32 Thoughts: The Podcast - Talking to Ownership in Their Language

Episode Date: April 3, 2026

In this episode of 32 Thoughts, Kyle Bukauskas and Elliotte Friedman break down what was said by MLSE leadership in the days following Brad Treliving’s departure and why this shift is about more than just the GM (25:01). They discuss early candidates for the GM role and Elliotte’s theory on how the Quinn Hughes situation could influence how players like Auston Matthews approach their futures (30:50). Elliotte also shares a story about how he heard the news of Treliving’s firing (35:30), while the guys touch on Nashville’s ongoing GM search, including upcoming in-person interviews (40:00). Elliotte unpacks the playoff races after a busy night of key-NHL action (43:45). They also get into tension in Ottawa following comments on the Tkachuk brothers’ podcast (50:31), Kyle Connor’s KFC commercial (1:05:49), and the Final Thought on Owen Michaels signing with the Oilers out of Western Michigan (1:07:14). Kyle and Elliotte answer listener questions in the Thoughtline (1:14:04). Today we highlight indie artists from Victoria BC, Door d'Or and their track Fibre Optics. Check their music out here. Listen to all the 32 Thoughts music here. Email the podcast at [e-mail] or call the Thought Line at 1-833-311-3232 and leave us a voicemail. This podcast was produced and mixed by Dominic Sramaty and hosted by Elliotte Friedman & Kyle Bukauskas. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates

And I guess this other person who's driving to, my name came up on their display. And all I hear is this pause. And all of a sudden the guy goes, is this the real Elliot Friedman? Oh, my gosh. And I'm like, oh, my God, this isn't the right number. Somehow, Siri dialed the wrong number. Welcome to 32 Thoughts, the podcast presented by your Canadian Toyota dealers and the 100% electric BZ. Available now during Red Tag days.

Elliot, Dom, Kyle, along with you once again, there was a lot to get to on another busy Thursday night in the NHL. The playoff races fast and ferocious in both the West and the East. But Elliot, why don't we start with the big news of the week in Toronto? Brad Tre Living out as general manager, the news of that coming down Monday night just over an hour before the Leafs were set to play in Anaheim on. Monday. Keith Pelly held the press conference on Tuesday. One thing I have learned from you in these situations, Mr. Friedman, is do not get caught up in language. No, do not get caught up in language. If there was anything in terms of what was said over the last few days out of the Powers at B at Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment, what grabbed your eyes and your ears the most?

First of all, Grasshopper, I like to hear that you are listening to my teachings. It's starting to catch on here. It's taking a bit, but I'm starting to catch up. Kyle, one of the things I really do believe, and it happened to Justin Cuthbert on the radio, by the way, people really loved your breakdown of how I looked on the radio that day. That got some traction. It was not a $12 yogurt. The entire bill was for the yogurt and the coffee was barely $12.

I don't. I don't buy $12 yogurt just so you know that. But, you know, one of the, like Justin, he got caught up. People get caught up in titles and they got caught up in language. Ignore all the noise. Ignore the corporate speak. I work at a big corporation. And I've learned just don't so much listen to people what they say.

follow what they do. And I ignore buzzwords. You hear them in every different corporation. You see them all over social media. We all have gained in the social media age, or we all should have gained, a better idea of what really matters and what doesn't, right? And so when Keith Pelley talks, I listened,

because I do think there were a couple of things that were valuable. but I ignore a lot of it in the sense of the corporate speak. And I'm more concerned about what he does in terms of evolving this position or picking the new leader. Ultimately, as he said, that is what we have to focus on, not the stuff, not 97% of the stuff that was said on Tuesday. So let's go through it. What matters? Number one, they're not tearing it down. They're not going into the tank. They are going. And like one of the things I had heard was that Pelly and Brad Tree Living were in agreement on one particular thing.

And that is they felt this was a one year blip. And it doesn't have to be a total tear down. I thought it was also interesting that Jonas Siegel had a really good interview in The Athletic with William Neelander. Nealander had said if it's a full tear down, he was not staying or rebuild or whatever. If it was a short-term thing where they try to get it back on track for next year, Neelander was going to be okay with that. I've heard Boston has come up a lot in Toronto this year. Bruins fans are going to love that. They think they're already in their Maple Leaf's heads over all the playoff results.

But now the Maple Leafs are looking at Boston and how they came back so quickly. And they're saying, how can we do that too? The players look at the Bruins and say, if they can do that, we can do it. And the organization looks at it like if they can do it, why can't we do it? So I think that's a very real thing that you have to keep track of if you're watching this search. The second thing is the data-driven line. I can tell you, right, because somebody asked me this internally, in terms of one of the keys to the candidate that you may be looking for, is they have to be data-centric. They have to really understand data and the importance of data and where data is moving.

Right. We have just completed a complete rebuild of TFC, all using data combined with cultural checks. Now, I have a lot of theories about this. I don't think that the next GM or leader of hockey ops, whoever it's going to be, whatever it's going to be, has to be an absolute total data nerd, for lack of a better term. I don't think that's necessary. But what I do believe is that they have to be someone who knows how to explore. explain things in a way where they can say, here's the proof. Again, I'm going to get in trouble for saying something here, but I hope people understand what I mean.

And that is that if you're going to make decisions for the hockey team, it can't simply be scout speak. That was a phrase I was told. I'm not disrespecting scouts. I think scouts are very important. and Boston is an example of a team this year where their pro scouting help get them back on track because they made really good fines.

I think scouting is important, but it goes deeper than that. The Toronto Blue Jays, for example, gave $500 million to Vlad Guerrero, and I think we're all betting on, especially after the way last season went, that that contract is going to pay itself. they offered

Shoay Otani somewhere between $500 and $600 million. They didn't get them, but they did it. They threw it on the table. And they didn't just do it on quote-unquote scout speak.

They did it on, here's our empirical evidence, here's our data, here's why we believe it's going to work. Otani was a bit of a different case because also you could push Rogers to a whole other part of the world.

Like that was more than just the baseball player, although as we've seen here, the baseball player is worth every penny. But can I just say quickly, Elliot? Yes. So just for those that may not know how just the ownership works, of course, Rogers owns the Lou Jays.

They now are controlling owner of MLSC. So that's why you're making a comparison. Right. But all, thank you, Kyle. But all of those decisions are made with hard data. Now, people might say that hockey's more random, and it's true. But still, what they want is they want to be able to say, if you're going to go into a room with Keith Pelley,

Edward Rogers, or Anthony Staffieri, who basically runs the Rogers Company for Edward, Rogers, you have to be able to go in there and explain in a way that they understand why this is going to work, why we're going to do that. And they, like, Rogers can be convinced to open the checkbooks, but you have to be able to convince them. And what this says to me is that when Pelley saw the way the Raptors do things, and when Pelley saw the way TFC does things.

And both those teams have been more or less successful than the Maple Leafs at times. The Raptors, of course, won a championship. TFC, of course, won a championship. But there have been times the Maple Leafs have been more successful than them. But he feels clearly what that says to me is the way those teams are making decisions are ahead of where the Leafs are. And the Raptors have had an up and down season, TFC off to a so-so start. But I think generally he believes that they are better decision makers

in terms of the way they approach things. And I would suspect that considering the people above Keith Pelley allowed him to make this GM change, they agreed with him. So when he talks data-driven, that's what I think he's talking about. Can you explain your decisions in a way that will convince Rogers that we are on the right path? And let me just say, I know I just mentioned Pellie, Edward Rogers, and Tony Staffieri. We all know that the real power at Rogers lies with Sarah Schmidt and Sarah Grossman. Those are the two people that you really have to impress.

And if you don't impress them, you've got no chance. No chance. Remember those names. Nicely done. Okay. Thank you. Thank you very much. You know, for example, you know, one of the names that kind of came up to me in the last few days was Alex Steves.

And Alex Stevens is a guy who was a Marley, a good Marley. And he ended up in Chicago. And he ended up in Boston this year and became a very good piece for them. Not the biggest star, obviously, on the Bruins, but a good, good part of a rebuilding team, a good, good part of a team that's built itself back up. And now they've already signed up to an extension. You know, I heard that there were some questions about that kind of a player and how successful or not successful the Maple Leafs had been at signing some of those guys and how some of those guys had moved on. And you know what, look, I am not interested in dumping on the previous GM. It's over. We've moved on. To me, I only care about what this means and where we're going. But I heard that was one thing that came up. Now, another thing that came up, Kyle, is that I believe there was a Zoom call this week. And basically, everybody was told changes are coming. So I don't think this is only a. about the manager, I think there's going to be more.

And they're going to look hard at the way they do things. Now, the thing about this that is, I'm still searching for more clarity, and I wrote this on Tuesday, is that the Maple Leafs have been heavily invested in data for years. They have an AGM named Daryl Metcalf, who's got a lot of respect in the industry, and he has built up an internal system that is very highly regarded. So I don't know if that means that Pelley thinks for some reason it's not as good as it used to be

or it wasn't used as well as it was at times. But that's, you know, the Maple Leafs did have something internally or do have something internally that's been very highly thought of. So that's something else we've got to figure out here. And I'll say this. You know, Pelley mentioned AI in artificial intelligence in the media conference too. Teams are very quiet about this stuff. There are definitely teams in hockey and undoubtedly in other sports who are fooling around

with AI and how it will be able to help them. So what Pelley's talking about here is, again, I don't know if modernizing it's the right term because, as I said, Kyle, they had a really good data department or a really good advanced stats department or whatever you want to call it. So I'm not, because I'm not in there, I don't have a hundred percent grasp of what exactly we're discussing here. but it's very clear that he wants them to be even more technologically proficient than they are, and it's going to be a priority. It's very clear to me that he feels the other teams in the organization are far, far ahead of the Maple Leafs in terms of the way they use some of this stuff. And like I said, that caught some people by surprise because of how well Toronto's data departures,

has generally been regarded. Because, I mean, this all really started when they hired Kyle Dubus in the first place back in 2014. Like, that was when they put a lot of money into it, a lot of money into it. And, and you could say certainly, like, at the player level, it's really been implemented. You hear about all the stories of, I mean, the access to different things in terms of nutrition, sleep information, all of the stuff that is tracked year round for the players. it's all been there. The resources are available to them.

But I guess in terms of decision making when it comes to roster construction, what players you value, which players do you not, draft capital, how do you go about best allocating all of that? You know, his line about not being aligned culturally in some ways.

I just wondered if that was kind of a nod towards those sorts of things too. And it's interesting now that a couple days later and we're parsing through all of this. But the trade deadline and Pelly being in in the room for that. I mean, you learned anything more about kind of what observations went on there or just takeaways from him in that moment of going things should be different or I'm not thrilled with how things are running after seeing that unfold.

Well, we've all kind of wondered about this deal that didn't happen, right? and you know it's it's just something like we've all kind of wondered about right um but at like it has to be something like that Kyle it has to be something like that but right now we don't yet have the whole story now one of the things I have been asked a bit about the media conference is the mentioning of Michael Hage the Canadians prospect and Merca the Buffalo prospect. It was weird. I'm not going to argue that.

It was very weird. Hage was not in this deal that didn't quite happen between Toronto and Montreal, which I still do believe was nice, even though everyone's denied it. I don't think Hage was in the deal. I think a lot of people suspected he was

because Pelly mentioned his name, and it's certainly, you certainly have to assume Toronto asked for him, but at the end of the day, Hage was not in that deal from what I understand. Merca, I have no idea what that is. I've still got to figure that one out. I, you know,

I hadn't heard about anything percolating between Toronto and Buffalo that day. Everybody talks to everybody else, so there probably was something, but I've still got to figure that went out. Now, later on Thursday night, someone sent me a note, and I don't know where this originated from. They just asked me about it.

They said there's a story going around that the Maple Leaf wanted to draft Hage at the 2024 draft, but Montreal jumped in front of them and stole him before Toronto could take him. The only thing they said is that true. and the only thing I can say about that is the Maple Leafs took Ben Danford in that draft. And when they took them both Tree Living the GM and West Clark, who was running the draft of the Maple Leafs at the time, said that the mandate for the Maple Leafs was to find the best right-shot defensemen they could.

And that was what they were focused on. And I remember I was talking to West Clark briefly about it after you've, finished his main scrum, and I said, do you ever push back? Like, if he says this, do you ever say, no, this is better? And he said, when the boss makes it as clear as he did that we need right shot defensemen or organization, you're doing everything you can to find the best right shot defenseman. So I can't say for sure that that Hage story is right.

that the Maple Leafs wanted to take them and were caught. I can't say it's wrong either, but I do know that they were focused on right shot D and they were locked into Danford at some certain point. But like I said, there was a Zoom call this week and people are nervous about it. Like, don't forget, 2014, Brandon Shanahan showed up and he cleared a ton of people out.

Yeah, you're right. So that was a Zoom call among staff? Yes. Yes. So, you know, he cleared a ton of people out. And, you know, I don't want to jump to any conclusions. But, you know, there's definitely an uneasy feeling there right now. I mean, it does make a lot of sense.

And we'll see where ultimately this search takes the Leafs and Keith Pelley in terms of a replacement. But it all makes too much. sense in the sense of like in just in terms of what he's looking for because as we talked about like these every team now is it's a billion dollar plus if not multi-billion dollar enterprise so you'd be foolish to not have somebody at or near the top being in some regard wired data driven wise and if you want to have an old school or more of a hockey based background guy there too to bounce idea is often compliment one another, you know, then go for it. But just seems like there's, there's too much stake and the business has become too grand to ignore or pretend you can get

around those ways of doing business and think you're going to achieve the level of success that that you want. I know you don't love Elliott, the idea of just throwing names out there of who could be possible candidates early on, but is there anyone that's really burning your ears right now in terms of top of mind. Okay, so let me just go through a couple things before I get there. It's not that I don't like to listen to you, Kyle. It's just that I kind of write notes and they seem to make sense to me. We'll see if they make sense to the listeners.

Number one, as we talked about with Nashville, Nashville's goal here is to find the right person and then build around them, right? And that's what it sounds like Toronto is going to do too. who's the right person and then build what we need around them. Like let's just say that it ends up being a type like Eric Tulski. Pelly said that, yes, if that was the case, you would need to surround him with good hockey people as Tulski has, right? So that's what it says to me. It's who's our person and then, okay, what are their strengths?

What are their weaknesses? how do we build around them? That's exactly what we're looking there. So you've heard some of the names. They've talked to Mike Gillis already. There was a report they've talked to John Chaka already. I've heard rumors about, and everybody says to me, well, you hear this from Mike Futa, no, I don't.

I'm smarter than that. Not much, but I am smarter than that. I don't like to do stuff like that that exposes people. I've heard Dean Lombardi's name that he has interest in this, but I forgot. Lombardi is still under contract to Philadelphia, so we'll see. They've got to ask for permission to talk to them. I think there's going to be a lot more. Like another guy who was really data-driven, who looks a lot better now, is Kevin Adams.

But I think there's, I mean, I am selling people short. There's going to be, there already is a ton of interest. And the biggest challenge they're going to have in the beginning, and we still got to hire a firm here to run all this, is just culling the herd. There is going to be, like I've said this, a ton this week, there's a ton of interest. It's going to be huge.

So I think right now names probably a bit, premature. There's a couple of people I did want to mention, though. I've heard that Pelly thinks very highly of Haley Wickenhizer and that one of the people he met with internally was Wickenhizer. Okay. I don't know that she's going to be the next person in charge. I honestly don't, but I won't be surprised if that something there appeals to her. She has. an elevated role. I mean, who knows? I don't want to say yes to anything. I don't want to say no to anything. I actually, but I did want to point out I heard from multiple people that he thinks very highly of Wickenheiser and that someone said to me, you know, they named Brandon Pridham

and Ryan Hardy as the co-GMs. Somebody said to me they wouldn't have been shocked if Wickenheiser had been the interim GM. But whatever. whatever the case is, apparently Pelley thinks very highly of her. The other one, too, is I did have someone asked me, do you think there's any chance they would bring back Brendan Shanahan? And I don't think that's happening. I don't believe that's going to happen. But with 2020 hindsight, it's clear that people there felt that Shanahan and played a massive role. And whatever they do here,

whether it's president of hockey operations in GM, or it's whatever a structure they have, they are going to have to hire somebody whose job is managing up. Like Keith Pelley has to worry about TFC and the Raptors in addition to the Leafs. And you heard him say it, even though he's around and has a big position,

he has no desire to be in charge of the day-to-day operations of this team. But they need somebody, the Maple Leafs do. It's too busy a job for someone like Brad Tree Living to manage the team on a day-to-day basis and manage up. You cannot do it. Now, maybe you don't want to hire a president of hockey operations and a GM. Maybe you want to hire one person to do both jobs. Fine. If that's what you decide, fine.

But what you have to do is hire somebody who's the vice president of hockey operations and their job is to talk to Pelly and the people above them. Their job is to make Sarah Schmidt and Sarah Grossman happy. Because tree living, it was too much. You can't take those meetings and. run the team. And whoever ends up being in charge of hockey operations, they will not be able to manage up and manage down. There has to be a person, man, woman, whoever, find the person you want. Their sole job is managing up. They're in the meetings with the hockey ops. They're taking

notes. They're checking with the poho or GM or whatever you want and saying, all right, at the end of the meeting, these are the notes I have, I've got to meet with the people above, and I want to make sure I'm explaining this properly. You have to have a person who's responsible for that. Whatever structure you want, make it, create it. I don't care, but there has to be someone whose job is managing up because the Shanahan role was lost this year, and they missed that. They need that. I also think it's important, Kyle, for everybody to recognize that the more money owners are going to spend on these teams. And if we do have expansion here in the NHL, it's going to be at least $2 billion. But the more money owners spend on these teams, the more input they're going to have, and the more

they're going to want their top hockey people to talk to them in their language. 30 or 40 years ago, when these teams weren't worth what they are now, you could have hands-off owners. Yes, some of them were super meddlesome, like the Harold Ballards of the world. But there were a lot of teams where, you know, the hockey people, they had the say. They were in charge. They made the decisions. And the owners just kind of listened because they weren't, quote, unquote, hockey people in a lot of cases. That's not the way it works anymore.

People are spending too much money to buy these teams. It's a big business now. And that's why you're hearing names like Eric Tulski, Mike Gillis, John Chaka, Sunny Meta. These are the kinds of people who speak in a language that the people who now own these teams use in their businesses. It runs with them. It's how they've made a lot of money to be able to afford these hugely expensive sports teams now. And that's why they'll listen to people who talk like this and trust them when they talk like this, because it's the way that they've learned to be successful in their other businesses. I do think, though, too, particularly for a job like Toronto's.

And the reason I've often thought that Doug Armstrong would be an interesting candidate here is that I think whoever takes this job, not only, I think there's a second character. that is just as important as speaking to ownership in a language they can understand. And that is a lack of fear. I am one of those people who believes that ultimately making no decision can be worse than making a wrong decision. Not always. Sometimes it's better not to act and be patient. But I think when you're forced into a corner and you have to do something, I've seen

a lot of people who can't because they're afraid of the result. The one thing I think about a guy like Armstrong is he's not afraid of anything. Right or wrong, he's got the courage of his convictions and he will dictate to the market, not let the market dictate to him. And I think that that is as important a characteristic for the next hockey operations leader of the Toronto Maple Leafs as speaking to ownership in the same language. think there's a lot of GMs and a lot of sports in really hot markets who've learned how to do that. Yes, we have to care about our fans and what they think.

They matter. If not for them, none of us have jobs and we have no financial flexibility to do anything. But as much as we love them, we can't be scared of them and we can't let them dictate our decisions. Well, and it can't be overstated also is that you can have all the great plans you want, about we don't believe we need to tear this thing down. And if you want to hear that from the candidates that you interview, that's all fine. And they can come up with their own plans until they know how Austin Matthews feels about everything. We don't have that answer yet.

We won't have that answer likely for a little bit. That's really what ultimately will chart their path moving forward. You know, my suggestion, my theory on this, this is my theory. It's purely my theory. based on what I heard this week is they're going to tell them we're back on track next year or trying to be and come back at the start of the year and let's see how it goes like I think the Quinn Hughes thing every player in that league every team in that league saw how the Quinn Hughes thing played out this year and that is that you start the year you see how it goes and then if it goes off the rails you adjust as

We'll see. I could be wrong about that. But that's my theory right now. That's my theory. You know, I think this too, it's like, you know, I mean, Kyle, we're both the same. We love the Jays, right? Not like our Philly-loving,

Philly's-loving podcast producer. You and I are true Canadians who love the Blue Jays. For how many years did people think that Mark Shapiro and Ross Atkins were total idiots. It was basically up until, what, Game 7 against Seattle last year? You know, like they had awful nicknames for them.

They carved them relentlessly. And all of a sudden, those two guys are geniuses. You know what? It just shows you, on the eyes of the general public, and even media, like we're guilty of this too. It's not process that matter. We're talking about this with Lindy Ruff last week. It's not about process.

It's about results. Results. It's purely, like, you could have the best process in the world, but if you lose, it doesn't matter. Right. In the last nine years have been, I think a reminder of that in some aspects in Toronto, right? No salary cap to how they spent in and around their roster. There was no stone left unturned in building up everything around it. but it doesn't guarantee you.

Of course. They will still do that. Can I just tell you, can I just tell you, is there anything else you want to ask about the situation? I got one funny story about it and then we move on. But is there anything else you want to ask? No, I think we're in an okay spot here. Let's see your story. So Monday night, I'm driving to work because I'm going to work that Ducks game against the leaves.

And I guess Barubei told the team around 8 o'clock. Eastern time, 5 o'clock Pacific time, two hours before the game. And first of all, let me shut out Max Domi. I am not surprised it was him. And somebody said to me after they were wondering if Goudis was hurt, like his hands, and he couldn't fight. But I was just amazed at the whole thing. Like I heard that Goudis was going to take one shift and then leave.

That's what someone does. bet me was going to happen. And he stayed out there and he took more of it because I, what I heard was that some of the leaves were talking about, do we fight him every shift? Like every time he's out there, do we fight him? Anyway, I give a lot. I'm not surprised it was Domi. I give him a lot of credit. Goudis, to me, he just looked like he said, I know what I did was bad and I'm just going to take it. Now, someone told me they hurt his hand might be hurt. I don't know if that's true.

To me, it looked like he just said, I know I've got to take my penance here and I'm going to do it. Up until Domey threw that extra shot. That was the best game of the year. Yeah, up until Domey threw that extra shot when they'd already gone down and then Goudas was like, okay, like I'm not taking that one. The extra one after he'd already got down. Then he went to take a swipe back.

But yeah, you're right. Otherwise, he was just hang on. It was the best game of the year. It really was. And I loved, you know, when Nealander cross-checked Huso and then kind of lolly gagged around, I just, I love what Cowan did. Anyway, it was. Best Leaf Game of the Year. It was the best Leaf Game of the Year.

That's right. It was the best Leaf Game of the Year. And, you know, I did want to say, too, I felt really badly. It was our last regional and I didn't, I forgot to thank on the year. But it was a great year doing the Leaf Reginals with Carolyn Cameron and Nick and Justin, who have, their own great show. And it was a really fun season. And what a great trade we made,

trading Dave Amber for Carolyn Cameron. That was the best trade in the NHL this season. Yes. I like to call it addition by subtraction. Anyway. Not even top five protected. No, I wouldn't even, that was such a lopsided deal.

I would accept no protection on the pick. Anyway, the funny story. So 8 o'clock. I got a tax at 8.15, two of them saying it sounds like the Maple Leafs just fired Tree Living. And I was like, what? And like, you play it on your Siri, right, on your car play. So I'm like, I had to pull over. Oh, what voice you go with, by the way?

Just the regular female voice. Okay. So Max, when my son was young, we used to do it in Cookie Monster. But it just, he can't do it anymore. It just makes you crazy. right. So, so cookie monster breaking the news to you that the least have made a change of the GM level. Yes. It would be pretty good, eh, how that would sound. Anyway, so I had to pull over. And, you know, we're on at the time. And, you know, all of a sudden, you're like, you're, you're making calls, you're pulling over. You're checking your text. While pulled over, I want to clarify. And then I'm like, I got to get into the studio too. Like I'm going to get stuck on the side of the road here. And so you're calling everybody you can think of and nobody's answering.

Like everybody knows, okay, he's on it. So there's one person I call and it turns out I have two cell numbers for them. They had an old cell number and they got rid of it and they used the other one. But when I yelled their name into the Siri, it dialed the first one. So the first thing I say is, look, I'm really sorry to call you well after. business hours on a Monday night. But I didn't even say the person's name, which I'm glad I didn't. But I'm hearing that the Maple Leafs have made a change.

Like, do you know this? And there's a pause. And I guess this other person who's driving to, my name came up on their display. And all I hear is this pause. And all of a sudden the guy goes, is this the real Elliot Friedman? Oh, my gosh. And I'm like, oh, my gosh. God, this isn't the right number.

Somehow, Siri dialed the wrong number. It's now been redistributed. It's been redistributed. So, and you know me, like, I never like anyone to know who I'm talking to because the worst thing I'm thinking about is, is that this guy is going to post on social that Elliot was looking for this person and to find out of Brad Tree Living was fired. and I was like, yeah, but I'm sorry I've got the wrong number. And the guy goes, no, ex person, this used to be their phone number.

And I get business calls for him all the time. Oh, outstanding. Yeah, and I said, can you just join a long list? I said, can you keep this secret? And the guy goes, yeah, no problem. So a couple days later, after this died down, I texted, that person, because I actually didn't get in touch with them Monday night. I got it figured out elsewhere.

But I texted this person and I said, you're not going to believe what happened. And he says, he texted me back. He goes, I already know that guy reaches out to me whenever someone calls asking for me, like I guess on LinkedIn. And he said, this was the most awesome thing. Elliot Friedman called me asking me if I knew that the lease had made a GM change. that's like a lane on Seinfeld giving out the standard fake and now you're trying to trace back to who's number it's right that's so good anyway that was just added to the craziness of Monday night I'm glad you did it all while safely pulled off to the side of the road amen because knowing you that is no guarantee I will say this it is no joke if you get caught like that so don't do it anyway That's so luckily that didn't happen.

Yes, good. Okay, so just getting started. I wanted to share that story because I thought people would like it. Thank you for doing that. Glad we parked time for it. So the search is just beginning for a new general manager or whatever that role is going to be in Toronto. The search has been ongoing in Nashville. Is there anything new to add to the process with the predators?

So I believe that the predators are either in the process or about to do in-person interviews. I don't know if I would call this the final stage of the process, but it's definitely moved into a deeper stage of the process. My theory is among the people they have scheduled for in person are Bill Scott of Edmonton, Scott White of the Dallas Stars, Brett Peterson of the Florida Panthers. And I think John Chica is another one that they have gone deep into the process with. So it's interesting that Chica has been. someone now is mentioned as a person of interest in both Toronto and Nashville. Mike Gillis was contacted by them.

I don't believe he's going to be a finalist for this one. I always believe there's the possibility I'm missing something. I have wondered if Jeff Kelty, who is a current assistant GM there, would get any chance at a formal interview. They had indicated they might consider it. And a few people have mentioned the possibility of it. I just don't know. I'll be honest.

I had heard that there was an agent who was part of this process. And I don't believe it was ever a formal interview. But I do believe they reached out to gauge the interest of an agent named Matt Cater. Now, Matt Cater represented as a, you know, Chara. He represents among current players Adam Fox and Chris Kreider. Yeah. Leo Carlson. Leo Carlson, yes. Geez, I don't know if I'd be too eager to run out on that commission.

I'll tell you that much. Good reminder, Kyle. Yes. You know, I kind of like the commission I could get there. Yeah. Great player. I don't believe that went to the interview process. But I do believe they reached out to gauge his interest.

And, you know, like I said, Matt is a pretty sharp guy. You know, I wrote this week, I think they asked for permission on Brandon Pridham. But as far as I know, I think Bill Scott's in deep. I think Scott White's in deep. I think Brett Peterson's in deep. I think John Chica's in deep. I've wondered about Kelty. And I have the suspicion that I'm missing somebody.

but and I always leave room for the possibility I'm missing somebody. As I said on Nick and Justin show the other day, I have wondered about Tom Fitzgerald for this job. And the only reason I've wondered about it is the combination of there seems to be uncertainty in New Jersey and he was their first captain. Now Fitzgerald's had a, I mean, that was 25 years ago. A lot of things have happened between now and then. but because he has management experience and because, and I've talked to him about this in the past,

how much he loved being captain of that team, I am sure if he was available that it would be, it makes sense from a sentimental point of view gentleman that maybe they would like to talk to him. He's a guy who has a connection to Nashville. But right now he's still employed in New Jersey and I just don't know where that's going to go. All right. So speaking of the Predators, they played in the final game to start and finish. On Thursday night, they beat the L.A. Kings in a shootout. So the Kings had a big ceremony at the beginning for Copatar, becoming their all-time leading score. And someone texted me after the game started with the Predators up 2-0 so quickly. And he said, do the Kings not like Copatar? Like, what's going on here?

They look terrible. And then later, when they tied it for all, the Kings did, they came all the way back to tie it, Armea. I texted somebody who was at the game, and he said to me, I said, this is unbelievable. And he said, I thought 20 minutes ago the game was over and I was about to leave. But L.A. came back, at least got a point out of it. that was, I did a shootout. I think I can't even look it up here. I just remember it off the top of my head.

It was in the preseason a few years ago between Buffalo and Toronto where I think the first 20 guys didn't score. Like nobody could score and this was close. They went 0 for 15. And the wildest thing about this one, over 15, is that the goalies were not fooled at all. They owned the shooters in this shootout, completely dominated them. And then the 15 shooter was by field and he actually made a move that beat Soros, but he lost control of the pocket and he missed.

And then Luke Evangelista wanted for Nashville. So what we've got now is a three-way tie, 79 points and wild card two. But the kings have the bad math. They've got the worst tiebreaker, so they're going to have to win out. And the sharks right now are technically in wildcard too because they have played one fewer game. The Kings and Predators are at 75. San Jose is at 74. Just the second win all year where Macklin Celebrini doesn't get a point.

This is why if the sharks makes the playoffs, he's my MVP, by the way. And Colin Graf goes to 20 goals. It's just a huge win for San Jose. behind them, an ugly loss for Winnipeg. Three-nothing. Dallas has not been very good lately. That's the best game I've seen Dallas play in quite some time. They dominated.

Oettinger was good when he needed to be, but generally Dallas controlled the ice. Seattle, a really rough night, up two-nothing, then got lost 6-2 to Utah. And St. Louis, we know lost in regulation the other night in L.A., a really tough. one where they don't even get a point. You know, St. Louis has the good tiebreaker at 27. That's a really good number. But all of a sudden, they're five points out of the playoffs with four teams in between them. It's a bad spot to be awful night for the blues, awful night for the Cracken, awful night for the Jets.

And now a dogfight between the sharks, kings, and predators. Also should shout out that Edmonton has now tied Anaheim for first place in the Pacific Division. The Ducks have played one fewer game. You know, Anaheim, you know that as a young team, they're going to be tested periodically at the end of the year and throughout the year. And they're getting that right now. A really tough loss against San Jose two nights ago, didn't even get a point, lost that one in regulation. Now the Oilers who are surging, having won five in a row have tied them at 87 points. Dickinson in particular, looks like a great.

fit for them and also coming is Vegas. Vegas with back-to-back wins under John Tortorella. They had one of those nights again. They were, the ice was tilted in their favor early, but they were down one to nothing. Calgary had one goal on four shots early in that game, but a five-point night for Mitch Marner, his first hat trick in Vegas. They are three points back of Edmonton and Anaheim for number one in the Pacific, and both the Oilers and the Golden Night.

are in a better tiebreak position than the Ducks. So Anaheim's getting challenged here in a big way. Over in the Eastern Conference, we'll talk a bit more about Ottawa in a second. But, you know, here we are again. Philly 86, Columbus 88, Detroit 88, Ottawa in the playoff spot at 88 because they have the best tiebreaker. Islanders 89 didn't play. Pittsburgh lost big at Tampa 92.

the Bruins 94 of all the years to get swept by Florida. You didn't think this would be the one with the tough season Florida's had, but Boston lost it. Montreal is going to have a shot at first place in the Atlantic, two back of Tampa Bay and Buffalo, but they won't catch those guys in the tiebreaker. They're both six ahead, but the Canadians have worked it. Carolina, the first team in the Eastern Conference,

the clinch a playoff berth. but Ottawa 88 the wings the blue jackets one behind them the flyers two back and the capitals three the capitals an awful loss to New Jersey got pounded

seven to three they have a good tiebreaker number 32 Philly probably deserved a better fate against Detroit but lost they got beat Columbus is all the sudden really struggling just didn't I mean Carolina

just smothered them. Didn't give up anything. Columbus really not an offensive threat. Dominated in this one, maybe finally tiring out after that big run, and Detroit gets a big win in a game that, you know, Philly carried the play, but they got the win. You know, one of the things I kind of wondered is if they've asked McClellan at all

to ease off them a bit. Like he was on them and rotting them. He's ridden them a few times this year. It just looked to me the other day by some of the quotes from those Red Wing players. It's kind of like, all right, we know it's tight and we know these games mean a lot. We know it's tense. But you reach a point where sometimes you've got to let off the reins. I just wonder if the Red Wing said, now's the time.

Got a win. Still seven more to go. Okay, Elliot, the Ottawa senators. I still think back to this would have been late January on a Sunday night. They beat up on Vegas at home. Things looked very grim for them at the time in terms of the playoff picture. But we talked about it, I think, back then of that video of Travis Green in the room saying, don't listen to the bleep and white noise, block everything else on the outside.

We'll get on a run here. We'll be fine. And then they've really started to do just that all the way up until Saturday in Tampa. Linus Allmark doesn't start. It's James Rimer's net. Green's explanation afterwards that Allmark needed a rest. He goes back in Tuesday, eight seconds in, they're down a goal, and everything just craters for them against the Florida Panthers Tuesday night.

There's the Cachuk podcast with their father Keith on it and his comments about a number of things going on with both Brady and the team. The noise is back here, Elliot, for a senator's team that's still trying to make something of their season. Kyle, massive W, massive W over Buffalo, Cleven hurt, and you know when he's hurt, and they said a post game, he's really hurt because he looks like a guy who eats nails. Another D down, just all the interest of their blue line, they're going to be calling Norm McIver and Bradshaw. and say, we need you guys to suit up, just like you did in 1992.

Once again, and you alluded to it, Travis Green sets the tone in the morning. He puts all the focus on the game, shuts down the controversy, no gasoline on the fire. There's been a lot of times this year where their season could go sideways and green hits the right notes like Beethoven on the piano. And this was another case. Never let them see you sweat. You know, when he was in Vancouver, I remember somebody there told me that when the coach, before he meets with the media,

a lot of them will speak to their media relations people and they say, what are the questions going to be? What questions do I need to be prepared for? And Green would say things like, okay, you've told me the questions. Now, what are the answers? he would also want to have like is there something you guys want me to say and then he would sort of think about it a bit and mold it to not only what the organization wanted to say but what

he thought was the best thing to say and he's been on fire with that all year you know i bet behind the scenes um he's probably seething a bit about all of this but in front of the camera, cool and calm. And the biggest challenge with this is it's easy when the noise is coming externally. It's harder when the noise is coming internally. And, you know, the thing about that is, like, I really like their podcast that the Kachucks have. I think it's a really, really good pod. I think it's interesting. The thing about these shows is, like, Kyle, when we do this and Dom drops it in the morning, right? Part of me is like, okay,

what's the firestorm going to be today? And you just never know. You know, some days I'm like, okay, tomorrow, this is going to be the craziness. And I'm totally wrong. It's like some line that I don't think is going to be a big deal. And it turns out to be enormous. And I'm like, really?

that's the thing that caused the problem. It's just like social media is the mob, right? And you don't control the mob. You never know what the mob is going to grab onto. But the thing is, with that, who has to deal with it? It's me. Okay? Like, Sportsnet really doesn't have to deal with a lot that comes out of this.

And you simply have to deal with people giving you the stink guys saying, is your partner on this trip with you. That's the extent of what you get. I quite look forward to those. Yeah. Actually, I take great choice. Is your buddy with you today? Yeah.

Your lesser half. Normally it's just like somebody texts me or somebody calls me. They're like, what the heck? Like, what did you do that for? Like, so like I, and that's the way it should be. Like if I, if I spill the mess, I clean it up. You know, in the NBA, this stuff is pretty normal. You know, Draymond Green has a podcast where he sets fire to things all the time, right?

And people in, like, in the NBA, that's part of the show. Like, they've got like 50 player podcast there, and they're all starting craziness. And everybody just accepts that as part of the gig. The NHL were still not there. You know, like I said, I like their podcast. I think they're a couple really interesting guys, Brady and Matthew. and I watched the one clip the other day that everybody's talking about.

Holy Christ, this whole team. My pinky hurts. I'm out for six days. I knew that was coming at. I knew right when he said that. I'm like, don't say it. I'm like, don't you say it. I just had a bad sleep so I can't play today.

Oh, my God. Disgusting. All right. Well, we're going to move on here. Can't play back to back. Now, Brady Kachuk post game said he was disgusting. by all this and he said it's pretty obvious he's talking about the panthers and when i heard this

most of it anyway most of it i thought it was about the panthers too mostly because of the way as you hear matthew reacts he's like i knew this was coming of course it's when someone reacts like that you know it's about him but you know that that just that line the back to back because of what happened with Allmark, there's enough of an opening there to make you wonder. And I'll take Brady Kachak at face value that they were referring to the Florida Panthers here. But still, it's a frenzy for a day. And it's pouring gasoline on the fire. It's Canada.

It doesn't take much. We know that whether your media or your social media, one thing that we've all been reminded about this year is that every market has its Tinderbox moments. It hasn't taken a lot to light the Ottawa Tinder box this year. And I think that's what. the Ottawa organization, whether or not they say it to Kachuk or they say it behind closed doors, they're thinking there's been enough stuff we've had to deal with this year.

We don't need anymore. And I just think Kachuk's reaction after this one was over, it's just a bad omen for where everything is going here. And we'll see, again, they have bigger things they have to deal with right now, making the playoffs. but you just wonder if it's another thing into some big off-season conversations. Now, in the last pod, we talked about Allmark not playing that game on Saturday afternoon against the lightning. And I told you how I feel. Like Glenn Healy, and I remembered it was Healy, he ripped me early in my career for something like this at hockey night.

He said, you're not a player. And you know, I will say this about Glenn. he never came at me with the you're not you were never a player unless I questioned like injuries or somebody's heart he's that really bothered him he thought that was over the line and he would say to me you're not a player you cannot do that you have no right to do that unless you know you better know you better know so I've always been careful ever since and as I said on Monday's pod. If the player Fuzz feel the need for a break, they can't

help you win. You've got to give them a break. And I have no reason to believe that this is any different, right? So I stick to that. I stick to what Glenn told me. I will say this, Kyle, it's been pretty interesting to me in the last few days how many former

players have really gone after Allmark about this. And to me, it's all tied into kind of like, we've had this conversation about Bruce Cassidy this week. and John Tortorella and a little bit about Peter DeBoer. By the way, Peter DeBoer gave an answer about analytics on the Marquesi Feudish show this week and how a coach uses it, which was spectacular.

But, you know, like the players who questioned Allmark and the Bruce Cassidy's of the world and the Peter DeBores of the world, they are great at what they do, but they are super demanding. and the honest truth is that if you want to be the best of the best, and if you play one game in the NHL, you are an elite hockey player. But if you're the best of the best, you know how demanding you are of yourself or you know what you ask of yourself to get things done?

And people like Cassidy and DeBoer, it's their job to pull even more out of you. And, you know, you can never go over the line. That's wrong. but you have to be able to push buttons that it's kind of like it's not quite this far, but I'm sure a lot of people watched Whiplash, that J.K. Simmons movie about the drum. Like he goes over the line sometimes,

and you can never do that in hockey, or any other sport that's not acceptable, but you have to be willing to take demanding people and be even more demanding of them. And that's why people like Casti and DeBoer, they burn so hot, they burn out quicker. And that's why Casti's won a Stanley Cup and has been as successful as he's been. And that's why DeBoer has, well, he hasn't won a Stanley Cup. He's been to finals.

He's been deep in playoffs. He's, his teams have been consistently good since he left Florida because they push the buttons. They push buttons that even demanding people. people already push and they push them even harder. And that's your job. And so I look at this Allmark thing and the way some NHLers reacted or former angels reacted, they're like he has to push himself even farther. It's clear they feel he has to answer the bell for that one.

That's all outside noise. Like I said, every time you drop a podcast, you don't know what people are going to leach on to. And the thing about their podcast is that you get senators fans or non-saniders fans, they're chaos lovers. And sometimes it is non-santer's fans. They're like, oh boy, look at what he said this time or look at what they said this time. It's bad for the senators.

and it just turns into a five-alarm blaze. Like there's just people out there. What does Michael Cain say in that one Batman movie about The Joker? Some people just want to see the world burn. And there are people who are waiting every time this podcast drops to start something. And that's not all the Kachach's fault. it's just the way it is. And I'm sure that internally in the Sanders organization,

they're like on top of everything else we deal with on a daily basis in Canada, we don't need this. But right now, that horse might be too far out of the barn to stop. Great job by Ottawa, though. Great win when they absolutely had to have it. Especially with the bodies they're missing already. they don't need anything further piled on what seems like

a very tall task to emerge from this race in the east as one of the teams in in one of those wild card spots that's been and I think part of the frustration too I'm sure from the outside is that if Brady Kachuk

was playing now as he was down the stretch last year I think there's a little more tolerance for it externally I'm talking about but whether it's he's talked about how demanding of a year it's been you know how quickly we forget of the injury he had early on in the year the cost and time uh and the lasting effects that that has but it's just been a different version here lately uh and i think that's that's part of the equation here too uh but the fact is and i thought Travis to your point handled it beautifully

Thursday morning because he knew the questions were coming he wasn't ducking anything but he wasn't also giving off dread. He goes, yeah, well, yeah, I know Walt Well, played together. I know he's a opinionated guy. Brady plays, what, over 18 minutes of ice a night. I think that's perfect. Like, there's just no problem. I'm glad you brought that up.

I forgot that. You know what I'm saying? Polite but firm? Yes. That was Travis Green. Polite but firm. I like the minutes he plays. Yeah.

because there are some warnings where he can just be firm at his media conferences, but he understood the magnitude of what everyone was kind of wondering going in and gave that its time to. By the way, speaking of Whiplash, one of the great lines from that movie is that something of the effect of two of the scariest words in the English language are good job. Yeah. Which I love. And I know, it's like, oh, come on.

That's way I just, but that whole. idea. I love that theory. I remember when I saw that movie, I sat there in my seat for a few minutes after it ended, just thinking about what I'd witnessed and what I thought about that. Yes, masterpiece. Yeah. That was a masterpiece. Did you see the latest commercial that Kyle Connor of the Jets? You heard of it? That was a masterpiece. That was fantastic. KSC commercial and he dressed up as Colonel Sanders. Or in the Colonel Sanders attire, I guess. Yes.

Fantastic. That is not gotten enough love for what a great performance that is by an NHL player. No kidding. Because sometimes they can be difficult to find in those settings. That was outstanding. He delivered. Yes. You can't tell me there isn't a correlation.

between that dropping and him being the overtime hero in Chicago earlier this week. Maybe he had some of the green coleslaw waiting for him. When I was a kid, I loved, I haven't eaten it in a while, but I used to love the green coleslaw. There's something about, maybe it's different now, but I think like my generation growing up, the dad's always loved going there. Oh, yeah. Green coleslaw.

Yes. You have like three spoonfuls of that and you were, just climbing off the walls. I loved it. That's right. They called it Kohl'slaw. Okay. Time now for the final thought

presented by the Toyota BZ. So the Ebbington Oilers, they nab, undrafted forward Owen Michaels out of Western Michigan. He had a dynamite year a year ago on route to a national title for the program, a good season this past year.

He ends up in oil country. Your thoughts on Edmonton and Michaels agreeing to a contract. That was a good pickup. I was a really good pickup for them. I was a little bit surprised because, you know, Owen Michaels, you know, he's a little bit older. He's 24. But I remember last year when he almost came out of college, there was a ton of interest in him. And this year I heard there was also a ton of interest in him.

And normally when you hear about a player where there's a lot of interest in them, you don't think a team like Edmonton, which is pretty loaded at top end, is going to get that player, right? So like normally you think kid from Detroit, USHL, Western Michigan, he's ticketed for the United States. but he ends up in Edmonton, and that's a good get for the Oilers. I still heard there was a ton of interest in him. Like, I think initial probably around 20, you cut it down.

He had a lot of choice. And one of the reasons I think he had a lot of choice is he's already a two-way guy, and he's a little bit older, and so you hope to think that he can make a bit more of an impact. He's going right to Edmonton. And the thing that's interesting about him, too, is he can only sign a one-year deal because of his age. There's something in the CBA that determines that. So I always assume that there's a little nudge, nudge, wink, wink.

We know what the next one's going to look like, right? Because he'll be a restricted free agent this summer. So I always assume that not only does he know what his role is going to be this year, but there's probably a plan for him next year, too, in terms of, contract and what things are going to look like for him. But that's a good get for Edmondson. You don't expect a good team like the Oilers to land a player like this in college free agency, especially when a one-year deal is involved.

And it's probably because dry-sitles injured that you have a bit of an extra spot where you can try them out now as you finish this regular season. You know, it's interesting. He, his agency is a 02.2. and they've had a lot of kids who've been unrestricted free agents out of the NCAA undrafted, who've played a lot of games in the NHL. Like they have Troy Statures played over 600. You know, they had Jason Garrison's in the 500s.

Jordan Osterly's over 400. Zat White Cloud's approaching 400. J.T. Brown, and he's a broadcaster now, so you know he's a genius. He played almost 400 games. Cole Smith got traded to Vegas. He's in almost 300. So clearly they have an idea of what they're doing there in terms of where they place guys.

You know, there was another name I actually heard, and he's a Bruins pick. He was a seventh rounder who looks like he's got a chance. And his name is Andre Gassau, and it looks like he is going to go to unrestricted free agency. He has a chance to go there this summer, and it looks like he's headed in that direction. He's represented elsewhere.

I think he's potentially his advisor, I got to say this, I don't want to get anybody into trouble. His advisor, I think he's a CAA guy. But it sounds like he's going to go to unrestricted free agency as opposed to signing with the Bruins. We'll see. That's where it looks like. I just wonder for Michaels, too, when you look at it, Elliot, beyond this year,

Henrique's a UFA, Dickinson, of course, Roslavik, Kappan, Lazar, beyond this season, and maybe even right away, you know, for a guy that's known as a two-way player, there could be opportunity to lower in a lineup on a team that's got McDavid and Drysaddle and are in the business of trying to win Stanley Cups right now. Yeah, good point, bud. You can see why that can be attractive. for a player like Owen Michaels.

So his tenure with the Edmonton Oilers is underway. That was the final thought presented by the Toyota BZ. With that, we'll take our first break and we'll come back with the thought line. 32 thoughts. The podcast continues after this. Now, there is one thing I would like to say before we wrap up the news portion of the pod. So Kyle is in Los Angeles this weekend for the Maple Leafs and the Kings on Saturday night. Kevin B.XA lives in that area before he flies to Toronto on Friday for the show.

Dave Amber, who lives in Toronto, was out there visiting some friends. And the three of them were at dinner Thursday night. And as you know, we do the pod. We do a chunk of the pod after all games are done to make sure we haven't missed anything. And I got a text from Kevin B. Exa on Thursday earlier saying, please, I beg you, we are going out for dinner with Kyle. Can you release him so that we can all go for dinner together? And then Kyle called me and he said,

I would really like to go out to dinner with Kevin and David. Can I please be, I know that I have a responsibility to the podcast. but for one night only can I be released from that responsibility. So I want everyone out there to know that Dom and I are the two dedicated employees putting this together at 2 to 2.30 Friday morning, a.m. Eastern time, although it's 11.30 year time, while Kyle is out dancing in underground nightclubs somewhere near El Seagando. All right, welcome back. Another brand new edition of the thought line in Elliott. I'm going to say it right now.

This edition of the thought line is dedicated to producer Greg Shannon and font coordinator slash statistician Usama Farooke. They were the ones that came together of the Canucks Hockey on Sportsnet broadcast in Vegas on Monday night. And when we saw John Tororella on the bed. for the first time coming out of anthems on his font, the graphic at the bottom of the screen where you see his name below John Tortorella, it read, old wise man. Oh, great job, guys. Great job, guys.

Greg and Usama, thank you so much for doing that. That was awesome. People were sending that to me. Tom Gulidi pointed out, you sent it. That is awesome, awesome. I also wanted to shout out, by the way, so last pod we mentioned Ethan Moore, who scored the overtime

winners in the first two games for the WHL's Calgary Hitman in their series against Brandon. It turns out his father, Trevor, is a podcast listener. Oh, cool. Yes, and he said, he's just sent a

thank you on behalf of the family, and I just wanted to say our pleasure, Trevor, every parent lives to see their child succeed, right? That's all that matters is that their children do better than they do. So I'm glad that Ethan had a great start to the WHL playoffs. But yes, Greg and Usama, you guys are the stars. Ethan's obviously a big star this week. So are you guys. Okay. I have a couple of notes today I want to get to. First of all, Mike Russo, friend of the pod, great guy, sent me a note. I mistook something.

that I said that on the road, players get two tickets for every game. That's not true. You get two tickets at home, and on the road, you have to pay for the two tickets. I thought you got two tickets to every game that's only at home. On the road, you have to pay for the two tickets available to you, but you can let a teammate buy them in your place if you have no need for them. Thank you, Michael. Right.

Okay. A couple of notes here. First of all, Hey, Elliot, just a heads up, as I know you're a grammar connoisseur. The plural of octopus is octopuses, not octopi, as you said on Monday's pod.

My four-year-old daughter and I had this discussion last week, and I myself had to look it up. She was right, and I was wrong. I didn't know this. I was today years old when I learned this. I had no idea.

So I would like to thank four-year-old Scarlett Roberts, who is smarter than me and Kyle combined. Are you smarter than a four-year-old? No. Apparently, no, I'm not. Her dad's name is Lucas, Lucas Roberts. He was the person who sent me this note. But Scarlett, who was four years old, she was the one who corrected us. and he also pointed out he had a newborn son or has a newborn son named Clay

because we don't want Clay at weeks old to be traumatized because Scarlett got mentioned on the podcast and he didn't. So Scarlett Roberts, thank you very much at age four. How old are you, Kyle? Ah, how old am I now? 32? I'm 55. I'm 32.

We are combined 87 and we just got outwitted by a 40. year old. Okay, a couple of other quick notes. My champagne podcast year, 32. Yes, a couple of other notes I wanted to put here. I wanted to thank J.C., who said maybe this is why Dom is not sharing the value of his

Luca Donchitz card. Because he sent me something from the Instacite BB card insider, which says the Donchage card was bought for $780,000, and the value now is $275,000. So the buyer has lost half a million dollars. So Dom, I ask, are you this buyer? Have you lost half a million dollars on your donchage card?

That's why I'm working with you to recoup my losses. You got a long way to go, man. That's right. You're never going to retire. And whenever we pay you, it's too much. Chris Corkery. They ran the data. They ran the data.

We pay you too much. Chris Corkery. Hey, Elliot, I'm pretty sure you didn't do this purposely, but it was very humorous. When you were discussing the Cassidy firing, you also mentioned the similarities between Vegas and Ottawa as far as great underlying numbers, but they can't get a save.

You then said Vegas is West Ottawa. Funny enough, one of the oldest minor hockey and junior B organizations in Ottawa are the Ottawa West Golden Knights. Ironically enough, it's also who Bruce Cassidy played minor hockey for. I did not know this. Yes. Some other notable alumni include Doug and Murray Wilson, Gary Galley, Luke Richardson, Dan McGillis, Randy Robitai, Brendan Bell, and Paul Byron. Cheers, love the pod.

Cork. I don't know if I would agree that Gary Galley is a notable alumni, but we'll just put them in there. There's another team that Gary Galley played for. Added to the list. When I think of Gary Galley, I think of the Ottawa last golden nights. All right. I should have caught that one as a long-time Ottawa resident. But thank you, Chris.

Thank you, Chris. And just a couple of a couple shoutouts. After the media conference with Keith Pelley on Tuesday, I was walking back to my car. And I was on the phone with editor Rory Boylan. demanding to know what I was going to write about, a taskmaster that guy. And I took a couple of selfies with people while I was on the phone with them, both listeners of the pod.

One's name was McGuire. The other's name was Sean while I was walking along Front Street. And I really couldn't strike up much of a conversation because Rory was driving my face into the ground, demanding an article as quickly as possible. So I just wanted to shout out McGuire and Sean. It was a pleasure to chat with you guys so quickly. and thanks for listening to the pod.

Excellent. All right. You'll like this here, Fridge. Bruce from Terrace, BC. Hello, Elliot and Kyle. I was struck with a thought the other day while listening to your podcast. Elliot mentioned that the two people

who were most responsible for the verbal abuse in his life that he has received were both born on May the 9th. Well, I would like to offer him the opportunity for the trifecta. I too was born on May 9th. So you would like to ask.

the abuse. I would be happy to continue to do that for you. Love the pod. Keep up the great work. Bruce, submit it to the thought line. I'll take it all. Griffin will send it. That's outstanding. Great stuff, Bruce. Nice job. Hopefully you're a little younger than my dad. This year he turns 87. Excellent. That's our combined age. Wow. Yes. That's right. That's a good point, actually. Okay. Chris from Boise, Idaho. Kyle Dom and the Ontario Trash Panda President. That's good for Boise. Very good.

The story of Anton Frundel using a consumer-grade sticks during the World Juniors and the NHL reminded me of the 2010 Tour de France. When Yen's Voight crashed and could not resume on his factory bike due to damage, his team car was too far ahead of him and could not return to provide him with a new bike to continue. So instead, he borrowed a kid's 10 speed that happened to be nearby and rode for nine miles before he got a replacement bike,

which his team left behind with a policeman. They're waiting for him. I completely forgot about that. That's an incredible thinking on your seat. I wouldn't have remembered that, but that is a great, that is a great pull. Great pull. Oh man. Apparently he had crashed in a similar fashion. I don't know how many years earlier in the tour to France, but obviously it was a bad crash. He couldn't continue because he was injured. I guess the wreck was bad enough to do his bike in, but he was okay. So he kept, he grabbed a kid's bike. It looked hilarious, but he was like, I've got to continue. Unbelievable. I don't know much about cycling, certainly at that level. But, uh, he looked hilarious. But he was like, I've got to continue. Unbelievable. I don't know much about cycling, certainly at that level. But, uh, Yens Void, I think, is one of the great, great characters and personalities and, of course, riders in the history of that sport.

So very cool. Okay. People who can do that stuff are just incredible athletes. I can barely get my bike down the street, and these guys are unbelievable. It's like, let's put on the most minimal clothing possible, the thinnest clothing we can find, we'll wear a helmet. Okay, of course we're going to wear a helmet. and then let's go as fast as we possibly can. All bunched together.

If one person sneezes wrong, we're all crashing. Yep. But let's do it. That's so cool. All right. Ian from Pickering, Ontario. Gentlemen, dumb. Whoa.

It's true. With the Leafs moving on from Brad Trilliving, the media has begun speculating potential names for the president and or GM rule. Elliot, one name you have mentioned, is Mike Gillis, who has not been active in the league for quite some time now. I won't ask for any specifics, but Elliot, how often does a coach or manager reach out to get their own name out there for open vacancies in the hopes it gets them on the hiring team's radar and a foot in the door for an interview? And does it ever work on them landing a role? Thanks for the content, gents.

Always a great listen. Boy, there's going to be a lot of people interested in this answer. I can tell you that much. it happens, but Ian, one of the few rules I have, I don't have a lot of rules in life, but one of the few rules I have is it has to be real. And there has to be a chance that somebody could get this job

or them be a legitimate candidate. And because one of the things I do believe is, if you become a person who's like a perennial candidate, I think it's bad for you. And secondly, I do think that some people, if you campaign a little bit too much, I think it can be a negative. I don't want to say what the situation was,

but there was a coach hiring probably about, I want to say about five or six years ago, where there were two finalists, and I reported the one finalist, and the other guy got the job, and the team told me that one of the reasons that this other person didn't, get the job was because I got his name and not the other guys. And I said, I actually said to the,

person who told me this, that's ridiculous. And the reason I said that's ridiculous is a lot of these people aren't telling me themselves. You just find out about it because people talk about who's open for a job and, um, who's interested and what's available and who the contenders are and you kind of figure out what is this team like or what is this manager like what's their profile and sometimes I just find out stuff and not everybody I find out wants it to be out there for exact that exact reason so I told them actually it was it was we kind of took a me and that person we spoke that conversation didn't end very well we since fixed it but you know I just said like that's that's a ridiculous reason not to hire somebody and but I do think generally

that teams do, they feel that if somebody can keep their names out of things or their name is less mentioned, then they, they do feel that maybe that person is more careful about what they say and who they say it to. But it happens. You know, Ian, it's a good question. It happens. Very good. Okay. A couple more here, including Smiley from, is it Kin Cardin, Kin Cardin? Ken Cardin. Okay, Ontario. Thank you. Yeah. Hello, 32 Thoughts, beauties. Even you, Elliot.

I'm hoping to get this question to you guys in time to address it as a lead-up to this year's draft. Oh, yeah, got in plenty of time. Plenty of time, man. You're like one of those people that hands-in essays early, right, Smiley? I hate people like you. Not us. Not us. To your knowledge, do scouts have a way of keeping their personal rankings of prospects

in an official manner or submitting some kind of official ranking of their own. I know hockey is all about the team, but if a scout is looking to apply for other positions or promotions, can they keep a track record of their picks over the years and judge how it pans out down the road as a way to boast and say, quote, see, I was right on these guys. Thanks for your time and your commitment to keeping the content coming all season long.

The best sunset stop in the Great Lakes, Ken Cardin. Well, Smiley, I don't know if there's anything official, but I have no doubt they do. I have no doubt that they, you know, it's like one of the best interviews I ever saw about the draft was, well, there's been a lot of them, but I remember Bill Belichick getting asked about

drafting Tom Brady in the sixth round. And he said everybody, basically said, everybody gives us so much credit for doing this. And the question we ask is, why are we waiting until the sixth round to draft Tom Brady? and I think the best are wired that way. They look and they say, this is what I was right about, and this is what I was wrong about.

And I think that they all do that. I think they know where their hits were. I think they know where their misses were. And I bet that in their own notebooks, their own computers or whatever, in addition to what they submit, they keep their own list so they know what they were right about and what we're wrong about.

So without Smiley having anything official, I would say the answer is yes, they all do. Yeah, and I heard, I think even this week, certainly with all the news in Toronto, when Feudu was on the radio with Marquesi and he was doing a little peek behind the curtain of just trying to paint the picture of when you're in a scouting meeting, particularly leading up to the draft. Yep. And everybody's got their own lists. And if the GM says something, then do guys now make an adjustment to their own list or are they staying firm and what they believe in? Because everyone kind of has their own from the different area scouts that work for the team. And from there, you kind of build one that is there as the team's list before you go, well,

we used to be down to the draft floor. And I guess now you just, I don't know, go to your boardroom in your own building now. As it's decentralized again. But yes, yes, own personal lists absolutely do exist. That's kind of one of the first steps in terms of determining the big one that you ultimately move forward with as an organization. Okay, one more here, and it comes by way of a voicemail. Guys, Wednesday night, the worst team in the NHL, the worst team in the NHL for years, this 2026 version of the Vancouver Canucks scores eight goals in Colorado,

eight goals on the road in Colorado. when was the last time that the worst team in the league scored eight goals in the home rank of the best team in the league? Okay? Whoa. At 32 thoughts me that. When was the last time the worst team in the league scored eight goals on the best team in the league? Thank you. Goodbye.

32 thoughts me that. I like that. 32 thoughts me that. When the guy was ripping the Knox at the beginning of it, I was like, Dom, how long did it take you to disguise your voice like that? Yes. It's very much, it's very plausible. That's something Don would say.

Off the top of my head, I would have no idea. So I assume you asked. Yeah, yeah. I had an idea. Amazingly, there is one other instance. in the history of this league. No kidding. Hit me.

January 22nd, 1953. Wow. That was the only other time. The New York Rangers went into the Olympia in Detroit. Detroit, yeah. And beat the Red Wings eight to two.

The only other time. And think about it, that's the original six era, right? Yeah, yeah. There aren't a lot of teams to kind of separate the, there weren't as many teams back then to separate the worst from the best. There was the only other time that the last place team in the league went into the building of the best place team in the league and put up eight goals or more.

What a stat. Great question. And once again, I marvel at the skill of the SportsNet stats people to find that answer. Now, I also got a note that is right in line with that type of questioning from Skyler Peters, who asked, there was 58 points between Vancouver and Colorado last night going into the game, wondering what the biggest regular season underdog win in terms of points disparity has ever been. Not 58. What was it?

78. 78 points? Yes, yes. I'm trying to. Okay. Okay, I wouldn't have gotten that. I wouldn't have gotten that. Who was it?

Detroit and San Jose. Yeah, Detroit had 121. San Jose had 43. That was two years or one year, sorry, one year after San Jose upset them in the playoffs. Maybe them in 95? 94. Okay, so two years. Oh, right, because that's 95-96 season, right? Yes, yes, yes. Sorry, April 2nd, 1996. Yes. That's the biggest gap. And that one by Vancouver on Wednesday night, largest since 21, 22. There was three such instances right all at the end of the year.

Florida and Montreal, Florida had 69 points more. Montreal beat them. 58 between Arizona and Minnesota. Arizona beat the wild. And 60 between Seattle and Colorado and Seattle beat Colorado. So that has happened a little more recently. But yeah, the biggest spread, 78 points. Crazy.

30 years ago. Wow. 30 years ago. today. There you go. Happy anniversary. Happy anniversary. To the future is teal. All right. Good thought line. Thank you, everybody for submitting.

Either via voicemail, 1833, 311, 321, 32, or by email at 32th Thoughts at sportsnet.ca. We'll take one final break. Look ahead to the weekend and some fresh new music on 32 Thoughts, the podcast after this. All right, just a heads up for your viewing pleasure this Saturday. penultimate Saturday of the regular season. Hockey Night and Canada, one of the busiest of the season. We're on the air at 630 Eastern, 3.30 Pacific Time with Hockey Central. Rahm McLean, the host, along with Jennifer Botterill, Kevin BXA, Elliot Friedman, Chris Pronger on the panel. This weekend, once again, Kelly remains with the flames out in California and their lengthy

road trip to conclude, or almost conclude, their season. Four games in the seven eastern window, including Toronto and Lottes. Los Angeles, Montreal and New Jersey, Winnipeg in Columbus. That's a big one. Utah and Vancouver. Evander Cain will be honored for 1,000 games in the National Hockey League prior to puck drop in that one.

Two late games as well. So the Calgary Flames, as mentioned in Anaheim, also the Vegas Golden Knights and the Edmonton Oilers, two teams that get along swimmingly, as you know. This week's guest on After Hours with Scott Oak and Louis DeBrusk. They will be joined by Ryan Nugent Hopkins, the longest serving member of the Edmonton Oilers. All right, taking us out today, a track from Door Door,

with roots in the indie circuits of Victoria, BC, and the west coast of Canada. Door Door, blends groove and grunge to create songs filled with hope, light, and an awakening spirit. Reuniting after years apart, Mike, Matt, and Darren rediscovered their sound in a jam space known for its golden door, a symbol of shelter, friendship, and renewal.

Rooted at improvisation and connection, their music invites listeners on a journey through shadows towards something luminous. Their new full-length album, the Exquisite Dream will be released May of this year. They got a couple of upcoming shows, including this Saturday at the Paul Phillips Hall in Victoria, Saturday, May the 9th, the Wrecking Crew Studios grand opening in Sydney, BC. You can catch them there as well. And I just wanted to say, Darren and Matt, keep up the Beer League brilliance. You two look terrific. All geared up. All right.

This track, along with all the others we've featured this year, can be found on the 32 Thoughts of the music playlist on Spotify. John Shemati, thank you once again for continuing to keep that up to date. Here is Door Door and Fiber Optics on 32 Thoughts the podcast. demonstration Economics of my generation Ooh the grid lines of teleconnection She's steering on