20/20 - Forever Young: Who Killed JonBenét Ramsey?

Episode Date: December 14, 2024

JonBenét Ramsey's father speaks to ABC News: what he thinks police can do right now to identify her killer. Can new technology solve this crime?  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

With Uber Reserve, you can book your Uber ride in advance. 90 days in advance. Perfect for all you forward thinkers and planning gurus. Reserve your Uber ride up to 90 days in advance. Uber Reserve, see Uber app for details. Tonight is a breakthrough on the horizon and one of the country's most high profile unsolved mysteries.

John Benet Ramsey, the name we all know, the case that shook America that Christmas nearly 30 years ago could there finally be a major turn in the case 2020 begins right now. I just can't say no no. John Benet Ramsey the story you can't forget. The case you think you know. With all that attention, all that scrutiny, why hasn't this crime been solved? One simple reason, the police have refused help.

It was offered and it could have helped. But now is the new documentary series changing the picture. Go back to the damn drawing board. So early on, they locked into this crazy idea that the parents were responsible. They get tunnel vision. New DNA technology is a solution closer than ever. We think the crime can be solved. Inspiring John tonight. The new John Ramsey interview. You do all under wash your loss, and you just can't do that. And what you've never seen before, from the iconic Barbara Walters sit down.

This was a monster that killed our daughter. And the police think that it's you. Now the detective who defied the police. They knew at the time that there was DNA and that it was not from Ramsey's DNA. And he just said, I have a name, I want you to write it down. And I did. And he said, that's where you start.

All but one person on that list is innocent. Then you got your killer. She was a beautiful child of God. We knew she was special. We knew she was going to make a difference. We certainly didn't expect it to be this way. And yet, here's a child who is known literally around the world. So she did become special. And Jambanay Ramsey. He enjoys painting the rabbit.

She is the special little girl forever six years old. While Jambanay Ramsey remains frozen in time, her father has endured nearly three decades without justice, without answers, and without his daughter. I sat down for a new interview with the now 81-year-old John Ramsey. Hello sir, Byron Fitz, Byron John. I had John Benet bless my life for six years and she really was a blessing. Just an amazing little kid. She was daddy's girl. She was daddy's girl, big time.

Do you allow yourself to think what if this hadn't happened? I don't. I did run into one of her little friends on the street who was now 30 and an adult and that was a little bit of a jolt. I think, wow, that could have been John Benet. She's still my little girl. That's the picture I have in my head when I think of her. Ramsey has renewed hope that his daughter's killer can finally be found,

confident that advances in DNA technology are the key to solving the mystery. There's been a number of old, old cold cases solved using this genealogy research. There was no more important story in the country than the disappearance and the death of your daughter. Police is still not named a suspect. It's now been 12 days since Jean-Bernard Ramsey was murdered. Officers have spent more than 3,000 hours processing evidence and interviewing more than 90 people. With all that attention, all that scrutiny, why hasn't this crime been solved? One simple reason, the police have refused help that was offered.

They had no experience. They didn't have a homicide department. That police response and its aftermath is the focus of a new Netflix docuseries, Cole Case, who killed John Benet Ramsey? Someone killed this 6-year-old child. You have a small town police force that gets a crime that they're not used to. Is it fair to question the Boulder Police Department's experience ability to investigate a homicide?

I don't think so. Just because you have one homicide in a year, I think is actually a sign of remarkable strength in our community. This was the first murder in Boulder that year and it was December 26th. So they don't have a lot of murders, particularly where a little girl is tortured to death. John Ramsey worked with award-winning documentarian Joe Berlinger, who says he wanted to shed new light on what he calls one of the most brutalized families in American history.

Obviously, he wasn't legally wrongfully convicted, but he was wrongfully convicted, and his wife, Patsy, the family were wrongfully convicted in the court of public opinion. You still feel like it's a cloud over your family name? Yeah. Because there are still people in the country who still believe that your wife was responsible.

Oh, sure. Absolutely. No doubt. And we can have the killer confessed, arrested, in prison, and there'd still be 5 to 10 percent of the population that go, yeah, yeah, I was the father or yeah, I was the mother. The hit docuseries has sparked a new generation of interest on social media. Okay, one of my girlfriends and I have a new JonBenet theory, and I want to float it. I want to float it. I just finished the John Benet-Ramsey new documentary on Netflix, and holy f***.

I need to know what happened to John Benet-Ramsey. With the wave of renewed scrutiny, the Boulder Police Department issued a video statement last month. So much of how law enforcement works has changed in the last 30 years. There are a number of things that people have pointed to throughout the years that could have been done better, and we acknowledge that is true.

However, it is important to emphasize that while we cannot go back to that horrible day in 1996, our goal is to find John Benet Ramsey's killer. That horrible day in 1996 began at Christmas time in the Storybook neighborhood where the Ramsey family lived in Boulder, Colorado. There's a saying here in Colorado that Boulder is 30 square miles of fantasy surrounded by reality. It's very wealthy.

It's well wealthy, it's well-to-do. John and Patsy Ramsey lived in a 6,700 square feet Tudor there on 15th Street. John Ramsey was the CEO of a computer services company. He'd suffered tragedy before when his 22-year-old daughter Beth died in a car accident. In 1980, he married his new wife, Patsy. By all accounts they were a happy couple. Patsy was a high society woman. I'm a daughter, I'm a sister, I'm a friend, I'm a wife and a mother. John used to just tell people that I invested in futures, the futures of my children. That's how I usually answer my occupation.

John and Patsy Ramsey had two children together. Their first born was Burke, nine years old, and John Benet, six and a half, in kindergarten. My name is John Andrew Ramsey, John Benet's half brother. John Benet was just an energetic and fun kid. Patsy Ramsey was a former beauty queen, Miss West Virginia. By the time Jambonet was four years old,

she was in the pageant system herself. -♪ I wanna be a cowboy sweetheart. I really believe that if we hadn't seen the beauty pageant photos of JonBenet Ramsey, it might have just gone into the ether as another child murder. This one captivated us because we saw the beauty pageant pictures. Hello, I'm Patsy Ramsey. This is Jean-Béné. She's four, Burke is seven. Christmas was Patsy's favorite time and she really went all out.

She had a Christmas tree for every room and every tree had a theme. The windows were done with garland, the staircases had garland, there were red ribbons everywhere. And from all of us at our house to everyone at your house, Merry Christmas and the happiest of New Years. There was plenty to celebrate that Christmas of 1996. Paxie had been battling ovarian cancer and was finally in remission. On Christmas morning, the family opened presents in their home. They were going to a friend's house for dinner that night. We were going to leave early the next morning for a trip to our summer cottage in Michigan.

So we came home, set the alarm, and went to sleep. This is your first extended interview. In 2000, Barbara Walters spoke to the couple about that terrible day. You get up, you're dressed, what happens? I went down our steps from our bedroom to the second floor. Then I started walking down the spiral staircase. And as I came to the bottom of the stairs,

there were three pages neatly laid across one of the runs of the stairway. She picked up the note, and she started to read it. I just remember when I read, we have your daughter. It just, this overwhelming fear. And then? Then I just screamed for John, screamed. Take me back to that day.

I was shaving or getting dressed and I heard Patsy scream and we called the police immediately. We were kidnapped. Please, please. Explain to me what's going on. What's your name? Are you happy? I'm the mother. Oh, my God.

911 emergency. I was the call taker that night shift when the call came in. 911 emergency. I was the call taker that night shift when the call came in. What's going on? What's going on there ma'am? We have a kidnap. Alright please. Explain to me what's going on, okay?

There's a note left in our garbage bin. There's a ransom note here. It's a ransom note? Oh my god. Please. There's a note left in our coffee store. There's a ransom note here. It's a ransom note? Oh my God! Please. She's hysterical.

She says there's a kidnapping. Please. OK, I'm sending you an officer over, OK? Please. Do you know how long she's been gone? No, I don't. Please, we just got out and she went here. Oh my God, please.

The note said, if you do anything, if police come, if FBI come, your daughter will die. You called 911. Yes, we did. I had to do something. I had to take action. And I mean, all this happened in a matter of moments. Patsy Ramsey called 911 at 5 52 AM.

And the first officer from the Boulder Police Department arrives three minutes later at 552 a.m. and the first officer from the Boulder Police Department arrives three minutes later at 555 We called friends for help at that point your daughter is gone. She's in the hands of a madman My phone rang Pam. They've got her What do you mean? They've got her they've kidnapped John Benet. She's gone What was the atmosphere like as you sat and waited They've got her. They've kidnapped John Benet. She's gone. What was the atmosphere like as you sat and waited? Well, it was awful. First of all, we didn't know whether the kidnapper

was gonna call that day because the note said, I will call you tomorrow. Get plenty of rest. I was deathly afraid that tomorrow was in fact the 27th. You lose all perception of time, of place. You've just been dealt a horrible crushing blow. At six o'clock on the morning of December 26, the police came in and did a cursory search of the residents. It was a lavish home with about 18 rooms. The police did a terrible, terrible job securing that scene.

And if you don't secure the scene, you don't get good evidence. The mistakes they made were outrageous. They were mystifying. They were mistake after mistake after mistake. People were streaming through that house. They were in the kitchen. They were in the living room. There were some friends of Patsy's that were helping her wipe up the kitchen. There could have been fingerprints there.

You had friends that were windexing the sink and washing dishes. People were making toast in the kitchen. And yes, a kidnapping is a crime scene, but we were so focused on getting Jomine back. That was the task. What we have learned is that everyone should have been sequestered into an area so that people weren't roaming around the house. And that was a mistake on my part. The reason I didn't is because these people were the Ramsey's support system. There was no information at all to indicate the family was involved at that point. It was a crime scene and it was getting contaminated.

The note was being passed around and reviewed by all of their friends. Of all of the evidence left behind, that ransom note is the most baffling. Number one, it is too damn long. A ransom note is not that long. A ransom note says, I have your child, I want a million dollars, I'll call you later. The note was three pages and written in longhand. That ransom note was the warren piece of ransom notes. It begins, Mr. Ramsey, listen carefully. You will withdraw $118,000 from your account.

$100,000 will be in $100 bills, and the remaining $18,000 from your account. $100,000 will be in $100 bills, and the remaining $18,000 in $20 bills. You think about this number and how is it relevant? And it's relevant because John Ramsay got a bonus from his company for $118,000. How many people knew that? I'm gonna guess not a lot of people. This footage of Barbara Walters interview with the Ramses in

2000 has never aired until now. The ransom note asked for an odd figure $118,000 that was a bonus that you had received well that was one of the theories that I came up with that it was close to It was one of the theories that I came up with that it was close to the net amount I'd received that year as a bonus. 118 means something to the killer. We know that. We believe that.

Whether it's tied to my bonus or something, only the killer knows. We don't know. Did you know that your husband got this kind of a bonus? Not at the time, no. Lou Smith, a detective who would later be brought into the case to re-examine the evidence, noticed something else unusual about the ransom note. Some of the phrases appear to mimic lines in movies about kidnappings. Lou Smith recorded his observations about the case. John? The movie Ransom was playing in Boulder.

I have your son. Oh Jesus! I want two million dollars. Oh God! In that particular movie, a fat cat industrialist, his son was kidnapped. There's a lot of the same verbiage in this note as was in even the note that was written in that particular movie. If we catch you talking to a stray dog, she dies.

A kidnapper says a similar line to Clint Eastwood in the movie Dirty Harry. If you talk to anyone, I don't care if it's a pecanese pissing against a lamppost, the girl dies. You and your family are under constant scrutiny as well as the authorities. Don't try to grow a brain, John. That's a line used by a terrorist in the movie Speed. The ransom note was a vital piece of evidence. Police need to figure out who wrote it and when. On the morning of December 26th, the minutes ticked by as the Ramses waited to hear from the kidnapper.

It was awful. The kidnappers had written that they would telephone you by 10 a.m. All I prayed for was that they would telephone you by 10 a.m. All I prayed for was that he would call. But it would be a call between 8 and 10 a.m. The police had prepped me on how to respond in a phone call and it's very important to hear Jomenai's voice.

Police officers were leaving between 930 and 945 before that time period of the phone call had even expired. One lone detective was left on the scene. Detective Linda Arndt is left behind in the house with John and Patsy Ramsey. Arndt didn't have extensive homicide experience, managing a kidnapping, and what was about to unfold, this was likely pretty overwhelming for one long police officer. I was praying. Linda Arndt had said to me, we're

hopeful that the kidnappers will just drop Jean-Bené off someplace. And I kept looking out the window, clutching this cross, and just imagining that she was going to come running down the street. They're waiting for a telephone call from the kidnapper. What's going to happen next? My former ABC News colleague, Elizabeth Vargas, did one of the first extensive interviews with Detective Linda Art.

Ten o'clock comes and goes, and there's no acknowledgement that the deadline imposed by the author of the ransom note has come and gone. Nobody said it's ten o'clock, and the kidnappers haven't called? Nobody said that. According to Arndt, neither John nor Patsy Ramsey seemed to market or freak out about it.

She says later she found it curious that John Ramsey checked his mail in the kitchen in the middle of the crisis. How are you supposed to act, William? Oh, I don't know for sure, but I really thought I could get John Mone back if I kept my wits about me. You know, there was a pile of envelopes

that had come through our front door slot. I was looking for another communication for the kidnapper. She should have been doing that. Linda Arndt tells the restless John, why don't you look around the house, see if anything is missing or looks strange. Check the house, top to bottom, look for anything that might belong to Jean-Bernier that is in place where it shouldn't be. Were you at that point giving him perhaps a little bit of distraction, busy work? I wanted to lessen his anxiety by giving him

a job to do, a task, a meaningless task. John took a friend with him. They went to the basement. And John opened the door. and John opened the door. You opened the door to the small room. I knew instantly, instantly what I'd found. I'd found my daughter. She was lying on a white blanket.

The blanket was wrapped around her. Her hands were tied above her head. She had tape over her mouth. I immediately knelt down over her, felt her cheek, took the tape off immediately off her mouth. I tried to untie the cord that was around her arms. I couldn't get the knot untied. Picked her up, and I ran upstairs and laid her on the floor

and still had a hope that she was alive. And I see John Ramsey carrying John Bonet up the last three steps from the basement. She looked like she was sleeping. She had some marks on her face and on her neck. I knelt next to her, and I leaned down to her face. And John leaned down opposite. And he asked if she was dead. And I said, yes, she's dead.

And as we looked at each other, I remember, and I wore a shoulder holster, tucking my gun right next to me and consciously counting up, I've got 18 bullets. Why did you do that? Because I didn't know if we'd all be alive when people showed up. She clearly felt in danger at that moment. She made it clear that she thought John Ramsey killed his daughter and that he might kill her.

Linda Arnt's ability to look in someone's eyes and determine they were a killer John Ramsey killed his daughter and that he might kill her. Linda Arndt's ability to look in someone's eyes and determine they were a killer is a remarkable talent. We reached out to Detective Arndt to ask her about her reaction back then, but she did not respond. Ramsey has long been upset with her. She said, yeah, I saw it in John's eyes. I knew he was guilty. That was the detective that was there that morning. How is it that you have all these cops searching a home, and nobody finds the body, but you asked John Ramsey

to go look for things out of the ordinary, and he finds his daughter in a room that had never been opened by anybody in law enforcement. That's crazy. He lays her on the living room floor where just a few minutes before, friends and neighbors had been walking and bringing in fibers and whatever to contaminate the scene.

And then the coup de grace, he grabs a blanket, which is full of who knows what kind of contaminants and throws it over the body. Patsy was being kept out of the room, and I didn't want Patsy to see JonBenet laying there like that. I remember walking in and seeing her lying there in front of the Christmas tree. I knelt down over her and just laid my body on her body and my cheek against her cheek.

And it was cold. And Father Ra was there. And he started saying the last rites, I believe. And I just kept saying, no, no, you know, ask God to raise her. So the kidnapping of Jambonet Ramsey has turned into the murder of Jambonet. Jambonet Ramsey was violated and murdered in a horrific way. Many injuries to this little girl's body.

The x-ray of her skull shows a massive fracture. This is an eight inch skull fracture. So we're talking a major blunt force. This is just a massive blow. But the ultimate cause of her death was strangulation with something called a garotte. It's a device of a string, and it's wrapped around what ends up being a piece of a paintbrush.

And what happens is, as John Benet is losing consciousness, she's leaning forward. And so this gets tighter and tighter and you can see how it cuts into my hand. You can see exactly why it cut into her neck. And that ultimately, according to the ME, is what killed her. If you look at the autopsy report, John Benet died while being tortured. She was alive while she was being tortured. There were signs that John Benet had also been sexually abused. The broken pieces of paintbrush that were used for the garrote were also used to sexually assault her. There were four people in that house, and one died overnight.

From the very beginning, they suspected the parents. Within minutes, a Jamedeh's body being found, this was who they were going to go after, and that's what they did. The police are thinking, we gotta talk to those parents and we gotta talk to them right now before they start getting their story straight together. 70,000 people are here

and Bob Dylan is the reason for it. Inspired by the true story. If anyone is gonna hold your attention on stage, you have to kinda be a freak. Are you a freak? Hope so. And starring Timothy Chalamet as Bob Dylan. He defied everyone.

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To all the planners, now you can reserve your Uber ride up to 90 days in advance. See Uber app for details. When John Benet's body was brought out past the candy canes decorating the front of the house, there were only a couple of reporters outside to capture that. And then the media frenzy started. Jean-Bernie Ramsey, the little girl in Colorado, was murdered. Beauty queen Jean-Bernie.

Jean-Bernie's murder has frightened residents of Boulder. News outlets from around the world had descended upon Boulder and were just hiding in trees and bushes and digging through our trash, following me around town. I mean, it was war. The Jomany Ramsey case was completely out of control. You also have to remember the O.J. Simpson case

had wrapped up. The 24-hour news cycle, their content had dried up. And so along came the Ramsey family, and we fit right into that slot. Joan Benet Ramsey was a precocious six-year-old strangled to death in the basement of her own home. You have the shock, this incredibly horrendous crime. And then you have these videos that surface

of this beautiful young girl. Joan Benet Ramsey! And then you have these videos that surface of this beautiful young girl. Johnson and Ramsey! There's one here in Greenland. Dancing in her costumes and those were the first viral videos. She might become a domestic ice skater. People who didn't really grow up in the South and understand that industry, the industry of beauty pageants, thought it was the most horrible exploitation

of a child they'd ever seen. So when those images started playing across the television, people started thinking, what's wrong with that family? For many, this was their first glimpse into the world of child pageants, long before shows like Toddlers and Tiers. ...number 65, Alana. But John Ramsey tells me it was something that would bring joy to John Benet and his wife, Patsy.

The pageants, the forwarders came out and that made it more juicy. Yeah, yeah. And that was just something that Patsy and John Benet had fun with. John Benet never participated in a, what I would call a beauty contest. She participated in a talent show. She would sing and dance. She would sing, she would dance.

I wanna be a cowboy sweetheart. I wanna learn to row a fancy ride. These were such a small, small, miniscule part of what Jean Monnet was all about. I think it's just because the photographs were so available and so beautiful that it took on a life of its own. It's part of what turned it into an international circus. This little girl's image was everywhere overnight. The biggest negative factor about John and Patsy Ramsey was that they had allowed their

daughter to be in child beauty pageant contests and people did not like them. But to think they would murder their own daughter was unimaginable. Yet police found evidence that in their, pointed towards the Ramses. When you start with children of this age, when they die, tend to die at the hands of their parents. So the focus is naturally going to be on the parents to begin with. Now, in the house, the ransom note is written on a pad that belongs to Patsy. This is the notepad. This location right here is where the note was physically found by Patsy.

The pin that was used was in the house. The garrote that was used in Jaminet's murder also got the attention of investigators because of what it was made of. It basically is an artist's paintbrush that's broken. And what's important is that it actually came from Patsy's art supply. And there were even fibers on the backside of the duct tape that had been on Jambonet's mouth

from Patsy's clothing. And that was important, but Patsy lived in the house, so those could have been there anyway. The police started thinking, well, maybe this is just a cover-up, that the Ramses harmed their child some way, then panicked and tried to create basically a kidnapping scenario. Patsy and John should have been taken to the police station immediately for separate interviews, for examination of their body, for defensive wounds, for collection of their clothing. That never happened.

At this point they haven't interviewed the mother or father. Not surprisingly, they're still very grief-stricken. They've not been in any kind of condition to be interviewed. My father, myself, we all marched into that police station, we gave blood, we gave hair, we gave fingerprints. The thing that really stuck with me is two detectives hand me their business cards and one says narcotics officer and the other says auto theft.

And I bury my head into my hands because I knew at that point we were in a bad spot. Though the police had spoken to John Ramsey after Jean Benet's body was found, what they really wanted to do was formally interrogate the couple. The police are thinking, we've got to talk to those parents and we've got to talk to them right now before they start getting their story straight together. Your lawyers advised you then not to submit to police questions.

Why not? People say, wouldn't you have not to submit to police questions. Why not, people say? Wouldn't you have wanted to tell them everything? Well, I don't recall that our lawyers told us that at the time. We said, you know, yeah, we want to keep working with you, but can't you come here? We can't go out. Patsy was in bed. Patsy was barely able to move. We were perfectly willing and anxious to work with the police to find the killer.

We had a higher priority at that point, and that was to bury our daughter. The family is flying the body back to Atlanta for burial. On New Year's Eve, Jean Benet was laid to rest just outside Atlanta, Georgia. This service is in loving memory of John Benet, Patricia Ramsey. We flew back to Atlanta to bury Jean Benet. Atlanta being our home, Atlanta being where my oldest sister, Beth, is buried. We give thanks today for John Benet, for the love that she had for her parents. I want to go back to the funeral. Whatever we do, we're gonna go through it together.

We may not get far, but sure as the star, wherever we are, it's together. Wherever we are, it's together. Wherever we are, it's together. We sang that. She and I sang that together. We'd sing it driving in the car. We just knew that we would always be together in everything. I wanted my children to know that I was with them through thick and thin, regardless of what happened in life.

Unconditional love. Look at that! You can go places now. Everybody wanted to see these parents. Everybody wanted to talk to these parents, especially the police. When you realized that you too were the prime suspects, what did you think?

The Boulder Police did not interrogate the Ramses, but they remained the main suspects. Many people found the Ramses' behavior peculiar and suspicious, and from that, many presumed they must be guilty. When you realized that you too were the prime suspects, what did you think? What did you feel? What did you say? Well, we were outraged. We were shocked. How could they think that? We were a normal family. I just didn't believe it. You just can't believe it. I mean, you were suffering from having lost

our child. And then for someone to accuse you, it's just, you can't believe that would happen. Then six days after the murder, they go on CNN and say they didn't do it. on CNN and say they didn't do it. If anyone knows anything, please, please help us. We've sensed from our friends that this tragedy has touched not just ourselves and our friends, but many people. As a mother, my heart went out to this couple. If I were a resident of Boulder, I would tell my friends to keep your babies close to you. There's someone out there.

Some people thought it was odd they were talking to the public rather than to the police. You did an interview on CNN. Why did you do that? We did it reluctantly and at the insistence of some friends who could see that we were being painted as guilty. Unfortunately, at that time, we were so, when we looked back at it,

we were so distraught and medicated. It was probably not giving the impression that he had hoped we would achieve. Police end their 10-day search of the Ramsey house and remove the crime scene tape. It is unknown if the family intends to resume residency at the home. We have no comment on the whereabouts of the family at this time. Starting from the beginning of this case, we, the media, blacked up what the Boulder

Police Department wanted to tell us about what they were doing in the Jambonet Ramsey case. For the most part, the police didn't say much. They didn't leak a lot of information. But when they did, it was major. They thought the mother did it. Some people who believe Patsy killed her daughter believe it was over bedwetting and then staged it to look like an intruder.

The bedwetting theory was a big theory at the time. I'm a cancer survivor of stage four cancer. When you are standing on the brink of death with a terminal illness, your priorities suddenly line up. Bedwetting is totally insignificant. I love my children. I wouldn't harm them for anything in the world. But many Americans were riveted by the possibility that the Ramses might have done this. Some of the authorities have said that you staged this, that you loosely tied your daughter's

hands, that you put the noose, the garrote, to make it look as if some terrible person had done this. That this whole picture was staged. Well, that's absurd. This was done by a terrible person. The garrote was deeply embedded in Jaminet's throat. Her hands were tightly bound. I couldn't get the knot untied. I tried to get it untied even before I brought her upstairs.

I had to say that we accidentally murdered our daughter and then staged this. It was nonsense. If we had staged it, why would we have disturbed it? Mr. and Mrs. Ramsey, did either of you have anything to do with the death of your daughter? No. No.

Mr. Ramsey, did you kill John Bonet? No, I did not. Mrs. Ramsey, did you kill your daughter? No, I did not kill my daughter. How do you feel when I ask you these questions? How do you feel when I ask you these questions? Insulted, pain, hurtful. How can I tell you how much I love my daughter? I love her from the depths of my being. It's just unimaginable.

There was a Gallup poll at the time that said something like 70% of the American public thought that you or your wife were guilty. I remember reading that. And it's like, well, I get it. That's what you were told over and over again. There's so many puzzle pieces here that just don't fit. Do you really think your daughter's murderer will be found? Yes, I do. Because the killer has never been pursued.

An objective-wide investigation hasn't taken place. The parents have been focused on it. That's all that's been done. I think it's solvable. I really believe it's solvable, given today's technology. There are a lot of people in this country who hope that crime is solved in your lifetime. The suspect might be out there and be someone

who is completely unknown, who has never been on anyone's radar. What we know is that just within a few mile radius of the Ramsey's home, there was approximately 38 to 40 sex offenders in that area. And the question is, have they all been completely vetted? And decades later, granddaughters of one of the investigators join the search for the killer.

There's a lot more evidence to cover and more myths to debunk. I do want to get the truth out there. Was it an accident? Was it intentional? Premeditated? I want to say something to the person or persons that took this baby from us. The list of suspects narrows. Soon there will be no one on the list but you. But you.

Our killer is John Van Aden. How many victims does he have in the past? And how many victims is he going to have in the future? Tonight, the new focused on one of the most haunting unsolved cases of the last 30 years. Will the spotlight push the police for further DNA testing? I just need some specifics from the police. Are you doing this? Are you doing this? Now new interviews.

They targeted you, John. They wanted to hurt you. And they did that by killing your daughter What you've never heard before from Patsy Ramsey the police were more concerned with feeding The frenzy of media sharks every day and in finding the killer of our daughter The detective who left the police to pursue his own investigation. Lou dedicated a big part of his life to finding Jomaday's murderer. Detective Lou Smith was like, whoa.

He just said, I have a name. I want you to write it down. Here's the answer in the list he left behind. Our grandfather was a detective on one of the biggest unsolved murders in our generation. Do you think if they'd taken to help offer, 28 years ago, this case would have been solved? Oh, yeah. I have no doubt.

It's a good opportunity to really find out who did this. I am so dreading groceries this week. Why? You can skip it. Oh what, just like that? Just like that. How about dinner with my third cousin? Skip it. Prince Fluffy's favorite treats?

Skippable. Midnight snacks? Skip. My neighbor's nightly saxophone practices? Er, nope. You're on your own there. Could've skipped it. Should've skipped it.

Skip to the good part and get groceries, meals, and more delivered right to your door on skip. Sure, I could tell you winter's coming or that it brings cold, dry air, but you already knew that. or on skip. Plus it's paraben and sulfate free. No matter how dry your skin feels, Dove has you covered. Buy Dove Body Wash today at your local retailer or visit Dove.ca to learn more and order online. ["Johne Meneh Rampsey"] Johne Meneh Rampsey. ["Johne Meneh Rampsey"] Johne Meneh was an entertainer.

She would entertain at the drop of a hat. She loved to sing and dance and perform. It was a natural form. I competed with Jean-Bernet. She had all these wonderful costumes and outfits and she had this presence. It wasn't really a competition for her. It was more of like, this is fun, like let's go on stage and do that. My name is Jean-Bernay Ramsey and I'm five and a half. What is your favorite animal at the zoo? The monkeys because they laugh and stuff and hang around.

Today Jean-Bernay Ramsey would have been 34 years old. I was her age. She would be my age now. She would be pursuing her own career. She never got to grow up. She is frozen in time now. Well, the police were convinced pretty early on that Patsy and or John were involved. And you had a district attorney's office that was saying, not so fast. And that created enormous tension between the two.

Did you hear anything yesterday? I think there are some new developments. Alex Hunter, the district attorney, wanted someone to come in with fresh eyes in this case and look at it from the perspective of a defense attorney. Who might have killed John Bonet as an intruder, not just the parents, but from the outside? Boulder DA Alex Hunter brought Lou Smith out of retirement to help solve the Ramsey case. One of the great challenges is to try to do the case right. And, you know, I think we're making efforts to meet that challenge by involving people like Lou Smith.

My name is Lou Smith. I'm a retired homicide detective from the Colorado Springs Police Department. Legendary guy. And he said, I follow the evidence. I've got to follow the evidence. Doesn't matter what my opinion is, what I might think, I follow the evidence and he did and that takes a lot of discipline. Smith had a history of closing cases. He had such tenacity. He was a bulldog. Once he got something in his mind, you know, once he got the reins in his teeth, he was not letting go. Lou Smith was my father. He was just known as, you know, the detective that solved cases.

When he got to a murder scene, he spent time dictating everything he saw. Where the sun was in the sky, what the weather conditions were like, what the neighboring houses looked like. The legend of Lou Smith is now in the stuff of podcasts with granddaughters, Jessa and Lexi, unspooling the crime for a new generation. He advocated for the victim and stood in their shoes. So that's why we've chosen the victim's shoes as our podcast name. Prior to this case, Lou Smith had investigated over 200 homicide cases that led to arrests and convictions. Lou dedicated a big part of his life to finding Jomine's murderer. When he started his investigation, he felt like everybody else did, that it was probably one of the two parents.

It seemed as though the parents were probably involved in it. I thought this would be a fairly easy case. I thought it would be a slam dunk. And I even remember talking to my daughter, I kind of joked with her saying that, you know, if somebody did get in the house, it must have been Santa Claus coming down the chimney. It was within a couple of days after my dad started on the investigation

when he had a chance to review pictures, the evidence, that he was already saying, I think that they need to look the other way. He was already noting in his journal that he felt that they needed to look at an intruder. Lou came up with the intruder theory. You can't think about that theory without associating it with Lou Smith. The first thing that stood out to him was an open window in the basement. There was a suitcase propped up against it. He didn't buy the Boulder Police Department's conclusion that no one could get in that basement window.

He began to say maybe somebody did get into that house. And I'll show you how easily it can be done. So what did Lou Smith do? He went and climbed in the window himself with a camera rolling to prove that it could be done. It really wasn't that difficult coming in that window. But as Smith's own theory compromised with the very crime scene photos he himself has studied. There are cobwebs in the window which could support that no one did go through this window. The big question is could you have gotten through this window. The big question is, could you have gotten

through this window, this small window, without disturbing this cobweb? I think the answer to that is maybe. But the other important point is, how soon was this picture taken after Jean Benet was killed? Because spiders can replicate webs very fast. Also found in the basement by Jean Benet's body, because spiders can replicate webs very fast.

Also found in the basement by Jean Benet's body, a shoe print, a high-tech brand that did not match any of the shoes in the Ramsey's house. The investigators believe, and maybe rightly so, that that's the bad guy's footprint. The counterargument is that footprint image could have been inadvertently left by police officers at the scene But a more disturbing image in Lou Smith's investigation comes from two marks left on Chambonet's face and back the marks themselves

Both on the back and on the face were the same distance apart Suddenly a little light went on and it was just, wait a minute, it was a stun gun. Smith looked at other murders where a stun gun was known to have been used. He examined photos of a crime victim who had a known stun gun wound. And the marks are very similar to the face of John Bonet. He also looked into an experiment performed

using stun guns on pigs. These marks were also the same as the marks found on Jambonet. When we did the pigs, we get perfect marks, just almost like on the back of Jambonet. This brings back our grandpa's whole motto that things are usually what they seem. Don't make it complicated. To make things less complicated,

Smith transferred all his knowledge and thoughts about the case to VHS tape, leaving behind a six hour video presentation of his intruder theory. There's no reason at all for the Ramseys to use a stun gun. And the Ramseys don't have a stun gun. If it's not a stun gun, what is it?

That's the question I was asked. You tell me what to do. Lou Smith stood up and said, wait a second, we need to look at this again. It actually is possible. It actually is plausible. And in his mind, it's actually the most likely scenario. But there have been challenges from the beginning

of this case. There were published reports that the Boulder Police Department refused to accept assistance from outside law enforcement. Denver police called to offer two experienced homicide detectives to come work at Boulder under their direction full-time. They turned it down.

Do you think if they'd taken to help offer, 28 years ago, this case would have been solved by now? Oh, yeah. I have no doubt. I've been told by experienced homicide detectives over the years, you know, this is not a hard case to solve But they needed to be on it immediately Lou Smith thought that the Ramses were being targeted unfairly. Thought there was something drastically wrong. I had seen evidence of an intruder

One thing the police and the district attorney do agree on both want the Ramses to come in for a formal videotaped interrogation. And when that day finally comes, it gets heated. Go back to the damn drawing board. I didn't do it. Within a few weeks of JonBenet's murder, police had an important clue. The discovery of foreign DNA found underneath her fingernails and in her underwear. DNA that does not match the Ramsey family and it shows a foreign male presence. They sat on that for months. They knew at the time that there was DNA in her panties. That it was mixed for DNA and that it was not the Ramsey's DNA.

Not Patsy's, not Jonathan's, not Brooks'. Detective Lou Smith was like, whoa, while you're pouring water all over the intruder theory, you're not revealing that you have unidentified DNA and it doesn't match anybody in the Ramsey family. Lou is just incensed that the focus is still being, well, it could be Patsy, maybe we need to get her to confess.

The police had eventually interviewed the couple four months after Jean-Béné's death. But now authorities want the Ramses to come in again for videotaped interrogation. There were months and months of negotiations, things about whether they could be videotaped, what are the questions going to be? Should the Boulder Police be a part of it? Because the Ramses said, we

don't trust the police, we don't want them there. Ultimately the interrogation took place at a different police department, and the Boulder Police had to watch it from another building. The Ramses finally sit down with the police for three days of videotaped interrogations in June 1998, a year and a half after Jean Benet's murder. We were there for as long as they wanted. Would have stayed for two weeks had they wanted. The myth that we didn't cooperate is nonsense.

When you're interrogated by the police, you were interrogated separately. Yes. Today is Wednesday, June 24, 1998. I'm president of the Roomfield Police Department, Patricia Ramsey. Tom Haney, who was one of the most respected homicide detectives out of Denver, was chosen to interview Patsy Ramsey. Patsy Ramsey had a year and a half to prepare. I knew that it was going to be tough to get a spontaneous response.

Do you ever recall purchasing black duct tape like this? It seems like there can't be a house in the world that doesn't have duct tape because it repairs everything. Well, I never liked it because it's so gooey. Isn't it gooey? He started out softly and kindly and curious, and then he got pointed with his questions and that made Patsy angry. If I told you right now that we have, in the process of being examined,

trace evidence that appears to link you to the death of John Bonet, what would you tell me? That is totally impossible. Go retest. How is totally impossible. Go retest. How is it impossible? I did not kill my child. I didn't have anything to do with it.

She said it was impossible that we had physical evidence linking her to that crime. I'm talking about scientific evidence. I don't give a flying flip how scientific it is. Go back to the damn drawing board. I didn't do it. John Ramsey didn't do it, and we didn't have a clue of anybody who did do it. I am so taken with her swagger.

She just tells him, you know, you think you have some evidence on me? them, you know, you think you have some evidence on me? Well, you better look again. We love that child, OK? We're not involved. Read my lips. Let's find out who it is.

My life has been hell from that day forward. And I can't stand the thought of thinking somebody's out here walking on the street. God knows what am I doing again to some other child. You know, quit screwing around asking me about things that are ridiculous and let's find the person that did them. Patsy was feisty. She was combative. In stark contrast to John Ramsey, who was interrogated by Lou Smith. When Lou interviewed someone, he pried anything out of people just by being understanding

and really listening. Now, John and others, touching right back on the very top of his pocket, was this tape wrapped around anywhere, or was it stuck down, or was it very firm across her lips? The interrogation tapes are intriguing to watch, as there's a lot of raw emotion shown by both John and Patsy Ramsey. But the bottom line is both John and Patsy deny that anyone in their family killed John Bonet. And there was nothing revealed that allowed for charges to be brought against them.

We want to do everything we can to help solve this case for you. My dad's conclusions after that interview were just firmed up his belief that the Ramseys had nothing to do with this murder. I'm not saying parents don't kill their kids. Parents do kill their children. But they're trying to say, pass you this. Their actions before, during, and after are all

consistent with innocent people. They didn't do it. My dad started getting frustrated as time went on because he felt that the case against the Ramseys was being slanted, where no other evidence was coming in. I thought there was something drastically wrong and that there was a gross injustice in this case. I had seen evidence of an intruder in the house

that night. Lou Smith thought that the Ramses were being targeted unfairly. And he didn't believe the police were listening to him. Smith so strongly disagrees with the prosecutor's focus on the Ramses that he is resigning from the case, saying, the case tells me John and Patsy Ramsey did not kill their daughter.

He wrote a letter to Alex Hunter telling them that he couldn't be a part of the persecution of these people is how he termed it. He wrote, I intend to stand with this family and somehow help them through this and find the killer of their daughter. My dad may have resigned from the district attorney's office, but he never stopped work on the case.

He walked in JonBenet's shoes, and he owed it to her, he felt, to continue his investigation. One thing Lou Smith fought to do was tell a grand jury his side of the story, the intruder theory. There were too many unanswered questions, in particular, that male DNA in JonBenet's underwear that didn't match anyone that they knew of. Who could it be? Grand jurors arrived at the Boulder County Justice Center this morning and were escorted into the courthouse by sheriff's deputies.

There was enormous pressure on District Attorney Alex Hunter to call for a grand jury and it took him almost two years to actually call on. I think it was the media pressure and pressure from the police that forced him to make that call. A lot of work went into it. You have to remember this case was happening just after other high-profile murder cases in the country. What did you think of your parents at that point by October 31st? I thought they were these great people that I had killed.

From the Menendez Brothers to O.J. Simpson. O.J. did it! Those high-profile cases were on most of the country's mind. Good morning, Counsel. Most people think that evidence of Simpson's guilt was insurmountable. We, the jury, in the above-entitled action, find the defendant, Orenthal James Simpson,

not guilty of the crime of murder. And yet, he walked. Alex remembered that. He told me one time, I don't want to spend two years of my life and $5 million of the taxpayer's money and lose in court. Alex Hunter sat a grand jury for 13 months. Are you surprised by anything you've seen?

No. Over 13 months, those people heard over a hundred witnesses. My name is Jonathan Webb. I was a grand juror on the John Badaeva-Ramsey case. I was a grand juror on the Jambanay Ramsey case. It bothers me that the murder of a little girl like this has gone unsolved for essentially a quarter century. ? Members of the grand jury looking like detectives themselves

as they finally tour the Ramsey house. From a crime scene perspective, it was very disturbing how she was found. She's on a concrete floor, a carot around her neck, and she's six years old. That's pretty horrible. Webb told us that the grand jury spent most of their time

focused on two main issues. First, who wrote that ransom note? We heard from three handwriting experts. And even though the handwriting experts couldn't definitively say that she wrote it, they all three came to the same conclusion that it could have been Patsy Ramsey. The Ramsey's defense team had their own experts

who said that the comparison between the writing on the ransom note and Patsy's handwriting was not conclusive. And the grand jury believed that she wrote it. The second focus for the grand jury, according to Jonathan Webb, was the viability of the intruder theory. Smith actually presented his intruder theory to the grand jury. This is the very first photo taken of a train room basement window. The window was wide open.

I was the detective. I just said, wow, this is entry. But the grand jury wasn't buying the intruder theory because of those cobwebs in the window. The intruder theory didn't make sense to the grand jury. The Boulder police had photographed cobwebs. So for someone to get through a small opening like that and not disturbing a cobweb would be remarkable.

A grand jury doesn't decide guilt or innocence the way a regular jury does. The grand jury is only there to decide whether or not there's probable cause to charge the suspects with a crime. We were troubled by to what level of confidence do we need to have to vote to indict. And it's the preponderance of the evidence,

which means greater than 50%. And soon after that, we voted to indict. The grand jury was looking at two specific accusations for the Ramses, child abuse resulting in death and accessory to a crime. The grand jury couldn't point the finger at Patsy or John specifically, but they were sure that one of them committed the crime

and the other person helped to carry it out. This is 7 News at 5. There is high anticipation in Boulder right now for a Ramsey decision, and we are about to hear an announcement from Boulder DA, Alex Hunter. I and my prosecution task force believe we do not have sufficient evidence to warrant the filing of charges against anyone who has been investigated at this time.

I was shocked. It's extremely unusual for a grand jury to vote to charge and the DA not charge. I think deciding not to prosecute the parents for homicide was the right decision. No matter what you believe about the case, it would have been very difficult to get a conviction. Thank you very much. There were too many questions, in particular,

that DNA in the underwear that appears to have been from a man didn't match anyone they knew of. That's why Lou Smith continued investigating even after he resigned from the case. He had condensed everything he knew about every person of interest into a spreadsheet. It's like a PowerPoint on steroids. It detailed 887 names.

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to request a ride under your supervision with live trip tracking and highly rated drivers. Add your teen to your Uber account today. But I think what turned this whole case has always been DNA. The killer left behind, I believe, part of his DNA. On their podcast, Lou Smith's granddaughter spoke about his focus on the DNA in the case. Over nearly 13 years, Lou took all of the information that he had on this case and developed a database. In this particular murder,

he thought that DNA would solve this case. And thanks to major advances in DNA, a number of big surprises were about to come to the case. What became groundbreaking at the time was a thing called touch DNA. Essentially, when someone touches something, the skin cells they leave behind can be tested. In 2008, the then District Attorney for Boulder, Mary Lacey, decided to do a new round of DNA testing on Jambonet's pajama leggings. Remember, there was already DNA from an unknown male found under Jambonet's fingernails and

in her underwear. But analysis of touched DNA on her leggings uncovered something new. DNA from at least one unknown male, maybe two. In recent months investigators used that new procedure which helped them discover fresh DNA on Jean-Benet's long johns left by the killer's fingertips. Now new DNA analysis proves just that. The Boulder District Attorney clears all members of the Ramsey family in the murder of their six-year-old daughter Jean-Benet. That's a pretty big development. You've got DNA

now in three places that doesn't match anybody in the Ramsey family. That's a pretty clear indication that somebody else was there and nobody knows whose DNA it is. This revelation of this new unmatched DNA drove the district attorney to announce they're no longer looking at the family. The news broke here at the district attorney's office with this incredible letter to Jean Benet's father. DA Mary Lacey wrote John Ramsey, we do not consider your immediate family, including you, your wife Patsy, and your son Burke, to be under any suspicion in the commission of this crime.

The DA also apologized to the Ramses. She wrote in part, to the extent that we may have contributed in any way to the public perception that you might have been involved in this crime, I am deeply sorry. John Ramsey responded to the DA's letter and the stunning development on a local newscast. We're certainly grateful for an acknowledgement that we are innocent, that this wasn't true, which of course we've always maintained. But this is a reminder how often that they are human beings and how often they get it wrong, how often their biases take them down the wrong path.

Somebody told me in the police world, they said the most dangerous thing is the police department's made up their mind. And that's really what happened in our case. All it takes is one match to the DNA, and you've possibly nailed the killer. Our killer, John Bonin, how many victims has he had in the past and how many victims is going to have in the future?

So this car could still be murdering him today. Lou Smith dedicated years to investigating the John Benet Ramsey murder case, but eventually he ran out of time. When he got sick with cancer, he knew that his time was limited. And so during that time, he just talked to others about not letting this case die. He had people coming every single day,

60 to 70, 80 people a day, coming to see him. And they said their goodbyes. And during that time, he would still talk about the case. I remember about the last three days he had slipped into a coma and the conversations would become one way you know what and I don't know if you could hear me or not. I'm John Ramsey. I had the opportunity to visit Lou a week before he died.

Remarkably during that time together Lou talked a lot about the case. He hadn't given up. He never, never, never gave up. Lou Smith's legacy lives on, and his tenacity to solve this case was passed on to his daughter, Cindy Mara. And he just said, I have a name. I want you to write it down. And I did. and he said, that's where you start. You know, we'd be glad to pay that. We don't have that electronic report,

so we would need Boulder to send it. After my dad died, a couple of us, our family, and then some of his old homicide partners, we just formed a team. You want to go down to number two, because that is an in-state one. What we all share in common is that commitment to fulfill Lou's dying wish that this case

doesn't die with him. And I think it's that devotion, that respect, that love for Lou is what keeps our team moving forward. According to investigators, there were other possible suspects, including a local Santa in town who had previous interactions with the Ramsings. There's no way in the world that I could be involved in the death of this little girl. I adored her. But there's another man who comes forward with claims he's responsible for John Benet's

murder. I love John Benet and she died accidentally. The mystery surrounding the murder of John Benet Ramsey haunted Lou Smith until the day he died. We left behind that detailed list, hoping that one day, John Bonaise Killer would finally be brought to justice. He had condensed everything he knew

about every person of interest into a spreadsheet. It was like a PowerPoint on steroids. The spreadsheet detailed 887 names. He wanted us to take the list that he had and try and keep the case alive. Out of those 887 entries, by the time he went into hospice, Lou had marked 134 cleared. Over the years, there have been many leads that seem promising at one time or another. That new Netflix documentary Making News details how just months after Jean Benet's murder a 12 year old girl who lived less than two miles from the Ramses was attacked as she slept in her bed. Sometime in the

late hours mom hears a noise going on and And there was, in fact, an intruder in her daughter's bedroom preparing to molester. That person has never been identified. That girl had attended the same dance studio as John Benet. Are the two cases connected? I don't know. Boulder police said that while the two cases connected? I don't know. Boulder Police said that while the two cases had some similarities, they found no definitive connection.

In the search for the killer, investigators chased down countless leads, including a local transient. Here you have Gary Oliver, who apparently on the night or the next day after John Bonett was killed, called a friend and told him over the phone that he had hurt a child. All of a sudden I get a phone call and it's Gary and he's sobbing into the phone like I've never heard anybody sob in my entire life. I hurt a little girl.

He was a homeless man who hung out at a church just a block and a half from the Ramsey I hurt a little girl. He was a homeless man who hung out at a church just a block and a half from the Ramsey's home. And he confessed that he killed John Vanay Ramsey. They took a look at him, but eventually eliminated him because there's absolutely no connection between he and the Ramsey's, and his DNA, they used that to eliminate him. Investigators also looked into Bill McGrinnells,

a local Santa Claus who'd worked at the Ramses' holiday parties. John Benet had made a comment that he, Bill McGrinnells, was coming to their house to see John Benet. I think everybody thought that was a little weird. His DNA didn't match, and he's out of the picture. And then Alex Hunter, the Boulder County District Attorney, speaks directly to the killer.

I want to say something to the person or persons that committed this crime. The list of suspects narrows. Soon, there will be no one on the list but you. A day after the DA rattles the cage, a man named Michael Helgoth attracts the attention of authorities. Michael Helgoth evidently committed suicide the day after the Boulder District Attorney threatened that, hey, we're going to find you.

The death of this child has broken all of our hearts. We will see that justice is served in this case and that you pay for what you did. That speech was designed to get the killer nervous. When Michael was found dead, there was a stun gun at his residence. Also, there was a pair of high-tech boots. These two clues had previously been linked

to John Benet's murder. Stun gun, a bit odd for people to have. High-tech boots, fairly common thing for people to have. But the real clincher would be DNA didn't match and he has no connection to the Ramsey family. And so investigators also eliminate Helgoth as a person of interest. Investigators finally felt they had a real break in the case with John Mark Carr. He famously claimed he was with Jean Benet when she died. I love Jean Benet and she died accidentally.

Are you a Christian nun? No. Her death was an accident. So you were in the basement? Yes. Problem is, he was an in-balder Colorado when she died, and his DNA didn't match. Even though Carr claimed he was in the basement

when Jambonet died, there was just no physical evidence linking him to a murder. And so Carr was eliminated as a suspect. Take a look at it, Amand. Decades later, the search still goes on for the little girl's killer. What our team has been doing is focusing on collecting DNA and testing DNA.

I think it's imperative that we investigate every credible suspect that's been provided. If we keep at it, hopefully we'll finally whittle it down to one person remaining on that list. Do you think you know who the killer is? You know, no, I don't. And this is a very dark, evil person. I don't know anybody like that. But could advances in DNA technology finally help catch the person who killed John B'Nai. The John B'Nai-Ramsay case is just as mysterious today as it was in 1996, when her devastated

parents were left with tiny mementos from their daughter to hold onto. It makes me sad that there were happy little hands in this club. Now they're gone. So the memories bring tears to your eyes, but you're also a little more at peace? I don't know, I don't think I will be at peace until we find out who did this. For Patsy Ramsey, sadly, her fight to find her daughter's killer ended in 2006 when she passed away.

Patsy died of ovarian cancer. Yes. Went through all of that without knowing that she'd been cleared. That's correct. She was buried next to John Benet in Marietta, Georgia. But the search for justice continues. I think it's even more mysterious now, to some degree, because who the heck was in that house? How'd they get in? Why'd they target her?

Lou Smith's family, dedicated to keeping the case moving forward, continues to work on whittling down a list they presented to law enforcement in 2020. And what we presented was a confidential list of our top 20 people of interest and the list of the eight people of interest that our team had eliminated through DNA analysis. The technology has just advanced so tremendously. John Benet's blood was mixed with an unknown male DNA in her underpants, and we need to separate out those two profiles, which can be done now and use genealogical DNA, which has been a

huge tool in solving cold cases recently. That technique has solved some old, old dead cold cases. That's what we're asking the police to do. Well, DNA science has progressed significantly since the early years of the Jambonais investigation. And investigators can now work with smaller, mixed, and degraded samples. There are still significant hurdles. What will be your message to the Boulder Police Department today? Look, just tell us, are you using one of these very cutting-edge labs to do additional DNA testing, if you are doing additional DNA testing? That's all I need to know.

According to the Boulder PD, investigators are utilizing panel of outside experts brought together in December of 2023 to review this case. Our department has had ongoing conversations with John Benet's family, the last of which occurred in mid-2024. Our goal is to find John Benet Ramsey's killer. Our commitment to that has never wavered. Don Benet Ramsey's killer. Our commitment to that has never wavered. The family has not lost the will to fight and the will to find the killer. If we can find the killer, then the next generation doesn't have to live

with that trauma and the unknown and the speculation. We leverage the evidence, we follow the facts, we will find this killer. My dad certainly suffered a tremendous amount, but I think he's focused on life today and enjoying life with his family and grandkids, and he's remarried. But he says he's still always thinking of JonBenet, trying to focus on the positive of this beautiful little girl

who will always be forever young. She knew she was loved. I mean, we told her that every day. Somebody asked me once, what would you say to JonBenet if he could? I would tell her, I'm sorry, I didn't protect you. You know, I had JonBenet bless my life for six years. And she really was a blessing.

The Boulder DA tells 2020 that the office is continuing to work with federal, state, and local agencies to make progress on this tragic case. And David, Lou Smith's family says they're determined to continue making their way through that list. We're going to stay on this story. That's our program for tonight. I'm Deborah Roberts. And I'm David Muir from all of us here at 2020 and ABC News.

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