A Geek History of Time - Episode 179 - V the Leftist Allegory Turned Fascist Dogwhistle Part I

Episode Date: October 9, 2022

And while we have a through line that states, Authorial intent means dick, right? I don't want to have to have the same haircut, you have dad. Sorry, I'm pretty something. Aww. Aww. So was this before or after the poster and you vomiting all over the couch? For those of you that can't see, Ed's eyes just crossed. It is fucked up. But it's not wrong. Oh, huh. Nu-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti-ti- This is a geek history of time.

Where we connect to the real world. My name is Ed Boylock, I'm a world history and I'm a and the English teacher and the sixth level here in Northern California. And as you know, as much, we try to keep this timeless. But I try to keep this timeless. You just, you like cross that line, do it. Yeah, yeah, you come back saying I kept it timeless. No, yeah, no. So this week was back at school night at my site. Yeah. And I, I, I, I, I

wound up being really ambivalent about the fact that we held it in person. And I mean, I'm, I'm, it's one of those situations where like there's one part of it that I'm really, really like immensely pissed about. And then there's another part that like looking back on it, I'm like, you know what? I'm actually, that was really good. There was a good thing there. So the part I'm pissed off about is, of course, that, you know, we're still in the middle of a worldwide disease pandemic. And in like wave, I don't even know what a variant like I lost track three Greek letters ago,

I like, I don't know. They don't use Greek letters at this point. So we are definitely dating this. We are past BA point four or five answers. Yeah, okay. It's now coming around to something different. Yeah. And so anyway, we're in the middle of all that

and like literally everybody at my site, I'm in two different departments. So I had to attend two different department meetings about this. You know, we held a vote. And in two different, you know what I mean? On the same day, I had to bounce from one to the other. But in two different department meetings,

the vote was unanimous. And the vote was apparently unanimous across the other departments too, English department and history department. And everybody else voted, let's do it virtual. Cool. And our administrator. And our administrator was like,

I really want to do it virtual. And the district office came back and said, no, we're want to do it virtual. And the district office came back and said, no, we're going to do it in person. Did they get to show up to the same place? Cause that's the only acceptable. You you plan what? What? And and sweat it out with with the Hoy ploy? Are you? What? are you? I didn't start off. You didn't. But what I'm there now. I'm there now.

Like how long have you been working in education? Come on. You knew the answer before you fucking ask. Come on. So anyway, so that was that I felt I felt desperately ill used. I was really pissed about that. We were all we were all, you know, everybody was to one extent or another grumbling from from mift to like incandescently angry about it. Um, but then I realized after the whole thing started part of the reason that I'm good at my job is I, I'm a performer and I need an audience. And it wound up actually, like I had some really good connections with some parents

and I got to humanize myself for them, which like you know is incredibly important. I'm pretty sure I bought myself some goodwill with a lot of them going into the rest of the year. And one of my favorite bits was I kept, because this is, you know, six graders are still new to me. And so I mentioned to these parents that like, you know, I'm used to dealing with seventh graders who frequently have harder edges and more of like a carapace on them, you know, they're they're harder and scratchier and they have they have edges.

they're harder and scratchier and they have edges. And so I'm still learning how to adjust to sixth graders and I'm kind of, you know, they're learning to react to me and I'm learning to react to them. And what I've learned is that, you know, I've gotten used to over the last many years of my career dealing with older kids. I've learned to, you know, use the steel fist in a silken glove. And I'm realizing now that I need to switch to a different metal, like bronze or copper, you know,

something a little bit softer. And I kept getting laughs with that. And that was, that felt really, like in the moment, that was, that was a hit of dopamine that I really needed. And like the rational part of my brain is like that doesn't fucking matter. Like, no, this is still a fucking travesty, but the squishy emotional dopamine centers in my brain are like, yeah, but man. Yeah, but, you know, and so that's so I'm ambivalent. I shouldn't be like logically. I'm like, no, no, this was bullshit. And we shouldn't have had to do it. But yeah, so that's I think both things of that can be true, though. Like this isn't like measuring whether or not Anakin was a villain.

This actually can have, you know, you can't have nuance. They're you don't have to weigh the scales. Yeah, you have to. Yeah, okay. You know, all of that is absolutely true. That's nicely done. Thank you. All of that is absolutely true. You absolutely thrive in that situation. And that situation still isn't safe. And therefore, should not have been foisted upon you. All of that can be true. So, so anyway, that's that's my big news for the week. Oh, how about you?

What do you add going on? Well, I'm Damien Harmony. I am a Latin teacher for one more year in a US history teacher at the high school level up here in northern California. And I, let's see, since we've dated this, I'm still not working at an iron different districts. His starts at a reasonable time. Mine starts way too late.

But that is neither here nor there. So I spent today having a work date. So my girlfriend and I are both teachers, and she came over with a list of things she wanted to get done. I had a list of things I wanted to get done, and we worked on those things, and then we broke at the end of it, and it was nice because it was,

my house is like incidentally set up well for working quietly together. Yeah. And so that's what we spend our day doing. Well, that's, that's actually really awesome. Yeah. That's cool that you got the opportunity to share, uh-huh, their space with each other. Yeah, it felt a little L-frame bomb and Matilda gauge, you know?

Minus personalities part. Well, I'm sure she's probably for a more aggressive and alpha than you are. Oh, Matilda? Absolutely. Yeah, well, yeah. And yeah, anyway. Yeah, well, and so here's the thing,

like she's a music teacher. So she is over there. So she's a knife fighter. She's a music teacher. So she is over there. She's a knife fighter. She's been trained. Her whole career. But she's over there. No, no, those funds discretionary, that's fucking mine. If you come here, I will cut you.

But she's over there, like humming out tunes and going, and I would hear her and I'd see her moving her hand as though she was on the bow. And you know how like people say, you know, I was writing an email and their fingers start going like they're doing it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So she's over there like phantom bowing and humming out a tune and she's like, no, that's too complex for them. But maybe four.

And so I just got to like see her process. And it was that had to be so fucking cool. It was neat. Yeah, that's really cool. You know, she's she's doing a process of a thing that I have zero talent in whatsoever Despite my last name so But it was it was really nice to just occupy the same space and then we would bounce ideas off each other Like hey, how does this sound if you're gonna do a rubric? What would you do and on and on and on? So there's it's yeah, I've never dated a teacher before. Much less been in level with one. Yeah, it's it's

kind of cool because you know, it's it's there's there's a level of there's a level of shared just like understanding of so much of like your paradigm. Yeah, despite our wildly different subjects and levels, like she doesn't teach at the high school level. And what level is she at? She's a K8. Oh, yeah. So, okay. But like, it's my admiration for her just went up like three notches. Well, now you know why she has the patience to be with me. I didn't say that out loud. I wanted noted like as your friend, I was the one who said that, you know, but I'm not going to disagree. But like when I was substituting, I eventually put in like like for myself, I just said, if it's if it's below fourth grade, I'm not doing it. Yeah. Oh, yeah. If it's third, if it's third, I'll look at it real hard and be like, how badly do I,

like, do I think I'll get another job? But if it was second grade or below, I was nope. Yeah. No. So because I'm, I just don't have, I don't have the, yeah. So I admire her immensely. Yeah. That's amazing. But that said, we have our three days of professional development next week, and it's the most ridiculous thing there is because it's all online modules. But the district is insisting that we be in person to do the online modules because, of course, they're insisting. And you're all going to have to be in the same fucking room, aren't you? Yeah.

And I'm like, you're going to have to be in the same fucking room, aren't you? And I'm like, you're gonna have to sit in the library, right? No, a cafeteria, because big old school. But still, we're all doing an online module. Guess where we could do that from. Like home, yeah. But it's, I swear to God, it's a conspiracy. Like they are trying, they are trying to kill us by virtue of,

like pretending that they didn't know any better. And it just, it's like your weaponized incompetence. With your district, which will remain nameless, that's not even a conspiracy theory. That's just like I accept that. Yes, just fucking true. Right? Like, you know, in every other aspect of life, I look at anything going on and I go, never blame on maliciousness, what can be explained by incompetence. And in the case of your district, I'm like, no, no, no, they're emulsified. They're there.

100%. They're thoroughly, it is a solution at this point. Yes, separate one from the other. thoroughly it is a solution at this point. Yes, separate one for the oil is in the water. Like we don't know how but we don't know how the hell it happened, but there is. Yeah, actually I'd say in your district, it's more like, you know, water and and uh, um, shit, peroxide hydroxide. Like the solution is just like, no, yeah, like no, it's it's the same shit. Like, it's not, but like, no, it is now a thing. My next shift, I bet my life on it. So, but yeah, so that's, that's what I'm looking forward to next week. It's going to be stupid.

Yeah. And the thing is, like, I actually really like the training that they got for us, but I wanted to go to the next level this year for it. And they've got us still doing like entry level type stuff. And they're doing it in the worst possible way. So, I can't absorb it. I can't integrate it into my philosophy. I can't reflect upon it.

And I can't change my teaching in those two and a half days before I have kids in front of me. So it's the best idea done the worst way. Okay, part of that, part of that always rankles me at the beginning of the year, which my current district is better than my old district was about this, but it's still, it's endemic to the profession is like, okay, so you're gonna come in and like we want you to report in, you know, three days before the kids show up. And we're going to take all but half of one day. That's precisely the model. Talk at you. Yep. Like, how about I've got a goddamn classroom to prepare.

Yeah, or could you at least give me a towel so I can get something productive done. Yeah. Like, like, you know, yeah, and, and I wound up, like this year, I didn't wind up decorating my room to anywhere in the same standard I did last year, because I mean, I'm still probationary, but like, yeah, I don't work for free. I'm putting that in for hours. I'm working for free anymore. Like, I've done with that, and no, you know, and I mean, you know, the kids don't know any better because they they're all six graders. They weren't here last year. But, you know, I still like I'm looking at my room like, well, shit, if they'd given me

more time, you know, but yeah. So anyway, now that we've bitched about our jobs, speaking of conspiracies. Yes. Yes Tonight's topic is is going to be about a TV series that got four iterations over the course of 26 years Okay, and it's yeah, and it absolutely feeds into conspiracy theory Absolutely feeds into conspiracy theory wacky this toward the end, but the whole time it actually is kind of encased in that. So yeah, you're older than I am. You remember more than I do. Okay. Um, and then also I'm going to talk about the podcast.

But do you remember a TV series with Mark Singer in it and Michael Ironsides in it called V? Okay, so you mentioned the name Michael Singer and nothing happens. Do you say you say Ironsides? Yeah, Mark Singer. Mark Singer. You say Mark Singer. I don't. I'm a master. Oh, okay. Yeah. So you say that and I like like I can immediately picture his face, but the name Versus off my memory like Michael Ion said Michael Ion's eyes on the other hand like yeah, no that's that's Ratchet dick boozy himself. Yeah, man. Yeah So yeah, I do have memories of me. I have I actually have some pretty vivid memories of V. And F. Yeah, so when the first mini series showed up,

I remember how many nights it was over, but when that was first on, okay. When that was first on, it was on after my bedtime. was first on, it was on after my bedtime. And I remember some of the other kids who did not have parents who were as strict. Well, a copter like, you know, talking about it. And I remember, like, I don't remember if I like snuck out of it. If I was intentionally sneaking out of my room to try to see what my folks were watching. Or if I, or if I like got up to go to the bathroom and I kind of glimpse at something.

Sure. But, um, it, what I, what I, what I actually saw on two separate occasions was the very first scene when she unhinges her jaw and eats the gerbil and eats the gerbil. Yes. Which glorious 80s special effects going on there. And then the other one was the baby. I put the glimpse of the alien baby or actually now the the yeah the alien looking baby in the room. And what I also remember was we were living in Hawaii at the time and it was on this was on way way late at night and the local news folks, you know, back when you know, back when, you know, people like watched the local news and it wasn't owned by, you know, huge multinational conglomerates.

The anchors on news were coming on and they were live doing their hay on the 11 o'clock news tonight, you know, their break ins during the commercial breaks. Like over several of those break ins, one of theors in the in the in the local studio was saying, oh, I got I got to see this baby. This is going to be good. I got to see this baby. I got to see this. And then when they when they cut to go to commercial break right after, you know, the cliffhanger, oh my god, alien lizard baby. The first thing they did was they went to tonight, I think, 11 o'clock. Yeah. They, they went back to that new studio, and it was just an empty studio, the desk,

there was nobody behind the desk, and the camera ran up on the desk, and you heard the camera, and you're going, Bob, Bob, and they pointed the camera over the desk. And he was, you know, like he passed out, like he said. Right. Nice. So yeah, you know, like he passed out. Like, right. Nice. So yeah, you know, it was, it was a different time in television.

But yeah, and, and the idea of, you know, the, the humans being like free dried or stored like board the alien ship and the pods, yep, that messed with me. Like that showed up in my nightmares for months. Sure. Sure. So yeah, no, I remember it. I remember it pretty vividly. I don't remember anything about the plot, but I remember those those details. in a podcast series titled V4 Times from allegory to warning to conspiracy hysteria. Or how a warning about Nazis became the tool of people who want the Nazis to win. Oh shit. Yeah, it's going to get depressing. So let's start in 1935. 35 year episodes. I did the one on Ace of Base. I know. And Nazis. I know.

But my fault is Nazis all the way down. This is what happens when you don't take your full course of antibiotics and you just take it until the symptoms of it. This is true. So anyway, okay. In 1935, Sinclair Lewis wrote, it can't happen here, which is a dystopian political novel that described a Hitler-like American politician drawing upon the baddest of faith and taking the greatest of liberties with opportunistic politics.

Sinclair Lewis's wife, Dorothy Thompson, Dorothy, reported on the growing power of Nazism in Germany that she became the first American journalist expelled from Nazi Germany in 1934. Go not. Yes. Thompson. Helly, man.

Thompson had met and interviewed Adolf Hitler in 1931. And then she wrote the book, I saw Hitler in that same year because she wanted to warn the world of what would happen if he came to power. She is a Cassandra obviously. Sadly, even though she's Dorothy. Yeah, and again, this is 1931. He has not yet come to power. She saw this coming because there were signs, and if you look at them and pay attention to them,

you could do something about it. Well, yeah. So she says of him, she said, quote, he is formless, almost faceless. A man whose countenance is a caricature, a man whose framework seems cartiliginous without bones. He is inconsequent and voluble, ill-poised and insecure. He is the very prototype of the little man. Wow. Okay. So she wrote that in what year? 31. And it took them until when to kick

her. Well, they had to be in power. But you could see why she was jacked hooded from the country in 34. Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, the moment the moment Adolf got up there, that could not be allowed to stay. Well, I mean, they took power in 33, right? Yeah. And so, but they're entrenching their power in 34. And some of that has to do with kicking out, you know, press the doesn't like it. Oh, yeah.

So, I mean, as soon as as soon as they could, she's going to be a top and a list because, you know, the leader cannot be disrespected like that. Exactly. But back to her husband, who wrote a book. Yeah. Yeah. In Lewis's book, it's 1936. We follow a journalist, Dorimus Jessup, who is a classic liberal, who hates communist and authoritarian both. And as he adjusts to the new thing that has happened here, Buzz Windrip, the senator from an

unnamed state is strangely charismatic. He uses a populist platform to insert himself into the Democratic National Convention, defeats FDR for the Democratic nomination, and runs on a platform of standing up for the forgotten man, making America prosperous and great again, $5,000 for each person and American values. He goes on to trounce the Republican and become president. Okay, I just I want to take a moment to to say how in the present moment, looking at the shape of our current politics, how, I don't know if odd is the right word, how, how, how interesting I find the change in paradigm.

That when he wrote that in 36, the politician that he was overturning or defeating to get the nomination was FDR, a Democrat. And he was a Democrat who was doing it. And he's a Democrat who's doing it. As opposed to what, of course, actually wound up happening in our country, which was the little man who don't you dare say he's a little man, he's, you know, six, two, right? Right. perfectly above average, right? You know, that guy wound up overcoming from the right. So here's the question. In 36, was the calculus that this is going to come from that direction because like from

the FDR direction because that's the populist direction. Yes. Okay. Yes. It's populism. Okay. Yeah.

It's 100% populism. Now, having figured that out, it makes like, okay. Yeah. Now, it makes sense. Because that's exactly how the Tandering demon also became president. It was populism. Yes. And it was playing to the same basic people.

Yeah, it was. People for whom inequality had hit hard and who felt ignored and aggrieved. Whether or not they're correct. Yeah. It's as a friend of the show, Gabriel Cruz, Dr. David Cruz, that resentiment where your feelings might be based on bullshit, but the feelings you've got are real. Yeah, they're actionable. Yeah. So within a blistering short, a blisteringly short amount of time, President Windrip creates a paramilitary force called the

Minutemen, whom he uses to enforce his political will, set up concentration camps, outlaw dissent, and completely nerf the Senate and the House. People do protest, including several legislators, and are swiftly and brutally put down by the minute-men who use bayonets to get their point across. Well done there. Thank you. We then reorganize the US into districts, eliminating states completely and presumably the need

for legislators from them as well as Installing military tribunals to put people on trial in King Rooquarts. Of course people don't like this, but they agree that it's the only thing that will restore America to its former greatness. That and suppressing the rights of women and minorities. Well, yeah, in the book, a senator, In the book, a senator, Trialbridge, and I just love these names. He openly resists, so you've got Doramus, Buzz Windrip, Trialbridge. Yeah, I love Windrip. I'm still getting over. Yeah. And it could be Windrip, or it could be Windrip, or Windrip. You know, I don't know.

Well, you know, or Windrip. Right. Well, that's ridiculous. But they openly resist the president's corpo government. And they set up this underground resistance called the new underground, which sets up a route for people to flee to Canada and sends out anti-windry pop propaganda. Dorima's Jessup is a part of this organization and he writes editorials critical of Windrip. There's a nemesis plotline going on,

but Jessup ends up in a concentration camp and then escapes it and flees to Canada. Meanwhile, Windrip manages not to follow through on his prosperous promises and more and more people flee to Mexico and Canada, including his own vice president. He also begins alienating, he vice president. He also begins alienate he being windrup also begins alienating the rest of his inner circle, his secretary of

defense and the main military attach to his secretary of defense ends up exiling windrup to France. But then the secretary of defense, his name is I think Sarasin, I say our ASON though, but I mean, it sounds. Uh-huh, yeah. Still, come on. He's so bad at his job that his military attach a hike, H-A-I-K, uh, leads his own supporters into the White House to do an insurrection to kill Sarasin and company and to set up hike as the new president. Seeing that people aren't fully on board, hike tries to invade Mexico since people love a good war, which necessitates a draft. And at this, the people finally bulk

and one of his chief generals, Emmanuel Koon, defects, yeah. Okay. Defects to the opposite side, taking a big chunk of the army with him, and then America has plunged into a civil war with the resistance holding the center pretty well, and that's where the shit ends shit, the, the shit ends.

That's where the book ends. That is a hell of a ride. It is, it is. I mean, it's 700 pages and I, I compressed a lot there, but there, the thing is, this is a really, really influential book on a lot of people. And I wanted to start it here because, and kind of pull it forward because this does become an influence in everything that we're going to talk about.

Okay. Now, Sinclair Lewis, he'll hated Huey Long and was clearly naming him without naming him. And rightly so. Yes, might I add. Right, but let's take a look at this. A strangely charismatic leader with a funny name, yeah, who is just grabbing power and grabbing power and grabbing power. That's Huey Long, right? Oh, yeah. And he was going to challenge FDR from

the left, from the populist left. That was his plan in 36. It is so weird. Okay. I mean, still it's just, it is, it is so weird. And I mean, it's totally presentism, but it's so weird to think of the idea of a racist populist demagogue coming from the left. What a pin in that part right there, the racist populist part. Demagogue, you're absolutely correct. But let's, let's right there, the racist populist part. Demagogue, you're absolutely correct. But let's come back to the racist populist. Yes, let's put a pin in the racist part, though, just to make sure, just to make sure. Okay. Um, so,

St. Clair Lewis also casts himself as Jessup, obviously. Like there's a writer who has done. Yeah, yeah. Now luckily for Lewis, Long gets assassinated in September of 35, so the danger that he could have posed, ebbed away. Long was from Louisiana. He was a governor, turned senator who was strangely charismatic, a huge left wing populist from the south who thought that FDR wasn't going far enough left. Remember, Jessup didn't like authoritarians or communists. And this plays well in the Impover South in the 1930s. Long called his program the Share Our Wealth program.

Okay. Long was in many ways a left wing populist dictator and waiting. He was the political boss in Louisiana and one of the first to use loudspeakers to get his message across. I mentioned that just because also Hitler did. Yeah. Yeah, which is a game changer. It absolutely is a game changer because you don't have to be Teddy Roosevelt. Yes. So he also made big use of the radio spots and was fine with punching his opponent in the nose in public. He did that. In case, yeah, in case anyone is tempted to lament the slide of American politics into incivility.

No. Yeah. Like that overhead is there again. Yeah, but that, that, that element is always, is what I'm trying to say. So yeah, all right. So once governor long fired hundreds of people that he considered political opponents, and he began consolidating power at an alarming rate to the point where he got impeached within his first year serving as governor. He raised. Yeah. He raised to the government mansion, or the governor's mansion, and then he had a new

one built in its place that resembled the White House. What? Yeah, he's making jobs. He used the National Guard of the state to overstep what the mayor's wanted, which like, yeah, he's getting enforce it with the National Guard. Now, having said that, you do recall that it was paratroopers that were desegregating schools in Arkansas. Yeah, no, I understand what was long having the National Guard do.

Uh, it was a lot of it was the mayors weren't giving out monies to people from the state, weren't doing out, you know, because you have the, the, the, the federal goes to state, the state goes to county, county goes to city, you know, that whole or parish, I'm sorry, goes to paris, yeah, Louisiana, Louisiana. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. And he dismissed criticism of bureaucrats who should have been a check on his power. His supporters and the legislature openly brawled with his detractors

during an impeachment vote in the state assembly chambers. There's an actual brawl. His supporters use Brax Knuckles and his own brother, bit a legislator's neck. What? Yeah. Like a neck stuffles part doesn't really surprise me because like this is this is the same culture. Yeah. Well, and this is the same culture that you have rise to, you know, the painting of Richard Sumner. Oh, that's that's on the East Coast. I I will say that Louisiana is a different beast, but you know, but it's deep south.

Yeah, you know, I'm just saying. Yeah. Yeah. No, I understand your quibble, but like I'm still not shocked The biting though his own brother this that's Because of course went blanca on him like like yeah, yeah Wow Long survives an impeachment largely by offering favors to enough state legislators that he would beat the math, as well as going to the bully pulpit to tell people that it was all a plot

by standard oil. Like, of course, well, I mean, yeah. And then he went after those who voted in favor by eliminating their relatives from the government. Um, he took issue with something that he called the lying press. Wait, wait, stop. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, what, what year is this again? Uh, 19, 29, because he would have gotten elected in 28 as governor. Yeah. He was using that phrase in 29. Uh-huh. Wow. Oh, yeah. That's, that's the thing. Gryfters never do anything new. Like, they just, they reassess a great. Wow. Yeah. It's either that they reassess a gift or that the easiest thing to do is the least imaginative thing, and that's all a grifters do too. Yeah, I think I think we're working on those dose. I mean, it's basically the two below down to the same thing, but like, oh my god. Yeah. Wow. So,

so went went after went after people who crossed him, used the phrase the lying press. Fucked over their family specifically. Like many of them weren't off it. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I, you know, I don't know why this comes to mind, but you know, there's concern about in investigation of the orange one lately that, that like the Department of Justice has said specifically

that they're worried about potential witnesses being intimidated or having their families be threatened. Like, yeah. God, you have it. Nothing ever changes. No, it just the stakes get deeper. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Anyway, so he also made his own newspaper, starting in 1930, which was happily distributed by police officers state troopers truckers and highway workers. Okay. Yeah, hold on a sure he's a populous leftist. Yeah, populous leftist. Yep. And the authoritarian and then the yeah, okay, yeah, because authoritarian then cops. Okay, right. Because I was going to say like wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, you could be an authoritarian leftist. You can't. Yeah, you can totally be an

assistant. Hi, Stalin Joseph. Hey, how you doing? Buddy, not buddy. No, fuck off. But wow. Yep. Yep. So then he runs for Senate, which is a seat that he took in 1932. Now during his campaign, his bodyguards abducted and held in captivity, one of his most vocal critics for four days before the election. What? Once his critic committed. Yeah, simple kidnapping. Yeah, all Simbrison. Yeah, well, I'm sure they didn't call it that. I'm sure they called it like, well, let's just come up to the cabin like And when you leave people will ask and you'll say, oh, I was just finishing up by the cabin

Yeah, right. Okay, if your family were to be hurt by any rumors, wouldn't it? Yeah. So once, once released, his critic, whose name was Erby, read a fake confession that he'd asked Long for protection, and that's what it happened. Look, I've been critical of Long, but he's got some followers that are kind of wacky long. Can you please protect me? And then he also had fake votes working in his favor as well. Okay, okay, hold on. Sure. Wait, stop.

Sure. Okay, because see, that's a level of complexity of plotting. Uh-huh. But I don't think our current crop of fascists would actually be able to off. So you're saying, I mean, I mean, we did have a general plead the fifth when it came to, to you think the Constitution is the highest law of land. Or yeah, yeah, but, but that's just saying I'm not going to answer that question. I mean, he literally, uh-huh, through his own followers under the bus,

as an explanation for intimidating guy. They fall. Who is one of, you know, like still. This guy's mask might not have been based on reasonability. I mean, how many of us would actually hurt this guy? Exactly, but he was afraid. Here's his condition.

All right. Okay. I'll get right. Fine. Yeah. I can almost hear that. They were orange ones voice. All right. Okay. Fine. Now he gets elected to Senate, but he delays assuming his own Senate seat until his governorship is almost up because he doesn't want his lieutenant governor to undo everything he did. So when he was asked why he was okay leaving the Senate seat vacant for almost two years, he we long remarks that it's been vacant for quite some time since his opponent held it for 31. So he did to the Senate and it does serve for two years because he doesn't want to undo what he's doing his governor. Okay.

So, so, I mean, he's an evil son of a bitch. Like, there's no getting around the fact that this is just like purely neutral evil right here. Like, totally 100%. Like, I got mine. Fuck you. Yeah. Damn sure ain't lawful.

But, but that, but that line. Uh-huh. I, I have to grudgingly give him credit for a hell of a burn there. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Like that's, like that only did you put the shade back onto the guy that you defeated. Yeah. But also, but you, you've sidesteped any further question because people are laughing. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Yeah, he was a dangerous motherfucker. Oh, I'm listening to that. Holy cow. I'd have been terrified as this asshole too. Oh, yeah. So when a governor leaves a state, the lieutenant governor is the de facto governor, right? Yeah, me and most systems. Yeah. Yeah. So when Huey Long went to Mississippi, he tried to keep it a secret so that his lieutenant governor, a guy named Seer, C-Y-R, Okay.

Wouldn't be able to say again. Yeah, Seer, sounds right. Okay. He wouldn't be able to act on it. Seer found out and then declared himself governor long then ordered the National Guard to surround the capital to prevent Sear from entering it. And then he petitioned the Supreme Court to kick Sear out since Sear had abandoned his post as Lieutenant Governor, the second that he tried to take over as governor. And it worked. All right.

Because only the good die young. Now through all of this, he can, he we long continued to do things that he knew would specifically benefit the poor. He continued to keep that up. The forgotten men of Louisiana long increased pave highways in Louisiana more than seven fold from 331 miles to 2301 miles. Okay, stop. Sure. Stop. Okay. He took, he took office in, in 29, 28. Yeah.

There were only 331 miles of paved highway. Consider when he took office in 28, the model he had been around for what 13 years. Okay, all right. Okay. Yeah, I mean, automobiles are really, really like, you don't really have trucking yet. We still go by rail, you know. Okay, all right. Meaningful point. Okay.

Well, at the same time, this is 30s. We're getting into building more roads, right? And so infrastructure, that's why a huge lump of infrastructure investment wound up. And as you can see, he also constructed a further 2816 miles of more gravel roads Okay By 1936 there were 9700 miles of new roads in Louisiana, which is doubling its road system by this point He built 111 bridges and started construction on the first bridge over the Mississippi River in Louisiana

I'll give you one guess as to what they called it. The Huey Long Bridge. The Boulder Bridge, that's great. No, yeah. Yeah, the Huey Long Bridge. All of this meant jobs for people and then the finished product, which would enable increased travel, increased commerce, etc. Well, okay. I mean, I'm from a from a hygiene economic standpoint. That's not the wrong fucking thing to do. Here's the thing. I didn't call this thing. Yeah. Right. He did very good things in addition to all this other shit. Yeah. There's a reason people voted for him, maybe not a majority, but he took care of the rest. But I see that's the goddamn problem.

Yes, yes, it is. But for instance, he increased literacy by over 100,000 people through his night schools that he funded and set up. He eliminated property taxes on the poorest 50% so that the first $2,000 worth of property that people owned was assessment free and Of course he kept teachers late wages low but Mother fuck because of course. Yeah, um you're here. We long once he senator He pisses off nearly everyone and he decries their lack of effort in his eyes

He filibustered like a motherfucker and he decries their lack of effort in his eyes. He filibustered like a mother fucker and he got zero legislation passed. Roseveld himself pointed to Huey Long and Doug MacArthur and said, these are the two most dangerous men of our time. Yeah. Roseveld also seems to have been the first president to use the IRS to harass someone because he turned them on Huey Long and his lieutenants right away. Well, yeah, because like, I mean, you look at Long and you're like, you do, there's no way your taxes are on the up and up. Right.

Like, like, you know, you are as corrupt as the day is long. There is absolutely no way you've got to be keeping four books. Like, you know, or you'll see. So in 1934, he along goes on the radio and declares his share our wealth plan. Clearly, he's lining up for a run for presidents, 34, right? The election will be in 36. And now he's got executive experience, legislative experience. He's getting national exposure.

He'd guarantee to minimum income for everyone a free college tuition veteran benefits a month's vacation for every worker a 30 hour work week $5,000 for every single person free medical services on and on and on. He is running to the left of FDR on and on and on. He is running to the left of FDR. Politically and economically, in terms of his personality, he's absolutely an authoritarian. So, okay, wait, yeah, sorry, I have to interject here. So, he was talking about guaranteed basic income. Yeah.

In 35. 34, 34 in a 30 hour work week. Like, I mean, he's, he's an authoritarian, you know, want to be emperor. Like, like, can we, can we talk about those points? Like, can we, can we break some of that shit up? Like now, now you can also see why having someone like him do that will poison those points. Oh, yeah. Like, yeah.

So in 1935, it's clearly just angling for the presidency and he is very scary to the Roosevelt administration. But the problem with Huey Long was that he made a lot of people angry in Louisiana too. And angry people in Louisiana can sometimes become armed angry people in Louisiana. Aren't they by default armed? Yeah, probably Louisiana. Yeah.

And sure enough in 1935, an anti-long paramilitary organization called the Square Deal Association was formed. It's members included. They were really called the Square Deal Association. Yes. Okay. I want to resurrect the Square Deal Association as like a corollary to the Redneck Gun Club. Like can we do this? Yeah, sure.

Please are Redneck Revolt and the John Brown Gun Club. So what I was thinking of. But could please. Yeah. That way I sign up. What would do? So it's members included former governor's John M. Parker and rough and pleasant, which I love the name, and New Orleans mayor mayor T. Semis, Womzli.

I mainly just included their names because their names are fun. They took their guns and they seized the courthouse in East Baton Rouge and long then told the governor who, you know, who he was no longer governor, to deploy the National Guard who then used tear gas and fired live rounds at them. He also had banned public gatherings of more than two people as well as any press that was critical of the present Louisiana government. Okay, wait. as well as any press that was critical of the present Louisiana government. Okay, wait. That's long had banned that when he was governor of the bands that stayed in place, or the replacement governor who was his creature had done this.

The replacement governor. He told the governor. He told the governor. Yeah, he's like, I want this to happen, and this is what happened. Yeah, he's like, I want this to happen. And this is what happened. He used state legislation to give him personally more power in appointing people to positions of power as well. And long got the state assembly to gerrymandor and opponent's district so that he wouldn't be seated anymore. The guy's name was Benjamin Pavi. Pavi's son-in-law, Carl Weiss, took exception to this happening so fast and so effectively. So he also took

a gun stood four feet from long and shot it in the back. Long's bodyguards returned fire, killing Weiss with over 60 shots. There's a reason that Long's bodyguards were called the ca sacs. Wow. Okay. Because they couldn't stop the internal bleeding, he dies about a day later. And this was a political and probably personal relief to the Roosevelt administration,

as well as the Democrat party bosses. I'm sure every member of the Democratic National Committee and Franklin Delano Roosevelt all slept much more soundly. Yeah. After hearing that this guy had passed on. Yeah. Here's what an economic advisor to Roosevelt said. He said, quote, when he was gone, it seemed that a beneficent piece had fallen on the land. Father Cochland, Reno, Townsend, at all, were all pigmies compared with Huey. He had been a major phenomenon.

for all pigmies compared with Huey, he had been a major phenomenon. Yeah, it kind of sounds like it. Wow. Yeah, so that happens in 35. I'm finding it like incredible, like in a sense of difficult to credit, that he had enough all. Mm-hmm. After he had left the governor's mansion, he still had enough power in the state. Yep. To have more power given to him. Mm-hmm. Like... A senator can now do this. Like see like there's there's not even but like constitutionally the federal system

is supposed to mean that like no, you're not the one who does that. Right. Like like that's not right. That's state legislature, buddy. That's not that's not how this works. But but because it was him. Yep, a whole to personality shit going on. Like that he could convince the state legislature to try to do that. And the thing is, and this is, this is what kind of,

not kind of fuck that. This is what scares me hearing that is with my limited legal training I'm listening to this like, you know, I genuinely don't know if article one or two of the constitution would actually make that illegal. So you think they're only legislature, if a state legislature were to say, well, you know, we're going to give the power to our senators, right? They have the power to do. They have the power to do. And like, I don't, I don't, if somebody was a good enough demagogue to make that happen,

I don't know if there's, well, you have to look at the state constitution for that. You're well true. But like, I mean, you know, here in California, I don't think that it'd be a thing because that's just not the way. Well, all you'd really need is for the state constitution to enable the legislature to pass any damn bill they want that doesn't violate the constitution. All you need to do is pass a bill that nerfs your own power. We've seen this in Wisconsin. The state legislature upon the governor losing and another governor coming in started passing laws.

The opposite of the opposite. and another governor coming in, started passing laws. The opposite of the opposite party. Started passing laws to nerf the ability of the governor. So yeah, these things happen. And they happen unless it gets challenged and the courts are actual arbiters of the law. But it's a largely arbitrary process when guess who gets to a point

or if the people elected a judge, that's the problem with elected judges. So that's true. Now, but holy shit. Mm-hmm. Just yeah, just that's all I got. Is it okay? Shit. Okay. Yeah. Anyway, I had to get that out of my system. Sure. But for the Sun and Law of a legislator, it could have happened here. And it appears that Lewis meant long. And it wasn't just Lewis who thought so. FDR was genuinely worried prior to Huey Long's death that if the Republicans won in 36 that they'd worsen the economic crisis, all evidence would prove that or would point to that. Undo all of the fixes he'd put in place, we've seen that happen time

and again and make the country better for business owners and the corporations not for the people. We literally have lived through that and it's not like the previous presidency had been really all that good for the people. That would leave the door for Bill. Yeah, that yeah, like, I mean, I was talking about Obama to Trump, but yeah, well, yes, okay. Yeah, you know, I mean, Hoover kind of gets a bad rap historically. He's rap to be deserves. Well, I mean, he has president here and he did the worst possible things as president. And I love the guy. I as a humanitarian, he was amazing. Yeah. But yeah, as president, yeah, he fucked up. Yeah. Okay. Right. So if that happened, that would leave the door wide open for Huey Long in 1940. So FDR wasn't worried about Long in 36. He's

worried about Long in 40. He said, quote, that would bring the country to such a state by 1940 that long things he would be made dictator. And he probably would have. Mm hmm. I think he. Mm hmm. You know, um, looking at looking at the way the winds were blowing worldwide in that situation. Mm hmm. Um, and if, and you know, it's one of those things that there was a really, really old political cartoonist, this is back in the 1800s, where a political cartoonist was explaining a difference between, you know, radicals and liberals and conservatives and reactionaries. And all of them had the phrases that involved

reform and revolution. And it was how they related the two terms to each other that defined which one like a radical would say, there's no point in reform we need revolution. Right. A liberal would say to's no point in reform we need revolution. Right. A liberal would say to avoid revolution. To avoid revolution we need reform. Yeah.

A conservative would say, Pretty much the same thing. Pretty much the same thing, but there was some shading of difference and then a reactionary would say any reform is the same thing as revolution. Right. You know, his tant same thing as revolution. Right. You know, it's tantamount to revolution.

Right. And so, and I bring that up because the thing is, if you went from somebody like FDR, who was a liberal, who was looking at the situation, saying, okay, no, we need to do something because if we don't do something, like we're all going to die, you know, this is just, you know, everything is going to go in the shitter and we're fucked.

Hard metal language. But, you know, as opposed to, if the Republicans taken over, they were in in that period of time, they were so rabidly anti FDR and anti New Deal and anti all of that, that they would have immediately gone to reactionary mode. Right. You know, any we have to undo reform, right? Because it's all revolution, it's all ben revolution, we need to undo it. Well, also if you undo it, then you can prove that it wouldn't have worked because you didn't

actually give it enough time to take hold. If you undid it in four years. Yeah, this isn't working. So we're not, we're not, we're not moving something. This hasn't done the trick. We're doing something else. Right. Yeah.

And, and then, you know, and yeah, shit would have gotten catastrophically worse. Mm-hmm. And yeah, shit would have gotten catastrophically worse. I mean, we talked about, I don't remember the episode number, you're better at that than me, but talking about Captain America as the embodiment of the New Deal, it was literally putting meat on the bones of Americans.

Like it was literally bringing millions of Americans out of malnourishment and and near starvation. Yeah, prior to the civilian conservation course 70% of Americans would not have been fitting up for service in the armed forces. Afterwards, we were able to draft millions and millions of boys. So, yeah, and I'm not and I'm not even talking about preparation, like, you know, being ready to get involved in World War II, because of course, if long had won, or if the Republicans had won in 36, I don't know if we would have wound up, like, I don't know if the Republicans put in, put in the position of the presidency,

whoever their potas would have been, if they'd won in 36, I don't know if the measures that led to the Japanese deciding that they had to bomb Pearl Harbor would have happened if you get what I'm saying. Like we know I think they still would have. But we may have we may have wound up being like I mean the Republicans would have said, let's just let's stay neutral and long might have very well looked at it and gone, well, you know what? I'm I think I think we might want to actually ally with the axis here. Right.

You know, like I've I've I've looked at old Hitler in the eye. This is a man I can trust. Or just simply let's stay out of it. America has got its own problems. Yeah, the easy route out for both of those groups would have been, this is not our problem. Yeah, I mean, to the point where in 1940 FDR was lying to the country to continue the Lenin's act. Like that's also. We don't like about that. But yeah, you're absolutely, by the way, the, the cap in America episode was episode 40 and 41, I believe. Okay. So it was that long.

Mm hmm. She's yeah. All right. Okay. So while he we long was to the left of FDR, he shows two things as real possibilities. First, that populism is a dangerous mechanical device by All he we long was to the left of FDR, he shows two things as real possibilities. First, that populism is a dangerous mechanical device by which a person can elevate their status to dictatorship, no matter the ideology.

And second, that liberal's fear left is far more than they fear fascists. It can't happen here. Didn't seem to take on Nazism per se, though it certainly didn't do it as, well, it certainly didn't do it as directly as Lewis's wife Dorothy Thompson did. She called out Nazism for the threat that it was. Lewis seemed to fall into the liberal ideology of totalitarianism as an equally bad on both sides, the horseshoe theory. Yeah. Yeah. Now we all know what? Well, okay. What here's here's here's my own take. I can't call it a hot take because I've kind of been reminaded on it for a long time, but we are a lot more likely. This is what I'm going to say.

Okay. In any Western democracy, starting as a democracy, with Western democratic kind of system, we are held a lot more likely to find a right wing movement turning into an authoritarian one and seizing power. Then we are to see a leftist one doing the same thing. I'm going to argue that if it walks like an authoritarian and talks like an authoritarian, it isn't authoritarian.

And left to right, like if you're fucking authoritarian, I don't care. Sure. And I don't feel bad saying that. Okay. What I am going to say is, like, we are way too paranoid in this country about, oh my God, leftist, you know, Stalin left us.

Right. Oritarians and it's like, no, the right are the ones who are shit uncloser to that. Yes. In like everything about their rhetoric, there's the ones we need to be worried about and like keep punching Nazis, you know. Right.

And so yeah, I, yeah, I'm, and this isn't me trying to be smarter than everybody. This is just me sighing in exhaustion because I'm like pissing everybody and this to pay. Like everybody makes me mad. Okay. Because like you say, liberals are too busy, like being afraid of the leftists. Mm-hmm. And of course Nazis are are Nazis. And they pissed me off. So, you know, both liberals liberals and the rest of America to the right of the

liberals, both have one thing in common. And that is that they fear the masses. It's just that on the farthest farthest right, they fear the masses and want to kill them. Okay. Um, the liberals fear the masses getting their way. They're, you know, like, well, we need to keep these bureaucracies in place. And I'm not saying it comes from a bad place necessarily. It comes from the recognition that social order is a good thing. Okay.

That social order is fragile. Okay. That social order is fragile. Okay. But also the liberals, they want power more than they want to govern. And they respect being in power more than they respect the will of the people. God, I really wish you weren't right. At well. I wish so too Thank you, Kesh. I would, yeah, I, I, I, damn it. Okay. Anyway. So of course, we all know that everything that I just talked about is really leading

to this main question. How the hell does Mark Singer keep getting work? That's, it's really, it is. Actually, I'm gonna say Like of the deep mysteries of the universe that is that is one of them. Yeah, it is up there with I just completely forgot his name Well Kevin Sorbo is one of them. That's not the one I was thinking of How does how does he keep getting work? Because God, you know, you read the guy's stuff on Twitter. He's an asshole. But, um, all right, I'll think of it later. Anyway, yeah, how exactly does this

guy keep getting work? Yeah. It was a soap actor, right? No, not that I can find. No, but I didn't look that much deeper back than Beastmaster. Okay. Now, Kenneth Johnson was a young man growing up as the only child of a virantly bigoted and anti-Semitic mother and stepfather in Pinebluff, Arkansas. His dad was absolutely convinced that black people were the intellectual inferior to white people because they had rabbit blood. Yep. were the intellectual inferior to white people because they had rabbit blood. Yeah. Yep. Okay. Where the luck does that come from? I've. Okay. That was that was his his particular list on that. Okay. Kenneth Johnson noted early on that despite his dad's

intelligence, he still had the ability to psychologically buy into something so ludicrous. Johnson has stated that this fed into his writing career. He wanted to chip away at such prejudices. Quote, hold it up and let it get sanitized. He became a writer for the $6 million man, the bionic woman and the incredible Hulk. Okay. Kenneth Johnson had read it can't happen here, but has noted as early as early as recently as 2020 as quote, we can't let it happen here.

He is a strong believer that we have to keep fighting and pushing against what is happening in the world. Now, after he read Sinclair Lewis's novel Wayback When, he tried to write about a society in which there was a sea change in a culture. He wanted to explore how ordinary people reacted to extraordinary circumstances, and he decided to write a feature film script about a fascist shift. He was having dinner with then-president of NBC Brandon Tartikoff who really wanted to read his script.

And at first Johnson held back because he didn't want it to be a TV show, but then he relented and Tartikov loved it. The idea of an occupation of America was a very attractive premise at the time, quote, but I'm not sure that Americans will understand fascism said Tartikov, who had little faith in the capacity for Americans to understand history or political philosophy. Well, okay. Well, I got a couple of things to say about that. Number one, nobody ever went broke under estimating the foolishness of stupidity of the public.

True that. Like, number one. Number two, this was the 80s, and I kind of want to say that the 80s were a low point of television writers giving their audiences any credit for intelligence. MASH. That's mostly, I feel like that's more 70s. I mean, it was, but it went all the way to 84. I know, but still going to say the ethos or the mindset of MASH was more 70s than 80s.

Okay. Yeah. I mean, I don't disagree with you. You had Archie Bunker. You of MASH was more 70s than 80s. Okay. Yeah. I mean, I don't disagree with you. You had Archie Bunker. You had MASH. I mean, you had stuff like that that was very much seated in the 70s. Maul. Yeah.

Yeah. You know, the Mary Tyler Moore show, you had a lot of bullshit. Yeah. Good times. Yeah. Some of which stretched into the 80s, the Jefferson's, for instance. Yeah. But this is also the eighties where you have

the fall guy, the A team, TJ Hooker, TJ Hooker, Dallas, Falconcrest, Dynastine. By the way, by the way, I did look it up and my singer was not a soap actor, actor before Beast Master, but he did have a role in season nine of Dallas after all of that because he just looks to me like soap actor. But anyway, you know, if you look at the stuff that was on network television in the 80s, there's not an awful lot of it that gives the audience an awful lot of credit for brains. Like if you look at Committees there are a few like soap for example, uh-huh, but it was very early 80s and it was very niche and Like and it was it was way ahead of the curve. Yeah

But like the wave in the 80s the crest of the wave in the 80s was was Kind of mindless entertainment. Yeah, it was much more vapid. Yeah, we could we could we could like now I'm looking at this like okay, I've got to do an episode on this because why it why exactly was 80 stuff as brainless as it was and I have a couple of theories, but that's another episode. It is. And but my point, I think, stands that like Partikov was part of the, I don't want to say architecture, but he was part of the industry. He was part of the system that gave us everything that we got in the 80s.

He was. Which was built around the idea that you're not gonna go broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public. And he was not wrong. And he was not wrong. Yeah. Like, I mean, I can't, I can't even, like, I can't, I can't criticize as strongly as I'd like to because it's not like he was wrong.

But, you know, the trend was not in the direction of really smart, thoughtful, let's give our audience credit for being able to think, kind of entertainment. Yeah. So Johnson responded to that, that, that unshirtness with quote, well, it's not a complicated concept, Brandon, you shave your head, you put on a black shirt and you beat somebody up. Tartikov still insisted that it needs to not be a grassroots thing because

I'm sorry, that's too good. Shake your head, but a black shirt, you beat somebody up. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Anyway, sorry, carry on. So, Tartikov still insisted that it can't be a grassroots thing because it can't happen here, you see. But an outside force. And okay.

Like the Chinese or the Soviets? Um, and I found this fascinating because within two years, a movie of exactly that kind was released to enormous positive response. Oh, red dawn. Yes. Well, because it was the middle of the fucking Cold War, we had turned the Soviets into like a mythical height of air. Right. See, we know. Yeah. But we couldn't think of ourselves doing it to ourselves even though that's of course not right because well Because again, we hadn't taken our full course in antibiotics, right and I think Before as a nation we're ever going to be able to get to the point where

The majority of our dominant culture can recognize the possibility of fascism being an issue here. We would need to come to terms with the systemic white supremacy that has been part of our national fiber, the weft of our weave since the founding of the country. And that's just too uncomfortable for too many white people to deal with. Yep. And so that's part of the reason

we're on the precipice of it right now. Mm-hmm. So. So Johnson rebuffs this suggestion, you know, that it be some outside force. He says, quote, I just didn't think that could happen, which, who's right, is a foreign invasion couldn't happen, it could only happen here.

Now, but Tartikov had a VP at that lunch as well. And in his suggestion was, well, what if they did aliens? Instead, much to Johnson's dismay, Johnson had written the Bionic woman and he'd written for the incredible Hulk. And he was worried about being pigeonholed quite honestly. But later he figured that he could tell the same story. But now it's got the eye candy of spaceships and laser weapons. And this could still be a show about power acquiescence, collaboration, and resistance. That would still make people think in many ways echoing the book that had influenced him so much. Now more on the ideology in a minute, let's take stock of what's happening in 1982, that would make this seem like a good idea in a lunch meeting. Star Wars toys are everywhere.

The Empire Strikes Back came out in 1980. ET came out in 1982, alien in 79. There's fertile ground for a sci-fi TV mini-series. And this was very... Okay, that'll start galactica. I don't remember my own research. 79, wasn't it? Yeah, 70. It was either 78 or 79. And there was the attack. Star Trek movie. It was a Star Trek movie, right? And battle star galactic, try to remember galactic at 80, 80 something.

I know I'll look it up, but there was the attempt at a, at a, at a sequel to the Galactic series that was just, I mean, it was crap, but it went nowhere. But there was an attempt to do it. Yeah, but seeing that as a failure is not going to sell anybody on. It's all these successes that really know, but I'm just saying that lots of things are getting greenlit. Yes. Yes. That that other thing too. So yeah. So this was very well and creatively advertised as a series to Johnson had suggested using Nazi propaganda posters where people were encouraged to enjoy the visitor's company. Visitors are our friends. That sort of thing. No

explanation, but do it three weeks before the premiere, two weeks before the release have kids go around and paint a red V on the posters with no explanation. And then a week before, put a sticker that says the battle begins on the premiere date. And it worked. It worked really well. There's so much more research just around that, but I decided to leave that out. That's like the beginning of viral marketing. Uh huh.

That's pre-internet viral fucking marketing. Yes, it is. That's the genius. Yes, it is. Okay. Also, there's some about Poes Law. Go on. Well, and it might not be Poes Law,

but the Poes Law is about talking about Nazis on the internet. Uh, it's kind of, anyway, might not be post-lot, but the post law is about talking about Nazis on the internet. Kind of, anyway, I'm trying to remember who's lulled is about satire. If you put up posters that are supposed to be reminiscent of fascist propaganda, there's going to be a sad percentage of the population who are not going to see it as as a reflection of that who are just going to respond to the insipient fascism that's part of the imagery. Yeah, but these these posters are not they're not your standard anti-Semitic Okay, Hitler is a white knight kind of shit. They are the visitors are your friend. It is very much more benign Okay, and then having them with the V

And then having them yeah sticker and then the sticker it very different Um, now the reviews for it the fact that they got a 40 share at the time, all of these reviews were according to Johnson due to the acting and the clever use of low-budget special effects, and most importantly, due to the message. V of the mini-series was a three-hour, two-night mini-series that came out on May 1 and May 2, 1983. Like I said, it was immensely popular. Now for folks who don't know, the plot goes like this. Visitors come to our planet from far away and promise all sorts of advances in technology in exchange for specific chemicals that we have in abundance that their planet

has run low on. They have saucer shaped ships, they have strange voices, they're sensitive to our light, and they have an eye catching red and black uniform. They come in peace and as friends. The governments are of earth all agree. How rad is that? They all agree on something. And they have a few leaders whose names are impossible to pronounce, so the visitors go by the names that we understand, John and Diana.

Everything's going fine, but people start to notice an uptick in the government restricting scientists specifically and a media offensive to disparage scientists more broadly. Some scientists who are especially interested in getting to know more about the visitor disappears, others are simply discredited to a public who is willing to go along with this vilification. To the point where the kids of scientists get into fights at school, with other kids who attack them because their parents are filthy scientists. Several note were the scientists admit to subversive activities against the visitors and or the

Earth's governments, and then it gets weird. Behaviors change. Dietary choices change, and most of the scientists who have committed these atrocities and have admitted to them are suddenly left handed. A cameraman and a journalist who were originally covering the ongoing Civil War and El Salvador had first noticed the visitorship while doing so.

He has his interest peaked, the reporter, has his interest peaked by one of his producers pointing out a lot of the behavioral changes amongst the scientists. Now during that time, his name is Michael Donovan, by the way. He has been working as a cameraman for reporters who are offered access to the LA mothership. On one trip, he finds a golden key aboard one of the shuttlecrafts and pockets it just

to give it to his son as a souvenir. His ex-wife complains that she can't compete with his exciting lifestyle for the son's affections. And after noting the handedness switch, Donovan and Tony, his reporter or his producer, rather, agree that they need to sneak aboard, but Tony ends up tripping and missing his chance. So Donovan sneaks himself and his camera aboard the mothership over LA.

There he discovers and films that the visitors are dumping the chemicals into the upper atmosphere because they don't need them. And he also hears them talking about Diana's conversion process while she and another eat rodents, including Diana swallowing the guinea pig hole, the thing that you saw going pee-dew. He ends up getting found by a visitor who was removing contacts to reveal reptilian eyes, who noticed him in the vent and then pulls him

out of the vent, hissing his snake-like tongue at him. He rips at the visitor's face, revealing a reptile underneath. Donovan sneaks aboard another transport and evades capture. He escapes and with the tapes and meets up with Tony and brings them to his new station. Just as they're about to hit the air with the shocking development, the visitors interrupt the broadcast, spinning a lie about how there have been several attacks at facilities making the chemicals for the visitors, and that the governments of Earth have declared martial law on the planet with the visitors in charge. Donovan is now a terrorist, making him and Tony fugitives, the visitors have control of the media, including his own colleague Christine,

and the co-opted law enforcement to hunt down Michael Donovan And that's really the crux of the miniseries these visitors haven't toppled our governments and killed our leaders They came in insinuated themselves into the halls of power and influence and then use that to go to swiftly silence those who would call them out for their more consuming wishes swiftly silence those who would call them out for their more consuming wishes. What's more, Donovan's own mom, a rich lady from Texas, as best as I can figure, is actively collaborating with the visitors. She's very wealthy. And he's kind of the black sheep to begin with. So that's the basics. And now I've got much more plot to go on. But I wanted to give you a chance to just call out anything that you so now. Okay, I'm trying to remember, but that's like episode one, right? Yes. That's just the first hour. Oh, it's, uh, yeah, yeah. And, and honestly, not even the entire first hour, I've still got it. Yeah, I know. And it's it. Yeah. That's the dawn of the dark, though.

Yeah, I know 80 80's mini series were a trip. They were like, dance. The yeah, there's a lot going on. the yeah, there's a lot going on. I find it really interesting that he's the writer managed to weave El Salvador into all of this, which was a civil war in our next episode. Between a right is going to cover a lot of it has movement like, yeah, I'm going to cover a lot of that in the next episode. Now, now, you know, to anybody just watching, it was like, well, yeah, El Salvador is in news because this is 80 83. Uh-huh. So that's before I ran Contra, right? I'm going to get into all of that. Okay. But, okay. But, but yeah, just I heard you say that in my ears, perked up like, wait a minute, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, there's mirroring here. And I had managed to forget that the protagonist was in order.

Like in all the years since this was on, I'd forgotten that the protagonist was a reporter. But of course, since he's cribbing from it can't happen here, he'd have to be yeah, you know interestingly in the cyberpunk mini series Max headroom Mm-hmm, which was a dystopian future also science fiction That was a much more like corporate over Lord dystopia rather than you know over like crypto military fascist But it was still a a somewhat righteous dystopia. The main character there is also a reporter.

Right. And that's an interesting kind of parallel there. Well, keep in mind the people who are giving this, these stories are writers and writers have a bias toward journalists. That's true. As fellow writers or a sub species writer. So there is going to be some lionization. Yeah, okay.

Yeah. Okay. So in other countries, I don't want to step on anything because clearly I twigged on something there. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So, in other communities, the young are encouraged to interact with the visitors and even join youth brigades, especially noticeable by their brown uniforms that they wear. Some visitors even begin relationships with teenage girls.

One such visitor named Brian seduces young Robin Maxwell into a sexual relationship and gets her pregnant which turns out to be one of Diana's experiments. Brian is also very good friends. He was played by Robert Englund, wouldn't he? No, he was not. That's a totally different character. No, shit.

Okay. Sorry. That's okay. Brian is also very good friends with the boy next door named Daniel Bernstein who's always had a crush on Robin. And there's a bit of tension, but Daniel largely sets that aside because of his proximity to power with his friendship to Brian. Daniel becomes one of the leaders of the human youth brigade for the visitors. Now, Robin, yeah. Sorry, Daniel Bernstein. Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, sorry Daniel Bernstein. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Yeah, just like okay. Yeah, again, I only caught the lips of this when I was sure eight. So I do keep forgetting that I'm the only one that's seen all of this. Like I'm saying this like fuck it's easy. It's obvious. These are the first time you've heard these names. I forget. I have well. Yeah. Yeah. Now, Robin's dad is a very well-known scientist who ends up disappearing. Daniel's grandfather, Abraham convinces Daniel's real, yep, convinces Daniel's, yeah, convinces Daniel's reluctant to get involved parents to hide the Maxwell's in their pool house because of his family's history with the Holocaust. Okay. Thank you. hide the Maxwell's in their pool house because of his family's history with the Holocaust. Okay, thank you.

Abraham gets it. His son is reluctant and he's like, what can we do? He's like, you have to. There is no choice. You have to. And he actually gives us impassioned speech about how he's, you know, I never told you what actually happened to your mother in the camps that, that, that, that, that, that. You know, we, we smuggled you out in a suitcase and he's like, yes, dad, I know, I know. You know, so you kind of have this interesting like mouse kind of thing going on. Yeah, a little bit there. But then, then he talks about how your mother actually did, you know, she, you know, the, the family story was that she died on the way of the camps. He's like, no, she survived. And it's worse. And here's what she saw. And here's what, you know, and so that's why we have to. And grandpa is crying about how we have to. And, and Daniel's dad, whose name I just fucking forgot, Daniel's dad absolutely like

acquiesces. So they let the Maxwell's, this family of scientists stay in their pool room, the Maxwell's, this family of scientists, stay in their pool room, their pool house because of this history. Daniel figures out that the Maxwell family is in hiding and he hatches the plan that he's going to marry Robin. And he says this at breakfast while pouring champagne for his family. And he says, quote, see, I want her just like I wanted this champagne. And I will get her. Otherwise, I'll just have to turn her whole damn family in. How does his father not fucking murder him or grandfather not fucking murder him right there? Funny you would ask that. His grandfather takes the champagne and spills it right in his face. Okay. Walks away. Daniel then fuck you goes out to the pool house immediately to drag out Robin and his own father

throws his ass in the pool At this point Daniel grabs his side arm because the youth brigade is fucking armed and points it on his dad and nearly shoots him Yeah, he's armed with a visitor's weapon so Wow, yeah little brown coat Daniel turns in the Maxwell's with the promise that his family would be granted amnesty. And of course, that is quickly betrayed. He comes home to find that his own family has been taken in for questioning. And Brian shows up and promises that his family and his grandfather will be home soon. And Daniel says, well, my grandfather isn't well. And then he gives Brian a ring or and then

Brian gives Daniel a ring and gives him a promotion to make Daniel feel better. Oh, no, actually, Daniel is worried about grandfather and Brian says, yeah, your grandfather's not doing well. But then he gives him a ring and a promotion and Daniel feels better. And I gotta add that Brian absolutely looks every bit the Aryan prints that you would expect. Okay, yeah, now I remember, now I do remember Brian. Yep. Dushbag. Young handsome douchebag.

Oh, yeah. Looks like he absolutely like missed out on the role of Johnny in the karate kid. Like, you know, central casting called and he was number three, you know, the Maxwell's then go on a run on the run, getting smuggled out of LA by a migrant worker who uses his migrant worker coyote methods that he'd used to get people into LA including like biting an onion. And so when they're stopped by the roadblock, he turns to the officers like,

how can I help you officer? And they're like, oh fuck, just go on, just go on. And the family is stuffed under the bed of the truck. You know, there's like a tiny bathroom. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Wow. These, the mask was. This was so on the goddamn nose.

Like, yeah. Holy cow. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, the writer, he is very good at this. I, I may actually have to go back and watch this now. Yeah. It's on 2B.

Okay. So he escapes, or I'm sorry, the family escape, uh, the former resistance movement in LA with a biologist named Julie Parrish. Donovan later joins them. But first he goes back aboard the mothership to find out more. And while he's there, he meets Martin, a fifth columnist who is against the visitors plan for conquest. And Martin tells Donovan everything that the visitors are there to steal all the water and harvest the people as food, which includes Mike's son as it turns out. Yes, my son. I remember him. And okay, see the kid in the in the freeze dried pod.

Yes, storage. Great. That is that is one of the things that fucked me up. Sure, sure. Like for weeks after that. Okay. And so this fifth columnist, the third columnist is England, right?

Played by Freddie Grooter, England, right? No, no, no. Where am I getting, okay, all right, I don't know, I don't know where I'm going. I'll get there. Okay, all right. I mean, if you want, I'll tell you, his name's Willie.

He plays Willie. Okay, all right. Yeah, and Willie is not a fifth columnist on purpose. He just kind of accidentally slips into it because he doesn't really agree with what's going on and he's an incompetent. Okay. So. Okay, fair. on purpose, he just kind of accidentally slips into it because he doesn't really agree with what's going on. And he's an incompetent. Okay.

So, okay, fair. Yeah. Now, sorry. Donovan sees Daniel's dad, whose name is Stan. That's, that was his name. And he sees that he's about to be tortured and Martin whisks him away. And he's like, fuck, I could have helped him. He's like, nobody can right now, Mike.

It's, it's dangerous enough for me that I'm talking to you. I got to save you at least. And he also notices his colleague from the news station, Christine, happily talking with the visitors. She's fully co-opted. Donovan escapes with the help of another fifth columnist who is a hot woman all the way down. They apparently do the skin suit all the way down. So you get to see a woman in her bra on panties on TV in 1983.

I mean, of course, yeah. So he escapes with the help of the other fifth columnist and he goes into hiding and there's I think in this instance, there's a chase scene, but he's caught by a young criminal who's also working with the resistance named Elias, who's, of course, black. Elias has an older brother. Don't remember his name, but Elias's older brother is a scientist, and it's very sad what happens. But so anyway, he's, Donovan is then brought to the resistance. He's interrogated a little bit and he's determined to be trustworthy. The resistance grows. The Bernstein's are returned and they show a massive disdain for their son and actually the scientist, Robin Maxwell's

dad, he comes back and he convinces them to turn their house into a safe house because this house has already been searched. They wouldn't think to search here. This is why it's the perfect safe house. They're like, yeah, but our son and you see what happened to our father. And at that point, Stan gets up and he's silent the whole time. It's the wife who's making the plea of like, leave us alone. We've already suffered enough. And she's right. And then Stan gets up and goes to the, like the bureau. And he grabs out a letter and he makes his wife read the letter. And it's the final letter from their dad or from his dad about why it's important to always resist. The battles ensue. There's lots of resistance stuff. There's a few victories, and eventually it ends with the visitors still having full control over the earth, but the resistance

pockets strengthening and continuing the resistance. And that's the end of the mini-series. That's it. There's no resolution just a we must fight message. And that's it for V. The fuck, man. Yeah. Okay. So I'm looking at how much time we have, and I'm thinking that we're going to stop there,

because then I'm going to get, because I said we're going to put his ideology aside. And the next issue, or in the next episode, we're going to talk about Kenneth Johnson's ideology and why he wrote this. So I know that I went at a bit of a blistering pace for the plot, but there's a lot of fucking plot. But the short version is, visitors come, take over the planet, only by co-opting minimal violence, we do it to ourselves. Scientists are de-legitimized, they're marginalized, a resistance begins, and that's how it ends. What is bouncing around in my head right now is the idea that the most instructive, the most, the most like, no, no, this is us. Like,

here is the Anvil I'm dropping on your head. This is Daniel. Oh, yeah. 100%. Is the teenager, you know, getting, getting, you know, completely brainwashed. And like, you know, like, that's, that's, that's writer looking, looking out from script going, that's you. Right. Yeah. That is you. You are the problem. Yup. I don't care who the fuck you are. Yeah. Attention. This is you. You suck. Yeah. Um, and I can't argue with him. Like, you know, looking at the series, and looking at, it can't happen here,

through the lens of the last six years or so of our domestic politics. I'm like, no, that's okay. Fair cop, man. That's us. Like, oh my God. You know, that he's so wrapped up in his own importance and his own, his own, I don't want to say fulfillment because that makes it sound like more meaningful than it is. Right. Yeah. No, like it's not even like fulfillment. It's his own aggrandizement. It's his own, you know, feeding his own urges. That that he winds up that he winds up literally as a Jewish teenager in the 80s, like with it still within living memories. Oh, easily within living memories.

Yeah. You know, managing to completely ignore that. And just completely, completely betray all of that. So, so blatantly, without understanding it, you know, the ignorance of really ugly thing. And yet he's the one that represents all of us. Yeah, well, I think there's something to be said there because scientists choose their jobs. The Jews were chosen because of their perceived ethnicity and their culture. And so there's your mental gymnastics. Really easy to be like, well, that's, that's no, that's not us because I mean, you know, we clearly have learned, you know, these are scientists and they were, you

know, I mean, yeah, they were resisting, you know, it's that kind of shit. Like, yeah, I know, yeah, I, yeah, I totally see that. But like, you know, I said a minute ago, you know, I may have to go watch this and, and, you know, give, give this kind of another chance because, you know, I spent my entire adult life every time the series has come up and I'm like, oh, wow, talk about 80s cheese, right? Oh, yeah. And That too because you remember this is the first iteration. Yeah, okay, and this has depth. Okay, and now you're talking about that I'm like, okay, maybe I need to go give this another shot, but at the same time I'm thinking I'm gonna spend the whole time Wanting to punch this teenage kid in a fucking neck

Just over and over and over again, like, oh my God, Daniel, you little shit. Well, and I'll tell you, he doesn't get his, his comeuppance in this series. Well, no, because it ends as the, we have to keep fighting. So he, he kind of can't. Yeah. All right. So I mean, that's, that's my takeaway. Yeah, and that's like, clean. Yeah. All right. So I mean, that's my takeaway. Yeah.

That's what you've cleaned. I don't want to be Daniel, but like, that's what the author is telling me. The author is telling me I am. Sure. Yeah. So, yeah, that's for now. That's what I've cleaned. Well, and at the end of the first episode, I will tell you this, there are some kids spray

painting a red V on the posters. And Abraham catches them. And he corrects, you know, they're just spray painting across it. And he catches them and he corrects them. He's like, no, no, no, no, this is not how you do it. This is how you do it. And he says V for victory. Always for victory. Abraham is the fucking man. He is. He is. So he actually is the one that the visitors find in the house when they go to raid the house after Daniel calls. And he's sitting in the pool room playing his phonograph

instead of where the Maxwell's were, right? And when the visitors open the door, he just looks at them and he goes, shallow him. And then it goes to commercial. Like, it's good. And they're there. What would it be? Abraham? What I grew up. Oh, yeah. Okay. So yeah, it's it's something. So all right. What are you going to tell people to read to this this time? I'm going to reiterate my recommendation of two gun, which are cool by friend of the show,

Bishop O'Call, brother of mine from another mother, of course. But genuinely, even if I were not biased in that way, I would still tell you, no read this book, it's amazing, it's awesome. It is propulsive and meaningful at the same time. It is it is propulsive and meaningful at the same time. Mm-hmm. I manage this to touch on very powerful historical issues and themes in a very meaningful way. Mm-hmm.

And it manages to drop anvils without you ever feeling like you're having a meaningful drop on your head. Nice. I'll put it that way. All the anvils. None of the headaches. I like drop on your head. Nice. I'll put it that way. All the info is none of the headaches. I like that. Pretty much.

Yeah. And so, yeah, I'm going to very strongly recommend that, again, to gun witch by Bishop O'Connell. Okay. Cool. How about you? I'm going to recommend it can't happen here by Sinclair Lewis. That makes sense. Yeah.

But then there's a coming. Not going to lie. There's a companion piece to it. So if you've already read, it can't happen here. I strongly recommend you do it anyway and reread it. But then when you're done with that, go ahead and read. It can happen here. And that is by, oh, God, what's his name? Connison.

I can't remember his name. And there's several books that are called, it can happen here, unfortunately. His name is like, Kossinan or Connison, starts with a C, his last name starts with a C. So I recommend that as well as a companion piece. Yeah, there's a lot of different, I'm like scrolling through,

and there are a lot of different, it can happen here, books. So it's Cossinon or something like that. So it can happen here. It's a good series. Or it's a good little companion piece. So let's see, is there anywhere that you want people to find you online? Well, online, I can be found on TikTok as Mr. MR underscorp, sorry, Blalock.

On Twitter, I am at EH Blalock and we are collectively on Twitter at Geek History time. And of course, you are listening to us right now. So you have found our podcast somewhere. If you have not subscribed yet, please do so. We can be found to subscribe on the Apple Podcast app and on Stitcher. And of course, you can look up individual episodes of the webcast and listen to them on our website, a geek history of time, dub dub dub, dot geek history of time, dot com geek history time. You're right. Yes.

Sorry. Geek history time, dot com. Where can you be found, sir? All the places you just mentioned, plus the harmony on Twitter and Insta. Also, you can find me, let's see, by the time this drops, I'm going to say it's past October already. If it's not past October already, then check me out October, November and December, the first Friday of each month at Luna's in Sacramento. If you have $10 and proof of vaccination come down and check out capital punishment with our new co-star, Justine Lopez. So I strongly recommend that you check us out that way. And I could use the money. It's coming up on Christmas. So that is basically that. So for a geek history of time,

I'm Damien Harmony. And I'm Ed Blaylock. And until next time, keep rolling twenties. So for a geek history of time, I'm Damien Harmony. And I'm Ed Blaylock, and until next time, keep rolling 20s.