99% Invisible - 475- Rock Paper Scissors Bus

Episode Date: February 2, 2022

When the two greatest auction houses in the world – Christie’s and Sotheby’s – vied for the privilege of auctioning off $20 million worth of art in 2004, little did they know that they would be forced to engage in an ancient form of ritualized combat known as rock paper scissors.Plus, we get a hilarious breakdown of the Shang-Chi bus fight scene by a real San Francisco Muni bus operator, Mc Allen.Rock Paper Scissors BusSubscribe to Snap Judgment

This is 99% invisible. I'm Roman Mars. Rock Paper Scissors is an elegant game dating back a couple thousand years. It hasn't always been rock paper or scissors, but the principles were always the same. Conflicting items in opposition thrown by hand simultaneously with a zero-sum outcome. You win, you lose, you draw. It's so simple and straightforward that anyone can understand it and play it, which is why it is spread everywhere in the world. The only non-intuitive aspect is the fact that paper beats rock, which defies our lived experience with both papers and rocks.

But I'm not here to nitpick. For as long as rock paper scissors has existed, it's been useful as a peaceful way to settle disputes. It's not as random as a coin toss, because you're playing against another human. It has enough randomness to feel fair, but enough skill to feel satisfying. Which leads us to one of the most high stakes

game of rock paper scissors I've ever heard of. Reported by our own Joe Rosenberg originally for the brilliant, brilliant show, Snap Judgment. Here's Joe Rosenberg, originally for the brilliant, brilliant show, SnapDouchman. Here's Joe Rosenberg. So, our story is going to start with this guy. That's, Lord, I'm practically making love to this microphone now. His name is Jonathan Rendell. I'm a deputy chairman of Christie's in America, who spent a lot of his time in the late

80s, early 90s selling material to Japan. Material meaning art. And in the mid 90s to the mid 2000s, going back to Japan to get everything back that I'd sold to them 10 years before. The extraordinary thing was you'd go to a trunk room. Which looks like that last scene in the Raiders of the Last Ark. You know,

there's things in boxes going on forever and open a box and in the box would be a work of art or several works of art and you would pick the object up and you would look on the back of it and you would find your handwriting from 10 years ago. That's so surreal. It really is like kind of this weird ebb and flow of prestige

between people and so long as you're the middleman you know You'll be all right in the end. Yeah, absolutely the beauty of the bubble market But of course Christie's did not have this wonderful pie all to itself It's a market that is really a duopoly between two Ultra-n-house giants those Christie's and then there's the other place You mean South of this. Yeah, it's like saying my opponent instead of yeah, so that's actually how one normally refers to it the other place So it's sort of a friendly ish rivalry. I

Wouldn't say it was entirely friendly friendly ish rivalry. I wouldn't say it was entirely friendly. And so the bees and Christy's to see there was one collection they both had their eyes on. The Mass Prudenco corporate collection was a jewel in the crown. It had everything that one wanted to sell at that precise moment. You know, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the He was really chummy with Sotheby's. They'd known him for years. If Christie's wanted that $20 million worth of business, they were going to have to win him over. It was very, very hard job for me, Mr. Hashiyama. This is Knai Ishibashi.

She worked at Christie's Tokyo office alongside Jonathan. Just think of her as the client whisperer. She'd been paying visits to Mr. Hashiyama think of her as the client whisperer. She'd been paying visits to Mr. Hossiama since almost her first day on the job, but he'd been proving tricky. He really doesn't sort of talk about business. We talked about art and music,

and he's great passions for dinosaurs. We could spend hours laughing. So he told me that when he's company was listed in a stock market, which was a very, very important incident, he chose the insurance company by throwing dice. Yes. So, when I heard that story I was I found it really funny and you know He's bit sort of eccentric and all that but we couldn't really read where he his mind was first Well, how many how many over how many years were you doing this? I think we'd spent six years Six years yeah meeting with mr. Hashem before the auction. That's incredible. And meanwhile though, um, you're not the only person meeting with him, I would take it.

No, no, no, no. South-South Abyss, they were there all the time. And after both houses, I've finally given their big presentations on why Mr. Hashem should choose them and not, you know, the other place. He came back with this extraordinary request. I received a call from Mr. Ashiyama in the office and he said in order to determine which auction house to handle collection. I would like both of you, Chris Sussan's Sotheby's, to play the game, Rock Paper Scissors. Yes, you heard her right. Mr. Hachiyama, one of the two biggest

auction houses in the world, to play a $20 million game of Rochembo. I think there was a moment, a moment of silence and surprise. And then what? That's it. I, I, I didn't really reply back to him. I couldn't really answer him like, why are you doing this? And you know, we can't really do that. I, I, I couldn't really answer him like why I do in this and you know we can't really do that. I couldn't believe it. You know we didn't know what to do but it was very clear that it was it was a very serious request from the client. And so when a client asks you to do something you just get on and do it.

Here's how it would work. Each side, Christie's and Sotheby's would have the weekend to come up with their choice of quote unquote, weapon. Then on Monday morning, they would meet at the Mass Prodangle offices in Tokyo, and there, they would do. This was one game, and Kenai's job was to write down one word on a piece of paper? And that word had to be either rock or paper or scissors. So we started compulsively playing rock paper scissors trying to work out how do we win this?

Is there some secret to this? How bad are you going to feel? How idiotic are you going to look in front of your colleagues when you've lost a collection for a child's game? I don't really remember those those three days. I was under enormous pressure to think what would be the best tragedy. But my struggle was always that I knew that there is no tragedy because it's just a pure chance. So constantly, whenever I had some moment on a train or walking in the streets, I suddenly sort of thought about rock paper scissors. I had to contemplate between choices.

I think it's paper, no, no, no, I think it's rock. Then I said, no, no, no, no, no, no, I shouldn't do it because there is no answer. There is no answer. Let's stop. But then even though I try not to think about it, I couldn't really forget about rock paper scissors from my mind. Do you think Mr. Hashiyama, do you think he was like just like sitting back rubbing his hands together like Mr. Visley?

I don't know. I really don't know. And meanwhile, of course, she was getting all kinds of advice. Every time I walked past, can I, I was constantly like, why do we go with rock? You know, it's the strong thing. And then there was this guy. My name's Nate McClain. Her boss at the Christie's offices in New York. Where we ran the impressionist and modern art department. Did you have an opinion about which to choose?

No, but obviously the first thing I did when I got home, I was telling my wife about this. And my daughters. I'm Flora. I'm Alice. They were 11 then. They're 20 now. And the Laura. I'm Alice. They were 11 then. They're 20 now. And the fun fact about them is we are twins. Are you identical, twin? Yeah, very identical.

One's left-handed, one's right-handed. Mirror twins. And we went in the kitchen of our home in New York. And he was saying, I've won a bit of an issue. So the reason it's going to get the steel. We were like, oh, yeah, we hate Sotheby's. And they came back to me quite promptly and said, yeah, dad, everybody knows you start with scissors.

Yeah, scissors is the pretty stand and move. So I said, well, how does that work? And they said, well, most people like the idea of gang was with rock. But because they were like super clever, so the bees were like, are they gonna bluff? So the bees would choose paper. But you then double bluff by getting scissors and scissors cuts paper.

And I said, all right, that sounds good. I said, what if they go scissors? They said you go scissors again. Because that's what I do. Yeah, you just stick with scissors and see what happens. At which point Nick called up. Can I? And he said, Panae scissors, I think scissors is a thing. And at that point, we get into the theater of the absurd.

You know, we're about to do this massive piece of business. And we're listening to the advice of 11 year olds. this massive piece of business and we're listening to the advice of 11 year olds. Would you would you have been willing to go with the Alice and Flores choice regardless of what it would have been with that of Stucky was like a at least at least that have had someone else to blame if it was wrong. But I wouldn't feel with my god that you know scissors are the best choice or rather I would say I got that, you know, scissors are the best choice. Or rather, I would say, I reached the point where the situation got beyond my capacity. I think I didn't quite sleep a few days,

but on that Sunday, evening, I stepped for a few hours. And then suddenly my husband came up in my dream. He said, can I? And he told me what choice I should come up with. Then I woke up and I saw the window and the sky was beginning to light up. I didn't look at the time, but I felt really sort of refreshed. Somehow, my husband's voice really struck me.

And I didn't even think about, you know, right or wrong, but I felt that it was a choice for me and I would go for it. So Monday morning, the car comes to pick me up with her in it and we start driving off towards the Mass Broadenco office And did she tell you what she decided? no She didn't no she was keeping her cards right place to a chest Did you pro pro her like oh come on can I just tell me yeah of course, but you know you try and get a secret out of her She won't tell you at that point point, would you have, um...

Happily got out of the car and walked away, yes. Why would you want to walk away though? I feel like the tension might be unbearable, but how could you possibly not want to be there in that room? Yeah, but it might be like, like, watching a kitten being steam-relet as well. Because if the pressure was big on me, it was absolutely massive on her.

So she had prepared herself and was sort of entering a semi-Zen state. So we arrive, we're shown to a waiting room. Then the two people from southern is arrive. Do you recognize the two people from southern is? Yeah, you know, I knew who they were. I recognize that you people from South of East? Yeah, you know, I knew who they were. But it's hardly the moment for, you know, hi, how are you? More sort of a grunt. So we sit one side of the table,

they sit the other side of the table, and there are two accountants and a facts machine. And somewhere on the other side of the facts machine, Mr. Hashiyam himself himself waiting for the results. And we're told to write down the word. And Jonathan actually looked at me and beneath the table, he showed me rock with his hand and his eyes were very sharp and he nodded to me once. I think he noticed to make sure that it was a good decision. And she's just saying nothing, so. Nothing. Nothing. And she goes ahead and writes down a word. Can you see what word she wrote? It's in Kangri, I don't read Japanese. But looking at the face of the accountant, holding the piece of paper, you could could tell nothing he was totally inscrutable. He looks at it, but what was

Probably 30 seconds and your your hearts and your mouth and then must pro person Open the envelope and he said sad the bees paper Christie's Seasus and then they look at Can I and say, you won. And it was like a huge, a huge weight in Kahnar for shoulders. But after we went outside the building, we screamed, saved by Can I, completely saved by Can I. saved by Kenai. Completely saved by Kenai.

Would you be deputy chairman of Christie's if if you if you had gone for rock? I know I suspect that might still be there but I probably wouldn't be quite where I am now. Really it really would have had that kind of a fact. It would have been a it's a huge career block. You just lost a great big deal. Obviously he should've come to us first. You never go paper. Paper just sounds like it's not going to win. It's a weak move. Wait, wait, wait, why not paper? Because the other person is going to stick with physics. It's just a weak move. Whether Mr. Hashiya may himself would agree with that, we don't know. But can I would meet him again

at the art auction in New York? And normally, you know, clients, they demand the very but can I would meet him again at the art auction in New York. And normally, you know, clients, they demand the very best restaurants in New York, but he said, well, I won't have a steak. So we went to the real sort of New York steak house, having crumb chowder and steak together. And it was a very simple dinner, but it was very nice. Did he ever talk about rock paper scissors again, or did you ever bring it up?

No, he never brought it up, and I didn't talk about it. But two years later, Mr. Hashem passed away, and that was the last time I saw him. Today, tonight, Izzy Bashi is quit the auction business entirely. She now runs a music school with her husband in Tokyo, and there's for next twin daughters, Allison Flora. Shortly after the art auction, Time Magazine ran a section called, quote, of the week. The Pope was there.

Arnold Schwarzenegger. I think the president, and Alice McLean. She has a framed. Yep, it's framed in the house. That's what was your quote. Everybody knows you go scissors. This story was first reported by Karen Vogel at The New York Times, and Joe Rosenberg first produced it for Snap Judgment, a show that I love, love, love.

We'll have a link to Snap and the original Times article on our website. Coming up after the break, in the Marvel movie Shang-Gee, there's an epic fight on a runaway bus, cringing down the hills of San Francisco. It is a great scene that we will make even better when we have an SF Muni bus driver tell you how that would really go down after this. I am extremely grateful that podcasting is as popular as it is. I get to have this career talking to you.

It's the best. But with the rise of podcasting comes an unexpected side effect. The sudden appearance of characters in movies and TV that are podcasters. They're usually played for laughs as one dimensional parodies. I really don't care. You find it fine. I'm totally into it. That show only murders in the building.

It is great. It is so funny. Not one second of it resembles actual podcasting, but I do not care at all. It is a delightful show. But there's one thing that does to go to me when a podcaster is shown on screen that bugs me just a little bit. And it is this. They never know how to hold a microphone.

In the real world, if you're recording anything, you generally have to be in a quiet place, and you have to put the mic right next to the sound. When you mic your voice, the mic is right next to your face. Fictional podcasters usually have bad mics and are pointed in random directions far away from the source of sound. Plus, they often record

narration in noisy environments like when they're driving a car, it's just ridiculous. And when the mic is in the wrong place on screen, it's kind of all I can see. I'm not so much of a grumpy pedant that, you know, it ruins anything for me, but it's just where my mind goes. I watch movies from the perspective of a podcaster. I assume this is true for almost any profession, be it a police officer or a doctor or a city bus driver, which leads me to one of my favorite things to ever happen on Twitter. A couple months ago, San Francisco Muni bus driver, Mac Allen tweeted one of the all-time great Twitter threads dissecting the thrilling runaway bus fight scene in Marvel

Shang-Chi. To begin with, I should say that Mac loves this whole action sequence, but like all movies, they took some liberties when it came to accurately depicting the operation of a San Francisco muni bus. So I asked him to come on the show to talk to me about it. So, the action in the scene really starts when Shang-Chi is surrounded by bad guys trying to grab his magical necklace and he summons always power and he punches one of them in the scene really starts when Shang-Chi is surrounded by bad guys trying to grab his magical necklace and he summons all his power and he punches one of them in the chest and the bad guy flies back like ten feet. And what do you write about this shot? This is the moment as a bus operator, I pop my parking brake and open the doors.

Once you have a fight on the bus, you don't want the bus to be moving and you want people to be able to get off. This is bus operator Mack Allen talking me through some of the highlights of his Twitter thread. Then we see somebody is recording a video of the fight. What up y'all, it's your boy Clevd coming at you live on the bus. I actually did take a little bit of martial arts

as a youth, so I'm gonna try and grade this fight as we're going. It's my opinion that this would definitely happen, for sure sure as soon as there's a fight on the bus. People are going to be taking video. Then the action ratchets up another level when the main antagonist in the fight reveals his energy sword arm, character named Razor's fist, and he literally is cutting through the floor of the bus. As a bus operator, I'm looking at this and I see that he's got non-slip boots that look like they're really excellent for working on a bus. So that's my comment on

Razor Fist is good shoes for a fight. And he actually cuts through the floor of the bus and cuts through the air hose that feeds the air breaks for the bus. Then we get to see my hero of the scene, the bus operator, maybe a little bit of a bumbling anti-hero. Michael Anthony Taylor, who is wearing earphones, is pushing on the pedal of the brake, the treetle, and the bus will not stop. He actually takes out his earphones and throws him away. And this is where I start to hold the bus operator

responsible for everything that goes wrong from here on out. So one, he shouldn't be wearing headphones. You know, that's not allowed at Muni. We're not allowed to have any personal electronic devices on our person in any way. And we're certainly not allowed to muffle sounds that we might need to hear. And you mentioned that the break pedal is called a treetle. I'd never heard that term before.

Yeah. There's a bunch of weird sort of inherited terms. I think some of them actually come from the early days of railroads. Our schedules are called paddles and the brake is called a treetle. They are different than the hydraulic brakes in a car. The emergency function of it fails safe in a very important way that we as bus operators have to be aware of all the time because if that failsafe engages when we aren't ready for it, it can be very dangerous.

So air breaks actually have a failsafe called the spring break, which is a physical lever that will engage into the brakes to stop the wheels from turning. And that spring break is held open, not engaging on the wheel, by air pressure. So we use air pressure to engage the regular brake, the service brake that actually we used to like slow the bus and stop the bus in normal service. And that is engaged by adding air pressure to the service brake.

The spring brake is held open by that same air pressure. So if you lose air pressure, then the spring break, which a physical spring pushes on it, will engage the brakes. We really don't want that to happen normally while the bus is in motion because it will, violently and immediately stop the bus. It's not something that comes on slowly, comes on at once.

So we actually have a audible and visual warning for low air pressure that alerts us before this spring break is actually going to engage. So there's air pressure in the system that makes the normal way we think of as break work work by uses pressure. It makes a break pads go against wheels and then it slows down. But if the pressure is cut, if little razor arm cuts through the hose,

then it releases all the air from the system. And then this spring break system activates and then it's physically impossible for the wheels to move at that point. The bus should stop. It's dead. It's dead. And it doesn't impossible for the wheels to move at that point. The bus just stopped. It's a dead, it's dead. And it doesn't move. That bus is not moving.

And it doesn't matter if you're at the very peak of California pointing down, it's not going anywhere. And that's a perfect place to resume the thread because that's where we find ourselves on the one California. And actually, this is an excellent point about the scene is that the bus that they're using for the one California is a diesel hybrid articulated motor coach.

And the actual one California is a trolley coach. It uses trolley poles to draw electricity from the overhead wires. And we never see any overhead wires in Shang-Chi. I think because the overhead wires would legitimately be a very dangerous thing to try and film around if you're doing stunt driving. Charlie coaches everywhere are offended that they've been sideline. I love Charlie coaches, but I don't drive them. You mentioned that it was articulating, which means that it's one of those buses that

has like two sections of the bus and a little accordion thing between them so that it can be a very long bus and still navigate, you know, normal, size streets. In bus operator parlance, we call those artics, which is just short for articulated. A lot of people like to call them bindi buses my kids call them bindi buses. They're called accordion buses and some people also call them slinky buses. They're all delightful whatever their name. So the scene goes on and your commentary continues and there are parts where you lay a little more blame on the bus driver for not wearing a seatbelt and such. And you heap some unexpected praise

on how well Aquafina can operate the bus and also use the little lever that opens the front and back to words, which I learned from you is a pretty tricky thing to do. And it's all really fun to talk about what is realistic and what isn't. But you are very clear to all of this that it is done out of love.

Like this is a great scene that you really enjoy. Oh, it's fantastic. It's phenomenal. I enjoyed every moment of it and I really loved that the bus is a hero in the movie. You know, it really is a hero in the movie and buses really are heroes of the city. So I was extremely pleased and you know, we didn't mention any of the fight choreography or anything like that, but it's incredible, you know, we didn't mention any of the fight choreography or anything like that But it's incredible, you know throughout the entire scene is incredibly enjoyable. I loved it It's so good. It's so good Whenever there's a viral thread, there's this joke that people are supposed to plug their soundcloud at the end

But you use that space to encourage people to think their boss operator Can you describe? Why you did that and what that means to encourage people to thank their bus operator. Can you describe why you did that and what that means to you? Yeah, as a bus operator, it's actually sometimes kind of lonely. A lot of times, you're not really aware of whether people are even aware that a person is doing this work to serve the system. So receiving just a simple thank you actually feels like a little boost. You feel a little bit better in your day as that happens. And I moved to the Bay Area 21 years ago in Oakland and writing AC Transit, an AC Transit operator actually taught me as like a 17 year old kid. You know, when you get off the bus, say, thank you operator.

And I've kept that habit ever since and now as a muni operator myself, I'm now trying to make it a habit to thank the passengers for writing muni. But I do think it really sort of, it makes you feel more human in the operator seat when somebody recognizes that you're providing that service. And so I think, you know, thank you operator should be elasting you to as you could offer bus. You can follow Mac Allen at that underscore MC on Twitter where you can find this whole hilarious thread and so many more daily insights from the perspective of an SF Muni bus driver. Thank you, operator.

99% Invisible was produced this week by Joe Rosenberg, music by Swansea Owl. Delaney Hall at the executive producer Kurt Colstad is our digital director. The rest of the team includes Vivian Leigh, Chris Baroube, Christopher Johnson, Emmett Fitzgerald, Washington, Jason DeLeone, Martin Gonzalez, Sophia Klutzker, and me Roman Mars. Special thanks this week to Glenn Washington and Pat Masidimiller at SnapJet. And Mac Allen from SF Muni. We are part of the Stitcher & Serious XM Podcast family, now headquartered six blocks north in the Pandora building. In beautiful, uptown. Oakland, California. You can find the show and join

discussions about the show on Facebook. You can tweet at me at Roman Mars and the show at 99 PI org. We're on Instagram and write it too. You can find links to other Stitcher shows I love as well as every past episode of 99PI at 99p i dot org. Coming up this year from 99% Invisible and the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation, a new four-part podcast series called The Future of Da-Da-Da-Da. I like to say the Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da-Da- being in years to come. Our first episode is all about the future of the office. It turns out people have been going back and forth about what makes a healthy and productive office since there have been offices. Just to give one example. This is Design Writer and Friend of the Show, Alison Ariaf. So, you know, Facebook, when they were first emerging as a company, they bought the old Sun Microsystems building in Menlo Park and

doubled the amount of people in the same office space. Of course they didn't pitch it that way. They said, oh my god, this is so amazing. We have all this collaborative collisions and spontaneous interactions because everyone's in here. And then they hired Frank Garry to design this giant warehouse next to its son, Microsystems, and to me that building looks exactly like the rows of desks of like little telephone banks that secretaries had in the 1950s, but it was supposed to be so radical and so amazing that everybody was on the same floor

and they were all going to be so innovative, but it's like so retrograde. So I think there's always this tension between narrative and reality about what the office is achieving. The 20th century was full of missb�an fads and productivity innovations that continue to this day, even when the whole notion of what it means to be in an office has shifted during the pandemic. This special episode is part of a fourpart series we created exploring the future of health

and well-being, imagining what the world might look like in the next 15 years. Each episode examines what we've done in the past and what we do today to create a healthier, more equitable future. The future of Da-Da-Da from 99% of visible and the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation. We'll be releasing these throughout the year for the first episode on offices for me years next week. To not miss a single episode, all you have to do is keep listening to 99% of visible. you