5 Live Boxing with Steve Bunce - Joshua stunned in New York

Episode Date: June 2, 2019

Mike and Steve are ringside in New York's Madison Square Garden where Andy Ruiz Jr. produced one of the biggest shocks in the history of heavyweight boxing to take Anthony Joshua's IBF, WBO and WBA world heavyweight titles from him. Along with David Haye and Carl Frampton they analyse a US debut to forget for AJ, heap praise on underdog Ruiz, and ask what this result means for future fights in the division. Then, the boys take a trip to the diner after interviewing both Ruiz Jr. and Joshua in the changing rooms.

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when there were three knockdowns. Two for Ruiz and Joshua knocked down the Mexican. himself. Joshua goes to the body with another one of those jabs. Will Ruiz continue to concentrate on the torso area, the body area of Anthony Joshua. The next change of left hooks overhand right from Ruiz. Ruiz mounts another attack. Joshua in trouble and Joshua goes down for the third time in the contest in the seventh round. He's up almost immediately. The referee gets to six and to seven and to the mandatory eight. He has a good look at Joshua, but there are two minutes and 15. seconds to go in round number seven are we about to witness one of the great heavyweight upsets

Joshua tries a couple of left hooks he's still fighting back and now Ruiz opens up a left hook a right hand and Joshua goes down again for the second time in a round Joshua is looking like a beaten man he's listening to the count the referee reaches the mandatory aid Joshua spits out the gum shield He won't be allowed to continue without the gum shield being replaced. The referee's talking to him over in the corner. Such drama here and absolutely everybody at ringside on their feet. And the referee has waved it off. We have seen one of the most sensational upsets in the history of Madison Square Garden,

in the history of heavyweight boxing. Anthony Joshua has been stopped by Andy. Ruiz Jr. in the seventh round. All the talk of Deonté Wilder of Tyson Fury can be silenced. Andy Ruiz has just thrown a grenade into the heavyweight landscape. The boy who was bullied at school, who was laughed at at the final press conference. They will be laughing no more. Andy Ruiz Jr. on a quite unforgettable night here becomes Mexico's first world heavyweight champion taking in the celebrations as Anthony Joshua stands disconsolate in the corner on the far side of the ring, beaten for the first time in his professional career.

He is no longer the World Heavyweight Champion. What a night, what a fight. Referee Michael Griffin steps in and calls a halt to the contest. The official time. One minute, 27 seconds. Round number seven, the winner by 20. TKO victory and now the new unified IBO, I BF, WBA, WBO, heavyweight, champion of the world, Andy Destroyer.

So a crushing defeat, the first of his professional career for Anthony Joshua on the night he thought would be the start of the new phase of his career, leaving his memory at Madison Square Garden. Joshua he is smiling and congratulating Andy Ruiz Jr. in the center of the ring. Some of the odds layers here in New York were offering odds of 30 to 1 against Andy Ruiz Jr. He has made nonsense of those odds and he has taken the title here in one of the great upsets in the history of boxing and the heavyweight division. Our guests here tonight on this amazing night at Madison Square Garden, Carl Frampton and David Hay, both two-weight world champions,

both shaking their heads, can't believe what they've seen. With dumbstruck with the outcome there, Mike, and I'm dumbstruck with these celebrations, with the love I'm seeing, and I'm shocked. What we all can't do is take away the credit from a man, Andy Ruiz, you know, who took this fight on only six weeks notice.

You had some of the biggest names in the division turned this fight down on such notice. You know, Louis Lutees turned down ridiculous money, six million to take this fight. Andy Ruiz took the fight and came out here with a fantastic game plan. He stood there his ground, took his licks like a man, and won the fight legitimately. No fouls, it was just clean punching. He knocked, and it wasn't a one-punch knockout.

It wasn't like anyone could win it. It wasn't Oliver McCaw or Hassim Rackman when he knocked out. He systematically broke down Anthony Joshua and beat him up. There's obviously a rematch clause in this. I don't know how much Andy Ruiz got paired. maybe four or five million dollars. There must be a rematch close, but he'll get the rematch,

he'll make an absolute fortune. Let's have a listen. Let's not have a listen, Mike. Sorry about that. Mike, I know one thing, and I don't want to make this. I don't want to trivialise what we've just seen here because it was quite brilliant,

quite exceptional, quite stunning, quite amazing, even for old battles like me. But at least we know where we're going in September. At least we know where we'll be in September, boys. But also, it's one of those lessons, isn't it, about fights that are mentioned and negotiated and there's talk on both sides, whether it's social media or whatever. And now we have a very different landscape for Joshua against Fury,

Joshua against Deonté Wilder. And these are the fights that we wanted to see happen. I mean, we've seen drama that we might not have seen in any of those fights, but it just now creates a very different picture around those fights. Massilever, maybe they'll start to happen now. We were all talking about them waiting one fight too long on someone getting beat in the process. We never thought it would be the Andy Ruiz fight.

We always thought maybe Lewis Ortiz, not swore to Furies fight next. You don't imagine them fights, the fighters to lose against these type of opposition. But this is what happens when you don't take the fights. Now, hopefully these fights happen. You know what? Let's say Wilder agrees to fight Joshua in September

because Ortiz pulls out. They'll still make the same. They'll still make good money, car. But it's not the same fight. And Eddie Hearn all week, Eddie Hearn, who's a great showman, he's a great salesman, let's get away, he's a great promoter. And I really mean that. All week long, he kept saying, one loss ruins everything.

One loss changes the entire landscape. We have to have a Rui's rematch here, although, of course, Ruiz is looked after by El Heyman. But all we know, we might have Ortiz pull out, and it's Ruees against Wilder in September, David. Just remember, if this was Andy Rui's on six weeks' notice, how's he going to be on 12thes' time? weeks notice, on 14 weeks notice, when he's had a full sparring camp, when he's had a full training camp, he's only going to be better next time. Now he's got the confidence. Has he got into Andy Joshua's head? Will Andy Joshua want the rematch? Well, let's know. Listen, even if Anthony Joshua was absolutely cream-crackered exhausted at the end when that fight finished in the

seven, he still was cautious in the fourth, the fifth and the six after that third round bludgeon and I hope Michael's gone up to the ring gets hold of Joshua because I still can't work out Carl, why you've lost and I've seen you. Let me tell you say you two are two of the worst losers I've ever known and that's a compliment

What's wrong with him? Why isn't he kicking off? I'm so shocked! You talk about people being good losers and stuff, it's nice to be gracious and defeat and shake someone's hand but it's a little bit too nice for this for me if you lose a fight you should be absolutely heartbroken, you should be raging with yourself,

to be absolutely gotten in. And I'm not seeing it either, David. I know what? I know my, I know, I know, I know, I know, I know, I know, I know when I'm in the ring, I go into the ring, I'm willing to die in the ring. I'm sure you have to, you've only got to watch my fights over the years, you know, I'm willing to, you know, go out. I know you, I'd rather get stretched out than not continue.

And I know, it looks, sorry, David, looks now, and listen, and I, and I share you, you, your sense of confusion. Joshua is finally going to be doing Sky up in the ring. Andy Scott's up in the ring. Let's hope that Mike gets him because I want to get a, and I've known Joshua for nine or ten years, I want to get a handle on what this is all about

because I can't work it out, Carl, because it's not, listen, you're a big boy, you lose a close decision, you deal with it. You know, you had life and death with Warrington. You weren't celebrating at the end, But at the same time, you understand what's going on. I can't see it. I just don't know what's going on.

People talk about bad losers and stuff, and especially you talk about it when there's kids, kids thrown a tantrum. I like to see that because it means they wanted to win. This is a completely bizarre scenario. There's too much males here for me. And let's not forget, those knockdowns came in the third round. First of all, he gets these kids caught square where he goes down from a really powerful left of,

every single ounce of Joshua's being put in that. He got up her and he then just said, you know what? Damn it, I'm going to go. And he caught and hurt Joshua dropped him. He hurt him at the end of the third. Joshua survived the next few rounds and then he was caught in that round. But the round before, he looked absolutely gone.

That was when both you and David highlighted the body shots. So he wasn't right. What we actually saw by the time it come wasn't a shot. That performance, Romani Rears, there was a complete, like, it was a, not a master class as such, But the way he went about it, he was dropped, he got up, he knocked Joshua down, and then he went to his body, target his body specifically.

And Joshua, as you've seen, was tired. He was so tired at the end. And the knockout, it was almost like it was going to come. And Dave, just to go back, because people might just be listening to this, or they might be scrambling to try and find it to watch it. Just to go back, the referee was left with absolutely no option. The referee gave him more than a benefit and a doubt more. The referee, what the referee should have?

have done is counter eight he gets to his feet wipe his gloves and waving and he were his back into the action but and the but andy josha wasn't ready to fight he was lean he had both his arms on the ropes the the ropes are holding him up at that stage and at some at one point there car michael griffin the referee quite illegally i'm sure and in fact if i mean rurries is called i'm going mad he actually grabs russia about his shorts and tries to pull him back in the He was given as much chances that he could have. There was a point in the run where Josh who was dropped twice. If that was Andy Reid, who was dropped twice, the fate was over.

Absolutely. It was over. And you're absolutely right, Dave. We need to give this guy a guy that has been dismissed so often. Mike is getting really close up there. I think we might just get to Joshua here. We have Mike's with Joshua now. Anthony.

A sensational night that went wrong for you. Where did it go wrong? Where did it go wrong? I'll watch it back, but it's just getting involved of it, do I mean? And taking some clean shots. But what a fucking fight. Sorry about my language.

What a bloody fight. Congratulations to him. You said you wanted to be involved in a Ron Lyle, George Foreman, right? I'll grab you here for a second, Anthony. Excuse me. Okay, we're being forced away,

and I'm going. We're being forced away. You don't own it. So. Okay, we got pushed away there. One of the other companies that's already interviewed him. I've decided to do another interview because I believe their first interview wasn't that good.

Girl who showed it up, Mike. I had a run up with her at Boston. She's not an ace lady. Yeah, you're right. There's a floor manager in the ring and she's quite infamous, actually. She's been around a long time and she's giving Mike some stick. But Jack, the producer, has calmed, is calming Mike down. Mike will go back and he will get a second shot. Don't worry about that. Meanwhile, meanwhile, there is chaos here and there's also a really bizarre sense of feeling because the fans went for a good time had that been in the UK there might have been some

booing and nastiness but here they're as stunned as us three let's not mince that a word everyone's stunned the whole world is stunned I'd love to have been I'm sitting on my couch watching this that'd be absolutely gobsmacked I'm texting everybody waking everybody up I'm 10 yards from a ring I honestly can't believe what I've seen

how do you compare that and in the list of all 10 great offsats. Well, I tell me up there. Oh no, hey, listen, there might be something above it, but I can't instantly think of what it is. Tyson against Buster Douglas, possibly. And of course, that was a fight where all of the

outside circumstances came to the surface after the fight. What do we make, not the swear word, but what do we make of Josh, the one thing he did say, we did say, I got involved, what a effing fight. Now, again, that's as confusing as what we've seen.

Was he celebrating the fact that he was in an up and down of war. Where you'll realise, he's taken a hell of a lot of big shots in there. He's concussed, you know, I've had interviews after fights, and I've watched them back on tape, and I've known that's not quite been me speaking.

And I'm pretty sure he's got dropped heavily. Bridgett five times in one fight. No, four, five times. Four times in one fight. He's exhausted body shots. I can go to Mike now. Mike's now with Eddie. Eddie, your thoughts, mate?

Just shops, you know. I think. just speaking to Skydera, I was like, I don't think it sunk into anyone, but we knew it was a possibility, we knew Ruiz could fight, AJ got badly sloppy. Third round was a beautiful combination

and it looked like Ruiz was finished, done. And he got sloppy, he came in, trading, he got hit on the top of the head, and he never really recovered. There was times in the fifth and sixth round that I felt like he did recover. And then, you know, again, got caught and just seemed to run out of gas.

He didn't seem himself, but tonight belongs to Andy Ruiz. It goes down as one of those big, big upsets in heavyweight history. And there's always that danger. But now it's about rebuilding. You know, it's about seeing what he's made of, and I know what he's made of. And I know how much this will hurt him.

This will devastate him. And he will rebuild and he will come back. He didn't want to give in, he didn't know where he was at the end. And, you know, like I said, Andy Ruiz, the lovely guy, deserves it. He's the new heavyweight champion of the world. And now it's down to the rematch. And winning that fight in November, December, to bring that back to the UK

and he must win that fight you know there's no other crack after that he must win that fire and he'll do everything he can to regain his titles we noticed towards the end of the week Eddie a sky above the right eye of Antony Joshua was all fit and well within on the way in all was fine I mean he had a stye in his eye

didn't affect his vision didn't affect his training you were just wondering whether it was a sign of something else no I mean you know was he under stress yeah probably but new environment you know honestly Mike I can't tell you something went wrong in Cam something weren't right he was fine obviously it was a new environment that was always the risk here but he should be in I think most people's opinion be beating Andy Ruiz tonight maybe in the

one or two times out of ten that Andy Ruiz wins that fight he done it and listen congratulations to him Mexico's first ever world every way champion and now we have to go back rebuild and try and win a rematch this it's all on up in now so we're looking at at November, December, you're saying. Yep, yep, that's... And by the way, Andy Ruiz will fancy this rematch. You know, he will believe that he can beat AJ again. He took the fight at reasonably short notice,

and the pressure's on now. I mean, you know, you lose that rematch, there's no coming back from, you know, the world championships. There's rebuilding, but to get back to the heights that he's been, he must win that rematch. And, you know, again, it's just... I'm shocked, you're shocked, everybody's shop.

But it's reality. we've got to swallow it, suffer it and come back. That's all you can do. And I know he'll bounce back. You know, he gives everything to this sport and he will do everything he can to try and win that rematch. Thanks as ever for your time, mate. Thanks for him.

Mike there with Eddie Hearn. We're still trying to get to Anthony Joshua. He's been taken away. I think there's some medical personnel surrounding him and an equally disconsolate group of his handlers and his mind does I hope we do get to him because I take on board what you say

David that he's probably a little bit, you know, he's a victim cast and Eddie of Sam doesn't know where he is but he's walking away there like he's pulled off a great shot win not like he's been the victim of a great shot loss is a

it's a it's a bizarre evening that nobody anticipated nobody expected and Andy Ruiz is the new number one in the division he beat the man of the most belt we've got ourselves a Mexican

heavyweight champion I'll tell you what the reaction might be down to you Anthony Josh is such a program commercial guy and he's never had to face anything like Justin's Leav even against Clitchco where he had to get up off the tack he got up and won big celebrations but he's just been beat

he doesn't know how to react to it yeah and also when he got dropped by Clitchco in that round he went back to the corner and he said to Robert McCracken, it's okay, I'm going to take a couple of rounds off. And McCracken was shocked and if you actually watch the fight back, he does take a couple of rounds off. They aren't desperate rounds and I would argue, I would suggest to you two, that those two or three rounds after that mad third, they were desperate rounds. They were survival rounds and not nice survival round.

There was a point where he tried to take a round off and Andy Ruiz targeted the body and then he really had to take a round off and it looked like he was, you could physically see he was become unexhausted. Yeah, the roundoff, he tried to take a round off, but Andy Ruiz exclusively aimed at his body and landed maybe six or seven clean shots to the abdomen, and that really does sap your strength, saps your energy stores.

And so when Anthony needed to step up the gears, there was nothing left in the tank. He had it punched out of him. I was saying early on whether I thought Ruiz might start to tire after three or four rounds. But something he said to me during the week stuck with me that he's never in his professional career had two back-to-back camps.

And he got this call towards the end of the previous camp for the fight he had on April of the 20th. So he told me he had literally a couple of days off and then back in the gym. And what he said to me was he's actually had a 15-week camp with a fight in the middle against a man who's exactly the same size and shape

as Joshua. Now, I don't want to sort of claim to be after-timeless here, but if you're going to pull off a shock that's a perfect set of perfect storm you talk about fate and things happening for a reason that's everything just seemed to fall into place there for brandy reese and

we look at what happened tonight this shock the biggest shock I've ever seen in my whole day is in boxing that's that's unbelievable and I'm live here I can't believe it Mike can I just ask you this Mike I know you only got him for a minute before he was wrenched from you and he gave you an answer but

I'm not asking about his words I'm asking about his demean you know what I mean I know what I mean I know you a long while What did he look like up close? Vacant I thought so well done And that was how he came across

And Eddie put And Eddie said to you He had no idea where he was And you could tell by the kind of If you can call it a conversation What was unfolding between him and the referee It was as if And then he suddenly

As the referee started waving He suddenly lent in as if to say Oh were you asking me the question His instinct strangely didn't seem to fight. For instance, when I've been hit on the button and I'm buzzing, my instinct is doing, okay, let's just start swinging.

That was my natural instinct. His instinct didn't seem to be that. It was to, I don't know, walk to the corner and stay in the corner. I like the honesty for Maddie Hearn after in that interview, he says that Joshua must win the rematch. And he must, where does he go?

If he doesn't beat Andy Reeves, where does he go? And the other thing, to be perfectly honest of you, what he reminded me of when he went back to his corner there so nonchantly after that second drop down, knockdown, whatever you want to call it in that round. That looked like sparring. That looked like sparring.

I've been here, I've been hurt, I spit my gum shoot out, I'll go back in the corner, I put my arms up, I'll take a few breaths. That looked like a man who had been hurt, whack, caught. In a sparring ring and just wandered back to the corner, Dave. I wanted to see more desperation. I wanted to see someone who realized my whole career's on the line here. I've got this is the biggest fight.

My life is my American debut. I need to go out, just go out swinging me. I've got a, you know, I've been on a deck four times. Let me get up. Let me convince the referee to let me at this little guy. The backlash from this is going to be absolutely massive. And he's going to have to be able to be mentally strong enough to deal with that. He's going to get so much dick by other boxers, but social media and stuff.

But watch Big Fury and watch Wilder go in. They're going to give him. Dogs abuse. And absolutely, so they should, because that's the business. You know, you use that tool. You live and die on social media. You use it when you need to put plugs to get your little bits up so you can sell the products you're endorsing and making millions.

And equally, you should take it as a big boy when you start getting abuse. I don't mean the rancid abuse that's often got a racist tone to it in some form or sexist tone in some sort of shape. I'm talking about those big, those two big guys have got every right. to stick the boot in. Because you know what? If Wilder was fighting Ruiz tonight and if Fury was fighting Maurice tonight

and he went down four times and was stopped on his feet, Joshua and Joshua's people, they'd be sticking that gilt edge dagger straight in under the rib cage. But one thing you've got to remember as well, Andy Rees got in the ring. Whereas the other two didn't.

How gutted are both Fury and Wilder going to be after seeing that thing? That could have been me. I could have been walking out there with his belts. If Andy Ruiz, a six-foot, you know, completely obese guy can knock out in Joshua, I would have had a great chance of doing it. And I think they're going to kick themselves because they've forfeited by far probably times five their biggest purse of their lives. Could I just throw this at you, Carl?

If there was nothing wrong and if the star isn't connected to him being run down and if there isn't an ongoing cold, then tonight that was a really bad performance by Joshua. when under pressure. That reeks of a man being backed up, of a bully being found out unless there's some reasons. Lucky hurt his right hand or dislocated something. So Mike asked the question,

the Eddie, and he refused it completely. He said he was in the shape of his life and it was just an underpower performance. And if that's the case, it was a very underpower performance. And it may have been the fact that Andy Ruiz, once he get dropped, he just fired back.

This is something that Josh is, I've knocked someone, Josh expects when he knocks people over, normally that's it game over it's only going one way this kid got up and put him down 30 seconds later and as david said during the fight responded in a way that vladimir klitschko didn't and maybe couldn't because he was 40 years of age yeah Vladimir klitschko didn't have the legs he was it was 40 years of age when that fight happened anti-josh was fighting someone tonight the same age as him you know the guy obviously doesn't look after himself physically but the guy's young he's got no miles on a clock he's had no

As he said, that was the first time he'd ever been knocked down. And how did he respond to the first time of him getting knocked down? 10 seconds later, he puts down Anthony Joshua. Here's one for you. Kudan Di Ruiz, Mek Cruiser. Weird have he lost some beef? 100%. I believe he made.

And also, you know, we're talking about, sorry, Mike, kind of caution you there. I know we're talking about Vladimir Klitsko not putting his foot down and not chasing and not trying to take advantage of Joshua. And we're saying that Ruiz did. But what Ruiz really did was when he got up, Okay, and he was okay.

He was say his feet were square when he got caught. When Rurie's got up, he said, this is when I'm going to do what I've promised to do. This is when I'm going to do what I've been telling everybody since, well, for the last two or three weeks, five weeks. I'm going to do now exactly what I promise you what I'm going to do. I'm going to dig my fat little feet in this soft canvas, and I'm going to swing like my life depends on it. And if I catch him, I know I can hurt him. He told us this at sunset on Monday, on a lovely bow. on the 25th floor, not six or seven blocks from here.

Carl, he looked me in the eye and told me, if I get hurt, I'll hurt him, I'll get to him. He said it. We dismissed it. We didn't want to believe it. No one believed it. And look, he was relaxed the whole week. There was no pressure on him, but Josh, it was relaxed.

When Joshua walked the ring tonight, that was the first time I seen a wee bit of anger in his face. And I was like, oh, Josh is up for it here. He's going to put in a performance. But the performance came from Andy Ruiz. And you were talking about there, the possibility of him going, down to cruise away. But when we're talking about

bodies here and the laughter that was around on social media and elsewhere, is it Anthony Joshua's body that's not fit for purpose? Is he just too stiff? Anthony Joshua started boxing a lot later than a lot of other fighters. He started in his late teens. He was 18 years

of age. Most boxers, world-class boxes start a lot earlier. I know that Deonti Wilder also started late. But Wilde, and Andy Joshua aren't, I don't know, they don't, they, they're athletes who happen to do boxing. Whereas, you know, Andy Riz Jr., he's a boxer, you know, you see we're slipping the punches, he's riding the punches, when he got hurt, his instinct was to keep punching. It's, it's, it, I don't know, Andy Joshua's designed to do any sport.

Look at him, he could do shot foot, he could be a hundred-meter sprinter, 50,000, he can do any sport. He's just a natural athlete. There's always, there's always been a concern about. his engine. There's always, and right through his whole career and they keep talking about it, but tonight it was proved that he gasped. And if they're saying that there was no illness and the sty wasn't related to a cold or a flu, then the engine's definitely a concern. If he thinks it was savage in there tonight, I can assure you, I can assure you, he's going to get a mauling, not just from the social media, one or two of the British press who perhaps feel

they don't have the access they should get, but he's going to get a real mulling from the Americans that came out and from the Americans coming in because they were promised the second coming they were promised a man that was going to transform boxing in America and they've seen that man battered by an overweight nice guy from down on the Mexican border one bit the one thing that really really sticks from me is I remember the first time Mike Tyson lost Buster Douglas his air of invincibility dissipated and everybody then truly believed all they've got to do is just get past the initial onslaught and they've got a shot. Anthony Joshua is invincible.

He's gone now. He's a mere mortal. He wasn't mortal before. We saw him and get knocked down by Vladimir Klitschko. And we thought, that's it. And then he comes back and wins. He then fights Poviccan. He knocks him out.

He just keeps winning. He's lost his invincibility now. And everybody is going to be trying that little bit harder. In the past, when people started losing, they realized, okay, it's my time to check out now. Now they just got to hang in there. Keep swinging. Throw the body shots. And he's going to really need to step his game up

if he's going to want to continue for the success he's had up until this point. I remember a lovely line from Buster Douglas on one of the anniversaries of that fight when he was interviewed. And he said, when he was asked how come he was so different to anybody before that, why was he the first to burst the balloon? And he said everyone else had fought Tyson with one foot in the ring and one foot out. And that's going back to what you're saying. But he also, and I'm not taking anything away from Buster, he's a lovely man and he's battled all sorts of staffs including a food coma.

But there were factors that that Tyson that got in the ring wasn't even a half decent Tyson. And I'm trying not to take anything away. But what we're hearing tonight, what we're hearing tonight is that that was a decent, Joshua. Well, we've had some response on social media. You were talking about the backlash that he can expect. This is from Tyson Fury.

He might surprise some. We have our back and forth, but Anthony Joshua changed his stars. through life. Heavyweight boxing, these things can happen, rest up, recover, regroup and come again. And Frank Bruno responded to that by saying well said. So, it seems

as though within the game, we're in here what he says tomorrow though. That, I tell what, that from Fury, you know, here's a man Fury that can wrong foot us and has wrong footed us several times in the last five or six years and he's just done it again tonight. Because I would have had the five

dollars in my pocket, hands on. He would have been the first in. And then he's gone and done some. I mean, just one few even more friends come. It was good, it was clever, but it's going to come. Steve, you know it's going to come. Let's get ready to rumble. Five live boxing. Well, that's how we all felt in the immediate aftermath at ringside.

We're now retired to the TikTok diner, one block up from Madison Square Garden on 8th Avenue. And before we left the arena, I caught up with Andy Ruiz Jr. Just as he was leaving his dressing room, we walked from the dressing room to a huge, service lift that took us to the press conference that he was heading to. And he gave me his reaction to becoming the first Mexican world heavyweight champion. Andy, can I just answer a couple of questions as we were?

The last thing you said to me was how you were going to make everybody laughed at you changed their whole attitude. I sure did, you know, and everybody that doubted me, look at me now, man. I'm the first Mexican heavyweight champion of the world. And if this wouldn't have happened without God's blessing, and we accomplished my dreams. How badly hurt were you in the third round? I really didn't.

I really didn't know what shot he got me, but I got up. I went stronger and had to put him down because he put me down, and what do you know, we did it. What was that feeling when your arm was raised at the end? Worse can't explain, man. I still can't believe it to this moment. Maybe one day soon it was sink in, huh?

Maybe tomorrow. You realize you've created one of the greatest upsets in the history of the heavyweight division? I sure did, man. And I just can't believe it. I thank God every moment from this moment on. And everything is possible, man. Everything is possible. Everybody doubted me and we're here now.

We're in a lift going to the press conference. Did you genuinely believe that you'd be going to the press conference as the heavyweight champion of the world? I sure did believe. I don't think I would have won if I didn't believe. So somebody wants to achieve their goals. They have to believe. and they have to believe in God and everything is possible. You came here straight from the fight against Dimitrenko.

How important were two back-to-back camps for you? It was really good. I don't think this wouldn't happen if we didn't have two back-to-back and being busy, you know. So we were ready for all the war and whatever it came on June 1st, and we're here now, first Mexican heavyweight champion. Are you ready for the rematch? I'm ready for the rematch.

Thanks for your time, Andy. Sorry, sir. Andy Ruiz, sounding as calm and relaxed, bizarrely, as he was on Monday when we first spoke to him. And Mike, let's pick up straight away on the one big thing. That line, and it's a great line, that wouldn't have happened without the back-to-back camps. And, you know, people often accuse me of using that after-timer and asterix too often. But we were talking about the back-to-back camps on Monday's pod, four pods ago. Yeah, it was a special performance by Ruiz.

for sure, Stephen. I was looking at the judges' scorecars. Two judges by the time the fight ended, i.e. going into round seven, had Ruiz one round up. The other judge had Joshua one round up. It was that kind of fight, similar to the scorecars that appeared after Joshua against Vladimir Klitschko. And we've seen another special night. This time, Joshua on the receiving end. But, as he was saying to me, before I got dragged away at ringside,

this was a kind of Ron Lyle, George Foreman type of fight that we were talking to him about in the buildup. Yeah, what he said was, obviously I can't repeat, but he said, what a great fight, what a great fight. Again, just one of the more bizarre and odd statements to a night that, I mean, if you're listening to this, you must get that sense of bemusement still and wonderment in our voices. Because we can't, and I don't.

I still can't really get it right. It seems odd even writing it, talking it, thinking about it, to be perfectly honest, Mike. There's so many bits of it that are shocking. There's so many moments in that fight that there's still no explanation for. I don't really know what happened in rounds four, five and six when Joshua, I'm going to posit, I'm going to suggest that Joshua has no idea where he was in those rounds. That's what I'm going to suggest to you. I'm going to suggest that he had no idea where he was.

It wouldn't be the first fighter to vanish in a fight. You remember Adam Booth talking about David Haye against Vladimir Klitsko, that rainy night in Germany that summer when Hay gets clipped in about round four and Adam says he doesn't come back until about round 10. He literally doesn't know what happened in those rounds. And I'm not so sure that Ruiz wasn't feeling some of that as well, Steve, after the battering that he took in the third round.

And okay, he came back to win, but I think he was feeling some of that too. And just to recap on those back-to-back camps, he fought as recently as April the 20th, by coincidence, the night we were in this same diner after Amir Khan been beaten by Terrence Crawford. And then he goes on, has a couple of days off, go straight back into camp. Never done that in a 10-year professional career. And there was justice done in the end, Steve, because at the end of the third round, there was every reason for the referee to call it all off with Joshua Down for the second time. Clearly, in no fit state to continue, the referee gave him the benefit of the doubt in a huge way.

And so Ruiz is the rightful winner four rounds later. And not only did he give him the benefit of the doubt, and we do these live, these pods. People think that we maybe go to them. People have been sending me tweets and Buncie, when you wake up, can you get the pod out quick? They have no idea that we're battling through the night and battling security and battle. backling exits and battling people living on the streets and the rest of the hazards that pop up in this glorious venue and city. People have to understand that we do this life. I still haven't seen a repeat of the time Joshua's down for the second time in round three.

Because I think the count was long. I think the count was long itself. Then he finally gets up. But I remember looking at the referee at the same time. It was one of those fights, Mike. We talked about this with a 12 round, sorry for going off on a tangent. We talked about this at the 12 round of Deontiwai. and Fury where somehow I went all Matrix on you and I was everywhere.

I saw Fury, I saw Fury's dad, I saw I saw Deonti Wilder, I saw Barry Jones next to me commentating, I saw everybody. I couldn't have seen them all because I saw them all in one second, but that's what it felt like. And it was a bit like that at the end of that third round. I think Joshua was down a long time. When I looked up at that one moment, Michael Griffin got to eight and I was like, leave off. It's about 10 or 11 or 12.

But then Michael Griffin, with Fury in the corner, and the bell just about the sound, he seemed to give, what was he talking to have a conversation? What was he talking about, Watford? I mean, what, was he asking Josh if he'd seen the Rocket Man, the movie? I mean, that was a long time. And Joshua was in no fit condition at that point at the end of the third round. So as you say, I hate to put the boot into a man when he's lost,

but I guess justice was served, Mike, yeah. Absolutely, it was. And what we were saying about Andy Ruiz Jr., which we saw for the first time live at the workout, as cosmetic as they can be, that just goes to show, Steve, that those can have some value. Something else that struck me that day

was how slow Joshua looked. I overlooked that because I thought it was just a case of Robert McCracken saying, look, go along here, do as little as you possibly can, and then just go through the motions for the cameras, for the crowd. And I thought that was what was happening there. But actually, he did look pretty slow that day. And what was impressive about Ruiz on the night, Steve?

Somebody coming along the corridor, I was waiting for 90 minutes or so outside the dressing room for Anthony Joshua. Before we realized there were two entrances, and eventually he came out at the other entrance where you caught him. So we're going to hear that interview in a moment. But Ruiz against Joseph Parker. kind of ambushed Parker, Steve, every now and again.

I just didn't think Joshua would fall for it, having seen it against Parker. And what he did against Parker, he would throw a flurry of shots and then almost calm down, slow down, and lulled Parker into a sense that there were no more punches coming. And then when he did mount the attack,

they were razor-sharp rat-attack punches. And they were even more effective tonight, for sure. And he clearly has grown as a fighter, I think. Speed was the absolute key to the win tonight. There's two things, Mike. We'll talk about the Parker fight first and what he did tonight. He's a responsive puncher. You hit him.

He's got to throw three punches back. You don't hit him with a jammer, then he goes for a wander. You hit him. He lets, and he unleases savagely, and he unleases quickly, and he unleashes nationally. That's just what he does. It's that simple. But what happened specifically at the,

What happened specifically at the open workout, Mike, is that what we saw was, oh, Brian Peters just walked in with Katie Taylor and Katie Taylor's marvel over the other side there. What happened, Mike, at the open workout, is that we looked at him, and anyone can be flashy and silly on the pads. Anyone can throw 500 shots in whatever it is, 32 seconds,

and that other rubbish that modern padwork. consists of. We've seen that. It's garbage. He wasn't worried about that. We looked at his feet. We spent you and I at least three minutes of his 10 minute workout, just looking at his feet. I don't even want to see anything above the knee. His feet were brilliant. They were fast. They were switching positions. Then we looked at his hand and his head movement. And it was really interesting. When I was talking to Carl and David on air, when we first went on air, which seems like about two years ago, when we first went on air and we were talking to them, it's almost like they were thinking, was hyping it, that I was maybe twisting it.

And I wasn't. You and I were really impressed. Good thing is, again, the old half the time was, we've mentioned it, we've done it, we've been doing it all week. Something else that struck me, Steve, and this is what fascinates me about boxing and sitting in places like this afterwards. And I remember Angelo Dundee once told me a story

about how they all used to go across from the garden to the speakeasies and talk through the night's fights. and it's almost like we're living out a kind of a fantasy but to get back to the point that I was going to make about Ruiz it struck me that he's been trained in his professional career by Freddie Roach

by Abel Sanchez and now by Manny Robles they wouldn't work with a waste of time now I don't know the reasons why he split with each of them whether they felt that he wasn't doing enough in the gym wasn't giving enough to his sport but they wouldn't commit themselves to a waste of space

no absolutely wouldn't commit themselves to a waste of space and that's because Mike I think why they end up leaving is that they probably, or the previous two, not manny because he got it tonight, they probably wanted more from him. Because as David Hay and Carl Frampton were talking about before we came to the main event tonight, they were talking about how perhaps he has too much to eat, perhaps he has a drink when he shouldn't have a drink.

Well, he might do, but if he went on a six-month regime, he's still not going to look like the worst Anthony Joshua. That's just the bottom line. That's just the body dynamics attached to, A, Ruiz, and B, his history, his lineage. I mean, isn't that nicely, Mike? He's never going to change his shape drastically. He's going to lose a little bit off his waist. But you remember what he did for this fight?

He came in heavier. All of us experts were saying, well, he was 262 last time. He's going to come in at 250, 251. He's going to go for speed. Why would he go for speed? He's six inches shorter. So he actually bulked up a little bit. came in the heaviest, one of his heaviest ever, heaviest ever weights.

And that, so maybe that's why Roach, maybe that's why Abel Sanchez parted ways with him. Perhaps they thought, you know, he's gone away. They'd let him go away after a fight at two, I don't know, 250 pounds, and he's come back at 320. Perhaps they were just exasperated, Mike. Perhaps they'd had enough. Manny hasn't had him as long as some of those guys. And, you know, and we kept going. on about it. Again, we're not geniuses.

We didn't predict he would knock Joshua down four times and win in one of the biggest shocks in history. Let's get that straight, straight away. But we did give people some tasters and some testers. And the big thing that we talked about, and he talked about it there, was the basically continuous double training camps.

We have a fight against a man you could not have found a better warm-up five weeks before fighting Joshua. Dimitrenko, same dimensions, all of the same problems, high guy, tall guy. You know, it's all becoming

so clear now why it happened. As it always does, yeah. That's what's so compelling about this sport. But the fight ended soon after 11 o'clock local time, Steve. But it was 2 o'clock before the press conference ended. And on the way there, you managed to interrupt Anthony Joshua's walk to the conference. AJ, it's been an hour or so now.

How are you feeling now? feeling like I'm a soldier Take the good with the bad Take the hell like a man Ruiz was A better man tonight And I got to look forward

Not back What went wrong? Was it the third round? What went wrong? Getting hit too much No, no, come on man I don't you can joke with me And I'm pleased, I'm pleased just smiling But what went wrong? There's a sweet science of boxing

Hit and don't get hit And when you get hit You know no matter their shape Or whatnot When 120 KGs lands on your on the top of your head. It just kind of dazed me a bit and I don't think I recovered.

That was in the third round? Yeah, I don't think I recovered over the next couple of rounds and that was the issue that I faced. So could you remember the end of the third round and the end of the fourth round? Was it, is it a bit of a blank? I can remember it.

But there was so much going on because it was unexpected. I thought, yeah, I got him so what I plan for onto the next. And then you can't ever overlook a fighter, a fight or even a round, I think in boxing.

You've got to just stay locked in. But I don't think you did overlook him. I don't think you went into this, but maybe it was subconscious. Maybe you didn't even know it. I'm seeing it's big right now. So it's like naturally you're always like, everyone's talking about what's next, isn't it?

So naturally I'm thinking about what's next. So I don't know. I don't know. And what about at the end when the referee was talking to you? You know, you went down the second time in the 7th. If your gum, shield was out, you're back in the corner. What was going on there? I mean, were you talking to him?

Were you aware of what was going on? Because he seemed confused the ref. Yeah, you watch the count. So I watched the time. Get to my feet, go back to the corner. Then he's asking, do you want to fight? And I said, yeah, yeah, yeah, but he's done his job in it. I never blamed, like, the ref.

No, I know that. Or the judges, or my job's to fight. I went in there and fight until I couldn't anymore, and then Ruiz got to win. And what did you say to Ruiz afterwards? Not much. We don't really talk much. Remember, in this boxing game, I don't really make too many friends. I know.

Yeah, so I didn't really say much. So a rematch has been talked about, Eddie's talked about it. Is it what you want? Is it something you want instant? Would that be your next fight if you had in an ideal world? Oh, so on Wilder. Still on Wilder. I don't know if you've seen,

but Fury's been really nice to you. Wilder, maybe not so nice. If I was to say what I wanted to say about it. I told you, I don't really make friends with all over boxes, so I don't really even take in what they say. Listen, AJ, thanks very much for your time. Hey, you come back bigger. That's it.

You know that, don't you? Yeah, man. It's early days. It's been a good run, eh? Do you know how many great fighters have lost and gone back to that changing room? How do you know it wasn't the same room Ali was in when he went back there? How about when Fraser got done by Foreman?

Yeah, it happens. Yeah, exactly. It does happen, all right? Yeah, this is life, in it. But as I said, we're soldiers. We keep my head, high, chest up, and we keep them going forward. Don't surround yourself with people that are down.

Surround yourself and lift up people. Everyone's spirit. Yeah, everyone's still high, yeah. Yeah? Yeah, that's exactly. God bless you, brother. See you'll lay, AJ. Thank for the listeners. Jok, boy.

See you later, AJ. Thank you very much for your time. Andy, thank you. Thanks, team. Steve, the phrase that comes to mind is putting a brave face on it. That's what it sounded like, but what was that brave face looking like? fairly sad to be honest with him Mike

you know he may have smiled and laughed several times there and there's a lot of fake laughter in the I'm in the same lift as you but I'm not surrounded by 30 people wearing tracksuits who are happy I'm surrounded by 30 people who are very unhappy who thanks to Neil and James you know I've got a bit of space and Eddie okayed it

and Freddie and Andy the people around him but some of AJ's friends they were not best pleased that I was getting I was getting him in that lift. Ben Alimi, his cousin, was fantastic. He's a bit hurt. I mean,

and he's going to hit him tomorrow and I talked to him, that's one thing I did get off there. I did talk to him about that. He's going to really hurt tomorrow. I don't mean he's going to ache, physically hurt. He's going to hurt tomorrow.

He's going to wake up tomorrow. But what does ache, Steve, will hurt even more. Yeah. Whatever aches and pains he's got. Of course. Listen, I wouldn't be at all surprise if he stays in a darken room for a couple of days until he's got some commitments with the Italian fashion house.

Hugo Boss, 48 large jacket, 39-inch waist trousers, 37-inch inside leg, just letting those boss people know, Mike. All jokes aside, and I really mean this, he talks about fighting wilder there. Well, we know it's not going to happen anyway. Certainly not in September, October. from what we've heard, from the various people we've talked to, he's going to be fighting in a rematch November or December.

I'd be honest with you, and I've got a couple of people telling me this, don't be at all surprised if we go to the Staples Centre for a reason people to fill the venue, create the atmosphere, or to Las Vegas, November, December, that's what I think's going to happen. And in some ways, Mike, and one or two people inside the different organisations surrounding Asia have been quite happy, because it was going to be Poolev in December, which would have probably been in Britain.

Kubrat Pulev. Coupette Pulev. He was meant to fight in one of his previous defences before he got injured and then faced Carlos Taka. So I'm convinced it's a rematch and I'm convinced that rematch takes place in either Los Angeles or Las Vegas, November, December. I would be stunned if the people advising Andy Ruiz

advise him not to take that fight. There'd be an awful lot of. of money on the table and he'll be able to get up for AJ. You won't be able to get up for someone else and he might end up losing. And boy oh boy, then we're being even a bigger mess. Then we're in at a moment with a bleeding heavy weights.

Just to paint a picture of the scene, Steve, I was waiting at one entrance to Anthony Joshua's dressing room. You were waiting at the other entrance. He came out by your entrance. But in that time that we were waiting there, which must have been the best part of 90 minutes, one of the matchroom staff

came along carrying his four belts, which of course he no longer, including the IBO belt that doesn't often get mentioned, which he no longer owns. No, so, so Ruiz will have had them for a brief period tonight, for some pictures. Photographs. And during the next couple of weeks,

they will be arriving at his house. And Joshua can always say he lost, I lost them somewhere. Someone took them in Madison Square Garden, and he can keep all of his bills. There was an awful, quite a funny point, actually, Mike, because when Joshua came out, and it was a bit like, you know,

something from Jack, look like, do, do, do, do, do that they'd give you to slip. On the other side, Jack, slip up. Mickey Stella was on one door. Don't go out of that door. Don't go out of that door. We'll go out of the back door. Get straight to lift, get to get a press conference, sir.

And they came out of the door, all quite happy. And there I was, and I held my hands wide, and I went, fellas, where you been? And even AJ laugh. Eddie wasn't smiling. and Luis ence on Tuarch wasn't smiling. I said, I've been waiting for you for 90 minutes. Can we just do three minutes?

So from here, Steve, I always said that Joshua is the kind of character who could ride the tackle in terms of a loss, that he could almost make a virtue out of it. But I said that, not knowing that that defeat would come against Andy Ruiz. I was figuring it would come against either Tyson Fury or Deonté Wilder, and he would make a story around redeeming. himself in the rematch? Well, it still will, Mike.

The key, in my opinion, and bear in mind, I'm just like you, humble hacks, been in the business an awful long time. The key is to get out there to the cold face early, like now, soon. I know he's got some commitments in this town this week in New York, sorry, this week, but to get back soon, get yourself on breakfast TV,

get yourself out and about on Saturday next week, maybe even get a press conference on Monday or Tuesday the week after or the week after sit down with people make yourself as accessible as you and I know he is going to right charm offensive because he's not saying

he's not going to make excuses about the cold which you and I think was maybe a factor about the sty and being run down he's not going to make those excuses Mike and he can meet and face his critics he can meet and face his devoted flock and put his case for a rematch

and you know what, he'll come out of it with even more grannies pushing their shopping carts around Tesco loving him than the granny's pushing their cars around Tesco's love him at the moment. But if he vanishes for two or three months, that I think

in that bit of absence, could hurt him slightly, could hurt the whole AJ image. I think he's got to get out there in the public, become accessible, do his stuff because he's the most honest kid out there, Mike. He's holding his hands I got hit on the chin. Bingo. Actually got hit on the temple loads of times and that was it.

And a mention of the undercar, Steve, a clinical performance by Callum Smith. Brilliant, pinpoint punching at the very highest level to knock out Hassan and Dam in his contest for the WBA super middleweight title. And according to Carl Frampton, who was alongside us at ringside, as you heard earlier on, the best women's fight he's ever seen between Katie Taylor and Delphine Pursune of Belgium with Katie Taylor getting the narrowest of verdicts. Callum Smith was clinical tonight. He was brutal. He just about landed three clean punches and dropped and Dan with all three of them. And dropped him really heavy, Mike. You know what we call like, you know, is there a sniper in the building because it looks like in Dam's just been hit?

He went down beautifully, beautifully time counters, concussive nasty. I thought that was a chilling end. And people might say, yeah, but he's only a middleweight. Okay, but he was a good middleweight and he's a half-decent super middle. And that was a great, that was fantastic. Katie Taylor's fight with Delphine Pursune was, well, actually it was eclipsed finally by the heavyweights as fight at a night. But it was the finest women's contest I've seen. And I've been watching women boxing since Jane Couch got her license 20 or years ago.

Mike, I've been at the amateur world championships and watched them at Olympics and seen some decent pro stuff. Katie Taylor eclipsed that and Delphine Pursune tonight. They absolutely eclipsed everything that had previously come. It was a really, really hard and tight fight. I fought the decision, I think, and I hate to say it, I thought the decision went the wrong way. But by saying that, I don't want to take anything away from what each of them had to do to put on that 20 minutes,

10 rounds of two minutes of that fight because it was a memorable, memorable scrap. And a very memorable, unforgettable night of boxing at Madison Square Garden. I sent my son, Connor, a text who bought a ticket to the fight, Steve, today, And I said that my dad used to come into my bedroom when I was a kid and give me the Muhammad Ali results in the early hours of the morning. Straight back from Victoria Odian. Or Lewisham Odian or wherever he'd been.

And I was saying that the first one I remember was Ali beating Frazier in 1971 when I was 10 years old at the time of that fight. And I texted him to say, if you told that 10-year-old kid that one day, you'll be commentating on a big heavyweight title fight. night, but little did I know, I'd be commentating on a night like it turned out to be. Well, you're slightly older than me, and I'll tell you why that's the case, Mike, because the first one I remember is the sun's, the sun, shine showdown when Foreman did Frasier, which is two years later, which is exactly, isn't that I?

It's like, man, so basically both our mothers said, don't wake him up till he's 11. So you got woken at 11 with that one, and I've got woken at 11, two years later, With the sunshine showdown, yeah. I mean, you know, it's a fantasy life that you and I live, and we don't deny it. And people often criticize me, you know, you always shout outrageous, you usually have a fantasy life. And I always reply on Twitter or Facebook, whatever.

Yeah, I do. Because I do, because we're sitting here now in TikTok, Madison Square Garden. I can see it over there, Mike. I've been wandering around in there all week. And four weeks ago, I was wandering around in there all week. My God, that's not a job.

That's a... I mean, it's a fantasy existence. And from New York, we move on to Las Vegas and the build-up to Tyson Fury against Thomas Schwartz, which has suddenly taken on a whole new dimension. So our next podcast, which you would have normally expected

to download, sometime in the afternoon, early evening of Monday, June the 10th, we'll now be slightly later because we'll be recording that when we arrive in Las Vegas. So probably early hours of Tuesday morning, the 11th of June,

will be our first podcast from Las Vegas in the build-up to Fury against Schwartz and after what we've seen here tonight, who would dare predict there won't be something to remember. I'm not brave enough to say Fury wins a routine fight. I tell you what we need to do, Mike, and I hope you weren't about to do it in your payoff.

On that subject, Steve, I was talking to Matthew Macklin who was working here for Sky Sports tonight. outside Joshua's dressing room while we were waiting all that time and he said to me, I don't fancy that fight I said that's what we all said about tonight. Absolutely, I know maybe you're going to do it in your clothes but I think we need to thank

and we sometimes we're a bit remiss like this if you need to thank all the people that have been downloading all week. I met a guy tonight who's a medical inspector called Miles who had a copy of my book and showed me on his phone all of our podcasts this week He's not going to listen to them until he flies back to Las Vegas on the plane tomorrow. I met him at 10 to 2 in the lift. So I think there's an awful lot of guys like that.

You know, Shawnee, Ian Albara, Royale's guys that have stored them up, different people that are out here. So thanks to all of you. Thanks to all of you, all of you for downloading. Thank you. And let us know what you think about tonight's action. Five Live Boxing with Costello and Bunce on iTunes or the email address, Costello and Bunce at pbc.bc.

co. UK. As for Madison Square Garden, well, life goes on. They're rearranging the furniture now for a Billy Joel concert tonight. But from us, that's it. Five Live Boxing with Costello and Bunce from New York. Next stop, it's Las Vegas. Let's get around. Five Live Boxing. The best B2B marketing gets wasted on the wrong people. So when you want to reach the right professionals, use LinkedIn has grown to a network of over one billion professionals, including 100,000. 30 million decision makers, and that's where it stands apart from other ad buys. You can target your buyers by job title, industry, company role, seniority, skills, company revenue, so you can stop wasting budget on the wrong audience. It's why LinkedIn ads generates the highest

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