83 Weeks with Eric Bischoff - Strictly Business with Eric Bischoff #55: CM Punk Returns to WWE

Episode Date: December 1, 2023

In this week's Strictly Business, Eric Bischoff and Jon Alba discuss CM Punk's shocking return to WWE! What kind of business can be done with Punk back in the fold? Plus, a look at the Raw TV rights negotiations, and the hottest topic, are Travis Kelce and Taylor Swift legit? Special thanks to this week's sponsors! Manscaped- Get 20% Off and Free Shipping with the code WRESTLEBIZ at Manscaped.com. FOLLOW ALL OF OUR SOCIAL MEDIA at https://83weekslinks.com/ Stop throwing your money on rent! Get into a house with NO MONEY DOWN and roughly the same monthly payment at SaveWithConrad.com On AdFreeShows.com, you get early, ad-free access to more than a dozen of your favorite wrestling podcasts, starting at just $9! And now, you can enjoy the first week...completely FREE! Sign up for a free trial - and get a taste of what Ad Free Shows is all about. Start your free trial today at AdFreeShows.com If your business targets 25-54 year old men, there's no better place to advertise than right here with us on Strictly Business. You've heard us do ads for some of the same companies for years...why? Because it works! And with our super targeted audience, there's very little waste. Go to AdvertiseWithEric.com now and find out more about advertising with Strictly Business. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey, hey, it's Conrad Thompson from Save WithConrad.com. Heads up, homeowners, all of a sudden your house is worth more than ever these last few years. But what are we going to do with that newfound equity? No, I'm not suggesting you sell your house or go buy something else. But didn't we all make this decision when we bought a house where we said, hey, someday we'd like to, and one day it would be nice if, maybe it's the dream kitchen, maybe it's an in-ground pool. cave. But you've got this newfound equity and I think we should use some of that equity

to turn your house into your dream home with no money out of pocket. But even better than that, we're routinely helping folks do this and they wind up with a cheaper monthly payment. So if you got the dream house you always want with no money out of pocket and your payments went down, how easy is that? Find out how easy it is to turn your house into your dream home with no money out of pocket right now at save with conrad.com. We can't wait to hear about your projects. Tell us what your dream is. We're going to help you make it happen at save withconrad.com. NMLS number 65084 Equal Healthy Lender. Woo! what's going on everyone it's time for another edition of strictly business with eric bischoff

presented to you by the ad free shows network and podcast heat i am john alba i'm the co-host of strictly business but if i'm the co-host that means there's a star his name is mr eric bischoff come on give him the wave you know everyone loves seeing the way there it is what's going on my man it was so great seeing you last week at wrestlecade good to be back in the saddle again with you here on Strictly Business. Yeah, it was a fun weekend. Shout out to Marine, who set it all up for us. For me, over at every shows, and all the fans that turned out, it was great, had a great time,

really enjoyed it. But, man, it was cold there. I mean, I left Minnesota thinking I was visiting my brother and sister over the Thanksgiving break. And I left from Minneapolis going to Winston-Salem. And I think, oh, man, I don't need a jacket. I'm going down south. It's colder there than it wasn't Minnesota. Yeah.

It was really cold, but I'll tell you, man, that was such a great convention. Wrestle Kate is genuinely one of my favorite conventions that we get a chance to be a part of every year. Tracy Myers, who we had on this podcast last year, they do such an awesome job with it. And those fans are great wrestling fans that come out there to that area. And we did get the news this week, by the way, Eric, that Sting's last match is going to be at the Greensboro Coliseum. and in North Carolina for AW Revolution, obviously so much WCW history there. Rick is a big part of that as well.

You got any thoughts on that? It's a great choice. Great, great choice, full circle. Kind of going back to Sting's Roots in his beginning. So I like the choice. It's a great choice for a venue. I'm sure it's going to be a great event. Yeah, great wrestling fans in North Carolina.

Thanks to everyone who came out to wrestlecade to support Eric. We did a live show for the Extreme Life of Matt Hardy. That was awesome. So thank you to everyone who support. the ad pre-shows family for that we are live on ad-free shows eric speaking of which we got lucas here in the crowd we got josh hennie in the crowd we got adam jefferson we got darren it's a full house man i'm gonna give a shout out to our ad-free shows fans here absolutely glad to see everybody here lucas i think this may be the first time i've seen your name pop up if you've been here before

and i didn't see your name my apologies but uh you jumped out man i said hey lucas this may be a first So whether it is or isn't, welcome to everybody. We got Anthony in here as well. So thank you to everyone who joins in. You can ask questions to Eric as part of your ad-free show's perk if you've got any coming on. We were supposed to do an Ask Eric episode last week, unfortunately due to the travel restrictions. Things just got a little out of hand. So we will get that to you.

Hopefully next week, we got so many great questions to answer for that, Eric. But we have a lot to talk about today. Something big happened in the wrestling world this past week. but before we can get to that i know there a lot of things happened in the wrestling world this past week but before we could get to any of that maybe involving one bill phil and the raw tv rights there was something i know you texted me about this and you were like we got to talk about this this is this is this has massive implications for sports entertainment the business of the business i when i i read the headline i it jumped out at me and i went wow

This is either one of those wrestling versions of a conspiracy theory where everything is a work or is the pinnacle of the tried and true wrestling formula where the rub means everything, the rub where one plus one equals three. This is big news, big, big news, and proves once again that professional wrestling is on the cutting edge of not only sports entertainment, but sports and entertainment. Take it away. So Paige Van Zant, MMA star, you may have seen her on A.A. television in the past couple years as well. She's one of the bigger names out there in the combat sports industry. She's got a hot take, Eric. She says that she believes the Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey, quote

unquote, love story is 100% fake. She said that on her podcast with her husband, Austin Vanderford. She's saying it's a work. She's saying it's a work. She said, come for me, Swifties. I have UFC fans coming for me. I think I can handle the Swifties. It is publicity. It is one. It's huge for the NFL because, yes, the NFL is big. Taylor Swift is huge. And now she's getting an entirely different demographic to come watch the NFL. She added, think of the lives that are buying Travis Kelsey jerseys now. It's a huge publicity play on both fronts. It's good for Taylor Swift. It's good for the NFL. It's good for Travis Kelsey. There's so much strategic stuff happening. Now, Eric, you are the king of strategy. Are you buying the

Travis Kelsey, Taylor Swift relationship as a shoot or as a work? I don't know, because there's a lot of money involved. And, you know, had Page not gone into kind of the comments about think of all the Travis jerseys that are now being sold by wives of NFL fans that kind of makes sense to me dude it makes sense i mean it could be true and wouldn't that be fascinating if it was all of this attention that the media is sports media is dumping on Travis and Taylor and all of the drama and the cutaways and sees Taylor Swift up in the box and cheering Travis on and I don't know, man.

I'm leaning into it. I think Page might be on to something. I don't know, man. I think they're legit. I really do. I think that this, do you know the back story, Eric, of how this relationship came to be in the first place? No, I don't. So this is the definition of shooting your shot.

And that's why I love it. It's a great light. Moonshot. Taylor Swift is a moonshot. So, so ready for this? So here's how this happens. So Travis Kelsey, again, very famous professional football player. And in my opinion, he's more famous now, isn't he?

Oh, yes, he is. Uh-huh. In my opinion, he will be a very successful. crossover guy once his playing career is done too like how gronk is um he went to a taylor swift concert and taylor swift fans exchange friendship bracelets and that's you go to a concert you exchange a bracelet has your name on it it's so cute that's very cute it's adorable right so Travis kelsey wanted to use his celebrity to give taylor swift a custom friendship bracelet that he had made for her now now he said that the friendship bracelet had his number on it as brother asked

what number are you talking about 87 the one you wear on your back or you're talking about a different phone number or a different number your phone number and he said you know which number I'm talking about so he didn't Travis got game man he got game on the field he's got game off so he didn't get to meet her because apparently before her concerts because she does a three hour show that's very intense. She doesn't really like to talk to people beforehand to keep her voice fresh. So he put that story out into the ether and was just kind of like, oh well, what are you going to do? Right. Taylor Swift's people heard the story and they connected them. She got his number and it started going back and forth. The next thing you know,

three weeks later, she's sitting in a family suite with the rest of the Kelsey's family cheering him on, getting all excited over him scoring a touchdown and the fans get to see them out there in the box. The reporter caught video of them walking out together. And it's been a love story ever since. It's a lot more deep than that. I don't want to. A year from now, she'll be cutting a song talking about what an ass he is. That's the downside. There's a lot of upside. You know, what an exciting dating experience. Taylor Swift, all the energy and the limelight and the focus and the attention and everything that comes with dating a megastar like Taylor Swift. But the downside is her track record not so good.

And if you end up on the wrong side of her, she's going to write a shitty song about you. You're going to get an album written about you. That's what's going to happen to you. And those Swifties are very, very, very loyal fans. There's no question. You better be good to her. They have a bunch of 14 year old girls hounding him down and wanting to kick his NFL ass. But it's kind of cool, though, right?

Like he shot his shot. He knew what he wanted and went out there and put it into the universe. He's like the Tony Robbins of the NFL, man. He manifests this stuff. Exactly. Manifestation. So that's why I'm choosing to believe in it. I want to believe in a good story out there.

I have faith that this could be a real thing. But you're not wrong, Eric. There's a lot of publicity that comes from it. I can't believe the NFL isn't branding Taylor Swift jerseys yet. Isn't that amazing? It's not over yet. yeah it's not over with let's let's see how the season turns out because here's the downside she could be like who is that other

singer a long time ago dated a Dallas Cowboys quarterback Tony Romo oh Jessica Simpson yeah look what it did for him man they crater his career he just he just ended up into sewage after that I mean he's like the number one color commentator and all the NFL on TV yeah but he's not playing football he she ruined him Women weaken legs, Rocky, women weaken legs. Anthony's buying your conspiracy. He says every time they're captured on camera phone,

Travis looks directly into it. Oh, he's working it, brother. He's working it. Interesting. Well, look, Paige Vance is smart, smart girl. She knows what's going on. She's got it together. I heard she has an only fan.

I haven't checked it out, but rumor. She has a very successful only fans, as a matter of fact. She dabbled a little bit into AEW. doing the Dan Lambert stuff. And I'm curious to see if she ever dabbles back into wrestling because those UFC stars, man, their crossover record, all things considered is pretty damn successful. Time will tell.

Time will, in fact. She's the woman of many talents. Hey, Rhonda Rousey showed up in AEW recently, so you never know what's going to. That was weird. Why do you think that's weird? I just, it's just weird to me. It's just weird. Why would you, why would she do that?

What's the motivation? She doesn't need the money. I just don't understand the motivation. Is she trying to prove that she actually loves professional wrestling, that she actually has it in her quote, quote, blood? Or is it just a stunt to get some attention and maybe get back into a conversation with WWE? I don't know. I don't know the lady.

Very impressed with her. I mean, her career, as you know, speaks for itself. She did very well. and UFC up until the time she didn't. Holly, all just rocked her. She was never the same after that. She got her bell rung and that was it.

She cashed in her chips and left the building. Honestly, I think she just wanted to do something fun. She got to work with Marina Shafir, who's her best friend. Oh, well, that makes sense. Yeah, she did the indie appearance too with pro wrestling revolver working with Marina. So I think she just wanted to do something fun, maybe try the industry out outside of the confines of wwe because look as we know eric wwe there's a very specific structure in how you do things so maybe she wanted to try it out try something different and never a bad thing as far as

i see it hopefully do you think we've seen the last of her in wrestling in any meaningful way yeah i mean she may pop up like she did recently with ring of honor or on the independent scene or whatever but i don't i don't see her making another big career comeback i just don't Would you say her run was successful? Define success. Financially, sure. I'm sure it was financially successful for her. I mean, to me, and again, this is going to sound like I've got, you know,

something against Rund, and I certainly don't. I admire her greatly. But I never felt like she was passionate about it. I think it was a career move for her. I think it was a great financial move for her, but I never got the feeling that she was in it. She was visiting from day one. But there is an argument.

I think Conrad Thompson brought it up. Perhaps you did a couple weeks ago. We were talking about Rhonda. And Rhonda was cast right out of the shoot as a baby face. If you're not a baby face, If you go back and you listen to some of her interviews or read some of the interviews that she did following her loss to Holly Holmes,

she was kind of, she didn't take it well. I think she's a heel at heart. And when you cast a heel at heart, especially someone who isn't really trained as a performer, she hasn't really developed a character. She's developed her skill as a fighter. She probably turned up, you know, the level of her aggression. and the way she came to the ring.

She always had this stern look on her face, which I always got a kick out of because she looks like she's 12. I mean, she's literally, physiologically, a baby face. But she'd come and she'd be scowling and be sticking out. She's trying to look all tough and intimidating. And it always made me chuckle. Of course, I wasn't the woman on the other side of the cage with her having to fight her either. But perhaps if she would have been positioned as a,

heal when she made her debut, the outcome of her run may have been much different. But when you take somebody with little to know real performance experience other than her athletic background, and you cast them in a role that requires some level of acting and character development, you're much better off sticking to someone's core personality traits as opposed to going, I know you're, you know, you're kind of a healed by nature. But we want you to be a baby face. That's, it's hard to be a baby face. It's a lot harder to be a baby face than it is to be a heel.

It's treacherous, treacherous water, that baby face water. That's treacherous shit. So who knows? Yeah, she had that amazing WrestleMania debut. And it worked well as a baby face in that particular match. But after that, I think if they had gone more in a heel direction, and you would have seen more sustained crowd involvement with her path. But I don't think you can take it away from her, man.

Like, I don't think those women would have main evented WrestleMania 35, the first time women were in the main event of WrestleMania without Rhonda Rousey's star power. You know, now, thankfully, it's a mediated thing where it's not unusual to see a woman in the main event. But they were the first. And I think Rhonda was the big reason for that that allowed Becky Lynch and Charlotte to be able to elevate their respective games in an, even larger limelight. I think she does deserve some credit there.

Oh, no, I'm not taking anything away from her. I just think perhaps she was miscast and perhaps she may have not totally been into the baby face role, which perhaps is one of the reasons why and just never felt connected to her. Sure. Well, let's talk about someone who is a natural baby face at heart in life. C.M. Punk. Phil Brooks.

Eric Bischoff, one of the wildest turn of events that we've seen in some time in wrestling went down this past week at Survivor Series, where C.M. Punk made his shocking return to WW after nearly 10 years away, a couple months off being let go by AW. I texted you right away, and I just said, how about you? about that this was something that we can dive into pretty deeply here and how things came about the element of surprise the moment itself the fallout of it but i have to ask you off the bat your initial reaction to it i was pissed because like two weeks before i made another dumbass bet with Conrad on 83 weeks because Conrad said,

I believe we're going to see CM Punk back in WWE before the end of the year. And I said, I don't think so. It doesn't make sense to me. They don't need him right now. The Survivor Series is sold out. It's already getting a ton of buzz. Where is the added value? This is not my opinion of CM Punk, the performer, or Phil Brooks,

the individual. Make clear every time I talk about him, I don't know him, the individual. Never had a conversation with him. Don't know what he's like beyond what we see and hear about publicly. But just because WWE is so freaking hot right now that there is no hole in their roster, there's not a need. It's not like an NFL team that needs a better offensive line that we've got to find that one guy who can be our anchor, right?

There was no holes. So it was like if you're going to pull that trigger and bringing in a guy who is as controversial as punk is and who has done a great job of keeping himself front and center in terms of controversy, why would you use it on a night when you don't need it? Now, Conrad, on the other hand, his position was they're negotiating for TV rights for raw and perhaps that added level of chatter or internet wrestling buzz and reaction to punk coming in, maybe that would be enough to push a deal over the top if there was one on the table.

I still didn't think that it would happen, especially at Survivor Series. So I bet Conrad once again, Conrad was very quick to seize the opportunity and say, well, if you're so sure of yourself, why don't you bet me? I bet that he's going to be there. You say he isn't. If I'm right, you shave your head. Again. And I didn't even think about it.

I just said, sure, because I was convinced. Yeah. It wasn't going to happen. It made no sense to me. Timing-wise, it just didn't make sense. Timing-wise. So my initial reaction was, here we go again. I get to sit in the middle of the ring somewhere,

probably a top guy weekend in January, and get my head shaved once again. And I'm getting tired of it. tired of me i mean you know your hair grows back quickly at least not the point it's the embarrassment sitting in that chair with people all around you at ringside cheering it on hoping to be one of the people that get up there and embarrass me publicly once again i don't know man this is the last time i make that bet yeah you probably come up with a different bet you probably should come up with something again wager dinner wager

there's so many things that you could wager here that's not your hair but nonetheless eric this deal did come together very quickly and very privately even according to paulovic himself he said very few people knew about it the reports sean rossap and mike johnson have been all over this story uh that essentially a conversation between punk and w e was had within the week prior to survivor series it was positive they spoke for a couple of hours then the day of the show, the deal came together, and he was brought in, he was sequestered in about 20 minutes before the end of the show. The people in the main event, the wrestlers in the main event, were told about this just as they were about to go through the curtain

that CM Punk would be returning after the match. Paul Levec was said to have taken over Gorilla himself and produced the entire ending of the show. And as we saw, Punk came back to a big surprise response with people going absolutely nuts. Now, he insinuated Eric, that him and Nick Con were the two that primarily knew. I would imagine at least a couple production people knew. And probably a few attorneys. And yes, a few attorneys as well. But aside from that, the ability to pull off a surprise like that in today's stage

and general wrestling environment is unbelievable as far as I see it. What do you think of the execution of the moment in and of itself? I want to make a quick shout out here to a friend of mine by the name of Ryan McGrath, who I hope is listening. Because a while back, I wrote a book called Controversy Creates Cash. And in that book, I talked about Sarsa, story, anticipation, reality, surprise, and action. the five elements that in my opinion if a storyline has all five of those elements you're printing money if a storyline has four out of the five elements it's going to be successful three out of five two out of five it's a flop and that formula has proven true time and time and time again in all forms of

business not just the wrestling business if you have a product and your product comes with a great story behind it and you create anticipation for that product or service and in this case the reality of CM and let's let's back up the story is there story anticipation reality surprise and action is what makes the frickin world go around CM Punk showing up in WWE clearly there's what a decade's worth of story there yep his role in WWE the way he left the pipe bomb promo which, by the way, I found out subsequently was actually written for him. But the story is there.

There's been this anticipation that's been brewing since the minute he left, he meaning punk, left AEW. Oh, is he going to come back? Yes, he is. No, he isn't. I bet he is. I bet he isn't. I'll shave my head if I'm wrong.

The anticipation has been there almost instantly. It didn't have to be created. manufactured. The reality is the authenticity of it all, meaning all of this stuff that we've been reading about for 18 months with regard to punk and AEW and the drama with the elite the press conference and all the gagga, yeah, that's all real. That isn't a storyline. These are all things that happened. It's authentic. It's not a manufactured story. So you've got great story, history, backstory. You've got anticipation that was built in from the moment the news broke that punk was being let go. The authenticity can't be doubted. The surprise was pulled off

perfectly. And now we have action coming up next. That's the easy part with wrestling. The action is the easy part. The story is the hard part. Creating anticipation is a challenge. Keeping it real and authentic is also a big challenge, especially in the world of professional wrestling. Surprises, as you pointed out, are few and far between, authentic ones, ones that really catch people by surprise, and you get the response that you hope for, which clearly happened at Survivor Series. And all that's left now is, you know, where does he go? What's the action look like. And I don't think there's any question. We're going to see great action, especially because there's great story and there's anticipation. There's a lot of

anticipation for who he's going to work with and what that storyline is going to look like. So in terms of the Sarsa formula, I think punk coming in at Survivor Series knocked it completely out of the park, which indicates to me this is going to be a very, very successful, long-term financially successful decision, provided that the wheels don't fall off because of personal issues. And as I said before, when the subject of punk going back to WWE came up and I was asked, well, do you think he'd work there? I mean, do you think it would work with see a punk being in WWE compared to what we just saw happen in AEW? I think my response was something to the effect of, I'm going to paraphrase myself, but I think he'd

get along fine in AEW because he's not going to be able to get away with the same kind of things in WWE that he was able to get into because of just the lack of leadership and structure and maturity that exists in AEW. And that's not really a knock. I know it sounds like one, but it's a new company with a guy that's never run a wrestling business. He was a fan, but that doesn't count. I'm a fan of the Rolling Stones, but I couldn't jump up on stage and do a set with them just because you're a fan of something doesn't mean you're good at it but i think because it's a new company with a guy who is although a wrestling fan has no experience in in running a wrestling company for sure or dealing with the types of personalities that exist in that world um there's

going to be growing pains he tony con is going to learn on the job just like i did and he's going to make mistakes and there's going to be a lack of structure and a lack of maturity just like they're was when I took over WCW because I didn't have any experience either in that regard. So I'm pretty sure Punk is going to, provided he wants to, motivation is at the core of this, right? If punk woke up and said, look, I want to have one more, really, really good run. And if he's willing to be a team player, I think he's going to be very successful. in WW week. It's just not going to be able to get away with the same kind of silliness, nor will he be

exposed to the same kind of backstage environment that he was exposed to in an AEW. He's going to have to learn to deal with a more corporate, structured environment. And if he's willing, if his intentions are such that he really wants to make this work and be a team player, I think his second run will be better. that is first in WWE. Yeah, structure is, I think, the big buzzword there because structure is what will keep things in place. I think this is going to work as well, and I want to hit on a few things that you said.

Sean Ross Sapp did report that there had been talked that there was a behavioral clause in Punk's contract coming in here, which seems to indicate WWE trying to cover its tracks here with Punk. I think Eric Punk probably carries a little more respect towards some of the individuals in WWE as far as performers go because I think in AEW he came in there and he viewed his role as being the guy to lead the ship and his mentorship and his tutelage would help bring others to that next level. In WWE, that's not a role for him here. He's surrounded by, and I wrote this out before Punk even returned that night. There are nine to 12 people right now in WWE, men and

women, who you could look at at any given moment and put in the main event as top people. They are top stars. And there is going to be a level of respect that is commanded with that alone where you don't reserve the right to tell them what they should be doing or how to do it because they have made it. And I think that's where punk's role now fits where he's now integrated into that fold. He's one of those people. And listen, he's not a stupid guy. I think he recognizes that his perception with everything that happened in AW was damaged. And I think finishing out his career with a successful run here.

WWE and being able to cement the legacy in a positive manner where people look back at him as a performer rather than a personality. I think that means a lot to him. And we'll see how that all unravels here in the next few months. Did you have any thoughts on his presentation after the Monday Night Raw promo and how they might be plotting things forward for him here? I didn't get a chance to see Monday, I was out of town and with family. and wrapping up our Thanksgiving week in Minneapolis. So I didn't get a chance to see it. So the promo was very much, I'm happy to be here.

He called, he said that he's finally, he's home. And, you know, a lot of people saw that and they're like, come on. Like, are you kidding me? After everything that's happened, you're saying you're home and you're finally yourself and everything. My thought, Eric, is that this character that they're going to take in the direction is going to be that he's essentially full of shit. and that deep down he is not here to make friends he's here to make money and that he is simply

see him punk at his core very aware of his own greed and i mean set ralins has been out there's calling him a hypocrite and i think they're going to play into all of that stuff going forward here yeah that's a beauty that is the beauty of it is that because of the history and this is again controversy creates cash my god you have to there's ever a reprint of controversy creates cash. I'm going to ask WWE if we can license the image of CM Punk because I don't think there's anybody that can better define or represent the phrase controversy creates cash than CM Punk.

Going back to walking out with WWE and everything that's happened since. So yeah, look, let's, I'm, look, I know I've been hard on him and I still believe everything that I've seen. I'm not going back on anything. I think what Punk did with Tony Kahn and the press conference was, in my opinion, so unprofessional that it borders, you know, being unforgivable. I would never put someone in that position again. And I doubt WWE will put him in that position.

But there's no denying that he's got value. He's on the top of mind with wrestling fans. He's in the conversation across the boards with wrestling fans, good, bad, or indifferent. And he's been able to maintain that for, quite a long time so i'm i'm look a lot of the stuff punk said when he first got to a ewe to me showed his ass you know coming out and cutting a promo on hall kogan and try to get trying to get a reaction from the internet wrestling community to me showed a level of

immaturity and lack of understanding it's not how you get yourself over you'll get a reaction it's cheap it's like walking out and you know criticizing you know you're in a venue you're at a live event you criticize the hometown team it's easy to do that it's not talent it's not creativity it's cheap heat and then some of the comments that punk made when he first arrived that him showing up on with a couple others was the equivalent of scott hall and kevin nash and was going to have the same impact as the nwl that was fucking stupid and clearly stupid given what we've seen happen and i called it out the minute he said it but look different time different place different opportunity and perhaps i'm looking at the bright

side perhaps punk meant that maybe there's not a work in a setup for his character go maybe he did maybe punk realized after everything that he's been through that wwe's not as bad a place as he made it out to be couldn't and and he is home so we'll see let's give him the i'm going to give him the better. Yeah, look, I hope it worked now, man. There are a lot of great matches on the table with him and great stories to be told. I mean, I said this immediately. I said, I see no reason, Eric, why WW shouldn't throw every bit of money they have at trying to make Stone Cold Steve Austin versus CM Punk happened. That was one of the last true marquee matches that has been on the table for the past 15 years that so many fans clarend for. WWE teased it multiple times, but Austin wasn't

in a place where he could work. Two years ago, we saw him come back last year they tried to get him to work again but creatively he said he didn't see it there's an opportunity here and fightful reported this week that there are people in wwee who are optimistic about a match like that happening and there's no denying that's a huge marquee match yeah i mean i'd be optimistic as well because i love watching steve i love his character he's just an amazing performer and so he's got such a great legacy i would love to see it you know i question whether steve's in a place physically where he wants to get in there and bounce around. Steve is also the kind of guy that doesn't want to go out there

and be less than what people remember him being. And it's one thing to go out in a WrestleMania moment for a spot. That's not a match. You know, I could see Steve getting involved physically, but a match, a 12 or 15 or 18 minute match that requires give and take, I hope Steve's physically in a place where he feels confident he wants to do that because that would be amazing but it's been a minute for Steve so I don't know

hey I hope it happens I hope it happens you go out and you work a match that's basically a brawl that's essentially what Steve did for the latter half of his career we saw that in the Kevin Owens match you don't even have to take any bumps if you don't want it you just go out there and have a fight for me Eric man Yeah, but Steve, look, let's, fantasy booking.

I agree with you, John. But I was one of the last matches that Steve had. Hell yeah. Yeah. And you basically retired him. Well, okay. But without saying too much, Steve was in no position at that point in time to take any kind of a bump. oh yeah he said that all or otherwise and that's that's my point if he's been able to overcome because

you know it was a neck injury that's a serious injury you're talking about centimeters of of some you know something going wrong a bomb you know turning your head too hard too fast one direction whatever little things can have significant adverse outcomes so let's just see i i'll pray for steve's now ability to do it because i think it would be so much fun to watch the feud itself the program would be great i'm sorry the program would be great was the awesome so let's see what happens i'm i'm optimistic i think it would be a hell of a gift for wrestling fans out there to get one of the last true dream matches that actually and that is a dream list i know we throw now you just ruined it for me calling it a

fucking dream match but it is though like that is and i'm not devaluing it eric i'm saying that is a legitimate dream i know i know i'm not i'm just i just hate that phrase straight hey but speaking of dream matches how do you think tony con took all this i mean he he can't have not expected it right like the moment that he let punk go was always going to be a possibility that it was going to happen yeah but i mean look it's cody it's jade now it's punk yeah i mean it's significant and and that does relate to a w because it does say hey here are these people especially as far as cody and punk go eric these are people who went to a w because they wanted to start a movement they wanted something different than the establishment and now they're back in the establishment

grass is always greener it's not but that's not to say that it's not a place that works out well for people it certainly does but now a w has this perception where people who came there are seriously entertaining going back to where their original problems started i think that's something that a w has to tackle head on i really do well and i think it's it all it comes back to the same thing that I've been banging my drum about for over two years where everybody decided, oh, he's an old man screaming at the clouds, he's a hater, and Tony won't give a job of that, none of which is true. But it's going to come down to story and getting characters over and coming up with something other than dream matches of a 14-year-old wrestling

fans' wet dream, because that ain't it. I mean, I read online. You probably know more about this if it's even true, but my understanding is that Matt Hardy's come out and had some criticism of AEW booking. We've heard recently, and I'm only talking about things that I've read and heard publicly. I'm not sharing any inside information. I don't do that. I don't share private conversations that I've had with people. I don't do that either. But.

There are people who are on that roster currently in AEW that are coming out, and Britt Baker just came out, critical of lack of interview time. When your top talent starts coming out and expressing those views publicly, that's a really bad sign. That's like waking up in the morning with a cyst in the middle of your forehead. You can't just pretend that's not happening. You've got to address it. and i think what tony needs to do is i've been saying for two years now story character development

because the rest of this nonsense isn't working it's just not yeah and as far as matt's comments are concerned you can hear that on this week's extreme life and matt hardy available right here on adfree shows dot com a lot of what matt talked about was basing booking around character and story and being a more open-minded to different forms of pre-shows of presentation with wrestling and I think there were definitely things that he brought up that were valid it wasn't a bitching and moaning fest but it was just offering constructive ways in which storytelling could be improved and more people being given opportunities I think there are something storytelling wise that AW is doing very well right now Mariah May I'm so high on how they've

introduced her character I think it's been very effective the Christian and Adam Copeland stuff has been very entertaining that seems to be clicking and working very entertaining So I'm curious to see if we start leaning more into that stuff with them. But all things considered, as far as the punk stuff with Tony, he had to have expected it at some point. I think all of us, Eric, at some point, expected Punk to be back in WWE. It was just a matter of when and how. And I think all of the planets aligned. I mean, Paul Levitt kind of even said as much, all the planet's just kind of aligned here where he's in charge now.

Nick Kahn's in charge. Vince is kind of out of the equation. He's the one that Punk had all the heat with. And now he has this opportunity to go finish his career on the right foot. And I hope that is what happens here because that would be quite the gift for wrestling fans around the world. And Eric, we've got a gift for wrestling fans around the world as well with our friends over at Manscaped. I've got a proclamation, ready? This is from the people at Manscaped.

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What the fuck are you doing with that at your desk? Because I've used it to demonstrate the product on our podcast, not physically demonstrating, but to show people what it looks like. Say, what do you, you got an OnlyFans thing going on? I'm like Page Van, man. I'm ready to go here. She schooled you. How to make money on OnlyFans.

Man, you ain't kidding. Those top creators on Onlyfans are, they are bringing it in. It's got me rethinking my career path. I'll tell you that, not that anyone would be paying for any of my content, but I digress here. So I want to get back to something you hit on, which is really interesting that you said Conrad brought up. And I totally agree with it too, which is punk being brought in for the possibility of trying to improve the TV rights situation with Monday Night Raw and try to add some leverage because what we did here was on Monday night, Paul Lebeck and Nick Con were not at Raw because they were out in Los Angeles negotiating

television rights for Raw. We know Smackdown is set. That's going back to USA. We know NXT is headed to the CW. So there have been a lot of questions and rumor and innuendo as to where Monday Night Raw is going to land. A lot of people, Eric, think that that announcement is going to come sooner rather

than later. I have to source the wrestling observer for this because this was their report today, whether you agree with it or disagree with it. I'll leave that jurisdiction up to you. But Dave says that, quote, They were hoping for $400 million for raw, but analysts believe it'll be closer to $387 million per year. For most of the negotiation period, the idea was FX as the leader, with Netflix, USA, Warner Brothers Discovery, and Amazon Prime, all being talked about.

Regarding WBD, which would be the game changer in many ways if it happened, the WBD version told to many this past week is that Nick Con last went to WBD in October with a pitch and was turned down. lots of different suitors out there. I feel like those are all the suitors we've been talking about the last year on this podcast that we've been discussing TV rights. That window is coming to a close soon, Eric. What are your thoughts on that? Do you see FX as a viable frontrunner here? Could we see the pivot to streaming?

Where's your mind at? You know, I really don't have a feel. There's too much going on in the industry that I'm unaware of and uninvolved in. it's a jump ball for me again you'd have to be really inside the executive suite at any one of those opportunities to have a feel or an opinion and clearly I'm not so I don't know you know the Warner Brothers discovery thing to me seems like one of the least more interesting opportunities But again, I'm not in, man. I don't know what their plans are.

What are their goals over the next five years? What's their strategy for the next three years? I don't know. And without some basis of knowledge, all we're doing is whiffing, guessing. And I don't like to do that. So I'm just going to sit back and watch. I can see benefits from so many different angles for all of the potentials. There's great benefits.

for all of them, but it all depends on what their strategies and what their goals are for the next three to five years. So I think there is one, and I'm going to try to be a little analytical here, I think there is one facet at play that has complicated the issue a little bit for raw negotiation rights. And that is what's going on with the MBA, because the NBA is going to be the premier media a property that's going to be hitting the market within the next year. The exclusive negotiating window for Warner Brothers Discovery in ESPN comes to a close at the beginning of 2024.

There are expectations that the NBA very well may double their rights agreement, which, to put into perspective currently, they get $2.66 billion a year from Disney and Warner Brothers Discovery combined, and they think that they're going to be able to double that. the NBA is one of the most television most valuable television properties period out there. Even more so than NFL? It's right up there.

It's right up there with the NFL. Because the NBA has a grasp on young fans in a way that no other sports property does. And that entered Taylor Swift. That's the NFL competing with the NBA. That's how they're doing it.

Page Van Zant is a freaking genius. that just answered at all. This show started out speculating as to whether or not this relationship between Travis, Travis Kelsey and Taylor Swift is nothing more than a work, a strategy where everybody wins. How does the end? We know how Travis is winning. We know how he's winning, right? That's obvious.

What does Taylor Swift get out of this? Perhaps she is nervous. nurturing, I know it. Here's what Taylor Swift's management team is saying. Taylor, you've got a bunch of 11, 12, 13, 14 year old girls that are the core of your audience. But somebody has to drive them to the event. Their parents have to take them. Fathers take their daughters. Mothers and fathers take their daughters. It's a family event. Why not co-brand? Take them. Taylor Swift with the NFL or one of their leading stars to nurture, not the current demo,

but the parents of the demo that have to buy those expensive tickets. It makes it easier for them, right? Because Taylor's kind of one of us. He's an NFL fan now. There's your answer. Is it possible that genius? Is it possible that she just might be in love with this guy, too? Oh, no.

But anyway, my point here is that Warner Bros. Discovery is going to, in all likelihood, prioritize maintaining some degree of their MBA rights. David Zazlov has said they may move away a little bit from them. You know that NBC Universal is going to be in on those negotiations. They would be crazy not to be. So in theory, that's probably more at the first. forefront of their priority list than professional wrestling. And I'm curious, now that USA already has Smackdown locked up, wouldn't they wait to see or try to wait to see where the NBA would go before deciding, oh, we'll take more wrestling on when there's this big, valuable sports property out there that would bring in significantly more eyes than wrestling

would? Kind of makes sense, doesn't it? On the surface, sure. And FX, Disney, Yeah, Disney's in on these negotiations. They're going to maintain the NBA with ESPN in some capacity, but they don't have to worry with FX. FX isn't going to be airing sports competition. That is its own entity. And we've also heard that Disney could be offloading FX at some point. So that could be offloading a lot of stuff.

Yeah. Disney stock price has tanked in the last couple of years because they've gotten so involved in ideology and politics and all that stuff i don't like talking about and they're getting their ass kicked as a result so with all that said then it just seems to me like one of brothers discovery especially but probably USA too are more or less on the outside looking in here at FX or Amazon Prime as a route for Monday Night Raw. And I do think we'll hear at some point in the next month or so where this is headed.

And I'm really curious to see what it boils down to. Brian asked Eric, if streaming is the option, why would WWE not stream live on Peacock already streamed PLE events and have a deal with NBC Universal? Could that work? They could. Absolutely, they could. But think about Amazon.

Think about the opportunity beyond just the streaming rights that come with Amazon. So much of WWE's revenue is generated by licensing and merchandising. To have Amazon as your partner and have access to all of the things that come with Amazon beyond just streaming, I think could be a massive, massive opportunity. It's a revenue opportunity. You may not see, you know, in terms of viewership, although, you know, the rest of the The wrestling audience will follow the product wherever it goes. That's been proven time and time again. Wrestling better than almost any other form of entertainment can bounce around on a weekly

schedule and relatively speaking be unaffected by it. You take a short-term hit when you change nights and things like that. But the audience always finds you. That's the advantage of having such a loyal audience the way professional wrestling does and has always had. It's one of the reasons that Ted Turner used professional wrestling to launch the superstation, to help launch the super station and Turner Broadcasting. It's one of the reasons that I think AEW got the opportunity that they got from Turner because people know that the professional wrestling audience will follow you and they're very, very loyal. Not a lot of programming other than wrestling and sports has.

that kind of loyal audience following general entertainment comedy sitcoms dramas whatever procedurals those fans are fickle they're very fickle so we'll see see i keep saying that we'll see i know it's going to be fun to watch is and look in a couple weeks here we'll be making our 24 predictions for wrestling like we did last year and we'll have to revisit our predictions as well to see how things ended up panning out and turning out because it has been a pretty wild year in wrestling and it's been a fun year for people like me and in us and this show and the people that listen to the show that like to learn about the business of the wrestling business and all the machinations behind the scene and everything that happens out except for what happens in

the ring you know for people that that are interested in that this has been a fascinating well and there might be something to what conrad was saying i again on raw this past week they did one of their highest numbers in a long time 1.884 million viewers they did 863 in the demo total viewership was up 29 percent they were up 34 percent in the demo which is pretty significant all things considered and that's with the return of cm punk the return of randy orton i'm curious about that how about the return of i know we're talking a lot about cm punk no no aunt randt let us not skip over the return of the return of what I think is one of the he's my favorite performer in the last 30 years is Randy

Orton Randy Orton to me is fluid and pure of a professional wrestler that exists in today's environment or has existed in the past 30 years not the biggest not the he's not the rock that stone cold Steve Austin but in terms of what Randy could do in the ring he is one gifted son of the bitch

he doesn't have to do much either right he doesn't have to do much he just knows how to connect with crowds and they come unglued every time that music hits he does his pose he does an RKO that's all it takes for him and you watch Randy closely put him under a microscope and watch him in the ring

he is never not positioned perfectly throughout an entire match he his footwork his timing his pacing his ability to control the audience and create the emotions he wants when he wants it he is in my opinion the purest purest sports entertainment he came in personality in 30 years he came into war games didn't take a single bump. It was fantastic. He knew exactly what he was doing. That RKO onto J.D.D.D.A. where came off the cage into it perfectly timed. He is a stellar performer. And someone who just connects so well with fans, whether he's a baby face or a heel, he always generates a reaction. And that is one of the true masteries of the art that Randy Orrin has down. And I'm with you,

man. I always get excited seeing Randy on my TV. He definitely, is a big part of this too in getting a good rating that's the laps fan we've talked about the laps fan on this podcast now it's how do you sustain them do you actually keep them did you do enough to get them to want to tune in next week that's what we're going to find out and see how they can try to and better yet the other part of that comment that you just made did they do enough and will they do too much too soon that's the art of building anticipation. That's the anticipation part. And you pointed it out. I didn't see it. Randy Orton didn't take a bump. They didn't give him too much. They didn't have him coming out

there bounce around like a ping pong ball to prove that he was back and he's 100%. He's going to slowly integrate. And you want to give the audience enough to hook him, but you don't want to give him so much that you've really got nowhere to go because we've seen it all, right? I think it's going to be a blast to watch, just business-wise. It's an exciting time of the year, man, heading down to Tampa for the Royal Rumble season. The Rumble is always one of my favorite events. I'm sure it's one of yours as well. You got the ad-free shows gathering down there and straight into Philadelphia for

WrestleMania. It's just crazy that we're already at this part of the year. And I always look forward to it. it's one of the more exciting times in pro wrestling. This has been fun stuff here. Eric, anything else you want to throw out there for our strictly business fans this week? No, man, I think we covered the hell out of it. How's Rick Flair doing an AEW?

That's a... A little bit of controversy about that. And honestly, I'm... I hardly looked at social media over the last five days. So what, I know there's some controversy. What's it all about? okay so i'm i'm looking up the line so i can read it appropriately and i don't want to attribute anything incorrectly here so let me let me just make sure i've got the actual line

taken care of but basically you know he's been he's been paired with uh sting as sting embarks on this last run that he's doing with a w as he goes to retirement and uh it's it's been controversial, to say the least, but they taped Rampage after Dynamite this week, and he said, quote, in the promo, let's see if it even makes the air, because as we taped this rampage has not aired. He invited all the women in the audience from ages 18 to 28 to meet him in his hotel room, no boyfriends or husbands, which, if you followed Rick Flair's career, that is a line that is very much into. tune with the nature boy character and stuff that he would have said that in the last 30 or 40 years yeah um i think given some of the controversy that came with bringing him in surrounded him just a couple of years ago it may have triggered some emotions with some people is there anything you would like to comment on that at all lighten the fuck up people come on just lighten up this is professional wrestling for god's sake uh if that's what this controversy is all about

it's ridiculous rick just go out there and have fun don't pay attention this is the the controversy in the twitter universe or the internet wrestling community does not represent the world as we know it It's a small little cesspool of people that want to bitch and complain and criticize and more importantly, judge. They want to judge you, Rick. They want to be, they want a virtue signal their asses off so they get likes, shares, and retweets. Just ignore that shit, Rick.

Go out and have fun. You know what to do. This is a great story. Now, it's not without, you know, treacherous points here and there. You know, Rick doesn't, you know, I don't think Rick has any respect for my opinion. But if he did, I would just say limit the amount of physicality because that's not why people are excited to see you. Just be there. Be as good as you can be on the mic, which is better than 90% of the people that are doing it today.

but beyond all that just have fun and don't listen to the garbage in the internet wrestling community or Twitterverse because it's not real I do want to get one more question here before we wrap up it's from Anthony from ad-free shows he says what are your thoughts on WWE going two full months between PLEs I'm excited for the time to build great story so yeah there's no longer you know for years there used to be a December pay-per-view but now there's not It's just Survivor Series to the Royal Rumble of two-month time period to tell all those stories leading into that. I think that's another fascinating thing from my perspective because, you know, having those monthly PLEs, they generate great revenue. One of the reasons I went from four pay-per-views to six to eight to ten to twelve was because WCW needed that revenue at that point in time back in the early 90s, mid-90s.

And you kind of become addicted to that, right? That's great cash flow. It's predictable. you know it's going to be you're going to get a great return on your investment that's all the good news the bad news is it forces you to rush your stories you don't really have time to let stories sink in or you have to tell them so quickly that the nuance some of the subtle aspects of stories that people like to read into and and speculate about you don't get to do that because you're your speed reading through the book you don't really get to enjoy the book you're

giving the surface to get to the next page or in this case to get to the next PLE. Now you've got eight weeks to really tell great, nuanced, layered story. And let's see, but I predict that this is going to be a huge, huge improvement in the storytelling structure leading into Rumble, leading into WrestleMania. Yeah, I think there's going to be a stellar, stellar season for WWE. We, they got the elimination chamber event coming from down under as well, which is going to be super fun. They announced an event for Paris this past month. It's the international expansion and making these things seem like big time events, pacing them out over the course of the year, too.

It's exciting stuff, man, and makes me anticipate what is to come as a consumer of the products. So big shows all around, cannot wait for the Rumble in St. Pete and Tropicana Field. Hopefully the power stays on there. That's a legitimate concern of mine with the Tropicana Field, but we'll see. We want you to be part of our show here on Strictly Business. Advertised withericcq.com is going to get your product out in front of thousands of people every single week on Strictly Business.

We got the 83 weeks feed. It's one of the biggest podcast feeds in the world for professional wrestling, and we want you to be a part of it. Advertise witheric.com. No better time than the end of the year to start getting that product going. Get your business out there. We got the holidays coming up, Christmas, Hanukkah, whatever you celebrate. Always a good time. I like that look on you.

That's good. The backwards hat. You're going to be covering your bald head soon. I know, right? Getting everybody used to it. I got some cowboy has to stuff later on too, except we're in. I think that's the route. But here's the truth.

I look so awesome bald. It doesn't matter. There it is. There's the swag. This is a fact. There's the confidence. I knew it was there. This has been strictly business. We will see you next time.