32 Thoughts: The Podcast - You Gotta Fight 4 Your Right to Face Off

Episode Date: February 17, 2025

In this edition of 32 Thoughts, Kyle Bukauskas and Elliotte Friedman look back at an electric tilt between Canada and USA in the 4 Nations Face-Off that featured three separate fights. Kyle and Elliotte point out how the timing of tournament has really worked in hockey's favour (16:55). Kyle talks about his run in with Georges St-Pierre and former Prime Minister Jean Chretien (19:39). Elliotte gives his appreciation for the countless listeners who were concerned with his chest (21:52) and the fellas dive into the Thomas Harley situation and how this funky roster rule has played out (29:17).  Elliotte highlights just how well the U.S. played defensively against Canada, and the pair talk about how Canada should adjust on Monday against Finland (37:46). The Final Thought focuses on Monday's nightcap between the USA and Sweden (49:34).Kyle and Elliotte answer your questions and respond to your voicemails in the Thought Line (55:20).In the final segment hear the full roundtable discussions between the Canadian coaches (1:23:14), followed by the American coaches (1:44:01). Email the podcast at [e-mail] or call the Thought Line at 1-833-311-3232 and leave us a voicemail.This podcast was produced and mixed by Dominic Sramaty and hosted by Elliotte Friedman & Kyle Bukauskas.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates

So that first period, he smacked me about eight times. And Amber, because he hasn't been missing too many of his quote unquote B12 shots lately, it hurts man. I didn't take any punches like any of those guys who fought, took punches, but Amber, man, he was pounding me. Welcome to 32 Thoughts, the podcast presented by the GMC Sierra 84X. Dom Shimati, Elliot Friedman, Kyle Bacoskis, Elliot, you and I have made our way to Boston along with the rest of our Sportsnet crew, and everybody that's covering this

Four Nations face off. Well, almost everybody. Travel was an absolute nightmare over the weekend. But we arrived in Beantown, bleary-eyed, sleep deprived, and electrified after what we saw on Saturday. The rivalry doubleheader that absolutely delivered. You had the column on Sportsnet.ca leading into the day that it was going to be one of them days. And somehow, despite all of the hype, all of the talk and expectation in so many ways, it surpassed them. Where do we begin? Kyle, that is a brilliantly written introduction, but here's where we're going to start.

Do you know who I feel sorry for, Kyle? Who? The Swedes and the Finns and you know why I feel sorry for them? Because nobody wants to see them after Monday. Everybody wants to see Canada and the USA round number two. I bet there's even people living in Sweden and Finland who want to see Canada and the USA Wow, now more time to hasty. Oh, I'm being hasty. I think everybody wants to see Canada in the USA Go at it one more time. We should just set the scenario off the top of the pod in case you're not familiar if Canada versus Finland ends in regulation

Whoever wins that game will face the United States for the championship on Thursday. The only way that Sweden can make the final is if they beat the US in regulation and the Canada-Finland game is decided in overtime or the shootout. Right. So again. At that point, it doesn't matter who of Canada or the shootout. Right. So again, at that point, it doesn't matter who of Canada or Finland wins

there. Right. Canada goes with a regulation win. Finland goes with a regulation win. If they go to overtime or a shootout, the only way the winner of that game will not make the final is if Sweden beats the US in regulation. So let's set that all out right there. Canada USA, as you said Kyle, so many times you go into a movie, this is supposed to be the movie of the year, your friends tell you, you have to watch this show on Prime or Netflix or whatever it is, and you watch it and you're disappointed. You think A, my friends have terrible taste, or B, that's nowhere near as good as they thought it was. Or they tell you, you've got to go to this restaurant. It is the best veal piccata you will ever have in your life.

And it's a let down. And then you eat it, and it tastes like cardboard. Yes. This was, this lived up to the hype, beyond the hype. This exceeded the hype. The funniest thing was the reaction on Sunday morning. We talked to some of the Finnish and Swedish players about it and you know, they were kind of laughing at it. And you know, Lester Reinon who plays with both Bennett and Matthew Kachuk, I asked him if he was surprised at what happened and he kind of laughed and said no and Matt and Paulo

who has played really well in this tournament, like I really liked his game, Ottawa's got a player there, you know we said to him, you know Brady Kachuk, when you saw Matthew fight, were you surprised that Brady fought? He couldn't even hold back his laugh. He's like, no, I wasn't surprised in the least bit. And you know, it's pretty obvious. What did you say? You said that some of the Americans had talked about this at the Super Bowl party on Sunday

night. You mentioned that. So, in the postgame we had with Dylan Larkin, he mentioned in the interview there that the Kachak brothers were discussing this in some fashion during the Super Bowl party. I looked at him going like, really? Like this has been on the to-do list for like a week. And he's going, well, like not, you know, specifically fighting right off the opening face off, but like they wanted to make an impact right away in that game and in Canada

and you know Matthew Kachuck's interview after they beat the Finns about I've been waiting nine years we'll be ready for this we should have known that that was how things were gonna roll come Saturday but that was really cool that was because from where I was sitting, and I'm sure you felt similar, when those gloves came off, off the opening face off, I have never and we're just a couple of days removed from the Mario moment in Montreal. I never heard a roar like that. Like I was feeling some kind of emotional way, like I couldn't even describe it. Like you're just caught up in this unbelievable scene.

It must have been like the gladiator days when they roll out into the middle of the Coliseum. A packed Coliseum. That's what that was to begin Canada US on Saturday. And I always think about this, and I'm sure you do too, Elliot, you don't wanna get caught up in the recency bias and you go, well, that was the greatest thing I've ever seen because it just happened. I try to keep that in perspective,

but I know I haven't been around the longest of times. I haven't seen a start to a night in person like that ever before. BX are called it the best start to a game ever. And I would agree with that. The other thing too is if you look back at, that was the 20th meeting between Canada and the USA and best on best.

That was the fifth time the USA had won. Canada's won 14 and there was a tie. So when I was sitting there on Sunday at the rink in Boston watching practice or waiting to talk to people, I was ranking all the previous Canada-USA best on best games. the previous Canada USA best on best games. So I think there are four that stand ahead of every other one. Okay. Those four are 1996 World Cup game three. Yeah. Where the Canada led 2-1 late and the US scored four goals in the last three and a half minutes

to win it. That was a huge win for the United States and the two gold medal games. 2002 and 2010. Yes. And you know what? Actually, I'll add a fifth. A lot of people don't pick this game, but I was there at this game and I think it was one of the best games Canada has ever

played at the international level. And that was the 2014 semi-final. Canada won that game one to nothing, but it wasn't even that close. Like I remember sitting there that night and watching that game and said they could play for six weeks and the US wasn't going to score on them. Yeah. So those five games stand out. To me, that game on Saturday night ranks third of the 20. You have to put the gold medal games ahead of them because those were just such massive games on a worldwide scale you can't compare it this was a round-robin game in a World Cup not insignificant but it doesn't compare to a gold medal game at the Olympics. The energy, it's like I had some people that said to me,

oh, the game wasn't that exciting after the fights. Get out of here. If you were in that building with that crowd, that game was a thriller shift to shift until the end of the game I was at the 2002 gold medal game I was at the 2010 gold medal game the fans were just as engaged it's not as big a game but it was no different a crowd and the thing that the players deserve the most credit for this week is That they have sold this tournament. I mean the Finnish United States game It turned into a blowout, but it was a good game for 45 minutes. It was competitive

The players came here. They did a ton of interviews They made themselves available, the stars have consistently been available, and they've played their hearts out, culminating in what I would say is one of the US, like I said, I was at the two gold medal games. I was at game two in 1996, which wasn't a great game like game three was. That's the third best Canada USA best on best game in history. And the only reason it isn't higher is those other two games were for the gold medal. That's it. That's the only reason it isn't higher is those other two games were for the gold medal. That's it. That's the only reason. It was incredible. The players came here to put on a show and like the fun of the funniest thing is I was asking the Canadian players weren't widely available on Sunday. There were a few who

were and there were about six or seven that were available for the U.S. And I was asking the American players who were available, what were the best text messages you got after the game? And Adam Fox, he says his brother-in-law, they come from a football family. He's texting him and he's like, the Kachuk brothers are a menace. And that whole game, you know what struck me about that whole game, Kyle, was how many texts I was getting from people I don't normally hear from. But they just wanted to talk about the game. They wanted to talk about the game. They wanted to talk about hockey.

Whether you were online and that game exploded on social media or you were there or you have connection to a phone with someone, people wanted to talk hockey. They were so energized and so excited by this game. And the players deserve the credit for that. It was funny, like a couple of the Americans, Slaven said he was, he, someone turned to him and said, watch this on the first shift. And he's like, what? And he goes, they're going to fight. And he's like, Oh wow. And he, and they, someone asked him, you don't know about it? And he says, they don't tell the Lady Bing winner about this stuff.

It's a great line. So I think obviously a bunch of players had to know, Ron Cutt-Kachak asking Hagel in the warm up. You had the Dynamite interview with Hagel. Mike Sullivan started them. He had to have an idea. Even if he didn't know, he had to have an idea. And then, you know, once Matthew went, you know, Brady looked for Sam Bennett and he knew Sam Bennett wasn't going to say no. And like they all thought there'd

be one fight, maybe two, but nobody saw the third one coming. Like the third one happened right in front of me. JT Miller was fighting somebody there no matter what. It didn't matter who it was going to be. He was fighting someone and Pareko one one career fight took it. And I think that's why Miller got the extra penalty there. I think the referees said, okay. It's time to play hockey We're gonna we're gonna end this now and we're gonna focus on the game

but everything about that was Awesome, it was awesome and and Kyle you know it was one of the funniest things about all this Sean McKenzie Goes to the morning skate on Saturday and says to Matthew Kachuck, you know your dad fought in 1996 at the World Cup of Hockey. And Matthew Kachuck laughs and says different era. He lied through his teeth. He knew exactly what he was gonna do. He played it brilliantly. Oh, he did amazing. When you look back at the footage. I mean, he looks Keith is looks a lot more

like Brady now, but there's still, there's the Matthew side of it. Keith was on tilt when he went out. Did you see the stick swinging he had with Adam Floyd? Oh man. Every now and then those pop up. The videos, some of the clips from those games on social, and even more so over the last few days, understandably,

but it was nasty, nasty hockey. Oh. But that's the best part of it like Matthew Kachak flat out lies to Mackenzie about oh this is a different era none of that's gonna happen. I wonder how many people in everybody's social group listening to this had someone say listening to this, had someone say when the Kachaks got in the fights, Tom Wilson just made next year's Olympic team. Oh, more than a few. Well, as we discussed, you can't fight there, it doesn't make sense, but you've got to think that this made him more valuable. Like I wouldn't be surprised when the Capitals resume playing on Tuesday or practicing, excuse me, on Tuesday, Tom Wilson gets to practice and we find out that in frustration, Wilson trashed his TV room.

That's like the scene in Anchorman where he says the F-bomb on the air and he gets fired and he's like sitting in his bed. He's got food everywhere like it's just a mess and it's Veronica Corning so it's now the lead anchor and he's like throwing food to the TV like ah. He just disgusted with the idea that she's taken over like he's like that should be me there. That's exactly it. Although I think Wilson would go, Wilson wouldn't throw food. He would name things in his house,

Matthew or Brady, and destroy them. I picture him more being that type of guy. Oh boy, you're on your own there. I can't wait for the next time I walk into the Capitals. But I think there's a lot of that, Kyle. I think there was a lot of, that puts Tom Wilson on the Olympic team. Because as we've learned, like the US,

they play a mean game. And they are a big team, like they are on average. So does Canada in its own way. Yes. This is a bit of a different team. But they are a heavier team. Yes. Like quite literally, on average,

they're a heavier team. Yes, like quite literally on average. They're a heavier team than the Canadians You know what we were talking about? last week Kyle about The game being in February as opposed to before the season Yes, the timing was perfect You're right there was nothing else going on. And I'm not saying that because I want to rub it in your face, although I would like

Dom to make a copy of you saying you're right so I can play it again from time to time. But I think that justified why it's happening now. I mean, the NBA terrible timing, their all star game, all star games are generally terrible. Now, it caught everybody's attention. People were energized, the fights, Canada, USA, the whole strained relationship right now, the anthem thing, it was fire. Like, there are a lot of people that don't normally comment on hockey that were caught up in the excitement of this.

And one of the smartest things I really heard, Kyle, was that the NHL has been handed an opportunity now. You have to take advantage of this momentum. I don't know even in some ways how you do it. Like someone said to me, you have to fix the game on Monday. You have to get Canada into the final. I was like, don't talk to me about that. You can't fix the game, but you know. The Finns' blades are dull. They can't fix the game, but you know. The Finns' blades are dull. They can't stand up.

That's this. This is you get like West McCauley shoving the puck into the finish net. I don't see anything. Replay is inconclusive. That's right. It's something out of the WWE now. They've the fix is in. But everybody's going to be watching watching Monday and if they play again

Everybody's gonna be what like I don't know if you like this is nothing we were talking about on Sunday if they play again Can you have a fight to start the game? Like this one's for a championship, right? It is and you heard When Brady was mic'd up As the videos started to come out in the aftermath, saying to one of the officials, he goes, the best part of that was totally organic. I know the three of them had discussed kind of during the day, but once it got rolling, that was what made it brilliant was the organic nature of it.

So now if you're going, well, you got to do it again because now you're playing for The championship or it's Canada us again in less than a week. It may not Pack the same punch speaking of punch So we go up to interview George St. Pierre to begin the second period Yeah, and he's in a suite up there with a number of who's who at the game that night. George Kittle of the 49ers, because he was there watching Sweden-Finland in the afternoon to cheer on his good buddy, Philip Forsberg. He was there.

He stuck around for the nightcap, wanted to see what was going on. And John Kretchen, former prime minister, was up in that suite as well. And so I guess as GSP was making his way over to where we were set up to do the interview, he passed Kretschian on the way and Kretschian put his fist right into GSP's chest and he looked at him and he said, "'Good shot' and kept walking."

So like everyone was in a fighting mood. Everyone wanted to fight, eh? Yes, yeah. I'll tell you this I would take GSP in that one. It's yes, even though he's retired now and a hall of favor I still I still like it. I still would take him against an 85 year old former prime minister Yeah, oh my god. Yeah, what a great scene Like I don't know if I can adequately convey like the funniest thing about it is is, obviously if you've watched the games you know I worked with David Amber at this. Amber is the most hilarious guy in the world

to watch the game with because whenever something happens, even if you're looking at it, he smacks you. He's like, are you seeing this? So that first period, he smacked me about eight times. And Amber, because he hasn't been missing too many of his quote unquote B 12 shots lately, it hurts man. He, I didn't take any punches like any of those guys who fought took punches, but Amber man, he was pounding me in that period. He was so excited. Oh, it was just a nice...

He's never seen a bench press he didn't like. But I'm sure everybody watching the game... And I want to say something to the... I'm sure everybody watching the game was the same too. Whether you were there or you weren't, it was awesome. And you know, there's one thing I wanna say, I had to, about our listeners, okay?

So, my brother-in-law was there with his son, my nephew, and I went through the crowd to go say hi to them at one point. You know, I don't wanna to use the line again too often because I don't think you can go there often. I think what really made it special was using it on Friday. Kyle, I cannot tell you how many people said to me, how are your nipples doing tonight?

Oh my gosh. Like it had to happen about 50 times. And I just want to say, that's why I think we're very lucky to have the audience we have. Yeah, I even got a few. Did you really? Yes.

That's funny, because it's all supposed to be fun. We're all supposed to be able to laugh and we're all supposed to be able to enjoy. I gotta say like, it was it was it was really, I got a great kick out of how many of you asked, because it's that's why you do it. So people can have a lot of fun with it. Yes. And for those who didn't hear a list for far our colleague and teammate put together a dynamite Mashup of all that with some music to set the stage

You've got Canada USA on a Saturday night in Montreal I Say it one more time. You can only pull it out on special occasions. Canada, USA. On a Saturday night. My nipples are erect thinking about it. Oh no. It turned out to be a very, it was a very good call by her to put that together because it was a perfect way to set up Canada US on Saturday night.

One more thing I wanted to mention. So that arena, Elliot, we've talked about, everybody knows, if you have a bucket list as a sports fan, even if you're maybe not necessarily only a hockey fan, if you're a sports fan and you come from wherever, a game in that building on a night where it matters should 100% be on there. And a big part of it, of course, is because, like we talked about this, Montreal fans, they understand it. They have the nuance, they have a great sense of occasion. The game presentation there is always top notch. But I was thinking about this over the last few days because sitting where I was in the building, you're in and amongst the crowd.

You have a chance to interact with the people that have come to the games there and it's really cool. But as I'm talking to people I say where are you from? came in from Alberta. Where are you from? from Thunder Bay? Yeah. Where are you from? I'm from Vancouver. Where are you from? St. John's from Halifax from Moncton. I'm from Moncton, New Brunswick. Yeah, a lot of New Brunswick. Yes. So my theory is now as much as the fans from Montreal and Quebec have a great understanding and they carry the torch in a lot of ways of how to

celebrate great nights of hockey, that building has an ability to pull those emotions out of you, regardless of where you come from, regardless of what team you cheer for. When you walk into that arena and take your seat, it's like a severance. Have you seen that show? Yes.

Okay, you go down the elevator. I'm just getting into it. And now your thoughts, your brains, what your perception of reality is, you leave your old life behind, and the new one is down in the basement. It's like your new world as you walk into that arena. It's really cool. It's a really, really cool phenomenon to be in there on nights like Saturday. I'm with you. And I saw people, in addition to all those places you mentioned,

I saw a couple from Vancouver. There was one family, I think it was mother, daughter, granddaughter, they were from Nunavut. And of course there were fans from the States who came up there. The families. The families. You know the other thing too about this is I don't think the World Cup will ever be on the stage of the Olympics there

There is something about an Olympic gold medal that will always be different but At its best The NHL game can compete with the International Olympic double IHF game for the reasons we saw on Saturday night. That game could never happen under double IHF rules. Never.

Oh my gosh. Because all those guys would have been kicked out of the game. Could Chuck sit on Doughty a little bit later? Well, it's just the fights, right? Well, I know, but I mean you can out of the game. Could Chuck sit on Doughty a little bit later? Well, it's just the fights, right? Well, I know, but I mean you can go beyond the fights. Well, of course, but I'm talking about that specific. You don't get that opening in a double IHF game. And, you know, one of the things that the NHL had to fight here

and the Players Association had to fight here was that this was, you know, does it really mean anything? Is it anything more than a money grab? I think what that game did was it showed you the potential of this tournament. And I'll say this too, I don't think this should be forgotten. I asked Matthias Ekholm on Sunday, could you ever see a Sweden-Finland game like that? And he kind of laughed and he said, I'd like to, but it's just not us, right? But that Sweden-Finland game was a great game.

It was a really good hockey game. It'll never have the prestige of the Olympics, because like I said, that Olympic gold medal is something special but what the players have done is they showed that this tournament every four years and every two years from the Olympics can be really something incredible can make its own magic can be special it's not the double IHF product but it still can be an excellent NHL product with the best players playing. That's not a small thing. That game and the other ones around it sold this tournament and what its potential can be.

Yeah, and I think because of your earlier point that you've made a couple of times here, the players took the initiative by saying this matters to us. And as soon as they did that, the rest of us went, okay, we're in, let's go. That's the ultimate driver there. And it was never more evident than on Saturday and both games in their, their own ways. So Elliot, as we look ahead now to another doubleheader on Monday, suddenly, as you laid out earlier, I mean, Canada needs to win in regulation to punch its ticket, or otherwise

they're hanging with bated breath if it's got to go beyond regulation and what happens in Sweden, USA. Can we get into the Thomas Harley situation here a little more? Because that was a great kind of side story to all of that Saturday too. Out of nowhere, he comes in for Kale McCarr and plays great plays great. And it was the old Craig Simpson line where you're not thinking you're completely, this wasn't even a thought to you a few days ago. It's 50, 50 in the morning and

now suddenly you're in and you're in that hornet's nest. That was that was a really neat. I was standing right on the Canadian bench waiting for the warm-up interview with Brady Kachuk and stood right as the Canadian players were walking out on the ice and just like the look on his face it was great like it wasn't even like a I don't even know where I am. Like I'm in shock. It was he just was a little bit of a smirk and up in the crowd and saw everybody there for warm ups. And it just that sense of, I can't believe I'm here right now. But he went

in and totally took advantage of a really neat opportunity. So can we lay out the scenario here now? Yes. Whether Cale McCart can play? Can I just tell you one funny story? Were you there when I asked him what was the best text message you got? Yes, yes, that was another great answer.

What a story. So I asked him what's the best text message you got about all this? And he says, well, one of my older brothers has a good friend, and I guess he started taunting him with text messages. You know, for those of you who aren't familiar, Freebird is the US goal song. It was that way at the World Juniors and now it's here.

He's like, Freebird, yo, let's go US. And then he wrote, sorry, I didn't realize you were playing. I wouldn't have said that if you were playing. Yeah. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha forward one backup at defense and one backup and goal. The Olympics do 25. But you know, that's the way they do it here. They do 23. And people were like, that's not enough players. And one of the reasons it went this way, and the players association were a real big driver in this was they didn't, like they didn't want players giving up an in-season vacation and having no chance of playing. There was a time, all the teams, once they asked for an extension, can we have later

than December 2nd to submit our rosters? And they were told no. And there was another time they said, can we have more players on our roster for this reason? And they were told no. And it was purely because they didn't want guys just sitting around doing nothing, giving up their vacation with no chance of playing. And they won.

Like I'll tell you a story. One of the Olympic games I was at, I went out for dinner and there's a taxi squad that each Olympic team can bring right and some of the countries and Canada was always very good at this they made sure that those taxi squad guys were basically part of the team even if you didn't have a chance to play you were part of the team but there were other countries that weren't like that they were like if you're not part of the team we kind of don't want you around. And I was out for dinner one night

in the Olympics and I happened to sit next to a group of players who were on a taxi squad and they told me they felt like total outsiders. That the coach was like, nope, you guys aren't playing. I don't want you around the rest of the team. And they felt like they were outcasts. And they didn't like it. They hated it. They were really upset about it. But what can you do?

You're not going to cause a problem in the middle of the Olympics. So that's why I think this existed. Now, initially, the rule was you can't replace anyone if they're injured. But someone also told me, as this unfolded on Sunday, we've got to leave, even if they aren't written and they were not written, we've got to leave some flexibility in case something happens.

You can't have teams playing short-handed, you can't have guys saying, oh well if they can't replace me I have to play even though I really shouldn't be playing. You have to have an open mind about what you can do. And then this happened. And so Theodore obviously suffered a very legitimate injury and but they still had six guys and they wanted to bring in Harley and You know the line kept moving It was okay. You can bring him, but he has to go to Boston He can't meet the team in Montreal then all of a sudden McCar's He can't meet the team in Montreal. Then all of a sudden, Mekar's situation was uncertain.

And they said, okay, you can bring him to Montreal, but when Mekar's on the ice, you can't have him there. So, there was that weird thing on Friday where he's watching while Mekar's on the ice and then he comes on and the players all cheer him. And then Mekar misses the game and he can play. Well, it's pretty obvious. As someone said to me on Sunday, it's pretty obvious, whether the other countries like this or not, it's pretty obvious Macar is dealing with something

very legitimate. Because you're not holding Kale McCarr out of a game Unless he's got a legitimate problem and the other thing someone said to me is they said if a guy is brought in to become you're either part of the roster or you're not and If you're part of the roster You it shouldn't be dependent on While the guy can go on the ice or not. You're either a member of the team or like I said, you're not.

Can I chime in here quickly? So I think in the future, what's, yes. So the other thing too that speaks to the craziness of that whole idea is that if McCarr had taken warm up on Saturday, Elliot, and then they were making a determination at that point, like Harley couldn't have gone out for warm up. Like he would have had to sit in the dressing room in his stall and wait for McCarr to be on the ice and decide, okay, can I go? Can I not go? All right, I can't play. And then Harley's been sitting there, no warm up and right into the game he goes. That apparently was the scenario for Canada. If McCarr took warm-ups. Well that explains why he didn't take them right. He probably had to make the decision right there. I mean

it next time they'll sort this out and it was a little crazy how he got from point A to point B but I'm of the belief if a guy's on your roster you should be able to play him or not and it's really interesting here how Canada Move the line because they moved it from No to yes, but here to okay You can bring him here to you can only play under these circumstances or practice under these circumstances and now we can play So it'll be interesting because Harley as you mentioned he played great So, it'll be interesting because Harley, as you mentioned, he played great. So I wouldn't be surprised if he's in the lineup, even if McCarr is in the lineup on

Monday. The funniest thing about this was how we found out. You know, someone brought this up to Cooper, like, you know, hey, you can only use Harley if McCarr can't play. And he looked at us with that Cheshire cat smile. Are you sure that's the rule? And obviously, he knew it had been changed. None of us know the rules. We all had to go chase it. The one thing we should say as we come to the end of all this

is I can completely understand why the other teams or countries would be upset about all this. You enter a tournament under the same rules, you hope they will stay consistent, and this one has changed on almost a day-to-day basis. But this is the overall picture of why things have ended up the way they are. You know I gotta say like this it was interesting like talking to the Finns about Canada so the best offensive performance I've ever seen I talked about it briefly earlier was the 2014 Canadian Olympic men's team. That was a team They were the best top to bottom defensive team I've ever watched over a tournament. They played six games and they gave up three goals. And in the playoffs, the quarterfinals, semifinals and gold medal game, they gave up one goal in three games and it was to Latvia on that lacrosse play.

Latvia needed to use a gimmick play, Ted Nolan, to score against Canada. That's how good that team was. This US team, the game they played in terms of individual games, that's as good a defensive game as I've ever seen and the Finns were saying they own the blue line they owned it against Canada I didn't think you'd see that on a team with Sidney Crosby even though he's clearly not a hundred percent Nathan McKinnon and Connor McDavid they own the blue line against Team Canada they could not get in with speed.

They counter-attack beautifully. They just did not let Canada do whatever they want. And you know, we talked in the Stanley Cup right now, the teams that win the championships are the big, long, lean blue lines. That's the U.S. right now. Big, long, lean blue lines That's That's the US right now big long lean blue line and Their forwards they backchecked they put on pressure That was a phenomenal

defensive clinic and You know some of the things for Canada I You know some of the things for Canada I Don't know how you feel about this But I would be putting Sam Bennett with Conor McDavid one of the most interesting points. I heard was You've got to give these three guys their own lines Crosby McKinnon McDavid Yeah, all three of them should be centers I Don't know how cool now Crosby clearly is not 100%.

He took no faceoffs the other night. So maybe you do Braden point there. But I thought it was interesting like a few current players and ex players were like, I would go with all three centers, all three of them having their own lines. Me I was wondering about Bennett with McDavid. You know McDavid, he got bumped a lot. I mean took the massive hit from McAvoy. McAvoy caught him twice.

Yes, which you don't normally see, but he got bumped a lot. See now you're playing against the best of the best. McDavid is so good and he's a great player and you underestimate him obviously at your peril but obviously there's guys in the regular season you can attack. Now it's the best of the best and the US is a great skating long team right there's it's like the thicket we talk about in the class there's always a stick always a leg always an arm always a body in your way so how do you create that room and I would try Bennett with McDavid they've known each other a long time it's it's

it's really interesting I'm very curious. I think Konekne comes back in. I'm curious to see who goes out. I mean, obviously, McCarr being back in, assuming he plays, will completely change the dynamic. Their transition game really, really struggled. You know, Canada usually in these tournaments loses once early, right? Every Canadian who... Well, not in the Crosby era. Well, 2010.

I know. That was 15 years ago. I know, but still, like, that's a big tournament. Yeah, it sure was. They lose early. In 2002, they also lost early and they figured it out, right? I'm not panicking.

I thought that they lost basically a 2-1 game. They got smothered, except for the brilliant goal by McDavid. The US looked bigger than they did, but I won't overreact. There is potentially another chance here. Monday morning before their last game against Finland is not the time to overreact. They have times to sort this out here. But the Americans dictated the pace of that game.

They dictated the tempo of that game. They played a great game. So now I've got a counterattack, and I'm really curious to see what Cooper does here. Because you know what the Finns can do. They will clog up the middle of the ice. They will, like they will see a good defensive strategy, the Finns and they will copy it. That's the thing. That was the blueprint for them on Saturday. Yes. Like outside of the McDavid rush, the speedsters on Canada, like they didn't have the room

to get going as you highlighted. And I think that was a lot of how Finland was playing the Americans through two periods. And then the wheels fell off and everything came to caved in in the third of course. But that was very much how they were playing where it was tough for the US that night to get going offensively they weren't given up very much and of course that's the DNA of that Finnish team. That's the DNA of this finished team going back a long, long ways. So you know that's going to be their MO here. Antipenan and their head coach was saying on Sunday, like, strong within the dots, right? So that's going to be a big key for them if they want to shock the

world here and beat the Canadians. And if you do it in regulation out of nowhere punch your ticket here to the final. I it was interesting what did you think John Cooper not committing to goalie for Monday only because and we talked about this early on the week he was like Bennington's our guy he's our guy and he had an opportunity to do that again on Sunday and he didn't do it now is this another John Cooper Sheshire cat smile type moment where it ends up being Bennington he plays great and then we see him postgame and he goes what did you guys think of course I was going back to Jordan Bennington or do you think there's a chance Aiden Hill is the guy I don't have a good feel for this one me neither I don't you know Ron brought up

a good point this is the scene of Bennington's biggest triumph It sure was. I won three games in that building in that series. Yeah. It's it's a good point. It's a really good point. Here's another one. So Sunday Hill practiced and Montembo practice but Bittington did not. What does that tell you? See I don't know. Like part of me kind of, it tells you that he's going again? So I thought that too.

And then I had a goalie tell me he was surprised. Now they said it was an emotional game. Bennington could be exhausted. Their travel was also not ideal either. The travel was also not great. Like he conceded all that. But he did say like if you had one goal that kind of went through you like the first Gensel one did, you'd be at practice working on that the next day. Like you don't have a morning skate on Monday because Canada's playing at one o'clock Eastern time, right?

Yes. Can't work on it any other time. So unless Bennington's working on it in secret and we don't know about it but he said that's one of those games where you're on the ice the next day and you're you might even be working without pox. You're working on your technique. How did that one get through me? Always remember Corey Crawford. Remember that game in 2013 where he couldn't, got beaten like 40 billion times on the glove side?

Next morning, 9 a.m., he was on the ice working on his glove hand. Now he had time off before the next game after that one. Bennington really doesn't but that one goal he put that in my head and now I can't stop thinking about it. God yeah I don't have a feel for it. I don't either. I don't. I don't. Because it's two games, it's two games, right? It's funny, like Bennington's made some incredible stops over the first two outings at some really key times. And then there's been a couple other where you're like, ah.

Tom Barrasso used to have a line. He had a few of them. I was thinking about it today actually and I wrote it down and I looked it up and I wrote it down and this is what Tom Barrasso used to say He would and this is a guy who just went into the Hall of Fame He said It's not the saves you make it's the goals you give up And it's not the saves you make, it's the goals you give up. Now I'm I try to be optimistic.

I always try to look at the good things. So I would probably look at it the other way. But you know what the difference is between me and Tom Barrasso? He's in the Hall of Fame. That's right. And I never will be so you have to have to give weight to what he says. Yeah, it's a good line. Ah, big one Monday.

Must win. Lankan is going to start for Finland. Yes. And by the way, yes, yes, he does. Twenty nine. I thought he was. He was very good in against Sweden. By the way, Slaven. I was asking him about text messages he got, and he says,

his dad doesn't have a Twitter account, but he looks with his moms. And his dad sent him one saying, they're calling you border control. And he kinda laughed. I said, you want that as a nickname? And he goes, no. Please don't start that. man other people were making official documents and

They were calling him the Secretary of Defense There's a guy who was getting his just do After that game. Yes over 25 minutes him and Brock Faber were both over 25 minutes and plus three they were dynamite. Very curious to see what Canada looks like after the lost. Some of those guys really hate to lose. Really hate to lose. And they can't lose anymore. they can't lose anymore. They can't lose anymore. Alright, so why don't we get to the final thought then, which is brought to you by GMC.

So the nightcap here in Boston on Monday is USA Sweden. We know the game doesn't mean a ton for the Americans because they're in the final either way. It could mean absolutely everything for Sweden, as you outlined in the final either way. It could mean absolutely everything for Sweden as you outlined in the scenarios earlier. So if you're USA, how are you playing this one? We don't think Matthew Kachuk is going to play for starters. There's no point in playing him. Even if he said no big deal. There's no point in playing him. He's out, I think, especially if it was up to me. So Kreider plays, like some people were saying,

if you're the USA, like if Sweden has a chance to win, if you're the US, do you throw it? So you play against Sweden. You know, number one, I think it's gonna be hard to throw it, because you can't take a bunch of guys out. The only guy you're taking out right now is a guy who's hurt and Crichter is from Boston. Like he's going to be wired to play if he's in. Secondly, even if you don't play Hellebuck, I assume it would be Ottinger over Swainman, but he's been the backup.

You don't think Ottinger is going to want to play his heart out, like get a chance to play. There's no way these guys are throwing the game. And the other thing I really believe too is when you start playing half-assed, that's when you get hurt. Yes. I just don't think you can throw a game. Now you're not going to go out and start three fights in the first nine minutes like you

did against Canada, but I think you do play to win. And the other thing I always remember is New York Giants. The year they beat the unbeaten Patriots, that last game didn't mean anything in the regular season. They gave the Patriots all they could handle. They lost late. But they convinced them that they could win. And they won the Super Bowl.

They beat the unbeaten Patriots in the Super Bowl. David Tyree. Maybe it's a stupid comparison, but I always think that. No, but I think the theory is right. Don't think you turn it off. Yes. Cause that's not how they are wired. Like again, going back to Larkin in the post game, sliding in there,

like, hopefully we see those guys again. Like they're going, we'd love to see Canada again in the final. They're not scared of a rematch. And also too, Kyle Connor on Sunday was asked about that whole concept and his point was, A, we want to show Sweden what we're about and also we're a year away from the Olympics. Like I think that's very much in the back of players minds too. Like this is a... That's a great point....very wonderful appetizer, a that's a great point very wonderful appetizer a very

filling appetizer but an appetizer nonetheless for Olympic medals that'll be out there to play for in Milan a year from now and the chance to get a better sense of who you are as a group and to let everyone else know who you are as a group, and to let everyone else know who you are as a group, that that's all going to factor in. And subconsciously, of course, Canada wins, Finland wins in regulation in the afternoon, and you know, okay, the Swedes have nothing to play for. Naturally, subconsciously, it's human nature that things shift a little bit, but not to the point where you're saying you're letting your foot off the gas so much that now you're opening yourself up to injury

because you're not locked in the way you should be. I don't see that happening at all. I'm with you. I think winning is all about attitude. And when you're a short tournament like this, you can't turn off the attitude. No. It's been a weird turn over for Sweden. They really felt they should have beaten Canada and maybe they should have Fumbled it

Felt really good about themselves Yeah, probably should have beaten Finland Fumbled it. Yeah, the worst is when you don't have your destiny in your own hands. When you need help. Yeah. And that's where they're at. That's by the way, we should mention that play in the Finland Sweden game. It Barkov on the breakaway coming out of the penalty box. Oh, the way he picked the puck up. Well, I the the other thing too is Mikala I give him credit because he knew that the pass was going to get knocked away if he put it to the forehand side. So we had to put it to the backhand

side, right? Mm hmm. He had that happened right in front of me and Barkov just picked it up on his backhand and almost scored. That was an incredible play. Barkov was almost like, like he saw the trajectory as it came off Mikhala's stick and he was like, okay, like he didn't even really look back. Like he just like looked down at his blade, waited for the puck to arrive there and it was like bang on the backside of his blade and he was gone. It was phenomenal. The hockey IQ there was just off the charts. Incredible play. Yeah, really cool. More plays to be made on Monday, Elliot. One more double header of the four nations here to decide who will meet the Americans in the

final on Thursday right here in Boston. That was The Final Thought brought to you by GMC. We'll take our first break and come back with the Thoughtline. You're listening to 32 Thoughts, the podcast. MUSIC All right, welcome back. Time now for the Thoughtline. Elliot, we've had a lot of fun on this segment over the season, wouldn't you say? I don't like where this is going. Oh, I think you're gonna like it. Trust me. Trust me. Trust me. Okay. We have had most recently, the poem from Pittsburgh. Yes. We had the triangle controversy early on in the year. Yes. We had the Triangle controversy early on in the year. Yes. There was an issue

with cats and memory loss. Yes, that's right. We had the Celia. I forgot about that one. Yeah. And this wasn't part of the thought line last episode, but as we mentioned earlier, last episode but as we mentioned earlier, Ailish's mashup of your Erect Nipples line from last pod, that got some good play on social too, okay? By the way, I also wanted to mention the watch controversy. Oh yes, that's right. After we went on about it on Friday and you got ripped for not asking the guy about it, I got another note, another text message. This is a text message from someone I know, and they wrote, you know, there are a lot of watch enthusiasts out there who are fuming that all that was disclosed, but what kind of watch was it, Kyle? Oh. They were mad that you didn't say the kind's an ICW. I see. W. That's the one. Yes. But they were mad that you

didn't disclose it right away. Well, I've tried to make up for it since it's been a week long journey of trying to make up for it. And I think we've got a pretty good option here. Oh, okay. All right. So has been the theme of the weekend Sometimes you hype things up and they don't meet expectations Just like Canada the US or Finland Sweden. I don't think this is one of those times. Okay, so we have Isaac from Melbourne, Australia G'day there from Melbourne, Australia. I wrote a quick rap for you all inspired by the Crosby poem

Okay time now for its world debut Thirty two thoughts Rap style Get a guys. It's your mate from Australia third times the charm hope this ain't a failure G'day guys, it's your mate from Australia Third time's the charm, hope this ain't a failure Poem from Pittsburgh, man that one got me So I'm here as the rap version of Sid Crosby Shout out Griffin Dom, legends of the show Now it's time to drop the puck, let's go! I'm a big fan of the pod, listen every episode Dishes get done and the grass gets mowed News is covered like hella bucks net, just one thing Have you heard about the NUX yet?

Sorry, I'll go easy, just teasing Believe me, don't track me down like the puck on my mantelpiece Elliot, messing with police but still a freed man Flying on the roads, start with the speed man Maybe save some of that pace for your record Spotify forced to fast forward when you talk Oops, should I call Bucovskaz and Friedman Lawton? I will just say this at the time of this recording and while they're at it can they work another angle kyle needs defense from the

guy playing triangles that bukowskas his hair is worth the boast never too ashamed to brew his own roast he's real nice though swede like enc this just can't believe how much he loves breakfast keep up the trivia freiges mental gymnastics gymnastics. Always gets there, man. Is that practiced? By now he's distracted. Gummy rapper crinkling. Let me just say this. We hate loser thinking.

That's enough now. It's late in Australia. By the way, Elliot, call me back. This is Celia. Wow. It's nice to have someone with actual talent on this pod. Holy smokes. Isaac summarized our whole year.

That was fantastic, Isaac. You'll have to do another one at the end of the season with any other insane stuff that gets compiled. Thanks so much, Isaac. That was awesome. That was fantastic. Very good. All right.

So that sets the table here. Okay. And number of submissions with four nations in mind here, as you would expect. Elliot, so we continue with the thought line. Jared from Barrie, Ontario. Hello, gentlemen. Just listened to the podcast about the four nations schedule conundrum on whether to have it in September or February and the challenges of wanting to have it in Europe.

I thought to myself, why not all of the above? The women's team Canada and team USA have a rivalry series with months in between games. I think this would be a great format to have the players go to Europe and grow the game in September and finish out the round robin matches in North America in February.

Just wondering, with Elliot basically having the equivalent power to Gary Bettman if he could make this happen. All the best and appreciate the podcast for my long work commutes. Let me just say Jared that somewhere wherever he is on Sunday night as we record this, Bettman just threw up his dinner at the idea that I would have anywhere near as much power as he does. Let's make that very clear right at the beginning, although I'm flattered you might even think so. Here's why I would say that's unlikely. I like the idea. I really do like the creativity of the idea and I know at

times when they've done the World Cup, whether it was this version or before, they talked about qualifying. Like Donald fear ran the players association he came from baseball where they had their world baseball classic and they had qualifying and he liked that idea he wanted to create it in this so it's not like your idea doesn't have merit in history all of that said it goes back to the point we made about not making the season longer. And I just don't think they would want to do that. Now, as I was just thinking about the answer, you know, sometimes, and it happens in basketball, like teams qualify for tournaments and then they use different players in the Olympics. Like sometimes, you know, Canada's basketball team won't have the Olympians available to

them but they will attempt to qualify for tournaments with the next tier of players. You might be able to do something like that. I don't know how everybody would feel about it but you could potentially do that. I just, I always know the players don't want to make their season longer so that's what you have to argue against or protect yourself against the players making the season longer. All right Jared thank you for submitting that. Good idea though. Yeah I don't have a problem with it at all, conceptually. Alright, Michael from Kingston, Ontario.

Hello everyone. You talked about a few things that are being tried at Four Nations that might move to the NHL. He puts in there, please, more of the camera on the ice. Yeah, I love it. So good. I noticed the 3-2-1 point system being used. The NHL needs this.

Is there any chance this is seriously considered? I believe this will add to the playoff races where a team could reel off five three-point wins in a row. Also, anything that adds to more times where teams will press harder in the games. It would be TV Gold. Imagine the graphics with all the possibilities of games for teams to clinch or be eliminated. So I did a little math work because we were waiting between our media availabilities in Boston on Sunday afternoon. Okay.

So I went through, I did the Eastern conference, kind of the playoff race, the top teams in the division in the playoff race, just because that's the more compelling one of the two conferences with more teams in the raceoff race, just because that's the more compelling one of the two conferences with more teams in the race right now, uh, as we have this conversation. So I went through and did it as if it was a three-point system where everyone would be at. Alright. Yup. And the top three teams in the division,

obviously, the totals are different but everyone would be in the same place. Okay. The only real change, like I think right now, one point separates Ottawa and Detroit, they're the two wild card holders. Yep. And under a three point system, two points would separate Ottawa and Detroit.

The biggest difference is, if it was a three point system right now, the Rangers would actually be in the second wild card spot because they have 25 regulation wins, which is the most among all those teams in that wild card race. So that would do them some real favors. Other than that, it's pretty consistent with where we are right now in the two and one system. Just more inflated numbers and the gaps are a little wider again, because that that's the thing that interests me. There are a lot of people I would say this to Michael, I think most fans agree with you. Okay. I over the

years and this is purely anecdotal, I've got no scientific evidence, but I think most fans agree with you. However, I've learned to look at this from a business point of view, and I know some fans aren't gonna like this, that's fine. I'm just explaining to you why it's the way it is. The more teams that you have in the race, the more interest there is in all these teams. And if the gaps get wider and more teams fall out, I just don't think that's going to appeal to the NHL. If you can show them or convince them that this system will have more teams in the race, then I think you could

see it someday. But if it means more teams fall out or more teams are in danger, I don't see it happening. And you can argue the loser point, it's artificially inflated things, and that's fine. I'm willing to listen to all arguments. But you're doing whatever you can to keep more interest. And the closer you are to the playoffs, the more it helps in season's ticket sales. This is actually one of the reasons I can't believe they haven't gone to expanded playoffs, because I've had teams tell me that if you take a year where

you make the playoffs and a year where you miss the playoffs, the difference in what it means to your business the next season is enormous. So if the current system keeps more teams in it or closer, then I think that's what they're going to go with. And I do believe that's the answer. All right. Up next, Justin and Airdrie Alberta. Hey guys, quick question. Why is Devon Taves wearing number five and not number 7 like he wears in Colorado with Team

Canada? There's no other Canadian player wearing 7, nor is there another player wearing 5 in Colorado, which would prevent him from wearing his preferred number. Brent Seabrook has worn number 7 in the past for Canada, so I don't think it's a case of being untouchable like a 99 or a 66 my investigation has stopped there So I'm wondering if you two have any inside scope well Alex Patrangelo would have a war number seven had he played for team Canada And that's why initially DeVon Taves was given number five and I asked around a

Little bit about this on Sunday, Elliot, and I didn't get a firm answer, but someone did make the point that there was only a couple of days between when Patrangelo announced he was backing out and the Jersey sales for four nations went public. That's a hundred percent the answer. The other one that happened this week is that, you know, Cale McCarr debated giving up number 8 to Drew Doughty when Doughty was named, right? But they're like, no, I'm sorry, Jersey sale, so Doughty took 89. It's 100% it.

Right. It's 100% it. You got it. Yeah. And you know I do I do understand this. You know, for example, if Devon Taves is your favorite player and you've got a Devon Taves number five and he changes it to seven, you probably feel a bit ripped off, right? Yeah. Upset. Right. Same with Macar. You've got Macar hugely popular. You got a Macar eight. He switches to 89. You're probably you're a bit upset. Yes, because those jerseys ain't cheap. Those jerseys ain't cheap. So I get this one.

Again, it doesn't always seem like a good reason, but it is a good reason. All right, up next, Kieran from Eastern Passage, Nova Scotia. Gentlemen, with all the talk, we've got a few of these over the last little bit, Elliot, so I wanted to get this one in. Okay. With all the talk of the rising salary cap, Elliot has mentioned that some teams may not

be comfortable spending to 105 or 110 million or teams floating the idea of using a quote internal cap. So my question is this, is the salary cap not linked to keeping revenue a 50-50 split between players and owners. I assume that the cap projections rise as the projected hockey revenue rises. If ownership does not spend to the cap, are they not just pocketing the extra hockey-related revenue and stealing what is owed to the players? In this case, wouldn't there need to be a reverse escrow payment from the owners to the players to make sure they get their owed 50% of revenue?

Sincerely, a union man. Kieran, it's an excellent question were right, it was 50-50. And the escrow was there to make sure it was split that way. When COVID hit, they updated their CBA to reflect that at the time, the owners lost so much revenue, because people couldn't go to games that the players owed the money So instead of doing it 50-50 then they delinked it for the six years of this CBA and there was basically a repayment schedule and until the players

Paid back all of that money, which they did early last season, they were out of schedule because thanks to our great fans, the revenues came back much quicker than anyone realized. So instead of 50-50, it became when is the debt repaid? And then we'll start adjusting the cap and that's exactly what happened so it was delinked and right now they've set the cap for the next three years and we'll see how the rest of the deal looks which will answer a lot of your questions looks, which will answer a lot of your questions.

But since COVID it's been delinked and what the players owed or didn't owe affected that overall situation. Now the revenues have been so good this year that the belief is the players could get over 100% of their paychecks and next year same deal they could get over 100% of their paychecks potentially. We'll see what that means but it's been delinked since the start of COVID. And I don't want to use the word delinked in any more sentences. You're capped out. I'm capped out. Maxed out of delinks. You're delinking from that word.

That's good. Good question, Karen. As I say, it's come up a few times here. So it was important to get it on the pod here today. So thanks for that explanation, Elliot. I hope that made sense. I think it did. If I can understand it, I think our listeners should be just fine.

All right, how about a voicemail here? Zach from Tampa. Hey, guys. This is Zach from Tampa. Elliot, like two or three pods ago, you mentioned that the NHL is able to step in on certain trades and they are allowed to veto them. What are some of those actual reasons that they could veto? I'm sure some fans would love if they would have stepped in and stopped their GM from

making a disastrous move, but I'm just curious as to what some of these reasons are that the NHL could step in. Thanks and go Lightning and Blues. Yeah, the NHL doesn't veto trades based on they think it might be lopsided. You know, for example, if you're a basketball fan, you'll remember there was a huge trade years ago where Chris Paul was sent to the Lakers, I think from New Orleans, and David Stern blocked it. He was like, we are not allowing this to happen because he thought it was way too lopsided. So Stern was so powerful. He was like, I don't like this.

No. And I remember there were a lot of fans who thought it was stunning in the sense that commissioners, even though a lot of people agreed it was a lopsided deal and it shouldn't have been allowed to happen, they're like, that's not why a commissioner should be vetoing a trade. And Gary Bettman doesn't do that. There have been times the NHL will veto a trade if a player won't give permission to go past a clause, like a no trade clause or a no move clause or anything like that.

They'll veto it if their math says that it won't line up salary cap wise, that they can't get it done. There was, you know, of course you'll remember the Lindros trades when Lindros was traded to Philadelphia and the Rangers and the NHL vetoed the Ranger one because they said there already was a deal with the Flyers. And then the Nordiques tried to back out to take the Rangers trade and they said no, you can't do that. So the NHL doesn't block trades because they think they're lopsided. They block them because they think things have been violated procedurally.

I think there have been cases too where at the trade deadline, teams didn't get things done by 3 o'clock Eastern time, and they're like, no, you didn't get it done. You're out. That's happened before. Very good. All right, Zach, thank you for sharing that. That kind of thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

All right, just a couple more here, Elliot. Selena and Jeremy, it's a good thought line here this week. Selena and Jeremy from Baltimore. Hi, Elliot. Selena and Jeremy, it's a good thought line here this week. Selena and Jeremy from Baltimore. Hi, Dom. I guess this is a question for Dom. We're Colorado Avalanche fans. And the most annoying thing about watching national broadcast games is that the game start time is never the game start time. Oh, my goodness. We're getting a few of these this week. Yes. The puck will drop at 822 or 815 or who even knows. How can the NHL and its broadcasting partners move toward what the MLB has going on where if the first pitch is advertised for 640 the ump points and that first pitch always happens at 640. Can we get a puck drop time love you guys Kyle and Elliott to

love the pod and go abs go well let me tell you something I have no idea Elliot take it away all right thanks Tom I'll try to add I'll try to pinch hit this one for you as usual Selena and Jeremy I would say that TV is the villain here. Probably more than I care to admit because I work in TV. We want you to tune into our post-game shows. We want to hold the audience for as long as we can. So that's what we do. I'll give you a hint. In most cases, if it's a regional game a

Game that is not aired on national television as part of the national packages the puck drop is usually 10 minutes After the top or bottom of the hour so 710 740 in most cases. If it's a national game, it's usually 15. In Canada. In Canada. When the US get their claws in it, it's 20. 22?

Yeah, 20 or 22. They like a little more time. You're right. So regional it is usually 10. National Canada 15. National US 22. I think Kyle's right. Yes, it is because it is because Selena and Jeremy. Elliot is paid such an incredible salary. They are trying to justify it by having as many as many viewers at the top of the clock To see him and David Knock the heck out of each other about all the crazy things that are gonna happen in the game

Before the game actually starts You know what They could pay me three dollars an hour and there's nothing I could do to justify even that. Your humility is what makes you great. But you know what? So that's the answer. And I'll say this, at least for some long pregame shows, because there have been times where for example, as you know Kyle, during the Stanley Cup Final,

we'll do a half hour pregame show, most Stanley Cup Finals, but once the US network joins, let's just say we start at 7.30, right? Local or Eastern. If the US broadcast comes on at 8, puck drop isn't until 8.22, that's a 50 minute pregame show. Yes. Not even this man full of the hot air that I am can kill time for 52 minutes. We do it twice a week. No, no, no. That's pretty funny. You do at least 10 minutes of that. Yeah. Yes, I know. And maybe by next season, I'll get it up to 12. All right, but it's a very good question. It's just kind of one of those

things too, or it's basketball similar to football is a little closer to their kickoff times and baseball, as history has shown, they like putting the opening pitch times. It's just kind of how the sports have done it on this side of the pond. Alright, one final one here, okay? A little trivia to wrap up as you like to do. Nick and Orleans, hello National Capital Region Kyle, West Coast Dom, and Metropole and Company. That's you, Elliot. Oh, wow wow okay. I've tried finding this info on my own but it's difficult. Do you know which player had the fewest points as their team's leading scorer in a season where the team made the playoffs? Oh he

points out Dean Prentiss of the 67-68 North Stars had 41 points, but that was back in an era where they only played 74 games. He asked, what would be the fewest amongst players in a more modern context, the 82 game regular season era? This is a tough one, because where do you even start? Okay. See, I remember like the devils when they first moved, but they weren't making the playoffs.

Yeah, you're on the right path. Okay. Okay, so you have the answer to this? Yes. Am I on the right path? I'm in the same era like that era? Early 80s? No, you know, you need to push ahead a little bit. Oh, wait a second. Is it like Minnesota when they had Jacques Lemaire's team and they were making the playoffs

and they didn't have a ton of scoring? No. Reel it back a little bit. But it's one of those teams like that era's New Jersey Devils that had Dynamite goaltending and didn't have to rely on a ton of scoring See I was thinking about the Ducks, but they always had like Korea and Solani so that doesn't oh Buffalo Hoshik yeah, you've got the team

Now okay, so scoring leaders back then, Pekka? Not him. Jason Dau? Not him. Dixon Ward? Not him. Brian Holzinger? Not him.

Thomas Vanek? No, earlier than that. Yeah, it wouldn't be Vanek. That's too early for Vanik. Jeez, who am I missing? It is a hero. Miroslan Shatan? Bingo.

In 1997, 1998, Miroslav Shatan led the Sabres in scoring with 46 points. Oh my god. They were a playoff team. My next I was going to start going with like Jason Woolley. Yeah. Because he would get points for them. Yes. We needed some Slovakian flavor here on the pod. Oh Dom's excited. He's sending texts full of Slovakian flags.

He gets a question directed to him and Miroslav Shatan. What a fluke that it's right. I wonder if the guy knew. All on the same thought line. But two different ones. Yeah. So that was the fewest.

Uh, Daniel Alfredson and Nick Cronwell, both led the red wings in scoring in 13, 14 with 49. Zetterberg led the Red Wings in scoring in 13-14 with 49. Zetterberg led the Wings in scoring in 15-16. That was the last time they have made the playoffs. 50 points that year. Jesus! Yeah. That's low. That is low. I think last season Dillon Strowm checked that box. 67 points for the capitals. Capitals. Yeah. But it's a lot more than 46. Different errors, of course. All right, that was a long thought line, but there's some good submissions.

Very good ones. We wanted to get in. So thank you, Griffin Porter, for putting those together. Thank you, Dom, for grabbing the audio, and Elliot for answering the wide variety of questions. 18333113232 if you'd like to leave a voicemail or a rap song. 32thoughts at sportsnet.ca is the email to submit a question or an idea to the thought line. We'll take our final break and come back with a couple of interviews, roundtable conversations I should say. Canada and the US and the coaching staffs you're gonna want to hear these. We'll be're back.

So before this Four Nations event got underway, but the teams had arrived in Montreal for their first couple of practices, Jeremy McElhaney, one of our feature producers, came up with an awesome idea. Having the coaching staffs of both Team Canada and Team USA sit down in a roundtable type format and just get them going on a number of different topics. Coaching the best on best, representing their countries, different tactics, the players they get to work with, all of it, and a little bit of fun as well. You may have seen the roundtable of the Canadian coaches before the game on Saturday.

The conversation of the American coaches will run at some point later on in the tournament on the TV side, but we wanted to play the audio from both of these roundtables for you here. So this is the raw audio more or less. Elliott was also part of it too in a way just off to the side to help facilitate a couple of different topics and get the wheels turning initially but both coaching staffs did a phenomenal job taking the ball and running with it and the conversation and back and forth we thought was really compelling and wanted to give you the opportunity to listen to as well so we'll begin with the team Canada staff John Cooper Rick Tuckett Bruce Cassidy and Peter DeBoer and then you will hear from the American staff Mike Sullivan John Tortorella David Quinn Quinn, and John Heinz. Enjoy. First topic would be, how do you build chemistry on a roster this quickly?

What? See which guys go to the Super Bowl party? Super Bowl party and a couple cases of beer? Yeah. Who comes in late? What group? Who can't get up the next morning? No, yeah. Chemistry is tough. Because you think you know it, until you don't.

And it's, like we talked about, when you're in the world championships, you have like three or four or five preliminary games that are kind of games you should win, and then you get to figure it out. Like the World Cup, we had three week training camp. And then exhibition games you got to figure out chemistry.

And you know, Austin Matthews was my 13th forward. Went up to be, played with me day and day and day. He was sick. But it's, when you find it, you got it, you know it. But at times it can be hard to find. Sometimes you get a little lucky with Rossby, McKinnon, Marshman, they all train together in the summer. So they've been around each other, that helps maybe, taking people in. So that could get a small group into a bigger group.

That's what I was going to say say because they're all leaders too right so that that's gonna help should help us last night you can see five to seven well you saw them last night yeah the table started small and then it grew by the end of the night so that that was, that's probably what we call chemistry. I don't know if there's one particular thing, right? All right, so, on a, how much do you share about your own players, your NHL players, when you're playing for Canada?

How honest are you about the guys you have? You know what, I think the beauty of Hockey Canada, and this is going back to the first Hockey Canada team I coached, Joe Thornton was an under-17 player, if you can imagine that, but is when you sign up for the job at Shit, you're an open book. That comes with accepting the job. You share everything, you know, that comes with accepting the job, you know, you share everything, you

share your opinion on your players, you share your systems, that's just what we do. And I think every staff I've ever been a part of with Hockey Canada, that's been the case, I think that's in the DNA of Hockey Canada, the program. We had that summer meetings I just kind of you go to that thing it's gonna sit back and listen and you guys are really honest about your players or about a guy and I was like man I better be honest you got the it's for the Naples right it's for the for the crest and it's pretty pretty impressed how honest people were about their own players even some some deficiency, how we could exploit them on other teams.

I thought that was really interesting. It was pretty cool. Yeah, I know for me personally, 2017 World Championships, we were playing Russia in the semi-finals, and Vaslavsky was goalie and Kuch was in the semi-finals. And Vaslavsky was goalie and Kuczy was in the game. You're sitting here coaching against, you know, the guys you go to war with every year, but still want to beat them. You're trying to put game plans together

to, you know, beat your guys. And so it's always hard to do, but you got to do it. But it's, you know, for me, when you are at this post that we're in together, I think it's, we'd be remiss if we didn't share everything and be the open book that we can be for the better of everyone.

And I think it's super cool when you're like, hey man, I love that drill you had. Like, I'm gonna take that. I'm like, yeah, well I like this drill you have, and I'm gonna take that. And you know, everybody's I'm gonna take that. I'm like, yeah, well, I like this drill you have, and I'm gonna take that, and, you know, everybody's, like, learning from each other, and I think that's, that's kind of the rewarding thing

for me. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, you guys, especially the system part, I mean, I know the question was players, that's, yeah, we get asked, we give our opinion on players, I mean, that's standard, right? We have to do that, everyone's single. But it'd be interesting when I got two guys playing for the US, when you play the

US, how much you want to know about, you know what I mean? And the thing for me is how much of the players share with each other. What's Stoney saying about Jack Eichel, you know, the night we play them? That'll be, because this is all new to me, so I'd be curious to go there. Yeah, we should be good. Okay. Watching the skate, the first practice, watching those five guys on your first power play,

they're the last guys on the ice. Crosby is pushing the putts and pushing the nets off the ice. Like, what's it like to coach players like that and see how they are both publicly and privately? For me, they're just low maintenance guys. They're a coach's dream. You know, like, you leave the room, they're preaching what we're saying, and then on the

ice, the work out, like, I know you guys are practice coaches and love practice, but to me, it's reps. And I was lucky enough to coach Sid as an assistant coach and I knew he was going to do that and all of a sudden Nick David, you know, talking to Paul Coffee said this guy's the last guy on the ice, McKinnon the last guy on the ice, you can go down the list with Carl Laskowski. These guys, if you don't get off, if the coaches don't get off the ice, they'll stay on the ice all day so the coach's dream. It's a good teaching point when you bring it back to your own team, these young guys

that are in a hurry to get out of there. Hey, take a look at this video. The five elite players on, well they're all elite, but out there working on trying to get it right, get it right so they can get better. You know what said everything about it to me was practice ended, so I went to go with you to go pick up the pucks with Misha, and they're all on their knees picking up pucks. All five of those guys. Someone should take a picture and send that to every minor hockey team.

No, talk about no ego, no entitlement. And coincidentally, they're all wearing letters. Yeah. And the guys that aren't are probably the next in line to wear them. That's the, you know, leading by example is a cliché. That is why they are who they are. Exactly. And they've got multiple rings to show for.

Okay. Last one on this one is how do you guys figure out who fits with who? Who plays with who? How much did you talk about and maybe take us through the process of creating your lines and your deep pairs? So what's tough about this is there's no training camp, right? So we're, it's all in information now and how we feel, you know, putting players in the best position to succeed. You know, for us, in our Zoom calls we would have and discussing the players once a team

was picked, but it's also getting the information from the players. So what type of player? It wasn't necessarily what names were being thrown around. I want to play with whatever, Barner or Jarvis or Pointe. It's more this type of player can help me. I'd like to have a shooter. I'd like to have a guy that can get putts off the wall. And so a lot of that information was big in how we went about this. And then, you know, you get a lot of that from the players and from what we see competing against these guys and, you know, obviously doing the best you can. We got a hope, as we talked about chemistry earlier, that these guys

reel that in pretty quick. I think Coop did an exceptional job of empowering the player through those conversations. You know, you'd meet with those guys when you played them or calls in the summer of not necessarily who but the type, you know, probably some suggestions on who. But, you know, I think that's critical because then they're part of the ownership of making it work, you know, and I think you did an exceptional job of that. No question. And the thing is that some might work, some might not,

but you need a foundation, or somewhere to start. And like you said, when the players, that's a great point. When they feel a part of it, and now it's got a better chance to work. The hard part too is, well, I shouldn't say the hard part, but a guy that can alter his game a little for the sake of the line. You can't have three guys that transport the puck.

Somebody might have to be a middle drive guy or whatever. And I think that's the hardest part, is to find the chemistry that way. And I think we went through that process and that's why you did a great job of talking to the players because you know you get guys across but he knows that he's gonna have to do this for that line or well it's the average fans thinks well put the three best players together it's automatically gonna work and well sometimes they all want the pucks you

need to get you know so the pieces they have to go together. What I like about this group is I feel whether we have the best players or not, I do feel we have a team. And just being around the guys, like we have, you can sense, we haven't played in a game yet, but you get the feeling that that's a team. Favorite memory watching or playing or coaching a team player? Mine was easy, 1972 against the Soviet Union. I was in a French elementary school in Ottawa and they brought the big TV out.

I don't know if you remember those ones with the long legs and the TVs up that high. It was Henderson who got the winner and they win the series so. I mean I just thought that that's the beginning for me of Canadian international hockey. We're old butchie that's why. I'm the same as you so you got my, the exact same, the rabbit ears

and the Buchanan high school, I mean elementary school but mine was I just loved Espo, that whole series. Yeah, his interview between the series when I moved to the Soviet Union. He was thinking, kicked off the ice, getting booed, remember giving a finger to the Russian fans. All that stuff was just... Well, he encouraged the Canadian fans

not to give up on them too, right? He said, hey, this isn't gonna be easy, but we're gonna get to our game. And he was good. He probably rallied the troops a little bit with that. That was my favorite. Mine would be probably Hamilton, Kana, Kupp, Zagretzky, drop pass to Lemieux.

Looked to Alvarez, no chance he was going to Larry Murphy. He's open. No, he's not. Doesn't matter. Just because it was in Canada and you know in Ontario, iconic moment. I'm the same. I think those three games, I don't know if that can ever be replicated. For just the swings of three nothing leads and blown leaves and all the games being 6-5 and overtime,

I think that was for me the coming out party of like international hockey. But I'll give you the one quick in 1984, I think the Olympics were in Sarajevo, I was going to High School in Notre Dame and I think it was James Patrick who was an alum and he was playing in the Olympics and so we'd be in school and they'd stop school when the game, when Team Canada played and wheeled the TV into the classrooms. We were like, oh, this is the best. Hopefully Canada's playing every day.

Didn't you play in Hamilton? Yeah. Yeah. You weren't on the ice on that goal? No, no. I was on the bench giving water to somebody. That had to be an experience. Yeah. Yeah, I think I was sharing the bench giving water to somebody. That had to be an experience. Yeah, I think I was sharing this story with when we went to training camp, we talked about how Gresky, Coffee, Massier, Anderson, Fuhrer,

how inviting they were, they brought the whole team together. You have multiple teams, they were incredible, and I think that's the team chemistry. that group really galvanized the team. You know, we had Ray Bork and Michelle Goulet and stuff like that. But yeah, that was, you got to remember too, that was when Russia, communism, who was the better Canada at hockey, the Russians, the Red Central Army. So there was a lot of hate in that. Not personal, but it was like a country hate and it was vicious those games.

It was a penalty every shift. If you actually watch that highlight, there's a penalty every shift. And maybe a suspension every shift. So it was pretty vicious. Who is the one player from history, Canadian history, if you could coach them, you would want to coach.

You mean hockey history? Yeah. Obviously. Has to be Canadian? Preferably, but if you want to switch, we'll go with it. All right, Rick, we'll go with you first. It was my guy, Guy Lefleur. I loved the flying Frenchman back in the day, and it's a flamboyant guy that can

score. It's my guy. Move around to Bruce. Bruce show it right there. Bobby Orr, my idol, revolutionized the game for his position. I thought he was miles ahead of everyone on the ice with tough, great offensive guy, but could play defense. So I would have loved to spend some time with him. Peter. Jumbo Joe Thornton. And you know what, I'm a little biased.

I know I should be picking a legend from the past, but I got the pleasure of coaching Joe for five years and never had more fun at the rink than with that guy every single day. I miss being around him. So I would love to be able to rewind the clock and be around him for another opportunity. I'm with the, sorry, we got to repeat. I'm with Butchi, Robert Gior.

Every time we play at TD Garden, that's where I look up. I got a perfect view of it. He was magic on ice. I'm a British Columbia kid, and my favorite team was the Boston Bruins, probably because of him and the way he played. He was special. OK, number two. That was great stuff, guys.

Thank you. Number two. Of all the players on the team Canada roster right now, who's someone that maybe you don't know, that you're looking forward to getting to know a bit? I see Peter is ready. So Cameron will go with Peter over here first. Kale McCarr, you know I've had the chance to coach Sydney and Marchant and some of these older guys on different world teams. It's amazing but I haven't had a

chance to work with Kale McCarr. Always seems to be playing in my division and we always seem to be playing him in the playoffs. Always admired his game from the other bench. Just looking forward to kind of get to know him. Let's go to John. Drew Doughty. I've been in the league now it seems you know over a decade now and he all I've got to see is this kid win and everywhere he plays he wins he wins he wins when we're playing

against them he's so actually entertaining his gamemanship everything everything he does, I marvel at. And now to have a chance to coach him later in his career, I just, I think he's a serial winner and I want to be around him. Yeah, I'm gonna say Connor McDavid, just from coaching Arizona for five years and then Vancouver now, all you're doing is scheming against him, pre-scouts, what are we gonna do to stop them, this this

that but I've really you know never really sat and talked to them or had a coffee with them and just hear stories about them through other people that that coach them and how great of a kid how he thinks the game so it'd be nice to sit down and get to know the guy and really you know know, hear the stories that every accolades that he has. So apparently he's an unbelievable kid. So I'd love to sit down and talk to him. I got Sid. Obviously, there's a lot of good choices in this one.

All three of those, they were right through my head. But Sid is the captain Canada. We would even talk about the Golden Goal in Vancouver for memories. I have never spent any time with Sid in any capacity in terms of coaching. So for me, a guy that's been around that long, that dedicated, I'm already excited. Just watched him this morning pull those guys on the ice to do a little extra for the power play. That's the guy I've been hearing about I know he's real good friends with Bergie and and Marsh so I hear a lot from them from the

Boston days but he's the guy I want to be around I'll give you this so in practice today I just happened to be whatever the drill was and Sid took off and went right by Bradayden Pointe and I. They just blew right by us. And Pointer looked at me and was like, this is unbelievable. It was just from being on the same ice as Sid and I. Yeah. All four special guys obviously.

And there's a lot. We left off Nate McKinnon. I've never... So there's so many guys. So many guys, but you've got to pick one for me to start there. Great choice. All right, last many guys, but you got to pick one for me that start there. All right, last one and then you guys are free. Hey Kelce, we ordering dinner. Last one. Canada needs a goal in the shootout. If it's up to you, who's going? Who's done, who's crunched the numbers on this one?

We need our goalie coach. I'll start. He should have shot. I can't play my hand. I can't play my hand in this team. Who was coaching that team? Mark Croft. Oh, actually Mark Croft it was. Mark's going to hate me for that.

I'm going with McDavid. I think we're pretty good hands if he's a pressure player. I went with Sid again just because he knows how to win and score at the right time. But I like 99. I like him. I went with McKinnon. I just think every time he touches the puck, it's probably going in. And he wants those big moments, seems like he does.

I thought Pete was gonna pick a defenseman. Yeah. I almost picked Theodore too, he's good at the shootout by the way. How do you build chemistry in such a small ground? Well, I think it takes place both on the ice and off the ice. I think an important element of it is just getting the guys together,

let them be around one another. For me, when you establish relationships off the ice, it carries over on the ice. So that's a big aspect of it. We got an opportunity here to practice a few times, put some players, some combinations together that we think are complementary, and then give them some reps.

And I think they got an opportunity through those repetitions to try to build some chemistry on the ice. For me, a big part of it starts off the ice. And I think fortunately for us, we've got a group that has had a fair amount of experience together, whether it be playing through the National Development Program. A lot of these guys, they have existing relationships through those experiences when they were younger. You know, you guys coached them at the National Development Program,

so you two guys probably know better than any of us. But for me, that's a big part of it. I believe in in the last, since 2016, I think, you know, the way the direction American hockey has gone, there's such a level of familiarity with all these guys. They all know each other. They've all played with each other in some point in time, whether it be at the national program, World Juniors, World Championships even. So, you know, we probably have a little bit of a leg up than we used to with that

because of the familiarity these guys have with each other and how often these guys have represented USA hockey. One of the things with this dynamic four games, I think you can build it within the tournament here too. A lot of building chemistry is through the experiences in games. The ebbs and flows, the momentum swings, the winning and the losing, how you won.

Just going through the experience of the games and in four games I think it's gonna build through that, through some of, we have Finland, then Canada's gonna be a game, and there's gonna be I think a little extra juice there. All the things you go through I think brings a team closer together in those type of situations. I agree.

I think with you guys, too, just seeing them together, that they've been all the different tournaments, World Championships, World Juniors, national program. You can see that there's a camaraderie within the group. But now it's getting them on the same page, how we want to play. And I think as you go through the tournament, the different results.

And even some of the guys that you talked to today that you know might be out of the lineup you can see just being in and around the lines you know they're asking those guys you want to jump in you want to you know so I think for us because of the experiences they've had together there's kind of an instant chemistry now it's just becoming a team. It's not easy. I think it's one of the biggest challenges you know like we've talked about we talked about this morning with our group, just the challenge of becoming a team as quickly and as efficiently as possible and the chemistry's an important aspect of it.

And we're gonna have to, we're gonna have to work at it. You know, we can't wait for it to organically evolve. We're gonna have to work at it. That's what I think. So everybody's gotta take some responsibility there and work at it. I like the day we had today. I think it was productive. I think the expectations are clear.

I think there's a lot of existing relationships that exist in that locker room that give us a chance to build on that. How challenging is it, or how is the process to decide who plays with who, how do you go through and figure that out? Want me to start? You're the head coach.

Yeah, so, you know, I know from coaching with you for a lot of years, I think you have a similar philosophy. You know, what I've always tried to do in Pittsburgh is, And with you, for a lot of years, I think you have a similar philosophy. You know, what I've always tried to do in Pittsburgh is, with the forwards, is to try to start with pairs and then backfill the line. So you know, what kind of complementary skill sets can we put together? You know, the objective is, we want to create some balance through our lineup, which is essential to winning.

In a tournament like this, it's a fairly simple task because the teams are so deep with talent, but balance is important. But I just think complementary skill sets are essential. So if you've got guys that have an inclination to score, who do we have that can get them the puck? Who do we have that are more pass-first guys, that are playmakers? That's something that I thought about when we were talking about our line combinations. I think we need an element of speed on every line.

And so I think speed kills. It's the ultimate competitive advantage. And certainly we've got an abundance of that with the group also. And I think the same thing with the defense fairs in the back end. Just trying to find complementary skill sets where these guys have the ability to work together

and build some chemistry. Like we talked about, we can look at that lineup all day long and come up with all different type situations. I think if we're just talking about the chemistry, how that builds through the tournament, we're going to see that during the game. You'll see it during the game. Is it working? Right.

Or maybe this. I think you'll refine that with such a great group of athletes it's a little bit different than our National Hockey League teams right because you have your top six in your third and have your fourth line guys so fourth line guys here right so it's gonna be interesting to see who who measures with who and I agree with you Selly. If a coach tells you you can get all three,

you figure out all three that they can play with one another, they're lying. It's hard enough to try to get two to go with one another. Yeah, sure is. And then you just go through the experience. And you find what works. And maybe let's change this here and see if that goes. The other aspect of it is you never really

know until you put them together. No. You think on paper, hey this should work, and we've all had experiences where it didn't for whatever reason, right? That's the human element. So you never really know until you see it unfold, you know, on the ice. The other difference is obviously during the course of the NHL season you have a little bit more time to let things evolve. Here, you know, you probably have a quicker trigger to make changes because you don't have time. It's only a four-game tournament.

So we've got to make the judgment of, you know, is this just not working or is it just, you know, whatever the circumstances are, you know, we just won't have the time to let this thing evolve. We've got to hope for instant chemistry and if it's not happening, we're gonna make the appropriate changes. How honest are you about your own NHL players who are playing for different countries than the United States? What do you mean how honest? Like, for example, I'll give you a story. One of the players in Team Canada in 2014 at the Olympics said that they were really challenged by the coaching staff before they played games against their own teammates in the NHL. Break down these players for us. Tell us how we're gonna beat them and how we're gonna get

out what are their weaknesses. So that's my question is how honest are you about your own players who are playing for Canada. Nice to meet you. Okay. That's your question, Clive. They're all his questions. Are you going to ask us? Well my initial reaction to that is I think in today's game with the technology that exists, the familiarity that these players have, I don't know that there are any secrets. I think these guys know each other so well. They've played against either with or against one another

so often. For me, I'm not sure the secrets exist. So I just think technology has played such a role in that. And the preparation process. Hey listen, we played, we're in the same division. We play each other so many times. I'm fairly certain you know how our players tick and I can do the same for your guys.

And I think the players know each other more than anybody. Yeah. With all the different tournaments they play in. So I'm not sure there's anything we can offer these guys that's gonna crack the code. That they don't already know. I think the players will talk. And that's more important than us talking to them,

the players talking to them. I think a player will talk if you're gonna face maybe a goalie or whatever, they might say, hey, this is what it is, but I think they probably talk more than we would directly about player. Yeah. The amount of pre-scouting that goes on in our NHL season with other teams that

you're playing against and how often you play against them, there are no secrets. Right. But a lot of times these guys are playing against each other anyways. Right? If we're playing Pittsburgh, then X probably playing against Crosby, and they're going to probably play against them in the tournament. They've all played against each other when they're doing the matchups at home, so I think it'd be the same.

Greatest memory, whether coach, player, or just a hockey fan, of watching Team USA? I don't know where the hell I was, but his goal. Yeah, I mean, that has to be one of the most memorable American events. I think it was a catalyst for American hockey, especially being in the Boston area with some of the guys who played on that team, so many of them from Boston. I know as a young kid for me that was without a doubt

was an inspirational moment. You know, when you're playing street hockey or you're on the pond, you know. You want to be a Ruzione, Jack O'Callaghan. Yeah, yeah. And then what he did with the award ceremony, waving everybody out. Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, I mean. Anyone in our era, that's it for every American hockey fan or player. Yeah. We even want to go back to Lake Platte. Anytime you're ever going back there, it's got the mystique about it. It does. The history with it, which makes it special. Changed American hockey forever, really.

Yeah. Okay, whiteboards. Okay. Elliot. Yeah. How are we going to come up with the, what's the question? Okay. The U.S. player?

The, the question is, how are we going to come up with the, how are we going to come up with the history of the league? Yeah. The history of the league. Yeah. The history of the league. Yeah. Okay. White boards. Okay. Elliot. Yeah. How am I, how are we gonna come up with them? What's the question? Okay. The US player? The American player from history. Are these erasable? Yes. Okay. Can be. I don't

look at the recent. I don't have to share. A reef is their own. Or a historical player that you would love to coach. I think it's hard. That's hard to do it right now. Okay. You can do it. Yeah. Neil brought... I thought of him.

Okay. Well, I got a guy. It's a guy that if you coach... I coach those guys already. So what are we doing with these? Are we going to just... You know, you're going to write it and we're going to show going to just you know, you're going to write it and we're going to show it to the camera.

Write it and then we're going to show it to the camera that I haven't coached that player that you American player that you haven't coached, not active, that you would love to coach if you ever had the opportunity. American player.

OK, we'll do that one third. So I got to think about that one, because like some of the, you know, like like Madonna or like that. Yeah. So I was I about that one, because some of the, you know, like. Like Madonna or people like that. Yeah, so I coached that Olympic team at Labia and those guys were all on it, so they're disqualified for me. I'm gonna have to go back to like the 80 Olympic team. Yeah, well that's what you have, yeah.

Or if you wanna say I wanna coach someone again, I'll make it easier. All right. There you go. Yeah, okay. So the first, oh, let me get out of the way. Well, I have a big, not a big name, but a grinder that I love. Anybody, like the thing is, John, like I think you, I think wherever you say

people are gonna wanna hear, it doesn't have to be a star. They're gonna be like, why? They'll be very interested in that. I know, I have a guy. Okay, first question. Who is a player on this current Team USA that maybe you don't know, you're looking forward

to getting to know a little bit better or see up close a little bit more? As a player? As a player. As a player. Just write it down? Yep. I don't have a pen. Well, you'll get a pen in a second.

I got JT Miller. I just think JT, I've never had the opportunity to work with him But I've always respected him coaching against him his competitive nature You know his personality seems to me like he's a guy that can rise to the occasion and high stakes environments I've always he's always been a player that you notice when you coach against them So I'm excited. I throw my USA hockey experience I've never had the opportunity to work with them, but certainly respected them as a player and excited to get to know them and have the opportunity to work with them. Let's go with Mike. Okay, I have two. Okay, that's fine.

Perfectly fine. Okay, Austin Matthews is my first one and I've got to know him a little bit through this process. But I just look forward to watching his game up close. Obviously, I've got a ton of respect for what he's accomplished in the league. And being on the opposite bench, he's always been a guy that I would like to be on the same bench with. So to see him up close and to get to know him as a person, I look forward to that opportunity.

The other guy is Brady Kichuk. And the reason that I chose Brady is I know Brady a little bit, I obviously know his father very well. I remember him as a young kid when I played with his dad in Phoenix, but he's just a menace. And every time we play against Ottawa, he's a guy that is hard to play against. And he drags his teams into the fight, so to speak.

And I think he's gonna do the same for us. David? Austin Matthews as well. Had the chance to recruit him at BU. That didn't work out. Obviously he's evolved into one of the great Americans and you know I knew him a little bit but certainly an opportunity here to coach him and get to know him a lot more as a player but also as a person. I remember watching him at the US National Program and thinking what a special player he was back then and it

was Bert. He was a young player for his age group so academically he was a year behind those guys. So college, especially the way his career was developing at the National Program, it didn't look like he was gonna go to college because it looked like he was gonna be the first pick overall and you know I've just you know admired him as a player so much from the first time I saw him and just looking forward to coaching the first time I saw him and just looking forward to coaching him and getting to know him. Okay. And John.

Two, two players. Jack Eichel. First time I met him was today. The thing, the thing that I've watched him from afar, coaching other teams, I watch where he's come to after leaving Buffalo, where I think a lot was heaped on him. A lot of pressure was put on him to be a captain in an organization that was trying to find its way.

And then watch him when he goes to Vegas and just watch how he has grown into what I never thought he would be, a 200-foot player where he does it on both ends. I just I just watched the first practice up close on the first time on the ice with him and and just amazing skill and just just everything how fluent he is as a player. It's so impressive. So I think he's really grown and I respect that in guys that are stars that keep adding to their game. Matthew Kachuck, I was coaching Sully at that time in Phoenix when the two Kachuck boys,

Walt's kids, were young. Knew him back then a little bit with Chantel and all the whole family. I just want to see him up close and personal on a bench. I want to be on the same bench with him. I think he's added so much and stabilized that Florida team. He has given him so much personality. I want to see him. I want to hear what he has to say on the bench. All the things you watch on TV and watch him play and what he's added to the NHL, I want to see it up close and personal when we get going on this stuff.

There's one more guy that I'm really looking forward to coaching that maybe this doesn't fit the criteria, but that's my son-in-law. For obvious reasons. Charlie McEvoy is a great kid, means the world to my family and my daughter and to have the opportunity to coach him in a tournament like this is for me is an incredible privilege. So I get emotional when I think about it because it means a lot to our family. I get emotional when I think about it because it means a lot to our family. Quite honestly, it's hard. It's a bad question to try to pick out one or two guys because quite honestly all of them are really interesting to us.

Because I think we respect them so much as far as what they've done at the game. As you're talking you think, oh I could have picked him. Yeah, yeah. Do all the rounds. That's a beautiful answer Mike. Okay, second question. We'll Do all the rounds. Keep rattling. Do all the names off. That's a beautiful answer, Mike. OK, second question. We'll go with the one I mentioned before. If there's an American player from the past that you would love the opportunity to coach

or coach again, who would it be? Jack O'Callaghan. The U guy, played on the 80 Olympic team. I've got to know him over the last 30 years. I remember watching him play in 1978 the Providence Civic Center for BU and I was 12 years old. It was the first college hockey game I ever went to and BU was playing Wisconsin. Jack Parker had the plaid jacket on and BU steamrolled Wisconsin and went the next night watching BBC and became a BU fan that night

and Jack O'Callaghan was kind of the coolest guy in the building and probably one of the best players in the building and he went on to have a great career and win the Olympic gold medal and so Jack O'Callaghan. That's nice. John? Mike Ramsey. Buffalo Sabre. I had just come into the National Hockey League as an assistant coach. Never played in the league and just trying to find my way and I watched how competitive Mike was.

One of the great shot blockers in our game back in the day then. The game was played differently. I was fortunate as a young coach to learn from him. I spent a number of years with him. I was there for six years. And Rammer was a kind of defined what a pro was for me early on in my career. I know it's not a sexy name, but he was a warrior. So I just have a ton of respect for him.

Haven't seen him for years, but it just gave me an unbelievable opportunity to see what it is to be a pro early on when I started coaching. John? Mine would be Dave Silk. I think he was a guy obviously on the 80 Olympic team and a BU guy, but he specifically had a big impact on me in my freshman year at BU. He was like a volunteer coach, and I'll never forget he and Jack took us to lunch, all the freshmen together, and he kind of laid the ground rules of what it means to have work ethic and what it means to play at BU.

First guy on, last guy off the ice. He spent a lot of time with our freshman class. And you see the history, like what he was like as a player, but the intensity level, the work ethic, the care that he put into some of us while he was there for a couple of years made a big, big impact on me. I still stay in touch or had stayed in touch with him for a long time when I went into coaching and seeing his personality and how he was as a coach and respecting him as much. I think he'd be a fun guy to be able to go back and reciprocate as a coach to him and some of the lessons and the impact that he had on me. I have Brian Leach and Chris Cellios who I both had the privilege to coach.

I coached Brian Leach's last year in the NHL in Boston. I coached Chris Cellios as an assistant coach in the Olympic with the Olympic team in Torino. I want to say 2006 I think. These guys are part of our peer group. I just wish I had more of an opportunity to coach them longer. I just have so much respect for both of those guys and how good they were and how they impacted how the game is being played. I think they're arguably the two best American-born defensemen to play the game. And I just wish I had a longer experience to coach these guys because I got a little bit

of a window into how competitive they were. But for me, these guys were two savants of the game during our generation. And I just, I can't tell you how much respect I have for them as players, but also just how competitive they were and their appetite to win. And so those are two guys that I wish I had the opportunity to coach for a longer period of time.

Okay, last one guys, thank you very much. I had the opportunity to coach for a longer period of time. OK. Last one, guys. Thank you very much. And the question here is pretty simple. Team USA needs a shootout goal. Absolutely has to have it. If it's up to you, who's going over the boards? I'll go first.

Austin Matthews. I think he's a pure goal scorer, and I think he would be at his best when the stakes are high. I second that. I'll go second. I'll go after you. Obviously, it's an unbelievable choice. I'll go another name.

I'll go Jack Eichel. Because he's that good. Yeah. Tough question, like you guys said. You could pick numerous guys. But I probably would go with Austin. I'll go with Jack Eichel. For all the reasons that we've talked about,

but I could pick 10 other guys for the same reason. So it's not a clear cut winner, but for the same reason that you would pick Austin, I'd pick Jack, same exact reason. Something about a righty too, going in on a goalie. All right, thanks again to Team Canada, Team USA, their staff and the mind of Jeremy McElhaney for putting all that together. That'll do it for us here this episode of 32 Thoughts.

A reminder here on Monday, if you're catching this episode in time, the afternoon affair from Boston, Canada, Finland, a regulation win for either country, puts them into the final against the Americans. We'll have a pregame show for you at 1230 Eastern, 930 a.m. Pacific time on Sportsnet, also on Sportsnet Plus, the Nightcap, Team USA, and Team Sweden. We'll see if that one means anything for the Swedes.

We'll be back on the air at eight Eastern, five Pacific from the TD Garden in Boston, once again on Sportsnet and Sportsnet Plus. Only so many hours in a day, we appreciate you spending a few of them here once again with us. As always, we'll talk to you again on Friday. Have a great week.