5 Live Boxing with Steve Bunce - Ben Shalom and the BBC

Episode Date: October 20, 2025

Ahead of his first promoted fight on the BBC, Boxxer CEO Ben Shalom joins Buncey for an in-depth conversation about the new partnership. He explains how the landmark deal with the BBC was reached, what it means for the sport to return to free-to-air television, and how he sees the next chapter for British boxing.

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You know the clip where he flicks the ball up in the air and it lands on his head, his neck, his knee, shoulder, chest, thigh, breast, wings. other knee, cheek, hand, toe and his mighty eyebrow. Well, that's a bit like heavyweight boxing right now. All the heavyweights and their plans are up in the air. Tyson Fury is back in the gym. He wants to fight Usik, but he doesn't want to fight AJ. That's the rumor.

AJ might fight in Ghana in December. Alexander Usik will fight again. He's not retired, he's going to fight again. Derek Del Boy Chizorra was going to fight Jalajang, the joint Chinese boxer. But it's now more likely on December the 13th than he'll fight Big Baby Miller. Moses Itama will not be fighting Alexander Usik

or Kubrat Puleb any time soon. Fabio Wardley and Joseph Parker will fight at the O2 on Saturday and what a fight that is, by the way, more on that fight later in the week. And if that wasn't enough chaos, the planned British heavyweight title fight on Saturday in Derby between Fraser Clark and Jamie TKV,

which was to be the first of Boxer's new deal with the BBC was scrapped and that fight will be on BBC 2 on November the 29th. I sat down with Ben Shalom, the boss of boxer, to find out a little bit more about his business and to try and make sense of this sport. I'm Steve Bunce and this is Five Live Boxing. Ben, first of all, how are we? I'm very well.

It's been a summer of hard work And it's been a summer of transition, which is, I think, good as well. I mean, I remember when I first started, I think we were on Five Spike. We've done stuff with ITV. We've done stuff with BT. I did loads of that with you. We then did, we went to Sky. So I think this is the last broadcaster on the list.

Hey, listen, never say last broadcast. I never thought, to be honest, that I get the BBC. I'd been, you know, chatting. There's been various people at the BBC. and been chatting them for a while about how can we get boxing back on on primetime television, especially on the BBC. So it's been a long process, actually. And so, yeah, I'm delighted to now to now be upon us and excited, apprehensive,

because you just never know, boxing is an unpredictable sport at the best of time. So to put it on a platform like this is going to be pretty special. But yeah, very, very excited. We'll start with a British every tight enough up. Before we talk about that and talk about some of the other. fighters and some of the great nights during the Sky arrangement, business, whatever you want to call it, the deal, the contract. Why did it end? Why did the Sky deal with it? What's the official line? Because there's a zillion trillion versions and I can't just use them. I need to,

hear it from you. Why did the Sky deal end? Look, I think I started working with Sky. I was 26 years old. I'd been, we'd gone in there with Top Rank. Top Rank did. the deal and I think I was seen as part of the deal and and so it wasn't like here you go hear the keys of the kingdom plan think about what you want to do it was very much we were within a structure and we're working with was someone and we're working with with top rank yeah and I think we rose to the top in that situation over time we signed some great fighters who did you have when we worked for the door at sky no one this is I like this story I know this story's true no one I mean You kind of did a Don King if you don't mind me saying so.

You went in somewhere, it said, this is what I can get. Right now I've got nothing, but this is what I can get. Is that basically it? It was a complete standing start. Completely. And it was a whirlwind. As I said, I've been on different broadcasters. I've done different things.

But this was something new. And I remember myself and Adam Smith, we got in the car. We went around the country. We went to every hotel. We went to every house. We went to every parents. It was a great time. because the Olympics had just finished in Tokyo.

2021 Olympics in Tokyo. And so there was a lot of opportunity, but there was a lot of hard work. And we had to, yeah, it was starting from scratch and pick up scraps. I mean, that was the order of the day. And it was a difficult time for Sky because they just invested in all these fighters

for so many years that had left overnight. So it was a big job. But as I said, there was top rank, there was Wasserman. I think the early days we did some co-promotions with Wasserman, if you were remembering for the first night was. And top rank with Catra Katra Taylor and then we managed to develop and come into our own.

And from then, I'm extremely proud of what we achieved from a standing star. Huge, huge nights, huge breaking records, huge pay-per-view events and did some historic things for women's boxing as well. And so there's two mad nights, the O2 back in 2022 with Savannah Marshall and Closier's at the top. And of course, the incredible knight, they're all out with Lauren Price, gold medalist from 2021 against Natasha Jonas, both memorable, unforgettable. iconic nights.

Yeah, and creating stars from scratch really. And it was a process, but it was an unbelievable. It was an unbelievable, I'd say three years when we really got into it. Once you could sign the four,

it was a four meddalysts you signed? Yeah, signed four middle lists. And I did our first pay-per-view events. And it was a tricky landscape at the time in terms of the boxing politics. But we... That means you on the outside looking in and the doors were firmly closed.

Is that the translation of tricky? I think that's what it has. been since I got my promoter's licence and that's what it was but we managed to establish ourselves pretty quickly we managed to develop fighters pretty quickly we managed to put on some huge main events quite consistently

and probably the biggest events in British boxing during that period Mimir Khan and Kelbrook was one of those and obviously a monumental night and then the two Chris Eubank Liam Smith Knights those three nights there would be good in anyone's promotional CV wouldn't they

I think it was yeah it was unbelievable ball, I believe, from a standing start and it was an amazing journey. I think the biggest achievements for us were perhaps picking up fighters like Savannah Marshall, like Chris Bill and Smith fighters that, even the Tyler Denny's that we had to go for

that were free agents that were sort of loiting around the middle of cars and getting opportunities and taking them to become a world champions and headlighting outdoors in football stadiums. Headline stadiums and I think those are the things that you remember as a promoter because those are the toughest challenges. So when it was coming to an end earlier like I'm assuming it was early this year when you start to look into

renegotiate did you know in your gut Ben that it that that that that you weren't going to get what you wanted from I've got to be careful how we were this one we weren't going to get what you wanted from Sky was it obvious to you I've got to be careful as well I understand that I think during the period it was very difficult at times because you're the promoter on the front of and it's your promotion, it's your license, but you're not making the decisions or you're not being able to do certain things that you want to do.

And I'm so passionate about boxing, I think it should be the number one sport, and they have other priorities and other things as well. And yeah, I think there were a lot of changes at Sky during the time that I was there. A lot of changes, a lot of changes in leadership, a lot of changes in direction, a lot of changes. And yeah, and who was around,

boxing and so I knew it was going to be tricky and I think ultimately as well it got to the point where as I say you want to do your own thing you want to be able to make calls you want to be able to put on fights that you want to put on and you want to be able to do things and I think it got to a point where I know I'm still young but I got to a point where you know what I'm 30 years old now I know the sport I'm my own man I can I want to be able to do what I want and and so yeah I think with all the changes going on there and what perhaps how they viewed the sport it was it was for me maybe time to step step into my own into my own self and I want to do my own things and I knew there were other opportunities out there and for us and for myself that perhaps would give me that um independence where

where I could really grow the business I mean I assumed from talking to you after the last show you did Callum Simpson outdoors, 23,000 people, unbelievable night that was. I mean, you know, it gets dropped a couple of times, unbelievable European Trial Fight, great atmosphere. I assumed from talking to you late that night at the back, you know, quite late, that you said, look, there's some big news coming, there's some news coming. I assumed it was a disown deal. That's what everyone assumed.

Look, I think if you look at that last 12 months, I mean, the whole, we talked about the big stuff on Skype, but that last 12 months, I think we started the year with Simpson. We then went into Adam Azim against Sergei Lipn. That's where he had a huge performance. We then did the historic Albert Hall night, the women's night. We then had Eubank Ben, which was the biggest show

of the year. We then had Whitaker in his rematch. We then had Callum Simpson in his outdoor stadium. We had huge wins for Vidal Riley and Caroline and Lauren. And it was just that was just this year alone. And so I think sometimes

the job that we did on the budget that we had with the restrictions in place, with the promoters that we were battling with, not just externally, but on the same platform. I think we did a phenomenal job. And I think it's only with hindsight, and I think it's only with that history will show how good a job we really did.

And I think, yeah, it got to the point where there was so many changes going on and that we had to make a big change. And as you said, I knew when we spoke after the Callum Simpson fight, what it was gonna be. I had an inkling that, we were going to get it over the line and we managed to get to a point where we could agree terms with with the BBC. It's not the end of our announcements. It's not the end of things that we

have in the pipeline, but that was certainly like the first thing that we wanted to put our marker down on. And just to explain to me, my understanding of the BBC deal is four fights in a 12-month period. Is that the case? No, it's not. I know a lot of a lot of promoters That's what I'm talking to you. I mean, when it was first rumoured that we were going to do the agreement with BBC, I was told that it was I player. I was then told it was, you know,

this was by other promoters. I was then told it was going to be this, it was going to be that, or maybe it was BBC 3. There was no way it was BBC 2. Tuesday night, Sunday afternoon. Then suddenly BBC 2, then suddenly it's four fights,

then whatever, whatever. We've got a long-term picture with the BBC. Multiple shows for what we want to create is something that has never, been done before we believe we've put in place are you a commercial structure that's taken a long long time to get in place where we can put monster shows on the bbc big big nights and big big fights and i think that's going to be a powerful combination that's something that in fairness the leadership at the bbc who wanted make a big change and want to make a big splash have

bought into and i couldn't be more grateful but also delighted for boxing because boxing is on pay tv platforms at the moment it's it's in a situation where the man in the street is not watching it every week and that can only harm our sport long term. So to be able to put boxing regularly on the BBC, on prime time, on channels like BBC too, it's a big responsibility, but something that is really, really key for the sport. So could there be more than four fights in a 2012-month period?

I would like at least eight shows within the first 12 months. The traditional way when a promoter leaves one broadcaster and goes to another, broadcaster is because the new broadcaster has come up with a massive financial plan to win the guy over to take his fighters now i don't need to ask you if that's the deal with the bbc because i know that's not the deal with the bbc i'm not saying you're fighting for peanuts but it's not it's not the deal so does that does that give you different obstacles to overcome them ben 100% it does i think we were left with a choice whether we at the stage of that i am in my career and the the promotions at to go on a pay TV platform, probably be paid directly by them a lot more money than perhaps

on the BBC, or take our brand, take our fighters, take the opportunity onto the biggest platform. And when we managed to get the green light from BBC, for me, it was just an opportunity I couldn't turn down. It's historic. It's something exciting. And then the work had to start on finding the right commercial partners to make it work and put on the biggest shows possible. And I have to say, we've exceeded my expectations,

what we've managed to put together, what we've managed to bring together. I think by parties that are interested in British boxing success and that are interesting in... I saw Anthony Crowley's comments recently around the British boxing shows are suffering. And I think we've managed to bring a collection of partners that care about that

and the one I put on huge British boxing events for free on the BBC and so yeah with that not in place it's a tricky one to navigate it's a tricky one to put on the types of fights that we want to put on and so yeah we're in a we're in a very very strong place now to do something historic now during this period when between the the Callum Simpson fight and the official announcement of the BBC deal and then the official announcement of the first fight the Fraser Clark fight in Derby a British title fight there There were all sorts of rumors flowing around, and one of them, and I was out in Saudi Arabia, back in August, whatever.

The idea was that you had no fighters left. Everyone was going to leave you. You wouldn't have a single fighter on the car. Now, we've got Fraser Clark on the fight. You've mentioned that Adam Azim will be boxing at some point next year, and there's lots of other dates. Ben Whittaker, silver medalist from 2021, has announced in the last 100 or so hours, 200 or so hours that he's going to be fighting for matchroom from now on. So can you talk me through maybe some of the other fighters?

Adam and Zeme we've established we've fighting in the new year. The deal with Ben, the end of the deal with Ben Whitaker, was that just the straightforward stand-alone, boxers decides he wants to go somewhere else? No, I think, look, every broadcaster that you take on has, you have to cut your cloth accordingly, and you have to make decisions that are right for that platform. Did we want Ben Whittaker to fight on the BBC? Absolutely.

Had we done a huge amount for Ben Whittaker through injuries, through difficult times, through difficult times in his career, had we done more than we'd ever promised, more than ever could be thought about delivering, especially for a fighter within 10 fights? Absolutely. But ultimately, money talks in certain situations. And I think, you know, advisors around him perhaps saw a short-term opportunity to do that. That happens in boxing.

You've benefited from that. In the sense, you've got Chris Eubank, on his third or fourth promoter or ninth promoter or 11 promoter or whatever it is. It happens in boxing. It's something that perhaps I'll be able to talk about in due course at more length. But for me...

Your diplomacy is brilliant, by the way. I love it. I'm very much enjoying it. Look, I have to be focused on the fact that we have a huge deal now with the BBC. And we have fighters that have a huge deal. opportunity which comes with you know there is a danger in fighting in front of millions of people there is a pressure with fighting in front of millions of

of people there is also the pressure that with the BBC we're going to have to put on fights that are competitive at the top of the bill we are going to have to put on 50 50 fights in that sense and so that's going to suit certain fighters that's going to suit certain names and a museum is going to love that isn't it let's get that right suit fighters that want to become household names William Simpson's going to love that. Exactly. And I think we're in a spot, though, where there will be changes to our stable.

There will be fighters that we believe, and our broadcaster believes, suits their platform and can take on that platform. There will be fighters that, unfortunately, the broadcaster may not, may not. And I'm not saying that about any certain fighters. I'm not saying that about Ben. It's just it changes. If I've gone to the zone, there's certain fighters that they want. Be the same thing.

If I go to Sky, there's certain fighters. fighters, they want a certain thing, they want to prioritize, and the same with the BBC, and that's the way you promote a work. Can I ask you about a trio of women, Caroline Dubois, Caris Artenstool, and Lauren Price. Lauren, of course, is a world champion. Caris, I think, is the British champion, Olympic medalist like Lauren, and Caroline is one of the, one of the best female fighters in the world. Can I ask you about that trio? Caris and Caroline were due to fight in October, actually, on this show. Both of them had small injuries. Karis was going to fight for the European.

Caroline was going to defend WBC. A version of the title, yeah. And so we will be looking at something this day. I mean, Jake McGuigan was on the phone to me last week asking if Caroline could get out before the end of the year. Lauren is due to fight and we're due to go

to Cardiff. And that's a BBC gig. Could that be a BBC game? That's the plan is that that will be a BBC show. And yeah, so it's a big moment for Lauren's career. We tried to make the Michaela Mayer fight in August against over in Vegas, and the money just wasn't there from top rank to be able to do it.

And so she'll defend her world titles and then look for that unification fight. The best B2B marketing gets wasted on the wrong people. So when you want to reach the right professionals, use LinkedIn ads. LinkedIn has grown to a network of over 1 billion professionals, including 130 million decision makers, and that's where it stands apart from other ad buys. You can target your buyers by job title, industry, company, role, seniority, skills,

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customers internationally. Be smart, get wise. Download the wise app today or visit wise.com. T's and C's apply. Spring is here and the shopping list is long. Time to make a lows run. Buy three bags, get three free of stay green one cubic foot garden soil. Plus, right now, members can earn four times the points on an eligible purchase. Start spring off strong with these deals and more. Our best lineup is here at Lowe's. Valeth of 325, while supplies last. Soil offer excludes Alaska and Hawaii.

Loyalty program subject to terms and conditions. See Lowe's.com slash terms for details. Subject to change. Point boosters subject to exclusions and more terms apply. One-time only offer. Can you make a Michaela Meyer, Lauren Price deal? with maybe using your sponsors extra. Could you make that fight for the UK?

We could. Michaela, we'd love to come over here. What we can see, though, I've had Michaela, you know, two or three times on my show. She is desperate not to come to the UK for this fight. Judges or whatever happening in the Natasha Jonas fight. It was what it was. If we could get her over to Cardiff, we would put that on immediately.

But at the moment, she is not willing to come to Cardiff, and that's the difficulty we're putting on that fight. And are there some more signings coming in? And I don't expect you to name them. But are there one or two people? And are they new, fresh, or established fighters that are transient? Look, I have to be honest. I mean, you learn as a promoter as well, what you want and what you're thinking about

and what you really value. And I think I look at it now and I want rough diamonds. I want the Callum Simpsons. I want the Adam Azemes. I want the guys that want to take fights, that want to get to the top of the sport, they want to put in the work. And so did the BBC.

And so there's fighters out there. I mean, Aaron McKenna's another fighter that I look at and I see. And I think you could, with your right opportunities, can go right to the very, very top. And so those are the fighters, I think, for us, at the end of the day, with a British broadcaster, with a state broadcaster, we're going to focus on British fighters.

And we're going to focus on trying to create household names. And so anyone that can fit. that bill is what we'll be doing. But it will mean that we will be reducing our stable and we will have to focus on certain findings. But we might, if you look at it like from a chef in point of view, we're just going to make that sauce just a little bit purer, just a little bit richer, not a gallon of it,

just a little cup full of sauce, so just the best. I like the idea of domestic v domestic. I like British v British. I think that it would be worked perfectly. And one guy can stick in with my condescending. dense source who never fails to deliver. Chris Bill and Smith, CBS. Now, did I read recently that there was no purse bid for a fight of his?

I would have thought CBS would have worked on the B. You know, with that old-fashioned throwback to the 50s style. He 100% would. I think we want to get the right fight and he wants to, look, he's been fighting the biggest names in the Cruiserweight Division and been earning huge, huge money. And so sometimes it's, that's what you want to continue. to do and you want to continue to have those names.

And so there was a purse bid last week. I think we'd spoken to the other side and they've agreed to put it back five days. So that purse bid will come around pretty quickly. But ultimately, Chris wants the big names. He's not got time to mess around. He's been to the top of the mountain. He's defended his titles. He's not had to mess around.

He's probably, let's be honest, got a couple of fights left and he wants them to be the biggest they possibly can be. And so that's the challenge now. But for me, he's still one of the biggest names in the cruise away. division and there should be a lot of fights out there for it. Has it been difficult the last few years putting on big British fights with, you know, the problems that we've had with so many great British fights not taking place in Britain because of the Saudi money?

Has that been difficult? I mean, and it's not a criticism, it's just a fact. You know, the great fights we've had on Saudi cards, which would be, they're still great in Saudi and men are making plenty of money. It's absolutely fabulous for them. But they'd be enormous fights here. I'm thinking a little bit of, like last year, or was it last year, Bwazzi and Danaziz.

Unbelievable fight. Now, it was, it was made because it was at Pack Wembley. It was just one of the all-time. It was just a really classic British title fight. Sort of thing you want to put on the B-ball all night long, as I was on a certain. That had been in Saudi, and it's not a criticism of Turkey, Alishak.

This is just the fact. That could have been lost. 100%. Lost the British boxing. You understand what I'm saying? We've lost a lot of fights, but we've also seen a lot of fights that we wouldn't have otherwise seen.

Absolutely bingo. That's why it's not a criticism. I think, I was, with his excellency a couple weeks ago. No name job in, Ben. No name job in allowed, we don't do name jobbing. This is what we talked about. And I said to him, you know,

you've got a long-term vision for rehab season, but you also got a passion for boxing, and in particular British boxing, we've got to make sure that it's healthy. We've got to make sure we're putting on the big shows in Britain as well. That's going to feed the system, that's going to create the next stars, that's going to create the next names.

And he's right behind me. He's right behind me in terms of the shows that we can put on in this country is right behind me in terms of bringing big british shows to this country and i'm broadcasting them as far and wide as possible and so i think we all recognize it including him himself and uh and i have to commend him because every time i sit with him he he shows me a passion for boxing that goes far beyond anything that i've seen before and i think everyone wants to address that and i feel the responsibility to i mean you look at the two two other promoters and on the same platform.

And it's a great platform for boxing and it's one that has done wonders for boxing. I feel responsibility with terrestrial television to make sure that British boxing remains as popular as it can be and continues to grow. Fraser Clark, Jamie TKV. I think Fraser might start as the slight favorite. Obviously, he's been in British title fights.

Well, you had a monster night with him last year at the O2 on a Sunday afternoon, which I love that in his 12 round draw. with Fabio Wally. That was a sense. That's one we forgot about. We were doing a little list of your big nights

in the last four years. That was a monster. I think with Fraser, one thing that I've sat down with the BBC is how do we create those heroes that everyday, you know, obviously God bless him.

We were Ricky Hutton funeral last Friday and those types of characters inspire you. Those type of characters inspire your boxing. Fraser Clark is the man down the pub. Is the everyday guy. And that's why he's become so popular so quickly.

and Wardley Clark won, as you said, broke all records on Sky. It was the highest viewed heavyweight fight they've ever had outside of pay-per-view. It was absolutely enormous and people fell in love with Fraser Clark's story. Then to go and see him have that career-threatening injury in Saudi Arabia and everyone got around him

and then he came back so quickly. He was out fighting before Fabio was in April and looked big and looked strong and looked ready to go. The British title was always his dream. I think he still breaks records in terms of the number of fights is taken to win a British title if he wins on October the 25th. He's more hungry than ever.

He's on a platform that will only help him grow even further. And he's against the fighter that I think a lot of people after what happened when David Adelaide do fancy in the fight. So it's a great British fight, but for Fraser Clark, this is a real moment for him to become a household name. It really is. Was it important to you to have a British heavyweight title fight

as the main? I mean, I'm sure you'd love to go on with Michaela Meyer and Lauren Price at the Royal Alba. behold, but once we step down from that, it's that British heavyweight title, which we associate with a baby. It hasn't been one for 25 years, I don't think, on the BBC Heavyweight, British Heavyweight Title Fire. But it's very much a kind of, you think about it, you know, even if it's fights that were happened 20 years before you were born, you know about those fights. Yeah, it's, I think it will be something that goes down in history. And so

you think of everything that you've achieved as a promoter, as it achieved in the sports, to put a British heavyweight title in this day and age where pay TV, we're all, and all the money involved, a British heavyweight title that no one can argue with on BBC 2. When that opportunity came up, it was huge, but obviously we've worked with both lads for a long time. We've watched their development. We've watched their journey to this point.

Both of them are in a no-lose situation, if we're honest. And it's going to be a compelling fight. But, yeah, I think the magic of a British towel on a platform like this is very exciting. And Francesca Hennessy will dance her way to the ring, no doubt taking four or five minutes. Explain to someone who's never seen Francesca Hennessy's ringwalk and how she fights. Just, dude, sum it up in a paragraph or two.

Look, she's 20 years old. Yeah, which people forget. The youngest, I believe, professional female fighter in the UK. She was, I think. She's just been beat by a guy. Okay, but maybe when she turned over. Which he turned pro, she was, yeah, absolutely. And son of one of the most famous boxing promoters we've had in modern history.

Formerly at the BBC. Yeah, he actually reminded me his fight was the last fight on the. BBC. Yeah. And here we are with his daughter. It was the last world title fight from overseas. Howard Eastman against Bernard Hopkins. Really?

Unbelievable. Yeah. And here we are with, on the first night, his daughter fighting. She's coming back. She's got everything. She's a show woman. She is someone that understands the big platform, the big stage, the big numbers and wants to be a star.

And she's the type of fighter that when you say the BBC in front of her, when you say you can box in front of millions of people, that's what she wants to do. And she'll then. entertained from start to finish. I know the broadcaster's very fond of her. She's fighting a girl, a former world champion, someone that's had four or five times more fights than she has. So she's very much,

she's experienced against youth in a big test for her. But, you know, we talk about fighters that can cross over. She's someone that can inspire every female in this country to maybe put on a pair of gloves because she's not your typical female boxer. And, yeah, she'll probably feature quite heavily. on the BBC for the next year. Ben, before I let you go,

because one or two things, you mentioned now our, it's a new platform, but it's also, in some ways, it's a new audience. And I mean that, you know, if you go from TNT to Sky to DZone, there's similar types of audiences,

you know, the backbone, you know, their new audience. It doesn't mean everyone watching is 23 years of age, which sometimes people need to be told. But at the beep, you've got a potential different audience out there. Are you trying to do different things

to make sure we get that audience to pay attention to us. I think it's very important because you've asked me a lot of very typical boxing questions in this. And when we sat down with the BBC, we to an audience that aren't necessarily boxing fans that probably have only ever heard of Anthony, Joshua and Tyson, Fioria. That's where I'm going, yeah. They're interested in human stories.

They're interested in human emotions. They're interested in where someone's from. They're interested in who they are. And so when we're looking at which fighters we're going to put in these slots, we're looking at who are you, what story can we tell, and are you ready to be adored by the nation? And that means more than just are you a good fighter? And I think with Fraser Clark of Fran Hennessy, you can see why they've been chosen for a platform like that, and you can see why the BBC want to get behind these fighters and behind this opportunity. And so, yeah, it's a very

different game. It really is. It's going to be an interesting challenge. But I hope boxing fans can understand that you know this is a this is a much bigger audience now that we have to engage with and and this is this is about growing the sport so with with with with with with with that in mind are you planning any different you know are you planning on doing things differently and if you discuss with the baby oh you know might we get some kind of you know some some more some extra filming and a little insight into into these boxes lives yeah I think for me this is it's now about content and I sat down with my team a couple months ago and said let's scrap this press conferences. Let's scrap the traditional physical press media things. Let's focus on the eye player.

Let's focus on content. Let's focus on telling a story on BBC. And that's what the focus is going to be for the next 12 months is the storytelling, the behind the scenes, the backdrops and building the sport because, as I say, the fans watching on October the 25th, of course you're going to have all the boxing fans, but most of them won't know they're left from the right when it comes to boxing. though and what they will buy into. And we've seen it with the Women's World Cup. We've seen it with women's football.

We've seen it with, I remember watching the rugby the other day. And what people are buying into is human stories of achievement. And to be able to put boxing, which has long been considered, this murky, ugly sister on a platform like the BBC, it's a huge opportunity for the sport to show itself in the very best life. And no one does stories like we do. stories, Sandoulay. I mean, Dave Allen looked the other weekend, you know, someone even like Callum Simpson, Karas Artenstall, you know, thrown on a scrapie but 16 years of age, basically. Big phrase,

having to wait all those Olympics. Oh, it's good, mate. Some good stories there. It is, and that's why you love the sport. That's why I love the sport. Now it's our job to convince others why they should love British boxing. Ben, that's an absolute delight and a pleasure. It's been a pleasure talking to you. Thanks so much for your time. Cricket World Cup, featuring the stars of women's cricket. Smash. Teams. The ICC Women's Cricket World Cup.

Radio 5 Sports Extra. And keep up to date with the TMS podcast on BBC Sounds.