32 Thoughts: The Podcast - Putting the C in Calgary

Episode Date: September 29, 2023

Jeff and Elliotte dive into the Calgary Flames decision to name Mikael Backlund the 21st captain in franchise history while also extending him (1:56). They also talk about Patrick Kane and his rehab after his hip resurfacing surgery (17:50), discuss the latest on Devon Toews' future (26:00) and provide an update on Drysdale and Zegras in Anaheim (40:25).The guys then answer your questions in the Montana’s Thought Line (48:19) and sit down with Edmonton Oilers forward Evander Kane (56:00) and Tampa Bay Lightning Defenseman Mikhail Sergachev (1:08:31).Email the podcast at [e-mail] or call the Montana's Thought Line at 1-833-311-3232 and leave us a voicemail.This podcast was produced and mixed by Dominic Sramaty and Jordan McRae and hosted by Jeff Marek and Elliotte Friedman.Audio Credits: Fox 5 VegasThe views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Today's show is dedicated to the Snow family of Calgary. By now we've all read Kelsey Snow's social media posts about Chris. This is a family, Elliot, that's shown us how to live life with dignity and respect and resolve, compassion, love, and in the process have made all of us better. And this is the feeling of every heart in hockey breaking at the same time peace to the snow family i'm still having trouble finding the words ever since his diagnosis he was a beacon of positivity. What Chris did, undergoing experimental treatment, will benefit people for decades to come.

That's his legacy. What a beautiful family. To donate funds to help ALS research and to find new treatments, go to calgaryflames.com slash snowy strong. Welcome once again to 32 Thoughts, the podcast. American Friedman with you once again. Coming up a little bit later on, you will hear from Evander Kaneane of the edmonton oilers muse about amongst other things playing in atlanta

comma again that was a good question i hate to give you credit for anything but that was a really good question listen it was an okay question he delivered a dynamite answer i'm not taking credit for what he said which was fascinating uh mikhhail Sergeyev as well. Speaking of fascinating, Tampa Bay Lightning defenseman, I think surprised and will surprise a lot of people with this interview. We love doing it. We hope that you'll enjoy listening to it. We'll start with the Calgary Flames and Michael Backlund with the new deal and the new letter. He's now the captain of the Calgary Flames and he has a brand new two-year contract extension in his hip pocket.

It is worth $9 million for an AAV of 4.5 million. So now he's had four different general managers in Calgary sign him to contracts. Jay Feaster, Daryl Sutter, Brad Treliving, and now Craig Conroy. Your thoughts on all of this. We've talked about Backlund going back to last season with this deal.

Well, number one, this is a big victory for the Flames. Even more of a victory than it is for Backlund. As we talked about in a previous podcast, Jeff, the marriage between Backlund and the Flames has benefited everyone. The organization, the player, the family, the community. And if he stays all the way through this contract it will be 19 years since he was drafted in 2007 by the Calgary Flames but the

reason that the team and the organization wins the most in this case is you'll remember how everybody went home after last year and Backlund was one of the most vocal about it. And this is why I always say time can change feelings. No matter how someone feels in the moment, there are opportunities for them to calm down and refocus their energy. And Backlund had a chance over the summer. He came back by all accounts, a very different person with very different feelings. And he told the flames,

I think he met with Craig Conroy not long after he got back and he kind of indicated, I feel a lot better about things and this was the guy the Flames had to get done first I know there's a lot of talk about Lindholm but I do think if there's going to be more here Backlund was actually the linchpin you know if you ask the players there and you know they had felt that last year there had to be a captain and they felt the captain was backland even if the second c because if you say jeff the c is not on his jersey that's a lie there is a big c on his jersey but it's not the captaincy um yeah thank you uh he was the captain

of the team and i think a lot of players look to him when things are going wrong. How are we going to fix this? So it's a huge win for the Flames to get him signed and get him in there. And I think it's good news for the fans. All of a sudden now the fans feel a little better. And I think if there was something that they were hoping would tip some of their guys towards staying I think Backlund being there for three more years and having the sea on his jersey it doesn't solve everything you still have to make deals with these players

but I think it makes everybody else feel a little bit better about where the team is going so you think that this might have a Pied Piper effect then? Sure, Toffoli went. He ends up with the New Jersey Devils. So that's one player who the Calgary Flames moved on from. But you think that this could portend well for, you mentioned Lindholm. I think a lot of us wonder about a couple of defensemen,

Hannafintanov, et cetera, Zdorov. You think it could have that sweeping of an effect? home i think a lot of us wonder about a couple of defensemen hannah finn tanov etc zadora if you think it could have that sweeping of an effect i think what it does jeff i don't want to come right out and say that because i don't think that's right because he's like i said you still have to make deals you have to make deals that people are happy with but i think what it does do is it makes all those players, including the guys who are still going to be there for longer, feel a lot better about the dressing room knowing that Backlund is going to be there.

If you do one thing that makes everybody feel a little bit better, it's getting this guy signed. Now, there's a couple of things that come out of this, though. Number one is that it shows you what Calgary is thinking. Backlund takes two times 4.5, which is a good contract. I'm not, you know, in any way saying that's a bad contract for Backlund. It's a good contract for Backlund at his age. But one thing it says to me is that the Flames are very conscious of term. So yesterday in my blog, or two days ago now, I guess, in my blog, like I'd said that Backlund was going to sign. We talked about it on the podcast. I'd

reported it. I wanted a new way of saying it. So I said, you know what, I'm just going to guess something here. Three times 5.5. And I got a couple of funny phone calls about that, but we'll get to that in a second. You know, obviously the flames came in lower than that. They came in at two times 4.5. And again, that's a very good deal for Backlund, but it's instructive to me that the flames are going to try to hold the line on term here. Backlund's in his mid-30s. He's in great shape. You know, that's one of the things Craig Conroy talked about at the press conference.

He's our captain. He's in the gym. When the captain's in the gym, the other players are in the gym. So he's basically saying that this is one of our best condition athletes. And I think he said like you know aside from mcginley he was always the guy who was at the top of the charts right so it's obviously everybody feels that you know he's capable of playing they're not worried about his health and his fitness but still he's 35 and the flames are going to hedge. And so what this says to me is, and I think Lindholm is different.

I think he's an eight-year guy regardless. But I think some of their older guys, like the Tanevs in them, they're going to say, look, we are going to hold the line a bit here on term. So we'll see where that goes. By the way, just one thing about Backlund's contract. From what I understand, it's a no-move clause. And even though his current one doesn't have it, if you're technically eligible for one, and he is, and you sign a new deal, you can add the no-move clause to your current contract. And they did that. So he's got a no-move clause now and a no-trade clause as well.

But on January 1st of the last year of his deal, so January 1st, 2026, while he keeps the no-moves, they can't put him on waivers, it becomes a 15-team no-trade. So there is some flexibility there at the end if both sides want it. That's an interesting note

about the Michael Backlund contract. You know, interesting with the Lindindholm deal if they get there uh and i that's a a huge if um like you mentioned that one i don't necessarily think that they're too concerned about term because i don't think that lindholm is looking for anything other than term yes his next deal you have a thought on how close or far apart, or do you have a spidey sense, or which way the wind is blowing, however you want to frame it,

about anything involving Lindholm and Calgary? You know, I want to be careful on this one. It was interesting. So Lindholm spoke at the Flames golf tournament, and he looked kind of, shall shall we say unenthusiastic and some people kind of took that as oh he doesn't he doesn't want to stay and i was told uh by a couple of people that it should not be interpreted that way it should be interpreted as more he doesn't want to talk about it

and doesn't like to talk about it. Like you saw Willie Nylander come out and say, look, I'm not talking about this again. And I wouldn't be surprised if at some point Lynn Holm does the same thing. I think he just doesn't want to talk about it. Look, I think they've talked to Lynn Holm. I think they really want to talk about it. Look, I think they've talked to Lindholm. I think they really want to get him done.

I just think that the number here, like I expected the number was about Horvat, and that's 8-5. I think it was higher than that, and I said it might be 8-7-5 or 9. And look, the team hasn't said this. The agents haven't said this. But there are some people wondering if that number might even be higher because you've got Huberto at 10 and a half, right? Yeah.

So, I mean, that's always a tricky thing for an organization to do. When a player comes in, they trade for a player, and he gets the big deal at 10 and a half, what do you do with the guys on your team who've been there for a while? So I think that's what the Flames are trying to juggle. I don't want to handicap this one. I don't want to make predictions right now. But I do think getting to the number here is going to be the thing that

Lynn Holmes camp at Newport and the flames are going to have to navigate. Here's what I wonder about here. One's an Elias and one's an Elias. I wonder about Pedersen. And I wonder if there's any symmetry here with the Calgary center in that it seems as if Pedersen in Vancouver very much wants to see what happens with the Vancouver Canucks.

Like he wants to see a winning path. I think, I think it's safe to say that's what he wants to see before he starts warming to a contract extension. I'm still firmly in the camp that he wants to win with the Vancouver Canucks, and that is plan A. Do we say the same thing about Lindholm here? Like I've been mentioning for anyone that bothers asking, I find the Calgary Flames to be the most interesting team in the NHL to kick

off this season. We all know what happened last year. And we all also know what the potential of everybody on this roster is, whether it's Huberto, whether it's Kadri, whether it's Uyghur, or most specifically, whether it's Markstrom, do you think Calgary's performance to start the season is in any way shape or form a factor in a Lindholm decision like we suspect it is with Pedersen in Vancouver I don't see how it couldn't be a factor like I don't want to put too much like I don't want to guess here on Linholm's motivations because I think after his first interview of the year that kind of happened a

little bit so I want to be careful but Jeff would you rather play for a team that looks like it's going to win or a team that looks like it's going to lose of course well I know you you don't care about winning you just want the biggest check so you could be different but i think a guy like lynn holm might feel otherwise okay i don't have that long quiet green in my pocket like you do my money makes noise when i walk down the street delhi that's the the difference between you and i by the way i i have to tell you you'll like this i got a call from someone yesterday and he goes, yeah, you got more angry phone calls or what? Yeah, I got, it was more funny. He says, he says, why are you guessing?

And I go, what do you mean? He says, why did you guess on Backlund? You never guess. And I said, I said, what I said to you is we've been talking about this for a few days. We know he's going to sign. It's going to get done. I just figured, you know, this might be what it is. He says, don't guess.

You shouldn't be guessing. And he says, look, because then if you're off, you look stupid. And either way, and if you're also off, the other, like one of the two sides, they're going to say, well, Elliot said this. Why didn't you get this? Or why isn't this deal this? I was like, you know, I want this to be fun. And he's like, this isn't fun, this is business.

I was like, okay. The nerves are already close to the skin in the industry. I love it. You know, it's fine. I had a conversation last night and some of the exhibition games were kind of like this too, Jeff. And well, I know we're going to talk about this, you know somebody said to me the stress level already is off the

charts in some of these teams like off the charts off the charts we're going to get to you know some of the hits here and and i do want to ask you your thoughts if you saw it on the ross johnson matt rempe fight of two giants uh going at it in the Islanders Rangers game. But you're right. There is that like there's like an intensity and then there's an intensity that borders on anxiety almost from one team. Normally, we don't see this until, I don't know, after the first couple of weeks of the season and you start to say, OK, man, these points are really important and these teams

are going for it. And now we're getting playoff hockey because no one wants to lose any ground because making up ground is so hard with three-point games, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. I don't want to make a sweeping generalization here, but every time I watch preseason hockey, I kind of already get that feeling, Elliot, that people already have an anxiety

about what's going to come in the season and it's playing itself out in preseason hockey. I don't think think you're wrong but let's dedicate ourselves to that in a few minutes is there anything else you want to say or ask about like you mentioned Toffoli from what I understand about Toffoli he wanted to know right away like he's been he's moved around a lot you know Kings Montreal Calgary and I think he wants some stability in terms of where he's gonna be and I think he wanted to know from the Flames are you gonna extend me now or not and when they said no I think he wanted to go and the Flames found a deal that they liked and I think that's a

really good place for Toffoli to be in this particular case i think some of these other guys were willing to wait so i think that's why you saw that move as opposed to any other ones but is there any other calgary thing that you want to touch on there's one really quick and it's just a bummer because i think we're all excited to see him start the season and that's jacob pelche and the shoulder injury and the surgery and out indefinitely and i was just like you know there are just some players that you're waiting for to see the you know to get a clean slate a breath of fresh air all of it to kick the season off jacob pelce was was one of those guys for me so no question attached here at all just it's a bummer like that's it like i i just hated to see it and and read that news that paul chee's gonna

be out with a uh with a shoulder injury that's all yeah that that is a bummer that that is a real bummer although he took a bit of a shot this week i mean it was boy it was it was interesting to see that i remember when that happened jeff yeah last year about what number is he out there? Yeah. Someone said to me, there isn't a player under 25 in the NHL who didn't hear that quote. Listen in the, and right now, and you talked about this, you know,

with the, with the Mike Babcock, Paul Bissonette and everything that happened in the Babcock situation. You know, you mentioned the idea that now more so than ever, players feel emboldened and have outlets to speak their mind more so than ever. I don't know that we've seen the last of this one. I know that Pelicic kind of threw it out there and said, I'm just joking. I'm just joking.

I'm just joking. And whether it's Calgary or other teams or whomever or wherever, I think that this is going to very much be a thing in the NHL continuing. We saw it to your point with Pelletier. I think there's going to be more. A couple of other things. One, there's a hidden star out there. But first, I want to talk to you about patrick kane yeah and the patrick kane video that caa put out the workout video we all know about the hip resurfacing surgery going back to june the first we've all speculated on teams and we're having a look at you know which high level teams are

leaving cap space open to accommodate someone like patrick kane i want to get to a undercover star of the game that nobody has talked about, maybe until right now. But first, your thoughts on that video and Patrick Kane. So Dr. Merrick, when you watched him, what did you think?

I don't, I hate playing doctor. The only thing I hate more than me being asked to play doctor is officials being asked to play doctor and judge whether it's an injury on the play doctor is officials being asked to play doctor and judge whether it's an injury on the play. How are they supposed to know? They're doctors. They're not taking this player into surgery. They're just making a call. I don't know. He looked good. He looked really good. I don't know. I'm not a doctor, so I'm not looking for anything

specifically, but I look at it with my eye and say Kane looks good to go and he's going to be a you know contributing member to whichever team has the the cap space to sign him well I'm not a doctor but I stayed at a holiday inn last night no you know what what someone said to me was and you know obviously it's it's put out by the agency that's their job CAA there to make sure that Kane looks good and teams see that he looks good but what so I texted one team and I said you know like what are you looking for here when you look at this video what what from a team point of view are you thinking and the number one thing that they said was does he look confident in his way he's moving like is he moving gingerly if you can you tell facial expressions like I wouldn't be surprised here if people are like trying to like zoom in on his face and see is he grimacing like how does he look while he's doing this and it makes a lot of sense

to me and so I tried to watch that he definitely looks confident like I didn't see anything in that video that said to me he's ginger or he's afraid to do something I also Jeff you know I watch athletes doing lunge lunges and I try to check is my lunge form good like when I'm doing lunges am I doing because when I used to work CFL on CBC David Benefield who was a great CFL player he saw me working out once and he he said you have good lunge form and this was like the greatest compliment I ever received yes when I when I when a tremendous CFL player tells you that you're like wow like I this is I am not known for my fitness so this was this was huge so I have good lunge form still but I you know I I just I looked at him and I I saw a guy

who seems confident now there's still time to go here and teams will obviously want to see much more strenuous workouts like we've seen situations before where injured players like in baseball there'll be a pitcher who's injured and they'll say look I'm gonna have a day down in Arizona or Florida where I'm gonna pitch and all the teams come down and watch like I wonder if that's gonna happen or maybe he's to do some private workouts or skates. But like, just that's what I was looking for yesterday. So I want to talk about a quiet star. A quiet star amongst the players.

So when you see summer skate videos, okay. One of the things that I'm always curious about is who's the goalie specifically obviously if it's not an nhl goaltender who's the goalie they're using and there's a guy by the name of julian syme who's from mississauga played a couple years in the ohl with north bay he's played for the university of waterloo He's, I want to say like 25 or 26 years old. Julian Syme is the goaltender in that Patrick Kane video. He's on the ice. Now I've asked someone about him who knows him, who says, and I think by the way, Connor McDavid has used him, I believe in solo sessions before as well

so like when you have like patrick kane and conor mcdavid like using you like there's something there so the question is well what's there about this guy like why is he in such demand for these solo skates for elite level nhl players in ontario and what i was told is he has a, an incredible positive attitude, which is key, obviously, when you're going to be the goalie. A, no one wants to just, you know, have a guy who's a glorified shooter tutor. They want someone that comes with, you know, some energy and positivity. And two, he never quits on a puck. Like he's not an NHL goaltender, but he never gives up. Like, I'm sure you've seen plenty of skates where the goalie is just kind of going through the motions. He has this incredible work ethic, and you combine that with this positive attitude that he has.

The guys apparently love it. And this guy gets called a lot. His name is Julian Syme. He's in his middle 20s, played at University of Waterloo, a couple of games with North Bay in the OHL. And just, I'm always curious, like, which goaltender pops up? And in that Kane video, and here's your trivia question for the day, everybody. The goalie's name is Julian Syme. That's a good one, Jeff.

Sneaky undercover star amongst the superstars in the NHL. That's really good, Jeff. That's a great story. Neat. Just, oh, by the way, like Kane, I know there's been reports about Detroit. I really wonder about Buffalo. Yeah, I do.

I also wonder about Florida. Like that seems like the kind of gamble that Bill Zito would like to make. How do you feel, just a quick aside, how do you feel about Florida like that seems like the kind of gamble that Bill Zito would like to make how do you feel just a quick aside how do you feel about Florida this year we all know about Ekblad and Montour to kick off the season and the challenges with the with the back end right now they don't look anything like they did last season there's going to be a lot placed on a lot of players that you know didn't have those roles um last. I know that someone like Gustav Forsling had a really good season last year,

but there's going to be more expected of him. Oliver Ekman-Larsen, essentially. Mike Riley. You have a quick thought on what you expect from Florida? I think they showed us last year it's foolhardy to count them out. I'm very curious to see what the defense is going to be like because of those things you mentioned.

The one thing that I really like for them and for him at the start of this year is that Spencer Knight is back and he seems to be in a really good place. He's played, he's played not bad in his first game you know he did an interview with Ken Campbell where he talked about his OCD and and how he's learning to manage it or deal with it and you root for people like that who come back from from time away but from a pure hockey point of view one thing we learned last year is Bobrovsky is

much better when he gets rest. If you have someone who can limit the amount of games that Bobrovsky plays, he's a much, much better goalie. And for Florida with this defensive challenge at the top of the year, then I kind of look at it as that night playing could really make Bobrovsky better. And that's good news for the Panthers. Absolutely. Okay, bouncing around a couple more topics around the NHL.

We know that there's going to be an interesting free agent class should they get there this offseason for blue liners. And that might be headlined by Devon Taves. What's the latest there with Colorado? The Avalanche are tight. The agent here, Ross Gurney, has been tight.

You know, they're in the middle of this. They're trying to see if they can get something done. Taves himself has indicated that he doesn't necessarily want it to go on during the season season and I've said many times now my history with that is if it's going well the player says keep talking if it's not going well the player says stop and right now as far as I can tell they're still talking so someone said to me and I was talking to just these are non-Colorado, non-TAVES agent people. And they really believe that the number here

that is the problem in this negotiation is 30. And that is what TAVES will turn in February. And they said that an organization like Colorado, he guarantees, like this is his, it's a Charles Barkley guarantee. And Barkley's guarantees are always wrong. So I hope this is better than that, but I think it's right. They think the Avalanche, who are a really smart organization, don't want to go long term. who are a really smart organization don't want to go long-term. And this is kind of the industry thought around the NHL,

is that the Avalanche don't want to go more than five years if they can avoid it. And the problem with that is that if your TAVs, and let's just say for argument's sake, you're willing to take a three or five year deal or four, three, four, five, maybe six year deal, Jeff, that's a big number. Yes, it is. That is a really, really big number. Like if your TAVs, you know, you know you're like and again i want to be very clear about this this is not coming from either of the two camps here this is you call around you try to

figure out what people are thinking like you've got to think that taves is thinking what let's What? Let's just say lower end. Eight times seven, seven times eight, something like that, right? Yep. But just below Makar. Yeah, below Makar. Like, the guy's the best defenseman in the NHL. I think everybody understands that. Okay, so let's just say you're signing a five-year deal. Let's just say, like, how do you do that if you're tased in Colorado?

So what other teams believe the issue is here, knowing the way Colorado operates, is term. Because the lower the term, the higher the AAV. And that's going to be really hard for Colorado to get there. And that's what people believe the issue is here is they're not convinced because Taves is going to be 30 that Colorado wants to do Max turn. Well, I mean the one of the challenges that they're going to have is not necessarily next season, but the season after when Rantanen is done, when that contract is up, like they're going to have is not necessarily next season, but the season after when Rantanen's done,

when that contract is up. Like, they're projecting out. And I know we still have a few more years of Kael McCarr, too. But, like, eventually, we keep waiting for this. Like, eventually, something has to give on this blue line, doesn't it? Like, Taves is due this big raise. Byram is, you know, the way that he's progressing. He's going to be up in a couple of years. One more after this season.

Don't you get the feeling that something here eventually has to give? Like there's only so high the salary cap is going to go up. Yeah, you have to make your choices, right? And look, I hope this all works out for Colorado and Taves. Like he's been great for them and they've been great for him. It's one of the best offensive pairs in the NHL, probably the best offensive pair in the NHL. And I,

I really, I really love watching them play together. And I, I have no doubt that in a perfect world, everybody wants to make this marriage continue. But like, you know, like you just ask around like what the

big challenge is and i i think that's what it is and you know watch like we'll drop this podcast and you'll sign eight times eight and everybody's like you're a moron don't guess dom take it out dom take it out no no no dom leave it in make me look dumb but you know again like you you try to call around to ask what's you know what's everybody thinking here and uh i think that you know teams who kind of kind of understand the way the avalanche work that's what they think is the is the biggest question here all right uh hits and fights before we get to uh hodgson stone before we get to posthusel and perfetti did you see ross johnson and matt i did not see that one on wednesday night i was in georgetown ontario for the georgetown hockey heritage dinner and one of the things they do there is they honor a uh a

volunteer um or someone who's been done a great job locally in hockey and the honoree this time his name was uh jay anderson uh who's been a coach there in or in the area in the region for two decades it was a really nice event but as a result i missed a lot of the early games on wednesday i'm gonna have to check this out i saw the late ones like I saw the Mark Stone Hayden Hodgson I saw that was a nasty game between Anaheim and San Jose Radko Gudis and Alex Killorn's hit on Philip Zedina like there were a lot of mean games on Wednesday night it's been mean all week like uh you know uh, I mean, Johnson and Rempe from a couple of nights ago,

like that's some heavyweights. And I haven't seen anyone catch Ross Johnson the way that Rempe did, who, by the way, stands in there at 6'8". Oh man, the Rangers fans already love this guy. But let's get into a couple of things here because I want to get to some audio from Mark Stone. What did you make of the Hodgson-Stone incident?

Two for roughing for Hodgson. Hodgson, by the way, was part of the Proveroff deal. What did you make of the hit, the situation, the reaction, all of it? Well, I heard the Vegas commentary. They were not very impressed. Look, do you remember when Denny Gauthier hit Jeremy Roenick a few years ago? Of course. And Roenick was furious about it?

The preseason hit. So I remember at the time asking players what they thought. And they thought veterans should not be hitting veterans in preseason games unless the veterans really deserved it. Unless Roenick did something to really deserve it. They felt that veterans should not be doing that to other players. When I first saw the play, Jeff, if that happened 20 years ago, there'd be body bags at that game. The game would still be going on Elliot like that shows you when people say how much has hockey changed that to me is a

perfect example of how hockey has changed because as you said 20 years ago they'd still be finishing the third period after they figured out who was getting ejected and who was getting arrested that's one way that hockey has really changed a lot. And not everybody thinks it's for the good. But, you know, I remember at the time, even the veterans said to me, if you've got a young player, and Hodgson, he's not a young player, but he's a player who's trying to make himself a job. Like, this is a guy who played, what, five years in the minors

before he got his first NHL game in Philadelphia. So he knows he's got to do something out there for the Kings to notice him, especially a team with as many players battling for spots, including top prospects like the Kings do. Even some veterans at that time grudgingly admitted that that's what that kid's got to do. Now, if I was Vegas, I'd be furious.

If I was Mark Stone, I'd be furious. But, you know, the one thing people even admitted to me, and this was veterans who said this, was that kid's got to get noticed and as long as the hit isn't illegal that's what he's got to do again i i don't want to keep doing this all season long like auditing hits where was the puck and all that but it's a legal hit elliot but i'll tell you this if i was the golden knights i wouldn't like that at all like that's my captain he's been injured i i would be furious so furious because you thought it was a bad hit or you thought that given who mark stone is his position in the game the fact that it's a pre-season game

he should be ineligible to be hit comma or, or maybe to be hit like that by that player. You know, I don't even really have an answer to what you're posing me. Like, probably most people look at it like, do you like the Kings? Do you like the Golden Knights? Do you like hitting or not? Like, that probably is how most people fall on this.

Like, I'm just saying, if i'm in the golden knight shoes here i i'm just my hair is on fire right now because if anything happens to stone like that could be your season and you're thinking that you're probably thinking that mark stone is deserving of of great greater respect than that but if you're the Kings and you're Rob Blake, and you know Rob Blake was one of the best hitters of his generation, you're like, hey, it's the NHL. Like, you know, when you go on the ice, that can happen to you if you've got the puck.

And so, like, again, I think it totally comes down to where you stand on those questions I just asked. I know why Hodgson did it. I know how the Golden Knights feel. I think if it's veteran against veteran, it shouldn't happen. But in the preseason, player trying to get a job, that's going to happen. And that's a player who has a history of hitting. that's going to happen.

He is going to, and that's a player who has a history of hitting. I didn't realize until I Wikipedia'd him that he'd been suspended in the OHL for an illegal hit, which that was not. So, you know, he's a hitter. And in true Mark Stone fashion, Elliot, afterwards, in front of the microphone, Stone delivered gold. Stick together. That's probably the last time

I'll ever play against that guy. Not really much of a player, so leave it at that. I think I scared him a little, didn't I? No, I... Honestly, I was looking around for some of their talented players and trying to run at them,

and he was really the only one. So it's unfortunate you're playing against a team like that. They're trying to make a name for themselves and losing preseason. That's Brant Clark that he's scared. Yes, correct. Yeah, he grabbed Brant Clark.

Well, in some ways, if I was Brant Clark, I would feel that that was a compliment on some level. If you're Brant Clark, you're like, I didn't even hit the guy. Why am I getting grabbed by Mark Stone? You know what? Some people were ripping Stone for that quote. My feeling is, as you know, you can't complain hockey players are boring

and then complain when they tell you exactly what they think. As far as I'm concerned, if that's what Stone feels, let him say it. The one I didn't like, though, on Wednesday night was Pospisil from Calgary on Cole Perfetti. That hit should not be in the game. You know, it's interesting, too, because Pospisil has hit Perfetti like that before in previous times in the American Hockey League

in a Stockton-Manitoba game. So I don't know if there's something there between the two, but, you know, it happens a second time. You say to yourself, hmm, is there something to this combination of Pospisil and Perfetti? I'm like you. That's just a... That should not be there.

That should not be allowed to happen. It's a guy that said, look, I can get a lick in here on another player, and I'm going to take it. I didn't like i didn't like it either no puck to the head perfetti's had concussion issues it was all bad well and that's just it and like you know technically he just came off ir going back to to late february like and he's one of those players that were watching the winnipeg jets and were saying okay who's going to take pierre lu Dubois' spots? I think we've all circled Cole Perfetti here. Just like I mentioned Jacob Pelche earlier in the podcast and wanted to

see what kind of season he's going to have and derailed by the shoulder injury. I have high hopes for Cole Perfetti in Winnipeg. So you just don't want to see that happen to anybody, regardless of what type of season you think they might have. I just felt horrible for Perfetti in that situation. But again, I'll go back to it. It's not the first time between these two. We'll see if there's some there there. Yeah, that's one of the ones the league has to police.

Don't need that. Don't need that. That Anaheim-San Jose game was wild last night too. If I had Radko Gudis coming at me like that. Don't need that. That Anaheim San Jose game was, was wild last night too. If I had Radko Gudis coming at me like that. Oh boy. Yeah. I would, I would run to the other side of the planet.

Like that's what I would do. You just start digging a hole and bury yourself. I'm out of here. I am done. Speaking of the Anaheim ducks, anything new with Drysdale? Anything new with Zegras? And I just, again, it's, it's one of those things you're so careful to talk about, Jeff,

because especially at this time of year, things can change with one phone call. But it just didn't sound optimistic. Like nobody I was talking to was optimistic about it. Like the team just doesn't seem like they're going to budge. Zegers just doesn't seem like they're going to budge. I don't think Drysdale wants to budge either. Again, I've said this before. Like the thing with Pinto,

people understand that the Senators are trying to win and they're capped out. They've got to find a way to solve this problem because they need them. But they're trying to win and they're capped out. Anaheim's not trying to win this year and they're definitely not capped out they've got to find a way to solve this problem because they need them but they're trying to win and they're capped out Anaheim's not trying to win this year and they're definitely not capped out and while again I feel like I'm a broken record it doesn't mean you have to you know fill their car trunks with cash you know I think you have to be you have to find a way to get a solid ground and someone just told me that anaheim's just risking just risking something here and i i would be very careful with that if i were the ducks like i you

know verbeek's tough we've jokingly called him eiserman light before i think on some level, he manages like he played. And this is a guy who was a freaking great player, a really tough player, a guy who if you were between him and what he needed to do to win a game or win a playoff series or win a Stanley Cup as he did in Dallas, he would do anything he could just to run right over you and win the battle for that puck. And I kind of wonder if he's bringing that same successful mentality to the GM role. And I'm just not sure if you can do that in this day and age. This level of athlete they don't just blindly accept it right you you can negotiate hard and you can demand a high standard but you also have to be able to recognize that you have to

bend in certain ways too and verbica is a player he never bent on anything I mean we're talking about a guy who once severed his finger in a farming accident and just kept on going so you know I just think that I just look at this and I say sometimes you need to bend a bit more than you like to, to get players on your team to buy into what you're selling. You don't have to bend a ton, but you have to bend a little bit. And I just wonder if he's just not interested in doing that. We'll see where it goes. I want to credit Matthew Joseph because this is not easy for him. He's playing good.

He knows he's in the middle of all of this. Yeah. And he came out and he played. Like, veterans can coast through the first week. Like, there's almost like a built-in excuse. But, like, this is a guy with a guaranteed contract. He played well against Toronto on Monday. He played well again on Wednesday.

He scored two goals. Like, this is a guy who's coming out and saying, there's no coasting here. I know what's going on around me. And he's taking care of his business. And him and his brother must have had a great summer because, you know, Pittsburgh's got some questions at the bottom of their D.

What are they going to do there? And Pierre Olivier has gotten singled out sullivan for the way he started so good on the joseph brothers they've come out very nicely here elliot the news is bad for the tampa bay lightning the news is bad for andre vasilevsky back surgery expected to miss the first two months of the season for the tampa bay lightning jonas johansson is now your number one goaltender for the Tampa Bay Lightning. Yeah, that's wild to say. When I hear you say it, it really... Well, listen, you're wondering now about goalie waivers, right?

Well, you know, Tampa really doesn't have a lot of room. But yes, goalie waivers is one of the first things I thought of. Like the Calgary fans are, oh, okay, maybe Dan Vladar gets traded there. I just don't see how Tampa makes that work. And also, this is not exactly a team with a plethora of draft picks here. No. Calgary's not going to be giving Dan Vladar

to the Tampa Bay Lightning. They're going to want a nice price for him. to the Tampa Bay Lightning. They're going to want a nice price for him. And, you know, Tampa doesn't have that cupboard of picks anymore. So I'm not so sure that, for example, that I don't necessarily think that's a fit. But I mean, listen, cap space issues too. Like it's not as if Andre Vasilevsky is not coming back.

He is coming back so any goaltender yet you're getting here has to kind of come at a bargain yes you're you're completely right about this that is absolutely true it's not like he's out for the year you've got to make room for his cap hit when he's ready two months into the season. You know, this is a reminder that you should always pay, and when I say you, I include myself in this, you have to be so careful about what people say. Like John Cooper the other day was asked about Vasilevsky, and he said, we're not concerned about this being a long-term thing for now. Maybe I'm not quoting him exactly right but he basically said we're not concerned for now well for now hang on can you tell can you tell that john is a lawyer

yes a good one obviously but what that should have put our antenna up like i was kind of thinking about this after it's over like i like all of us should have been like, including myself, like for now, what does for now mean? For now it's 24 hours in this particular case. Because the next day, like I think this, like whatever was bothering or that surgery corrected, Tampa and Vasilevsky were hoping all summer that, you know, rehab and rest and whatever work he does would solve the problem. Like, I believe that was the plan.

Just treat it the way you need to treat it minus surgery. And we think we should be OK here or we hope we're going to be OK here. we should be okay here or we hope we're going to be okay here and I think the idea was and I'm hearing this second hand is that if we got to this point it still wasn't fixed then you fixed it at the start of the season so that you don't have to do it later like if you're going to do the surgery you do it now as opposed to later well that, that's ultimately what happened. They just got to a point where it wasn't working. He wasn't comfortable. He wasn't able to go. And now they're going to be out. And you're right. People aren't going to make it easy on the Lightning to do this. I have no doubt they're going to look at the waiver wire. There are people out there who are predicting that the lightning are going to drop this year

i don't buy that i still think they're too good and they're too talented but you know this is one of the few teams jeff that really lets their starting goaltender play like you remember in the playoffs last year they were game there were games they were getting blown out against toronto yeah coming out and derrick lalone would say on the panel yeah you guys are nuts if you think he's going to allow himself to be taken out of this game like i'd be sitting there saying take him out kevin and kelly and jennifer would be sitting there saying take him out and lalone would look at us and say you you guys are nuts. Like, you don't know who you're dealing with this year. So it's not only that they're losing their number one guy, it's their number one guy who takes more workload

than anybody else. And the Lightning may say they're not going to do anything. I don't buy that. I understand why they're saying that, but I can't imagine, Jeff, they're not going to be looking to see what's out there. Here's what I come to on the Tampa Bay Lightning. Again, we always say don't, you know,

it's always the fool that bets against Tampa. I get all that. But if there's one player that they cannot afford to lose, it's the guy they just lost. We've seen Tampa succeed while losing nikita kucherov in the regular season steven stamkos has had his injuries he's been fine anthony sorelli ditto uh braden point like we've seen uh victor headman like we've seen the tampa bay lightning survive with big injuries to key forwards and key defensemen.

But Vasilevsky's different, Elliot. Vasilevsky is completely different. You can make the case that in this star-studded lineup of Kucherovs and Stamkoses and Hedmans and Sorelles, etc., the MVP is the goaltender. How many times have we said that? How many times have the guys on the team said that? He's the guy. He's the one that makes this all work.

That's the thing that if you're looking for the Tampa Bay Lightning to take a step back, that's the one guy they can't afford to lose. That's why this is so concerning. To say nothing of, we all know what back injuries are like. That's why this one is, this one, this one one I'm not prepared just to shrug off and say, you know what, it's Tampa, they'll be fine. It's Andre Vasilevsky, man. I don't know.

I'm not feeling good about this one. And that's why I don't believe them when they say or indicate they're going to stand still. I just, it's not the way Julian Breezeball and the Lightning are wired. They are wired to win. And I think they're going to be smart about it. Like you said, Vasilevsky's coming back,

so you can't do anything that warps you into trouble. But I just find it hard to believe they're not going to scour for some move that they think is really smart. Minutes played last year. He was fifth. But, you know, if you go through the last five years, Minutes played, he's second. Only Hellebuck has played more. He's played 20,000 minutes in the last five regular seasons. And that doesn't even count all the playoff games that he's played. Like, if you take a look in the last five years,

the top 10 goalies in minutes played are Hellebuck, Vasilevsky, Markstrom, Bobrovsky, Gibson, Fleury, Frederick Anderson, Martin Jones, Saros, and Jonathan Quick. In that time, you know, you go into playoffs and you add his minutes there. In the last five years, he has played almost double the minutes of number two, who's Marc-Andre Fleury. He's at 6,100 minutes, and Fleury's at 33.

And so, like, I know it's not the playoffs, but it's really going to be a different world for them. Okay, finish up here before we get to the Montana's Thought Line. Spencer Martin and the Vancouver Canucks. Yeah yeah so tweeted this out earlier on Thursday uh he's going on waivers I think they talked to a couple teams about him like Colorado knows him and they've got an injury situation there with Fransos and Columbus I think may have been another one because they've got an injury situation there with Tarasov so I think those two teams have talked to Vancouver, but he's going on waivers or he went on waivers,

and we'll see where this goes. You know, really a shame. Like you'll remember when Martin played that, when he first came up to Vancouver and got an NHL shot, he was standing on his head when they were a little bit desperate. But unfortunately, last year didn't go very well. He looks like he's been passed on the depth chart. And, you know, it just seems to me like player and organization

both need a fresh start here. So hopefully he gets it. Elliot, speaking of waivers, Ty Smith of the Pittsburgh Penguins on waivers as well, to which you say what? I was surprised. Maybe I shouldn't have been, but I was surprised. Look, Ty Smith is not making a big number this year.

He's at 775, and at the end of the season, he's a restricted free agent without Arbright's. And I had heard that he had struggled in some of their early games in the preseason. Joseph had played really well. I knew Pittsburgh was thinking about what do we do with the bottom of our defense? I think there were jobs to be won and lost. And I would be shocked if somebody doesn't take a flyer on Smith. You know, one of the things here I clearly wonder is if you go back to last year, like

this is a guy who was on the all-rookie team a couple of years ago, Jeff. Yeah. And last year, how many games did he play in the NHL? Under 10, sir. Yes. There were questions about like his AAV last year was 1.26 and there were some people who were saying it was performance related there was also some people saying that the Penguins were so tight to the cap they couldn't even really put him on their roster like the Penguins had some real issues last year

there was a situation with Ruda where he was getting healthy and they were having trouble fitting him onto the cap like they were doing all sorts of cap gymnastics but one of the things I think the Penguins did here was by putting him on waivers now he's going to get a chance to get a fresh exhibition season start somewhere else. Like if they wait till next week to do this, you know, I think someone's going to take Smith, but I think it's going to be harder for them to crack the roster. And part of me wonders if Smith is just going to be saying, look, ever since I got traded to Pittsburgh, it was a trade that obviously didn't work out for the Penguins. He spent most of last year in the minors. he probably saw the writing on the wall right now i am betting that for a player like this to end up on waivers this

soon it's a combination of the player wanting you know what this isn't working for me i'd like to go somewhere else and the team just saying you know what this isn't going to work for us either that's kind of what it looks like to me yeah i um i don't want to make my mind up about ty smith quite yet he's still a young defenseman i know some people think like hang on he's already 23 years old we should have our mind made up about him but he's he's still young um still lots of opportunity ahead i believe for ty smith i just can't help but wonder, and this has always been, you've heard me go on about this before, Elliot, a little sort of pet peeve of mine, specifically about defensemen. And I know that there are outliers and guys that can do it,

but overwhelmingly, when you consider that position in the NHL, I always feel that no matter how high a draft pick you are as a defenseman, it's always a good idea to start your pro career in the American Hockey League and spend some time there. What do we always hear about the American Hockey League? Oh, it's the defense finishing school. It's really hard to jump in from junior hockey. He played Spokane right into the NHL, and that's what Ty Smith did. I know initially it looked really good.

I just can't help but thinking, could this player have been better served spending some time in the American League before joining the National Hockey League? I always wondered that specifically about blue liners I know you've heard me go on about it before you have a thought on that philosophy I know they're outliers but generally my defensemen are going to the AHL you know I mean also too like it's I call it the Rutherford rule because he's one of the big champions of it. Ty Smith at the pro level has played 162 games.

Yep. 123 at the NHL level and 39 in the American Hockey League. Now, look, he's not the biggest guy, and there are some people who question his skating, but I think it's way too soon to write him off. Way too soon to write him off. I think, too, like, I've just got to wonder about Smith. There's no question in my mind, Jeff, he wants to make a team look good for trading for him, right?

Of course. Like, there were a lot of people in my timeline today when I tweeted out there that Smith was on waivers. They were all bringing up the trade Marino for Smith and I guarantee you because I think any competitor would be like this you want to make that trade look good for the team that traded for you right and now he can probably see this isn't going to work for him here and he's going to have at least not right now and he's going to have to listen to this some more like at least the start of the year it's going to be all more of uh what a this trade didn't work for the penguins like this just did not work for the penguins and at the very least what i'm sure he's thinking is if you guys don't believe in me just give me a chance to go somewhere that might so i can try to change this narrative i know that's

how i would feel and i gotta think that's how he feels hey speaking of goaltenders on waivers you know last year i think uh what we talked about here on the podcast we wondered about seattle with joey decord, what would happen there. He cleared and ended up going down. Do you have a thought on the Buffalo situation quickly here? I think there are some, even though he does carry, you know, for a backup goaltender, maybe a hefty price tag. But I think that there are some that wonder if Buffalo ends up waiving him considering it's going to be the Devin Levi

show and Ukapeka Lukanen that someone may claim him do you think that is a legitimate concern if you're the Buffalo Sabres I I do um I wonder about Lukanen's future there like last year Levi told the Sabres he wasn't turning pro unless there was a path to the NHL for him and the Sabres understood that and he was dynamite and I watched a little bit of his game the other night and he looked really good again like that kid looks ready you never know what can happen but that kid looks ready the guy i wonder about darren buffalo is lukin in i wonder if buffalo's thinking here that and you're right like if comrie goes on waivers i mean i hope he doesn't just because i'm tired of seeing that guy get claimed on waivers i'm sure he's the same way. But I wonder if Buffalo's thinking Levi Comrie

and how do we make this work? Like one of the things that teams say to me is you're very strategic in training camp about when you put goalies on waivers. Because you know there's more of a chance you're going to lose those guys than anyone else. So when do you put your goalie on waivers that you have to put on waivers like you know like Toronto's going to go through this with

Martin Jones yep like does he stay or does he go on waivers um you know Calgary's going to have an interesting one here with Dustin Wolfe he doesn't need waivers teams really try to figure out when is the right time so that's always the big challenge do it when every goaltender is healthy that's when you do it don't do it when there's an injury do it when everyone's at the peak of their health Elliot that's the only time you can try to sneak one down there. Okay. That's what they try to do. We'll hit a break.

We're going to come back with the Montana's Thought Line, some interesting questions and voicemails, and also Evander Kane from the Oilers, Mikhail Sergachev from the Tampa Bay Lightning. 32 Thoughts continues. Elliot, before we get to our interviews today, that is Mikhail Sergeyev of the Lightning and Evander Kane of the Edmonton Oilers. Time for the Montana's Thought Line,

Montana's Barbecue and Bar, Canada's home for barbecue. Elliot, your tag is? Try the ribs. Try the deep fried pickles. We have to change it soon, but try the ribs. Okay, your ribs for now, and i'm sticking with my fried pickles 32 thoughts at sportsnet.ca is the email 1-833-311-3232

simon submits a question about finnish coaches uh i'm writing to you from edinburgh scotland with the time change i miss out on a lot of north american sports so i watch old youtube videos to fill the void i was watching some old world junior highlights and reminded of a thought that often crosses my mind. Finland always does well at the international level, even when they're outskilled. They always find a way to medal or threaten for a medal. They're always well coached. Why do you think it is that a Finnish coach hasn't stuck in the NHL in recent years? It seems like the constant carousel of coaches takes precedent over someone taking a chance.

I figured, especially with a team like Columbus, who has a tie to Finland with their general manager, Jarmo Kekkalainen, and one of their top players, Patrick Laine, they might have taken a chance, but they ended up going in a different direction that obviously didn't work out. Any thoughts or information on this would be awesome.

Love the show. Thanks for keeping me in the loop. We have seen Finnish coaches, well, a Finnish coach in the NHL with the Blackhawks in 2000, Alpo Suonen, once upon a time, was an assistant with the Jets and with the Maple Leafs with Pat Quinn as well. I think the bigger question here is, Elliot,

when will we see more European head coaches in the league? We also had Ivan Halinka, the Czech coach, who coached Pittsburgh. So it's happened there. Teams have started to interview more of these people. And I think it comes down to, number one, and like I think it comes down to number one there's so much pressure now who's taking the leap you have to be a really secure person and I'm talking about someone who's only been in Europe like if it's a Finnish coach who comes into North America or a European coach who comes in to North America and wins playing or a North

American style in North America I think that would be different but I think to bring someone over who coaches maybe on international surface coaches an international game like like I will tell you this when Ralph Kruger came in to coach edmonton and buffalo one of the critiques of kruger's coaching you know was that he played a system that couldn't work in north america so like people said kruger was an excellent organizer he had a good rapport with key players. People really liked him, but they felt his system didn't work. And one of the things in Edmonton they said in particular was it just didn't defend certain areas of the ice. Because the ice is so much wider in Europe or worldwide, there were places he would defend there

that he tried to defend here or places he wouldn't defend there that he didn't try to defend here that just didn't make any sense. So that to me is the biggest challenge. But I also think now, you know, how many head coaching hires do you get now? Most GMs, two? Oh, the trigger does seem quicker for general managers. I've always felt

that most managers should get three hires. That is a number that I pull out arbitrarily. And that's just because that's the way that I feel. But that's, I've always sort of used the three coach rule for managers. After the third coach, you take it's going to take someone to take the leap and for it to work yeah if halinka and suhanan had been more successful this wouldn't even be a question like i remember john davidson before i worked on hockey night he told a story about talking to suhanan and he said when do you think how long do you think it's going to take for your system to work and suing and told him i think the whole year and davidson was like what like the whole year like that's that's a that's a lot to ask of your owner or your manager so you don't have there's how many teams i mean there's a couple right now that can be patient enough to burn a year, but there aren't many like that. You're right.

It's going to take one to be successful, and then the floodgates open. You look what happened after Bruce Boudreau came up from Hershey to Washington and had success and got the Capitals into the playoffs. How quickly did everyone start saying, who do we have down there? Who's our AHL coach? And can they be a candidate here for graduation?

You're right, Elliot. All it's going to take is one, and that person has to be successful. All right. Time for a voicemail. Brett in Weston, Massachusetts. Hi, guys. This is Brett from Weston, Massachusetts, just outside the great city of Boston, city of champions. I had a question about the interview you guys did with Troy Terry a few weeks ago.

He said that before the night of the arbitration, the guys went out to dinner together with Pat Verbeek. And I'm wondering who picks up the tab for that dinner, not just because I'm curious, but because here in the States, in the NCAA, you can't give anyone a cracker without cracking down by the league. So is that considered a player benefit for which the league has to be responsible or the club has to be responsible or can they just split the tab or does the agent pick it up because he's trying to lay some good groundwork for the deal anyway appreciate all you guys do great show thanks so jeff i thought it was a little bit gauche to go to the two parties here and ask who paid like that's I wasn't I wasn't crazy about

posing that question so I didn't but what I can tell the questioner here is that it's not the same thing as the NCAA obviously obviously. It's pros. Terry's been a pro for a significant amount of time. That's business. Like, there's not going to be any illegal benefit here that the docs are providing if they were the ones who paid for dinner. Now, if, say, for example, Troy Terry was living at Pat Verbeek's guest house for a discounted rate, yes yes that could be a problem under the salary cap but buying a dinner that's that's not going to be an issue good question fun question though okay thanks to everyone for contributing and again 32 thoughts at sportsnet.ca 1-833-311-3232 those are the ways to get in touch with us here on the Montana's Thought Line, Montana's Barbecue and Bar, Canada's home for barbecue.

Let's get to our interviews. Mikhail Sergachev, defenseman for the Tampa Bay Lightning. You're going to get a chance to hear him in a couple of moments. But in the meantime, to talk to us about the Edmonton Oilers and the, checks notes, Atlanta Thrashers, here's Evander Cain. Evander, first of all, thanks for doing this. Second of all, everyone pretty much who's sat in that chair, no, actually everybody, has talked about cup or bust.

This is the best version of the Oilers that we've seen. How do you feel about this team and the expectations? Yeah, I think ever since I got to edmonton um i think a lot of the guys in that room that's been their mentality um obviously now this being my third season with the oilers um and having the playoff success and and not getting to the ultimate goal uh these last couple years has driven that mentality a little bit. I think everybody's of the same mindset of we've got to get the job done this year. When you look back at Vegas, I've asked a few. Eichel said he thought depth was the difference.

Dreisaitl said that we just did a couple of small things that really cost us the series, and that was the difference. When you look back, what do you think was the difference? Yeah, I mean, I've had a lot of playoff series against Vegas in my career and I was probably more aware than anybody the type of team they are and how good they are transition wise and they can score goals you know obviously we can score goals but they have some firepower that can put the puck in the net and I think we got in especially the games we lost we got into a little bit too much running gun uh with them and and like I said they're probably the best transition team in the

league believe it or not so you know I think too they're it's funny their starting goalie gets hurt and in a way that helps them you know it's sometimes when you have a different look in the net it gives your team a a different uh look and a feel on the ice and maybe in a series. And obviously their goaltender was a big reason why they beat us and then obviously went on to win the Stanley Cup. But I kind of agree with Leon a little bit. The mistakes we made and the goals that we gave up were just too easy. And that's something I think we're going to be looking to eliminate a

little bit more from our game you know listening to you there the most interesting thing for me is when I hear run and gun and I agree with you I think Vegas is a hell of a team but when I think run and gun I don't think there should be anybody who would be better at that than the Oilers yeah I mean like I said that's that's a that's a perspective for most people and most hockey fans that probably watch our team and then you look at the people that we have on the roster, you would think that and not to say we aren't a very good running gun team, we are, but it's a dangerous game you can play and if the other tender is hot and you're not putting the puck in the net down on that side

of the ice, well, the other team's coming back down your throat. And like I said, Vegas has been known for probably since they've entered the league to be one of the best transition teams. So they showed that in that series. Jeff, he just called me dumb. I'm kind of a... Listen, Evander says before, if you think that Elliot's dumb, don't feel special. Don't feel special. Why've says before, if you think that Elliot's dumb, don't feel special. Don't feel, don't feel special.

Um, why has this worked out for you? Like this city, this team, like this seems to be like a real hand to glove relationship. Why has this worked out so well? Um, I think, uh, right from the top down in this organization, it's been first class. I think, um, coming here, uh, I think one of the first things I said is wait and see to the community and the fans of this city. And I think I've done my part. They've done theirs. And it's been a really, really special time in my career for me and something that I've enjoyed this far. And I think, you know, part of that kind of helps the on ice play, too,

with with wanting to perform for such a passionate fan base in city and people that have treated me so well here to win for not only our team, but the city is really special. You know, this this offseason,, there was the Jeff Jackson news, but it was pretty quiet around the Edmonton Oilers. I think there's always going to be little changes that happen, but it wasn't as if there was anything really massive with the Edmonton Oilers. When you, after the Vegas series, did you and your teammates think, you know what, we're

good here. We don't need to change a lot. Or did you think like you know what we're good here like we don't need to change a lot or did you think you know what we need to we need to change some things around here yeah um to be honest i think one of the first things that went through my mind after probably a week had gone by and you know you do your year-end meetings with the coaching staff and kenny and whatnot and um i like our team know, from the way we finished last season. I like the guys we brought in at the deadline. I liked some of the guys that worked their way up into the lineup through the course of the year.

I was as confident as ever with that group as any group I've played on. And I look at our team now. We've lost some of those guys, unfortunately, with the cap situation, contractually speaking. But some of the pieces we've added, and we'll probably add as the season goes on here, our group is as strong as ever. And I know guys are excited about that. I think as the season goes along, you'll see where you are in the standings and see how other teams are looking and how matchups look when it comes to the playoffs, and you'll make additions based on that. You know, this is a team that's expected to go deep.

It's a really good team. Elliott's cursed you already by picking the Oilers to win the Stanley Cup. I appreciate that. Thank you very much. But, you know, I always wondered. I'm going to prove you right, Elliott. You look smart. I knew that at the start of this interview. But I'm always curious about, and people that are, you know,

I like asking thoughtful hockey players, it's like, are there teams that you need to go through to get there, or does it even matter? Like, we all understand, like, your history with Vegas. Like, I know how badly you want to beat Vegas. Is it important to beat Vegas? Is it important to beat Colorado to get there? Is it important to beat Calgary again to get there?

Yeah, I think it's important to beat whoever you're playing against in the series. I mean, there's a good chance it's going to be a lot of those teams you mentioned. You know, I go back to last year, you look at L.A. and Vegas, the two teams we played. I'd argue those are probably two of the top five teams in the NHL. You know, we got to play them in round one and two. And that's the penalty you get for not winning your division. You know, you got to play in L.A. that, you know, you look in that series, we could have

been down 3-1 instead of winning at 4-2. So those are the teams we know we're going to have to play. We have a tough division in the Pacific with a lot of good hockey teams. I know Calgary is going to have a bounce back here, and they're going to be tough to handle. Obviously, Colorado will be healthier and even more potent. So the West, it's tough to get through, and I think we're up for the challenge.

Big picture question. Almost 15 years now. What are the biggest changes you've seen in hockey, in the NHL? The things that you really think about the most that have changed the most since you've been a rookie? Oh, there's been so much. Whether that's on or off the ice. You just kind of see the young blood coming into the NHL

and a slow but a shift in the culture of hockey. You know, I remember as an 18-year-old in Atlanta, every single team in the league had at least one, most likely two fighters on their fourth line. Now that's pretty much non-existent. Especially your division, by the way. Yeah, you know, we had Eric Fulton, Chris Thorburn. You know, Philly had about five, six guys that could fight.

It was just, it's almost like I played in three different eras in 15 years. So, yeah, I think the style of play has changed a little bit. The type of player you need in your bottom six has changed greatly yeah and I think too you know you look at teams that have won you can't have just two or three guys you know you have to have a entire group because I think with the way the cap has been the league is just so competitive every team is good whereas back then when i came in league there was still a little bit more of discrepancy with teams you know you had your

you know sid and malkin and those guys you know they had they had some they had a good team but you know two or three really really good players superstars could could take you a long way you look at ovi in washington um you know when he was younger so um i think just the competitiveness in the league has gotten better. Okay, you mentioned Atlanta. I want to ask you two questions about Atlanta. One, Bogosian, Wheeler, and yourself, will you be the last thrasher in the NHL? Well, that's a great question.

I certainly will. I plan to play another, like, seven or eight years. Probably will then. I think those guys are a little older. Well, Bogosian is only a year older than me, but, yeah, I plan to play another like seven or eight years. So I probably will then. I think those guys are a little older. So, well, Boga's only a year older than me, but yeah, I hope to be, yes. Do you think that market can work again? Yes. I'm very happy you asked me that question.

I think it's, I, looking back, especially now, like I wish we would have still been there. Looking back, especially now, I wish we would have still been there. You talk about a great city to live in, a great city to be a part of. The fan base, I know everybody talks about the lack of fans, but the fan base we had there was so awesome. They were so passionate about us as a hockey team. We had fans at practice all the time, similar to not as many, but maybe as a Vegas and whatnot and this community support. And as an 18 year old, I loved being there.

Great travel, Eastern Conference, you know, you got four major, four other major sports. There's lots to do. It's a hub you can get anywhere in the US or even internationally from Atlanta. I mean, there's so many good things I have to say about it. So I would be 100% supportive of having an NHL team back in Atlanta. I know you're an Oiler, but would you play there again, like if there was ever a situation? Yes, yes, I would. What is it you like to play?

It's Atlanta City because it hasn't really been in the NHL since I've been there. I haven't seen a lot. Like what do you like about it? And they put the rink in a different area, but what does it for you? Well, no, I mean, the rink's downtown where the Atlanta Hawks play. But they're talking about this one being in a suburb. Yeah, so, like, our practice facility was in Duluth,

which is about 30 minutes outside of downtown Atlanta or Buckhead. So I think they would do really well there as well. I mean, there's so many great suburbs outside of Atlanta, which I think would be, you know, which would highlight players wanting to go there. I don't know if you've ever talked to a guy who's played in Atlanta, but they probably have nothing bad to say about it. You know, I come from Vancouver, you know, which is kind of a melting pot for a lot of different cultures. I go as an 18 year old to Atlanta where you're most likely either black, white, or you're both. So it was a bit of a culture change for me, but I definitely picked up on that Southern hospitality in a real genuine way,

which was, again, made it very welcoming for me to be a part of that community. Last one for me, finish this sentence. It will be a successful season for the Oilers if blank. I'll give you the obvious one. We win the Stanley Cup. How do you get there? What is it about?

What do you need to do right? We look at the Oilers and we're like, okay, look, all the pieces are here. But that's just part of it. What needs to happen? But that's just part of it. What needs to happen? I think if we commit to playing a slightly harder game, to sacrificing a little bit more at the offensive end,

to worry about the defensive side of our game and just limiting our goals against, we're going to score goals. We know that. So hopefully the numbers will work in our favor and if we can limit more goals going in our net, which requires everybody on the ice, not just our goal attending, I think we'll have a lot more success. Listen to the 32 Thoughts Podcast

ad-free on Amazon Music, included with Prime. Mikkel, one of my great memories of you, whenever I hear your name, I think back to the Windsor Spitfires of the OHL and the Memorial Cup, but I don't necessarily think of hockey. I think of some of the most intense table tennis games i ever saw between you and rocky thompson can anyone beat you on the tampa bay lightning in table tennis well cooch was able to a couple times we would play like 10 games he would beat me like two or three times yeah maybe. Maybe actually he beat me more. I don't want to lie. But it was still seven to two, like eight.

I'm better. I'm better. Yeah. Yeah. I think I'm better. Actually, we were battling with Brendan Lemieux. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Like hard.

Rocky. Rocky's okay. And Rocky's intense. He's intense at everything. Yeah. Yes. We were doing push-ups with him a lot. Like push-ups until you drop?

So you do one, one, two, two. The whole team does that. And then you go up to like seven or ten. And then you go down and see how many guys can actually last. So it was me and Rocky at the end. So you did all the way up to ten and all the way down? I don't want to lie. I think it was like up to seven or ten the way down? I don't want to lie.

I think it was like up to seven or 10 and yeah. No, you can lie. It's okay. No, I don't want to lie. Because Rocky is not going to respect me if I lie. So you were the only one who could keep up with him, right? Yeah. It was me and him a couple of times for sure.

That's incredible. Yeah. It was actually fun because the whole team was doing it and the guys were like competitive. Yeah. It was actually fun because the whole team was doing it. And the guys were, like, competitive. Yeah. And we did a lot of skates with him. Like, because we'd play Friday, Saturday, Sunday. And then Monday, Tuesday would be, like, two days kind of off. So, but we would skate on Tuesday and do a really hard back skate and see who could last, too.

So, it was like that, competitive all the time. So, are you, so when the Lightning get together, the main group, and they do their fitness tests, are you going to be the best scorer? No, no. We don't do push-ups. We do bench press, really narrow. It's weird. I don't know.

So basically you think the Tampa bench bench press is useless is what you're i'm not saying it's useless maybe it's good for boxing out or something i don't know and like what it doesn't show how good of a player you are you know what i mean i would much rather do tests on the ace please cut that out i don't want to do this so hard so hard but you know the it just shows the fitness level you have off the ice, but not necessarily translates to on the ice stuff. Who do you work out with in the off-season? Who do you train with?

I have my Russian trainer, but now the last few years I've been training with our Mark. His name is Mark. So, yeah, he's great. He's our strength conditioning coach in Tampa. So is there, like, the one thing I know about the Lightning is you're not as good as you guys have been the last few years of being an intensely competitive team.

So in the room, what do you guys compete against each other at? And who are the most ridiculously competitive people and biggest sore losers? They compete at the football fantasy fantasy football yeah i don't so i don't know like i hear them yelling all the time you know talking about like drafts and trades and all stuff like that golf too when there's a big golf tournament everybody's talking about i'm not really into that so biggest sore loser heady i don't know no there's nobody like that you know mostly it's our uh like a doctor mikey he he he

likes it so they'll like it i'm just not into that so so what do you compete with the other guys in it i'm just not into that so so what do you compete with the other guys in hockey okay yeah that's that's that's the best because we go and practice and it's in very intense practices if we do like battles in the corner everybody's trying to beat each other so everybody's going at it with each other do the coaches ever have to tell you guys to calm down i don't remember like we had couple uh you know hard moments when you like go at it and you like slash each other after and stuff like that but it was when i was younger but not anymore kind of i kind of took it down a little bit but uh and me me and killorn i think last year went at it oh yeah he was really pissed off like i dangled him on a blue line three times or five.

And he like slashed me and hit me really hard. Like I was like, dude, relax. And we kind of got into it. So, but after that, you know, it's all good. You go in the locker room and the boys are sitting and chirping all like both of you for doing that. So it's great. So what's the secret? Because we always talk about Tampa and we always make the point.

It's, it's the fool that counts out the Tampa Bay lightning. What is it about this team that is so resilient that gets us to a place where we say it's a foolish person that counts out Tampa? Well, it's our leadership group. You know, you watch, they went to the final in 14 or 15 against. 2015. Yeah, against a really good Chicago team. And they were, you know, a couple of moments changed the way of the series and they lost.

But still, they got that, you know know in their head that they lost and they went to the finals they know what it takes to get there so when i got to the team right away we went to uh semifinals against washington lost in seven games you know it's just like you come to the team as a young guy and you see the culture that they established in tampa a winning culture and and really good environment of respect and love for each other. And so anybody comes to the team, they blend in right away. So our GM likes to say like,

we don't have assholes here, so, cause we don't. And it's, they're doing their job to, you know, make sure that they bring right people in and that blend in and play well. And that's, what's been the most fun, you know, make sure that they bring right people in and that blend in and play well. And that's what's been the most fun, you know, the guys. Do you like rugby? Rugby?

Yes. No, it's too violent, man. It's crazy. Well, because the reason I ask is there's a book about the All Blacks, the legendary rugby team. And one of the chapters is, and they talk about their success, and one of the chapters is and they talk about their success and one of the chapters is called no and that's exactly what I thought of when you were saying that yeah no like we I don't remember one not like bad person but you know one person that or one player that would be like you you know, going against somebody or like doing something. We always had a great group of guys and, you know, Vic and Stammer kind of established that,

like with Callahan was there, they kind of established that culture of, you know, like respect everybody, humility, respect the fans, like stuff like that. You see them every day, what they do for fans, for the community, and you respect that and you want to do the same thing. So that's what I appreciate the most. I love listening to that. I asked, so someone asked me which Lightning player was coming down here and I mentioned your name, and they said, ask him,

because he says to me he heard from a lightning player they are all pissed off coming into this year because they felt they should have beaten toronto and they should have been playing longer is that true yeah i mean obviously in my head we should have won the cup so every year we should win the cup in my head but uh yeah obviously we're pissed off. We don't want to lose. We don't want to be the team that, you know, Toronto finally got to the second round and they beat Tampa Bay Lightning.

Like, they didn't go through, obviously, the second round. So, but, you know, we didn't want to be that and lose to them. So, yeah, this year we'll see. We'll see when the camp starts how pissed off we are judging from that little smile it's it's pretty pissed off yeah the guys are very competitive even now usually before camp we skate we play like some we do like five drills and then we uh play a game and usually it was just like a beer beer hockey, and now it's intense. Some hitting too from young guys too.

It's great. Competitive. Nobody's going to let me walk them on the blue line. It's just not acceptable for them anymore. Not like Alex Killorn did. He let me walk him, and then he hit me. Figure it out. John Cooper. Relationships that players have with coaches,

the up and down. Sometimes the coach is a good guy. Sometimes not a good guy. And that's just the way a season goes and the way a team goes. What is, by and large, the relationship between Tampa Bay and and the way a team goes what is by and large the relationship between tampa bay lightning the players and that head coach i mean he's the longest serving coach in the nhl he's doing something right he's won stanley cups what's the relationship like

well he's very good i think that's psychology i think he was studying psychology in school or something because he sees the problems right away, sees what's going on with the team, talks to players. You know, he's not making decisions just like, you know, out of being pissed off or something like that. He's just like talking to players, great communicator. So, and he's evolving in the game of hockey too. He's not just, you know, he's been in our of hockey too he's not just you know he's been in our coach for what 10 years or whatever and he's just sitting there like being you know having fun

about that no he's evolving he wants to win and we get that energy from him every every camp so there's no sitting around there's like go go. What's maybe like the biggest change you've seen him make in the last couple of years from evolving? From evolving? Like I think our neutral zone changed a little bit and the breakouts. Yeah. We've been doing some new breakouts. You're going to make me work to figure this out? Nope.

I'm just not going to tell you. Are you going to make me work to figure this out? Nope. I'm just not going to tell you. Yeah, I think we've got some new changes coming this year. I'm not going to say where, but I think we've got changes. You guys will figure it out easy when we play. That's interesting.

Yeah, I can't really tell because I don't know if I can or cannot. So I'll just say we've got some changes coming. Nobody listens to this podcast, so you can say yeah right you can say whatever no no no everybody listens to it i see it every everywhere so there's like little rules like yeah someone was explaining to me once something about you know protecting lead in the third no d2d passes like kind of little rules like that that's not true no you see you see a play, you make it. But obviously when you're up 3-2 in the third period, some plays you don't make, like passing,

like breaking out through the middle. That would be a little risky. So we just kind of keep it on the yellow sometimes or off the glass and out. So actually that's the best play in the third period, off the glass. That's called the 80s breakout. Yeah. High off the glass and out. So that's, actually that's the best play in the third period, off the glass. That's called the 80s breakout. Yeah.

High off the glass and out. Yeah, they call it off the window. Yeah, Luke Shen calls it that. Let me ask you about Andrei Vasilevsky. I mean, listen, this is, we're in the era right now of the rise of the great Russian netminder

and Andrei Vasilevsky, everybody defers to. What's it like playing in front of him every single night? Well, I can turn the puck over as the last guy. I don't worry about getting scored on. So, no, it's just, you know, sometimes you don't box out. Sometimes you lose the puck. Sometimes, you know, stuff happens that you don't want to happen and you know that you don't box out sometimes you lose the puck sometimes you know stuff happens

that you don't want to happen and you know that he's there he's gonna make the save 95% of the time so and uh that just gives you confidence to make plays like to all of our d not just me everybody's making plays everybody's skating because they know he's gonna do his job to save you know the goal so and uh it's just the consistency of him. He's been the best goalie in the league since I came in the league, six, six or seven years. So, and he's, I think he's going to get only better, especially now after two months off, I think we're going to see a lot of good things from him. And, um, just like, I've never seen a guy work as hard as him on our team like stuff he's doing is incredible so that's why i have no worries about him anytime because he's he's there he's

in a gym he's on the ice he wants guys to shoot on him he wants and he's battling in practice too he doesn't want to give up goals doesn't want want to be like, sometimes we play a small game. He doesn't want to be that goalie that loses. So he's great. I think he's one of the best athletes that ever played a sport. Like you watch him go on a split and then put his leg up from there, from a split. Like I've never seen anybody do that. Or from a split, push and make a save.

That extra, like, I don't know, 5, 10 inches he gives himself. It's just, like, from a stretch, he's really strong. So, and the feel for the game, too. He's, like, you know, sometimes we, like, you dangle on the blue line, you, like, do something like that. He's doing the same in the net with his gloves and making crazy saves behind the back. The glove save behind the back is always the one that freaks me out.

What did you think the first time you saw that? I remember, what did I just see? Would that be the same as Michigan, but for goalies? That's a great question. You know what? Maybe Kiprasov with the scorpion save might have been like that because I think the first time

I saw a scorpion save Yeah, but still think about it. I had a similar You're putting your arm around your back. You know what? Now everybody does that now. And it's

it's total Vasilevsky. It's total Vasilevsky. Now everybody tries. It's like it's a hope play, right? It is. But I think I think he could have played

with the blocker but I think he over have played with the blocker. But I think he over-skated and turned. So it kind of made him go with his glove. So that's why. It wasn't like he was trying to be cool. He was out of desperation. I don't know.

I think it looks pretty cool. Yeah. But I think it's kind of like Michigan. I like the way you think. Yeah. The way it impacted the game. Well, the creativity of it's kind of like Michigan. I like the way you think. Yeah, the way it impacted the game. Well, the creativity of it too, right? Exactly, exactly.

That's what I'm saying. He's very creative in the net, how to make saves. Last one for me. One of the things about the Lightning is you've had to let a lot of good players go, just the way the salary cap works. Just wondering of all the great players who've left Tampa, who was the guy, just maybe even tampa who was the guy just maybe even personally who was the hardest for you to see leave mac mcdonough mcdonough yeah because we uh

we're really good friends and uh when he actually got traded to tampa i was kind of not upset i was upset yeah i'm not gonna lie i was upset because uh he took the second deep air spot and he kept it for as long as he's been there then it kind of started changing because I was playing with him or with Hedy and you know they gave me a bigger role but then I realized he's such a great player such a good deep presence that I have to learn from him and he's such a great guy such a good deep presence that i i have to learn from him and he's such a great guy too like everybody loves him like the funniest story was so he never talks to the refs never like says anything to them bad like oh you made a mistake here he's not he's not victor victor like yells at the refs so he uh one time uh allianceman was messing up, did like five missed calls or whatever.

And so linesman is staying by our bench. Mac gets up. He's like, this is the worst performance I've seen from a linesman in a long time. Sits down. And Lainey was like, oh, I'm sorry, Mac. Like, just a tough day for me. I was laughing so hard. I'm like, oh, my God.

It's the first time I've seen him say something to a ref. How are you with officials? Oh, I was tough. Like, oh, I was crazy my first couple of years. Like, I had a really tough moment my first year in Chicago. I think Hartman kind of slashed me. I gave him a cross check and I kind of got him

in the face so a ref gave me two minutes for that I go in the in the box and I'm really pissed off so I throw a towel

at the glass and it gives me two plus two so it gives me four minutes that's more spilling yeah and I'm more pissed off

I'm like breaking my stick there and stuff I go to the bench and guys are like no I actually go to their locker room after that and guys are giving me like yelling at me like cali our coaches stammer everybody and i'm 19 years old and like i almost cried i felt so bad like i let you know let my team down obviously but in the third period coach decided to play me 10 minutes or like nine minutes and i felt like wow okay trusting me and then they uh scratched me for two games after that backskated me hard yeah and then i talked to that ref and i apologized to him

you know and um but that didn't change me like for two years i was kind of an asshole to refs you know yelling at them sometimes but now i kind of an asshole to refs, yelling at them sometimes. But now I kind of figure it out. Just be nice to them. Talk to them. Say hi. And if you don't like the call, they already made it. You go to the box and sit down.

Shut up. You know, it's interesting. Kill them with kindness. No, I'm not. Sidney Crosby talks about that. Remember, we asked him a couple of years ago, if you could change anything about your career what would you change and he said

how I treated officials when I started in the NHL he said I was awful well he was getting killed oh yeah oh for sure high hits like I would be upset too and sometimes they would miss it but still yeah like they missed a call they can't really do anything about it but you have to let them know too

like now what I do is like if I miss a call I come up to them like dude like I'm you know like I got see like I'm bleeding

so please like look next time yeah next time look for that so that's what I do this has been great

a lot of fun best of luck this season on the the new look the new variations of how the Tampa Bay Lightning are going to play. You've given us all homework now. Thank you so much.

Thank you so much. That's Mikel Sergachev of the Tampa Bay Lightning. Previous to hearing him, you heard from Evander Kane. Interesting stuff on the Atlanta Thrashers and that market. Kane, of course, of the Edmonton Oilers. That's it for another week here on the podcast. We return Monday, regular drops, right? Monday morning, Friday morning, you know the schedule.

Other podcasts still on the horizon as well. Enjoy your weekend. Enjoy the hockey. Inching closer to the official puck drop of the 23-24 NHL season. It can't come soon enough. Have a great weekend. We'll talk to you on Monday.