it just came out of the blue. So it seems that the part that makes this story so difficult to listen to, and which has obviously completely changed the trajectory of Michael's life to mutilate Michael was just a spur of the moment decision by Nairi. Handley seemed shocked.

Kavorkian says he was shocked. And so remember, Michael is mutilated, doused with bleach, beaten, tased, burned, in agony. They leave Mary and Michael in the desert. It's now the morning of October 2nd. And then the three guys, you know, they go to subway. They go get a sandwich. Hussein and Kyle, they left me in the van at a subway we ate kind of close to where the house was at and stuff. It's also like sadistic sounding, Matt.

And it sounds like we keep talking about how Ryan Kavorkian has every reason to tell the cops. Like none of this was my idea. This was all Jose Nairi. But it sounds like cops basically agree with that, right? That Nairi is really the one in charge here. Yes, I think, Brad, that becomes even more clear after this proffer with Kavorkian. And you can hear him. I mean, he is very reluctant.

He didn't seem to be in that world at that. time he seemed normal reactions to hearing like let's cut somebody's member off and like that like right normal reactions to having to bind a woman to hold uh an innocent person at gunpoint and at this point towards the end of the interview kovorkian's actually expressing fear about his family me worried about him no it's my family he knows where my family's at he knows what that's why I worry about you know now he's being honest with you guys and this guy's very and you guys know that dangerous deal. Do not put anything above this guy.

Well, that's like the muscle of the operation is saying, like, I'm scared of this guy still. Yeah. It sounds like Kavorkian was cooperating, and that's why you had this proffer deal. But I think it's totally fair to assume that anyone involved at any level in this heinous plot would be spending most of the rest of their life

in prison, just because it was that terrible. Kvorki got much less time than that, though. Why? I mean, I think he cooperated with police. He also made a plea deal, right? Those other two guys pleaded not guilty. When you fight it and then you lose, typically the sentences are longer. So he pleaded guilty to two counts of kidnapping, a count of burglary, a count of assault with a firearm. And he was given what is still a pretty hefty sentence of 12 years and four months. And of course, Nayari and Handley are

both serving life terms. Matt, I'm curious just to hear your perspective, because at this point, you followed this case for a decade. So I guess is it over? Like what comes next year? But also, what are you taking with you? You know, I think with most cases like this, Brad, it's never quite over. So, you know, everybody kind of always thinks about what happens with Nayeri. Is this guy going to get out? And what he's doing right now is filing a petition for appeal based on a number of issues. We're keeping an eye on it. There hasn't been any result specifically. But obviously, we will bring it to you as soon as we hear anything about that appeal. But yeah, I mean, this is the kind of case that I think sits with people for a long time. It's really interesting, both to hear

this new information you've been sharing with us and just to hear your reflections on this, Matt, as somebody who's been following this and who guided us through this entire series. Really great reporting by you, really great work by everyone on the team. And I'm sure you're already working on another case right now. So we'll let you get to it. Thank you so much. Thanks, Brad. All right, and that will do it for us. In the meantime, there is more to come from ABC Audio and the team at 2020. Cold-blooded, mystery in Alaska, a brand new true crime podcast is out right now. And if you've made it this far, you strike me as someone who likes to be in the know, someone who appreciates not just the what, but also the why and the how.

So if that's you, I would definitely suggest checking out the podcast that I host each weekday morning called Start Here. It's a quick daily news show. It's there for you whenever you want to just catch up on the news. crime yarns to the latest financial news that could impact decision making for you and your family. You'll even hear Matt Gutman sometimes. He's a regular. We've linked to start here in our episode description to make things easy. So again, that's start here, revigate your podcasts. Thanks for having me. And until next time, I'm Brad Milky. heard some of them, so I'm getting rage. It was about a beloved surgeon, one of just two in town, named Eric Garcia.

When police officers arrived to check on the doctor, they found him dead on a couch. Is it a suicide? Is it a murder? What is it? From ABC Audio and 2020, cold-blooded mystery in Alaska is out now. Listen, wherever you get your podcasts. To you, my darling. No, to you.

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