32 Thoughts: The Podcast - The Arizona Coyotes & Cramer's Curse

Episode Date: February 9, 2024

In this edition of 32 Thoughts, Jeff and Elliotte kick things off by focusing on the Arizona Coyotes, whose future in the desert hangs by a thread with a looming threat of relocation to Salt Lake City on the horizon. The guys then shift focus to the Toronto Maple Leafs and their impending decision on their 2024 1st round pick. Should they move it before the deadline at the risk of further depleting their pipeline? (14:55). The Calgary Flames then take centre stage as Andrei Kuzmenko has made an immediate impact with his new club. Plus, Jeff and Elliotte ponder the future of Noah Hanifin (21:48). Travis Konecny also demanded some time on this podcast with his Gordie Howe hat-trick which only took 4 minutes of game time to collect. They also dive into Sean Walker, Rasmus Ristolainen, and Scott Laughton's future with the Flyers (27:16). Elliotte also provides the latest on the Edmonton Oilers following their devastating loss to Vegas (34:48) and the guys get into the Buffalo Sabres and what they might do with Casey Mittelstadt (42:48). Finally, we deep dive into the NHL's audit into hitting stats (51:27). The guys answer your questions in the Montana’s Thought Line (57:13). They end the podcast by sitting down with Toronto Maple Leafs forward Mitch Marner (1:20:48). Email the podcast at [e-mail] or call the Montana's Thought Line at 1-833-311-3232 and leave us a voicemail.This podcast was produced and mixed by Dominic Sramaty and hosted by Jeff Marek and Elliotte Friedman.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

You know who I really feel badly for? Claire? Well, her too, yes. But Dom has to edit that. Like, Dom, how long is that going to take you to edit? Long enough that it'll be a minor inconvenience. Don't touch a thing, Dom. It's all genius and touched by the divine.

Oh, my God. Yeah. Holy smokes. Elliot, Elliot, I am an artist. Not even the players who played in that era knew as much about that face-off as you do. Here we go. Welcome to it once again.

32 Thoughts to Podcast. Glad to have you aboard today. Presented, as always, by the GMC Sierra. Merrick alongside Friedman and Dom Schramatti. We've got a lot to get to, including the Philadelphia Flyers tweeting about a Gordie Howe hat trick, which is, well, pretty on brand. and dom schrammati we got a lot to get to including the philadelphia flyers tweeting about a gordy howe hat trick which is well good on brand for the very for the philadelphia flyers

yeah we'll get to a travis connecting in a second here but first oh and we're going to hear from mitch marner elliot and i sat down with mitch marner last friday and he put some unnamed instagram hockey trainers on blast so that's up. Stay tuned for that excitement with Mitch Marner. He was good. In the meantime, yeah, he was excellent. You know, he's really, as he's sort of matured through the Maple Leafs through his career,

he's really become one of the better interviews on this team, I've always felt. He's, I thought he was excellent. Okay, Elliot, what is happening with the Arizona Coyotes? Well, I have to say that Wednesday was a bizarre day, even by Coyote standards. You know, I was writing.

A lot of people were doing reporting. I sent the 32 Thoughts blog the top part on the Coyotes. I think I rewrote it about six times. I think I rewrote it about six times. I have retired some editors in Sportsnet history who have done my blog for a year and then said, I need to get a different job. And I would have to say that if Rory Boylan resigns after this season, it was because of Wednesday's blog.

But I have to say, I didn't know everything that was going on online because I just wasn't paying a lot of attention when I was writing. And when I went back and looked, I'll tell you, like, that was a really hard day for Coyote's employees. And the one thing I really do feel is that, you know, for a lot of us, we're talking about this, we're reporting on this. It's not our lives like it is for those people. That was like riding the Cedar Point roller coasters for those Coyotes employees. And I do want to mention that. I heard it was really, really hard on them. And the other thing- I'm going to Sandusky this summer, by the way, for a baseball tournament. So thanks for pointing out Cedar Point. You'll have to go. You have to go. I will. I know. Sorry. Continue. So the, and the one thing I wanted to mention, and it's probably the new news I can really drop at the beginning of this podcast is I understand that the owner of the coyotes, Alex Morello communicated with the staff and I don't know how he did it, but I heard he communicated with the staff that he is going to address them all next week I think he's going into Arizona and he's

going to address them with exactly what is going on so they were kind of relieved to hear that and so Craig Morgan had the probably the biggest news of the day in the sense that even though we had talked and written, Jeff, about how online there was nothing in that Arizona land development meeting that pointed to the coyotes on the agenda, we had discussed that these things can happen in camera. I've done enough city council or government reporting to know that this can happen and Craig Morgan reported that that was going to be the case. Now I don't have any fresh news about that for this pod. Like I said the most fresh thing is that I heard is that Morello had indicated to the staff that he will address them face to face next. But I do think at some point in the next few days,

they are going to release a statement about where we are. So, you know, I have to tell you, you speak to five different people and you get five different opinions on where this is going to go. You speak to 50 different people, you get 50 different opinions on where this is going to go you speak to 50 different people you get 50 different opinions on where this is going to go the one thing I think that a lot of us believe here is that this is Morello's last

attempt to get this right that the NHL will not let this continue and the one thing we don't know here and I've been told this is very important, is we don't know what Bettman has said to Coyote's ownership privately. If he's given them any deadlines, if he spelled out what he expects, like that's a very, very big part of this is what has Bettman said to the Coyotes behind the scenes. And we don't have this information. coyotes behind the scenes. And we don't have this information, but I think everybody does feel that this ownership group, they're at fourth down. You can pick the yardage. It's fourth and two, it's fourth and five, it's fourth and 10, it's fourth and 20, whatever. They're on fourth down

and they've got to make a play. And, but what nobody really knows is what happens if this doesn't work is it sell to another ownership group in Arizona and then play it mullet until that happens is it go to Utah and then as you and I have said sort out the arena situation in Arizona and bring a team back when that's done? Is it go to Matt Ishbia, the owner of the Suns, and say, you have an arena there, or let's either join in or build a new one together? Nobody seems to know what's going to happen if we don't get clarity on this ownership group's latest plan but i will say this jeff there's there's a lot of skepticism there's a lot of skepticism that morello can get this done and look i don't know if it's true that alex morello jr runs the team twitter account and on wednesday night he's hate tweeting at all of us um but they have to recognize that there is a lot of skepticism now if they prove us

wrong about this skepticism they can do a celebration dance across social media i've got no problem but they've got no problem. But they've got to prove us wrong. And Jeff, you know what I don't like about their start? They used a Jim Cramer meme. Have you heard about Cramer's curse? I have heard about Cramer's curse, yes. I am well aware of this one.

I freely admit that I have had a horrible year for predictions every prediction i have made has been almost entirely incorrect but nobody has has been on a worse run than jim kramer and people call it out over the internet like whenever he says something's good is gonna happen people are like sell sell sell so i would just say i don't know if it's alex jr or someone else is running the coyotes account if you want us to believe that this is going to work don't use jim kramer memes it's a bad omen so a lot of this here in the opening segment here this podcast is all about alex morello and the arizona coyotes part of this and you know what i'm thinking this whole time as i'm watching all of this unfold you know that great visual it came out years ago it's patrick kane and there's like 50 pucks around him and

he's stick handling through all of them and he's i mean he's patrick kane it's perfect but it's like you're looking at this thing and say okay it's only a matter of time before he bounces one off another puck and of course he's Patrick Kane so he doesn't that's how I'm looking at Gary Bettman right now as he has all these pucks all around him as he's trying to stick handle through all of it all of this to try to bring this thing to a certain conclusion there's an old saying that you get the most flack when you're directly over the target. And I get the sense that right now the NHL is directly over the target to the point where someone, you know, someone mentioned this to me the other day, said, you guys aren't paying attention enough to one very important thing in that Ryan Smith open letter the other

day. And I said, what's that? And he said, all the talk in the Ryan Smith note was all about expansion, nothing about relocation. And as we've talked about before, we don't believe that that note gets released without the approval of the NHLl much like his appearance on the podcast last year probably you know had to get the okay nudge nudge wing wing photography yep exactly yeah exactly right you know what i'm talking about he said this is all very deliberate not one single word from ryan smith about relocation it's all just expansion like this is again this is like patrick kane deking out all of those pucks every tiny little move that the nhl makes because they're right over the target elliot has to be perfect yes right now and especially in this case because there's a lot

of money at stake and you know the thing is here is that, look, maybe he pulls this off and he keeps the team, but if he doesn't, and I've said this once, I'll say it a million times, Bettman is not giving Morello any ammunition that the game was rigged against him. He is going to be able to say, the game was rigged against him. He is going to be able to say, we were supportive of you 100%. This was your fault. You couldn't pull it off if he has to sell it. Because one thing a couple of people have said to me is,

Morello's going to do pretty well on a sale here. If he sells it to someone else, or he sells it to the league, or he sells it to someone else or he sells it to the league or he sells it to another market, he's going to do pretty well and the league's going to make sure that he does pretty well because they are going to want nothing hanging over this. So Jeff, I'm with you. I think that the league is playing nice in the sandbox.

So Jeff, I'm with you. I think that the league is playing nice in the sandbox. Now, if this goes sideways, is Bettman going to bear his fangs? Absolutely he will. But his goal is whatever happens here to get it done as precise and cleanly as possible. You know, we don't talk about enough, maybe because there's no significant information that we've been able to glean. I mean, a lot of it is behind closed doors. We'll focus a lot on the Coyotes organization. We'll focus a lot on the NHL and the commissioner, Gary Bettman, how those two parties feel about this issue. how the players and the players association uh feel about this is outlined by marty walsh executive director last friday we know the fans are frustrated as well some annoyed um how do other owners feel about this that's one thing that i'm always curious about oh they hate this how do 31 other owners feel about this situation right now they don't like it

they don't like it they don't like it at all and they have opinions but they're careful um the one thing they do agree with do agree on the ones that deign to speak to me the one thing they do agree on is that it's time and that this is the last shot they they agree with that uh they did they disagree on what the outcomes might be, but they agree on that. You know, one thing I will tell you that I had some of the biggest pushback on was in Forbes, they say that the Forbes figures, and it's Forbes, they don't see everything, but that reporter, Mike Ozanian, he's very good. He's very connected. He's been on it forever but he's very connected

important people talk to him he says and he's written that the coyotes are cash positive and I was like that can't be true it can't be true because you know they they don't make any money on their arena and their ticket revenues are the lowest in the league. And what some people have told me is that the league has done well enough in terms of its revenues that it helps, which is probably true to some degree. But I played it safe and I wrote, as Forbes reported, they're cash positive because this is not something I am totally an expert in. I got to tell you, I got some feedback on that. Like, that's insane.

Like, I had one person in the league, a pretty prominent person, send me a picture reading my blog with that line and holding their face in their hands and like, no way. And I have to tell you, Jeff, this is an extreme reaction. This never happens. I had a couple other people say, no way. I, you know, the one thing I'll say is that, uh, people do hold Ozanian in high regard and I do too, but that was the one thing that people disagreed with. They said there's no way the Coyotes are cash positive. All right.

We'll see where this one heads. We'll see where this goes. But like I said, we're expecting a league announcement, and we're expecting Morello to address the staff, and we'll see. But this is the one thing I stick by is you know if this doesn't work we'll see where we go so somehow we've gone from judge redfield t-bomb to speculating about alex morello's son controlling the arizona coyote social media and putting everybody on blast. Don't use Jim Kramer.

Very good. Okay. Someone else. Okay. From the boardroom to the 200 by 85. The Toronto Maple Leafs. Not exactly a secret. Brad Truliving, very interested in doing something with the blue line.

We've talked about this countless times, but very much in question here. The first round pick. You have a sense of where the Toronto Maple Leafs are at with their first round pick, what it would take to part with their first round pick. Do they decide to keep the powder dry and keep the first round pick? Figuring we're not living in the high rent district this season. Let's just see where the skill can take us and where the talent leads the maple leafs and the first round pick elliot well first of all

our draft gurus and you watch a lot more of this than i do but the guys who really watch it are sam cosentino and jason bucala they don't think the draft is really good after 20. They think there's a drop. And after, you know, there was a big under-18 tournament, I guess it was in Michigan this week, and that was definitely the talk there, that, you know, after 20 it drops. And you're seeing that some of these teams, Vancouver and Winnipeg have done it already,

they're okay with trading those picks and I do think a lot of the experts agree with Jason and Sam on this so I think in any normal year like for example I think one team that will deal its first rounder another one is Edmonton I think Edmonton is perfectly prepared to trade that pick, and we'll get to them in a couple of minutes. But again, I think the problem with Toronto is that their cupboard is pretty bare. If they trade this pick, they have one pick in the first two rounds between now and the 2026 draft, and that's their first rounder in 2026. They don't have a second rounder until 2027.

And that's their first rounder in 2026. They don't have a second rounder until 2027. So what I think, Jeff, is ultimately, I think they're prepared to do it. But what they're trying to figure out is if they can use it to pack a bit more of a punch than just a first round pick for a rental. And, you know, for example, when they were trying to get both Tanev and Zdorov from Calgary, I believe their first round pick was there. They were prepared to do it to get two players and see if they could sign them. And so I think that's what they're trying to do. Like I wouldn't, it wouldn't surprise me at all if, you know, in trying to get Tanev from Calgary you know the leaser is thinking

hey can we get a second player with this is it Hannafin or is it Markstrom or is it you know someone else and like I don't necessarily think Calgary is going to do that the Canucks tried to see can we get Lindholm and Tanev? And Calgary was like, no, we can do more if we split it up. So I'm not sure it's going to work. But that's the kind of thing I think Toronto is trying. Is there a way that we can use our first round pick to do something more creative than just one player?

And that's where we are. So they've got time to figure this out between now and then, but that's the way they're thinking. They don't want to trade Minton. They don't want to trade Cowan. They don't want to trade Nyes. And you know what? The one thing I do agree with is I would rather trade a draft pick

than a prospect I'd seen a little bit. Like after seeing Cowan and after seeing Minton kind of make the team and seeing what Nyes is, and I know he's been struggling, but I think he's going to be a really good player. I would rather trade the pick than the other guys too. Hey, just as a quick aside, and we'll do a little bit more on Calgary in a couple of moments but um you saw chris tan have taken eric holla stick in the face like there's a lot of hue and cry about you know everybody's clamoring for tan if we saw this last time he got hurt uh in a game there's a hue and cry about you know shut him down if you're

going to trade him what are we doing here do you have a thought on that one because it's not exactly like we're anywhere close to trade deadline at this point. There's still some runway here. The idea of shutting down. But listen, the way that Tanev plays, every game might be his last game of the season. Like that's just the way that Chris Tanev plays now. That's the way that Chris Tanev has always played. And I think we all make the argument.

That's what makes him so attractive to teams. But when you see him get an Eric Hollis stick in the face, like we saw in that Calgary, New Jersey game on Thursday, does a part of you say, if I'm Craig Conroy, I might want to step on the gas a little bit here or maybe just shut him down? I was talking about that with someone today.

If you actually look at it though, in the last five seasons, he hasn't missed a ton of games he played i think almost i think he played every game but one in the year covet hit he played every game the year after he played 82 and 21 22 but he played 65 last year and he got hurt this year so the narrative doesn't always back up the the true facts here but i understand what everybody's saying you know he'll block a shot with his face and you know that does sources tell me that puts you in harm's way so yeah i i get it you know the one thing is is that

the nhl kind of frowns on that a bit i get it they only they only want you to take guys out if you actually have a deal now remember last year this happened with gavrikov and he went crazy over it in in columbus because they thought they had a deal with boston um but generally generally the league doesn't like that. So you've got to be close. Now, the one thing, like there's a lot swirling around this guy right now. There's Toronto. There's Dallas.

There's, well, Tampa Bay, Vancouver, although they don't think, I don't think they can do it, I think they, at this time at least, I think they like them. There's Ottawa. There's been more and more talk about Edmonton, which I think is possible. I had some people say they wouldn't be surprised if Colorado is there too. I just wonder if this one ends sooner rather than later. But I'll tell you this. Toronto is not the only team.

I was told this. Toronto is not the only team that doesn't want to do a first for a rental. So it's in Dallas' best interest to hope that this gets better over time. But when it comes to the Maple Leafs, I think that's what they're trying to do. Is there a way we can squeeze more juice out of our first rounder plus? Mentioned Calgary a second ago, speaking of Chris Tanovin, and a couple of things this week for the Calgary Flames.

Andre Kuzmenko has scored in both games this week for the Calgary Flames. Scored against Boston, scored against New Jersey on Thursday night. So clearly they won the trade, right? Because they won their two games and Vancouver's split their two games this week. That's how we're doing this, right? Yes, declare a victory.

Okay, clearly Calgary has won this trade. But you know, one of those players who was outstanding the other night against the Boston Bruins for the Calgary Flames was Noah Hannafin. It was like an audition. Didn't it feel that way? Like, hey, look over here, everybody. Remember me?

I know I've been playing in Canada for a long time, but just thoughts on Hannafin. Hannafin's decision. We know there's a deal on the table. You know, just back in his hometown, I would imagine family and friends and various conversations about said deal. Do we have a thought on noah hannifin these days i do i don't have any confirmation um you know the the the longer it goes though the more you wonder that's that's what i'll say um you know i just don't want to make any declarative statements until i i know for sure but the longer it goes the the more the more you wonder

but I I do think the plan was to at least let it know by uh the end of the week and we're getting depends on what deity that you pray to that you choose whether the end of the week is Friday Saturday or Sunday very good very good you know know, the one thing, too, is these wildcard races, Calgary's math isn't as good as St. Louis's or L.A.'s, but I give them credit. They're in the race. They've put themselves back in the race. To me, I'm watching the Islanders.

The Islanders beat up Tampa tonight. More importantly, they didn't let tampa get any points and the islanders are back in this um you know i'll tell you one thing like what barzell you know first of all i don't think he lacks any confidence at all secondly though i i do think when you go to the all-star game and you're part of that competition and you show as well as he did and I know the last one didn't go well but he was right there like he had a chance to win and now you've got you've got Wah unleashing you it's not only that he's up in his even strength minutes three to four four minutes or whatever it is, but he's now playing 20 minutes a game at even strength.

Like the one thing that's very clear to me is when Patrick Waugh met with Lou Lamorello about this job, he said, I'm going to unleash this guy. And like in the game in Toronto, Sheldon Keefe had to put his best players he couldn't find other players aside from his best players to play against Barzell because nobody else could handle him and you know that seems to me that it's one of the keys to the Islander season here on in is that the chains are off this guy and he's going to play and he's going to play a lot. And, you know, they look like a much more dangerous team.

Like that Tampa team, they're reeling and they're going to have some really big decisions to make. I think they were looking at defense already. Someone told me they were looking at forwards too. So they're going to have some big decisions to make, but they were re at forwards too um so they're gonna have some big decisions to make but they were reeling after the Sergeyev injury and you know there's no way like there's no way we're gonna see him in the regular season I I just think that they're gonna have to have a big run as they kind of indicated for him to come back like that's an awful awful bad injury

and I'm really curious to see how the Lightning decide to attack this. They're going to have more flexibility. His number will be off the cap. But deep down, and I know they always go for it, but I think that's an honest, honest franchise. The way I've heard they speak to each other in the front office there is they talk to each other honestly. And I just wonder if they look at it and say, is this the year that we do this?

And that's my only question. And if they say that though, then the question becomes what becomes of Stephen Stamkos, who's on the expiring contract? There's no question that's going to be one of the biggest storylines of the summer. By the way, I did want to mention something last week. You know, Tampa Bay, they do an incredible job of charity donations. Yep. You know, what Jeff Vinnick has done there with his rewards program is pretty impressive. has done with there with his rewards program is,

is pretty impressive. Well, Julian Brisebois, he committed $500,000 last week to the Ronald McDonald house charities of Tampa Bay. And that is a great, great gesture. Great gesture. That should be applauded and broadcast as well.

Okay. Elsewhere around the NHL. Elliot, what was the most Philadelphia Flyers thing you saw on Thursday night? So when somebody does something really well, team says, here's our three stars of the game. Martin Natchez has a hat trick. Jonathan Huberto played his 800th game tonight. The Philadelphia Flyers sent out a tweet not only

announcing that travis connect me had a gordy howe hat trick in the first period but mentioning that it happened in four minutes during the first period yes that is red meat to flyer fans that is a social media team knowing their base because they're going to sell as a matter of fact when i tweeted out that nature said the hat trick in just under 16 minutes i had at least one flyer fan probably a couple more actually i think it was at least two or three saying you got to recognize the gordy howe hat trick too and i was like you know what i'll mention it on the podcast but these flyer fans fans, they were like, hold on. You think that's good. Travis connect me at a Gordie Howe hat trick in four minutes, you know, connect me by the way, they can extend them

July 1st. This is one thing that people kind of mix up. People are like, well, they can't talk to him before July 1st. No, that's not true. If he's your player, you can talk to him whenever. You just can't sign it until July 1st. I think that the Flyers and Konechny are talking about this extension. I believe they've made it a priority, and they're going to try to get it done. It's going to be a big number. I don't know yet where we're going here. It's going to be a big number,

but I believe the Flyers want to make sure that this guy is a lifetime Flyer. And I understand he's receptive to it. And why wouldn't it be? He clearly plays like he loves it there. Let me ask you more about the Philadelphia Flyers here. One of the things that I started to wonder about on the last little while here,

the Sean Walker situation. And we know that there's a number of teams that are interested in Sean Walker. And you know who one of those teams are, I believe? The Philadelphia Flyers. So you think they're going to keep him? Here's what I wonder about. Do you think, like this will take some stick handling,

but do you think that there is a chance, and by that I mean a marketplace, and it may mean retention as well, for Rasmus Ristelainen? Boy, it was a real crazy scene when he didn't take warm-up tonight for about five minutes there. People were like whoa

i mean you gotta chase this so he was ill um i'll say this i spent a lot of time uh talking to people about ristalainen there is no question no question that his stock has risen. And I'll tell you one thing about Riz Alainen. The question was never about his desire and his will. Like this was always a guy who really cared. This was always a guy who would do anything for his teammates. And this is always a guy who played hard. The issue is the contract.

That's number one. So both if a team wanted him and the Flyers wanted to trade him, there would have to be a lot of willing to bend both ways. The Flyers would have to agree to eat, but the Flyers would also ask more to eat. And some teams will say, hey, we're not giving you as much as you want in this particular case so it's a complicated negotiation that said the most interesting thing i heard about wrist

alliance was this is the time of year where teams don't practice very much that's one thing rick bonus talked to us about yep that's about about getting a player this time of year is tough because there's no practice time. There's no practice time. If you don't play like Philly does, and you don't, like, Ristolano's challenge is his foot speed. He does not have great foot speed,

especially on some of the moves that defensemen have to make. Now, the Flyers know that they've found a way to put him in situations where he can be more successful and they've really tailored what they they've asked him to improve in certain things which he has done but also the people i know who've really watched him play say the Flyers do a great job of putting him in the best possible positions where that weakness doesn't hurt him as much. So if you're trading for him now, do you play similarly? Do you have, can you put him in those kinds of situations? Or, this is what one guy said to me, and I think this team kind of likes him, do you trade for him in the summer when you know you get a camp to evaluate all those things and

prepare him? And that is what one team said to me. It's not only how complicated the deal is because of the contract, it also is the fit right mid midseason for how you have to prepare him and protect him. This guy, like I said, this guy likes Ristolainen, but he said, I'm not sure we're the right in-season fit for him. Well, that doesn't work with my scenario at all. Because my scenario, I just wonder if they could move Ristolainen and then keep Sean Walker. That's what I want. It's one or the other, it seems, with this situation.

You're not having both. It could be. You know, I mentioned, by the way, Colorado with Tanev. They're really reeling, too, coming out of the All-Star break. Oh, boy. They started Parise on one line. They moved him to another. He scored. You know, they started parise on one line they moved him to another he scored um you know they lost to carolina on on thursday night um you could see the steam coming out of

mckinnon's helmet that's another one i'm wondering just how long they wait before they they get on to things there um scott lawton real quick before i wrap up with the flyers yeah i i just think it's not i i think you can see the writing here he's down about three minutes a game like he loves being a flyer and like he's one of those guys whenever his career ends he'll be a flyer they'll take good care of him because he played his heart out there but you you can kind of see where this is going. And I think there's an understanding here that I don't know if maybe even understanding is not the right word,

but I think there's definitely a realization here that it might be time. I wonder about a team. And people are looking for centers, like look at what's being traded for centers. I don't disagree. I wonder about a team like the Buffalo Sabres as well for, for Scott Lawton, again, maybe off season, centers i don't disagree i i wonder about a team like the buffalo sabers as well for uh for scott lawton again maybe off season but that's probably a team that's looking for a little bit more snarl

and some veteran presence uh we'll see what i didn't hang on but just as an addition off top of my head here i think kyle dubas had some interest in lawton when he was running that year that lawton signed his extension as i I understand it, it was basically either he signs an extension or he gets traded to Toronto. That's the story I was always told. And I'm sure the Philadelphia Flyers would love to make a deal with the Pittsburgh Penguins. What about Columbus and Boone Jenner?

That's an intriguing name, Elliot. I just think it comes down to does someone knock their socks off? That's what it would be. Like I'll tell you this, people out there, they love Jenner. Yeah, I know. He's got great respect, but you got to knock their socks off. And, you know, I think teams have definitely called, but it's going to take a big deal.

Okay, one of the teams that, you know, might be a fit for Boone Jenner are the Edmonton Oilers. What is the latest of them coming off that devastating loss against the Vegas Golden Knights? The streak is over at 16. First of all, what a great game that was. That was fun. The emotion in the building, the fans were great that night. Edmonton played great.

Edmonton played great. Look, they got goalied. Aiden Hill beat them. I think McDavid, it was so good to see how pissed off he was on the bench. It just shows you how much that game meant to both those teams. And you know how much the Golden Knights wanted that game too. They just loved being the team that ended that streak.

For sure. You know, first of all, one thing about Eichel is he saw the surgeon over the All-Star break. And from what I hear, he's on time. The good news is no setbacks, no concerns. So I think it's going to be end of February, maybe beginning of March at the latest. But, you know, he's on the right path to returning. So that's good news, except for the west of the western conference i was gonna say good news good news for who good news for eichel and the golden knights

that's it that's the hops you know there's been a lot of talk we mentioned earlier about tana being connected to the oilers like i said i think the oilers are going to move their number one pick and there might be other things they move but i think they're going to move their number one pick and there might be other things they move but I think they're going to move their number one pick to me the question is what do they think if the number one pick is the best asset they have what is the most important thing for them to get now they might have another good asset here in Broberg he's playing 25 minutes a night in Bakersfield and he is playing extremely well so I'm curious to see what happens there but he could be another very good asset but to me it all comes down to what Edmonton values the most and the thing I really believe they value the most is is forward depth. And I just think that after that game in Vegas, it's a reminder, especially if they get them in the first round,

you have to be a true four-line team to beat Vegas. If you go back to a lot of the interviews that we did with the Vegas players and the Edmonton players at the start of the season, we asked about the difference in that series. I think the thing that came up the most was the depth, particularly from the Vegas side. Up front. And I believe in that game, Edmonton was reminded of that.

That they have to get another forward or two. And now it's money in, money out for for them so it's tricky and I do think they might like I think Edmonton could have a really interesting deadline I think there could be trades to bring something in and as part of like when they got at home last year they said Tyson Berry had to be in that deal so maybe a player that goes out is a player that they include in the deal, or maybe they make another ulterior move to clear the cap room. Whatever the case is, I think they're going for a forward. Now, I really do believe that they, like if Gensel is available,

my opinion is that's their guy. That's the guy they would like to get. That's my opinion, but that's their guy that's the guy they would like to get that's my opinion but that's the guy we just don't know where that's gonna land right now but i watching that game the other night i think the oilers look at it like if we're gonna beat these guys in a seven game series we have to be a four-line team and And I think they see that as a bigger concern than their blue line. Where they want at least one more piece, a right shot D. So there's still a menu there for Ken Holland. There's still a menu.

Yeah, but I do think, especially watching that game, I think it's got to be forward for them. I do. And like I said, I think they've got two pieces here they're looking at. Their first rounder for the biggest swings, right? Their first rounder and Broberg. Who's the first rounder himself, as we all know. Yes, he was.

All right. Washington Capitals. Are people going to go goofy trying to get nicked out? I'll just ask you bluntly. Well, first of all, he's a good player. And secondly, look, a first rounder for rentals, and he's making one three this year and one three next year. Like, that's a good player.

Yep. That's a really good player. A really good player. So, yeah, I think there's definitely interest. Like, who are the centers left? Henrique? Dowd? You know, we don't know about Jenner yet

or if that's going to happen. Hang on. I wonder about Casey Middlestat. That's who I wonder. We're going to talk about Buffalo in a second. Let's get there. But, you know, I thinkhington you've like anyone who's got a center has got to be looking at this and saying how can i not listen to what's out there number

one i think washington's got to decide you know what their their plan is they lost the other night they lost again tonight although ke Kemper had a big game. To me, it's, first of all, they have to set a plan. And secondly, the other thing is right now, Kuznetsov is off the cap, right? He's, and everybody wishes him the best, but he's off the cap right now. And that could even add to what Washington can do. You know, can they facilitate things?

Can they, can they get an extra piece by doing something? And so, you know, I really think that they could be a fascinating, fascinating team. And look who's scoring again, by the way. Oh, Vetchkin's got a pair.

Well, one in each of his last two games. Scored against the Habs, scored against the Florida Panthers. Here's where it gets even more problematic for the Washington Capitals. They lost 4-2, doubled up by the Panthers on Thursday night. It ain't over yet, Elliot. They got Boston. They got Vancouver. They got Colorado. It's not getting yet, Elliot. They got Boston. They got Vancouver. They got Colorado.

It's not getting any easier here. You not wonder if they're close to having the conversation about making the decision on the season and the direction. That's what I mean. That's exactly what I mean. They have to set their, where are they going and what's their plan see we had always assumed at least i had always assumed elliot that as long as ovechkin was chasing gretzky that was the plan surround ovechkin with players that are gonna that's gonna

get him the record i'm not so sure that's the plan anymore is it well you reach a point where that has to change but secondly the other thing it does is if he's scoring again, it sells out your building. Because people want to see the chase, right? They do. They do want to see the chase. Okay, a couple more things here. Let's get to Buffalo.

Again, I mentioned I'm curious about Casey Middlestad. There's always players that you look at and you say, okay, they're doing well. But does that you look at and you say okay they're doing well but does the team look at that success and say this player is doing well so that's great for us we'll keep him because why trade him if he's doing well or there's the he's doing well that's great he's now a trade ship for us. Something's got to change in Buffalo. That mix needs to change. Where that change is going to come,

I would suspect probably a lot of the veteran guys that are on expiring contracts, we won't see next season. There'll be different veterans that they bring in. But I do wonder about Casey Middlestad's presence in this sort of sea of you know thompsons and quins etc up front and cousins for me it's not as much about middle stat as it is about the some of the even younger players that are on the cusp of playing like i'm not talking about

coolidge i think he's gonna play uh for Buffalo but if you take a look at Buffalo's prospect base they have a lot of them and there's just there's simply I think when I was looking at the list like what are the chances like you look at these names well Benson he's different he's he's a saver but you look at you know Coolidge, Rosen, Ostlund, Wahlberg, Savoy like there's a saver. But you look at, you know, Kulich, Rosen, Ostland, Wahlberg, Savoy. Like, there's a lot of players here. And are they all going to play in Buffalo? Well, in a perfect world, you hope they do. But one of the other things you realize is

not everybody can, and everybody gets there at different points. And, you know, the thing that you get there is you start to say okay who do we think because you have to like you know like like i know someone who went down to watch their game against dallas on tuesday and i'm not saying they played really good. They should have won the game, but beat them. Yeah. Fantastic. Yeah. He beat them and they had a, they had 48 shots. Like I think half of those were really good chances.

You know, the thing is though, is that it's really like, I'm a patience, patience, patience guy. You can't ask these fans to be any more patient. Like that's one of the best hockey markets anywhere in the world. And my buddy said, you can feel it in the building. It's just, it's not there. He basically, he said, this is not the way you should be experiencing hockey in Buffalo. And so you can't wait any longer. You can't tell these people, be patient. And I think the Sabres know that, obviously.

So I think they're looking at some of these players and they're saying, okay, who's going to be here next year? Who do we think is an absolute can't miss? Okay, if you're not on this list or you're not on that list, who's left? And those kind of players are valuable. And I just think that that's what they're doing i think they are starting to ask themselves do we have to move out a player or two that is value to someone else but maybe isn't going to be one of our guys our top guys and say we just have to do this because you've got to do some cpr on that team you know the one thing about middle stat

um i was just thinking about this is i'm looking at their their cap situation and you know obviously the sabers don't have a lot to worry about there um but the one thing that happens is look they've paid a lot of their guys they've paid thompson they've paid cousins they've paid delene they've paid samuelson you know paid power like people aren't going to disagree with a lot of those, but I'll tell you what happens. If you're not going to pay somebody, you've got a problem. So middle stat is at two and a half. He's a restricted free agent.

He's got ARB rights, and his counting stats are are good so it's not like uh you know i mean you know you're gonna have to pay him he's a he's got 42 points in 50 games you know you're gonna have to pay him um but he's getting closer to ufa you're basically at the bleep or get off the pod stage and the and the thing is there jeff is if you're not going to pay him he's not going to be happy and that doesn't mean casey middlestat's a bad guy but what it does mean is that he's going to look at everybody around him and say, all these guys got paid and I didn't. So you have, if you're not going to pay him, you almost have to move him. What you just heard was Elliott Friedman talking himself into my point. So now you're with me on Casey Malstead.

Well, like I understand, right? Like I get it. Honestly, I'm agreeing with you all the way here on everybody else around him getting uh getting a nice dollar and getting term as well and i just wonder if this season the buffalo sabers is saying this is great for what we have to do or what we want to do with casey meddlesead again i'm just wondering i'm just like you i'm looking at the players that they're building this entire thing around and i'm saying i'm not wondering i'm just like you i'm looking at the players that they're building this entire thing around and i'm saying i'm not sure where the room at the inn is for casey medelstad

here we'll see where it goes but that's one of the things uh eric johnson never thought there you talked about him i i will say this i will say this the sabers are getting followed a lot like there started to be i'm very careful about uh scouts because they're they're everywhere and because the unbalanced schedule there tends to be games where 20 people show up on nights when there's only three games being played but there's definitely a certain teams are starting to watch the sabers vibe out there elliot i'm really glad you wrote about the goalie market as well and that is led by one of the great stories in this generation, the NHL, Marc-Andre Fleury.

And boy, is that a huge game on Friday between Minnesota and the Pittsburgh Penguins, celebrating Marc-Andre Fleury against his old team. Elvis Merzlikens, Jacob Markstrom, John Gibson. And I was really pleased to see you mention Capo Kakanen of the San Jose Sharks. Would you like to start there? Well, I've watched him a little bit this year

and his numbers have started to drop a little bit. But when you've seen as much rubber as he and Black would have this year. That blue line is tough, man. Yeah, I'll tell you this. When the Sharks came toronto a few weeks ago they knew it was a big media stage and by the way i love the teal helmets those things look fantastic they knew it was a big media stage and they made a point of letting everybody know

that their goaltenders deserved a lot of praise considering what had happened in their games this year. And that night, they got blown out by Toronto, and it wasn't Kakanen's fault. Like, they just weren't very good. But, you know, he's been good, and Blackwood's been good. They simply said, you know, like like they've been besieged and that's the thing about kakunin he's he's had really good numbers you know the the money puck goal saved above he's dropped a bit but he was very high and the the only issue is he just doesn't have the runway

right like that's that's the issue but people have noticed how much better he's gotten there the one thing is we're not talking about goalies as much right now maybe because you know Toronto isn't as a disaster as much of a disaster in that as they were but we aren't talking about goalies as much but to me flurry as you said he's going to be the guy that's going to determine what the market is out here by the way winnipeg has completely forgotten how to play hockey no they've forgotten how to score in hockey no you know what i yeah that that's a problem but like all that structure that they played with all year it's it's MIA I don't know if it's a post all-star thing I didn't think they played too badly in those two games against Toronto right before the break but since they've come out of it um you're right

that you can't win if you don't score but their structure has completely broken down like just they're doing things that i have not seen them do all year elliot rick bonus will never talk to us again it's before the two game series against the maple leafs he spoke to us then he spoke to us at all-star he will never talk to this program again elliot's another thing raising eyebrows this week um hit stats in the nhl and the nhl audit of hit stats and the nhl making the appropriate adjustments now the first place my brain went to was uh-oh what does this mean for wagering but as you've pointed out bigger story here bigger story here yeah i think this was about some agents uh potentially flagging it um about some of their clients being maybe

short-changed on hits now i did get a note after i wrote it on thursday morning that the nhl may have also looked at it and said and this is not someone from the NHL offices, this is someone from a team who told me, but they think also that there were people at the NHL who noticed a difference. That it wasn't only agents and players who might have noticed it, but it was also that someone was looking at it and they said boy hits are really down and probably much more than some of the other categories and so I think

it was a it was a couple of things like I wrote um I wrote that uh like one of the guys I've wanted to get on the podcast for a long time is Roland Lee and Roland Lee is is basically the he is the brain power of the NHLPA like basically if I think if if his brain isn't hooked up to the computers the lights don't turn on in the morning um like he's he does a lot of their research for salary arbitration, contract comparables. But he is media phobic. He does not want to ever talk to anyone. So I just figured I'd throw him in there just to see if he'd react at all.

Elliot, just because someone doesn't want to talk to you doesn't mean they're media phobic. Oh, that's a good point, Jeff. That's true. But I wanted to see if he would come up for air if I put that in there but basically I did get a note that it wasn't him but oh I do I I do think there were some agents but I also heard like I said from a team that the league noticed there was a discrepancy. And, you know, it's funny. It made me wonder a little bit. You know, we talk about how we're missing some of the edge and the physicality, and it's kind of gone in a lot of regular season games.

That says to me the league doesn't like that very much. So they did an audit, and a lot of, like, Jeremy Lazon, I was on my Nashville radio hit this week, and they were telling me that I think Jeremy LaZon, who's number one in league in hits, suddenly had 29 more hits. I think Simon Benoit went up a couple of hits

per 60. And Benoit was one of the guys I was thinking about because, like I think that's a guy the Leafs should be extending, right? He's found a home and he's been a very good player for them and he's not a ufa he's an rfa but so he would have arbrights and everything right so like that's the kind of case like he's the kind of player you would look at him and you would say if his hits go up that could really benefit him in comparables and an arb hearing so he's the kind of guy that I was really thinking about but

I understand why you went to gambling and it matters for gambling I'm not denying that and what I thought was really interesting was that they promised more up-to-date audits now like on a daily basis but I think this was a combination of some agents and also the league saying these numbers look really off I'll tell you this I thought it was really smart of them to announce it when a lot of us weren't expecting it and the reason is if they didn't announce it someone would have noticed there are a lot of very smart people who go through these numbers very closely and if they tried to change it without telling anyone someone would have figured it out hit stats uh insert your own private new york islanders joke as you see appropriate there were there was a lot of that i i will say that there was definitely a lot of right away with messrs uh sezikis and martin and clutterbuck pacifically as we say in the atlantic

okay elliot before we wrap up this segment of the podcast want to make special um mention of two very special people who are taken from us far too soon um matthew spezza and and Logan Hunter are condolences to the Spezza and Hunter family. Logan Hunter is someone that I remember covering when he played with the London Knights and the Peterborough Peets of the OHL. He was someone who listened to the podcast as well and was just such a wonderful, wonderful presence around junior hockey and a great family man later in life as well.

And condolences to the Spezzas on the passing of Matthew and Jason Spezza, his brother, delivered just a beautiful tribute at the funeral on Thursday. Condolences to the Spezzas and the Hunters. hunters. Listen to the 32 Thoughts podcast ad free on Amazon Music, included with Prime. All right, welcome back to the podcast. Time now for the Montana's Thought Line. Montana's Barbecue and Bar. Canada's home for barbecue, Elliot. Try the ribs.

At 32thoughts at sportsnet.ca. That's the email, 1-833-311-3232. Again, 32thoughts at sportsnet.ca, 1-833-311-3232. We have kind of a... By the way, before we start, I just wanted to announce that I'm four pushups behind Brody. Oh, for a 2000 pushups in February.

Yeah. So he's doing 80 a day. I, my Thursday number was 76. So yes, you're right there. Pushups away from a 12 year old. For those who don't know what we're talking about,

Elliot and I are doing the 2000 pushups in February challenge. And my 12 year old son, Brody is doing it with me. And much to Elliot's chagrin. Although I keep telling you, like by the end of this month, you're going to be doing like 200 a day and you're going to lap both of us. I got to tell you this morning, I was really not looking forward to it. After the 76th pushupup i was i was thinking i'm not gonna enjoy 200 a day of this so brody and i are just doing 80 a day to keep it consistent

elliot is following the app so by the end he's gonna be doing like 250 a day and his arms are gonna be like spaghetti it's gonna be like your arms are gonna feel like angel hair pasta is what it's gonna feel like it's always been my goal. I think I wrote that in my high school yearbook. Arms like angel hair pasta. Something I wanted to mention before we get to a couple of questions here. Kimberly Weiss is a assistant coach at Trinity College. She's a wonderful coach.

She's part of the Colorado Avalanche mentorship program as well. So she can pick the brain of Jared Bednar, real smart. Like she's going to do great things in hockey. And she already has her and I exchanged notes every now and then, and she submitted one for the thought line and I haven't been able to find an answer and it's becoming another white whale for me, Elliot. And it is this, she wants to know why the Chicago Blackhawks,ks like tell me this isn't right up my alley like her and i like our brains are symbiote on stuff like this why she's going to be a miserable failure after that last sentence yeah she might be i may have i may have doomed you kim um why are the

blackhawks not using clear sock tape for games she said she noticed it and went down a rabbit hole on their social media they use clear tape and practices but she says i don't recall seeing nhl players let it on a team using color tape on socks for games what's the deal now she did go on because she kind of went deep on this one too um to point out that there are some individual players whether it's anthony mantha william neilander david pasadak there are some that don, whether it's Anthony Mantha, William Nylander, David Pasterak, there are some that don't use a clear tape for games. And the Chicago Blackhawks themselves use white tape for games. Like, you know how I love stuff like this. Elliot, I have no answer. I've called people in Chicago. No answer. I've called people around the team.

No answer. I've called people to report on the team no answer i cannot find an answer other than this is the way we've always done it in chicago so i have a new white whale courtesy of kim weiss the assistant coach of trinity college thank you for that one kim now then elliot for you i know welcome to my. There's a peak inside my life right there. Okay. Larry from Los Angeles. Hi, I'm a millennial who grew up in Southern California. The only way this guy's name could be any more perfect would be Lounge Lizard Larry from Los Angeles. All right, let's go. All right. Lounge Lizard Larry from Los Angeles. It's a lot of L's. Hey Jelly D. Nice.

So I'm a millennial who grew up in Southern California and unfortunately didn't even know we had professional hockey teams until I was in my 20s. My dad's into baseball, doesn't speak English very well, so I don't think hockey at the time had the best outreach for his demographic. However, once I discovered that hockey wasn't just for Disney movies and I could learn and root for this sport and join the hockey community. I finally become a diehard fan and have avidly rooted for my kings for the last 15 years.

Well, you've seen Stanley Cups, my friend. You've seen Stanley Cups. Goes on to talk about finding the podcast during the pandemic, etc. Thank you for teaching me more about this sport and for being my surrogate hockey dads. Anywho, here's my question. about the sport and for being my surrogate hockey dads anywho here's my question when teams change and or fire coaches mid-season how do contract negotiations work i assume jim hiller would get a bump since he's sitting in the big chair now but how much leverage do coaches have when they are interim and what kind of terms go into these contracts thanks so much gang go kings go lounge

lizard larry from los angeles that's a it's actually a really good question for a lounge lizard it's it's an excellent question um if in hillar's situation where the kings announce he'll be the interim head coach for the rest of the year he will get a bump um you know the highest paid assistant coaches in the nhl as far as i can remember i'm doing this off the rest of the year he will get a bump um you know the highest paid assistant coaches in the nhl as far as i can remember i'm doing this off the top of my head scott stevens was very highly paid when he was an assistant coach in minnesota i think he was around 700 a year i believe john stevens at a couple of his stops was one of the highest paid assistant coaches um in the nhl when rick talk it there we go that's the one that's the one

yeah go ahead when rick talk it was a free agent a couple years ago the leaves tried to make him uh an assistant coach in toronto for a million a year they offered him around there it was it was about a million a year i believe i don't have it right in front of me so i'm going off the top of my head which is never bad but i think it was around a million a year and he turned it down and he went to Vancouver as the head coach, but the Leafs did do that. So like the average assistant coach is in the few hundred thousand dollar range. And there is a spectrum there. You know, if you're an associate coach, it tends to be a little bit higher. Scott Arneal i believe when he was with the rangers i think there was a time where he was the highest paid assistant coach in the league and he was associate coach and also it was new york so those high high paid

assistants tend to be somewhere between 500 000,000, that kind of area. So what they'll do with Hiller is, I don't know what he was making before. I assumed he was pretty well paid. He's been around a bit. He's got a good reputation. But he will get a bump. And usually it's a bump to pro-rated what the lowest end head coaches in the league would be.

So I don't know if he'd be at a million, but I think he would be. So I don't know if he'd be at a million, but I think he would be not far and he would get that prorated bump for the remaining games in the schedule. Now someone like John Hines, he comes in, he replaces Dean Evason, he got term. So he would get a contract more in line with an NHL head coach with term but hiller would probably go prorated rest of the season based on some of the lower end head coaches that generally tends to be what happens okay let me ask a follow-up on this one and we'll stick with the los angeles kings as well how would for people that may be unaware how would it work with dj smith so dj smith dismissed his head coach

of the ottawa senators goes to los angeles yeah take an assistant coaching job he still has term left on his ottawa deal how do those negotiations go it's it's pretty simple what would happen there is that uh first of all anything that dj sm Smith would do where he would get paid would be subtracted from his Ottawa salary unless he had some language in there protecting him. But in most cases, most cases, it's written in there. Let's just say, like, I know people who've come in to do TV and who've been let go or fired out of their jobs. And the team will say, OK, you can do it. But any money you make from television comes off what we owe you. That generally tends to happen.

Again, there are exceptions. But a lot of teams say, look, we'll give you permission to do it, but we're not paying you for that. So that does happen. So I think the way this would work is unless DJ Smith has specific language in his contract protecting that, Ottawa would give him a market rate for an assistant coach, especially one of his experience. Like the league says you can't just pay a guy $1. It has to be a fair number,

and that would be subtracted from what ottawa owes him so the senators would probably be very happy with dj going to get another job there have been teams that have tried to do that to see oh yes that does happen oh yeah's saying to themselves, hey, look, free coach. Yes. You can't just pay someone a dollar. And as you know, the league couldn't moderate this stuff. The league steps in, right? Like league steps in and says, hold on a second. No, this is market value.

This is what you need to pay this guy. Yeah. And now sometimes they will give a break to a team that's a high revenue team versus a lower revenue team. They'll say, you know, hey hey you've got to accept something different here but i will tell you this there was one time someone from the league heard us talking about this on the podcast and they say if this gets to the commissioner he's like really it's like when you leave your kids home with a babysitter and you're out for dinner and the babysitter has to call you because your kids

are misbehaving you're really mad at your kids so you don't want this to get to the commissioner is what i was told right uh all right yeah get off your wallet uh spend your communion money uh get rid of the alligator arms don't throw nickels around like manhole covers pay your coaches pay your coaches i'll tell you what happens too okay um and i believe betman has had to mediate in these situations before there have been situations where coaches have been fired and whether it was the circumstances or something there's a fight over how much they still have to be paid. And I know Bettman has had to mediate those before. Okay. Max in Mosinee, Wisconsin. I hope I'm pronouncing that right. I think it's Mosinee. He's a player on the Mosinee Paper Makers of the Great Lakes Hockey League. There you go.

There's your blog, Max. All right. Gentlemen and Elliot. Oh, I like them already. My wife and I were watching a game this season where the equipment manager was hovering his hand over the backup sticks of the players on the ice. I love that visual. My wife was fascinated by this and requested tickets to a local Milwaukee Admirals game near that end of the bench so she could watch this instead of the game. It is hypnotizing. You've seen it before, right? Where the trainer will wave his hand over the stick in case the stick breaks

and he's right there to grab it. It's awesome. She believes the equipment managers should have an ISO cam where we can watch some of the fine work they do. Amen. It is so cool watching that. I don't know why I'm so fascinated by it.

Can you mention this as some broadcast teams for me? This gives me an excuse not just to tell an interesting story and praise uh praise equipment managers but also in trainers but also elliot max and moise knee wisconsin here references the milwaukee admirals i don't know how much longer carl taylor is for the American League? He has done an exceptional. As we record this, that team is on a 12-game winning streak. Now, we're recording this part of the podcast Thursday afternoon.

12-game winning streak right now for Milwaukee, and they are tops. He's been excellent behind that bench. He has been very good. And they interviewed him last year for their job before they gave it to Brunette. But I had started to hear his name a bit more. There's, there's no question about that. He is on people's radars. I'm not going to argue with you about that at all.

Okay. Voicemail time. Let's get to Brianrian what's up boys brian from mitchell have to say thank you so much jeff for the howie moren's shout out from mitchell ontario love that yeah in here on first yeah i have two questions for you a couple weeks ago elliot talked about his favorite statistics that are never going to be touched i'm a baseball guy and i have to say the statistic that is never going to be touched is cy young with 749 complete games the next closest active

player is adam wainwright with 28 so that me thinking, what is your favorite stat that you love to spout out off the top of your head at the bar? If you're talking to somebody and you have a hockey stat that you have in the back of your head that you think is funny or coincidental, I'm just curious. What are those stats that you love to spout out? Love the pod boys and try the red. Whoa.

Didn't expect that one in there. Brian from Mitchell. Thanks for that one. I think Elliot, I'm not much of a stats person. I'm not much of a stats person. I'm not much of a numbers person. I'm more of a stories person. Do you have any stats that is one of your favorites?

I mean, you mentioned the Glenn Hall one from a couple of weeks ago, and that's the one that will never be touched, especially when you factor in his American Hockey League streak as well, and you put those two together and you say to yourself, my goodness, Mr. Hall, come up for a breath. But are there any, like, I've just got some stories and I'll share a couple of them here really quick. But do you have any stats that you just love dropping for Brian and Mitchell? Well, look, he's right, by the way, about that Cy Young.

That's a great, great stat. There was one for a long time. I't even know it's if it's a stat it's more of a trivia question but i i don't think i think it's now been changed but for a long time the trivia question was who was the last switch hitter to win the american league mvp award oh uh i don't know i have to go through i'm sure there's been another one since then. Who was it? But the answer was Vida Blue in 1971. Oakland A's. That's right.

And he was a pitcher, so nobody thought about it, right? So I always liked that one. Okay, let me jump in after Vida Blue here. You just get the hamster wheel in your brain going here because there's a few. And whenever I hear someone say three words I always perk up you know what those words are Elliot what's that I'm a traditionalist whenever we're talking about progress in hockey or doing something different someone will always

say well you know what I'm a traditionalist so blah blah blah blah blah blah to which I always come back with a couple that I really enjoy, which is, well, if you're a traditionalist, then you want face-offs done differently. The way that face-offs were created when the game first started to be played in a significant way, face-offs started with the puck on the ice. I've talked about this before with you. It kind of makes a lot more sense in a lot of ways. I know the drop is fun and we all dig it, but face-offs started with the puck already on the ice. I've talked about this before with you. It kind of makes a lot more sense in a lot of ways. I know the drop is fun and we all dig it, but face-off started with the puck already on the ice and the official would stand between the two players and would say something along the lines of play or start or go or something like that. The problem was officials were getting their shins and kneecaps banged in and bashed in by the players. So there was an official by the name of Fred Waghorn who came up with the idea of the puck drop. And it wasn't to do with like to make the face-off more fair. It was just a way to save official shins.

So whenever I hear I'm a traditionalist, I say, okay, well, let's go back to the beginning then if you're a traditionalist. And we'll start with face-offs with the puck on the ice. The other one that I love and I believed it when I read it, but it wasn't until I heard it on a video that I have that this story really warms me. In Canada, when – and this was all I believe in Nova Scotia is where this tradition started. Brawls were just insane and you could not stop them. There would be like police on the ice trying to separate people. And what they found was the only way to get players to stop fighting in Canada was to play God Save the Queen. Which at that point, the rule of the land was...

It's like Slapshot. I'm not in the three, you guys. You put one thing, you're out of this game. I run a clean game here. I have any trouble, I'll suspend you. I'm letting you have the song. Yeah. Elliot, that's where that's from.

I'm convinced that's where that's from. When you heard God Save the Queen, you had to stop whatever you were doing, whether you were walking down the street, whether you were having lunch, whether you were fighting at a hockey game, and you would have to stop doing what you're doing and stand at attention for the entirety of the song. And I remember reading this like years and years ago. I thought, okay, well, that's interesting.

And then I went back and watched a video of the 1965 Memorial Cup final between Edmonton and Niagara Falls. And there's a huge brawl and cops are hitting the ice. And at the old Edmonton Gardens in the background, Elliot, sure enough, they start playing God Save the Queen to try to get the players to stop fighting. They don't, but there it is playing in the background.

And it is one of the warmest hockey moments I've ever had. I'm like, wow, that's a real story. In Canada, they used to have to do that to get players to stop. And one more, one more quickie. This proves that once upon a time, the NHL was actually a very creative force on the ice because what the NHL used to have, and we talked a couple of weeks ago

about players freezing the puck on the boards and how boring that was and how really it should be a delay of game penalty. Well, what the NHL would do for that, they experimented with in pre, I think it was just in pre-seasons though. What they did is they had something called the free face-off.

And what would happen is if you were guilty of freezing the puck in your own zone to get a whistle, the other team would get a free face-off. I'm dying to see video of this, by the way. I've never found it. The free face-off was the other team wouldn see video of this, by the way. I've never found it. The free face-off was the other team wouldn't be on the ice and the offensive player would get to

take a draw, like take the puck at the face-off dot and could either skate outside of the face-off circle and take a shot or could grab the puck and pass it to any of his teammates who are lined up outside of the face-off circle for a shot. They also had something called the free shot,

which was if you were guilty of that infraction of delay of game with your skates, you would get a free shot at whichever side the infraction occurred. They would put a puck at the face-off dot, and you could take a wrist shot, slap shot, backhand, whatever you choose on the goalie. But it had to be from the face-off dot. Only one player ever scored. It was a guy by the name of Kelly Pratt for the Pittsburgh Penguins. Scored the only free shot on New York Islanders netminder Billy Smith.

This would have been 1974. It was the only goal Kelly Pratt ever scored in the NHL. I think he only played like 15 games. But it didn't count in his stats because it was preseason. He later went on to play in the NHL. I think he only played like 15 games, but it didn't count in his stats because it was preseason. He later went on to play in the WHA, but Kelly Pratt of the Pittsburgh Penguins scored the only free shot goal

in the history of the NHL. Those are some of my favorite stories when you're sitting around the bar to get the juices flowing. And it always, Elliot, it always starts with, well, I'm a traditionalist. I love to come in with some of those stories.

You know who I really feel badly for? Claire? Well, that, her too, yes. But Dom has to edit that. Like, Dom, how long is that going to take you to edit? Long enough that it'll be a minor inconvenience. Don't touch a thing, Dom. It's all genius and touched by the divine.

Oh, my God. Yeah. Holy smokes. Elliot, Elliot, I am an artist. Not even the players who played in that era knew as much about that face-off as you did. So, see, I don't consider these to be words. I look at them as sound shapes as an artist, Elliot.

You just use words. I use sound shapes as an artist elliot you just use words i use sound shapes elliot yes evidently well those are some of the ugliest sound shapes i've ever heard okay we'll finish up with ryan uh good day dom jeff elliot faithful lister you guys do a great job to the point i wish there were more podcasts for per week you're killing us ryan you're killing us uh you guys spark oh you like this elliot you guys sparked me to join the push-up challenge for february to achieve 2 000 by month's end with my weight gain maybe we call this attempt to get in shape quote find the ribs that's good that's very good okay it's really really good okay so here's this question i have a question for you in regard to puck possession

because it has come up a few times recently. I've tried to look it up, but with no luck. When a player has the puck in their feet, even if they're not touching it, does that count as having possession? By that, I don't mean sliding past them through their feet, but actually within the possibility of controlling it. We've had players with the puck in this position

get body checked hard with no penalty because technically had possession by some calls and then the opposite with the same puck in feet situation but awarding a penalty because the argument is the player did not touch the puck so it did not have possession i'm wondering which it should be another knowledge attempt to make me look a little bit wiser again so this is actually a good question because i think in a lot of ways it depends on the referee like some referees will say if you touch the puck uh you don't that's enough like that blows the play dead but i have seen you we've all seen plays where maybe it hits someone and they don't

control and they say well you didn't have control and i think i do think there has been a one referee told me a couple years ago that there has been more of an effort to go to control as opposed to just touch so i think like if a player was to if it like just hit your skate i don't think they would blow it dead as much anymore but if you made a play with your foot or something like that i think you could see more of a chance of it getting blown dead the the way that it's been described to me is for the if you're if you have the puck in your feet for the purposes of things like offside or delayed penalty, it's not considered possession,

but for the purposes of being eligible to get hit, it is considered possession. Yeah, that's fair. Does that sound fair? That's the way it's always been described to me. Yes. All right. We agree on one thing and we agree on two things.

This is a wonderful segment. Thanks so much for contributing. 32 thoughts at sportsnet.ca. 1-833-311-323 contributing. 32 thoughts at sportsnet.ca. 1-833-311-3232. 32 thoughts at sportsnet.ca. 1-833-311-3232. The Montana's Thought Line, Montana's Barbecue and Bar,

Canada's home for barbecue. Mitch Marner of the Toronto Maple Leafs joins us next. You know, one of the great things about All-Star Weekend in Toronto was Elliot and I last Friday had a chance to sit down with a number of players, and also, as you heard last podcast, coaches. It was great having a catch up with both Rick Bonas and Rick Tockett and loved interviewing them at the same time. Today, another one of those interviews, Mitch Marner of the Toronto Maple Leafs.

And if you know anything about Toronto Sports Radio, it is always fertile ground talking about Mitch Marner. It is always fertile ground talking about Mitch Marner. And as he's matured through the Maple Leafs organization, he's turned into one of the better interviews of anybody on the team. Here's Mitch Marner on 32 Thoughts, the podcast. Enjoy. Mitch, on a scale of 1 to 10, how impressed are you watching Kelly work on his phone right now? That's what we were just saying. Yeah, I mean, walk in here, I hear a trade breakdown.

What do you want to handicap? Want to hand to the Jets? Yeah, it's, walk in here, I hear a trade breakdown. What do you want to handicap Monahan to the Jets? Yeah, it's a great trade. He's a great player. He's had success in playoffs as well. It's obviously a piece that was very helpful to any team. How much do you watch? Great players, and I know you love hockey.

How much do you watch other teams, and who do you watch? I'd say I more so watch after our games when I get home, just the Western kind of times. It's kind of hard to watch the Eastern teams a little more, obviously, with our schedule. So at the same time, I mean, I feel like our minds are always on hockey. So I try to get away from it as much as I can as well and kind of get my mind off it. You know, I try to play video games with my buddies from other places and connect with them and try to stay in touch with them as much as I can as well and kind of get my mind off it. You know, I try to play video games with my buddies from other places and connect with them and, you know, try to stay in touch with them as much as I can. So I'd say, you know, every odd night I'm watching hockey and, you know, trying to see. Maybe more to the end of the season, I'm watching a little more to see teams

and see what's going on. Is it hard to unplug? Like, is it hard to, like, just park it and I'm away from the rink and I'm not going to think about it? Yeah, I mean, I think I think it's easier now. Definitely was at the start, especially living downtown. You know, you never kind of get away from it just with the buzz going around, which is what you love and what you like to see. But definitely is a little hard sometimes to get your mind off it.

But I think, you know, that's why you need to have people around you and pieces around you to help you get off. And my wife's been amazing with that. And obviously my dog Zeus has been amazing with that too. So it's nice to just go home to that and, you know, kind of take your mind off things, go for a walk with the dog and just kind of enjoy outside and, you know, try to leave your phone and just get away from everything. What's your video game of choice now?

Call of Duty still. Still Call of Duty? Yeah. Massive Call of Duty guy. It's kind of always been that. Fortnite got in there for quite a bit, but the building now in there for quite a bit but the building now in fortnite has got a little too far advanced for my liking more of just i've always grown up a first person shooter kind of guy and um call of duty was always

a game growing up i played were you ever a gta guy a little bit yeah very excited about that gta6 the new game coming out yeah um it's been a long time. So, yeah, I'm sure we go through phases, me and all my buddies, we go through phases where we buy a game, play it for about a week and a half, and then decide to go right back to COD and get very mad at each other through a microphone that we're not playing good enough.

Are there NHL players in this, or are these friends from outside of hockey? A lot of guys I play with are friends from home. I talk to guys on our team about Call of Duty, but it seems like no one really plays. I play with Revo quite a bit after games because usually it's tough to go to sleep right after a hockey game.

Your mind and adrenaline are just rushing. So why not just keep the competitive edge going and go play Call of Duty for an hour and a half? So we do that sometimes. Who's better, you or Reeves? I am. Yeah, I am. I am. Yeah, I am.

I think Reevo would say the same. We played with him a couple times. He would agree. But Reevo's got a good game, too. He's a lot better than actually I thought he would be. So kudos to him. That is the most backhanded comment. No kidding. Yeah, yeah.

It really is. And it could come back to haunt me, especially with that man. But no, I mean mean just so he's got the two kids obviously the wife so I you know it's a couple guys that have kids it's usually hard for them to get away and play call of duty and um but he plays with his brother I play with my brother too so it's it's nice to kind of get on there and just relax and talk to my buddies that are also from out of town about just other things going on in their life and you know another way to kind of check out and get away from everything you know know, it's interesting. You mentioned sleep a couple of seconds ago.

And it's funny, we're having this conversation this morning about the nature of hockey and like, how do you get rest? Like, how do you get sleep? Like this is, this isn't like a football where you play one game a week and, you know, then, and then you recover for six days. Like you're always playing and these games are at night. And like you mentioned, like you're still wound up. There's a lot of adrenaline going still.

How do you do it? I'm sure by now you have your Mitch Marner formula for sleep. What is it? Yeah, I don't know. I mean, usually when I get home, I just try to get a tea, a chamomile tea or something like that, relax with that. Just get on the couch with my dog again and just relax with him and just try to mellow out as much as you can and just kind of uh you know rather put a tv show on that you like um a movie or something like that just kind of ease down and try to get in bed around one o'clock

ish or so and hopefully within that time frame of two ish or so be able to fall asleep but yeah it's it's harder some nights than others and um you know it's definitely a bit of a grind sometimes to get to sleep a lot of guys would say probably so we interviewed nate mckinnon a little while ago and the one thing that we heard about him was that his dog runs his life and it's apparently it's this cute little dog like you wouldn't imagine the guy who plays like nate mckinnon does has this kind of a dog that runs his life what kind of dog do you have and does he or she run yeah i got a chocolate lab named zeus so i mean i would say yeah he kind of runs our life uh he runs the show of the house of just doing whatever the heck he wants to do um but he's great also i mean uh he's

chocolate lab so he's very understanding with kind of commands and stuff going around, and he's also a very lazy lab, which is great. He's not afraid to just kind of hunker down and, you know, sleep until whatever time you want to sleep. That's kind of the nice thing about our off days is that's kind of the time to check back in on sleep schedules and sleep in a little bit because I don't got to wake up for kids or anything like that still. So he'll sleep right until whatever time we want to get up.

And that's a nice thing to have. We were talking with Nylander about how this year has kind of been weird for you guys. Like in the last few years, generally, you know where you are in January or February. You're in the playoffs. You kind of know who's around you. This year, it seems to have been much more of a roller coaster than we've been used to in Toronto. You agree or disagree?

Yeah, I mean, definitely. I mean, it's been a bit of a roller coaster of a season, ups and downs to it all. Some games where we've played really well, some games where it hasn't been particularly good. And I think that's just that's just the season. I mean, the grind of the season um it's always not going to be you know rainbows and butterflies it's going to be um some tough times in there and that's probably good you know you want those tough times to hit

you so the adversity comes and you can battle through that with one another um feel closer to one another about it um but I mean it also thinks it stands out for our division. Our division is very competitive. We got a lot of great teams in it. And, you know, it's good to see that. I mean, that's what you want. You want your division to be competitive and every point matters. So it's going to be an exciting second half. And, you know, we're excited for it and looking forward to it. Craziest game of the year. The one where you guys went into the room after the game and said i just cannot believe what we went through oh dang i mean the craziest one i've ever been a part of was that carolina game on christmas um i think that was the next gen game yeah that was a wild one that one uh that one i was talking about all christmas that was crazy i mean i remember uh slavin and i were talking about it at uh I don't I think it was

maybe the St. Louis All-Star game I think it was that year um just how crazy that game was to be a part of but this year um I mean obviously that Columbus game was a pretty big holy kind of crap moment um you know I think that's something I talk about a lot about our team is that uh we're not obviously you don't want to be in those moments you want to be down in those moments especially that score wise but we have faith in our team to you know come back in any kind of game and swing momentum back from our favor and obviously we didn't win that one but that was kind of one after when you go home and you're like kind of what the hell just happened moment but that was probably the one for me, I would say, yeah. It was a wild game.

Yeah. I want to ask you about skills coaches. Mm-hmm. And, like, you're one of the most highly skilled players in the game, period. And I always wonder, because I'm, you know, I'll follow skills coaches on Instagram and watch stuff. And I'll always say to myself, I wonder what someone like Mitch Marner

would think watching this. Like, how often do you find yourself, whether it's on Instagram, social media, somewhere, looking at skilled coaches and you say to yourself, what the hell are they doing? Can you pick out frauds? Yeah. I mean, I think with what technology is nowadays, obviously, it's a business thing now. I mean, you can make a lot of money on social media-wise. So that's what everyone's trying to do now.

I mean, they're trying to endorse their own brand, endorse what they do. But honestly, do you look at some of this stuff and go like, what's going on? Yeah, I mean, I definitely do, and I find it hilarious. I won't lie. I mean, I watch video. Yeah, I don't want to name who we've watched

on here um you can tell them what their name rhymes yeah exactly um if any of my teammates see this he'll definitely know who i'm talking about but um i think it was a lot more so during covid year there was a guy on instagram that we were sending his videos back and forth to one another and it was outrageous watching really oh yeah i think i know what you're talking about it's just like i don't i was just sitting i was like and then you see like i mean it's i'm putting this person on blast if they ever find out who it is but uh posted videos of himself and then you know you get the comments of people asking how is this guy not in the nhl you know he's doing all these things he He looks great. And it's like, well, obviously, you know,

there's a lot of other components that you have to work on and do and everything. But, I mean, at the same time, I give kudos to all these people. I mean, everyone's trying to make a name for themselves and grow a business. And in some way, somehow, I mean, I'm sure it is helping a lot of kids and helping people develop. But, yeah, I mean, for me, I've always been with one guy my whole life since I was four. His name is Rob DeVoe. And, um, he's been very obviously helpful in my career to make me who I am. And, and, um, I'm sure people, if they watched me when I was growing up,

when I was five or six doing some of the skills we were doing, they would also say, what the hell is this kid doing on the ice? Um, I know I've posted that one video of me on the jump board. That's something I've gone on for a long time in my life doing. And I remember when I got to the rink, saw all the guys are like, what the hell are you doing? Like,

this isn't a skill. This isn't anything. But I mean, again, it's all balanced coordination, everything like that. So, you know,

like I said, people are probably getting better from these videos, but at the same time watching it now where I am, it's pretty funny to see some of this stuff. A little cringe. Very cringe. A lot of cringe. Last one, they're announcing the World Cup today and likely the Olympics.

I know you and McKinnon have skated together before about the possibility of being a line mate with him. What would it like to plan a line with Nathan McKinnon, and how would Mitch Marner set him up for the gold medal winning goal um I mean first just to be named to the team would be amazing um just growing up always wanting to wear a Team Canada jersey wanting to represent your country I've been fortunate enough to do so in a couple events um it's always amazing so to you know obviously want to try to make the team first and then decide where where

you slot in on the lineup and wherever you slot in you're happy to be there you just want to help the team win so um obviously the dog's a special player he's uh he's an intense man i've been with him as we all know as we all know um yeah i mean i skated with him a little bit at the bio that bio steel camp a couple years ago remember I didn't make a play to him, and you would have thought it was the Olympic gold medal game, how he was talking to me on the bench. I was like, Nate, we're sitting here at this camp. It's like we're three weeks out from the season.

What do you want me to do? I'm trying to make a play myself. I'm open in the slot. You've got to find me. I'm like, okay. But no, it would be good. I mean, we're both competitive guys. We want to win.

Obviously, what he does with the puck, his speed and skill with it, finding open ice, making open ice plays. You know, for me, I'd just be trying to find him in open ice to get his feet going up ice and, you know, find him in areas where he could succeed. And he succeeds in a lot of them in the offensive zone. So just try to find him, put him in places to score goals and i don't know i mean if i had to pick it'd probably be like just give him the puck from the red line

and just let him do his thing and go 800 miles at a d-man and quickly make a move and you know go short side or something that's still a primary assist yeah exactly and what i just learned from this conversation is it's not n dog. It's the dog. Yeah. The dog, the dog. Yeah. Yeah.

This has been quite eyeopening. Mitch. Thanks so much for this. Good luck. Second half. Yes. Thank you. Thank you.

And there is Mitch Marner of the Toronto Maple Leafs. So you Instagram hockey trainers, beware. Marner has put you on watch and you could watch Mitch Marner and his Toronto Maple Leafs face off on Hockey Night in Canada Saturday against the Ottawa Senators. Also, you can see the Pittsburgh Penguins take on the Winnipeg Jets

and the late game sees Connor McDavid and the Edmonton Oilers take on the Los Angeles Kings. That's it from our little podcast corner. We'll join you again Monday morning for the next edition of 32 Thoughts, the podcast. Have a great hockey weekend and oh yeah that football thing too