20/20 - Footprints in the Snow

Episode Date: February 14, 2026

A burned-out car, one victim inside, and a married couple are both missing. Police are left to untangle what happened as they search for answers and a possible killer Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

It's an early morning in January. It's windy, it's dark, it's icy and snowy. It's honestly a pretty miserable winter morning. And a car is traveling down a road called Arrowhead. It was blustery. It was a snowstorm. And that's typical for that area. It is in ski country. This driver, a staff member of the Alpine Ski Club, knows the lay of the land. As he's driving south, it's pretty alarming for him to see a bit of an orange glow in the distance.

This is really unusual. Realizes, okay, something's going on, stops the car, opens his door, starts walking towards this light, leans over the guardrail, and in the ditch is a car on fly. car on fire. The fire permit was your emergency. The 911 call came in at 5.54 in the morning. Hi, there's a fire on top of Arrowhead Road. It looks like a car went off the road. It seems fully engulfed. I'm not sure if there's passengers inside.

One of the concerns was though is that it's a car fire and if there was a body in the vehicle. And what kind of vehicle is it? I can't tell. It's fully engulfed. It's down in the ditch. About 75 feet down. And you don't know if there's anybody around? I have no idea. The person who called 911 was also a part-time volunteer firefighter. And he took some pictures of the scene. It's like a minivan. I don't know if there's anybody in it. It looks like there's print and the footprints in the snow.

Okay. It looks like they must have come up and got out of the vehicle in time. One of the things that he said was that it looked like there were tracks leading from the vehicle up out to the road. Footprints? Footprints. In the snow. In the snow. It looked like a little trench. There were some track marks in the snow.

As if somebody had walked out of the snow. Yes. My name is Ryan Martin. I'm Captain with the Colling Fire Department. We were dispatched at 613 and we are unseen at 622. Within a matter of minutes, all of a sudden this quiet country road starts transforming into a scene of intense action. emergency responders dealing with a very sort of weird and unusual event. By the time Captain Martin and his firefighters arrived on the seam, they estimated that the fire had been going for at least 20 minutes, if not more.

We were fully expecting to find a vehicle that had self-extinguished. Realistically, there probably wouldn't be a lot left of a vehicle that was in a free-burning state after 20 minutes. So it was surprising to turn the corner to see it still full. involved in fire. The fire behavior wasn't characteristic of a typical vehicle fire. They had begun to attack the fire from approximately the top of this hill. It was difficult to advance the hose line just because of the slope of the hill, and they were dragging it through fairly deep snow at the time. Every time that we applied water to the fire, we would blacken the fire down,

and as soon as we stopped our extinguishing efforts, it would flare back up as if we hadn't made any progress at all. It was a very stubborn fire to extinguish. We had both Town of Blue and Collingwood fighting the fire at this point in time, and the flames just continued to flare back up. We did deplete our entire water tank in the process of extinguishing the fire, which is very uncommon. The fire characteristics were not normal. The visibility was poor around the vehicle. We were contending with thick black smoke, and we were applying water to the vehicle.

We were generating a lot of steam. which impaired our ability to get a good look inside the vehicle. Firefighter Parks pride opened the driver's side door and was able to sweep the driver's seat with his arm. He scanned the car with the thermal imaging camera as well swept the driver's seat with his arm, which appeared to be empty at the time. That's as far as he could get into the vehicle. At that point, there was a lot of things running through our mind. We were confused about the driver's seat being empty. We had checked with the drone in the immediate, the surrounding area, and we couldn't locate

anybody else in the area. When they extinguished the fire, that's when everything changed. Approximately 7.09 a.m., the radio call went out over the air that there was a patient inside the vehicle. From that point on the scene was turned over to the OPP, the Ontario Provincial Police. When they extinguished the fire, they found a human body. It was in the front passenger footwell.

They believed at that time to be a child. One of the fears that ran through our mind was that if a parent was driving and left the scene to go get help while the vehicle was still relatively intact and then the vehicle took fire with somebody inside and that was very scary to us. My first thought might have been that there could have been a drunk driver that went off the road. The vehicle got stuck on the side of a mountain and it caught fire and somebody may have left but we just at that point we didn't really know what we had. You could see that there were

track marks, there were road crews there, police were there, they closed off the road for several hours to figure out exactly what the path of the vehicle was, how it ended up down the embankment. At the end of our shift that day, our accident reconstructionist experts were there still processing the scene. There was a lot of questions that we had and a lot of answers we didn't have yet. After the body was found in the car, it becomes a more serious traffic investigation. I don't normally get involved in fatal crashes. When I do get involved, I'm going to treat that death like a homicide. until I can prove that it's not.

In this case, we're going to use everything at our disposal. All our very skilled traffic investigators and our detectives canvass the area. When the reconstructions are there, walking in the snow, they step on the license plate, which got clipped off the vehicle. It gave us the owner. That's when we went to his house.

What happened when you knocked on the door? In the Blue Mountains, you've got mountains to the west, you've got water to the north, you've got farmland to the east, and it's honestly beautiful. It's a four-season wonderland. In the autumn, the colors are beautiful. The skiing in the winters, it's fabulous.

The summer, we're on the Georgian Bay, and you can swim anywhere. Blue Mountains, which is mostly sort of a resort town, and then right next to it is Collingwood. And Collingwood is more of sort of an actual place to live. It's a really nice place to raise a family, and you have that small, that small town feel of kind of everyone knows everyone.

This is small town Collingwood. Word travels real quickly about a death. Police are now putting together the pieces after a fatal crash in Blue Mountain. When they extinguished the fire, they found a human body. There was only one body in the car and they couldn't figure out who was that person. When the reconstructions are there walking in the snow

and they step on the license plate, which got clipped stepped off the vehicle. It gave us the owner, James Schwamm. Right at the beginning when they find that license plate, it's entirely conceivable that that's James Schwamm in that car. James Schwamm was a firefighter with Brampton Fire and Emergency Services. He was 38 years old. He lived in Collingwood. James Schwamm had a beautiful family. He was married to Ashley Mellons.

They had two wonderful children. So we got in his address. That's when we went to his house. What happened when you knocked on the door? Nothing. No one was there. It's a normal Thursday work day. So after we left, we went to do a little more digging. I knew somebody who worked for the same fire department.

So I called her. And I asked, what can you tell me about this guy? We've got a fatal collision. We're looking for her next akin. The colleague says, let me see if I can reach him. When she calls, she doesn't get an answer. And so she's starting to worry. And her next response is, well, I should tell Ashley.

She calls Ashley's work and learns she didn't show up for work that morning. So now she's thinking, okay, what the hell is going on? They were a popular family. Absolutely. They did a lot of things together as a family. They were all both very present in their kids' life. Everyone seemed happy.

They call it a million dollar family, I guess, where you have your boy and your girl, and they both have great jobs. They live in a beautiful area in the community. James Schwalm and Ashley Milnes, who people called AJ, were both born and raised in Toronto. When I met Lindsay, Ashley's older sister, you realize this is a really genuinely tight-knit family. What was it like growing up, 104? It was fun. It was busy, I have to say, kudos to my mom. And how did Ashley fit into all that? She was just a bubbly, blonde-haired, cute thing.

She was just this spunky, funny kid full of life. I know her nickname is Boob. Boob came from Yogi Bear. Hey, boo-boo. How about that boob? And so my father would call her that. And then we just started calling her boob. The boob.

Yeah. The boob was always, she was always the center. The two older kids adored her. She was magnetic. Big time. She loved life. I rarely ever saw her without a smile. Anything she did, she was incredible at.

She really took to hiking and tennis, golf. You name it. She was a phenomenal athlete. She was a fabulous dancer. Her favorite artist was Whitney Houston. So there was a lot of Whitney Houston blaring on the stereo. Yes. Was their favorite song?

How Will I Know? She would just let loose on anything and would sing, would dance. A lot of people are described as the life of the party, but I get the sense that she was literally the life of the party. Absolutely. James Schwamm grew up in Toronto. James' family was well off. They certainly had money. He enjoyed the privileges of being able to go to a private ski club.

Ashley and James belonged to the same ski club. Like Ashley, he would be going up to the Blue Mountains to ski every weekend. Where you met all your friends and families and everyone kind of congregated there. Social Hub. Yes. That's how they met. You're at the ski club. Yes.

Is it fair to say he swept her off her feet? Yes. She was young and in love. James was a handsome guy. He was a firefighter, so he was in great shape. He looks like Captain America. He's a firefighter. He's a hero. Look down. He would do demonstrations where he'd be hanging off a bungee course.

hanging off a bungee cord from a building. He'd be smashing a door down with an axe, and he chronicled it all on his Twitter page. Very charming, very polite. What you would hope a young man would be like in front of meeting new parents and a new family. What was your impression when you realized, oh, she really thinks he's the one?

He was very nice. He's a kind of guy that sucks up to adults. He wants a good impression. Your parents were married. for 30 plus years for your mom passed. Do you think your parents' marriage gave Ashley a sense of what marriage would be like? Absolutely.

Unity. Best friends. Ashley's was a fairy tale way. Oh my God, it was so beautiful. It was her dream wedding. Literally, she arrived in horse carriage. That's a Cinderella moment. And she looked like Cinderella.

She was the most beautiful bride. You could just tell in her smile and her eyes. eyes that she was living everything she thought it would be it was. The Brampton Fire Department posted a photo on their social media. It shows Ashley's growing family, first a boy and a girl. She was making a name for herself as an interior designer. So she was a busy working mom. She was.

She balanced it. She did. But her kids came first. Such a great mom. It just came naturally to her. But where is that? mom now or their dad for that matter. On that cold January morning, investigators are desperate to find the parents, either parent of the Schwam children, to learn whose body was in the car.

As police are investigating the charred remains of this SUV that seems to have just driven off into the snowy ravine, they're trying to figure out whose body is inside. At this point, the Schwam children are both accounted for, but the parents, James and Ashley are not. We went to Ashley's office, and they told us there that she didn't show up for work that morning. So that's an ominous sign. So we're like, okay, she's missing. He wasn't at home.

We contacted his fire service, and he wasn't working that day. He works for the Brampton Fire Department, and they do get through to one of his colleagues. And so she, you know, rings him up and he's not picking up. And so she starts to worry. Like there's been a terrible accident. Like, maybe James is dead. The detectives need to answer that question. And they quickly find out that James has a part-time job on the side at a repair shop.

So the police head on over there. And James was behind the desk when we showed up. Looked like a normal working day. When you contacted him, did you know it was Ashley in the car? We didn't know. But you presumed. But we presumed. When you broke the news to him that his wife was likely dead in a car crash, what was his reaction?

He cried. He was emotional, distraught. Tears felt very bad for him. I got to travel down to the Bahamas, which is where Ashley's dad, Ian, now lives. It's also where he got a horrible phone call from his son. son-in-law, the kind no parent should ever have to take. The phone rings and Jamie's at the other end in tears blubbering about it and I couldn't understand it and I screamed and said, what are you saying? And then he said that AJ had

passed away. She was in an accident and I screamed into the phone and said, what are you talking about? That's a day that will be ingrained in my head forever. I looked at my phone and my dad was calling. And he said, well, we lost someone today. And I said, okay, who? And he said, boom. I mean, I don't know.

It was the hardest thing I've ever heard in my life. At that point, we have a crash. We don't have a cause of death. We don't know if it really was just a terrible circumstance where the car left the road, the car caught fire. and she died as a result of the fire. Two days after the crash, the police asked Ashley's husband, James,

to come into the station for an interview. These are Canadian investigators. They're going to treat you politely. They're going to ask you to come on in. Let's have a chat. Tell us what you know. What was going on? Okay, so I got you coffee.

Thank you very much. It was really a conversation to him. Like, James, tell me what happened. When you think about the day in the morning, is there anything that stands out? Well, I know in the morning, Ash was upset then, so she was a, it was a little argument in the bedroom. He had an argument with Ashley because he wanted to go for a walk with the dog. And she wanted to do this hike at 5 in the morning. Would she normally hike at that time?

She normally had to work. She hikes out to work too. It was a bit earlier than usual. And when she'd go on these hikes, was she normally with somebody? Sometimes, but not all the time. He explained that he needed to take the dog for a long walk because the dog would be left alone all day because he was going to his part-time job.

I don't know what time I left the house. I came back and Ashley's car was gone. He seems entirely distraught and emotional at the loss of his wife. So what I want to ask you to do now? Do you just go back another day? Okay. They take me through Wednesday. Okay.

Welcome up once they'll work. When you say work. Sorry, I'm Brentton Fire Station. Okay. It was starting to snow. I ran out of gas with a snow water. And I left the empty cans in the garage. I sent her a message just asking if she could fill them up.

It'd be great. He sent her a series of texts imploring her to go get gas for his snowblower. And there was weather coming. It seemed like such an old day. She was tired and she made a comment that she was getting a lot of text messages. She was on her phone through dinner and I just assumed it was work stuff. Okay. And overnight from Wednesday to Thursday morning, anything out of the ordinary?

No, just the snowstorm now. Okay. Do you know if she was supposed to meet anybody that morning? I'm sorry, I don't. So she may have set up a hike date in the text in the evening, you don't, you don't know? Yeah, she very well could have been. Was Ashley texting about a hike where she was going to meet up with somebody? In his explanation, she had plans to go on this hike. So whether that was with somebody or alone, I don't know how many people go out at 530 alone. So remember those photos taken by the 911 caller at the scene? The ones that show footprints in the snow,

they're going to tell their own story, one that police say confirmed that Ashley was not alone in that ravine. James is talking to police and he's telling this story. He had a text message that he sent to Ashley saying, I went for a walk this morning at 514. That seems pretty precise. Correct. How did he show it to you?

It was on his phone. He had a video from his home surveillance system showing him leaving for his walk. Draw your walk for me. If I brought you a map, just to show me the route that you took that day. It shouldn't be a problem, yeah. He was very cooperative. He told us where he was. He drew us a map of where he went during that walk.

Next Mark's the spot. And so just walk me through the route and sort of just trace. So he draws a map for you? What does it show? It showed a pretty decent route through his neighborhood and around, and then him coming back home. This is a family that is very outdoorsy. So where was Ashley going? He said, well, she was going for a hike. But with all this snow coming down, it being so early, that's kind of an odd decision to go for a hike so far from home on this particular. from home on this particular morning.

And he went back to the phone again. And he was able to show a text from her saying she was leaving and also to show a video of the car leaving. So she sent a text saying she was leaving several minutes after you left, right? Okay. James shows police a text from Ashley's phone. Okay, I'm going to zip out.

I think the kids will be fine. they're sleeping. You left for a walk with the dog, and then afterwards she leaves, and that leaves your kids home. And that's, to me, as a parent, I was pretty upset. And I'm not judging her, right?

I'm just saying it just seems to me out of character. So, can you help me with that? It was a bad habit that we got into, a little bit of early morning stuff. It's only happened maybe two or three times. That was really bizarre, that she would leave her young kids in the house alone to go for a hike. Like, that's just to me, that's not happening.

In the dark, in a snowstorm. That didn't add up to me. Did you get that text when you were walking? No, I had to plug my phone on that last night. So I plugged it in and just took Rock over a walk. Okay, so your phone was trying to get home while you're up for a walk with the dog. Yeah. He said he left his phone at home, went for the walk, and when he got back,

back, she wasn't there, but all these messages had shown up on the phone. So after he sent a text saying he was going for a walk, she sent a text saying that she was going for a hike. And a few minutes after that, she sent another text that said the inside of her car smelled like gasoline and she'd have to be driving with the windows down because she'd forgotten to take out some gas cans that she filled up. So the other text, you know, when we look at them, it's strange. Okay, and it's about the gas.

Can you tell me about the gas? Yeah. Those are gas cans that he texted her to please pick up the day before, right? That's right. So I can't imagine driving with a gas can and the fumes that have been in the car all night with the windows open without taking those tanks out to sort of air the whole thing out. I don't know why she couldn't just take them out of her. Would we go to that next text that she talks about having the vertigo?

Another text from Ashley's phone says, quote, oh, I have vertigo. I'm going to rush home and try to do it, work out in the basement. Ashley had this inner ear problem. She would feel dizzy, off balance, sick to her stomach. She took medication for it, and it would come and go. And her husband made a point of that. Oh, she had, you know, vertigo and that may be why she crashed.

Could have been. The text continues, I feel like crap. I can't hike. And that she was going to come home. And when he got back, she wasn't there. After a two and a half hour interview, detectives are ready to send James home. He agreed to hand over his phone.

He agreed to hand over the blink camera system from his house. And he agreed to allow us to come and do a walkthrough of his house. As a grieving husband would. Absolutely. At the end of that shift that day, we're left with we have a body in a car that's been burned. We have a grieving husband. We have some interesting text messages that, and video as well on a phone that he showed us. All his messaging that he showed us from her phone tried to set up this.

This hype was important for a reason. So it's almost like your spidey senses are up. Your gut is telling you something. he had the answers to all the questions before they were asked. But Ashley's autopsy reveals even more questions. And the answers are frightening. How key is the forensics lab? It's extremely key.

It's going to tell us how she died. ABC Wednesday, February 25th. The Emmy-winning comedy Scrubs returns. This is a whole new chapter for me. No more sad stuff. That's what I'm talking about. I want both of our sacks to be fun. You two idiots are perfect for each other.

From the executive producers of Ted Lassau and Shrinking. We were all a part of this victory. Now get those nachos out of the premium warmer. Natchos! It feels like there's more applause for the nachos than my speech. The new season of Scrubs. Wednesday, February 25th, 8.7th Central on ABC, and stream on Hulu. This show is supported by Chime.

Chime is changing the way people bank. If you're accustomed to old-school traditional banks, you're probably no stranger to paying fees. Overdraft fees, minimum balance fees, even monthly maintenance fees. But Chime offers smarter fee-free banking for everyday people. As a 2020 listener, you can get up to $350 by joining and making qualifying direct deposits. That's extra money in your pocket just for banking smarter and fee-free through Chime. And with Chime Card, you can build your credit history with your own money and get rewarded every day. No annual fees, no interest, no strings attached.

Plus, with qualifying direct deposits, you can also get 1.5% cashback on eligible CHIM card purchases. Chimes not just smarter banking. It's the most rewarding way to bank. Join the millions who are already banking fee-free today. Head to CHIM.com slash 20, spelled out T-W-E-M-T-Y. It only takes a few minutes to sign up, and 2020 listeners can earn up to an extra $350. That's chime.com slash 20. Chime is a financial technology company, not a bank. Banking services and the secured CHIMB fees of credit card are provided by the Bank

Bank N.A or Stride Bank N.A. Option. Optional services and products may have fees or charges. See chime.com slash fees info. Terms apply. Limited time only. Must open the new account and complete qualifying activities to earn rewards. Advertised annual percentage yield with Chime Plus status only. Otherwise 1% APY applies. No minimum balance required. Chime card on time payment history may have a positive impact on your credit score. Results may vary. See chime.com for details on applicable terms. We went to the site and got out, but we see black and all the trees and the pine. So like you go, how does a car get on fire? when it's plowing through all fresh powders in the whole home.

For me it didn't sit right. She would not have come out here this way at 5 in the morning to hike, like after a snowstorm. But she loved hiking, right? So for me it was like, okay, maybe I'm dead wrong. So this is Arrowhead Road. It basically runs north-south. You can see there's a curve up ahead,

navigated that curve. No problem. And then the car. is driven off the road. But what this crash didn't show us, it didn't look like a horrible crash. There was fire damaged and some burnt and there was some divots in the trees, but it wasn't a terrible crash scene. If you walk a little bit down this way with me guys, you can see there's still like branches broken. You can see the path of the car. Did you see the birch? But you can still see the burnt trees. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's how hot it was. This whole mountainside was covered in snow. Were the skid marks evident when you were here? What did they look like? They weren't skid marks. They were tire tracks just leading off the road. When they said no skid marks, I thought, in an accident, isn't that suspicious?

Well, police thought so too. Once the emergency responders got that car out of the ditch, they send it to Toronto, where a forensic pathologist can take a lot. look at the body and try to figure out, you know, who is this and what happened to this car. How key is the forensics lab? It's extremely key. It's going to tell us how she died. The Center Forensic Sciences is a multidisciplinary forensic laboratory in the province of Ontario. We do numerous different types of analyses here.

We have an amazing state-of-the-art building here, and we conduct approximately 6,500 autopsies a year for people that die suddenly and unexpectedly. The call came in to me to say that there was a vehicle that had been on fire and there was a body inside. Badly burned bodies are one of the most difficult type of autopsy to conduct. And I said, bring the car here, we have to put it in the extrication bay to extricate the body. Because you have to remember when a body comes from fire,

the body can fracture from the fire. Heat effects. If the extrication happened at the scene, there would be the chance of, you know, an open environment, losing important pieces of evidence. When I first examined the remains, there was a body on the passenger side. When we removed a sock from her left foot, the sock smelled of gasoline. It was not clear what the circumstances of death were. However, the smell of gasoline was somewhat suspicious.

I wanted to know if there was any evidence that she might have inhaled gasoline while she was alive, if there was any traces of gasoline in the lungs. So I was a scientific advisor that particular week. There were two separate submissions, fire debris that was collected from the car, and Dr. Bellis was requesting to submit the lungs of the deceased. So this is a mock-up of the evidence that we received, and Jasmine's going to show you here how we do the sampling. One of these items was a sock that was removed from the deceased. from one of the feet of the deceased.

There was a glove that was found in the vehicle, which had an odor of gasoline. The testing is similar for debris items as it is for the lungs. If there are any ignitable liquid residues present in those debris items, they're also gonna be present in that airspace above the debris item.

Ignitable liquids are any liquids that are capable of fueling fire, one example of which would be gasoline. After poking a small hole in the lid of the jar, essentially a sample of air is drawn from the item. And inside that hollow tube there is an absorbent material. And any ignitable liquid residue is present are trapped now on that absorbent material. And so now this tube represents this particular item in the case. So we're now going to go put these onto the GCMS instrument for analysis.

So this is the auto sampler. Essentially what the auto sampler is going to do is heat up each of these tubes. At that point it'll be detected by the instrument and produce a chart called a chromatic. a chart called a chromatogram which we use for identifying ignitable liquids like gasoline. You can see a gasoline pattern here, which has a very distinctive look to it. Essentially, the results that I received is that the gasoline was identifiable in items that were recovered from the inside of the cab of the vehicle. So it makes you wonder, like, did the fuel in the gas tank of the car spill out into the vehicle during the accident? Typically, if a gas tank is compromised, then gasoline can

spill out over the road. there can be a significant fire. But assuming that the car is fully sealed unit, I wouldn't anticipate that gasoline would enter the vehicle in that manner. The results were quite interesting. My role is not to determine what those results mean, but the lungs themselves came back negative. Just logically speaking, there's only one explanation for that.

So while police are awaiting the final results of the autopsy, they get wind of another 911 call that came in, the evening after the crash. And it's heartbreaking. It's from the teacher of one of the Schwam children. Well, she said that her mom had fallen down the stairs. And what's the mom's name? Do we know?

Her name is Ashley, A-F-H-L-E-Y. So we came up here the next day. Obviously, too, you know, be with Jamie and the kids. And it was a week of hell. What happened during that week? I mean, everyone was up here. here, it was a lot, a lot of police in and out. We're all blubbering around and trying to fear.

I just, you know, like, what are we going to do and all this stuff? But it must have been total grief and shock and horror. I mean, I don't like vomiting. And that's what I was doing. At first, I was like to have the flu, and then, no, it's part of trauma. You know, and I'm going, Gene, I just, I'm so sorry. You know, like, what can I do? and he had taken the kids to the Science Center.

He took all the grandkids to the Science Center from Callingwood to Toronto for the day to have fun. But that's Jamie. Let's get away from that morning house and let's have a fun day. It was bizarre because I didn't see him cry. At least not with tears. With the car now transported to the Forensic Science Center,

all police have is a charred body, a grieving family, and an ongoing investigation into what they're still calling an accident, at least for now. So I left work and I went out to one of my favorite restaurants. I'm just enjoying a hamburger and a beer. And that's when the phone call came in. Hi, I was just wanting to share some information that a student gave me. I'm a teacher in calling with this morning. It's not sitting well with me today.

I don't know if there's any way that somebody can do a wellness check. And the good Samaritan making that call is the elementary school teacher of the Schwalm's six-year-old daughter. The night shift sergeant calls and says, Jare, something's changed. Okay, and what did she tell you? Well, she said that she didn't have a very good night last night. She would woken up to her parents' fighting, and then she proceeded to tell me that her mom had fallen down the stairs.

And then I said, well, did you see your mom in the morning? She said, no, that her mom had gone for her mom. that her mom had gone for a long hike. What's the mom's name? Do we know? Her name is Ashley, A-H-L-E-Y. And this is a mom who got her kids ready for school every morning. Yes. Who suddenly decides to take a 5.30-A-Og hike.

In a snowstorm. In a snowstorm. Police were trying to figure out from friends and family, what was the situation like between James and Ashley? Were they happy? Were they loving? Was there infidelity? On the outside, they were a shiny, happy couple. It seemed like they had everything he could ever ask for.

It's like the usual juggle of drives and extracurriculars and chores, the usual things. Police have discovered some secrets, that things weren't as great as they might have seemed from the outside. So you knew there were cracks? Yeah, in the facade. Yeah, I mean, but they were working. through things and I thought it was okay. But then there's one thing that really sort of shakes their world up a little bit. In one of her messages on her phone to one of her sisters saying,

I'm all out of love from air supply. Yeah, that was one of the last texts I got from her. It's very profound, those lyrics. What goes through your mind when you think that? Heartbreak. Heartbreak. There was a lot of trouble in paradise. Did she confide in you over that?

No. Justice detectors are starting to piece together the Schwalms passed. A bombshell. And he came up and said, Do you know? It was hard to grasp and understand what we were hearing. How did Ashley Schwamm end up dead on the bottom of that and bank? in her car charred beyond recognition.

It was her body that yielded all those clues. It was part of the aha moment. And the information changed the whole dynamic of the investigation. My alarm bells go off. It's almost something you would see in a movie, to be honest with you. The fire on top of Arrowhead Road, it looks like the car went off the road. We didn't have a crime at the time. We had a death that was suspicious.

There was some, some unambiguous. There was some unanswered questions about it. One of those nagging questions was why that early morning fire was so hard to put out? The fire behavior was extremely unusual. It was approximately a nine-minute response for us. So when we arrived, we expected the fire to probably have self-extinguished. But when we rounded the corner, we saw the orange glow. The intensity of the fire was not typical of a car fire that is already half hour old.

A typical fire, it's relatively easy. It's relatively easy to extinguish with your onboard water supply, but in this case, both Town of Blue Mountains and Collingwood exhausted their onboard water supply, just extinguishing the fire. We lost the whole inside of that car. It really needed to be looked at under an expert's microscope to see what was going on in there. A forensic pathologist takes a look at this body, and she's trying to figure out, okay, is this Ashley's dead body by fire, or did something else happen? I took samples of lung so they could be examined for volatile substances, including gasoline.

I was able to identify gasoline in all three of the samples that came from the vehicle, including the sock that came from the deceased, but the lungs themselves came back negative. Logically speaking, there's only one explanation for that. Perhaps the individual was not breathing at the time that the gasoline vapors were there. In addition to discovering that there was no gas found in Ashley's lungs, Dr. Bellis has another discovery that's telling. The alarm bells went off in my head. There was no soot in the airway, which indicated that she was dead before the fire started. The body is dead at the time of the fire.

The next question is, how did they die? In this instance, there were no anti-mortem injuries to indicate that she died from a crash from a car accident. There was no evidence of natural disease to indicate she died from natural causes and was dead before the fire because of something naturally killing her. At the front of the neck, you have a windpipe, you have a certain cartilages, and there were hemorrhagic fractures of those cartilages. So it indicated that she was alive at the time that there was pressure put on her neck. I attended the post-mortem autopsy. When we were done at the end of the day, the pathologist asked to start speak with me in a side room and she said to me, are you a homicide detective?

And I'm like, okay, this is going to be interesting. I said, yeah, I'm a homicide detective. And she's, well, based on all the information, I believe I have a homicide. Did the coroner have a theory as to what happened? Yeah, what was interesting is the whole aspect of the daughter saying that mom fell down the stairs. A student said that she was woken up to her parents fighting and then she proceeded to tell me that her mom had fallen down the stairs. I immediately jumped to the conclusion that that's how she broke her neck.

I actually said that to the pathologist, and the pathologist said, no, that's not how. She explained to me that there's two bones in the side of the neck that can be broken as a result of manual strangulation or legature strangulation. So you knew you've got a murder on your hands. 100% at that point. That was really a defining moment for me. It was, I mean, I can't even describe what. a loss that was.

And then finding out how, I mean, you know, you think that she passed in a car accident, and then you find out that it wasn't that, was gut-wrenching. And then it's her, just her presence. It's not an accident. This is a homicide. That changes our focus. What happened to make it a homicide? What are the circumstances?

That's what we have to figure out. Now, detectives have to re-examine everything through the lens of a homicide, including those pictures taken to the crash. This is a daytime view. You can see the tire tracks. The track marks go directly down the hill. There's no swerving. It's a direct line.

It's remarkable that this vehicle was able to precisely find itself between the guard whale and the rock face and go down the side of that mountain. They were able to plot the tires, the path of the vehicle. What they were able to determine eventually was the wheels were always moving, so no one hit the brakes, it wasn't skidding out of control. It was straight and into the embankment. That car just drove off the cliff. The key word there, it drove off the cliff.

It didn't just spin out of control off the cliff. And then rode down the culvert. From the get-go, detectives were trying to figure out why the car burst into flames in the first place. Yeah, there were those gas cans in the back. But don't forget, James says he had asked Ashley to get the gas for the snowblower. There was a lot of accelerant in that car. Oh, it was super hot, yes. And conveniently, the one window, the driver's side window, was down to add fuel to the fire.

Meaning... Oxygen. In order for the vehicle to sustain combustion, they would have had to have an oxygen source. So had the vehicle's windows been closed, there is a good chance that the fire would run out of oxygen. before the fire was able to take over the entire vehicle. There are gas tanks in the back of the car, but you also recover a lighter. When they sift through the debris in the car,

they come across the Zipo lighter. When it was cleaned off, it was telltale. It had his initials right on it. JWS, those are James Schwamm's initials. When you saw the monogram lighter, what was your reaction? Wow. Wow. Wow for sure. As Ippo stays lit, you can throw it to the fumes and the gasoline. Great explanation for how that fire got started with him being able to have some distance.

I know the lighter sounds like, wow, you know, this is like a hoop. This is a slam-down case. Well, it is his car, and it is his lighter. So his property in the car, that does not make it a slam dunk. You have an innocent explanation for why that would be there. That's right. And one of the text messages being sent back and forth talked about the gasoline. in the car. In Ashley's text message, she says, ooh, it stinks like gas, I got to drive with the window down. Not only that, James also has that alibi. When Ashley's car drove off the mountain,

he was on the other side of town walking the dog and offered video to prove it. Police have discovered how Ashley died, but they don't know why. And so they start looking into her life and into her marriage and they discover some secrets. One other touchy subject to deal with. We've been told that there were some marital issues. Do you know who she was involved with? The NBA is happening now on ABC and the ESPN app. And right now, this season is unpredictable.

We know this rookie class is special. This MVP race is tight and this crew is the best. So for Inside, Primetime, Showcase, finals and everywhere in between there's one place to call home the NBA on ESPN presented by state barn all season long on ESPN and ABC it's the paradise podcast I am your host ryan michel bathay with my husband sterling what's up join us here on hulu and hulu on disney plus where we'll discuss each episode with the cast and crew of paradise I'll be getting all the secrets from dan fulglement James marsden shayley

Queen Woodley, Julian Nicholson, and Sterling Calbee Brown. Oh, Paradise. The official podcast premieres February 16th and stream Paradise on February 23rd on Hulu and Hulu on Disney Plus for bundle subscribers. Terms apply. Police have discovered how Ashley died, but they don't know why. Police were trying to figure out from friends and family. What was the situation like between James and Ashley? Were they happy?

Were they loving? And there were rumblings in the family. that Ashley wasn't happy for years. Ashley's family members told me that she felt sad and lonely. After she and James and the kids moved to Collingwood full time, which is two hours away from her loved ones in Toronto. We were all in the city, my older sister and myself, that, yeah, I think she kind of felt a bit isolated, left out.

AJ didn't like it because she loved all their friends in Toronto. There was something off. I always felt about him. He was controlling in the sense. You know, he was very regimented. In what way? Just working out everything he ate. Everything is about me.

How I look, how everyone perceives me. Ashley's friends and family say she was unhappy in the marriage, and she began to find affection elsewhere. It happens when Ashley starts a new job. and she has a boss, a guy named Steve. And, you know, there's an attraction there. She's married, of course, but they spend a lot of time together. Steve is married too.

So it's not just Ashley. Steve is also cheating on his wife here. I asked her after and she said, Dad, I was just, I was unhappy with the marriage and it was a woman. And it was a weak moment. And now that I look at it, it was just so stupid. This past affair was something the police were already aware of,

even as they're interviewing James. We had some information, obviously, that there had been an affair, and the troubles that that had caused, so we were aware of that. One other touchy subject to deal with. Sure. Okay. You've been told that there were some marital issues. Do you know who she was involved with?

involved with okay her old boss okay and I understand that she she was open with you about this affair or she didn't tell you about it she got caught she got caught and I know my Steve's wife Ashley was having an affair with her boss and her boss's wife and said if you don't come clean to your husband I will I'm going to to spill the beans here on this affair if you don't. Ashley's loved ones say that ultimatum could not have come at a worse time. We celebrated our 40th birthdays in the Bahamas together. They were out in the boat two or three times and they're drinking and having a ball.

She probably had the most fun week of her life and she probably the next week had the worst week of her life. Because she got a horrible phone call. She got a phone call from a wife of a situation. It's while her husband is at the beach with their kids that Steve's wife calls Ashley with that demand. Tell James about the affair or else. And so Jamie comes with the kids. And A.J. told Jamie what had happened.

And he went bonkers. I've never seen anything like it. I'll never forget that. His rage. It was a very cold. old chilly week in NASA, Bahamas. James has a decision to make, you know, he's been cheated on. Is he going to say, that's it, this is the end, we're breaking up, we're getting divorced.

No, he says, let's try to make this work, let's try to patch things up, we'll go to therapy, we'll figure this out. What we heard really was that he could not get over the affair. And months and months later, as there's still working, working through it, he's telling people in social situations about what happened. Clearly he couldn't let it go. James's demeanor starts to shift. At work, he's a little more moody. He's sort of condescending to his juniors.

And the same is sort of true at the ski club. He seems to be like drinking a little bit more. I don't know if James and Ashley talked about divorce, but they were to be like, They were talking to their own families and friends separately and disclosing that they didn't see a future for this relationship. They were thinking about the end. I said, so, you know, what's going on?

I said, you just don't look happy. She said, it's tough. And I said, well, if it doesn't work, get a divorce and get on with it. Just get on with it. Did you think she should get on with it? 100%. Why? Because I think they needed time away from each other for Jamie to cool down.

He felt slighted. He felt embarrassed. And when you're a narcissist, there is nothing worse. A witness after witness said, James was all about James. He was always worried about his public perception, his persona, how he and his his reputation stood in the community. As James and Ashley are trying to figure things out, James is secretly beginning to text Alexandra,

Steve's ex-wife. And not just texting, but like texting, texting, texting. And they're starting to flirt with one another and talk about, you know, the aftermath of what happened to both of them. They've both been cheated on. They have something in common. He confessed some feelings for him. And does Alex reciprocate?

She had feelings, but she wanted him to sort out his situation. And he told her he had a plan to do what was going to make him happy. A friend would later quote Ashley saying, this year, I'm choosing me, my happiness, and the safety of my children. It's going to be the year of Ashley, and I can't wait. That conversation happened five days before her death. He Google searched alimony. You know, how much does it cost if you get separated from your wife?

For James, maybe he wasn't so thrilled by this because maybe it meant divorce. He was telling firefighters, she's going to take half my money. I'm never going to see my kids as much as I used to. I'm going to lose my lifestyle. He's going to be falling way down that property ladder. They have this magnificent home that both worked and paid into it. Now that's going to have to be sold. Ashley had a life insurance policy, and if she died, he would receive a million dollars

and an extra $250,000 for the kids, which would be under his control. A million dollars is a lot of money, and so police took that into account. One of the pieces of evidence that came out was that he was at a party one night, and James was talking to a doctor in town. He said, I have some information. I think he'd be interested in. He and James were both at a social event. And James came up to him and asked him,

is it possible that you can kill somebody by snapping their neck like in a Stephen Segal movie? He was trying to figure out, would he get caught? How can I pull this off with limited evidence being traced back to me? The best tool that police have in solving crimes is the cell phone of a person because that is a window into their mind. He sent her a series of texts imploring her to go get gas because he was out of gas for his snowblower. But you have video suggesting otherwise. I don't think it's suggesting. I think it's showing absolute otherwise.

James thinks of his phone as part of his alibi, as this text message evidence in these videos. but when the police eventually get it and they look through it, they realize it's actually very damning for him. After the collision and the death initially, he was completely cooperative with us. He told us where he was. He agreed to hand over his phone. He's got a pretty bad search history. He's searched, can a road flare completely burn?

He Google searched, can police see? what's on your phone after it's been deleted. And he found out that the answer is yes. James had cameras all over his home. He had dash cam video. So it was pretty easy for investigators to figure out where he was, when he was there, how long he was there for, and where he had been in the days and hours surrounding Ashley's death.

On the morning of January 25th, 2023, James finishes up one of his usual 24-hour firefighting shifts. At about 8 o'clock in the morning, he sent her a series of texts imploring her to go get gas because he was out of gas for his snowblower, and there was weather coming. And then in those text messages to Ashley, he said, I forgot to bring the gas can. Can you please go fill it up? But you have video suggesting otherwise? I don't think it's suggesting.

I think it's showing absolutely otherwise. Jeremy ended up finding dash camera video from his motor vehicle that he had of what I call a recky of him driving the route that he was going to take. So on the 25th, he takes his daughter to a riding lesson. The police say he drives out to the Alpine Ski Club parking lot just to sort of scope it out. And he's got his son in the car with him,

At first glance, the video seems innocent, James doing errands with his son in the back scene. But when the whole picture becomes clear, investigators realize that this is part of his elaborate plan to cover up a murder. Part of his planning was also that he needed a snowstorm. He needed a snowstorm to fit what he was doing. I think partly because you need to account for a car accident. And if you've got slippery roads and the visibility's poor, that speaks to it. Also, part of the planning is not as many vehicles are out on the roadway when you have a big snowstorm. Which brings us to the early morning of that fateful day, January 26th. You can see James taking his dog out for a walk on his security camera, just like he told the police. So don't forget, James was asked by the police to draw a map of the route that he walked his dog.

We thought, okay, let's find him walking the dog. That would be a great alibi for him. If he's out and about, whether we find people or a video of him, that would really say he's not out at the crash site. So we went in front of the house there, and we walked his route. So basically this dog walk was James' entire alibi. Yes, we came out here, and we walked the route that he gave us. You walked this walk?

We walked this walk. Jeremy had walked on the sidewalk and I'd walk on the road just to be able to account for his possible whereabouts. So at this point police start asking homeowners, hey, can we see your security footage? Can we see your doorbell footage? And so you knew that there'd be cameras on that route? There's cameras everywhere today. It's a typical thing that we do. Like that is 101 in policing us to do a canvas and talk to people and see if we can find video.

Corrobate the alibi. Correct. And so how many cameras picked you up? So we got picked up on, I think, about eight cameras. Oh man, that's a lot. The officers retraced James' steps. But what they found was where James said he had walked, he never appeared on any of those cameras.

Eight cameras that did not pick up, James. Correct. Nobody picked him up. He's a ghost. He didn't exist here. We referred to it the walk that wasn't. Also absent on the security camera, security camera is any video of James returning from the dog walk. What is seen on the camera is Ashley's Mitsubishi SUV pulling out of the driveway.

James was telling police that Ashley went on her hike and took their car. Making a right-hand turn and heading out to where? It was going the right direction. You can't see the driver. You can't see who's in the passenger. You can't see what's in the back. Which is perfect for him. What do you know to be happening in that video?

He went for the dog walk. I think he just walked up the road, disarmed his camera, walked back in, reactivated his camera, and then drove the vehicle out of the garage and turned right and then headed his way up to the mountain. With his wife's body. With his wife's body in the car. The video evidence is damning, to be sure, but cases tend to turn on first-person accounts from a witness. And now, investigators are about to hear a story from the Schwam's nine-year-old son. about the last time he saw his mother.

She asked for a phone from her son that night to call 911. Yeah. She knew she was in trouble then. 100%. It's a little bit snowy, but on the day it happened, there was a lot more snow on the ground. Most of our region is under a snowfall warning tonight as 15 to 20 centimeters of snow. A lot of media given people warning about this huge stormfront, and it came.

It's still quiet in the early morning hours of January 26th, but not at the Schwam House. So explain to me where he was coming from and where he was going to. We left his house. He took a couple of rural roads to get out into the town of the Blue Mountains. He went and parked the car in the Alpine Ski Club where he prepared the car in Ashley's body with the gasoline. That's what we believe. Yeah. That's when he did it. Because it was just a little. just around the corner from where the crash site is. And then he drove a couple hundred meters down to this site here. After driving into the ditch, he got out, she's on the passenger side,

and he lights the fire with that zippo. And then he starts running this way, and we have him on video, 300 meters up the road, running. That's when he becomes the running man. The running man. Well, we referred him as the running man. It's almost something you would see in a movie, to be honest with you. Detectives are now convinced that this shadowy figure wearing a backpack and running across the frame is James.

And in the background, you see that eerie glow. It's the car on fire with Ashley's body inside. It was a very large fire. So he knew how to build a hot fire. He's a firefighter. Given how destroyed the car is, this is a... pretty good testament to how well Zippos perform under pressure. It was metal, and the metal is what survived this crash.

So when it was cleaned up, it was a pointer in that direction. What is on the back of here, do you know? It looks like a number. Looks like his badge number from work. He's using his own lighter with his own badge number from the fire department that he worked for. This is quite a calling card. Throughout this entire time, maybe an hour,

James has left his kids entirely alone at home. The SUV that James drove into the ravine is now on fire, and home is 10 miles away, too far to get there on foot. That's why detectives say the day before, James had already come up with a plan that involved deceiving his own mother. He lied to his mother to facilitate the getaway vehicle. For him to get from the crash scene to home, he told her he needed to borrow that.

car because he was going on a big hike and he needed a ride home and he made arrangements to get that car later that day he borrows his mom's car he takes it to the ski club and he parks it at the parking lot there he makes sure that mom's car's pre-positioned for the next morning to take him back to Collingwood after he staged the crash in the fire James runs to the parking lot, he gets in his mom's car, starts it up and starts driving home. He doesn't park in his driveway because he knows that's going to invite some questions from the kids, why do we have Graham's car?

So he goes to the nearby school and parks it there and goes to the rest of the way home from there. How important was the video surveillance in helping you piece together this puzzle? It was crucial. It allowed us to track that car right back to the school. It allowed us to track him then leaving the school where he parked mom's car. Police also combed through James' social media, and they find a clue that's hiding in plain sight. We'd seen on social media that he had participated in a number of charity events,

and he would wear a bunker suit, which is the protective gear that firefighters wear. So you think he was wearing that as he drove himself off? the cliff. And we think he wore that so he didn't get burned or hurt when he's crashing the car or setting the fire. While those pieces of evidence are great, that pales in comparison to the evidence given by a witness on the scene of a murder. Let's go back to the night of the murder. The son also was an ear witness to something. He was and Ashley actually asked him to bring her a phone and he he did she wanted to call the police because they had been fighting he heard the commotion

and then moving down the stairs fortunately she was never was able to make that call the police that she said she wanted to do later in the morning he came down and james said that mom had gone for a walk with the dog but he actually he could he could see the dog in the back room his own father was lying he knew that he was he was being lied to. It's horrific. He exposed them to something absolutely terrible that would affect them for the rest of their lives. So all those messages that you were reading on Ashley's phone, who actually sent those texts? So they were messages that James sent using Ashley's phone. But he wanted you to see them because he was laying those breadcrumbs for you.

He needed us to see them. He needed Ashley to tell us. what happened because it's far more compelling than him telling us what happened. Detectives are convinced they have enough evidence to arrest James for Ashley's murder, but they're afraid that tipping him off might cause even more harm. We had a lot of concerns about the safety of the children. If it becomes knowing that we're looking into him, what could he do? From 30 for 30 podcasts. Brian Patta, senior defensive lineman from Miami, gun down. In this case, it's Brian.

Boy, he's bribing. An hour before he died, he was on the phone. Argonauts about this might be a hit. You want the truth. Biggest one of conviction. In place him to arrest. We had a killer amongst us. Murder at the U. Listen now.

ABC February 25th, in comedian Nate Bergettsey's new game show. To win, you don't need to know the right answer. Just what most Americans think is right. It's not about being the smartest. You just have to be the most average. We asked 100 average Americans. Keep an empty gas can in their car. No.

Have they ever broken a bone? No. I said a lot of no. That's all right. My wife says a lot of no as well. The greatest average American premieres Wednesday, February 25th, 9-8 Central on ABC, and stream next day on Hulu. This story is about a man who had everything in his life handed to him. The perfect marriage, the perfect family, the perfect career, a hero in the community, and he burned it all.

to the ground. There was real concern that James might be dangerous, especially with regard to the kids. Absolutely. Until we had the evidence, the grounds to arrest him, he's out there. He has access to the children. He's driving around with the kids. It was a big concern. We made the right decision to protect the children, and we didn't want to show our hand in that moment that we were actually looking at him for the possibility of murder.

We wanted everybody to believe we're still about. investigating this car crash. We knew he was out at driving with some family members. We had surveillance on him. And as he returned home, he was stopped and I arrested him. And what was his reaction? Jeremy. How can I help you? What do you need?

He was hoping, I think, that this would just somehow go away still. It took eight days for police to arrest James Schenberg. to arrest James Schwamm. He is charged with first degree murder. First degree murder in Canada is 25 years. You cannot apply for parole until 25 years into your sentence. And there's no guarantee that you're going to get out at 25 years. The case now makes its way directly to the Superior Court of Justice. The allegations against James Schwam have not been tested in court. How did it hit this community? I think it surprised and saddened an entire community.

It can happen in your backyard. People were shocked. They were devastated. A lot of people knew her, and they knew us because we'd been there for 40, 50 years. But here's the thing, in order for prosecutors to be able to put out the strongest case, they're going to have to call as witnesses, James, and Ashley's young son and daughter. Is that something you wanted to avoid?

It's not something we ever want. Sometimes it's unfortunately necessary. Were you worried about a drawn-out trial? If it was going to serve justice for my sister, I would have stayed on it for 20 years. Yeah. Why did you not want those kids to take the stand? Just their whole world in a one evening

was ripped away from them. No mom. no dad. And then having to go on the stand and stare at your dad who's killed your mom, like absolutely not. Two or three months later, James Schwamm is appearing from jail. I'm watching his court appearance. And I hear that he is going to be in the Superior Court of Justice pleading guilty to second-degree murder. I asked his lawyer, do you have any comment right now? She said, So my client did the right thing, and we're hoping that this gives the family some closure even. I had a chill run down my spine because at that moment I realized it's over.

He was guilty. Guilty as sin. There was an agreed statement of fact and he did agree that she was strangled. And they set her in the car on fire. He agreed that he dressed her in hiking clothing beforehand. This is a level of premeditation that, that really eliminates any idea that this was a crime of passion. 100%. In order to decide what James's sentence should be,

there was a hearing in the courthouses. And plenty of Ashley's family and friends showed up and submitted 21 victim impact statements. Talking about holes in their hearts and how this crime had just shattered their community. I just wanted people to know that she's not a victim. She was my sister, she was a mom, she was an aunt.

There were so many people that loved her and I just wanted that to be known. That courthouse was sad, that courthouse was somber and I'm sure for some of them it was a good feeling to be able to tell the courts and to tell the public just what they loved about Ashley, but I'm also sure for some of them it was just another painful experience. What was your statement to him? That you tried to get away with something and we're not stupid, we caught you. The judge ultimately sentenced James to life in prison.

He did not look at the crowd once. He gave a short statement. He said essentially, I'm sorry for him. for my terrible actions and I want to return to the man that I once was, but this is the fate that I deserve. Do you think he had remorse? Did he express it? It was in court. I didn't really hear it. If somebody's remorseful, there's, you really don't question that. You see it and hear it.

But you didn't see it? From my opinion, though, obviously he wasn't as smart as he thought he was. He made mistakes. And we had good police officers, good detectives that made decisions and were meticulous in collecting evidence to show that he did what he did. One bright spot in this story is that Ashley's family wanted to honor her by partnering with a domestic violence shelter, which helps so many women. It's called My Friend's House. Obviously, because of the circumstances, she never had a proper funeral that was public. that was public. It became clear quickly, we need to do a hike.

Ashley's celebration of life, they waited till a lot of the legal proceedings and things were done so that they could be on the other side of that to make it just about her, and it was beautiful. What do you want people to remember about Ashley? She had the kindest heart, and I hope everyone can get a sense of who she was.

Her smile, her love for life was unmatched. She was so incredible. No one could replace her. I mean, am I happy now that I know she's with my mom? Yeah. But she is terribly missed. And we should point out that with James Schwalm taking that plea for second-degree murder, a judge has ruled that despite his life sentence,

Schwalm would be eligible for parole after serving 20 years. David, meanwhile, Ashley's sister, Lindsay, has been working to raise funds in Ashley's name to prevent domestic violence. That's our program for tonight. Thanks so much for watching. I'm Deborah Roberts. And I'm David Muir from all of us here at ABC News in 2020. Good night. How old were you when you realized you were the son of a president?

I don't think anyone's ever asked me that before. NFX's love story, John F. Kennedy Jr. and Carolyn Beset. I didn't think I could love someone like this until you. From executive producer Ryan Murphy. It's not a question. of if I want to spend the rest of my life with you. It's if I'm cut out to be Mrs. JFK Jr. FX's love story, John F. Kennedy, Jr. and Carolyn Bissette.

Watch now on FX Hulu and Hulu-1 Disney Plus for bundle subscribers.