32 Thoughts: The Podcast - IIHF Rules On Russia

Episode Date: February 28, 2022

Sports leagues and federations around the world are taking action. Jeff and Elliotte discuss the decision by the IIHF (00:01) to suspend “all Russian and Belarusian national and club teams” until further notice as well as withdrawing Russia’s hosting rights of the 2023 World Junior Championship. The guys also talk about the NHLs statement as it relates to Russia, how Russian and Ukrainian players in North America are responding to the invasion of Ukraine, and what their leagues are doing to support them (7:30).They also get to some news from around the league including the meeting that took place last week between the Coyotes and the NHLPA (13:30), what Vancouver might do as we approach the trade deadline (22:30), if the Maple Leafs should be concerned following a wild night in Detroit (26:40), a losing streak that’s caught our eye (31:10), Elliotte addressed a production complaint (33:20), and the guys take your questions to wrap things up (39:20).Plus, a surprise storytime cameo at the end of the podcast from a former NHLer (52:00). Thank you, Andrew Peters!Here is the Togiai vs Togiai brother fight that Jeff referenced in the podcast.This podcast is produced and mixed by Amil Delic, and hosted by Jeff Marek and Elliotte Friedman.Audio Credits: Cotillion Records, Sportsnet, Toronto Maple Leafs Radio Network and WSGW.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Welcome to the 32 Thoughts Podcast, Jeff Merrick alongside Elliot Friedman. This podcast was, well, this intro was originally recorded Sunday evening, but then once we got word that the IIHF was going to rule early Monday afternoon, we thought, let's hold it, provide the most current information and present it to you. And so, Elliot, that's what we're doing. The IIHF has now ruled, and I'll read it out. During an extraordinary meeting held on Monday, 28th of February, the IIHF Council evaluated the impact of the current war.

The IIHF strongly condemns the use of military force in Ukraine and urges the use of diplomatic means to solve conflict. The IIHF Council has decided to take the following actions. Suspension of all Russian and Belarusian national teams and clubs from participating in every age category and in all IIHF competitions or events until further notice and the withdrawal of the 2023 IIHF World Junior Championship hosting rights from Russia.

Your initial thoughts. This is what the international hockey world, the IHF, had to do. You look at what's happening in soccer. You look at what's happening with the Olympic committees. You take a look at what's happening around the world. And I'm sure all of these different organizations have been in contact with each other. Russia and Belarus are out. They're going to be out at least, at least until the end of the summer, I think.

That's one thing that it doesn't say specifically here. It's events until further notice. But if you look at the list of things that they talk about, they do include the World Junior Hockey Championship, which as we know is going to be in august so i think this goes through until the end of the summer look you know there was no choice we've seen some countries when it comes to soccer saying we're not playing against them and i think the u.s olympic committee and potentially even the canadian olympic committee we're going to be put into a situation where if federations were going to be told you can't compete against Russia or Belarus right now.

So this is where we are. It wasn't announced, but I think also what's happened is, you know, for example, the world championships this year in Finland were supposed to be played in Hartwall Arena. Yes. Which is in Helsinki and it's owned by one of the powerful Russian families. It wasn't said, but I believe it's going to be moved out of that arena and moved into another arena in Helsinki. So that's been done too. Another thing that wasn't put in here is

I'd heard there was some talk about whether or not Russian officials would be banned. So no Russian referees or linesmen or anything like that. So I'm curious to see where that's going to go. There's no mention about the world championships next year yet. I think we will get to that eventually, but you know, right nowussians and the country of belarus their persona non grata for obvious reasons and there was no choice but to do this you have to do this right now and uh there will be other countries that take their place uh come world championships in helsinki we believe as well this is a comprehensive ban and i think the caveat and we talked about you

know provisional suspensions the the phrase until further notice which essentially means we understand that things could change between say now and the world championships next season listen Vladimir Putin might not even be in power by then we don't know there were two things we're looking at short term and long term and right now they're going up to the 2023 World Junior Hockey Championships and saying, to your point, persona non grata, not going to do it. After that, it is based on behavior and based on what's happening with the situation. You know, what this represents in a lot of ways is a huge break

between the IIHF and Russia for the longest time. And this has been well documented. We've talked about it. Simon Semberg, former communications director with the IIHF, tweeted extensively about this last week. There used to be a really cozy relationship between the IIHF, specifically former president Rene Fussell, and Russia, specifically Vladimir Putin and his various oligarchs.

That break has now been done, Elliot, by someone who's only been in this capacity for what, five months? Luc Tardif, born in Trois-Rivières, but as president of the IIHF, representing France. This was a, I don't want to say it was a big challenge because everybody knew what the right thing to do was, but it was a huge decision by him and the IIHF. I think that's one of the things that everybody thing to do was, but it was a huge decision by him and the IIHF. I think that's one of the things that everybody was looking at was this going to be any different. As you mentioned Faisal, I mean, there's plenty of pictures of them all over the internet with Putin and other Russian officials. That's all you need to know.

And there were a lot of people who wondered if the IHF would have shown any teeth if Fizell was still in power they thought that maybe they wouldn't even get this far in terms of a punishment luckily we don't need to sit there and find out it's irrelevant it's over he's gone now you know Tardif the thing that is interesting to me is he's had two very big challenges early on. First of all, were the COVID shutdowns of two tournaments, the World Juniors and the Women's Under 18. And I thought he handled those very well. This is obviously a much bigger challenge

on a much larger scale. And he's done the right thing in the short term. We'll see where all this goes. One of the things i heard was happening was you know ukraine very courageous people they're showing it right now very courageous people yes and there's always stories that people behind the scenes hear that there's so much on social media right now you don't even know what to believe but there's so many things that aren't even on social media that people hear.

And, you know, in some of the other sports, they've been talking about getting information that isn't public yet and reading it to the people on the calls or the people who can make decisions. And it can't not affect you. There's a certain way you have to deal with this. And there's a certain way you have to handle it this and there's a certain way you have to handle it. And they did that. You know, I think we're all wondering how long is this going to go for? Will there be future sanctions? How far into the future will this go? You know, someone said to me the other day that there's more events that were being discussed with Russia than the ones that we already know about.

So all of those ones are halted right now. And that's the very latest. Russia and Belarus out until further notice. With that, we'll kick it off. Welcome to 32 Thoughts, the podcast presented by the all-new GMC AT4 Life. Okay, welcome once again to the podcast. Glad to have you aboard. And a quick couple of follow-ups from our opening segment discussing, you know, what the IIHF is doing about Russia and Belarus. The NHL has now weighed in as well, condemning Russia's invasion of Ukraine, urging a peaceful resolution as quickly as possible,

Russia's invasion of Ukraine, urging a peaceful resolution as quickly as possible, and indicating, Elliot, that the NHL is suspending their relationships with business partners in Russia, pausing Russian-language social and digital media sites, as well as discontinuing any consideration of Russia as a location for any future competitions involving the National Hockey League. Do you have a thought on this one? Not exactly a surprise. Well, number one, it's clear that, you know, I think we're all wondering if the NHL was going to say something. It's clear to me that they're winning for now, that they're for the double IHF to go first.

I mean, it's obvious by the timing. They were going to let them take the lead. The games for overseas next year don't involve Russia, so they don't have anything in the short term that they have to deal with there. The one thing that stands out in the statement is the line at the end about concern for the well-being of players from Russia. We understand they and their families are being placed in an extremely difficult position. I do think that this has been a big concern over the last 24 to 48 to 72 hours. And the teams have really

been in contact with their Russian players, asking them how they're doing. Do you need any extra help or security monitoring the things that are said to them on, on social media? Are they threatened by anything that's been said or written? And, you know, one of the things that someone said to me was, and this is something that people get reminded of all the time, but sometimes you forget, is if you're sent a link in a DM or an Instagram message or to your email, don't click on it. I mean, you never know what it's going to be, right? So they are very worried about that. There's no question about that. Panarin, who's been very vocal about his feelings in the past, he hasn't said anything yet.

And I think some people were expecting him to say something, but I understand if he doesn't want to. Nikita Zdorov came out with a very bold Instagram post. I think that's incredible of him and impressive with him. He doesn't look like he frightens too easily, but I'm always very careful of allowing that to affect my judgment of anybody else. You know, over the years, Jeff, we've both been around long enough to know and have conversations with Russian players or teams who know Russians very well that we don't understand what it's like there. We think we understand the pressures, but we don't. We talked

the other day about reaching out to players who are going to, North American players who are going to play in the KHL playoffs, which are supposed to start on Tuesday. And one of them said to me, we had 1600 people arrested the other day. I'm not going to talk. And I think there were 6,000 people arrested on Sunday. And that's the one thing I always try to remember. I think sometimes we always try to put North American thoughts and North American solutions to other parts of the world problems, and they're not comparable. And in times like this, and with some of the things I've heard over the past couple of days with teams being concerned about their players and their families, no matter what their opinions are, I remember that. You know, the other thing too is, you know, it's a small thing, but

Kuzmenko, who's a Russian player who's supposed to come over next year and there's a lot of interest in him, he was left off the Olympic team. And one of the reasons was the amount of NHL attention that was coming his way for next year. And he wouldn't be back now, obviously Jeff, that's not the same, uh, as speaking out against the invasion of Ukraine. And I'm not saying it is, but I think it shows you the level of, I don't even know if

paranoia is the right word, but the level of like that's nowhere near a big deal. And it cost him his Olympic spot. So when you're talking about something that is this, that's the Ukraine invasion and speaking out, I think it just gives you an idea of when it's on this level, what the consequences are. And there are Russian players who say to me all the time, and even North American GMs who deal with Russian players to say that we think we know, but we don't know the consequences they face. You know, I reached out over the weekend, Saturday before the show, I reached out to all three commissioners in the CHL.

So Gilles Corteau of the Q, Dave Branch of the OHL and Ron Robison of the Western Hockey League, just to ask about what you were talking about with the NHLers and providing support for Russian athletes. What are they doing for Ukrainian athletes as well? I mean, these are kids. I mean, the CHL is essentially 16 to 20 here, and these players have come from overseas to play. And the message back from all three commissioners was pretty similar, if not identical, and that's, you know,

they are providing import players with mental health support additional security where it's required and also working with the billet families on all of this as well whether it's security whether it's mental health whether it's support as well there's a lot of certainly more russian players and ukrainian players across the chl and they're going through what they're going through right now as well. And much like the NHL is providing support, just want to get out there that the Canadian Hockey League is doing the same for their players as well.

There are still questions that I have. Will these players come back to the three leagues in the CHL after the summer? Don't know the answer to that. The CHL import draft comes? Don't know the answer to that. You know, the CHL import draft, you know, comes up in a few months. Will the CHL not allow teams to draft players from Russia or Belarus? Don't know the answer to that one. So still a lot of questions here at a lot of different levels as to what happens to Russian and Belarusian hockey players in North America. Okay, Elliot, as you reported on Saturday,

the Arizona Coyotes and the NHL Players Association meeting, what was it? Was it last weekend, last week? it was a week ago saturday so this is dropping on monday it'll be nine days ago and the nature of the discussion um as you mentioned was to update the players on what the plan was as this team transitions from the gila river arena to asu what more can you tell us? You know, the one thing people told me about it was, like, I heard about it probably on Friday, and I made a couple of calls, and I got some really interesting reactions to it.

Like, some people said to me, you know, it was a really blunt meeting. And what another player on the team told me was some of those players in Arizona, they were talking to other players in the league and the other players were like, ask this question and ask this question. And, you know, I think some agents were kind of wondering, you know, ask this question and ask this question.

Because one of the things I didn't really talk about on Saturday night, because we just don't have the time, is I think there were players who asked questions like, how did we get here? Like, why is this happening? You know, why is there the possibility of playing in a 5,000 seat arena next year? One of the players who I know who's really angry, he gave some credit to Javier Gutierrez, the president and CEO of the Coyotes, because he said he stood in there in front of what was really a hostile audience in some ways. He didn't duck any questions. He tried to answer the best he could.

But as another player said, and Matthew Schneider kind of confirmed to me, they don't really have a lot of answers. I guess they said they're hoping to get clarity on the arena in the next 60 days. And it sounds like it'll be at a, sounds like, it's not guaranteed it'll be the city council meeting in April. Nobody really knows what the answer is if there isn't an arena long-term. So it's not like Gutierrez can give them all of the answers, Jeff. But I think they asked a lot of questions. Basically, why did this have to happen? And then how is it going to work?

And why were we so in the dark? Like one player said to me that they you know there had been some rumors about arizona state but how come they found out in the media like for example when craig morgan broke the story it seemed to be a lot more certain than they'd all been led to believe and so they just felt that they deserve to know more and they wanted to know more and as i report on saturday night matthew schneider told them look if the players don't feel that they're being told everything whether you get a new arena or not you're going to have the reputation as an organization that you know doesn't tell the truth and i heard that you know gutierrez got the message you know

one of the things that bill armstrong the g, is doing, and I think this is a smart play, is now he's trying to go out and get players with term. He traded for Nick Ritchie. They know that they're going to have Nick Ritchie next year under contract. They just signed Dyson Mayo to an extension. So I think now that's seven under contract, but one of them is Chikrin, who's likely going to be traded. So I think that all of this is a concern, Jeff. I think, you know, one of the things that kind of came up was how are practices going to work?

Are they going to dress at that arena and be transported to the ice stand for practices. I mean, all of these things kind of came up and, you know, it's tough on those players. And I think one of the biggest challenges they're going to have is, I mean, they're going through a rebuild, but are they going to have a difficult time finding players to play for them? Are players who are on the roster going to say, look, I really don't want to do this?

The other thing too is there's still got to be a negotiation, I think, between the league and the Players Association over what happens if revenues go down and what does that mean and where do we go from there? Are the Players Association going to be protected from revenues decreasing at all if they do? It's really a challenging situation and it sounds like it was a really blunt meeting and the players let their concerns be known. I was interested in what you had to say on Saturday and I talked to a couple of different agents on Sunday and just sort of asked, you know, informally, you know, would you dissuade any of your clients from signing in Arizona? And a couple of said, yes, it wouldn't be our first choice. We'd have a hard

time advising our clients. But there was one agent that I spoke to who has some very high profile athletes who said, no, it's still an NHL job. At the end of the day, this is still an NHL job and an NHL contract. From your discussions with various agents, does there seem to be a consensus? Because for me, it was mostly, yeah, I would dissuade my guys, except for one agent who said, not a chance, still an NHL gig. I've asked that question a lot too. I think it depends on the client and their situation. One of the things that came up, I don't know if it came up in this meeting, but I did have someone say it to me, Jeff.

And that is that you make the NHL to play in big arenas. And, you know, sometimes arenas don't have a lot of capacity, you know, or for whatever reason. But generally the facilities are good and it's a big league feel, right? That won't be the case. And there will be some players who say, you know what? I don't want any part of that. But there's going to be some players who maybe they're coming off a bad year. See, that's the one thing that I think if you're Arizona,

you're going to have to pitch players on, Hey, you know, you just had a tough year. You need somewhere to play. Maybe under the microscope, come here. You're going to be under the microscope.

You get a chance to put your career back together. Do you like tourney as a coach? Uh, from what I've seen? Absolutely. I mean, again, that's based on his experiences in junior and how he handles junior kids.

But that was, that's some of the best junior coaching I've ever seen. I've tried to watch them as much as I can this year because I knew there were going to be a lot of players who were available and Chikrin, obviously. I think they play pretty hard. You might be able to sell a player or two on, hey, you had a really rough year last year, come here in a quiet situation and maybe restart your career a bit. That, I think, will appeal to a couple of guys.

But the other thing that's going to happen is, Jeff, there's going to be players out there who need work next year. And Arizona's going to need to hit the floor. They're going to find situations where, I talked about this, I think, with Ottawa a couple years ago, when the Philadelphia 76ers were a really awful team they took JJ Redick who was a pretty good NBA player and they signed him to a

one-year deal worth I think 22 million dollars because they had to get to the floor so there's going to be players in the NHL who might get you know a one-year deal at decent money to play for Arizona and there's going to be players who take it. You may not get the first choice of players, but you're going to get players. And that's where you have to take advantage to what Schnatter said to Gutierrez there, is you're going to get these players who come in for a year.

Can you do everything aside from giving the players the best facility to say you know what there's something good here about that organization that's your challenge you know what i also wonder about for each what's that college free agents because if you're the arizona coyotes as part of the package you can present to them is you start your career in the nhl yep and there's no one you have to jump over you want to play in the nhl. Yep. And there's no one you have to jump over. You want to play in the NHL? Here it is. Like I can see the Arizona Coyotes aggressively

pursuing college free agents. Why wouldn't you? And that would be one of their advantages. I think one of the questions is going to become, and we don't know yet. I haven't heard from any of the camps, but whether it's, you know, someone like Shane Wright this year,

Connor Bedard or Matvey Mishkov or Adam Fantilli next year, what happens if a draft pick says, I don't want to go there or I'm not going to go there? I don't know. You cross that bridge when you come to it. Well, there's a draft coming up

in July, so that bridge is coming up as well. Okay, yep okay i want to take you on a little bit of a trip here at this point in the podcast is this a vacation does it involve sun and a beach and no water but it does it does involve you closing your eyes okay i'm closing my eyes just opening yourself to the possibilities okay okay Okay. Okay. Right now, if you were a bubble team in the NHL, we're a few points out of a playoff spot right now, and you looked at your schedule, okay,

and you saw the New Jersey Devils, the New York Islanders, Maple Leafs, Montreal, Washington, Tampa, the Devils, the Red Wings, the Flames, and the Buffalo Sabres as your schedule leading up the trade deadline. And then after trade deadline, you saw an almost immediate and steady diet of Colorado, Minnesota, a couple against St. Louis, the Dallas Stars, three games against the Vegas Golden Knights. Would you say to that team, you have some bigger decisions than you think? Talking about the Vancouver Canucks, because their schedule leading into trade, right now, they just beat the Rangers, okay,

on this Sunday as we record this podcast. Yep. They just beat the Rangers, so they're three points out of the second wildcard spot, which is being held by the Dallas Stars right now. And their schedule leading up until trade deadline, I mean, there's a couple of real tough games in there, but it's lighter than what happens after trade deadline. So the Vancouver Canucks could find themselves

in a playoff position, but then look at their schedule after trade deadline and say, I don't know about this. All I'm saying is Vancouver's got some interesting decisions we all know right now with their players. I'm starting to get the feeling too that a lot of this is going to be complicated by the schedule.

And if they keep winning hockey games when the schedule is light, knowing full well that post deadline, that schedule is getting tougher. Here's the other thing too. And you mentioned the ownership in Vancouver and people go crazy about ownership interfering too much. And that's not what I'm saying here, but I think it's very real. If you knew you could get a couple of a hundred percent playoff dates, considering all the money these teams have lost, is that part of the motivation too?

If you knew that your games might be better attended down the stretch because you're in a race after all the losses these teams have gotten. I get it. You're familiar with the term penny wise and pound foolish. They're the people with the most skin in the game, right? They're the people who've carried the losses. And I know sometimes people get driven crazy when I say this. To me, it's just like any business owner.

Some business owners, whether you're large businesses or small businesses, have been absolutely crushed over the last two years. And Canadian hockey team owners have been crushed more than other owners in the league because of this year in particular. At the end of the day, I think if Jim Rutherford comes forward and says, we need to do this to make our team better, he probably does it. You know, we've talked about Vancouver so much. And to be honest, I don't know how much I want to talk about them anymore. Like we've really spent a lot of time talking about them.

When Jim Rutherford comes out and says, I want to create cap flexibility. I think he's telling the truth. That's why all these names are out there because they're testing all their value. But if you're in the race, I understand being in the race, especially now in Canada. I know that there's Canuck fatigue when it comes to talking about a hockey team right now in and around trade deadline time.

I just wanted to throw that other wrinkle in there to keep it in the back of people's minds as well. And there's the face off in a hurry. Usually there's a lot more preamble. Leafs taking on the Detroit Red Wings. The Red Wings ran the Leafs show early in their last meeting in Detroit. And then the Leafs scored like a billion unanswered goals. That's the unofficial number. Let's dovetail that with a conversation about what we saw on Saturday night.

Saturday night was time machine. Saturday night was, let's go back to 1982 or 1985. Nylander scores. What a rocket up top. And William Nylander. let's go back to 1982 or 1985. And he is the rookie point leader now with 40. A Mikheyev shot scores! David Kemp was in front of the net. I'm not sure if he touched it or not, but a wrist shot from Mikheyev, and it's 3-1. Dropped off here, Matthews to work with Marner. Mitch Marner scores! Surprise grace with that rip.

And the Leafs have a 4-1 lead buck along the boards 10 46 left to play in the period here's marner scores a natural hat trick for the magician and the maple leafs are in a route here six to one drops it back to the line for brody sizes Sizes it up. Fires. Scores. Austin Matthews is the goal scoring leader. Now here's a shot from the line by Roenick again. Redirected in front. Two quick ones for Detroit. And the Red Wings get their fourth of the hockey game. Here is Sider. Scores. It's a one goal game. Well you talk about your mental makeup.

If you're Peter Morazic, you've watched. Had the center to Raymond. Up across the line. Moves in. Shoots the puck. Scores! Peter Morazic shaking his head. That one bounced off of him and into the net.

He'd like to have that one back, but it's now a one goal game again. Crowd celebrates. Toronto 8 and the Red Wings 7. Pass intercepted. Bunting breakaway in. In on goal. Leaves it for Marner, who scores! A four-goal

night for Mitch Marner. Like the Bunting and Austin Matthews, they were the top line in this one. Throwback night. 10-7 the final. 10-7. The Toronto Maple Leafs defeat the Detroit Red Wings in a game ripped out of the pages of the 80s.

And my question to you is, can we read anything into it? In terms of what? In terms of how we evaluate players, I'm trying to nudge you towards the goalie conversation. So we mentioned in the second intermission, our 32 thoughts segment, I don't believe that Toronto will hold Muzzin out to the playoffs if the option is there to bring him back.

Look, number one is his health. He's going to be out for a while. They know he's going to be out for a while, and they have a few more weeks here before the deadline to figure out what his situation truly is. But after point number one, which is making sure he gets the proper care, point number two is if he can come back,

they're not going to hold him out. I just don't think they believe it's a good idea. I think they feel that Muzzin will need to play if he can play before the playoffs begin. So for that reason, instead of using LTIR and having $7 million of cap room, I think they're operating under the idea that they're going to have $2 million of cap room, I think they're operating under the idea that they're going to have $2 million of cap room.

Now, I still think they could try to move players out. Other defensemen, you know, Holland Dermott have kind of been there all year. But I do think they're going to target a defenseman. I just don't think they feel that they can start going all the way around their lineup. You know, forward, defense defenseman and goalie. I think they're going to go with what they've gotten goal and hope that one

of them figures it out. I could always be wrong and I would always be surprised, but I don't believe the plan is to go for a goalie. I want to get a quick thought on Vegas. Then I want to get into some emails, a phone call or two from the thought line and a cameo. Someone's straightening out one of our stories about brothers fighting. Hold onto that one. to get into some emails, a phone call or two from the thought line and a cameo. Someone's straightening out one of our stories about brothers fighting.

Hold on to that one. It's going to be a good one. So promises our producer, Ramil Delic. Don't look now, but the Vegas Golden Knights have lost five of their last six. This is all without Mark Stone. Do we say this is growing pains of trying to fit Jack Eichel into the lineup here and he

hasn't played in 11 months? Or is there a real chance that the Vegas Knights as Calgary ascends and the Los Angeles Kings who are playing great hockey right now continue to ascend that Vegas might just fall out of this thing? Like I still think they're going to be okay. I refuse to believe that they're not going to be able to make it unless they're so badly injured that they just fall apart. I still really like them and I think they're going to be okay. I refuse to believe that they're not going to be able to make it unless they're so badly injured that they just fall apart. I still really like them and I think they're going to be okay. You know, the one team I think, even though they didn't gain a lot of points, they got only two out of six points out of Tampa, Florida, and Carolina. I thought there was a lot of good from Edmonton there.

That's a tough trip. That's a tough trip, man. It's a really tough trip. And I think the Oilers, and they're still on it, they still go to Philadelphia. And we don't know what the situation with Ryan Nugent Hopkins is. As of Saturday and Sunday, they hadn't gotten the imaging necessary to figure it out. But I thought that was a really good swing for Edmonton and a good omen for them. I just have to think that Vegas is going to be okay, but I do admit I'm a little more worried about them than I thought I was going to be. Dallas is back in it. As you said, Vancouver's

maneuvered close. I generally haven't liked the way that Anaheim is going. The math is starting to really go up against them, but they're still there. I just think Vegas is too good to fall out. Like even though they lost a couple of games to Colorado, I thought they played really hard. If you play hard, but lose kind of like Edmonton did, we were just talking about, I think you're okay.

They haven't fallen apart yet. And that's what I'm worried about. Does a team look like it's falling apart? Vegas doesn't look that way to me. We'll hit pause. Come back with a couple of voicemails, some emails, and a cameo from one of our favorite tough guys. 32 Thoughts continues.

Welcome back to the podcast. Going to get to a couple of your phone calls here at 1-833-311-3232 and emails at 32thoughts at sportsnet.ca. But Elliot, before we get to this part of the evening, do you have anything else to add to the pod today? I would like to talk about bald spots. Okay, proceed. The floor is yours okay so i do want to talk about this because basically the way saturday night works is that circular table is only used really for the first game yeah and i'm not on the first game panel unless somebody else is missing and this week kelly rudy couldn't be

there so i'm on the first game panel. And then they put us around that table. And, you know, there have been times this year where my bald spot has been shown. And all of you send it on Twitter. They're like, Elliot, this is not a very flattering angle of you. And I just laugh. I don't really care.

The producer, Brian Spear, had once actually asked me, it was actually recently, about a month ago, he said, does it bother you that your bald spot gets shown? Like we can move you. And I said, no, I don't care. I said, what's my wife going to do? Leave me? I'm not going to let her. Like I'll lock her in the basement. She's not allowed to leave me. And so I have no one to impress and I really don't care. I'm not self-conscious about it at all. I had a great head of hair for 40 years. I'm 51 now. It happens. They said, okay. Cause they liked the look of some of the other shots and they said,

no problem. Well, again, uh, two weeks ago, there was a lot of bald spots showing and social media got my pictures of the bald spot and an external viewer registered a complaint, Jeff. What? Yes. It's someone that we both know. It's PJ Stock. He called me. Count Stockula sent something in? No, no. He called. So first of all, we were talking.

Well, first of all, he did a great job as part of the hockey show. It was awesome. On the Olympics with Hanurayan Singh and Haley Salvian. But he called me. Did you see the return of the puck wall? I did. I got a good laugh out of that. So awesome.

But PJ said that bald spot has to bother you. I said, nah, I don't care. And he goes, he got like mad at me. He was like, what do you mean you don't care? I said, PJ, I don't care. Like PJ was the guy, was one of the, when he first met Steph, he said to me, does she have like problem with her vision

that she's married to you so pj was one of the you know the worst offenders when it came to mocking my appearance so i said you know pj working with people like you it's giving me a really thick skin it doesn't bother me and he said well it bothers me like i don't like looking at it so he called brian spear the producer of the the hockey den canada saturday night studio lead producer and he said like you can't put elliot on tv last night and brian said what i told him which is elliot doesn't care and he goes i care and he said that it's distracting to the viewer you can't do that what because the viewer is looking at that. So Brian caved in and moved me.

No. Yeah. I said, Brian, I don't care. And he goes, PJ has a point. It's distracting to the viewer. And I'm like, okay. Like, you know, like, you know me, like I'll fight about some things, Jeff. I will, but I'm not going to fight about that. But I just want, I wanted every, I am vain enough to let everybody know that I did not ask for this.

I was okay with my bald spot being exposed to people. A couple of things. One, I mean, I'm extremely good looking Elliot. That can be really distracting on the set, but Brian allows me on. So I'm shocked that he would have made that decision with you.

And two, at what point, like my hair is starting to creep a little bit and I don't know what the point, I've had the conversation with myself. You know, what point do you say to yourself, okay, when it hits this point, it's all got to go. Have you had that combo with yourself yet? Well, I would like to shave my hair. I've done it before.

I would like to shave it. Steph doesn't ask me for a lot, really. I think to be married to me, you have to have low expectations and she does have low expectations, but she has asked me not to do that. So I'm like, fine. I would shave my head if I could.

I would actually shave my head and go big beard, but she's like, no. That's a good look. That is a good look. No, you're not doing that. Do you know that I have a PJ Stock vasectomy story? No, I don't, but I'm suddenly very curious.

So this was back when I was doing Hockey Night in Canada radio. I have to say, I was not expecting that. Well, I was not expecting a story about bald spots, but here we are, Elliot, on a Sunday night recording a podcast. So this is when I was doing Hockey Night in Canada radio and pj had just been hired by hockey night in canada and he was booked on the show and it was the first time he had appeared and had a nice conversation like half an hour talked mainly i think about montreal canadians because he was doing uh montreal radio at that point but like every couple of seconds like i could hear him like grunting and groaning

almost like he was in pain like as he was talking and so i finished the radio show and i'm about to go home and i give pj a call i'm like peach like thanks for coming on man but what was all that about and he goes oh dude i totally forgot when I booked on with your show, I forgot that that was 20 minutes after I just had a vasectomy and I was driving home. And if you know anything about Montreal, it's pothole heaven. He goes, I was driving home and I got a bag of frozen peas on the place on me that is most a man. And I keep hitting these potholes and it kills as I'm trying to have a conversation with you about the montreal canadians that is my pj stock vasectomy story oh my god that's so good and the best part of it is he's not on here to defend himself so this story is going out there without him to say anything

about it awesome love it all right let's get to a couple of phone calls here and a couple of emails. You can always leave voicemails for us at 1-833-311-3232. The email is 32thoughts at sportsnet.ca. We will start in Washington State and say hello to Madison. and I'm from Washington State. I was catching up on the Jeff Merrick show, and you guys were talking about how you can make overtime more interesting. And I was thinking of what if you had a shot clock for overtime? I think that if we recreated the NHL, it would be so fun to have no shootouts or maybe a shootout after 10 minutes of overtime, but have a shot clock where if your team has the puck for too long and are just cycling it, you have to get a shot off or else, you know, the face off maybe comes back to center ice. Thought that that would be super fun.

All right. Thanks. Bye. First of all, Madison has excellent taste and we, uh, taste in podcasts and audio shows. So thank you for that,

Madison. Um, okay. So the overtime question is an interesting one because when overtime is at its best, it's five minutes of sprints. Yeah. When overtime's at its worst,

it's five minutes of neutral zone regroups. So how do we get it from neutral zone regroups to five minutes of sprints? I mean, I guess one of the ways that people have noted before, which is pretty creative, is get rid of the coaches. And since that's not going to happen,

what do we do, Elliot? What do you think of Madison's idea of a shot clock? I brian brick mentioned that a couple times too i don't have a problem with it i don't know if i want to see a face-off though if a shot's not taken you go to a face-off that's the one thing i don't mind the idea of a shot clock but i don't know if i want it to be a face-off the question then becomes where do you surrender the object of play do you dump it down like do you have the option just to fire it at the net or dump it down or do you have to just get your stick away from it and the other team plays it where it lies i don't know like i'm not against it either anything that encourages more sprints in the overtime i'm all about that that's when overtime's at its best i don't know if i want a 10 minute

overtime because i think it will make people even more cautious the reason that some of those overtimes in the olymp Olympics were so good is because those are sudden death, right? Yeah. So you have to try to win it. You know, I think in the regular season, I'm not sure that teams would do that. I think they'd become even more cautious. So I am willing to listen to the idea of a shot clock, but what I want more of is,

is if you don't get the shot off in time what happens i don't want another face off because i think teams would take that i think they if they're not in a good spot they just eat it and face off and i'm not even sure if a face off in your zone for letting the shot clock go off is a good enough penalty maybe you just have to surrender the puck where it lies and therefore your best option right when time is expiring is just to shoot it down the ice. And ice it. And give the other team, yeah, get center ice

so it's not icing, but get center and then shoot it down the ice so the other team doesn't get favorable position. One of the reasons teams hate three-on-three in the shootout to begin with is that it determines playoff positions in a situation that's not really hockey, right? It's got no relevance to the way the game is played in the postseason. So if you're going to do this, you might as well really go off the deep end.

Two pucks. No, not two pucks. I don't know. Maybe that's the answer that the buzzer goes off and the referee of the linesman blows the whistle and the player has to leave it right there. And if you touch it, it's a penalty. And if you blast it down the ice after, it's a delay of game.

Yeah. You know what I would like to see? I wish there was somewhere we could take this and say, you're going to try this. I do. I talk about this all the time. Summer R&D camps. No, no, no.

It's got to be somewhere meaningful. It's got to be like an AHL game or something like that. That's a little too guinea piggy for me for the American Hockey League, but I think somewhere it needs to happen. But that's why I like the R&D camp idea. Like it's harmless. It doesn't really mean anything. What if you had a weekend of a year where maybe, I don't know,

like I realize people are going to listen to this and say, this is the stupidest conversation ever, but. We just talked about PJ stock turning the tap off. Come on. How much dumber can it be than that? That's actually funny. And he can't defend himself here. So that makes it even funnier.

You know, you could almost have a made for television event every year with good players. Oh yeah. And I don't even know if it's in the maybe it is in the summer maybe this is where you try all these things position as the the 32 thoughts r&d camp and we'll put the whole thing together try goofy ideas for the weekend every game has different ideas different equipment different rules different configurations of the ice who knows so the truth is madison i like your idea i just want to know how we what's the penalty for it is it delay of game i don't like just a face-off down in your end that doesn't do it for me is it you have to leave the puck where it lies and back up and if you shoot it it's delay a game

if you have two shot clock violations in an overtime, do you get one warning and then delay of game? Yeah, I don't know. All good, Grist from the Mill. Madison, thanks for the call on that one. An email from Patrick. Had a question that came to mind while hearing

about Michael Bunting and his penalty drawing prowess this year. If a delayed penalty occurs, but a goal is then scored to nullify the call, does this still count as a drawn penalty? I haven't been able to find an answer with my own research. I don't think it does. No, I don't think it does

because you actually have to have a penalty for a drawn penalty. Yeah, because the player who got a set doesn't get the penalty minutes assessed. So how are you going to give it to the guy that drew it? So yes, the answer there, I believe, I believe would be no. Here's an interesting one. I love that we get these emails consistently.

This shows creative thinking. And bonus, bonus, if it annoys Elliot. From John, I'm a massive fan of the podcast. I find the pod my go-to background listen when I'm doing my morning lifts. Excellent idea. Nothing gets me more engaged to get up to work out at 6 a.m. quite like the latest trade insights or one of Jeff's CHL anecdotes. Always a great listen.

Thank you, sir. When Nick Suzuki scored on a penalty shot against Buffalo the other night, it made me think, why is that goal unassisted? Sure, Zooks had a great finish in alone, but let's give Kulak some credit for tipping the puck up to him so Cousins had to take a penalty bringing Suzuki down. Would you guys support awarding assists on penalty shot goals if a player feeds the puck to the teammate right before they're brought down

obviously this would be ridiculous for penalties that lead to power plays but isn't the idea supposed to be that penalty shots stimulate the immediate scoring chance if so let's give an assist to the one that gets them the break assists penalty shots, Elliott. I have supported this in the past. Hang on, I've never heard this one before. I will say this. This came out of minor hockey. We had a guy, and I don't want to say his name. I actually still do remember his name.

In minor hockey, you always play with these kids who have 80 goals and three assists a year, right? We had one kid kid and he was, obviously he was the best nine-year-old I ever saw. He was on my team. It was the first time I ever saw a box defense against us. The other team, they had one guy take the face off and the other four guys lined up in a box,

basically in their zone. Like we were dropping the puck at center ice and they lined up in a box in their zone to make it hard for him to skate through everybody there. It was crazy. This is nine-year-old hockey in 1979. Like that's how bananas it was. And there was one game where he gave the puck to someone and they got tripped and got a penalty shot and they scored and he found he didn't get an assist. He got really angry. The kid was nine. It was so crazy. And I actually agreed with him. I said, he made the play that sprung him for the penalty shot. Why shouldn't

he get credit for it? One of our old bosses, Scott Moore, always used to say, I never want to hear as an answer, this is the way we've always done something because he thought that was the worst answer. And I really do agree with him. It's true. But in this case, this is the way we've always done something. And I really don't have a good answer for why it should be, should or shouldn't be changed. But I would generally tend to agree. If you make a great play, you the reward great question john uh enjoy your morning lifts uh from adam when someone scores a multi-goal game as in a four-goal game we'll often see a picture of the player holding four pucks in the locker room after the game but in reality i

assume the first second and maybe even the third goal pucks were just used in the ensuing face-off and not grabbed by a teammate as a keepsake. I've often found it kind of weird that these, quote, at the time not so special pucks were saved, but maybe, I don't know, does the NHL change pucks after every goal? First of all, they don't change pucks after every goal, but they do change pucks all throughout the game as much as they can,

as I'm told, without disrupting the flow of the game. And they do keep them refrigerated, as we all know. But all throughout the game, pucks are always getting replaced as long as it doesn't interrupt anything. So it's not an automatic that right after a goal, you're going to replace a puck. But the puck does get refreshed consistently and then the other question becomes what happens to the puck that just got replaced does it get reused and the answer is no reused pucks are taken out of the game

completely and that's because sometimes they get beaten up a little bit, nicked a little bit, and they always want to keep the sort of consistency and integrity of the puck intact for the entire game. But to the point about where do the other pucks come from? Are they really goal number one, two, three, or, well, really one, two, or three? The answer is no.

Those are just random pucks. They're just prop pucks more than anything else. You have anything to add to the puck phenomenon? way to ruin it jeff oh okay yes every puck is saved just in case it's special you know what's gonna happen now because you just did this and this pot is so hugely influential oh yeah you're going to have people every time someone has a four goal game now like marner did the other night they're gonna be holding up four pucks, and there's going to be people tweeting at the Maple Leafs or Marner,

those are three fake pucks and one real one. Or they might be two fake and two real, because they probably get the hat-trick puck. Yeah, they'll get the hat-trick puck. But goals one and two? Yeah, no chance. Some poor social media interns' mansions are going to be destroyed because you did this.

I'm just here to make kids cry try i mean i'm just here to make kids cry man i'm just here to make kids cry and ruin some dreams along the way uh dennis and georgetown i've heard guys like mason mctavish and cole perfetti might not play at the world juniors in august because of their nhl commitments can't they use the world juniors to prepare for the nhl season do you have a thought on that one for each? I think that is likely true. I just don't think a lot of those players are going to be able to do it because it's going to be right before their NHL training camps.

And I don't think the NHL teams will want them to get injured right before they're play that kind of high level hockey right there. I think there could be some exceptions, but I generally feel that most of them will not play. And I think the other thing too, is like for a guy like Owen Power, I think there's a decent chance that Owen Power is going to be playing

for the Buffalo Sabres in April. I think there's a very good chance after the Frozen Four, he's going to be playing for them. So I'm sure the Sabres will want him, especially after this year where he played for Michigan. He is likely going to play for the NHL team. He played at the Olympics and he even was at the aborted world juniors. They're going to want him to take the summer off.

Yeah, I can see that as well. Okay. Thanks for the emails and the phone call there. I want to end on a cameo, a cameo from Andrew Peters. You go on Andrew's show every week. With Craig Reve, yep.

Yep. And a few weeks ago, we talked about the phenomenon of brothers fighting one another. Now, it hasn't happened very often in the game, but every now and then it does. And someone by the name of MA at hockey underscore guy, underscore four sent me a DM of a great brother scrap. It is the, uh, the togi brothers, uh, Justin and John. Now we've seen brothers fight before, but it's not really, you know, stretch

out and really throw. It's more just, let's just get in not really, you know, stretch out and really throw. It's more just, let's just get in tight and, you know, seatbelt one another. And then someone falls down and we'll call it a fight. But this Togiai, just go to YouTube and look up Togiai versus Togiai. It is legendary. And also next month, there is a police versus fire charity hockey game coming up. Did you ever watch Rescue Me with Dennis? Of course.

Yeah. Dennis Leary. Dennis Leary. I call him Dennis Lynch. Dennis Leary. Those games are part of the show and they were always gong shows. Well, the interesting part of it is police versus fire in this one. The brothers are playing against each other.

Justin is in law enforcement and John is a firefighter oh my goodness looking forward to that one thanks for the dm as part of our conversation about brothers fighting against one another elliot maybe you want to refresh this story or just leave it and let andrew fill in the blanks you talked about andrew peters fighting his brother once upon a time. Let's let Andrew tell the story. Here it is. Andrew Peters on 32 Thoughts, the podcast. Listen up. This story contains some fruitful language.

So it was in Rochester, 2001-2002 season, closer to the end of the year. Jeff was playing for the Norfolk Admirals, and I was just finishing up my first year pro in Rochester and having a very mediocre slash below average season. And Jeff was rolling into town, and everyone always knew that my brother and I had a competitive beef with each other. Great relationship, but always very competitive. I'm the younger brother so you know guys were always joking like gonna fight your brother you're gonna fight your brother i'm not gonna lie to you i i had obviously put some thought into my head about fighting my brother right because listen i'll be quite honest with you i mean anyone that knows me or at least knew

me back then you know it's easier to say now If someone had said to me back then, you're such an attention seeker, I probably would have gotten so upset and defensive about it. But the truth of the matter is that I was totally an attention seeker. But obviously, opportunity has to present itself, right? So it was the first period, we're on the ice together. And I knew I was on the ice with them. I can't remember if it was the start of a face-off or not but it was in our own end so this is this just goes to show you how hungry i was to hunt him down he's a centerman so he's behind our net battling with our defenseman for the puck i'm a left winger and i end up behind our own net right against my brother and there's a pushing and shoving match going on and and um

you know i know that aaron downey who was a tough guy in the league at the time was also on the ice i started giving it to my brother a little bit i knew it was jeff that i was wrestling with at the time there's a great picture of it too he's leaning back and just planting an elbow right in my face okay like a legitimate elbow penalty and um we start you know shoving back and forth and we i dropped my gloves i dropped my gloves first for sure and i grabbed him and you know it didn't really seem like much and uh you know there's like some grappling and some pulling and pushing or whatever and all of a sudden we end up against the glass and he just hauls off and hits me with about three fast jabs

right in the mouth i mean and he hit me as hard as he could you know so i start throwing a couple punches back and we fall to the ground now the story goes that you know i came off and i was like i had no idea it was my brother my helmet was over my eyes you know and i'll admit to you guys that uh you know i definitely knew i definitely knew it was my brother you know and it wasn't really much of a fight we got five minutes for fighting and all i can remember is someone telling me after the period that the arena was playing the song, We are family. All right?

So that's going on over the PA. Now, granted, you don't know that when you're fighting. You can't hear anything. But Jeff and I, it was the end of a period, so we get sent to the locker room because there was probably like three minutes left to go on the period. And my brother, I'm going down to his locker room and I'm like, Jeff, Jeff, I'm sorry. I didn't know. I didn't know.

And he's like, get the fuck out of my locker room. You fucking piece of shit. That's fucking gutless what you did. That's embarrassing. And he's just giving it to me. And now I'm like, I'm super sensitive. And I'm just sitting there thinking to myself, oh, my God, my brother is so mad. My mom and dad are here.

We had so many family and friends in the stands that night because Jeff was in the Western Conference in the AHL. So he never really made it this far east that often. He was only here once a year in Rochester. And we grew up in St. Catherine. So it's like two and a half hours away or two hours away or whatever and so we had a lot of people there and my mom and dad were so pissed at me after the game it was like i just remember i came out my mom

didn't want to say anything to me no my dad was furious because they know what i'm all about jeff is very serious. Jeff would never go and try and do something like this where I'm more of like a publicity type guy. You know what I mean? I'm like, give me the headline. You know what I mean? And it made some headlines, you know what I mean? I know it caught the, it ended up in the hockey news, which at the time was the Bible. And, um, we still laugh about it to this day, but I definitely knew it was him. I think I sought him out intentionally, and it was fun to talk about at the time. But I think the further you move on from it, you're just kind of like, oh, it's kind of embarrassing.

But that's not nearly any of the most embarrassing stuff I've done. But it's right there. It's right there. That's a great story.