83 Weeks with Eric Bischoff - Strictly Business with Eric Bischoff #52: NXT to The CW ft. Mike Johnson

Episode Date: November 9, 2023

This week on Strictly Business, Eric Bischoff and Jon Alba are joined by Mike Johnson of PWInsider to dish all on NXT's move to The CW. What does this mean for WWE and TV rights going forward? We discuss. Special thanks to this week's sponsors! Manscaped- Get 20% Off and Free Shipping with the code WRESTLEBIZ at Manscaped.com. WrestleCade - Pick up your tickets for WrestleCade weekend at WrestleCade.com! FOLLOW ALL OF OUR SOCIAL MEDIA at https://83weekslinks.com/ Stop throwing your money on rent! Get into a house with NO MONEY DOWN and roughly the same monthly payment at SaveWithConrad.com On AdFreeShows.com, you get early, ad-free access to more than a dozen of your favorite wrestling podcasts, starting at just $9! And now, you can enjoy the first week...completely FREE! Sign up for a free trial - and get a taste of what Ad Free Shows is all about. Start your free trial today at AdFreeShows.com If your business targets 25-54 year old men, there's no better place to advertise than right here with us on Strictly Business. You've heard us do ads for some of the same companies for years...why? Because it works! And with our super targeted audience, there's very little waste. Go to AdvertiseWithEric.com now and find out more about advertising with Strictly Business. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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What's going on? Everyone's time for another edition of Strictly Business with Eric Bishaw, presented to you by the ad-free shows and podcast Heat Networks. I am John Alba. We have a great edition of Strictly Business ahead for you. We've got a special guest who's going to talk all about the CW and NXT deal, and we're going to talk about the Vladimir documentary as well. But before we get into any of that,

we're going to bring in the man to the hour of my guy. Mr. Eric Bischoff, what's going on easy? And the crowd goes, nothing, just me and my dog. Bro, you had like 30 plus years, 40 years of crowds going wild for you. So it's okay. You're in, you're in retrieve now. Great to see you, man. That painting behind you.

I'd been spotting that while we've been taping. Tell me all about that, man. I'm going to throw you full screen here because that is awesome. Yeah, that is the moment. the moment that in my opinion at least and I think an opinion of a fair number of people really changed the wrestling industry in the mid-90s. It's obviously the moment after the big leg drop on the macho man Randy Savage. It's an oil painting gifted to me by none other than my podcast partner over at 83 weeks, Conrad Thompson. It's an oil painting framed by

I paint your life, and it's that moment right after the big leg drop, and you look closely, you'll see the garbage in the ring. Mean Gene Oakland is interdoing Hulk Hogan when Hulk is letting the world know that you can call them the new world order of professional wrestling. It's a very, very historical point in time, certainly for me personally, but I think the industry is a whole. And it's just cool as hell. The detail, again, you can't see it from here, but the detail on it is just amazing.

amazing now i got to come up with something big for christmas to get you because that is going to be a hard one to top that's some good stuff there i was i was really i was shocked you know i knew it's coming i had it sitting up behind me conrad didn't want me to see it so mrs b went and borrowed a couple easels from a friend of mine who's an artist or a friend of hers who's an artist in town set him up i wasn't home then she unpacked the pictures put them up and put a silk over him so i couldn't see him it's kind of red wouldn't let me see there's two of them talk about that in the next week or two but um this one yeah in my office needed some color you know i got a picture of me and j leto on the wall there's one up there a couple of me

and mohammed ali and one of mohammad ali a boxing uh photo but i really don't have a lot of wrestling stuff in in my studio so that's my my one and only very cool very cool love to see that make sure you check out eric and conrad's work here on the 83 weeks feed of course you can subscribed 83 weeks.com. You're going to get Strictly Business and the 83 Weeks sent right to you every single weekend on YouTube. The 83 Weeks feed has all of that content covered. We're going to talk in content today on this edition of Strictly Business. Eric, we are bringing in Mike Johnson from PW Insider to discuss this NXTCW deal before we get into the conversation itself. What was your initial reaction when you heard the news?

Surprise. To be honest, I was surprised that USA would let it go. I was a little surprised that WWE would move their program over to CW, but after learning more from our guest who's coming up and reading a little bit more, it all started to make a great deal more sense. And Mike Johnson, the man who broke the news, he is probably going to do an in-depth job of explaining why, and how, and we'll all discuss what the future could possibly look like as a result. Yeah, the deal was officially announced November 7th, where starting in October 2024, NXT will move to the CW on a five-year agreement. As press release notes, it's the first time in the 13-year history of NXT that it will air on a broadcast television network, and it will air 52 live weekly events throughout the season. The indication is it will be live.

aiming to keep Tuesday nights, but there will be flexibility with that, as Nick Con and Ari Emanuel have both demonstrated in the past with their words. The one word, Eric, that kept being thrown around in the press release was sports. Even Nick Kahn's quote here from the press release, I'm going to say, quote, the CW has made impressive moves over the past year with its live sports programming schedule. It's a truly exciting opportunity to expand NXT's audience by bringing the show to broadcast television for the first time in NXT's history, end quote. The press release also notes W.W. NXT joins a growing roster of live sports on the CW network, including ACC football and basketball games, airing every Saturday throughout the season and live golf.

The CW is also the new home of the Emmy Award winning weekly studio series inside the NFL, and will bring NASCAR Xfinity series beginning in 2025. The network will soon offer more than 500 hours of sports programs. year round. Now, you and I are going to talk more about the sports element of this deal with Mike in just a few minutes here. But to hear pro wrestling mediated through the lens of live sports programming, when you yourself have said many times on this podcast that pro wrestling is not sport, what do you think of that potential change in perception there? I don't think it's a change in perception. I think it's a sales tactic. It's marketing. It's branding. It's creating a perception in order to control your reality.

It's not sports, folks. You can't bet on it. It is scripted entertainment that looks like sports. But I think the connection that I heard, because I know you love looking at professional wrestling as a sport. Hold on you're putting worse. But it's not sports. It's scripted.

Live action. entertainment, but the two words that coincided in all of those references that I'm sure everybody wants to believe that it's a sport in terms of the business. We all know what professional wrestling is, but to throw it into the same bucket as the NFL and ACC and NASCAR is great from an advertising or marketing perspective to would-be advertisers. Live. It's live. It's not sports. It's not live sports. It's not live sports. It's not live. It's just live and the value in professional wrestling because it has a loyal very loyal audience i would argue in some cases more loyal than some sports because it has a almost loyal to the point of

obsessive compulsive it's got a large loyal audience that want to see it live not one of them thinks it's a sport nor do any advertisers that that know what they're doing, think of it as a sport, but they do recognize that it's live and it's action and there's a sports-based audience that are going to be attracted to it. There is a lot of crossover, but it's not sport. I'm not calling it. I always say sports-centric is always the term I use. I'm on one of the biggest sports networks in the country at the regional level talking about the Yankees and the Mets and the Giants. You don't hear us talking about Roman Raines in L.A. night on S&Y every Thursday night. I recognize the difference, but I do think clumping it in with those major sports properties

there is only a good rub. That's all it is. It's a rub. Yes, certainly. It's no difference than putting the midcard talent that nobody really knows and is trying to break through and you see a lot of potential and then throwing them in the ring with the undertaker. It's a rub. That's all it is. It's not a sport, Nick Con. It's a freaking rub. Well, Mike Johnson, is going to give us quite the rub here on this edition of Strictly Business because it's going to be a great conversation you guys are going to enjoy. So let's not waste any more time without further ado. Let's welcome in our special guests, Mike Johnson. Well, Eric, it's time for us to welcome back. Mike Johnson of PW Insider, making his strictly business return here as the man who broke the CW NXT deal. And we're going to talk all about that alongside some other stuff. Mike, thanks for hopping back on Strictly Business with us. How's life treating you lately, man? I'm okay. Thank you, John. Thank you, Eric. Good to see you guys again. Thanks for having me. Interesting week, but it's always an interesting, crazy week in pro wrestling. I never stopped. But an interesting week for sure with the NXTCW stuff.

Let me jump in right off the bat. I want to start to show up right. First of all, props to you for breaking that story. Thank you. And moreover, props to you for being so good at what you do in covering wrestling, you're one of a handful, and you're at the top of the list, you and Dave Cher. And in my opinion, in terms of being credible and being a new site that's positive for the industry, when anything ever breaks from you or on PW Insider or from Dave, I don't have to second guess it. I don't spend a lot of time wondering if it's really true or if it's based on fourth-hand information that's not been verified. When it comes from you, brother, I know it's news and I know it's real.

So props to you and PW Insider, J. Sure, you guys do a great job. Well, I appreciate that. And, you know, listen, sometimes other people get stories before us. Sometimes we get them first. My whole goal has always been since this was my full-time gig was to be as honest with the audience as possible, to be as fair to everybody as possible to try and have empathy for people in the business. Because whether it's you or John or Tony Khan or Vince McMahon or Tavalec,

everybody's just trying to do the best job as they can in that moment. trying to make the best decisions that they can. And I realize everybody has the life, everybody is a family, and nobody walks into this world or the entertainment industry in general and thinks, I want to make a bad movie. It doesn't matter whether it's Star Wars or it's Giant Shark versus Mega Octopus or it's pro wrestling, whether it's AEW or WWE or Impact. Nobody's trying to have a bad product.

Everybody's trying to do the best thing that they believe in their heart is the best thing for their audience in the moment. So I always try to take that into consideration. And I really do try to like double and triple check stuff as much as possible. And sometimes like I knew I heard rumblings of this deal like eight weeks ago. And I could have went with it then. And I was like, let me be sure. Let me make sure.

Because one, the last thing you want to do is say, this is absolutely 100% happening. Put a stamp on it. And then it doesn't happen. Because you look like an idiot. You erode your own credibility. So sometimes having the patience to wait is as, important as being first. But being correct is always the most important thing. You're not always going to have 100% batting average. And when you don't, you got to jump on the grenade and

take that blame and try to explain yourself. But we really do try so hard to be fair to everybody and to be as accurate as possible. So I appreciate that. Because listen, there have been times you've been on the other end of my reporting. And I'm sure you haven't liked everything that I've reported. But I've always tried to reach out to you. I've always tried to be fair. I try to do that with everybody and I think everyone who writes about wrestling should john you know that it's you know if you're chasing a story you want to try and be fair to everybody because you don't know you're never going to know 100% every aspect or every dimension of every story but you want to try to get as much perspective as you can because that's the best way you're going to present anything to your readers

certainly and and i can i can attest i don't mean to jump in there john because that was directed to you But, you know, when I was active in the business and there were controversies or stories about to break, I can say firsthand, Mike and or Dave would reach out to me, Dave, sure that is, not the other idiot. Reach out and at least give me a chance to explain myself or verify or add to or give a perspective. And that's all anybody can ask. You know, I know I'm really hard on certain people on this site because I think not doing what. what you do, Mike, in verifying and giving people an opportunity to have input, especially when it's a major story or something that could affect somebody's life or the relationship with their employer. It's really important to get it right. And way too often,

there are too many people, we all know who I'm talking about, that just rush in and not only report a story, editorialize on it. And I just think that that's so not only unfair, but bad for business. So, again props to you guys thank you i appreciate that so let's get into the conversation and hang you said you heard about two months ago yeah about eight weeks ago that they were they were talking to and don't i didn't mean to cut you off i'm sorry right they they were they were c w was talking to a number of different people in the wrestling industry they you know obviously there's discussions oh there's an nwa deal no one from the cw and never told me there was but certainly on the nwa end there were people whispering oh we've heard this we've heard that but i know they were talking

and Dave Marquez Productions about potentially doing a live show every week out of Los Angeles, and it got to the point that they were doing blueprints for sets and strategies for our advertising and marketing and things like that. But then, you know, the giant ship that is WWE came looming in like Godzilla. And if you're a CW, are you going to go with an upstart or are you going to spend a little bit more and go with the industry leader and know that you've got a built-in audience? And I think that's what happened here is that rather than going with something that they would have had to help build from ground up. They went with something that even although NXT amongst the wrestling fans is considered

like the third tier brand to the outside world, it's still WWE. So there's a built-in ad audience there, no matter what brand it is. So there's a lot of ground I want to cover there that you just hit on because I think there's a lot of layers. And I want to start with that NWA thing because when the CW deal was announced first with NXT the other day or when you broke the news first, I should say, immediately everyone was like, well, what happened to this NWA deal that had been reported? And there was the note that indicated that the cocaine segment that Billy Corrigan had greenlit might have affected that.

What is your read on all that? That's what every wrestling fan is curious about. Okay, so here's my read on that. You cannot tell me that a two-second spot on a pay-per-view that only aired on Fight. TV was going to be such a big deal. And so many people watched it on Fight that the entire universe rose. in horror like Alderon had been blown up in Star Wars and went to the CW Network and said, how could you put this on your TV when it was never on there, never going to be on their TV to

begin with? I don't believe there's, I don't believe there's any bearing on that spot and the CW deal happening or not happening. What I believe happened is Billy Corrigan and his crew were selling this, I heard it was a 12 episode reality series about Billy running the NWA, and I would assume other aspects of Billy's life. Now, the WWW. deal doesn't start until the fall of 24. Right. The CW Network could put a 12-week show on tomorrow and air it for a couple of months and then it's done.

So that, you know, it's still possible that show could air in some way, shape, or form on the CW network just before the WWE deal officially kicks in and they start paying WWE. Because in my heart of hearts, I don't believe for a second, WW is letting any other wrestling on a network that they're currently on. So, Mike, I just want to make sure I understand. And I was one of the ones I thought that cocaine spot was just fucking stupid. It was just in bad taste. No, it didn't advance anything. It didn't do anything for anybody. All it was was a stupid spot to get people talking. And I think overall, it's one of those things, kind of like, you know, slicing somebody's forehead open with a pizza cutter is not good for business. And whether 12 people saw it on fight or 12 million people saw it on television, it's out there. It's in the universe. And it's another one of those things that add to the

stigma that professional wrestling has amongst people who are outside of the industry, who aren't fans, who don't follow it on social media, but who make decisions regarding programming and advertising. So I'm one of the ones that cried stupid on that one. It's like people are, I think what I said on social media was people are inventing ways to screw up good opportunities. But what I'm most curious about is I understand the Billy Corrigan reality show. That's an easy thing to sell.

He funded it himself for crying out. loud so yeah you know it's it's like doing a fishing show because you like to see yourself fishing on tv it's a vanity project but there are two separate things i was led to believe not believe but i was in i read on social media that cw was considering an nwa wrestling series and oh by the way there's a reality series what i'm hearing you say is there's a reality series but there was no confirmation i've never i don't mean to cut you off i've never heard anything from anyone in the broadcast industry that i speak to and i speak to a lot of people in that world because that's the world the entertainment world is what i worked in before i did this for a living

and i haven't heard from anybody on the cw network and i've written some pretty high up people there that have come back to me and said yeah we're we're in discussions with corrigan the show's definitely happening this is this is 100% true what i believe happened is i think they probably had i'm saying probably probably had conversations about the reality show and in those conversations it was like oh and we have a wrestling show too and if you guys would like this maybe you could put it on your app maybe you know that would be that's what my guess is that would be natural that makes sense right and that's my guess it's all like part of this expansion from c w that we can get into during the course of this conversation where c w is starting to try and put a lot more emphasis on

sports-centric properties. And that's what I want to ask you about right now with all of this NWA talk, WWE talk. Is that the lens that from the indication you've gotten that the higher ups at Next Star and CW view pro wrestling as sports-centric programming? Yeah, well, I think part of it is one, sports is always kind of Teflon. Whether it's WWE or the NFL or a golf or the NBA, there's a built-in audience that's going to want to watch it live because unlike everything else that could be watched later on via video on demand or DVR. Do you kind of need to know sports right in the moment, right? Like, as we're recording this, there's a new Marvel movie coming out.

Those Marvel fans want to see that movie. The second it comes out, they don't want to be spoiled. They don't want it ruined. They want to know what's going to happen with Captain Marvel and Goose and all these other characters. Sports fans are that way times a million. There's no NBA fan that's going to sit there and go, well, I want to see what's going to happen when the Knicks play the Philadelphia 76ers, and I'll wait three days to find out.

That doesn't happen with sports fans. NFL fans or anything. And WWE kind of has that sort of allure built into it. So I think that's part of the reasons why they look to pro wrestling in general. But certainly WWE. And the other thing is, if you look at the numbers that the CW network has brought in over the last couple of years, they've done some really wonderful shows if you're a superheroes fan or you're a teen drama fan with Riverdale and things like that, Supernatural. But those shows aren't bringing in over a million people a week. They're bringing in a million people a week on a good week. Next star, they bought it because

or they bought controlling interest I should say because they want to reshape it in their own image and it's a lot easier to bid on sports programming that they believe will bring in an audience automatically like inside the NFL has been an institution forever bringing it to the CW brings

all those decades of prestige and football fans to their network and to me I just think WWE fits their bill and it's more it's not I don't think it's as much as they want to be in the wrestling business, as much as they want to be in the live sports business. And WWE sits on the precipice of that and brings in an automatic audience. If you look at the numbers that NXT brings in on the USA Network, if those numbers transfer 100% from

one to the other, it'll be, if not the top thing in all of CW, but in that top 1% of all of their programming. So it's just a smart buy for them, even if they're paying more than USA Network paid for. Have you ever wanted your shot at meeting Eric Bischoffel? Now is your chance to meet him along with more than 130 other legends and figures from around the world of professional wrestling over at Russellcade. It's a three-day family-friendly convention going down November 24th through November 26th in Winston-Salem, North Carolina. All you got to go to is wrestlekid.com to pick up your tickets. You're going to have an opportunity to meet these people. You're going to have an opportunity to get autographs from them. You're going to get a chance

to take pictures with them, to chat with them, live shows, live podcasts, including my other podcast, The Extreme Life of Matt Hardy. Matt Hardy and I are going to take the stage and discuss how he was able to conceptualize the broken Matt Hardy character right there, live on stage November 24th in Winston, Salem, North Carolina. That's Hardy Country as a matter of fact. You can pick up those tickets at Russellcade.com. And for the entire festival as well, meet and greets, paper views, panels, podcasts, costume

contests, merchandise, and a whole lot more. head on over to wrestlek.com and pick up your tickets now. Yeah, and that also is a broadcast channel. It has more exposure in more homes. Now, Eric, we have been keeping this in our periphery for a long time now, even dating back to when we started discussing the live golf stuff and how CW was starting to build somewhat of a platform. They've added NASCAR in a smaller form since then.

What kind of value do you see WWE for a platform that is, is just trying to establish itself as a sports-centric property. You know, it's interesting because I got up this morning and was searching for a book that I read many, many, many years ago. I think right after I started working for Turner Broadcasting, it was one of the first biographies, I think, on Ted Turner. There's been several cents, but this one of the first ones, at least, that I read. And there's a whole chapter, really, about how it was Ted's life growing up

and how he, you know, bought the sign company from his father and then had a vision for television. And, you know, it really does a great job of covering the visionary that Ted Turner is and was at that time. But there was an entire chapter on the beginning years of Ted programming TBS when it, like Superstation. Right off the bed, his first really big move in cable was creating the superstation. and the book talked a lot about Ted's view on professional wrestling and some of the other types of programming that and Ted wasn't a programmer he didn't come up in the programming industry in the television industry he was working off of instinct and Ted believed that even though shows like or programs like professional wrestling didn't have the allure of you know first run syndication things that he couldn't afford at that time Ted believed that professional wrestling was a consistent, bankable way to build an audience and build a network from the ground up. You have to attract the eyeballs because of wrestling, if WWE does what we all think it probably will, based on your question at least, and you migrate, let's say 75% of its current regular audience over to CW, that's a major win. a different demo, probably similar in some respects to some of the content they already have.

But you're bringing an entire, what, three or four decade proven television commodity to your network and you're going to be, more people are going to be watching your network, which allows you to promote some of these other programs that will fall into the same kind of programming appetite that a lot of your current demo has. It's a great way to build a network, and it's the same way Ted Turner built TBS and Turner Broadcasting because he could afford professional wrestling where he couldn't afford first run syndication. He couldn't afford movies, you know, out of the library. He couldn't afford the MGM library at the time.

He eventually bought it. But at that time, he needed affordable programming that he knew would deliver an audience. We're just seeing history repeat itself, brother. Let's be honest, finding the right promotional products can feel overwhelming. But with 4-imprint, it's easy. Four-imprint makes it stress-free, straightforward, and backed by real peace of mind. That's 4-imprint certainty. Not sure what promo products to order?

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Plus, you could get up to $15,000 in free gold or silver with a qualified purchase. Don't wait. Text iHeart to 50505 today and take the first step toward protecting your savings. Now, Mike, we talk about finances here quite a bit on strictly business, and this has been one of the elements of this story that has been reported somewhat differently by a bunch of different outlets. Nothing has been firmly confirmed as far as how much of an increase that NXT will be getting here what is the indication you currently have as of this recording well ira manuel himself on the tka

group holdings call said they had a 70 70% increase deadline hollywood has said that they were getting 15 million a year from the usa network for the nxd brand so if that's the case they're getting over 30 something million from the uh from cw and that one person in the industry told me they thought the deal was as much as 35 to 37 million i don't know that i know that that's 100 percent accurate, but it's certainly in the 30 to 35 million range is my best estimate, which that's a huge, you know, when you think about the NST brand as it currently exists was created in 2012 by Paul LeVec, they were putting that on WWE's website, they were streaming on Hulu, and then it went on the WWE network. Now you're talking not even 10 years later,

they're getting $25, $35 million a year for the media rights for that brand. That's a huge win for WWE, you know, and in 2019, when it went to, you know, it only went to the US network like three four years ago now when in the fall of 2019 so think about the growth that that's had in terms of the prestige and the worth of what that brand means internally within wwe not just as a breeding ground for future WrestleMania performers but as a breeding ground for finally building a third viable brand which they tried to do so many times whether it was the new version of ECW with the original version of nxp or the 205 live they tried so many times to get things off the ground that just never really happened this version

of nxte is now turning bringing them a legitimate revenue stream where it didn't exist five years ago and now on top of that they can invest more money from it into their developmental system if they choose they now have a broadcast audience starting in the fall of 2024 where maybe the audience falls in love with a carmello hayes or a tiffany stratton or whoever and they become stars there on national tv as opposed to well we think they're ready we're going to pluck them up throw them on raw smackdown and And hopefully it works out the way it did when Vince McMahon was in charge of creative day-to-day. Like, this changes their entire process little by little. I don't think I'm going on in a limb here to think at some point,

you're going to pull NXT out of that performance center and start touring it again. Maybe it won't be in Madison Square Garden or big buildings, but you could run some smaller buildings and still have it look great with lasers and pyro and all that and it looks like more of a spectacle that people expect out of a WWE program. I think like by the time we get a year into the deal, unless something, something really unforeseen happens, the NXT brand is going to look a lot more pumped up and a lot more, a lot more juiced up and different than it currently does in that performance center. Let me jump in. A couple of questions on the price tag. I've read, obviously, it's all over the map.

I've heard reports that, you know, USA was paying 50 million an episode or 50 million a year for NXT. I hear you saying it was 15 million. That's what deadline Hollywood reported. They said 15. Okay. Well, I would believe Deadlight before I'd repeat, believe the people that reported that it was 50 million. But let's just say it was 15 million and now it's up to 30 million or whatever the number is, 35 million a year. That's roughly $575,000 an episode. I can promise you that that show from the Performance Center, that production does not cost 575. There's a good margin in that number. Yeah.

This is a profitable television movie. So it's not only going to, you potentially, because let's be honest, not a lot of people watch CW. It's the lower tier, obviously the lowest of the lowest tier, I think, of network. But if the indications between Livgolf and NASCAR, as John pointed out a few moments ago, now, WWE, that suggests to me that they're building that network. And if NXT is able to make that move still reach the audience. and I'm not just talking about the 18 to 49 year old demo, everybody, especially people that have never been in the television business, don't really understand the wrestling business. Yeah, the 18 to 49 demo is the live or die demo when it comes to advertising, which is more important to a network than it is to necessarily directly to the producers, in this case, AEW or WWE.

But why overall audience is, I won't say just as important, but very important. to a wrestling producer, whether it be, WW or AW or NWA or NWA or anybody else, is the larger the audience, the better your potential to drive live ticket sales. Because it's not just 18 to 49-year-olds that buy those tickets. Yes, advertising critical. It's the lifeblood of advertising.

But when it comes to pay-per-views or premium live events, whenever you decide to call them, when it comes to live events, ticket sales, the entire audience is important, not just the 18 to 49. My point is, though, if CW is growing and the platform is going to become bigger over the next three, four, five years, which apparently they're attempting to do that, and WWE and NXT is already profitable, which they will be at $575,000 an episode, if that show costs $250,000 an episode to physically produce, I would be surprised.

Because everything's there. You're not traveling trucks. You're not traveling props. You're not traveling stages. You're not even traveling talent. It's a very profitable venture at $575,000 an episode and the opportunity to expand and grow that audience. It's a good move. It's not all that different than your plan to take WCW to Vegas back in the day.

Well, yeah. I mean, there's an economy of scale when you have one location. And I get, because, you know, one of my critiques, It's not a criticism because it is what it is. It's a third string developmental territory. That's what it started out being. But when we saw AEW Dynamite head-to-head with NXT a few weeks back, man, you can't deny that watching Dynamite looked like a better presentation, right?

Forget about the matches and the quality of the matches and the storyline. Forget all of that. You just dropped down out of a freaking spaceship. You've never watched television before. somebody plops your alien ass down in front of two television and says, okay, watch these, which one is more fun to watch? More often, you're going to go to the event that feels like a live event because it's in an arena and you see a crowd.

We're conditioned that way as opposed to a soundstage. And I think taking the show on the road, no doubt gives it credibility and makes it feel more important. But it gets a lot more expensive once you start doing that. a lot more. Now, Mike, there's no true way to quantify this per se, but you're someone who is covering all these TV shows every week. You're very much in the weeds of it.

Too much in the weeds sometimes. And we've seen in the last few months how WWE has really tried to position NXT as a show where main roster stars are going to cross over. How much do you think that influenced the monetary value of NXT in these television discussions. Well, it certainly didn't hurt. Neither did having

NXT talents like Dragon Lee and Tiffany Stratton on Raw or SmackDown. You know, I think the entire point of that experiment was to take away some of the pre-resequent of oh, this is just the guys who aren't

you know, they're not ready for prime time players are down in NXT. I think they really wanted there to be more parity between Raw and SmackDown and NXT with the idea that by raising NXT up, you could have something that if Becky Lynch needs to go and get off of Raw or SmackDown TV, she can go down to NXT and kind of refresh herself. And I'm not saying she needed that, but I'm just using her as an example of a talent. You know, maybe their storyline is over and you want to keep them busy but not expose them more

because you have other stories going on. So you could send them to NXT where she can help Leah Valkyri or, or typically, Stephanie Stratton or whoever. And I think there were a lot of different plates that they were spinning at the same time, but certainly the long-term goal here was to make NXT much more credible and give it a lot more prestige

than I think some wrestling fans and some viewers thought that it had because like Eric said, if you looked at one, you looked at the other, it's like, oh, it's in a smaller building, it's in a sound stage. It doesn't have the same allure of an arena that has AEW Dynamite

or WW Monday Night Raw. But by having a John Sina or an undertaker or Becky Lynch or Ray Mysterio or even, you know, Judgment Day, I think because Ria and Dominic have been such a hot act, putting them on NXT was just as important as anything else. You make people believe, all right, anything can happen here. I need to watch more often. This is something it's just as important as anything else. It's not just this little side pocket of WWE where, you know, if you're a diehard fan,

you've got to pay attention to everything. Now the big stars might be there. I need to tune in. And certainly that's going to make broadcasters go, oh, wait, if we can have this for X amount of dollars and the Undertaker might be on, or they can bring John Cena in or they can load up the big shows every now and then, that'll only help our bottom line. And we're going to get more for our dollars. So why wouldn't we want to be involved in it? Yeah, I think about this, too, if you're a programmer and you've got a big movie coming out that has a similar demo, similar appetite to professional wrestling, and you're going to premiere that series or that movie or that event, whatever it may be. And it's a big deal for you.

now you've got nxte with the potential of an undertaker showing up to help boost the ratings and help drive people to what's coming up next it's it's subtle but it's a really important factor when it comes to making a decision about professional wrestling because you have to understand the potential that it has to help grow your network and grow other programming if you do it right and the one thing that they have in the company's 40 year history is they're so great at integrating everything into their programming, whether it be music, whether it be film characters, whether it be marketing, you know, even going back to the zombie movie with Batista for Netflix, when they had all the zombies on the show, as stupid as that was, and as

goofy as that was for wrestling fans, they got paid for that. And it helped promote the fact that, hey, there's a zombie movie starring Batista, who every WWE fan likes and respects. Maybe I'll sign up for Netflix to watch it. So I mean, and this is what gets lost on viewers. And it's not again, it's criticism, there's no way you can expect people to understand an industry that they're not involved in. But yes, as you pointed out, that particular stunt, you know, wrestling fans hated it. But it was good for the advertiser, the studio, right? But here's the real benefit that lives much beyond that particular moment when that stunt

aired is that the industry, the movie industry, the studios, who probably already know, This is another great example. And advertisers, it's just another reminder that there's a lot of different ways you can use WWE, as you just pointed out, whether it's music or videos or movies or whatever it is. It's a very valuable piece of content that serves a purpose that no other form of entertainment can. Yeah. You know, you can't stunt an episode of an eight-week or ten-week series that was produced 18 months ago. It's done. It's in the can. There's no flexibility with WWE or

AEW if they ever get their wheels on tight. It's a hell of a hell of a marketing opportunity. Other than SNL, there's nothing that's produced live as often as pro wrestling with that can intersect with any piece of pop culture that it needs to in that moment. That's the beauty of wrestling. It is whatever anybody wants it to be from a creative standpoint. Sure. And I want to cycle back to a point that you made earlier where you noted the next star the broadcasting company was the majority owner of the cw with majority controlling interest as a lot of fans have pointed out warner brother's discovery does have a piece of it 12.5 percent is there any indication to you that this will have any effect whatsoever on a w television rights that are currently up in the air and the direction

where that's going to go is it simply within its own bubble what kind of like can you shed here I don't think the NXTVL has any cascading effect on whatever the future of AEW is. Because like you said, Warner Bros. Discovery doesn't have controlling interest. So they could voice an opinion. But at the end of the day, Next Star is going to say, we spent a lot of money and we're going to run this and govern it the way that we see fit. If you wanted to own it and run it, you could have not sold it to us. So I don't think it's going to have. Listen, I can't say 100% what's going to happen.

I don't have a crystal ball for every single thing in pro wrestling in the future. None of us do. If we did, we'd all be multi-billionaires already. But I really don't think that's going to, like, that, that ball is going to bounce down to AEW. I don't think a CW deal when WBD has so many investments and so many different things they're involved in is going to affect anything to do with AEW on TBS, TNT, etc. The only thing that's going to affect that is what Warner Brothers executives think AEW is worth when the the current deal expires and what they're willing to pay to keep it going forward, if they're willing to pay to keep it going forward. We'll see.

Eric, do you have thoughts on that? No, I absolutely agree. I think we all have a tendency to read too much into the spider web and the connectivity between all these different entities when it comes to broadcast or cable. I'm going to be interested in where AEW ends up with WWBD. I've heard also, these are just rumors. I don't believe anything I've read so far. that Warner Brothers' discovery is interested in Raw.

Don't know if that's true. That would be interesting because of the fallout that would occur. But at the end of the day, I still believe, firmly believe, WBD owns 30% of AEW. So that's a factor as well. But we just recently heard from Fox, and I don't remember the executive, Loughlin, Mernard?

Yeah, yeah. Came out and said, we couldn't afford Smackdown because the ad rates, even though it got great audience, oftentimes number one for the night, in demos included, you still couldn't get the premium dollars that your audience should get. It's still what they call an opportunistic buy in the world of advertising is you get a hell of an audience, but since it's not. not very high in demand amongst advertisers, you get a much lower CPM or cost per thousand

in SmackDown than you would get in a drama or comedy or a movie. AEW is going to have the same issue. At some point in time, WBD is going to have to look at the math. And if Smackdown and Fox were having a hard time getting an equitable value for their audience, I can only imagine. Imagine, basically on the fact that it's a new brand and advertisers aren't just going to jump on a new brand. They're going to buy numbers. But at a certain point, you've got to look at the audience and how it's deteriorated on Turner and ask yourself, is it really worth the money that we're spending? And it's getting to the point where I think it's probably questionable.

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Because that's the final domino that has yet to fall here. USA, they're investing in Smackdown. That's being looked at as the A show right now with the amount of money they're throwing at it. Does this give any indication in your opinion that Raw could be on its way to a streaming network? or another network altogether, or does this still keep Comcast, NBC Universal, still in the equation here? All right. So Ari Emanuel said they're taking their time. They're having robust conversations. He loves that word robust. Robust and Wheelhouse. Those are the two words that guy loves. And he said they're talking to a lot of broadcasters, which I would assume that he meant cable, and a lot of streamers.

I know how Nick Kahn thinks to an extent based on just the patterns of what he does. and I look at it like this, they've got one show on broadcast, they've got one show on cable, obviously NXT and Smackdown, I really wonder if now's the time where they're going to go, hey, let's go for Amazon Prime Video, or let's go for a Disney Plus, and put something on streaming. So they've got a footprint in all the different little levels of broadcasting right now. That's a fascinating, that's a fascinating take line, because that's, forget about the fact that we're talking about professional wrestling. That's diversification. That would be the same approach, a good, you know, fund manager would take is don't put all your eggs in one basket.

And I never thought of that. You know, you've got broadcast covered. You've got cable covered. Let's put our foot in streaming so that we're diversified across the board. That's really smart. And when you think about it, what are all these streamers doing now? They're going back to what we, you and I, Eric, certainly grew up on. John's a little younger. No matter what, we were watching television and we had to sit through commercials. And with streaming platforms, a lot of them are doing a lot of ad supported programming now, whether it be something like Tooby, you know,

the free advertising and the, but Amazon's Prime Video was looking at doing programming that would include ads that are built into the programming. And certainly Monday Night Raw, you could do all sorts of programming like that, whether it's ad product placement, whether it's sponsorships or whether it's,

all right, we'll be back in two minutes on Amazon. Here's some words from our sponsor and, you know, and the Muppet show goes off the air and here's your commercials that you have to sit through for two minutes. Because unlike a DVR,

you can't fast forward. through those commercials. So think about how much that. Think about how much that would be worth to an advertising buy. Mike, for the record, I did exist in this world pre-tebo. You're like 17, John. I made it very clear. I did watch television before you can fast-forward commercials.

I just want to make sure. But no, I think you're definitely on to something in that. One that just came to mind for me, too, even, Mike, was we just got this announcement this week that Disney Plus and Hula are consolidating as one streaming platform. And think about the opportunities for audience growth on that and how appealing that would be for a live sports entity. Bob Iger said this week as well that ESPN is going to be going direct to consumer at some point within the next two years.

So those wheels have to be churning in some capacity. And you think about this. UFC has made a ton of money by selling their pay-per-view rights to ESPN Plus, where you have to be an ESPN-plus subscriber. just to be able to order the pay-per-view. So you're paying your ESPN Plus charge every month, but then you're paying per pay-per-view. Who's to say that down the line,

whether it be Disney on Disney Plus or another platform, doesn't want to do that when the peacock rights come up. Hey, we can have Monday Night Raw, and then they could feed right into direct pay-per-view where you have to be a subscriber to our platform and then pay $30 to watch Survivor Series or WrestleMania or whatever. I know, like, for everyone who's now been conditioned to paying $9.99, for everything, for every

WWE show per month, that doesn't mean it's always going to last that way. So they could change their, when the peacock rights come up, they can always change the parameter of the deal, you know, and be like, well,

now we're going to be on Hulu and Disney Plus, but WrestleMania is going to be $99 this year. And people will pay for it because they want, especially the dire wrestling events, they want to watch it into the moment. Or even if it's, hey,

you're going to pay $30 to watch it in the moment, and then it'll be on video on demand in a month. How many people would pay to watch it live? There'll be others who will wait to watch it on video on demand, but certainly people want to watch it in the moment. They want to see what's going to happen with their heroes, with their villains, with their storylines in the moment. No one wants to wait 30 days to find that if L.A. Night's going to be Roman Rains.

Certainly, that was not the case this past weekend when they were airing Crown Jewel. People were diving into watching that show. Let's be honest. Finding the right promotional products can feel overwhelming. But with 4 imprint, it's easy. For imprint makes it stress-free, straightforward, and backed by real peace of mind. That's for imprint certainty. Not sure what promo products to order?

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they're giving away a free wealth protection guide. Just text iHeart to 50505. Plus, you could get up to $15,000 in free gold or silver with a qualified purchase. Don't wait, text iHeart to 50505 today and take the first step toward protecting your savings. Certainly so. Certainly so. Eric, do you have anything else for Mike on this conversation because I do want to team up about something else as well. No, man, this is the most enlightening conversation I've had with regard to the current landscape when it comes to streaming and cable and broadcast. So, Mike, thank you very much. Really astute observations on your part. No, thank you guys for having me. I mean, it's this is fascinating stuff for me because like I worked in that world and I knew what it was like trying to

try and figure out where the world was going. Even when like the second after strike this I remember that we're working through another strike and it led to the huge boom of reality TV because it opened up like, oh, we have to create programming. So suddenly reality TV was the new cheap thing to produce. Now we fast forward all these years later, sport, not that sports is cheap to produce, but we need something to fill in all this programming. We're going to go to game shows and reality TV. And sports has now become more important than ever, you know, and it's, you know, a lot of times

that you can just see the pattern reemerging over as we repeat the same cycles. So then let's pivot here, Mike, to something WWE did produce in-house, and that is the Vlad Superfan documentary. This is something I know you're very passionate about. For those who don't know, Vlad, he is a WWE super fan. He's been present for every WrestleMania, and you've seen him on television a million times. And back in 2020, 2021, WWE commissioned and produced a documentary about Vlad. And then it was shelved out of nowhere after being completed.

it disappeared. No one knew what happened to it. And suddenly, this past month, the documentary reappeared and debuted on the Peacock and WWE Network platforms. You've been a big proponent of this, Mike. What can you tell us about it? And why is it worth people checking out? All right. So let me say right now, 99.9% of the time when I write about something, even if it's someone I don't personally like, I try to stay as unbiased as possible. This is that 0.1% where I was completely open and honest. I did not care. I was completely biased. I wanted to see this thing come out. Vladimir Abu Zid has been one of my best friends for 25, 30 years. And it's quite ironic that I do what I do because he could care less about anything inside baseball stuff that I write about.

He just wants to go to wrestling, cheer on the heroes, boo the bad guys, have a good time, and be in the front row and scream and cheer and enjoy himself. It was his outlet in life. It was his passion in life. And, you know, in 2019 to 2021, WWE made a documentary about it because there's always been sort of this aura. of who is this guy? Why is he always around? He's very unique. Is he part of the business? Is he connected to somebody? And the reality was he wasn't connected to anybody other than he had built friendships with people just by being a fan. He always paid for his tickets. He and his old group, which later adopted me. They always worked hard to save their money and figure out how they could get the tickets when they got them. And it was a situation where they made this

documentary and then COVID happened and they couldn't finish the documentary. So it kind of pivoted into what happened in his real life during all of these things. And then there's this big happy ending where he get, despite all these tragedies that he goes through in his life during the COVID, the worst times of COVID. He, WrestleMania comes back. He gets to come back and WWE honors him and gives them this award and names him the first official ever superfan. And it's this beautiful story of someone who loves pro wrestling so much that wrestling, that wrestling loves him back. And even in the worst times of his life, wrestling is there to help him at the end and uplift him. And they went through a lot of different problems. I don't even know problems

the right word. Like some people are like, oh, they tried to screw him over. You got to look at it from the outside in. They announced their documentary is going to come out the summer of 2021. They changed their strategy by not giving as many documentaries to Peacock. Then they have a deal with A&E. And A&E is using some of that content, but not all of it. Vince is out for reasons we all know. Triple H is out for health issues. Vince comes back. Triple H is in charge. Vince is out again. They sell the company, and this thing is just spinning around in the vortex waiting to be seen. And it wasn't that. Anybody was like, ah, what's the hell with this fan? It was, we have bigger fish to fry. And I kept voicing to people, both publicly and privately.

He's not a wrestler. He's not in the business. He spilled his heart out about so many things that were important to him. And I think it's owed to him that this comes out, especially because after the film was completed, he was diagnosed with Parkinson's disease. And he has unfortunately been forced to retire. He's got a lot of health issues right now. One of the problems, and this is why no one's seeing him right now talking about the documentary coming out, his speech has been greatly inhibited and impacted by the Parkinson's to the point where he's stuttering a lot and he can't really speak. So people like me are kind of speaking for him right now just out of respect and to honor him because he can't do it himself. And trust me, when that documentary came out,

it took me 18 hours to find him because he's an analog guy living in our digital world. And it would meant the most I could ever explain to anybody. And the first thing he said is, wow, people are going to know all about my mom now because his mother is a big part of that documentary for those who haven't seen it. That's what he cared about more than, oh, I'm going to be on WWE network and I'm so important and rah, raw, me. It was about I get to honor my mom and he was so touched. And like, I've been reading on like different tweets and like showing them different things.

And he's just blown away that so many people, he's always been blown away that people even care about him. But the fact that so many people are sharing in his story, it means the world to him and it's brought him a sense of peace. And I'll be honest, the fact that it finally came out, I've said this publicly, I don't need anything else ever again out of pro wrestling. Like, I've made my living doing this. It paid for my house that I'm, you're looking at right now.

I'm so happy to have this job. But the fact that my friend has this when it really helped him on an emotional level and it helps his story live on forever. He's forever in the pantheon of the time capsule or whatever else you want to consider. That to me, that's the best blessing. Anyone, probably could give anybody. And I'm so happy and I'm so thankful for the people in WWE who are quietly trying to push it through and get it out who wanted no credit for it.

And they all did the big lifting. And then finally, you know, they decided for whatever reason they're not going to promote it. They're not going to push it, but boom, here it is. Let's see what happens. And it became like this big viral thing on social media. I'm like, oh, my God, it's finally out. Oh, my God, where was it? Oh, my God, was it there all along?

But the most important thing that I think is it takes you back to this moment where, and I think anybody listening to this can understand this, that moment where you fall in love with pro wrestling. And there's just a purity to it of it's superheroes in real life. And it's good versus evil. And it's whether you look at it like it's a Marvel movie come to live or Star Wars come to live or athletics that has theatrics in it. There's something about it when we first start watching it

that's just so neon fluorescent greatness that just captures your heart. And you go, what is this about? Like, I remember the first time I saw Roddy Piper. I'm like, what is this guy? What is this about? Why is Mr. T. not throwing him through a wall? And like, that literally is my first impression of wrestling.

Why is B.A. Baracchis not throwing him out of window. And it made me want to watch again. And I think Vlad holds on to that purity. And if you ever see him in a show, it doesn't matter if he's at WWE, WCW, AEW, an independent show, he just loves the fact that he's at wrestling in a way that none of us can. And I've said this before. I think he loves wrestling more than anybody who ever walked the face of the earth, more than Vince McMahon, more than Eric, more than John,

more than me. He just loves it and he gets something out of it and it uplifts him in a way that it doesn't uplift the average person. But that film brings you back to the purity of, I love this. And it also tells the story of if you love WWE, WWE will love you back. And I think, you know, for fans who use WWE to fill an important part of their life for whatever they, to fill a void for what they need, that's an important thing that they need to learn is that, hey, if I care about this, it's going to care about me back. It's not a one-way street. And whether that's true 100% of the time or not, your mileage may vary. But for Vladimir, it turned out to be true. And I think that story emotionally uplifts a lot

of people. And the reaction has been, I love this guy for how much he loves wrestling. He reminds me of me. Drew McIntyre said that on the documentary. The Vladimir that he sees is what he feels inside about wrestling. What better message could WWE or any company send their fan base than, hey, you love us, we love you back. You're with us. We're with you. You spend your money with us. We're going to give you everything that you want. Like I don't, to me, I was always a mind-blowing thing as someone who saw the film when it played at the Los Angeles Shorts Festival a couple of years back. Why would you not put this out? Why would anybody take something that's a huge asset that makes people fall more in love with your product and sit it

on a shelf. So I'm very thankful. It's finally out there. I don't care people love it or hate it personally, but it's out there for Vladimir and for everybody else. And it's not even Vladimir's story anymore. People will watch it and digest it and they'll take whatever they want out of it. But if it honors my friend and it honors his mom, man, what a great gift that is for him. That is, first of all, that's what I'm going to be doing tonight. I will watch the, you know, I haven't watched it yet i've been hearing about it but after listening to you talk about it i am all in that's that's very touching i i think it's i think it's some of the best 37 minutes of of anything we ever produced they've done some great documentaries but i think i think it's one of the best ones

they ever produced couldn't we all learn from vlad when it comes to us couldn't we all learn from from i haven't seen it yet you just billy maize the hell out of that movie man i'm i'm excited to check that. Vlad is like the nicest guy ever. I had a chance to interview him once and just such a nice, appreciative, humble guy. And I haven't had a chance to watch it yet, but I'm very excited to. I know John Carlo, who's now with A.A.W. was a big part of putting that. And John Carlo is a masterful. Such a talented director. And I've said this everywhere. If I'm AW, I take John Carlo and I say, no matter what your other responsibilities are, they are not your responsibilities anymore. You get a camera and you go follow Sting and you make us a documentary about

his final run. Because I think they'll find something special and emotional in that story that we would all cherish in the years to come because who doesn't love Sting. No matter who you are as a wrestling fan, you grew up with Sting at some point in your life, no matter what era of him it was. I hope AEW dives in and really documents that because it would be special. It's been great, Mike. We really appreciate you, man. Check out all Mike's work at pwinsider.com. He's always right on the nose of a lot of the big breaking stories. Anything else you want to add, man? No, just thank you for, from the bottom of my heart. I don't care if people love me or hate me.

I really don't because either way I'll make my money, hopefully, knock on wood. It has meant the world to me to see how many people have embraced the Vlad's story and have loved that documentary because the person you see in that film, it is not a manufactured person. He is not acting. He has zero acting skills, trust me. And it is him giving his entire heart and soul talking about his love of professional wrestling and his love of his mom.

And the fact that so many people have cared about that and love that means the world to me and has kind of refilled my cup in terms of my belief in humanity. After the last couple of years we've lived through through COVID and political strife and everything else, like it's just like, oh, something good is still out there in the world. There's still kindness out there. And that kindness is all focused on my friend Vladimir, especially as his health is failing him, I could never ask for a better blessing in the entire world. So I'm just really, really thankful.

And I know for him, he's blown away. And the fact that, like, two different action figure companies have come to him and said, hey, let's do action figures of you. You know, Matt Cardona and Brian Myers, they're doing one. And then there's another company, figurecollections.com. And this money's all going to go to help him with his health issues. He's retired now. Other than going to physical therapy and speech therapy, he's at home watching wrestling all day

because he loves wrestling. And, you know, I feel like it gives him sort of a happy ending where no matter what happens, people will always say, ah, that guy, or, oh, man, that guy loved his mom, or man, that guy loved wrestling. And if it inspires someone to love wrestling or even call their mom when they don't think about their mom as much because they're caught up in the crazy mundane world that we all live in, or just makes them take a step back to think about the things that they need to make themselves happy in their life, even if it's something else, what better, what better. better happy ending could my friend have, even if he just inspires one other person to care about something as much as he loves pro wrestling. And to me, if I had a little bit of a voice and I'm able to talk about my friend until the day I'm gone, that's a blessing in itself. And to me, that's more important than anything I could ever write about professional wrestling is to be able to honor my friend when he's at a point in his time and his health where he can't

do it for himself. And I will do it. I will do it to one blue in the face. You're a good man, Mr. Johnson. Oh, so were you, no matter what anybody says about you on the internet. That's your own elbow, though. Oh, just scroll down and look at the YouTube comments for this video. And that's all you got to know. Hey, Mike, thanks so much, man. Appreciate your time.

Guys, always a pleasure. I appreciate everything you guys bring to the space. I wish you and your families, nothing but the best. We don't talk. Have a great holiday. And I just want to say to everybody, I know we all love pro wrestling. It's okay to take a breath and go out. outside and Twitter will be there when you get back. We don't have to worry about what's on

Twitter 24-7. Trust me on that. So thank you. And I hope everybody checks us out of PW Insider when they have a chance. Eric, what a fantastic conversation that was with Mike. So insightful, I loved hearing all the NXT conversation, but really his passion for this Vladimir project really shines through. Yeah, there is no better word than passion. And I'm serious. I will be posting about my, my reaction to the documentary tonight. I'll be given Mike a call. as soon as I'm done. He really made me want to watch that documentary and passion is the key word. Yeah. And when I, I had a chance to discuss that with John Carlo months and months and months ago. And he really did get across to me that it was one of the proudest projects of his career.

So I can only imagine how much it means to everyone who is involved in that documentary to see it out there. Make sure you're checking it out. Make sure you check out PW Insider. Mike does a great job over there. And make sure that you check out our website over at Advertise witheric.com. to help you get your product out in front of thousands of listeners and viewers every single week. Advertise with Eric.com is going to help you do that. We would love to have you on board with our team here. Eric, we are just a few weeks away from Russellcade. I'm excited to see you down there.

Anything exciting this weekend ahead of you? This weekend? Yeah. Or Russellcade? No, I'm looking forward to Russellcade. I'll be down there. I've got some great, I'm going to bring in some copies of Grateful with me. So if you don't have a copy or if you want an autograph copy,

I'll be there, signing my life away, and meeting, meeting fans, seeing a bunch of people I haven't seen a long time, seeing you there, John, I'm looking forward to it. And it's right around Thanksgiving. I love Thanksgiving. Be and I are going to be in Minneapolis, visiting my brother and my sister and some of Lori's extended family. So it's going to be a fun time. This weekend, though, I'm still elk hunting. I haven't got my elk yet. So that's what's in store for me this week. Fantastic.

We'll make sure you keep at it there, my friend. Thank you, everyone, for tuning in to share. Strictly Business with Eric Bischoff. We'll see you next time.