32 Thoughts: The Podcast - Are the Leafs a Team or a Club?

Episode Date: March 13, 2026

In this episode of 32 Thoughts, Kyle Bukauskas and Elliotte Friedman open with Auston Matthews taking a knee-on-knee hit from Radko Gudas and the lack of response from the Maple Leafs. They discuss uncertainty around Brad Treliving’s future as he approaches the final year of his contract (8:30), and the tightening playoff races across both the Eastern (10:00) and Western (21:00) conferences. Elliotte also shares that Nashville appears to be interviewing candidates for its GM position (22:30), before the guys weigh in on NHL awards voting and the difficulty of winning the Hart Trophy in a league with players like Connor McDavid for Nikita Kucherov (25:30). They also dive into Nathan MacKinnon and a confusing goaltender interference call and the differences between NHL and IIHF rules (29:00), Connor Bedard’s big night against Utah (37:00), and Utah locking up Nick Schmaltz to an eight-year deal (40:00). The episode also touches on the NHL modifying its penalty against the Ottawa Senators (42:30), Montreal pushing toward the top of the Atlantic with Jacob Fowler impressing in net (47:30), and a Final Thought on Elliotte returning to co-host the Canucks for Kids Telethon (52:04) Kyle and Elliotte answer listener questions in the Thoughtline (55:41). In the final segment Kyle and Elliotte speak with Glenn Healy ahead of the 2026 Keith Magnuson Man of the Year Award Night (1:20:46) Today we highlight soul and R&B singer/songwriter Jules and his song Karma feat. Naomi. Check out his music here. Listen to all the 32 Thoughts music here. Email the podcast at [e-mail] or call the Thought Line at 1-833-311-3232 and leave us a voicemail. This podcast was produced and mixed by Dominic Sramaty and hosted by Elliotte Friedman & Kyle Bukauskas. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates

Before we get to the show, we wanted to send our thoughts to the Larson family. John Tortorella shared on ESPN on Thursday night that we lost Hannah Larson, the wife of Brad Larson, a longtime player and most recently a coach for a number of years. Brad had stepped away from his role in the coaching staff with the Calgary Flames last season due to family reasons. And the reason was Elliot, Hannah, was in a battle with cancer. We've gotten to know Brad a little bit over the first couple of months of the season. And not surprisingly to anybody who knows him, he's a great teammate, very easy to get along with. And we just wanted to send our best to him and his family. Welcome to 32 Thoughts, the podcast, presented by your Canadian Toyota dealers and the 100% Electric BZ,

available now during Red Tag days. Kyle, Elliot, Dom, back with you. And Elliot, continuing the theme that you had laid out earlier in this week, that how many teams across the league are seeing red in matchups that maybe you didn't necessarily expect, but this time of year, the nastiness, the hate has been ratcheted up. We saw it in Boston and San Jose on Thursday night. We saw it in Dallas and Edmonton.

Maybe that one we shouldn't be surprised by, given their playoff history the last few years. And the one that surely is going to get plenty more discourse. There's already has been lots on Thursday. The theme in this. era of Toronto Maple Leafs hockey. Player gets hit in a bad way, gets taken advantage of in a bad way, and the lack of immediate response.

And on Thursday night, it was Austin Matthews, the captain shortly after snapping a 12-game gold drought, taken a knee-on-knee from Radko Gudis, and what followed immediately after is what's going to be the talking point over the next little while. Kyle, it just figures that in this season, the Maple Leafs finally end the, their losing streak. They get their first post-Olympic victory, beating the duck six to four, and nobody was talking about the W. Everybody was talking about that. You know, I had a friend who texted me after the game when he's like, what if that is the last game Matthews plays for Toronto? And I'm like, don't even go there. Like I just got off a plane from New York. I've been

working all day. And I don't have a mind to comprehend this stuff. right now. I was like, really, that's the first thing that you're, that's the first place that you're thinking went. And this guy is a hardcore leaf fan. I said way, way, way too soon to get into that. But, you know, I was thinking the exact same thing you talked about, Kyle. You saw the end of Boston, San Jose, when Charlie McAvoy took a run at Kiefer Sherwood. And Vincent Day Arnae in particular, like the linesmen tried to keep those guys separate, but the sharks weren't having it. They were trying to get at him.

And that whole Dallas Edmonton game, a guy who made a name for himself, Justin Ricks, they call him Ritz Carlton, because his last name is too hard to pronounce. Like he made a name for himself. He had Connor McDavid dropping the gloves with him. He had Trent Frederick trying to knock him out.

He was pointing his stick at the Oilers' bench. bench. You figure that would be a 15-year veteran who would be doing that in the middle of a game against Edmonton. And I had no problem with either team in that game. The Oilers were standing up for themselves in a very frustrating night, and the stars were standing up for themselves against a team that's knocked them out of the playoffs over and over again. I had no issue with that, but it was so jarring in Toronto when everything that happens in Toronto gets magnified into a much bigger place just because it's the center of the hockey universe. But it was impossible not to notice.

And, you know, there were players on the ice for the Maple Leafs who noticed the hit and didn't do anything about it. And it sure looks like this year has kind of broken the spirit of that hockey team a bit and they're going to have to recover it in the offseason. That's one of the things they're going to have to do. but it was just shocking to watch that. I don't know if people were intimidated by Goudis and saw the guy that did the hit and were like,

yeah, I'm not so crazy to take on that guy, but it was jarring in a night where you saw so many other NHL players standing up for their teammates. And as we touched on it, I mean, unfortunately, that's kind of just been the theme of this era in Toronto. we talked last pod and remind, you know, those that forgot about it. But when Brad Marchand took out Timothy Lilligrant a couple years ago, showing the video of the Tampa Bay Lightning, you mess with one guy, you get all of us as a plea to, we need to do a better job protecting our own.

And once again, it's, it's another similar scene within that, that group. I have to say, I was, I couldn't believe it, Elliot, you know, going through the post game and Morgan Riley said I take full responsibility. I was there on the ice. I didn't do enough afterwards. Barube says we should have four guys in there right away. But I was

William Nielander saying I didn't see it. I mean, if you go and watch the video, he's the first guy to throw his hand up after the hit from Goudis. It was, it was, anyway, it's very shocking. And we'd just love

a dose of truth serum on the inside there. it's just emblematic of everything that's gone wrong this year, right? And I saw it all over the interwebs on Thursday night. Anthony Stewart's father's line, are you a team or are you a club? And I think the other thing here too is that when you're not really fighting for a playoff birth, how do you go out? Do you go out with a bang or do you go out with a whimper? And if you look at the Rangers, for example,

the Rangers aren't making the playoffs. They're done here, but they're starting to play better. And, you know, I know fans are like, do we want to ruin our draft pick, things like that? But the one thing I find that's really curious is look at some of the guys who've gotten hot for the Rangers, LaFrenier, Gabe Perrault. Like, if you're a Ranger fan,

you're sitting here and you're saying, wait a second, maybe in a lot of, post-Panaran world, these players can be a little bit more important for us. It's a small sample size, and I don't think anybody should jump to any crazy conclusions. And I also believe in the Craig Simpson rule, which is be wary of the player that gets hot when the season is over. But you're looking for anything that's a positive, right? And you're sitting here and you're saying, at least these guys are trying to show us something

in the March to the end of the season. for the Maple Leafs it's been the so opposite of that like it's just like I said it's just crazy um six four win first win post Olympics and it's completely overshadowed by that you know the one thing I wanted to say about Toronto is there's all this discourse about what changes that that might happen and might not happen and you know Brad Tree Living has one more year left on his contract I cannot see the Maple Leafs allowing him to go into next year without some clarity. I just, I don't see it.

I, they did that, they did it with Dubus and look at the craziness it caused. They did it with Shanahan. Look at all the uncertainty it caused. I just don't see them doing that. I think one way or the other, we're, we're going to get some finality here. I just, I think after seeing it happen the last couple of years, they realize it's just not the right way to do business. there's all this discourse now about how hard it is to play in Toronto and I mean, whatever.

I've always said this. If I had the ability to play at the highest level in any sport, send me to the places where the risks are highest, but the rewards are highest. That's where I'd want to be. I'd want to be in the spot where if we won, it would feel the greatest. Losing sucks everywhere. It sucks everywhere. It doesn't matter whether you play in the NHL's biggest market. or the NHL's smallest market,

losing socks no matter where you are. But get me to the places where the rewards are the greatest. I would say also one thing too. I was talking to somebody right today and executive in the league and he's like listening to Bill Guerin do interviews about how great Austin Matthews is.

And he's like, Minnesota, why don't you just put up a neon sign outside your building that says, come here, Austin. Quinn is waiting for you. Well, they kind of tried that with Trocheque a little bit. Maybe not as obvious. Maybe that's what they should have done.

Instead of doing a Trochak picture with the wild guys, they should have done a Matthews picture with the wild guys. Oh, my God, this guy was laughing his head off. He's like, every time Garron does an interview in Toronto, it's like the pitch is on. Oh, but another great night. of hockey. I mean, um, there were some, there was some tremendous games. Um, you know, the races, Kyle, which we talked about, they looked like they were over. They're, they're very

much, uh, back on again. Um, you know, you look at the east, all the sudden, after the races looked lost and we thought we were going to coast into the end of the season, Columbus is right there. They're a point out. And that is, playing like they are playing like a team. Every game they play right now, they get points. Either they win or against the Kings and or the Panthers as on Thursday night, they get a point. And they don't have a great tiebreaker number.

Their number is 23. The Bruins, the Red Wings and the Senators all have at least two more than them. The Bruins have four. But the Blue Jackets, they just keep grinding their way close there. The Senators, that was a, a really bad loss to Montreal the other night. Flyers right there, capitals right there. Although the capitals, even though they beat Buffalo,

they're kind of floundering a bit. You know, Detroit, you can feel what was, what did Todd McClellan call some of the players the other day? Jersey's on ice? He's like a few times from game one this year and a couple other moments along the way. He's really gone after them public. Like starting from the very beginning of when is enough enough.

And it's kind of gut check time with Detroit, don't you feel? Because you look at the last three years, how they, like a lot of ways their season fell apart in March. Yep. And now you've got, you're without Larkin for at least a couple of weeks. You're without Andrew Kopp, another important forward for at least a couple of weeks. You've done all this good work all year to put yourselves in a spot to finally end this playoff drought. And now you feel things tightening up again. You mention the teams that are suddenly back in the race. Detroit's now outside of the top three in the Atlantic.

You know, like as wonderful of a player, Lucas Raymond is, and he's by and large had a really good season. He's gone quiet lately, just one assist in his last five. Yeah. This is, this is it for Detroit. This is where you really feel, this is where you really figure out, are they different this year?

Are they going to fall back into the trap again? You know, the, the thing about it is, I think we'd all agree that the worst place you can lose your best player is in that because goaltening is just so important. But I often, I really do feel the second place you can really, least afford to fall apart injury-wise is center. And, you know, you look at their face-off percentage. I think it was 50% the other night against Tampa, which is fine.

But your centermen, like, they're the guys who do all your heavy lifting, up and down the ice, breakouts, being in the right spots, coming down low. in high intensity, late season games where everybody's knocking down their details, like some of your most detail-oriented players are your centers. They, they're the ones that have to make sure, like, if they're the ones who are not in the right position, everything breaks down. And if you've got guys, like Larkin is your number one center. A cop has, is a veteran player, has been playing the position for a long,

time. If you have to go into people who either aren't used to those kinds of minutes, or they just aren't centers, or they aren't, you know, players who can handle that kind of pressure and responsibility, your team can really break down, really break down. And Comfer scored a big goal. And, you know, this is such a big moment for Casper. Like, I think, like, by the way, I heard from a lot. When we're talking about our defensemen this year, like the top defensemen, I heard from the Red Wings fans, yes, I miss Cider. And I heard from the Oilers fans, yes, I miss Bouchard.

And I know Bouchard had a rough game on Thursday night, but so did everybody. You can't throw that totally on him. I think Cider's been pretty good down the stretch. But you can see that for some of those Detroit forwards, like I think a guy like Casper and a guy like Raymond, you can sit there and you can say to me, it's not fair and it's not right, but these are the moments

where they have to be superhuman. Like I think you can say, hey, you shouldn't be singling out those guys. They're missing other players. It's not on them. And you're right. But this is the moment where the human have to become superhuman

for a franchise. guys. And you're looking at Raymond and you're looking at Casper and you're saying, we need a night that is a sort of like a legacy defining night from those kinds of guys. And it's a really difficult position to be in. But that's where those two guys are. It's like, hey, tell it. Tweet me and tell me it's unfair dependent on them. Fine. But like it or not, that's what you need if you're Detroit. I still think about, you know, Raymond, when we We talked to them back before the season, like understanding the significance of their centennial

and the opportunity to join some of the other pro teams in the area that are now, I mean, the lions have been added for a while. But more and more, the pistons are relevant again, the Tigers, of course, and to be part of that conversation of playing beyond the regular season.

The moment and opportunity this year wasn't lost on Raymond then. I think he's a hell of a player. I really love watching him. He was really good at the Olympics, too. He was one of their best players. beginning to end. Of course. Of course. Like if even if it's been a little quiet the last little bit, I would have no issue going. Yeah, he's he's got the ability to grab hold of everything you just

laid out there, Elliot. And to go into kind of a superhuman type mode missing, you know, his running mate and Larkin, their magic together. But to have to do it without for a little bit, I think he's got he's got the ability to do that for sure. Also, just going back to that San Jose Boston game. Yeah. Did you see? the goal Will Eklund scored? Oh, my God. First off, the assist he had early on was incredible. And then the goal later in the night, that camera handheld in the corner, the angle of his goal as he twisted through the air.

Yeah. Man, oh, man. I'm glad they had that angle because it really shows the skill to do that. So, you know, I am in, I was in, sorry, I was not in. I was on Long Island, Wednesday and Thursday. Good catch. We were taping some stuff. And I watched the Islanders practice.

And first of all, it was a great practice. It was fast. It was up-tempo. One of the things I don't get to do in my job much anymore is watch practice. And I didn't see who it was, but there was a play on the practice when they were doing like rushes. And one of the Islanders players, I didn't really get the chance to see who it was. through like a really hard pass that was not along the ground. It was probably a little over ankle high.

And I was like, that's a tough pass. And whoever was the winger and it was a right shot, batted in and scored. And I was like, wow, like, what a play. Like just the hand eye there to do that that quickly in practice, I was so impressed. Just a reminder of the kinds of athletes you're dealing with. And then at night, you see that Eklund,

goal where he does it while he's being knocked through the air, the skill level of these players is incredible. And I was glad that camera angle existed so we could all truly appreciate what Eklund did on that play. I'm going to guess it might have been Callum Ritchie was the guy at practice that you saw do that. You know what? I really, I really didn't see. I was, looking at a bunch of things and it might have been, but I didn't, I didn't see. By the way, I'm happy for Eklund because now this week, he's known as the guy that scored that beautiful goal

as opposed to the guy that Horvett got fine for flicking on the bench. Yes. He's, he's responded well. You know, he didn't let that define him. Affect him, affect him. Yeah, so the other thing, too, about Columbus is, Columbus has two paths, right? They have the wild card path where they're chasing Detroit and Boston.

They also have the metro path where they can chase the Islanders and the Penguins. So, you know, it's going to be interesting there. Like, you know, we did a piece with the Allenders that will air later. But the one thing around them is it's going to be a challenge because it just is. But there's really good vibes there. really good vibes. And you can tell those guys like Shen, and he's made an immediate impact.

And, you know, that's a team that really feels good about itself. And again, they had a big comeback that, you know, they were down three nothing to the blues and they won it. But also they stood up for each other there. And Patrick Waugh was asked about that on Thursday. And says, we've done it all year. Like they have it's a it's a big part of who they are. But we thought this eastern race was evaporated.

But now you've got the penguins, the Islanders, the Red Wings, the Bruins, the Blue Jackets, at least fighting for four of those spots in Ottawa, Philly, and Washington trying to see if they can at least, at least make it interesting. West, can I just say I'm slightly annoyed at the Jets? What an opportunity this week. You know, the Jets, they could be two points out. Now, Anaheim's a good team, but you got to beat the Rangers. And that was a really ugly loss. I mean, the Anaheim loss was ugly too because the ice was tilted so badly.

But the Ranger loss is really ugly. I mean, look, like, they could be at 66 right with San Jose, Seattle, L.A., and Nashville. and this is a real lost opportunity week for the Jets. And it's got to be so disappointing for them because the way it all started, they really could have, like you remember how impressive their surge was at the beginning of last year. They could have done something similar at the end. The opportunity was there to have an awesome surge at the end of this year and make the playoffs. And if they don't do it, they're going to look back at this week and say,

We lost out because we had two flat performances, and Elliot Friedman said we could be good. Those were the two reasons that we didn't make it. Very, very disappointing. By the way, I just wanted to mention Nashville for a second. I think they're interviewing people, Kyle. And I don't know what the speed of this one is going to be, but it sounds like they got a lot of permission.

for a bunch of assistant GMs around the league that they're talking to. And I know we've been focused on some of the bigger names like Brendan Shanahan, obviously, who I think will end up somewhere if it's not Nashville. But depending on what else becomes available, but at the very least, they are talking to a bunch of AGM types around the league. Like I saw today, Team USA for the World Championships named Brett Peterson from the Florida Panthers as the GM for the upcoming World Championships.

I would be shocked if he wasn't one of the guys on their radar. And I heard there's a bunch of people in similar positions to him that Nashville has been talking to. So I don't know if this means that that's what they're going to do. They're going to try to promote somebody who's an agent. GM now, but I do know they're talking to people. They ask for a lot of permission from people in those kind of level jobs around the league, and they're definitely talking to some of them. Okay. So they're very much open to a first time GM at the NHL level. At least now they are. Like it's, we'll see what they end up doing, but they're showing that they're, they're interested in

that type of thing. Nashville, I mean, really fast. season. Almost wave the white flag at the deadline, shocked their players, but once again, they've kind of reset under the O'Reilly's, the Stamcoces, and the Yosys,

and they're giving this a run. Like, again, the Kings were on Long Island. They're playing there on Friday night. I was around them a bit with Kopitar, and, you know, they're still in it. they absolutely feel that there's no reason that they can't be the team that takes that that second wildcard spot. Incredibly.

Just 16 regulation wins for them, though, on the year. So, like, they've got to get it outright if they're going to do it and get in. Just a couple of other things wanted to highlight from Thursday night. Quinn Hughes, third defenseman in history, to put up 60 assists in his first 60 games of a season. I'm sure you can guess who the other two are. Bobby Orr, Paul Coffey. Yep. That was an easier one.

Nikita Kutrov, 1,100 career points. John Cooper. Thank you, Eric Erlinson for this one. Third coach in history with 700 wins with one franchise, both regular season and playoffs combined. Tampa's trying to write themselves a little bit. Kutrov continues to be brilliant. I got to say, I mean, there's a handful of

really, really incredible players in the league right now, as we know, Elliot. But something doesn't completely sit right that at this point in time, Kutrov has just one heart trophy to his name. Now, I'm part of the problem. I know. I haven't had him at the very top. I don't think of my heart ballot the last couple of years. But man, oh, man, he is a marvelous watch. You know what? I'll say this.

Okay. I'm a voter. I do this every year. Some of these votes are brutal. Okay. And, like, Haskinen has never won a Norris, all right? McKinnon didn't win his first hard trophy until, what, two years ago? Yeah.

It is hard to win that trophy. I understand all the Lightning fans are like Kuturov disrespect, Kuturov disrespect. Nobody disrespects Nikita Kuturov. Like, you're in a league with Connor McDavid. There was one year where Austin Matthews scored 69 goals. Okay. Connor Hellebock led the Jets to a wire-to-wire president's trophy last year. You are losing to players who are having exceptional seasons.

Exceptional seasons. I'm sorry. There is no disrespect. Everybody knows how good Kucharov is. Everybody, okay? you are losing, like, Hayeskinen, is, is Hastinen disrespected? Because he's losing Norris trophies to players like Kail McCar and Quinn Hughes.

In your mind, yes. You are, like, you are willingness into existence, the Hayeskinen for Norris. Well, look, I think he should win a Norris trophy at some point. And I hope he does. Yeah. Of course he's a hell of course. And now here comes the new generation of guys that are going to start winning the Norris trophies like Rasmus Dahlene, right?

but like there's no shame in losing Norris trophies to McCar and Hughes. Like it's not disrespect. I'm sorry. This whole argument is stupid. And I wasn't looking to have that argument, but it's just, that was more the point I wanted to make is like how great it is at the top in this league. And Kuturov's like he's the player's favorite player. I mean, he's got two Lindsay's.

That's what McKinnon said. McKinnon said that, and I know he's not the only one. Like, you just, just, all you got to do is watch. I just, I think that argument is so terrible. Disrespect. There's no disrespect. Losing to Connor McDavid. You're losing to Nathan McKinnon.

You're losing the 69 goal, Austin Matthews. I'm sorry. It's not disrespect. It was the 60 goal year when Matthews got his, though, right? I think when he got 69, he didn't even win the heart. That's right. So there you go. The disrespect that year, though.

No, I'm kidding. Can we talk, we want to talk about McKinnon and this goal of interference thing for a second? Yes, yes, I do. All right, you want to set it up? All right, yeah. So Tuesday night's game against Edmonton, Mad Dash cutting across the crease,

five-minute major, he's kicked out of the game. As more and more replay angles came up, there was definitely an argument to be made. He was at least attempting to avoid Connor Ingram and the contact from Darnell Nurse on the back check certainly didn't help matters. Jared Bednar, who by the way is one of the most blunt when it comes to defending his players publicly.

I was watching him, that whole thing was happening, and I was thinking myself, this guy has hated goalie interference all year. I could not wait for his post-react. game press conference. I was like, this is going to be an 11 out of 10,

and I was not disappointed. Jared, thank you for not disappointing me. Steped up to the plate. So, first of all, good to see the Conner-Inger was able to back up Thursday in Dallas for the Oilers.

Because that did not look pretty initially. But the league rescinded the game misconduct aspect of the call. So clears him from potential suspension down the road if he were to receive another and

relative quicks. We saw the thing with Ranton in earlier this year with the stars. But your theory, I heard you on radio with Marquesi and Futa this week, given how close we are to the playoffs and for all the

pounding of the table of look at the role that Nurse played in this, totally understand it all, but why the call was what it was in the moment, trying to to set an example or a message at least across the league that that type of contact with the goalie cannot happen full stop. I agree.

I still agree with that. And nobody has told me I'm wrong. Nobody. Further to that, the next night I'm watching Montreal, Ottawa, and early in that game, Dylan Cousins gets called for goalie interference. And it wasn't much. And I'm sure you could go back and find a lot of similar plays this year that were not called and Travis Green was seething on the bench after that penalty was called and I'm sitting

there watching that going I guarantee to you after listening to what you said after watching the McKinnon penalty that those are not all in some roundabout way related so I also have another theory I have another theory I will pile on top of this I have theory upon theory upon theory Kyle that ever since the Olympics, you know how we talked about it, the Olympics, the NHL rulebook kind of bled into the double IHF rulebook, the whole idea that there's no longer an NHL game and an double IHF game and it's just hockey. I like the way the international hockey rules protect goalies. you know, I still, I believe the goalies have to be protected.

I think they have to be special. I think they have to be different. And because when they get hurt, it affects outcomes too much. Like there are people in the lease organization who you will never be able to convince that if Stolars isn't hurt last year against the Panthers, they don't win that series. They thought that was the thing that changed that series. People can argue everybody's entitled to their opinion. I just know there are people in that organization who feel that way.

At the Olympics, I think people saw how the goalies got protected and they liked it. And also, it's kind of cleaner. Like in international hockey, it's pretty much accepted. You go into the crease or you prevent a goalie for making a save. either you're going to get a penalty or the goal is going to be disallowed. And I heard from some officials there, it was much less of a guess. It was more like, this is the way we feel and this is the way we're going to call it. You know, there was one not long after the Olympics when Anthony Mantha had like a toe in the crease against the Rangers.

And that goal was disallowed because I think it was Shisterc in that day, tried to push off and Manth's skate was there and they disallowed it. And I had some people who said to me, that was an interesting one. So I think, I think we're bending that way in general. But that McKinnon play, first of all, when I watched it live, I was, I watched the review, I watched the play, I was watching the game. I'm like, he's going to get two. This is not going to be a game misconduct. And when they called a game misconduct, I was like, wow. I was as shocked as The avalanche were, their fans were, and the avalanche broadcast was, who were typically understated in their reactions. Yes.

But they, along with Bednar, 11 out of 10 delivery. Yes. But I, to me, it's pretty simple, Kyle. It's very simple. They saw the goalie, they saw blood in the net. They saw Ingram hurt. and they're like, if we allow this, our goalies are going to get destroyed. And look, you know, McKinnon had a head of steam.

The thing about nurses, the other thing, too, I think may have been a factor here, is that if you watch Nurse, he's trying to play the pass, right? He's trying to prevent that pass from getting to McKinnon. He's like he's not even, even though there's contact with him and McKinnon, there's body contact there, I think he's playing that. the puck. And in the playoffs, there's going to be a million of these kinds of plays. And I, you will never be able to convince me that the referees who in that case have the final say and the situation room weren't looking at this and saying, if we don't come down on this now,

we're going to have goalies getting clobbered during the playoffs. And we can't have that. And until somebody tells me I'm wrong, that's what I'm going with. I think they felt that McKinnon had a steam was probably going to make contact with the goalie anyway. And they're like, we have to call this to eliminate mayhem. That's my theory. And I'm sticking to it. Remember last year we'd kind of talked about ringette, how it's called it. Maybe not going full on down that path, but just the idea that, do the something.

Like, it's got to be some kind of holy ground. for the goaltender when looking at these types of plays. And it's funny. So next week we're going to be down in Florida for the GM meetings. I remember last year they did that exercise. They ran through all the different reviews from what had gone on that year. I mean, I think there was some on misstoppages, but there was a lot of goal interference. And I don't know if I want to say it was like a PR blitz, but it was definitely they came out and they were like, look, we ran through all these plays and in all.

But what? It was like three or four of them. Like we were all in unanimous thinking that it was it was going to be this call or that call. Like look how aligned we are. All to talk about gray area, there really isn't that much. We all see it the same way. If they are planning to run a similar exercise down there this year, I've got a feeling that the conversation, the tone may be a little different.

It's just that time of seat. Like it's perfect. We're not that far from playoffs. teams are emotional about this stuff as is and now we're seeing it as we talked about as these games are becoming more and more important you know how's how's everybody going to feel when they get in the same room and start talking about

this stuff down in Palm Beach you'll be really curious every year something happens right before the GM meetings as you said did you see Connor Bedard by the way so you were telling me about this Did he go like Well first of all

He had a great game Yes he scored the winner in Utah in a great game I'll tell you this I really like watching Utah play I find them really fun to watch And and the Blackhawks gave them everything they could handle On Thursday night Now, Bidard scored the overtime winner But he also set up Tyler Bertuzi on the 1-1 goal

And after he glared at a fan and yes, Steve Sullivan, both Blackhawks at the time it occurred. But Bedard, as far as I know, was not bloodied by a puck before that happened. Or the fan. But no, it was the fan. Now, Mark Lazarus, who was reporting that game, he said he spoke to the fan and the fan said that I kind of deserved it. But that's great. stuff. I love Bedard doing that. I absolutely

love it. Oh, yeah. It's so good for the sport to see Bedard do that. It's fun. And have that kind of swagger. You know what? Like in the world of comedy, crowdwork is becoming more and more of a thing. Like Riley Smith? Like when the guy doesn't recognize Riley Smith? Yeah, yeah, that's right. But that's the thing, because now all these

clips go online and and the back and forth interaction, like it becomes, it becomes things on social, right? Yes. They pop up and everyone gets a kick. Like crowd work used to just almost be like it was a necessary survival skill for comics. If you had to deal with someone who was unruly in your crowd. But now it feels like more and more are actually trying to work it into their sets. And anyway, my point is like that stuff is, like, that stuff is. very entertaining.

And when you've got someone like Bedard working somebody in the crowd after scoring an overtime winner, great, great entertainment. That's awesome. Speaking of Utah. Yes. Official with Nick Schmaltz, eight times eight. Yes. This is a player that has said, loves it in Utah, didn't envision anywhere else.

And after a season long of what was all going to end up here, $64 million. gets this thing over the finish line? So not surprised it happened. We've been talking about it for a couple of podcasts now that we heard that Schmaltz was getting close. Nice to be accurate about something. I was surprised at the term. It was longer than I thought it was going to be.

And I was a little surprised at the number. It was lower than I thought it was going to be. I thought the number was going to come in around 8.5. But it's pretty obvious what happened here, Kyle. The team agreed to bend on term and the player agreed to bend on the number. Like at the end of the day, it's pretty obvious. Nick Schmaltz wanted to stay there with the mammoth and they wanted him. Even though he wasn't drafted by them, he's come of age there.

He's one of them. It's pretty clear he's got a good chemistry with Keller. As we talked about, you know, it's a good reminder that not all of these conversations are about money and term, right? They're also about fit. How is a guy going to be used? And as we discussed, Schmaltz being a center now, a center for Keller especially,

is where they see him. And that got done. So he didn't want to leave. It's, you know, I'll say this. It's a real win for the mammoth too because I think earlier in the year, there was just a general feeling that there was no way they were going to be able to sign him.

and they did. And so it worked out for both sides. And if everybody compromises, you know, oftentimes the best negotiations are the one where everybody feels they won something and they lost something, right? And that's, and at the end of the day, both sides do end up winning.

You know, I think one of the things that, uh, I asked about is in this day and age, you can extend your effectiveness longer. if you take good care of yourself. There are so many things now we know about, like I briefly went into your hotel room in Milan

and you've got like a pharmacy in there. I don't know what you're doing in your room. Don't start paid in that picture. I mean, you're taking Amber's B12 shots now. So if you want to take good care of yourself, there's lots of opportunity to do it, particularly with a professional sports team. And apparently Schmaltz is quite good at that.

All right. Also coming down on Thursday, Elliot, the NHL, they announced that they have modified the penalty that was placed on the Ottawa Senators for the whole of Guinea Dadenov trade fiasco on his birthday, no less. July 2021, he was Delta Vegas. I wonder if they looked that up. When someone mentioned that to me,

I was like, really? I wonder if they did it. I wonder if someone in the NHL has a sense of humor. And then I remember, no, no, they don't. So that's right. So they traded in Vegas in 2021 and the trade protection that was not disclosed at the time, didn't come to light to almost a year later when Vegas tried to trade in Anaheim. So instead of forfeiting the first round pick completely this year,

which was the original punishment after selecting the last two, they will now pick 32nd this June. Now they cannot trade the pick. They're not eligible to win the draft lottery if they do miss the playoffs. Also find a million dollars Canadian. The mishap happened under previous ownership. Remember we interviewed Michael Landlauer at the Board of Governors meetings back in December in Colorado Springs. And there was some people on the aftermath going,

how could you not ask them about the whole first round pick situation? And the reason was we were told going in, He did not want to discuss it. And now we understand why, because though they may not have conveyed it publicly, quietly, there was a belief that this penalty would be lessened. And it was officially on Thursday. I have to say, first of all, I think it's the right outcome, but I'm surprised at it. Because I looked into it earlier this season and I was told it was very unlikely to be changed.

Now, I will say this, Kyle, the thing that I find most intriguing about this, is the timing. After the deadline? Yes. Yes. Now, didn't they do the same thing with the devils in 2014? Yes, but still, like, I mean, that's 12 years ago. I mean, you can, you know, you can change anything.

That's not like a precedent. That's like, that's like before the world invented fire or the wheel. Like, things have changed a lot since then, right? I guess. Because, you know, I think Ottawa wanted to try to do some things over the deadline. And what I'd heard was that it was harder for them to do them without a 2026 first. So I, although I'm sure they're ecstatic that they're getting the pickback, I did find it interesting that it wasn't officially reinstated until after the deadline.

Although officially they said that they cannot trade it. still, I found that whole thing very interesting. Right. Because even if you can't trade this one, if they had known before going in, well, at least we have pick number 32 this year. Yes. Maybe we're willing to part with our second round pick or another one. Or maybe our 2027 first or something like that, right? Correct.

Yes. So I did, I thought that whole thing was very interesting. But look, I think it's the right thing. It's just like the devils. You know, the ownership has changed. I would bet that the NHL also probably said to Michael Anlauer, you might have thought that was a really entertaining a press conference that one time. We didn't.

And we'd kind of prefer if there not be any repeats in the future. Why I inherited this is beyond me. It was one of like the great lives. Don't let them muzzle you. Michael. Yeah. Don't let them muzzle you. It was gold.

Absolutely gold. Fight the man. Don't let the man put you down. But again, I think it was the right thing. And I thought the draft pick should have been reinstated. To me, to me it is the proper outcome. The other really funny thing I heard about it was, I had one guy say to me, he said,

it's not a real fine. And I go, what do you mean it's not a real? It's a million dollars. It goes, because it's a Canadian dollars. I go, it's still a million dollars. It goes, everything in this league is in US dollars. How come that fine is in Canadian? I thought that was really funny too.

That was odd. Because you're right. Everything's done in US dollars around the league, except in this case. I don't know. That would be a fine if it was slapped on me. I'll tell you that much. I would feel that one. Me too.

Oh, my God. Is that funny, though? I was laughing all day. Someone says me a text. It's not a real fine. It's in Canadian dollars. They completely let them off the hook. They only have to pay in Canadian.

They're paying in triangle rewards now. Oh, God. Gosh, that is excellent. Do you want to talk about Montreal a little bit? Because suddenly you talk about, you know, the playoff race to the bottom of the east, you know, first place in the Atlantic is not out of the sites for Montreal. Big back-to-back wins over Toronto Tuesday and then walking into Ottawa knowing how badly the Sends need points and beating them in regulation with 21-year-old Jacob Fowler,

phenomenal shutting it down in the latter stages. You know, I could see roster manipulation here for the Canadians. You know, you're allowed to be over 23 now as long as you're under the salary cap. You know, the one thing you have to be, the one thing now is you only get five call-ups, right? And he's not an emergency call-up. So, like, it just makes me wonder, is this kid just going to be here to stay? Hmm. Why not?

You know, I mean, you're, you've got to win games. you're in it for playoff position. As you said, winning the division, they're four points, they're two points behind Tampa and they're four points behind Buffalo. They've played the same number of games as Tampa, and they've got two games in hand on the Sabres.

Their tiebreakers really not good. They're not going to catch either one of those teams. They're six behind the lightning and nine behind the Sabres and the tiebreakers. for regulation wins. But I think if you're the Canadians, you want to put your team in a mood. Like we're out to win every game now

and we're playing our best goalie, no matter who it is. You know, like before the deadline, you could probably do up-down, up-down if you wanted to, but now with your call-ups limited and the other thing for them is your call-ups are limited until your HL team is out. You know, their HL-L-T,

team is pretty good. So you're not necessarily banking on them, uh, to be out early for that reason. So I don't know. I mean, I think if it was me, he's staying and I maneuver my roster as I have to. I'd have no problem with that. No problem. Because I think at this time of year, you have to have a mentality for your team that were in playoff mode and you treat these games like you're in playoff mode.

Because I don't think they're making the call to have them start Wednesday night. If they don't envision them as a possible option come playoff time. Game one of the playoffs. Absolutely. And the other thing too about Marty San Luis, and I think this matters is there'd be a lot of people saying, you know what, he's too young, is he really ready for this? I mean, he sure looked ready for it at the end of regulation the other night.

but you take a look at Marty San Luis path to the NHL, both as a player and as a coach, I think he just throws conventional wisdom out on its ear. Like he won't care about stuff like that. He'll simply look at the kid and say, is he ready? And, you know, when Marty San Luis took over his head coach of the Canadians, people were like, this is nuts. And look at the job he's done there. So do you think he's going to be phased by a first year pro?

No chance. Zero chance. What did he say to Sean McKenzie when they did the interview pregame on Wednesday? I think you can tell when he's in the net. Yes. That goes a long way. And he believes in that. Like he believes in presence.

Awesome. Kyle, did you see the picture the Edmonton Oilers posted after the Dallas game? Looking at it right now. Connor McDavid and Micah Parsons. Oh, look at that. With like novels written on the jerseys. Yeah, it's actually, it's a cool shot. Now, I can only imagine,

you've seen McDavid after losses like this. He's not going to be mean mugging Micah Parsons. I can tell you that much. One of the few athletes that he'll manage to stomach a smile for for the photo. that is excellent. That's a great picture. I have to say this, even though the site of a Packard's jersey

makes me vomit, that's an awesome photo. It's just, it's one of the great athletes of our generation and the Oilers captain all together. I knew that's where you were going.

I know you're trembling in fear. Kyler Murray, I know you are scared right now. Yeah, it's, can't wait for September. Can't wait for September, man. All right, with that, it's time now for the final thought. Presented by the Toyota BZ, go all-electric and a winter-ready Toyota BZ at your local dealer today. Elliot, got a busy week coming up. As we mentioned, we'll be down in Florida for the GM meetings, the first half of the week.

and then you jet off to the opposite corner of the continent to Vancouver. Thursday night, the Canucks hosting the Tampa Bay Lightning. It's the 36th annual Canucks for Kids Fund Telethon. The event raised over $600,000 last year. This is an event you have been part of before. How are you feeling about the opportunity to go back? And were you surprised you got another invite? I'm always thankful.

I would say not surprised. I'm always thankful. Like this is something I really love doing. And, you know, I'll say this about Kinnock Nation. They are incredibly generous. They are incredibly generous. And I'm glad to be a small part of it. Co-hosting this year with Olivia McDonald.

Nice. She's going to be, yeah, she's going to be doing it with me. She will be carrying me through this broadcast. And as you said, yes, we finished the GM meetings on Wednesday. And then I will be making, you may have heard there's no direct flights from Palm Beach to Vancouver. So it's a long travel day and it's worth it. But I'm very excited. You know, one of the challenges for a year like this one is it's always been tougher.

Like the mood around the Canucks is usually equal to how well the telethon does. You know, they had a big win on Thursday night. They beat the Predators and a shootout. came back late to win that game. But I look at that as a challenge, Kyle. Like I said, Kinnock Nation has been incredibly generous over the years. I've always been impressed, never been disappointed. So even though this has been a harder year,

I'm taking it as a challenge to try to get a big number. And, you know, one of the things was pointed out to me is that they're already opening up space for donations. and it's at Canox.com slash telethon. Canox.com slash telethon. So it's already opened for donations. And I always say this, any amount helps. I've met people before.

They're like, oh, I don't have a lot. I don't care. Any amount helps. And to me, it's just the fact that you do whatever you can to help out. That is what matters, not so much the number. Well, after your work with Winnipeg this week, you are setting yourself up for an incredible, incredible night, I'm sure. Thanks, Carl.

That's going to be awesome. I'm glad you're going out there for it. And a wonderful, wonderful cause that they continue to do. 36 years now. That's very impressive. Awesome stuff. Okay, that was the final thought presented by the Toyota BZ. It's about time for our first break.

Oh, we should mention, because we haven't yet, Glenn Healy of the NHL Alumni Association. We have an interview with him coming up a little later on in the show. Before that, though, another edition of the thought line. That'll be after this. All right, welcome back. Here we go. Another round of the thought line.

Elliot, remind me again, are you a big video game guy? Not hugely, but I would like to thank the hundreds, and I am not lying. The number was in the hundreds of people who sent me the link either in my DMs on X or on Instagram for Trash Day, the new raccoon-themed video game that was revealed on social media. I am not joking when I say the number of you who shared it with me one way or another was in triple digits. And I laughed at everyone. Because, yes, and that's, and I know it was big because usually these things are just sent directly to you. I was tagged in a bunch of it. So that makes sense that the number eclipsed 100.

So yes, I was looking at the post. Trash Day has been announced co-op adventure game where you and your friends play as raccoons scavenging junk made by X Rocket League developers. So you know it's got to be good. The game supports up to four players online. and is coming to PC via Steam. So you, me, Dom, who's our fourth? Would Max play? He probably would, yes.

He's really good at Super Mario Games. He's won, like, I think the best one, the one I've seen that I really think is the best is Luigi's Mansion, and he's won that a thousand times. So he would probably play, yes. All right, so he'd be our ringer. that's excellent. He would be a ringer. It would be a great, great bonding exercise trying to navigate trash day as a team.

Or it would reveal our flaws as a group in a major way. So, like, we need our flaws revealed even more than they already are. That's right. By the way, just tune into this place. Speaking of that, speaking of that, for those of you who are not familiar with how the sausage gets put together, this thought line was done on Wednesday because of travel. I was unavailable to do it on Thursday, and I just want to let you know that in my hotel room right now, Kyle,

it is a balmy 73. Oh, gosh. Chances of it increasing throughout the night, I imagine. I don't know. It's pretty warm today. I had a good hour-long walk. It was nice. And 73 seems very reasonable.

Yeah. You throw, I see you've got a nice quarter zip on. I imagine. you wear that to bed, keep the body temp up. It's crazy. Of all the things in that Iliad experience, that was the nuttyest. Okay.

Waking up like a slightly toasted hot dog. Yes. All right. You thought trash day was good. Get a load of this. Emily, high 32 thoughts team. I'm a graduate student in biology and a long time listener to your marvelous podcast.

surely Emily's mistaking us for somebody else. I recently read... Emily, you wrote into the wrong podcast. I recently read about the study, which she has attached, and also includes which sadly I was not involved in, and the parallels to Mr. Friedman's raccoon alter ego and love of logic puzzles were too uncanny

not to email you about. So I'll just read the title of this study, Elliot, and see if it makes any connection or resonates with you at all. Raccoons optimally forage for information, exploration, exploitation tradeoffs in innovation. So they have a thirst for knowledge and love. The study goes in about problem solving, all of it, all the things that you love to do in your spare time.

So she goes on to say, I'm sure you'll probably get a lot of messages about this study, but it's just more evidence to suggest that Elliot is in fact himself a raccoon. Thank you for all your wonderful coverage of the Olympics and the trade deadline. All of you are awesome and great company on long runs. Go Cains. Well, Emily, first of all, thank you very much for that very kind note. I would freely admit that they are smarter than I am.

That much is clear. I got to tell you, so on, it's suddenly, finally got nicer in Toronto. On Tuesday, I went on to my back deck for the first time since the snow melted, just to relax out there, take a couple of phone calls. It was so nice, get some fresh air. There is poop everywhere. Oh, no. Like, everywhere. It is just, it's just brutal.

They've, and there's old poop, there's new poop. I'm like, I'm going to have to hire someone to kind of remove it. It's crazy. Oh, geez. That doesn't sound relaxing at all. It's just insane. Like, honestly, Kyle, it's everywhere. Like, this year, it's raccoons have sweat.

If we were an HL playoff series, it would be a sweep and none of the games were close. The raccoons have pounded me this winter. Oh, geez. Oh, well, you've got a whole season coming between spring and summer to try to even the score. Though it feels the odds are long. Okay, let's get to the hockey portion of this thought line. Francois from Quebec City. Hi, Elliot and Kyle.

This is Francois, a teacher from Quebec City, big fan of the pod, had a question about how trade rumors sometimes start around the league. With the recent speculation around Robert Thomas and the St. Louis Blues, It made me wonder if sometimes a general manager might intentionally allow a room to circulate about a player, not necessarily because they want to move them, but to get other GMs calling. Then, when those calls come in, they can pivot and talk about other players. They're actually interested in moving. Ahem, Matthew Nyes.

Does that type of tactic happen around the NHL? And if so, how common is it? And how do GMs start them? So Francois, bonsoir. Let me just start by welcoming you in your official language. And thank you for the question. They start in different ways. Sometimes, you know, I will say this for a lot of general managers,

this kind of stuff is the bane of their existence. Some managers really hate these things. They don't like that, they don't like what it can do. to a player or their dressing room or the player's family. But sometimes conversations between general managers get out. Other people talk about them. Things get overheard. There's broken telephone.

You know, there have been situations where I've called a manager said, I've heard this and they'll either deny it or they'll say they don't want to lie or they'll just say, look, I don't want to talk about it. I think, you know, for lack of a better term, I think if someone doesn't tell you directly, people talk and things get out. Now, there are some things that never get out. There are some teams,

like I think the teams that get covered more, like the Canadian teams, it's not impossible to keep a secret, but it's harder because there's so much discussion around you. And, you know, sometimes I think that teams or agents or sometimes even players, they want something to happen or something to occur so they get it out there so it can occur. You know, I think all of this stuff happens.

Sometimes people use it to their advantage, sometimes because people want something to happen, sometimes because people are mad at someone else. But I think generally the preference is to keep it quiet. Like one of the ones, Francois, that was kept really quiet that I was surprised, was Catergoche getting traded from Philadelphia. Philadelphia to Anaheim. Normally if a prospect like that had asked for a trade, I think it would have gotten out, but that was a rare one where the Flyers and the agent for Goce kept it quiet. You know, I think quite simply, honestly, Francois, people talk. And, you know, one of the things

I've learned about the general manager community is they consider themselves a kind of group of 32 that understand each other's problems. Like when you're in one of those chairs, sometimes the only person who understands the challenges you face in that chair is another one of those 31 people, right? And I think they talk amongst themselves and maybe they'll share information

with some of their lieutenants and things get around. I think that's a lot of how it happens. But, you know, I hope that answers your question. But like, you know, for example, you know, McKenzie Weeger, who was on our trade deadline show as a guest and, you know, we kind of talked about his surprise at how it got out. You know, I think what happens is you try to keep it to a small group, but maybe, you know, you ask someone for advice or sometimes the wives group finds about it.

And, you know, it just spreads. And nobody means for it in any negative, hurtful way. But, you know, the more people hear things, the more of a chance. spreads and that's generally the way it goes. And a lot of what I do, I think, is just broken telephone. Hey, I'm hearing this. You know, what, you know, is it true, not true? What's the accuracy? Kyle, do you think that's an acceptable way of explaining it? I tried to keep it as simple as possible. I think so. It gives a great little peek behind the curtain of just the way these guys think. And to your point, I mean, it's it's never the same across the board. There could be many different

circumstances and way certain players names kind of come into the fold in terms of discussions, whether through GMs or from the agent, it's never always cut and dry the same process between organizations, situationally, it's all different. So I think that that is a good little snapshot there, Fridge. You know, one thing I will say, Kyle, is I've told the story on the pod before about how several years ago there was one manager who called me about something and he said I'm going to ask you to put this out there and I said is it true and he goes oh yeah it's true and I go why are you telling me this and he said look like our owner is thinking about this and I think it's a bad idea and you know the only way that I can maybe stop it is if the response is negative enough that he changes his mind and I was like wow and but like the thing I asked first and foremost was could it happen? And he said, yes, it's legit. I'm not making this up. And I reported it. And a few days later, I checked back and I said, what's going on with this? And he said, nothing's going to

happen because, you know, the response was kind of what I hoped it would be. And I actually, I've told that story a couple times and people have asked, how much does that happen now? And I, I don't think that, that hasn't happened to me in a long time. So, like, that was one specific case where an owner was trying to talk a manager into something that he didn't think was good for his team, and he put it out there hoping their reaction would be negative enough that the owner would change his mind. And that did happen in this particular case. Excellent. All right.

Mike from Buffalo. Gentlemen, the Sabres traded for Luke Shen, Logan Stanley, and Tanner Pearson from Winnipeg, all Canadians that were on a Canadian team. I understood that since the trade deadline was at 3 p.m. Eastern, It would be difficult to get their visa squared away before a government office closed up shop on Friday, and they would not be able to play over the weekend. But then I saw Nazim Kadri suit up for Colorado over the weekend, who was also a Canadian that previously played for a Canadian team.

Did the time zone allow Cadri enough time to get a visa or were there some other reasons? He was eligible to play. Also, do the individual teams or league employ experts in this field in order to expedite this process? Thanks for your time. and let's go Buffalo. Boy, that is a great question. And, you know, I'll say this. People are employed to do this kind of thing.

And sometimes it comes down to, yes, where you're based. Do you have extra time? Like that extra couple. I don't know specifically in this case with Cadry if that made a difference, but I have heard of situ I asked, you know, I don't normally like Kyle sending me thought line questions before.

I like to think them off the top of my head, but Kyle wisely did send me this one, and I asked a couple of questions. And, you know, people were, you know, I don't want to get into this too much. I think everybody will understand what I'm saying here, but people are really sensitive

about asking this question at this time because, you know, you really, in the world we live in now, your paperwork has to be thorough. And teams and agents did tell me that right now, you know, if you make a mistake in your paperwork, it can really cause you a problem. So you really have to be on top of things.

You really have to be careful in what you do. But, you know, a couple hours, yes, can make a difference. And the other thing too is it also can come down to, you know, sometimes where you contact someone. Do you have lawyers on staff who've done this a lot before? Do they have good connections with people who need to get visas done? Have you worked together with someone a lot before who kind of knows you? Do you have a history of playing in the United States?

That absolutely can be a factor. Like someone did say to me that the fact that the fact that, Cadre played in the states recently could have really helped him as opposed to a player like Logan Stanley who hadn't played in the U.S. Yes, it can be a factor. But oftentimes it can be which office you contact, which one you deal with normally. Do you have a connection there where you've dealt with someone really well in the past? Is there any reason that this player would have a challenge getting over the line? I know somebody who just in a different job,

who not in the NHL, but he had to move back to the U.S. for work. And he had an old green card. And he was told, you know what? Times ago, this wouldn't have been a problem to get your visa back quick, but the way it is now, it's different. So I think the political times that we live in

have made it more challenging. oftentimes it can simply come down to what's your relationship with or do you have somebody who has a good relationship with who can move things along pretty quickly. For athletes, it's generally pretty fast. You know, like I've had some people tell me today if it wasn't an athlete, it can be a more difficult process, but some situations do move quicker than others. And yes, the fact that Colorado was not Eastern time, it's mountain time. absolutely can make a difference. And also, I mean, going back to remember when Anderson, Rasmus Anderson, got traded to Vegas and the team shortly thereafter did an Eastern Canadian road trip,

and he played his first game in Toronto. Remember some people with the team were saying, like, we're hopeful that it should be all squared away by the time we get back to Vegas, but they just didn't want to speak too soon because, as you say, like just the way the landscape is right now, they didn't want to risk rushing anything. and then really be caught in a bind. You know, I will say this.

The people I spoke to, they said, like, you said, there's no shortcut. You go by the book and you're hoping that you have someone who really knows how to get through things quick and that they see that you're a sports team and that you do this a lot. And it's part of the game and they try to make it happen as quick as possible. All right. Mike, thank you for that. Up next, a voicemail from an unconstitutional. unnamed Leafs fan.

Hey there, Kyle, Dom, and our favorite commander in the fight against the raccoons, Elliot. I am a currently suffering Toronto Maple Leafs fan who had a question about how Toronto retaining its own draft pick works. If Toronto finishes in the bottom five in the NHL this year, they keep their own first round pick. My question is, can they then trade that pick? or do they have to make the draft selection if they finish in the bottom five?

Thanks so much for the pod, guys. I listen to you every morning and a huge fan. Alex in Vancouver. Yeah, have a great last year week. Oh, so there was a name there attacked on the end. Alex in Vancouver.

Well, you know, I have to say, Alex, that was a bit sketchy. You didn't actually give me a lot of confidence that your name is actually Alex in Vancouver. I brought a work indeed. Yeah, it's like, it's like, uh, Fletch. I know your generation is Anchorman. Mine is Fletch. John, I'm John Cockatozen. Like that's, that's the one that for my, my generation that we all laugh at. Um, that's pretty funny. So the, the honest truth is if, if they get the pick and they keep the pick and it's, they say,

finished third overall after the lottery, they can trade it if they want to. It's theirs. So they get to choose what they want to do with it. Right. And the other thing, too, I mean, it was going to open a whole other can of worms that if they do get their pick back by finishing low enough this year,

I mean, effectively, the first round picks the two years after that are unprotected, whether they end up in Boston or in Philly. Now, I suppose you'd rather have the draft pick this June than the one, two June's from now is they're trying to turn things around. quick, but it's like it doesn't solve everything if they get into the bottom five here, this year, but a long ways to go. All right, one final one here.

Another Quebec City flavor, this one from Felix. Hello, Elliot, Kyle, and Dom. Long-time listener from Quebec City here. I've noticed something this season with Samuel Montembo in Montreal that keeps coming up among Canadians fans. It feels like he gives up a goal on the first shot of the game, surprisingly often. And he goes, it actually happened twice

against the ducks last week after the first one was disallowed. And it made me wonder if it's actually measurable. Do you know if anyone tracks goals allowed in the first shot faced in a game? And if so,

is Montembo near the top of the league for that this season? I'd also be curious if there's any historical data on this for goalies. Has anyone ever been known for giving up a lot of first shot goals over a season?

Merci, poor Votra. Bolte d'i. It's our pleasure, Felix. I understood exactly what that meant. I can understand French written and spoken by you. May the Quebec wild parl three vit pour moi. I can't understand them. Too fast.

Who is it this year that was giving up a shot on the first goal all the time? It was Buffalo, right? Didn't they have like eight or nine games where they gave up a shot on the first shot? Give up a goal on the first shot? Well, they're not. Like, I've got the top three guys this year, and none of them are from the Sabres. Well, Toronto went through a stretch where they were scoring on the first shot.

Yes, but there was someone this year, was it Philly? Like, somebody was giving up goals on the first shots this year, an unbelievable amount. Are you thinking of... Who is it this year? It's Lukash Dostel, surprisingly, in Anaheim. It is? I would never have gotten that.

Eight times this year. And Felix was right to be worried about a walking boat. People, by the way, are still mad at me for that quarter final against Chequius, saying that he could beat Canada. He almost did. Yes. So Dostell's first, who else is there?

Yeah, and Felix was right to be worried about Montembo. He's second at seven, and Dustin Wolf in Calgary, third at six. So our group was able to go back to the 13-14 season to look at who had the most in one season, giving up a goal on the first shot tied for one the two goalies it both came in the same year the 2017 2018 year one is still playing the other one should surprise you that he's at the top of this list they were both teammates for a period of time but weren't in this particular season is one of them jonathan quick no okay let's see but like yes that era like if you think Jonathan quick kind of at the height of his powers this goalie was also among the games elite around that time hall of famer like well you know who was jumping into my head who's still playing bobrowski so he's third in the 22 23 year it did it nine times

Okay. I'm trying to think who was the, um, is it like, Carrie Price? No. Because he's a Hall of Famer. Mm-hmm. The only other guy I could think of who could be a Hall of Famer around that time. Oh, wait a sec. Are we talking about Lundqvist?

Yes. Really? Ten times in 2017, 18. Jesus. He gave up a goal on the first shot. Now, the other guy. also at 10 was a teammate for Lungquist

was a teammate with Lungquist for a number of years but not this particular season and he's still playing That's got to be Cam Talbot Bingo nicely done Your hints were great those were great hints They sit at top the list

probably not a list you want to be at the top of but yeah surprisingly As great as Lundquist was over his career of the 1718 campaign, which was a tough one for the Rangers, as you remember. I think that was the year of the list one point or the letter 1.0. That was that season. Oh, that's right. Probably one of the reasons why.

So Felix, thank you for that. And great question, by the way. Excellent questions. That's a fun one. All right, love to wrap it up with a bit of trivia at the end. Thank you, SportsNet stats. Oh, okay. for your continued help all season long.

And thank you to the listeners for great submissions once again. If you would like to join the party, please do so. You can send us a voicemail 1833-3-3-1-3-1-3-2-32, or you can email us at 32th Thoughts at Sportsnet.ca. When we come back, our conversation with Glenn Healy with the NHL Alumni Association. You don't want to miss. That's on the other side of this break on 32 Thoughts, the podcast.

All right, as promised, with the 2026, Keith Magnuson, man of the year award celebrations happening tomorrow night at the concert hall in Toronto, where Paul Coffey will be honored and celebrated a conversation with the man, boy, do we ever miss on the air? Thankfully, he parked aside just over a half hour to chat with us

here on 32 Thoughts, the podcast. It's Glenn Healey on 32 Thoughts. So pleased to be joined here on 32 Thoughts with Glenn Healy. a longtime NHL netminder, Stanley Cup champion, long-time broadcaster, and now maybe most importantly, his role as president and executive director with the NHL Alumni Association. Glenn, great to see you. Welcome to the pod.

I'm sure you've got something you've got to get off your chest with your old travel buddy here alongside in Elliott. I'm just glad this is audio only because I'm looking at you. Kyle, you look as great as splendid as you always look. I don't know about that. And yet I'm looking at Elliot and, man, he's got a Halliburton dinner jacket on and he is, it's like you just roll out of bed.

We joked about it because, you know, he was a couple minutes late coming on this show. And we joked about the time in Washington, hockey night in Canada. I show up at the lobby. We're supposed to meet at, let's say, 4 o'clock. No, Elliot, 410, 415. And I wonder why there's all these guys in suits

staring at me. And I feel like these red dots on my forehead come to find out Barack Obama is in the hotel, and the secret security thinks I'm some sort of an infiltrator to the meeting. But, Elliot, just take your time while I get patented down, grilled, interrogated. I've never been back to the U.S. since. Anyways, good to see you, Elliot. If I know that was going on, I would have taken longer.

I just have to tell you that there are some people who follow. out of bed and look good. And there are some people who fall out of bed and don't look good. Kyle is in group A and I am in group B. I just took a nap. I woke up from a nap and Kyle can look great after doing that. I can't. And before we start the formal part of the interview,

I just want to say here, Glenn showed us the room he's in. I have to tell everybody, Glenn still has his Christmas tree up. What is the story with that? Well, Elliot, there are moments during a year when you're maybe just a little pick-me-up, you know, and so I don't know why it's got to be two weeks of a year that you have your tree up, and this one's clearly not real. Otherwise, it would be just a bunch of branches. But those times when you're just a little down and you want a little pick-me-up,

you light the tree, you put some Christmas music on. And I think the traditions started back when I used to play in different cities. I was never home in Toronto until the last number of years for Christmas. We would actually have Christmas in July because I wouldn't be home for Christmas, wouldn't get to celebrate with the family. And in fact, early in my journey as an NHL player, we basically played Christmas Eve and played the day after Christmas. So there was no real celebratory holiday of any significance.

So we started that tradition, we kept it up. And then as a grumpy old guy, after working with you for too many years, becoming grumpyer, I've just decided to keep it up. And anytime you guys want to come over, there's always a present under the tree for you, Elliot. Always a lump of hole for you, always. But hey, you can laugh. But those moments when you are down and out, trade deadline, hang on a limb, let's go to Elliot. don't have any trades, Kyle and Elliot.

Two full hours, no trades. Don't you wish you had a Christmas tree instead of someone putting makeup on your stupid ugly mug? You know what? Actually, Glenn, I have to say, after hearing that, I really respect it. I do. And the show's over. Congratulations. I know what?

If turning on the Christmas tree and putting on a bit of music brings you through a hard day, I like it. I respect it. I bet you there's going to be somebody who listens to this says, I'm doing that. Why not? I'm a trendsetter. You've seen the way I dress the fashions.

You know that everyone's wearing kilts now. Everybody. Everyone's wearing kilts. You know that. Come on. Yeah, let's be honest. Well, probably not. That'll never come into fashion.

But at the end of the day, happiness and kindness is free. And so if this gets me through another year, hallelujah. It gets me through another year. It's a beautiful setup you got there, heels. It looks like, I mean, just in behind you, that's like an ideal setting for like a murder mystery party. Something like that. It is incredible.

I can think of one guest I'd like to have over. Oh, no, no, I can think of two. But one would be easier to get here from Toronto. Let's say the address. Let me just look it up. No, I would never do that. Yeah, it's, you know, when we play, wherever city I played in,

whether it was in L.A., whether it was in New York, with the Islanders or with the Rangers, we always came back here. I'm in the Durham region. Love the community, love the people, love what this community stands for, love the charitable foundations that we've been a part of for decades.

And so coming back here, it was always home, always knew I wanted to come back when I retired. And I managed to get to play four years with Toronto. So moving back here, it was just a matter of doing laundry. Perfect. I'm back home.

So I'll never move. I think this is home. We've established some roots. There are a lot of players, oh, man, do they jump around one year Montreal, one year, Bahamas, next year, L.A. You know, you can hardly keep track. I can tell when they've moved because Christmas cards come back with Return Descender. And it's like, well, they never told me they moved, and maybe it was on purpose.

But this for us is our roots are here. We've dropped anchor and we won't go. And it's lovely. Kids have grown up here. They've all grown up in the same house. They all are established. All went to university. Some of them even went to the same school Elliot went to.

I can't believe Elliot got in. It was a tough school to get into. But it's home. Home is where the heart is. You know, I actually want to talk about your place. This actually ties into some of the stuff we're going to talk about. But for all of the craziness, I've seen and heard from you over the years, I think you've, you give a lot of great advice to players and especially young players coming into the game.

I remember years ago we interviewed Alex Petrangelo and Patrangelo had the reputation of the guy everybody went to for advice. Like, what do you think about this? They'd ask me to give good life advice. So I'm going to, like, you're very proud of your home. You talk about it all the time. But you bought it, like, I think with your first contract, right, Glenn? Like the first thing you ever did when you got a contract was buy the place. So you had something smart you put your money into.

Is that correct? Well, I think, yeah, your investment vehicle should not have four wheels. Just letting you know, should not have something with four wheels as an investment vehicle. Now, you know, everything has changed over time, Elliot. Like my first contract, I made $72,000 in the NHL. I made $23,000. And I might be lying by $500. I'd have to look, but $23,000 in the HL when I played for the New Haven chickyhawks.

And then I negotiated, I was like basically, you know, super sleuth negotiator. I didn't have a third way on my contract, which would have allowed me to make $10,000 in the IHL when that league existed of significance, because we all shared farm clubs. We didn't have our own farm club where you could put 23 players down.

So when you looked at it back in the 80s, mid-80s, you realized pretty quick that in a short career with a long life, you're probably not going to play a lot of years to be able to put your feet up and say, that's good for me. Good for the next 50 years. Just going to sit back and just let the money come in. So you had to do things that were smart.

And what mattered to me was purchasing a home, setting some roots down. And if the game provided me that, and that's all the game provided me, then I thought I had a step up from where I was when I left Western Michigan University and I had a so-called double major, which really was a major in babysitting and in daycare.

So I was a great double major. But quite frankly, it was just a matter of understanding these were the times. Times changed. Salaries improved. Bob Good now kind of grabbed us by the throat. 92 with the strike changed a lot of things. The lockout in 94 changed a lot. We gained our player like this in 92, fought for a lot of different rights, arbitration, free agency.

These are all massive changes that have really paved the way. for the guys to drive on the roads. I got to drive on the roads that were paid that Ted Lindsay allowed for me to get to. And then the current players are driving on an Autobot. So things are a lot different as time has gone on. So there is relativity and everything, relativity in the way the game has played today, the salaries, the business.

You know, you look at teams like the Ottawa Center sold for a billion dollars. When I played, the team was sold for the price of, an interchange. The institutional equity that the alumni built into that franchise has allowed for these teams to be sold for billions of dollars. So good on us, but, you know, I had to look at it from the days of, you know, I didn't want to cash my first check. I thought I was rich. And looking back on it now, boy, times did change. But yeah, no, if there's one thing you're going to invest in, and it's a place that you can put your feet up and build a family. And if that's, what we give to our most prized treasure, which is our children, then we've done a pretty good job.

And I think for the most part, that was my focus right off the bat. Although I would have loved that Maserati that you're driving. Actually, no, Elliot, I drove one time after a game. You don't drive a Maserati or a Rolls-Royce. You drive a garbage truck. I have never seen more cups and coffee mugs and press notes in my life. in your car. It's better now. It used to be really bad. I do a better job of it. Congratulations. And you know what, Glenn, like I am a little bit like you in the sense that I probably underspend on cars.

And if you're going to, when I was younger, if you could, if you had to spend a little bit more on investing in where you lived, I would do that. Can't work for everybody, but that is the way I've always tried to think. So, Glenn, 2017, right, you take the role at the Alumni Association, but your work in the space far precedes that. And the whole idea of setting players up better tomorrow than the reality that they live in today. Like, what do you remember about when you first had that feeling that the work in that area mattered to you as opposed to just being along for the ride as a, professional hockey player.

Well, you know, I think that there are a couple things that are true with players. One is one guarantee I can make. Every player retires. The current guys that you went down the list and looked at their salaries and who's going to stay and who's going to go. They're all going to retire. Every single one of them. So that's a reality.

Not every one of them retires and transitions well. And I can say that for every industry. I can say that for people that leave television and the job is taken away from them and then it's what's next. That transition can be very hard. It could be the same for lawyers and CEOs. So for us, with our unique brotherhood, we have a very short career, very short. Average age of an NHL player today is 23 and a half.

Average career is two years, just slightly over. So that's your average. Some guys play 15 years, 16 years. I was lucky. I was one of the lucky ones. Not everyone gets that luck in the. life. And so that short, career, long life, they never correlate together. So our unique brotherhood says, let's take care of one another. Let's protect and take care of one another as best we can.

And when I took over, there was a bunch of services that were not available to players in the sense that, you know, we're like humidity years in our life. We're 50, but really we feel like 70. Our bodies give up on us. The game beats us up in a huge way. So physically, we need to get a little bit of help. Financially, sometimes we need some help. And certainly the guys in the 60s, 70s, and 80s have definitely needed that. The game did not give them justice. There are marital issues.

There are financial issues. They're emotional issues. And I think the biggest one that kind of reared its head, the tsunami that's approached us after COVID has been the mental wellness space. Our willingness to share our mental wellness issues and our willingness to say, I deserve better. And so for myself in this, role, my job's very easy with our staff, make tomorrow better than today, and for players that are

minus help and hope, provide that help and hope in a huge way so that where they don't know where to turn, they can turn to this organization, to this group, and understand they've got 5,000 friends that are their family that are going to put their arm around them and make a difference for them. So that's been the biggest change. You know, I'm not looking back at past regimes. I'm just saying moving forward from the minute I took the job, it was going to be amateur hour is over. It is time to put our big boy pants on and having guys like Gretzky and Lemieux and it's all about the players, having Messier, having Paul Coffey, the players have made this work. It's not me.

There might be some vision, some leadership, but the players are the ones that have said, we're going to make a difference together. And it is unique. It's better than any other sport. and I'm proud to say we are better than any alumni in any other sport. I didn't get Marvin Miller to get me some of the benefits he created in baseball, but I certainly look at the benefits that we create today, and it's all because the players, the alumni, have said,

let me help, and how can I help more? It's a pleasure to see. So, Glenn, you mentioned Gradsky and you mentioned Lemieux. I've heard you tell the story privately, and I'd like you to ask you to share it publicly. when you took over as the head of the NHL alumni, I understand you went to the two of them and you said, we cannot do this without you. If we want to be successful, we need the two of you.

Can you discuss those conversations and what they had to say? More of Wayne than anything in the sense that, you know, he had an organization with like Dave Semenkel that died without getting a medical. And so you sit back and, you know, you kind of, you look at that and you think about what Dave did, He fought for everybody on the ice. He never fought a fight for himself.

He fought for everybody else. And so, you know, for Wayne to come in and say, okay, well, fix this. All right. Well, there were a couple things I needed. Well, one, I need baby Jesus in the manger. So Christmas morning comes to the point where my trees here. Well, I need Wayne, clearly. Best player has ever played the game.

And so that was an issue. We needed to create our own logo. We didn't have our own logo and Gretz's vision of scoring 802 certainly something that would have given us autonomy away from what was once owned by the league so anything I did I had to go to them. We also had to have a group of players

who would show up when we're looking at putting fuel in the tank and building a business base because, you know, if you have 3,800 Glen Healy's, not a lot you're going to make with 3,800 Glenn Heelies. And so a lot of what was created with the players, with the Messia's, with the Adam Graves and the coffees and go down the list is almost like a complete copy of what we did in 92 when we sat down and took back our player likeness and decided why can't we put players into hockey card sets? That would be valuable. Why can't we put players

into a video game? I mean, the most popular player in the video game of just a few years ago. It wasn't Conner McDavid. It wasn't Wayne Gradsky. It was Johnny. Bauer because kids couldn't believe you mean a goalie play without a mask or I want to be him. And so why couldn't we do that or put players on whiskey bottles? And so these are things that we did to create the base, to create the fuel, to make tomorrow better than today on the side where the library of services medically, we are chock a block and full. And it again has to start with the big guys in the game that are willing to say, I want to

make a difference and I want to make a difference for that, that guy who doesn't have the strong voice that I have. So while you have your voice and while you have gas in the tank, why wouldn't you want to help those guys that helped you win championships? You know, you looked last year when Florida won their championship and it was the fourth line that got them back in the Toronto series, right? Who finished the game for the Florida Panthers? Because Paul Maurice is a classy guy. The fourth line, you got us here, you finished the job. That's the way. That's the sports are in hockey for this sport particular. It's not the big guys, the LeBron's, they get it all done with the Currys. It is an entire team. And I think our stars recognize that. And while they can

make a difference, they've been the ones that have stepped up. But it started with Gratz. It had to start with the best. And from that moment on, the players have said, we would like to make a difference. How do we do it? And how can I help? And they've done it in states. So what have been the biggest mountains, I guess you felt you've had to move? Because a couple times I've talked to you about this in the past, Glenn. It's like two completely different worlds of where things were at, 10 years ago even, to the reality looking for retired players today. Well, I think there's not one mountain we've climbed and we got to the top and said,

Hallelujah, we're here. It's over now. Put your feet up, everybody. you know, these tablets, they're all enshrined now. They've all been engraved. So let's go to the First Commandment, and we're done. We're done, by the way. Yes.

I think probably one of our biggest achievements most recently, and I think it took a lot of years to accomplish. And it took the Players Association and Marty Walsh, and it took Gary, Batman and Bill Daly, is health care, is a wellness plan. You know, our players, when we finish the game, do not have health care and do not have a wellness plan. We have 1,300 players that are European, and they go back to Europe without a health care plan.

You have a bunch of players that will be in the U.S., and there's a lot of them, and we know what the issues and challenges are south of the border. The Canadians, we have a universal health care plan, but does it allow you the dignity to maybe pass away other than having three people watch you because you're an award because you don't have a semi-private or you don't have prescription medication for cancer or you don't have. have that ability to, uh, to, you know, take care of a wife. And that's one of the things we do in our sport. We take care of the wives and kids too. If it's not right in your home, it's not right with you. So getting a wellness plan and it was facilitated through the vision of not only ourselves, but the PA in the league. I think that's been our biggest accomplishment. And, and the second of June that comes into fruition. You know, none of us have our own teeth. So as you could imagine, Kyle and Elliot, man.

There is a dental plan as part of this. And so we'll probably be looking a lot prettier than Kyle. Give us a couple months, but we're going to put some heat on you. Well, maybe not you. Some other guys might, but not you. Yeah, but things like that, that I think is the biggest one. Changing the culture a little bit. Like every player has a number now, and that number signifies when you signed your

NHL contract. I'm player number 2144. So that means any player that played before me, Gordy Howe's number one, Jean Belivose eight, Doug Harvey's number two, Wayne Gretzky's got a number. Anyone that played before me, I owe it to them to fight for the rights they fought for. Sidney Crosby, who is yet to get a card because he is not a retired player yet. Oh, maybe on the weekend, I'm hoping. Please, Sidney, no, keep playing, kid.

But he's player number 4495. So when he retires, it's his responsibility to make sure that, you know, all the work that we put in with social workers and doctors, don't let that go because you might have more money. So that culture is being built. So there's a number of different avenues that we've worked on. But a wellness plan, thank you to Gary Bettman, the league and the PA, that's going to be, that's our Christmas morning. It really is. It's a start of something that is so needed with the players. As I mentioned, we have humidity years in our body.

We're 60, but we're really going on 80. We need help because the game beats us up. I have two fake hips. It's not from bagpiping, and it's not from bagpiping poorly. It's from playing goal. And so I needed some help, and it's on its way June 2nd. So now that you've accomplished this, and congratulations, it's a great accomplishment for the alumni. What's next?

Like, what's the next thing you say, if I want to make it easy, even better for the alumni, we have to do this. Well, we're just starting. You know, one of the things I did when I first took over, I was getting suicide calls. Again, I went to Western Michigan. I'm not prepared or educated to take those calls. And so we hired a social worker out of Hamilton, Jerry Jermakka, wonderful guy, worked with the worst of the worst, and came into the situation and looked at our group

and said, okay, I'm in. he hired with us a female to work with the wives. We have a lot of players that have Alzheimer's, dementia, and Parkinson's, and the wives are the ones that are the caregivers. That's a hard job. And so they work with the wives. That's probably one of the best things we've done. So if we sit with three social workers and Ben Scrivens is our third,

he has all the papers on the wall but needs a lot more experience, and he works peer to peer with players, let's make it five. We have a doctor group that is extreme. Everything from dental to hip replacement to hearts to neurosurgery to scans for the brain. We have it all in our group now. We need to expand on that because when I played in 85, we talked about that at the start. There were 340 players in the league. Last year there was 1,100.

There's more and more guys playing in the league, more and more families that have, you know, big money means bigger issues that have bigger issues. We have to deal with them. And as I build this for our group, the Ted Lindsay's and God rest his soul that have passed us and you build it for that group. And then you get to the 90s and 2000. We are also building this for the players of today because we know that when they retire, their issues are not going to be Glenn Healy, Adam Graves, Paul Coffee issues. They are going to be different issues than what I have.

and so I have to build it for that group. And we work real close with all the doctors in the NHL and with the NHLPA to build what will be our next tsunami. And I think we're there with that group as well. So it doesn't stop. Players will retire. I'll get 143 guys in a couple months and they need a place when they need help and hope to call.

And I'm the number to call. We have them. So that's one of the things I wanted to talk to you about. you know, there have been some public situations where players have had trouble and it's been reported on. And I know how much that hurts you and it hurts me as a fan to see those kinds of things.

And one of the things that you have really tried to talk about is, you know, don't be afraid or embarrassed to ask for help. Like, you know, when you're, like, when you're a NHL player, even if you play one game, you're the elite of the elite. You've made it to the top. And there are a lot of people who get there who are, you know what, I don't need help. I don't want to ask help. I'm weak if I need help.

And I know you've really tried hard to change that attitude. How successful have you been at it and how much of a challenge still is it? Well, I think, you know, I could go back to you and I. And the one lesson I kind of taught you early on in your broadcast career, you were following a team in the playoffs. team and the door was slightly ajar. And we were having a little team meeting at the end of the game and I basically stood up in the middle of the room and used a bunch of F-bombs and told everyone to sit out and then proceeded to lay out what I thought would be the message for a better tomorrow than

today for our team. And then we moved on and in came the media and Elliot came right to me. And he said, this, I have just heard this about what may have been said in the locker room. And I bold-facedly looked at Elliott and said, never happened. No one said a word. I never spoke. I completely lied. If Pinocchio was in the room, I would have knocked an eye out for Elliot.

And what does that mean for what we're doing here? What happens in the locker room stays in the locker room. So any player that calls me, they know it is in strict confidence. and any player that calls our medical team, strict confidence, that's how it works. That's how they know if they call, and yes, they may have an issue, and it may take a while. And sometimes it's a wife that says, I want my husband back. Sometimes it's a kid who says, I want my dad back. But whatever happens in that locker room, stays in that locker room.

And there are probably 500 players getting help right now, and I probably couldn't name most of them. And I don't want to know most of them unless I need to know. most of them. But even through that, our staff would never know who they are and no names would ever be passed around. And the media, unfortunately, wouldn't get those salivating little bits of info. And like that day when Elliot came in and said, this is what I heard that was said. And he heard it because he was basically in the room, which, you know, maybe you should have stayed out of the stick room, Elliot. But I just denied it and lied. And I apologize to Elliot. But And anyways, we became broadcast partners and told the story after.

But in the locker room, it stays, it's in the confidence of the group. And there are things that get out. I mean, the Joe Murphy story is quite public. And, you know, but for the most part, you know, guys are getting help and hope. And it's their journey and it's up to us to protect them. Yeah, the Joe Murphy one was the one I was referring to because I know how much that hurt you, that situation happened. So, Kyle, let me explain that story because I do want to defend myself a little bit.

Oh, good luck with this one. It was the 2000. It was the 2001 playoffs. And Ottawa had a great year. I think they had 107 points. And the Mapleys where Glenn was the backup to Curtis Joseph, they made the playoffs on the second last day of the regular season. And so it was Ottawa, Toronto, and the Sanders fans were out for blood. They were, you know, they were like, we're going to kill these guys.

And Toronto came out. Matt Sundin scored the one year in overtime, the one-nothing game, I think it was. And the lease were up three-nothing after three, and Ottawa was reeling. And the game four, Toronto was about to sweep. And they gave up a fluke goal. Ottawa scored like a ridiculous goal late in regulation to force overtime in game four. and their lease are going back into the room and they look like stunned and before the silver doors closed the ones you know Kyle that open up into the Toronto room I heard Glenn yelling hey if we were one shot away from going up three Cobb we would have taken it one shot from three nothing we're in great shape and they came out and won that game in overtime and swept the series yeah so I did ask Glenn about it yeah and he lied to me He, like, flat out lied to me about what he said.

Yeah, I only usually do that on a Friday night when I get home about three in the morning, you know. But you guys out drinking? No, no, gosh, no, not a chance. No, straight home. All right. Sorry. Hey, we had to, we had to do what we had to do. And I think there was other words and adjectives and things that were put into those sentences and descriptions of my, my characteristic of the Ottawa senators.

and their team. But that was then, this is now, which is softer, gentler, time. Yes, yes. It was funny. That's right. I understood. I understood.

And you become softler and gentler over the years, Glenn, surely. Okay, so I do want to ask about the event on Saturday. Paul Coffield be the recipient of the 2026 Keith Magnuson, Man of the Year Award. Sounds like you've got a great night lined up. Tom Cochran, Sam Roberts, Barney Bentall. Brian Trotche is going to be performing. Are you going to be there with the Highlands?

In the Glen Creek pipe band? We are and we will bring Koff in with the Stanley Cup and the numerous trophies that he's won. And I think, you know, it's one of the things that Koff did want. You know, that majesty of a pipe band bringing you into a sold-out crowd in a building that the Who played in, the Stones played in, Frank Sinatra played in. And so it'd be exciting to bring, you know, one of our pioneers in, one of our steam guys in. The pipe band will play Amazing Grace to the players that is as an act of remembrance that have passed away. And the list is long. We lost another one yesterday and Troy Murray.

And so heartfelt, we will do them justice. And so, and then the musical acts, which, well, first for Paul, we've got some surprises. We have surprise guests. we have surprise video. He has no clue. This is a complete ambush. I'm going to apologize soon before the night. But him and his family and all the players, it'll be close to 70 players there, are going to love it. They'll be proud of the fact that, you know, he has accomplished so much not only on the ice, but off the ice, what he's done off the ice. And that's what this award is given to. It's not just whether you're a Hockey Hall of Fame member or a top 100 player. it's what you've done to make a difference

for a whole bunch of people and that's what he's done. But the musical acts, you know, we all think we're musicians. And, you know, maybe no one thought they were a bagpiper, but we all thought we were musicians and musicians all think they're hockey players. And where we got it wrong in hockey is you can only play till 26

in hockey. But man, you can keep singing to you're like 80 and music. We should have went to music. But those guys, they all love Paul. And, you know, we'll probably finish off with a bunch of the bigger Acts. Chad Brownlee will play. It was a draft pick of the Vancouver Canucks, a big country star and won a Juno. So it's a long list.

And again, there is some surprise guests that are going to get up and play. And, you know, Brian Trache, who, you know, last year at the golf tournament, when he's saying country roads take me home and he stood there with the heart trophy in his hand, certainly something. But it's Canada's who's who of the Junos that will be there. And the Friday before, we're going to have a hockey game.

And it's going to be the musicians against the NHO guys. I know where my money's going, okay? I'm just going to say, uh, it's going to be a spanking. No question, but the pizza's free and the beer's free. So enjoy that boys. And then make sure you play well the next day while you're up on stage with us. But, uh, you know, it's that, that building has got so much charm. Like when you go upstairs to what they call the red room, there's still the pool table that Mick Jagger brought into that room that he brought when he was practicing for the world tour and they wanted a pool table to play on. And now they can't figure out how to get it out of the building. So the charm, the history, it will be a special night for Paul.

So deserved his friends, his teammates, they will all be there, some from overseas in Europe. We will celebrate Paul. There's some great family movies that we put together for him. He will be a puddle. And this will be a celebration of one of our greatest players to ever play. the game, one of the greatest defensemen to ever play, the greatest skater maybe to ever play. And I tell you, I didn't realize when he became man of the year, he was, if he doesn't know the Pope, he's next to the Pope. It's been nothing but an avalanche of people that want to come to this event because it's Paul. And that's a real testament to his legacy, a life well lived. And he's not dead. He's not dead. So I'm just saying, it is a legacy of a great life. You know, you know,

The only interesting thing about Paul is, you know, one of the things I really like about him is he's pretty blunt. You know, he's like, you know, it's funny, like a couple, I think it was last season when the others came through Toronto. You know, he looked at me and he goes, lost some weight. And I'm like, yeah, thanks for noticing. It was just funny, but, you know, it's interesting because obviously you know him a lot better than I do. But he always has like such a steely facade, right, Glenn? So it's going to be interesting to see him if he loses it like that. No, you're banging on, at least he stayed away from your hair because that would have been next.

He's got a great dry sense of humor. But so well liked. But the stuff he's done off the ice and just helping so many charitable causes, even to go back midstream to work with the Oilers, He's got one more go at it, more gas in the tank. Can he be the guy to make a difference in that coaching staff to bring him over the top? But, you know, whether it's Mark Messier or it is Kevin Lowe or it's Wayne Graskey, Jerry Cury, Esotique, and Jeff Buccaboom, you know, like the list goes on.

Adam Graves, Brian Trache, Mariel Lemieux. You know, we've got testimonials from Sidney Crawford, Kiefer, Sellerlund. I'm like, like, who is this guy? Like, what did I get? I think I got patty tight pants from Pickering. He was probably going to give me a couple props. I could maybe get a dressed up, Elliot, who maybe could lose weight. I don't know.

We'll ask off about that. But, like, you know, my list of the entourage is way, way less than Paul's. But, you know, I'm just proud of what he's done on the ice. And he's a real pioneer. And he's, but for every player that's playing the game today, you know, aspire to carry yourself with the class. he's carried himself with the ability to have the fun that he's had and man, those oiler teams had fun, to look at the hard work he put into it and win or lose, always have your

head up and make sure you treat others with respect. Those principles that his dad jacked on him, he clearly has passed on to his kids and to the players of the Oilers and anyone who've come across his path. And so congrats to Paul. We're having a great night. Buckle up for this one. It will be epic. probably is going to have to retire because I don't know how I'm going to beat it next year. I don't know. We're going to figure that one out after, but this one is going to be a little bit more special, I think, and look, we've had some great ones.

We celebrated the 72 team last year that really made a difference in international hockey, right? You think about them going to Russia and giving up their summer. We celebrated the 67 team the year before at the All-Star game, a Toronto team that had never been celebrated just by themselves. Yes, they were put with other teams and other Stanley Cup teams that never on their own. And then it's been the Mariel Lemus and the Gordy House and the Gila Fleurs and the Mark Messiers. So pretty much, Kyle and Elliot's safe to say, I'll never be the man of the year.

This is a good thing. Oh, I'm going to make sure before you retire, you're getting it. These guys are rarefied air in our sport and are deserved to be just in. In every way, Harolded. And we will do that Saturday, Saturday night. And I think, Elliot, your network is going to do a hit from the show, which I think is great. And I'm just, you know, now I've got to rewrite my speech and cross out all the F-bombs. So now I'm, you really handicapped me and my ability to be a good orator.

Okay. Last one for me, Glenn. You used to work for the Players Association. You were incredibly involved in the Players Association when you were active. And there was a big debate this week about no trade clauses. Do you believe, I'll just throw it open to you, do you believe anything needs to be done about them? Well, I think in a salary cap world when you're looking to,

and you're very handicapped as to what you can and can't do, trust me, it's not like you can have, hey, you know what? We're a team that's going to have a Father's Day weekend the whole year and treat them to every Ritz Carlton in the world for a year. Because that would be a great benefit to get my kid to sign in Toronto, wouldn't it? Dad gets to vacation all year. No. So you're very handicapped as to what you could do, how you can do it. And so when you have financial limitations to what you can create, then there is a financial component that goes into a no trade.

It is worth some value to say to your family, we're going to put our feet up for the next eight, seven years now. with the new CBA. We're not moving. This is our home, hun. Let's bring a family up. What's that value to some players? Not much. To others,

if I don't like you and you don't like me, then I'll rip this thing up in no time. I kind of wish for a world where loyalty is a two-way street. If you give a player a no trade, don't ask them to waive it, a no move. Don't ask them to move it. Don't ask them to wave it. You accept it.

They accept it. Move on merrily together. Rarely does it happen where the player goes to the team and says, I'm done with this. So if you go in knowing you're only allowed to spend $82 million, if you go in knowing, if you give this guy a no move, we are both stuck with each other. This is a divorce that can happen.

And I'm not there to have that decision or to make my voice known, but I just wish loyalty was both ways because in a lot of ways, It's the team extracting himself from a contract that they don't like. And on top of it, if they buy that player out, it's the Players Association that pays the freight with escrow on getting rid of that contract. So it doesn't seem like a two-way situation with loyalty going both ways. That will never happen, but that would be my utopian world. Give it to a player.

You accept it. They accept it. Don't come to me and say, you know what? I kind of like the prettier girl over there. What do you think? Can we make a move? No.

You're in for a pound of this and a pound of that. Suck it up. Move on. But it won't happen. All right. I've got one more. I was told to ask you about a story. This would have been in your broadcaster days,

working in New York at Madison Square Garden, and the topic of Larry David. I believe he was in the building that night and talking about him on the air. Well, for those, look it, some may miss me on TV. Some are happy that I'm not on TV. Some don't even know I'm off TV.

So that tells me they either never listen to me or don't watch TV. I don't know. I think I'll be in a, on a via going to Ottawa. The day of a game, sitting back, we're going to go meet with a bunch of the players. and I might happen to have a beer in front of me, and they'll say, good luck at the game,

Tonight Heels. I'm sure you'll do a good job. Yet that's what I do. Have a few beers before I get on TV with Elliot. It makes it better. So, no. And I'm not exactly when it all comes to the best of knowing music and the best of knowing actors

and the best of knowing good shows. I'm a bagpiper. I know the world champions in bagpipe. And so one of our great, great producers, who we all work with and love, Love to death, Shirelli Najak. Arguably, nobody better. He would put things in my ear like, Glenn, I'm going to show you someone,

and I would look on my screen between the benches, and no idea who it was, and it was Larry David that particular night, kind of thought he looked like the politician, you know, to be 1% of the 2% of the 1%. That's what he looked like to me. He says, no, no, he's on TV, and all I want you to say is this, pretty, pretty, pretty. And I said it, and I thought, I don't know what I just said, but I'm going to get an avalanche of critique.

And it turns out people liked it. So really, I should have had Shirelli as my marionette just to tell me what to say. And maybe I'd still be on TV. But that was our time in New York. And honestly, I thought it was Bernie Sanders. I didn't know it was Larry David. It could have been Elliott in glasses. I have no idea.

But I didn't know Bernie Sanders said, pretty, pretty, pretty. Thank you, Shirelli Najek. You made me a better broadcaster and all of us for sure. Well, and the irony is, of course, Larry David's gone on Saturday Night Live to do an impression of Bernie Sanders. So you are not wrong in thinking that's who you saw that night. Yeah, but Kyle, I thought Bernie Sanders was the one who said, Pritty, Prissy, Prissy. It's even worse. This makes me look dumber than I could ever have been.

But, no, like we would put, you know, words from an adult. song and I never heard it. How does it go again? And Shrelly was big into that. And for anyone that wants to be a broadcaster, he was big into, you need to watch the Grammys and the Oscars to be a good broadcaster. You need to bring common fare

into the homes of people. And when you do that, you're going to get more fans. And one of the reasons we went between the benches is to bring the fans closer to the game, to bring the fans down to what speed really is and what anger really is and what hits really are. And get me closer to the game. So anytime that we can do that as broadcasters, and Shirelli was great at it,

at helping to manipulate us in the best way, I would never change it for a world. And I'm sorry, Larry, I thought you were Bernie Sanders. But my bad. Anyways, it went over good. Thank you, Yes. Well, he would always say, I mean, you were one of the pioneers, of course, being between the benches, but he was like, that was his creative outlet, the work you two would do every Saturday together. The funny one, just my last little go at it, when it was the lockout in 04. And I know that, you know, some other broadcasters will say they were the first ones between the benches, pants on fire, they weren't. We were the first ones to kind of give it a go. And Mark Askin was the producer in the truck at the time. Shirelli was the big boss.

And we would do things like, let's see the speed of a shot. How hard is a shot? And I would stand between the benches with a radar gun. And I can still remember. I can remember shooting the guy, shooting the puck from right behind me. I'm between the benches. He's at the left point. And Sidney Crosby skating by and going, what the hell is that?

Okay. Radar gun, I guess. But we tried to change the world one game at a time. And it worked for a lot. And it was a lot of fun. I wouldn't change it for the world. So miss you guys, miss doing games with you. But I'm sure it's not a reverse street.

But we will cook up down the road for sure. No. We do miss you as well, Glenn. So with all of that said, it's been great to catch up here today. So thanks for coming on. All the best with the event Saturday. Enjoy, guys, enjoy it. Our thanks once again to Glenn Healy and the NHL Alumni Association

for making that conversation happen and the continued important work they are doing for players post-playing days. The next time, Elliot and I and Dom, of course, will talk to you. Fridge and I will be down in Florida covering the NHL GM meetings next Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday from Palm Beach. In the meantime, some programming notes to keep in the back of your mind this weekend. Actually, later tonight,

The Edmonton Oilers can be seen nationally on Sportsnet. They're in St. Louis. Pucked up a little after 8 Eastern 6th Mountain Time. Saturday. Hockey Central gets you underway with Ron McLean and the gang at 630 Eastern, 3.30 Pacific. Three early games just after 7ET, once again, including Toronto in Buffalo. Should be a tremendous atmosphere at Key Bank Center. San Jose Sharks, Macklin Celebrini, go into Montreal to face the Canadians.

And the Calgary Flames continue their trip. Through the New York area, they face Matthew Schaefer and the Islanders. Also in the early window on hockey night are late game this Saturday, the Seattle Cracken and the Vancouver Canucks. Canucks legend Trevor Lyndon, along with Marco Rossi, will be guests this week on After Hours with Scott Oak and Ian McIntyre will join Scott on After Hours this Saturday night. Taking us out today, a track from Jules,

A singer-songwriter, rooted in soul and R&B, music that reflects who he is, is music that brings people together. A proud Montrealer shaped by the many influences of his city, he sees his art as a hand extended toward others. First revealed to the public through LaVois and Star Academy, he later joined Corne's record label, Maison Canda, where he has developed a warm and deeply human artistic universe. released in May 24, his debut album, Porto Vudir, earned him a nomination at the Gala de la Disc

2024 for Album of the Year in R&B and Soul. Carried by a distinctive voice and a raw emotional sensitivity, Jules continues his dialogue with the world as he prepares to release his next album in May of this year. In fact, in Montreal on May 21st, Jules will have his album launch party. concert. Here is Jules featuring Naomi. This is Karma on 32 Thoughts, the podcast. Cousand the mirage

I don't know Poo of these sorrache Of all the same I'll let's my place c'all It's false Espoise Karma

I'm I'm in all my Etaire Buton I know I know After all this time I

I think you Mendore At least When you're Dyer Hepe the Hill Tadair When all these

Fos Spores It's Vobobo Don't search not, you'll You'll find out On the whole It's all these false espoise