83 Weeks with Eric Bischoff - Episode 339: Will AEW Be On FOX?

Episode Date: September 13, 2024

On this episode of 83Weeks, Eric and Conrad discuss all the changes and happenings in the world of professional wrestling. This 83Weeks episode breakdown is brought to you by our friends at LUMEN! Take the next step in improving your health, go to https://www.lumen.me/ 83WEEKS to get 15% off your Lumen.  The guys cover it all. from the WWE starting a new journey on USA, to Monday Night RAW going to two hours. Eric also shares his thoughts on the latest in the AEW/WBD deal and gives Tony Khan some advice that could help his cause. The guys then cover AEW ALL OUT and the extremes the talent are going through to entertain the audience. Eric explains why he believe's the ALL OUT was garbage. All that plus, the guys share their views on the Kevin Nash/ Logan Paul feud, WWE cutting their house show dates and so much more. EARNIN - Download the EarnIn app today. Type in 83 WEEKS under PODCAST when you sign up. EarnIn, the most loved way to get paid as you work. ROCKET MONEY - Cancel your unwanted subscriptions – and manage your money the easy way – by going to https://www.rocketmoney.com/83WEEKS LETS BE KIND AND REWIND - If you love 80s and 90s nostalgia, Be Kind Let's Rewind is the podcast for you. New episodes air every Friday on all major podcasting platforms. Subscribe to their YouTube page @BeKindLetsRewind. HENSON SHAVING - It’s time to say no to subscriptions and yes to a razor that’ll last you a lifetime. Visit https://hensonshaving.com/BISCHOFF to pick the razor for you and use code BISCHOFF and you’ll get two years' worth of blades free with your razor–just make sure to add them to your cart. SAVE WITH CONRAD - Stop throwing your money on rent! Get into a house with NO MONEY DOWN and roughly the same monthly payment at https://www.savewithconrad.com ADVERTISE WITH ERIC - If your business targets 25-54 year old men, there's no better place to advertise than right here with us on 83 Weeks. You've heard us do ads for some of the same companies for years...why? Because it works! And with our super targeted audience, there's very little waste. Go to https://www.podcastheat.com/advertise now and find out more about advertising with 83 Weeks. Join this channel to get access to perks: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCqQc7Pa1u4plPXq-d1pHqQ/join BECOME A 83 WEEK MEMBER NOW: https://www.youtube.com/@83weeks/membership Get all of your 83 Weeks merchandise at https://boxofgimmicks.com/collections/83-weeks Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Get what you earned. Visit shoes.va.org. Not all veterans are eligible for the type or amount of benefits mentioned here. Hey, hey, it's Conrad Thompson, and you're listening to 83 weeks with Eric Bischoff. Eric, what's going on, man? How are you? I'm good, Conrad. It's good to be home. I got home late last night. But I made it home, and that's all that counts. And it looks like I'm going to be here now for some time. I don't have any trips in the future. And I'm so looking forward to just being able to settle in.

and get on top of some stuff. But I'm feeling great, man. Feeling great. It's crazy, man. You and I recorded last week because we talked about the WCW Hall of Fame here at 83 Weeks.com. And if you haven't already, what are you waiting for? Go check that episode out right now. A couple of weeks ago, we talked about the nominees.

You guys voted and we've inducted the class. Go see for yourself right now at 83 weeks.com. If you haven't already, hit that subscribe button, turn on the notifications bell. You don't want to miss the next time we're live. Eric, I saw you live in Chicago in the last week. Then I saw you live in Tampa in the last week. And now a week later, here we are again

in Wyoming and Alabama. We were world travelers this past week, weren't we? I know. And do you miss me yet? I mean, it's a little weird. I mean, I've gone two days without seeing you. I'm going through withdrawals. Well, I have to come down. And it's football season.

Man, I got to get down to see your new place on the lake and really just sit down with you and your mom, dad, and your buddies and let's some football. I've got to do that. We got to have you. Can't wait. And boy,

I can't wait to talk about today's episode. We're going to be talking about your last month running WCW. But before we get into that, because I guess really this is fall brawl 99, but before we get in all that, man, there's been so much that's happened in wrestling over the last couple of weeks. We should probably break it down.

I guess we should get started with what's happening later today. It's the first Smackdown on USA. So we've had the entire run of Smackdown on Fox come to an end. And the rumor and innuendo is they're pulling out all the big stops for a very special Smackdown tonight. What do you expect to see and what do you make of the transition here? Well, that's always, you know, I was there on the premiere of Smackdown on Fox. And obviously that was a different situation. It was the first time, you know, WWE was going to have a regular schedule in prime time on a major network.

That was a big deal. But this is equally as big because you want, you want the audience to look at this as an opportunity, as an improvement, as a step up. And that's hard to do when you're going from a platform like Fox and a network like Fox to a cable outlet. but it can be done and you make up for it and creative you make it important you make people feel like this is a step up you do everything you can

to to attract some attention to get them to sample you if they haven't sampled you in a long time and stick around afterwards it's no different than any other TV show I'm excited and interested to see what happens tonight on Smackdown

I know that we're going to get a big match in a steel cage Jacob Fatu and Cody Rhodes I know you and I are big Cody fans but I've been on the Jacob train for years I'm so glad to see him in the WWE he looks better than ever and this is the biggest opportunity

of his entire career tonight what do you expect in this cage match with Jacob Fatu and Cody Rhodes well you know how I feel about cage matches and I haven't been watching enough at WWE to determine whether or not there's been a decent buildup and a reason for a cage

but I'm just going to assume there is for the sake of discussion. It'll be intense. It's going to be in a cage. It's going to be, I'll be surprised if we don't see color. The question is how much and how soon is what I'll be looking for. But other than those, you know, a couple things. Damn, it's just going to be an intense, very physical, well produced, well-rescled, exciting end to the show. I'm confident.

I mean, it's hard to second-guess. WWE creative as of late. Yes. I get a little bit of heat. I get a lot of heat social media because I don't criticize WWE the way I've often criticized AEW. Well, there's a reason for that, folks. Their business is growing.

They're producing revenue records every time they step outside the door. It's hard to criticize something that's functioning at the level that WWE creative, especially, is currently functioning. I mean, can it be better? Sure, anything can be better. Everything can be better. But realistically, I think WWE creative has been

so on the money for the last year, year and a half now that there's just not a lot to criticize. I'm looking forward to Smackdown the night. I'm also looking forward to bad blood. Just a hop, skipping a jump from me. I guess we're three weeks out. And it's going to be in Atlanta.

It's going to be a big time. But before that, they're going to be hitting a live event in Huntsville. And it might be the last one for a while. I don't know if you saw this. But recently, we've heard rumors and maybe more than that, been confirmed, I guess. There's going to be less live events in 2025. And we're also going to see an increase in ticket prices. We probably knew this was coming with TKO.

But Mark Shapiro, the TKO president, made it plain as day when he said, what we're doing is cutting events at WWE. We're taking our low, marginal, marginally profitable events, un-televised events that events had put in place to grow the brand, right? You're taking the show on the road and we've got to go to every city. We can grow the WWE brand in. Well, the WWE brand, while we still have to grow it, is on fire right now. So we don't need to carry these marginally profitable events.

So what was 300 events last year will be roughly 200, events this year and next year will be close to 200. Mark said this at the Goldman Sachs conference this past week. This is not really news. I mean, I had heard from people who used to work there who don't anymore.

Hey, man, the reason Roman Raines doesn't work some of these house shows is because he's too expensive. I don't know what you're thinking. What does that mean? Well, the value of his contract versus the number of dates meant that if you added a Roman reigns match on the card, then that P&L for that live event,

that a non-televised live event, went from black ink to red ink. So you'd lose money. And with all these new contract renewals, and we're hearing that guys are making more than ever, I just felt like, hey, eventually they're going to have to cut this out. But it does make me wonder, do you think there could be something different in the future?

Might there be a residency somewhere? Perhaps at a Disney? perhaps in Las Vegas on the strip. Could you see something like that taking the place of house shows for WWE? And what do you think of the idea that I don't think all house shows are going away? But I don't think they're coming to Huntsville anytime soon. Maybe after this, house shows will be in Chicago or New York or L.A. Where you have some bigger arenas, bigger markets,

and it might have a more super show feel. And even then, it might be streamed on a streaming service somewhere as opposed to, you know, not through a linear television outlet. What do you make of this change, this paradigm shift in WWE with regards to live events? It's really been going on for a while, as you pointed out. But I remember back in 2019 when I first went to work as the director of SmackDown. In that role, presumably I touched every facet of the Smackdown brand,

including live touring. Now, when I say I touched it, I didn't run it, I didn't manage it, but I was fully up to speed on all the different aspects of the touring schedule as it related to SmackDown and Smackdown Talent. And sitting in a couple of those meetings early on, like within my first week or 10 days, sitting in a few of those meetings where live events were being discussed at that time. Again, this is pre-COVID.

This is still 300 plus dates a year. That traditional WWE live touring model, I guess, But even then, there was a lot of conversation about, look, these things are just not profitable. If we're lucky and we route properly and everything goes according to plan, we may break even and make a couple bucks. So it doesn't surprise me. And it's certainly when COVID hit us and everybody was forced to re-evaluate their touring model. Right? And it's it's almost like people during COVID when they got used to working from home and companies got used to their employees working home. What was what looked like an extreme kind of temporary solution became normal course of business for a lot of companies.

And we're slowly seeing that, you know, kind of go back in some respects to what it used to, but it'll never go back. And I think after COVID, I thought to myself, now they're going to be forced, they, in everybody in the wrestling business that's in a touring. in the touring element of it, are going to have to really reevaluate. And this does not surprise me. This does not surprise me. Live events have all, you know, that was one of the first things that I did when I took over WCW was cancel live events for the very same reason. They were either marginally and WCW's case, they weren't even marginally.

We lost money every time we went out the door. My solution was, stop it, put a tourniquet on this shit. before the patient dies, stop the bleeding. And we did. And this is a version of that. You're looking at that touring model, which is such an expensive part of the business model. But it's also a kind of a necessary evil

because you've got to, the talent's got to stay in shape. They've got to get their reps in. And they've got to learn. They've got to grow. They've got to get that experience in front of a live audience. And sometimes, that's not experience you want to get when there's a camera on you.

You can't try new things, right? You can't lay out a different type of a match. And you don't have the ability to learn the art of manipulating the crowd. That's such an important part of it. So even when live touring is marginally profitable or even break even, it still has a lot of value as it relates to the entire business. you've got to grow your talent. And you're not going to be able to do it at NXT. You're not going to be able to do it in a sound stage. To your question, do I see a residency? I absolutely do see a

residency. I see them, again, not, you know, trying to create a parallel path here, but, you know, Brian Badaul was really the advocate that wanted a residency back when we were attempting to buy WCW. It was Brian Badaul who felt strongly about a residency for, economic reasons. Right. It's just cheaper to get people in and out of Las Vegas. Accommodations are easier to manage. There's so many different reasons why Vegas makes sense back then, or made sense back then.

Now, even more so, particularly with the footprint TCO has there, UFC, and they're wired in that town. And I think that WWE, should they decide to use a residency to kind of make up for some of the experience the talent, you know, no longer is able to get on a 300 event, yearly live event schedule, maybe they get those reps in in front of a real crowd that cycles through every week it's a different crowd. It's not like going to NXT or in TNA when we were down at Universal or even, you know, WCW early on at Disney and Universal. You know, there you're getting different crowds in every day, but you still have a fair

amount of regulars, particularly in TNA, you would see the same 30, 40 people sitting in ringside every episode. And that's cool in a way, but having that fresh turnover of crowd from different parts of the country is really, really important. So I do see them phasing out live events or changing that element of their business model significantly. I do see a residency as part of that solution and opportunity and time will tell them. I got to totally agree with you. I think it's inevitable. And I want to encourage everyone listening to this.

Obviously, you're a diehard wrestling fan if you're listening to a wrestling podcast. I want to encourage you, take the young people in your life that maybe it's your niece or your nephew or a son or grandson. Take them to a live event as soon as you can because it seems like the writing's on the wall. This is going to be a thing of the past sooner rather than later. but if you've ever been to a live event and I know that some diehard wrestling fans think that well live

events are of no consequence because typically you don't advance storylines, you're not starting new angles, there's not title changes and things like that. But it is a totally different experience and one that if we're not careful is going to go away forever and a whole generation of fans might miss

but as a little kid I always had way more fun at a non-televised WWE or WCW show. The live events, the performers, well, they can do what wrestling was supposed to do. I don't know another way to say this. A live event is a show for you. And if you're going to a television taping, well, the show is for the people watching at

home. So instead of playing to the camera, they're playing to the fans and the seats. And it is a much more enjoyable, much more lighthearted, much more fun wrestling experience. There's no lull where we're all just sitting around saying, we must be in commercial. I really want to encourage anybody listening to this who has an opportunity. If you see WWE or AEW when they start running house shows again, hey, they're going to be here in so-and-so weeks. Take a young person, let them experience it, let them feel that magic.

I know you may be looking for storylines and angles, but it is a totally different experience. Is it not, Eric? You know, I'm so glad you brought that up because it reminded me, I talk often about research and listen, I've been involved. There was some research that was just a waste of time and money. It's not like every time I've been involved, I've had a good experience. But there was one research company in particular that we worked with that did such a deep dive

into why people were watching wrestling and what they missed about it and they used to watch more and what they would like to see differently. This was back in 95, obviously. But one of the other discussions about... The wrestling fan in general and their connection to professional wrestling versus their connection to other forms of entertainment. And one of the things that makes professional wrestling so unique and has from the beginning of television time

is that these stars you see on television come to your, come to Huntsville. Yeah. They come to your backyard. Yes. And because of that, the connection, the cultural connection to professional wrestling is so much different than the cultural connection to any other form of entertainment. Now, you can look at sports and there's an argument there that they're very similar,

but setting sports aside, you know, what TV star is going to come to Huntsville and perform for you? Right. When does anybody have a chance to grab their kids? and go to a non-televised event that they can actually afford, or at least for now, that they can afford with their kids or their brothers and sisters or whatever, buddies, wives and girlfriends, get to go to this event and see and interact in many cases,

interact firsthand with some of the same stars they see on television. That's a powerful power connection, powerful connection, that if you lose house shows, you're losing that connection. You are. You're using that ability. You're losing that attribute that makes you so much stronger than any other form of entertainment setting aside sports. So it's, look, you've got to manage the bottom line, and that's what Shapiro is clearly doing. Yes.

Has to. It's a publicly held company. It's his obligation to look for ways to be more efficient and make more money, save money. but you also have to keep an eye on what makes wrestling so different than everything else and the live touring model is part of that you're not going to feel it right away but comment how many stories have you heard over the last couple years since you've been doing this with all of us where you go to an event and you're going to hear a story about the first time dad took first time my uncle took the first time my brother and I went and those stories are what

It's what create that initial connection to the product of the memories that allow it to survive 10, 15, 20 years after that young kid went to his very first live event or her live event. It's an important piece of the puzzle that's easy to, you know, take a calculator to because the benefits of it are not as obvious, but so important. I want to mention too, you know, I know that the world has changed, but one of the reasons that the live event business was so important for WWE once upon a time, and I don't know why this doesn't get talked about more. But that was, by and large, the primary way you sold merch. I know you could, you know, they had the magazines and the little brochures, and you could mail a check off and then six weeks later something would show up.

I know that exists. But I'm saying, for the most part, people got their WWE. merch at a WWE live event. The only place you could go get a Hulk Hogan poster when I was a kid was when you went to the show. Now, that's all changed, of course, because now we can just look at our phone and click, click.

It's in our mailbox in two days. So I get that the business has changed in that regard, but the stickiness of the way you and listen, we don't talk about politics or religion on the show, but anybody who has had any sort of spiritual journey, I mean, I'm a Christian, I'm not ashamed

to announce that. But as a young person, man, I remember being in church and feeling it as a young person. Like, oh, man, I don't know what that is, but I feel something. And you don't get that watching church on television. You also don't get that watching wrestling on television. I think you got to be in the building sometimes and feel those chill bumps and feel the emotion. Like, I saw The Undertaker for years and years on TV and was just like, eh, it's not really my thing. And then I went to a house show where he wrestled Farooke in the big blue cage at the Von Braun Civic Center in 1993. And I was like, I can't believe this is our main event.

I'm not into this. But when the gong hit and I just looked around and I just like, what's happening? I feel it. And I think you're going to lose some of that magic when it goes away. And I just want to encourage everyone listening to this. If you normally only try to get to the pay-per-views and you normally only try to get to the TV shows, I get that. Keep doing your thing, bud. But if there's a young person in your life who you'd like to be a wrestling fan and like to continue their wrestling fandom alongside you,

Take them to a live event while you still can. And, you know, I don't know, I don't follow TNA other than I'm noticing that, I'm noticing traction. It's incremental. They're making small moves, but it, from the outside looking, and I'm so far outside, from the outside looking in, it looks like they're attempting to, to modify their business model. And we're hearing a lot of discussion about WWE and TNA. perhaps there's a scenario where you'll see some of that younger talent that I'm referring to, that NXT level talent that still needs reps in front of a different crowd and to work with different people. Perhaps there's a scenario where we will see more and more WWE talent, NXT talent, kind of co-opping with other promotions, whether it be TNA or anybody else.

and with some of that younger talent that needs that experience. Perhaps we will see that because that kind of checks two boxes, too, right? That MLW lawsuit, that's a big deal. Doesn't get talked a lot about. That was a big deal. And I don't think TKL wants to be in that position again. So opening up the doors and doing business with other promotions makes a lot of legal sense from being proactive in avoiding future monopoly issues.

And it could also mitigate the issue of talent, not being able to travel and get up for it. So maybe that will be part of the solution. And I think that would be great. It would be great for everybody. Because look, here's the good news, I think. Let's look for a bright side of this. The good news is your independent wrestling promoters around the country,

are going to have more of an opportunity. They're not going to have to book around WWE. The harder it is to see a live event, the more interesting live events will be for those that are putting them on. So maybe we'll see AEW put their toe in the water and try to produce some live events for the same reasons we've been discussing about getting reps in and trying new things and all that. Who else?

Look, the business will continue, it has continued to evolve. It has kept pace or actually stayed ahead of the curve. in terms of evolution compared to a lot of other forms of entertainment that have come and gone, it will continue to evolve. It's not going anywhere. It's just going to be fascinated to see how it evolves. Well, I want to mention that, you know, with these increased ticket prices that are on the horizon, you know, I just want to remind you all that life doesn't happen biweekly.

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All of a sudden we've got a flat tire. All of a sudden we need to do something at the house like there's something wrong with you. air conditioner immediately. Or maybe you've got a last-minute gift for a loved one or maybe something not so fine, like an unexpected trip to the vet. But when life comes your way, Earn-In can help. Make Earn-N a part of your financial routine and join earn-ins over three and a half million customers who say things like, when I think about Earn-In, I think about financial stability,

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Again, that's 83 weeks under podcast. Earnin is a financial technology company, not a bank, subject to your available earnings, daily max, pay period, max, and location. See Earnin.com slash TOS for details. Bank products are issued by Evolve Bank and Trust, member FDIC. So before we did the commercial there, Eric, we were talking a little bit about MLW. And you said, hey, you know that lawsuit, I don't know why nobody talks about that. Well, I do want to bring this up because at the start of the program, one of the first things

we're talking about is an old MLW, almost like a masthead. I mean, Jacob Fatu was the MLW guy. And he's in the doggone main event tonight at the debut of Smackdown on USA against Cody Rhodes in a steel cage. He's a part of the biggest storyline in WWW history, the bloodline. and he was an MLW guy. And just a couple of days ago on NXT, we saw someone answer the challenge in the main event for the TNA. I mean, wow, what in the world is going on?

Hammerstone is on WWTV. Now, yes, he works for TNA, but still, you've got two former, I mean, if you look through all the success that MLW has enjoyed over the last five or six years, these guys were in the main event over and over and over and over. MLW success in the last half a decade has been built on those two guys.

And now this calendar week, they're both on WW programming. Now, granted, one of them is through T&A, but I just find all of that interesting that nobody has really talked about that $20 million settlement and how that affected MLW. But now you see two of their biggest stars on WW programming, and I, for one, am all four Hammerstone. Have you seen much Hammerstone, Eric? I have not. I haven't heard about them, but I haven't seen them.

I think you're going to dig it. I hope if you're listening to this and you're out of the loop. You'll go back and check out NXT this past week and certainly check out TNA where you can catch more Hammerstone in the future. MLW is actually doing some big things, by the way. Center stage tomorrow night. MLW is running the show there.

Matt Riddle's going to be in the ring with Tom Lawler. Obviously, Riddles fresh off of WWE run. Arne Anderson's son, Brock Anderson, is teaming with C.W. Anderson to sort of put together the whole Anderson initiative and Mystico's on the show my buddy Adam Priest is on the show Kojima's on the show

I mean it is a loaded show and it's at center stage that's awesome when you hear about companies running center stage I mean doesn't I mean center stage doesn't even feel like that should still exist to me

because everybody I've talked to in WCW hated being there but every wrestling fan my age was like oh man center stage I gotta go to center stage I'm excited to say I'm going to Center Stage this weekend for the first time. Oh, good for you. Good for you.

Because I wish, you know, with the benefit of hindsight, I wish I would have seen a show at the Omni. I wish I could have attended a show at the Sportatorium. And, well, the way things are changing, you know, that building's not going to be there forever. I don't know what the future. I'm surprised that building is still there now. That's what I'm saying. Tony Shimani just goes on and on, like, they got to tear that thing down. And I'm like, wait, I got to see one show there first.

But I think it's cool that MLW is going to be there tomorrow. I'm kind of jealous, actually. I would love to attend a show at center stage before it's too late. One of these days, sooner or later, I'll get down there because it's talk about nostalgia. And I think, you know, I used to walk around when I was in WWE and even WCW to in the very beginning when I'd go somewhere like, oh, I don't know, we go to San Francisco. What's the name of that arena there? The Carpalus. Yes.

It's like you walk around there and you just imagine, not only from a wrestling perspective, but all the people that have come through there, the amazing stories that come along with those people, and the experiences that the audiences have had over the years of Cal Palace, or certainly you go to Madison Square Garden, And because they celebrate it. You walk up and down the halls backstage. You walk up and down the halls and there's nothing but pictures of history.

And anybody and everybody you can think of over the last however many years have been through those walls and through those halls. And the idea of being able as a performer or a producer to be there working in that same environment as some of these larger names and sports and entertainment, just know that you're sharing that one kind of common denominator. It's a very cool thing if you're into history. I often thought about early on when I was at WCW. It would be kind of great while these low buildings still exist to do a tabletop book

that was essentially, you know, these walls can talk and just kind of talk about the history and the stories and some of the amazing performers and events that took place in some these venues with great, you know, pictures that go along with it. I think that would be a thing to have. And center stage should be there. Look at all the rust. Look at, I mean, you think about the names that have passed through center stage. Right. It's kind of amazing, really, to, you know, in this little tiny theater in the round with maybe 500 seats, I don't know, 350 perhaps. You know, the reason Tony hated it so much or hates it so much is the same reason I did when I worked there, is because the backstage area is so small and cramped.

You know, you put 10 people in a locker room and you're standing on top of each other. Now, the little room that we had to conduct interviews was, you know, more than three people in that room and it wasn't functional. It was so small and hot during the summer because it wasn't air conditioned back. It was just miserable in so many ways. But out in those seats, you saw a lot of. lot of history. Some names that are no longer with us that were important figures during that time. Rick Flair, Ricky Steamboat, Hall Cogan made his WCW appearance there, one of his first

ones on television. It's pretty fascinating. One of Randy Savage's first appearances, and I can't wait to walk around and say, hey, man, is this where Vader and Orndor fucked up? I mean, where was that? There's so much history in that building. And by the way, this is not a plug for MLW. But since I mentioned it, I just want to say, the show is free. You can watch it on YouTube tomorrow night. So be sure to tune in 9 p.m. Eastern MLW Live.com. I mentioned my buddy Adam Priest is going to be on there with a Japanese legend who's made his name in CMLL. And we got Donovan Dajic taken on Tim Thatcher.

Have you seen what's Tim Thatcher, Eric? I think you'll love Tim Thatcher. He's an old school throwback down in dirty. He's your kind of guy. Kent is on the show. TjP's on the show. We mentioned Mystico. The main event,

Kojima and my buddy Mads Kruger. Well, I guess he's not my buddy. He's a monster. But it's going to be a fun show. And I just love that MLW is doing some really cool stuff. And it's free. How often do you hear that from normally independent promotions? They make their living by, you know,

partnerships with companies like Triller, which I totally get. But the idea that you can see this doggone thing free. It's on YouTube. Go check it out. out MLW Live.com tomorrow night at 9 p.m. Eastern. Looking for relevant CME-eligible content that fits your schedule, check out ACOG's new podcast series. We cover the latest on early onset breast cancer

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Not all veterans are eligible for the type or amount of benefits mentioned here. Eric, there's so much other news and notes. I feel like, you know, we've sort of glossed over the fact that you and I watch some crazy stuff this past weekend. Some stuff that I didn't think we would see. And we're not going to spend all day talking about AW. but we'd be remiss if we didn't at least bring up AEW's big pay-per-view extravaganza in Chicago. I think it beat all expectations for attendance, and I was really happy to see that because last year, man, they had such a short runway.

We did Starcast associated with it, but it made it tough to sort of promote that event and even the actual pay-per-view because you got one pay-per-view on Sunday, and then six days later you got another one. So you got to really tighten up some stories. I don't think they're going to do that next year based on the calendar we've heard this year they moved it back a week so they had 13 days as opposed to six days

so it was better but I wasn't so sure how it would draw and to my surprise it did really, really well but the actual event itself the content of the show is what had everyone buzzing we saw thumbtacks in the ladies match I saw some spots in there I'd never seen before we saw Brian Danielson get a bag over his head

which I couldn't believe people were outraged about in 2024. But then in the main event, a cinder block and a syringe and another chair shot. I, for one, don't have an issue with the chair shot. I mean, if anybody was concerned, it was gimmicked. I think that was clear. But you and I did a live watch along with all of our folks over to adfreeshows.com. And somebody to my left, as I couldn't exactly see exactly who it was, but I heard the voice say when Swerve Strickland picked the cinder block up,

up and he dropped it on the mat. Oh, I wish it would have smashed into a million pieces. And I turned and looked and said, hey, man, he did that to prove to you it's not gimmicked. It's a real cinder block. And then we see a cop killer on the doggone thing. And up comes Adam Page and he's all scraped up. And I'm like, oh, my, what an evolution of the business. As a kid, we used to all think, hey, the ring's just a trampoline. No, it's actually not. It's reinforced steel and boards and a little bit of foam and then a canvas that will burn the shit out of your skin. But now as if that's not enough,

let's put digong concrete on top of it. That's what they did. And then we finished with a syringe through the mouth. Like, I don't remember ever seeing that before anywhere, even independent wrestling. Maybe it has happened somewhere in Japan and I missed it. I don't, wow. You want to talk about up in the ante and the violence and the craziness.

This was over the top. What did you think about the presentation? It's just desperation. I don't, I do get it. I'm just searching for a different way to say it, and it's hard. But I just think creatively they're in a pit, and apparently the harder they're trying to dig out of it, the deeper the pit gets.

This was garbage, in my opinion. It's not the kind of thing that you'll be. build an audience with it's not the kind of thing you can build a business around I mean if the look I can't take AEW or anything they do seriously they are what they are they're going to be what they're going to be which is a niche company that is going to have its base of fans it's going to always be a small percentage of the overall wrestling market but they're going to have 100% control over that percentage of the market that loves that crazy, hardcore stuff just for the sake of it, good for them.

If they can build a business and be successful, satisfying that percentage of the audience, then go with God and be successful. I can't take it seriously because I don't think it's going to play. I don't care if they get five more renewals. I don't care if they get television on other, you know, sports cable outlets, all of the rumors that I'm seeing. Those are all good things. But it's not going to change the product.

It's not going to grow the business. So hats off to them. I was, you know, Ryan DeAnison. And, you know, you made this statement, you can't believe that people got upset with that in 2024. Yeah. And I understand. Tell me why.

Tell me why you feel it. Well, well, first of all. I mean, what made me sort of laugh out loud is I saw some of the, and I'll just call it like I see it, fake outrage about the spot. And they're making comparisons to, oh, they're going to lose sponsors. Well, first of all, what sponsors? As far as I know, AEW has two sponsors for their television show that are like real deal sponsors. But this is a pay-per-view, bud.

I mean, anybody who buys an AEW pay-per-view knows there's going to be crazy over-the-top stunts and violence. I mean, anytime you got John Moxley and Darby Allen and something, they're looking for it to create spectacles. So I expected some spectacles. I expected some craziness. But I feel like that was, you know, in 1989 when Funk did that to flare, wrestling was certainly presented more to children. And this aired on television. And that's not what this is. This isn't on television.

And A.EW is not aimed at children. And I know people are saying, oh, but what if a kid at home tries that? we just saw ladies wrestling in thumbtacks. Then we, I mean, I'm just saying, I don't want kids jumping off ladders. I don't want kids hitting each other with kendo sticks or chairs over the head or or or. I mean, any of these moves, like remove the damn cinder block from the spot. A cop killer, I don't want kids doing that in their backyard. Like, kids can't be getting dropped on their head.

I'm just saying that seems like a silly line to draw. Like, oh, well, this is too far. That's too far in the same show where we saw cinder blocks and chair shots and thumbtacks And we're talking about Can I jump in there for a second? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just to support what you're saying

And you look at video games and the type of graphic, incredibly graphic violence that's manufactured and created digitally targeted towards kids. You're going to watch kids to do any of that shit too? I mean, you can take that justification or that perspective of, well, we don't want kids to do it. You can take that and apply it to just about

Any other form of entertainment you want to. So it's a convenient thing. Yes. It's a very convenient, convenient bitch. I have no problem with any of that. That's not my issue. First of all, if your kids are doing this kind of stuff at home, just like if they're recreating video game,

you know, hijackings and murder scenes, yeah, you got a problem. And it probably started a long time ago before wrestling came into the equation or a video game came into the equation. So I'm not suggesting that that's my issue. The issue is that it's just cheap. It's just cheap.

It is not creative. It, it, is it a wink and a nod to funk and flare? Okay, great. One out of 3,000 people will get that or care. It's, to me, it's just, you got Brian Danielson, for God's sake, who's capable of so much. And you're going to choke them out with a plastic, but you're going to suffocate them. I just, it's, I think my, I don't want to say disgust, that's too strong, but my reaction, my negative reaction to it all was just, it's just cheap heat.

It's lazy. It's not creative. And to the point someone made about advertisers, I do disagree with you a little bit on that point, because an advertising agency isn't going to delineate between, well, what's on pay-per-view and what's on TV. That's a conversation people in the industry will have. But a 28-year-old woman on Madison Avenue who sees a clip on YouTube isn't going to say, is that pay-per-view or is that TV?

Oh, come on now. It's just going to create an impression. It just does. I'm not arguing that, but I am saying, by and large, my understanding is these folks, the buyers, they're going to watch the program. They're going to want to know what their commercial is up against. not to throw AEW under the bus, but a few years ago,

they did have a bit of a maybe poor timing moment when Nick Gage was wrestling Chris Jericho and was cutting him with the pizza cutter and went right into a pizza commercial. I could see how people

would be upset about that. That's not what this happened. That's not what this was. We didn't transition from the bag over the head to a hefty commercial. That's not what happened. Now, it would have been hilarious.

It would have been hilarious if immediately we got a Ziploc commercial. But that's not what, and by the way, if I worked there, I would have worked hard to sell that sponsorship because I would have thought it was hilarious and gone viral. But I just know that's not what the circumstance is.

And I wanted to bring up something because I feel like you had the nail on the head with the video game analogy. I remember as a kid, there was a discussion about should kids have video game guns. Because as a kid, I had a regular Nintendo and one of my favorite games had a gun where you pointed at the screen and you shoot ducks. Now, you might say to yourself, was it a shotgun? If you don't remember, no, I was shooting ducks with a pistol. It made no sense, but that's what Nintendo marketed to us. And there was a discussion about, hey, is that good? Is that okay?

But at the same time, I could go to the toy aisle, and half of my toys were different toy machine guns and Uzi's and Mac 10s and all that sort of stuff. And we did away with that and we said, hey, that's too close. that's too dangerous. That's risky. That might be setting a bad precedent. And then we fast forward and now kids play video games where they're drug runners

and they're smuggling dope and they're trying to become a kingpin in Miami and they're stealing cars. And it's horrifying. And having sex with hookers and shooting them in the face to get their money back. I mean, this is the evolution. And we're like, well, he had a bag over his head.

What if kids try that at home? Well, what if, I mean, Darby Allen and Jeff Hardy have been jumping and Shane McMahon have been looking to the ceilings to say, what can I jump off of today? I don't want kids jumping off of it. Where is the line? The plastic bag talk is fake outrage BS.

I don't disagree for the people that are arguing that, oh, it's a bad influence on kids. I agree. That's just them. Yes, clutching their pearls. And using that as a cheap excuse. I think the reason that people are against it, frankly, is for the same reason I am.

It's just like, are you kidding me? This goes against everything. I was thinking about this this morning when I first woke up knowing we're going to be talking about this. You know, if you go back and you look at AEW in the very beginning and a lot of the conversation about AEW before they first aired. And there was a reason why so many people, including myself, were excited about the potential. And it sounded like in the beginning, Tony was going to take a very different approach to professional wrestling, create a more sports-based platform. where, you know, wins and losses matter and there's a discussion about, you know, records and who earned what spot. I like all that because that's a basic framework for the question why.

And if you're able to, and it's very, very difficult, I'm not surprised that it came and went because other people have tried it, including me. And it's really hard to do without booking yourself off a cliff. That's what happens. it can be done, but it's hard. But I was excited about that. I was excited about being an alternative to WWE, especially at that time. People won't remember this because people choose to remember what they want to remember in the moment. But months, a year before, months before I was actually offered the job to come and work for WWE in 2019,

I was very critical of the product. And you can go back and find it on some of my earlier podcast with Nick Housman where I talked about the fact that, you know, WWE has the sameness to it, had at that point in time when Vince was in charge. Vince had a perspective, he had a filter, he had a lens through which he looked at the product.

And he was so, he was such a micromanager that his fingerprints, Vince McMahon's fingerprints, were on just about everything that the consumer saw with regard to WWE and its brand, especially the product in the ring. And there was a point in time when the characters, yes, they had different, they dressed differently, they had different colors, but blah, blah, blah.

But there was such a sameness to the characters. I'm not talking about the gimmicks they wore to the ring, but the way they presented themselves, the way they moved, the types of matches they had, The promos that they cut, some of the language, some of the narrative that was in there, and I remember I was there, I watched it, you know, you have a bunch of writers working with the talent, trying to figure out, you know, a promo, and then you'd take it to Vince McMahon for approval because he had to approve every single thing. And God forbid if there was a typo, even though it was a draft, and we were 20 minutes before

showtime, but if there was a typo, Vince would lose his shit, kick the whole thing out, tell you, you're right, like a fifth grader, and come back when you've got something better. And that process resulted in the sameness. It's like everything was Vince McMahon's perspective. And that sameness was boring. So when Tony came out, we're talking about the things that he was going to do differently. and you know how I feel about better than, different than, less than. When he was talking so much about what they were going to do differently,

I was genuinely excited. But I think as we've seen over time, not only because the roster is populated so heavily with ex-WWE talent, that's part of it. But the content that we're seeing in the ring is not so alternative anymore. And the stuff that is alternative is what we saw Saturday night, a syringe in the face. And, you know, I smashed a cinder block over Jim Ross, put it right out of his head,

stomped on it. It was a fake cinder block, obviously. So it's not like the first time that's ever been done. I'm not criticizing that. I am critical, though, of the lack of imagination and creativity. And the fact that AEW has become essential, in my opinion, this is just my opinion. it's become a dollar store version of WWE. And it's, again, it's missed opportunity.

The opportunity was there in 2019. The opportunity's still there. But I don't see it ever happening. Guy in control just is doing what he wants to do and what appeals to him. And unfortunately, I don't think he understands the audience as well as he should. let me say this all the violent stuff when people get outraged i always sort of go yeah but what do you really upset about like old kids are going to do this that's nonsense but eric jones who's with us live here as part of our live studio audience which you can be too if you join us at adfreesows

dot com we'll talk about that later eric says i'm against it he's talking about the bag over the head spot because it's stupid i'm watching wrestling chokeholds don't stop men but cheap ass can't hold my groceries from the car to the house without ripping, choked a man. So he's talking about the idea that, hey, logically, it is hard to sort of hang your hat on the fact that Brian Danielson couldn't just rip the bag open. I get that.

So if we're going to poke holes in the logic, okay. Now, granted, there's a lot we have to sort of suspend our disbelief for just a little bit and to enjoy wrestling. But I think that is a better argument as opposed to, oh, think of the children. That's nonsense. I do want to mention, too, that you and I had a conversation in Chicago about a new sponsor here on the show.

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Eric, there's a... That was called Lumen, right? Yes, sir. You got it. Hey, I wanted to ask you about some other news and notes. there's a report from Dave Meltzer that's come out and he had a comment about what's going on with AEW and Warner Brothers Discovery.

There hasn't been an official announcement, but here's what Dave said. Dave Meltzer recently said on Wrestling Observer Radio, the AEWWBD is a done deal and there are going to be changes. From what I gather, there's going to be a pay-per-view component in this deal. Exactly what it is, I don't know. There is going to be a deal with Max with the pay-reviews and some. some form is what it looks like. We've yet to see an official announcement,

and even after the big event in Chicago, the post-match presser, which normally has a whole host of talent, was largely just Tony Kahn. And when it came to that question, he indicated that he hasn't put pen to paper, but he feels really, really good about the future of AEW on Warner Brothers Discovery.

Of course, we're talking about TBS and TNT. But the whole paper view component is, interesting because it may indicate that there is a bit of a paradigm shift where, you know, once upon a time UFC changed their pay-per-view model, and we all know WW has changed their pay-per-view model. AEW's really hung on to that pay-per-view model, as we just mentioned. They just ran too across the course of 13 days. And I'm curious to see or hear what you think about perhaps if this report from Dave is true

that some of the AEW paper reviews might be on max instead. What do you make of that? Not much. I mean, there's not, I mean, Dave didn't really reveal much other than pay-per-view is going to be a component. Okay. I mean, it's not allowed there to work with as far as reporting goes. But, you know, look, my understanding and belief is that Warner Brothers owns 30% of AEW on paper, which means they have access to the books.

should and they're probably looking at ad sales and going out not working real well how do we monetize how do we increase how do we get a return our investment whatever that investment is whatever the license fee is for whatever programming they're going to put under contract how do we get a return on that investment because it's not coming from ad sales and one of the things that i noticed that was interesting and this is going to sound like a knock and it's not but it's it is i guess in a way it's like every time tony comes out and talks so positively about Warner brothers and how he's confident that they're going to do a deal and all that and and by doing so he'll be profitable and he'll be the second most powerful wrestling company in the country whatever his bullshit is right because he can't

help himself he's got to hype it up and i get it not being critical of that. It's just pretty transparent, but whatever. But I'm thinking to myself, if I'm Zazloff and I'm negotiating with this cat, he's got more money than the network does probably at this point. And he keeps telling everybody how much money he's going to make off this contract I haven't given him yet and how he's going to be so profitable. In the meantime, I've lost $9 billion in my sleep last month. And now this. cat's wanting a race for a show that isn't really doing that well, I'm going to negotiate accordingly. I mean, he has to, does Zazlov has to?

He has to negotiate whatever is the best interest in his company. His job is on a line. So I would imagine he's looking at all the numbers and he's looking at attendance and all of the things that you can possibly make money off of in the wrestling business and go and pay-per-view is about the only pie that we can get a piece of that's going to move the needle. So I would imagine there's going to be a profit sharing beyond the 30% equity that Warner Brothers owns. There's going to be some kind of a split.

It's not nothing because Tony's paying a split right now. He's got, does it deal with DirecTV. They're going to take whatever their percentage is. I'm assuming it's 50%. They're going to take their 50% cut and Tony's left with his. Same thing's going to happen at Warner Brothers. It'll be an intercompany allocation. I know all about those sons of bitches.

But it's got to be a profit sharing with pay-per-view. That's the only, what else is there? I don't want to be clear. Will that max distribution increase the number of buys potentially that AEW gets? I don't know anything about the footprint of max. I don't know how popular it is. I don't know what other kind of content that they have on there. You know, it's losing money.

we don't know, I don't think distribution matters that much to people. I don't think people care where they're getting it as long as it's easy to get. If you have to jump through a bunch of freaking hoops to get a premium live event or pay-per-view, whatever you want to call it, whether you're getting it traditionally or whether you're getting it through a streaming platform, the idea is that it's an easy, almost a spontaneous buy. Good percentage your buys usually happen, at least they used to. used to happen within 36 hours of the event.

So we'll see. I just don't know enough about Max to see if that's going to be any kind of an upside or not. To be clear, you threw out there a 30% equity number. That's a rumor. I don't think we've ever seen that confirmed, right? No, we haven't seen it. I've heard it from people that I know who have looked at deal memos and letters of intent. doesn't mean it's accurate.

Right. It's not just a Dave Meltzer type of room. Well, this is also not a rumor. And I know that, you know, the people who hate AEW, and I realize we have a lot of people who listen to this show, who hate AEW and therefore hate me when I defend him. But I heard from a person in the industry that All In did record business on some of the pay-per-view streaming platforms. I'm not saying that it's their greatest they've ever done for any resolution.

wrestling pay-per-view ever. But it was a high watermark for AEW. And I have to admit, that sort of caught me by surprise. Like, wow, that was the record. But they're still doing record business on pay-per-view. It's really, really a strong proposition to have AEW pay-per-view on your streaming platform. And it does make sense that if we're going to sort of up the ante, we got to get something back. We've got to get some skin in the game. But the other thing that really sticks out to me. And I don't know anything. I'm not privy to any inside information here. But it does stand to reason that if we're this late in the game

with regards to the Warner Brothers deal, and we've all heard that there is an offer, and we've heard Tony say on multiple occasions, I haven't put pen to paper. There's a reason why. Now, it's up to us to guess what that is. But when they went out and trademarked shockwave, a lot of people were curious,

hey, what is that about? What is this going to be? because it sounds like a show name. Is it a show? Is it a pay-per-view? And Dave Meltzer reports that the idea of there being another show created for Fox is possible. The Fox deal is not done. I know a lot of people have been talking about the idea of the Fox network,

but I would strongly suspect it will not be on the Fox network. It will probably be another station, whether it's FS1, whether it's a streaming component as far as the shockwave thing they did trademark the name so they have to be pretty darn close to a deal to the links of trademarking the name. Now I'm going to disagree with Dave there

as you know Eric you can trademark something for a few thousand dollars it's not that big of an investment that's lunch for Tony Con but the idea that there might be some sort of a relationship with Fox. don't think it's going to be the traditional Fox, but with Fox on any level, on the heels of

WWE, just ending their deal, boy, that would be a major feather in the cap for all wrestling, because it would prove, to me at least, that Fox hasn't just sort of thrown their hands up and given up on wrestling completely. So I'm really, I mean, even if they don't get a huge landmark deal from Fox, just the idea that Fox is interested in having wrestling on their networks. And we don't know that that's the case. But if that rumor proves to be true, AEW on any level of Fox, I think, is a win for pro wrestling. What do you make of these rumors about AEW having programming on Fox? It's a fun thing to talk about. It makes great clickbait. It'll create a lot of discussion for Dave amongst his audience. A lot of people

speculate because it's kind of cool. It's kind of like a Monday night. worst thing, oh, Fox walked away from WWE, but they embrace AEW. You know, it's that kind of low-level, low-hanging fruit that wrestling fans love to grab a hole of and have fun with, myself included. Put it in, it's not Fox Network. Fox Network is never going to put on the AEW ever, ever, ever. That is not happening. As much fun as it's to talk about.

FS1, Fox Sports, maybe they have a lot of stuff on Fox Sports One that you'll never find anywhere else. It doesn't get much of an audience. I don't think AEW is going to do very well on Fox Sports One for a lot of reasons. It's not doing very well on TBS. So to imagine that they're going to somehow create a news. First of all, creating another show or a company who can't figure out how to produce one is going to be a real challenge. It's just more.

It's just more. They don't have a system down yet. They don't have their feet underneath them. So to take on another show on top of what they already have that they can barely hold an audience for, they have like 168,000 viewers the other night on one of their shows, Friday night. or Saturday night. I mean, come on, people, you've got it at some point, put down the Kool-Aid and have a cup of coffee and wake up.

It's just silliness. I don't think it's a feather in a cap of wrestling. If Fox Sports One takes another show, which basically has no audience and no production values, it is what it is. They're filling air time. They're filling schedules with content. that's all that Fox Sports One really is.

And then you've got, you know, talk to Jeff Jared about Fox Sports One. I'll tell you all about it. Sounds great. Makes a great press release. Gets people excited. But you can't do anything with it. The show will probably end up if it, if it follows the same pattern, I think that TNA did with Fox Sports One when they were there for a minute. You know, your schedule is different depending on what part of the country you're in.

It's hard to promote that show because it's all over the map, or at least it was back there. I don't know what the situation is now. If it's in a regular primetime spot, you know, on a night of the week where it makes sense, maybe it'll find an audience. But if it's going to move around the Fox Sports schedule, depending on other sports that are taking place and take priority, it's just going to be a burden somebody's going to have to produce that isn't going to generate much of an audience at all. that's not hate that's just having been there seen it and done it well i'll tell you this just in case i'm going to make sure that my uh max subscription is good to go i just uh i finally

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com slash 83 weeks. Eric, there's so much going on in wrestling. I feel like we should mention. We just talked about the AEW Fox opportunity. Well, right after losing Fox, the WW announces they're back on NBC. They're running a live Saturday night's main event, and it's going to happen heads up against AEW's World's End at the end of the year in the same city

boy this is this feels remember that remember that discussion we had a little while ago about you know kind of planning ahead a little bit defensively legally for that whole monopoly kind of thing

this is a good reason to do the kind of stuff that they're doing because this is a big ass This feels like the Monday Night War era. This feels like Dusty versus Vince when it was Crockett and Vince in the golden era. Wait a minute. You're running a pay-per-view. So I'm going to run a special on free TV, which by the way is the way WrestleMania and Clash of the Champions came to be.

And then later, you know, the Bunkhouse Stampede and the Royal Rumble. Like the Royal Rumble and Clash of Champions were created as free television properties to battle a pay-per-view. And now we might be seeing that in just a couple of months. This is wild, Eric. It's kind of fun. It's like watching two, like

watching people play chess. Okay, who's going to make the next move? And is it going to be a big one or a little one? It's kind of fun. We should also mention that Milwaukee, we've got some news out of Milwaukee. They're putting together a bid to get money in the bank 2025 for WWE. Now, when you hear about this,

sort of thing. You think, well, what's the big deal? That's happened before. And yes, that's true. But by and large, city's sort of bidding for paper views has felt like it was mostly reserved for WrestleMania or SummerSlam or perhaps Royal Rumble. No disrespect to the money in the bank brand, but it didn't really meet that mark. But now they're doing these economic impact studies. And so as part of the presentation, they can roll out and say, well, here's what we brought to your area. They might get tax benefits. They might get free buildings.

They might get paid to go there. That's happened for WWE with some of their larger marquee events like WrestleMania and Royal Rumble and SummerSlam. But money in the bank too? Eric, this is wild. The WWE just continues to find revenue in places that people didn't know you could find revenue. It really is fascinating. And again, going back to what we talked about earlier on.

on. I wonder if perhaps the new tour model, the business model for touring, includes maybe not the Huntsville's of the world, but mid-sized markets where they can try to raise some, you try to offset expenses in smaller local markets. You're not going to have a market that's going to be able to say, here's two million dollars to bring a house show here. I'm not suggesting that. But WWE as an event coming to mid-sized markets could be configured in such a way is to attract at least sponsorship in the form of breaks on taxes, breaks on the building, breaks on concessions, enough of the other ancillary areas within the touring model where you can make up for the ticket sales or you can afford to bring in talent that you

might not otherwise afford to bring into if it was a traditional non-televised live event. What I'm saying is perhaps they guess those mid-sized markets up a little bit, make them a little bit more attractive and a little bit more of an experience by bringing in some of their top talent so that they can then go to some of those local communities or to the states in some cases and say, hey, we want to bring WW here once every three months. What can you do for us today? And even if it's not significant, like a major pay-per-view, anything that you can do to offset expenses, as you know, that's business. That's what you're going to do.

And perhaps this is part of that strategy. I don't know. Well, I'm excited to see it. I'd be looking at it. For sure. Are you kidding? My goodness. I mean, I just, I'm in awe of the way WWE's business feels like it's hit fifth year.

And something else that's changing about WW's business, as we know, is at the start of the year, we're going to be going to next. Netflix. It's a big opportunity. But in the meantime, it looks like Raw is going to become a two-hour show. I think all of us are throwing our hands up and saying, finally, yay. I mean, three hours of Monday Night Raw was at least one hour too many. Would you agree with that? Oh, 100%. This is going to be fun to watch too, because the format, the pacing of the show, the format of the show is going to change so much. That two hours is going to feel like seven minutes after having had to sit through three hours of Monday Night Raw for how many years now? You're going to turn on Netflix. You're going to watch Raw and those first two hours are going to go by so fast. You're going to feel like what

the hell? Where's the rest of the show? And that's a good thing. It's good for talent. It's good for production. It's great for the audience. I think stories will be able to pick up more momentum because so much is diluted in three hours. You've got to fill that content. And in between all of your A story and your B story and your C story, you've still got a lot of time to fill. And it dilutes the overall product to a degree. And I think this is going to allow WWE and creative to really gas up, tighten up their stories, become even more disciplined. It's going to be fun to watch. I'll be really, really fascinated to see what happens to the format.

What are they going to lose? What are they going to add? That's what I'll be looking for. Well, I want to mention this too. Not only are we going, now that USA has got Smackdown, I assume since there's this lame duck period where now the Fox contract has ended, they need a home for Smackdown, okay, we'll send it to USA. As part of that negotiation, or so it seems, I don't know this, but I mean, it's a logical

leap to make, that WWE is going to offer two hours of RAW to USA, not three. So we're going to have four hours of main roster programming between two hour Raw and two hour Smackdown through the end of the year. Now, when we get to Netflix, Eric, we're going to have two hours commercial free of Monday Night Raw. And you talked about how it's going to change the format. This is going to be perhaps the biggest change of all for me and the one I'm looking forward to the most.

The idea that there is no commercial, because a lot of the other programs I watch, well, they don't have commercials. I'm watching a lot of streaming stuff. So the series that I watch are on streaming and I pay a few extra bucks. Thanks to our friends over at Rocket Money, I don't overpay. But I make sure there's no commercials. And I don't have to sit through that. The only time I have to sit through a commercial is if I'm watching a football game,

a basketball game, or I'm watching the news. Otherwise, I'm not watching stuff that has commercials. But a Monday Night Raw that's been formatted without commercials, that's never happened. Like, there are so many tired wrestling tropes that exist in professional wrestling, specifically WWTV, for years and years, and it's not his fault. I knew whenever someone got thrown to the outside of the ring in the middle of a match, we're going to hear Michael Cole crash to break. Like, all of that changes when there's no commercials.

It's going to make it feel, like if you've ever, gone to a live football game, a college game or an NFL game that was televised. And of course, all the NFL games are, but not all the college games used to be. Maybe that's different now. But man, I remember sitting in the stands and feeling like, what are we doing? We were doing a TV timeout. But guys are just standing around on the field waiting and the linemen are waiting and the referees are waiting and the guys with the sticks are waiting. And we're all just like, what are we doing? We're waiting on the television audience. That's all going to change with Netflix. This is a major change happening in WWE.

What do you expect? Again, here's what I expect. We're going to see some massive changes in format. If I'm talent right now, no, I've, obviously I'm not a wrestler, so I've never had to wrestle through a break. But as a character being out there in the ring, I've had to be out there with four or five other guys through a commercial break. And it is the most awkward, uncomfortable feeling because you're just buying time

and the audience knows it. It's hard to keep the audience engaged during those commercial breaks. You lose so much energy in that arena during that two and a half for three minutes, whatever it is, not even know. I haven't even time to commercial break in a long time. They keep adding commercials into those breaks.

They used to be like two minutes and 30 seconds. Now I think they're up to 3.45, whatever they are. But that period of time where you bring the audience up and then you tell them to take a nap for three or four or five minutes and he got to re-engage them again that's hard so i think the producers the writers and producers ability to manage emotion in a two-hour show with no commercial breaks is going to be fun to watch that's an entirely different format when you're not formatting or that lack of energy trying to Finish a match off exactly when you want it to finish off and try to hold them through the commercial.

All of that goes out the window. And now you just have to focus on creating emotion and sustaining it and not have to worry about sustaining it through a three-minute commercial break. It's going to be fun. I'd love to be a fly on the wall and just watch how they do it. It's going to be, it'll be fun to be a part of that process. So let's talk about this, Eric. We're going to lose a three-hour roll. I mean, there's so much happening.

we see Fox say we're out of the WWE business Smackdown's going to USA it's a lame duck deal that's a big change and it's a big change to take Raw from three hours to two and it's in my opinion

an even bigger change that it's going to be commercial free on Netflix but we just saw news that happened earlier this week the Raw rating came out and it was not good 1.43 million viewers saw Monday Night Raw. It got a 0.45 rating in the 18 to 49 demo.

That's the lowest rating that Raw has done since going up against the NFL playoffs in January. I find this fascinating to me. And the reason this is so interesting to me, Eric, is we're all still talking about ratings. But that's all changing with the Netflix deal. gone are we talking about we won't be talking about the Monday night ratings anymore like we have been talking about the ratings

for Monday Night Raw since the thing became a show so we're talking about 30 years worth of ratings talk and it's all we did during the Monday Night Wars who won all of that conversation dies in just a couple of months I don't know that the internet wrestling community is really

that that's really clicked just yet isn't that crazy what are they going to talk about that's what I'm saying I'm just going to go out of business. What's he going to study? But I'm just saying, like, even the, the AEW hate where it's like, oh, yeah, well, they only got 700,000, but Raw got 2 million. When this goes to a streaming service, we have no idea. And that's been such, you'll, you'll still have Smackdown.

SmackDown's, yes, I guess that's true. But the Monday Night Raw rating, I mean, for as long as I can remember, remember, that's been such a major talking point, and it's not going to be. That's interesting to me. Yeah, it is. And, you know, I don't know what the, what the measurements are for Netflix. I think they're internal. I don't think I've never seen anything published unless they want to promote something.

So, yeah, nobody will really have access to. It'll give a lot of people, you know, an opportunity to speculate and sound like they have inside information. It does the same things are always doing. But you're not going to get any real measurements unless it's not. It's coming from Netflix. And even then, they're going to tell you what they want you to believe. I want you to hear.

But you're still going to have SmackDown. So people will be able to compare the dynamite rating to the Smackdown rating. You're still going to have their chip that they can play with. Nothing's really going to change that much. But it is fascinating. You know, you just wonder how long it's going to be before, you know, Smackdown ends up on a streaming platform. When you're separating from the military, no one tells you how hard it can be to get your civilian. in life up to speed.

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Do you long for the good old days? I think we all do. You still too sweet every stranger wearing an NWO shirt? And you got to check out the new nostalgia podcast. Be kind, less rewind. Join three lifelong friends as they discuss TV, movies, music, pop culture, all of it from the 80s, 90s, and beyond. They've covered topics ranging from personalities like Macho Man Randy Savage and Hulk Hogan to movies like Predator and Happy Gilmore. They have live interviews with authors like John Finkel and her buddy Dr. Brad and even the Batman executive producer Michael Eustlin.

Be sure to check out John and Brad's books, Macho Man, The Untamed, Unbele, life of Randy Savage and my favorite, the six-pack on the open road in search of WrestleMania. Dr. Brad hooked that one up. Join Be Kind. Let's rewind for weekly segments such as booze of the week. Shit stuck in my head this week. And the infamous pizza gorilla. And of course, the Norm McDonald clip of the week. New episodes air every Friday on YouTube, Spotify, Apple Music, and all major podcasting platforms. Be sure to subscribe. to their YouTube page at Be Kind Let's Rewind

and you can engage with the show on Instagram, X, and even Discord. So if you love the 80s and 90s nostalgia, this is the show for you. Check it out. Be kind. Let's rewind. Eric, we sort of buried the lead here today. You and I

had a great time last weekend in Chicago. We're coming off of what we call Top Guy Weekend. So here's how it works. If you're a member of our family, at ad-freeshows.com, then you get tons of bonus content, like more than 100,000 hours. An exclusive series, you can't hear anywhere else from some of the biggest stars and Hall of Famers and legends in the history of wrestling. You also get all the starcast panel shows,

but we've got live interactive Q&As and watch-alongs, and we've even got a live studio audience here with us today. I want to give a shout out to Lindsay and Eric Green and Eric Jones and Tony Flowers and Isaac Riston and Anthony and there's so many folks, Matthew Presley's here, Coach Keith. I appreciate everybody coming in and hanging out early with us. But we had such a great time in Chicago, including some real surprise guests and one that people thought maybe we'd never hear from. Jason Hervey joined us.

Yeah, that Jason Hervey, we haven't seen or heard from that guy in the wrestling space in forever. We've got a clip I want to share. from Chicago this past weekend for ad-free shows Top Guy Weekend. This is my second Top Guy Weekend. Never being to Chicago has been a absolute blast. It's been a fantastic weekend. I had tons of fun.

My favorite part probably was meeting downtown Grotto. That was completely unexpected. Great guy and was a lot of fun having that fail. We've been surprised. The talent here has been amazing. This is my first time and I have literally had one of the best weekends of my life. Seeing the vintage belts was unforgettable. I highly recommend this for a wrestling fan.

Times of fun. There's so much to do here, so many different panels, so many people to see from David Crockin to Eric Bedshop, Jeff Jarrett. It's like Disneyland for a wrestling fan. Holding the actual big old belt that Rick Flair had. It gets me all of our idols and our heroes. Me and my dad have always been really close. But with that free shows and the top of the weekends,

it brought us even closer. We get to hang out every year. We plan this all in advance. You know, that's our trip every year. So not only did I have a great relationship with Dad before, I have a better relationship with that free show. Like bullshit with him. I just think for the fear.

I get together, but for us, it's a family event as well. You know, we're all family, and it's just great to keep. And it's just great to catch up with everybody. It's one of the fun that we get to the year. I recommend anybody who's a fan. Come out next time to join us. Like you said, we've been a lot closer. But still, I only came to the beer.

Dave and Evan and so many others, you've got a great team of people. But every time I go, this is like, I don't know how many times I've been to these now, a couple, three, four, whatever. I always have so much fun. I am so grateful that I have the opportunity to be a part of it. It's just the quality of people, just the quality of human beings, they get together over that weekend. And they've got nothing in common other than they love wrestling.

and then they end up becoming close friends and Mrs. B's got friends now and that are all part of the ad-free shows family. And it's just awesome. It's just awesome. And we've got another one on deck. It's going to happen Royal Rumble Weekend, and boy, do we have some special surprises in store.

I'm going to give you some spoilers. If you want to join us at ad-freeshows.com and become a top guy, we're doing fantasy camp again next year. And the same guy who taught Kurt Engel and the Rock, and even Vince McMahon how to wrestle. Dr. Tom Pritchard is going to be hosting our fantasy camp. If you've ever wanted to know what it's like to step in between those ropes

and actually learn from the guy who taught Kurt Angle how to become a pro wrestler, this is your chance. Not only that, we're going to do what we did in Huntsville before. We're going to fantasy book a show. We're going to have a lot of independent stars who you're going to see on television one day. And we're going to come up with a cold card. And it's going to be a blast. As if that's not enough, we're going to watch the Royal Rwomen.

Rumble together. We've got some special surprises there. We're going to play games that, man, if you miss this year's Top Guy Rumble, Effron, who puts together the game event, made the Royal Rumble experience I had more fun than even when I was in the building. I've been to four Royal Rumbles in person. I had more fun in a hotel banquet room with this game that Ephraing came up with. And you just saw the community. If you're looking for some wrestling friends, look no further than ad-freeshows.com. Give it a shot, become a top guy, I hope to see at Fantasy Camp, I hope to see at the

Top Guy Rumble, I hope to see what you can do when you fantasy book your own wrestling card. That's what we're doing at ad-freeshows.com, and I hope you'll make plans to join us. Let's talk about something that has gone a little viral, in case you missed it.

This back and forth with Kevin Nash and Logan Paul, did you see any of this, Eric? I saw the clips, yeah. So let's just recap and catch everybody up. Here's what Kevin had to say about Logan Paul. He's not one of the boys. Where would he learn that shit yet?

Now, of course, this comes out of a clip where I guess I should give context. Hulk Hogan was recently on Logan Paul's podcast. And he's talked about work and shoot. And Logan was like a deer in the headlines. And Hulk was blown away that this guy who's had so much success in WWE, who's been a U.S. champion, who's been on WrestleMania, who's been on SummerSlam, He's been on the Royal Rumble. He didn't know what work and shoot were.

And Kevin, on his podcast, clicked this, said, he's not one of the boys. Where would he learn that shit yet? Where is he going to go up and down the road talking our jargon? In the building? Everybody's in their own fucking motor coach. There's no fucking interaction. There's no socialization.

You don't become one of the boys just because you're fucking around them. That motherfucker, from what I've heard, he's making like $5 million for fucking fucking dates and those other motherfuckers are out there making house shows fuck you, fuck you. What are you making Kevin's statements there, Eric?

Kevin was grouchy that day. He's a big grouch. Something went up his ass sideways. Kevin was frustrated at my first starcast because I'll admit, I didn't know what the fuck I was doing. And maybe I didn't handle his travel

the way it needed to be or something. I missed something. And he was upset. And I was trying to talk to my buddy, Sean Waltman, like, hey, man, how do I fix this? And I laid out exactly what happened. And Sean just said, hey, man, on TV, he was big sexy. But to us, sometimes he was just big grouchy. He's just big grouchy today. He'll be fine tomorrow.

And he was. So when you said he's a grouch, my eyes lit up like, okay, maybe he just caught Kevin on a bad day. Somebody he could have, somebody could have said something to him. It could have been, could have been any little thing. But Kevin, look, I think I'd have. love about Kevin is he'll tell you exactly what he thinks he doesn't he plays no games there's no gamesmanship with Kevin he'll look you in the eye and tell you exactly what's on his mind and sometimes that's uncomfortable sometimes it's unfair but it's never untrue so I appreciate that

and Kevin is one of those guys and I've had conversations where I was Logan Paul and Kevin was right in front of me, and he was motherfucking me that way. And occasionally, I'd give it right back. And then an hour later, we'd be laughing and joking and on to the next thing. Get some business done. That's just Kevin. You've got to take the good with the bad. Well, what I found interesting was, and I think it's probably been taken out of context,

and I know people are going to say, well, what other context could you take it in? I don't think for a minute that Kevin Nash is begrudging a guy getting paid. This is a guy who used to, you know, remind us all that, what was it? It's not show friends. It's show business. I think that's a Scott Hall quote. But like Kevin Nash has always been the guy who was really proud of the fact that he was able to make a lot of money and didn't have to do some of the crazy things that other performers did in order to make it.

So I don't think that Kevin is like, as the kids say, pocket watching Logan. Paul here, but I do understand maybe some frustration about him having this level of success and maybe not understanding the culture and what the, even the simple words work and shoot. Well, Logan Paul, he had time and he did a selfie video that he posted and it said, I got people messaging me that, yo, Kevin Nash is talking shit about you. I said, damn, who's Kevin Nash? I mean that.

I'm unfamiliar with this guy, which I think is his problem. I'm not as versed in the WWE and wrestling as maybe I should be as my peers are. But then how am I so much better than all of them? I don't have the answers to these questions. It is a question. I don't know how I could be the best in WWE

or at least one of the best. I'm surely a top fiver and I don't even do it full time. Now imagine if I did learn a little bit. Imagine if I devoted and became one of the boys learned what the difference between work and shoot was. Will that make me a champion? Fuck me.

Fuck you. you're one of the old guys who's bitter that I'm better at you than your job than you ever were that makes you pathetic this will be my sport and I will continue to make guys like you eat your words when I devote a little bit more time to it

so fuck me fuck you and when I read this back I thought okay I want and I don't mean to give credit maybe where credit's not due but this feels like

my man is just leaning into be in a heel. He can't really, I mean, this is all, this is character work trying to get people to hate you. And if Kevin Nash said that, hoping he would get a response from one of the biggest influencers in not just wrestling, but in the world, bravo Mr. Nash, well done, sir. Let's see you. And, and, and, bravo, Mr. Paul.

They both handled their roles perfectly. Yes. Perfectly. in fact, I hope Logan gives Kevin a call and thanks him because that little bit, that little comeback from Paul got him more heat than anything he could have done in the ring. It's awesome. If I'm WWE, maybe it wasn't on the,

maybe it wasn't the plan at first. Plans change. I'm going to have Kevin Sullivan make an appearance, or not Kevin Sullivan, Kevin Nash making an appearance. And we're going to do something with Logan. Paul. And I'm not suggesting that Kevin Nash is going to go work a match. I don't think he has any interest in that.

I had a conversation with it. You don't have to work a match. That's right. They could do something on SmackDown. Yes. Ooh, the timing is a little suspicious, Conrad. Isn't that great? Nothing is coincidental, Conrad.

This is what I love about pro wrestling. Like, we all want to believe, Eric. And again, that exchange back and forth the week before they moved to smackdown because I'm like you I mean I know Kevin pretty well I love Kevin the good the bad and everything in between I've just learned to accept it and there's no way he's bitter that's not Kevin it's not Kevin if anything Kevin's probably thinking you motherfucker I couldn't I have figured that out back down now of course social media didn't exist back then it would have been impossible. But I think Kevin, my way of saying, I think Kevin kind of admires what Paul's done.

You have to. How do you not admire what he's been able to accomplish physically in the ring? It's just a freak of nature to be consistently as good as he is at the level that he's at with the people that he's working with. He's a freak. I think Kevin probably admires it deep down inside. He may not want to admit it, but I think he does. I mean, I'm sure Kevin does. Like, how can you not appreciate the athleticism, like, no matter what you think of Logan Paul, the influencer, the business person, the professional wrestler, the dude's a legit athlete. I mean, you can't argue that. I mean, he wrestled in high school and then, I mean, he fought Floyd Mayweather. No, he didn't win, but nobody beat Floyd Mayweather. But I'm saying he is a freak athlete and he has had great

success with WWE. And I know Rhonda Rousey would say, oh, but he had an opportunity to practice. whatever the business is changing and it would be great for business for both Kevin Nash and his personal appearance business and his podcast business and it would be great for interest because I for one would love to see Logan Paul who's known to talk a little smack

with a microphone in his hand and Kevin Nash with a microphone in his hand and just see what happens if that happens. Ooh, that be so much fun. I'm in. Sign me up. That would be so much fun. I mean, as soon as I'm I saw this, I was like, I got to text Kevin just the clapping emoji because well done, man.

I don't know if that was the plan, but it ought to be. Because I'll tell you what, for Logan Paul, if he, if that opportunity comes up and he's face to face with Kevin, Kevin will give him, I mean, Logan Paul is really good. He's mastered social media. He knows how to play this game in his sleep. But you don't want to underestimate Kevin Nash because you get Kevin Nash fired up and focused. and you get into a verbal battle with that man, he can take you apart.

It'll be fun to watch. It will be fun to watch. I can't wait to watch the Vince McMahon documentary. We were in Chicago last week and a trailer came out. So we got our first glimpse of what this thing is going to look like. And I wanted to play it here and let everyone take a look. And then you respond, Derek. People wondered.

Who I really am. You know, portrayal to me, I'm a bad guy. But no one really knows me. In the world of professional wrestling, Vince McMahon. He's easy to hate. What you expect. I don't fight fair.

That's exactly what you're going to get. It's not my fault that I happen to be a self-made billionaire. Hello, everyone. Welcome to All-American Wrestling. When it's business, my vision was. to make just mainstream. Welcome to Russell Media. Vince created this huge empire.

Billion dollar entertainment juggernaut. He did things no one thought were possible. Everything he did turned to gold. There were so many scandals going on. On trial for steroids. 90% of the wrestlers are on steroids. Another dead wrestler. This rocked the very foundation in the WW.

I would accept no responsibility whatsoever. None whatsoever. They live this life. Breaking news, Vince McMahon is stepping aside. The lawsuit accusing him of countless, depraved, and humiliating acts. I didn't think the lawsuit could shock me, and I was floored. When it comes to Vince, a lot of that is a character. He's going to show you what he wants you to see.

The lines of reality are very blurred in our business. The individual loses all sense of who they really are. My name is not Vince. My name is Mr. McMahon. It's coming to Netflix, September 25th, and boy, I got goosebumps watching that. This is going to be wild. You're going to have non-wrestling fans talking about wrestling. This is going to be water cooler talk.

It's going to be mainstream. I mean, this is going to get a lot of attention for WWE, and I don't think all of it's going to be positive. What did you think when you saw the trailer there, Eric? I'm confused I mean the situation is confusing for me in that this is Netflix who just signed a $5 billion deal

with WWE the ink is still dry still drying haven't even had their first show yet yet Netflix is going to take arguably the face of or what has been the face of WWE, since most of us have been alive, most people watching.

And they're going to expose them to the world in a way that's not going to be flattering to the brand. One would think that it would not be flattering to the brand. I'm not going to suggest that there's a way to make it flattering but I do have to wonder if this is essentially

just rip that band-aid off get it over with and let's move on and create more distance it's the only thing I can think of because why else would Netflix air it why would they stream it? They've have more projects

that they've paid a lot more for than this that they just stuck in a closet and forgot about. There's no need to do this unless there's a reason for it. And that reason could be to further distance TKL from Vince Bickman. And the idea of WWE separating that from Vince Bickman. That's the only thing I can think of. Otherwise, it's just confusing as hell as to why they do it.

It's going to be interesting to see how they do this. You know, I think everybody listening to this. knows that in my real life, I do mortgages. And on social media, I'm Conrad the Mortgage Guy. Like, that's how people have me programmed in their phone. Thousands of people have me programmed as Conrad the Mortgage Guy, which is great. But I just want to add some context to this. This project was not started in January of this year after that lawsuit came out. This project was not started when two years ago we first read that Wall Street Journal report over the summer.

This project was started years prior to all of this. We're talking more than 36 months ago, I think. So when you think about it from that perspective, it is going to be interesting to think about, because I believe cameras were following them around like the first sort of post-COVID WrestleMania. So a lot of this stuff was happening with people in masks and COVID. I mean, that's how long ago this stuff was put together.

I don't know. I don't have any insight, but it feels like what the original intention was for this documentary series had to change when those allegations came out in 2022. Well, Vince was the one. This started, as you know, I was working with Scott Silver, who wrote Joker and then the new Joker that's coming out in November. I was working with Scott Silver on the script for the Hogan project for Netflix.

And I'm pretty sure I heard from Scott more than three years ago when this thing first started, when it was first a conversation that perhaps Vince was interested in looking for someone to do this. So this is originally Vince's idea, it was my understanding. Yes. And like five years ago, this was Vince's. I mean, he was. Yeah. Yes. So the goal then was certainly different than the goal now.

But that's the other thing that confuses me is this was a Vince McMahon initiative from five years ago. There was no commitment to it. There's no reason to do it. And one of the other things I heard, and again, I'm not going to share this because it's Dave Meltzer type second, thirdhand bullshit. I'm not doing that. But based on conversations I had, it was Vince McMahon who really wanted to present some of the most controversial. material. All of this obviously before the Janelle Grant

situation and resigning and all that. This is going back four or five years ago, some of the conversations that were communicated to me that took place between Vince and the producers were mind boggling. Why would you talk about that? Dark stuff from his childhood.

But Vince was that guy that was like, fuck it. If I'm going to tell you, if people want to know what I'm about, they're going to find out. He had that part of his character. I don't know, man. It's just going to be fascinating to watch. I can't wait to review him. The rumor in innuendo is that all six episodes are going to drop at the exact same time.

So as a reminder, Eric Bischoff and I are going to be breaking down each and every episode at 83weeks.com. And we're going to do one episode per day. We're not going to watch all six and then give you our take. We're going to do one episode on the 25th, another on the 27th. the 27th, the 28th, you get where we're going. We're going to do one per day, and we're going to be live, and we're going to be taking your questions, and we're going to be breaking down each episode. We'll probably have some guests.

It's all happening at 83weeks.com. It's totally free. I want you to go right now, hit the subscribe button, turn on your notifications bell, and join us as we all break down and sort of navigate and sift through what the heck this thing looks like. But where I was getting a minute ago with me being the mortgage guy, Eric, I have to deal with underwriting. And anybody who's ever been through the insurance process or the mortgage process, the home buying process, we all get a little skittish when

we hear that word, the underwriter. I mean, ultimately, that's sort of the judge and jury and executioner as to whether or not this thing is approved and can move forward. So sometimes if someone had a blemish, maybe they had a hiccup, maybe they had to file bankruptcy, maybe they were laid on a credit card, maybe they had a car repossessed. They had something that makes them look like, hey, is this person a credit risk? In the mortgage business, they would ask that person to write what's known as a letter of explanation. And here's always the strategy I give to our borrowers, our families who are trying to buy a home, who have had some struggles in the past. Here's how you structure that letter, Mr. Barrower. Here was what happened. Here's why it

happened. Here's why it won't happen again. And I think that's probably what this documentary series is going to have to wind up being from a WWE perspective. Now, to be clear, as far as I understand, they don't have any creative control. But I do think that on the other side of this, if there is a lot of negative, bad, vent stuff, they can, W.W.E.

can just pivot and paint the picture of, hey, we had a problem. He's not here anymore. So it won't be a problem moving forward. I think that we can all sort of see the writing on the wall, that that's the way it has to be positioned. But is there

going to be other collateral damage along the way. There's rumor in innuendo that there are Paterson allegations in here. I don't know what to expect, but I know that I can't wait to see it. And I've got friends in the wrestling space who say, they're not going to watch it at all, ever. And just that is a head scratcher to me. We want you to watch it with us at 83weeks.com. We're going to go live every day, six days in a row, and break it down. this might be the most anticipated documentary or film or whatever in the history of wrestling, I think.

I mean, more than beyond the map, more than wrestling with shadows. I think there's more interest and intrigue and going to be way more attention on this than anything in wrestling before. You know, I'm just thinking about the legal implications. I just, as you were speaking, I realized that there's still an SEC investigation taking place. Yes. There is a major lawsuit taking place. I mean, the ramifications of this go beyond the PR component for WWE. This is why it's so confusing to me.

It's really confusing to me. Why now? I can see, you know, putting on ice and maybe a year from now, after the dust settles and, you know, things are solidified even more than they have with TKO and WWE. I mean, they look freaking rocks. solid, right? But, you know, time heals all wounds, and maybe the appetite will be a little different for this a year from now or two years from now, but why now? Why in the middle of the SEC investigation? Why in the middle of the Janelle Grant thing? Why now? Now, maybe they didn't

have a lot of control over it, but it's Netflix. They've got a $5 billion relationship day, meaning WWE and Ari Emanuel, who's, if not the most powerful person in Hollywood, shares the title with somebody else. Why? We'll find out. Maybe it'll be clear. You know, we've heard that there's over 200 hours of interviews done here, and they're going to whittle it down to like six.

So it makes me wonder what wound up on the cutting room floor. Well, it concerns me as I saw a clip of myself in here, and I didn't do an interview for this. So it makes me wonder, did the producers have access to, the archive. Oh, they 100% did. You know, they can get a comment from Hall Cogan talking about Vince McMahon or Eric Bischoff talking because when I got the phone call to do this, I passed.

I had heard what it was and was not interested in participating. But yet, there I am. So it'll be interesting to see what I say. You know, listen, you and I've never talked about this and I'm going to tread carefully here and I'm going to try to speak in code. And I know that's not fair to our audience. but you sort of said, hey, I had heard about this before and there were some things that

I couldn't believe Vince wanted out there. And he said, hey, you want to know why I am the way I am? Here it is. Here's who I am. It was one of those stories, a childhood story that was very dark. Okay. That's the same thing. I heard, if that's in this,

people are going to, yeah. I'm interested to see what's in the cutting room floor. I hope that some of that drips out. By the way, speaking of cutting, if you were born after 1970, there's a very good chance your first razor was a multi-blade razor. These razors have been the status quo for over a half century, but where's that gotten us? According to a recent study, two-thirds of men expect some irritation when they shave. But there's virtually no information on how to prevent irritation, only on how to treat it. Over two billion plastic razors enter the landfills each year here in the U.S. alone, and the razor-raiser-r-blade

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other razors, they notice a consistent lack of blade support. Basically, that the blades have too much bend or flex. Think of anything else you'd cut with like a kitchen knife or scissors. You wouldn't want the blade you're using to be moving. That's because you'd have to have. have less control. Well, Henson's razors are designed to hold the blade steady, so there's less bend and less wobble. Henson makes their razors with their aerospace grade machine shop in Canada. That's also made parts for the Mars rover and the International Space Station. Hanson's machinists are exceptional at manufacturing, and that level of precision is one of the big reasons their razor is so much gentler on your skin. They've made it to where the blade

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Eric and I are true believers. I've got one here. I've got one I travel with. I absolutely love it. I showed my barber this and they're all in. This is what they use professionally now for a living. It's that good. It's time to say no to subscriptions and yes to a razor that will last you a lifetime. Visit henson shaving.com slash Bischoff to pick the razor for you and use the code Bischoff and you'll get two years worth of blades free with your razor. Just be sure to add them to your cart. That's 100 free blades when you head over to H-E-N-S-H-A-V-N-G.com. Bischoff and enter the code Bischoff. Eric, we talked a lot about Chicago and how much fun we had. It was great. And we got to hang out.

That was awesome. You got to catch up with your buddy, Jason Hervey. Hadn't seen him in like seven years. It was awesome. We had some surprise guests. We played some games. We made some new friends. We had more laughs than we know what to do with.

But then you and I got together for something that I got to admit, I was filled with dread on. I didn't want to go. I hate this sort of thing. I wanted no part of it. But I was asked to attend and I felt obligated. And I made myself go through gritted teeth because I just hate everything about this sort of thing. But I wandered in there and I saw a bunch of friendly faces, and within 30 seconds, I realized this isn't a funeral. This is a true celebration of life for the late great Kevin Sullivan. We got together this past weekend in Tampa at what used to be Hogan's Beach. It was beautiful, overlooking the water, all his friends, all his family, so many great stories.

I don't know what I expected, but it exceeded all expectations, and I thought it was a fitting tribute to a great man, and I didn't want us to finish our show today without at least talking about Kevin Sullivan and the stories we heard this past week in Tampa. Yeah, I was, I was, I don't often go to funerals or services, a lot of the same reason. I'm a fairly emotional person, as you probably figured out, it's, it's hard for me. And sometimes it's chicken shit and it's selfish. But I don't want to take away from anybody else's moments by being weepy or just not feeling like celebrating. But I'm like you.

Garrett and I, my son Garrett went with me, obviously. And, you know, Garrett and Kevin and Garrett worked with Rick and so many of the other people that were there. Garrett has history with them too. And it was important that we both went. And like you, man, I started feeling pretty good until I got up to say a few words and I fell apart. But it was fun to see Kevin's friends having fun. And I stood out there, you know, there was this image that you posted just a few moments ago. There was a big picture of that, that picture of Kevin right before you walked into the area where we were getting together and having drinks and so forth speaking.

And I stood out there and stared at that picture for the longest time. It was a song playing. I can't remember what the song was, but I stared at that picture. Because that picture right there is such a good picture of Kevin. Now, that's what I remember Kevin looking like when I worked with him for years in WCW. And like, as I said or tried to say that day, I didn't get to know Kevin like a lot of the other people there that knew Kevin. because they knew Kevin when he was young and when Kevin was a wrestler

and they traveled with him and they worked against him and they have all kinds of different history. I didn't have that history with Kevin. The history I had was in the office and being one of those guys that I could rely on and depend on and he was such a honest

and loyal person. Those are the things that stand out to me the most about Kevin because I knew he'd tell me the truth. Whether it was, you know, an idea of mine or somebody else's, didn't have an agenda. Kevin wanted what was best for the business. It doesn't mean he was always right either. None of us ever are always right, ever, especially when it comes to

creative stuff. But his intentions were always right, whether the idea was or not. And I know that sounds simple, but it's hard to find people like that that are consistent. And Kevin was one of those guys. He had passion for the business, was loyal, honest. And he dug in hard for the things that believed in. And you can't ask for more from a partner than what Kevin Sullivan was able to provide to me. What a great man. It was so awesome to hear stories I'd never heard about Kevin and meet some of Kevin's friends. I'd never met. And man, what a turnout he had. You know, Rick Flair kicked things off. And I know you said some words. And Diamond Dallas Page spoke. Man. Oh, did he ever? Tony was great. Tony was awesome. Tony's the best.

Shout out to Dave Pinser and Joe Gomez, who helped organize the whole event. It was a very special celebration for Kevin Sullivan. And, you know, who cares now on some level, but on another level, I just want to be one of the first to say it here publicly. We got to get Kevin Sullivan in the WWE Hall of Fame next year. The idea that that guy's contributions to wrestling have been recognized in pretty much every other Hall of Fame there is, except WWEs, is crazy. I don't know that I should be sharing this, but I just want, before everybody starts to immediately jump on that and take it as a negative. I really do believe that if Vince McMahon had left WWE a decade ago, go, maybe there would have been an opportunity for Kevin Sullivan with WW, because I, for one, was shocked when they ran such a great tribute to Kevin Sullivan on WW programming.

Years ago, it would have just been a single graphic and the years, and that's it. We got a package sort of laying out exactly who Kevin Sullivan was and what his contributions to wrestling were, and I think Triple H deserves a lot of credit for that. and I'm probably speaking out of cool and betraying some confidences but I want to give WWE some credit they helped a lot with Kevin right there at the end I don't say anything more than that

but let me just say WWE has a lot of love for Kevin Sullivan so on some level what they've already done for Kevin and his family boy they answered the call in a way that you should be proud to be a WWE fan that being said

as silly as it is. We need to get his family on stage. We need him to be enthrined in that WWE Hall of Fame. I know it's not a physical place yet, but it will be one day. And Kevin Sullivan belongs with those greats. And I was just delighted to be able to spend the day. It's funny because the whole way there,

I'm like, I don't, I'm like you, Eric. I don't, even when I've had family members pass away, I'm not going over to the casket. I'm not, I'm not, that's not my thing. I don't want to be here. I don't want to think about it. I just want to remember them the way they were. I just don't do well with it.

So I'm just through gritted teeth driving to the airport like, I don't want to do this. I don't want to go. I don't want to do this. But man, when you're in there, that was just, that was a unique experience. And I was so glad I went. And I was so glad I had the experience and I heard it all. and I know right now Kevin Sullivan's putting together

one hell of a card upstairs, don't you think? Oh, there you go. And I guarantee you there's going to be heat and the finish. Real heat, too. Not that bullshit. Candy store heat. Like, real heat, brother. Real heat, brother.

I want to encourage everybody listening to this to tell your people you love them. You know, if you've missed a phone call from somebody and said, oh, I'll get back to them tomorrow. or, oh, I forgot to call them back. Make a few extra minutes and make the call. I think it's important in times like this to just hit the reset button and say, you know what, there's more to life than whatever these little silly stresses we all have in our life right now,

because Kevin lived one hell of a life. I'm glad that we got to know America, and I'm glad you got to work with him. And I'm so thankful that you guys did. I mean, you guys created magic together. And it's the damn name of this show, 83 weeks. On some level, the name of this show is a tribute to Kevin Sullivan. Absolutely right. I just hope that people respect that and appreciate that and understand that.

And, you know, this isn't popular, but I just want to throw it out there. When Kevin Sullivan passed away, I saw a lot of people making Crispin-Wan comments. Fuck you. Whatever you think of Kevin Sullivan, you don't know what happened. But we know that that dude killed his family. And I spent the week with Kevin Sullivan's family this week, and boy, they sure are going to miss their dad. Don't compare him to that man. And I know he booked an angle.

But guys, it's fucking wrestling. We're talking about real human beings. It would be a great disservice. I can't imagine being Kevin Sullivan's family, logging on the social media, and seeing all that nonsense. Don't be an asshole. Be a better person.

Step back from your wrestling fandom for just a minute. And remember, these are real human beings. Kevin Sullivan didn't kill his wife or his son. Chris Benoit did. And if you're making any parallels there, fuck you. Do better. Be better.

Kevin Sullivan was a great man. And you'll never find anybody who met Kevin. who would say differently. I know that his major television run ended in 2001, but boy, he continued to pursue his passion for wrestling and helping people. Think about all the people who came out after Kevin passed away. People you see on TV on Mondays, on Tuesdays, on Wednesdays, on Fridays, and thanked Kevin.

Not only that, the independence. Kevin wasn't just helping top guys. Kevin was helping people who were getting ready for their first match. Kevin was friends with fans. Kevin was friends with me. Before I had a podcast. Kevin was a genuinely great human being. And sure, we've all had our flaws and had our missteps.

But don't compare him to a murderer. Don't put a murderer in his conversation with his name. I don't mean to go hard there at the end, Derek. But that just annoyed me so much. And I even see it now. Like, dude, that was wrestling. What are you talking about? It's silly and it's unfair.

and Kevin deserves better and I hope that everybody listening to this will go watch some of Kevin Sullivan stuff and I'm not just talking about those series of matches with that guy I'm talking about the Florida stuff I'm talking about the fun, silly dungeon of doom stuff Kevin was laughing at that as much

as we were I mean he just was he had a lot of fun and he helped a lot of people and I'm glad we got to celebrate him one last time this week here me too brother me too so long everybody know we were going to talk about Eric's last month in wrestling or in WCW.

We do that next time. By God, we went over two hours without it. We will talk about it next week, Eric's last month, Fall Brawl, 1999, right before he went fly fishing and his now forever home. We'll do it next week, right here on 83 weeks.com. Have I told you what I'm helping people with in my real life? Yeah, I'm helping them save money over at saved with Conrad.com. If you haven't already, what are you waiting for?

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