5 Live Boxing with Steve Bunce - IT’S ON: FURY v JOSHUA

Episode Date: September 24, 2026

It sounded too good to be true. Now it’s official. Anthony Joshua will finally fight Tyson Fury on December 11th and Buncey and Barry Jones have been scrambled into action for an emergency pod. They react to the announcement, assess where both men are at this stage of their careers, and break down how the biggest all-British heavyweight fight of a generation could play out when they finally meet in the ring.

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. Welcome to the Haunted Library. Have you come in search of a tale? This podcast invites you to browse the shelves and find stories that will linger long after you've left this place. From Gothic masterpieces to Paupey Penny Dreadfuls, join me, Colin Morgan with new episodes twice a week. Find The Haunted Library wherever you get your podcast.

This is Five Live Boxing. It's on. After years and years and months and months and weeks and weeks and days and days and hours and hours and minutes, it's finally official. December the 11th in Cardiff at the Principality Stadium, former world heavyweight champions and great bitter rivals. The finest British fighters of their generation, if you like. Tyson Fury will fight Anthony Joshua. Steve Bunce and without a doubt, this is five live boxing. So it's finally on. It's been on, it's been off, there's been contract side, forget all that.

It's actually happening. To talk about it, I'm joined by former world champion and the King of Cardiff, the Ely specialist, a man who knows every single street corner, knows every single inch of that principality stadium. The one and the only Barry Jones. First of all, Barry, you did predict nearly three months ago that this fight would take place at the principality. Yeah, and I've been smug ever let's be honest. I really have. To be honest, it just made sense, you know,

with the roof and the infrastructure and the fact that, you know, there's no residential area really around there to be bothered at early hours in the morning. So yeah, I'm glad this in Canada. It's good for the economy, of course, in the capital of the principality.

And it's a great stadium to host boxing like it has been in the past. When you get 78,000 people come to town, it's a Friday night, by the way, not a Saturday night. When people come for the weekend and they will stay, obviously, the Friday night,

because the fight will start somewhere between 1 and 3 o'clock. That's one of the things we'll talk about here. But when that many people come to town with their friends sometimes who haven't got tickets to the fight, who are going to experience it on the streets and in the bars, as you and I have done with Joe Kowzaki down there. As you and I have done, or I've done, when Anthony Joshua's fought there previously,

the entire city gets wrapped up, caught up, and overtaken by this vast, invading boxing army. And you're right about the economy. The Klitskos did this for 10 years in Germany. Cities love big fights like this. The good thing about Cardiff is it's not a big city in general. And the city centre is smaller again.

So that's what makes it such a fun place to go out for. And I tell because you're only around the corner from the next pub, club, restaurant, bar, stadium and so on and so forth. So we've got the castle, obviously, right in the city centre as well. so it has a great look so I mean the Americans would be overwhelmed with it when their Netflix

are there doing their stuff it's a great place to host any event of course and we've been tried and tested with the Champions League final and we've had of course all the big rugby matches and we've had some huge boxing fights

on the anti-Josh's boxing boxes twice before already so you know he'll know what it's like there and that maybe might give him a bit more comfort going into this fight but certainly for Cardiff it's a massive coup

really is so there's lots of the stories attached to this fight finally happening. Obviously, there's the story of the fight itself, what might happen when the first bell sounds. There's the story about how the fight was on and off since 2016 April when Anthony Joshua, having just won the world title at the O2.

The first thing he says when he's interviewed in the ring is, I want to fight Tyson Fury. And at that point, Tyson Fury had boxed Vladimir Klitsko about eight months earlier and had at least two of the three World Championship belts he won't. in the ring. No chance of seeing it in 2016. It was done and secured, we were told, in June of 2020. And in 2021, early 2020, or about April, we had a date, August the 8th in Saudi. Every single one of those collapsed. This deal, we're led to believe, was done in about May when Eddie Hearn announced

and Frank Warren announced and Spencer Brown announced and Anthony Joshua's people announced, and Tyson Fury's people announced that the fight was done and Dusted finally signed. And then, about Six weeks ago, Barry, it started to go wrong, very wrong. Yeah, it did it massively right. I mean, it's such a big money fight that everybody's going to want to be involved, try to get their piece of the pie. And understandable, there's a lot of egos. It's a big pie, it is a big pie, though.

Well, I thought the stumbling block in the past was always the egos of the fighters, you know, from who goes on the poster first, who gets called into the ring first, what dressing room you have, all these things, you think they're nothing, but they become something when your ego's involved. Who's the biggest star? who's the biggest draw, who gets the biggest part of the purse. But then you also got the promoters.

Who's promoting this? How much am I getting? What do I get to do? What say do I have and where it goes? And all that plays apart as well. So there was a lot of egos to massage, but luckily, whether egos were set aside or money usually just puts people in line quite quickly.

And there's too much money now for these guys to... I mean, I would say before, there was always other avenues they had to go for big fights and big money fights. And I think those avenues... And one of them was always a world champion at the times of the negotiations and the talks. One was always a world champion.

This fight's different. They're both no longer world champions. But also, there was, for want of a better word, a thruple. There was Deont de Wilder. Let's not forget that. And so they had that option. A massive name in America,

one of the biggest punches in boxing history. He was there, which obviously Tyson Fury went on to fight him in the end, and they had their fantastic trilogy. And then Joshua, you know, just with his own star in his own vehicle of fame went on his own route. He had the two Usik fights, which then fury then eventually had.

Barry, I've got to pick up on one thing. You mentioned there about promoters. Well, to all intents and purposes, this fight was, in theory, to most of us, when it was announced or when we were talking about it. It would be Turkey Alashakes money, the re-ed season, bottomless pit of cash.

That would be part of it. Being shown on Netflix. And, of course, the initial assumption was the Eddie Hearn, who's promoted Anthony Joshua's fights and been by his side since just after the Olympics, and Frank Warren, who's been close to Tyson Fury since 2018 and managed to steer him back from weighing 22 stone and being completely a loss in life and in his boxing life. We just assumed they would be the promoters. Well, of course, it's very clever the wording on the press release that comes from,

that's been put out by the Netflix people and put out by every, everybody because it says it's being presented, obviously by Turkey Alashake, there's no mention of Frank Warren, there's no mention of Eddie Hurd, but there is mention of Dana White. Now, it's simultaneous with that being sent out to people. Eddie Hearn has given an interview to Match Room, of course, he's the boss over at Matroo, him and his father Barry, who founded it all those years ago. And he has said that that's wrong, that Dana White will not have any role to play. play. It's a bit tricky. I don't want to, I don't want you to dig yourself a hole that you find you to never climb out of.

No, no, listen, people are spiteful in our boxing business. What's your understanding of how and who is going to be promoting it, Barry? Where did we start? A contract was signed according to Eddie Hearn, and I believe that, that he was going to be the promoter. And that Dana White couldn't be the promoter. And I sort of believe that, but I mean, then, but the way he talked about, we've signed the contract, but it wasn't as if we've signed the contract so tough. It was never that, was it?

So we should have the contract. So we're ready. Going down that avenue, but they're doing other things, of course. And whoever got the money calls the shots. That's the truth of it. And Eddie Hearn rightly should dig his heels in because even though he's a friend of Joshua's,

and I think they generally are friends. And even though he wants the best for Anthony Joshua, I'm sure he does, he also wants the best for his business. And there's nothing wrong with that. That's not a callous comment. There's nothing wrong with that. So they should be involved,

I mean, you would think. And they are pushed for it. it. But ultimately, the fight will go ahead. I think now, regardless of who's promoting it, I would be pretty sure. I can't see Oeddy Hun's not involved. I cannot see that. And he might have to run there a little bit. Maybe Dana White has to have some sort of part to play in it. I don't know what part he would play, to be fair, because where does he come in, except for being in business with Turkey-A-Shake, with, obviously, with Zouffer boxing. I can't see where else they have, unless they put fighters on the undercard. This fight's so big, the undercard

almost irrelevance. That's the truth. Yeah, the undercar, in fact, there's an interesting point because it's a Friday, we can't start a massive event at 4 o'clock because everyone will still be at work. So it'll have to start a little bit later in theory, so it might be a slightly reduced undercar. I want to go back to sort of fresh out

a little bit more about who is actually the prime movers here. Because once this fight was first announced, and Eddie Hearn was very public, as was AJ, or agreeing with Eddie Hearn, the contract that Eddie Hearn and AJ, or AJ signed with Eddie Hearn, was for the fight to be in Great Britain. Tyson Fury, we found out, signed a different contract.

Now, his contract called for it to be in various places. The number one place for Tyson Fury was for it to take place in Ireland, where there would be various tax advantages. However, about six weeks ago, it was announced, not formally, but through enough different channels, and there was enough vague answers given at press conferences. and enough odd things said to make us all believe that this fight was going

on I think November the 14th I'm not mistaken about that date to New York City, to the garden. Now that was definitely going to the garden for three or four weeks. Journalists in America were wondering why. Everybody here was wondering why, but we're all slightly afraid

to say this is a disgrace. I mean, some boxers did Tony Belly was massively outspoken. But some of us in the media were saying, well, it would be better if it was here what we should have been saying. I mean, this is, I'm reprimanding lots of people here, including myself.

We should have said this fight has to be in Britain. And luckily, luckily, Eddie has stuck to his guns. AJ has stuck to his guns. And AJ changed his tone, changed his tune last week, and suddenly announced last week, about a week ago, that not only was he not going to fight in New York, he wasn't going to have the fight unless it was in England.

Now that changed things quite dramatic. Because the other negotiation was Eddie admitted that there'd been an addendum sent to Turkey Alashake to the original contract, which included all the things he wanted for AJ if the fight were to take place in America. Last week, the addendum became obsolete because AJ absolutely stuck, just said that's it. Doug his heels in. I'm staying in England. It's a fight for the British. I'm staying, sorry, I'm staying in Britain. It's a fight for the British and that's where it's going to be.

Tyson Fury at this point was that his training camp in Miami he's switched and he's come back and Frank Warren rather cheekily announced and I do like it that Tyson Fury has made this happening by agreeing to it taking place in Great Britain I mean the carnival and circus is beautiful now that it's made we can laugh about it surely and not get sued the fight it's a huge fight it doesn't have the same raw appeal that it had

when they were both at their peaks absolutely but it's still a big fight and it's a big occasion fight It's a fight that transcends not just boxing, but sports itself. Absolutely, Barry. It'll do great figures. Arguably better than it was first announced now, but I mean, but for hardcore boxing fans...

It's a much better fight now, public-wise, publicity-wise, than it was in 2016. The fight itself won't be as good. That would have been so brilliant, so raw. Both of them unbeaten at that point. For hardcore boxing fans, the fight's lost that edge for us. That's the truth of it, but it's sort of a fight that we're going to want to watch.

selfishly, I wanted to go to New York. I wanted to go to New York. I mean, it should be in Britain. I'm glad it is. Hands up. Yeah, and also, to be fair, I mean, the fact that, no, they have so much money

those fighters anyway between them. I mean, this is going to be crazy money for them. But, I mean, they got so much money that they could do what Joshua's just done and say, I'm not fighting unless it's in the UK. They have a bargaining chip because if they don't box again, they're not going to be on the street.

If they don't box again, they're not going to be in trouble with anyone else. They're not going to be financially, know, wary of how they live their rest of their life. They've got money you can't spend, a pair of them. So they can just say what they want.

And for sports fans, not just boxing fans, more sports fans, I mean, for this to be in the UK, is massive, because, I mean, people will go, and it'll be huge and people will be watching,

this would be like an old-fashioned fight where people will go to cinemas to watch it, I think. Yeah. It'll be that. Close Circuit TV. It'll be all that. I think it's going to be mega.

Welcome to the Haunted Library. Have you come in search of a tale? This podcast invites you to browse the shelves and find stories that will linger long after you've left this place. From Gothic masterpieces to Pulpy Penny Dreadfuls, join me, Colin Morgan, with new episodes twice a week. Find the haunted library wherever you get your podcasts. It's got that kind of feel to it.

And one of the things that was worrying me slightly, let's say 10 days ago, before exclusively revealing the venue and the date, but that's neither here or now, here or there, Barry. I'm not asking for a pat on the back for that, son, but when you get it right, when you get it right on the ninth of September,

that's neither here nor there. But one of the things that was worrying me was that we were running out of time. We were running out of time for that November 14th date. So I was dreading it being pushed to next year. But I also did fully believe, and I'm interested to hear what you think, you mentioned there that they could both walk away

and they wouldn't be, you know, they wouldn't be in trouble financially. Do you think that AJ was absolutely telling the truth, that it was Great Britain or nothing? I think so. Or was he bluffing? What do you think? What's your gut feeling, Barry? No, I think he was.

I mean, he was until they come back with more money. No, we all have a point where you just go, even I can't turn that down. Yeah. I mean, it's all relevant to your life. In our job, these jobs we don't want to do, and then they offer you more money, you go, I'll do it.

Yeah. Do you know what I mean? But to them, they don't need the money, but tens of millions, oh, can you say no to that? You're false. Because this is the end for them. This might be their very last fight.

I think it should be the last fight. We'll not lose. It should be the last fight. This is a way to go out, just that they seal their careers with them two fighting. They'll have a trilogy or certainly a rematch clause,

100%, but I mean, I mean, unless it's a competitive fight, we don't want to see it again, but to get it over the line with a years of promise, even though they're not the same fighters, there's wear and tear on one more than another, I would say, but still on both,

it'll still be a great occasion, a great night, and the closer the fight gets, with big fights like this, everyone questions their prediction, their opinion, and what they think the fight's going to happen. They always say, oh, maybe I'm not quite sure he looked in great shape,

and Joshua's the greatest for that because he always looks in, they're both great things, and Fulry always looks out of the shape, and Joshua always looks, in the best year of his career. Yeah, so you're always going to start switching and swaying where you think the fight's going to go.

Barry, let me ask you this. In 2016, when AJ took care of Charles Martin, who was unbeaten and was a dangerous puncher, and at that point, we were hearing rumors that Tyson Fury had lost his way. He'd only lost one world championship, one world championship belt outside of the ring. In fact, that was the belt that AJ won that night.

At that particular time, let's say, April 2016, had it been announced then, who would have been your favourite? and had it actually taken place on August 8th in Saudi Arabia in 2021, who would have been your favourite then? I'm not going to ask you about now. I'm asking you about those two dates. That's quite simple.

It's always been Tyson Fury, to be honest, it has. But the odds were shorter the first time rounds. Because Joshua had that rawness about him then where he was vulnerable. He felt he was invincible. Well, he did the basics really well. But he had a bounce to his step and he was fluent with his work. work and also he had that real like hard man

a big guy on the street when they fight they go for it because they they know that if they get hit they're done but if they can hit you you're done they know that for a fact and he

had that in him because he obviously he comes from the streets and I could see it that even in fights where he's being tagged he would go for it but with form and shape he wouldn't lose his shape but he would commit and then after the Ruiz defeated, the first Ruiz

fight in New York, then he taped with his style to be a little bit more risk adverse, which is sort of the right thing to do. Does that make him smarter since losing to Ruiz?

It makes him more thoughtful. Being more thoughtful for him was never a good idea because, like, for someone like me who can't punch and likes to move and has good legs, then yeah, you get hurt, you retreat,

you come back, you make sure you're okay, you go again. But for him, that's not good for him. It took away something essential and Anthony Joshua's makeup.

Yeah, yeah, I think so. And I think he's been on a quest ever since of trying to find new things to make him a better fighter. And that's admiral, but I think you lose sometimes what makes you good to gain something that you think's going to make you better, but it doesn't.

And I think that's been the problem with him, where Tyson Fury has just stayed like he is. And if anything, as he slowed down, has become more of a puncher, but he's still a guy who's gives you opportunities to land, but he's tall, he's tricky, he knows what he uses, reaching his length.

So he was always the favourite. But as the years have gone on, I've made Tyson a bigger favourite. And for now, I have to see, before the Prenga fight, I would say... This is Christian Prengue

who A.J. fought in the summer in Jeddah when he was wobbled and dropped in the first round. Before that fight, I thought this might be a closer one than I've ever thought before again. After I've seen Fury against MacMoodoff, of course.

Back in April, Tottenham, 68,000, yeah. And he didn't look great. And I thought, Well, if he's lost a step, because he's such a reactive fighter, if he's lost that sharpness and his reaction's not as fast, then Josh was, if Josh was one, he's got a chance. But the way he got hurt by Prenga,

and Prenger's a big punch, I know he is, but the way you couldn't see the shots coming, that's the problem, not the power. Big punch at certain levels, though, Barry, that's the difference, isn't it? He couldn't see him coming, and that's the worry. The awareness has gone from him, and I think that makes fury now, probably a bigger favourite in my mind than ever before. See, I've got to say, Steve, but in this division, anything happens. Oh, mate, the one shock can hit you, it can hit you from the shoulders up and you're in trouble.

Yeah, and that's every heavy week on the planet. Yeah, men that have had, you know, 33 and 38 fights, and AJ's 36, the Fury's 37, and sometimes they can look every single minute of that 36 and that 37. It's really interesting, Barry. Over the last five or six weeks, if I've been stopped on tubes, on trains at airports or in restaurants, or talking to friends or talking to people at boxing, I was ringside. And when I was ringside with you last weekend up in Manchester.

I'm trying to, I can't remember anybody telling me they thought that AJ would win. One or two people said they thought he would win years ago. But I'm of the opinion that this fight is absolutely 50-50. I think they both shown things this year in their fights that are very alarming. And I think they're both alarming in equal measure. Now, what's going to be really interesting, and it's going to start next Wednesday is once they come together.

Now, we know they met before because I famously did that interview with Tyson Fury back in 2010 after he just sparred with a very young kid called Anthony Joshua at Finchley and it was that incredibly open interview from him. And then we know they bumped into each other, I think in Marlbaer,

I think Tyson was walking and AJ was in a car all the other way around. But as far as I know, and they never, I don't think they've ever shaken hands. Now that's going to, apart from when they touch gloves at the end of the sparring session. So we're going to start to see that. because I'm not saying that this fight can be one outside the ring by the antics,

but I think it will give us an insight into how the two of them are coping with this part of their careers. Because it's the, let's get it right, it's the twilight parts of the years of both their careers. It is, you know what to expect von Fury, chaos and madness, that's what he's going to be like. I mean, even if some, he might turn up with one press conference and be very respectful and very philosophical sometimes. he can be, you know, but sometimes he's just mad. You just say some outrageously crazy things just to get into your skin

or just to sell the fight. He knows what he's doing. And Joshua might just sit there and smile. I mean, all the target is going to come from Tyson Fury. But I hope Joshua gets a little bit nasty. I mean, I hope he plays that part. He's good when he's nasty.

I like him when he's nasty. Do you remember against Pulev? When Poolev had said something to him, it was probably not printable. And Joshua was really really angry and it was an anger in his and it was almost a return to the pre-ruis Joshua. I like that. The thing is

Joshua's been a victim of his his likable personality and his huge success and his crossover appeal where you want an animal in the ring and you want a saint outside the ring and then when the pandemic happened and all the other stuff around that before that

and after that he was criticized for being himself and I was like what do you want? When he was when he was the perfect know interviewee he was too media trained he never gave us a set we don't know what he's all about

we just know all we see is the media persona we don't get to know him and then he lets his guard down he shows what he's all about a little bit not fully a little bit and he and he backs his people and he does this

and he says a few things that people don't like and now and then everyone hated him all of a sudden like what do you want how can he win you can win I mean you can't win

and also when when he was at the top. When everyone loved him, everyone hated Tyson Fury. I mean, Tyson Fury came back from all the, all the problems he had. Up and down, up and down. Then everyone, when everyone loved him, they couldn't love Joshua as well. They had to hate Joshua. Then it was like, why can't just like him both or hate them?

I don't care. But I mean, it's, if you got to, if one's the angel, one's the devil, and if one's the devil, the other one's the angel, I mean, it's always like crossing over that way. And I think now they're fighting, people get to choose to side. And I think people will choose, because this fight, no, a lot of people outside. the boxing will choose who they like, not who they think is going to win. That's where they'll choose. It's going to be interesting on the night, December the 11th. The roof will be on, obviously.

Of course, there are four tiny sections where there is no roof, but hey-ho, that's the way it works. 79, oh, 80 or 81,000, depending on who you believe. Hey, you know, when we went to Katie Taylor at Croke Park, it was 80,000 all week. By the time the fight had finished, the capacity was 83,000. You talk to people now, it's 85,000. I tell you what, Steve. This is going to be the same down there in Cardiff. If it was the old state, yeah.

I used to sneak in there all the time. I know a route, but it's gone, it's the new stadium for the last 30 years. Barry, I'm going to... To me, it's a new stadium. The old stadium, I could have got you in. I'm going to speak with the powers that be and worse ways, worse ways.

Me and you will go out for a cup of coffee when I'm down there. So Anthony Joshua will finally fight Tyson Fury, December the 11th. After several full starts, going back to 2016, fights seem to be signed and sealed in 2020, signed and sealed in 2021, signed and sealed four or five months ago. Then it fell out of bed.

Then it was going to New York. Then it fell out of bed again. Then there was some ugly, ugly stuff. And there's still some stuff to be settled. Dana White's involvement. That's something that needs to be settled. How much as Anthony Joshua got left? How much as Tyson Fury got left? There'll be cynics out there saying, oh, it's too late. You know what? For a fight like this, and I'll say this now, Barry, it's never too late. We just want to see it happen. Next year it becomes more of a freak show. The year after it becomes more of a freak show. Right now, it's still a fight.

And I've been to some of the biggest nights I've ever been at when one or both of the men have been past their best. Trust me, that's the way our business works. Barry, just thoughts quickly going into it. Will there be anything you're looking to see from either of them between now and the first bell on the December 11th? Just something, a little bit of boxer insight. I think

nothing now you're going to get you know the theatricals and all the it's going to be a great it's going to be a great buildup it's going to be a massive buildup

and there's going to be people there who media people who've never seen before turn up oh yes darling oh you're going to be you're going to love every minute of it but I mean

at some point as the fight gets closer because it's I mean no one likes to lose to lose your nemesis I mean that I mean that's I mean

okay it's not for It's not for who's the best in the world anymore, but it's like you're going to go, no one wants to walk into retirement, losing to this guy. Yes. And it goes both ways, by the way, and I don't know who it affects more.

I don't know, because they both lost now, isn't they? That's a really interesting point. When they were both unbeaten, I think that Tyson Few would have felt it harder had he lost. Yes, I think so, yeah. But he was unbeaten.

Now they both lost, but there again, I would argue, all defeats pale into insignificance compared to what a defeat will be to that, as you say, use the word and it's the right word and it's going to be overused between now and December the 11th, midnight or 2 o'clock in the morning

whenever this fight finishes. Nemesis. It's nemesis. It's nemesis v. Nemesis. Not the catchiest title in the world, Barry, I'll give you that, son. But it's not bad because that's what it is. I know they're getting paid fortunes, but the personal pride here is immense. It's staggering. And it might be overwhelming.

Barry Jones, it's been a pleasure and a delight talking to you. Now we can officially announced what we have been talking about on and off for about four weeks. December the 11th at the Principality Stadium in Cardiff. Barry Jones can no longer get you in. Don't fall for that. You won't sell your tickets and you'll smug you in and a balaclava and a pair of sunglasses. Those days are well and truly gone.

Five Live will be around all week during Fight Week. We'll also hopefully get an audience with the two boxers and the people involved. You see, I didn't use the word promoters. sometime next week. I've been Steve Bunts, and this has been 5 live boxing. I'm Steve Bracknell, assistant manager of Sunday League

Powerhouses, the Royal Oak FC. And I'm back in changing room at Royal Oak for a new season of Games Gone, the podcast that takes you back to the grassroots of the game. With my colleague Paul Samson and Bob the Buckey.

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