32 Thoughts: The Podcast - The Important Thing Here Is That You Tried to Do the Wrong Thing

Episode Date: May 12, 2025

In this edition of 32 Thoughts, Justin Cuthbert, Kyle Bukauskas, and Elliotte Friedman begin the podcast by recapping a chippy Game 4 between the Florida Panthers and Toronto Maple Leafs. They delve into the Max Domi hit on Aleksander Barkov (11:45). Afterwards, they discuss the Stars-Jets series, with Dallas taking a 2-1 series lead on Sunday (18:02). The trio then talk about Game 3 between the Oilers and Golden Knights, which ended with a buzzer-beating game-winning goal (31:44). The Final Thought focuses on the Capitals and Hurricanes, where Carolina leads the series 2-1 after a 4-0 win on Saturday (38:45).The final segment covers news and notes from around the NHL. Kyle and Elliotte discuss the LA Kings' ongoing search for a new GM (45:53) and the Pittsburgh Penguins' search for a new head coach (47:28). Elliotte unpacks what is next for Peter Laviolette and Gerard Gallant (51:16), followed by an update on Rick Tocchet's search for his next job (52:49).Email the podcast at [e-mail] or call the Thought Line at 1-833-311-3232 and leave us a voicemail.This podcast was produced and mixed by Dominic Sramaty and hosted by Elliotte Friedman & Kyle Bukauskas.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates

The cable jumps, McMahon with a jump. Penalties coming up and with the clock running out, the action might continue here for a flag at the end of game four. Welcome to 32 Thoughts, the podcast presented by the GMC Sierra AT4X, Kyle Bacauskas, Elliot Friedman, Dom Schramatti, Justin Cuthbert. Plenty to discuss after another outstanding weekend in the Stanley Cup Playoffs. But first, it was an outstanding Mother's Day weekend in the Stanley Cup Playoffs. Guys, I trust we all placed the necessary

calls, purchased the right items, and struck the required balance on a work night. I'm still alive, so yes. Here's a question. When your wife is expecting, how do you handle Mother's Day when the birth is still likely over a month away yet? I always deferred to Steph on this one, Kyle, and she said no Mother's Day until she was actually a mother. Okay. So, her rules.

You see, that's how I thought going in. Her rules. Until she said, well, I'm the mother of what's inside me right now growing every day, and I thought, shoot, you got a good point there. So I'm learning, I'm learning along as we go here, Justin, to answer the question. It's almost like a free roll at the table.

The pressure's not necessarily there, but a nice gesture would not hurt. Yes, the pressure isn't there, but still an opportunity to disappoint, and I think I found a way, gentlemen. I'm proud of you, Kyle. Yes, that's what I need. That is the hype man I need.

That is one of the great lines from the old TV show, Cheers, Carla telling Sam, the important thing here, Sam, is that you try to do the wrong thing. Yes. And I'm just grateful that you're listening, Elliot. That's right. I heard on Sunday you don't often do that.

I completely missed. You know what I was thinking of? So for those people who don't know what Kyle's talking about here, Ron said, what is Kyle's big line he always uses from Scarface? And I completely forgot because when I think about lines from Scarface, the number one thing that jumps out is, say hello to my little friend. But I knew that wasn't it. So I was grasping for the other one, and I just gave up.

That's good. He put you on the spot. That line. Justin, we got a lot to get to. Yeah, that line will work in June when Kyle becomes a father. Say hello to my little friend. That's good.

That's right. Very good. Very good. And with that, guys, let's go to the action round two of the Stanley Cup playoffs a reminder Sunday night fellas of What the Florida Panther fastball looks like pushed to the limit Friday night? The Panthers earned the chance to even their second round series with Toronto and with it submitted a complete performance Vintage even with memories of last season's March to the Stanley Cup

the Panthers. It's a great experience. It's a great performance. Vintage even with memories of last season's March to the Stanley Cup final still fresh in mind with Game five Wednesday. Both teams will have a chance for an extra day to mull over the game,

which will surely be more enjoyable as an experience for the Panthers lots to dive into Elliott. Let's start with you. What's the major talking point coming out of game four? The major talking point that most people are discussing is Max Domi's hit on Alexander Barkov. That's sort of the newsy social media thing that most people are jumping all over because it's the most emotional and it's the most feral. So that's what I think a lot of people are jumping on. For me, there's some other things.

Number one, where has Toronto's offense gone all of a sudden? Number two, uh-oh, Sergey Bobrovsky, even though they didn't have to count on him a lot in game number four, suddenly looks a lot more like himself. But I know to a lot of people out there, Justin and Kyle, they'll be talking about Domi and Barkov, and I see that dominated a lot of the postgame conversation, even though I don't think it's the biggest issue for

the eventual outcome of the series. A lot of Toronto's success in these playoffs has been predicated upon good discipline and that was not evident here in game four early on with all the penalties they took and then to bookend things at the final buzzer. As you say, the Domey hit on Barkov. I will say like Sunday night, this felt a lot more of what I anticipated going into this series, not Toronto getting shut out, of course, but I didn't have the score lines being 544354.

The first three games going in, I know Stollers gets hurt and that changed the dynamic a little bit, but Elliot, as you touched on, like Bobrovsky looked very ordinary. The first three games of this series and Toronto Friday night was one shot away in overtime from taking an absolute stranglehold on this thing the Panthers escape and Bobrovsky's like okay we got one I didn't feel the greatest and now you've got a chance to have a signature Bobrovsky night and that's what we've got here on Sunday in game four and suddenly Toronto comes back home with the series tied and this thing's now a best of three. Just a

great reminder of how quickly a series can change but at the same token, regardless of how we got here, I don't think many can be surprised that we're two all between these two teams headed back to TO. First of all, the Panthers are the champions for a reason. They weren't gonna go down easy. This wasn't gonna be a sweep. Even the people who predicted Toronto to win this series, and there were plenty, didn't predict them to win, I bet, in less than six games.

Most people, I think, if they predicted Toronto to win, they thought it was Toronto in six or Toronto in seven. And I always try to step back and remember that. The Maple Leafs aren't getting goals from their bottom six. It's not all on saying Matthews. Matthews is taking the heat right now because he's not producing. First of all, before I get into this with any more depth, Kyle, doesn't take the morning skate before game four. What do you think is going on here? What's your best guess?

Remember there was the off day, I believe before game five in the Ottawa series, it was a full skate. He didn't skate then, but then he was out the next morning for the optional and just did some work early. I think, look, we all know he's been managing things all season. He's missed time for a bit. There's other times towards the end of the regular season, Elliot member, there was a full day off and then a team morning skate the next morning. He wouldn't be out there for that, but played in the game. I believe this is just a continuation of all of that. The team made a concentrated effort as all the media is watching the skate start. And it's like, Oh, there's no 34.

There's no Austin Matthews to let everybody know, Hey, it's just a maintenance thing. No worries. He's going to play like they didn't even wait for Berube to get to the podium and address it there. So, and they're trying to quiet the alarm bells in that sense. But this has been a season long kind of journey from that standpoint. Elliot, don't you think of him managing his health and doing whatever he feels is necessary so that he can play in the games? But as time goes on here, the goals haven't totally fallen for him, though I still think he's managing to play some effective minutes.

But when the goals aren't going in, naturally people start to wonder. And remember too that dump in in the last round that he took off his hand and you saw he was icing it too. I mean, who knows if that's still a factor, but all these things start to add up at a certain point. I think what happens is when you start to lose or you have trouble scoring, the scrutiny becomes more intense. Like it's kind of like it's the it's the perfect storm for Toronto right now. Again, it's not a shocker that this is two-two

after four games, but you've gone from two-nothing to two-two, you now have two days off, and you're coming off a shutout, and Matthews hasn't scored. Like, for those of us who live in Toronto, or follow the Toronto Maple Leafs, you all know this is going, with two days off until the next game, right? So the focus is

When it was two nothing leaves and McMatthews isn't scoring nobody's really gonna worry about that as much But now it's two days off and it's two two now people are gonna worry about it more now Kelly showed how much Matthews is missing the net. I Now, Kelly showed how much Matthews is missing the net. I don't worry about that so much. In the post game, I compared it to Steve Nash leading the NBA in turnovers. I remember talking to him about it once and he says, I've got the ball in my hands probably more than anybody in the league. Of course, I'm going to have a lot of turnovers.

That's just what you deal with for his genius at his position. So I don't get fazed that Matthews is leading the playoffs in most Miss Nets. He's going to do that when he's shooting. But I will say this, Kyle, there have been some weird ones and I'm just wondering how injured he is in the sense that it's one of these things you kind of wonder about at the end of the year whenever that is you're gonna find out that this guy couldn't shoot the puck like he likes to yeah i mean you got to remember too like they scored 13 goals the first three games of this series so yeah i understand like it's all the timing of it right like the shutout comes that's what it is it's timing yes it is timing now it, right? Like the shutout comes. That's what it is. It's timing. Yes, it is timing.

Now it's two two again. And it's like, Whoa, whoa, whoa. I will say to Justin Ali, I thought game four, that was the biggest start of Joseph Wall's career to this point was game number four. I know it's going to go down as a loss. But that guy battled after a couple of shaky moments in in game three. Like if there's something from the Toronto's perspective that you're going to take from there, you feel really good about the effort you got from from your goaltender tonight.

And as recently as Saturday, the news from the team was Stollars isn't even on the ice yet. So I believe it's going to continue to be Wolves net here as we move forward. And for the Panthers, you know, like Elliot, we talked after the first two games, I thought Toronto was doing a pretty good job of beating them at their own game in some aspects. Paul Maurice pointed out second period of game three, thought that was the first time in this round they had looked like themselves.

That was a pretty close to 60 minute version of the best version of the Florida Panthers. One, I don't know if you guys caught this. So Maurice has said for years that Gustav Forsling is the most fit player on that team by a mile. That power play that Toronto had in the second where the first unit stayed out for the full two minutes that had him hemmed in for the entire time. Forsling was out there the entire two minutes of that. And then the puck goes the other

way and he like jumps up in the rush and nearly gets a scoring chance after two minutes of killing a penalty there. It was fascinating but they were full value where the Panthers here on Sunday. They were they were a lot better. So let's just talk about the end of the game there. The Domi hit on Barkov. It's not a good hit. I mean, everybody can see that. It's not the kind of hit that you want to see. I don't think it'll be...

I haven't been very good at predicting and not predicting suspensions here in the playoffs. I don't think that'll be a suspension, but we'll see what happens on Monday at a Department of Player Safety. I thought Blake Wheeler said it best on the panel after the game if the positions were reversed and Florida was losing that game, that's the kind of play they make. I compared the Panthers to the Detroit Pistons, the bad boys of the late 80s early 90s. That is not an insult. That is a compliment They won back-to-back NBA titles Bullying the NBA They basically said we're better than you were meaner than you were tougher than you and we're gonna commit so many fouls

knowing that they can't call all of them and When they lost they were the worst losers in the league. There's a lot of comparables there between the Panthers and the Pistons. That's why, like the Pistons, they're champions. And when they're losing, like you have seen over the years, they take a piece out of you. As we said in a previous podcast, they really ran roughshod over Tampa Bay in the first round. And I think some of Toronto's veteran guys were kind of like, you know what?

We've been getting beaten up this whole series or we've been getting pushed around this whole series. We're losing this game. We're playing the Panthers game with them. And I don't think you can do that all the time. The Panthers are just built to do that and the Maple Leafs aren't. But there are times you have to stand up for yourself and say, this isn't going to go only one way. And I think that even though, again, I don't like the hit,

I understand why it happened. I think that the teams like the Maple Leaf say There's only so much we can get bullied by the Panthers and we have to make them feel some of it, too I'm with the Elliott like I Understand why it happened. I am though a little bit surprised with the reaction to the hit. Like I feel like we're forgetting just a little bit because we haven't seen something truly bad happen in a while. How dangerous it is to hit someone from behind like that, two feet away from the boards.

Like I don't wanna wait for something bad to happen. And you know, there's a lot to talk about Sam Bennett and a forearm on Anthony Stolar. It's like if I compare those two incidents incidents Like it's not even close for me That's totally fair. I think that's totally fair for me I I haven't added sensitivity toward the goalies as I said that day I think an injury to a goalie can hurt a team unlike any other one You know Stollers was Toronto's best goalie,

Calvin Pickard was Edmonton's best goalie. I don't think Hurdles play was dirty but I think they're... I always have heightened sensitivity towards the goalies so that's why I tend to think of them in that way but Justin I completely... I think your opinion is an absolutely valid one. I should just say quickly, the best chirp I heard from the fan in the crowd on Sunday night was towards Joseph Wall, who again, I say battled and gave a really good performance here, but someone in the crowd yelled, Hey, Joseph, you're the backup to our old backup. And I thought that was pretty good. Hey, you I wanted to ask you something, where was your interview with AJ and Big Justice on Friday? You were all over me for that hey? You wanted me

to bring the boom. If the Rizzler had showed up would you have interviewed him? That would have been a game changer yes yeah. No we had talked about it but But anyway, it just So the Rizler, okay, AJ, big justice Don't make The bacoscas grade. Is that what we're learning here? No, no, no, no, you know There's always people in the building where you're debating. All right, do we try it? Do we not? It just didn't fit on friday night. Elliot just didn't fit

Okay, the boom didn't fit The boom didn't fit on Friday night, Elliot. Just didn't fit. Okay. The boom didn't fit. The boom didn't resonate. By the way, guys, before we move on, exact same shade of cream on the two suits you two wore tonight? I think his was darker. Yeah, what did you have, Frej? I couldn't even see. The one that I wore, I think, for Ottawa playoffs.

Oh, yes. Yes, yes, yes. Yeah, the one I have, it's like, it is a South Florida only at this point. That's the biggest fear. Select scenario for when it comes out of the closet. Coordinated outfits going in, like you guys aren't sitting on my couch. It was like Louis and Jack in Vegas, right? They had the light suits going together the one game yeah but no one ever sees those guys no yes the the booth on cams are a hotly contested topic here with our crew Elliot I will tell you I actually asked Chris and Craig if they bring one suit and just change. Like bring three shirts and three ties and they were both offended. Yeah. I simmer packs a big suitcase in the playoffs. As you know, he spends a lot. He's on the road for all

of it. Alright boys, let's go to the other game on Sunday. Dallas Stars took a 2-1 series lead over the Winnipeg Jets, winning the game 3- Sunday matinee 5-2. The score may not be reflective of a controversial ruling being sort of the difference in the game, but the Discourse Post game does center around the decision to uphold an Alex Petrovic goal that wouldn't have been the same without a skate boot to puck contact from the depth defenseman. You heard the ruling, you talked about it on the panel, Elliot. This was a convoluted one.

What's your take, what's your reasoning, what is the verdict after Petrovic's goal is the difference in many ways for Dallas? First of all, we talked about Petrovic on our previous pod. Like, what a story of perseverance. I was very happy for him personally. I completely understand why the Jets and their fans are furious. When I read the rule book on the play

and I went back and I double checked it, I said, there's no way this goal is going to count. So everybody there who was upset and angry about it, I get it. My initial reaction was zero chance that this is a goal. If you're a lawyer or you have spent any time in legal circles, there is one thing you know is truth. The longer a jury deliberates the more likely the less obvious thing is happening it's not as clear-cut as you thought if a jury deliberates longer so as that was going to six minutes seven minutes like if someone told me who was in the building that they were playing the song Freebird

while the review was going on, and they basically got all the way through it with the guitar solo, that is a long review. And it also leads to my alternate theory that the people doing the review just wanted to hear the songs. They just kept letting it play, because it is a great song.

We can't give a decision yet. The solo's coming. The solo's coming. We've got to let this play. So there's a few things here. Number one, even though the video room has the final say, I've heard they are really trying to let the on ice officials have a real say in the outcome. They want them to feel involved or empowered or whatever term you want to use. And I was told that the on ice officials didn't see it as a kicked puck. They said it was directed and not kicked. Now, Kevin attempted to give a physics lesson on air, which resulted in the DM I got from someone who claimed he is a physics professor who said that was the worst physics lesson he ever heard at any level. But, okay, I thought

it was a kick-puck, but the officials on ice were like no and the other thing here is they called it a goal So now under the Betman standard which I get reminded of from time to time is is the call dead bleeping wrong? Okay the second thing is and if you read the rules it says if a puck is kicked in, and if a puck is kicked and it deflects off the goalie, it's no goal. Basically they said that was not a deflection. Hellebuck knocked that into the net, or the word they used was propelled. He propelled that into the net.

It's kind of like the dry-cidal goal, the Riley-Smith goal at the end of Vegas-Edmonton game three, that dry-sidle knocked it into the net. And that's the call they made. I think this, I think at the end of the day, they don't want to overturn calls on the ice without good reason, and they want goals to stand I I really think that's what a lot of this comes down to the rule book says deflection They didn't feel this was a simple deflection They think that hella buck put it into the net. I also believe they don't want to overturn calls unless they get a high level of evidence that they have to.

And I really don't think they wanna take goals off the board unless they absolutely feel they have to. And that's why we ended up where they did. I get why Arneal and the Jets are their fans and their fans are angry if I was had what any one of those group of people I would have been furious to But I think what it came down to was they did not think believe that was a simple deflection It was more than that so they let the goal count

As I was watching that Elliot the first few replays I'm like that needs to be a goal like just for the purpose of what we're seeing I'm like that should be a goal and then and then I go into the rule book and I see the line that you've referenced here and I went oh well maybe it's not going to count but But I think too, like that's the ultimate, like where it went off of his skate, regardless of if it's a kicking motion or a redirect, like it's not even going towards the net. It's going into the slot, but it's not going into the direction that if not touched or interfered with, that would be anywhere near the goal line at that point.

So it was all the movement of Hellebuck stick that put it behind the net in the end of the day. And I'm sorry, Jets fans. Trust me. And I echo your thoughts, Elliot. I understand the frustration, but because again, like if if I'm defending for the Jets there and he kicks it into the slot and then I wind up and I shoot it into my own net, I'm not going, well, hold on. He kicked it though, so it can't be, like it's an own goal effectively. I think that's ultimately where the officials got to. Take the kicking out of it. That was an own goal by Connor Halsluck.

All I ask from here on in is that if we see anything like that again, they make the same call. For sure. Because, like I'll say, I think what really drives people crazy is, so a couple nights ago in game three Florida, Toronto, Evan Rodriguez hits Tavares on the side of the head, right? And that's a penalty. Like, that's 100% a penalty. Doesn't get called.

Okay. The next night Evander Kane hits Alex Patrangelo in game three Vegas Edmonton, he doesn't hit him in the head. He hits him in the shoulder or the chest, whatever it was, and Patrangelo goes into the glass and they give Kane a penalty. And I'm like, okay, that's not a penalty, but they're sensitive because of what happened last night with Rodriguez and Tavares.

And then in game four, Kulikov hits Marner with the elbow in the head and there's no penalty. Like a very similar hit. That's the thing that makes people crazy, is the consistency. So I just hope from here on in, if we ever see this again, it's called the same way. Like that's, I think, what people want, is the consistency. Now there was another play in this game that had a lot of controversy,

and that was what happened at the end of the second period with Mason Marchman and the referee Graham skilliter Just before I get to that Justin is there anything you wanted to add on that goal or anything like that? No, I mean, I'm with Kyle like if I'm a fan I'm thinking they didn't want to rule on the actual kicking motion So they found a reason to uphold the original call and I think you know that goes into What both of you are saying in that okay There's not actually concrete evidence as to I mean

I know there's a rule book and I know there's been something that's been delivered here in terms of a Reasoning but it felt like they didn't want to decide whether or not that was a kick or not So there was another reason why it stood Fair enough. That's fair So there was another reason why it stood. Fair enough. That's fair. So Skilleter and Marchman. So earlier in the period, Marchman has a breakaway and he gets pulled down and he's mad.

And I understood. I thought there was a penalty there. But so then late in the second period, he gets, I don't know, I can't even remember. So please excuse me if I don't say it properly. I think he got slashed on the waist or wherever it was. It's been a long day. I forget the details. And he didn't get a call. And like, Marshman has a rep. Referees have told me about him before. He's been fined about for embellishment before. Like, he does have a rep. And he tapped Skilletor with his stick

and immediately when Kelly and the other guy saw it, they were like, oh boy, he's in trouble. So I checked after the game and it's rule 40, it's abusive officials, and it's up to the officials to make the determination Like they have to write a report postgame and if they put abusive officials in there, it's a big suspension Now again, I think the league leaves this up to the officials a lot to decide and They were told that skill at er didn't want to make a big deal of it. He didn't think it was anything major

And therefore he just said I I'm not going to file the report. So the NHL let it drop there. And there was an incident at the end of Edmonton, LA in the first round with about two minutes left in game six, where a linesman is kind of holding on to Warren Fogel. he slaps the arm down and Connor Brown is like pointing hey abusive officials abusive officials and that one went nowhere too so you know there's a lot of people looking at it and saying hey like why allow the precedents it's a slippery slope and yes it can be but in both of these cases the officials said there's no need to take these anywhere They weren't serious and they weren't problematic

Chris Rooney to at the end of was a game to Carolina, Washington Stankoven was making a beeline for McMichael and he tried to get in between the two of them and wore a bit of a Stankoven whack obviously accidentally he was trying to get McMichael and Rooney just got in the way, but you could tell he wasn't thrilled of that either. You know what, they also shot a puck at his feet in the warm-up in game three. That's right, 24 hours later.

That's right, he was the extra ref, so he has to stand in the penalty box during the warm-up to make sure nothing happens, and when he got out and he was walking off, I think he was mad they ruined his shoes shine or something like that. That's right. Got him cleaned up at Dulles International that morning.

Already scuffed. That's 20 bucks. That's right. Plus tip. Plus tip. And Chris, I hope you left a good tip. No cheap tips. You know, that was a good game, Dallas, Winnipeg.

Hellebock's got to win a game on the road. He just has to win a game. Again, I thought Blake was really interesting. He said, we talked about how game seven against St. Louis was the biggest game of his career. Blake actually said he thought that game three was the biggest game of his career against the Stars because he has to show we can win on the road. Well, he gets another opportunity. Game four, sooner or later, like I thought Hellebuck was a lot better.

The Rantanen won the fourth one. It was a brilliant goal again, but apparently there were some form things there. Like one of the goalie experts I reached out to said that there was something with that goal that he didn't like and we're gonna talk about it I'm gonna speak to him on Monday but generally I thought Hellebuck was a lot better he's just gonna break through and win a road game here yeah 0 for 4 on the road in these playoffs 0 and 8 dating back to previous postseason so it's been the bugaboo for Connor Hallebuck.

We all know and we all understand here moving forward for the Winnipeg Jets Goaltender. Just quickly on Randon, guys, there's not much more to say because he's been so transcendent, so brilliant in these playoffs. But it's been fun watching Pete DeBoer like discover the superstar player as we go in these playoffs to bore, like discover the superstar player as we go in these playoffs because it feels like he's got the sports car and he's figuring out that he can go an extra five clicks every single night with him. Yeah, he's not so concerned about the speed traps or the photo radar cameras or anything like that.

The thing to me that's interesting about Ranton and Justin is there's some guys who have to occupy the puck to beat you He can either occupy the puck or just go somewhere like the first game When he had the hat trick in game one of this series How much do you have the puck on a stick like barely any? Like he can have games where he's so quiet for 20 to 25 minutes and then all of a sudden he just kills you. I think we talked about this last pod. There are so many different ways that he can beat you.

It's wild watching too. Like Nazim Kadri tweeted about it on Sunday night. This is why you keep the big dogs or whatever it was he tweeted and It's it's always interesting when a player Weighs in like that. It's it's one thing for a fan or a media member to do it it's something else when a player does it it adds an extra level of gravitas and Very on brand that just a little dig in his old team along the way to yes for cat very on brand

nicely done Okay, guys, let's go to Edmonton and Vegas a stunning finish in Edmonton on Saturday night Oilers score late to both equalize and continue their pension for late game heroics It looks like games going to overtime for sure But William Carlson breaks in one on four, about 10 seconds left, heaves a pass into the middle of the ice. It finds another original misfit. Riley Smith, fake slap shot, cuts around,

throws it into the crease for Leon Dreisaitl, who tips it in with four tenths of a second remaining. The third go-ahead goal in playoff history scored with under a second left to go. It was the final moment on a no-good night for Dry Cytle. Lost to dig into this game as well, but life here for the Golden Knights after looking, well, sort of like the Oilers did early in round one.

It's kind of funny how you can score with four tens of a second left and it's only the third latest winner. It's crazy. I could have understand if- I'm in the wiggle latest winner. It's crazy. I could have understand if- I'm in the wiggle room there. I could understand if one of them beat you, but two, that's pretty amazing. I'm always amazed at how goal scorers know.

It reminded me of 2010, Patrick Kane in Philadelphia. Only three people on the ice knew that Patrick Kane scored that night him Michael Layton who was in goal and I think it was Braden Coburn who was the Philly defenseman who was right there like other guys didn't know they had no idea and last night there were a lot of people on the ice who didn't know, including the officials, but Riley Smith knew and William Carlson knew. They knew that puck was in. I wanted to shout out Calvin Pickard. It's pretty clear that he won game two, including making about four massive saves at the beginning

of overtime while he was far from healthy. Calvin Pickard, not only did he win six in a row. He battled He really battled and the last of those ones came when he was clearly hurt and uncomfortable We know he won't play Monday night. We'll see after that. I Actually have to say I understood I understood what Stuart Skinner was thinking when I watched his post game and he said I just wanted to force him out because I knew he didn't have a lot of time. Unfortunately if Dry Settle isn't unlucky that works. It was actually a very sound strategy but you know Vegas got the bounces and to be honest

they deserve to win that game. They were almost blown out of the building early Edmonton left them let them off the mat. They lost Mark Stone who could play game four and but Vegas just Stuck with it. They clogged up the middle. They made life hard on Edmonton They sucked the air out of the building and they found their way back Like if the others lose the series and nobody was predicting that they were gonna sweep Vegas in the first place, but that's a game you'll look back at and say, man, we had that, we had them on the ropes

and we let them up. Eichel to me has been phenomenal. Yes, he got undressed by McDavid in game two on the overtime winner. But wouldn't have. Yeah, everybody would have. But he had a short memory. He didn't let it affect him. And he played a great game in game number three.

I don't think anybody is surprised that that this is two one one way or the other. And, you know, Edmontonon's gonna have to be a lot better when the Golden Knights try to slow down the game on Monday night. I was thinking back Elliot and Justin to the conference final last year for Edmonton against Dallas they're down 2-1 in the series so many people are all over Darnell Nurse like he had become the lightning rod and the morning of game four Connor McDavid comes to his defense and just diffuses so much of what had been going on and then of course he ended up winning that game and the series and I'm

not suggesting there needs to be a repeat performance of that but naturally the way that game ended up there's more nervous feelings on the outside about having Stuart Skinner in goal. And I've said this before, I've got a lot of time for Stuart Skinner, the guy. But I just think within the confines of the Oilers room there in Roger's place, like, there's got to be that kind of mindset of like, we've got everybody in here. We just need to worry about ourselves. Not given as much time to what the feeling is on on the outside. Because he's seen it in the past with this team, like the way they go to bat for each

other in critical moments. It's it's led to some some pretty, you know, special bounce backs here and Skinner's fought it in the playoffs before in the past. But as you said, Elliot, you know, even though it was far from a perfect night from him, he did battle, he was in the fight there with his, his group. And I think for Edmonton going forward, knowing that you're running it back with, with Stuart here and in game number four, like that has to be the, the mentality of we're okay in here and

and setting the tone that way after a night that yeah it was a tough one to swallow with how it ended with point four left on the clock six and oh with Pickard oh and three now with Skinner Skinner as you mentioned Elliott playing game four it'll be interesting to see how the Oilers respond. The ending was similar to game one versus the Kings, right, is the shock. Philip De Nose scores the goal. It's shocking when you think you're clawed back, when you think you're going to overtime, when you think you're resetting with a different opportunity. Oilers were not able to rebound from that. They lose pretty decisively in game two versus LA.

The Oilers seem to be at their best when the knife is pressed against their neck and I'm not sure it is that yet but getting a win for Stu Skinner would be unbelievably huge for this team given as you mentioned Kyle where the conversation is. 100% they've got to win a game with him they need that breakthrough it's similar to what we just talked about Hellebuck on the road He's got to win on the road Skinner has just got to get a W doesn't matter where can be at home on the road or anywhere else You prefer to play a neutral site the moon a different galaxy needs a W Very quickly Elliott you mentioned mark stone could play

Yeah, they said he's day to day-day so and you know they said that Braden McNabb was day-to-day and he didn't even miss one game so I've I learn I adjust I don't like to see anybody hurt so maybe we see Mark Stone on Monday night. And he's seen a lot of McDavid that being Braden McNabb in this series. I'll give credit because you gave credit to Jack Eichel to Evan Bouchard on the ice for 80% of the Oilers five on five goals in the series and he's seen Jack Eichel most among Vegas forwards so Bouchard after a tough start to these playoffs has certainly rebounded. Let's go to the final thought brought to you

by GMC and for that Carolina and Washington a series perhaps trailing in the Department of Intrigue is this series Carolina now with a 2-1 series lead after holding serve in game three teams have combined for 11 goals in three games One single lead change and the name atop the marquee for this series Alexander Ovechkin has failed to register a point They say there's beauty in everything Elliott. Can you include in that this series? Yeah, this is the What would we call it the Zack Snyder Superman of the playoffs? I Hope I got this right. I can't decide I can't tell from all this stuff

That's all over my ex feed if Zack Snyder is good or bad. I mostly see bad So I'm gonna go with this is the Zack Snyder Superman of the second round of the playoffs Everybody's ripping it calling it boring as you said Justin Remember one man's trash is another man's treasure. What a smother job by Carolina in Game 3, especially after the first period. Like Washington didn't get much going. Someone sent me a stat that in Game 3, Carolina won 57% of the puck battles.

You are not going to win in the playoffs if you're winning four out of every 10 puck battles. You are just not going to do that. And I realized that the margins aren't that high, but 57-43, that's a lot to me. Puck battles are a 50-50 game and The best teams are always above 50 To me, it's one of the most important Non-recognized or not credited enough stats in Hockey puck battles one and if you're at 43%

You're simply not gonna win at this time of year. And I'm watching that too. Like, so Tom Wilson has a break, like less than 30 seconds into the game. And Frederick Anderson just calmly makes the save. And just like that's the first kind of early exhale for Carolina. It's funny, like on the TNT broadcast, I believe it was some point during the second period where the interview kind of early exhale for Carolina. It's funny like on the TNT broadcast, I believe it was some point during the second period where they interviewed Rod Brynnamore and he was like, we've got no energy going. Like he didn't like really anything at all

about how his team was playing. And then shortly after that, you know, Svechnikov scores and then they were off and running. I don't know if the players heard the interview that he gave or what, but the timing of it was quite curious. But that's, like as you say, the smothering. Like I remember game two in Washington, they were all over the Capitals again early, and finally towards the end of the first period, the Capitals got like 30 seconds of zone time

and Capital One Arena like came alive of like, oh my gosh, like we've actually got some sustained pressure here finally for the first time. Like the bar had been set so low for trying to get anything going for Washington and a lot of that was credit to how Carolina's been playing. So yeah, it's not dominating the headlines. It's not taking command of the marquee like some of the other ones here, but you know, for a Carolina team that maybe doesn't have the same level of game breakers as some of the other eight that still remain in the Stanley Cup playoff hunt here, the way they're playing is exactly how they have to play to continue to stay in the fight here.

And a healthy Frederick Anderson clearly is shown as a difference maker for them. You talked about Svechnikov, Elliott, about needing to have a big series. Like there he was getting things rolling again in game number three. So they put themselves here in a good spot. But Washington also, they've had the ability to have defined answers here.

I know the questions about Ovechkin hasn't got going. Still had four shots. I thought there, you know, he had chances, you know, maybe even though he's not quite at the same pace as he once was, but he still looked like a guy that, you know, at any moment he can be a real problem here for Carolina, but they've had an answer for him to this point. Yeah, Svechnikov, he had a great first round, he's continuing it again. I'll say the other thing about Carolina that really stands out to me about them is the teams that win have a look to them, long, lean, difficult to get through, set up a picket

fence. I still think two things. One, Anderson has to stay healthy, and we've already seen a point in these playoffs where he's been hurt, although it really wasn't his fault. It was contact, but still. And secondly, as you said, they don't have as many game breakers

as some of these other teams, but when it comes to how they play defense, they look like the kind of team that wins. They have that pedigree. Like I said, long, lean, there's always a body or a leg or an arm or a stick in your way. And that is how you win championships in this league. Still a long way to go. They've got to win ten more games but the way they defend, it's championship

level. Yeah offensively it's quantity though. They are hurricaning at a very high level averaging 41 more shot attempts per game than Washington if that's not Carolina I don't know what is and Freddie Anderson up to a 940 save percentage just nine goals allowed in seven games they are they're hitting all the hallmarks for a Rod Brendan Moore team at the moment that was the final thought brought to you by GMC guys we'll take a quick pause you two will wrap up the pod next with some news around the league.

All right, welcome back. Elliot, some other news around the league. Actually, before we get to that quickly, just wanted to point out, I'm sure you saw this, Elliot, Gavin McKenna's 54-game point streak CHL record came to an end on Sunday night, game two of the WHL Championship Series. Yup, Spokane got a split in the hat, but just wanted to acknowledge that. What a run for the kid that's still not draft eligible for another year. Wow. Thank you for bringing that up. That was an incredible accomplishment. I didn't realize it had ended and just wanted to say I'm really happy for the Lindstrom family

who we met last year at the draft. That was big for Kayden to come back and play. It had been a long wait for he and the other family members. He scored in game number two of that WHO final. Okay, speaking of the West, the LA Kings, Elliott and their search for a new general manager. Any updates on where things stand there? Like I said on Friday, I think Ken Holland's name is has become very prominent in that search. We'll see where this week takes us. Initially, I was under

the impression, I think a lot of people were under the impression, that Mark Bergerven would slide into that job. Now it appears much less likely and we'll see where this week takes us, but Holland's candidacy for this job is legitimate Wow, so how long like so he leaves the Oilers last summer Yeah, you for a second think that that would be it for for Holland because it wasn't too long afterwards He was doing some stuff with the league like he stayed very much involved like he was biding his time for the next opportunity. I think there was a point this year where it kind of sounded like he wanted one more shot at it.

Now it was gonna depend on how it would all work and structure and things like that, but, and I don't necessarily think this is gonna be a long-term deal, I'll be curious to see if this closes what the term of the deal is, but the Kings don't think they're that far away and that makes sense. Like I don't know if like a five or seven year rebuild makes sense for him, right? So the fact that the Kings believe want to contend, I think that makes a lot more sense for him.

Okay, the Pittsburgh Penguins in their search for a new head coach. It's an interesting time in that organization's existence. I mean, it's clear the direction that Kyle Dubas wants to go and take things, the longer play, and yet you've got some first ballot Hall of Famers still on the roster. So who are they looking for in terms of coach type? I was making some calls about this on the weekend and I had someone say to me they were kind of looking for the next Carberry but then someone else said to me I don't think that's the right way to put it. I

think it's very clear though whoever gets this job, they're going to have patience. It's a rebuild now. Kyle Dubas has said it's a rebuild. So there's not going to be immediate pressure to win right away like some of these other jobs. But you said it right. Whoever goes in there is going to be able to coach Crosby, is going to be able to coach Malkin, who's probably added into his last year, and LeTang, all of whom are going to the Hall of Fame. And because of Crosby's magic, you never count out the fact that maybe he drags this team farther than is expected.

You're going to have the patience of your general manager to say, you're going to be able to grow with the younger players of this group. You're going to be able to try some things here. So in this situation, you're going to need to handle the sunset of legacy players. Malkin looks like he's retiring after next year. Letang, however long he can still play, battling the injuries. And Crosby, even though I think people hope he never retires. You're going to need to handle the beginning

of the next wave of the team. You're going to have a commitment from your GM and ownership that yes this is a rebuild and you're going to have to be a very big part of creating something. And so I think there's there's a lot there in the sense that the expectation isn't going to be for you to win right away but to build with the recognition that you have a nuclear weapon there who might be able to drag you into the postseason and is going to be part of teaching those younger players how to win. What one of the members of the coaching fraternity said to me and this

is not a person who would be up for the job is that you're going to be able to experiment there. You're not going to be expected to deliver immediate results even though I'm sure someone like Crosby would like them, but you're going to be allowed to experiment. And I'm curious to see what they're going to look at for this because I've heard that there are some young coaches or maybe first time coaches that have a serious shot at this job. And what an opportunity that could be. Like you just think of if you're a young coach, maybe it's your first head coaching gig in the National Hockey League, the opportunity to learn from the legacy players that

still remain there and to not have the same pressure of you've got to win right away. And as you mentioned, the flexibility to start to try some things, man, it could be a breeding ground for a lot of development, even just on the coaching side, say nothing of where they hope to go with the players throughout the Long-term for that organization really true true All right a couple more things here Elliot as New York Rangers have moved on Mike Sullivan the new head coach there But in terms of the two previous bench bosses there, New York I mean you brought up Peter La Violette a a couple episodes ago, the fact that he still

very much wants another shot at coaching. Gerard Gallant, you can put him in that conversation as well. Yes, both of these coaches. And you're right, we did talk about LaViolette in one of the recent pods. I think it was last Friday, where basically he had indicated that he wanted the opportunity to show people that last year wasn't on him and it was bigger than just coaching and he would have the desire to prove it and show it and La Violette does have the reputation of the turnaround master. His teams in the first year do extremely well but

he's definitely got that mentality and the word on that is out there. But you know we talked about that on the pod, somebody reached out to me and said Gerard Galant is the same way. Gerard Galant interviewed in Toronto when Barube got the job, but that was more of a courtesy interview. That was always Barube's job to lose. I don't know if he's been in any of these particular interviews this year. I just don't know. But I have heard that he is eager to prove same thing.

That when he got let go with the Rangers, it wasn't only about him. And he wants an opportunity to show people that. And we'll see if he gets an opportunity to talk to only about him. And he wants an opportunity to show people that and we'll see if he gets an opportunity to talk to teams about that. I also heard a good line about Rick Tauket who was at your game on Sunday night. He was there with Wayne Gretzky. The line I heard on Tauket that made me laugh

is he's not interviewing with teams, he's interviewing teams. Basically he's interviewing them more than they're interviewing him. So I'm, I'm curious to see what's going to end up here. I, I think Seattle had a lot of interest in him. I'm not convinced that's going to happen. Um, I don't know about Philly.

Uh, I think he's very high on their list, but I'm just, I'm not sure what's going to happen there. You know, Boston, the one thing about Boston is, Tauke it sees himself as worth a certain market. We know that from his balance with Vancouver. Boston historically hasn't gone there. Like I think Vancouver's offer was in the fours. Boston historically hasn't gone there. Like I think Vancouver's offer was in the fours. Boston historically hasn't done that. So I don't know. I mean, it could work out.

I just don't know. But that's what someone said to me about Tuckett. Teams aren't interviewing him. He's interviewing them. Well, he's dusted off his TV role here the last little bit, Elliot. So that'll make sense. He's in interview mode not the one being interviewed. If you had a choice coach a team or do TV

what would you do? Well considering I do one of them though it can feel stressful at times I feel it would be nowhere near being the head coach of the National Hockey League franchise so I'll take my current gig. Thank you very much. What would you do? I would coach for one year, go 0-80-2 and then take my newfound knowledge back into television. Then I'd write a book.

0-80-2. Man oh man. I figure I could get teams to overtime twice. That's good. Speaking of overtime, Ali, before we go, we gotta shout out Catherine Dubois and the Montreal Victoire, 1533. Oh yes.

The fourth overtime on Sunday night, the longest game in PWHL history as they even their first round series against the Ottawa charge. Friend of the show, Aaron Ambrose, leading the way in terms of ice time that night. No surprise with old Aaron Lungs Ambrose. Let me guess, she played more than half the game. I saw the last I saw was north of 52 minutes. So not quite more than half, but a lot.

No surprise at all. Good on you, Aaron. I wouldn't expect anything different. Monday night, couple of game fours. First from Raleigh, North Carolina, seven Eastern on Sportsnet in Canada. You can see that one nationally. And then the late game 930 Eastern 730 Mountain Time on Sportsnet

and CBC game for from Edmonton the Golden Knights and the Oilers after that buzzer beating thriller on Saturday night at Rogers Place. Appreciate y'all tuning in taking an hour out of your day to listen to us. We will be back on Wednesday with more 32 thoughts the podcast talk to you then have a great start to the week.