32 Thoughts: The Podcast - Playing With House Money

Episode Date: June 10, 2026

In this edition of 32 Thoughts, Kyle Bukauskas and Elliotte Friedman react to the Carolina Hurricanes tying the Stanley Cup Final Series 2-2 against Vegas. They get to the news where Mike Babcock is reportedly in line to take the Edmonton Oilers' head coaching job (23:32). Elliotte touches on the Leafs open coaching vacancy (42:21) before talking about top free agent Alex Tuch (43:00). The guys also talk about the latest developments in Detroit around Dylan Larkin (46:11). The fellas talk about Mike McCarron's contract extension (52:40). The Final Thought focuses on the top prospects that were present at Game 4 (54:57).  Kyle and Elliotte answer your questions and comments in the Thought Line presented by BetMGM (1:00:40). Listen to all the 32 Thoughts music here. Email the podcast at [e-mail] or call the Thought Line at 1-833-311-3232 and leave us a voicemail. This podcast was produced and mixed by Cristian Ceniti and hosted by Elliotte Friedman & Kyle Bukauskas. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates

Did you just do an Insta story of me? I did it before we started recording. What is this? It's just a photo of a microphone and you getting ready in the background. Oh, okay. I thought somebody just texted a nice Insta story and I'm like, what are you talking about? Yeah, I like sneaking the quick ones on you. That's all I got going for me.

Freach cam. That's what the people want. Welcome to 32 Thoughts, the podcast, presented by your Canadian Toyota dealers and the 2026 Tacoma. It's time to Toyota. Dom, Elliot and Kyle with you once again on this Wednesday morning. And the Stanley Cup final is all square, two games apiece. Five to three, the Hurricanes win game four.

So this one was a real blowout, Elliot, when you look at every other game in this series. But another game where an early two-goal lead means nothing. Brandon Bussie, Elliott, gets the coach. all first Stanley Cup playoffs start, first Stanley Cup final start. And this, it's clear now, is going to be a series where say percentage, goals against, be damned. The only stats for goalies that matter are the Ws. And that was what was next to Bussie's name by Knight's End. He delivers a win, made the saves enough of them when Carolina needed.

And they go back home with the win in Vegas that they were looking for. I apologize for what I'm about to say, Hurricanes fans, but when the Golden Knights made it two to one, I was convinced they were going to win. Carolina had the two early goals, but I hated that power play. Vegas could have scored three times short-handed, and even though they were being outshot,

they just seemed so dangerous to me. even when it was 3 to 1, I was still thinking Vegas is going to win this. And then McNabb was just a bit late, a bit late, at the buzzer, and when they tied it,

I still thought they were going to win it. So on Saturday, in game 3, Kyle, I don't know about you, but when the hurricanes came storming back from that 4-0 deficit, it to tie, I think all the Knights fans, whether they admitted or not in the building, thought they were going to lose.

They were nervous. They were scared. Carolina was the better team in the first overtime. And when they got out of it with the victory, they erupted. That was as much relief as it was jubilation. This time, it was the Knights doing the chasing. and I really believed everyone in this building thought that Vegas was going to win. And they were shocked that they didn't.

Thanks for an incredible play by Jordan Stahl. So we're flying to Raleigh on Wednesday. Game 5 is on Thursday. I apologize in advance Hurricanes fans, but I really thought you were going to lose this one. That is a great way to set up. your arrival back in the time. My hotel is, my room is.

Yes, exactly. And if anyone wants to reach out, I will have no issue. Schofering Elliot to the location of your place. Kyle will be holding a sign, Friedman staying here. Yes, that's right. We'll have it in the back window of the rental car.

Elliot's in here. Windows will be down. Please let me get out before you do what you need to do. You know, Bussy is the story. Well, Stahl's the other story. There's two big stories, Stahl and Bussie. Let me just talk about Bussie for a second. So Dave and I were at our section getting ready for the show.

And someone turned around, someone yelled, hey, and I turned around. It was John Ose Tutu, who represents Bussie. And he goes, let me introduce you to Bussie's family. And I go, oh, you guys rushed in just for this one. And they all went silent for a second. And you could tell they were a bit sheepish. And I looked at them and I said, I think we have a pretty good idea, your guys starting. There were so many rumors. But literally I said it was about 20 minutes before we went on air, which is, you know, about 25 minutes before the warm up. So we kind of had an inkling at that time was going to be him. I said, don't worry. You're not

telling us anything we don't already know. And it was such a nice family. His parents are Rob and Lisa, his fiance and Mary's parents, so his future in-laws were there. And John was wearing a hat and I forgot it. It says house money on it. And it is the family slogan and they sell merch and I'll be going on to the website after to buy the merch because the house money hat, the house money hat, it looks great. Yeah. And that's the slogan. You better do that quick. What's that? You better do that quick before they're sold out after Tuesday. After you mentioned it too, it's it's such a great, it's fitting that you would win in Vegas with a slogan house money. And for those of you unfamiliar what that means, it's like when you've already beaten the odds and you're

playing from ahead. And it's such a great slogan because you look at his career path, the fact he'd been on waivers, how long it took him to get here, starting out of nowhere, really in this spot, it really is playing with house money. And I thought he made some brilliant saves in this game. He got help from a crossbar here and there like every goal he does. But, you know, that kind of a situation, when you start in that kind of a situation, it really says a lot about who you are. Because a week ago, we're all talking about Frederick Anderson as a Kahn-Smith candidate. And you don't think that a huge game in this series is down two to one is going to be on you unless there's an injury, a severe one. Like, you just don't think it's going to be you.

So it showed a lot of great mental toughness and it was a brilliant performance. Like I said, I thought the hurricanes were reeling for a good chunk of that game. I don't care what the shots were. And Bussie had to be spectacular. Well, I think they talked about it a lot on the panel of how aggressive he can play.

Now, that can get you in trouble. But I thought about that one cross-crease pass to Eichol shortly after Jordan Stahl had put them back ahead. if he's not the aggressive mentality of pushing out to cut down the angle, because Eichel even got it up, like it was just like another inch higher, and it was tied again in the third period. Had he just slid across and stayed closer to his goal line,

I think that was going in. The fact that he pushed himself outwards was enough to cut down the angle. And, I mean, he made a few big saves there in the last few minutes, but that felt like the biggest one. I agree. I agree. I'm watching Eichel and I'm watching Ajo here, by the way, I'm wondering which one of these guys busts out first.

You know, Eichl's got a lot of points. He's got a lot of assists, but you can tell like both those guys are a bit, snake bit. Anyway, so Bussie to me was the number one story of this game. You know, I have to say I was, before we get to stall, I had heard rumors that Anderson was not going to address. Obviously, nobody was going to confirm it. And then we saw Kachkov come out as the last guy.

and the backup goalie. And, you know, initially we were told it wasn't an injury. And I know there's a lot of conspiracy theories around this kind of thing. You know, when he took quite the contact from Barbachev, and I know there were people who were surprised that the concussion spotter didn't take him off the ice. But Brindermore had been adamant both in the postgame of game three and on the off day on Monday that he's fine. and so I'll take them at their word. He did go out and skate for a few minutes on Tuesday morning early.

There's not really any morning skates for a five o'clock local team game for either team, but he wasn't out there a long time. And I know people are wondering, okay, if that's not it, is he being bothered by something else? but Brindamore came out and said he needs a rest and if we're going to give him the rest, we give him the full rest. He doesn't play. And I know some people were kind of mocking that or saying who does that in game four

of a Stanley Cup final or they haven't had a big schedule. They'd only played what, 13 games. And even though he'd played every minute before the final, I would just ask everyone to remember that he's been through a really, really difficult time with Claude Lemieux's passing. and they were extremely close. And if you heard the interview we did that aired before Game 2,

where he talked about how Claude Lemieux always fought for him. And sometimes even when Anderson didn't fight for himself, Lemieux fought for him. So I think anybody who's wondering about him taking a day off or a game off just remembers that that's a guy who's been through a lot.

Yeah. I appreciate you pointing that out. No question. And Brinimore also said in the post game here that they haven't even begun thinking about what the net's going to look like for game five back at home. That's either a Wednesday conversation or a Thursday morning conversation. But he certainly does lead up. You've got to think that they're going to tell their goalie Wednesday night who's playing. Yes, yes.

Imagine showing up at the rink Thursday morning. I don't even know it's playing. I don't know. Absolutely. I know. That's just what he said. and I'm relaying it. But he definitely does lean on Paul Schoenfelder, the goalie coach, heavily when it comes to this stuff.

And with Bussie, I mean, Craig Simpson showed it during the game. You look at his season. Early on in the year when he first got his taste with the hurricanes, he went on 11-0-1 run, 9-0-0 at one point. And late in the year, 6-0-1. So this guy can get on a lengthy streak. Carolina doesn't even need that lengthy of one. They just need three, they need two wins now in the next three games is enough for the hurricanes to become champions.

So he has done it and was good enough here in game number four. And you mentioned the parents. It was a really neat moment. The reaction of them. Yes. When Eilers hit the empty netter and they could finally kind of take a breather, was really sweet. We showed it to Bussie in the post game.

You really need to see both your parents, Robin Lisa, your fiancé, Mary here as well. There's some great reactions. And then as you can imagine in the crowd, so I just wanted to see this. What do you think? Oh, that's pretty special. So the other reason why I'm able to do what I do right now,

their sacrifice means everything. And yeah, they're the best. It's the fact that they're here watching this in person. I mean, what does that mean to you? I mean, flying. East Coast to Vegas in one day or this morning is a lot. It means a lot. I can't believe you guys just did that to me on TV. So yeah, it's special though. That'll be a memory I have forever. But I'll enjoy this one tonight. And then tomorrow we move forward to game five.

I didn't anticipate he was going to be as emotional as he was. That certainly wasn't why we put it there. I just thought it would be a neat thing for him to see his parents in that moment, knowing how tight the family is. And you mentioned the, I mean, their family mottoes on the back of, on the back of hats, right? Yep. So that was really cool. Jordan Stahl, Elliot, 37 years old. And it's been a long, long time since anybody has scored in each of the first four games of a Stanley Cup final. He has done that.

And that game winner here on Tuesday night, that one replay of it is going to, I think, live on in the history of Carolina Hurricane's lore. That was such a great replay. and also the one from behind the net, the slow-mo. Yes. Of the puck going in was such a great replay. It was great television. So I'm going to ask, I'm going to ruin this. I'm going to ask Rod Brindamore a question on Thursday morning at the media conference.

Okay. If 2006 Rod Brindamore lined up against 2006 Jordan Stahl, what would happen? Because they both have to be about the same age at the time, right? Yeah, Rod was months away from turning 36, so he was a little bit younger than Jordan at the time. Okay. So they're close. Yeah. Anyway, I see a lot of similarities.

That year, Brindamore was an MVP-level player. He was a hard trophy. It didn't win it, but he was in the conversation. And Stahl obviously wasn't a hard trophy player during the regular season, but he was his usual Selky self. And all of a sudden, he was a hard trophy player. is very much in the con smythe conversation. Yep. Dave Amber is our Con Smyth handicapper.

He's constantly talking about it. Yeah. He's constantly wondering about it. He's the first shift of game one. He was like, I don't know, healers looks pretty good. Oh my God, he could win the con smite.

Like he doesn't even have a vote, and he cares more about it than the voters. And so he's been talking about winner lose, Marner wins it. Yeah. I think Carolina wins now, stall. For sure. And that's why I always say to go, Dave, we're three games into the final.

Like, there's a lot to still be determined here. So to try to say right now, well, even if Vegas loses, would Marner not have a legit shot? Potentially. But now, I mean, do you not feel differently about that conversation than you did 12 hours ago, Elliot, after watching what Jordan Stahl just did. I usually feel differently about my conversations with Dave

about 30 seconds after I have them. Regret. Regret is the right word. But Stahl, what, the fourth guy, what is it, Johnny Bucick, Steve Payne. Is it Mike Bossy the other one? And Mike Bossy, yes.

As guys who scored in each of the first four games, and also, if you look at it, the players he's played against, all four rounds, have been completely shut down in terms of scoring goals. And, you know, the thing about him is he's still, you wouldn't, couldn't tell the guy is 36, 37 years old, right? He's still a monster and he's still an effective player. And the interviews with you are,

hilarious. Like they're human, the one from the other day. And then this one, after game four, where you showed him the replay, and you could see the real smile on his face, eh? And, you know, the other thing I think about stall is, I

thought the hurricanes made the Canadians look small. I think the Golden Knights make the hurricanes look a bit small. And Tortorella said post game, he's killing us in front of the I think that for Stahl to do what he's done in this series is even more critical,

not just because it's the Stanley Cup final, because physically I think he's one of the few hurricanes that really can stand up to these guys. Like you know who's really trying is Taylor Hall? Like he's really taking runs at people, but a lot of the hurricanes are smaller than the Golden Knights. He isn't, and he's making life miserable. on them. And I think that's enormous for this series.

Well, I had a conversation with Eric Saul a little earlier in the playoffs, and he had kind of joked like all the genetics that I did not get, Jordan got. What genetics did Eric not get? Well, he said all the physical ones. And he goes just like the way he's built, like just a way stronger. Yeah, Eric's leaner. Yeah, Eric's leaner. Yes. than Eric was when he played, of course,

both effective in their own right. But yeah, and Jordan Martinuk even said, and he's been his teammates since, what, 2018? He said, of all the years, he goes, this is from a complete totality of all the different areas that he can impact the game. He goes, this is the best I've seen him. And he's felt that way really all season

and then certainly through the playoffs. This isn't a sudden realization. He's been really, really effective. What's interesting, though, Elliot, through, I think, each of the first four games, second period has killed Carolina, the long change. And they talked about it again, they talked about it on the update. Like Taylor Hall said, we have to get this momentum. We have the momentum after the first period all the time, and we never hold it.

And Briddemore was like, it even, it's not so much in their own zone. It starts in the offensive zone where whether it's a turnover at a bad spot or just lack of awareness. when Vegas starts to blow the zone, but it just feels like one pass and suddenly there's danger off the rush. Carolina has been during the regular season, they were one of the most effective teams off the rush, and it hasn't been that way in the Stanley Cup final.

It's been Vegas doing the majority of the damage there. So that continues to be a story where you mentioned the shot disparity. You keep looking at the shot clock. I felt myself here on Tuesday, Elliot, and it was like, oh, only seven for Vegas, only nine for Vegas. And yet it seemed like they had seven or nine glorious chances. They don't give up a ton of shots, but the ones that do are really, really high quality. I don't know if that helps Brandon Bussie or Friendwick Anderson or hurts them.

But the few chances that Carolina do give up, they sure are juicy ones. It's just been a bizarre series on a number of fronts. Not exactly a defensive lockdown series. Which is kind of funny. Which is great because the less defense you play, the more entertaining it is. Absolutely. But think about what we've watched from these teams, just from the playoffs alone. I know you can become a different version of yourself from the regular season when the game changes.

But they have been so good defensively up until this final. And now it's been completely different. But to your point, to all our benefit. Anything else on this one before we move along, free? I love the drummers. every game I love the drum show love the drummers the whole show is fantastic but I

I really do like the drummers a couple of things by the way you mentioned Martinuk he got a good laugh post game I tried to walk into the Carolina room and the guy stopped to look at my pass and they're like he's checking your pass like he loved it

that's like getting carded yeah it's like well we'll get to that we'll get to the getting carded I love when you went up to Eelers after the game and asked him if he'd done any curling and went up and he's like, I wanted to, but why are you asking? Yes. Well, because Cuthbert mentioned it on the air.

He had the one clear laid in the game that was perfect drawaway, died just before the goal line for no icing. And then we wondered on the empty net goal. I mean, it wasn't a complete traditional bank shot. It was a rim that went off the stanchion, but it felt like there was some curling magic behind that one, too. I was surprised, by the way, at the end of the game for the extra shooter or the extra skater, they didn't put Howden out there. Yeah. I was a little surprised at that.

That was the one thing that surprised me a bit. Right. Leading goal score for Vegas. Yep. 2-2, man. I feel as it should be. So there's a couple members of our crew who are staying out here until we return for game number six. Yeah.

Gene Principay, I just want to say, I think. that guy tans and butter. I know. Eight in the morning is when our pool opens and he's all, while he wasn't out, he went out to Vegas practice or availability on Tuesday. I don't want people to think that Gene doesn't work. Like Vegas had an early availability out at their practice facility.

And he was there. But other than that, he's the first guy at the pool. He's like the door opens up to the pool and Gene is falling into it. it. I'm absolutely convinced he tans and butter. We're going to get back here Friday afternoon. Yeah.

I just wonder, is that going to be a situation where, you know, at the hotel where you put the bread on the conveyor belt to run it through the toaster and you've got to crank just a little too high and it's a little more done than you would like, is that going to be Gene when we get back here? Like just a little too much time in the toaster. But he's tan so beautifully, I feel. He could be out there for weeks. It's incredible.

I'm so jealous of it. You have no idea. That's what it's all it is. It's just, it's jealousy on our part. It's pure jealousy. I thought I spent a good chunk of time in the sun on, when would that have been? Sunday when we didn't have much to do. And you wouldn't, you wouldn't know it.

Color hasn't changed in the least. Sorry, I'm completely distracted. I'm on the house money website. So yeah, you know, you got to put the order it. They still have any in stock? Buddyhockey.com. Yes, they do. I'm buying a hat and I'm going to buy something else.

Now, the proceeds go to autism awareness because they have a member of their family who's on the spectrum. So I'm adding to that too. Nicely done. Okay. A few other things to get to in what's been a busy time around the league, separate from everything going on here at the Stanley Cup final, Elliot. And we will begin with what's been percolating in Edmonton.

And the idea of Mike Babcock becoming the next head coach of the Oilers. You even put up a report. It's on Sportsnet.com.ca. It was posted during game four that the NHLPA has requested the league. to investigate what all happened with Babcock, was hired in Columbus, and then stepped down, even before training camp, had begun in earnest. There's a lot of layers to this, and naturally when his name comes up, there's a lot of reaction from all sorts of corners here, Fridge. But it sounds like this is a situation where, obviously, the particulars when it comes to Connor McDavid, a Leon Drysidal, the big names in the United, that dressing room,

uh, are well aware of what the oilers are looking at here. So bring us up to speed. What's, what's going on? And where do you think this is headed? So the latest news and as you mentioned, it kind of continued during the game.

So basically the way we understood it leading up to before Tuesday was that if the oilers notified. the league that they were going to hire Babcock, the league would look into it. And the Players Association, and I think they have to do this, I don't think the Players Association has a choice here. If they want to show that they have any teeth and they want to show that they are mindful of the players, they have to step in and say, hold on. And I was told, and I didn't realize this, but I was told that at issue, and the reason the Players Association is adamant about this, is that when Babcock resigned in Columbus, the NHL was about to do an investigation into everything that happened there. And Babcock just resigned.

He just said, look, it's not worth it. Whatever his rationale was, he resigned. And so the league just said there's no point in having an investigation. I think everybody felt at that time Babcock was going to retire and we weren't going to see him in a head coaching role again. Well, now that this has come up, the Players Association has said, hold on a second. there was supposed to be an investigation that never happened because Babcock resigned. Now we want it to happen.

He shouldn't be able to come back without that investigation. And I don't necessarily think it would stop the others from being able to hire him. But I do believe the league will grant this. I don't think they're really happy. This is happening during the Stanley Cup final. but I do think they'll grant it at some point. I don't know when. And, you know, I just can't see the Oilers moving forward with the hiring if they know this is coming.

I think the Oilers know now that if they really are going to hire Babcock, they're going to do it in the face of an investigation. So how do they feel? We'll find out. And where do you think the genesis of the interest from the oiler standpoint all started? I'm able to... Oh, right. This broke after our last part, right? You've been able to hammer that down?

Yeah, absolutely I can. Well, we can go through this. It's good way to do it. So, Darren Dregor was the first to report it. He got it confirmed first. I'd been working on it for a few days. I'd heard it, but I wasn't sure what, I'll be honest. I wasn't, this is not a story you can go out with when you don't really know what's going on.

And I wasn't really sure. I heard that they were interested. I heard that it could happen, but I was trying to figure out what all the facts were. What his status was, what was really going on, and where this was all. really standing. And I had heard that, as I've said a couple of times now, I believe a lot of what has happened

in Edmonton since their loss has come from the top. I believe the owner, Darrell Cates, was incredibly upset about the way this season ended, as were a lot of people around the Oilers organization and their fans. But I believe he was determined, to act.

And what adds to this is the fact that McDavid is only on a two-year extension. Like everybody is super paranoid about what that could mean. And I think he was the driving force behind the coaching change. I think he was the one really pushing for Cassidy. I mean, I'm sure other people agreed. he was the number one guy available on the market, but I think Cates was really pushing it. And I think he's one of the people

who was really interested in Babcock and pushed Babcock. I had heard, I don't know if it's true. They've definitely spoken. I had some people say they met face to face, but I've never confirmed that. And what's also been confirmed now that I'd heard was that Babcock had met

with some of the players. Like I think, like dry settles overseas. So one of the things I was unsure about is, had he met with dry settler, just zoomed with dry, like I was trying to knock down all these details. I'd heard he'd gone golfing with a couple of the players.

Again, like there was so much out there. But there's no question in my mind that while the players had to be consulted, the leadership group about the hire, it wasn't their choice. But if they would have been uncomfortable, the leadership group, I think they could have blocked it. And I think the players have talked to all of these potential coaches.

Like one of the things it's clear here, and again, I've said this a million times, I have no desire to kick Knoblock while he's down. And whoever takes over is going to have a really high bar to beat what Noblock did, take them to within three wins of the Stanley Cup over two years. But one of the things I had heard was that this year, they just felt like even the best players felt, they needed to be put back in their place sometimes. That maybe they had too much say, too much control, and they needed somebody who was going to say,

no, you guys are great players, but I'm the boss and I'll make the decisions. And Cassidy, for example, is not a guy who's afraid to do that. And they interviewed Baroube and they interviewed LaVuette. Like I heard Lavulet was there last week and interviewed very well I heard. I think they interviewed Jim Hiller. I'm sure they interviewed some other people. But that's even I think I've heard that the players recognize that. they probably needed somebody who would tell them no more often.

And that's how we kind of got to Babcock. And I think they were about to push this through and hire them. And I think the Players Association got word of it. And they were upset for the reasons that we talked about before. And then it gets out. and all the sudden, I think initially the Oilers were like, we're still doing this unless we get told we can't,

and now we'll see. I mean, I don't know. I don't know where this is going to go as we record this on Tuesday night. I really don't know what the outcome is going to be, but I can tell you, in addition to what the Players Association said was, hold on,

if there was going to be an investigation, there should still be an investigation, there were two other things that were presented to me on Tuesday, Kyle. Number one is how would, I think some people spoke up on behalf of some of the other players who weren't on the leadership group or who didn't meet with Babcock. I think that there were some people who were concerned some of the younger veterans or prospects. And I think somebody also said,

I heard there was someone who spoke up. I don't know if they spoke up to the PA or who he spoke to, but, you know, like, they would say, hey, like, what if my player gets traded to Edmonton? Am I going to want this for my player? Or is it going to be harder for Edmonton to get players to go there, even with the talent they have? Because those players didn't have the chance to meet with Babcock beforehand.

And I think that's another reason that the challenge started to grow. And it just makes me wonder, again, we'll see what happens with this investigation if it's granted and what ultimately comes of it. But however you feel about this, you knew there was going to be some kind of blowback and you knew there was still some loose ends over how it all ended. in Columbus, Elliot. So you just can't help but wonder from the Oilers perspective,

even if you think there are qualities to Howie coaches versus the situation you are in and seeing the possibility for the right fit, is it worth the headache and the consternation

and everything that potentially could still come here? depending on how this all goes and what the PA was requested. I think it just shows you how important it is for them to win. Because I don't think for a second that now suddenly the oilers are caught off guard going, oh, investigation, we didn't see this possibility coming. No, but the thing is, I don't know if I would say they didn't know that there would be this blowback. But I think sometimes out there people, I don't know, maybe they think,

it'll blow over or maybe like I don't know if there's anything there in Columbus that we don't know about yet but maybe you're told something and then you find out and you find out later there's something else I don't know I don't know what the answer is or maybe you think that other teams bring in people that have had a past so you can to or maybe you think this time it'll be different. Like there's, I think it comes down to, to me it just shows that, look, Edmonton just came off two newer coaches, Jay Woodcroft, and let me just say,

I'm surprised that Jay Woodcroft may not get a head job out of this cycle. I'm really surprised at that. And then they did Chris Knoblock. So now they did two in a row, and you know what they're going to do now. They're going to, they clearly decided they're going to, they're going in the opposite direction. I think people find reasons,

especially when you're like, we got to win, we got to win, we got to win, and we think this is the guy, you find reasons to do it instead of not to do it. You know, I'll say this, like, I was going through a really tough point in my life, and the two people who gave me the best advice to help drag me out of it were Daryl Sutter and Mike Babcock.

And, but that doesn't mean I don't recognize that other people have their own experiences, which are different. I will never mitigate anybody else's feelings. And I just think that what's happened here is you're so determined to win that you, that that consumes you. and I hope everybody involved here is really considering all angles. And there's, everybody here should be saying, is there anything we're missing? We already have all these stories.

Is there anything we're missing? I think it does speak volumes, the fact that, I mean, the leadership group at Edmonton has by and large given their blessing, the fact that you've got a link in Zach Hyman, who of course played for Babcock. I mean, became an NHL player under Mike Babcock and now has a big role with the Oilers.

So I do believe that that speaks volumes. But as you know, it doesn't speak for everybody. You're right. This case. You're right. Good. Okay. Anything else here?

Yeah. The other thing I want to talk about here is, and this is something that I thought of was another reason I was waiting to write the story before Darren beat me to it. is that the question I was asking is, what's with the timing? Because, so before game one of the Stanley Cup final, Bill Daly was asked about Cassidy, and he said Vegas is within their right to do it,

but they said, look, they don't want to be distracted while they're playing. Let's see what happens when they're done. Now, I took that to mean the league will back Vegas saying no, but they left the window open slightly, slightly, in case Vegas changed their mind.

Other people have taken that to mean the league thinks Vegas is going to change their mind. I don't know. I'm just saying that everybody, it's funny, like two or three people, 10 people, hear the same answer and they interpret it six different ways. So when this got out, I said to myself, why are they doing this now? Why don't they just wait? If they want to hire Babcock, then just say, okay, Mike, you're in a holding pattern. Let's just make sure we can't get Cassidy. Why wouldn't

you wait? And I spent a lot of time working on that. And I think that Edmondson believes they won't get permission. Now, maybe there's a 1% chance, a 5% chance that it turns out to be wrong. So while we've been here, I had someone say to me, and I think this is someone who would know, they said to me that Vegas blames the Oilers for this getting out. Look, I don't think it benefited the Oilers to get it to get out the way it did with Cassidy. I was actually surprised to hear that Vegas thought that way. So I was like, how do the Oilers benefit from that getting out? But Vegas thinks it was from them.

And it may not have even been Edmonton's hockey operations. And I suspect it wasn't. but Vegas still is annoyed at the oilers over it. That's what someone here has told me. And so it's like, you know, people think about Vegas as this kind of group that doesn't care what anyone says about them. Let's just say that's not 100% true.

And there are some people who are very sensitive. And I think that they're mad about it. And so almost out of spite in the way. Oh, you think this is inconvenient? I think there's, like a couple people said to it. So I ran that off a couple people. And they said to me, they think that's true. So we'll see again if they change their minds.

But I also think that I'll say this too. The feeling here in Vegas is, that, and obviously there aren't Edmonton people here, but there's a lot of other people around who are pretty connected, is that the Oilers don't think they're going to be able to get them. So now they've got to shift their focus elsewhere. Yeah. Wow.

We knew this is going to be a big offseason for the Oilers. It's just getting started. And there's a lot still to unpack to see where that ultimately goes. We've got a few other items here to get through Elliot, but I guess just on the topic of coaching, you said you had a couple of things you wanted to touch on. Well, yeah.

So, you know, first of all, I wanted to mention Calder Cup. It'll be Toronto versus Chicago. And Chicago, Spiros and Nassos took over the middle of the season. That's all, so we now have two interim

coaches in the NHL and the HAL who are competing for championships, John Tortorella and Spiros and Astos. He's done a really good job there. I'm still trying to figure out if John Gruden is one of Toronto's interviewees. I don't know. But he's obviously got the team in the Calder Cup final. And the hurricanes have a chance to win at both the NHL and the HL level.

I heard tonight here that San Diego is about to have an opening for its job. And I'll tell you, and I've said this a million times. If the NHL ever expands to San Diego, I'm going there. But Matt McElvane is their American Hockey League coach. He's leaving for an assistant coach job in the NHL. I think it might be Boston. But I heard tonight that that job's going to be open, and I can imagine that will be a good job.

So that's the one I wanted to mention. And I also wanted to talk about Alex, talk for a second. Yes. So number one free agent remaining on the market. I just heard, I'm careful with this because there's still time. And things can always change with one phone call. But the word at the combine, I heard it from a couple different people, is that there hadn't been a lot of movement,

that there's still a gap. Now, I had a couple people tell me he's definitely testing free agency. And I said, guys, I'm not going there because who knows what can happen. There's still a couple weeks. Deadline spur action. Nobody has to do anything now. You can always do it later or closer to July 1st when everybody really shows their cards. The one thing I definitely did here is that there's still a gap.

there's still work to be done there. I keep thinking about what we saw when we went into their dresser room after game seven when they lost to Montreal and him still sitting there in the bulk of his equipment. And it took me back, Elliot, and please, I'm not trying to compare the two situations. But I remember my first year of, I guess now what you would call U-18 playing rep hockey. And at that time, you know, I was in grade 10. You played with kids in grade 11 and grade 12. So, and I remember the last game of the year and we got knocked out of the playoffs and one of the guys on our team that was in grade 12 and he knew that was it.

Like he knew then that that was it. That was going to his last game of competitive minor hockey of his life. And he sat there in the dressing room. I couldn't tell you how long he sat there with his equipment on because he just, he knew once he took that jersey off, that was the last time he was doing it. and he wanted to delay it as long as he possibly could. And I'm not suggesting or putting thoughts into Alex Tux's mind saying he knew right then and there, this would be the last time he'd wear a Buffalo uniform. But I just keep coming back to that image anytime you mention something like that to suggest

there hasn't been a lot of movement on a new contract front. Did you just do an Insta story of me? I did it before we started recording. What is this? It's just a photo. I have a microphone and you getting ready in the background. Oh, okay. I thought somebody just texted a nice Insta story and I'm like,

what are you talking about? Yeah, I like sneaking the quick ones on you. That's all I got going for me. Frege cam. It's what the people want. The Fridge content never misses. I put anything involving you out there and it does numbers. No wonder you're so valuable to the company.

Okay, Dylan Larkin, there's still lots of, fallout with that trade request and where things could possibly go there. So Helene St. James reported three teams. She did Minnesota, Florida, and Vegas, right? I had heard different teams, but I don't want to discredit anyone else's reporting. I think I'd mentioned Minnesota, but I had Tampa and Dallas. But, you know, I think the thing, I think, for her to report that she probably had a great source.

So, but I think the key thing here is that I just believe it's going to be somebody who's ready to win. You know, the one thing I think is, you know, Pat Bresson represents both players. At the beginning of Quinn Hughes thing, he didn't think he was going to Minnesota. And they, and he got talked into Minnesota. So I think that's kind of important to recognize. people can be talked into things. I already think that, you know,

Garron's history and he talked about it we traded for Hughes, going hot, make your best offer. I think he probably has already. And I suspect Florida has to. And now it's just a matter of, okay, is it what Eiserman likes? Or is it, or is he say, sorry, that's just not good enough.

So, but I do think teams have started to make offers. And I'm sure there's something I'm missing out there. You know, the other thing, too, is one of the things I've really tried to figure out is, you know, where it kind of went sideways there. Someone sent me a note and they sent me video of when he got. very emotional when Tyler Boutuzzi got traded and said that must have been the beginning of the end. I had a couple of people said to me, the Bertuzzi trade was really hard on him and the contract

talks after that were really hard on him. But they really felt that that was business and they kind of got through it. And then they felt where the relationship, and I had a couple people tell me this. where the relationship really started to fall apart was as, you know, the Red Wings kept missing, as you can imagine, it would be hard on everybody. And then just kind of what happened around those deadlines and the summers. Like a couple of years ago, 23, 24, Larkin got hurt, and he missed a whole bunch of games around March. And then after that season, they lost.

Gostas Bear and Peron. And I think those were tough losses because they really thought that they were players that really helped Detroit. And, you know, Perron continued to be very effective and Gostis Bear has been really good and is a key part

of a potential Stanley Cup champion here. Then they come back to next year. They miss out again. That was the year Larkin gets mad. then, but I will tell you, I will tell you that year that Eisenman didn't add anything, I did have people say to me, he tried really hard. Like he was out there, he was grinding, he just struck out. It wasn't for lack of effort. And then this year, they don't get Hughes because Eisenman wouldn't do it without the commitment of the extension.

They do get help, though. They miss. It was interesting, John Wharton, the former trainer from the Red Wings, who's had some really insightful tweets about it, talked about Larkins celebrating with the Olympic team and how Iserman might not like that. And then they miss again. This time, Iserman gets help.

I think Larkin was pretty banged up, but he didn't produce. And, you know, I thought the, as I said the other day, unfortunately, it was time. I just think Eiserman, hard driving, old school, demanding, and Larkin, and I'll say this, like, I think it's been really hard the reaction on Larkin, but even, even some of the biggest detractors would never say that he didn't compete all out. And, you know, for whatever reason, I think they just kind of lost faith in each other a little bit. And, you know, it's interesting, like there was a report they haven't spoken in a while. I can't confirm that, but I had heard something along those lines that they, for captain and

general manager, there wasn't a lot there. And I just think that, you know, Nick Kiprios once said to me, one thing I always remember, losing sucks. And I think it just drove the wedge into this relationship. Right. Because it's been, we've talked about it at length, three years in a row, four years in a row. Yeah, right there. Right there.

In one way or another. Yeah. And absolutely that can wear on everybody. It's funny. Like, Kyle, there was something else I said in my NHL network hit where I was kind of talking with, I was there with Catherine Tapp and Mike Johnson and Jason Demerriss that day. But it's kind of like that U.S. national team group chat, right? There's a lot going on out of there.

Yes, that's a, the ripple effect. Yeah. One of the more impactful group chats to ever exist. You mentioned Minnesota earlier. Speaking of them, Mike McCarron, you anticipated there was a path to getting him re-signed with the Wild, and it in fact happens. A beauty of a contract, six years, 3.3 million per.

Yeah, you know, some people didn't like this contract. My guess is, so I heard from another GM, that before Nashville traded him, their last offer was nowhere close to this. They were not willing to do this. And McCarron bent on himself and where the cap was going. And I actually think he took less AAV. So, and Minnesota was willing to give him more term to keep the cap hit down so that they could do other things. Like I think McCarran, and the other thing, too, is Minnesota for them,

if I'm right and Hughes is going to extend for three years, this is about the next three years and that's it. This is about Minnesota trying to win in the next three years. And maybe, let's say they get Larkin or whatever, or they get somebody else, maybe they extend the window. But right now, the time is now for Minnesota. So, you know, people are saying, oh my God, you're going to hate that contract in four or five years.

I'm like, who cares? Like, this is a win now contract. And you'll take McCarron now. I think you're going to take in McCarran now at 3.3, you'll take it for the next three years to win you a cup. I understand what he's doing. They're in their window. You go for it.

I get it. And it's the way we're seeing more and more examples of contracts at least. they kind of wink at what Bill Guerin has done here with with McCarron, right? Like I'm not even talking about the, the Marchand deals of the world, but those types of players where you see a fit there, you've got to get it to a certain number in totality to get it done and spreading it out over a few extra years.

The price teams are willing to pay, especially those in a situation like Minnesota. Okay, well, with that, let's get to the final thought, which is brought to you by your Canadian Toyota dealers. And Elliot, we had a handful of the top prospects that will be showcased at the NHL draft later this month. Keaton Verhoff was here. Chase Reed, Carson Carroll's,

Albert Smiths as well of Latvia. Caleb Malhotra, of course. Caleb and Keaton on with Ron and Kevin in the pregame show was really good. Need to hear from both of them. But then you and Dave had Albert He was the recipient this year of the E.J. McGuire Award of Excellence had a heck of a year I thought was terrific with Latvia and the Olympics for a kid that was barely 18 years old and now just getting ready for the NHL draft. How was he? What was it like being able to meet him and to speak with him for a bit? That guy is massive. And he's only going to get massive earth. I'm looking at this guy and I'm sitting here and I'm saying,

When this guy fills out, it's going to be impossible. It's going to be like trying to skate around a tree trunk. Yes. And I'm not talking about some wimpy birch tree on your lawn. I'm talking about a true sequoia. This is, yeah, Douglas fir. A Douglas fir. Really nice kid, quiet, you know, didn't have a lot to say, but that's fine.

did not have to do the Canadians throw the puck in the garbage challenge. That was a great line with Caleb and Kevin when he found out he missed. And he said your uncle Steve Nash would be very upset that you missed the shot. But I can see why, you know, I've seen him play a little bit at the Olympics

and I've watched a little bit of film of him. I wouldn't say it's a lot. But because he's more, mobile, I can see why teams like this guy. If you're going to be as big as this guy is and you're only going to get larger and you can skate, that's what championship teams win with guys like that. You know, it was interesting. I was asking, you know, what's his points?

He doesn't have a ton of points. And I don't know if he'll ever be a big point score. But the one thing a couple guys said to me is he can pass the puck. So if you're big and you're mobile and you can pass, you're going to play a long time in this league. I understand the hype. Let's put it that way. Yeah.

Well, especially when you look at, I mean, some of the defensemen in this series, Elliot, and I know this guy does have production to go along with it, but Shea Theodore, how effective he is,

whether it's stretch passes or just making that first pass out of his own, how valuable that is for good teams. I can totally understand why the excitement is building around that guy. And before the game here on Tuesday, So Emily Kaplan with ESPN and Renault-Lobois of Tivia and myself, we all had a few minutes just to go speak to the players, just because I think all three of us are going to be there working the draft in Buffalo at the end of the month. So just a chance to say hi and ask him a few questions.

And I think it was Renault that asked Alberts, whose favorite players were growing up or player. And the two names that he said, interestingly, Elliot, because when you consider how young he is, number one, Sandus Ozilinch? Really? Number two, Artur's Irbe. You know, it's interesting when he, maybe he liked you and Renault better than me and Dave. Because he said more at Cider on the air, which I thought was a great answer. Yes, but that was kind of more who he tried to emulate or something, right?

But when he was with us, he didn't really name a lot of favorites. You know, maybe he just found Dave and I really off-putting. Yeah, or at least one of you. I'll let you decide who. Clearly, it's Amber, clearly. But, you know, it's, it's, the thing I liked about him was, you know, we put the earpiece on them. And a lot of people, the first time they have that put on them, it's really uncomfortable. It's, it's not a headset.

It's the actual ones that go inside your ears. And he was pretty calm. Like, and doesn't have a lot to say. like not in a bad way, just quiet around, probably around people he doesn't know that well, just doesn't offer a lot, which is fine. But like I said, a beast on the blue line for a lot of time to come.

And these kids, Elliot, I mean, we've seen it happening for a lot of years here now, but just seeing them interact with some of the staff with the league that obviously have been doing this for a long, long time. I don't imagine they've had a ton of time to get to know them. but a lot of them took them out for dinner last night here in Vegas or it would have been Monday night.

Anyway, you just tell that is a confident group of kids that easily adapt to their environment. Like none of what they were experienced here at the Stanley Cup final in Vegas, all of that, none of it looked overwhelming to them. It's just it's a new age of players. That was the final thought brought to you by your Canadian Toyota dealers. With that, we will take our first break when we come back, a brand new edition of the Thoughtline. 32 thoughts, the podcast continues after this.

All right, welcome back. Time now for the Thoughtline, presented by BedMGM, Make It Legendary. And Elliot, I can only imagine with two full days off in the city of Las Vegas, all the different corners of the strip that you found yourself in, and who you could have possibly met along the last. the way do you have shoutouts well first of all dom which one of us do you think got carded at the craps table definitely kyle elliott good guest dom i would have loved it if you would have said me but i can understand why you voted for kyle yes kyle you got carded proud moments

so long as i will take that as long as i can i would too but it was funny yes we're sitting there in a casino and we're about to play the game and they're looking at you. And I was like, who are they? Who were they side eyeing over there? It's you. And they asked you for your license. It was great. So I think what we should talk about here, though, is that.

So Dave really likes craps. He's good at it. He likes it. And I can see why. Yeah, it's a fun game. He likes the fact that everyone can win it. Someone could win for it. anybody at the table and or everybody at the table.

But you had a big run. How long did you hold the dice for? Like 20 minutes? I don't know if that. It was probably closer to 10. Maybe it just felt like 20 when we got got into it. But the thing was because we got there and the guy that was rolling when we first started, he came out hot.

Yes. So built us up a bit of a cushion. And then suddenly it was like cold, cold, cold, cold, cold. The next three, four rollers, including. And I was ready to like walk away. So I thought, I'm going to be cleaned out here before I know it. And then suddenly a few people backed out. And so the roll of roller landed on Amber.

And I thought, okay, I can't leave if he's going to roll. And maybe I should have because that was short lived. It was like maximum carnage when he crapped out. And then it got to me. And I think again, I was ready to leave. And you're like, well, you can't leave now. It's your turn to roll. So I knew I had.

had to dig in for the group and there was no rhyme or reason why it happened to work. But my most proud moment as the roller, Elliot, because we got going a little bit. And at a certain point, you threw a bet down on me rolling a hard six because I had rolled six a few times and you finally put a little bit of cash on that and I hit the hard six for you. I was so happy about that. Yeah, that was great. I mean, I put that money down. It wasn't a lot expecting to lose it because you never win those bets. And you nailed it pretty quickly. But first of all, you did a great job. You were hugely successful. You lasted much longer than Dave or I did with the dice. But I noticed that whenever before you threw them, you were, you were fiddling with them so that a nine was showing. What's the, why were you doing that? Well, nine was my favorite number, right? Paul Correa. I tried to. wear that as much as I could growing up, whatever sport I was in. And so I don't know, because the guy

again that was hot when we first got there, he had a whole kind of pre-shot routine, which I kind of liked because it was working for him. And those in between did not. So I was like, I have to do something here. So I guess in the moment I decided the numbers facing up was going to be nine and I chose six and three to kind of get there. So I had to fix the dice. So it was showing that. I did like this little wrist roll action, whatever the hell that was. And then I tossed the dice. But again, it started to work. We were on a bit of a run, so I couldn't change it.

And I stand by my decision because I'm determined had I not done that, it would have been much different. Anyway, great job, great job. Actually, by the way, not only was I carded at the table, I was then carded again at the cashier when I went to cash out. It would be hilarious if they said, sorry, you can't have your money. You're too young. Keep the chips. No cash for you. Yeah, so there are some shoutouts.

There was a Vegas fan I met Sarah Rose, her husband Weston. Sarah is a ringer for Velma from the old Scooby-Doo cartoons. Oh, nice. But she's a big Vegas fan. Then I met Francois Bourbonnet. Actually, we met him. We went to Shake Shack after game three. And Francois Bourbonnier was in Vegas playing in the World Series of poker,

not the big event, but one of the smaller ones. It's called Event 18 Monster Truck. I asked him, how are you doing? And he said the buy-in for that was $1,500. He'd already recouped his buy-in. So good job, Francois. Hope the rest of the tournament went well. We met one of Logan Stankovins' youth coaches

whose name actually is Connor McCoach. I didn't believe it when he first told me that. I was like, you're putting me on. He's like, no. That's my name. Bill and Rhonda. What's that? Carded him.

That's right. Billy and Rhonda from Victoria, always got to shut out the Victorians because it's from your island out there. Jamie Hendricks is a former Canucks trainer. He was at the game with his wife, Jill White, who still works for the Canucks. And their son, they drove down from Vancouver, 20 hours. And then I met. these two other fans from Alberta, their names were Ethan and Luke.

I'm like, did you guys drive down too? And one of them said, are you crazy? Have you seen gas prices lately? So that flopped is a question. Then there's a couple other people I wanted to shout out. So I met these two fans from Washington, Mark and Jerry. And one of them, big Capitals fans. They just wanted to come to the Stanley Cup final.

I was like, you're back to the scene of the crime, the 2018 victory. They were like, they love that that got pointed out. But they're just big fans who came, and one of them was wearing a referee jersey. And he said, he showed me his phone, and he says, this guy took a picture with me. Do you recognize who this is? He says, hey, I'm a ref. Can I take a picture of your referee jersey? So it was NHL referee, Kyle Reiman, who was at the game.

because he's buddies with Garrett Rank and he just wanted to come support Rank who finally gets to work a Stanley Cup final. So actually I saw Kyle Rehman there with his wife, Alyssa, just said hi to them briefly. I thought it was kind of cool that an official would come to support another official like sometimes players were who were friends.

I wanted to shout out an eye doctor from Vegas who's a regular listener of the pod, Dr. Matt Kootenelli. And I met a couple members of the Vegas off-ice stats crew. I was rushing to the dressing room after the game, so I couldn't remember their names, but I wanted to shout them out.

The last thing I wanted to mention was I had some buddies and some people who wrote in and they were like, what was Kevin talking about with your nail clipping in public? Oh, yeah. He brought this up on air in game three. And so this is what happened.

I walked from our hotel to the rink before game three, which is about a 30-minute walk. And I was not on the strip. I was on one of the back roads. And I was by myself. And I brought a nail clipper. And I clipped my nails while I walked. And some people were like, that's disgusting. and other people

Jennifer Bottle was one of the people thought it was really disgusting by the way and other people were like no was anyone around you no you weren't on the strip no it was basically private yes perfectly fine where do you fall on this

yeah it's it's a no for me dog because especially when I heard that I thought there's no way this is the first time you have pulled off and act like this am I right No, it's true. Like, I've done it when I'm driving.

Not like actually moving, but when I'm stopped somewhere. Explain some things. But I guess it makes it seem even worse. But never around other people. I guess, but there's plenty of things you can do. It's not like I'm doing it, like, watching the game tonight in the arena. I know. You're still just like leaving your DNA in areas of Vegas.

even if it's not the strip. And I still think that that probably wouldn't even make the top 20 of strangest things you could see on the strip. That I agree with. Man, I can't get behind it. I really can't. I want to support you in trying to find loopholes in life to save some time. I think that one, you just got to take the extra two minutes in your bathroom,

your sauna bathroom. People are so soft. Yeah, this guy walking on the sidewalk, clipping his toenails or his fingernails going, I can't believe how soft people are. That is such a visual. No one even saw me do it. I know, but I think there's a lot of things in life where even if people didn't see it doesn't make it right. And I'm kind of put this one in that category slightly.

Oh, my guy. you are your own content machine in so many ways it's great okay uh okay we're going to start with a voicemail here because i've been called to the carpet this is bruce from henderson nevada so there you go a it tells you how much i know about this brand of of chip i had no idea it was capitalized the ut and the z or the z was capitalized in the note. So I thought he just read the letters, but turns out it's UTS. And now I feel like a putts. So I have to do Uts and I still have to do the Big Turk. I have to find a big Turk. Yeah, that's right. That. I'm on a food hunt. Yes. When we get to Raleigh, Big Turk and Uts.

By the way, there was somebody, I think in the crowd at Game 3 who also said, told me that Uts can be bought here. Oh yeah. Yes. Okay. So I guess the question. not, as you said, the flavor. Yes, that may be the ultimate decider, or what makes getting them in Raleigh, unique was the barbecue flavor. Okay, this addition to the thought line, Elliot, I call it, this is your life. Okay. And we begin with Matt from Colonna, BC. Hi, gents, love the pod. First, a fun fact. I once worked as one of Elliot's minion reporters when he was the sports editor for the Gazette. the official student newspaper of Western University. Really? Yes. Any recollection? The only Matt I remember is Matt Casey.

Okay, you're close. This is Matt Carter. Ooh. I'll be honest. I'm sorry. I don't remember that individual off the top of my head. All right. Well, there you go, Matt.

And that'll do it for the... No, no, no. I'll still get to this. But guys, here's my question. How do NHL teams account for bonus-laden contracts to ensure their team is still cap-compliant? What made me think of this was of Guiney Malkin's recent contract extension. He signed a five-and-a-half AAV one-year deal, right? Two questions.

Why is it structured as two and a half base salary and three million in bonuses? And how are the additional performance bonuses calculated? For example, if a team was against the cap, could they ever be in danger of going over because a number of their players earned performance bonuses? Thanks again for the pod. 32 thoughts is a must listen for me on the long drives through the interior of British Columbia. And thanks for not firing me in 1991, Elliot, pretty sure I was an awful writer. I will say this, you're probably nowhere near as bad as you think, Matt, and there were some people who were definitely worse.

one of whom is the co-host of this podcast. So thank you for listening, Matt. Always good to touch base with somebody from my past. So there's three types of players that get bonuses. Number one, entry level, guys signing their first deal. Number two is players over 35. You can sign a bonus contract. And number three is players who've missed a lot of games due to injuries.

If you've really been hammered by injuries, you're allowed to sign bonus laden contracts. So the simplest way to say it is, let's just say, for example, I'm signing, Kyle is bonus eligible and I'm signing him to a contract, and he wants $2 million as the base, without any bonuses, he wants $2 million.

If I only have $1.5 million in cap space available, I can't give him that. I can't do that. Your base salary always has to be cap-compliant. So if I have a million and a half available, I can give Kyle a million, I can give them as close to a million and a half as I want, but I cannot give them a base salary that puts me over the cap.

Bonuses are different. If you're one of those three groups of players that are eligible for bonuses, then you can go two ways. Either you have them all the bonuses that are reached fit under your cap, or if you can't fit them in one year, you can put them on your cap the next year. The problem is, whatever you're over, overages gets taken off of next year's cap.

So for example, let's just say this year you had bonuses and you were $3 million over the cap. Next year, you lose $3 million off the top of your cap. You can spend $3 million less. So that's the way it works. Your base salary always has to be cap compliant, but if your bonuses take you over, you can put it towards the next year. Pittsburgh with Malkin, they have a ton of cap rooms.

They really don't have to worry about this a lot. But if all of a sudden, they do some blockbusters or they give some big contracts on the off chance they have trouble next year, they can put it on their cap the year after. That's how it works. Excellent. Up next, this is from Jeff, either Biderman or Biederman. Do I, did you say I know this person? Well, we're going to get to that. If it's the person I know, and I think I know who it, and if it's the Jeff, I know it's, it's, it's, it's.

It's Biederman. All right, there we go. Dear Elliot and The Hangers on. Just kidding. Love everyone on the show. But as a proud member of the venerable Mr. Friedman's demographic, I do think it's time we 50-somethings got a little respect. If not from the raccoons,

then at least from fans desperately hoping to hear their name said on your podcast. Certainly not me, Jeff Biederman, but I digress. I'm sure I'm only the 97th person to flag this egregious error, but it was Eugene Levy who hosted the classic SCTV Halfwitz sketch. Okay, so first of all, Jeff and Kyle, thank you for putting this in because I got a bunch of notes about that and I forgot to mark it down. I screwed that up. And there were a number of people who actually sent me the links to the YouTube's,

and I realized right away to my horror that Eugene Levy, Levy was the host and Joe Flaherty was one of the contests. You know, I must have gotten confused when they did the news, SCTV news. Oh, yes. Joe Flaherty was the serious newscaster. And so I must have just screwed it out. I got a mixed up.

But yes, as several of you pointed out my egregious mistake. Carded guy had it right. What were the odds of that? Okay, so Jeff continues. Question for the pod. And I want honest answers only. I assume one day will reach the point where fans can get a direct feed of the behind-the-scenes conversation between the crew and the broadcast team. Until then, I need to know when a playoff game that seems headed for a decisive 4-0 finish somehow lurches into overtime, how many, quote, are you bleepin kidding me moments are thrown around?

Is it pure production panic, prep mode where everyone is figuring out what, to say who to interview and how to fill the time, or is there genuine chagrin that your, I'm going to be in bed my midnight plan has been delayed indefinitely? You can tell me, we shared a camp cabin in August 1981, the summer of Bolo Bats. That kind of bond means something. Love the pod. Keep making Camp Timberlain and YMCI proud. So YMCI is York Mills Collegiate. That's where I went to high school. I do remember, Jeff, we were in the same cabinet at Camp Timberlane.

And I should shout out another friend, Corey Mandel, who bought Camp Timberlaine and has made it an even bigger success than it was. He and his son went to go see the Canadians twice in the Buffalo series. I think they went to game six in Montreal and they went to game seven in Buffalo and saw the victory. I should shout out Sports Night editor Mike Corrine, who's a huge Sabres fan, who drove down to that game seven. I'm sorry, Mike. I know how hard that was. Anyway, so that's funny. I remember Jeff very well.

Corey didn't ever mention what his son's name was, so I can't shut him out. But they're big Canadians fans who went to those two games. So the honest answer, Jeff, is that for that game, the game three that was 4-0-4-4-4 and then double overtime, nobody's complaining about that. Nobody. That's a great game. You love to be part of them, as we talked about on the pod.

When our careers are over, we'll say, boy, we were there for that night. And it was incredible. I mean, also, like, if you're not enjoying being a, that game, then just leave and give someone else the opportunity to work it. You shouldn't be there. So when you're asking me to be honest, that's my honest opinion. If you can't enjoy that game, get lost and give the job to somebody else. I will tell you where I've seen people lose their minds before. So years ago, I think it was my first year at hockey night, which would have been, I can't have it was 0304, maybe was another year later, but early in my time,

time at hockey night. Vancouver and Dallas played in the playoffs. Yes, 2007. What's that? 2007. So it was three years into my time there. And on the first night of the playoffs, what did they play? Four overtime?

So you have to understand, Jeff and everyone else, at that time, you're doing double headers for the first two weeks of the playoffs. And you get your first game. And then, so that game would start at whatever time. and all of a sudden you're in quadruple overtime on the first night in the late game. And that's a night where people are like, kill me now.

And it's not like they enjoy it. It's not like they don't enjoy it or their bad attitudes. It's the first night of a two-month run and you get quadruple overtime. And what they all would tell me, I was a ringside reporter then, So I would have been probably in Ottawa, because I think that would have been a year. Ottawa was the early series for us.

So I'm not in the studio. I'm not working the West Coast. And they tell you, if you got quadruple overtime on the first night, you never catch up. You need a short series. And that one, I think, went seven. Yes, it did. So you never, like, you're behind, you're under a rock right away. Those are the killers.

Those are the ones where people say, please God, have mercy on my soul. I think both Ron and Kelly have talked about that game. Like it, and to your point, they're going, we were right for weeks after that because it came right at the beginning and it was a perfect storm of the late game that goes into four overtime. So even later for them working in Eastern time out of the studio in Toronto. And I'm with you. I think when you get into these situations, whether it's, a feverish four-gole comeback or not, in the moment you're just living what you're seeing, right?

And I mean, that was Saturday night. We didn't have a flight the next day. We had nowhere to be. It started a little after 5 o'clock your local time in Vegas. It could have been much, much worse for us. But even in situations that are less ideal, it's really you're just focused on the game itself. You're enjoying what's playing out in front of you

for me, like my mind doesn't wander to all the other stuff. Like maybe afterwards you get back to the hotel and you're like, holy smokes, okay, now I got to pack because I've got to be up in three hours to get on a flight and then it hits you a little bit then, which I think is only human nature. But in the moment, it's all about the game in Fronia because, man, waited all year to get to the playoffs and you want to enjoy what's unfolding. Okay, one final one here, Elliot, comes from, I don't think this is, from your past, but you never know.

This is Caden from Edmonton. Even though many of us projected this final, not to have many goals, we have been proven wrong. So what's the most, on average, total goals in any Stanley Cup final? I'll say eight. So you're not too far off.

There are two series that tie at the top. Bob, Canadians Blackhawks in 73. That was the 87 game there, I remember. There you go. Yeah. And Maple Leafs Rangers in 1932, both of those had an... Are you serious? Yes, I am.

Both of those had a 9.33 total goals per game average through that series. I would never have gotten that in 1932 one, I'll tell you that. Number three and number four on this list came in successive years. both with the Islanders, 1980 and 1981 versus the Flyers and North Stars respectively, eight and a half and eight point four. And as of right now, coming in at number five is this Stanley Cup we are currently covering, Elliot,

Vegas and Carolina, 8.25 goals we are averaging through four games in the series. The average actually drops slightly after game four tonight because there was only a mere eight total goals scored. Always happy with no defense. Keep it coming. We'll see how much that number can climb here throughout the rest of this final. Great, Caden, thank you very much for that question.

Thank you to everybody who submitted. That was a thought line presented by BedmGM. Make it legendary. You can submit your own at 1833-3-1-3213.32. If you'd like to leave a voicemail or email us at 32 Thoughts at Sportsnet.com. We'll take one final break and wrap up this edition of 32 Thoughts the podcast on the other side. So that is going to do it for this edition of 32 Thoughts, the podcast.

Thank you so much for listening. Now we will be spending today hustling back to Raleigh, North Carolina, with only one day in between game four and game five. Said game five goes Thursday night. Hockey Central, pregame show will be on the air, 730 Eastern Time, 430 Pacific, from the Lenovo Center. Puck drop a little after 8 Eastern 5 Pacific on CBC and Sportsnet.

The Stanley Cup final, all tied at two games apiece. It is down to a best of three. Have a great couple of days. We will speak to you post-game 5 on Friday morning.