32 Thoughts: The Podcast - Drama In The Desert

Episode Date: February 13, 2023

Football is done and it's time to talk some hockey! Jeff and Elliotte discuss the Coyotes' tweets about Jakob Chychrun (2:15), whether Erik Karlsson could find himself in Edmonton (12:45), and more trade deadline targets, including Luke Schenn (35:45), James Van Riemsdyk (38:30), and Brock Boeser (37:30). The guys also discuss the unfortunate injury to Anton Forsberg (45:00), as well as John Tortorella's coaching style (42:40), the future of Kane & Toews (54:45), and take your questions (62:50)Email the podcast at [e-mail] or call The Thought Line at 1-833-311-3232 and leave us a voicemail!Music Outro: Arson Daily - Pipe DreamListen to the full track HERE.This podcast was produced and edited by Mike Rogerson, and hosted by Jeff Marek and Elliotte Friedman. Social support is provided by Griffin Porter.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Welcome once again to the Monday edition of 32 Thoughts the Podcast presented by GMC and the new Sierra AT4X. Elliot Friedman, yours truly Jeff Merrick alongside Mike Rogerson filling in for Amil Delic. Now Elliot, a few things here. We're going to start by talking about Jacob Chikrin who was held out Saturday against the St. Louis Blues for a quote-unquote trade-related reasons. We can get into the conspiracy theory of what that may or may not have meant. I think a lot of people, maybe you as well, were having flashbacks as you tried to go to bed, maybe feeling a little bit guilty about it, thinking, I did this back on February 19, 2011, and at 2.30

in the morning, St. Louis and Colorado got together on the Eric Johnson deal. Maybe I should stay up. What is the latest as we record this very late Sunday evening with Jacob Chikrin and the Arizona Coyotes? First of all, you bring up a good point. I have remembered times where I've gone to bed and woken up in the morning and said, you know, this happened overnight. And you're like, Jesus bleeping, whatever. Never sleep, Jeff. That's the lesson.

Never sleep. Okay. Sleep is for the week, Elliot. Sleep is for the week. Going against everything that we've heard in the last 10 years about how important sleep is. Sleep is for the week, everybody. It's just a phase. get yourself through that phase anyway with the understanding that things can change at any time jacob chikrin the arizona coyotes and the la kings are like that

slow budding romance from high school you You see someone you like, you're interested, they're interested. You both know you're kind of interested in each other. There's some slow flirting. One of the two people really has to go and say, I'm going for this. So past the point of like the little note in the locker at lunchtime, past the whispers

and tell your friend that I think that he or she is cute. Like we're past that phase now. Yes, we're past that phase. I think the LA Kings made it very clear, not only to the Coyotes, but other teams that in anything we consider, we are not including Quinton Byfield and Brent Clark.

I think they felt strongly about that and I'd heard that they'd let everybody know that internally and everyone who asked about it externally. No Byfield, no Clark. Despite that, the Clark rumors went crazy on Sunday and I believe the Kings took the step of notifying Clark that he would not be traded. And you'll talk in a second about Clark's weekend because you had some really good intel. I think people should know it. Like, is it heated up on Saturday and Sunday?

I think everybody was thinking LA was the team, and I think LA is in the driver's seat, but I kept getting warned. It's not close. It's not close. And I think I'm afraid to say this because things can change at any time. I think somewhere between the Kings and Coyotes, there was a snag. Now that doesn't mean that it's impossible. That doesn't mean it can't happen.

But I do think there was some kind of snag I think what the snag may have been is that the Kings and the Coyotes were talking about a contract that needed to be moved and they couldn't agree like I don't think it was one of the principal members of the trade but I think it was potentially an ancillary member on the trade and the two sides couldn't agree on it. I think that stalled the trade a little bit. Again, does it mean it can't happen? No, I don't think it does mean that. I think it still could potentially happen, but I do think it gummed up the works for a little bit. And that's, I think, where we are. Like, as we record this Sunday night after the Super Bowl,

I don't get the sense, again, famous last words, old takes exposed, that this is going to happen tonight. But that doesn't mean it can't be resuscitated. It may have been smart for the Coyotes to do this. Because they held Chikorin out of the game. And because they tweeted what they did, I wonder if it's re-engaged some other teams. I think there's some other teams that are kind of like, okay, this is in the final stages here. Let's see if we can get back in it.

And I think it's possible that's happened, which only clouds all this. Again, I do believe the Kings and the Coyotes were serious. I do believe there were serious conversations between them. I still think it's possible. I don't think it's Clark. I don't think it's Byfield. And I think one of the potential problems was a contract that needed to be moved and they couldn't work it out. That's my best guess at where we are on Sunday night. So to extend then your high school movie motif, then Rob Blake was playing the role of John Cusack in the boombox scene from Say Anything, saying essentially, it's time to see if we can actually do this. I'm still interested over here. You mentioned Brent Clark a couple of seconds ago,

and after we finished 32 Thoughts on Hockey Night on Saturday, and I was working from home, I got upstairs to go and watch the third period of the game, and all of a sudden it was text after text after text, and the common denominator was because we had mentioned Toronto has denied it Edmonton has denied it it wasn't going to be them and the report that we had was the Los Angeles Kings are throwing cold water on it now it was Dustin Brown night so it was the statue it was the jersey was Dustin Brown holding the

Stanley Cup and I don't think they wanted to distract from that or take away from that so i think that was maybe part of of all of this but i had so and you and i went back and forth on texts like into the wee hours about trying to figure out is brant clark involved in this it got to the point where i'm wondering considering you know how much you know you're reading social media as a hockey player, considering all the reports as everyone, you know, jumped out to speculate that if it's going to be Los Angeles, it's going to be Brant Clark as a key piece going back. I'm thinking to myself, you know, if I'm Brant Clark on the bus after a game, I'm reading all of this on my phone and I'm saying, am I going to the Arizona Coyotes? And we tried to figure this one out. And I'm with you.

I've been led to believe all season long. And again, nobody is really untouchable. But the two players, the two young players that the Kings have, that they really have not a lot of desire to even engage any trade conversations about are Quentin Byfield and the aforementioned Brant Clark. So I was skeptical from the beginning. You and I both looked into it and checked around.

A lot of people in the hockey industry and at various levels in various leagues, because everyone's got a sort of vested interest in this or at least a curiosity in it, were sending me texts saying, it's going to be Brant Clark. It's going to be Brant Clark. I'm thinking to myself, going to be Brant Clark, it's going to be Brant Clark. I'm thinking to myself, I wonder if Brant Clark thinks it's going to be Brant Clark that's going to Arizona here. But, geez, you and I were texting till the wee hours trying to sort this one out and quickly arrived at the idea that no, Brant Clark wasn't going to be part of this.

Although, I'll tell you what, I got a text from one agent on Sunday morning who said the same thing that we were talking about on Saturday night. What do you know about this deal? All I know is that Brant Clark is involved, to which I responded, I really don't think that's happening. But I'm sure you had the same experience

of people either making that assumption or what's the old line about a mistruth runs around the block before the truth gets out the front door. This thing spread like wildfire with Brant Clark all through the industry. Honestly, Jeff, the biggest challenge I have in moments like this

where I'm trying to be on top of things is disbelieving things I believe to be true. Things fly so fast. Things fly so quickly. Like you have people that you really trust who are telling things. But someone said to me on Sunday night at the Super Bowl party I was at, why aren't you tweeting more about this? And I said, because things I'm hearing do not line up with some of the information that's out there. And the worst thing you can be is wrong. so sometimes i think it's better to do it

on the pod like this and kind of explain uh the way i feel as opposed to do it out in social media but like as we said at the beginning that's that's the best i can tell you i i think it was very serious between these two teams i think they legitimately tried to get a deal done and i think something snagged the deal you know what my theory is it's a contract that has to be moved as part of this deal that they can't get worked out and we'll see where this goes and i do believe too that there were other teams who re-engaged and we'll see where we go here um they play monday night against nashville the coyotes do we'll see if he's in the lineup um you know you know, like the other thing I wanted to

say about Saturday night, remember last year, the coyotes traded Ilya Labushkin to Toronto and it was on a Saturday night and he was out and they didn't make that kind of a tweet that he just wasn't in. And I called someone, Jeff, it was like two minutes before we went on the air and for our 32 thoughts segment on hockey night. And someone said, be on top of this.

Labushkin's going to Toronto. I think we said it and it happened later that night. It wasn't phrased this way. This time, the Coyotes did it this way, which I think was smart. You know, I'm never going to have a problem with a team doing that. that the other thing i wonder though about this case is i also wonder if it was a situation where maybe the trade wasn't done but they knew it was a possibility and they weren't going to risk it chickren is a guy who's had a lot of injuries and i think it was sort of like we're talking we don't know if this trade necessarily is going to happen, but it could happen.

So we're playing it safe. So they weren't lying, but it wasn't necessarily right on the edge of happening. So a couple of things there. I am curious about this phrasing trade related reasons. Now, if you're of a conspiratorial bent,

maybe you look at that and say, well, an injury could be a trade-related reason for holding someone out. Like we've seen, I think you and I have talked about one of my favorite press releases of all time from any team was from the New York Islanders when Chris Botta was

running communications for the Islanders and they wanted to disguise a rick di pietro injury and so instead of being any type of specific about the injury uh they reported it as general body soreness which i still think that chris takes a lot of pride and not a lie i think chris still takes a lot of pride in that one and that that was kind of his Picasso. There's that conspiracy attached to the quote trade related reasons why Jacob Trickwin was held out. And the other you already hinted at as well. Was this an attempt to get some of the other teams that may have been talking to the Arizona Coyotes to the table? other teams that may have been talking to the Arizona Coyotes to the table. If there's a feeling out there in the hockey universe that the Coyotes are close to a deal and you're not currently engaged with the Arizona Coyotes and thought you were playing maybe a longer game with them, does this get them back to the table? Do either of these two scenarios resonate with you, Elliot?

I wonder. I don't think we're going to know until this is actually done like let's see if it happens later Monday let's see if chicken plays Monday night let's see where we are I don't think the guys are necessarily pulling a fast one on anyone here I think there were legitimate trade conversations like usually when that happens like the deal is done the next day right now maybe everybody wanted to watch the Super Bowl and nobody wanted to ruin the parties, but we're sitting here on Sunday night as we record this, and this is going to come out Monday morning,

and it isn't done yet. Again, doesn't mean it's not going to be done. I just do think that something held this up. Are you scared to sleep tonight, Elliot? Are you scared to close your eyes? To another defenseman, you talked about this on saturday and that is eric carlson now of the san jose sharks perhaps one day of the edmonton oilers i would have to imagine so much of this has to hinge around getting him to a price that the Oilers can afford.

Well, that's exactly what it is. I do think the Oilers want to take a run at this. So if you remember, we interviewed Leon Dreisaitl at All-Star. Do you remember this happening, Jeff? I know you've got, you're like a cat. You've got short-term memory problems. I do remember sitting down. I asked him what he was scared of.

That was actually the best part of the interview. It's fun. The ocean. He said, we don't like to talk about these things. There's people paid to make these decisions, but yes, we give our opinions. From what I understand, one of the things the Oilers players have made it very clear is

if they make a trade, they want to make sure it's somebody who can get the puck out of the zone, not just bang it off the glass, but move it. That the Oilers feel that they're a better team when they have that kind of player back there. Now, everybody can debate this. They can say, we think Edmonton should get this. We think Edmonton needs a heavier presence.

That's the great thing about sports. We're here to debate. But I believe the Oilers are listening at least to their top players who have said, we prefer puck moving, and they're going to look into that. And the best puck mover available is Eric Carlson. going to look into that and the best puck mover available is eric carlson and i don't know if they tried to kidnap him at the all-star break or whatever they did down in florida down twist his arm twist his arms and and and let me say this from what i've heard about carlson is he's trying not to think about it until he's actually presented with something. He wants to go to a winning situation, but I think the key here is,

can the Oilers get him to be a $6.5 to $7 million player? And that means the Sharks, for four years, are going to have to eat somewhere between $4 and $5 million. And there's only one person who can decide if San Jose is willing to do that, and that is the guy who signs the checks and pays the bills. Now, the other thing someone pointed out to me after I said it Saturday night

is you could always do this with a third team. That maybe a third team could get involved. But again, a third team is going to have to eat money for four years. Four years. That's the big one. And it's two to two and a half million. What are you going to have to pay for a team to do that? It's not going to be a fifth round pick.

Yeah. It's not. So one, you got to do that. Two, you got to get the trade done. Three, Carlson's got to say yes. And this is what I really do that. Two, you got to get the trade done. Three, Carlson's got to say yes. And this is what I really do believe. For argument's sake, if this is what McDavid and Dreisaitl want, I think if you're the Oilers, you have a responsibility to try. Because if you're going to ask them your opinion, and as Dreisaitl said, we do get asked our opinion, but I'm not going to say what it is.

You have to give them the impression that their opinion is valued. Like the last thing you want, if you're the oldest, is let's just say, let's just say for argument's sake, Dreisaitl decides to leave. You don't want him saying, well, I offered my opinion and they never listened to me. That was one of the reasons I left. Well, I offered my opinion and they never listened to me. That was one of the reasons I left. So if you're going to ask these guys for their opinions,

you have to explore what they want. And I find it very hard to believe that these Carlson rumors haven't kicked up again without the Oilers having a general idea of how their players feel. And I think that's what you need to do. Now, you can go back and say, look, we can't make this work. And I think everybody would get that. I would say this, the odds of it not happening are much greater than the odds of it happening, but you have to try. And I think that's what the Oilers are doing here.

I'm with you. I don't think this is a 50-50 proposal. I still think this slants more towards, no, it's not going to happen than yes, it is going to happen for a lot of the reasons that you detail here. And I think a lot of that is the money that San Jose will have to retain on, not just this, the response I got was, well, yeah, but it's either, you know, you're hanging on to $6 million or you're hanging on to 11.5. You know, you're not going to be, you're not going to actualize again or rebuild this team for another three or four years. So isn't it just, you know, empty calorie production and empty calorie money that you're spending here. But I think this is a hard one, obviously. you're spending here um but i think this is a hard one obviously uh i still think that san jose would have to take salary back from this edmondson lineup right away like this has got to say nothing

of you know whether it's you know first round picks or prospects whatever else the oilers would have to trade in this situation this is like this is the opposite of a turnkey deal this is the opposite of an easy deal this this might be elliot as we believe it right now the hardest deal to do in the nhl period yeah having said that if you're eric carlson you know and you're saying okay i want a shot at winning the stanley cup. And you're having visions of making passes, the likes of which you made to Mike Hoffman once upon a time against the Boston Bruins, but doing it with Connor McDavid,

that's pretty enticing. And if you're Connor McDavid and you're Leon Dreissel, you're saying, well, all of a sudden, our exits out of our own zone just got really easy and our already insanely great power play just got that much better. I'm with you. Like from a hockey play point of view, this hits on so many levels. and our already insanely great power play just got that much better. I'm with you.

Like, from a hockey play point of view, this hits on so many levels for all players involved here. Like, if you're Carlson, yeah, give me someone playing with McDavid and Dreisaitl and Hyman and go right down the list. And if you're the Oilers, like, this makes our lives much easier. And if you believe that a team like the Colorado Avalanche has taken a step back this season, all of a sudden the field is more wide open than it's ever been in the Western Conference. I think the West is wide open. I really do.

Now, the one thing is I still think Colorado is the team to beat, providing everybody's healthy. But I do think the West is really wide open. I think the other thing, too, here is look at the way Edmonton's playing lately. They've got their flaws. Everybody does. But they're winning games. And the other thing too is, and this is, I think, a key thing. They used to get caved in when McDavid and Dreisaitl were not on the ice.

They're holding their own now. I think that's important. I think Edmonton has to go for it. This is a year where you cannot waste this year. I remember a year ago when they were struggling, Ken Holland was saying, I'm not trading my first rounder. He didn't even know they were going to get in the playoffs at the time. And people were saying, no, you can't waste it.

You can't waste it. You can't waste it. And he was telling people, I don't know what we are here. I don't think that's the same this year. I think the Oilers have a much more comfortable feel about who they are and where they're going. I don't think there's any fear this year about do we chase it or is this the wrong year to burn assets now i don't

think they're going to be reckless but i think they're in the game and and i'll tell you something else like i want to say one thing about another player and that's tyson berry um like i think if they'd gotten klingberg they were going to have to move Barry. I think if they get Carlson, if, if, if, I mean, Barry's probably going to have to be in the deal because Carlson's going to take all that power play time. I have heard that this year they have been really happy with Barry. And I think Barry has played really well this year. They've got a killer power play and obviously he's not the number one reason. They've got a killer power play.

And obviously he's not the number one reason. But what I do think is that he has shown that he's a great fit on that power play with those guys. And I think he's played really hard. I think the other thing too is I just think he's a big part of their group. And one of the things I've heard this year the Oilers have said internally is, it's the Al McInnes question. What does this do to our room? Now, I think if you're adding an Eric Carlson, I mean, what are you going to do? He could win the Norris Trophy this year.

But I do think the Oilers have thought long and hard about the way that Barry has played this year and the role he plays that if he's going out it better be for a good reason i i have heard that about them that they they really feel that barry has become a big part of their framework internally and they can't just be all willy-nilly about moving him okay one more thing on carlson So you mentioned he could win the Norris trophy this year. He's having this season. I don't want to say out of nowhere because

we've all, we should expect something like this from Eric Carlson. He's just that good, but he's having a spectacular season. And I don't think we expected that to happen this year for Eric Carlson. You know, I've said to you before, it's almost like he's gone to Lourdes and bathed

in holy water and he's come back and he's completely healed up. That's an excellent reference, by the way. Just excellent. Thank you. And he's 24 years old and he's playing, he's in perfect health here and he's never met someone by the name of Matt Cook. Someone said to me on Saturday, this is San Jose's best chance to get out of this contract because there's no guarantee he's going to continue like this. There's no guarantee he's going to continue to perform at this level.

He may go back to being the Carlson we've seen over the past couple of seasons in San Jose. He's having this career year, Norris candidate, all of it. This is their best and maybe only great chance to get out of this deal. Agree or disagree? I disagree. I don't think it's their only chance because I think this deal might be, I don't know if less complicated is the right word for all the reasons that you have said, but I do think this is deal would potentially be easier in an off season than a regular season.

Don't forget in the off season season see where the cap's going contracts come off your books you get a 10 summer cushion i wouldn't ever say it's easy but i would say it's easier knowing that and it might not be this season but in subsequent seasons the cap will be going up does that make it an easier pill to swallow for san jose if they make this deal knowing that they're going to have some dead cap space um on their on their roster here knowing that the cap will eventually go up here and maybe even substantially as well does that make it easier for san jose like is it part of the pitch like hey i know you have to eat a lot of salary here for the remainder of this year and for subsequent seasons but the cap is going up i think it makes a huge difference absolutely i think it makes a huge difference

and we always should mention jeff that if it's not carlson i do wonder if goss despair is going to be their guy it's going to be somebody it's going to be someone that moves the puck the chickering thing with edmonton it's really difficult for me to pin down like for a long time i heard no it's not going to be them for chickering then i heard they were kind of considering it and looking at it and i don't know like i'm being honest with everybody here i don't know what to make of this i think there have been times they've been no i think there have been times they've been you know what he's played well enough that we better do it i think there are people in the organization who really support it I think there are others who are not so sure I'm just going to tell you you get mixed messages

from Edmonton when it comes to Chikrin but I do think on Saturday night they were not the team that was close to treating them. Listen to the 32 Thoughts Podcast ad-free on Amazon Music, included with Prime. Now, I want to talk about something else. Before we get to the other stories and rumors from the weekend, with the trade deadline a few weeks away,

did you watch the Super Bowl? I did. On Sunday night. I did with my boys, yeah. KC. Did you watch the Super Bowl? I did. On Sunday night. I did with my boys, yeah. KC. Did you wager at all? Did you bet? No, Elliot, I'm not much of a wagerer.

The only thing that I wager on is the in-season cup currently held by Erin Ambrose and her Colorado Avalanche, and I'm trying to get it back on Tuesday as my Tampa Bay Lightning try to bring the in-season cup back to where it belongs. No, I'm not much of a gambler but uh... i was wondering maybe the same thing that you were towards the end of the game the uh... the holding call very very safe

grabs on he's got his left hand on his back i don't know what my i think you let him play obviously the home study side i think i think you let him play, finish this thing out. I don't love that call, Mike. Which, again, like I'm not the biggest football fan, so I always say to myself, you know what, it's best that someone like me doesn't weigh in on this one. But from my naive football eyes, man, that looked like a soft call considering where

the game was at and the gravity that that call had. a soft call considering where the game was at and the gravity that that call had well greg olson who was the the color commentator during the game he ripped the call oh yeah and he was he was a really good player for those of you who don't know him he was a long time tight end in the nfl he said he hated the fact that that call decided the game now please understand as i say this i wagered on the chiefs so this might you know bias my opinion because i won money because of this i look at that play and i say if he is not held kansas city wins the game right there and i think the other thing that happens is not only does kansas city win the game right there or at least take the lead right there, Philly gets more time on the clock. So that call doesn't just give Kansas City another first down, but it allows them to run the clock down to eight seconds before they kick the winning field

goal or whatever it was. Right. So that game really changed things and Olsen ripped that call. And I had a really interesting text exchange with someone in the game. And they said that that call would never be made in the NHL. And sometimes people rip that in the NHL, that they don't make those calls. Like you take a look at non-calls that happen late in NHL games or late in or during overtimes, like we get more calls than we used to, that happen late in NHL games or during overtimes,

we get more calls than we used to, but generally a lot of stuff is let happen. And I wonder after watching a lot of people rip that call, and hey, social media is not the best arbiter of the world, but I see a lot more ripping that call than I see praising it. Do people want that? The NHL way is generally let the players decide and and don't give me this argument about well if you don't make the call then you're not letting the players decide because they can't make the plays look either the referee makes the call or they don't

and there the referee made the call and again i thought the guy was about to score a touchdown. Olsen hated it. What does everybody want? Like after seeing that, do you want that call made in NHL or an NFL game? Or are you like, no, that's too soft. Let the players decide. And I guarantee you, if, if you think like Greg Olson, then that's the way that's generally the NHL philosophy. Let the players decide. And there are some great Hall of Fame players

who believe that that's the way it should be. But I also hear a lot of people out there who hate that those calls don't get made. After seeing that tonight, I wonder how everybody feels. To me, this is a matter of the players weighing in on what they want this is not the managers or the coaches or the fans to me this is the moment where you say to the players how do you want this game officiated do you want more of the strict enforcement of the rule book do you want more strict enforcement the rule book but just in the regular season and then the rules get laxed in the playoffs specifically when you get into overtime

to me this is one where the players need to weigh in and i will tell you one thing because i thought about this when i saw it because i had a feeling we're going to talk about this on the podcast and and measure this off against the NHL. If you were still working a beat, if you were still covering a team or, you know, at the rink every day, holding microphones in people's faces, would you not ask every single player that you talk to what he thought about that call? And does he want that type of call made in the nhl this is essentially me asking everybody who covers the team who's going to hold the microphone on monday please to every single player you interview ask what they thought about that call this is the

perfect time to have this discussion i could not agree more and i'm glad you brought this up elliot now we've seen it right here right and it's the super bowl yeah this isn't like like a random sunday afternoon at three thirty no this is the super bowl that call changed the game in two ways not only did kansas city score but they were able to run down the clock because they made a brilliant play to dive at the one yard line. That was real good. And if he catches that ball and scores the touchdown on the original play, Philly and Kansas City can't stop them. At least Philly has almost two minutes to go down the field with two timeouts. Yep. Like it's a completely different end of game scenario. It destroyed any chance Philly had of making a comeback.

So what does everybody think? I have to tell you something else too, Jeff. There was a lot of replay in that game. There was a very stop and start athletic event. I am very pro replay. My opinion is starting to change. The only thing that makes me not come back and say no is that if a clear replay could save a championship game,

we're going to regret it if we don't have it. See, here's the thing. It doesn't seem, and again, I am a very, very casual football fan. To me, it doesn't seem intrusive. I look at football as a stop and start game, and I look at hockey as a flow game. So too much review to me seems really intrusive. It doesn't feel that way to me when I watch football. It's the play, it takes a couple of seconds, and then you stop and you regroup again. Like it already feels like we're stopping regularly anyhow. So it didn't, doesn't feel

intrusive to me, Elliot, but hockey, it really does because hockey's flow. Tyler Bertuzzi, other Detroit Red Wings, as you mentioned earlier, and we've talked about before, not a lot of information comes out of Detroit. But one of the things that we can, you know, safely surmise is Tyler Bertuzzi is valued around the NHL. Is he valued by the Detroit Red Wings? I think much like every other player on the Detroit Red Wings, he is valued at the price point

that Steve Eisenman judges is fair. See Larkin, comma, Dillon. So I think there's a few teams that are interested. I think Dallas is in this. I think Edmonton has shown interest. And I believe Tampa as well. That's the kind of player Tampa's looking for. Yeah, because Tampa needs more pricks, right?

Like they've only got Pat Maroon and Corey Perry and Brandon Hagel. It's like, yeah, we need more pricks on this team. And also, I think that's really funny actually. And Ken Holland knows Tyler Bertuzzi. Yes. You know, the one thing about Bertuzzi when it comes to Canada is I don't really have clarity on what his status is and what that means. And, you know, he's unvaccinated. And technically, although nobody really seems to care anymore, technically, if you're not a U.S. citizen or you're not on a U.S. work visa, you can't just cross the border if you're not a US citizen or you're not on a US work visa,

you can't just cross the border if you're unvaccinated. Right now, he's on a US work visa. And if he gets traded to another US team, I don't think this is an issue. But I had one Canadian GM say to me, we don't know that it wouldn't be an issue if, for say, we were the one to trade for him. That's the one thing I don't know that it wouldn't be an issue if, for say, we were the one to trade for them. That's the one thing I don't know here because technically you have to apply for a Canadian work visa and then it becomes like the question,

like, do you have to declare it? I don't think anybody really here knows what the answer is, but it's a thing. I would hope that if Edmonton's really serious about this, they're making sure that this is not going to be an issue.

I don't think it's an issue at all for a Dallas or a Tampa Bay. You know, Dallas is interesting. You talked about, you know, Ken Holland knows the player and certainly has a relationship with Steve Eiserman as does Jim Nill. I would imagine that Dallas is trying to find someone to play with Tyler Sagan. I know they don't have a first round draft pick this year to play with.

They do have a lot of prospect capital. I don't think there's a few players I'm pretty sure they don't want to let go of, whether it's Stankhoven or Bork specifically, Exhibit A and Exhibit B. But do you not get the feeling, because I do, that Dallas wants to do something? We talked about the West being wide open. Yes. When we had the Edmonton conversation. If you're Dallas, how do you not figure the

same thing? Like you're flying high, you're doing great. Everything is firing. Everyone's healthy. Everything's clicking right now. I don't know if you're, if you're Dallas, how do you not look at making a move right now? I think you have to, I mean, you can win the

Stanley cup. You could. And if you feel you've got a hole, you got to address it. This is your year. Uh, I I'm, I'm with you a thousand percent. I absolutely am. Okay.

Vancouver Canucks, Luke Shen, Brock Besser. What do you hear? What do you know? What's the latest? I have heard the Shen one could happen at any time. The way he plays, he risks getting hurt because he plays a tough game.

Yeah. And I heard that when he got missed the game this week things kind of accelerated like people were saying okay we better get him because we don't want him getting hurt there and i think vancouver's like we don't need him getting hurt here i i do think that this accelerated it's one of those really tough things because i i had people say to me yesterday they think it's really close, but then other people remind you like it's not done until it's done. Like I think Calgary's there. I think Boston's there.

I think Toronto's been there. I have a sneaking suspicion. And again, it's just a suspicion because I think Dubas is trying to do everything he can to confuse people as to what he's up to, including nosier reporters. Just the intel is saying he's looking at a forward first. Again, I could be proven to be totally wrong about this. But on Saturday afternoon, when I was prepping for the show, that's kind of where I thought they were. And maybe it changes, and maybe that's wrong. We'll see. I think changes and maybe that's wrong.

We'll see. I think that's what Toronto's thinking. So I think a player like Shen has kind of been pushed to the background for then. I was asking everybody I spoke to on Saturday, who's the next player to move? And this was before Arizona sent out that tweet. Most people said Shen. They thought that Shen was the next guy to go. We'll see where this ends up. Now, the other thing here too is it's been reported now,

Shen's wife is due to give birth right around the deadline, and I do think Vancouver is trying to take that into consideration. So that adds another layer to this. That's good. But he's the guy I think everyone's looking at. You know, Besser, I do think they're trying to move him. I do think that he wants to get moved. You know, as I told you on Friday, I think this Minnesota thing is too complicated.

I think he'd like to go to Minnesota. I think Minnesota likes the idea of him. I do think they talked about a Greenway for Besser kind of deal. I just don't think it's going to work it's interesting like greenway fits the way minnesota wants to play oh yeah but i i think i think there's something going on with him too i think he's a guy who could be on the move whether it's now or it's the summer he has a no trade a partial that kicks in in uh on july 1st so between that and everything else,

I think we're all kind of wondering about him. The one thing about Besser is I had heard that Vancouver kind of thought that Meyer would go first and then Besser would go. But another GM tell me don't ride that with next month's mortgage payment because there are teams out there that know they're not getting Meyer who will just, who will just, who will look at Besser. As we bounce around players and bounce around teams,

James Van Reemstuyck and the Philadelphia Flyers. Like, I think there's a lot of rumors swirling about, you know, around the Flyers and who's available and who they're willing to move. And what that indicates for the future. Is this going to be a little bit of a step back? Is going to be a total teard a step back is going to be a total

teardown how deeper cuts going to end up going with the philadelphia like i'm still with the belief that they like a lot of their players like there's a lot i think a lot of people are thinking oh you can get anybody off that philadelphia flyers roster i really don't think so for each but one of the players that is available and has interest is james van reams dyke um the teams that we've bandied about and again did it again on on saturday the uh minnesota wild the winnipeg jets and maybe most interestingly although maybe not most essentially when you consider kelly mccrimmon how aggressive he is the vegas golden knights i don't like i don't think you should be surprised about mccrimmon at all I think that

you know they have a lot of cash free here or cap free here all of a sudden right I think he's going to do something I don't think he's just going to sit there and not use it they won't have stone back for the regular season and they were already looking for depth forwards anyway I think Vegas is going to be a team to watch whether it's you know the st louis guys or riley barbachev achari whether it's van reamstike whether it's patrick keen like i think vegas is going to do something here and um you know like the the one thing that's about them in the last couple weeks is they've been pretty honest about stone he's out for a long time yeah and and but they said thompson like someone asked bruce cassidy the other day is's out for a long time. Yeah. And, and, but they said Thompson, like someone

asked Bruce Cassidy the other day, is he out for the rest of the regular season? He's like, no, that like, that's not what we're talking about here. So I think they go for it. I, I think they, I think they will. I wouldn't expect, especially after missing the players last year.

I don't think there's any doubt in my mind that they're, they're looking to add. And I think they're willing to be creative of what they've lost in stone by the way i wanted to mention to you know i heard there's been a little bit of interest in philly nick sealer and it makes a lot of sense if you really think about it first of all he is signed. Yeah. You know, they signed him. They extended him. He's signed for 775 next year. And he's 775 obviously this year. So it's not expensive contract.

He plays a tough, tough game. Yeah. Remember last year he took on. Nick Delorier. Nick Delorier in a fight. Like people notice that. And he's a good third pair defender on a really good contract who plays hard and you know what the the what i was told is like people

have watched sealer play and you're looking at a team like philly like i could see philly has every reason in the world to keep this guy that's what i believe yeah like like i could see john i could i could hear john torrella saying like, what the hell? Like, are you guys serious? But I've heard that, like, I've heard, like, I've had a couple of guys tell me that like Nick Sealer is a guy who's gained some real respect.

And if you're looking for a third pairing D, you could do a hell of a lot worse than him. I agree. I, I like Nick Sealer. Um, I'm of the belief that teams have called about Nick Sealer, but for all those reasons you just laid out about why other teams would want him, that's probably why Philly wants to keep him. And I think a lot of it is the price tag.

Yeah. It's a great contract. What a great team. If you're Philadelphia, it's like, okay, if you want Nick Seeler, it's going to sound weird because we're talking about a 6'7 defenseman here. You're going to really have to knock our socks off. Yeah.

Why would you do that? Yeah. Why would you? Like if, if I'm Philly, man, I'm like, yeah, thanks, but no thanks. Unless you're going to like really over quote unquote overpay. No way.

I want to keep Nick Seeler. I've heard the same thing about Konechny too. I know people have wondered if they're going to move him and, you know, he's really struggling, but Tortorella, at least production wise, but Tortorella paid him a really big compliment the other day about how hard he's playing um you know I I heard that Philly said to someone like why would we do that he's signed for three years we need players you you have to get people in your building you know I I think they

said like you you really have to make it worth our while for us to consider it the one thing i do think about philly is i think they're looking for centers you know i'm i'm glad you mentioned that about um about about travis connect me because if you've if you follow john tortorella this year it's been really interesting because players that find themselves in the doghouse for a while end up being the player that Tortorella goes out of his way to praise. Remember when Cam York was sent down? Yes. And it was not ready for the NHL. And I said, we heard everything about Cam York from John Tortorella. And then we figured, okay, he's going to do his, what were you figuring? Like 30, 35 games in the American league at Lehigh. And then he's going to get finally called back up because this is one of the

big, like, this is a big project for the Philadelphia Flyers. He's been raving about Cam York. Like on the, on the one hand, like it's classic Tortorella on the, you know, there's a, there's a pat in the back and then there's a kick in the ass. And there's, they're separated by separated by about 18 to 24 inches. And that's been classic. He did the same thing with Ristolainen as well. I'm endlessly intrigued by John Tortorella and how he handles players.

Because whenever there's the stick, it's followed by the carrot. Not instantly, but over the course of time. He goes out of his way to praise York. He goes out of his way to praise Rasmus, Chris Delaney, and Kevin Hayes as well. Travis Konechny. He's been a fascinating study this year. To me, the Philadelphia Flyers

are one of the most interesting teams, and maybe a lot of that is because of John Tortorella. I'm so glad that you mentioned that because it's one of the things that's meaning to mention here on the podcast and talk to you about. And the Cam York thing to me is just stunning because you hear Torts talk about York now

and measure it off against, you know, what he talked about at training camp. It is night and day. Yes, it is. Okay, Elliot, the Ottawa Senators, and we'll start with the bad. You know, watching Saturday afternoon, watching Anton Fursberg and the injury, it looked awful.

And our hearts, you know, broke for the Ottawa Senators goaltender. And it looked, you know, terrible from the get-go. And watching him get stretchered out, you're crossing your fingers and you're hoping for the best. But we got the opposite on Sunday. Ottawa Senators General Manager Pierre Dorian saying it is MCL tears in both of his knees. He is out indefinitely. It's just awful. There's not much of a conversation to be had here other than it's over to Mad Sogard and Kevin Mandelese to shepherd the other netminding duties. I just hope, I think we all do, that it is a speedy recovery for Anton Forsberg, who was delightful with us when he came on the podcast, a wonderful guy, great goaltender.

We really hope the best for Anton Forsberg of the Ottawa Senators. Alex DeBrinckit, you talked about him on Saturday. What's the latest? So obviously he isn't signed right now. And I think people have kind of wondered what that all means. It's a $9 million offer for Debrinket. If you want to keep his rights. Yes. You know, I think that teams call because they should call and okay. He's not signed.

What are you doing here? I think that's happened. I've heard the senators have said, we're not doing this right now. I think they have also said, we're going to take another run at this with new ownership. I'm not a guy who likes to throw up

the emergency signal, five alarm blaze, emergency 51, Randolph Mantooth. This is really old. This is not cool. You're the worst. You always blast me for all the references look at you i i just think that it's basically what it tells you is that to bring gets chosen to wait until he sees what the future of the team is like what's the new ownership going to look like what's

the direction going to look like yeah and we'll see where that goes you know by the way on that i spoke to someone who i i think is one of the potential bidders here. Yes. He said something very interesting to me. He said that because it was Melnick and everything they heard about Melnick, they were kind of expecting the books to be a mess. He said to me, it's a lot better than they were anticipating he said that whatever is going on here in terms of putting the numbers together and cleaning everything up and i don't know if this is

why the portal took so long to open or the sale process to begin but he he said to me, he was skeptical about the number the NHL was talking about, like 800 million plus. He said he sees a path there based on what the numbers say. He said that whether it was poorly run or not before, it looks like a much better purchase now. Who knows if it goes higher if they get a bidding war, but he said 800 is not unrealistic for this team. That's a good sign for the Senators,

but I think the Brinkett, I think he wants to see. And I think it's going to be interesting to see what Ottawa does here. Do they add someone for the rest of the year or do they wait? Like they have a lot of good small pieces like Tyler Mott. I can definitely see him

being a guy that a contender picks up but i think the curious thing is going to be is do they add anyone do they bring in a d to test drive do they do anything like that but like i said i think they're holding to brink it and they'll see how it all plays out the rangers and vitaly kratsov i know at various times you said okay it's over okay they've tried again it's not working they need to part ways and here we are again elliot same conversation like chris jury is really quiet he's another one of the super quiet gms so it's difficult to find out what's going on here. It's possible. The GMs are really careful about this chain now. I remember a couple of years ago,

I got some names that were sent on that chain and I heard there was a massive freak out. So they tend to be more careful. I think it's possible the Rangers sent something out on him yesterday, but nobody would confirm it. He played Friday. He didn't play saturday but i think there's an understanding now that the time has come and i i think the rangers are have made it very clear that if you have interest in kravtsov give us a call so i i think we'll see where this goes i look i i think it's clear that the coach is not a huge fan and i

think the player wants to play and you do reach a point where you've got to say okay it's time and i i think we are at that point now with the rangers and something else i want to say about the rangers man i was talking to someone this morning sunday morning and he said to me he wonders if some teams are going to make moves now because they've seen what the addition of Tarasenko has done for the Rangers. He goes out and he scores in two minutes against Seattle on Friday night, and then Panarin scores four on Saturday. And the guy said to me, Panarin's good enough that he can score four goals without Tarasenko, but you look at the video the Rangers put out

after the game of Tarasenko giving the hat to Panarin. People notice these kinds of things. It gives a lift to a team. The Rangers know now that their general manager thinks that they can win the Stanley Cup. We were talking about that with Winnipeg on Saturday night because I think you mentioned JVR. I think he's one of the guys on their radar.

I look at Winnipeg, and I think you go out and you get a guy like JVR. You're sending a message to your players, we can do some damage here. I look at the Rangers, those two games in 24 hours, they beat two really good teams, and you can see the level rising because their players know that their ownership and management thinks that they can win the stanley cup and i think it's a great theory it's again it's the mckinnis question how does this play out in our room

it's playing out pretty good in the rangers room right now well you know who i'm looking at specifically because it seems as if every superstar is going to the Metropolitan Division, whether it's Bo Horvat to the Islanders, whether it's Vlad Tarasenko to the Rangers. The two teams that I'm looking at here are the Carolina Hurricanes and the New Jersey Devils. And listen, we've attached Timo Meier to the New Jersey Devils. You could maybe do the same thing for the Carolina Hurricanes. Not that you want to specifically just respond to other teams' moves, but if you're Carolina and New Jersey

right now, knowing how hot the Rangers are, and as we record this, they've won five games in a row, and to your point, they look fantastic since getting Tarasenko. How are you not thinking about a response? I think you have to be. Because you know what? I think the Devils, they could win the Stanley Cup this year. They could? So could the

Carolina Hurricanes. Carolina to me is a really interesting one now because with Pacioretty being out, are they going to need two moves? They need a center and a winner. They got the cap space to do it. And they're creative. I think it's fascinating. I agree with you. I just like the idea of all the big names going into one division here. Just everybody to the Metropolitan.

Every single big player just right to the Metro. There's a name, Elliot, I want to get on everyone's radar right now. He's a late bloomer. So he's 21 years old. He's a Finnish defenseman. He's 6'6", never drafted. His name is Valtteri Puli. Kind of been turning heads all season long.

He's playing this weekend at the BHG tournament. That is the Bayer Hockey Games for only the Swedish games. He plays TPS Turku. Now, a number of teams, trying to think of the best way to phrase this. There are a number of teams that have shown interest, but at varying degrees. Like I've heard of a couple of different teams that have been, you know, really hot on them. And a couple of like, yeah, maybe we'll just kick tires. And I'm having a hard time trying to figure out who's really aggressive and who's just curious.

But it sounds like the teams that have had interest, and again, to varying degrees, the San Jose Sharks, which should surprise nobody considering how, you know, they want to, you know to redo the prospect pool there. The Winnipeg Jets, the Boston Bruins, the Vancouver Canucks, the Nashville Predators, the Pittsburgh Penguins, and the New York Islanders. Now, the one thing about Pooley is he can't sign an NHL deal until his season is done in Finland. I believe that regular season ends in the middle of March, and then whatever playoff brings along with it. When this podcast comes out Monday,

I'll throw up a clip of Pooley playing so everyone can see what we're talking about. But 6'6", not drafted, 21-year-old Finnish defenseman Valtteri Pooley just wanted to get that guy's name on people's radar because somewhere by the end of the season, he's going to be a member of some NHL team. Hit a pause,

come back with your phone calls and your emails. 32 thoughts continues. All right, get it before it's gone. Visit the Sportsnet shop to get your 32 thoughts merchandise. That's hoodies, that's teas, crew necks even a

coffee mug that changes color when you fill it up with your go-to warm beverage visit www.shopsportsnet.store to get your 32 gear today www.shopsportsnet.store world. Elliot, I want to ask you about Patrick Kane and Jonathan Taves because they continue to be headline makers. And we saw Patrick Kane's remarks after the Vladimir Tarasenko trade to the New York Rangers. Now, let me frame this this way. I was having a conversation with someone on Saturday who said, here's the question we have of Patrick Kane. And I said, what's that? And he said, where's his heart at? Because his heart was in Chicago. His heart also was in New York. his heart also was in new york now that it doesn't appear as if new york is an option the question that we're wondering is where's patrick kane's heart at right now what do you think so i i think there's a few things number one i believe that patrick k Jonathan Taves thought they were going to retire as Blackhawks.

And I believe last summer when the Blackhawks were beginning this process and they were training to brink it and all this, I think they told those guys, guys, this is the way it's going to be. It's not going to be pretty. And we're going to start over. And sometimes I think when you hear that, you may not believe it because it's the summer. They're like, okay, things can change. And reality sets in. Like, first of all, I think when you've won as much as those two guys have, it's really hard to lose like

this. And now all of a sudden you're seeing, oh my God, like this is for real. This is where we're going. And losing sucks, especially when you've won as much as those guys have. So I think that's one thing that's happened. I think they've come to the realization that this is what it is in Chicago. They're going to lose,

and they're going to lose for a few years and it's not going to be fun. That's number one. Number two, I don't know about Taves. I do think at the very least with Kane, I think there was, I don't know if it desires the right word, but the idea that maybe he plays there for one more year while he gets healthy. I just don't think that's the road the Blackhawks want to do. I think that adds to the level of, oh boy, this is real. Like this is, this is happening. Some people didn't like what Kane said the other day. I refuse to criticize him. We're always complaining that hockey players are boring and don't tell the truth and don't say what they mean. He came right out and said it. We cannot criticize him for that.

He told us his raw unvarnished truth. And I have no problem with that. And I thank him for doing it. Look, I like, uh, there were people out there who thought it was rangers or nothing that he was rangers or he was nothing when those quotes came out people were texting me see see see i told you it's rangers or nothing and now i think at the very least he has to think is there somewhere else he wants to go like i think Edmonton's looked at it, but you know, the tough thing is, is that, you know, he's not going to play

on the number one power play in Edmonton. Like, is there really a sensible fit there? Like, I've wondered about Vegas. I've wondered about Dallas. I think he has to wrap his head around, okay, what else is out there for me that I really like like there were two things that he struck me as being really upset about number one the trade obviously and number two he's upset about all this talk about his hip and you know I did an

interview with Pat Boyle and Barstool Chief in Chicago on Saturday and and Chief said that Kane says he feels better than he has before. And he might, like, I'm not, I'm not arguing with anything that Patrick Kane feels, but it's what it looks like to other teams. Now, I think there were two factors here with the Rangers too. And one that doesn't get as much reported. And that is that because of Kane's number like he makes three million a year more than Tarasenko does in terms of a cap hit even banking space like the Rangers had been they would have had to wait until later to make the move for Kane or they would have had to pay another team to do it they went after Tarasenko because of the fit. They went after

Tarasenko because of the health of Kane, but they also knew because of Kane's number, they would have had to wait to do it longer. And I don't think they wanted to do that. You know, how many times have we seen this when a player thinks that they're going to be in a place for their entire career and it goes sideways? It's never pretty. Like the Hawks have basically said, our decision was made that we're tanking and we're moving on. And it's up to Kane to decide what he wants to do here. And I think when you're a guy who thinks

you're going to be in one place your whole career, like you're sitting there saying, I've done everything good here and we've been successful. And now you're sitting there saying, I've done everything good here and we've been successful. And now you're sitting there saying, you know what? Like this isn't the place for me anymore. It's jarring. I think anybody listening to this has had moments in their lives where they felt the exact same thing. Yep.

Totally agree. I think with Kane, all of that emotion came pouring out on the Friday. So I think what now is you're going to see Kane take another week or so to make up his mind. I think he's not going to pour gasoline on the fire. I think he's really going to think about where the path goes from here. But I think he said what he needs to say, and I think he's just going to now it's all about, okay, what do I want?

But again, I don't have a problem with what he said. I think we want our hockey players to speak honestly. He did, and that's that. Taves, Jeff, you know, one of the things I wondered about, is there any chance that Taves is not going to play again this year with this ailment he has considering his health history? I mean, I hope that's not the case. I want him to be healthy and playing. going to play again this year with this ailment he has considering his health history i mean i hope that's not the case i want him to be healthy and playing i don't as it stands right now i don't get

that impression like he's still around the team he's still working out so that says to me that he intends to come back but you know this situation we don't have clarity on it yet so we've got to wait till we know what we're dealing with. Okay, Elliot, as we do on the Monday morning podcast, we will go through some emails and go through some phone calls. The email address, 32thoughts at sportsnet.ca. We always get good ones. We appreciate you putting on your thinking toques and sending great questions and voicemail, 1-833-311-3232.

Again, as I was always told in radio, say the numbers slowly. 1-833-311-3232. There is nothing worse than listening to the radio and hearing a host just blaze through a phone number and you're expected to remember it. So there it is. We will start with a voicemail, Elliot, from someone who goes by the moniker of Anonymous. Well, this person doesn't go by Anonymous. They just didn't leave a name.

Here's Anonymous from South Florida. Hi, Jeff and Elliot. Long-time listener, first-time caller. I'm wondering what y'all's thoughts are on what the Panthers should do with the trade line coming up. I know the team is seemingly trying to figure things out, but there's also this need for long-term capital. So yeah, curious what your thoughts are.

Thanks in advance. All right. Just an instruction to everyone who leaves a voicemail, please leave your name. We like to say, hey, Steve, or hey, you know, Kathy, or whomever, like just leave your name so we can be polite. Anyway, your thoughts on that question from mr anonymous well the first thing is do the panthers think they're going to make the playoffs and or do reasonable damage there they're pushing right now they are they're pushing man they really

looked like they were in big trouble yep they have righted themselves. They've had some good hockey. I mean, still, the math isn't huge for them. Right now, they're three points out, and they've played 55 games going into Sunday's action. So you're three points back of Pittsburgh, and they've got three games in hand. You're four points back of Washington, and they've got a game in hand. So they've made a race of this, but the math isn't their friend. of game in hand so they've made a race of this but the math isn't their friend you know the the one thing is is that you know the panthers as they struggled this year there started to be a narrative come out that the panthers knew that this was going to be a tough year until they got out of some cap issues and they were kind of aiming more for next year. And some people said, that's crap, that's spin.

And maybe it is, but I had heard that last summer. And I talked about that on one of the podcasts after the Kachuk deal with the Flames that we did. They shot their wad last year. They did everything that they could. It didn't work. And you can't do that every year. You were one of the people who was wondering if Florida was the trade partner for Chikrin, and you weren't the only one.

I had other people saying, Florida, Florida, Florida, they need him. And I was like, yeah, they need him, but you know what Arizona wants, and they don't have any of that. Now, I think the Panthers, I don't see them doing rentals. I see them doing anything for term I see them also saying look if we're not going to make it is there anybody we've got to move out or anybody that's got value we can get something for them we can move out I just don't see them doing anything remotely close to what they did last year and then we'll see what they do in the summer like

I have to tell you I have really thought that that's one of the teams that makes sense for Eric Carlson in the summer. Like you look at their D, he would be a heck of a fit there. And again, they don't have a lot of the capital that San Jose might want. That's just me speculating. I think Florida's bigger decisions probably come in the summer when they reshape their team like the the Kachuk deal looks really good for them oh yeah and I think they figure out they finish this year they I don't think they make any crazy moves this year unless it's long-term benefit to them I agree

and I think they kind of reset in the summer I wonder and this is just my opinion, is if Calgary tries to see if they can get Anthony Duclair. Does he need more speed? You need to solve this Huberto problem. I think they have one question they have to solve more than anything else. And that is, how do we get Jonathan Huberto comfortable? And Duclair, like he played with Duclair and Bennett. I'm not expecting them to trade for Bennett,

the flames. Uh, no, I think that ship has sailed. Yeah. But like, I wonder what a guy like do Claire because Huberto needs somebody with speed who can back away the defense and do Claire's that kind of guy. Like, I don't even know if it's possible.

It's just something I was thinking. I spent a bit of time last week wondering about how do you solve this Huberto issue if you're the Flames and you need a player like that. I wonder if they have any interest in him at all. But of course, he has to get healthy. He hasn't played yet. So when you're saying you spent time last week

wondering about this issue, what you're really saying is, while I was on the radio with you, Jeff, instead of listening to you, I was wondering about what the Calgary Flames need and how they get there and ignoring your questions. And I'm doing that on the podcast right now too. Brandon in Williams Lake. We've had

something similar to this. We can knock this one down quickly. Although I think answering questions like this on a not regular basis, but semi-regular basis is is important because we get different listeners all the time yeah i have a question regarding the draft lottery and i do not think i've seen this scenario explained before for montreal would it be possible for them to win and keep both lottery picks they own this year i know with the new

rules a team can only win two lotteries in a five-year period since one of their picks is Florida's would that count towards this total also as an aside when a team wins a lottery they are ineligible for which pick will they receive how does the NHL plan to deal with this good job Elliot well I don't like that I like this guy

don't like that part Brandon and Williams Lake if that is indeed your real name well so one of the things I Like that part, Brandon in Williams Lake, if that is indeed your real name. Well, so one of the things I'm under the understanding of is that you can only win the lottery twice in five years, but I don't believe that extends to the other team's pick. I agree with you. Technically, it's not your pick. This is what someone said to me.

And if someone else disputes it, I guess I'll hear it after it goes out on this podcast. But I asked and somebody said to me, no, that's Florida's pick. If they win that, that's a Florida lottery win. Now, one of the things that's happening now is that Florida... Hang on, by the way, just so there's no confusion. It's considered Florida's pick, but Montreal makes the pick because they own it, but it is considered Florida's pick. Yes. Now, one of the things that's helped the Panthers is right now they're 19th, so they can't win the lottery because only the top the boss or the bottom 11 teams could win it

so right now that's not as much of a concern for the panthers but i'm under the impression that if montreal was to win the lottery with florida's pick that counts as a florida lottery win okay so uh unlike what you might hear a lot of general managers say and that is uh i don't answer questions based on hypotheticals we do a lot of general managers say, and that is I don't answer questions based on hypotheticals. We do a lot of that here. So any of your hypothetical questions, please feel free to send them in. Cody in Winnipeg.

With Tortorella's letter to season ticket holders, is anybody in Philly untouchable? I could see Konechny getting big interest. We talked a little bit about Philly before, especially considering he's at 5.5 for two more years after this one I'm a devil's fan there we go and as much as I am programmed to hate Philly he's a great player and would look great with Hughes or he sure if the Meyer trade ends up not happening I think it would take a lot like a lot to get connect me out I really do free we talked

about earlier on the pod and that's what i've heard too like it doesn't like you're really gonna have to work to do that you know i think i think the thing is here is that and sometimes we forget this we look at it purely as well the team's no good get rid of all your good players and go for lottery picks the people who say that without thinking about the business side don't have any financial skin in the game. I get reminded of that all the time. You have to give your fans a reason to come into your building.

And I think also you have to show that you're not a mark. Oh yeah, this guy's team is terrible. We can rob him of all his good players. No, you have to set a standard can rob him of all his good players. No, you have to have set a standard that says, if you want our good players, you're going to have to pay for them. Like I'll tell you this.

Not everybody's crazy about bill Armstrong in Arizona, but he has a line and he holds that line. And some, it makes some people crazy sports or sharks. And we now know Jeff, a shark is a fish. Sports is sharks. Okay. That's good.

If you're going to swim with the sharks, you got to be tough and you have to be willing to bite. Elliot, I'm glad you used the term marks. Do you know where that comes from? Wrestling. But specifically in wrestling. Isn't it like from the carny age? Yes. Yes.

Okay. Okay. So where it comes from. So in the carny days when wrestling events were staged as if they were legitimate, they would take bets on these things. It was one person's job to go around the crowd and ask each person which way they were betting. And if they were betting one way, the guy would have a piece of chalk and would put a mark on the back of that person's coat. And they would go around and count up how many marks there were. And then the other person, they'd fix the match, the other person would win,

and they would end up taking the mark's marks money that's where the term a mark comes from it's a piece of chalk scratched on the back of a person who is soon to be removed from his money and I think that's a really good way to end the podcast today nice little story about the carny days of wrestling thank you for that Elliot taking us out today a rally based four-piece band that has grown beyond their traditional raw garage rock approach with new songwriting methods. Arson Daly writes each of its songs on the acoustic guitar before bringing it to the studio to work around the lyrics. With Pipe Dream, here's Arson Daly on 32 Thoughts, the podcast. Enjoy your week. I'm your average man on American land Why pick your fancy so you know who I am?

I've got an ocean I tickle the emotions Emotions The American dream Was never for me I've got a chip on my shoulder Not a part of the scene American dreams Are not what I need.

So if you're selling the dreams, don't even bother with me. you