32 Thoughts: The Podcast - Bye Bye, Burkie

Episode Date: February 10, 2021

Brian Burke is joining the Pittsburgh Penguins as their President of Hockey Operations. But before he goes, he joins Jeff and Elliotte to chat about why he decided to get back into an executive position, how the deal came together, what he likes about the organization, the message from ownership and much more. This podcast […]

Burke, you ready? Yep. This is 31 turds. This is 31 turds. This is 31 turds. So I made you a promise, Elliot Friedman, and I'd like to say that this is a promise I actually kept. A few shows ago, I said to you, every podcast,

I will ask you for an update on the Pittsburgh Penguins general manager search. And today, now that that is concluded, my promise has been kept. I've asked you every podcast, but now I don't have to. Ron Hextall, general manager, and the shocker, Brian Burke, now ex of Sportsnet, now president of hockey operations for the Pens.

Set us up on this one. Well, first of all, I'm happy to give the timeline because, you know, one of the texts I got in the aftermath of it was, did you know Berkey was in the whole time and just hide that fact? And the answer is no. And I do want to make that very clear. Only once have I ever done anything close to that in my career. And I will tell that story too.

So Berkey called me at 1 40 PM on Tuesday and said, I'm leaving. And I like laughed and he goes, no, no, I'm serious. And he said, I'm going to tell you something, but you have to agree that you can't release it until 2.15. And I said, okay. And he goes, I'm going to Pittsburgh with Ron Hexdahl to be the president of hockey operations for the Pittsburgh Penguins. And I was like, wow.

And he could tell he was excited. So I said, obviously you're very happy about this. Cause at the end of the day, like you said, in the interview that we're going to play, you just want someone to be happy. You want your friends to be happy. The people you care about to be happy. So I was happy for Berkey. I never heard Burke's name.

I mean, Hextall, we were all over. We reported before the game on Monday that he had his second interview, and then I tweeted it out late at night. I forgot to do it earlier. Tweeted it out late at night, and it certainly was trending as if Hextall was going to be the GM. But I have to tell you, I had no idea about Berkey until that moment where he called me and told me I was blown away. The only other person I'd heard for the president of hockey ox job, like the person to work alongside Hextall, the only other name I'd heard for that specific spot was Kevin Weeks.

So I think Weeks was definitely in the mix, but Berkey, I was shocked. I had no idea. Well, over the past few days, I mean, you've talked about how this might not just be a one person hire. I mean, you said this a couple of different places on the last podcast. You mentioned this as well.

I believe sometimes the podcast bleeds into conversations that we've had. Yeah. But I believe you said that there's, this might be a multi-layered thing and there might be more to this than just a general manager hire. I know that you didn't know it was going to be Brian Burke. Nobody did. Like the security around this one was sealed tight.

He did a great job of keeping it quiet. I know. Like I was in our position, we really shouldn't applaud people for keeping secrets but bravo like that was that was a master class in keeping a secret there but at what point did you realize as we're going through timelines that this wasn't just going to be one hire right from the beginning i had heard that it was likely that they were going to bolster their staff it wasn't just going to be one hire. It was going to be more than one. But when I was chasing the confirmation

that Hextall had interviewed for a second time on Monday, I had some people tell me that there are additional layers to this and you should assume it's more than one individual. So that just sort of confirmed what I believed. I should tell the story too. Like I mentioned that only once have I ever not done that. Years ago, and this is several years ago,

I can't remember who the event, I think it was when Brian Murray was hired. Glenn Healy interviewed for the Ottawa Sanders GM job. And we worked together at Hockey Night in Canada at the time at CBC. And I found out that he had interviewed and his jaw dropped. Like I walked right up to him and I said, did

you interview for the Sanders GM job? And his jaw dropped. He goes, how did you find out? And I said, you know, I'm not going to tell you that. And he asked me as a coworker never to bring that up on the air. And I never did until now.

Like this is the first time I think I've ever told that story. So you're breaking news. How many years later? I'm breaking news several years later. Cause you know, it is tough. I, you know, I did have one individual today who I'd called and said, are you interested? Who said the whole time, did you know Berkey was in it? And the answer was no, but I wouldn't want anyone to think

that I would do that to them. I remember Mario Tremblay, when he got hired to coach the Montreal Canadiens, he had to go on radio and say, and how he apologized to people about interviewing them for being the coach of the Canadians when he knew he was getting the job.

That always stuck with me. So, you know, I just want people to know that I didn't intentionally conceal Burke's name because I think it would have been the wrong thing to do. I want to get your thoughts on Ron Hextall here in a couple of seconds, but a little bit more time here with our now former colleague, Brian Burke. You've mentioned this a couple of different places and you do bring it up in the interview. And I always think it's an interesting one. I mentioned this on the last podcast and anyone that's followed this

podcast or listening for a while knows that, you know, I don't have like a favorite team. I cheer for people. I cheer for moments. You know, I want people to be successful. You've talked about that as well, but Brian has always grown up in this environment where you're on a team and you dig in your heels and you swing and that's your team and that's who you cheer for and that's who you defend and i'll give you a story so when when brian started with us brian and i hadn't been on the best terms for a while yeah and i remember going to work that morning when the first show I was going to do with Brian. And I remember my wife said to me, what's this going to be like? And I said, it's going to be fine for me.

Like this is my home turf. Like we're going through Sportsnet, CBC building. I'm fine. I harbor zero animosity for Brian. Maybe he does for me. I don't know. Brian. Maybe he does for me. I don't know. And I remember walking into the green room, Lotus, and Brian standing up, looking me in the eye, shaking my hand and saying, and he said,

I'll never forget this moment. He said, we're on the same team now. Now we're on the same team. Ever since then, I'll tell you, Elliot like this guy, anytime I've had an idea, every time, you know, something for whether it's radio or television, he's been completely supportive. He's called on me to do charitable work for him, hosting events, things like that. I've always stepped up for him. And he talks about his charitable initiatives in this interview coming up. up for him and he talks about his charitable initiatives in this interview coming up but he does strike me and always has as someone that needs to be involved emotionally in the game like i don't know that brian ever liked leaving the studio and kind of not being either elated about a win or pissed off about a loss. That's fair. Yes. I think that's very fair. You know, I got to tell you, you've had a good week, Merrick.

You've actually said things that are interesting, not usual for you. Don't get used to it, bud. Don't get used to it. But you know, it's funny, like Berkey too, like we went a year without talking when he was GM of the Leafs. And, you know, it's just a reminder.

And, you know, Berkey and I talked about this today when, when we spoke a couple of times and we get in battles because of the things we say. And I understand it like the Berkey and I, the, you know, I don't mind telling the story now. Berkey and I got in a fight over the report by Dave Fetchuk and the Toronto Star about James Reimer getting a concussion.

And if you'll remember, Dave Feschuk called the family and they confirmed it for him and Berkey went crazy. And I've never asked Mike Milbury this, but I'm convinced that Berkey called Mike Milbury and asked Milbury to rip the reporting. like Milbury and asked, uh, Milbury to rip the reporting. And so I was on the air at the time and, uh, Milbury, uh, said that. And I said, and I defended Dave, who was a friend and Berkey got mad. Cause he was so angry about it. We didn't talk for a year.

And, you know, the thing is, is that in this business is set up in a way that you are adversarial with people. You don't always try to be, but you are because the things that we report sometimes and say sometimes they obviously don't line up with what the teams want to hear out there. And that's the way it is. But even though sometimes this happens, Jeff, like I think you're, you're a lot like me. You don't take it personally. Sometimes we do take it personally. Yes. If we feel it gets personal, but other times I look at it like, you know, unfortunately that's just the job. That's just the way it goes. And it doesn't mean you're a bad person. It doesn't mean the other person on the other end is a bad person. It's just the way it goes because you're set up in adversarial roles and we have to report

things that other people don't want out there. And that's why, like, even though that Berkey and I went for a year that time without talking, whenever I saw him, it was never about, oh, I hate this guy. It's just like, that's the way it is. And that's the way it goes. Sometimes. Ron Hexthall, your thoughts as him as the general manager? I think very early in the process, he was their guy, if not right after his first interview. And I think it was all about who was going to go in there kind of with him. He worked in Philly.

They seen firsthand what Hextall's resume is doing in Philly. I think anytime you get fired, what that team does in the years after you get fired is your resume. And Ron Hextall's resume only got better since he was fired. Like one of the things Berkey in the interview and people will hear it. He talks about how Hextall will learn about what he did wrong or what he could do better. One of the things Ron Hextall did was leave Carter Hart in the American

hockey league. I wonder if, if he brings up Carter Hart sooner, he keep his Carter Hart sooner. He keep his job? Yeah. Or is he the GM longer? I don't know.

But that's his resume, and it looks good. And I'm sure the Pittsburgh Penguins are looking at this and saying, that's what he did. That's what he built. We want that here. And the Penguins know they don't have a ton of picks. They don't have a ton of prospects. That's what Ron Hextall's there for, and that's what he's good at.

I am not surprised in the least bit that they went for him for that reason. I will tell you, the funniest thing I thought in the conference was him saying he likes rivalries and when people hate each other. People from Pittsburgh are like, that guy's a flyer, even though his dad played for the Penguins. The way it ended between Ron Hextall and Philly was not pretty. There's a lot of hard feelings on both sides.

This rivalry is going to be fierce because of how some in the Flyers organization feel about Hextall and how Hextall feels of how some in the Flyers organization feel about Hextall and how Hextall feels about some people in the Flyers organization. They just both have to be good, Elliot. They both have to be good teams for that rivalry to get personal. And if they're good teams, that means there'll be playoff series at Keystone State. They both have to be good.

The question becomes, what's going to happen to the Pittsburgh Penguins now? Is it a step backwards? Is it a continuation of, we've got these elite level players, let's keep adding and going for it? Given that it's Hextall that's been hired and one of his calling cards is patience.

What happens to the Penguins now in your estimation? We'll ask Berkey and you'll hear what Berkey says. My impression from the call is they see where this year goes and then make their decisions. I'll tell you before we hit the break and come back with the Brian Burke interview. One of my favorite things every night working with brian burke when you're on the panel is at the end of every segment how he signs off so he'll go to everybody else and say good job and then he will ignore me or not say it to me so on a wednesday night it's great job anth great job kevin great job merrick or last week great job jennifer

and he'll just ignore me and it never it fails to make me laugh i laugh every time it's that dog face look that he gives you silence and walks right by you he does it every segment so it's happened hundreds of times and i still never fail to laugh that's the thing i'm gonna miss the most oh you and me both uh okay on the other side you're gonna hear from brian burke uh this is and welcome to it 31 thoughts the podcast presented by the gmc sierra at4 Sierra AT4. First of all, Brian Burke, congratulations. Second of all, you always talk about security around announcements.

This one was Ziploc sealed. This one was Lou Lamarillo-esque. How did you keep this so tight-lipped? Well, I was trying to really go out of my way to screw Elliot. That was the whole plan. Because he breaks everything. And I thought, well, I'm going to screw Elliot this time. But no, really what happened was, and David Morehouse told the story today, we weren't talking to me about the job.

He was asking me about candidates. So I said, like, Mike Feud is really good at this. This guy is really good at that. Here's his shortcomings. And that night, David Morehouse was talking to Mario. shortcomings. And that night, David Morehouse was talking to Mario. And Mario said, how come you know so much detail about all these guys? And he said, well, I've been talking to Brian Burke. And Mario said, Berkey, we should be talking to him. What night was this? Like, when would this have been?

Like Wednesday night. Okay. This is all in the last week. The deal came together in hours. The next day they said, would you be interested? And I said, well, they didn't offer me the GM job, but senior advisor job. I said, yeah, I would be interested. It's Pittsburgh. Like this isn't just another NHL team. It's the Pittsburgh Penguins.

So the deal came together very quickly. I actually did not get a formal written confirmation until noon today. And then they called the league and told them and did a Zoom call with Mario and Ron Burkle, the other owner, who's a brilliant guy. So I remember one of our earliest conversations when you joined us at Sportsnet, you and I were going on about something. And I asked you if you would go back and you said, I would only go back for, and I think you told me two teams and you wouldn't tell me who they were, but should I assume that Pittsburgh was one of them? Yeah. And the other one was if the league took over a team. Okay.

You could guess maybe what that one might be. Yep. And what will happen is people will speculate, well, Brian Burke left Sportsnet because X, Y, and Z. The simple fact is I loved working at Sportsnet. Like I was sleeping in my own bed, no travel. I liked the people I worked for. I liked the people I worked with. That's a description of a great job.

If you like the people you work for and the people you work with. So, no, I was resigned to this. I told Elliot how many times broadcasting is my life, but this is one job that, man, I just got this boost of energy. I feel five years younger. You know, the other thing too, though, Berkey is that it's like Michael Jordan coming out of retirement twice to me, as good as broadcasting is for you. And as much as you enjoy it, nothing for you will beat that feeling of trying to build a champion.

That's your rush. That's what you were wired for. I totally get it. I totally understand that. There's no question about it. Like when I worked for the league, the thing I told Gary Bettman when I left is I can't stand not caring who wins and loses. So I'm watching NHL games. I'm praying for two things. I'm praying that my officials don't mess up and I'm praying that I don't have

to suspend anyone. I'm not really interested in the outcome and that's hard. That's the part where I got back today is now I care about the outcome of the games. Now I'm invested. That's the biggest rush for me. I remember when you were with Calgary, one of the things you Now I'm invested. That's the biggest rush for me. I remember when you were with Calgary, one of the things you always said is like, I don't want to be in front of the cameras. I don't want to be in front of the microphones. This is true livings gig. He's the guy he needs to be out in front. Now that you've got three more years of broadcast chops, you've done plenty of television. You've done plenty of radio. You done an animated series do you do you still want to be the guy behind the curtain or do you say to yourself yeah you know what i kind of like

being out in front of the camera even more than i did before no this is ron hexdahl's team when someone talks about hockey operations it's going to be Hexie, not me. I don't crave the camera. I never did. And I don't know. Like, I don't think the camera is very kind to me anyway. I think I look old and grumpy. So to me, it's like, this is Hexie's team. My job is to take as much off his plate as I can and give him whatever guidance I can. Let me ask you one more broadcasting question then we'll probably get into more hockey stuff here. One of the things that I didn't like about you on TV is that they made you do up the tie.

I always wanted to see the Brian Burke look, the loosened collar and the, you know, the tie not done up. How did you feel about that? Much rather have gone on the air with the tie untied. Rick Brace was running Sportsnet when I came on board, and he was like, you're tying the tie.

So I did my press conference today with the tie untied. I noticed that, yeah. People should know the origin of that too. It's not some fashion statement. When I worked for Pat Quinn, I would be in the work at 6 o'clock. So when the Boston Bruins were open for business, so were we. But I would come in in jeans and a T-shirt. And I would work from 6 till whenever Pat could in, which was usually 7 or 7.15.

And Pat would come in dressed immaculately. And I would come into Pat's office and we'd spend sometimes 20 minutes, sometimes an hour and a half. Now, here's what we have to do. We've got to sign David Bruce. We've got to read a lease issue. Here's a couple of kids I'd like you to see in the draft. And then I'd go downstairs and work out. And then I'd put on my suit.

I kept all my suits at work. And I'd come upstairs. So I stopped tying the tie. I'd rush upstairs with the tie around my neck. And I wouldn't tie it until I needed to. Sometimes that would be 11 o'clock in the morning. I remember tying my tie during the anthem a couple of times. And that's how it started.

Just sheer laziness. It wasn't a fashion state. By the way, sheer laziness will serve you well when you get back into television. You're my idol, Elliot. So let's talk about the Penguins for a sec. Number one, and I think we have the answer, but I'm just going to clarify it. So let's talk about the Penguins for a sec. Number one, and I think we have the answer, but I'm just going to clarify it.

If there's a decision to be made and the owners always have say, particularly when it comes to Crosby and Malkin, but if there's a trade to be made, does Ron Hextall have the final hockey authority? And the answer is yes, but I think there's a better way to approach it. So when I took the job in Calgary, I said to Ken King, the late great Ken King,

how's this going to work? Do I have veto power? And he said, don't think of it in terms of veto power. Think of it in terms of being business partners. If you and I were business partners and we owned a shoe store, you would not come in one morning and say, I'm taking the next two weeks off on holiday. You would talk to me two weeks before and say, what about this? And that's what I told Brad True Living when I hired him. I said, look, we've got to approach this like business partners. And Ken King, this was a brilliant strategy. Let's talk about stuff before it gets to a point where I have to veto you or I have to make a decision.

So let's talk about trades. And if it's something I don't think will go anywhere, I'm going to tell you that. And let's move on. Let's do something else. So to me, it will never come down to who has final say. But if you ask Brad to living, and I hope someone does, he'll say, I had autonomy there. And that's my goal with Hexie because I respect Hexie. Like, look at the job he did in Philly. I don't think it's going to come down to who's got final say. The answer is the owner always has final say. So the only deal that got vetoed when I worked in Anaheim was we were talking about trading Bobby Ryan for Keith Kachuk.

Henry Samuel, he said, I don't want to do this deal because it's 1.5 million on the cap. He said, I will not overrule you on hockey decisions, but on the cap, I have final say. That made sense to me. So at the end of the day, everyone has a boss. So automatically, the Pittsburgh Penguins have now one of the toughest front offices of any team in the NHL. Two Flyers guys too. Can you imagine that? I was going to get to that point too.

Like, isn't this something? Like here's the main mariner and here's, you know, someone, you know, chopping down Edmonton Oilers in 1987, like a final in the front office. So it's a really tough front office. I want you to talk about Ron Hextall. What are some of the things that you think we should know about him? Well, first off, he's really bright. If you look at the history of GMs in the NHL,

very few goaltenders. And the thinking was back in the day, you could be a great goaltender and not know a thing about how to play the game. It's different now because the goalies are in the power play meetings. The goalies are in the power play meetings. The goalies are in the PK meetings. The goalies acquire a lot more knowledge now than they did back when I played. But I think Hexie, the one thing I would say about him is when I've talked to him, what impressed me is how bright he is. He's a smart man.

Number one is like you look at the job he did putting that team together in Philly and the draft picks he's made, this is a good a good hire well that sort of leads to another question the one thing that we learned about ron hextall specifically in philadelphia is he's patient like he does not mind you know sitting on an egg waiting for it to hatch like he'll take his time and that ended up, there was some friction in Philadelphia because of it. Is that what the Penguins need, do you think? Well, I think it's a combination of all of the above. Patience is a virtue. And impatience is also a virtue. But it has to fit the reality of your team. So you can be impatient. And Hexie felt in Philly that they weren't ready, and he was patient.

It cost him. I think he's learned from that experience. And I understand you have to balance the two things. But I think you're always better the second time as a GM. I was a way better GM my second time than I was my first time, although I was pretty darn good as my first time. But I think he's benefited from that experience experience and he's wiser for it and we're all better next time around so what i had heard and it sounded like it was kind of confirmed

in the call you had with david morehouse and ron extall is that the pittsburgh Penguins are going to play out this year, see how it goes, and then make some major decisions that could change the course of the franchise forever. Is that an accurate portrayal or not? I'd say that's accurate. I'm astonished to use those words in a sentence to you, but I think that's accurate. Here's the difference.

So two months ago I was asked, can the Pittsburgh Penguins win? And I said, no, based on, I diagrammed the team. I put it next to the Tampa Bay Lightning. I diagrammed the team. I put it next to the Washington Capitals. I'm like, no, they're not a Stanley Cup contender. But now you get the job and you're like, wait a second. I had Scott Niedermeyer. I had Chris Proger. I had Pavel Bure. Mark Messi that played for me. I've never had a better player than Sidney Crosby.

So all of a sudden now you're saying, well, okay, it's fine on paper, but let's find out. Let's see what we can do. So I think the thinking is, without divulging what we talk about in the boardroom is, let's see what this team can do. And basically Hexie said that today. And then we'll see in the offseason. We've got some tough decisions. If this team can't get there, let's see if we can get them there. What additions can we make? I think there were some people, Brian, and I know you are not one to shy away from anything. And I know Ron Hextall is definitely not one to shy away from anything. But I do there think there were some candidates who were not crazy about being the idea of the idea of being the person who might have to dismantle the Pittsburgh Penguins, do you look at this and say, I could be the guy who trades Letang or Malkin or Crosby? Did that come up at all in the conversations? No, here's the difference, Elliot, and this is

not trying to be dramatic. I've never looked at a hill and said it's too tall or too high. Like I had GMs call me today and say, you're out of your mind. You're going into a minefield with nothing but poor options in front of you. This aligned badly. What were you thinking? I'm like, I don't see it that way. I got special players. I got a GM I trust. I got a coach I trust. Let's see what we can do. They're playing without three of their top five, or I should say we, are playing without three of our top five defensemen. Like who knows how good this team is if we get healthy. So no, I have no problem with that. And the notion that you wouldn't take

a job because of the hurdles in front of you, the sand traps in front of you, that thinking has never entered into my mind. My mind is you give me enough time, give me the resources, I can fix this. You know, one of the things further to that point, so I'm curious about what happens now. One of the things that I always liked doing with you on television, on radio, Brian, was the what happens next or where do the dominoes that have to fall here? Whenever a new general manager would join a team, whenever a new executive would join a team, I'd always say, Brian, what's the first order of business? So-and-so goes in, what does he or she do?

So for Brian Burke, today is the happy day. Today is congratulations. Today is the celebration. Tomorrow, it's roll up the sleeves. What does your job become starting tomorrow? What do you do? Well, job one is call Sid. Job two is call Sid.

Job three is call Sid. And job four is call Sully. So I have not talked to Sid yet. I told Hexy, I said, you should make that call. You're the GM. I will talk to Sid tonight. I have talked to Sid yet. I told Hexie, I said, you should make that call. You're the GM. I will talk to Sid tonight. I have talked to Sully. So you evaluate a team and you say, okay, what's wrong with this team?

And it's easier to talk about what's right with the Pittsburgh Penguins. They've got a great coach. They've got huge pieces. They've got arguably the best player that ever played the game or certainly one of them. So you've got to focus on the positives and like, how do we turn this into more wins right now? We're scuffling a bit. It's not about how do we break this down?

How do we tear it down? What do we have to replace? It's more like, okay, I have taken over teams where the list of challenges were as long as your arm, like that's not the Pittsburgh Penguins. Now tough decisions coming. I think so. I've taken over teams with a way higher hill in front of me.

I've never understood guys who are like, that hill's too high. I'm like, Jesus, Murphy, it can't be too high. Someone's going to fix it. I came to Toronto. People told me I was nuts. Like, someone's going to fix it. I got fired that year, but that team made the playoffs. If you're a guy that looks at a hill and says it's too high,

then do something else, man. Sell life insurance or do something else. Do you see the Penguins adding anything in the short term for this year? Well, we're capped out and we don't have a lot of draft picks, so it's going to be hard. But yeah, we'll see. We're going to get in there and find out what we can do. But the answer would be yes.

Like the message from ownership is clear to me. Let's see what we can do this year. What is Mario Lemieux like in a job interview? Well, he was very kind to me. Like I've known him for years. So when I was still practicing law in Boston, his first game ever in the NHL was in Boston Garden. Pete Peters was the goalie for the Bruins, who was a former teammate of mine and a client of mine.

I represented Pete. I talked to him that day. I said, look, this Lemieux kid's something special. You got to watch him. He scored on his first shift on the ice. I've always gotten along. I had dinner with Mario a couple of years ago with, I think Richard Petty was there Paul Coffey might have been there so I've known him for years he's a very gracious guy he's a very humble guy for being like a superstar he doesn't act like that around people he's very gracious and accommodating so in the interview it was nice I don't know Ron Burke a lot well but I was really impressed with him too so here's my last one then good there's an there's an end coming to this no I know don't know Ron Burke a lot well, but I was really impressed with him too. So here's my last one then. Good.

There's an end coming to this. No, I know. Don't worry. We're going to put your head back. Here comes the drill. Here's why I'm excited for you, because I know that you like, like you're an ideas person and you like going in there and changing things, or at least fighting for things you think should be changed.

You've always been that way. You've always been passionate that way. Now you're in those meetings. You're around those people that make the changes in the game. This isn't a Penguins question. This is an NHL question, really. As you reenter NHL management, what are some of the ideas or pet causes that you would like to see changed?

And why is the answer the draft lottery? I think your job as a GM is prioritize a list of what we need and get to work. My job as president of hockey operations is to help HACC do that. As far as league stuff, I believe I will be attending league meetings. I intend to raise the draft lottery question. I believe the way it was left with the GMs was anyone who has an idea to change the lottery, send us a note, which means they probably won't get any notes except from Steve Eisenman. I do think they've gotten notes. Okay. So this goes back to when I was a rookie GM, Lou Amarillo would come on the call and talk about the four recalls,

and Lou would be like, it's unfair, it sucks. And I was like, let it go. He had like the four recall rule. Who cares? Then we go to the conference finals, and we got an issue with the four recall rule. I'm like, why didn't I listen? Why wasn't I paying attention?

So I worry that teams that have not been adversely affected by the draft lottery rule will stay silent, but it's a terrible rule. The draft lottery is a terrible, the whole point of the inverse order of selection in the draft is that the crappiest teams get the most help. And I understand we have to have a lottery. Okay. We have to have a lottery because we had owners and GMs that were willing to tank. So we have to have a lottery. But the lottery should be the lowest number of teams that can affect that outcome. And that for me is five.

Like what they've got right now is busted. It's broken. It's wrong. They've got to fix it. Damn flyers, eh, Berkey? Listen, this has been a lot of fun. Again, congratulations. Listen, everybody was surprised,

and there's a lot of people, like on our conference call today, there was a lot of surprise and a lot of people that were happy for you, obviously, but we are poorer for your loss, like not having you around anymore, not having you on the shows. You've been a delight to work with.

And I know of all the people that we've had come through SportsCenter on various properties, the one thing about you that really stands out for me, outside of the broadcasting, and I always knew that you were a generous person, Berkey,

but I don't think too many people know how much of a charitable person that you are. Like a lot of people are losing a colleague. And the one thing that I'll take away from my experience working with you is that's a really charitable man. I'm grateful for that comment. I will tell you this.

I used to say to my kids, who's going to come to your funeral and what are they going to say? It'd be like Eleanor Rigby and three old ladies that live in that who's going to come to your funeral and what are they going to say? It'd be like Eleanor Rigby and three old ladies that live in that village are going to come to your funeral. The only ones there or will be a packed church. And what are they going to say? They're not going to talk about how much money you made or how big your house was. They're going to talk about what you did. Were you a good dad? Were you a good brother? Were you a good sister? Were you a good mom? A good employee? Did you care about brother? Were you a good sister? Were you a good mom?

A good employee? Did you care about things? Did you make a difference where you lived? This is in the book. A guy came up to me last year on the street in Toronto, just before mass. And he said, hey, Mr. Burke. He said, our city is better because you live here. That made my month.

Total stranger. Made my month. Because he understood month because he understood so to me it's all about being involved and giving back and that's never going to change for me. Berkey we're going to miss you we're going to miss you a ton and I guess I would close this interview off by saying in five years

after you've won a Stanley Cup and you're ready to come back to TV which panelist are you going to take off the air hopefully you but Stanley Copp and you're ready to come back to TV, which panelist are you going to take off the air? Hopefully you. But if you're still there in five years, I'll be shocked. Okay, you close this one out. You can close off every TV segment that we do, Berkey.

Go. Okay, and good job, Jeff. I know you feel the same way, Elliot. I'm really going to miss working with that guy. You know, I really am going to miss working with Berkey every single week. We wish him all the best with the Pittsburgh Penguins. And the one thing that I've always, and you go back to all of his teams, Hartford, Vancouver, Anaheim, Toronto, all of them, Calgary, now Pittsburgh, where I feel it would be the same.

There's always been a question about managers and is it their job to make their sport more efficient or more enjoyable? And people have always put those two things at loggerheads. And one of the things that i've always admired about brian is he doesn't see those things as opposites he sees what might be explicitly two as implicitly one he sees that you can do those two things at the same time that's always the thing that i've admired about brian his hockey teams and i know leafs fans are going to say oh it was brutal the 18 wheeler off the road and all that you could tell he was trying to make them enjoyable hockey teams

you know i think he believes that you're there to entertain as much as anything else right it's a show by the way i was one of the people who fought that he shouldn't have to tie his tie but i lost that fight. Good for you. I said, if we're bringing him here to be Brian Burke, why don't we let him be Brian Burke? That's what I always wondered. Like those decisions are way above my pay grade, but anyone who would ever ask me,

I'd always tell them the same thing. Like that's Brian Burke. Like that's the open collar, the tie around the neck. Like that's his signature look. Let him be him. Again, we wish him all the best around the neck, like that's his signature look. Let him be him. Again, we wish him all the best with the Pittsburgh Penguins. We're going to miss him, but Elliot, you know what this means?

Now we can start ripping him again. When do you think we start going years without talking to him again? I know, right? Shocking. I hate having to end the podcast like this again but some really good people lost some some jobs at three sports radio stations

across the country Vancouver Winnipeg and Hamilton I don't know what to say other than I hope all these people who lost their jobs find other work quickly and I will point out that every market that these these people who lost their jobs find other work quickly. And I will point out that every market that these stations were in made everybody better,

whether it was Hamilton and not just Hamilton, but Hamilton made Toronto better. You know, Winnipeg, that station grew that Winnipeg sports market, Vancouver, uh, really battled the Rogers,

uh, the sports net station there and made them better and made everybody better. So what happened on Tuesday is in no way a reflection of the work or value of any of those people that lost their jobs on Tuesday. No, it's business. It's got nothing to do with ability, nothing. And honestly, I don't like the way it was handled not at all there has to be a better way

to do it and it's incumbent upon people who make decisions to find better ways to do it one of the things i've always believed in my life is you judge a person by how they say goodbye saying hello is easy. That's happy time. That's everyone's excited. Hey, it's a new friendship. It's a new relationship. You think of all the possibilities.

Once you go through things and there is baggage, emotional, mental, all built up, saying goodbye is difficult. But that's the moment where the relationship gets judged. And I'll say it again. You judge a person by how they say goodbye.