5 Live Boxing with Steve Bunce - The Rhino Reloaded

Episode Date: May 14, 2026

Can Dave Allen really beat Filip Hrgovic? The White Rhino returns to the ring in Doncaster this Saturday and sits down with Buncey ahead of the biggest fight of his career. They look back at the brutal defeat to Arslanbek Makhmudov, why Allen believes he’s never been in better shape, and what victory over Hrgovic would mean. Plus, we hear from his trainer Jamie Moore.

This is Five Live Boxing. Boxing's remarkable heavyweight season continues. In the last three months, we've had Deonti Wilder against Derek Del Boy Chizora. Tyson Fury in front of over 60,000, Moses Itama sending a warning, and the fight of the year last Saturday, Daniel Dubois and Fabio Wardley. Next week, in the shadow of the pyramids, the king's back when Alexander Usik returns to action. Now, this Saturday, a long way to be. from any ancient cultures, it's Dave Allen fighting Philip Hergevich outdoors at the Keepmote

Stadium in Doncaster Dave's beloved Doncaster. Big ambition in Yorkshire. There is a lot at stake. I'm Steve Bunce, and this is the continuing story of the heavyweights on Five Live Boxing. The last time I came up to Jamie's gym, it was around the corner to talk to you was before you thought the big lead, Arslenbeck, MacMoodov. And he was highly. fought after, highly rated. But Philip Hergevich has got an even higher rating, he's even more highly thought of.

Couldn't you have had a couple of easy ones? Dave? Or is this what you wanted? Yeah, there was no one more surprised by it than me, really. I beat Kareem in Nottingham. I was in Malta on holiday. Got a text off Eddie Earn. Hergovich or Jean. So I'm thinking,

what on if he's asking me that for kind of thing? They've already boxed for one. So I basically said like, what do you mean? Send me a text back then with two figures, two amounts of money. And I just said, this is not a wind-up, I'll box Hergevich. Was Hergovich more money, if you don't mind me asking? It was, but... If it was the same money, I would have pitched Hergevich.

Yeah, cool. The Zhang, biggest punchering the division, I think, Southpour. I wouldn't have avoided him. If Zhang was the only option, I had a boxing. But Hergovich out of the two, I fancied more. A safer, a safer option, I think. So yeah, that's how it came about, but no one thought it was more random than me. I didn't expect to box Philip Hergovich.

I'm sure Philip Hergovich didn't expect me to be boxing Philip Hergovich. But I never turned down a fight ever, no matter what. So as soon as it was offered, yeah, of course I love it. You're right about Zhang. I mean, if Zhang finds his rhythm, as we saw in those fights with Joe Joyce, he's still a real danger. You know, I don't really fight at a high tempo. I think I'd be a perfect opponent for Zhang.

I don't want to be a perfect opponent for anybody really But if you're a perfect opponent for Zhang You're getting you're getting not tover Yeah Hergovich people will say he's high output And all the rest of it But I think I've got the kind of style Like I can give him problems

Whereas Zhang I wasn't as confident Now with Hergovich He's one of those guys I know he lost that fight against Dubois Which was an absolute slug fest He went in fact he went toe to toe With a guy that people go to That don't like going toe to toe with

And he's kind of been circling and waiting and he's talking boldly, not looking past you, but he's talking about all the fights that in theory has been promised. He's a danger man in a division. Yeah, I've seen him a few times. You've watched the Dubois fight, even in defeat.

Yeah. He's a man you don't want to face. But then you're watching Box Dempsey McKean, and you fancy the job. Yeah, absolutely, yeah. You're watching Box. I've watched him box a few times and been less than impressed,

and I'm not sitting here saying that I will beat him, but I'm saying the fellow that beat Dempsey McKean, I can certainly beat that, Philip Herkovich. So it depends. what Hurgich you get, if I get the Huggovich under the Bois night or from a few other nights, I'm against it. But if I get Philip Hurgich on the McKean fight,

I don't, I fancy it. And do you think that the McKean fight, and one or two others, as you say, he has some odd performances, do you think those are because he's maybe not out for the fight and he's maybe considers it, you know, and this is not a slout, and you're an easier touch,

not a danger fight? Yeah, I'm hoping he does. It'd be a big help. You know, it'd help close. It'd help close that gap, between us, because there is a big gap between us. It's four in the world with the Ring of Magazine. Yeah.

I think I'm about 72 on box, right, for what that's worth. So there is a big gap, and people keep saying to me, why are you doing it? A hell of a lot of money. Fighting my local football ground. And the chance to get across the world's scene. So I would never say no. But there's anyone that wonders why the fight is happening.

Go and ask the promoter, that's me. And it is a bigger jump than if you'd have beaten Arsenal Beck-McMood of on that night in Sheffield. You know, had you beaten him, you know, who definitely elevates you, don't get me wrong. But this is a much bigger jump, much, much bigger jump. Yeah, yeah.

If you win. If I'd have beat Matt Madov, Hergwitch was a fight I was looking at. That was kind of fight. I was like, well, he beat Matamadov. You could get Philip Hergov. I'll lose to Matamadov. I beat some French guy now.

Philip Hergovich. So... Yeah, I don't know how the maths works. But what I do know is, unfortunately, to have the chance. Yeah, I've really put it in for this camp. I, um... The McMillov fight, I watched in Box Chiori and I thought, you know what?

I did feel a few weeks after the fight, I sat back and watched Mark Madov and I thought, could have won that one. I felt like I felt like not should, but I could have. You'd like to think this is my last chance at the big time. Wouldn't you with Hurgovich? I say this, I've already had 80 feats. So you never know, really. You talk about McMuda watching it back and thinking you could have won.

Did you sense that, did it take a few weeks for you to sense that? Or did you sense that on the night that I could have done. I could have won this tonight. When I was in there, after two, two and a half round, I started to push him back. And I thought, I got the job done he, I pushed him back. But in pushing him back, I let him get into a rhythm. He got into a rhythm.

He got his job going. And I walked on to everything because I thought, all I've got to do is stand up for six, seven rounds. He'll not be able to, he'll fall over. Yeah. And it didn't happen. I should have kept him coming at me. I was pretty comfortable with him throwing punches at me.

I was getting out of the way of him. Because that's what people think I get hit all the time, but I don't really get hit properly. Because I had it properly, I'd have been on my arse loads of times. I've boxed all the good ones. But I panicked about in Sheffield. I panicked. Got like my 34th pro fight and I panicked

and I let the atmosphere get to me. And I swallowed it a bit and it was safer to push him back. I got it wrong, got it totally wrong. And I really think on another night, if I had just been a bit more patient, let him out, let him throw his punches more, made him miss. I could have pushed him back after five or six

and got him out of there. But that's being gone now. Hergwick's a different challenge. I think a more difficult challenge, but one that I'm, I would say, more up for than the matter of one. Talk about the pressure, Dave, because we talked about, you know, did you feel there be any pressure leading in? And it was all, it's new, I mean, you know,

you had a bit of adoration when you thought Lucas Brown at the O2, let's get that way, you want a bit of a run then. But in Sheffield, I mean, it was a bit, I mean, you know, I always stand up when I'm doing comms. I take my headset off when the ring entry had a local fire. That was unbelievable. that injury. I mean, you're smiling now. It was just fantastic. So that pressure,

which is good pressure, can get to a fighter. Yeah, I weren't expecting it. No, that's what I'm getting at. Because I think it shocked you more than it shocked a lot of people. In Sheffield, I watched it. When I got on the stage, I had a little bit of a panic attack because I couldn't get my breath. If you watched it back, you can see me, you can see it in your face. Yeah, I was trying to catch my breath. And afterwards, it was one of the best nights in my life.

I only started boxing. I told you, I only started boxing for people. I want my dad to like me. I want people to like me. I wanted people to people say, oh, like David, oh, good fighter. Yeah, no excuse. You know, by the time the third round came around, that had been in the atmosphere, I took it in, but I just got it wrong. You know, I weren't listening to the corner.

I was just so adamant that I would get this fellow out by soaking up the punishment and then they fall over. But boxing don't work like that. No, of course not. So I got it wrong, and I've got to live with that. But being Philip Hergwicz, I've got a long way to... It's a bigger test, isn't it, Hurgovich? Yeah, definitely.

Yeah, much bigger. People thought I was going to be in that. Maddof. Yeah. And I thought, though, mad. I thought, how do you think I'm going to beat Matamudov? I thought, I thought you had a good chance to be Mountedov in that last half.

No one thinks I can beat Hergovich. Yeah, it's a tough one. I mean, it's a much tough one. And that's great for me. Hergovich needs to, I mean, let's be honest. We're, you know, we're big boys. Hurgovic needs to be looking past you, which is another way of saying, underestimating you, which has happened in the past.

Let's get that right. And then, then everything needs to go right with you. But you look like you're in good shape, weight-wise, you look. I mean, you look now like you're fighting in three days time, four days time. Yeah, I feel good, yeah. I feel best I've trained. I've got a nutritionist on board, Greg Marriott. I've been over here training, I'm sparring, I'm doing everything I need to do,

my weights. I weigh less now than when I watch Johnny Fisher the first time. I beat Johnny Fisher the first time. I knew I'd beat in the second time, whatever I'd weigh. And I bought a nice house, and my life was so comfortable. If I get comfortable, it's hard for me. what you need. I got the onsuit and

got the nice life. Of course that was the whole thing. We're getting a new kitchen. We're getting a new bathroom. I weighed 19 stone 5 in Nottingham. Just, but I made myself uncomfortable for this one.

If I were doing an eight round in Liverpool on that work show, I'd probably weighed in 19thstone. I needed a challenge. So what will you be for Hergovich then? 1713. Wow. Yeah.

That's the plan. 1713. That's a fast. and slim. Tell the Povich was being for a big shock. I remember running the boys' clubs, Arlo Dog Track. Yeah.

I had eight amateur fights. I won them all. I won the boys' clubs at night. And people coming up to me saying, you're the best kid on this whole build. There were Ted Cheeseman, Jack, Katchel, Lawrence of Colley. It's a really good year your year. And I won him.

And everyone came up to me and said, you're the best by a mile out of everyone. And that was the last time I trained properly. I met a girl New Year's year, 2012. waiting the ABA, he's got beat by Simon Barclay, who won him twice, got beat by a couple of points by him. And I fell off, but Philippe Purgievich, you don't realize the ability I've got. I've always had the ability always. But obviously, you've never had anything else to go with it.

That was a problem. But I think May 16th, I put it all together, and I think I beat Philippe Purgievich. When you're in the gym now, when you're around Niger, around Jamie and you're doing the spa, I've watched another eight rounds or whatever you did today. Do you feel that you're so much better? Yeah, I think I'm getting better. Burned's inconsistent now for two years. I'm the kind of guy like I'm 20 stone,

but you can try and throw an handful of ice at me. You're not going to really hit me. No, exactly. You're not, you're not, you're not. You're not, you're not. I don't get it on the chin. I don't get it on top of the head. People like no boxing, no.

No. I've got a lot of ability. You can't hit me clean. I'm not the biggest puncher in the world but I'm heavy-handed, I'm strong, I'm tough I can do a bit of everything I really believe now that I'm fitting in the gym and listening

I really think I've got the ability to be one of the best every way it's in the world you punch hard when you set your feet and let them go properly like saying the Johnny Fisher rematch when that was a different there was still the same Dave Allen who'd fought him the first time

still the same Dave Allen and I thought Mac Mood have but you just set your feet and you just let them go just a little bit more viciously I think it comes out of confidence I think it's a mental thing with me, confidence and belief and if I get it all right on May 16th, I think I'd be Philip Pergwicz.

I think I'm better than Phillypergwits, which sounds crazy to say. But I think I'm better than Phillypergavich. I would never normally say something like that out loud, but I have every elite. I have more ability than Philip Bergerich. Well, that's what you need going into in a fight against Hergavits. And then you join all the other winners

in this mad, heavyweight season that we're in the middle of, which started way back with Moses. I mean, it's just fights and fighters. I'll be honest, I don't care about it after May 16th. May 16th is the one. I beat Philip Lergevich. I stick middle finger up to loads of people that say, I'm no good.

And then I'm not bothered after that. Do you still get that feeling that you've got to prove yourself, Dave? Even after the fission fight and the mood of, you know, you're still fighting one of the top 15 heavy weights and you're still having a, you're still in the fight. Do you still feel that way? Yeah, you always prove, always, always. Being Philippe Purgievich will be everything for me.

I'm not saying I'll pack in after it, but I'll never, I'll never commit like I have this, to this one. This one's the one. I said to everyone, this is the one. I'm going to be Philip Hovich, and then I'll blow up 22 stone. See what you need after that? Yeah, whatever happens happens, because this is it for me. I really, my dad's my biggest critic,

but he's always said to me, you're one of the best of which in the world. for the last 50 years he begged me to train beg me to diet beg me to go to the gym beg me to look David I've watched your spot of Fiore Joshua you're one of the best fighters in the world

what's wrong with you is it do you think you have a sense Dave or a fear of giving it everything and then losing yeah definitely more lazy though definitely more lazy part of that's a bit lazy yeah but this time you may be breaking through that barrier

and you want to push yourself so what we'll get is the best Dave Allen If I lost to Philip Hridge, at least I can go, you know what, I weren't as good as I thought I could be. And that's all right as well. I'm all right with that. I'm a good fighter. This is my chance to be from possibly a great fire. And this gym, I know Jamie's moved around the corner from where we were a few months ago.

It's a buzzing gym in the moment, from young kids like Taylor Barron and Adam Hamid, Connor Walker in there, the 10 Stone version of Dave Allen, by the way. It's good being the proper gym, isn't it? Yeah, it's good. You know, Jamie and Nigel, the boss and the underboss, and the boss of the fighters. You're the boss of the fighter. You're like team captain.

I'm the team captain, I guess. My vice captain, Connor Walker. Pat around dying to get in my shoe. It's got a long way to go, Pat. No, there, yeah. No, but it's good to be in the gym. I'm the eldest in the gym. I never thought that would be the case.

I've always been the baby at the gym. It's just grouped up on me, really. I don't know how it's happening, really. I'm 34, but it's great to be in the gym. Like I said, I'm the eldest, I'm the captain, but by no means I'm not the best. You've got Shandy Camwell champion, Pat Brown, Olympian, Connor Walker.

You got the Hammard brothers, semi-pro. Yeah. Sammy and Sammy-Man. Yeah, so. And Taylor Bevan, who's just... Taylor Bevan's a nice kid. In people with good shots, a good fighter. Bevo, yeah.

Paul and Bevo. Yeah, Bevo. And in all fairness, he told me in secret. He really likes being in the gym with you and Conor Walker. He said, because he looked around and made sure he knows his name was listening. He brings it, brings something out of me. He's a quiet kid, don't he? Yeah, I wind them up 24-7.

Oh, there's a shock. All of them. All of them, I wind them all up. Conno local winds me up, but the rest of them I wind up. But I've been an old man since I was about 10. I've always been the old man in the gym, trying to tell everyone what to do. Yeah.

And now I'm finally there. You're finally there. Yeah, I'm finally able to do it. Are you looking forward to that coming out in Dongaster, walking to the ring and facing off against Hurgovich, knowing how important is. Are you looking forward to it? It's the biggest sporting event

Doncaster ever had, I think. Yeah, I don't doubt that. And I can't tell you how proud I am because I am Donnie through and through. I never sported Donnie over, but I'm proper Donnie. Yeah, proper Donny. And I know what Deand Donny means. We used to get lots of fights there with John Joe Irwin

years and years ago, yeah, at the Dome. So I had about 15 nights in Donny and it's a proper night out. Yeah, that's me, I'm proper Donnie. D&12. Do you know what I mean? I'm not so on Marilyn Philippeague, which will find out, but I am proper. What was the thing you did with Hurgovich when you saw him? You kept looking at him and said, you're handsome.

He's very handsome, yeah, he's handsome, yeah. And he plays it, he sort of plays it funny. Like, he does it, he plays it sort of cool. I know it won't suppress. I know, yeah, I like winding him up. But he seemed like a nice guy. Yeah, with Hurgovic, it's just pointless going directly at him. But he would have been sitting on a plane flying back somewhere.

He would have gone, what did he mean when he said, I'm the most handsome fighter? You literally would get up on the plane and go and talk to his trainer because that's in his head, yeah. I'll do his ending five week. I'll do his ending. Yeah, I know I will. Listen, Dave, it's been a pleasure talking to you.

I really appreciate your time. Thanks very much. Thank you. No, no, thank you. Cheers, mate. That was Big Dave. Now, as the gym emptied, Jamie came and sat with me on the ring.

He's an enigma, isn't it? And when he first walked... Don't want him to stop, do you ever? Never, never. But when he walked in the gym six years ago, or when he first asked, if I were training for him. a fight. The Dave Allen then, compared to the Dave Allen now,

it's just night and day. And it's been beautiful to see. I've always loved him in terms of his character. But to see how he's grown and developed over the years, it's just ace. And before we started this interview talking about the impacting boxing on kids in the local area and how it can change the lives, it shows you that no matter what stage and age you're at, It can literally, if you surround yourself with the right people and get the right advice, it can literally change your life, has it done for Dave?

And this whole area, Warkden and Worcester, they're tough areas. Worcly's beautiful. Warding, Little, and these are, you know, that worsty thing as you go through it, then suddenly you're in Walden, it's like, bang. Wurtsley's probably one of the nicest places in the country, and all of a sudden you're at Warden, you're like, well, we're coming to here. But I've grew up here all my life. He's got his problems, but it's also.

got beautiful people and this gym let's not go off subject here but this gym has proven if you if you create something for people the right environment and they'll go in and it changes people's life now Dave was telling me that he considers himself the boxing captain now he's a grown man but he wants to be the boxing captain and when I laugh is that in general or just in this gym? No no no just in this gym I mean outside of here he's just he's just Dave he's just Dave Allen

but in this gym you and Nigel at the top your commanders or Commandance or whatever is above captain in the military rank. I'm not a big military man, as you can guess. But he likes to think that he's the captain. So Connor Walker is the mini Dave Allen, as I like to call him. He's in the gym. Taylor Bevan's in the gym. Chantel's in the gym.

Some really good fighters in the gym. But Dave's installed himself as the captain. I don't know if he told you that. I thought I'd like, I'd share that with you. He has mentioned it a few times. Does he want a T-shirts or a cap or something? I think he wants an hour. He loves the idea that Pat Brown's nowhere near captain.

Years to go before Pat Brown's captain, he made that point to me. I'm sure he'd bring it up on his own podcast. Absolutely. I think I might actually get him a captain's armband. Oh, Captain's arm band, please. Just to make him feel better. I think it would go down really well.

Hukovic would have no idea what was going on. If he comes out of a captain's arm band, he'll have no idea what's going on. He saw under the radar and he sat there at a press conference, but we'd know what we're going on. All jokes aside, Dave looks very sharp. Yeah, very good. And very focused.

he looked focused before MacMudov. Yeah. Didn't quite work out on the night, and I think he's a little bit disappointed with that, but he looks really focused now. Deep diving with Dave, and sort of, hindsight's a great thing in it.

So, so, so, so, so, analyzing it afterwards and, and sort of thinking, because for all intents and purposes,

he was in the best shape we'd had him in, in that, in over the last five years. At that point, at that point, exactly. And it was a sort of work in progress.

Now, he's just spar today, and he's through three times as many punches per round than he has done that he ever has done in the last five years so he's well on his way now we've had me and Dave have sat on our own

we've had deep conversations about the McMudov fight the journey's been on what it's took for him to get from where he was six years ago to where he is now and you can't just flip the script and go from where he was to where he was without it being done in his stages. There's all hiccups in a fairer-tale, son?

Of course there is. And he was in no condition whatsoever. So for us to get him anywhere near the type of shape you need to be and to compete with someone like Matt Moodov was unbelievable. He now realises watching that fight back, he could have won.

That's exactly what he said, yeah. He now realised he could have won and I've said to him, okay, I know that, I knew that before that, but the only person what needs to believe that is you. Because even if I didn't believe it

and you did, then you've got a better chance of winning. So please, Dave, the next time we get a big fight, do me a favour and just give it 100%. And I don't just mean in the gym because you did that in the gym, but the condition you was in

meant that you couldn't put it into action. You need to be at least the heaviest you can be is 18 stone. I'd like you to be around about 17.10. He's promising 1712. Yeah. It will be. He's around about 182 now.

Which is going some, yeah. Yeah, and he looks great. And the reason why he could throw as many punches as he did today, inspiring, for instance, is for that reason. He was as fit, probably, when he fought McMudov, but he couldn't transfer the vessel because he was too ever. But Horgovich is a better fighter. Technically, without a doubt, than McMudov.

Well, he does have times when he's not on his night, when Hurgovic shows up and he's a little bit, I don't know, maybe overconfident, could you say that? I'd say so. I think technically, you know, adept fighters like him can turn up and start to be overconfident. Absolutely, yeah. Need a challenge.

He's not the type of fighter who tries to sit on a punch because he's not a huge puncher. Matt Moodov gave us different problems than Ergovich will. But Dave, I've said this lot to times he's technically a lot better than he's ever shown us. And I'm going to put my neck on the line here. He is going to... If he doesn't win this fight, he's going to go out there

and give us a performance where everyone goes. Thank you. Thank God for once, Dave. You've give it 100% in the gym. You've turned it into the ring. And I said to him, I don't want you to go into this fight going. I need to win this fight.

I need to win this fight. I want you to get in that corner. I'm going to say this to you a few times in the change rooms and just before the bell goes, you can win this fight. I'm not saying you need to win. Very different sentence. The mindset's different.

I don't want the pressure on him to say you need to win this fight, but I'm going to say to him, you can win this fight because if he believes in himself, he can win it. He can win it, yeah. Talking to him out there,

he's getting close to that. He knows he can win, and he's just getting, he's, oh, you feel like he's very close to saying, I'm going to win this, I'm going to win this. When you have an idea, 10 weeks out,

of where you need to be and then it starts to come to fruition and you're walking that walk and you're going, do you know what, I feel good now? For the first time ever, he's feeling good and that sparks something inside of where you go start having that belief in yourself and you're going, do you know what?

If I actually turn up on the night with all the fans behind me, screaming my name, you know, for all intents and purposes, Dave isn't known for being a good fighter. He's known for being an unbelievably funny person and a great guy. Character. Yeah, he's a really good character. I love him to bits, but I know he can fight.

And if he turns up on the night, anything could happen. Listen, James, it's been a pleasure talking to you. Thanks for letting me into your gym. Busy today. I like that. Chantelle was here. Yeah, it's great having Chantel back. Yeah, I'm really pleased the two of you all got back.

Or the three of you all got back. I mean, because there's three in this relationship, as someone famously said with Nigel. I mean, it's, I can't, yeah. Do you know what I want to say? There's not many stories in boxing what have an happy ending. You know what I mean? That's the truth.

The vast majority of the time is in terms of fighters they always go out on a loss of relationships breakdown between coaches, fighters, managers, promoters, whoever. It's a nice story

and she's a great girl and never fell out with her when we decided to go our own ways and that was probably the reason why we're in this position today so it's great having her back. And Pat Brown not in the gym today.

I think he's golfing in my They are. He's not messing about that way. I'm not being funny. That's a sentence that I'm worried about you out of his sentences like that. So if I say to you, Jamie, where's Pat Brown? You say, and I'm thinking he's doing,

I know, he's doing some marathon fell running. No, no, he's golfing in Marlbaya. If I said... What kind of cruiserweight prospect is that, Jamie? If I said that in front of Dave Allen, he would be, honestly... He might tear up his membership. It terrifies him.

He's actually said to Pat quite a few times. Golf. Like, you can't be a... professional boxer and a golfer. Do you not say it's said that no one's ever said? Where's Dave Allen? Oh Dave Allen's golfing in Marlbaea. It's never been said and it never won't be said. I know Pat took him and they filmed something playing golf and Dave was awful.

And he said, I eat golf and I understand why not. Listen to him. It's an absolute pleasure and delight talking to you. And I'm really looking forward to Donkis. I'm looking forward to Dave coming out, sucking it all in and getting in there. And I'm seeing what you've seen a lot. on what I've been privileged enough to glimpse a few times. Jamie, thank you.

Thank you, mate. Alan V. Hurgovich, the latest heavyweight fight in the endless heavyweight season. Usick next week, AJ in the summer, then a Fury warm-up, then AJ and Fury, the Dubois Awardly rematch. Come on, you get the picture. Lots of heavyweights, lots of fights,

and most of them taking place in Britain. I'm Steve Bunce, and this is Five Live Boxing. Five Live Sports. So here's the first ball of this series. All the cricket you laugh. Check Relby W. Out. Lives on BBC Sounds.

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