32 Thoughts: The Podcast - Edmonton’s Gamble, Arizona’s Downsize

Episode Date: January 28, 2022

Evander Kane finds himself a new home. Jeff and Elliotte explain how Kane became an Edmonton Oiler (00:01) and provide an update on the grievance that was filed by the NHLPA. They also discuss the arena situation in Arizona (9:30) as well as the press conference in Philadelphia (21:20), take a closer look at the Nathan MacKinnon hit (28:45), add some details to the GM search in both Chicago and Anaheim (33:00), and they take a few of your questions to wrap up the podcast (36:00).Full transcript for the episode can be found here by Medha MonjauryMusic Outro: Sean Hayes - Everyday HamletListen to more music by Sean Hayes on SpotifyThis podcast is produced and mixed by Amil Delic, and hosted by Jeff Marek and Elliotte Friedman.Audio Credits: MSG, NBC Sports Philadelphia, Orion Pictures, Sony Pictures and Turner Sports.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Alas, poor Elliot, I knew him well. When shall we three meet again in thunder, lightning, or in rain? Evander Kane is an oiler, the Philadelphia Flyers are signing blank checks, and the Coyotes are playing at ASU. Welcome once again to 32 Thoughts, the podcast presented by the all-new GMC AT4 lineup, and buckle up, the day has arrived. Elliot Friedman, Evander Kane is now officially an Edmonton Oiler. It's a day we all thought we'd get to.

We didn't know when we would arrive at this day, but the NHL finding insufficient evidence to conclude that Evander Kane knowingly misrepresented himself regarding his COVID status or test results in connection with international travel. Do you have a timeline here? Like this seems to go to such a crucial week for Evander Kane and the Oilers. results in connection with international travel. Do you have a timeline here? This seems like it's such a crucial week for Evander Kane and the Oilers. Can you walk us through what happened this week? Sure. I would actually go back to the moment that his contract was terminated and

everybody began to figure out here that he was non-restricted free agent. I think people were just kind of grabbing their bearings. What does this mean? And then some teams started reaching out. Did I tell this story on the podcast that I was talking to a general manager on that day when Kane hit unconditional waivers? Because the waivers hit at 2 p.m. Eastern, and we were on the phone, and I had my AirPods in, and all of a sudden a text came by saying, I think Evander Kane's on unconditional waivers. And the GM checked too, and he was like, yes, and I was double-checking because I didn't believe it at first.

And that executive was like, hmm, I wonder what he wants to do from here. So I immediately knew that there was going to be some interest. Yeah. Teams started talking about it. It started heating up a bit. And then the NHL, they slowed down the process by sending out an email a couple weeks ago that Evander Kane was under investigation for how he crossed the border into Canada on December the 29th. And that really slowed everything down.

And who do I think was in it? Obviously, Edmonton was in it. You know, Florida was in it. Tampa was in it. And then they pulled out. Calgary was around it, but I don't know how serious. Carolina, too, was a team that was in it for a while you know i found out just last weekend that washington was around it and they were doing

their due diligence they never offered a contract but they were clearly in it and then word started to get out last weekend that it looked like kane was going to be cleared you know i kept checking but i kept on getting warned that the final report wasn't through yet until the final report was through. It wasn't certain, but the Oilers seemed to believe at least that it didn't seem like there was going to be any additional discipline. And we talked about this at one point on the podcast, Jeff, but the Canadian border services wouldn't confirm anything to me, but I had a tip that they

were investigating Kane's border crossing and they were interviewing the officer or officers who'd spoken to Kane and they were also going through their video. And I believe that was the basis of this NHL investigation is what was said when Kane crossed the border. And if you looked at the statement that the NHL released on Thursday night, it said no further discipline because of insufficient evidence to do so. So I think what it came down to was what was the exchange in that border crossing. This is an educated guess for me if I'm wrong I'll admit to being wrong but this is what a couple of people have told me it came down

to what happened in that interview and I just don't think it could be proven or shown that Kane had said anything wrong and then once that was done he had to pick the team and Edmonton played in Vancouver on Monday or on Tuesday I believe that Ken Holland and Dave Tippett went out with Evander Kane probably for dinner on Monday night in Vancouver or met for dinner look I don't want to get any anybody in any COVID trouble here I think it was all done on the up and up but I think they met with him face to face and they got it all sorted out. And I think after about that meeting, if Kane was going anywhere, it was most likely going to be in Edmonton and that turned out to be the case. Okay. So how does the NHL's decision impact

on the grievance with the Sharks now, Elliot? So I've seen a lot of people asking about this. Well, he isn't getting suspended further. so doesn't he win his grievance? The answer is not necessarily. What we should point out here is that the investigation was into how he crossed the border and did he cross it illegally. The contract termination was because he broke protocol and also he returned to the team a week later than he was supposed to now obviously Kane is fighting those things we don't know how yet the arbitrator will rule or

if that is going to be settled but these two situations are different just because Kane didn't receive any additional penalty has nothing to do with the contract termination and whether or not he wins that case. Now, this is, outside of being a controversial move, this is a high risk but high reward, a potentially high reward move here. If you're the Edmonton Oilers here in this situation, are you just simply looking at this as he has the potential to really help here?

It doesn't cost us anything other than the contract. So we have one more contract spot. We don't have to give up any compensation other than the salary. Essentially, this is a free player. Except it takes up 2.1 million in cap space. Correct. And accounts for one more against your 50 contracts. But what do you think this says about the state of the Oilers right now?

Should we read anything into it? I definitely think it shows you that the desperation in the Oilers to make the playoffs. How many times have I said in the last month? I actually had someone text me and say, if you say it's not an option for the Oilers to miss the playoffs again, I'm unsubscribing from the podcast. So we've just lost one listener. Okay.

Sorry. Nice knowing you. I think it just shows you that, you know, the Oilers, as you said, aside from the money, it's a free player. And that's what this is about. Like I said, I think there were some teams who were in on this. I think there were a lot of teams who said,'re not touching this we are not doing this but edmonton was desperate especially when this was going on over the last week before they won a couple of games and i think they just

said we have to do this opinion on this is really split as well like to your point about some teams saying we don't want to do this uh we don't want to do this to our team because if you look at the history of evander kane and this even predates you know nhl things haven't always ended up well hasn't always ended up in a good spot for evander kane and the team that he leaves i mean part of me says, they have to make the playoffs here. You know, Vander Koehn's not going to play net. We know that issue still has to be addressed, but are they helping themselves on the ice? Yeah. But at what cost? And we don't know what the cost is yet because we don't know how this relationship is going to go. But the one thing, Elliot, curious what you think about this statement. The one thing that I do know for sure is that no

matter what happens here with the Vander Koehn and the edmonton oilers they can't feign surprise if it doesn't work and it collapses it goes up in flames they can't see well we didn't see that coming or if the room disintegrates we didn't see that coming it's a risk they've completely lost the ability to say we didn't see this coming or, we're surprised that it didn't work out. And listen, I hope for Edmonton's sake and for Evander Kane's sake that this is a great relationship and it works out well. You like to see teams get in order. You certainly like to see people get their lives in order as well. I hope it does work out. But what's the old line? History doesn't always repeat itself, but sometimes it rhymes. Old quote that I like to throw at you

whenever you talk about, uh, what's the one that you always like to use the best indicator of future behaviors, past behavior. Yeah. This is a situation where, okay, you can make it, it's risky, but you can't be surprised if it blows up.

You know, Jeff, one thing I did get, I got a couple of calls just from people saying, you know, Elliot, you're not really aware. I don't think of the NHL's opposition to this move. I think they're worried that something could go wrong. I think they went really hard at the investigation about crossing the border. They didn't find anything, but they certainly didn't not try to look, I guess is the way to put it. certainly didn't not try to look, I guess, is the way to put it.

And I think they're not happy that Edmonton and other teams looked into this and that Edmonton signed them. And so we'll see where this goes, but I don't think the NHL is very thrilled about it. When do we see him in Edmonton uniform? I had heard that they wanted him to play on Saturday. They play in Montreal on Saturday, and I had heard they wanted him. They were hoping they could have him for that game. We'll see.

We'll see. We'll also see about the Arizona Coyotes and where they will ply their trade next season. Yes. Arizona State University. On radio this afternoon, that would be Thursday, you said, I think this is a done deal. Yep. this afternoon that would be thursday you said i think this is a done deal yep like this sounds

and looks and smells like it's a deal that is close to being official what do you hear what do you know so we were working on this story for some time in credit to craig morgan who got it done before we did and uh you know he beat me to it. It's that simple, but I have been hearing that this is going to happen for a while now. And, you know, one of the reasons that I hadn't written it yet was because I felt that I didn't have a good enough answer to some of the questions. And I think what Craig did that was smarter than me in this particular case was he said they were deep in negotiations like i think it's much more than that i think if the team is in arizona next year this is where they're going to

play and i think it's basically a done deal now some of the things that craig um didn't address that i've been working on as he points out the seating for the arena is supposed to be 5 000 see one of the interesting things i was told this afternoon after I spoke to you, Jeff, is that if you look at the CBA, section 34 of the CBA, article 34 talks about, for example, things like visiting dressing rooms and visiting weight rooms. And they have to be done to certain specifications. And someone said to me, that could be one of the things that you're talking about is that, you know, they might have to change that Arizona state arena to fit for, especially

for visitors that it reaches NHL specifications. And I thought that was interesting. I think it's possible. So even though it's 5 000 as quoted in the article and on their website i've had people tell me the attendance could actually be 3200 and like i said i've heard this is pretty far along that maybe they haven't said yes it's a done deal but there are people who've been told to expect that's where arizona is going to play the next couple years i think there's also a question about whether or not it'll be ready at the

start of next season. I have heard that the key days here are in the second week of February, February 10th to 14th. That is when some of the money is due. Like one of the things Craig reported that I didn't know was that the coyotes themselves ownership would have to pay 15 to 20 million for the renovations and things like that right i think that those payments have to be in around february 10th to 14th like in that area so that's the other thing they have to hit here yeah one of the other things that people had

raised to me and that is that you know arizona state's hockey schedule is done next year are you going to tell people the coyotes are never going to be able to play next year on friday or saturday night at home you know that's a big concern you know obviously there's the revenue question like before we get there because i do want to get to the players associations viewpoint on all of this and yes brad marsh and social media as well but we should couch it this way this is couched in the idea that they get the new arena done in tempe yes okay so huge questions if that goes south and they don't get the arena deal after After that, then it's wild. Yes. And it's wide open. I think that's a great point that you make is that if they're not guaranteed the arena after this year,

does this all change? That's why I said, if they're playing in Arizona next year, I think this is where they're going. And so this would be, if they get the deal in Tempe, this is like three, maybe four years until they can build a rink. And so this is that home. And so one of the things that you do worry about is hockey related revenue players, of course, very concerned about escrow and teams that are, as we saw famously in Brad Marchand's tweet to the Carolina Hurricanes, you know, drags on hockey related revenue. This one would

certainly be a challenge. We haven't heard from the Players Association yet on this. How do you think they feel about this recent development? Not happy. The issue, though, is, Jeff, what can they really do about it? And I asked someone, is there anything specific in the CBA that they can do to say we block this? And that's where the person actually told me about the facilities issue in Article 34. And what he said to me is, aside from that, he's not sure there's anything that they can really do.

However, I think they're going to make a stink about it. However, I think they're going to make a stink about it. One of my only predictions that turned out right this year is that there's going to be a Brad Marchand tweet about this. Matt Coleman, who's a reporter based in Boston, quote tweeted the Sportsnet article about this, the rewrite, and said, what do you think about this one? And he tagged Brad Marchand, and Marchand responded, well, the only way they get 5,000 fans at their games now is if they give 4,500 away for free. So it wouldn't change much.

So of all the teams in the league this year, Arizona has the lowest ticket revenue per game. I've been told it's about $525,000 a game. And this was in December and they're down 8% from last year. So the only team this year as of December that was lower was Buffalo. And Buffalo was the team that was down, you know, 47%. It's not a lot of revenue. And if the goal is just to say, can you get to that by having less people, but charging more for tickets? I mean, that's a question. If your tickets are more expensive in Arizona, is that going to be

okay or not? Okay. For your fans only they know that, but I think the player association is not happy. I've had some people say to me today that it's their duty to fight this. I mean, Bettman could always step up and say, look, if I contract the team, that's 23 plus jobs lost, but I don't think that's what he wants to do either. You know, you've had your solution out there before, which I'll get you to repeat in a second, so people can be reminded of it.

But, you know, one of the things we've talked about is that Marchand is speaking up at a time where it's a little bit dicey with the players association because the players are pissed off about the olympics and there probably is going to be a search for a new leader like one of the things that's actually happened is the players association wants to have its first in person agent meeting in a couple of years i'm hearing that they want to have its first in-person agent meeting in a couple of years. I'm hearing that they want to have a meeting in April. And one of the things I think that's going to be addressed there is going to be the succession

plan or if there's a succession plan for Donald Fear. And it comes at a time where the players are a little militant about the Olympics. You know, if Marchand is any indication, are they going to start taking a bit more of an active role which some people have said they've needed to do for some time but they haven't you are going to have players saying a 5,000 seat arena I had one player text me today and say are we in the Ontario Hockey League so this is a bit of a minefield there's no question about that someone texted me today similar to that vein it's funny someone texted you saying are we in the ohl here someone texted

me saying are you really going to tell me that shane wright connor bedard matt fay mitchikoff whomever are going to start their nhl careers like big name first overall draft picks in a 5 000 seat arena i'm like yeah that's the plan like the coyotes are going to do this with a lot of kids and some really high draft picks and you know a lot of college free agents that they sign i like i said i think this is a bit of a landmine for the pa i'm not sure what they can do but i think you're going to see them under pressure to really try to make some noise about this yeah i'm with you i think that they do something but i don't know what they can do more than to stomp their feet and make it an issue and raise awareness around it. I'm not really sure that they honestly have any say in the matter.

They can't block it. Players can be upset about it. Certainly. You know what part of me wonders too, Elliot? Again, but I always wonder about, you know, the final minute, do things get changed? Because let's not forget too, there've been a lot of, you know, last minute plot twists with this Arizona story, going back to the days of Judge Redfield T-Bomb. Is there any chance that this is just the coyotes

trying to get leverage on Glendale? It's always possible. There's no question that could be the case. I have had people tell me that they thought they could write a check and things in Glendale would go okay, but there's legitimate heat between them. Put it this way. I was told that this had to be done because they needed this plan. Okay. So the long-term play then, if there's no new rink in Tempe,

what then is the long-term play for the Coyotes and the NHL? It's a great question. the one thing i believe about betman is he's gonna have a backup plan finally he reached the end in atlanta and he had his backup plan he's got one and i don't know what it is yet but i do think he has one i just find it very hard to believe that he isn't preparing for where else he's got to go. It's just not like him. You know, as I said many times, he will do everything he can to protect this market. He's shown that that's the way he is.

I just find it very hard to believe right now he doesn't have his back pocket move if he needs it. So here's my theory, and I've mentioned it on the podcast before. This isn't based on insider info. This is just me thinking about what could happen here. If there's no rink in Tempe, they have nowhere to play next season. I don't think the NHL is interested in Arizona relocating, because relocating doesn't do the league any financial good and it removes a potential expansion market from their hip pocket. And nobody wants that.

So here's my theory. Do we see the NHL's version of the Montreal Expos who didn't just directly pick up and go to Washington, but the team was sold back to MLB and then it was up for auction and that's how they got to Washington and became the Nationals. What I wonder about here is if there's no rink in Tempe.

I wonder if we see a scenario where the team gets sold back to the NHL. Puts up for auction and just for sake of argument. Houston becomes a destination. Then the team goes to Houston. And you have essentially a relocation, but you have an expansion fee attached to it from the auction for the Arizona coyotes. It's a great theory.

That's what I wonder about. I think it's really good theory. And I will tell you, I've had someone say to me that the way you are talking is something that has been discussed, but I don't know the answer. Still more questions with this one. Look, everything's on the table.

We're going to try to aggressively retool here. I can tell you everything's on the table. We're looking at the front aggressively retool here. I can tell you everything's on the table. We're looking at the front office. We're looking at the coaching staff, which we have been. Our players, investment, whatever we need to do to improve this team. But I don't see it being a three, four, five year thing. We've invested a lot of money in every area, including player development. In the last few months, we're doubling the size of our analytics department.

We just named Alan McCauley, a director of player personnel, and we've added to our pro staff. We've added to our amateur staff. I will say this, you know, Comcast has been the same terrific partner to me that they were to Ed. I mean, Comcast has been in this thing for 26 years, the controlling partner. So, you know, Comcast is committed to keeping the flyers. Absolutely.

I mean, right now, I mean, you know, Chuck's my guy and we're trying to build around that, trying to strengthen his front office team as much as we can. Then I'm going to give him a blank check. We're going to get this right. I mean, whatever we need to do. Don't want to, again, don't want to wait.

I want to, you know, want to deal with it now. Okay, well, we got some answers as we move from the Arizona Coyotes to the Philadelphia Flyers. Yeah. We got some answers earlier on this week about a potential direction for the Philadelphia Flyers. And I think it's what we expected. Chuck Fletcher and Dave Scott holding a press conference a day after Keith Yandel broke the Ironman record. Congratulations to Keith Yandel. record congratulations to keith yandel and we heard terms like need more top end talent

aggressively retool everything is on the table blank check i like blank checks uh i know i think a lot of players i wish i was in position to get one from comcast here um we heard dave scott say we're not looking at a three to four to five year rebuild. Like the whole press conference. It was a great press. We don't get enough press conferences like this. I loved it. Chuck Fletcher and Dave Scott.

Give me one of those. It was a great press conference. Chuck's my guy. Like all of it. Give me one of those press conferences every week to dine out on. Yeah. It was very Philadelphia Flyers. Yeah.

It was. No, no, no. There's no long rebuild here. Yeah. We're going to do some things this season, but we're the Flyers and we're coming back, damn it. We got some players. We're going to go get some more and we're coming back strong.

It was a very Philadelphia Flyers press conference, Elliot. What did you make of it? Like I said, we don't get enough. There's been so much going on in the world and in everything right now. We don't get enough of these press conferences where we get blank check. There are going to be blank checks out here. That's great. First of all, what did we learn?

We learned that there's no long rebuild here, as you said. Comcast Spectacore is not interested in three, four, five-year process. They expect to contend, or at least try to contend for the Stanley Cup next year. That's number one. Number two, we learned that Chuck Fletcher was safe. What does it look like to me here? It looked like to me here that even if Chuck Fletcher wanted to pull the chute and start over again, like Ron Hextall basically did that.

When Ron Hextall became the GM, he said, guys, I've got to get us out of cap hell and I've got to turn some things around. And other people in the organization hated that. That's not what they wanted. Like that's in the Flyers DNA. Ed Snyder, we're not rebuilding. Who's the the best goalie go out and throw 50 million at them bingo it'll briskel up like briskel off come on down that's philly and obviously that has not changed like i don't have a problem with fletcher staying if that's the mandate here's what i think is interesting

is that they asked who the core is and what names did they mention? They mentioned Couturier. Yep. They mentioned Farabee. They mentioned Ellis and they mentioned Hayes. And there were some pretty prominent names missing from there. You know, one obviously is Giroux. And I really thought Chuck Fletcher paid Giroux proper respect before he got to the meat of it, this will be Claude's decision.

Yeah. Okay? And we'll talk about Giroux in a second. But what's interesting is who wasn't mentioned. So they've got about $70 million tied up to the cap next year, which will probably leave them around $11, $12 million to play with with assuming that they let their ufas walk i'll tell you this like everybody's talking gudro you know who's a fire blank check local boy come on but you know who's a flyer if he's not signed cadre wow like he's a flyer, but again, he's got to be a free agent.

We'll see where it is. Nassim Kadri, by the way, with the new agent, Darren Ferris as well. That will lead to some carnage, but basically the Philadelphia Flyers let everybody know that if you're a UFA,

you have to start reaching out to your third party who knows somebody in Philadelphia and says, there's Scott talking about my guy. that's what this just did yeah i think the philadelphia flyers just sent a note to everybody that they are open for business and what do you want to do and you know to me the interesting names about this are they didn't mention connect me what does that mean for his future they didn't mention proveroff what does that mean for his future and of course they didn't mention jeru and they said it's up to him i think what colorado decides to do here is going to play a role i i think they're interested in him i think he's interested in them it just comes down to what does colorado decide it needs to do to go out and

get to win the stanley cup you know hearing you, I want to go back to blank check for a second. Is that a way of cleverly tampering with every free agent? Well, I didn't mention anybody's name. No, I know. But one of my favorite, well, you know, how like some general managers will, will talk to agents of players under contract and say things like, Oh, is we'll talk to agents of players under contract and say things like, oh, if we only had a 6'3", 28-year-old,

215-pound right shot defenseman who was born in Red Deer, I'd probably pay that guy $3.5 million times seven. That's the Doug McClain way. When you have a conversation with someone, I'm looking for a right-hand shot. Maybe he's got hazel eyes and blonde hair. Boy, if we could only find one of those.

Do you think Doug McClain could be banned for retroactive tampering the more we tell these stories? I don't think he cares. I think he took one of those I don't give enough pills we've talked about here on the show a long time ago. He's taking pictures of himself on beaches while we're all working? Here I am doing Kipper and Borny's show on the beach. You'll like my new office.

I love it. It's fantastic. I just feel all the people have to watch him out there tan. I'll tell you this. When they said that, and I was just making some calls after, the one name everyone was talking about was Goodrow for the obvious local reasons. But I had people say to me, Cadry. They said, that guy's a flyer. But we'll see where it all goes. was good row for the obvious local reasons but i had people say to me cadre like you know they

said that guy's a flyer but we'll see where it all where it all goes you know one of the names that um and i can't remember which reporter brought it up but they did talk about it and that was daniel briere's role and you've written about briere most recently on 32 thoughts of hey have a look at who he's sitting with we know that he's going to have more of a prominent position with the phil Philadelphia Flyers organization. And listen, a lot of that was confirmed at that press conference. Not that I think we really need much confirmation from either Fletcher or Dave Scott, I guess, Elliot.

That was kind of an obvious one. Yeah, and he said it'll be after the season where we get an idea on that. A couple more things here before we get to some emails, Elliot. Aaron Dell, three-game suspension, the elbow on Drake Bathurston. The injury is significant. High ankle, a couple of months. Three-game suspension for

Aaron Dell. I want to dovetail that into a quick conversation. Not just about that, but also the Taylor Hall and Nathan McKinnon situation. So, Hall hits McKinnon. Oh, there's a bad hit by Taylor Hall on McKinnon. Got him right in the head.

Landeskog comes over after him. There is a penalty on the play. Both referees have their arm in the air as the athletic trainer comes out. Oh, no. Oh, boy. There is blood all over the ice from the face of Nathan McKinnon, and he is down. He tried to get up, and he just wob blood all over the ice for the face of Nathan McKinnon and he is down He tried to get up and he just wobbled back to the ice

Hey the look on Taylor Hall's face when he came to the bench right to my right was one of a player that didn't either See understand what he did or how it happened or that it was something that was done on purpose But clearly he wasn't even prepared. When Landeskog came back to the bench here, he really shoved him into the boards pretty hard. He wasn't even braced for that. So, oh boy, great applause obviously for the Western Conference All-Star, Nathan McKinnon.

He's gushing blood. The primary point of contact is the hands. That was an accident. Of course it was but where i'm going with it is sort of dovetails into the aaron dell situation mckinnon stick flies back into his face it's gruesome there's blood all over the ice and it looks horrible and yeah you see taylor hall's face like he's not looking around saying who's coming who's coming he's horrified at what's just happened and he's not that kind of player but nonetheless Gabriel Landeskog chases him a little bit tries to goad him into one let's go that was a great

game by the way but a lot of people coming out of both the Aaron Dell Drake Bathurston situation and the Taylor Hall Nathan McKinnon situation with Landeskog going after him you know talked about this idea of you know instant retribution and code and how come Ottawa didn't do anything against Aaron Dell and how come Taylor Hall didn't answer the bell, even though Gabriel Landeskog afterwards said, look, I saw the hit in between periods and I thought the hit was fine, but still implying that Taylor Hall somehow had to oblige him in a fight. Did you see any correlations between those two events

and the code speak around both of those two situations? It just shows you how the game has changed. You remember Greg Steffen? Of course. Greg Steffen and Billy Smith were those two guys. They were the fighting goalies, right? Yeah. They didn't just accept fights.

They started them. Especially Billy Smith who fought players consistently. Ask Lindy Ruff what that's like. Ruff charged at him. Yeah. I was in a game in Toronto. I don't remember the exact situation, but

Stefan fought someone or got into a scrum with someone and gladly wanted to do it when he played for Detroit. You know, when we were kids, like that was an all-out brawl and the goalie was expected to answer for it. I have really mixed emotions. Like some people aren't going to like me to hear this, but you know, what the hell, this is the way I grew up. I always grew up with don't fight, don't fight. But if somebody does something to you where, you know, they're going to hurt you or they start it, you're entitled to fight.

I didn't win every fight I was in. I probably have pretty close to a 500 record. But if someone pushed me around, I tried to defend myself. I wasn't always successful, but I tried to defend myself. It's just different now. It was so funny. You know what movie i was watching last night i don't know why but first blood what really yeah it's it i was watching it on prime and i i love

the movie and i was watching it last night after hockey late at night i was having trouble sleeping and so you put on of a movie about a vietnam war vet well no it's just it's such a great movie like like richard krenna in that movie, and he comes and he says, to eat things and to make a billy goat puke. He tries to get Sylvester Stallone, John Rambo to give up, and Rambo's like, no, they drew first blood.

I don't know. I mean, I always thought if someone picked a fight with you, it gave you license to, or someone did something to you, it gave you license to go back. But, you know, it's different now. It gave you license to, or someone did something to you. It gave you license to go back, but you know, it's different now.

Are we seeing any difference, any change in the situation with the Anaheim ducks and the Chicago Blackhawks? Vancouver has hired their general manager and their assistant general manager and Emily Castonguay and new GM, Patrick Alvin. Do we know what's happening with the Anaheim ducks and the Chicago Blackhawks now?

I think with Anaheim, they had their three internal candidates of all interview, Jeff Solomon, Dave Nones, and Martin Madden. I think they have interest in external candidates, Chris McFarlane from Colorado, Ryan Martin, formerly of Detroit, and now with the Rangers. Another name that has now been reported that I thought was in Vancouver but wasn't is Pat Verbeek. I've wondered about John Ferguson from Arizona in Anaheim, and I think there's probably one or two more.

I think those are kind of the names, and I think Anaheim is probably getting into its second round. Chicago, so Danny Wirtz sent out an interesting update this week that they're only going to hire a GM. Kyle Davidson is going to be interviewed, and they want to have it by the trade deadline. And I have to say that a lot of people are very curious about that. I do think there are teams that have told Chicago and Anaheim

that have been asked about permission and they've said no, not before the trade deadline. The one question I have for Danny Wirtz, he said that the GM will be hired and they will be the highest ranking hockey operations person. My question for Danny Wirtz is, is that for now or is that moving forward? Is that for now or is that moving forward? As in, could we get to a position where in the summer they say, now we can speak to some more people and we may hire a president of hockey ops.

He said they're going to have an availability. And that's a question I would have for him. Is this now or is this all of it? And that would be the question I have for the Blackhawks. The other thing is they kind of confirmed something. So Jamie Faulkner, who's also running the search in Chicago, she has a history in baseball. And I had heard rumors that they were going to interview people in the baseball world for the Blackhawks job. And the fact that they've said that they're going to interview people outside of hockey, I'm wondering if there's any chance of that. Well, this is what Mike Ford talked to us about, too. Yeah.

That you're not just staying under your own tent, but you're looking elsewhere. On that, we'll pause. Come back with some of your emails at 32thoughts at sportsnet.ca. We're back in a moment. Okay, Elliot, finish up here on the podcast with a couple of questions, a couple of emails. This one from Ethan. First of all, Ethan, thanks for the email. Was wondering what happens with an agent's clients

when that agent may get hired to a new job. For example, what happens to Kent Hughes' clients or Emily Castonguay's clients? Do those players get transferred over to someone else or do they have to find a new agent? Ethan, go watch Jerryguire and the scene where he gets fired and they all race to the phones wendy cushman's line is busy you keep calling him till you get through it please bring me my numbers jj what's up kid yeah boy have you

talked to mcguire yeah homeboy had a meltdown or something i just wanted to be the first to tell you that i was talking to Doritos about you, and they're very interested in you. Hold on. Talk to Rick, okay? Martinez, hombre, como esta? See, one of the things I think that happened is, obviously, with Kent Hughes' agency, they knew beforehand that Kent was going to take the job in Montreal.

So they started informing their clients and, you know, they get the headstart to say, I mean, the rumors were out there. So people I'm sure were trying to see how those players felt, but they could at least had the headstart of saying he's going for sure. We're going to convince you to stay. It's also pretty obvious here that Emily Castonguay's clients knew that she was leaving to take the job in Vancouver. Yes. So guaranteed you that agency was working on, let's make sure all these players stay.

But I'm telling you, I have no doubt there was a run on some of these players. Like I guarantee there were a lot of people looking for Alexi Lafreniere's phone number. Absolutely. Jordan from Aberdeen. Hello, Scotland. Just wanted to hear your thoughts on teams being able to get a discount on the salary cap in a player that they have drafted and developed.

Has always seemed harsh that a team who has invested so much in a player that they can't keep due to market value that's been floated before i don't think that that's gonna happen look as long as betman's in charge he doesn't like like i like creating flexibility salary cap i like the idea of a franchise player i like the idea of maybe if a player reaches a certain amount of time with a team you get some sort of break on it but that's money outside the system and he doesn't like it.

And you may like it and I may like it and Jeff may like it and your relatives may like it, but the commissioner don't like it. And he's got 11 billion votes. That's true. It's what ain't going to happen. Rob from Spokane with the frozen cap. At what point will GMs finally get creative with three-way or more trades?

I'm a bit shocked they haven't become more common yet, and this feels like the only logical way to get creative with player and salary movements. Well, we've seen some of them. We've seen some. And, you know, remember last year, Doug Wilson, or was it last year or two years ago? Doug Wilson, I can't remember off the top of my head, or was it last year or two years ago? Doug Wilson, I can't remember off the top of my head,

but someone didn't like the fact that he was a middleman in a deal that got a player to Vegas. Yep. And one of their media members was like, how can you help Vegas? And he's like, come on, I got an extra draft pick out of it. So it is happening more often. I really think you could see that happen this year because it's so tight.

Yeah. And there's a few teams like Detroit, like Ottawa, Buffalo, that won't be rushing to make moves at the deadline, and they have cap space. So they can facilitate that. It makes it a bit more expensive, but I do think you're seeing more and more of that. And I think there are teams, like they let teams know in advance.

Like I think Toronto's done this before. They let teams know in advance like i think toronto's done this before they let teams know in advance here's what we're willing to pay for you to facilitate it great question uh and we'll end on this one brian from fond du lac wisconsin i was watching a chippy game between the wild and the bruins a couple of weeks ago that wasippy. Each team has a Felino brother. It made me wonder, have brothers on opposing teams ever gotten in a fight in a game? Oh yeah, well the Primos. Yep, that's a big one. Primo on Primo.

I guess that's Primo Vera then. And they're going at it. This is unbelievable. Here they go. Brotherly love right here, I guess. Pete Primo, Wayne Primo. Mom and Dad watching. This may go back a few years.

It's all business. Yeah, you never know. This could be payback for something. Keith's bigger than his brother, probably ate more food at the table. Wayne's a little bit upset with that. But that shows, and I watched it many, many times in my career with the Sutter brothers, it didn't matter. When it was game time, they were just another jersey.

They went at each other, and here's a great play by Keith Primo coming to the aid of his goaltender and taking on his brother. Will the benches look on? Their parents were at the game. And the mother was mad at them. Livid. Not cool. She didn't like that.

And I think they realized they got in a lot of trouble there. Did Ron and Rich ever go? Sutter? I don't know. I remember the Kachuks got mad at the questions. That would you guys fight ever? Yeah, they weren't. They almost. Remember in front of the net? They almost did. the questions that would you guys would you guys fight ever yeah they weren't they almost remember

in front of the net they almost did got thrown down and then a stick swing to the jock that was as close as we've seen those two guys go yes i don't know that we ever see it you remember the um uh friday massacre a good friday massacre yeah the hunters were in that the hunters were both in that dale and mark but i don't think they fought each other. It's funny because I watched that not too long ago. This is during the second brawl. So there's the first brawl

when Slager hits Jean Hamel and Hamel is out. It's a vicious punch. And then they all go back to the dressing rooms. It's right at the end of the period and then they come out for the next period and even before they line up to face off another brawl starts and very briefly dale and mark get involved like it's not like they're at center ice

and the buckets are off and the gloves and the elbow pads and they're thrown from the cellar but there was an engagement between Dale and Mark. The one, this was legendary, and I remember asking Scotty Bowman about it once because he was a coach when it happened. This is a junior fight. When Scotty Bowman was coaching Peterborough, there was a game against Guelph,

and Bob Plager played with the Guelph Royals. Barkley played with the Peterborough Peets. And they had a fight on the ice. They separated them. Then they fought in the penalty box. And then as they separated them and kicked them out, they fought under the stands. Oh, God.

Scotty told me it was like one of the wildest things he had ever seen. It was in junior hockey. I think it was in Peterborough, too. It wasn't in Guelph. Pretty small barn. But yes, from Brian from Wisconsin, there have been some, not many, examples of brothers fighting with one another. Yeah, I've got to ask if the Sutters ever, like at some point,

two of them had to do, at least the very least, they probably slashed each other somewhere. Something. Like none of those Sutters are backing down from anybody and not a chance. I would figure that somewhere along the way the Sutters. Now, you know what? Another one I was just thinking about. What's that?

Because I just Googled it. It was in an AHL game. Andrew Peters fought his brother. Are you serious? I didn't know this. Really? Yes. In the American League? Yes. I remembered this. Is the fight

up online? His brother was Jeff Peters. Yeah. Now I remember this. Andrew was playing in the American Hockey League, and I've got to figure out where Jeff played. I do remember, because I've heard Andrew tell this story that he didn't realize it was his brother when they fought. Oh, was it in a scrum and you just grabbed someone and started swinging?

I don't know. I don't remember the exact situation, but I Googled it. And yes, Andrew and Jeff Peters did fight in a game in the AHL. Wow. That's incredible. All right, so that's where I'm going after the podcast, down YouTube wormholes, trying to find Andrew Peters fighting his brother. Lovely. Welcome into my life.

Taking us out today, Elliot, is a San Francisco-based artist whose musical journey started in the 90s with his debut album, A Thousand Tiny Pieces. with his debut album, A Thousand Tiny Pieces. Sean Hayes' collection of music is colored with all kinds of sounds over his 10 albums, including his latest record, Be Like Water. From his Alabama Chicken LP, here's Sean Hayes with Everyday Hamlets on 32 Thoughts, the podcast. Brother said he's lonely and made me sad Wish a pretty girl could come and save him And I close by to keep him warm Tell him everything's alright

You're alright, you're alright to be Alright, alright, believe Alright, alright Fear is a deer, you're in the light Life is a light, got no grace And you're moving to, to move again You're walking in the dark I'm standing in the light Alright, alright

Alright, alright To be Alright, alright