32 Thoughts: The Podcast - Good Goal. Questionable Process.

Episode Date: April 27, 2026

In this edition of 32 Thoughts, Kyle Bukauskas and Elliotte Friedman run through all the Stanley Cup Playoff action from Sunday: Oilers vs Ducks (1:00) Canadiens vs Lightning (16:30) Sabres vs Bruins (28:41) Kings vs Avalanche (34:07) The Final Thought focuses on the front office searches in Toronto, Nashville, and Vancouver (44:00) Kyle and Elliotte answer your questions and comments in the Thought Line (47:20).  In the final segment the fellas review the remaining series that we haven't touched on:  Senators vs Hurricanes (1:03:22) Golden Knights vs Mammoth (1:31:44) Stars vs Wild (1:27:11) Flyers vs Penguins (1:36:53) Listen to all the 32 Thoughts music here. Email the podcast at [e-mail] or call the Thought Line at 1-833-311-3232 and leave us a voicemail. This podcast was produced and mixed by Dominic Sramaty and hosted by Elliotte Friedman & Kyle Bukauskas. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates

How long's the flight? So two hours to Dallas, two and a half to Tampa. Are you purposely saying it like that? Saying what? The city in Texas. No, no, sorry. Not Dallas. It's like the major airport in Washington.

It's called Washington Dulles. Oh, okay. I thought this was another mishap. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. No, Washington, Dallas. This is Detroit and all over again. Yeah.

Welcome to 32 Thoughts, the podcast, presented by your Canadian Toyota dealers and the 100% Electric BZ, available now during Red Tag Days, your Monday morning edition, Dom Sharmati, Elliot Friedman, and Kyle Bacoskis with you once again. Fridge, the margins in the playoffs,

as you know, are razor-thin, and they certainly were in Orange County in overtime on Sunday night. Ryan Paling, the hero for the ducks. They lead the Oilers three games to one. On a goal that was probably in, it was really difficult to tell for sure under the skate of Tristin Jari. However, it was the process of getting to that point that's kind of come under scrutiny here in the emotional aftermath of that game.

I agree with what you said on the air afterwards. And look, you were the one that was on the phone with the situation room. So why don't you bring us up to speed on what you were told there and just your whole feeling about how that game ended at Honda Center? So, you know, first of all, you know, I obviously had a lot to say on social media and after the game. And like, even though I may disagree with some, of the things that happened.

You don't need to pile drive anyone to the ground. So let's just stick to the facts here. They call it a goal on the ice. I respectfully disagree with that call. I just don't think anybody was in position to make that call. And then when they sent out the email blast later on in the night at 158 a.m., the situation room determined. that the puck completely crossed the goal line.

Now, let me just say that when I made my phone call, that was not specifically communicated to me at the time. It was later. It was not at the time. But I think it's important to recognize that it was probably a bit of chaos. It's right after the game. And we had a quick conversation. So it's okay.

Like, it's fine. that was not communicated to me at the time, but like I said, it was chaos. When they sent out the email at 158, they said the puck was completely over the line. And I do believe, I do believe that first of all,

the puck was probably in. Logically it was in. But at the time, I had been told that there were no replays that could overturn the call. on the ice, which was good goal. Which I respect. There was no replay that could overturn the call.

So I understand how they ended up there. I think it's the right outcome. I just disagreed with the process. And I also really strongly believe, Kyle, that at the end of the day, people in the league felt that they couldn't go to Pat Verbeek and Stan Bowman, the two GMs, and say that was no goal, that they felt that was a goal. And because the call was made on the ice, they couldn't overturn it.

Now, one thing I'm going to say here that I strongly disagree with, and it's 2.25 a.m. And I was just sent this text message by someone. I had somebody send me a note saying, the original call on the ice doesn't matter. I was like, and this was not somebody in the league. This was someone who is, this is not somebody who works in the actual office. I want to make that clear at the beginning. And I just said, I think that is total BS, total BS. Because there have been times when I've had this debate about people and they have said to me that generally all the GMs get told and

Betman has said this himself that you only overturn calls if they're dead wrong. Okay. So for me, for anyone to claim that the call on the ice doesn't matter, that is, that flies in the face of everything that I've ever been told covering the league. And it's been made very clear to me that the commissioner himself uses the words dead wrong. and sometimes even one more word piled into there, which I will not repeat on a family podcast. Not even this late at night.

Not even this late at night. Will you go down that road? Will I go down that road? So like I don't want to hear that. I can totally understand that they felt that was a goal. I can totally understand logically it was a goal. And I completely feel that, the idea that you go to Pat Verbeek especially and say,

you know what, I can't tell you that's not a goal, I got no problem with that. I just, you know, like I just said, like I think we all look at that and say it's a goal. I just think the process there, you know, there was a referee I had a big fight with last year, good referee, a guy I really like. and, you know, we had a big fight over something.

And at the end of the day, he said to me, don't guess. Like, either you know or you don't, okay? And I think that's the right approach. And I just think in this situation, they weren't in a position where they could make that call. You know what I would like to have seen there just from a point of view of if this happens in the future is, They're going to review that call anyway. The NHL always looks at goals. Are they in or not in legally or cleanly?

So even if the officials on the ice had ruled that no goal, they still have the right to look at it and say, we're going to check it. So there didn't even have to be a goal call there. It was still going to be reviewed. We've talked about this on this podcast before. and because again, this is the process of how they got to the point of what they called on the ice. You know, take away the review part and the situation room from the equation.

But how they got to the decision on the ice where they said, we have a goal, and now we're going to review. Another example of where it would be wonderful if somebody could go down to the official's room and just be able to get an answer of, What was the conversation between the four of you? How did you get to that point? Because it looked impossible for anybody, any of the four there, where they were situated when that puck trickled right to the goal line,

almost across, probably just enough across, to be able to say then and there, yes, we have a goal. And then at least we have some sort of explanation. But that is not the world. We live in the here and now with the lead. And so we're forced to talk about it this way instead. By the way, is there been any further steps towards a world in which there's something resembling VAR in terms of puck technology being able to track where it is in the NHL? Not as far as I know, but my kingdom for tracking that works.

You know, it's interesting. Like they've tried cameras in the goalpost. They've tried cameras in the crossbars. They're really challenging things because they get obscured too. It's not like they haven't tried other things, but no technology. Kyle, we need the technology. There are really smart people in this world. you must build us the technology.

Yes. Give Hawkeye a call. I think they've looked at that a bit, but again, it's because the goalie blocks some of the, this would have been the exact kind of play that might not have worked on Hawkeye, from what I understand,

because the skates blocking the puck. That's right. So there is still not a correct answer. on social media there were some pictures of people who obviously know the dimensions of a puck and they kind of draw it for lack of a better term

what it would look like underneath the skate and it looks like it's in I mean it's probably in I think we all recognize that now and then some people sent similar drawings to me like photoshopps of what the puck

would actually look like. And I was kind of laughing with someone. I was saying, wait a sec, do you have like a protractor at home or one of those metal compasses we used to have from grade eight geometry? We were kind of laughing about it. And they said, well, you can use the dimensions

and there's stuff for this. And one thing I learned tonight was that the NHL has something like this. And I don't know if it's AI or what, but they have some technology. that allows them to do that. And it doesn't make the decision for them, but they look at it and they say,

okay, it does have no, the dimensions of the puck, and this is where we think it is, and they use it internally, I think, to support and explain their calls. So look, to me at the end of the day, what this is about is you got to look two GMs in the eyes and say, this is how we came to this decision and this is what we think is right.

And especially for Pat Verbeek and the docks, they're like, hey, we can't go to them and say, that's not a goal. And that's how I think they came to this. It doesn't take away from Anaheim. They deserve the win as much as Edmonton did.

And the Oilers here are really pushed to the brink. really push the brink. I don't think it's impossible, but it's been wild to see how Edmonton, which has terrorized the league on its power play for years, is getting really hurt by the Anaheim power play, up to nothing, two penalties, two goals. And the ducks are full measure for this win.

This is not a fluke that they're up three to one. This is not them goalying the Oilers. They have earned and deserved this win. win. I think the things that you look for, you're Edmonton, you say, okay, we hang our hat on this is Jari was good. You gave you a chance to win. And also, McDavid, a couple plays in the third period that made him look a little more healthy. If that's the right phrase to use, he looked a bit more like himself. But it's not impossible for them, but it's a big hole to climb against a confident young team that just doesn't think it can win, it believes its full value for the

win. Yeah, and that's the big part. We should also mention, I think it was Mark Spector that asked McDavid after the game point blank about his health. And though he didn't answer directly, he just as any or most players would in that spot, we're all playing through something at this time of year. But to see the jump in the third period, you're right. That's a positive sign for the Oilers.

It's been amazing to watch Anaheim through this series that the belief grow through game 1 to 2, 2, to 3 and now 4. As you say, not just hoping to beat a team like Edmonton, but now thinking they really can do it. It was a great interview with Mason McTavish and Scott Oak in the aftermath. We've talked about on this pod through this series some of the forwards, the young forwards, going through this first time, how great they have looked, Jackson Lecombe here on Sunday night, nearly 30 minutes for a game that just got into overtime. You know, for all the love of the forwards are getting, he has been incredible as the guy on defense for the ducks

going through all of this for the very first time in the postseason. And not only not looking out of place, but staking claim of a pretty big role here. It's cool to watch. Guy couldn't even get a minute at the Olympics. By the way, I'm laughing here. There's a tweet from J.C. the Swede. My head already hurts in anticipation for 10 minutes of discourse on the podcast about this.

Hopefully, J.C., we cut it a bit short for you. Yes. And that you came armed with, I don't know, a heat pack. Try to soothe you. All right. else on this one, Fridge? I would think that if any team is capable of coming back from a 3-1 deficit, the Oilers would be very high on the list.

Like I said, McDavid looked better at the end of the game, but you've got dry-sidal, not 100%, you've got Dickinson, not 100%, and you've got the ducks flying, confident. Jeffrey Vail, one of the heroes of this series, traded for a fourth rounder. Like he was going to go on waivers, I believe. And then Verbeek said, no, I'll make the trade just to make sure I get them. Right now the ducks, they're good and everything's coming up. Millhouse for them. But if there was one team I would look at that could come back from,

three to one, I still think Edmondton could be that team. Banged up and beaten up a bit, write them off at your own peril. They have looked on the ropes and in deep, deep trouble a couple of times over the last two years on route to Stanley Cup final appearances. They found a way then, and now they are being asked to do it once again, down three games to one, head and home for game five back in Edmonton. Now, meanwhile, earlier on Sunday night, the Montreal Canadiens and the Tampa Bay Lightning

for the first time in the series, no overtime was necessary between these two teams. Do you have a guess, Elliot Friedman, of who led all Tampa skaters in Ice Time in game number four? All Tampa Skaters? All of them. Was it Crozier? It was not.

He led the team in devastating hits, We'll get to that in a minute. Was it, was it Hagel? It was Brandon Hagel. Okay. More than Darren Radish, more than JJ Mosier. He was just over 25 and a half minutes, a player who would not be denied on this day.

Trying to avoid going down three to one. They do just that. Two more goals for Hagel. He was the guy that had the roof going off the Bell Center at four nations over a year ago. He silenced the crowd here on Sunday night. By the way, I have to say, you had a lot of great interviews. You had a great, your Hegel one was a great interview,

and your Cole Hudson one was a great interview. You are, I give you your props, Kyle. You're on a run of really good interviews in these playoffs. Been fortunate to have some good guests. Yes, but still you have. By the way, I wanted to say, too, it was really funny because I put out the video of the cap and penalty, and we'll get to that there.

And I had DMs from Canadians fans calling me anti-Canadian and saying, why do I hate Canada's team, the Montreal Canadiens? And then when I made the comment about the Oilers game, I had a bunch of Ducks fans saying, I root for Canada and I hate the United States. You cannot win. But those are the nights that are so awesome about hockey, Kyle. And those are the nights that I actually really love working in this business

because we have great fans. And some of you are crazy. But without your passion, none of us have jobs. Yes. And we're all on social media together. And we're all going through this together. And it's awesome stuff. It actually reminds me of a story that,

it actually reminds me of a story. You remember the comeback on Catella, right? Yep. So Bob Murray was the GM of the Ducks at the time, and him and I actually got along reasonably well. But I found out, like, so that night, on one of the goals on the comeback, the ducks had held the leg of the Edmonton goalie,

but nobody noticed it until the intermission. And someone sent me a note saying they held the goalie. So they played, we found the replay, the overhead, and there it was. They were holding the leg of the Edmonton goalie, and we just made a big deal out of it in the intermission. And the guys, it's the bosses at the time at Sportsnet. The next day I came in,

and they'd gotten a call from the league. and they were kind of laughing. They said, the docs called the league and said, is there no such thing as unbiased reporting anymore? You've got this Homer Canadian and this Homer broadcast showing video of us holding the leg. Says, these guys are total homers,

and they're trying to get penalties called against us, and they're trying to fix the series for the Oilers. And I said, well, what did you guys say? And they said, well, I mean, the video was pretty conclusive. But it was just funny. Somebody had sent me a text about that tonight after the game, that it's the second time I've been pro-oiler and anti-dux in an overtime game involving those series.

They were laughing about that old memory. Anyway, sorry. Oh, God. Let's get to this game. Yes. Actually, can I add to that about just the fandom? Like, just leaving the building on Sunday, there was a HABS fan that was like, hey, don't you think the Kutrov faked an injury just so he could get the penalty on Evans?

I'm like, I don't know, man. Evans gave him a pretty good ride into the boards. Like, I don't think many of us would be getting up after, like, did you see how hard Kutrov went into the boards? They were like, oh, do you think he faked an injury? I'm like, I don't think so. That was a pretty solid thud. But mere eyes, you should have just got up.

It's crazy. It is. You know, it's funny. Like I've, like, first of all, I think the embellishing in this playoffs, not to this specific play, but just in general, the embellishment in this place, we've talked about it. It's been horrendous. And it's screwing up the officials. Like, I know people are getting on the referees.

and I know they were mad about the cap and play, and we'll get to that in a second. But like some of these plays, it's on the players that the officials are so screwed up. We said it before and we'll say it again. I was talking to someone on Sunday, and he said to me, they really thought that by calling those embellishments

on Crosby and McKinnon, they would solve the problem because the players would look and they would say, okay, one of the greatest players ever and potentially the hard, trophy winner this season just got called for embellishment on back-to-back nights. That'll send a message. And it hasn't worked. So I don't know what these guys are going to do now. But what a great series, Tampa, Montreal. Like, we all thought we were getting seven games of this.

There's nothing between these two teams. Like whoever wins this series, it's not an upset. It is just a hard-fought, hard-played, great series. And nobody should be surprised. It's two, through four, and we're probably going seven. And there's nothing between these two teams. You know, the cap and I'll say this, a little bit of inside baseball for everybody. We felt very strongly that we had to show it because people were using the one sports net play to show that there was no penalty. And James certainly looked like he embellished.

but you know we felt that we have to show that there was a penalty on this play it was just a little earlier and high sticking is getting called everywhere like to me that's the most consistent call the playoffs Kyle is high sticking if people get their sticks up they're getting called and it's happening in every series so when I saw that play the original play I was like oh of course that was a penalty I actually didn't realize until some Canadians fans pointed out out to me that they were upset about the later part because the arm doesn't raise until after that and there's no contact. And I didn't actually realize that at the time. I just assumed I didn't understand why everyone was upset because clearly there had been a high stick. I get that more now,

but it was a penalty. So I don't have a problem with that. What a, I just, I know we just felt we had to show it because people kept on using our play to justify it. So we're like, no, we better show the full replay. But what a great series. And it'll be interesting to see how they handle this because like I don't mind the Gensel penalty. I think goalies have, you know, if you've ever heard me talk about things like Sam Bennett on Stollers last year, I think goalies have to be protected.

You cannot afford injuries to goalies. And if they're going to go the extra mile to protect goalies, I'm good with that. But I know that both Lightning fans and Canadian fans were furious about some of the calls. All I'd say is that I just think the embellishment is making it borderline impossible on these referees. Yeah, and I think you could feel it again on Sunday here that both sides were having difficulties finding where the standard and the line was. You saw John Cooper teetering towards kind of losing control a little bit, particularly in the second period. over some things that either were called or were not called. But ultimately, it was the lightning that prevail here.

One of the plays that helped change things in Tampa's favor here in game number four was that Max Crozier hit on your eyes, Slavkovsky. Maybe not quite as heavy as Cleven on Nikitian, but boy, it was absolutely in the same category. It was good to see Slavkovsky came back to start the third and finish the game because that was heavy, heavy, right in the middle of the ice. Actually, Dan Hino, one of the assistant coaches with the Lightning, told a great story to Gabby Shirley of the Lightning Show. You saw that.

You saw the clip? Yeah. Yeah, it's great. You should mention it. So for those who didn't catch it, he was saying, so they had an optional practice the day before. And I guess Crozier clearly had a feeling then that he may be playing here on Sunday. and this is a guy that had missed time for about two months. I think he had core muscle surgery done.

He was gone for a long while. He played that last game of the year, the regular season, when there's really not much to play for. So he's telling high note on the ice going, like, I need to get hit. I need to feel getting hit again if, you know, just to be ready to go back in. And so he calls over Connor Geeky,

who is by no means a small guy. That's a big body out there. and he goes, take a run of Crozer. They just ran him down the boards like the old gauntlet drill. You'd do a minor hockey. And Geeky took a couple of runs out of him and I guess got to the point where he was like, all right, I'm glad I got to feel this again. And physically, clearly he was ready to go here on Sunday.

Richter scale. You know what, Kyle, I asked, I saw a clip of that from the Lightning Broadcast and I asked if we had any of it from the pregame, and it was unfortunately, I didn't see it until the third period, so with no overtime, we never really got a chance to look. So we'll watch it for Game 5, because I'm assuming Crozier is still going to play. I mean, that hit was clean on Slavkovsky.

I'm glad Slavkovsky came back to play. I want to see players play, and also I think that just changes, I think it just changes the series, tremendously if he can't. And then I don't like to see that. But what a great, what a great series of hockey that is.

Hegel has been phenomenal, like just incredible. And you know, I'll say this. I thought Suzuki played his best game of the series. And that's a good omen for Montreal. Just great, great hockey. And I hope we get three more games of it. Although I'm sure the Canadians and,

Lightning fans will say, please only give us two. We can't take three. Last thing I'll say on this for Montreal, youngest playoff roster. And for all the talk of not having the same playoff pedigree as Tampa, as you mentioned off the hop, nothing about these first four games says that they're not at Tampa's level. I think the big thing going forward over either the next two or three games, can they handle those swing moments in a game? better than their opponent.

And that's going to go a long way to see who ends up in the second round. And who will end up meaning the winner of the Buffalo Sabres and the Boston Bruins. It is the Sabres now with a three to one series lead. They take both games at TD Garden, maybe one of the best first periods all season in the eyes of Lindy Ruff. First game of the series, they didn't wade into things to the Sabres. and it's kind of full circle-ish, I think, for Buffalo, LA. Because you remember you go back, the second game of their season, they played in Boston, they lost 3-1.

I remember Ruffed ripped his team after that game. And it was like, oh, man, is it disaster already again in Buffalo? And back in that building, their most thorough victory of the series, they've got a stranglehold up 3 to 1. I could not believe Boston in this one. first of all, both Boston and Buffalo fans who listen to the podcast have really disagreed with my analysis of it so far. And I have said that it's not a series I've been able to watch a lot

because it's usually on against the game I'm working. This was the first one, Kyle, I really had a chance to watch that was not against anything. So Sabres fans, you're welcome. Bruins fans, I'm sorry. because obviously I'm good luck for Sabres fans, an awful luck for Bruins fans. I think that the thing that really blew me away,

first of all, the guy was I'm happiest for Peyton Krebs. You know, Peyton Krebs has taken a lot of heat from Sabers fans. It's hard to be traded in a deal like that and be a main piece coming back. You're always compared to that player who goes, even though it's not fair. And he's had a great start to the playoffs for them. He's been excellent, really happy for Krebs.

But secondly, the thing that shocked me was all four of those goals in the first period, Kyle, like Boston handed it right to them. They made bad plays on every single one of them. And you watched Sturm at the end of the game, and he was absolutely shell-shocked. He didn't know what to say. He was at a loss. And McAvoy's quote about, to a man, we all have to be embarrassed. You know, he's right because almost all, like, all of those goals were self-inflicted to some degree.

Like, sometimes a guy makes a great. play or sometimes you get beaten on the rush and that happens. But they were all breakdowns and giveaways. And in the playoffs, you can't do that. But, you know, game five in Buffalo is going to be insane. A chance to win a playoff series. I can't imagine what that crowd is going to be like. The Bruins made all the giveaways and the savers to their credit.

You know, that's what good teams do. You're up to one in a series and you get a chance to do a, to give a stranglehold and you do it. And they took every single one of the Bruins mistakes and they put it in the net. And I really do believe that that's what true Stanley Cup contenders do. They make you pay for your mistakes and they don't let off the gas. And Buffalo, like watching Buffalo win that game like that, that's when you look at a team and say, boy, that team has what it takes.

Like that, that's a winner because they step on your throat and they don't let go. Swayman, that was, you all saw that shot of him going off the ice in the third period after he got the hook and the TV timeout. He, of course, was not the problem for Boston, this one, but some words for the bench and trying to get them in the right headspace again heading into game five. That was an interesting thing to see. Sturm did make a couple of lineup changes. Clearly, it did not have the effect. I mean, the problems for the Bruins were much bigger than just that. Crabbs, you mentioned, great story.

Both Byram's having a great, great series as well. He's not the only Sabres defenseman you can say that about, but a second straight multi-point game for him. Buffalo, and it felt like loud in there for, in terms of the amount of Sabers fans that were in the garden on Sunday. It's just a lot of momentum behind not only finally ending the streak, but not just one and done here. The Sabres have plans of doing something much deeper. They're good enough to do it.

You know, the Swamen thing, I have to admit, I'm a little bit mixed about it, just in the sense that I've always kind of been of the belief that team keeps their problems in-house as much as you possibly can. but I also understand the competitive nature of that and how angry he got. So, I mean, and also, also, as I say, we always say hockey players are boring. We can't rip them when they speak their truth. Carrie Price did the same Perhaps fans will remember Michelle Tarion pulled him at a home game a number of years ago

and gave him the look coming off the ice It happens They are competitors They sure are Game 5 in Buffalo on Tuesday night All right The fourth of the four here on Sunday, Elliot We've got our second sweep, and it will be only two sweeps here in the first round.

Colorado Avalanche put the L.A. Kings to bed. And with that, the incredible career of Anzee Kopitar comes to an end. It's a wonderful scene that he got a nice ovation from the home crowd and was able to salute them one more time. I can only imagine the feelings and mixed emotions, not only for him, but of course his teammates. and your season just come to an end and now you're kind of seeing your captain

and leader off one final time. What did you think of the scene there in Los Angeles on Sunday, Elliott, and Colorado doing what I think was not a shock if you were to predict going in, putting away L.A. and 4th straight. If anybody out there listen to our preview of this series, I really felt it was an awful matchup for the Kings.

You know, honestly, Kyle, they probably played as well as they could. They didn't get blown out in any game until the end of Game 4. You know, it was funny. DJ Smith was asked in the pregame on Sunday about McKinnon and having not scored yet, and he kind of said, I hope this isn't a bad omen. He went out and scored twice. Like, you know, they did a lot of things as best as,

they probably could. They defended well at five on five. They didn't let their top players run wild. But every game, Colorado was just a little bit better, as you would expect, because they were the wire-to-wire presence trophy winners, and they're a better team than L.A. And so this was, I think, what a lot of us expected. You know, the avalanche are going to get, you know, I think it was Mike Russo pointed out that if wild stars go seven, they could have over a week off.

And I don't think teams like that, but that's what we're looking at here. And that series shows no sign of going, it's like Tampa, Montreal. Like that series is probably going seven. You know, I, Colorado was just too good for them. It's that simple. And it's going to be a really interesting offseason in L.A. Copatar gone, a huge void in their organization. You know, obviously, Gretzky played for the king,

so you could say he's the greatest king ever. But if you really think about a guy from beginning to end who was a king, Copatar goes down as the best king ever. And it's going to leave an enormous hole in their organization to fill it. And, you know, you heard DJ, DJ Smith talk after the game, you can tell he wants that job badly. When you take a look at interim coaches, like there were some guys who got hired really late in the year this year. Peter DeBore, of course, was one.

That's a little different. You know, Smith took over with six weeks to go in the season. And I thought he did a pretty good job there. I thought the team played as well as it could with him. You know, I thought Byfield showed some improvement with him. And you could tell how much he wants to be the head coach of the Kings. They defended well five on five. And like I said, the big thing for them is Byfield.

In a lot of ways, they need him to become the standard bearer of the franchise. and I think that whatever you do, one of the most important decisions you have to make in running the Kings now and making this coaching decision is, can you show that you can grow by field, that he can go to the next level with you? And at the very least, Smith has made them think.

now they're going to go out and they're going to have to find another center. It's going to be tough because there's a lot of teams that are going to be out there looking for centers. You know, I think who isn't? You know, I think Winnipeg is going to look hard for a center. You know, Calgary is a team that always talks about looking for a center. I mean, I'm just going over my list now. There's a billion teams out there looking for centers. and I think the one thing that's going to be interesting is that if the kings are going to want to make a big trade to get an impact player, Kyle, who do you think they're going to be asking for?

Byfield? Yes. So it kind of defeats the purpose. You want to center to play with Byfield. One two punch. You don't want to have to trade Byfield because then you're no better off than you were. before. So it's it's

going to be fascinating because they don't have a lot to deal. I think they want to be big, big players. You know, the other thing we're going to learn is that there's a lot of teams talking about and hoping to make big moves this summer. Not everybody's going to be able

to do it. Like some of these teams and some of their fans are going to be disappointed. I think the Kings are one of these teams that really want to swing big. It's L.A. Like that's what they want to do. Not everybody's going to be able to pull this off and the really tough thing is that everyone's what are people going to want from the Kings they're going to want byfield who's the player they should least thinking think about trading um you know I'll say this too um I think they're

going to need to become faster on the blue line you know you could see that you know like I said they did they did the best possible job that they could to contain Colorado I think they were disciplined in this structure. They played strong. But they just weren't quick enough on the blue line. And this is a fast league now. You're watching Anaheim. You're watching San Jose in their division.

You're watching all these teams now that are good. They're fast. They either skate fast or they move fast. And they're going to have to improve their speed. And Byfield, too, I think of all the years he's been with the Kings and you're watching the development next season for me is going to be the most intriguing and possibly revealing one because now there's nobody ahead of them on the depth chart.

Like he's going to have all the opportunity to play in all the situations that they believe he can that he wants to be in and wants to show he belongs in. I think we're going to get as good of a sense as we ever have with Byfield as an NHLer of where he can take things in terms of his abilities and potential as the go-to guy there in L.A. Because you're right. It's a big hole there now with Copa Targon.

And for a few years now, it's been, can he be the next guy to fulfill it? Golden opportunity this coming fall. It'll be an interesting one to watch too. That and along with Brent Clark needing. a new contract this summer. Oh, yeah. Imagine that'll be an interesting conversation there, in terms of where they ultimately want to go with that one

and where they, how they view the player and all of that. You know, it's interesting because he's a really talented guy and you can just see he wants so much more responsibility, right? And all, I want to say this about Clark. I don't think it's always been easy. The organization will tell you they really like Clark, they really believe in Clark,

and they really think he's got a bright future, which I definitely think is true. But there's been times she's been frustrated, and he has shot any negative talk down, at least to this point. He has not allowed it to become an issue. You know, like you've seen it. Like reporters there, they ask him,

Are you happy? And he kind of parries it. He won't let it become a thing. I think he's handled himself extremely well. But you're right. The contracting, that's where it can sometimes go sideways. So we'll see where this one goes. So we head towards a new era in Los Angeles.

We wish Anzee Kopitar all the best in his retirement. And as he said, you know, the kids now get dad on a lot more regular basis. So more time seeing them at that Toyota Performance Center in shorts and flip-flops sitting on the bench watching his kids play, Elliot, than in the weight room and training room and on the ice himself, as we did when we were down in L.A. a couple years ago. And for Colorado, they took care of their business. And now they await a heavyweight clash. Well, a current one is still ongoing between Minnesota and Dallas, which will get. get to a little bit later in the pod. Okay, time now for the final thought presented by the Toyota BZ.

So just some other news around the league that you wanted to shed some light and some updates on. And it's a lot of the stuff that we've been following over the last few weeks. So what have you got for us here? We'll make it quick. And it's because it's late at night and you've got an early flight. Just some of the GM searches, Toronto. I think what we're kind of awaiting here to see how this is all going to work is Matt Sundeen's decision.

And we'll see where that goes this week. But as you've heard me say, I have wondered if he's contemplating a larger role than has kind of been hinted or reported. And I still believe that's true. And I think everyone's hoping to get an idea this week of where he's leaning and what he's considering. And so I think once we know where Sundin falls on this, we'll have a truer, clearer picture of what the Maple Leaf's front office is going to look like. In Nashville, I have a sneaking suspicion that there's a potential curveball there

that they've been either considering or talking to or looking at someone we haven't seen yet. I'm not expecting anything Monday. Like I said, I heard they've gotten it down to a short list, but there were some things I heard on the weekend that have led me to believe that the predators may have a curveball in there I haven't seen yet. Vancouver, I think, more interviews. Names we've been reported or have been reported so far, Shane Donne, Kevin Adams, Ryan Johnson, Ray Whitney, Bill Scott was reported by John Shannon on Sunday. And I've heard five other names. I'm working to confirm.

Some of them have BC connections. I think that's one thing that Canucks have kind of looked at there. Maybe is there anybody, and not even necessarily somebody who was a Canuck, but somebody who has BC connections that might have some pride in the region. And so I think those are some of the things, not all of them, but some of them. And I think those are some of the things they're looking at. But I still think they're doing their interviews. All right.

So Curbball, Nashville, is that just a name that is under serious consideration that we're not aware of yet? What does Curbball mean? Yeah, I think that's what it is. Somebody who's under consideration that we're not aware of yet. All right. Just somebody a little different. Yeah. Okay.

Thank you for that. That was the final thought presented by the Toyota BZ. We'll take our first break. We'll come back with the thought line. And then after that, we'll get to the other four series that one has concluded and three more still ongoing in the first round of the Stanley Cup playoffs. More 32 thoughts of the podcast after the break. All right.

Welcome back. Another edition of the thought line coming your way here, Elliot. So before we get to that, how about this for a chance run-in? So I'm walking back from the arena here in Montreal after the morning skate Friday before game three, bump into hockey fan podcast listener Lewis, who reminded me of a conversation him and I had inside the building prior to Canada, US, four nations in Montreal, just over a year ago. And he goes, I said to you that night, I hope this is the loudest this building will ever be. And arguably it was up there that night.

Oh, yeah. So I just happened, he was in town going to the game Friday. I just happened to run into him on the street. And he goes, hopefully tonight, it is even louder than that Four Nations game. I'm not sure it'll get there, but hopefully it was. Anyway, and it was rocking on Friday and again on Sunday night. But it was nice to see a recurring podcast listener for another conversation. A sequel.

A sequel. Yeah. Yeah. Which one was louder? Which one was louder? Well, it was, you know, Four nations or the game the other night? Four nations was like a once in a lifetime.

Yes. Perfect storm of things coming together. But I love it. So Caden Gully said his first playoff game last year there. He goes, get in the room afterwards. My ears are popping. He's like, I've never felt that before. And this is a guy that loves going to concerts, some music festivals.

He likes listening to things loud. And he goes, I've never. never felt that before. Awesome. And then to clear the deck with you? I didn't have a lot of time to go through it, but there was one. We had a couple of good Insta DMs, Kyle. Okay.

And one of them in particular was somebody who sent us a video of Rocky's announcers sharing him, Mikey Ziegler is his name. Rocky's announcers sharing a one pound, 23-inch hot dog, known as the Glezilla, and said, your move, gentlemen. I've just seen this now.

He also said this a video of a guy trying to dummy the five-pound ice cream in Tampa. Mikey Ziegler did. Before our careers are done, we are taking down that ice cream. He just, I guess he wants to see us eat. Wants to make sure we're...

What did Don call it, Lady in the Tramp? That's exactly what it is. Yes. Yeah, well, certainly the Glazilla absolutely is that. 23-inch hot dog. There was another person, Reese Musgrove, I think it is. He said,

can you please bring this up on the next pod of how corny this post is? And it was your insta post of the arena in Montreal where you wrote two minutes for looking so good. Yeah, standing in the penalty box. Now those of a, this was well before both of our times,

but there is a great commercial with Maurice Richard back in the day. Oh, yes. Grecian formula. Yes. I actually, it was before your time, but it was not before mine. I remember that commercial. I tried to protect you. You did.

You know, it was nice. That's a good teammate, Kyle. It was nice. But I am old enough to remember. It was so easy, remember. Hey, Rocket, two minutes for looking so good. But Reese thought it was corny. Okay.

Hit me. Hit me with the thought line. All right. Just a couple here for you today, Elliot. And we begin with Tyler from Etobico, good day gentlemen. And Elliot. Back in September during the live show in PEI, it feels like five years ago. Oh, seriously.

My goodness. Great trip, but it feels like forever ago. Oh, God. Geez. You took a question from a friend of mine, Sean, though technically, the first interaction came earlier at the hotel gym while Elliot was... I remember, Sean. Absolutely. Yes, yep. While Elliot was struggling through what could only be described as a interesting workout routine.

Sean was the one with the thumbs up, right? It was like the squat with the thumbs up. Oh, yeah, yeah. You're admiring that one. I got to say something. I just want to say something for the record here. Sean's routine was much more interesting than mine was, if I remember it correctly. Mine was pretty basic. The hotel we were staying at had a pretty basic hotel gym. So I have like a basic hotel gym workout. His was stranger than mine.

I would like to say that for the record. I love, you adapt to your surroundings. Yes, yes, yes. Basic gym, basic workout incoming. I'm like a chameleon. I just blend in, yes. Fast forward to this week, Sean and my beer league team found ourselves in the championship game, Despite being sidelined with an injury from the semifinal,

Sean still suited up and took his rightful place on the bench. No shifts, all vibes as we pulled off a two to one shootout win. Congratulations. So with the Stanley Cup playoffs now in full swing, it got me thinking about memorable Stanley Cup final moments involving injured star players forced into more of a morale role. Of course, Stephen Stamcoast and his goal in the 2020 final against Dallas, despite only playing a few shifts immediately comes to mind.

I'm curious what other stories you guys can think of. There's one that you and I were both at. I'm sure you're going to mention. Charra, right? Like, are you talking about Zia Chara? That's the one I remember where he sat there and when he broke the jaw in St. Louis and he opened and closed the bench. That was a big one.

And then when he was introduced in the starting lineup before the next. game, just the huge ovation in Boston for him. Another big one was Sidney Crosby when the Penguins won their first Stanley Cup in 2009. He was injured in the second period in game seven at Detroit. And he sat on the bench for the third period and didn't play but sat there and gave moral support and celebrated when the penguins hung on and won that game. with the great save by Mark Andre Fleurioff, Nick Lindstrom, with seconds remaining. So those are the two that I really remember well.

The other one I always remember for that, and it wasn't an injury, but I always remember when New Jersey won its first Stanley Cup over to Troy, how Mike Paluso couldn't play at the end of the game because he was so emotional and crying so hard that he just couldn't take a shift. And I think anybody who saw that has all, always remembered how Paluso, how emotional he was as the devils were closing out that series.

And he played a big role on that New Jersey team with the crash line. One I think of it wasn't Stanley Cup final, but the playoffs, a few years ago that game seven against Toronto, Tampa in Toronto. I remember Braden Point, who was having a great series. He scored the overtime winner in game six to force a seventh game. Remember he got hurt. I think it was fairly early in the first period. I think he tried to play maybe one more shift. You knew he couldn't go.

If I remember correctly, he stayed on the bench through the rest of that one. And Tampa, of course, wins game seven and goes back to the Stanley Cup final. I also think, too, like with point, now that we've brought him up here, if he had not missed time with injury, I think particularly their first cup run in 2020, I think one of those two years, he was earmarked for a Kahn-Smith trophy. Like, he was that good during those. back-to-back cups. That was one that came to mind for me of recent memory.

Good memory. I wouldn't have remembered that one. But all good. Good question. Sean, great teammate, bud. Weird gym workout, but great teammate. Austin from Cleveland. One more here.

Hey, guys. Short-time listener here. Been tuning in since the 32 Thoughts Days. Nice. Welcome, Austin. With Marco Sturm being a former Bruin and now stepping in as the B's bench boss, it got me thinking,

how often has a former player come back and coach the same team they played for to a Stanley Cup? Well, the guy who held the record for most cups for a long time before Scotty Bowman broke it was Toll Blake, who won eight Stanley Cups as the coach of the Montreal Canadiens and also played for them and was an extremely successful player

two. So that, like, right off the top, he is the absolute first guy that I think of because he was the record holder for most Stanley Cups as a coach for a very long time. So that's, that's number one. That's the first thing that jumps into my head. I'm trying to remember off the top of my head if anyone else did it. Like, I thought you were going to ask how many players, coach teams that they played for. And I was jumping right to the Bruins because the Bruins have a long history of coaches who played for them. Steve Casper, Mike Milbury, Terry O'Reilly, Jerry Cheever's. Like they had a long list of guys who coached their team who played for them.

But off the top of my head, who else am I missing? if anyone, Kyle, that coached a team that they played for. Like, Daryl Sutter won Stanley Cup for the Kings, but he never played for them. Correct. Joel Quenville never played for the Blackhawks. Like, I'm trying to remember, am I missing anyone here? There are actually seven others from Toll Blake that meet this criteria, yes.

Okay, okay, hold on. Like, okay, all right. Let me think here. It's been a while. Oh, really? So it's nobody in recent? No. Like, did Glenn Sayther ever play for the Oilers?

Nope. Okay. So that's, you know, okay. So I discounted Sather. I didn't think he ever played there. Okay. Let me think about this year. I will just say it's funny you mentioned the Bruins of all the ex players that coached there

because two answers here, won Stanley Cups with Boston as coach. Ew, okay, so let's go, let's go back. Okay, I'm just doing this in my head. I'm going back through every winner. No, Terry Crisp never played for the flames. Al Arbor never played for the Islanders. Did Al McNeil play for the Canadians?

Yes, he did. Okay. That's one. Like we're going back into situations here. I can't. That is the second most recent example. That's the second most recent? Yes.

Well, okay. So Joe Primo for the Maple Leafs. Correct. Hap day for the Maple Leafs. Yes. Yeah. Before that, I can't remember who all the coaches were. So we'll get Joe Primo and we'll get half day.

And then I'm trying to remember who's after Al McNeil. Not Scotty Bowman, not Fred Schiro, not Arbor. Okay, I'm checking something here because I can't remember who the Bruins coach was in 1972. So I'm looking up. I know it wasn't Harry Sinton. I know that wasn't Don Cherry. Oh, Tom Johnson.

He's one because he played for the Bruins. Other than that, I can give you three. I can't get the rest of them. I can't remember who the coaches were back then. That's all right. So, yeah, you got Tom Johnson, you got Al McNeil, Joe Primo,

Hap Day, Toe Blake, Frank Boucher with the Rangers. I never would have gotten that. And when the Bruins won in 1941, Cooney Wyland, I hope I'm pronouncing that right, was the coach of Boston then.

He played over 300 games with the Bruins. And the other one, which is, imagine a tricky one. Lester Patrick won two Stanley Cups. He played like the one game for the Rangers. He played one regular season game, one playoff game for the Rangers. And then won two Stanley Cups as coach. Okay. So I am looking this up because if I remember correctly, he played the one game in goal because his goalies got hurt. Yes. Yes. So that's it. It's in the final. eye injury and he went in, he played at age 45. That's a pretty famous story. When you mentioned it, I kind of remembered it. I had to look up the exact details, but he only went in as an emergency because the number

one goalie got hurt. Wow. Wow. And if I remember the story correctly, they, at that point in time, they actually had to ask the other team for permission. to use a different goalie, and the other team refused to let them use certain guys until they had no choice but to put in for Patrick.

And I guess, yeah, the one regular season game would have been the same instance, too, because he was the head coach simultaneously the previous year and got one game. Great question. Really good. Great question. And, you know, I just want you to know, Kyle, I wasn't even, though I was old enough to remember the Maurice Richard commercial. I'm not old enough to remember this occurring. As I said, tried to protect you. Welcome aboard, Austin. Thanks for listening.

Yes. Okay. That'll do it for another edition of the thought line. 1833-3-3-1-3-1-321-3. Is the phone number to leave a voicemail, or you can email us at 32thoughts at sportsnet.ca. We'll take one final break. Back with more 32 Thoughts, the podcast, after this. All right, so let's go through the series that we're not in action on Sunday. We'll begin with the Ottawa Senators, Elliot, the first team knocked out of the 26 Stanley Cup playoffs. Congratulations to the Hurricanes being the first team to punch their ticket to round number two. Elliot, the Sends were largely viewed with how they finished the regular season as a team that you may not want to face in the first round. And not only did they not win a game against the Hurricanes, they did not.

hold a lead for a second over the course of the four games. Naturally, the questions begin around what the future looks like. How does Steve Seos address things moving forward? And there's the Brady Kachukh question also. Where do you want to start with the Ottawa Senators, a playoff run that ended almost as soon as it began? Kyle, there's one thing that you did not address in your introduction to the Senators. Okay. Where are your Senator's pajamas today. I left him home. Maybe that's why I went so poorly.

I didn't bring them with me. Senators fans, Ottawa fans, there's your man to blame. It's really unbelievable, Kyle. Think about this. All year long, what did we say about Ottawa? They just need to get some

goaltending. Linus Allmark had a 9.30 save percentage and a 2.03 goals against average, and they got swept and never led in the series. If you would have told me, if you would have come back from the future and told me that that would have happened, there's no chance anyone would have believed you. No chance. The other thing, too, I was looking at some of the numbers. Carter Yakimchuk, who played one game,

was tied for second in Sanders' playoff scoring. Two points. It's just, what happened in this series is unbelievable. It really is. Like, I don't think anybody surprised Carolina won,

but the way it went and how it all went down and Allmark playing great and the lack of offense, And also the craziness of the last two games, it was just an insane series. The number one thing, I'm going to give free advice. Normally I charge about $800 an hour for advice, Kyle, but I'm going to give some free advice. Yes.

The senators need to make no decisions, no decisions for a week or two. It is white hot around that organization right now. They're angry, they're frustrated, they're disappointed, they're furious, they're all the bad emotions rolled into one right now. There's no sugar-coding it. It's an awful defeat. It is terrible injuries. Everything about it sucked.

They had such high hopes. They really thought they were going to be better. They thought last year they didn't start the playoffs on time. And they figured it would be different this year. They got the goaltending. And still, they went nowhere. And, but what they have to do is take a deep breath. Because it's painful and it hurts.

I have said this many times, and I'll say it again. The way the NHL playoffs are set up, I never worry about when you lose. Okay? I always worry about who you lose to, okay? They got swept by a playoff-tested team, a team that seemingly wins two rounds every year. a team that is always in there, won the Eastern Conference, won their division comfortably, a disciplined, structured team that understands the assignment and did what it does. Now, I would also say, you know, for all, like everyone's talking up Stan Covein and he was great,

no question about it. People are talking Taylor Hall, he was excellent, no question about it. But Freddie Anderson, it's a reminder. you can always rewrite your narrative in the playoffs. He had the worst numbers of his career in the regular season, and he beat them four in a row in the playoffs. Like you heard what Allmark stats were. He beat that four straight times.

He gave up an awful goal in game too, but he did what every elite goal he has to do. He shrugged it off. I did this wrong. I'll fix it. He did and never was out of control. He was the best player in the series. So when I look at this, if I'm the Ottawa Sanders, you can sit there and say internally,

we got swept in the first round, yes, but you know what? We lost to a machine. And that is the standard that we are going to need to aspire to. That is the team that we have to be. and that's the way I would look at it. I would say you don't have to do major surgery and we'll get to something here in a second. You don't have to do major surgery. You don't have to say, because this is what happens, for a week, you're going to hate everything and everyone.

You're going to be like, this guy's bad, that guy's bad, this is what happened here, this is what happened there. you still have a very good core. You still have a lot of really good players. Like I said, there's one circumstance we'll get to here in a second, which could force you to make some hard decisions, but you don't need to sit there and say, we need major renovations. Like, Kyle, do you know when Rod Brindamor says,

it's not a sweep, like a couple years ago when they lost the floor? This was not a sweep. Everybody made fun of Brindamore for it. this is where I understand what Brindamore was saying there. Yes, it's a sweep. And if you're on the losing end of it and you want to make fun of the other team's fans, you don't care about any of this how close it was. And this was a sweep and Carolina earned it.

No question here. But this is where I get what Brindamore is talking about. You can look at it and say, regardless of the result, there's a lot of things we've got here that we can build on. There's a lot of things we got here that are good. Don't overreact. Don't do something stupid because you're emotional right now. There always has to be one person in the organization who says,

guys, this sucks, but we're not doing anything dumb. go on vacation. Players will do their exit meetings here on Monday and of course we'll do one final bit of media and the questions will be flying fast and furious surely there. And I know over the course of the four games by and large it always felt Ottawa was a shot away.

Ottawa was a shot away. I think if you looked under the hood a little further, I'm not sure it was as close as some may have made it out to be. But what a lesson to your point, Elliot, of going up against the team like Carolina. And you mentioned that about Anderson. It's easy to forget, too.

He was statistically one of the best goalies last year through two rounds in the playoffs. And then, you know, they run into the juggernaut, Florida Panthers. And things change from there. But he has put out some very, very good performances in the playoffs with the hurricanes, despite some shoddy at times regular season numbers.

Okay, you want to get to Chuck here? Yeah, so this is obviously the big one. And in the interview we did with him, he made it very clear, I'm not the one saying this stuff. It's other people speculating. It's other people's conjecture. That's all fair. A lot of that is true.

I think now we probably find out where do things really stand. You know, where are we going here? And obviously, it's a huge decision because if there is any change to the status quo, it is a major turning point in the future of the franchise. So I'm not going to guess. I'm going to wait and hear what he has to say or what the team relays in terms of what they know from him. So no more he said, she said, let's get to the facts. So you talk about one situation

that could drastically change things, that is one there. And also at some point, there's likely after July 1st, a conversation to be had with Drake Batherson. Another career year for him. He's been at very good value with just under $5 million for a while.

He's extension eligible this summer. he's not going to be at that number beyond next season. So what does that conversation look like too? Zub too. It's a very good point. Absolutely. Yep. Who is as important a guy on their back end, maybe not at Sanderson level,

but Sends fans know the value and importance of having him there. There's some business to be done or at least some hard conversations to be had and it extends beyond just their cap. And Claude Giroux. I mean, Claude Jureau is an obvious one too, and he's still as competitive as ever, and he can still play. And you can tell that those players all really respect him. He is very much a big part of the attitude of that group. You know, I'll say this. One player I'm also curious about Kyle is Zetterland. I really like the Zetterland trade. I really like the player. It's been a difficult fit for him. You know, I would just say that in the first round, like I said, I really like the player. He just wasn't as impactful as I think he can be. And I'm just wondering, do they look at it and say, we have to do a better job of finding a spot for him or what? because it just, you know, like, look, like Chuck had no points,

and is the captain, you take the heat. That's the reality. That's life in the big city. Stutzlow had one point. I thought he competed like crazy. He couldn't score. You know, but I mean like this is a results-oriented business. You're that guy.

You take the heat. That's life in the big city. Zetterland isn't as front line as those guys are. But again, I really liked the player. It just didn't work. It wasn't effective. So how are you going to deal with that situation? All right.

Before we move on, by the way, Carolina Hurricanes social admin, were they ever out for blood after this series were done? One hit after another. They were relentless. Kind of like how Game 4 was at times when it really got dragged into the mud. that Tyler Cleven hit on Niketian. Now we hear he's in concussion protocol. He went back with the team.

We wish him all the best. That was heavy. And then everything beyond that, man, it went beyond just trying to settle some scores. There was some pretty hardened intent when you see some of the stuff. We know Ridley Greg is going to have a hearing and rightfully so. for what he did. There's a lot to get to beyond just the score itself

in game four Saturday. So I got to tell you, when Nikitian got hit, it reminded me a lot of when Tavares got hurt in the bubble against the Canadians, like just the player, Tavares trying to get up.

And I think that's, you know, I remember hearing at the time, like that's what someone in that position does. You try to get to your feet to show you're okay, right? And, you know, we remember how scary that was. And I was happy to hear that Nikitian was celebrating with his teammates after the game, and he was there to enjoy it because in the moment,

you were really concerned about him. First of all, Kyle, did you think that was a penalty? I could have been convinced it was late, but the fact that they reviewed it and didn't even say, all right, two minutes for a charge spoke volumes to me about how the officials saw it. I agree. They reviewed it and they had all the looks at it.

And, you know, people can decide how they feel about it. It's totally fine. but if you want to change that play, you are going to change how hockey is played. Now, some people might say, okay, because I don't want to see that outcome, but you do realize that the same people who say that, in the playoffs, if someone peels off that kind of hit,

they'll be highlighted and being called like a chicken, right? Because Nikitian does the puck's right there. and even though he doesn't really have possession of it, he tries to play it. So under the way that we currently play the game, he's eligible to be hit. If people want to change it, then ultimately we can change it. That is going to fundamentally adjust the way hockey is played, particularly at this time of year. People can decide how they feel about that. you know, BX is saying it was a two-minute interference penalty.

I was kind of laughing because I was like, you would have delivered that same hit too. That's exactly the same thing that you would have done. And he didn't deny it. And he didn't deny it. So people can decide what kind of game they like or they want. And go ahead. So I didn't think it was a penalty,

particularly since they reviewed it. And, you know, he doesn't get the head. The end of this series turned really, nasty, really brutal. I like good hard hockey. You know, I didn't like the sucker punch. I thought that was terrible. And, you know, everybody's had their own opinion about that. He's going to have the hearing, as you said. You know, a couple of things about this. Ottawa was furious about the Sanderson play. I understand why, like, when I saw that, I was like, that is not going to be a suspension.

You look at the hits that lead to suspension, they're not that. I realize, too, when I watch the slow-mo, Sanderson also gets hit a second time when his helmet's off. And, I mean, it's bad because two shots to the head like that, Sanderson takes a second shot after the helmet goes off, and it's completely unintentional.

But one of the things we've learned about concussions is if you have head contact, two times so quickly, it can be damaging. So I felt a concern for him when I saw that because you don't have any chance. Like with Hall, you can at least see it coming and kind of try to defend yourself. The other one you can't. Like you're, it happens instantaneously and you're spinning. But when you take a look at the way the NHL suspends for hits, I knew that wasn't going to be

suspension, although I can understand why the senators were angry that the Kachak one got reviewed, and that one didn't. I understand that completely. You know, the Ridley-Greg thing, I have to tell you, Kyle, every time I talk about this, I forget the, there are some officials active and retired who get really upset at me whenever I suggest that the situation room should have more control over the game. It's a real sensitive sore spot. And for those of you who are not familiar what I'm talking about,

I've heard in the past there's been discussions in situate. And like, I do not blame the on-ice officials in that situation. It's chaos. There's multiple scrums. They're trying to control the players at the benches. Like I had some people saying, to me that Deloree should be suspended, Kachuk should be suspended

because they left the bench to get involved in altercations. I mean, it was craziness there. It was out, I don't, I don't blame them for missing that. There was a lot going on. So one of the things that has been discussed before is if there's

an incident like that in a scrum, should the situation room have the right to call down the penalty box and say the officials should add this call or make this call that they didn't see that will either make things more fair or calm things down. And the on-ice officials, they hate that. They don't like it. It bothers them.

They feel that they've already lost enough say for what happens on the ice through video review. Like, ultimately, the on-ice officials are supposed to have the final say on, is it a major or a minor? and they have input on the offside or the goaltender interference, but the final call is made from the situation room. So the officials are very sensitive to losing control about what is happening on the ice. And I heard it from some people after I suggested that. They were very upset about it.

But I just look at that situation, and especially what happened after was Sean Walker and Whitley-Greg. And Walker, who got cut there, he was out for his own pound of flesh, which, as you saw, Kelly Rudy had no problem with. You know, I mean, if that penalty is called and he's given something or a game misconduct or a major or whatever, does everything calm down? And so, like, ultimately, my only goal, because everybody accuses me of having an agenda whenever I say, stuff like that. My only goal is to make it the best possible outcome, to try to get it as close to right as we can get it. But people are really sensitive to that. But I look at that situation where the officials on the ice had no chance to see that. And my overall point is, is it really a bad thing if they can buzz down and say, go to the monitor and look at what happened and you guys

make the call. So we had a listener right into the thought line after you had that intermission segment on Saturday. And they were wondering about the idea of having like a third referee watching virtually. So someone that's part of the group, male or female, is a referee, not from the situation room, watching virtually have access to all the different video inputs and replays. and in certain situations like on a major or something where an injury occurs, if something was missed on the ice,

being able to call down and say, hey guys, maybe you want to take a second look at this. And you'll remember interviewing Rod Brindamore a couple years ago, coincidentally, the head coach in this game, and his thought of having one official on the ice in the game, the other in the penalty box or by the timekeeper's table,

with the opportunity to look things over when review is necessary because you take one less body on the ice, the game is fast enough as is to be out of the way, and you've got somebody there to confirm what you did or did not see. Yeah, it's an interesting idea. Maybe that's a way that can make the on-ice officials a little more comfortable with the idea because it's one of them. I'm open to any suggestions.

Mike, I think that's a good, that's a good solution. I'm open to it. Like, I'm open to the idea. If that makes the on-ice officials happier, I'm open to it. I just think you can point to that situation in general and say, how much does that game calm down if that call is made? Right there. Right there. I think you could make an argument a lot.

And that will carry over to next year, too. You know, it was interesting. So somebody texted me after the game, a player, in the league now, and he said that if that was him at the end of the game, he would have, when it was four to two and it was basically over, he would have asked to go out on the ice and say, let me pay my penance now. I don't want this hanging over me all summer. And I thought that was interesting. You said, let me just deal with it. And I'll take my, I'll stand up for myself. I'll deal with whatever I have to deal with.

But again, I'm open to any idea that allows for that call to be made in the moment. Anything else you want to talk about with Sanders Carolina or anything like that? No, but I should just, because we did get a couple of questions to the thought line about this too, of while the Ottawa senators are eliminated, and now Ridley Gregg's having a hearing. what does this mean if he gets, in fact, a suspension, it takes him over into the regular season next year. And it's a phone hearing, not an in-person, so maximum five games. There we go.

All right, to the three other series we haven't gotten to yet this pod, Elliot. Minnesota, Dallas, not unlike, as you mentioned, Montreal, Tampa, it has lived up to all of our hopes and dreams through four games, another overtime thriller there. Tip of the cap to Esper Volstadt, who made some key key saves shortly before Matt Boldie scored the

overtime winner. That's a guy that looks playoff hardened. I know that's been a bit of a process between Boldy and the Wild certainly the early years as he was coming into the league. He has looked fantastic for the Wild. Three goals now in the series and

up to five points. We're all square to two there. What a series. This one like Tampa, Montreal, has to go seven. Just has to. It's a heart attack on a plate for Wild and Stars fans, but this one has to go seven games. I do, by the way, Boldie,

the U.S. could use him at the World Cup with that excellent free kick he almost scored on in overtime in game number four. That had to be the most blatant. kick puck in NHL history. Yes. No need for a huddle there. No, definitely not. They got that one. You know, to me,

number one, does hints show up at any point in this series? Hard to say. But that's a big one. Like, if you're Dallas and you can get him back, you'd feel even better about yourself. So that's number one. But number two, Dallas got to start scoring at even strength. I mean, they've only got three goals

that even strength this series. I don't know that you can win in a world, Kyle, where you get outscored that badly at even strength in the playoffs because eventually your power play dries up. Teams are too good, I think. That's the one

thing that really concerns me for Dallas is can you score at even strength and make this more difficult for Minnesota in that situation? I mean, you know, the one thing is the thing about Dallas is, I generally think they're a lot like Carolina. They always go two rounds.

You know, the last couple of years, they've run into Vegas, they've run into Edmonton twice. They haven't been able to make that last win to get into the Stanley Cup final. but they always seem to find a way early, even times when it looked like they could be in big trouble. It's the one thing I look at in this series is, I think you have to prove you can climb the mountain. One team has, one team has not.

I think the wild are very different. I think Hughes has changed them in a good way, but you've still got to prove you can climb the mountain. That's the last thing. There's almost nothing different between these two teams in this series. Almost nothing. They're evenly matched, just like Tampa, Montreal.

However, you've got to prove you can climb the mountain. I wrote down the even strength stuff as well. Eli, I believe the Wilder outscoring them 11 to 3 at evens through four games in the series. And the reason is because I remember talking to someone with the Oilers after last year about the series where they beat them in five. And they really believe that, you know, that there was ways for them to expose Dallas at five on five. You know, if they could just limit the power play damage.

And I just went back and looked as a refresher. Game one that the stars won that year, and they had three power play goals that game. And then they had all of two over the remaining four as Edmonton ran away with it. So to your point, when the power play dries up, it can be trouble. if that's what you're relying on. And Dallas this year, they have eight on the man advantage,

by far the most in the league, but that three at evens kind of looms large. And the irony of all, of course, was Glenn Gulletson was part of that Oilers staff last year and now the head coach here in Dallas. So things for them to sort out as it heads back to Big D for game number five. Okay, the Vegas Golden Knights and the Utah Mammoth, the first playoff game in Salt Lake.

Lake City did not disappoint. Amazingly, Elliot, just 12 shots on goal in the entire game for the mammoth, but it was enough to score four. They have a two to one series lead over the Golden Knights. They got goalied in that one. The thing is that if life were fair, Vegas wins game three. But you know what, Kyle, my parents always used to tell me when I was a kid, life's not fair. They always told you that? Yes, way too often I heard that.

I would say that's not fair. And my parents would say, you know what's not fair, Elliot? Life, life's not fair. So here we go. Look, Vamelka was really good. and Hart wasn't. Four goals on eight shots. And you're just not going to win like that.

You know, the thing, it's really interesting. Like, you brought it up, Gunther, and what Keller said about him, best release. And, you know, Utah fans have known it. Hardcore hockey fans have known it, known it. Now the world has seen it. Like, what did Tortorella say? You can't do anything about that.

And that's true. but when you have a goal-tending performance like that, unfortunately, you're going to lose a lot of games. And that's just what's happened to Vegas this year. It's been their Achilles heel all season. Now, the thing about the playoffs is it's just one game and you can forget it and you can move on and you go on to the next game.

And if you win the next couple, it doesn't matter what happened in game number three. But if you're Vegas, you've got to be concerned that the one thing that has really hurt you all year has raised its head in the middle of a really tough series. You know, it's interesting. Like Tortorella's been Captain Positive, Mr. Positive.

They changed around their power play, it looks like a bit. They called up Trevor Connolly and Brandon Bowman, and Bowman gave them really good minutes and scored for them during the year. You know, Dora Fiev, who's been a killer, particularly on the power play, has been very quiet to start. this series. The thing that you have to be really concerned about is that the Keller Smaltz Kraus line had a big game in game three, so you know they're going to be feeling it a bit. Like, you know, like I don't think you ever panic, but it's clear that, you know,

Vegas, Vegas knows they're in a real battle here. You know, the one thing I really don't like for Utah is that McBain has missed two games in a row. And clearly he's been battling something. And I just think he's such an important type of player you need in the playoffs. A big, strong center who is somebody the opponents have to deal with. And somebody who can make life difficult, especially with a strong two-way gain. I don't like that for Utah that McBain's been out and hopefully he'll be able to come back because they need them. But there's no question that Utah has Vegas thinking a bit here.

the way the Vegas lost game three was the way they kind of got in trouble all year and they're a confident group they've been there they understand what it takes to win and like Edmonton you count them out at your own peril but like it's it's been the season long nightmare and it's the worst time to rear its ugly head it's kind of thinking like you know between Vegas Elliott and Edmonton you know two teams in that division veteran teams have been at this whole playoff thing for a number of years now consecutively and both at times

in their own series have kind of struggled with the pace a bit of their opponents. I know Utah and Anaheim don't play exactly the same way, but they're both young, they're both fast, and that's really, it's been an advantage at times.

Even if you're only getting 12 shots on goal in the game, you know, Utah has done enough to overwhelm the Golden Knights at certain points should also point out another upper deck home run moved by the organization. You see that before game three on Friday night to open up to exchange the Vegas jerseys for a free Utah one? And also made sure that those Vegas jerseys that were returned were put to a good cause,

donated. So, and I don't know who the reporter was who thought to ask that, but great question. Because that only adds it. Like, it's supposed to be fun, and that is fun. But, you know, it's not like they did anything negative to those Vegas jerseys. They donated them, which is, you know what, that just adds to how good it was. Fantastic. Okay, one final one here, and it's the Battle of Pennsylvania.

So no sweep for the Flyers, the Penguins finally look a little bit more like the team that we have seen for most of the season. In game number four, Sidney Crosby makes his first real mark on the series offensively. any part of you surprised that Dan Mews went to Archer Shilovs with the season on the line? No, sometimes you just got to throw a jolt, right? You got to try something different. And especially, you know, I don't know if they see Skinner as a goalie of the future there. He might be somewhere else next year. And Shilovs is probably there, right?

Like you're not turning your net over to both H.L. goalies. There's a good chance or at least a decent chance that Shilov could be one of your goalies. So give them the game. I didn't have a big problem with that. I'll tell you this. If there's one thing I'm not looking forward to Monday is the potential Mishkov discourse. Among Flyer fans, Kyle, that's like World War I. You dig a trench on one side and you dig a trench on the other side and nobody gives an inch.

You know, the people who support Mishkov, they don't hear it any other way. And the people who are anti-Mishkov, they don't. hear it any other way. And, you know, one of the things here is that, you know, Rick Talkett has pushed a lot of the right buttons. A lot of the buttons he pushed late in the year got them in the playoffs along with some great play, obviously, by their group. And, you know, they're up three games to nothing before they lost game four. You know, the one thing I look at and I understand all the potential pitfalls here, believe me, but I just think that he has earned the right to make these calls because he's made a lot of the right calls.

And if as long as it's like the one thing I always say is it can't be punitive. It has to be with instruction. This is what you need to do better. And I have no doubt it will. It has to be handled properly and done properly. But the way Tucker is coached and the surge the flyers have had, I think he's earned the right to make the call. though I know it's going to be crazy discourse day on flyer Twitter if he is indeed a scratch.

And you know what? Other guys have sat. And I just think that sometimes it's your turn and sometimes even being a high pick can't save you. If it's your turn, it's your turn. No points in the series for Mishkov through four games. He had just over 11 minutes in game number before. I think that they may have been the most ice time you've seen of any of the four here so far in this series against the penguins. So it all was kind of trending towards this potential reality of being sat out for game number five if it in fact gets there.

It won't ease the frustration and the anger that surely all has already started, but we'll go to a different level if it in fact is the case here on Monday. Anything else there for each or are we good? I think we're good. All right. Well, with that, another edition of 32 thoughts in the books. Just two games on the schedule here Monday night. The aforementioned Flyers Penguins, game number five from Pittsburgh, 7 o'clock Eastern Time, 4 Pacific for viewers in Canada.

You can see that on Sportsnet 360. And then a little after that, 9.30. Eastern time. 630 Pacific. It is game number four, Utah Mammoth and the Vegas

Golden Knights that'll be on SportsNet and CBC from the Delta Center in Salt Lake City. Two games for

your viewing pleasure on Monday night. We will be back on Wednesday. We'll talk to you then. Music