32 Thoughts: The Podcast - Sam Gagner: Taking Over the Marlboros with John Tavares

Episode Date: March 2, 2021

Detroit Red Wings forward Sam Gagner joins Jeff and Elliotte. They discuss why he and fellow Marlboros alumnus John Tavares wanted to get involved in minor hockey, where he was when Elliotte broke the news on Hockey Night in Canada, if he was surprised by the hockey community’s reaction, the types of changes he’d like […]

I think I'm 40% this year, so. Don't worry about that. You know, Elliot, when you talked about Sam Gagne and John Tavares and the Toronto Marlboros of the GTHL a few weeks ago on Hockey Night, I've ever since referred to that as the innocent bombshell. I didn't really have an understanding of how big an explosion this news was going to be until I put it out there. We're going to talk to Sam Gagne of the Detroit Red Wings.

Also now, once again, of the Toronto Marlboros, where he played in the GTHL on the 89 Marlboro squad, along with John Tavares, amongst other outstanding hockey players. Now that you've had a few weeks to really digest, and I'm sure you've had plenty of phone calls from people in and around the minor hockey world do you now get a sense of how big that news was that you broke on hockey night a few weeks ago much better idea much better idea and part of that obviously is because my son

doesn't play at that level so you're not really in that world. And in this day and age, if you're not really in that world, you really have no idea of the ins and outs and the real inner workings of it. But Jeff, I do now, and I know you did. I can only imagine what your reaction was when you saw it. A jaw was on the ground. I think I texted you right away. I can't

remember what exactly my text was but it was something along the lines of i don't know that you understand how huge that news is right now elliot because listen you're involved in you know breaking trades and huge developments in the nhl like big headline nhl. But for the minor hockey world in Canada, specifically in Toronto, what you did in about 15 seconds on Hockey Night, Elliot, will probably have effects now for I don't know however many years in the GTHL. Because there are discussions underfoot after that announcement, even before your announcement, about how to change the way the GTHL operates. And let's just say that your announcement of Gagne and Tavares getting involved with the Marlies, let's say it strongly hastened things along. You do know that now, right? I do now, yes, as I said. And I'm curious to see where this is going to go. You know, one of the things that I was kind of asked and Gagne said that it came up to him too is, Jeff, you've talked before about how NHL players

want to buy junior teams. Yep. I think they're going to look at it now as how can we be involved with minor hockey teams? Yep. And, you know, it's clear Gagne and Tavares, they're calling this a transfer right correct yeah you know technically you can't buy a minor hockey team at least in toronto

and they're calling it a transfer but i think this is going to open the door to more and more current or former nhlers saying hey if the junior hockey space isn't right for me, maybe this is the one instead. And specifically with the GTHL, when you consider 10% of the entire NHL has gone through the GTHL, it would just make sense. Like high profile players have gone through this league.

And if you want to continue your career and stay in hockey and you don't feel that owning a junior team in canada is right for you it can be pretty rewarding owning a triple a club and pretty interesting as well and it seems as if some of the interesting comments that i got after your report i'm talking to various people around minor hockey was this isn't a good thing that gagne and tavaris are getting involved it's a good thing that Gagne and Tavares are getting involved. It's a great thing. And I always say, why do you think it's a great thing?

And they would generally say to me things like, well, they can't be moved. They can't be nudged. They can't be tempted. If you catch my drift, these guys are established hockey people that have earned a lot of money and will not be, will not look the other way. You know, I told that story of the ex NHL and locking in ice time, the amount of money involved, essentially the more people like Gagne and Tavares in the game, the expectation is the cleaner it will be.

And that's something that if you're, you know, Scott Oakman, the head of the GTHL, you welcome. So the fact that Gagne and Tavares are getting involved is, I think, a great thing for the GTHL.

And I honestly, I can see other players getting involved as well from the NHL. Why don't we let everyone hear? All right. So let's go. Here he is without further ado sam gagne of the detroit red wings or for the purposes of this conversation of the toronto marlboragne of the Detroit Red Wings.

And most specifically, though, for the purposes of this conversation, and Sam, thanks so much for joining us, the transition of control with the Toronto Marlboros of the GTHL from Jim Nicoletti to Sam Gagne and John Tavares. Why would you want to get involved in minor hockey in the first place? I mean, Jim Nicoletti, Lynn Dennis, they approached me in the, I guess in the spring about the possibility. And, you know, it really got me excited. I think just my minor hockey experience was fantastic. You know, I feel very fortunate to have gone through it. And I know that, you know, not everyone's is the same. And I think that it's a great opportunity to get back to a hockey community that, you know, has meant a lot to me. And, you know, it's also a great opportunity to kind of, you know, learn that side of it.

I think, you know, I've played hockey for a long time. You know, I've been really focused on developing my own game. And I'm always looking for different ways to improve. And, you know, I think I can take a lot of that knowledge and help the next generation of player. And then just in speaking, obviously, John Tavares and I are really good friends, and we talk a lot about everything, really, mostly hockey. But so just in having this discussion with him,

obviously the Marlies, he's very proud about his history playing there. And, you know, it just felt like it was a good fit to have him involved as well. And we're really looking forward to seeing what we can do with it. And, you know, obviously there's a great tradition. The Nicolettis and the Dennis's have done a fantastic job over the last 35 years. So we have some big shoes to fill, but we're excited about it. Did you have any idea the craziness that would ensue

when it got out that you and John Tavares were taking over? Yeah, well, yeah, I mean, it's hockey in toronto right um so i have a lot of stories growing up about just the craziness of of minor hockey tournaments minor hockey parents when you're in the hockey hotbed i think most parents feel that you know there's a chance for their kid to play in the nhl and it brings out a lot of emotions and uh so I kind of figured it was going to be a big story just based on the fact that you know it's John and I as well but um you know obviously when you came out the news I didn't expect it to be uh at that level but um yeah it's uh it's it's it's funny it became an entirely huge phenomenon as we all saw play out.

And this was, I mean, Elliot, correct me if I'm wrong. This was, I think in Elliot's mind, a kind of last detail on a hockey night in Canada segment that was supposed to be a, a feel good story that, that went to break. How did everything change for you when Elliot put that news out on headlines? Yeah. Yeah. thanks for that elliot my pleasure i was um it was funny i was actually getting lined up for a face-off uh in nashville um and you guys were on air or you guys might have been on air before and uh one of the lines

said to me hey congratulations on the marlies andley's. And I was like, what? And he's like, yeah, yeah. I just heard about it. It was on NHL.com. And I'm like, so I lost that face off clean, but yeah, it was, uh, it was an interesting couple of days just kind of, um, trying to sort everything out. Like, you know, uh, we, we've been trying to keep everything kind of under wraps while, uh, the transition took place it's still in the process right now you know we're we're in the process of naming a president

and a general manager obviously with John and I still playing and wanting to play as long as we can I think on the day-to-day side we're going to need a lot of help so we're in the process of getting that taken care of and you know hopefully that'll all be done in the short term I guess let me pick up on that because you know you went through as you mentioned both you and John played in the in the Marlies organization that was one of the by the way your minor midget that's one of the best teams I ever saw that team was was ridiculous I think you only guys only lost one game all season long you and john and kim alu would have been on that team and brendan smith and brian cameron and justin vive and and and and and and like cody golobev's played cody golobev right the defenseman like it was a stacked team

yeah and i'm sure i mean it's gthl so everybody has an opinion on how everything should run like every parent every kid every, every coach, every administrator. Do you have in your mind, and maybe in talking with John, ideas on how you would like to run things differently or how you would like to do things differently in minor hockey? Yeah, definitely. I think, you know, that was part of the reason we were so excited about this is because of our experience in matter hockey was just incredible.

We rolled four lines. I mean, we had a really good deep team, but we rolled four lines. Everyone got their ice time and it was all about development. I can't think of a practice that we went through that was systems based or, you know, anything but the development of us as players and as people. And, you know, my dad was an assistant coach on that team. Obviously, he had a lot of experience in hockey. And then James Naylor was our head coach. And I can't say enough good things about him, about the way he operated things.

You know, if we had a 50-minute practice, it was 50 minutes of trying to make us better hockey players. It wasn't, you know, what are we going to do to win tomorrow? The winning took care of itself because we were developing so much. If you look at the first year, uh, that we all got together to the last year,

we were all together, the strides that we all took as players, they were huge. And, you know, you look at some of the success that we've had between John and myself and Cody and Akeem and Brendan. And we had guys play college hockey and in the OHL, had big numbers in the OHL, Brian Cameron, Steve Teresak and Justin Vive. I mean, it's a testament to kind of how we were raised within that system. And, you know, I look at some of the other minor hockey teams that I kind of, you know, watch their practices or, you know, I would get called up to different teams or, you know, play in tournaments with different teams. And it was a different mindset.

play in tournaments with different teams and it was a different mindset and I think trying to develop a winning mindset at that age is important but at the same time winning isn't be all end all and I'm not so worried about uh you know winning in the short term for the you know the sacrifice of development at that age group and that's that's kind of the vision we want to set within the entire and you know the way it's been operated with the Marlies so far, I mean, we're coming into a situation where they've done a fantastic job. So, you know, it's going to make it a little easier on us. But, you know, I envision that if you come to Canlan Ice Sports and you're watching the minor, I think it changed now.

If you're watching the under 12 Mar it changed now it's if you're watching the under 12 marlies or the under 15 marlies that's right yeah the practices are going to look very similar and it's going to be all about skill development and you know there's a lot of different ideas that we're kind of poking around to see if uh you know we can develop some different programs to help but um yeah i mean it's still in the early stages so there's a lot of work to do but we're uh really excited about it universal coaching program that's unique right there like just bringing on coaches that coach the exact same way because as you all know development at the

triple a level in toronto isn't just players in a lot of ways coaches themselves say hey you know what this is my stepping stone you know these kids all you know have eyes to go to the OHL and beyond and coaches are the same way as well so that's a unique one right there isn't it Sam yeah yeah no that's a huge opportunity for us I I think, like I said, having James as a coach growing up, it was so huge for our development as players and as people. And I know that John and I still talk to him and we get him to watch our games and give us advice. And that's a great thing to have. So, you know, we were really fortunate. I mean, I think the other thing that we want to look at is is trying to make it accessible for everyone um i think we want to create opportunities for

everybody i think i look at my experience growing up i had a rink in my backyard i got to play in every tournament i could think of and i feel so fortunate to have had that upbringing and you know we want to look at ways to give every kid a chance to do that and you know we're excited to kind of dig into that. Sam were you a Seinfeld guy did you ever watch Seinfeld? Oh yeah. Why do I have images of you and John Tavares being like Kramer in the dojo and just punishing young kids on the ice like Kramer did in the dojo will you guys get on the ice with young kids yeah yeah I mean I I don't want to speak for John but um personally absolutely I love the game uh I really enjoy being on the ice and um um, you know, especially with the kids, I think, you know,

at that level, especially there's such a passion for it and there's just such a raw energy and, um, kids just always want to be in the ice, always want to get better. And, you know, I think it keeps you young being on the ice like that with them trying to help them get better. Um, so yeah, absolutely. Um, you know, when my career is done, I'd love to be on the ice and help in any way I can. So yeah, for sure. Hang on. What about recruiting as well? Yeah.

The phone call from Sam Gagnier, John Tavares. Hey, I know your kid plays for Don Mills or the Red Wings or Mississauga Senators, but let me tell you what the Marlies can do for your son. I'm going to make Connor McDavid do that for us. I'm going to get him doing that for us. But yeah, no, I think that part of, you know, John played for the Mississauga Senators for a couple of years. And I remember part of the recruiting pitch was having my dad meet with him

and then him come and skate on our backyard rink. He lived five minutes from us in Oakville. And I think that sold it right there. So I feel like I owe a lot to John in terms of the player I became. And, you know, just I think when you get a chance to play against the best players every day in practice, and then for him and I playing against each other so much one-on-one in the backyard it made us both better players and we owe a lot to that so yeah for sure we we want to make sure that we're helping these kids develop in any way we can and uh it should be a lot of fun you know sam one of the biggest questions I've gotten is that, as you said, minor hockey in Toronto, it's a gong show. And I've had some people say to me that they'd be surprised that you and John would want to step into it.

I've had other people say to me that they hope that your presence will force a cleanup. Are you ready for all of this? up. Are you ready for all of this? Cause this is probably going to be, there's going to be things that come at you from sideways here that you probably never expected. Are you ready for all this? Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I, I feel like I have a lot of experience in the game and I've seen a lot at the pro level, at the amateur level, and I feel like i can draw on my experience but at the same time i think we're going to have people around us that are really going to be help us navigate that i mean james nailer uh we're going to have him as our as our president he's been around the game a long time at that level and he's he's kind of seen it all and then uh dave

nicoletti uh will be our general manager and you know he's great at all that as then Dave Nicoletti will be our general manager and, you know, he's great at all of that as well. And he's an extremely hard worker and, you know, we'll be able to do his due diligence and figure out if anything's going wrong. And, you know, I like to think that, you know, we can help kind of change that perception and, you know, I'm excited about the challenge of it for sure have any other players since this got out have you had many other players or people in the game ask you about it and whether or not there would be other teams available or space in your group not so much space in our group but i've had a lot of questions about just kind of how it came about and you know some guys that aren't familiar

with the Toronto minor hockey landscape you know that grew up out west or whatever asking kind of just details of of you know what we're doing and um you know I think it did certainly create some excitement you know it's been a lot of fun kind of discussing our plans and just having those conversations with people. So, you know, I've enjoyed it so far. What's your biggest challenge, you think? I'm sure you and John have talked about this. You mentioned, you know, James Naylor taking over alongside Dave Nicoletti. You know, you guys will always have this on your horizon whenever you're done playing in the NHL. What do you think the biggest challenge for you guys will be? Yeah, that's a good question.

I think, well, number one is the Marlies have been the top organization from a winning percentage perspective for I don't know how many years. So no pressure coming in, I guess. You know, like I said, the Nicolettis and the Dennis's have done a fantastic job and it's big shoes to fill so we don't want to come in and kind of mess things up like they've they've done a fantastic job you know we think that you know we have some ideas that can help you know bring it forward in the next generation I look at kind of the model that's kind of changing out West where the academy model, that's something we want to look into. You know, I look at kind of my upbringing, going to school in Oakville, playing hockey in Toronto. It's a lot

of time in the car and it took away from my education at times. And, you know, my family has always been big on education and, you know, is there ways that we can kind of facilitate that for the next generation of players? I know that it's something that, that has been happening in Toronto and, you know, we're looking into those avenues. And I think the challenge too is, is making it accessible for everyone I know that minor hockey in Toronto has become big business in a lot of sense and we don't want it to be that way you know I I know Elliot you you had told some stories and Jeff about parents paying for ice time or yep you know that's not something we want and I I think that there's a lot of great minor hockey players out

there that have big dreams that their parents might not be able to afford it. And, you know, we want to give those kids the same opportunities that everyone else gets. And so we're going to look into ways to do that. But, yeah, there's going to be a lot of challenges ahead. We're aware of all of them. And, you know, we just kind of take it day by day and go through the process with the greater toronto hockey league in in this transition and um and then just you know look forward to seeing what uh what we can accomplish final question for me uh sam is if there's a philosophical debate you're on one side

tavaris is on the other side who wins the argument i i do i'm sorry john but yeah i do i'm older i'm older john he's kind of been like my little brother for forever right um now it's a little different obviously we're 31 and 30 but when you're 14 and 13 um he was kind of like the little brother on the team so uh any debates uh didn't matter if I was right, I was right. So yeah, I think it'll probably stay that way. Sorry, John. Two things, Sam, from my perch, and we'll let you get on with your afternoon.

One, does it feel to you like 10% of the NHL this season played in the GTHL because that's the stat yeah yeah um you know and that's the other thing i i don't want this to be a situation where it's like okay come to the marlies your kids playing in the nhl because i i don't i i mean i think that was one of the reasons that made our minor hockey experience so much fun is it was about fun and it was about getting better and we learned so many things about you know if I didn't play a game in the NHL I would still look back on my minor hockey experience and say I learned so much from that and it made me a better person and allowed me to have success in so many other different facets of

life and we want to continue that tradition and continue that development of, you know, not only athletes, but people. And, you know, we're excited about that challenge too. So looking forward to that. Okay. So you were an 89 Toronto Marley. There is an 06 Sam as well, a kid by the name of Sam Dickinson, who's a defenseman on the 06 team.

Who's the next sam that everyone's talking about with the marley's organization sam i just thought i'd throw that in there just to make because whenever i see the kid play i feel old yeah and i want you to join that club now too yeah oh no i'm in that club i mean i look at when i first started in the league and everyone was looking at me like oh you're born in 89 that's. And now I look at guys playing in their 2000s. I know. During the league. And it's just, you know, everyone told me, I mean, enjoy it because it goes by fast.

And it really does. So, you know, I feel very fortunate to have had the career I've had and hopefully can, you know, play for many more years. But, yeah, it's been a lot of fun. And, you know, I'm looking forward to kind of giving back in another way. We wish you and John, certainly, and James and Dave as well, all the best in this endeavor. Yeah, thanks very much, guys.

I appreciate it. So as we learn from that interview, all of a sudden, the face-off statistics for Sam Gagne this year will have an, how should we call it, Elliott Friedman asterisk beside them. I don't like to talk about this kind of stuff too much

because I think it's overly self-indulgent, but I do think that I should clarify to people who might be thinking, don't you warn someone that you're doing a story on them? And that was a game day for the Red Wings, obviously. And I did reach out to people around him to let them know that I knew. Because I thought, you know, that he would be told. And I guess he was told he was just surprised by what happened in the face-off circle.

And that day, it was Hockey Day in Canada. And Tavares did an interview with Ron before Toronto's game. And I actually told Ron, why don't you ask Tavares about it? And he did, but Tavares said he didn't want to talk about it at that particular time. So I would like people to know that I don't go out of my way to blindside people with news about them. Well, the one thing that your story has done now

is it's shaken loose a lot of other stories and really shone a flashlight on how minor hockey is run. I don't know if this was your intention, but this is very much a sidebar to your story. Like you've shaken a lot of stories loose now and they're flowing. Like you've turned the tap on for all these minor hockey stories and how the league is run and it is very strongly my belief from talking to people around minor hockey specifically the gthl that

they are looking at various different ways that they can run the operation again i don't know that you intended like this i'm pretty sure you didn't. Hopefully good things happen. We shall see. But we do strongly believe that the presence of Gagne and Tavares in the GTHL is a good thing for it. We thank you for joining us this week on 31 Thoughts, the podcast. Thanks so much for listening to the podcast. It's just sort of a quickie edition with Sam Gagne.

We thank Sam for stopping by. We'll join you later on this week on another edition of 31 Thoughts, the podcast. Thank you.