32 Thoughts: The Podcast - So You Think You’re Stressed … Here’s Steve Dangle!

Episode Date: May 31, 2021

The Montreal Canadiens force a game 7 against the Toronto Maple Leafs. Jeff and Elliotte discuss (25:00) the excitement around the game, fans in the stands in Montreal, and which team has the most to lose. Plus, they are joined by Steve Dangle (42:00) to talk about his frustrations, who he thinks is underperforming, and […]

If they blow it in seven, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know if I can keep doing this to myself. In our never-ending quest to try to satisfy everybody, today's podcast will be half car cast, half regular cast. Earlier today, Elliot and I sat down with Steve Dangle, whose voice sounded a little bit scratchy, which should come as no surprise to anyone who watched his video on Saturday night.

We will park a lot of time here talking about Game 7 and Game 6 between the Toronto Maple Leafs and the Montreal Canadiens. In the meantime, the very latest news. Elliot, you just finished doing the Colorado Avalanche 7-1 win over the Vegas Golden Knights in game one of their best of seven series. Match penalty for Reeves on Ryan Graves attempt to injure. I mean you've got cross-checking on the goalie you got roughing on Graves and then he kneels on his face like the penalty minutes are adding up they're all adding up so I don't know what the refereeing

is going to call if he calls them all or not but at the end of the day this is going to be a lot of penalties that are going to go down and everyone else is just kind of watching and then you know they were looking for graves ever since the yanmark hit early in the game and they got him at the end reeves got him this is after a a cross-check on Philip Grubauer as well. It's a match which brings with it an automatic suspension pending a hearing. What happens now? I think a lot of it's going to depend

on what exactly the referee saw in that scrum. I mean, it looked like Reeves had his knee on him, but it was really exactly difficult to tell in some of the replays. So there's no question the referees saw something they absolutely didn't like, threw him out of the game. And I have a feeling that that referee report is going to be critical to this. I think Reeves is getting some games.

They're going to want to tone down this series. And as you said, they spent quite a while looking for revenge. And I just think it got out of hand. No question about it. And I'd be surprised if he didn't get something. That'll be a story all this week, no matter what the ruling is. What did you make of the game itself? I mean, Colorado came out and it seemed as if they had their way with Vegas.

They did whatever they wanted to do. And most notably that top line and most notably Nathan McKinnon, who was spectacular on Sunday night. Well, you know, like they're so good. You know, they, I, I'm amazed at how quickly they can score on you. I don't think there's another team in the NHL where the puck can be behind their net and then it's in your net seconds later. It's incredible how dangerous they are in transition.

One of the things we were wondering was who would have the advantage? The Avalanche had a long time off because they eliminated St. Louis so quickly and Vegas played that emotional game seven just a couple of nights ago. So you're sitting there and you're going, you think Colorado has the advantage, but a lot of teams don't like that much time off. And it was interesting, Nathan McKinnon was interviewed in the postgame, and they talked about last year in the bubble, they knocked out Arizona so quick, they felt that they were dopey at the start of the Dallas series. was so quick, they felt that they were dopey at the start of the Dallas series and how they practiced hard this week and made sure they pushed themselves

so that that wouldn't happen this time, and it didn't. You know, there was a lot of debate about the decision to start Leonard. Marc-Andre Fleury's numbers are really good. Kelly Rudy felt that Leonard was the right call because Fleury might have needed a rest at his advanced by NHL standards age, but Leonard looked really rusty. He was flailing quite a bit. He was chasing it all night. I have no doubt we're going to see Fleury in game two, and you've just got to hope that that decision for vegas won't come back and bite you hang on one second hang on one second on lennar yeah i just want to pause because he did

something in there today in this loss that i i don't want to get lost and i want to make sure we we note it there was no way barring injury he was going to get the hook he had to suck up that whole game and that was a game where you know vegas was not at their best colorado was and they were rested and they were firing and they were putting pucks by him and putting pucks at him all night long and there was and you mentioned he was rusty he hadn't played in a while there was no way he was coming out like if that's not a good soldier act right there i don't know what is like i got a ton of respect for leonard because he's going in that situation knowing that if he's getting shelled there's no no one's coming to save him

you know that's true i think that's a very good point and a very fair point to bring up because you you've got to let flurry get his rest right yeah let me ask you something because we were debating this at the top of the show what did you think of leonard's tweet first of all i think robin leonard has a lot of showmen in him and i loved it i wish there were more players like that did you have any problem with him doing it on a game day no not at all I wish more players would it's interesting to me in the sense that Kevin BX has said that when he played they had a rule no social media on game day a camera if he said in the playoffs or the regular season but now let's just go with playoffs here because it's it's bigger you know I tend to be on your side of this, that Robin Leonard is who he is.

If you sign him to a five-year deal, you understand who he is. And he's going to engage. And the other thing I thought about after the game, because I was thinking after the game, is someone going to make an issue of this because it went so badly for him and them? It's not like he was tweeting all day like he was tweeting at a time where he was probably traveling back to the hotel or something like that it wasn't like it was during rest hours or

whatever he does in the afternoon to prepare for the game so i'm you. I don't think this is a big deal. And I think it's something we better get used to. Somewhere, someone's going to make a big deal out of this. And as long as Leonard's doing it at a time where he shouldn't be resting or preparing, I'm with you. I've got no problem. It's evolving that way anyhow. And I think for some guys it's fine. And for others, it's not. Some guys can just send a tweet and then put the phone down and not obsess over their replies and not get distracted by it, not have it affect their performance.

Others can't. So like, like many things, I don't think that there's one cookie cutter formula or one simple answer for things like, wow, is seven days too much rest for a team? Well, for some teams, it probably is. And for others, it's not.

Just like for some players, it's fine to tweet on game day or use social media on game day. I can't believe it is 2021 and we're still talking like this. Yeah, but you know what? I think there's times you shouldn't. I think for some guys, they shouldn't, and they can't. But some guys can, and Leonard's clearly one of those guys that has no problem with it, and I don't have any problem with it.

I think we're getting past that last generation of being terrified of social media. But no doom-scrolling either. I don't think that's good. One thing we should point out too, as we talk about the forwards for, for Colorado, that power play,

it looked like the globe trotters, the power play. They're just firing it around. The zone entries, like when McKinnon gets ahead of steam, forget it. Like when they do that ladder play that drop, like forget it.

And McKinnon picks it up. Good luck trying to protect the blue line. But man, I don't know outside of at times Quinn Hughes, if there's anyone that can do on the blue line, across the blue line, under pressure on the blue line, what Kael McCarr does. It's remarkable. And there are more guys like him coming.

He's just part of that new age defenseman. But I just think that we should note like how good, how good he is on the blue line, how good Samuel Gerrard is on with really night. The thing about Gerrard is I love the way he makes like really small, short, nifty passes, the way he configures his body into weird contortions to make passes happen.

Like he's almost, you know, Mr. Fantastic reach with with these long rubber arms reaching around guys to make passes happen. It's just a flat-out fun team to watch right now. I know we're looking at this one and saying, ooh, this could be a Stanley Cup final. That's how it's going to be played.

We say the same thing about Carolina and Tampa on the other side as well. Listen, game one was a blowout. I don't think the rest of the games are going to be like that at all. I'm just glad that we finally got these two together. I agree. It'll be flurry in game two. Vegas will have two days to rest,

but they're going to have to be a hell of a lot better. I mean, a hell of a lot better. There was a big, big difference between those two teams in game number one. There was. And on that, we'll kick it off. Welcome to 31 Thoughts, the podcast presented by the GMC Sierra AT4. Carcast. Okay, here we go. Welcome back to the CarCast Podcast, 31 Thoughts Style.

Boy, you made some headlines on Headlines Saturday, Elliot, on Hockey Night in Canada with the Seth Jones information. You know, we've been talking, and a lot of people have, clearly, about the future of the Columbus Blue Jackets and how much of it is tied to Seth Jones' decision to either entertain re-signing with the team or declining to do so. Your report Saturday made it pretty clear

that Seth Jones, I'll throw in the caveat, at this time is not interested in signing an extension with Columbus. So knock over some dominoes here. What's next? So first of all, I'd like to thank all the people who tweeted at me and said, so you're a Jedi and not a Sith because you don't believe in absolutes. I got a few of those tweets. You know what? The way it got conveyed to me, Jeff, was that he told them that he's not going to sign,

he's going to test free agency. But when I did some more research into it, I just wasn't comfortable coming right out and saying, he's not signing. I just think that weird stuff happens in life things can change and then you end up on old takes exposed because you're wrong unless I have a hundred percent reason to believe something I qualify them I think the Blue Jackets know it's unlikely that he wants to test free agency and he wants to see what's out there.

And Seth Jones has earned that right. You know, that's the one thing that I think everybody has to remember here is that you earn the right after a certain point in your NHL career to test free agency. And Seth Jones has earned that right. And he wants to see what's out there. That's, earn that right, and he wants to see what's out there. That's, I think, what's going to happen. Now, the interesting thing about this is, a year ago, Jarmo Kekulainen, he took his gamble with Panarin and Bobrovsky,

and they had a really good team at the time. And it didn't work, but I understood it. It was a time they had to reward their fans. They had to go for it And I know their fans are very disappointed about the Jones news and I know they're upset But I don't think you can afford to do the same thing here after the season. They just had they're not in the same spot they were a couple years ago and It's almost like free agency in some ways Jeff because Unless you view him as a rental,

are you going to pay what it's going to cost to get Seth Jones and not know if he's staying with you? Like, to me, this is almost like you're making two moves here if you're trading for Seth Jones. You're making the trade and you're trying to work out a deal for him. So it's almost as if Seth Jones is a free agent now and a team has to work out a deal with Jones as well as the Blue Jackets. If the Blue Jackets are going to maximize the value here of Seth Jones.

I think they're going to trade him. I don't think that there is, like I said, it's not like they were a couple of years ago. I think they're going to trade him. You mentioned Panarin, you mentioned Bobrovsky. There's a few more names you can throw in there.

Most recently, Pierre-Luc Dubois, Josh Anderson, to some extent, Matt DeShane as well. Not the same. No, it's not the same, but it's another player that did leave, another marquee player that did leave,

although that was a rental for them. So maybe you might want to scratch that from the list, and that's cool. But this list is growing of players that have wanted out of Columbus, high-profile players. of players that have wanted out of Columbus, high-profile players, top five draft picks that want out of Columbus. I don't know what it is, and I've checked around too, and I'm sure you have.

I don't think it's the city. I don't know if it's the players. I don't know if it's management. I don't know if it's the players i don't know if it's management i don't know what it is but doesn't it feel to you like there's something there that we're all missing you know we we've talked about this at points this year and when yarmulke kalina was on we talked to him about it right yeah and um you know we about, is it the way they negotiate? Is it the perks around the team? I think it's some combination of all of those things.

Is it because, like, Panarin wanted the big city. He wanted New York. Some people want the smaller place with the great college feel. Like, is it going to surprise anybody if Nick Foligno goes back there? No, it's not like maybe he ends up in Minnesota with Marcus, but maybe he goes back to Columbus and that's a success story. That's a guy who loves it there and,

and would like to stay there. I just think it's, it's a combination of all of that. And I really believe that one of the reasons that Davidson is back there is that is he going to help try and smooth some of those rough edges also he loves it there you know I think that he wants to help them fix whatever this issue is. And I think that's why he's back, to try to help them manage and handle all of this. I think he's also going to be the face

of some of the painful decisions that they're going to have to make. But, you know, like, we have talked about how Columbus is a team that negotiation-wise in the past has grinded some of their players. And Jarmo Kekulani didn't run away from that. And I just wonder if the team needs more of a velvet touch. That's one of the things I'm kind of wondering.

Does the team need more of the velvet touch? That's interesting because when we had Jarmo on the podcast, one of the things that stands out in my mind is, and he's 100% right about this, and this is just basic and some would say awkward business, but I don't. I just see it as business. It's business.

He wasn't shy about saying, like, look, we have certain advantages under the CBA when we have a player under control and we will use them. Just as we expect players to use their leverage under what they've negotiated collectively as well. And he's quite blunt and quite open about saying that. Now, do some players need a little bit more of a foot massage during negotiations at times? Probably. Absolutely. And that's why I think your JD point is a good one,

that he's in there to sort of play, you know when the attorney stands up in court and says, Your Honor, Your Honor, what my client is really trying to say is, he's almost fulfilling that role. But I do wonder about a couple of things here now. And, you know, John Davidson in Aaron Portsline's piece in The Athletic talked about, and we've heard this from John Tortorella before as well, we want players who want to be here. That's a common theme either between, you know, the last coach, John Tortorella and the new president, John Davidson.

You know, when you look at this string of players that have left and now Seth Jones is poised to be the next one. How crucial is it that they get Wierenski done long-term? You know what I kind of look at here is that I was just thinking as you were talking about all of this. And that is, you know, with Davidson coming back and whatever you trade Jones for, you have a chance to restart. Like this has been a tough year for Columbus. They didn't have the year they wanted to on the ice. for Columbus. They didn't have the year they wanted to on the ice.

As we mentioned, Foligno was traded, although he may be coming back, but he's a guy who loves it there. Dubois is now gone. Jodes, we assume, is going. Tortorella is gone. Savard is gone. You know, you still have Atkinson,

who clearly loves it there. Bjorkström just signed an extension and he definitely likes it there. And Davidson coming back in, we were talking about the velvet touch. Can he bring it? Like to me, life is all about when things go badly for you, how are you going to change it and how are you going to fix it? And I think what it's incumbent on the Blue Jackets is they have to look at themselves and say, this is what we think we might not be doing right here.

And I'm sure some things are on them and some things aren't. Okay. Not everything is their fault, but whatever it is, they're not doing right. You have a chance to fix it as you build a new core. And the best way that you can create loyalty among your players. And we just talked about Darnell Nurse last week. And I think a lot about Darnell Nurse when I think of this. The best way you can build loyalty in your players is if you're the team that drafts and develops them and you bring them into the NHL and you give them their first real chance to play. And you, you make them say, wow, like this is the team that started with

me. And this is the team that gave me a a chance and this is who I want to play for. That's powerful. You know, Jeff, remember the first place that you and I worked, the first place that really gave us a chance for you and for me. Like I'll always be loyal to that place, even though I'm not there anymore. I always think of it with a smile. that place, even though I'm not there anymore. I always think of it with a smile. I'm sure you do too. That's what Columbus has to create here. They have to look at it and say, okay, this is the thing that happened here that we could

have done better. And now we're going to do it better with this next generation of players we're going to bring. Like when it comes to Dubois, I really think that one of the reasons Dubois wanted to be traded and wouldn't say it, why, is because I think he knew that this was going to happen with Jones and maybe others. I don't know, but Jones, I really believe it. And I think he looked at it and he said, like my peer group is going. And so I think they have to be honest with Wierenski.

They have to go to him and they have to ask him, what are you thinking? And then they have to make their decisions based on that. So do you think then based on this impending Seth Jones move and the fact that they have three first round picks in the draft this year and potentially more if they go that route they move seth jones maybe not picks for this year but next year's a stacked draft are we talking about full rebuild here i think it depends on what you get in return. I expect Jones to be traded this summer. I expect one of the goaltenders to be traded as well.

And maybe a surprise or two along the way. But those are the two things that right now I'm sure of. And I have no idea what's going to happen with Patrick Laine. Do you? I think they keep him. Unless someone blows you away with a ridiculous offer. To me, the key on that one is Kekalainen. Nobody knows him better than Kekalainen does, right?

Yeah. If he believes in him, keep him. I still think that Patrick Laine is the kind of player who can do things that very few NHLers can do. Now, it's time for him. He has to deliver. But you've got something that not everybody can have. He's got the shot. He can score goals. He's shown that he can be an impactful player in a lot of different ways. The thing that impresses me most about Patrick Laine,

because we've seen like there are a lot of really good players with really good shots in the NHL. Nobody scores from distance with their shot the way that Laine does. Like he scores with that wrist shot from farther out, I believe, than anybody else in the nhl you can score when you start to get in that home plate area you look at vlad teresenko and where he scores all of his goals for the minute he does not let go of the puck until he hits the home plate area not line a the only other guy i think off the top of my head is hoffman hoffman's got the great release too. Absolutely.

Not from the distance that Laine does, but Hoffman's a good one as well. There is one thing that I do hope, as we wrap up this Columbus conversation, there is one thing that I do hope that Jarmo Kekulainen has up his sleeve this summer. And you know what that is, Elliot? What's that?

One more Yegor Chinnikov pick. Columbus has three in the first round. Give me one more. One player that we have no idea about at the draft. We'll step away, get on the Toronto-Montreal page here in a couple of moments. 31 Thoughts continues. The thoughts continue. Paul Byron to Shea Weber at bat. Travis Doolittle lost it inside the line. Chance continues. It's pretty unbelievable. I actually just start to think that's probably my first ever OT goal.

So, pretty remarkable. It's a great feeling, especially when the fans are in the stands, you know. Just give you those bumps, you know. It's just an unbelievable feeling. Hard to describe. I'm going to be feeling hard to describe. First night of fans in the building, and they get a chance to cheer the biggest goal of the season for the Montreal Canadiens. So, Elliot, ever since the Maple Leafs lost to the Montreal Canadiens on Saturday night, I'm sure we've all seen all the takes, heard all the lines, read all the tweets, gone to bed with them in our heads and woken up to even more.

The best one that I saw is from one of the people that I think appreciate and understand the game maybe more than most of us. And her name is Ellen Etchingham. A Theory of Ice is the Twitter feed. I think Etch is fantastic. Wonderful person too. And this is perhaps the best possible tweet that I read about the Toronto Maple Leafs all weekend. It's brief and I'll read it to you right now.

Ellen Etchingham. Against the Leafs, all things are possible. Nothing sums it up better than that to me. Your thoughts on Saturday night, hockey night in Canada, overtime, Kotkaniemi the hero, Habs win, and force a game seven. Steve Daniels coming on in a couple of seconds. I thought his video captured it perfectly. You know, Jeff, you're a Toronto

area guy. I'm a Toronto area guy. We grew up in an era where there was, they exited their success and went into long periods of darkness and it has tortured that generation of fans. They live with that darkness. They expect the worst. And, you know, through the last few years, as they were building this itineration of the team, I believe that Kyle Dubas had it right. You bet on your talent, just like the 2016 and 17 Penguins did, just like the 2018 Capitals did. You look at what you've got and you say, eventually these players are too good not to break through and that's what i would have done if i was in their shoes and it amazes me when i think about it how much is on the line monday night in game seven to a lesser degree for the montreal canadians but to a an enormous

degree the toronto maple leafs whether you think it's fair or not, a lot of what they've been building to is either validated or crushed on Monday night. There is so much on the line in this game. I cannot imagine what true, diehard Toronto Maple Leafs fans are going to be feeling from Saturday night until puck drop on Monday night. Their insides are going to be churning. They are going to be emotional wrecks pulled in every direction because on one hand, you're going to have the belief. You're going to want to believe. you're going to have the belief,

you're going to want to believe, you're going to try to convince yourself to believe. But on the other hand, you're going to be looking at everything that's happened since 1967, and you're going to be defeatist. Someone sent me a note today, and I've been looking at it while we're doing this. Mitch Marner, that puck over glass penalty is the fifth one of his playoff career. Does anybody else have five puck over glass penalties? I mean, it's unbelievable. It could only happen to one team. A lot here.

So Saturday, game six, Much Ike in Game 5, the Montreal Canadiens with the lead, cruising, and the Leafs claw back to force overtime, and then Montreal delivers the dagger. Nick Suzuki in Game 5, Jesperi Kotkaniemi in Game 6. Of particular note in Game 6, which will be troubling and haunting Maple Leafs fans simply because of how important he is and they've seen this movie before, the Jake Muzzin injury.

If there was one defenseman that does something so unique that you say he can't be replaced on that blue line, it's Jake Muzzin. Yet, for Maple Leaf leafs fans here they are again it's unbelievable really and the credit to the cameraman and our truck who caught that and you know just the look on muzzin's face oh yeah when he showed that look on that stride, every Toronto fan watching the game had the same look on their face. Yeah. Now, I don't know if you could say any one guy is more irreplaceable than another, but he's pretty close.

Well, I just look at, you know, what, what goes into each defenseman, what each defenseman does on that blue line. And nobody else does what Muzzin does. Nobody else on that blue line does what Jake Muzz muzzin does nobody else on that blue line does

what jake muzzin does at all he doesn't get all the headlines but you can make the point that based on what he brings to the game he's the most unique and maybe you could even say the most important blue liner on that team and i'll tell you something else too off the ice i think he's critically important in that room yeah you've talked about that before tavares is the captain but i believe muzzin is the next closest thing after you know after tavares i believe they depend on him they lean on him they take his advice you know you're not only taking his play his on ice performance out of the game you're taking his off ice presence out of the game too if he can't play and i i don't think that that's a small thing okay before we get to dangle here elliot uh should

mention the 2500 people oh so nice even though it was you know like 10 capacity it still was real nice to see fans at the bell center on saturday and i thought going into it i thought man at those prices you're not going to get loud rowdy fans you're not going to get the fans are you kidding you need if you're going if you're spending nine thousand dollars on a ticket in the black market you're doing exactly what you want you're getting your money's worth on no man i thought you were getting the richie riches that would give you polite putt-for-par applause after being played. They've been waiting for this for so long. I'm saying I was wrong, way wrong about it.

Your thoughts on the fans Saturday? Well, I thought it was great. I was very happy for people who got to go, the families, people who went and paid tickets. I'm sure there were people who illegally crossed the border from ontario to quebec but i'm not gonna turn any of you in who i may who i may know i mean it was it was great to see some fans and uh you know i hope we can see more of them you know i you know obviously manitoba right now very very, very hard times. And we send all of our best to the people in Manitoba

who are struggling a bit right now. But I mean, it was great to see that last night. It was great to see some atmosphere. Like I said, it gave me goosebumps watching it a little bit on the air. Just that those pictures of people in there, the singing of the anthem. Anthem was great. And I'm not a big anthems guy but that was fantastic there was a time we kind of thought and this was before hockey night was on sports then it was still on cbc you know maybe we show the anthems too much maybe we don't have to do it all the time and i remember the first couple times we didn't do it

the flood of complaints we got yeah i know people loved watching because they loved watching the players faces the anticipation the build-up and we're like okay we're changing that decision i always knew that we missed fans the games in florida the games in vegas game six islanders penguins it just reminded me how much we miss them. And I was, I really love seeing them back in Canada. And I, I hope it's not too long until we can see more. You know,

we went into this series saying all the consequences are going to be on the Montreal side. If they lose, then look out what happens at every level of the Montreal Canadians because there will be consequences, damn it, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Do we say the same thing about the Toronto Maple Leafs if they lose on Monday? I think that's a great question. You see, I think that Brandon Shanahan believes in Kyle Dubas.

And he believes in the way that Dubas has kind of structured the group. And he believes in the way that Dubas wants them to play. And not only that, but the way Dubas has built out their analytics department, has put everything together. out their analytics department has put everything together you know the other thing too is a year ago dubas changed his path a little bit in the sense that if you look at and i believe it started last year at the trade deadline i heard there was i think i've mentioned this before but there was a conversation about i i want to say it was mark borowiecki. I think that's who it was. And Borowiecki was still in Ottawa at the time. And there were some people who said, hey, he doesn't fit what we do. And Dubas kind of said, yes, he does. He does now. And if you look at what

Dubas added this year, it was a lot of, I think we need that, the edge. You know, we have the skill. We need a bit more edge. So I don't think it's fair to say about him that he had blind spots towards what a lot of people felt Toronto needed. I think he adapted. I think he did address that. I look at Pittsburgh and Washington, and I know I say it all the time, but watching them come back to win cups.

I look at Boston. You know, Boston won a Stanley Cup in 2011. They missed in 2013. So close. They missed in 2019. So close. But they always bet on their top players, right? I look also at Tampa.

When they got swept two years ago, they added some edge. They brought in the Blake Coleman's. They brought in the Pat Maroons. Yeah, they developed the Yanni Gord's, but they won the Stanley Cup because their best players, Kucherov, Point, Hedman, Vasilevsky, they were unbelievable. I think in this league, you have to depend on your talent. You have to say, we have elite talent, and we're going to build around it,

and we're going to depend on them. I think that's the right way to go. But if they do lose game seven, Jeff, it's going to be extremely difficult not to say something big here has to change and the thing is too is that the guy who usually takes the beating for this has probably been the best of all of them are you referring to the eternal target number 88? Yeah, I am. Now, he took a bad penalty in game six, but I think generally, he's the guy that everyone looks at. He's the one everyone says,

that's the guy, right? Yeah. He's been very good. You see, I look at this and, like I'm hearing the same thing that you're hearing, getting texts from people, oh, things need to change. And I always come back,

what would you change? And how would you do it? And the answer I'll you're hearing, getting texts from people, oh, things need to change. And I always come back, well, what would you change and how would you do it? And the answer I'll back is always, I don't know. Like I come back a lot to the Washington Capitals 2010 and compare this team to that squad. There's an expectation that that 2010 team was going to win. And ironically enough was against Montreal Canadians in that opening round. But, you know, there was Kirk Muller drawing it up. There was Mike Camilleri snapping it home.

There was Jaroslav Halak making all the saves. You know, that was a team that for the first time was playing as the favorite and playing as the heavyweight. And there was all the stories about you can't win

with this group. You got to blow it up. And they made a ton of changes and coaching changes and goalie changes and personnel changes. And eventually it worked. And eventually they won the cup. But to your point, they bet on their big guys.

And they kept that main crew together. Now, sure, Carlson shuffled in and replaced Mike Green, but basically that was the nucleus of what was going to be the Stanley Cup team we saw as that 2010 team that couldn't get past the Montreal Canadiens. And we were all stunned. I remember the HockeyNet in Canada pregame show, and I can't remember who said it,

but it was like, oh yeah, Washington in three for that opening round against the Habs. Listen, if you're a Maple Leafs fan, you probably don't want to hear this. But if they lose on Monday, I don't know that I'd change a thing other than some of the obvious things that are going to happen in the off season by way of contracts expiring.

I don't know that you change anything. I know there's going to be anger and maybe the market, you know, if you look at the market as a volcano, maybe it demands a sacrifice. I volunteer you as the sacrifice, by the way. That's fine. Throw me into the volcano.

Just end it. Put me out of my misery. No, it won't work because the volcano will say, come on, this is all you're giving me? That's all I get. It's really an appetizer here. This is just the pepper and the parsley. I want the full bowl of soup.

Yeah, the lava's flowing. If this is all I get, eruption. You know, you might not be wrong. I want to see game seven first and who plays well and kind of go from there. The Montreal thing too, like there's a lot on the line from Montreal, a lot on the line from Montreal. Like there was one member of our group off air last night, and I won't say who it was because, you know,

I don't necessarily think that's right. But they were saying that for Montreal now, this is enough. Like their fans could be satisfied. And I don't buy that for a second. I don't. Yeah, I don't know about that. Like if they lose, I don't think anybody's going to be satisfied with this. I think there's a lot on the line there too. Like I think they galaxy brain this a little bit by not playing cole caulfield for game

three until game three you know kevin bx he he makes the jokes like play cole caulfield play cole caulfield that's funny he's he's imitating he's making it pretty clear i'm trying to think of a first round game you know what you know what it reminds me of and it's a little bit old it's 1989 calgary flames that was a team you know how many times had they lost they went to one stanley cup final in 1986 they lost to montreal but how many times have they lost to edmonton oh can't get out of the smite division edmonton juggernaut too bad if they were in if they were in the patrick division they may have a better chance oh yeah i we all remember it well okay so you go into the first round and you're playing the vancouver canucks and during the regular season the vancouver canucks

had finished i'm looking at it now 43 points behind behind them, 117 points for the Flames, who were number one in the NHL, 74 for the Canucks. This isn't the same, but it's close. They go to game seven overtime. Stan Smeal has a great chance. The Flames should have lost before Joel Otto scores. Then they go and win the cup. Now, I'm not saying if Toronto wins the game seven,

they're going to go win the cup. But I do have that same feeling. I have one great friend in university who was a big Flames fan. And I remember him talking about that game. And if they lose that game, what happens to the Calgary Flames? And I'm sure people can think of more recent examples, but I've always remembered that one because i was 18 at the time it's you know times you remember in your life but that's what it feels like for both these teams if you lose this game what is the pressure to change it's enormous someone who knows this all too well elliot who lives and dies with the maple leafs, both in his personal life and his professional life

and his digital life, is Steve Dangle. And his watch parties have been something else. They've been a lot of fun to follow. The LFR videos are always good. The watch parties are called Watch a Leafs Game with Steve Dangle. I want to mention a couple of people specifically who helped put that together

because they deserve recognition. Drew Livingston, Graham Campbell, Stéphane Perret, and Tom Stewart do an excellent job putting this together. Let's default to Dangle and get his take on all this. Steve Glynn, you probably know better as Steve Dangle, hockey's multimedia force. He has a huge social media following. LFR videos are legendary. A best-selling book, a hit podcast, amongst other endeavors.

And most recently, you can watch Steve go through almost a nightly existential crisis in the Leafs Habs series on his YouTube sidecast, Watch a Leafs Game with Steve Dangle. Steve, how are you today? It is Sunday morning as we record this. How's your blood pressure? Get out of here, Jeff. Both of you. Both of you get out of here.

Everyone get out of here. Get out of my face. I said I was going to make this video Saturday night so the Leafs would not take up my Sunday. And here I am, bright and early, this frigging team, man. This frigging team. I. This frigging team. I really, I genuinely don't believe them.

I cannot believe we're in this spot. Your voice reflects that. Oh. Like all you need to know about the Maple Leafs right now, Steve, is reflected in how gravelly your voice is. Two games ago, I was talking about that's their best playoff game in years. Their most dominant performance they're up three games to one what happened what happened small sample size that's literally the playoffs

that's the playoffs everything like I can't trust any numbers I can't trust any regular C like I make a video after every least regular season game and I've been doing that for 14 years now, and they lose this playoff series, there's no point doing that anymore. There's no point doing that anymore because it doesn't matter how you do in the regular season. I'll find something else to do. Like, I'll still talk about the Leafs. I'll find something else to do.

You're going to be 32 thoughts next year? I'll be 33. Price is right, you guys. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I just don't know anymore. You know, I watched the nine minute video before we taped this. And there was something you said in the fourth minute.

I always try to think like the fans think. In addition to the way I try to think as a reporter, I always try to tap into the fans energy. What's on their mind? How are they going? And, you know, because I grew up in Toronto, I was born in Toronto. I grew up in Toronto. I have a lot of friends who are really big Leaf fans.

And, you know, after Thursday night's game, game five, they started to text me. Oh, no. Oh, no. Oh, no. This is everything we've seen. And I was like, you know guys it's it's game five come on and then game six last night I felt it I felt it the whole night and I felt it when they fell behind and then you know they come back they start to play well there as you talk about they dominate early in overtime

and then they lose and the text started pouring in from people i know and there's something you say in the fourth minute and i'm gonna write 31 thoughts later today for monday too and the whole top of my article is going to be about what's on the line in game seven for everybody involved, not just the Leafs, but also the Canadians. And you say it, you say. The process. I don't care about the process. And I tell you what, I don't trust the process. I don't.

What is the point of the process if you don't win? The process is there. So you win. process if you don't win the process is there so you win and i think there's an entire fan base that is right with you on that i have always thought that kyle dubas did the right thing by betting on his big four but it seems as if judgment day is Monday night for that. It has to be because last year's team was like genuinely flawed in a lot of ways. You know, you had in key moments, you had two usable defensemen. Like I like this year's depth, which has supposedly taken a hit compared to last year's in terms of talent.

But I think they're better suited for role. This year's team, I look at them and I try to put myself in Kyle Dubas' shoes and I go, what would I change about them? They have the Rocket Richard winner. They have another guy who's not the Rocket Richard winner who finished top five in scoring. Jason Spezza has thoroughly turned back the clock. That dude had more points. He had six more points than Josh Anderson in the regular season. Their defense, I mean, TJ Brody is one of their better free agent signings on the back end ever. Defenseman one through six is as good as it's been in 20 years. The goaltending, my God, Jack Campbell plays like this in 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020

for the Toronto Maple Leafs. They win each and every one of those playoff series. I'm serious. I look at Dubas' team, the team he's assembled, and I go, what would I do differently? And this, this is what's killing me this time around. The answer is nothing. Like I genuinely believed in this team because they gave you a reason to believe in this team heading into game six I was getting texts from all over the place oh what do you think what do you think what do you think I'm like come on they're obviously the better team in the series game five the Habs play clearly their best game of the series and still blow a three goal lead the Leafs are the better team here they're gonna win oh my god they lose

three straight elimination games here just forget it forget it forever so sports in a lot of ways is about relationships i want to focus in on uh from a fan's point of view because from a fan's point of view it's a relationship with your team and sometimes you're born into fandom sometimes you discover it later sometimes you change allegiances you, sometimes you discover it later, sometimes you change allegiances. Usually people that are involved in brand work will tell you brands and your association with them generally forms, I think it's around the age of 12 when you really start to define yourself by the brands you surround yourself with and they generally stick with you for the majority of your life.

But we've seen people sever relationships. Maybe it's a personal relationship. Maybe it's a sports relationship. We've seen relationships severed. If the Maple Leafs lose on Monday, you're more in tune with Leafs fans than we are. You deal with them on a daily basis, Steve. Is this a breaking point for a lot of fans? You know, it's messed up.

No, it's not. And the Leafs abuse that fact. They really do just abuse that fact. How so? I saw, I saw someone with a great tweet. They're like, I, if the Leafs lose game seven, I am absolutely watching every single game next year and because we can't help ourselves.

And I say this all the time, you know, when they choke or, you know, the game seven against Boston or against Columbus, I scream into the camera at the fan base. I go, I've hitched my wagon to this team. I have to do this. What's wrong with you? What's wrong? I get paid to do this. What's wrong with you? Why right i get paid to do this what's wrong with you why are you doing this and i

gotta say i i i just don't get it anymore like the Leafs are blessed with the most tolerant the most patient fan base in the world bar none but do you ever think it runs out it's gotta for some people and okay i love my anecdotal evidence here so stop me if you've heard this before a lot of people on this podcast are about to roll their eyes if they listen to mine i used to work at the toronto zoo i worked there for seven years 2005 is when i started was there 2006 2007 2008 2009 and i say all those years because the Leafs sucked in all those years. All of them. And what I noticed is moms, Leaf shirts. Dads, Leaf shirts. Kids, Crosby, Taves, Getzlaff, Ovechkin. The kids are not going to cheer for this team if they keep getting their heart broken by them.

Now, kids today, I mean, they're covered in Leafs stuff. Matthews and Marner and Nylander. Let's not act like this team hasn't given fans something to cheer about. Some amazing moments. I mean, imagine being one of the kids in the building for that 8-6 game against Carolina last year. That'd just be spectacular. eight six game against carolina last year like that'd just be spectacular so this iteration of the toronto maple leafs has given fans more to cheer about yeah than they did 10 15 years ago and that's the most pathetic part they haven't won a playoff series since 2004. i don't know if

they're going to lose the adults but kids aren't as dumb as us and they'll drop this team like a bad habit but here's the thing even if they dropped, when you look at the modern sports fan, and this is true of anything where attention spans are quick and we attach and detach and come back again and everybody loves a redemption story, et cetera. Even if they detach, how quickly would they come back? I mean, pretty fast. Pretty fast.

I mean, you know, God love him but uh Mr. Adam Copeland edge he dropped him for a while right and he went over to the dark side with with the New Jersey Devils and now they're great and and here he is he came crawling back he kicked out at the two and three quarter count I gotta cut another promo on that guy, on that scrub, Adam Copeland, Mr. Edge. I mean, obviously they'll be back. But I know for me personally, I own a lot of Leafs stuff, and I'm happy to wear it. But when they blow it in the playoffs, I don't wear any of it all summer. I can't even look at it for two months.

And that's got to affect merch. I have a shirt that I was sent by a company and I won't say who that says Toronto Maple Leafs North division champions. I might set it on fire. Someone sent you a shirt with North division champions on it. North division champions because they were first place in the regular season. What is this?

Baseball. They're not North division champion in a season where you, you will literally get a North division champion. Whoever wins the second round series against Winnipeg, whether it's Toronto, Montreal or Winnipeg, whoever wins that series to me, they're the North Division champions.

Then you get to brag and hang a banner, I guess, if you really want to. You finish first in your division in the regular season? This bar, the bar is a tectonic plate for the Leafs. It's so far under our feet. My God. My God. So sorry, to answer your question. Yeah, they'll be back.

You know, do you read Twitter? Do you go online or do you shut it out? Like when you're after a game like that, do you say timeout or are you diving in? So I've actually, I've had a unique experience these playoffs by doing the live streams. experienced these playoffs by doing the, uh, the live streams and during the game being on the live stream. And, and I don't have access to the chat because it would just be way too much information all at once to perform the stream and also read the live chat at the same time. But I haven't been on Twitter and I got to say it's a far far less stressful way of of consuming the game i pay better attention to the game i'm not subjected to thousands upon thousands of people's every thought and it's not that they're

bad thoughts it's just that it's i have too many of my own thoughts i i have more than 31 i i have far too many of them and then everyone is just dumping their every anxiety and every insecurity and then I'm supposed to consume it? It's terrible. After the game, if I do the video night of, I get on there because I want to see the reaction. So I did last night. For game five? Nah, I didn't bother because it's just going to be a hyper ramped up version of what it was all during the game. Like, you should have seen yesterday. I asked for questions for people to send me for my Leafs postgame video. I had over a thousand responses in about half an hour.

People got a lot to say about this team. And almost all of it after game six is panic. Oh yeah. That's real. This, well, this city is always tense and always tight come playoff time. And I still maintain that even if the Maple Leafs won something, I don't know whether people would be able to really appreciate it because it's a feeling that's so uncommon. They wouldn't know what to do with themselves.

Where do you find right now? Most of rage directed at, rightly or wrongly? Because historically, you know, whether it's Murphy or Cross or Berg or McCabe or whomever, Maple Leafs fans will traditionally always pick a defenseman. You know, some markets will choose a goalie. Some markets put it right on the desk of the general manager. Leafs fans historically have always picked a defenseman to vent everything at. Who is it now? Well, down the stretch, you saw fans getting ready to make that person Morgan Riley.

They were, they were getting ready. He was making a lot of defensive mistakes. But this year, I mean, I go hard on certain players, and I do feel bad about it sometimes. And I really make a concerted effort when I'm hard on a player to dial it back sometimes. And when they do something good, really put focus on that morgan riley's been really good in the series i think and i've barely had any criticisms of him and i haven't really

seen any criticisms from the fans i cannot say the same for mitch marner and this dude i think he finished tied for third in nhL scoring this year and it's not enough. It wasn't enough during the regular season. He has the best goal scoring clip of his entire career. Ah, he never shoots. Ah, take this guy off the top unit of the power play. He sucks. Even though he had a ton of goals, a ton of even strength goals, which are valued, and

he had top five scoring in the entire league. He didn't have a power play goal. So he's a bum and get him off. Matthews has really struggled this series too. But there's something about that contract saga that until he has some sort of big moment that erases everything, oh, this fan base can't shake it. They really can't shake it. And all season long, after hammering him during the contract saga, I hammered him because I hated the whole thing. I hated the way it was executed. I hated the

way it turned out. But look, here we are. Here we are. All season long, he performed like a star. But because they're losing now, or because they're, I guess, going to game seven after having a 3-1 lead, and he takes that penalty as well, it's all those ugly feelings from the contract saga are coming back. So I do agree that it's typically a defenseman, but no. Mitch is the dude right now. As we wrap up here, I just wanted to quote your numbers from the beginning of your video.

41,000 at one particular time, an overall reach of 275,000. I do think that this is the future of sports viewing. There will be multiple feeds. And so, for example, for game six, there's the Hockey Night in Canada feed with those of us who are on it. And then there's your video feed, your YouTube feed,

where you can watch along with Steve. And who knows, maybe we'll come up with StatCast somewhere in the future too. But that reach is really good, Steve. I know you're not feeling great right now, but I just wanted to say I is really good, Steve. I'm, you know, I know you're not feeling great right now, but I just wanted to say, I'm, I'm really happy for you. I'm, I, you have definitely carved out another big part of the viewing process when it comes to the Toronto Maple Leafs.

So I know you're not feeling great today, but I thought it was important to end on a positive and congratulate you on something. Well, thank you very much. And you know, it's, uh, it's taken a long time to get here, right? I started these videos when I was 19 and I'm a 33 year old man, but, uh, it, you know, sometimes it takes a little push maybe from

one, uh, Jeff Merrick when I'm early in my career and don't really know how to say words. Um, you know, Jeff, uh, Jeff, uh, was one of the kind people who helped give me opportunities. And I've been yelling and screaming for years that this was a future and now it's here. It's pretty great. Don't worry. You, you, you said you're 33. Yep.

Tell you in that video, you looked at least 133. I feel it, dude. I feel it. I do a back routine every morning. I do my dead bugs. I feel it, man. Oh, man, dead bugs, man. Those are tough.

Yeah, I got to do it. It's good for the hip flexors. Yeah, sorry, Jeff. You got to sit up this fitness conversation. Elliot and I are doing a fitness podcast. That's right. Okay, no problem. No, I know dead bugs.

That's good. Calm down with your gym picks, buddy. Sorry, Freed. Where were we? You know, I, I have to say, I have to say one thing. We're going to do it after this interview is over, but we have to go downtown today to do a shoot and you know, it may involve a slight change of clothes and Jeff is complaining that there's no change rooms available outside to get changed in.

And I'm like, Jeff, like you're not at the corner of Young and Dundas going to proudly take off your shirt and show those ripped abs to everybody who's walking around. Jeff can't go sleeveless. Thanks for your time, bud. We really appreciate it. Thanks, guys. Really appreciate it.

Thanks for your time, bud. We really appreciate it. Thanks, guys. Really appreciate it. Okay, so Elliot, one thing we do know about the city where we live and work is it's going to be crazy today. Today is going to be a nuts day on sports radio. It's going to be a nuts day on sports television, conversations in casual meeting places. Game seven, Montreal-Toronto will dominate. And in Toronto, it will be anxiety-filled. True or false? That is true.

That is absolutely true. I just can't wait to get to tonight to finally see this game. The blog is coming out today too, Jeff. I interviewed a friend of mine, one of my oldest friends. He's my age. He's a month older than me, so he's 50. His son, his eldest child, is 19.

The father is a big Leaf fan and his son is a huge Canadiens fan. Oh, great. Yeah. Tonight's going to be a wonderful moment in that family. So they have a rule. They have a rule that whoever, whichever team wins game seven, if the father or the son,

their team wins and they taunt the other, they have to wear the opposing hockey sweater for the rest of the playoffs. If they taunt the other, they have to wear the opposing hockey sweater for the rest of the playoffs. If they taunt? Yes. Do they have definition of taunt yet? I believe so. There's Dave's wife, Iris, and there's two other daughters.

I'm assuming they're the referees in all of this. Okay. So they determine what a taunt is. Yes. Very good. I suspect there are many families like that with divided loyalties of the two teams here in question this

evening. One thing before we wrap up here, Elliot, I want to mention, got a chance to work alongside Carolyn Ouellette, Leah Hextall, and Cassie Campbell-Pascal doing the play-by-play. Carolyn Cameron hosting the entire thing. Her panel with Blake Bolden and Jennifer Botterill was outstanding, Brendan Parker doing ringside at the Scotiabank Saddledome,

the PWHPA Secret Dream Gap Tour, the last one on the PWHPA calendar, got to work this the last three days. Wonderful time, wonderful working with Ouellette, who is a star in the making, as is Blake Bolden. Botterel's already there. Really good hockey. And interesting that at the end, and this is like five games

in seven days for these athletes. And so you can tell who's got the best conditioning, who's in the best shape, who are the elite players. And it was. By the end, it was Marie- philippe poulin who was a star sarah nurse was outstanding in this tournament a couple other names we should mention as well uh jesse eldridge was tremendous in the tournament jamie lee rattray real good victoria bach aaron ambrose sunday who blocked like five shots including a a game saver rebecca johnston was outstanding the last series winner or the one that popped the water bottle holy smokes what a shot and and she's fading backwards and takes the one timer and goes and

hits that tiny little spot it's like she's i mean listen people say oh she's the best you know she's the best hockey player in that space ever yeah you make a really good point uh one other name we should mention as well sarah potomac um who played for team calgary i thought was outstanding as well real good tournament a lot of fun some high-end hockey glad to be involved in it and now since we've covered a lot of women's hockey this year elliot now the questions come because this is the end of the pwhpa uh calendar right now uh july 25th um the canadian athletes will centralize there is the world championships on the horizon and then there then there is the centralization period whereby they chisel down 28 to 23 skaters,

and questions become what becomes of the PWHPA when that happens? What happens to those athletes? What does Lauren Gable, for example, do who didn't make centralization? I just mentioned Sarah Potomac. She's another. What happens to her? Where do they end up playing? Do they go to Sweden? There's a lot of the Finnish

players that are real good who end up playing in Sweden. Do they end up going there? Do some go to the NWHL? We don't know, but now the questions are going to start. It would appear to me, that the PWHPA's calendar doesn't have anything else on it. But real good hockey, outstanding athletes,

really good people, really inspiring stories. And I got to tell you, this is a side note too, and Willette and I had a lot of fun with this one. Team Canada's always used Sarah Nurse as a winger. And in this tournament, she played as a center. And there are some questions whether she's strong enough on draws as a center right now. We've heard this plenty from, whether it's Sidney Crosby

had that knock once upon a time. I think Sarah Nurse is going to be a real good center for Canada, maybe sooner than later. I don't know about this Olympics, unless they put someone like Sarah Fillier on the wing. Would you try her in the world at center? I think you would. I think this is one of those situations, you know,

Willette brought up a really good point here. You know, you can probably never have enough centers in your lineup because centers can always play wing. And if you have someone like Sarah Fillier, who's a name we've talked about before um who is she's going to be like the next one remember how like before vancouver we were talking about marie philippe and she was going to be you know that next superstar coming out of canada remember the name sarah phillier because that's the next one that Canada is going to produce. So yeah, I would try her at center.

It seems as if there's a couple of very high profile people in and around Hockey Canada that really want Sarah Nurse to become a center. And there's some very high profile people in Hockey Canada that don't like the idea very much. Well, who's got more power? The center people or the non-center people? I'm not close enough to know. Although I do know both people that want her as a center,

and they have a lot of stroke. Okay. So we'll see. We shall see. What does Sarah Nurse want to play? Center or wing? Doesn't everybody always want to play? Center or wing? Doesn't everybody always want to play center? That's what I would think.

You know, with the added responsibility and going all over the ice. And although we've talked about this before, and this is true at the women's game, not just the men's game as well, you know, you sort of identify as a number now more than anything else. You know, your F1, F2, F3,

the table hockey days are done where you just sort of patrol your wing. If you're a winger and if your stick can't touch the boards, then you're out of position. I mean, all those things that I grew up with is all gone, thankfully, and we're moving towards positionless hockey, and we're moving towards positionless hockey in the women's game as well. But I'm pretty sure if you ask Sarah Nurse where she she'd want to play i think on camera she'd say i'm just happy to do whatever the team wants me to do whatever's going to help us win but you know athletes elliot

they want the high profile spot they crave it just like they crave the big stage i think if you ask sarah nurse where she wants to, she'll tell you center. Why not? Okay, taking us out, and thanks for joining us on the Half Car Cast, Half Regular Cast. Taking us out, and thanks to Steve Dangle for stopping by. And I hope that he's okay tonight. Enjoy the game. Going to be a big one. Make sure we're all checking in on Steve tonight, okay?

Taking us out is someone we talked about and Elliot wrote about at the beginning of the year, former professional hockey player turned musician, Mike McNamee performing under the name Boston Levi. Oh, Boston. Great.

Right. Traded his stick for a guitar after a challenging year stemming from the pandemic from his debut EP prophecies, which just dropped last week, here he is with Run, Baby, Run on 31 Thoughts, the podcast. Nice. Take your first ride and run, baby, run. If you want a sign, this is it.

You're mad, you're magic, you're as hot as a gun. You want to play with fire, consider this You'll chase a thrill if it's worth it Cause you'll never ever wanna work for it Take your first ride and run, baby run You got a spine of steel and a roar of thunder. Yeah, you make me drown. Yeah, you're pulling me under. Your love is like an ocean wave.

Don't let my love turn you away. What's coming is better than what's gone. Hit the road, chase the desert moon Do you like the thrill? Well, I'm not into it You're bad, you're tragic, you're a sunny fool You chase the thrill if it's worth it But you never ever wanna work for it

Take your first ride and run, baby, run You got a spine of steel and a roar of thunder Yeah, you make me drown, yeah, you're pulling me under Your love is like an ocean wave Don't let my love turn you away What's coming is better than what's gone Right