32 Thoughts: The Podcast - Todd McLellan

Episode Date: December 14, 2022

Jeff and Elliotte sit down with the head coach of the L.A. Kings, Todd McLellan, to talk about the high scoring we've seen as of late, his theory on goaltending, how he keeps current, mixing in veterans and rookies, what he writes in his notebook, coaching in Detriot, interviewing with the San Jose Sharks, the difference between Pavel Datsyuk's blade and Leon Draisaitl's blade, and he shares some of his memories from the 2016 World Cup of Hockey.GET YOUR 32 THOUGHTS MERCH HEREThis podcast was produced and mixed by Amil Delic, and hosted by Jeff Marek and Elliotte Friedman.Email the podcast at [e-mail] or call The Thought Line at 1-833-311-3232 and leave us a voicemailThe views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Remember when Billy Ranford played, stand up, toe move, soccer goalie, whatever, all of a sudden the butterfly came in and then butterfly, and then you'd kick off the slide, the post and stuff like that. What's next? Because things are evolving with everything else, all the skill development, everything. Good Wednesday, everyone. Welcome to another 32 Thoughts interview podcast brought to you by the new GMC Sierra AT4X. Always thankful to our great sponsor, GMC Canada. We gave Jeff the day off because I thought anybody could do a short interview podcast introduction. However, it's taken me about nine takes to do this. So as much as it pains me

to admit this, Jeff, Amal really needs you. And before I actually introduce the guest, I do want to shout out a couple of listeners just got back from the Board of Governors meetings in Fort Lauderdale, Florida. And a couple of people came up to say hello. Paul Strong, who was our Air Canada pilot, going down on Sunday. And also met a nurse by the name of Bryn. I don't want to give much more information than that. And she said she's a big 32 Thoughts listener. And the nurses have done a ton of work the past couple of years. They've been the backbone, not just in Canada or the United States, but in a lot of places.

And the fact that Bryn said she loves hockey and loves listening to the pod, it's greatly appreciated considering everything she's had to do since the pandemic began and the other nurses have had to do since the pandemic began. So we want to thank Paul and Bryn. Our guest today is Todd McClellan, the head coach of the Los Angeles Kings. We sat down with him last Wednesday in Toronto, the night before the Kings played the Maple Leafs on their Eastern Road swing. And he's a good guest. We've been really happy with these conversations. More

importantly, many of you in the audience have indicated you've been really happy with these conversations. And we appreciate that. If you love him, we'll continue to bring them to you. And he tells some really good stories. He talks about the offensive explosion in the NHL. He's got a really good theory on goalies. And, you know, he talks about the Kings. He talks about the Oilers. He talks about San Jose.

And an interesting story that we've been tipped off about that he confirmed about what he did at the end of his job interview when he first was interviewed by the Sharks. So without further ado, here's Todd McClellan, the head coach of the Los Angeles Kings. Listen to 32 Thoughts, the podcast ad-free so much for joining us here today. One of the things that Elliot and I, a lot of people have been talking about this season, specifically in hockey, we've seen that no lead is sacred, plenty of lead changes, and plenty of comebacks.

You were involved in a 9-8 game with the Seattle Kraken. I know that brings back difficult memories. But do you have a theory as to why we're seeing this now? I mean, you have to watch the full three periods. As a fan, you have to watch the full three now. Well, first off, I think it's really good for the fans. Um,

for years we've been craving goals and excitement and we've got that in our game right now. Uh, you're not leaving the rink at, uh, at five, three and starting your car up because the game could change. So I think that's a really good thing for our game.

Why is it happening? One, I think that the players coming into the league now are so skill orientated, practiced skill coaches, uh, drilled into them, not just a single skill, but combination of skills. The older player never had that. So they're bringing that to, they have the courage to use it. Lacrosse move back in the day probably would have been a bench clearing brawl. Uh, now that doesn't happen and it's encouraged. There's a skill or an art to it and players are using it.

Team construction, I think, is really important too when it comes to that. You can go back 20 years where your fourth line and your third pair, if you will, were built dramatically different than they are now. It's really more about speed and skill and potential offense on those lines than it is about beating the you know what out of each other. There's still room for the policeman, but it used to be you'd have a car full of policemen, three

forwards and two defensemen, and that's how the game was. But I think the game now, it builds throughout the night and the pace stays high. The past, it built and then fell and then built and then fell. And that's perhaps why we're having what we're having. Also, you had a theory on the goaltending. I did.

I don't know if I'm correct and I don't want to. This podcast is not dealing facts. Oh, geez. We just throw opinions out there. That's why you two are the hosts. That's right. That's right. That's right. That's right. That's right. I like theories. I like theories. Well, and I'm certainly not correct

with it, but I think there's been so much advancement in player development and skill coaching at such a young age is the goaltending part of it keeping up? And I remember I used Billy Ranford as an example. When Billy Ranford played, he was a toe move and a stack pad save and those types of general movements in the net. And what changed? All of a sudden, the butterfly came in. And goaltenders went to a butterfly. They played certain angles.

Then they started to push off the posts. And we heard terms, you know, paddle down and reverse VH and all that type of stuff. Is that dated now? I don't know. What's coming next down the goaltender line? Is there a better way of defending these skilled players? Is there a better way of placing your defensemen in situations to defend against it? I'm not sure we're at that point yet. And many would say, why do you want to get to that point? We'll be back down to the 3-1 game. But that's my theory on goaltending. I don't know if it's correct or not.

The thing is, though, even if the goaltenders change, Todd, I don't think we're ever going back to 3-1 games. And you can tell me if my theory is wrong, and that is that you can't defend the same way you used to there was the there was the obstruction crackdown then there was the cross-checking crackdown then there was a slashing crackdown it's not always perfect but the bottom line is i don't know if there's been a time in the last 30 years where the rule changes and the slimming of the goaltender equipment have gone to benefit offense and i don't think we're going back there. No, I would agree with you wholeheartedly that

every rule change we've had since I think the lockout in 05 is when it, or the work stoppage, pardon me, in 05 was a significant moment in hockey. I remember, I think it was Brendan Shanahan set up some rendezvous points with different players, different people in the league, and it was, okay, let's make this game better. Rule changes were made. Since that day, I think just about

every rule change was one, either made to protect players, which should be enforced and in play, or two, to create offense. And that's the way our game has gone. And over time, you should see the results of it. Young players now, players that have played Peewee, Bantam, Midget, Bedard in the Western Hockey League, he doesn't know any other way. He only knows how to play the way he's playing right now. And the other analogy I use with rule changes is, if you remember, probably 15 years ago, there was checking from behind. We used to put these little stop signs on the back of P week players and Bantam players. My sons were playing at that point and it was

an issue. We rarely hear about it anymore, or maybe I don't cause I'm not in minor hockey anymore, but we rarely hear about it. It's because these young players have grown up with the rule. It's common to them. They haven't had to change along the way.

And how does that fit what's going on in offense and that type of stuff is the players grew up a certain way. They only know that way. They don't know hooking. They don't know holding. They don't know a skating screen. They don't know the mauling part of the way

the game used to be played net front. We're calling more cross-checking. We're limiting how much goaltenders can play the puck outside the crease, Marty Brodeur. So the game has been geared towards offense for many years and kids are growing up with that in mind. And again, I go back to the courage they have. So what are video sessions then like with you?

If our definition of what a good goal versus what a bad goal is, like how much do you calibrate your expectations for your players? You know what I mean? It's a really good question because we have structure in our team and we'll hold our players accountable based on the structure but not necessarily the mistake within the structure.

So we want to be in a certain position at a certain time. We want to steer the puck to a certain point. But if Connor McDavid comes down and puts it between your feet or attacks your triangle and he's going 100 miles an hour and he cuts lateral and he makes a move back against the grain. Pretty hard to defend that as a coach or as a player.

So we focus on the structure. Where can we place players to be effective both offensively and defensively? And the other thing that's changed immensely for me, I believe, is catching players doing things right. Coaches have always been repairmen. We open up the hood of a car, even if it's running good, we're going to tinker around with it.

Not so much anymore. We fine tune things, I think, a little bit. We catch guys doing things that maybe they wouldn't have tried before. Hey, that's a good job. It looked really good. Next time, try it, but maybe try it at this moment. Not with a 2-1 lead, but maybe if we're trailing 2-1, it would be a better thing.

So we're catching players doing things right more often and maybe encouraging more. That kind of takes me to where I was going to take it. Your first head coaching job, I think, was 14 years ago. Oh, boy. Yeah. So as you talk about the young players now, they've grown up with a different set of rules

than those players, Dan. But how are they different as people? How do approach them how do you discipline them how do you get your message across and that's i i always answered this question seven eight years ago by saying listen i've got two boys they're completely different but the one thing they do for me every day is keep me current and i knew what was going on with phones I knew what was going on with phones. I knew what was going on with social media. I knew the trends at the school. I hear guys using words that I don't even know what they mean.

You know, bar down used to mean something when Tyson and Kill, my boys were playing hockey. Now they've got different lingo for that. And I'm not so current anymore. But to your question, I don't believe there's no I in team, put it that way. I think there's 23 I's and they've got to fit your team. And if you approach them that way, you give them the self-satisfaction and the recognition that they're their own individual entity and they fit the group. Now there's give and take with that

coach and player. But I think each of them want to get in the car when they leave for the rink and they think about themselves, which is okay as long as we admit it. They want to score, but they also want to win the game.

But they think about scoring a goal. I was lucky enough to coach Derek Bugard and I always use him as an example. I think Boogie got in the car and said, I want to score tonight. And there's nothing wrong with that, but he was probably never really given a chance by me or many other coaches to do it. But in his mind, he wanted to score. He thought about himself first that way. I think a lot of players do that. And if we, as coaches recognize that and, um, understand it and manage it and deal with players that way, they may be more receptive to what we're

trying to get across to them. You used to go to the coach's office, even when I started Detroit with Mike Babcock, you'd go into those situations, nervous, tense. It's almost like you were going to the principal's office. We're trying to change that. We don't want players to feel nervous and tense when they come into our environment. So again, catch them doing things well. Hey, Victor Arvidsson, we've asked you to do these things for the last three games. Come on in. And it used to be, oh no, now I'm in trouble. Now we want him to come in and show him, hey, you're doing things right.

We asked you to do it right. He feels good about that. And especially with the younger players. They're dealing with a lot of things in their lives, a lot of stress. This didn't happen 20 years ago. Social media wasn't as prevalent. Publishing salaries, money, all the things they have to deal with in their world is different than it was 20 years ago. And we have to recognize that and understand it. You know, it's interesting you say that because I think there was always pressure and like I'm 52, Jeff's same age. You're a little bit older, not much. I just look a lot older.

But like we always had to deal with pressures, but I don't think we deal like pressures with these kids do now because everything is so out there. But you have a team where you've got Anza Kopitar, Drew Doughty, and Dustin Brown until last year, and you've got a ton of prospects. You've got a ton of kids who are pushing. And I wonder what that must be like that you've got these accomplished, older elder statesmen and these young kids who want their jobs so bad.

Well, we feel lucky to have both. One leads, the other follows. And sometimes it's upside down. Sometimes the kids are leading and the older guys have to follow. It's just not natural for age to take charge anymore. But Kopi, Quickie, Drew Dowdy, and we can include Brownie from last year, did an incredible job and they continue to do incredible job because they've learned how to do it for a long time. They have deposits in their bank account, if you will, forget the money, but their time, their effort, their energy,

their wins, their losses, their practice habits. And they continue to bring that even out at 1,200 games. So now we bring Brent Clark or Quentin Byfield or any of our young players in. They should be like sponges, and they are. They should take it all in. They should be able to observe. But the difference now is those kids have enough courage to ask questions.

It's always the worst thing in the world for a coach to say when I played, but back in the day when I played, I didn't have the courage to ask my older teammates, Hey, what was it like? What, what am I supposed to do? I just watched and shut my mouth. Players have the courage now to ask those questions. So it's a great mix for us in LA. We think the older players are leading the right way and showing them what to do. We believe the young players have enough courage to ask questions and to react to what's going on around them. But it works the other way sometimes too, because Kopi seeing some of the younger players and Drew seeing some of the younger players doing some things and they're going, hmm, I should add that to my game. So it's twofold.

It works back and forth. Let me ask about Brent Clark. From a coach's point of view, can you walk us through his season? Now he's off to the world juniors now. Can you walk us through maybe a mild surprise, maybe a big surprise, makes a Los Angeles Kings, plays some, doesn't play, stops playing, conditioning, stand off to the world juniors. From your point of view, can you walk us through what we've seen so far? Certainly can.

Brent was drafted. Obviously, we hear a little bit about him. And I, as a coach, don't always like to hear a lot of things. I'd like to see them and develop my own opinion. Obviously, when we pick a player, when we draft them that high, we like them or we wouldn't have picked them. So you're going to hear a lot of really good

things and there's a lot of really good things to say about Brent. But we kept an open book when it came to training camp. We wanted to see what would happen. We wanted to see how he'd carry himself, perform in practice, perform in games. Of course, that's a natural thing.

But how is he going to fit in around the group? Is, is the group accepting of him or is he not quite ready maturity wise? So we, we had observations on him in, in every different point. Passed all those tests, got into exhibition season, started to play and played really well. So then it just grew from there. Open the season. We have some players, Drew Dowdy, Sean Walker, individuals that were injured for quite a while last year, and we're trying to

incorporate an 18-year-old into our lineup. Not an easy thing to do, but he did a really good job. He played his eight or nine games, and then that's a critical point for most organizations to begin to make decisions. Yep. At that point, he came out of the lineup, not because of that 10th game. Uh, it was just time for him to come out. Uh, Trent Yanni, the defensive coach believes that players need to take a step back sometimes

young ones, especially on the blue line and just watch a game. We took him out. The team played pretty well, so we didn't make any changes, decided to send him down to the American League so he could keep his game going with a little bit of foresight into the World Junior Program. And obviously that's where we're at right now.

We're excited to see him go play there. From what I understand, they have, like every other year, a chance to be a very competitive team, and we think he can be a big part of it. We want to see him take his professionalism now that he's gained over the last three years and imply it there. He should be a leader.

He should be able to command some ice and have good vision during the games. But we did have the talk about going there and immersing himself as a junior player, not as an NHL player. And what can happen sometimes, at least in my experience, is that he's going to get asked a lot of questions

about Drew Dowdy and Ansi Kopitar. And it's really important he shares with the other players what's going on, but you have to be a member of Team Canada, not a member of LA Kings anymore. And we tried to share that with him. So he has a better chance of success with his new teammates than just telling stories. All right.

I want to ask you about some other kids in a minute, but first a couple of years ago when you were coaching San Jose, I met you after a game in Toronto and you were gracious enough to show me your notebook and you were gracious enough today to bring yours down with you. What's in your notebook? Can you share with the audience?

Like, what do you put in there? Well, first of all, people think that I'm crazy because I have a notebook. It's the, what is it, 2022 right now? You either have an iPad or a phone, and I have a phone, but my kids teach me how to use it. So I'm a little bit behind times, but I make notes for myself.

I make notes for meetings that I may have with a player just so that I can refer back and say, Hey, you know what? On November 3rd, Drew Dowdy, we talked about, uh, some of the great breakout plays you were making and how your feet were, were getting you into that situation. So if it ever comes back and I have to meet with him again, I can just pull my book out. They're going, oh shit, he's got it again. Like, uh, the other thing we do is, is we do, I do my pre-scouts in here and do it by

hand. So, you know, on, on a game 11, we played in St. Louis on October 31st. So there, there are some key things that I think were important that night and I would jot them down. And then after the game review it, because we we've got so much going on in our world that you forget things yeah oh yeah and i think right for me i love to write because i remember better when i write yes and it's it's

just a way of going back and saving yourself some time being clear on what your message was that day and has it changed since then has our team team changed? Has their team changed? Obviously video is important and the way you deliver, but if you don't have the right information, you're lost. And this just helps me. And then I've got personal stuff in here. I've got my to-do list, my wife's list, all that type of stuff in there. But it's something that I learned with Mike Babcock, actually. He brought these books in, he threw them all to us one day and said, we're going to work on these. And inevitably everywhere I go, everybody seems to end up with these books. And there's a belief system in them.

A real good friend of mine, Rosemary Tobaldi with the San Jose Sharks, she's been there as Doug Wilson's assistant for 30 years. She's even using them now. So she'll send me a Christmas present. It could be a t-shirt, but one of these books inevitably shows up with it. So it's funny how it's spread, but that's how we live. Do you ever go back and look at previous books

or anything like that? I do. It's good to reminisce. And you find things that you did that you need now, yet you forgot about them. A team may be in a slump or you may be dealing with a player that's upset about something and you're going, geez, I had a player like this before.

Ah, how did I deal with it? And you can go back and look at your notes and say, you know, had a meeting, it went well. These are some of the cues that I used. And was it firm? Was it soft? So a lot of real good reference points that you can take from the past use now and hopefully use in the future too. When you look back Detroit specifically,

I mean, such marvelous players, Nick Lidstrom, Henrik Zetterberg, Pavel Datsik. I mean, it's, it's all-star, it's hall of fame, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. What were some of the things that you used then that you might not be able to do now? You know, early in the conversation we're talking about, like whenever I would watch, like whenever I'd watch that Red Wings team, one of the things I marveled at is how you guys, I don't know what the proper term is, casual picks, skating picks. You guys were brilliant. And it was just borderline enough that it wasn't

going to get called but you did it consistently enough that's like these guys are the masters and when you have players like that you can do it what kinds of things back then jeff that's a really good observation because we talked a lot about working into position um everybody thinks about what you're going to do when you have the puck but what how are you getting it and how do you work into position? Sometimes those skating picks or those, uh, those three extra strides sets you up. It's hard work, but it sets you up to go the other way. And that's where the offense would come from.

Right. I was responsible for the power play in Detroit in 05, 06. That was after the rule changes. We had over 500 power plays that year. So that year was so odd because everybody was getting used to don't hook, don't hold. Well, what's a penalty? What isn't? I think there was an exhibition game that we

played and it might be off by a little bit, but at least 60% of it, maybe 65% of it was all power play and penalty kill. Was Iserman steaming on the bench about this? No, Stevie was pretty good. He still got his power play time. So he was okay with the 500, the 500. I remember him saying the standard was unrealistic.

That's right. You know what? But he was at the back end of his career then. And as I mentioned earlier, he grew up only knowing it a certain way. Yeah. And for skilled players, you think of Medano and Iserman and those type of players, they had to play through that crap for their 20-year careers. Yeah.

And all of a sudden in Stevie's last year, the game opens up and he can't believe that these guys are getting to free wheel around without getting hooked and tugged. And so you could sense some of their frustrations, but, uh, you know, so the hooking, the holding, the skating picks, uh, I think power plays have completely changed from the day. There's similarities, but the attack points and how you open up ISIS is completely different. Uh, neutral zone play, uh, dramatically different,

you know, but those are the tactical parts. The big parts are the ones that we talked about, player relationship, motivation techniques, practice. We don't practice near as much. We used to get on the ice and practice for an hour. You almost set the timer and whatever we had to do, we didn't, used up our hour and then we went home. Now fatigue and rest, the balance of it goes to

rest all the time. And so we practiced here in Toronto, did it really quick. We were, I think we were on the ice for 25 minutes today, but we got what we needed. We think we're set up for tomorrow. Detroit, we probably got what we needed and we tried to squeeze a bit more out and all of a

sudden we're on the ice for 45 minutes to an hour. Practices have changed. Yeah. You know, the whole player treatment, not the players were treated poorly back then, but the days off and the science departments that are involved in the organizations, that's

completely different. Skill development. There was no such thing as skill development back then. You either had it or you didn't. Resources that are available to us as coaches, the video systems are remarkable now. They were good then, but they're remarkable now.

How fast we can get stuff. Analytics, stats. There's nothing that any organization goes without. It's just the good teams know how to use it. Can I ask you about the video system? Because I spoke to someone this morning about you who said Todd McClellan is the master of the VHS to VHS video review that there was no one better setting up a couple of

VCRs and VHS tape to VHS tape you had that in the American Hockey League with Houston you had that reputation well I think good coaches have great assistant coaches. So for me to sit here and take any type of credit for that would be, I'd be Pinocchio because I'm very poor when it comes to technology. I could see it, I could deliver it, I could pick what I wanted to use, but the actual pushing of the button, I may as well, I could pick what I wanted to use, but the actual pushing of the

button, I may as well thrown those machines out the window. We had really good assistant coaches. Matt Shaw, Cam Stewart, who I saw here, did an awful lot of work. Reards, Todd Reardon, who was a player assistant coach basically for us, did a lot of that work in Houston, Cleveland in the

IHL for me. And that's what's terrific about a coaching staff. Everybody has something to do. And at the end, we all own the, uh, the presentation and hopefully it works for, for everybody. Okay.

I want to go back to Detroit a second. You're a young guy. You're coming up. You've been in the american hockey league you've learned under jacques lemaire a little bit and you walk into your first power play meeting with steve eisman and nicholas needless to say i was awfully nervous but the one thing is if you're not prepared and you're nervous you're a failure if you're nervous, you're a failure. If you're prepared and you're nervous, you have a chance to succeed. So I had done some homework. I had put myself in those situations mentally about what it's going to feel like to be in there.

I tried to create some relationships with some of those guys, just have one ally before I would get into that room and then carry myself like I knew what I was doing. And it didn't take long. And if they know what you're talking about and they believe you can help them, the minor screw ups, the video that doesn't quite come out

right, they're okay with that. If they think opposite, if they think you're wasting their time and you don't know what you're talking about, those screw ups can cost you an awful lot. So I maybe tricked myself a little bit, gave myself some confidence, but there's no doubt I was nervous. I hadn't been around those people.

I didn't play very much, so I wasn't in the locker room with Steve Eiserman and Nick Lidstrom and even Chris Draper. We had a huge influence. Chelly was there still. But prepared enough. I had enough stops in coaching. I was prepared for that moment. Did they, I don't know if challenge is the right word,

but like those are all Hall of Famers and Draper was a hell of a player. Would they ever say, I don't like this or I disagree with this? They were very respectful. Remember back in those days, players just shut up and they played. But you'd hear about it after, kind of

individually walking down the hallway or on the ice. And I remember Chelly used to come in and I love Chris Chellius. He, he would come in and, and we'd have the old VHS tape machine in, in Detroit. And he had a power play montage of all his goals and he'd pop it in the machine and hit

play and we'd walk in and, and then he'd ask me out on the ice he said you see the video and i said yeah like the goalies pads were this big and they were brown horse hairs chelly like but but we had that candor we had that relationship um and then when he really got serious i said that's the head coach over there you're talking to the wrong guy go see him if you want to get the power play so i always had that out, but I know how that works now because there's guys knocking on my door wanting more ice time. So it's not easy.

I heard a great story about you. So you win the Stanley Cup with Detroit in 2008 as an assistant and you interview with San Jose as their, to be their head coach. And I heard two things about that interview. At the end, you said you wanted to go stand on the bench in San Jose and imagine yourself coaching the Sharks during a game.

And you also said you couldn't come home unless you had jerseys for your boys, Tyson or Kale. And I heard the Sharks love that you asked for those. Well, that's important to me. And I did that with all the teams that I've been with. Unfortunately, in our business, you never stay with one. But the standing on the bench part of it was important to me and similar to the walking into the room with Iserman.

And I needed to put myself in that situation. The next time I was going to be on that bench, if I got the job, was with 17,000 people in there and, uh, Joe Thornton and, and the whole crew, Patty Marlowe in front of me. And I wanted to be there and imagine what it would feel like so that I had some sense of what the stage was going to be like. And I thought that was really important for me as an individual. I didn't know how, what type of impact it would have on the Sharks or Doug Wilson or anything like that.

It wasn't for them. It was more for me. And then the Jersey thing that you, you don't get to be, you don't have longevity unless you have support. And that, that's the same, I'm sure at your house or Jeff, your place, like you need people that believe in you when a lot of others don't.

And I'm fortunate I have that. So with two boys and my wife and it's the only way you get through it. And it was important that they were part of it. Standing behind the, I'm interested that you mentioned standing behind the bench. So much of how you see the game is from that one fixed position.

I remember talking to scouts, I actually, it was about Drew Dowdy specifically about, you know, where the best view is to see a certain player. And one scout said to me, I was totally turned around on Drew Dowdy when I watched him from behind the net, behind the glass. And I watched and I saw what his options were. And I saw his decisions. Then I started to understand how great Drew Dowdy was.

If it's not behind the bench bench do you have like a place in your mind you think you know what maybe to appreciate the game a different way or appreciate a player a different way i need to be in this corner or behind the net and not standing right in this one fixed position on the bench and and my only real experiences with that is my oldest son tyson who still plays he's over in europe right now. When I was fired in Edmonton, I had a significant chunk of season left from basically December 1st to the end of the year. And he was playing college in Denver. So I got to go almost every weekend, wherever they played, I'd fly and go watch. And I'd walk into the rink and I'd go, holy, where am I going to watch this game from? And I want it to be by myself or my wife and I,

just away from people, just so we can enjoy it and focus on the game. But we picked a lot of different spots or perspectives. The best spot to watch it is still on the bench. And maybe that's because as coaches, we're trained to see things in that situation. But other than that, if I was a fan or if I was a manager, I would want to see my bench, our bench, the opposition's bench, I'd want to see interaction and emotion. So I would always sit facing our bench.

It's hard to pick up long areas along the boards when you're in the stand. So maybe somewhere in a corner is where I tended to go. But I can tell you when we go to training camp, the most confused person in training camp is me because there's 40 players on the ice. They're either wearing black or they're wearing white. I know all of them and I can't watch 40 players.

So I almost have to pick a team a day and just focus on that and then go back and watch a little bit of video. So we'll get in the meeting after and somebody will be going, boy, Gabe Velarde was really good. And I'm going, I didn't even see him today. I was watching the other team. Like it's so hard.

Everybody in the game sees it a little bit different. You watch from the press box. You watch scouts watch it in a rink in Kelowna or in Kamloops or they're watching it in a college arena, probably small European rinks. Like everybody sees it from a different perspective and a different height and a different pace. I think the good hockey people put it all together. They're able to see things and put it all together

and understand pace changes the closer you get to it. If you can involve, for a fan's perspective, if you're picking a seat, if you can involve as many of the senses you have in the game possible, I think it, it gives you a better chance at, at enjoying it. So obviously we're going to use our eyes, but

can you hear the players? You obviously can't taste it, but you can almost get a, an emotional attachment to it. You can smell it sometimes, believe it or not, not pleasant, but you can, you know, so as many, and you can't feel it unless you get a puck or something not, not pleasant, but you can, um, you know, so as many and you can't feel it unless you get a puck or something where it's cold, but you get, you get close.

If you're on the glass, you can feel the glass hit. And the closer you get, the more senses you, you involve in the, in your experience, the better off it is. So. Bigger character, Drew Doughty or Joe Thornton? Different, both big.

Jumbo was bold. He, he had, both big. Jumbo was bold. He had, when Jumbo was in the building, you knew he was there. Strong and confident. Drew, confidence comes out in a different way in his play. He's got this interesting giggle. You could hear him laughing in the background. You know, Drew's there.

Drew's our vocal leader. Between periods, you can count on it. When he's in the locker room there's something going to be said. Often a really good point that maybe we're not thinking about. He's into the game all the time. But both unreal talents, both Hall of Famers,

bold personalities. Okay. Weirder stick blade, Datsuk or Dreisaitl? Oh boy. They are similar and it's kind of ironic. Both long blades, both are very astute when it comes to the lie of their stick and how they're going to use their stick most of the time. I think Pavel Datsuk was crouched over a little bit more, a little more compact. Lien can get stiff and upright. So his lie is a little bit different.

Both outstanding on their backhand. So they didn't have major curve, but the length of the blade, the height of the blade, they get as much paddle as they possibly can versus some guys that have these little sticks and rarely have the puck. Well, I mean, did you ever like look at them

or talk to them and say, how do you use that? Like normally players will want a shorter blade, keep the puck in tight control. And these guys are out there using the puck on this. They have to feel comfortable with their, um, with their hands and the sense of who they are.

It's interesting because both are really special players now and they, they both have some of the same tendencies yet they're different, but they, they have tools. It's like a golfer, you know, why are you using this club and not that club? Right. They found something they liked and they just

went with it. And the last thing I was going to do, if you ever saw my stick, was going to go ask Pavel or Leon one that they should change or why are they using that? Just keep doing it. Whatever you want, we'll get you more. Edmonton, you had McDavid and Dreisaitl,

and I mean, that year in the playoffs, you beat San Jose, and that Anaheim team, that was a mean, tough team, and you gave them everything they could handle. What do you remember about coaching those guys, and why do you think it didn't take off then? Well, that year was a real good year for us.

Especially the second half of the year, we started to take off and evolve and guys found their niches. Our belief system grew. Playoffs arrived, we made them. And the one thing that I give the guys credit for in Edmonton, we hadn't made the playoffs in a long, long time.

That wasn't enough for them. And it was a sign of things to come for, I think Connor and Leon. It's not just enough in Edmonton to make the playoffs. You got to do something when you get there. And, uh, we were lucky enough to beat San Jose. They had some injury problems.

We took advantage of it. And then the series against Anaheim, uh, was, was I think Leon's coming out party. He was our leading scorer. I think in the playoffs that year, uh, I remember it being a heavy, hard series, a lot of penalties, a lot of nastiness. We had that series in our hands, but we gave it back and we weren't quite ready to take that, that secondary step to get to the third round. We didn't have enough experience. Uh, we gave up some leads, but what it also did was set up expectations for the following year. And we were very inexperienced in dealing with that. And it affected us greatly. Um, trying to use that lesson this year now in LA, obviously different pressures because of the communities, but trying to share that with

the team, that expectations after you make it grow immensely and some teams can handle it. Some teams can't. Someone said to me that the biggest problem at the time in Edmonton, and it's something that they had to fix was that there were too many voices. There were too many people who had opinions on

what should happen. Yeah. I don't know if that's the case. Um, it depends who you, you deem as people and voices and, and, and whatnot. Um, you know, they're, they're, uh, unreal organization ownership down. They've got tremendous people in their

organization. They've got, uh, uh, people they can, uh, lean on outside the organization that have a tremendous amount of hockey experience. But what you have is a, you know, a city, the northern part of the province that the people there, they grind it out every day. They go to work and they leave it on the table. And then they come back and everybody wants to help the team. And there's nothing wrong with that. A very passionate fan base, passionate alumni,

passionate management, passionate coaches, passionate players. Is there too much? I don't know if that's accurate or not, but we had all the resources we needed. We just didn't do enough with them. What was that series like for you last year when you played the Oilers?

What did you learn about your team? What did you learn about individual players? Because to be honest, for a lot of casual hockey fans that may not have watched a lot of Los Angeles Kings last season, their eyes were open to a lot of different players. And we are, that's what happens when you're in the Western Conference.

You play, we have a lot of games at 7.30 p.m. Pacific time. 10.30 out here, life is tough right now. Everybody's working and you got to get to bed. I understand that. So we're not a well-known entity. But the other thing is some of the names we had in our lineup because of injuries, people are going, I don't even know who these guys are. But we rallied around that.

We rallied around it early in the year when we lost all our defensemen. And it helped us because we knew we had to protect and isolate, or insulate, pardon me, our back end. And everybody committed to it. So a team commitment's pretty powerful. The players we brought up were ready, probably more ready than we knew. And the insulation of them helped us even more. What did we learn in the Edmonton series that we

can compete with them? That we perhaps had the right game plan for a lot of it, that if you didn't follow the game plan, they were going to score about eight against you because they did that once. So, and that's a sign of an inexperienced team a little bit is that you, uh, you can, you can have a game plan, you can stick to it.

As soon as it goes good, you want to stray and try something different. And that happened to us in that series. So maybe that was the biggest learning lesson for us coming out of it. One of the biggest disadvantages you have is that you have to play Connor McDavid all those times a year.

And when he's at that level, like he was in game six and seven, what do you say to your team? Like, what do you do with that? Well, we, we tried to plan for, for the two players, uh, but their, their team was deeper than that. And it still is.

They, they've got a real good hockey club. Now again, they're well coached, but we tried to plan for it. And, um, Connor's awfully good and he did take it up in the series but it didn't affect what our plan was from game one to game seven it happened in in what 12 days 13 days so we're not going to reinvent the wheel we just didn't quite get it done and he took it up a notch and and the difference between the two was enough for them to to get over the top i have a

couple more jeff first of all was any part of you when the kings offered you the job say did you say kings yuck this is counterintuitive to me well i know why you're saying that that's because of those shark days so um at outstanding rival rivalry uh games and series with uh with the kings when i was in san j. And the whole California thing was a rivalry. You just didn't play LA and San Jose rivalry. You had Anaheim in the mix. And those three teams were elite at that time and heavy and hard.

And the hockey was just a battle. But I think after you leave your first team, you quickly learn that this can happen again and again and again. And you're looking for the best opportunity with the best people possible to fit your needs as a coach or your wants as a coach in LA was that easily for me. So I was excited about going there and you quickly jump on the other side of

the fence when it comes to rivalries. And that's where we're at now. Okay. 2016. The only thing I didn't like about the world cup was that we didn't get Canada versus the young guns in the semifinals. I think those guys could have beaten Canada. Do you think you could have beaten Canada?

Well, of course. It's easy to say when you, when you'd never had the chance or anything, but no, it would have been, um, it would have been a monumental task for our players, uh, for two reasons. One, because I'm not sure we would have respected them more than, than maybe we should have. Uh, we got to that point because of lack of respect. Sometimes our guys just, those kids just went out and played. And they weren't too worried about results. They weren't too afraid of being embarrassed. They just played.

And whatever happened, happened. But I think if we would have played against Canada and they would have seen these names that they grew up idolizing and looked over and warm up, I'm not sure if that would have froze our team or not. We'll never know. I wish we could have found out. But when I reflect back on that, that was a really fun month. It was an opportunity I'm so fortunate that I had as an individual,

and I think each of those players as well. I can't tell you how many people run into me now and say, hey, I remember that team, and I've got a jersey. I've got buddies asking me, hey, do you have any old t-shirts or it won't exist anymore. And everybody's begging for that stuff. And then the players, they're running the league right now. They're running the hockey world, nevermind

the league and good for them. And there was some really remarkable players that didn't even get on that team. But yeah, that's where we're at. It just means we're six, I guess, eight years older now. And they're in their primes. That's the way it is. Let me finish with a follow-up then.

If your team, North America, would have taken on Team Canada, whoever wins, wins. I always wonder what the crowd would do. Because that team captured the imagination. That's what I think. They were cheering for you guys. But I don't know because that team captured the imagination of hockey. Yes.

Of the entire hockey world. But it's in Toronto. It's that logo. What do you think the crowd would have done with that? That's a really good question. I may be a little bit more with Elliot because I think that there's always a soft spot for the underdog. Yep.

And there is a soft spot for youth. Not all of those players were household names. Austin Matthews, yeah, you know what, he's supposed to be the first pick overall or was. Yep. He hadn't even played a game yet. So to, you know, to David and Goliath, like

there's probably more people cheering for David than they were for Goliath just because they wanted to, to help the little guy. And maybe that's where it would have gone. But boy, Canadian fans are, they get that, that maple leaf on their chest and it's hard to pull them away from it. So I don't know where it would have gone.

I think it would have been one of the most interesting crowds in the history of the game. Like the game itself would have been awesome, but a Canadian hockey fan cheering for another team against Canada. I honestly, I don't know. And I think hockey fan, Canadian hockey fans would have been really conflicted for all the

reasons you mentioned. Best of three. If I remember correctly. Well, the semifinal was one game, conflicted for all the reasons you mentioned. Best of three. If we, if I remember correctly. Well, the semifinal was one game, but if we're going to the finals. So, so if we would have got, I'm trying to think of, would have we met team Canada in the semifinal? Oh, okay.

So that's, cause I would have said if we would have met them in the finals, you could have picked team Canada for one night and team North America for the next, the hope for the third game. But obviously that wasn't going to happen. Your first NHL game was December 28th, 87. You scored. Your second NHL game was you had an assist.

So your first two games, you had a goal and assist. You played five career NHL games, which is a huge accomplishment. Did you think after those first two games that you were going to stay? And you were on a good team. You were the Islanders. Yeah, we, obviously, uh, I believed I could stay, but what I didn't understand, and maybe what a lot of players don't understand now,

and I get it, is that there's a whole business to it and contracts come into play and waivers come into play and, um, size of contract does. And the, the veteran that's out, isn't going to lose his spot to Todd McClellan, who was in Springfield. You know, we talked about this the other day. I, I, the longer I stayed in the Islanders organization, I wasn't there that long. The more I will look for another team to go play for, because when you're in the minors,

you always think you get screwed. It's just the way it is. I am better than that guy up there. And in some cases you are, but circumstances are keeping you out and they may not be in your control. But inevitably my mind started to think, well, I want to go play for Detroit or Toronto or Vancouver, whoever it was. I was in about my second or third year because I thought I was getting screwed.

Guys were going up. And now when I sit back and I think about it, what a terrible attitude I had. And I hope our players don't think that because your best chance to make it is with your first team because they really believe in you and they want to give you every opportunity

and you get second and third chances and they help you through everything. Now you start bouncing around from team to team. You're almost coming in to fill in and you, you've really got to catch somebody's eye earlier quickly and get up there. Because if you play your 40, 45 games in the American League, you're probably finishing the year there. And guess where you're going to your next team again. And you just keep bouncing bouncing so make it in diapers always say that's your first team make it there if you can that's a great saying well awesome make it in diapers i like that now this has been great thank you so much for stopping by thanks for having me fellas Thank you.