5 Live Boxing with Steve Bunce - Greatest Fights - Ricky Hatton on Hatton v Tszyu

Episode Date: May 21, 2020

Reliving the night in 2005 when Ricky Hatton beat Kostya Tszyu to win his first world title, in front of a packed M.E.N. Arena. Hatton reflects on his greatest night in the ring, how his career developed afterwards and why he has struggled with depression in retirement.

BBC Sounds, music, radio, podcasts. Costello and Bunce's greatest fights. And thanks for joining us once again on Five Live Boxing with Costello and Bunce, as we continue our series looking back at great nights and great fights. And this, Steve, one of the most significant in the history of British boxing. I take you to Manchester. It's June. And what's more, Mike?

It's a hot Jew. We're not talking about one of those June nights where it's just bad weather outside. It's unreasonable. unseasonably hot. Now, we always say, and I'm going to tell you a small lie at the top of the show, okay? In fact, it's an outrageous fib. Is that we always use 22,000 people. Well, it wasn't 22,000 people.

It was a sellout of about 19.5,000. There aren't 22,000 seats inside the Manchester Evening News, the Fabled Arena, as it was called. But you have to try and get your head around what it was like in there. They'd locked the doors, and I mean locked the doors, and locked out a few people. at 11.30 sharp. The bars had run dry,

something that Hatton and his fans would do in Las Vegas. And the first bell was 2 a.m. Two and a half hours of singing. Two and a half hours of people getting themselves into an atmosphere that I have yet to experience again, and I had never experienced at that point. It was quite unique. It was Manchester.

It was 2005. It was Hatton. And it was monumental in global terms, Steve, not just in looking back over the course of British boxing history. And that's why the fight was at 2 a.m in the morning because it was a huge event for Showtime Television who were broadcasting this back to the United States. This had global impact, partly because the reputation around Hatton and the huge crowds that he drew to arenas before becoming world champion and Costeux, you, the Russian-born Australian, who was building a reputation and was already being ranked as one of the great light welterweights of all time. He was on a run of nine successive World Championship contest wins

and up against Ricky Hatton coming to this country, it took a lot of money for promoter Frank Warren to get him to this country and he started as an overwhelming favour that night to beat Ricky Hatton. It wasn't just that Zoo was this exceptional fighter with this incredible history and just the one odd bizarre defeat, you know, nearly 10 years earlier. was that he was considered. He was in that mix of three or four fighters for the best

pound for pound fighter in the world. The Americans liked him. The Americans really wanted him. And I'll tell you what, Mike, had he won, he would have gone out to Las Vegas and he would have done unbelievable business. And sometimes, this is one of those fights that you argue with people about because the general, the simplistic reading of this fight is, oh, he was past his best, he was shot to bits. Well, for God, sake. Okay, he was 35, but the man was a supreme athlete. And for eight or nine or 10 rounds, he wasn't shot to bits. He wasn't an old man. He wasn't fading. It's amazing how many after timers we have in our business. Zoo was fearsome. I watched him spa in Manchester. He came in about

20 or days before the fight, 18 days before the fight. And I saw him very early in that run when he first got over here, when he was really close to weight, only a couple of pounds. And he was in, incredible, incredible shape and incredibly sharp. And you have to imagine what it was like in those four or five days before because the best and the best we were kind of hoping for was that Ricky would have a good go, would be there, would push him, might have some early luck. He might just be able to hold on and get through the 12.

That was the feeling before the first bell. And you said there, Steve, about some were questioning at what stage of his career was you at, was he over the top? but you look at one of his most recent performances at the time when he got rid of Zab Judah in two rounds with a devastating display of right-hand punching. And that's well worth looking up on line for coverage of that fight and what a stunning knockout it was and how Zab Judah was knocked down twice from the same punch. He got up and fell again.

Such was the thudding effect of that particular finish from Zabudor. And then so distressed was Zabudor that he actually picked up a stool, tried to punch the referee J. Nadia and picked picked up the corner stool and threw it at the referee. But that was one of the most recent performances at that time for Costa Zua. As far as Ricky Hatton's concern, Steve, it was a slow burner. He took eight years to get to this stage to challenge for a world championship belt. Just for comparison, Carl Frotch took six years. Joe Kalsaki took four years. It can be very different depending on the style and who's around in your weight division at the time. But just to underline, Steve, what an attraction Hatton was back then in the middle.

2000s. In 2000, Mike Tyson had come over in the same arena to box Julius Francis. Tickets for this fight between Ricky Hatton and Costizu sold out much quicker than they did for the appearance of Mike Tyson here in the UK, underlining just what a fan base Hatton had built. Not just in Manchester, it started in Manchester and then filtered out, of course, but you're talking about one of the great attractions in British boxing, one of the most loved idols, you know, in our lifetime, I'm probably Henry Cooper and then Frank Bruno and then Ricky Hatton matching them. Hatton was very aware of his position

inside that group you just mentioned there and I'd throw Barry McGregan in there as well Mike in some ways with that, especially with the Padrosa fight, you know, a fight that 275,000 people watch live and 98 million watched on TV. So I'd throw Ricky in with them. Ricky was very aware of that. And of course he was also very aware

that those guys hadn't actually achieved it, hadn't actually done it. As good as Cooper had been in two fights with Ali and as great as Frank Bruno was, eventually beating Oliver McCall. Ricky always wanted to be a little bit more than that, and he always fancied being a little bit more than that. And I think one of the things in the buildup here,

people were making sure they didn't end up with too much egg on their face because they were allowing themselves to talk about how great he was, but at the same time referencing back to those guys. So basically placing him with those guys, placing him with the men that had fouled, because that's what we were getting ready for that night. And you talk about the concessions that Frank Warren had to make. There were an unbelievable amount of concessions.

And watching this fight again before we cut, but before this, as prep for what we're doing now, I was reminded of something. So I searched through my notes and I found it. And I found it in my fight preview. Is that Frank Warren had had to agree to give Costa Zoo the ring post, which is big business in our business. And if you look at the ring post, this is 2005.

They're advertising the 2012 Olympics, take place in Moscow if you ever look at it. So that's what the, so that was one of the concessions. Doesn't sound like an awful lot, but that's a fairly decent concession. Massive fight. Biggest fight Frank Wellner promoted up to that point and he has to give away the ring post because that was part of Costa Zuz negotiating tactics. And we're going to hear from Ricky Hatton very shortly, Steve, but just for the benefit of those who are going to watch along with us as well as listen, the usual format we're going to cover six rounds of this fight. In this case, it will be six of the.

the 11 rounds. And we're going to start with the first round, and that will be coming up shortly, so you can get your synchronicity sorted. But Steve, at this time, just before we do hear from Ricky, the light, well-to-weight division was just the house of greatness at the time. Even though Miguel Cotto, who held one of the versions of the title, Floyd Mayweather held another of the versions, weren't what they would go on to be, when you consider that Costor-Zew, Miguel Cotto and Floyd Mayweather at this time, and both of those incidentally fought within a month of the fight we're covering here today, just goes to show what sort of a division

we were talking about at this time. And Mike, the fourth contender along that line was a man called Vivian Harris, who was about, who'd been knocked out by Carlos Mouser, who of course Ricky thrown it forward to, would beat later in the year. So, Mike, if there was a case for that division,

let's just do Zoo, Cotto and Mayweather, those three being champions inside the calendar year at any weight, I would take that. and you know my expression, I'd parachute that back anywhere in the last 25 years, and you find me a division with three names like those in a six-month period, that's going some. You know, we get excited about various things that happen and are happening, but you look back on that, and this is not ancient history, it's only 15 years ago.

I can remember it like it as well, 15 years ago. Well, time to get into the fight now in terms of sound and vision, and I'm delighted to say that we're joined by Ricky Hatton to take us through the events of that momentous night back in June 2005. Ricky, it's a joy to have you with us. Thanks for joining us. You're right, make you see me. Yeah, I can see you.

So looking good. Ricky, a privilege to have you with us to look back to this momentous night coming up to 15 years ago now. When you think back to that night, what's the first thing that goes through your mind? Well, no doubt. I think it was the best win of my boxing career.

I mean, I had so many great nights in my career. When people say, what was your best, victory on your record it's got to be cost you, too, because I mean all of us dream of becoming a world champion and to become a world champion any world champion is one thing

but I was in the unique position that with so many versions of world title belts now, I got to fight the number one in my weight division and he was also, I think he was number one or two ranked pound for pound at the time so to have a victory where you're not just win the world title

you became the best at you or weight and then to the pound for pound rankings in the process. I think it goes without saying. And the fact it was in my hometown of Manchester and he quit on his school, such a formidable first and ferocious punching champion. But it's doing like it did. I don't think in my wild, I think if it had knocked him out with one punch, it couldn't have ended up any better than what it actually did on the night.

And we were setting the scene earlier on, Ricky, saying that it started at close to 2 a.m. in the morning underlining just how big an event globally this was because Showtime television insisted on it going peak time in the United States. How did you prepare then for a fight that was starting unusually late for you? Well, it wasn't too bad for me because normally I used to get in that phone in the morning, didn't it? So, you know, but no, all I did is, when I got the first few weeks of a training camp under under the belt, obviously, the first four weeks was always a mission to get as much weight off in that first four weeks as I could. So I just left me training at normal.

But then once the fight got about six, seven weeks away, all I did was I started training at seven o'clock in the evening as opposed to 12 in the afternoon. And then I ended up going running at two o'clock in the morning. So all I did was remove me training, you know, along well, I'd go running at seven o'clock at night. I'll go running at two in the morning.

and instead of going running at 7 o'clock at night, I'd move my training to 7 o'clock at night. So just move my day along. So I'd end up going to bed about 5 o'clock, and then 5 o'clock in the morning, and then wake, you know, dinner time, if you like, as opposed to 8, 9 o'clock in the morning. So just move my day along,

and that just become, my day just become different to everybody else. And my body clock just, you know, settled in then. And we want to relive this night, Ricky, through your memory. So take us into the arena now and how you're feeling along with Billy Graham on this, this night. You've boxed at the Manchester Arena so many times before, but this is a task and a challenge beyond anything you've faced before. So take us through the mindset now as we get set to hear the first bell.

Well, it was, you know, just walking down, you know, towards the ring. And it was even at the press conference on the Thursday before. You know, there was always a big occasion for Ricky Hatton, but, when I thought, of course, you did there's a little bit more of interest, a few more press, a few more cameras, and you knew you were in there with someone formidable. And, you know, the newspaper reporting's in the build-up to the fight was because of my style and his style,

I didn't have half a chance. And I knew all these things that people were saying, but as I was walking to the ring, I was just trying to, you know, have confidence in myself, have confidence in what me and worked on, what we believed we could do and achieved. And I think under such pressure, it was just holding it all together for that ring warp

because I think any boxer will tell you guys the most nervous part for any fighter is when you leave the change room as you're making that walk to the ring that's the worst time and that's when you've got to be strong when you're up against such a formidable fighter like he was.

Yeah, well I'll be absolutely honest with you from about 12, 31 o'clock I'd start to get, I used to get really nervous for big fights, but for fighters that are liked. And that last 20 or 30 minutes and the first sign of Blue Moon as Ricky started, is slow walking.

It was one of those where you're taking those big gulps. You and I have taken them at big fights in the last 25 years, Mike. And you just take those gulps. And I remember looking at Ricky, and I'd seen Ricky get in that ring so many times in those previous 20-odd-so a consecutive title fights, 15 or so WB.

I'd seen his face, and I'd seen him when I knew he was maybe more emotionally charged and other times. Like, for instance, when he thought Ava McGee in the same arena, he was hyped up. You could sort of half sense it. But this time, and really, strangely. He looked, and I don't know if this is out, if you felt this rig, but you look

serene. You look completely calm in that ring. And I was really surprised, because I was half expecting to see you, maybe too hyped when you got through the ropes and when you started moving around. But you looked so calm and so relaxed. The place was, there was bedlam in the place everywhere. The noise was off to scale. But you just looked, almost out of step with the rest of it. You looked like the calmest man in that ring. To be honest with you, nobody gave me a chance in the fight. Everyone thought, my style, rumbling for, with me getting caught with right hands and getting cut. I think everyone thought, you know, we love your enthusiasm, Ricky, but, you know, you knew that I had half a chance.

But I think all deep down, if we're all honest in the back of our minds, you think, for good old Ricky might come across here tonight. You know, you want me to succeed, and you want me to do wealth. But it's just that fear of our heart. says, yeah, come on, Ricky. But when we really think about the styles and the tactics and all that, this might not be a bridge too far. I think you could, although the fans were behind me in the arena,

it was like an atmosphere. It was like a nervous tension. Yeah, I agree with that. Where everyone was behind me, everyone was supported me, but there was a little bit of everyone sat there ready for it, but also thinking, oh, shit, you know what I mean? And that's, but that's what I knew. this, but I knew this, that nobody really gave me the chance.

And I used that as my fuel to win the fight because I was a little bit pissed off with all the press, that nobody had given me a chance. And unfortunately, myself, I'm going to prove all you, you are wrong here. Because unless me and Billy have seen something that the press had, this is my moment where they said, Ricky, he's just a good ticket seller, he gets cut, sells a few tickets, but he's out of his debt for here. that was my fuel. And I think you could see that

in the confident look, the way we're watching the wing. There was no doubt in my mind, yeah. Well, let's go into the ring then on the night of the 4th of June 2005, drifting into the morning of the 5th of June, as we say, to suit American television. And you're talking there, Ricky, about your mindset and almost how you have to put on a kind of poker vase.

Are you also trying to read Kostezu at this time, looking over to see what he might be feeling? Yeah, well, I was always, I was always, if you look at my expression, not just in this fight here, in the majority of fights, you could never see any emotion. You couldn't tell whether it was psyched up, whether it was nervous, whether it was. I just used to have a very blank expression. But I was never one for eyeball in or staring someone down.

But I just think that, you know, when Mike Tyson, when fighters were beaten, when they got in the ring with Mike Tyson before the bell had even gone. Crosses-Zoo had that same aura about him. And I wanted to make sure that, you know, that, you know, I'm not going to get in his eyes because, you know, if I do anything out of character, you know, that's when you're making yourself more nervous than normal.

I wanted to do, I wanted cross-Zu to know because I think my demeanour at the press conferences and everything was this Rick, this Rikian, and he's not just saying it, he's not just talking it. you can see in his eyes he means it. And I think that was a big key. And the fact that starts off this first round, so positive.

And, you know, I wanted to get off to a really, really good start to just enforce that thing, you know, because then Cossusoo must have sat down on the stool at the end of the first round and must have fought where these kids were real, you know. Well, let's follow it from the first bell then, Rick. As you say, you were determined to make a good start. But you have said to me in the past after this fight as well

that there were occasions when the red mist came down. And you've often pointed to a fight three years before this one against Damon McGee when you got flawed early on because you were just too hyped up by the crowd. So was that in your mind here? Yeah, I think I'd learned my lesson from Amy and McGee, not to go back, but if you notice, I'm going here, I'm going in jabbing.

You know what I mean? I'm going in jabbing, which means, you know, when I fought Amy and McGee, it was a left hook, right, look, a left hook. Even though I'm putting the pressure on, because you do, if you watch, we go in. I'm always jabbing. See what I mean?

I'm jabbing here. And that's what I learned, even though I had to put the pressure on cost you because I didn't want to stay on the end of his jab for that straight right. So as I was putting the pressure on him, really said try and get in his chest as quick as you can, but you've got a jab before you get on that chest.

And I think that was the game plan. If you see, I wasn't taking a back step. I was on the front foot all the time. But as it was marching in, it was always behind a good solid left jab. If you just here, just stiff jabs. That was the key to getting in chest. A stiff left jab, knock his head back, and then not giving a chance to get on his chest.

And even then hitting him behind the head, Ricky, and going after him when he's back had turned, almost signs you're telling him you're not overawed by this occasion. You're completely at home here. Absolutely, yeah. You know, we was talking about the look, you know, when you first get in the ring, you know, you know, and like Steve mentioned earlier

before we started to fight, that there was a confidence about where that looks. And it's not just, it's not, it's about how you look, how you start the fight. When he got close, he was puffing me and trying to bully me. I thought, I'm not having that. I'm going to let him know. Every time he hits me behind the head,

he's getting one back. Do you know what I mean? Every time he hits me low, which, as we see as the fight progresses, he gets one back. So no corner was given if you get me, I mean, looking at that, Rick, Dave Paris pulls you apart after five seconds. He has to pull you together the pair of you and tell you after two minutes.

But you weren't bothered by that, it seemed to me, on the night. I mean, I'm going to use the word now and I'm going to try and not use it any other time. You were possessed this night, Rick. It wasn't just that you were moving your way in, you know, behind the jab. You were letting everything go, and it was sensible. It was smart boxing. It wasn't just reckless, stupid. It was such an, it's such an impressive 180 seconds this.

when you watch it again. It really is. And you know how many times, Steve, did I get criticised in my career? Or maybe not just from doubters, but myself personally. I had a great left jab. I never used it after half my career.

But on this fight, everything just seemed to... I knew I had to do the tactics right. I knew I had to have the right game plan. Because if I did it, this fella would knock me out. And that's the difference. So, you know, wearing fights, I'd never used the jab early on

to get myself in. I set my opponents up. I was using it in this fight, and I think that was key. And when I got on the chest, well, jam my way in, jammy way in. When I got on the chest, do the right work,

rough him up, bully him back at the head, throw him out of shape, you know, see like that, and tell him, that didn't hurt him. That was a nothing thing. I'm just letting him know, listen, you're not bullying me

like you bully everyone else. And I notice also, as we were watching slow motion replays of some of the action of that first round, Ricky, how you were actually slipping outside of the right hand as well as inside the jab. So, you know, in a sense, that that was a gamble, but a calculated one.

No, and so, you know, because nine times out of ten, I was when I was WBU champion and things, fights like that, I was always the favourite. And sometimes when I was in the favourite, when I knew I had the beating of someone, I went a little bit gunhole and I went a little bit red misty fight because I knew they weren't as good as me. but in this fight against Costa Zoo where normally he used to eat that right hand and I didn't eat a few of them because let's have it right

you can't, you won't get a better right hand than what he has but you know sometimes when Billy used to say to me slip outside the right hand he used to go in one day or out the other because I was too eager to get to my opponent Billy would say to me all the time

jab on your way in and forget to jab on your way in but I knew if I didn't do those things across your zoo you're going to end up on your ass and that's just that simple as that ain't it And we're going to move now, Ricky, from the first round to the end of round five. So round six is coming up. And at this stage, Costasieu has found some of his accuracy. And time and again, he is catching you at single shots.

He did. But what I think was important, Richie, whenever you were tagged by him, you came straight back. And that was an important message, wasn't it? Yeah, you know, and to be honest with you, they knew that, you know, the open second of the round. see I'm just trying to do it on volume of punches and that you know just when he feels like he's getting a grip of the fight and getting a hold of the fight I've got to put a little bit of avalanche of a burst in you know

to throw him out of his rhythm again but me and Billy said first two rounds start fast and then he has to raise the game then and he did raise the game rounds three four five six you know but I was happy for him to raise it because you know I I set off like a, you know, like a ground out of the trap, won the first two rounds,

knowing that he had to raise it for the next three. So, you know what I mean? And then when he had them good three rounds, then I knew he'd want to rest. So then I raised it for the next two. And I think that's what being a good season pro and a good 12 round five years, knowing when, you know, you've got to put your foot on the gas,

when you know you've got to take your foot off the gas and let him have a little bit of a goal, just to drain him of a little bit of his strength. and that's what, you know, a good 12 round fighter was working when you need to work and when you want a little bit of the rest, make him do the work, you know what I mean? Vic, and it's all very well saying that, but he was still catching you. Not a lot. Still catching you with the short right hands, the long right, still catching you know.

There's no doubt about it. It was hurting me. Absolutely. And a couple of times, you know, he caught me with the straight right hand. Right there? It didn't buckle, but it's stiffened. I think this was Custridge who's one of his best round in

if I remember that you know But like he said I just tried I was walking in I sort of like you know He was really more

straight rights In order to stop me in my tracks Because he knew He couldn't have me Keep rumbling in Like I did the first two rounds So you know He was trying to nail me hard

As a as a company But this is when he was having His strongest moment Oh wow Billy Graham was saying to me At this stage in a fight Ricky, just stay with it. I don't mind if you lose a few of these rounds

either way. Just stay with it, stay with it. Because he won't be able to maintain this. You know what I mean? And there was a period at the beginning of this round, Ricky, where you drove to back to the ropes and he was held up by the ropes. It could have been scored a knockdown but wasn't.

And he has some success in the last few seconds of this round. But as you say, these are the moments in a fight, a long fight where you have to ride the tackle. Yeah, you know, he's nailing me with some really, He is. He is. Really, really heavy shots coming here. And I said to Billy at this stage, I said to Billy, I said, I think the fight is running away from me here.

I think he's banking too many rounds, Billy. And Billy just said, stay at it, stay at it, keep him working, keep him working, try and be as safe as you possibly can, Rick. But just keep him working and get through it. Because what he's done in this last three rounds off last three or four rounds, he's not going to be able to carry that through to round 12. So if you keep on him, keep on him and keep him working, keeping his face, keep hurting him to the body

with heavy single shots and double shots to the body, keep him working, keep him the fight. He said he won't last this, Rick. He won't maintain it. He said he's not done this for six, seven years, Rick. And that was our feeling. So as much as he was having the successes and hitting him in with big shots,

Billy which he was, even if you're losing these rounds, just stay with it and keep on at him. Eventually he's going to break because he won't be at a maintain. And we're going to continue with round number seven coming up shortly, Ricky, but you're talking about taking these right hands. Can you describe taking a right hand from Costa Zhu compared to anybody else?

Is there a different reaction? Does it feel different? Well, it was different. You know, I mean, I got caught with shots in the past, but here we come starting around here watching what. We didn't do it that round for a change. But no, it was murder. And even if you look in the close quarter,

stages of the fight when we're at chess Costa was like a bit of style where he'd pull away and cuffier Cuffier was shot Cuffy were shots and he didn't

look like he was getting much leverage him but they were horrendous and power at them was horrendous but sometimes he'd nail me with the right and you'd see him

dropped my hand by me by my waist and look at him dead in the eye and as hurt as it was and as much as it was hurting me

you know Costas he must have drilled me, he saw me drop my hands and sort of like wave him on if you like. And a bit by bit, I think, not only from a stamina point of view, I think from a confidence point of view, I think bit by bit, as the round progressive from this stage on, you can see him confidence-wise and strength-wise, power-wise, a little bit less each round, more losing that little bit away. And we're coming up to the halfway stage of round number seven, Ricky.

and I think it's noticeable. There's a lot of close quarter exchanges here where you're rubbing heads. Given your history of cuts at this stage, were there any fears on that score? There was a little bit, but I mean, to be honest, with you, I'd learnt a lot.

I was a very clever inside fight here. If you notice, my head always tends to be low than this, or lying it on the shoulder. You know what? And I think as much as the class of edge care, if I had to stay in on the outside guide, then the firing line for that.

straight right hand. I think I stood in a worse chance of getting cut. I think it was in a worst place getting cut. If I stood on the outside where you can line me up with that right hand, I think I had more chance of getting cut. At least he could lie up, put my head under his chin, lay it on his ear, like you can see me lying my head there. It was very, very smart, but I had to he had to keep him out of his comfort zone, didn't he? I thought there was a point there, Ricky, when you both landed right hands almost simultaneously and he came off worse. And I don't know, you know, well, you're living the moment, but it looked on the outside as if that was a significant moment, you know, the big dynamic right hand puncher lands a right hand,

but you land one at exactly the same time and he comes off worse. And there's the low blow that lands from the left hand of Kosteuseu. Because I think he's a bit of a buddy type of a fighter himself, not in the close quarters of foul in states. There's such a formidable puncher, there's that bully side about him, and he never once had anybody jumped down his throat like I did. And I think he must have thought, who's this cheek of little shit doing this to me? And I think when he was hitting me with the low blows, I think he was doing this, you know, like I was trying to throw him out of his stride. I think he was trying to do it to me in the same breath. But I think from a confidence point of view, when I traded right

hands with him, that right hand that I traded with him. He must have forged himself. No one's ever traded right hand with me. And the fact that I kept on his chest, kept working away, I think bit by bit, he got that little bit more and less tired, that little bit less, that little bit more of confidence would dwindle, that little bit more of, you know, zipping his punches. And it was basically because I was taking into a place

where he'd not really been for a number of years. Rick, you know, when he drops you with that body shot, is low, it's underneath, it's underneath the belt, you go down. Were you hurt? Because Dave Paris gives you all of about five extra seconds. Were you hurt when you went down? No, there was one, I can't remember which one it was. I think it was the first one he hit me with. And then this, and then this last one, before to get my own back, when he sort of went a bit like that. Yeah, that comes up later. Yeah, that's nasty. Yeah, that one didn't hurt me, no. But obviously, I'm trying to make the most of it because it was his third one. Of course. You know, so,

but, you know, but it was only the first. first one, I think, that hit me. It might be the second one. But there was one that hit me. You could tell, even even the pseudo-steen went, oh, that was the one that hurt me. But the other one, that were just borderline. No, I was, because he kept doing on a regular basis. I thought if I'm old enough, he's going to get a point of.

Surely, you know, so. So we're going to move, Ricky, from round seven now into round nine, and we're going to take the fight all the way through to its conclusion now. That took a lot out of it. took a lot out of me there, guys. That push didn't hurt me or anything, but once you get to round eight and you get pushed on your heels

and not only on your heels, on the seat of your pants, that hurt me harder than any of the body shots. Getting back to my feet again after eight grueling physical rounds, when I went down, it probably only pushed me, but to get back on my feet, as soon as I stood up straight, I thought,

who, good God, that's... Even that took it out of me, but I mean, but... This was the stage of the fight where I started off well, Kostya, won the middle part of the rounds and sent it like a little bit of a rhythm. But this was the stage, we're about the stage where he started to dwindle fast. Which was very pleasing to me because he was banking the rounds and I felt like the fight was running away from him. And Billy said, keep on him, keep on him. Eventually he's going to break.

This was when I started to realize that Billy's words were true. working. This was the moment you felt, you started to feel as weak as a kitten at this team. So we're into round nine, Ricky. The clock says two minutes, 20 seconds to go. When you talk about the feeling that Zoo is fading, how do you sense that in the ring? Is it deep breaths, heavy breaths? What changes that gives you that signal? Deep breaths, you're finding the target a bit more. The punches that he's landing on you having no effect. And when I do get in his chest and close quarters and finding I can bully him a little bit more. And then when I'd land a shot,

which wasn't really a big shot or a thunderous shot, he started tottering about a bit, you know, a little bit more, a little bit more unsteady on his feet. And, you know, even though, you know, even the early stages when I was having the better of it, he still felt as strong as an opt. Well, at this stage, I knew it had got him. And I thought it was maybe a round of two behind,

but what I've worked hard for in the middle round was now paying dividends if you get me in it. And it suddenly seems like there's a renewed zap in your footwork, Ricky. Suddenly you've realised. Well, I've got a little bit of an extra zip. I got a second wind. I was doing a little bit more damage than it was normal. I could fail him dwindling.

And obviously, you can hear the crowd getting louder because they can see it between their eyes. Ricky's the first two rounds Oh Ricky's going to win this by a mile Round three, four, five, six, seven, eight Oh no, he's going to get knocked out here And then they see the fight change hands again And if the crowd could sense it

And so could I And coming up to this important moment in the fight, Ricky Where Costas you, hits you low For a second time And this time you decide Yeah, I think it was a third time Maybe third time This is where he goes low again

And I took a chance really guys because they didn't hurt me, but they were low. But that's the first time he's done it, when I thought, if I hit him low air, surely he can't take a point of me if he's done it three times. And I took a chance, because maybe he could have done. What a chance. Not just that, Rick, that's the most perfect left hook.

It's the most perfect illegal left hook thrown in a British ring. I've got to tell you. Beautiful, unbelievable. Yeah. And, you know, because everybody in that arena knew, that he'd landed three low blows on me. That was my first one. So if Dave was in an impossible position,

what do I do? If I take a point of fear because it was deliberate, the crowd are going to eat me alive because he's given me three. So Dave was in a difficult position. But I think to myself, I think a high percentage of referees would have done what Dave did.

Absolutely. And at this stage, Rick, do you think Kostjizu has to carry on as quickly as he can because you did? And you can't give anything away psychologically. Absolutely, yeah. You know, he's got to know.

But to be honest with you, I could feel him dwindling before that. And that, you know, that shot to the knackers might have just sent him over the head a little bit. But, you know, he was bristling before that. And I thought, but don't forget, when he was having the breeder for the low bro, I was getting a brewer too.

And I was thinking, as he was getting a briever, I was trying to fill my lungs up. So much for a big push for these last few rounds. And as you go back to the corner, Ricky, you can see everybody in the arena on their feet. So illegal or not, that has really seriously stoked the crowd.

Yeah, because they knew, because they knew the fight was in the balance. You know what I mean? I think, I mean, I referred to say, I think I was maybe, maybe I'd just have been nose in front by a rounder so or something like that. But to be honest,

it was in the balance, once it. But everybody could dramatically see, what way that how the tide had turned what way it was going yeah only two rounds to go but they're a long long six minutes aren't they Ricky yeah and I said to Billy Graham

at this stage on my stool I went Billy have nothing left he went I don't Billy Graham said to me Ricky I don't want to hear that from you he said we knew that we'd be in this position one day and you know where we've got him where we want him

if you're not mad enough to take advantage of it now and you're not the fighting we've been telling everyone you was. So we're coming into the 10th round now, Ricky. Yeah, this was the... And every time he hit him, you know, my punches were having the effect on him, that his punches were having on me, the early rounds,

you know what I mean? You can see, you know, I turned into the heavier puncher, if you like. He felt dead weak in the clinches. You know what I mean? And then I was always... And he was knocking his head back. His head was going back on his shoulder,

who was falling back on the soles of his shoes, and he was the one looking to hold at the end now. The Crosters who never really holds. And I think it's here at this stage here. He has a good burst towards the end of the round, but he picks me off for about four or five shots, and I think he put his own nail in his coffin there. He was trying to have one last burst of energy,

and it packed fire on him. But this is remarkable, Ricky. for a man who sits on his stool and said he's got nothing left. I mean, you're not giving him a second's respite here. No, I don't know that, but Billy turned around and said, listen, it's in the balance this. He's gone. You win these two rounds, you win it.

So I said, I don't want to hear that you've not got nothing left. Because this is the position we knew we'd be in for. And when it came, we knew we had to be in a position to take it. So I don't want to hear you saying you've nothing left. And whenever sometimes he used to, you knew what he was doing, Billy Graham in the corner with me. He knew if he insulted me, he got the best out of me. I thought Billy was great in the corner here.

I mean, I've listened to this. On the recording I've watched, which is the one we're watching now. I listen specifically to Billy in the corner. And I don't think he put a foot wrong, Rick. Billy, I really don't, for the entire, through the completed rounds. I don't think he put a foot wrong in the corner. It was great corner work. No, well, Billy got his reputation as getting the best from fighters

when they were coming home to the end of their career, Steve. You know, like Epi Binklin and Steve Viking Foster and Paul Byr. So his reputation as a trainer was a conditioner. He was always good at getting his trainers in peak condition and stuff like that. But I thought the opposite. I thought, you know, because of his boxing brain and tactical brain, I thought that was his best attribute. I really did.

So, Ricky, the last 30 seconds of round number 10 we're into now. You're on the attack, but as you say, Zoo does have some successes. So give us your thinking now, 10th round, last 20 seconds. I knew I had him here now. I absolutely knew I had him here now, and that's why I could sense it. So I kept putting my foot on the gas, kept putting my foot on the gas.

And I think at the end of the bell, he used me with a right hand there. Oh, what a shot! Right down the pipe there. I think he used to me. And I took that. My legs were stiff, and he hit me another one on the end there,

and he must have walked down. And he had sat down one last bit of energy for him. And I think they must have thought, When he hit me with that right hand there, Steve, that was, he had all the bite, he had all the leverage, everything. Perfect shot. And I think his trainer must have thought, listen. Johnny Lewis.

Johnny Lewis, I think if we haven't got him with that fighter in round, if we haven't got him with that right hand in round 10, we're not getting this fella. Well, you know what, Rick? I think that's why he pulled him out. Yeah, you might be absolutely right because we'll do Johnny Lewis's final words at the end of this round, but you might be absolutely right,

because that wasn't just a good right hand, it was a great right hand. Yeah. And you barely, you barely flinch. It's incredible. Yeah. And these shots here,

you know, he's having full blood, he's having full-blooded ones, and then he comes back, look, that was the second right-hand see. That was the right-hand left hand, and left the right on the bell.

He landed a bigger one before that. See, I think, I think, I think, at the end of the tenth round there, when he lands at that second right-hand

and the left-o. I think your leg-shaped for a bit. He did. You're hurt, then. Yeah, he did. and I dropped my hands by my signs and looked at him in defiance as if I say, come on.

You know, I mean, Costa Zoo, they never walk through them. You can see how he's sagging here and how Steve is swaying all over the show. He's a little bit like an MFFI wardrobe here. He's all over the place. But, you know, I think there's one period about middle part of the round

where he throws a, I think this might be it. Look, look. Look at that. shots. That took more out with him, Steve, than me. Yeah. Because you're in front of him, yeah. Yeah, it was one of them flurries when he's having one last goal.

And I think when he finished him, when he stopped that flurry, I think the fight was over them. But what I found here, Mike, look at this round, the pair of you, is that my feeling from the night was that Ricky smashed him all over the bits, the bits in the 11th round, and the Zoo was gone. But he's still standing up, Zoo. He's still, as you're showing there, connected with shots. He's not actually out on his feet.

he's just not got anything left. Yeah, no. And he's been the true champion he is. He could have throw the town in a couple of rounds earlier. Because a couple of rounds earlier, the fight was running away from him. Yeah. And it was a little bit like me when I thought Floyd Mayweather. I knew the fight was running away from me.

But I said to Billy, don't you dare put this towel him? He've come here to win. And I think the same in Costa here. He knew that maybe he should have threw the towns in a couple of. the rounds earlier, like I did against Floyd. But when you're the champion and, you know, like this man was, you know, you don't, you don't entertain that thought. Just over a minute to go in the 11th round, Ricky, at this stage, you're thinking,

well, there's still four minutes to go in the fight here, but absolutely relentless aggression. Yeah, just trying to summon the last, you know, big guts of air, you know, and just, you know, and even when I was up close here, some of these were all cupping punches and they weren't really giving much damage. I was just thought, keep the punches coming. Keep the punches coming. So these last two rounds,

if it is close on the scorecard, you're the one that's punching, not him, you know. And again, astonishing the atmosphere, driving you forward. Yeah, if I've got to score the last two rounds

of anyone, it's going to be me because you're the one punching, you know. Absolutely. And we're coming up to the last 20 seconds of this round 11,

and the action is relentless. He hasn't got a leg to stand under him here, yeah. And what's striking, I think, at the end of this round, Ricky, only 10 seconds to go. You're separated again by Dave Paris.

It's the way that you don't just walk back to the corner, you march back to the corner, and that must be disconcerting for those in the other corner. Here, you're absolutely much back. You'd never believe 11 rounds have gone. And this is where the drama unfolds now, because there's a discussion in the corner. And as Dave Paris comes over to tell both corners

we're moving into the last round, he goes back over to the Costa Zoo corner, and the man you describe in your books, as the Australian Angelo Dundee, Johnny Lewis, is having real issues here. And he thinks, at this stage, Ricky, you don't know what's coming. If I'm not mistaken, guys, I think the Russian guys around him, we're trying to get him out to go for one more round. They were.

Johnny Lewis was like, like Angelo Dundee's did with Mohammed Ali against Bobby Holmes. No, I'm the chief second time. Stopping it. You know, it's one of them moments, wasn't it, Steve? It was. And you heard Dave Parris say at one point, so what's you going to do in his big London accent? So what's you going to do, he says?

Because as you say, the Russians want him out, Johnny Lewis doesn't want him out. Yeah, that's it. Describe this moment, Ricky, where you fall to the canvas in the opposite corner. It was a dream, you know what I mean? You know, what's cost you do for the last few years, knocking everybody out,

number two pound for pound. He said, and he had to have got people with Ricky out, and he doesn't live the life like he should. He doesn't do the weight like he should. He gets caught. He gets caught with the right hand. And you know, as much as a lot of people, as much as a lot, as much as a lot people love me, you know, I don't think, I think a lot of people didn't share enthusiasm I had.

And that was like my, my to say, I told you from day one, and I told you before the buildup. And I'm telling you now, I told you I was going to do it. And I think the manner in which you did it, you know, because it's like with Tyson Fury box, at the other week. Everyone thought he was suicidal for saying that he was going to get him in his face and push him back. If you remember, Steve,

he was saying the same thing about me. Yeah, because Rick, we didn't think you could push him back for 10 or 11 rounds. We thought you'd ever go at it, and then the best you're going to do was survive the last four or five. It's unbelievable.

So he's like, and to do it in my hometown of Manchester against such a formidable champion. And I think one of the best things I remember from the night, not just the win, was how we both got the mic, and I congratulated to cross you. And then he grabbed the mic,

and he said, good luck to him, with you. If you need any help in your future, you know. And he was like, you know, if somebody had phoned you and said, you know, he kicked a genie and he'd come out of the top of the bottle, and he said, you know, how would you like your greatest win to ever be? It would be, you know, winning in your hometown

against a formidable champion, quitting on his stool, saying, leave me alone, no more. and then the sportsmanship at the back the way it was that's the dream end it was yeah we've seen you Ricky hugging members of your family and now back up in the ring jumping up and down ecstatic now I mean is you are one of the most articulate

that we've dealt with down the years but is there a way to describe what you're feeling right now with your hands in the air it's probably the reason why I mainly struggled with retirement so bad because that is Mount Everest in it Oh, yeah. And you know what? I climbed a few mountains after that,

you know, with Mouser and Colazo, Yirango, Castillo, and, you know, and all that. But the feeling you get from boxing, like, on nights like this, once you retire, you hand the gloves up. It's very, very hard to replace that feeling. And I think that's why I struggled. And I think that's why so many struggled.

But it's nice to sit here 15 years after you two guys reminisce, being able to tell the story and enjoy the moment. And at the end of this year, it wasn't just British bias involved here, Ricky, and all of us getting so excited about this, but you were named the first British winner of the Ring Fighter of the Year award. Yeah, first British winner ever, the Ring magazine fighter of the year. And, you know, the next fight,

when you expect me to have an easy one, was a unification against Mouser. And then I got the Ring Magazine belt. And then my next fight, I moved up to invite two different ways. two different ways. And I think people said this was my best night. But I think people thought

because of the way of my lifestyle and that, I think people thought that would be it. We might see Ricky disappearing off into the distance now. But there was so many more, aren't they, you know, when you think. Oh, so much. There was Mouser.

There was Calazzo, Urango, Castillo, Castile, Mayweather, Les Garano, Pakeau. Unbelievable. Malinaji, you know, and that was after that one. And that was supposed to be me everest.

So we didn't do a bad job, did we? We went up a few mountains together, Ricky Boy. Oh, absolutely, yeah. Well, that was it for Kostia Zoo, Ricky. He didn't fight again after a 13-year career, but he was just to underline again what a win it was for you. He was named as Rings Light, Well to Eight of the decade in the 2000. So that kind of underlines who.

but in the literal sense he quit but is that the right word to use about such a great champion no I wouldn't say he quit I'd say I made him quit you know what I mean that you know that's you know

I don't believe the boxers like a crosser zoo or myself you know would turn around and say listen throw the towel in I'm done finish I would never

you'd have to you know Billy Graham said to me two rounds before the May and I thought, Rick, it's not our day there tonight, Rick. It's not our day. I said, you know, we're not going to win this fight. I think we're about five points behind here now.

You know, we need the knockout, Rick, and it's not going to come. I said, you're telling me that if I need a knockout, you're going to pull me out two rounds of four. And that's what, you know, that's what champions are. Cross Tosur would have carried on, absolutely no doubt,

but it was taken out of his hands by Johnny Lewis, who was more than a coach to Costa Zoo. he was like, what Billy Graham was to me, Johnny Lewis was to Costa Zoo. And I don't think cost you zoo wasn't the one on that still saying pull me out, pull me out, pull me out. No, no, no, no, no. I'd like to think I made him quit. And I think he had good reason to quit because I was young at the time. I was fresh.

I had an eye-in-churned. I had energy to burn. I was a heavy body puncher. He, you know, his last two fights, he'd only done five rounds from knocking everybody out. I think the fact that in them latter rounds, boys, how he stayed in and he was still punching back with me, still punching back with me. How can we say he was a quitter?

At the end of the 10th round, as I said, at the end of the 10th round, he hurts you. Billy Graham told me afterwards. He said he knew that if Costa was under an awful lot of pressure, Johnny would pull him out because, as he said, he loves the kid, which is just what you said. And what Johnny Lewis said to us afterwards in the change room, when we went to interview him, he said that he said to Zoo,

You've not got a knockout in you. You need one, and I'm pulling you out. But then when Johnny Lewis was really heavily criticized, and he said, but it didn't matter. He said, because when I landed at the airport, I'm assuming it was Sydney. When I got back to Sydney, Costa Z's wife pulled me aside and said,

thank you for doing that, Johnny. And he said, that was the all I need. That was the only praise I needed, which I thought took a big man to say that. And you know what, Steve, you know what, boys? You know, sometimes, you know, you know, you know, Johnny Lewis should have been the main coach, like Billy Graham was my main coach.

and you have different phases that come and, you know, Bob the Redding round in the corner, you know, you'd have a different house second or a different team second or different, you know, like that, but nobody knows you more than your main trainer. Absolutely.

No one knew me better than Billy Graham and no one knew better than Johnny Lewis, new cost you knew better than Johnny Lewis. And if Johnny Lewis has pulled him out, and Costia and the family and everyone must have thought, that's good enough for us. And I think it's,

I don't think you know your boxing, and I think you're a very, very hard-pushing critic, if you can see, never mind my performance. What about his performance? Absolutely. Can't say he was a quitter there. The way he was fighting back, and he had a young bull like me coming at him,

and he stood there and he was having it out with me. Can't call him a quitter. That's might as unfair. That young bull you talk about, Ricky, that performance that night, you spoke about the granite chin, you mentioned all those facets a couple of minutes ago, everything you had at that time, the intensity of that night.

I'm just throwing it forward to two and a half years when you fight Floyd Mayweather at Welterweight. Come back that night in Manchester at Light Welter with that intensity, that chin, that desire, that relentless pressure. Would that have beaten Floyd Mayweather? Well, you know, I'd like to think so, but I'm not going to be a hypocrite

because, you know, Floyd Mayweather is Floyd Mayweather. You know, and I'm not going to turn around to me and say, the reason why I got beat by Floyd was the referee. You know what? I might not want to fight. but I know my boxing, and I like to think, I know me boxing. And I think to myself, you know, I'm not going to out box Floyd, I'm not going to out speed Floyd, but if I'm allowed to get close to him,

I'll throw more punches than him. Simple. I will throw more punches than him. And the difference was, you know, I wasn't allowed to get close to him. Against Costa Zoo, Dave Paris let the fight flow. When it was at a distance, he let it box at a distance, and when it was up close there was no one holding up close there Steve

we were both trying to dig it both throwing you know what I mean so he didn't have to break us go on I'm going to let you fight our distance and I like you fight up close and I think if Doug Cortez

would have let me I think I might have out words him because the only person that pushed him harder was my Darno in my view and my Dada had more success in because he was allowed

to fight up close. And I'm not saying I was, you know, my dad was an urgent puncher, but I think I was a more, I think I was a more high-quality fighter technically inside, close him. I think I had a bigger engine, even though I didn't have a bigger one-punch knockout, I think if I was allowed to get close to him, like my darner was letting that fight, who knows? Who knows? We were saying in the build-up, Ricky, about how, you know, there was you and Costas you and there was Miguel Cotto and Floyd Mayweather all in the light well-to-eight division at that time. I've often said if people say to me

give me your fantasy fight that never happened one of them would have been and look we're greedy because we had you in Las Vegas but Miguel Cotto against Ricky Hatton at Madison Square Garden would be one of the dream fights for me that never did happen. What was the what was the scenario with you and Cotto around that time? I think Miguel Cotto would have been there was talk about the fight it was discussed and Cotta was the WBO champion.

And I think it was wrong about the same time I got mandatory for Kosteusu or I was three or four rankings off fighting Kosteus and I was dead keen on fighting Kostezu because he was the best. And the talk was about Koto and everything, you know, but I said, well, we've got a chance of fighting the best day.

And I honestly think because at the time Koto was really struggling to make the weight at Light World to Weight when he was WBO champion. You remember? Before Pauli Malinardi and I think he'd be pointing on points

I think but he was really struggling to make 10 stone and he moved up shortly after but I think if I had a boxed him at 10 stone but due to him struggling at the weight I don't think he'd have lived with the Ricky Hat and we just watched there against Costa Zoo I think Miguel Cotto

became a better fighter as he went up through the weight. I think when he was at Lightwell to wait, I think he was weight drained. And I think, I think, you know, you don't want to fight Ricky Hatton like that when you weight, so I think I might have, I think if it had a boxed him at welterweight, I think it had killed me because I was never really, I was never really a welterweight. I struggled with Colarzo, you know, as we well know, that is just seven pounds going

up, but then I still moved up and give it a go against Mayweather, which, you know, the opportunity comes to fight the best pound for pound. You've got it. But, yeah, I think Miguel Cotto. was a fight, that would have been brilliant. But I think my favourite would have been a Turro Gatti, just simply because he was one of my heroes. And I think I speak,

big of speak for everyone who's probably listening out there, the Turro Gatti, you know what I mean? God bless his soul. I think the fact that, the fact that meaning and then it's like a bucket list fight that for me. I thought, Zero Gatti. Do you know what I mean?

Yeah. That's what it had been. Over 18s only, though. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, so over 18s in the ring It would certainly have been over 18s Once they were out the ring together And out on the town, I can assure you

It might be over 21s Yeah, they're about to put that up past midnight That's the truth But here we are, Ricky, those of us on the outside Still getting excited like big kids Watching back 15 years on And it must And I know you've had all your issues

But it must be of some solace That you are part of one of the great knights In British Boxing history it goes back more than a hundred years and your name's right up there near the top. It was and, you know, it makes me feel very proud, you know, that people say to me now and even like youngsters, they come to me and got,

oh, Ricky, oh, you were my hero growing up watching you and these people are about six foot too tall, you know what I mean? You're my, how is your hero growing up? No, it's like, people, even lads of my own age and our age, you know, that'll turn out and say, Ricky, The greatest night I've ever been to the boxing night, you know, one of the best nights we've ever had in Manchester.

You know, it's, you know, that's what you do. And it doesn't matter, you know, it doesn't matter what you go through, good times, bad times, what money you've got in the bank, what you've not got. When fans always come up and like to talk to you about nights such as that, and they say to you, Ricky, the best times I ever had was going to Vegas, what you knew. That's worth any money to anyone. it's worth anything.

And I remember Anthony Croller saying to me, Ricky, how he was, as a kid you, the kids you talk about, he said he was in seats so high, he could almost touch the roof of the Manchester Arena, watching you, but that was what inspired him to say, one day, I want to be down there in that bear pit. So that's an important,

as well as the memory of one of the great fights, it's what you've left behind with those who followed you. And it's snowpost, don't it? You know what I mean? Everyone wants to go in the gym with Tyson Fiori now, you know? and I think, you know, through that period we had, you know, Nassim Ahmed and we had, you know,

Joe Galzakiate myself and then, Nick's Lewis and Cal Frock and, you know, and Anthony Croller and now we've got Tyson, and Joshua, who's top of the tree in the heavyweight division. Oh, snowballs, don't it?

Keeps our amateur gym is busy. And then, you know, and it's, that's our job, not just to win the fights that were in there now, to try and, you know, for youngsters to look down and say, I want to, you know, to keep the British bow

rolling as far as being in the next one's true. And it's due to the successes that we've had is why these kids want to go in the gym and that's what it's all about. Well, it's been a pleasure reliving that great night, Ricky. Thanks for your time and special memories. A fight and a night we'll never forget. My pleasure, lads. Good to see you. Thanks, Rick. See that, boy. Good to see you both. See that, son. Thank you, Ricky. Stay safe. Thank you, mate. All right. Well, just reflecting on that, Steve, there were moments there when you sensed that Ricky was back in the ring. I mean, we could see him in vision, almost throwing punches all over again. Mike, you know, there was a point there, certainly in round 10 and 11,

when I could have shut up and you could have shut up, and he would have done a three-minute commentary. And he was throwing punches, and he was living in. He was moving his head. Sometimes moving, he said, a bit more than a bit more needed in the fight. Certainly moving his head as much as Billy Graham wanted him to be. I mean, we got sucked into that one there, didn't we? I mean, this is a great series, this.

And I don't want to give too much away. This is a great series. but I felt we got sucked in there to pair of us. And you can't help but get sucked in with him because of what he was then and what he still means now, Mike. This series, Steve, he's given me a whole new education about fights I thought I knew so well. When you watch them with this kind of microscopic interest

and you get the voices of either one of the fighters involved or somebody very close to it for whatever reason, you just get a different outlook. Well, of course, Mike, we've seen it with Sugar Ray Leonard. I mean, this is, you know, how often do we get to casually talk about that? Leonard telling you, remember, what punches was going to come, what punch was going to come? And Ricky said, oh, no, it wasn't that round. Oh, no, no, it's going to be a left to the...

Ricky was picking those shots out. He was throwing the punches that he was about to land. That's quite stagnant. We've seen the same with Leonard. These great fights never leave the heads of the men that made them great. I'm convinced of that, Mike. I'm absolutely convinced of it. In terms of the big fights that I could have been at, Steve, and wasn't at, this for me is very close to the biggest miss of my career.

Because at that stage, I was working as the ringside reporter for BBC 5 Live, who were live there that night. This was before I'd taken over from John Rowling as the commentator. This was his last commentary for BBC 5 Live. I was actually in Glasgow that weekend, again, 4-5 Live, because it was one of the farewell races of Kelly Holmes. then as of now, I still cover track and field athletics as well as boxing. And Kelly Holmes, the previous year, 2004, had won double gold at the Athens Olympic Games. So she was a massive story. And so I was sent to Glasgow to cover her race on the Sunday.

So I watched it in a bar in Glasgow at like 2 and 3 o'clock in the morning. So that for me is one of the biggest misses of my professional career, of the fights that I could have been at. But for you, where does it rank? I've been asked that before, and I'd have to go back maybe 10 years or so. I feel sorry, a few years, 10 years earlier. I was talking about 95 for Nigel Ben, Joel McClellan at the London Arena. It's right there. It's with them.

It's one of those two as the greatest nights I've seen in a British ring. And also the level of victory. And what it meant on the night. That was, I mean, you know, I know I said at the time. top, which seems like a long time ago. It's like a lifetime. It's draining watching a fight with Ricky Hatton. It's draining watching Ricky Hatton fights like that. It's emotionally and physically draining. And this is not what you want to hear, Mike, but you need to be there. That hour or so in that 30 minutes and that version of Blue Moon, oh boy, that was quite incredible.

Yeah, I can fully get it even in your voice. And, you know, that as I say, was a huge miss for me. I've been very, very lucky, Steve, to have been at many a big night. But maybe this is an opportunity to put it out there, you know, let everybody tell us what was the best night they've ever been at in a British arena or that they watched on television pay-per-view or whatever. But just to close this off, Steve, I thought what we saw there at the end was not necessarily a theme, but a repetition of what we heard from Sugar Ray Leonard earlier in the series about how after he'd beaten Thomas Hearns, that was the start of downfall outside. the ring for him because he just

couldn't cope with the level of adulation and just the sheer magnitude of what he'd achieved. And we got a very similar reaction there to Ricky Hatton 15 years on from that day. As far as Leonard was concerned, you know, it's getting on for 40 years on

and they still talk about those nights that they couldn't and still can't leave behind. Because they both have to be Ricky Hatton and Sugar-A-Lennar 24 hours a day, seven days a week, even to this day, Mike. But you have to imagine what it was like for them at the time. Both Leonard and Ricky struggled with the walking away.

They desperately struggled with it. Ricky, we fought had gone after the Pachial fight, kept us waiting for a while, and then he came back for that ill-advised return, which we still thought would never happen. And in all fairness, it hasn't taken anything away from what Ricky how Ricky is remembered now.

But I must admit, I wish there wasn't that final fight. And there were plenty of fights in Leonard's career after the first Hearns fight that you wish he hadn't taken them. One that I went to the night when he stepped up, sorry, a light middleweight when he got beat by, smashed the bits by Terry Norris at Madison Square Garden,

a night I happened to be at, Mike. There were loads of fights in his career. I wish hadn't happened. There's only one really in Rickies. The outcomes are the outcomes. But I wish he'd never had. that last one. But it's been great to revisit one of the great nights in British boxing history,

June the 4th, drifting into the morning of June the 5th, 2005 in Manchester, and Ricky Hatton's remarkable win against the odds over the Russian-born Australian Kostia Zoo. There will be more to come in this fascinating series on Five Live Boxing with Costello and Bunce. Thanks for being with us.