83 Weeks with Eric Bischoff - Episode 414: What If? Vince vs Triple H

Episode Date: February 20, 2026

This episode is presented by Chime, Chime is not just smarter banking, it is the most rewarding way to bank. It just takes a few minutes to sign up. Head to http://chime.com/83WEEKS  On this episode of 83 Weeks, Eric Bischoff and host Conrad Thompson dive into the headlines shaping the business of professional wrestling. Eric shines a spotlight on the often overlooked creative forces behind the scenes, discussing how Kerwin Silfies helped craft some of WWE's most iconic looks and production moments and why great television presentation is just as important as what happens in the ring. The conversation turns to the elephant in the room: if Vince McMahon were cleared in court, could he realistically return to WWE? And would fans actually embrace a hypothetical power struggle storyline between Vince and Triple H? Bischoff also tackles the narrative around WWE ticket sales, explaining why the numbers don't tell the doom-and-gloom story some critics suggest. Plus, the guys explore the global box-office potential of Logan Paul vs. Bad Bunny a crossover spectacle that could transcend wrestling entirely. It's big business, bold opinions, and unfiltered analysis only on 83 Weeks. BUTCHER BOX - As an exclusive offer, new listeners can get their choice between organic ground beef, chicken breast or ground turkey in every box for a year, PLUS $20 off when you go to http://ButcherBox.com/83WEEKS   CHIME - Chime is not just smarter banking, it is the most rewarding way to bank. Join the millions who are already banking fee free today. It just takes a few minutes to sign up. Head to http://Chime.com/83WEEKS  POLICYGENIUS - Head to http://policygenius.com/83WEEKS  to compare life insurance quotes from top companies and see how much you could save. BLUECHEW - Get 10% off your first month of BlueChew Gold with code 83WEEKS at http://BlueChew.com  THE PERFECT JEAN - F*%k your khakis and get The Perfect Jean 15% off with the code 83WEEKS15 at https://theperfectjean.nyc/83WEEKS15 #theperfectjeanpod HARRY'S PLUS - Get the Harry's Plus Trial Set for only $10 at https://harrys.com/83WEEKS #Harryspod MARS MEN - Get 50% off FOR LIFE, Free Shipping AND 3 Free Gifts at Mars Men at http://Mengotomars.com  SAVE WITH CONRAD - Stop throwing money away by paying those high interest rates on your credit card. Roll them into one low monthly payment and on top of that, skip your next two house payments. Go to https://www.savewithconrad.com  to learn more.

This episode is presented by Chime. Chime is not just smarter banking. It's the most rewarding way to bank. It just takes a few minutes to sign up. Head to chime.com slash 83 weeks. That's chime.com slash 83 weeks. Hey, hey, it's Conrad, the mortgage guy, and you're listening to 83 weeks with Eric fish off. Eric, what's going on, man? How are you? Yeah, everybody. I'm doing great, man. I'm having a wonderful. It's a frigid five degrees out, but the sun is shining and the wind's not blowing. So it's actually a nice spring day here in Wyoming.

And we're getting a different look. I love that we're getting a live look into the Bischoff compound. If you're not already, you should go check it out at 83 weeks.com. I can't wait to pick your brain. There's so much news and so much stuff to talk about. We do have a piece of sad news that we're going to talk about. But first, I wanted to start with some good news. And before we clicked record, you told me some news that, boy, I haven't

seen reported anywhere online. It's about the next real American freestyle event. Tell everybody, remind everybody when and where the next event is and why they better get tickets now. Yeah, Saturday the 28th, we're going to be in Tempe, Arizona, at Molder Arena. And I think, man, we're within a couple hundred tickets to sell it out. So very, very proud of that. You know, we've been doing pretty well since the very first show. We've probably been averaging between four, 5,500 people. But, you know, this is going to be a complete sellout predicted here. I think I predicted it last week, actually.

But I'm feeling more confident this week because I know the, you know, the internet wrestling community would love to, you know, rip me to shreds if they could. And they can, but not this time. But yeah, we're really excited about it. It's going to be a great car. It's going to be an amazing card, which is why it's probably selling out. But things are going so well at Real American FreeZell. I'm just generally excited about it.

It's fun. I want to encourage you to go out of your way to, check out the card over at Real American Freestyle. I, for one, am excited because once upon a time, I was a big WEC fan, and the star of that MMA promotion way back when was your Raya Faber. And you've got Raya Faber in the main event against Henry. I mean, you want to talk about two prime time athletes. Here it is in the lightweight division.

But if you're an old school UFC guy or MMA guy, you can't help but notice some of the names on the undercard as well. As I scroll through, I see Chad Mendez, Benson Henderson, uh, Gordon Oliver, Clay Guida. Like, there's a lot of names that I recognize just for my MMA fandom. And of course, you've got, like, if you're a long time, Real American freestyle viewer, Bubba Jenkins, who was once in the cans, now he's inside the ring. This is going to be fun.

You know, Bubba's in there against David Carr. David Carr's our chairman. David Carr is smooth as silk. And he's a fun, entertaining guy to watch. I fell in love with David Carr. I think it was his first real American freestyle event, man, he got it right off the bat. He came out wearing a crown, had a cape on, and he was there to entertain. And when he stepped out on the mat, you realize why he's as good as he is, man.

He's a fourth generation freestyle wrestling. I don't want to say prodigy, but he's such an amazing athlete on the mat, but he's a big personality. Now, he's, this is going to be a fun one to watch. This is going to be a fun one to what? We had a great card. And, you know, you talk about, we've got a lot of the UFC guys and former MMA guys, and that's always fun.

We love the crossover matches. But for the audience, it really loves freestyle wrestling. And believe me, there's a lot more out there than people ever thought there was because they're all coming over to Fox Nation. Or as a recently prime, Amazon Prime, you can find us over at Fox Nation there as well. We've got a great youth audience. You got a young wrestle like Bo Bartlett, you know, unbelievable young, just fantastic athlete at such a young age.

We got a young lady that is, she's still in high school, but she's competing at the world as an amateur. Oh, wow. You've got the very best of freestyle wrestling if you're just that purest, but you've also got that crossover, you know, they were all freestyle wrestlers at one point or grapplers at one point, and then they went out to MMA, and now they're coming back. back to what got them to the dance. So check us out at Fox Nation, Amazon Prime or show up. A couple hundred tickets left in Tampa, Arizona, 28.

It's super exciting, man, to see, yeah, as I'm scrolling through, you can see all the sort of tail of the tape. I encourage everybody, go check it out at Real American Freestyle. You've got an 18-year-old lady here. Everest, that's who you're talking about, right? Still in college? Man, my goodness. And if you look at a record, it's, it's unbelievable. the things that this young lady has accomplished. It's,

it's, it's fun. It's really fun. They're a great group of athletes and they've got big personalities. Yeah, 78 and nine overall as of August of 2022, but she is the 2025 under 20 world champion. Some of the best stars,

biggest and best talent around all at Real American Freestyle. I think maybe the best value around, you know, you can not only watch the most current, the up to date, Real American Freestyle, which is next weekend. But you can also see all the old ones on the Fox Nation app.

And it's just a few bucks a month. I think it's like four or five dollars. Go check it out. It's a Fox Nation, the home of Real American Freestyle. So it's a quick and easy app. I signed up. You will be glad you did too. Eric,

I tease sort of some bad news, man, and I hate starting on a downer, but I was really encouraged. You and I are recording on a Thursday afternoon. And last night, to the shock of many, myself included, AEW, specifically want to give a shout out to Ryan. Danielson and Tony Chivani and Excalibur. They did such a fantastic tribute to one of the unsung heroes of WWE, which I thought was a really,

really classy move. And it's a guy that I know you have spent some time with. I'm talking, of course, about Kerwin Silfis. You know, he had been with the company since around WrestleMania 1. And he was a guy that seemingly everybody who at one point or another worked with with W.E had some interaction with. And I think it's a shame that we don't get enough conversation about some of the, these really, really valuable contributors behind the scenes.

So I wanted to take just a minute and allow you the opportunity to talk a little bit about Kerwin Silfis and what his contribution to wrestling may have been, even though a lot of fans may not be familiar with it. Yeah, I got to work with Kerwin for a number of years when I was in WWE the first time around as a talent, less so for my four months did as an executive. But in that time, I got to work with Kerwin and be around him. super, super talented, incredibly understatedly so. I think he was a sleeping giant in many ways.

Herman, my experience only, and I didn't know him as well as many others that you can talk to, just my read was he wasn't the kind of person that was going to fight for something he believed in. He would, to a point. I think Kerwin was probably responsible for. for a lot more of the look and the feel, in the vibe of, especially early WWE, and he really gets credit for it. Now, I say that, I wasn't there, obviously, but when I first brought Gene O'KLen into WCW,

now keep in mind, Gene and I had an almost instant relationship and trust and friendship, the minute Gene walked through the door, even though I had never met him before, but we both came from Vergaena. Gene at that time was a Minnesota guy. And I think Gene understood, you know, what I went through working for Vern. So we instantly bonded, right, over Verde.

And in those early conversations, one of the things that Gene would always talk about, you know, you'd always talk about how much. And, no, don't get me wrong, Gene wouldn't do this in a negative way, but it would all have, especially early on as I got more control, I was like constantly telling me how WWE did it so much better. But he did it with an honest intention. He was pushing us, not just me, but us, to improve the production values of the show. Because Gene was a TV guy at heart.

He was obviously one of the best, if not the best announcer in that kind of a role in our lifetimes, or maybe anybody else's in the future for that matter. but in his core he was a production guy and he understood it really, really well. And whenever he would talk about how great everything was at WWE from a production point of view, Kerwin's name was in the conversation. Not Kevin Dunn's. Kevin Dunn was to a degree. But more often than not, it was Kirwin Sophies.

And then, of course, I got to work with Kerwin later on and I could see what Gene saw. very, very smart, very talented guy. He had great feel in an instinct. He just wasn't that guy that's going to fight his way to the top. But he could have been easily at any given moment, which is probably why he had such a long career there. Because anybody that everybody that really needed to know knew that, you know, in case of fire, break glass, take out curb with selfies and you won't skip a beat.

I wish we could spend more time celebrating folks behind the scenes like this. I think it's a shame that we don't really talk about them until they passed away. But shout out to Kerwin Silfis and everybody who was friends with him and certainly his family. What a major contributor for such a long freaking time to. Long time to be in that business. And listen, I know, you know, at different points and I know, you know, it gets miscategorized a lot of times in my opinion. You've been critical of AEW, but them allowing Tony and Danielson to go out of their way to talk about Kerwin, I thought was a really nice gesture.

And it made me think about when famously, Gorilla Monsoon passed away. And Bobby the Brain Heenan was allowed to talk about it on Nitro. That was a really cool moment. Did you know that the monsoon, I don't know, farewell was going to happen on Nitro? I can't imagine that's something you would have had a problem with.

No, no. No. Look, I've always, there are times, you know, when it's real and it's not business. It's just real. I think it's,

I think it adds humanity to what we do. You know, I mean, you're producing professional wrestling for crying out loud. In the minds of many people, it is probably anti-humanity. I mean, it's choreographed cartoon-level violence in some cases, right? What does it serve as far as humanity is concerned other than, you know, entertainment? But there are times within that show is inhumane as some people may have. feel it is. There are moments that are real.

And those moments sometimes take out more value and more weight because you don't see them that often. And you know that they're genuine. And that's why everybody feels good about it as well they should. Glad it happened. Let's talk a little bit about the news of the week. And I hope that everybody will continue to try to keep Kerwin in their thoughts and prayers. I mean, obviously he had it.

incredible run with WWE and hopefully he lived a full and happy life, but, uh, it's never the news you want to hear when somebody has passed away like that. But I do want to say, I thought it was really nice that Tony Cohen and, and, and, and, and the crew was afforded the opportunity to, uh, to shout out Kerwin. I thought that was a really cool thing for Brian Danielson and Tony Shavani to do. Let's, uh, before we talk about the news, let's talk about butcher box. I'm pretty fired up about this. I, I just got my box of meat this week. And I can't tell you how it.

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in every box for an entire year, plus $20 off your first box, and free shipping as always. That's butcherbox.com slash 83 weeks. Don't forget to use our link so they know we sent you. I'm pretty fired up about it. Megan and I have been rocking butcher box for a while and we've always just rocked the steak. But with this new promotion, we got the ground beef. And I don't know that you know this about Megan, but ground beef might

actually be her favorite thing, especially when she's doing bodybuilding shows, man, she just uses it all the time. And so she made herself some the other day and she said, oh, God, this is the best. You got to try it. And so I had some. And I'm like, uh, yeah, we got to do that again. So she's made dishes all week with ground beef. And the idea that they're just hooking you up and throwing it in every box for a year. It's a great deal. I'll go right now, butcherbox.com slash 83 weeks. So, hey, listen, man, let's talk about some news. This is kind of big news.

And I guess they're going hand in hand here. Johnny Ace is making a public appearance. And we have not seen hide nor hair from Johnny Ace, the real life John Laurinitis in quite a while. Of course, he was named in a civil lawsuit in January of 2024. So just over two years ago. And I know you and I saw him at, at Hulk Hogan's funeral, but that's the first time I've seen him in forever.

And it just felt like he sort of stayed out of the line light. He's advertised for an appearance about a month from now. I think he's in Chilicothe, Ohio, but it's an autograph signing. A lot of legends are going to be there. And he got suited up and put on a suit and tie to promote. I guess he's going to be there as the Smackdown General Manager or Raw General Manager or what have you. I was interested to see that he's getting out there and making some appearances.

And of course, in reality, I know that. that there's a lot of people who feel a certain way about Johnny Ace, and I'm not here to change that. But I just want to remind everybody that he was never charged criminally. And he was named in a civil suit, but all those charges have been dropped. But this has been a talking point of conversation now of should he or shouldn't he and all that. And I'm like, hey, wait a minute. Remember how we feel about the guy.

I don't think he has any legal issues and he wasn't charged with anything criminally. What's to stop him from trying to make a living? Where do you land on this, Eric? This is a tough one, but I'm just going to be honest. First of all, I don't judge anybody. I get enough stupid shit I did in my life. You know, I'm not in any position to judge anybody. Everybody's got to make up their own minds about how they feel.

I'm not trying to influence anybody. People make mistakes. Johnny put himself in the position Johnny was in. And let's face it, it is what it is. It's an ugly situation no matter how. how you look at it. There's no right, there's no justification. There's no, it happened. He's a human being. He made a choice. The choice was a bad choice. And he's going to, he is, has, and we'll probably continue to bear responsibility for that in ways that none of us will

probably understand. That's his burden. As someone who's known Johnny for a long time and considered him a friend and still do despite what he did or is alleged to have done. Do I hang out with Johnny? No. Am I going to go out and promote for Johnny? No, because of what he did. Well, I'm not going to judge him. I do choose who I associate with.

And while I'll always pick up the phone, if Johnny calls and have a conversation, Johnny's decision to go out and do what Johnny's about to do is a brave one because he's going to face it. There's going to be people that are going to be excited to see him and they should be. He's a name. He's a legend for reasons good and bad, I guess. But it is what it is. And I, you know, John's got to get on with his life. And he made this decision.

Let's see what happens. I wish him the best. I do too. I don't know what to expect, but I believe that, you know, America's largely built on second chances. And there's sort of been, I don't know, it feels arbitrary at times based on who gets a second chance

and who doesn't get a second chance on the court of public opinion. But if he wants to get out there and make some public appearances and sort of face the music, I say, Hey man, more power to you. Go do what your gut tells you and figure it out. I hate to even get sucked into this kind of thing because no matter what we say, it's going to create the kind of division and hate and bullshit.

that the internet wrestling community thrives on in their epic fucking stupidity. So it's going to come probably because I said something a certain way here. And I don't feel like that should be necessary for anybody. We saw it, you know, recently with somebody else. It's like, you know, I don't want to dive in a pool. I don't judge Johnny. I wish other people wouldn't judge other people. You know, we're all guilty of a lot of shit.

If we're really, really honest with ourselves, we're also guilty of some pretty nasty stuff. We wish we weren't guilty. But we were. We move on and you learn and you grow. But try to remember not to judge other people along the way because it's, yeah, a little hypocritical. Well said, Eric. Well said. Let's talk a little bit about the lawsuit that I think a lot of people still think Johnny is

actively involved in, but Johnny has been dropped of any civil litigation. He was once a defendant. He is not a plaintiff or a defendant. He is not involved. But the famous lawsuit from January 2024 has taken a turn. There's been a lot of postings about this that I suppose, well, here's the report. Grant McMahon and WWE have agreed to June for the arbitration hearing. And then there's the joint notice that was filed on February 6th. And as this, they're saying that, you know, they have some deadlines. April 1st is going to be a deadline for the plaintiff's opposition to the motions to compel arbitration.

And April 13th will be the deadline for the defendant's optional replies in support of their motion to compel arbitration. And the idea is they will agree to propose a date in June of this year, 2026, for oral arguments on the defendant's motion to compel arbitration. So yeah, at some point in June, it feels like this thing is headed for arbitration, which I think is probably what Vince and WWE expected from the very beginning. I don't pretend to know all the ends and outs of this case, but my understanding is if there was an NDA done, that it probably had an arbitration clause in there.

That's typically standard practice. And I could be wrong. I don't follow this that closely kind of around, but I seem to recall that WWE was petitioning for this to go down. arbitration. It's what they wanted originally. I believe Vince McMahon and WWE both wanted this to go to arbitration. Right. And so the idea that it is headed that way does make me wonder, hey, that's got to be a good thing if you're WWE or if you're Vince. It feels like it's one step closer to having some sort of, boy, I hate the way this sounds, but a happy ending for everyone

involved. Like, look, it's happy ending. I don't think that's going to happen no matter what. in any context. But let's also keep in mind, again, public opinion being what public opinion is, this is still, this comes down to, forget about the poor judgment. That's a separate issue. Right. It's still justifying the judgment regardless of everybody's consent or not. The judgment part of this was so twisted up.

It's ridiculous. But in terms of, you know, right and wrong? it's still an argument. And we don't know all the facts. None of us were there. So let's see where this plays out. But I'm like you, I'm thinking, you know, arbitration means no jury. Jury means no attorneys getting to do what attorneys are so good at doing to sway a jury.

They're not even going to get that opportunity if this goes to arbitration. So again, I'm not a lawyer. I'm not trying to sound smarter than I am. But if it was me, I would think I'm going to be better off with a judge than I am with a jury. So I'm guessing this is probably a win from a legal perspective. It feels like to me, you know, as we say when, that's kind of what I meant is I feel like we can reach a happy medium here. Maybe that's the right way to say it. You know, I don't pretend to know what the financial demands of the lawsuit would have been.

I don't know that that was ever laid out publicly. But it does feel like if it's arbitration, hey, we're going to, we're going to come to some sort mutual agreement here and somebody's going to write a check. Maybe not as big as they originally were expected to, but somebody's going to write a check and then everybody's going to sign off and hopefully put this in the rearview mirror. So let's assume, because we are making an assumption here. And by the way, nobody will ever know what really happened, which is fine. Which is what I imagine Vince and WWV wanted all along is, hey, let's write a check that we can

stomach and put this in the rearview mirror and move on. That's logical. That's the way these sort of things are supposed to go. But I'm asking all that to say, let's fast forward now. Let's pretend that arbitration is complete. We're into, we'll call it July of this year. With this in the rearview mirror, do you think it changes anything for the standing of Vince McMahon in WWE? Specifically, does it create an opportunity? Does it open a crack in a door for Vince to return in some former fashion to WWV or will we see something else? That way of knowing for sure, because I'm not close enough to the inside to get any kind of a read. I think the door's already being cracked, tree crack, if you will.

I think it has been since last WrestleMania. in very subtle ways so that if this thing goes, I'm just really thinking, I'm just imagining, but if this does go to arbitration and therefore nobody will ever know, it's gone, it's over, it's done, NDA's blah, blah, blah. At that point, I think after a certain amount of time, do I see him in the Hall Fame? Maybe. That's a big step, first step. But, you know, from a PR management, you know, crisis management, whatever you want to call it,

seems to me like there would be a kind of a slow role of reintroduction. It wouldn't happen all at once. So maybe WrestleMania would be too soon. But between now and WrestleMania, or I'm sorry, you'd be talking about the following WrestleMania. It depends on the timing. Yeah, that could happen. I was thinking about, you know, arbitration being over soon.

It's not. We're talking about a year from now. And in a year from now, it could happen. And this could be, with that behind him, whatever the plan may be to ultimately bring Vince back, that's when you'll see it start to accelerate. You know, allegedly, there were messages that were released that, that basically laid out that, hey, Vince is going to get this behind him and then, you know, he'll come back.

And I don't know how much of that is real and how much of that is viable and how much of that has changed. Let me ask because that's okay, that's some heavy shit to throw out there. That's like chumming the water of the internet wrestling community. Let's talk about those messages that have been revealed. When were they? What was the timeline on that? Before Vince step down. Okay.

So we're talking about years ago. Yeah. So let's just make that clear. So it's not like something that just recently was on. Oh, no, no, not at all. No, that's what I'm saying is. I don't know. Listen, so much has changed in the last four years, not just in WVE, but just in the world,

that there's no telling how this really shakes out. I mean, I think this was all 2022 when all of this hypothetical discussion first started. I know the lawsuit didn't follow until January of 2024, but the allegations and rumors and innuendo and all that, I believe it was like the summer of 2022. So it's years old. and plans change pal we know that so i'm not throwing any accusations i'm just i'm curious when you were sort of laying out russomania and you laid out hall of fame you didn't really finish the thought were you suggesting that if vince is cleared of this and let's say july of

this year that he would go into the hall of fame for wb next year i think what i was not about hall of fame but more about involvement day to day with w oh no no no and i was just talking about involvement, you know, acknowledgement, you know, a presence in one way, shape, or form running day today? No. No. That's, I'm not buying into that for a second. Well, I know that you're not buying into it.

And if I'm honest with you, I'm not buying into it either. But do we think Vince is? I guess what I'm trying to get to is I don't know Vince. You know Vince better than I do. And I'm not suggesting you know him real well. But I am just saying, do you think on some level Vince has at the back of his mind, hey, when I get this behind me, I'm coming back in. Do you think that exists or does he feel like, hey, that door's closed.

He can't go back no matter what. So are we painting a picture? Not trying to paint a picture, but are we maybe kind of sort of thinking about painting a picture that would suggest that Vincent would kind of come in an aggressive manner, try to find a way to force his way in to control at WW. Well, well, I guess what I'm suggesting is if he was put on the sidelines, basically, because I think he did it on his own. I mean, that's the narrative that we want to put out there that he stepped down.

But I think he may have stepped down thinking he could put this behind him. And all I can think about is at different times, you know, when guys like Paterson had allegations, he would step down. And when those allegations would go away, he would return. So I'm wondering, do you think, because like even, you know, when anybody had a legal problem, years ago when Lawler had a legal problem, he comes off TV, he clears up the legal problem, he comes back. That's kind of been a pattern in wrestling.

for a long time. Hey, once you've cleared your name, you can come back. Do you think Vince has that in the back of his mind? Or does he feel like, hey, man, there's been battle lines drawn and I'm not wanted back. I can't go back. Or do you think he'll challenge that? I can't see it. I mean, I understand why you're asking the question. And I do agree with you. I think if this would have been 20 years ago, absolutely, I'd polymarket, you know, Vince on this one coming back, forcing his way in one way, shape, or form. But the, the, Business has changed so much. Right.

And the, the, the, the publicly owned aspect of it, shareholders, the drama that that would create, the uncertainty within the shareholders, what's going to happen to WWE if Vince forces his way in. I mean, just think about that. That's, that's, that's, your institutional investors would just, they'd run from that. Well, hang on, let me ask you that. I appreciate that thought. But the reason I'm bringing this up is, and again, we don't know how it's going to shake out.

But as we sit here today and we'll call it mid-February, there's lots of conversation about, oh, WrestleMania ticket sales are down. You know, they've only sold 37,000 tickets each night, which is phenomenal. But based on the number of tickets sold last year, it's not as good. And they've blocked out a lot of Las Vegas, which was not the case last year. So I do think WWE is battling the optics, if nothing else, that they don't have the momentum they had last year, that maybe they've lost a step. Listen, I'm going to agree with you. The optics aren't good, but those optics really only matter to a certain group of people.

That's fair. The optics are cheap, low-hanging fruit entertainment for the Internet. That's the community that cares about those optics. Nobody else does. And I say that because, you know, comparing this year's ticket sales to last year's ticket sales, which was a fucking record shattering amount of money. Yes, all time. Unbelievable.

So the fact that they're not quite on pace to beat, to meet or beat that record again, it's a pretty high expectation. And because we talked about this last week, I won't beat it up. Because I think there's two expectations, one in the real world and one of the wrestling, internet wrestling community where those optics matter. Yeah, it's something to talk about. It's interesting. And there's probably intelligent, interesting conversations that you can have

from both sides of the equation. But none of it matters. What matters is the revenue. And I don't think there's any way to connect. Vince McMahon hovering over here in the fog in the mist with a cloak and maybe a dagger, we're not sure. He's hanging out over here and then you've got, ooh, the optics in the internet wrestling community,

which provides maybe some vulnerability where the cloak and dagger, Vince McMahon, could come out of the shadows and reemerge. That's the story that's kind of shaping here in this narrative. And I don't see it. I don't see it for a lot of reasons. I don't even think Vince sees it because I'll be honest with you. I do not know Vince McMahon at all. I'm acquainted with him.

that's as far as I would that's as far as I would go with it. Even Vince has to realize physically he can't keep up he just can't he knows it the public isn't as aware of it probably but I'm guessing

it's a little harder for Vince to get around based on pictures I've seen and in back braces and so forth it doesn't get better with age folks it just doesn't right Um, even for someone like Vince McMahon who's really not that human when it comes of being physical, he's amazing in that respect, but even he is vulnerable when it comes

to your back and your hips. And that's what I see. And that job is the, no, I don't see it. Vince has got to know that. But if it was 20 years ago, I could see it. Not now. I can totally see that this is going to be the chatter though. You know, there's already, um, a.

a groundswell online on social media of fans who are saying bring back vents i'm tired of this you know people are frustrated and there is um i don't know i've seen it called triple h fatigue before recently online and i know that wrestling fans by and large we're a bunch of mouth contents we want what you're not giving us you know push new stars oh who are these new guys bring that's so true what you just said is so true it has been consistent for decades. Yes. It's absolutely true. I love that you said it. Well, I mean, it's the quiet part out loud, but it's true. I mean, the reality is we're a lot of armchair bookers and, and we would like to see what we don't have. And when we get something, hey, we wanted it sooner. We didn't

get it as fast as we wanted it. And I get that. But I feel like there will be a narrative out there that if this WrestleMania doesn't exceed last year, because there's probably a new set of expectations, I imagine that for them to go back to Las Vegas and pivot from New Orleans. And again, I have no inside information that it had to be a racehorse good deal. And I hope it is. But if that was the case and they got some sort of a racehorse good deal, realistically, where does that leave the pressure for them to do something or not do something in a corporate level with events? And I'm not suggesting for a second that the actual decision makers or powers that be are going to do that.

But I think there's a lot of online sleuths. who were going to say oh, WrestleMania was down and Vince is clear. And it feels like that online will continue to beat that drum of bring Vince back. But I'm like you. I don't see him coming back in a full-time capacity. Him being friendly and being acknowledged on air and going in the Hall of Fame and all of that sort of thing I do.

But it's hard for me to imagine him coming back and not having total control. That doesn't feel very. From a storyline point of you, can you imagine a fun we could have with this? Oh, I mean, it's what everybody wants. You got the evil Vince team coming and kind of like, you know, that was a chance to really, you know, do the NWO thing,

but really fucking do it, right? You got Shane over here. Come on, we've seen a lot more Vincent Shane lately. Yeah. I think that whole thing's a little more interesting now storyline-wise than it would have been a couple years ago or was, actually. You got this cat named Eric Bischoff over here. He's, you got a couple months with a value out of

that part of the story. Vince could put together his evil team of Vince supporters. He's got, in fact, he wouldn't even need me. He's got enough, he's got enough. There's enough people out there that, that, that could make that story really fun and interesting. Would the audience accepted? I don't know. Might be a little too soon. But just for a fun, you know, over a couple beers at a piece of pizza. It's a fun idea to talk about. You know, what else makes it fun is, And again, we don't know. I don't pretend to know. I think I've met Shane McMahon three times in my life.

We've never had a real conversation. No experience whatsoever with Shane. But guys like Jonathan Coachman will go on his podcast with Vince Russo would pretty much say, oh yeah, Shane McMahon hates Triple-A. They don't get along at all in real life. They hate each other. And I'm like, I don't know if that's real or not. But as a fan, boy, it would make an interesting story if that were true.

And then you see like earlier this week, Seth Rollins was on Shannon Sharp's podcast, club shay-shay. And I think it was on this podcast where he talked about using triple H's finishing maneuver of the pedigree. And he said he knew if he asked triple H if he could use it, Triple H would say no. So he intentionally bypassed asking Triple H and he went to ask Vince because he knew, oh, here it is right here. I was like, if I asked Triple H, I can use the, if I can use the pedigree, I feel like he's going to say no. He was the only person who has ever used it. So I was like, here's what I'll do. I'll ask Vince about it. And I know Vince will say yes just to spite Triple H.

H can't say nothing about it. It was a good idea. I was a bad guy. Hunter was my mentor. I was his protege. He wasn't wrestling. I was like, it's a good way to carry on the legacy of the move.

Vince okayed it. Whether he did it because he liked it or just to take a shot at his son-in-law, I don't know. But either way, it worked. And when stuff like this comes out, I'm like, man, this would be the ultimate storyline, Vince versus Triple H,

because so many fans, we want to believe that, whether it's true or not, it doesn't even matter. Here's the beauty of it. Because we talk about these things like they're in the now, right? Yeah. We're talking about a relationship between Vince and Triple H that has probably evolved quite a bit over the course of whatever it's been, 25, 35 years, whatever.

Yes. Right? I am absolutely sure there were times when, just like members of my family. throughout my life where there was heat, right? And then he figured out and you move on and it's no longer there. So when Jonathan Coachman says, you know, the things that Jonathan says, I, you know, I like Jonathan a lot and he, a stand-up guy, nothing but respect for him and I believe him when he says it.

But he's talking about that moment in time. That's right. He's not talking about now. So what I'm saying in a long-winded way is all of this backstory that we know of, much of it probably was true at the time. And there was enough of it out there that you can start aggregating some of those stories and moments with the people that are still there in part and central to a new story. And you could make that so easily a part of your backstory.

And it's all believable. And it's there. It's real. It's as close to being real as real can get from a storyline perspective in professional wrestling. Can it get more real in a ring? Yes, obviously. get too real and rig. But in terms of a story, there was enough reality in this story that you could add to and take, you know, creative, enough creative liberty to weave an

amazing story that would almost feel like a documentary. It would be funny, but it would be fun to watch it come together. I mean, imagine that season of unreal. I mean, that would be one we would all be watching. It would be appointment television. It could find a, you get an Emmy. It's amazing. Now, will it happen? And will it not? I would say probably not. But boy, what a storyline it would be.

It's funny. Probably not. You don't think? No. No. But you know, never say never. You know,

they've got so many, so many platforms to keep full. Yeah. And they're venturing off into other formats beyond, you know, the four corners of an arena, so to speak. So maybe,

I don't know. It all depends how everybody gets along when this is all over. and, you know, how the audience reacts to any kind of an introduction to Vince McMahon and how that process is managed. I'm going to go on record to say continue to be managed because I think we're already there in many respects, some respects, very subtle. So, yeah, let's just wait and see. Hopefully somebody's listening to this show.

I heard Eric and Conrad talking to it. They both sound like they're talking out of their ass, but they did have one idea that sounded kind of interesting. that'd be good. Even if it doesn't happen as a storyline, if Vince is back in the fold and WWs got their own podcast network now with fanatics, sign me up for Undertaker and Vince to shoot in the shit for two hours.

Sign me up for Cody and Vince shooting the shit or Vince and Stephanie catching up. Like I think so many people would want to watch Vince and Stephanie interact. So here's a story. So here's a story. You just give me an idea, Connor. I'm sorry to interrupt you. I'm inspired.

I love it. You've got Vince and McMan on one side. Mr. McMahon and his cast of characters behind him with him. Undertaker's gone full-blown corporate and he's going to

have an office down in AAA in Mexico pretty soon. He is gone from being a Vince guy to a guy. Now you got your two pillars on both side. Vince versus Undertaker.

Well, I don't know that it's going to happen, but it sure is fun to talk about. Something that should happen, though, is you need to look into Chime. Chime is changing the way people bank. It's fee-free and it's smarter banking built for you. Not like old-school banks that charge you overdrafts and monthly fees. No, built for you, not the 1%. And here's why Chime is different. Chime isn't just another banking app.

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That's obvious if you've kept up with his journalism. I know you challenged that word, but if you read the observer in recent years, you would get a rock tent here and there. and there was a statement made on a show last week where, well, Meltzer said something like this. Duane has been a great help to the company over the course of the last 20 to 30 years, but he kind of left them high and dry. Everyone's got their own speculation on what he did and why he did it. And then earlier this week, John Sina was doing an interview and he said something along the lines of,

hey, you know, plans change. Even at the top of the card, you know, plans change. they'll just come to you at the last minute and something will change. Like, Travis will decide he doesn't want to do it anymore and Rock will change his mind or something like that. And it's the first time we've heard John Cena sort of say something like that. And of course, we're talking about the failed hill turn and how Rock was there and then he wasn't there. And it looked like Travis was going to be a big part of the show moving forward. He was involved in the WrestleMania main event.

And then there was no payoff. But the idea that Meltzer is saying, he kind of left. them high and dry. It does make me wonder, I mean, we're certainly hinting at a lot of political gamesmanship behind the scenes. What do you make this? I can't make anything of it.

I just don't know the players in the situation. I mean, I'd be taking a weird, I tend to default to the most obvious. And most of the time when there are issues, like we're talking about creative issues, it comes down to communication. And I think if there was a breakdown in communication,

it's probably why we had the stutter step. I think there was some general consensus going in. And I think after the commitment was made, it got a little muddy in the middle and was subsequently abandoned. That's my take. And if I'm right or close to it, it's probably because the communication wasn't what it should have been going into the plant.

You have to pre-produce an idea with as much detail as you pre-produce a physical segment or a shot on a location. There's a lot of moving pieces. And the mistakes that you make, it gets expensive, both from a creative perspective, lost opportunity, and from a financial perspective, because you're wasting money. Most of that comes from poor pre-production. both creatively and in terms of logistics.

So I mentioned that there was just said, yeah, yeah, let's go do it. And then once we're kind of committed, it was like, well, that's not exactly how I wanted to do it. It can break down real fast. Now, you've got some big egos there, and I'm not using that term derisively. These are guys that earned the right to have a very strong opinion.

They've proven their knowledge and ability to, to lack of a better word, manipulate the audience in a positive way, to reach a goal. So you have to listen to them. And that sometimes is most of the time is a big asset. Sometimes it can come back and bite you in the ass. And it sounds like that's what happened here.

I don't think there was, I don't know. I don't want to say anymore because I just don't know. It's a mystery to me, you know, as it is to all of us or any of us who weren't actually there in the room. Do you think there's a chance we see the Rock do something at this year's WrestleMania? Like if that was on Polly Market. Would you say that Rock will or won't be at WrestleMania of this show?

I would be surprised that he wouldn't. But I don't know. I don't know. You know, what's Rock school? Rock came off a critically acclaimed movie recently. That may signal a move to enter into more serious acting roles. He's been kind of the action hero for, what, 25 years now, 20 years, kind of conquered that category. Apparently still has a desire to act.

as we've seen the commitment that he made and the weight loss that he went through and in the work that he put in to the character, uh, in his most recent movie, that suggests to me, maybe a renewed or, uh, even more of an interest in acting. And if that's the case, then we might not see him. I don't know. You know, as a reminder, the movie you were talking about, uh, was smashing machine. And I don't think it did nearly as well as he or others would have hoped. it wasn't what we would call a box office success,

but it didn't get a lot of critical acclaim. But I think he's just wrapped up filming another Jumanji, and I think he's got another, um, I'm probably pronouncing it wrong, but there's like a kids like Hawaii island type character, Moana or something like that. Oh yeah.

And so I know, I know that he's doing a few of those type things. So I know the blockbusters are still coming. It's not like he's not in demand. Uh, but I think there's a lot of curiosity based on the fact that there was no follow up for last year's WrestleMania. His daughter just announced that she has departed WWE and didn't renew.

I think a lot of people are sort of scratching their head about, hey, what to expect. So I think we're all going to be curious, when will we see the rock again or will we see the rock again? It felt like when they announced they were going back to Vegas, I just assumed, oh, well, that's where they're going to do rock and Roman finally at WrestleMania. We've heard about it forever. But it feels like with each passing year, Eric, it gets less and less likely to happen. Do you think we ever see rock,

versus Roman at WrestleMania? Do I think we will? No, but I think it could happen. I mean, again, so much we don't know. What, where's Rocket physically in terms of taking bumps? Right. We don't know. He's only 53.

That's a big question. Yes. Does he want to take that risk at this point in his career? Or does he want to do what many guys have done? Get in the ring when you know you're not as good as you used to be. We talked about this last time. expectations. You know, when someone like the rock comes back, or, you know, when Rick Flair came back,

or when Steve Austin, you know, came back, if you were, Hulk Hogan, I went through this with him for a long time. Hulk always wanted to do the things. Like, in his mind, he was so capable of executing and performing things in the ring as well as he could have. You could debate that all you want. But as well as he could have at the peak of his career. In his head, he could still do it.

can relate to that. I still think I'm capable of doing certain things physically that my body would definitely disagree with. It's just, you know, it's human being. It's how we're wired. And sometimes wrestlers who should not get back into the ring because the audience has an overly inflated artificial expectation anyway. The longer you're gone, the more amazing you were in the ring. It's funny how that works. And then you come back after having that really worked for several years, and you've aged a little bit, and you can't deliver on that audience's expectation. You just can't. So that's a risk you take.

And depending on what your intent is, your motivation, what makes you happy, you'll either do it because you just love to go out there and perform. And there are people that are like that. They just love to go out and perform. It's a big part of it. Even people that don't need the money perform well beyond their expiration date, just because it's so much fun and it's so rewarding in a way that you can't get anywhere else. So there's a lot of different reasons for it.

Where does Rock fall in that? I have no idea. I don't know. He certainly doesn't need the money. So it's not a money thing. It would be a passion thing. Do I think Rock might be able to muster up the passion to get excited about he and Roman?

I absolutely think it's, I don't know Rock. I mean, I know we're acquaintances. That's it. So I couldn't tell you what he may feel about anything. I would guess based on everything I've heard and read that he could get excited about that. So I do think it could happen. I don't think it necessarily is part of a plan right now. Well, I think you need a plan right now, which is why I recommend policy genius.

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Both nights of WrestleMania 41 combined for $66,0.74,058 in ticket sales. That's all according to the data from Polestar. These are figures that have not previously been reported in the media. It's said here, if the two nights broke down roughly easy, evenly, each night generated about 33 million in sales well beyond any pro wrestling event in history, even when taking inflation into account. Last year's WrestleMania in Las Vegas easily shattered all prior records for ticket sales revenue in pro wrestling history.

The two events combined for $66,0.674,558 in ticket sales, according to data obtained by post-wrestling from the live event trade publication, Post-Star figures, of course, are not normally just, you know, shared out the previous events, you know, like WrestleMania at Allegiance Stadium on April 19th and, and 20th sold the total of $113,412 attendance numbers from the authority that oversee the stadium previously disclosed the attendance each night was 58,0538 and 60,003, which is a total of 118, 641. So no matter how anybody slices it and says, oh, well, it was this number, it was that number, buddy, 66 million and just ticket sales.

Now, if you're curious, the prior year at WrestleMania in Philadelphia, uh, it was 17,000, 656,000 on night one and night two was 18 million, 433,3,325 dollars. I'm saying all that to say. There are no problems in WWB land. I know that everybody, we should buy after looking at those numbers, got a fire pole. Look back.

damn. He didn't beat last year's record growth. He beat it the prior year by damn near double, but he didn't do it again, my God. It's a little delete. You know, we're not, nobody's getting fired here. Um, but I do want to ask, you know, the thing that I think a lot of people are missing in this is as awesome as it is, 66 million tickets. Are you kidding? It's just tickets. That's not the merch and that's not the ads. So the sponsorship for last year's WrestleMania had to far exceed every previous WrestleMania by double and the merch probably fell right in line like merch prices have not gone down they've gone up and fanatics have sold more and more and I know that they're licensing that out to fanatics but they still participate on some

level or they wouldn't have it represented at every single event I would not be surprised in the slightest if this 66 million dollar number was closer to that 80 million maybe more last year don't you think? It has to be. Yeah. It has to be. I mean, those of, I was just kind of running rough math in my head and I was thinking back to WCW when I first took over the company and that our, our entire gross revenue number was $25 million. For the year. For a year. $25 million in gross revenues, which included pay-per-view, ticket sales, and whatever Bonesley would throw us from Turner ad sales, which is negligible. And, of course, course we had licensing, well, we theoretically we had licensing and we sold T-shirts occasionally.

All told it was $25 million a year. Of that $25 million, probably three or four of it was ticket sales. Think about that. Four million over the course of a year, $4 million in ticket sales over the course of a year compared to 36 million, whatever it was, 30 plus million dollars in ticket sales per night. It's mind-boggling. It's crazy. You could go back and look at some of WWFs early. When I say early, yeah, go back and look at some of the early house show numbers, even in well into the 90s, really until 95. You know, if you look at their ticket sales in a number of events and compare it to the ticket sales on that one night, it would be almost as staggering.

So it's just so hard to put the success of last year's WrestleMania into any kind of context that any of us can really relate to until you start really breaking it down. And then it just gets more incredible. That's just nuts. I mean, I remember once upon a time we talked on this show and you said, you know, a real goal for WCW. Now, granted,

this is way back when we're talking late 90s, but a real goal for WCW was to have that million dollar gate. And to think, oh shit, they broke it 33 times over in a night. Dude, there was a long period of time.

Well, felt like it at the moment, at the moment, but there was a period from about 1993, which is when I started really getting involved in management, until just before Nitro. No, before Nitro. 95.

So there's a two-year period of time. Our goal wasn't a million-dollar house. Our fantasy wasn't even a million-dollar house. That was delusional shit for us. We were like dreaming of a hundred thousand dollar house. That to us, that's when Zane Bresloff first came in because he came in when we were kind of bottomed out in terms of house show revenues, which is why he was brought in.

And I didn't bring him in. Somebody else did, but it was a good, it was a good ad, obviously. But when, when Zane first came in, you know, we were, we were, we, management was like, oh, good news. We did $38,000 last night at a TV taping. What? And that was rare, because most of them took place at Center Stage where it was free. but for a pay-per-view.

If you hit $38, $40, $45,000, oh, my gosh, we did great. No, you actually didn't. You sucked. But that was the bar. And we would fantasize about $100,000 house. Guys, it had been a part of $100,000 houses on the card. Russ was on a card that had been in WWE. We'd come back and just talk about those $100,000 houses and how much fun they were.

meanwhile we're wrestling in front of 1,200 people. Half of them got in free. So when we finally hit that $100,000, $100,000 house, $200,000 house, you know, I mean, that was, that was amazing. Even then I wasn't thinking about a million dollar house. To be honest, I wasn't. I didn't think it possible. Something else that's just crazy and, and I don't know, hard to even wrap your

around. I want to talk about John Cena's last match. And of course, I know that happened in December. So you're probably saying, what new is there to discover? Well, the December 13th episode of Saturday night's main event is the biggest live gate for an arena event in WWE history. Now, we knew it was sold out 17,121 tickets. But the live gate for this one show, not a stadium, not a dome, just a regular ass 17,000 seat arena. $6,553,883. And again, that does not include the revenue that would have come from Peacock for the show. That does not include the sponsorship that would have come through for the show.

That does not include the merch. And who moved more merch in their career than John Cena? It's a short list. How much you want to, how much you want to bet the merchandise? I bet you when you did the final accounting on that show, you were at $30 to $40 ahead for merchandise. Can you imagine? That's worth, let me run the numbers on that just for funsies.

And we'll round it down to 17,000. But the idea that there's 17,000, and we'll call it $35,000 ahead, that's $5.95. I think you're right on the money. I mean, maybe 600 grand in merch. And you know it's got to be millions in sponsorship.

I feel like there'd be a lot of people who would understand the historical significance of John seeing his last match and say, yeah, you know what? Give me a spot on that canvas. How many pictures are going to be circulated? from that night forever. I mean,

it feels like WWE for all the chatter about oh, ticket sales aren't moving as good as they could be. Well, based on the all-time record high last year. But the real challenge in WrestleMania this year is going back to the same town again, most of all, don't you think? It is. But I want to go back to that $17,000, $6 million house thing.

Somebody out there has to know what the per cap is on that. And that's a data point that I always hung on to. You know, you look at ratings, you look at quarter hours, you look at minutes, some people look at minute, five minutes. I can pitch it much that's too. But there's all these data points you can analyze to either find a solution, a creative direction, or justify one that you're going to take anyway. But the one data point that I always pay close attention to, because you can't interpret it anyway. it's not subjective is the per cap number on the house shows for the merch right for the merch yeah that tells me more about what's working and what's not and it's not one you know you can't

compare week over week but you've got to look at trends over time but when you're merchant when you're per cap tendance merchandise starts creeping up at house shows that's when you know you're kind of on to something and then you kind of scale that that formula up a little bit. But as I said, you know, I thought I got $35 a head per cap. I think that was probably low. And I'm hoping somebody out there knows because I would really be fascinated to know that number. Hey, I do want to mention, you know, the average ticket price. If you divided, you know, the number of tickets sold into the ticket gate, it's 38280. That's your average ticket price. So that tells you, because that factors in the cheapies, you know, my back is against the concrete. I'm at the

tippy top. I'm getting the nose bleed. I'm so high up here. $382.80 is your average. So these are healthy ticket sales. I'm saying all that to say, I'm fascinated by what you just revealed here because I didn't put two and two together until right now as you're speaking. When you're talking about how closely you monitored the per cap of merch per head, even for live events,

I remember like it was yesterday reading the observer in like 97 and 98 and seeing that Meltzer had detailed data about what the merch sales were for WCW. And I believe that I've been able to deduce that Eric Bischoff relied heavily on Zane Breslov and Zane Bresloff was friendly with Dave Meltzer. Would that have been something that

Zane taught Eric to monitor the average merchandise per head spend on the arena shows? I was doing that long before Zane came on board. One of the reasons I got the job to be president, quite frankly, was because I had that understanding

long before we brought Zane Breslov in. In fact, used that very point to articulate my positions of Bill Shaw before Zane Breslov came in is how I would approach fixing the current problem. It was all part of a discussion I had about pulling a plug on house shows. I pulled the plug on house shows.

Bob Drew ended up leaving the company because that was his job. He was the executive vice president. He oversaw the wrestling side of the business, the arena side of the business because he was he was the arena manager for the Omni. And so he got the job at Turner and ultimately WCW. So he oversaw the touring side of the business. I had nothing to do with that. But I was executive, I was executive producer. This is before I was vice president and I was a part of the discussions about where WCW was back in 93, 92, that ended up with actually Bob Duke, you know, left the company and we'll leave it go at that.

My position about pulling the plug on the house shows partially because of the fact that I used the per cap argument to show a trend. No, nice try, but no. well I wasn't trying to suggest that that Zane had taught you about it I just realized that that's exactly what you said so well you cut me off bud in fairness I was trying to say I was curious if Zane had taught you this per cap thing or if that was an Eric Bischoff mandate that went to Zane either way it got printed in the observer and I know that he would have gotten those number he being Dave Milser would have gotten that information from Zane so Zane was

preparing those reports for you and then back channeling that information to to Meltzer, because how else would Meltzer have known what the per head for merch was unless it came from Zane? Because you weren't giving it to him, right? That per cap basis was reported across the board. It was reported for on WWE as well, and it was just like a lot of other information that leaked out the doors it never should have. And it might not have been Zane. It could have easily been Gary Jester. It could have been any number of people because Gary, Gary Jester was probably closer to Zane Brazzloff than anybody in the company.

So it could have been Zane. It could have been Gary, could have been Gary Jester. Who knows where it came from? But it wasn't like a guarded secret, by the way, within WCW. It was the information was distributed throughout the company. Assistance in the marketing department were provided copies of results and including per cap, you know, reporting. So it wasn't a big secret that,

Anybody had to try to dig up to find. Here's what I'm getting to. Nobody reports that information now. It was an Eric Bischoff thing. Like it's not, it's not reported in the observer now at all for TNA. I think it's because the way accounting has changed. Hmm. You know, it used to be a lot easier to read financial reports and pick a lot of this stuff out.

I, and I say that because I've tried to do it recently just to try to create some comps in a way in certain categories in WWE. And I'm using WWE because of the business models, obviously the same business model for Real American Freestyle in many respects, as it is for UFC and a lot of other MMA companies. We have a similar business model. The revenue streams are very similar in many respects. So in terms of goal setting for our team,

I've been trying to and obviously adjust for scale, right? but look at different ways to measure our own performance so that we can track, similar to what I just described here that I did in WCW, so we can track our own performance in it, at least one data point that has what I feel is pretty valuable. But in trying to determine some of the, like per cap is specifically as what I was trying to find the other day, it's really, I can't find it. Even though all of WWE's financial reports are public, they have to be.

a publicly held company. Good luck trying to find that piece of information. But it used to be reported so, so regularly internally. And again, it wasn't, it wasn't, you know, proprietary information. It should have been, but it wasn't. I love that we have such a hard on for Dave Meltzer around these parts. I mean, I don't, but you could with our friends at Blue Shoe Gold. Blue Chew is the newest innovation from the number one chewable ED brand. I'm talking about Blue Chewold. You're familiar with Blue Chew. It is, of course, the number one chewable that you've ever heard of. But this, Blue Chew Gold,

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Bluechew.com, 83 weeks. Hey, let's talk a little bit about. I'm going to let the audience know. Some behind the scenes shit here. Like you sit here, Conrad, for two and a half hours, sometimes more. And you don't get a chance to get up.

That's true. I'm just talking. Yeah. You never get to leave. I get to get up and use the restroom when we do these spots. And I want you to know over the last couple of years, I've got my timing down pretty good. Yes, you do.

But this one was so close. It was scary. It was freaking scary. So I am really grateful you've got a big bladder. Well, shout out to my big bladder and shout out to WWE going back to Saudi Arabia. There's rumor in innuendo that Night of Champions 2026 is tentative scheduled to take place in Saudi on June 27th.

Now, this is not something I expected. I say that because I know that there may pay-per-view, which we're going to talk about in a minute, is also international. But I am kind of surprised that they've already announced their plans to go back in June. I guess we're thinking we're going to have two events there. We know we just had the Royal Rumble. We'll go back in late June for now to champions.

And we know next year's WrestleMania will be in Saudi. I think I speak for everyone that I hope at the next event in Saudi they don't use the, or they at least dial in those lights that are on the seats. It was kind of distracting, I think. That's the biggest takeaway from the whole show, though, don't you think? Yeah, I was. I am absolutely certain that won't happen again. Yeah.

Feels like a safe bet. I got to tell you, I'm hoping that they dial this one in. I feel like a lot of people were sort of non-plussed by this year's Royal Rumble. I saw some people who were normally pretty staunch WWE advocates online being very specific in saying they did not think highly of this show, did not think it was a good show. And I was kind of surprised to see that sentiment almost across the board. And I think there's a lot of concern that, oh, man, I hope next year's WrestleMania isn't like that. So I hope for the for the sake of fan, enthusiasm and optimism and, I don't know, consumer confidence that they nail night of the champion.

in Saudi Arabia. So I'm pulling for them on June 27. But before we get there, this was just announced this week. It's official. The first ever PLE in Italy is Clash in Italy. It's going down on Sunday, May 31st. This will be the first European summer tour, 2026, where they're doing Italy, Spain, France, Portugal, and the UK. But Italy, man, and in the next month, Saudi, if there's ever been a need for there to be more evidence that this is no longer a domestic company. This is a global operation at this point, Eric. Certainly as I was thinking when you were describing that schedule, one of the things that WWF used to do is talking about probably 90, starting of 92, 93, 94, the

WWE house show business was down significantly. and part of the reason it was down. There was different reasons for it, but one of them was because house show business was so hot throughout the 80s and probably bumping up to, you know, 91. And I'm operating off memory here. And I'm not a historian. I don't pretend I am.

But there was a big window of time where the house show business was so hot. You hear the stories. Guys begin in a row, 350 days a year. Some guys like Hulk Hogan and Rick Flair are doing double shots on weekends. And they did that because the business was so hot, but they burned out the market.

They made so much money in those markets that there were other reasons, including the serial and all kinds of other stuff. So it wasn't one thing. It never is one thing. It's always a couple things all at the same time. But in this case, one of the reasons why the household business was down so bad is because they exploited it so much when it was hot that they burned it out. Well, they transitioned.

That's when they really started doing bigger tours overseas. that served two purposes. One, it keeps your talent busy, keeps the revenue coming in, because Europe was an underserved market at that time. They weren't getting a lot of WWE. There was no reason for WWE to go overseas because they couldn't keep up with the opportunity that was existed here in the United States.

Why go through the expense? Why work for less money? Because it's more expensive. Ultimately, they made the move and started doing regular big tours and doing really well over Europe, which not only created, cash flow, which they desperately needed at that time. But it also took market pressure off the live

event audience in the United States. Absence makes the heart grow fonder so that when you step away for a year and instead of being in a market four times a year because that's a hot market, now all of a sudden you don't come back for a couple of years. Guess what? Absence makes a heart grow finder and you can start building that market and touring in that market again and actually make money. Same thing in a way is happening now. W.W.E is becoming, now they've changed their live event model dramatically. They've gone from the, you know, they've gone from a touring model to a television model. Big change. I don't know how many events WWE does a year, right? I'm going to take a whack at it, but I would imagine very few of those are traditional house shows. So all of the

resources is being placed where the money is being made, but you can't go to all of those big markets here in the United States too often, or it no longer feels special. So by going to Italy, by going to Saudi, by going to Germany, by going to France, by going to Australia, by going to Japan, you're taking the pressure off the big markets, the New Orleans, the Las Vegas, the New Yorks, the Chicago's, you know, the really big markets where you can have a WrestleMania. You're taking some of the pressure off of them, but you're not bringing those smaller, still PLEs, but smaller ones to those same markets. So it's kind of a, there's a lot of advantages to it from a business perspective. One is you're creating new

revenue in a new market, which is obviously a good thing. It's consistent with an increased television presence, so it's a really good thing. But you're also taking pressure off. the market here in the United States to create demand via absence. If that makes sense. Well, you won't have a chance to miss the Royal Rumble this weekend. I know what you're saying to yourself. Self, wasn't the Royal Rumble three weeks ago? It was, but ESPN is going to air a condensed version of the Royal Rumble on ESPN,

on the main broadcast channel. This is happening this Sunday, February 22nd. And I have to admit, this is what I think a lot of us kind of expected when they first announced this partnership that maybe these major PLEs would be on the main feed. But I certainly understand with the amount of money that they're paying WWE, hey, they need a chance to recoup some of that cash. So they're going to make it a part of their ESPN unlimited program and have you pony up some bucks. But the idea that, you know, regular old school channel changers are going to be just flipping around this weekend and stumble across the Royal Rumble on. ESPN, that feels like a win for WWE and ESPN, doesn't it? And a consumer.

Yeah. Because you may be exposing that product to an entirely different audience that otherwise maybe not have checked it out. See it, decide next time it comes around, I will. Which is I'm guessing the strategy behind that move. I wanted to also bring this up. This was big news earlier this week. WWE has landed a major partnership with dude wipes.

I know for certain that this has been. something that has been shopped a little bit and they landed on a partnership with wwee the announcement says tuesday wbvdh announced a new multi-year partnership with dude wipes highlighted by the first of its kind integration with wwee superstars such as dominic mysterio and enhanced match sponsorships at tentpole wwee events so obviously they're going to have some p lees and maybe main event saturday night's main event and things like that where they will be an integration for dude wipes. But the idea that maybe Dom is going to wear that on his gear,

like an old school UFC fighter, I think this is hilarious. People joked about this when they first started putting ads on the canvas. I remember seeing someone on social media took a picture of Triple H on his back, and he just had him plain black trunks. And instead of having the game logo or one of his goofy logos, it was the dude wipes logo right on his butt. And I thought, man, that's kind of funny.

if they were forecasting that this might happen. And I'll be damned it did. But I mean, how great is this? The idea that we're now going to turn our wrestlers into freaking NASCAR drivers. Here's the deal. I've got two predictions for tonight's show, today's show. This is one of them. I predict the marketing people of dude wipes and WWE are going to get together.

And they're going to be in a room somewhere. Somebody's going to go, you know, we want to come up with some great product integration ideas because our research, you know, you get the marketing talk because that's what those people do. They went to college. They got to vomit all that college shit out to justify what they really want to do anyway. But they're going to come up with some ideas. How do we integrate the product?

And somebody's going to have the balls to say, hey, guys, I listened to this guy by the name of Conrad Thompson. And he does these blue two spots. And these spots are so funny. And this Bluetooth started out on a podcast. And now you see it advertised everywhere on mainstream. But when they first started promoting Bluetooth, it was kind of nobody really wanted to take it. There were some podcasters and radio stations who went, nah, we really don't want to go there.

We don't do Dick Pills or Rubbers. We just, that's where we draw the line. Well, now it's everywhere. What if we take the Conrad Thompson approach to dude wipes from WWE and we embrace the entertainment? because that's what Conrad Thompson did. He made those blue shoe spots fun. They were well produced. They were well written.

And he had fun with them. And look where they are. Now, let's do the same thing with dude wipes. And we're going to see some of the funniest dude wipe spots that are going to be hilarious. And whoever that marketing genius is that raised his or her hand in the corner, it admitted that they listened to Conrad Thompson's podcast and has learned by listening to the blue chew reads how to make this thing work. Dude wipes is going to be a huge hit from a marketing standpoint.

All because of you, Conrad. Oh, gosh. Will you stop? My Lord. Mark my words. That's one of my predictions. Put it down. I'm 98.

98. I don't even can't get 98.7. 6, 4, 63. I can't remember somewhere in there. But I'm going to throw that up as to count against that score or for it. Either way, but wait and see. I'll give it six months. Well, if that happened.

I need a little royalty, just a little bit. You should. Good luck with that. Look where I am with NWO. I get nothing for that. Yeah, you're getting screwed for life. Hey, let's talk about Hacksaw Jim Duggan.

He posted something on social media the other day that I thought was super fascinating. I wanted to share this with you. It was a memo from Vince McMahon in January of 1991. And it was sent out by Vince to the talent and agent. on January 25th, 1991, so around Royal Rumble Time. The message reads, if your family physician prescribes the use of steroids to overcome an injury sustained in the ring,

the responsibility is yours to carry the prescription for that medication at all times. In closed, please find articles and information that discuss steroid possession both in the United States and Canada, and then of course it's signed by Vince at the bottom. Now, we know that 91 is when all of the Zohorahor and stuff really starts to pop up. And the idea that there was an internal memo way back when and that Haxaw kept it and

somehow found it and posted it, I thought was super fascinating. That's an interesting piece of history right there, don't you think? Yeah, it is. It's exactly that. Because back in 1991, steroids weren't illegal. So if they were prescribed by a doctor, the whole steroid FDA thing was quite different than than it is now. And you could carry steroids if they were prescribed by a doctor.

But if you were carrying steroids and you didn't have a prescription, and there are some drugs that fall into that same classification today. I'm not an expert, so I can't tell you what they were. But I know there have been times that I've traveled with medication that I brought a prescription with just in case there's a question. So it's not a common. And back then, yeah, with the pressure on and there's a Horian trial, I'm sure Vince made extra sure that his talent, if they were carrying anything they got from a doctor,

to be sure they had their prescription because he didn't want the publicity of something were to happen. Covering his ass. As a reminder, I did look this up. Antibolic steroids became illegal to possess or distribute without a prescription in the United States on November 29, 1990, with the enactment of the Anabolic Steroids Control Act. So that's November 29th of 90. So almost two months later to the day is when Vince disseminates this memo. Obviously, it's a little C-Y-A piece of business.

But let's be, I want to make sure I understood you. I don't mean to interrupt you. It's rude. I hate when they get said to me and I hate when I do it to others. But I thought I heard you say when you read that steroids were legal without a doctor's prescription until 1990. Did I hear that correctly? Anabolic steroids became illegal to possess or distribute without a prescription on November 29th,

1990. So if you had a prescription, you're good to go. And this is Vince making sure that his company is complying with the new law that passed two months prior. So I know that sometimes people see a note like that. And they're like, oh, he's just trying to cover his ass for Zahori. Well, the law had changed in the prior 60 days. And he's making sure that, and that law was here in America. And obviously they're touring Canada, which is why he wanted to make sure that everyone understood it. Here's the policy for America and for Canada.

I just think it's fascinating because it was such a talking point in wrestling for so long. And these days, I don't think it is nearly as much. Like, respectfully, you can watch TV and see who's on performance enhancing drugs and who's not. But also don't think it's that big of a deal. I want the performers to be able to make their own choice and have their own agency to make their own decisions and live their life how they want to live. When you're talking about contact sport, legitimate sport, with all due respect to WWE and AWE and all professional wrestling performers, if we're punching people in the head for real in the UFC or boxing or for that matter, you know, football or whatever, I understand we want to make sure that we're keeping the sport clean and we've got an even level playing field.

But a lot of times the steroid use in wrestling is for cosmetic purposes, no different than Sylvester Stallone on the silver screen, right? Or any other action hero that you pay money to see. Let's be honest about it. And, you know, again, we're talking so many years ago, you know, anybody can get testosterone. I mean, you, you know, once you hit probably 30, 35 years old, there will be a metabolic indication or biological indication. that you're beginning to, your testosterone, your body's production of testosterone is dropping significantly enough that testosterone replacement therapy is a good thing, just like taking all your vitamins is a good thing, right?

Now, it can be a bad thing if it's abused and so forth, but it's just become now so common that you can't watch television, you can't open a magazine, you can't drive down the highway and not see a billboard that in one way, shape, or form is promoting some form of hormone replacement therapy for men and for women. That market has exploded. So the perception of it now is so much different than it was. And the products that are available now, so many of them are, for example, today aesthetically, we talk about, you know, movie stars and which starts to get themselves looking as good as they look for the camera. A lot of that has to do with peptides.

And peptides are cellroids. Peptides are amino acids. That's all they are. And they're natural. They're the same things that your body produces, but they're just configured in a way or assembled in a certain way that promotes your own body's production of, for example, growth hormone or testosterone without any kind of synthetic additive.

So there's so much more available now that I don't. You don't want when people see people who, sometimes people are just obvious that they're doing the things you shouldn't be doing that are black market, you know, the dinaballs and all that kind of stuff. But when people, you know, kind of lump, you know, movie stars or people who do take replacement products or enhancement products aesthetically, they're not the steroids that you used to hear about all the time. It's a much different situation, though. Well, I'll tell you what else is in much different situation now, and that's the perfect gene. You know, a lot of us have been paying like 150 bucks or $200 whenever we buy our jeans online. And sometimes when you buy them online, it's like, you don't know what you're going to get. Are they going to fit me right?

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We know Logan Paul is a major influencer. My man's got just a plethora of social media influence on all social media platforms on YouTube and certain platforms he's got as many or more than WW8. It's unbelievable. And every now and again, there's a superstar who maybe has a bigger following. One of them might be bad bunny. One of the most downloaded people in the history of streaming. He's right up there with Taylor Swift.

He's often number one ahead of Taylor Swift. There's been a lot of speculation about. about Bad Bunny coming back to WWE. And there's a little bit of controversy. I think it was silly and stupid about the halftime show. Who cares? We're here to watch the freaking Super Bowl. I can't imagine giving a riff one way or another who's in the halftime show,

but whatever to each his own. But I do know that Bad Bunny has had a couple of pretty critically acclaimed matches. And from all accounts we've heard inside WWE, he took it very, very seriously. And I know that Logan Paul, the younger brother of, or I'm sorry, Jake Paul,

the younger brother of Logan Paul. He came out and was pretty anti the idea of having Bad Bunny do the halftime show. And Logan Paul would ask, hey, are you excited about Bad Bunny doing the halftime show? He said no. And I think a lot of people thought,

oh, well, he must share his brother's opinion. And that was not the case. Logan went on his podcast and clarified saying, hey, he was half in character when he was saying that. The gist being, he wants to wrestle Bad Bunny. He says the idea has been floated around.

Quote, I've been candid about the fact that I'd love to do it. I think it would be the greatest W.W.E match of all time. I really believe that. In that regard, anytime I'm asked about Bad Bunny, I think that in the back of my mind, I set that up when I'm asked if I'm excited saying no, one word, now people are talking about it. However, there is truth to the fact that I'm a 30-year-old man. I'm not excited about any halftime show. I don't care.

I wasn't even really watching the game that much. I was ripping packs. I think it would be the greatest, most popular WWE match of all time. It would be insane. It transcends WWE. What a statement. If I wrestle bad money,

it'll be the greatest match in WWE history, and it will transcend WWE. Now, this is going to piss off a lot of wrestling fans. And he is a heel, so that's probably the idea. Good on you, Logan. But when you think about it from a mainstream perspective, these are the two of the most influential people in the world. And you had incredible success with someone who was a media darling before there was a social media like Dennis Rodman.

And certainly someone who was, you know, hot, hot, hot in Hulk Hogan as the leader of the NWO. But Bad Bunny versus Logan Paul, that would make mainstream news in every language around the country, wasn't it? Around the world. Yeah, that's what I meant. And around the world. I mean, I don't know how many followers, Paul has. I don't know how many followers Bunny has. I'm going to guess between the two of them, what, 15 million?

Way more than that. We'll go before this is over. But Logan has 27 million on Instagram, 23 million on YouTube, 18 million on TikTok, and 6.8 million on Twitter. Okay. Let's just be really conservative and assume a lot of duplication in that number, meaning one person is, you know, all those different platforms.

Let's just be conservative and say, I don't know, what's fair? 35 million conservatively. It's a lot. While we're just talking about it, let me give you the bad bunny stats. 54 million on Instagram, a hundred and nine million on Spotify

52 million on YouTube 41 million on TikTok I mean I know it's going to piss off WWE fans but like this is so fucking what yes you know here's here's two things

first of all I wish you would have kept K Fade and kept taking shots yes and that come out and say no I'm just trying to promote a map Number one, have some freaking fun with it. There's not that many opportunities in this business to have real fun at this kind of scale that Paul and Bunny have.

Are you freaking kidding me? Work it a little bit, just a little longer. Anyway, it doesn't matter because it would be in many respects. You know, here's what I wish you wouldn't have said. I wish it would have said the greatest match in WWB history. Because that's, you know, will it be the best? the biggest. Will it be the most financially successful? Will it achieve marketing awards and break records and do all kinds of shit? None of us know about

absolutely it will. Will it be the best match in history? I'm going to give that up a little bit. I don't think so. But for all of the other reasons why I hope it happens, it will be amazing. If it happens. If it happens at WrestleMania this year, it's going to be wild. Oh my gosh. And I think they could be doing it. Like I know there's a lot of speculation about the masked man in, in, in,

WWE with the vision and who is it? We've said on the program here, I think it's bad bunny. I hope that's who it is. There's a lot of speculation that it's Seth Rollins, but what a way to set up bad bunny versus Logan Paul. And if you're going to do that with that much attention, wouldn't you want it on a WrestleMania,

especially if you feel like, if the reports are true, oh, tickets are down 18%. Announce bad bunny and Logan Paul, right? Gosh. What a fun. What a,

I mean, what a fun thing to think about. Who knows if it's true or not, if it's real or not? For the time being, it doesn't really matter because it's such a fun thing to think about. You know, when would they reveal that it's actually a bad bunny the week before WrestleMania to take advantage of just the firestorm that that would create?

And the impulse buy. that would follow it. It's just so excited to think about. It makes me wonder, do you think there's a chance, everybody's speculating on this? They revealed a big crate on Monday Night Raw this week, and there's all kinds of speculation because it says something like,

do not open until February 28th or something like that. And so there's speculation. Hey, is it Danhausen? Hey, is it Chris Jericho? What if it's bad bunny? And hey, I'm back in WW, if he I don't know it'll be interesting to see there's lots of intrigue right now with the mass band with the crate where are these as silly as they may be hook's going to lead because a lot of people are talking about it but

bad bunny just feels like box office you know who's in a bad spot right now is Seth Rollins oh no doubt because if Seth Rollins is in that conversation and ultimately it becomes Seth Rollins a lot of people are going to be disappointed it wasn't bad bunny and be a few amount of people that'll be disappointed wasn't Chris Jericho. I feel like that the box, I was talking to a friend here at work and they asked me, hey, what do you think? And I said, I think they've set themselves up to disappoint folks accidentally because, you know, with all due respect, I remember being in the stands when AW had Tony Cohen announce

that, hey, we've got a mystery guy who's going to make his debut at the pay-per-view this weekend. He's one of my top 10 favorite wrestlers of all time. It was a daily's place in Jacksonville. So around me, I'm seated and I hear people just fans in the crowd speculating. Oh, it's definitely John Sina. Oh, it's definitely Brock Lesnar and no disrespect, but it was Christian. And so when the expectation had been set by the fans in their mind that it's John Sina or it's Brock Lesnar, they were disappointed to see Christian.

If we hadn't announced, hey, not only is there a special debut and it's one of my top 10 favorite wrestlers of all time and just Christian randomly showed up on an AEW show, people would have went bananas and lost their mind. and that's my concern is whoever and whatever's in this box, I feel like it's going to disappoint people because people are, oh, it's the rock, oh, it's Stone Cold, oh, it's Danhausen. Oh, it's Chris Jericho. Oh, it's bad money.

What if it's not? I mean, now you're sort of hamstringing somebody. I was there Danhausen in that mix. It's just, yeah. Well, I'm, I'm being legitimate. I mean, I think there's speculation that, oh, he's leaving AW, so it's him. But it's like, no matter what, if it's Danhaus, you expected Chris Jericho, you're disappointed.

If it's Powerhouse Hobbs who debuted at the Rumble and now they put him in a box, now people are disappointed. If it's, I just don't see a big upside on the box. I think people will be disappointed. I hope not. I hope it's a fabulous surprise, but I think the people who are like, it's definitely

Jericho because the guy had a clipboard and that's the list of Jericho. Who knows? But it is what makes wrestling fun. We want to speculate. We want to guess, but sometimes we disappoint ourselves by not managing those expectations. Well said.

Let's talk a little bit about Rhonda Rousey. I don't know if you saw this, but she did a book and she did kind of Hey, we hate WWPR tour. And I think we kind of thought, well, that may be the end. But they've announced a super fight and it's not with TKO and UFC.

But it is on Netflix. It's a done deal. 10 years ago, this would have been the fight everybody wanted to see. Ron DeRousey versus Gina Carano. It is happening on May 16th. It's at the Intuit Dome and Inglewood, California. It'll be live on Netflix.

And who's the promoter? The other Paul brother. Jake Paul is who put this together, MVP. This will be the first MMA card to ever air live on Netflix. You may be thinking to yourself, wait, that's not true. TKO has a deal with Netflix. They do for WWE. UFC is airing on Paramount.

And as the story goes, I guess Rhonda did some interviews this week. She said that she did have a conversation with Dana about possibly coming and fighting with UFC. And those didn't lead anywhere. And I guess once upon a time, Dana was less than positive with Gina Carrano and she never made her way into the UFC. This to me feels like the female equivalent of the Mike Tyson, Roy Jones Jr. fight we saw a few years ago. where I don't know that anybody thinks either one of these folks are at the absolute top of their game right now, but we remember when they were.

And then nostalgia is what pulls us in. I've heard from people that I haven't heard from in years who want to talk about this. I think it's great for Netflix. It's great for Rhonda and Gina Carrano. But I don't know that I expect it to be some super fight that maybe people are expecting. What do you expect?

I expect to be entertained. I expect to feel like I've, receive my money's worth because I will be buying it. I will check it out. It's not buying it on Netflix. I'll be watching it on Netflix. I have Netflix. I'll definitely carve out the time to see it live.

I won't worry about, I won't even try to check in. I want to see. I think it's great. In terms of what do I expect in the fight, I don't expect anything. I'm more interested in seeing where Ronda is with her hands. I heard that she was working on her.

her hands. That was a weak spot for her. So I'm really curious to see how serious she's really taking this. And I think Gina Carano has done a really good job of holding on to her fan base. You know, she went through that issue with Disney and got a lot of publicity out of that, a lot of sympathy out of that. So I think she's coming into this as a baby face, which is a good thing. If I'm Jake Paul, I'm leaning into that. If I'm Jake Paul, I'm also leading into the fact that Rhonda is a natural heel. She should have never been positioned as a baby face in WWE, which is one of the rise,

one of, not the only, but contributing factor to the lacklesser, you know, state that she had there in WWE. It started off on the wrong foot. So she is a heel. She's been bad mouth in WWE.

She's maintained her profile. She does have a lot of online kind of hate, which is money. If she leans into it, embraces it. So let's see what happens. I'm more interested in how much they really engage and try to create the story and create the conflict. If it's just two, you know, former fighters going out there and putting an exhibition, I'll be disappointed and I'll be sorry that I wasted my time. But if they go out there and they put in a hundred

percent effort regardless of, you know, how it compares to their previous fights, I'll be satisfied. I do want to ask you about, um, the other fight that was announced. Obviously, it's not as wrestling adjacent because Rhonda Rousey was a regular part of WWE and hell she even wrestled to the AW once as a one-off. But Mike Tyson and Floyd Mayweather in the Congo, that was announced this same week. And that's, I mean, what a sentence that is. And we've also got Manny Packyell coming out of retirement to fight in April. There is a resurgence of these, I don't know,

older and wiser fighters. Maybe that's what I'm getting to. Hear me out. Maybe it's not my best idea. But what if we had you put the headgear and the gloves on and we got Sonny Ono in there and we had Ninja Stars sponsoring it? And you guys mixed it up and we had a kickboxing match. What do you think?

Me and Sonny? Why not? She had fire. You know, he's short enough. I could actually kick him in a head without hurt myself. I mean, what an industry this has become for retired fighters, the spectacle of fighting seemingly, I mean, every time we think, well, they're not doing that again, fuck, here comes another one.

I mean, three in the same week announced this. I think it's, you know, and look, it's, I think it says a lot about where we are culturally with regard to entertainment. Yeah. We've all heard, you know, generally that, you know, live events is really, you know, it's resurging. And for a long time, right, the live event business was. really brutal for a lot of reasons.

But now it's kind of like if you've got a live sporting event, look at Savannah bananas. Trying to explain that to anybody. It's like, well, it's a new Harlem Globetrotters only baseball. And I think these kind of things are coming up. I think the reason Real American freestyle is enjoying far more success than I was even optimistically hoping for. in the early days of conversations, right?

And one of the reasons I'm so surprised and grateful is because I think we've come along at the right time where people want to go out and experience emotion and have fun at a live event versus something on their phone or on their computer or on their 720-square-inch, you know, IMAX theater that's built into the bathroom, whatever. You know, there's so many ways to enjoy entertainment and it's amazing stuff, but it's not the same thing as being there live. There's an energy that's different at a live event. And I think that resurgence is partially responsible for the growth of, again, Savannah bananas and in other what would otherwise be new sports. I mean, our investment partners specialize in these are very very,

very sophisticated investors, left-lane capital. They look for and invest in emerging sports leagues for the very reason I'm describing. That business is growing. And I think it's an opportunity for guys like Mayweather and Floyd Patterson or Rhonda Rousey and Gina Carrano or whoever's next on the list to get out there and have fun, fill that need that I talk about all the time, that you can't get anywhere else. you don't have enough money to buy it. You can't.

You can only go out and do it and experience it. So these guys get to go out there and have some fun, make a shit ton of money, and be able to go out for a steak dinner and drink right after. I see no reason. And the people that come have a good time. I see nothing wrong with this formula. No, I'm a fan of it.

I look forward to it. These are the two biggest names in women's MMA history. Both are coming out. of retirement for this dream fight. They're going to be fighting at 145 pounds. They're going to do five, five minute rounds. That is like a championship fight in the UFC.

But unlike the UFC and you're going to get a kick out of this, Eric, they're not fighting in an octagon because that, of course, is trademark. So they're fighting inside a hexagon. So by God, all these MMA fans,

they're going to learn their geometry one way or another. Octagons be damned. Here we go. hexagon. Hey, let me tell you about something else that's leveling up. You know, if you notice that it feels like everything in our life is faster, every year we get a better, faster phone. Every couple of years, we get a better faster computer. Isn't it crazy that we're still using the same type of razors that we first learned how to shave with? That is until now, Harry's Plus is here to the rescue. They're not stuck in 2008. And I have to admit,

when I first heard Harry's Plus, I thought, well, what's the big deal? Because I know what Harry's is all about. There's a guy in my office name John. He's been a Harry's guy. I've tried to convince him to try the stuff for the years. He's a brand loyalist. He's Harry's for life. But Harry's Plus, man, it's leveled up in a big way. It's got an advanced pivoting system to reach every corner over your face. Refined blade technology for a closer, smoother shave and a weighted metal handle. Check this out. It's Harry's heaviest handle yet. All for added comfort and added control. It feels like an expensive shave, but buddy, it's not. the refills are still cheaper than the other guys.

It's designed with progressive blades. That's going to help you with less tug and pull. And you get Harry's Plus, that means you get a barbershop quality shave with German engineer blades. Each blade is honed at three different angles to cut hair cleanly at the root without tugging. Blade spacing is optimized to glide smoothly

and avoid all that clogging. Those drugstore blades, they just clogged so damn fast. By the way, every cartridge has a lubricating strip with aloe and vitamin E to calm your side. skin down while you shave. But maybe the best part about Harry's and Harry's Plus is just how affordable it is. You may not know this, but Harry's actually owns their own world-class blade factory in Germany, in Germany, rather. So there's no outsourcing. There's no middleman.

That same facility has been perfecting blade making for like 100 years. So they control the entire process from steel to chef and they can keep the cost low. I mean, why would you go and pay $30 for refills when Harries gives you better blades for a fraction of that. Harris has also launched this most advanced razor ever. We're talking, of course, about Harry's Plus, and it's still cheaper than the Gillette Fusion 5. By the way, if you don't love your shave, Harris is going to make it right. There's no questions asked here.

We're talking a risk-free trial. That means there's zero downside to giving it a shot. But with Harry's Plus being the heaviest razor handle ever, made from metal, never plastic, designed to fit comfortably in your hand. you're going to have more control. It's got a luxe feel. And by the way, Harry's doesn't just make razors. They've got all your grooming essentials covered. Dude, they got your shave gel. They got your deodorant, your body wash. It's all thoughtfully made and it's price so you can stock up. And it all gets delivered right

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It would really help the show. Man, you're going to love the way it feels. It's only 10 bucks. Aries.com slash 83 weeks. Eric, I'm pretty excited. We made a prediction here, I don't know, six weeks ago, two months ago. And I said, listen, I hope that AJ's last match is not in Saudi Arabia because according to the calendar, Monday night Raw is going to be in Atlanta on the 23rd.

Well, guess what this Monday is, AJ Stiles appreciation night. you're going to do a whole tribute to AJ Styles in Atlanta this coming Monday. I for one have fired up about it. Brian Alvarez has reported that it won't just be the raw cast of characters. They're going to have Smackdown talent coming in for this as well. As we're recording today, I guess AJ is down at the Performance Center in Orlando, but the entire wrestling world is wanting to know, hey, what's next for AJ? Is he leaving WWE on good terms?

Is he going to pop up somewhere else? Well, I think we have our answer on whether or not. not he's leaving on good terms. They are giving him what feels like a proper farewell on Monday, the 23rd. Do you think there will be any physicality? Will it turn into an angle or will it just be a classy? See you. Thanks for the memories, AJ story.

Depends on AJ's plans going forward. If there are plans for AJ to do things within WWE, I don't see, no, I don't see them doing anything physical. I mean, look, AJ said he wants to retire from his in ring. He's retiring. Well, he's retiring from WWE. We don't know whether or not he's ever going to a wrestle again. We can assume that if he does, well, I'll assume that if he does,

it's because as we discussed last week or the week before, there are certain people he'd like to work with just for personal reasons before he finally hangs it up. That could be true. If that's true, close to be. being accurate, what sense would it make to do something physical, unless it's to put AJ over in some positive way? That could be. That would be taking it quite far, but it's possible. But if that's not it, then what would the advantage of doing anything physical if there's no

way to end the story, if it's just physicality for the sake of physicality? It's like Hulk would say, Hmm. Where's it go next week? You know, what do you do? And if there's no really good answer for that, you probably won't do it. Let's keep our fingers crossed for AJ Styles. I, for one, I'm not going to miss this coming Monday Night Raw. We hope you guys will check it out.

You can call that, by the way. I'm going to interrupt you, even though it's rude. And I hate it when I do it to other people. But I will to put you over. You did call that. The accuracy on this show, it's really uncanny. It's it's it's it's it's it's it's freaking epic Can I give you another one that I think we can predict correctly?

I'm into predictions I got one more left before the show's over we haven't talked about AEW at all there's a there's a report going around that Chris Jericho is still firmly under AEW contract and it's written here the belief from those around Jericho and in AEW is that his deal was frozen after he took time off in 2025 you smell that Eric how do you read that i mean i take that at face value okay well what's my what's larry thompson's favorite word that he says that you like bullshit buddy that's what that is a hundred a million percent why do you think that i'm not the delay the delay says freaking everything you're not as good of poker player as you think you are i'm not going to say what's larry what's larry call

it bullshit that's what that is i mean and by the way, I want to be surprised. I'm pulling for whatever's coming next. I'm a wrestling fan first and foremost. I want to see the surprise. But that, my friends, is some bullshit. That's some fake news.

But listen, that's what makes wrestling fun. Let's keep them guessing. But who published the news? I don't want to dump on anybody, but it was reported by a major wrestling website, and it's one of our friends, but he got bad information in my opinion.

In my opinion. playing the mud with the pigs, you're about to get muddy. You know what's bad is, Eric, I, uh, it's hard to sort through some of the nonsense sometimes because this is an industry built on making people believe. It's, it's an industry built on priding itself on working people. And by the way, working people outside the confines of, of professional wrestling is commonly known as fucking line.

But working people, brother, is part of the deal. And I think, unfortunately, when it comes to real life stuff, sometimes people in the industry, they will work other people. And you have sometimes categorized those folks as saying they become, for the people passing the news along, a useful idiot. But there's some half-truths and not so true at all stuff being reported about this, I think. Always has been. Always will be. Sometimes. Yeah.

Everybody's guilty of it, is, aren't they? I mean, the spin, the distortion, the lies by omission with regard to probably every wrestling organization at some point, probably every business at some point or another. It's just the normal course of business. I'm not surprised. It's like the nonsense with AEW and their $185 million a year contract. and whether or not, you know, Time Warner owned a percentage of AEW. Now it's out that it's under 5%.

Here's my other prediction. When it's all said and done, we may never know unless there's a merger acquisition or something that forces the issue. But I suspect the number, the equities somewhere between 20 and 25% of AEW, not the 2% or 3% or whatever it is. it's been released by somebody to the internet, to be disseminated in the internet wrestling community. So we'll see when it's over.

I've been right pretty much, though. You know, you look at little dots, you look at little pieces of information, you look at patterns. I always say that. I just look at the patterns over a course of time. There was a reason why last week, CNN, the Warner Company,

released the information about Warner's position in AEW. We talked about it last week. It made no sense. It had a weird smell. It didn't smell good. It wasn't a revelation of information that was a positive spin for the company, and it wasn't necessarily bad. It didn't smell good.

It didn't smell bad. It just smelled very different. different. And I've been thinking about that ever since. And I think there was more to that than probably met the eye. And I suspect there's more involvement in Time Warner in AW than is we have been led to believe or what is readily available to the public. There you go. Did you just a minute ago suggest that you think Warner Brothers owns like 20 or 25 percent? I think they own more than we've been led to believe. So it could be as much as that.

The reports that are out there that say, hey, with a publicly traded company, if you own more than X percent, you have to disclose it. I forget if that threshold is five or 10 percent, but it has to be. I think it's five percent,

but there are ways. We all know. It's accounting. There are. Oh, I see what you're saying. Generally accepted accounting principles. Yeah.

There are ways to structure things like this. And I don't know anything. But I know what I went through at Turner. I saw how things work. I see dots. I pick up a piece of information here, there, see the pattern, and go, hmm, this is the only thing that makes sense to me. So we'll see what happens.

You know, 98 point some odd percent, correct? Maybe this is, you know, maybe this will take me down. Who knows? We'll find out eventually. hopefully we'll find out. Hey, I want to show a little love to AEW's MJF. You know, we talked a little bit about Booker T and him winning the worst announcer award last week and how silly that was. But I did enjoy that when they introduced Booker on NXT this week,

they introduced him as the award winning commentator, which I thought was fabulous. MJF, though, took up for Booker T over the weekend, which I thought was tremendous. He took to Twitter and wrote, Booker T in a lot of ways is a blueprint to me. a completely homegrown top guy with massive drawing power on Warner TV without having to have worked for McMahon. If you dislike what he does in the booth, that's fine. But you guys talk crazy on Legends. Show some respect. He's earned it.

Man, that's a pretty nice message from MJF, especially for a guy we don't like, right? Straight up. I wish he wouldn't have done it. But I respect him in a way. I respect his sentiment tremendously. Just stay in character.

I don't. And maybe that's just me hanging on to a formula that just I refuse to let go of. But I do believe you should stay in character. At least try to stay close. Use social media as an adjunct to your character for television. I just, I think portraying one character on TV and then portraying another character in your social media. I mean,

there's good and bad parts to it, but I think overall it's a negative. Well, I like just believing he's a heel. Just be a freaking heel. DM and private message him. But stay in character, dude. Come on. Well, if you want to stay in character, you need to feel like yourself.

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They're going to ask you where you heard about them. Please support our show and tell them that we sent you. Eric, I don't know that you saw the news, but friend of the show Paul Walter Hauser, he's confirmed that he is attached to portray Mick Foley in a limited series. He reported on the Stunner Network. We can kind of break that news. I haven't said it yet, but I'm attached to play Mick in a limited series. We haven't gone out to market with it yet, but it's happening. Man, I love the idea of Mick Foley being featured in some sort of Hollywood type production. What a crazy story he's got. What an interesting and dynamic character he will be.

but Paul Walter Hauser, a clinically, or not clinically, critically acclaimed performer. I mean, he's had a golden globe on AEW and Hid Jeff Jared over the head with it, I think. I mean, this guy has been in some big time stuff and he's going to do a wrestling role. I think this is pretty cool, pretty exciting. What do you think? It is. And he's such a great actor and he's so passionate about wrestling. And he's so knowledgeable that there is no question he's going to do a phenomenal job.

I hope it gets a lot of support from a studio. I hope it gets great distribution. I hope it's promoted very well because Paul Walter Hauser is. He is a fanatic when it comes to wrestling. He's, he truly loves the art of the business, the psychology of it, the storytelling aspect of it. He's immersed himself in it. It's going to be amazing to watch.

Something else that just happened today, or at least it was revealed today, Pat McAfee is leveling up. It's written here, TKO CEO Ari Emanuel is reportedly trying to turn Pat McAfee into the next Sylvester Stallone. He's begun booking McAfee into film and television roles with McAfee having a four-episode arc on the upcoming season of Tulsa King, which stars Stallone. He's also has a role booked in the upcoming Mosquito Bowl movie. This is all being reported in mainstream media, you know, one of the broads, broadcasters who's been in the ring and obviously doing his own thing on a regular basis with ESPN and the Pat McAfee show, revolutionized college game day. And now he's going to scripted. What do you make of this report?

I think it's great. I mean, is Pat McAfee living the greatest post NFL career in the history of post NFL careers? Probably. I mean, this is awesome. Again, has anybody else? in the NFL, post-N-N-FL had any kind of success that comes anywhere close to this? I mean, I know there's been guys who've emerged that have gone on to become prominent sportscasters, legendary sportscasters, but they've stayed within the game of football. Pat's out there doing everything. It's crazy. Good for him. Yeah, I mean, he is the modern equivalent of the king of all media.

You know, I know how it's starting with that a generation ago, but it feels like he may be, you know, when you're talking about other guys who've had great success, you know, a mainstream standpoint, not nearly to the level Pat McAfee has as far as influence. But Michael Strayhan hosting Good Morning America, I don't think I would have predicted that just because he didn't have the conventional morning show host looks. And to-da, he crushed it on Good Morning America, which I don't know that I would have guessed that. Yeah, well, I look forward to seeing it.

And I love Tulsa King, by the way. It's one of my favorites. Oh, God. Mayor of Kingstown is really, really good. Like really good.

I tapped out on that one. I understand why. But, and I came close to it as well, but I stuck it out. And now I'm glad I did. But Tulsa, I love Tulsa King.

I mean, just how do you know, it's just light, fun. It is. Now, if you're not taking it seriously, it's light and fun and easy.

Yeah. But boy, it is some cheesy, terrible shit. But you got to be in the mood. And every now and again, listen, every now and again, I like a frozen pizza. You know, it's not the best pizza, but hey, it has its place. That's Tulsa King to me. It's comfort food. Yeah, there you go. There you go. They're great characters. It's tongue and cheek at times. Yes. There's some phenomenal actors in that series. I, the storytelling, look, it's cheesy.

it's not meant to be taken seriously. It's medium light entertainment, but it's pretty damn good. It's well done. Well, something that we do take seriously is saving people money. I recently had a chance. I don't know what motivated me to do so,

but I scroll through some of our reviews over at savewithconrad.com today, Eric, and I saw some that just really jumped off the page at me. And I wanted to share these because I know that there's a lot of folks who are kind of struggling right now. It feels like there's more month at the end of the money and that sort of thing. and I've sent some of these testimonials or I guess their reviews that were left at savewithconrad.com forward slash reviews check them all out for yourself but

Silva's got one here for us that I wanted to share with everybody and I thought how nice this was. This is from Justin. He says the team at Supreme Lending helped me bundle all my debt into one manageable bill and I finally feel like my head is above water after drowning in debt for years. The process was easy and they were available and helpful. He gave us five stars. we've got another review here. This one comes to us from Gerard. He's out in Colorado. And Gerard writes, Diane was extremely helpful and supportive. She was frequently available and hasty in response when she was unavailable.

She took the time to answer every question and really made the process simple and streamlined, unlike other mortgage companies I've worked with in the past. And no payments for two months, I have the peace of mind to work on building up savings on top of the already great affordable rate and payments they were able to get me. win, win all the way. And we would love to help your family. I don't know if you've seen this, but towards the beginning of the month, Fannie and Freddie announced that they were pumping $200 billion back into mortgage back securities in an effort to get rates lower. Well, this past November, they removed their minimum credit score requirement.

Once upon a time, you had to have a 620 credit score. Since that time, I've been able to help families in the 530s. So to explain, you can't have a credit score in the 530s unless you are currently delinquent. You're actively delinquent. Well, Fannie and Freddie say, hey man, we're most interested in how you've paid your housing payment. So if you've had your house payment drafted out of your account, no matter what your credit score is, you could still save money at save with Conrad.com. That's not me saying that. That's Freddie. That's Fannie. Not only that earlier this week, they started a new program on the Fannie Mae side called Refine Now. That expanded your

debt to income ratio to 65%. Here's what that means to you and I and layman speak. If you're overwhelmed with credit card debt and it's all you can do to just make your minimum payments each month, this program was built for you. Once upon a time, if you had too much debt, you wouldn't qualify to save money. I know that doesn't make any sense, but that's the way the banking system was set up. Fannie and Freddie with this new program will allow those folks who were much deeper in debt, who need the help the most to now still qualify for a cheaper payment and save a boatload of cash in the meantime. It's a brand new program from Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, and we can help you with that

at save withconrad.com. You don't need perfect credit. You don't need money out of your pocket. We're not going to charge you an application fee or a credit report fee. If we can't find a solution that saves you money, we'll part friends. But what if we could save you $1,000 a month and you wouldn't have a house payment for the next two months? That's right.

No payments in March or in April. You're done until May 1st. If you're lacking to get a little bit of peace of mind, you're looking to save a little cash hit the reset button on your household finances let us run the numbers see what we can do for you at save with conrad dot com give us a call toll free at 888 4250105 or shoot us an email directly at conrad at save with conrad dot com save with conrad dot com equal housing lender animaless number 2129 save with conrad dot com and erika before you know it man you know we had a blast in atlanta but before you know it we're going to be in now

Nashville. I can't believe this was real, but we celebrated the WCW history together at the end of January. We had the power plant. We had the old TBS set. We had Tony Chivani and David Crockett. You got to do your own ring entrance. You got to take bumps with Sergeant Buddy Lee Parker. And there was a whole lot of other fun stuff, including going to see all of the props, like the prop master, if you will, of WCW, the behind the scenes of the business. How fun was that? We're going to do it again, T&A style at the end of May. Let's take a look. This May. Wrestling history comes home.

As Ring Classics brings you the ultimate wrestling fan experience at the birthplace of TNA, Nashville, Tennessee. It's Jeff Jarrett's Asylum, May 29th to 31st. Ring Classics is giving you something most wrestling fans only dream about. A true backstage pass to the business. Not from the crowd, not from behind a screen. You'll learn firsthand what it's like to be a pro wrestler. Cutting Chrome.

Making your entrance, stepping inside the ring, and training like the pros do. You'll visit historic wrestling landmarks, be part of exclusive panels, get up-close meet and greets, and experience huge surprises along the way. This May in Nashville, you're not just watching wrestling history, you're stepping directly into it. But there's only one way to be a part of Jeff Jarrett's asylum, and that's by being a backstage passholder at ringclassics.com today. Sign up by the end of February to be eligible to join Double J in Nashville this May at ringclassics.com.

This May in Nashville for Jeff Jarrett's asylum weekend. The only way to be a part of it is to be a backstage passholder at ringclassics.com. Sign up before the end of February to be eligible. Head over right now to sign up. Ringclassics.com. Eric, today was a lot of fun, man. I had a good time talking about the news and everything that's moving and shaking and pro wrestling. And I'm pretty fired up, man.

We're just like a week away from you setting another record with Real American Freestyle. I'm going to have my system ready to record. We're going to be watching live at the here at the Conradison. I'm pumped for you guys, man. Congrats on all your success. Thank you very much for that. And just a reminder, if you want to check out Real American Freestyle on like Saturday, the 28th from Tempe.

You can do it at Fox Nation. If you've got Amazon Prime, you can find us through Amazon Prime. If you live outside of the United States, you can watch us live on the REF wrestling YouTube channel. So I'm getting a lot of my timeline is filled with people ask me how they can watch Real American Freestyle outside of the U.S. So we are geo-blocked YouTube in the U.S. You can only watch on Fox Nation. But outside of the U.S., you can watch live on our YouTube channel. So check it out.

Real American Freestyle.com has all the information about how to watch, where to watch, when to watch, who's fighting, and how to subscribe. It's the best value in combat sports. Go check it out. Real American Freestyle.com. Eric, today was a blast. I can't wait to see how many of these predictions come true. And we'll be talking about the good, the bad, and the ugly next week right here on 83 weeks

with Eric Fishoff.