A Hot Dog Is a Sandwich - What's the Best Regional Burger? ft. George Motz

Episode Date: November 5, 2025

Today, Josh & Nicole are joined by writer, filmmaker, and burger scholar George Motz to discuss a plethora of regional hamburgers to find out which one is the best of them all. Leave us a voicemail at (833) DOG-POD1 Check out the video version of this podcast: http://youtube.com/@mythicalkitchen To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Yeah, I put ice in my cereal, so what? That makes no sense. A hot dog is a sandwich. A hot dog is a sandwich. What? Welcome to our podcast, A Hot Dog is a Sandwich, the show we break down the world's biggest food debates. I'm your host Josh Cher. And I'm your host, Nicole in Iady.

And today we have a very special guest on the pod. He's a restaurant owner. He's an author. He's a YouTube sensation and a verifiable empressario of burger flipping. Please welcome George Motes to the pod. That's me clapping. George, thank you so much for joining us. Thanks for having me.

Anytime. So I have had the immense privilege of eating a very hyper-specific regional burger from your hands in your own home, the Michigan Olive Burger. No way. Which was truly one of the hallmark moments. moments of my life. Dope. But actually, what, you're, you at my house? You did?

Yeah. Do you remember that? Did you black out during that shoot? I do that too sometimes, to be fair. It was about a year and a half ago. It would have been March 2024. I was in New York and I stopped by her house. We did a first we feast, uh, burger scholar session shoot where you made me the, uh,

the Michigan Olive burger. And then we made some like the cheesecake factory sliders. That's going to have been on the menu. you. Iconic. And although it meant so much to me, apparently it meant nothing to George. I'm just another one of your burger flusies out there, and that's fine. I'm sorry, I didn't even lump you in with the okay, another person who likes burgers, but

yeah, no, I'm glad you enjoyed that because that is a very special burger. It's one of the oldest, actually, it's very important. It's one of the oldest regional burgers in America that goes back almost over 100 years at this point. Man. Yeah, yeah. Well, it's funny because there are so many different regional burgers, and I know at Hamburger, America or your restaurant, you have the Oklahoma Onion Burger, which is certainly a contender for

top regional burger in the world or in America. But then also you have a rotating section of regional burgers on the menu. What do you have going on this month? Well, not, I wouldn't say rotating. It sounds like they're coming back soon. Someone will say, oh, what does this burger come back? It's so good. Your monthly burger special is so good. Like, well, maybe three or four years because we have a lot to go through. There are so many regional burgers that I can celebrate in the restaurant that it's kind of endless. I mean, I wouldn't say endless. but at the same time, they're not rotating. Rotating means they're going to come back

and maybe eventually. Rotating in the long arc of history. Exactly, right. We do feature them. I would say we feature regional specialties because they're just so much fun and they really tell a lot about a place and they also taste great.

Yeah, if you had to pick, what we were asking of you today, it's going to be like choosing between your children. What do you think the best regional burger of all time is? You know, I can't. I can't. I don't play favorites ever. I wouldn't give you favorites. I wouldn't say best of all time. Okay. I like the one that's right in front of me right now. That's the one I like the most. But seriously, the Oklahoma Onion Burger has done so much for us, especially because it's the one we serve in the restaurant.

The only regional burger we actually technically serve in the restaurant every single day. There are other burgers on the menu that are original specialties, but they only show up, like we said, like, you know, monthly, only once in a while, and definitely for an entire month. But we have a very strict policy. Whatever that moment is over, it's over. It doesn't, it's off the menu. And you can't, all those ingredients leave the restaurant. It's like magic. You can't come in the next day and get the burger.

You can't even try to get the burger because we've worked it right to the point where the next burger is on the menu and we have the ingredients for that burger, but not the burger. you just had yesterday. Incredible. Why the Oklahoma City Onion Burger? And can you describe what exactly that burger is to the audience who might not know? You got it. So first of all, definitely not Oklahoma City. Not Oklahoma City.

Oklahoma. Sorry, El Reno, Oklahoma. Thank you. There you. Thanks to clarify that. No one ever really seems to get that right, which is fine. Oklahoma Onion Burger started in, we believe, started in El Reno, Oklahoma in 1922. Wow.

At a place called The Hamburger Inn, which is right across the street from another place that still exists today called Roberts. And at one point, there were many Oklahoma onion, well, I were called, back then, they were just called onion burgers, by the way. I don't call them French fries in France, you know? Ironically, I went to a place called SIDS in El Reno, and they did not have French fries in the menu. They had Freedom fries.

Oh, my God. Freedom fries. Freedom fries. 20 years after, they still remember. I'm sure they did. Oh, God. Sorry about that. The, there were still actually many places to give an onion burger in.

in El Reno, Oklahoma. And now, actually, there are a lot of places to get onion burgers in all parts of Oklahoma, mostly in Oklahoma City, west, and south. That's pretty much where all the onion burgers are. But basically to describe it, it's very simple. It's only five ingredients. Well, actually, if you're in Oklahoma, it's only four ingredients. It's onions, beef, bun, and salt, and that's it.

There's nothing else on the burger. And it's sort of a beautiful science experiment, culinary adventure. where you take a ball of beef and into that ball of beef, which is sitting on a flat top, you smash almost a similar volume of beef to onion, of thin sliced onion into that ball to make a flat patty with these onions tangled together. It makes this, what the beef fat renders and cooks the onions. People say, oh, why can't you just cook the onions separately and put them on the burger? It's like, well, you need to have that special temperature and also that rendered beef fat to make.

It tastes so amazing. Is it typically white onion, yellow onion, sweet onion? What are we working with with the Oklahoma Onion Burger? Well, if you're in Oklahoma, it's a Spanish onion. That's typical for the great Oklahoma, the great onion burger joints of Oklahoma. We actually use Vidalia. I started using Vidalia years ago. I liked it, so I never changed.

They're very similar in a way. Spanish, it tends to be a little more acrid, and Vidalia is very sweet. It's much sweeter. But they're both very sweet onion. What I love so much about burgers is that, like you mentioned, it's not just putting, it's not sauteing the onion separately. It's a burger is, what is it, anti-Gahtaltian. Oh, I was going to say it's a marriage. It's like more than the sum of its parts, you know what I mean?

Like a marriage, like a great marriage. You as a couple and as a family become more than you two as individuals. No, it's a great example. I feel like I'm in couples counseling right now. I never heard of the scrap that way, but okay. But you know what I mean? It's like the architecture is so important to it. I think the Oklahoma Onion Burger is like maybe the best example of that,

of the interplay between ingredients. Just a few ingredients, too. Just a few ingredients. It doesn't need to be too complicated. It's simple. I think so much of our burger preferences, and I think our preferences when it comes to fast food, are like shaped by our childhood.

Okay. You know, George, where did you grow up in what were like the regional burgers of your childhood? Was there anything specific or no? No. There actually wasn't. That's actually why my fascination runs so deep. Because I grew up on Long Island, but there really weren't a lot of great burgers. They were just burgers.

They were just something you did in the backyard. My dad would take us to Howard Johnson's when I was a kid. And they had, I believe they were frozen patties with the lines painted on them. Oh, my goodness. They said it was a grilled burger, but you look at the lines. There's some liquid smoke in there, yeah. Yeah, they're always the same size grill mark. So my dad said, I think these are fake.

And we did ask them. I said, oh, no, it's actually, they're not real. It's made of like food coloring, dark food color. Wow. Oh, jeez. So, yeah. So I think I was fascinated by it only because I just, I didn't have it growing up really. I didn't have regional burgers or anything special burger-wise growing up.

It spent a lot of time McDonald's and burger came when I was a kid. And then before I realized, you know, really it wasn't, it was not worth it. Yeah, that's so funny. I mean, so Nicole and I both grew up in Southern California. Nicole, do you remember, like, eating, like, regional burgers from child date? And even if you think you didn't, I feel like you maybe did and didn't know it. I mean, other than the California fast burger, I feel like, with like the Thousand Island sauce and the Shreddice and the lettuce and tomato and something like that.

Which I think, I think, I think, I think, forgive me if I'm wrong, but I think in like the earliest iterations of hamburgers dating back like 100 years ago, they would call a burger with lettuce and tomato on it, a California burger. This is true. Or anything that was fast, you know, thin paddied. Really, I've started by places like in and out, Carl's Jr. early, early, early burger places that mini-chains and local spots, it all made basically the same kind of burger. Pie and Burger still makes a great version. If you're looking for an original, original in-and-out burger,

I always tell people, go to Pie and Burger. They make something that's so similar, but with even better ingredients. Oh, and just the thickest, crunchiest, coldest iceberg lettuce. It's never shredded. It's always a giant wedge. I love Pie and Burger so much. The best part of a Pie and Burger, though, is they will put meringue on pies that definitely should not have meringue on it.

Can I tell you something about that? That's one thing I learned about you is Josh loves pies with marangs where the meringue should not exist, but it does exist. Like lemon meringue makes sense. The sweet cuts through the lemon. They have a butterscotch custard meringue pie. Sounds really unnecessary. I'm eating. That's the one they run out of every day.

They actually don't even happen every day. It's so good. I'm eating 2,000 calories of burger and thick cut fries. You know, I've never been. We've got to go to pie and burger. Where is pie and burger? Pasadena, baby. Dude, it's because I'm such a west side girl.

Like, I never find myself in the dirty Dina. It's my fault. It's my own doing. But my brother used to talk about this space called Capital Burgers all the time. And they say that in and out, quote unquote, stole the fast burger from them. They actually closed, I think, maybe like 10, 15 years ago or something, maybe like 10 years ago. Capital closed about five years ago. And it was very sad because they were making a great burger with really the freshest possible ingredients.

And they just, the neighbor had kind of changed. It got bad. It got good. It got bad and bad. It wasn't great. And it was also, it was the son of the guy who made it great. And he just, his heart wasn't in it anymore. Yeah, my brother used to take me, he would like take me all.

He was like kind of like my first tour guy to L.A. He'd be like, he'd take me to Dino's. He used to take me to special palaterias in like L.A. And he'd be like, this is the real food of Los Angeles. Like, you need to try these, especially if you're going into the food industry. So he would just like take me to all these really cool places. And then one time he took me to a palateria across history from Capitol Burgers. And he's like, this used to be the place.

of the OG burger and stuff like that. That's like the most wonderful thing about regionally specific foods. You can go to the palateria right after eating one of these formative fast food style burgers that originated in Southern California and then now kind of became non-regional. But George, what was like the first regional burger experience you had where you said, oh, this is an incredible canvas that can be used to tell a story? Probably, I would say the butter burger. One of the very first butter burgers.

It was in Glendale, Wisconsin, part of, Milwaukee, basically. And I couldn't believe it. I couldn't be people would actually eat these things. And I took one bite and I'm like, oh, wow, I know exactly why they're eating them. And I also know why they're not selling it

anywhere else in the country because it's so intense, but it's so good. And I actually found myself, from the first time I had the burger, I took a bite, I looked down at the plate and I just saw that there was still like a pool of like melted butter and I dipped the burger back into the butter.

Oh, my God. I love butter so much. Wisconsin is far and away the drunkest state in America. I don't know if people know this. I was looking up the statistics the other day. I was in Milwaukee like three weeks ago, and I sadly did not get a butterburger. We were too busy eating fried cheese curds, and I didn't know Bloody Mary's were so regionally specific to Wisconsin.

So much dairy in Wisconsin's wild. Oh, my God, so much. But I've never had a butterburger, and I've never been to Culver's. And I feel like it's a tremendous mishap in my life. Same. The Culver's Butterburger is not quite the same thing. They put a little bit of butter on the bun, like the way anybody would put butter on a toasted bun. If you go to Sollies in Milwaukee or Glendale, you're going to get two to three tablespoons of room temperature butter, soft water that goes on the inside of the crown of the bun, the top of the bun, and when it hits the hot patty, it begins to melt.

So if you're lucky, you get to take a bite of that burger while it's still in its sort of semi-solid state, and it is absolutely heavy. Fall is the perfect season to invest in yourself. And what better way than learning a new language? Whether you're planning a trip, craving a new challenge, or just looking to make the most of cozy nights in, Rosetta Stone makes it simple to turn just a few minutes a day into real progress. Rosetta Stone has been the trusted leader in language learning for over 30 years. Their immersive, intuitive method helps you naturally absorb and retain your new language

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Visit rosettastone.com slash hot dog to get started and claim you're 50% off today. Don't miss out. Go to rosettastone.com slash hot dog and start learning today. Yo, who don't love food? Idiots. David, so we are foodies. Oh, foodies to the max. But guess what?

We start talking about food and we start talking about relationships. And religion. And uncircumcised situations. But that's why we got the best foodies. slash everything podcast that you need to check out. Dues behind the foods. I'm Tim John Taransoo. And I'm David So.

You got to see me on Wild and Out. You might have seen me on the YouTube's. Or you might have seen us doing our food show together, send foods, which is hilarious. We travel around all over the United States where we eat and try everything. We go to food festivals. And guess what? When we do that, we have a lot of fun stories to talk about. There's a lot of other podcasts out there to talk about foods, but they don't have us, too.

And they suck so bad. unless they're also part of the same platform that we're a part of. They're great. That's why y'all should check out Dews Behind the Foods. And remember, you can subscribe for free on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts. I remember having a very regionally specific burger

in Albuquerque, New Mexico. It was the first time. I was there. It was when I was on the track and field team at UCLA. We used to travel around random places in the country. You'd end up in Baton Rouge, Louisiana for LSU. been college station, Texas for Texas A&M, and we were competing at University of New Mexico and Albuquerque, and at this point I'd already fallen in love with food, so I'd take all of my

large shot-putting teammates out to just eat as many calories as we could. And we ended up at a bar, I can't remember the name, but it was the first time I had, like, a proper green chili cheeseburger. And to me, talk about simple, right? I mean, the green chili can have a couple different ingredients in it, but to me, the green chili cheeseburger, the simplicity of, it was a charbroiled burger just on a grill in the back, and some sort of non-discreet. ripped white cheese, a smear of this green chili. It's like a paste. And there's the MSG from the chicken bullion in there.

And that to me was like my first truly great regional burger experience. George, where do you have the green chili cheeseburger ranked? Right now it's in my belly. Literally, you're not going to believe this. I might blow your mind here. I just had a green chili cheeseburger for breakfast. Jesus Christ. How was it?

George, you're living a dream, man. So this is actually a true story. I was, we are featuring, I'm part of Burger Bash this year in New York, the New York Wine Food Festival. I'm going to be Burger Bash. In my booth, we're not competing. I said, I'm only due to if I'm not competing. I just want to make people happy with burgers. So last night, we decided we were going to do the green chili cheese burger for the burger bash, just for fun, because it's so good.

And it's so easy. And it's so simple. And there's only really four ingredients, green chili cheese, burger, beef, burger, and a bun. That's it. It's such a great burger. So I just had to test it today and take a picture for Burger Bash. So I ate the model. Man, I am so mad.

I was supposed to judge the Burger Bash. Oh, no. Two of my best friends. Oh, that looks gorgeous. Oh, you just showed us a picture of the burger. Oh, I want that so bad. Oh, so beautiful. I literally took it made the burger so I could take a picture of it.

Two of my stupid best friends are getting married. I made myself. I got green chili from New Mexico and I roasted it. And I chopped it up and put it on the burger. Oh, my God. It's so simple. Can you ask your friends to get married like another weekend? I would love to.

I'm missing the world produce festival, which I was so mad. In Orlando? No, it's in Anaheim this year. And missing burger bash. Oliver Hunter and Alex, I love you too. Your love is beautiful. I wouldn't miss it for the world. There's another cousin, though, of the green chili cheeseburger.

I don't know if you'd call it a cousin. It's kind of like the drunk insane cousin that kind of trashes everything. Oh, okay. This is another one I had in, I was outside of that, I was in Aurora, Colorado, and I had something called a Pueblo Slopper. Oh, my gosh. The Pueblo Slopper is, I don't even know where to start with it, but it is sitting in a large bowl of like, because green chili can refer to the actual chili itself, likely a hatch chili. But then green chili, I would call it green chili prepared. It's like a stew.

It's like just a sauce, but it's not like a chili like we think of diner style chili. Sure, sure, sure. But, George, you've had a Pueblo Slop. You've had many sloppers, I imagine. I have not had many. I've literally had one, to be totally honest. And it was fantastic. Also, it was in Denver.

I think it was in Denver. I had it outside of Denver. How do you eat it if it's so wet? Is it a fork and knife situation? Oh, definitely. Is it a pick-up with your hand situation? George, I wouldn't say definitely, because if you are drunk enough outside of Denver, Colorado, which one, it's one of the beer brewing capitals of the world.

So I was. I did pick that thing up with my hands, and then I think I developed a rash on my palms. Well, that's probably why you shouldn't do that. It's such a good time, though. It's like signing a waiver at Hell and Ray's. I think wet bread and wet sandwiches are truly one of my favorite food groups in the world. You know I love wet bread sandwich. I just love, I love, I mean.

Like a French dip, that kind of thing. 100%. Especially growing up, you know, in Southern California, going to, we'd go to a, in L.A. Clippers game because tickets used to be $10 when they really sucked in the mid-2000s. And we'd drive up and we'd go to Philippe the original. It's not called Filippe. It's my favorite restaurant in L. L.A., do you know that?

And they invented the French dip and the spicy mustard. And so I, like, love wet bread. You too. California also has, like, a distrami culture that people don't understand. Pastrami burger culture. Different than New York deli pastrami, like our fast food. Thin-shaved, curly-kew situations. We have these establishments that have some of my favorite burgers where they also sell bean burritos,

teriyaki bowls, pastrami, and burgers. And there's one spot in Northridge, George, if you come out to L.A. I got to take you to a place called Kings Burgers Got Sushi. It is half old school L.A. Roadside Diner and then half Omikaze Sushi Barre. It was one of the original Carl's Jr. locations. Really? That was then deep franchised. No, no, no.

It was an original, like, 1960s Carl's Jr. charbroiler location. Okay. And then a Greek immigrant bought it, turned it into a Greek roadside diner. Okay. And then a Taiwanese family bought that from him and was slipping burgers. Their son goes and trains. at, like, Katana and Roku and some of the best sushi bars in Southern California, he comes back, tries to save the business by improving the burgers,

finds out people don't want that. So he said, screw it, I know sushi. So you can get an $8, California roll with your pastrami blue cheese burger. And it is an utter delight. So those are the regional burgers that I grew up with that I just love. Hmm. Well, I was just to see, if you like wet bread, one of our special coming up, one of our monthly specials is the Garjulo burger.

I'm not sure if you know that is that. Oh, my God. Our Julo burger was invented at a place called Brennan and Carr in Deep Brooklyn in Nostron Avenue in Brooklyn. And that goes back almost 100 years. So back to the 1930s and 40s, I believe. It's a cheeseburger, but it's also a roast beef place. So they put sliced hot, warm roast beef on the burger with grilled onions. They take the entire thing with tongs and they dip it into a bath of beef broth.

You're literally speaking my language. Oh, this really, it really is the hybrid of a French dip and a burger. It's a very wet burger. What are some more off the beaten path regional burgers out there? Because I know there's some like the slug burger, the goober burger that have a kind of a bit of not a sorted history, but like an interesting history. Since I was a kid every time I saw the goober burger, I'm like, there's no one that really eats that. I guess it was one of those things like whenever you're a kid and your dad is watching like best burgers in America by like. Spike TV or something. Probably hosted by George

Marston. Probably. And it's like, this is the Guber Burger. They put a smear of peanut butter and I'm like seven and I'm like nobody's, nobody's doing that. They're just doing it just to do it. Like Fear Factor. No. It's actually, historically, I was invented 80 years ago at a place called the

Wheel In Drive-in in Sedalia, Missouri. And they were one of the very first to put peanut butter on a burger. It was an idea given them, I think, by a random person who walked and said, I got a great idea for a burger. They've got peanut butter on the burger. But it's just warmed, smooth peanut butter poured onto the burger. It's glorious.

I mean, I tell people, like, you know, think beef satay. You know, if you're having a hard time with it, it's basically the same thing. Peanut butter to me is one of the most fascinating things in the world because I think the European mind can't comprehend two things. It's one, how to throw an American football. I was on the beach with a friend from Spain trying to throw an American football. It was just so tough. They just don't get the shape of it.

They can't get it. They can't get it. Yeah, they can't get the spiral as it makes it in peanut butter. Like peanut butter is such Like nut butters in general or just peanuts Specifically peanuts are like such a uniquely They exist throughout the world But like peanuts and peanut butter specifically

Are such a uniquely American product And so if you look at when Industrialized peanut butter first hit the scene In the early 1900s late 1800s It would show up in like fancy New York hotels And they'd be like A peanut butter with iceberg lettuce Because I don't know

Because they don't know what to do with it Well they did know what to do with it It was put it with iceberg lettuce And people enjoyed it You know and then 80 years ago they're putting it on a burger. It wasn't until we kind of like, through marketing campaigns hit this kind of like peanut butter jelly,

Reese's peanut butter cup paradigm. So changing it from like savory to sweet. Yeah, peanut butter isn't sweet at all. I had this argument with people. There's four grams of sugar in Jif peanut butter per two tablespoons. That's negligible. It's a salty, delightful, savory treat. You should be putting it on hamburgers. Yeah. We had two Germans, and this is a true story. We had two Germans in the

restaurant the other day, and they ordered the peanut butter and jelly. I have an excellent peanut butter and jelly sandwich in the menu. It's nuts. It's not complicated. It's literally just square white Pullman brand, untosted with GIF and like regular smuckers grape jelly. And they acted like they had eaten like the greatest food in the world. They had never, we don't have this in Europe. What is this?

How do we do this at home? What should I do? Oh, my God. It was unbelievable. I was like, well, I never thought. So I actually sat down and talked to them for 10 minutes and told them the best strategy for making their own peanut butter and jelly sandwich in Germany. You keep the crust on? of course

you're a man-a-taste food waste he's got margins you're a man-a-taste what was the snackables what was the snackables what was the thing that was uncrustables

uncrustables oh I can't I can't do uncrustables oh my god it's too weird you guys need to grow up uncrustables are delicious stop it

drop them in a deep fryer maybe they're just they're the parogi of peanut butter and jelly what's what they hate well it's like as an American if you were to go to Malaysia and eat kaya toast, which I've gone to Southeast Asian restaurants and eating kai toast.

My mind has been blown, but that's just the daily breakfast for a nation of hundreds of millions of people. It is mind-blowing, though. The first time you have kai-toast, it is quite mind-blowing. I'll say that much. What other regional burgers have you had, Nicole, that you were like, okay, this is a strange and delightful combination? If I could see, I mean, it's a very polarizing, it's a very polarizing choice as my favorite. Wow. Some people might not even call it a burger. it's a patty melt.

I love paddy melts. I just love, there's something about the bread, the rye bread, and how crusty it gets, and how delicious. The way that it melds with like the caramelized onions, like the deeply dark caramelized onions and the cheese and the meat, it's just so delicious. But a lot of people don't like patty melts I've learned. The first patty mout I ever had was at Johnny MFin Rockets. Johnny Rocks, man. And I love Johnny Rockets. To this day is the first place I ever had a milkshake, like I had a cookies and cream milkshake at a patty melt, and I still remember it to this day.

And it was one of the most delicious eating experiences I've ever had, and I made sure all my friends took a bite of the patty melt, and they all loved it too. There's something about, like you said, onions and meat and fat are just such a wonderful combination of foods. And then whenever you add that rye bread, that little twinge of something different, those delicious seedy breads, it just opens it up. For me, at least. It's a delicious eating experience. I rebuke the patty melt. Ouch. I rebuke it. I rebuke thee, Nicole.

Why? Why do you rebuke thee? One, listen, I'll eat anything. I eat rotissory chickens over the garbage for most of my meals, so I'll enjoy a patty melt. But I have, like, a couple fundamental problems with it. A circular burger on a square piece of bread. It's a round peg in a square hole. It doesn't make no sense. You know what I mean?

There's extra pieces of bread that I don't want. Also... You're not thinking about the melting. You know what your problem is you're not thinking of the melt of the cheese and the onions that compensates. There's a spread. There's a natural spread that compromise that does not compromise the sandwich. One, like the Brits, I think they kind of got it right where any sandwich that served on a round bun is a burger to them. And to me, I think the round bun and the round puck of meat is just so beautifully endemic of what makes a burger like the perfect food. And I think you put it on sliced bread and I know Louis lunch, you can talk about it.

I see it on George's lips over there. No, no, I've many things to stay here. But that's just, I don't know, I've never enjoyed a patty melt as much as I would. Put some caraway seeds on my burger bun, that'd be lovely. But I can't do it. Let me tell you why she's right and you're wrong. Yeah, let's do it. I like you both, equally.

I'm not saying that. But the main thing about the patty belt, first of all, just number one, is I have a lot of things to stay here. It is a regional burger, by the way. And it is from, technically from San Francisco, but really made its home in Los Angeles. It's from Los Angeles. It was started at a place called Tiny, oh my God, Tiny Nailer. Yeah, Tiny Nailers, which was in Hollywood, West Hollywood, in Hollywood. And it was originally supposed to be sourdough bread.

When it was in San Francisco, he had a restaurant, tiny head of restaurants in San Francisco. He moved down to L.A., and he opened up Tiny Nailers in L.A., but he couldn't find good sourdough. So he switched it to rye. That's why he used rye. That's how it happened. But specifically, a patty melt is exactly. that. It's basically it's a rye bread Swiss cheese grilled cheese with a burger patty inside and some onions. So what I like about the patty melt, which is so brilliant, is that even though

sure it's a round patty with a square piece of bread or an oblong piece of bread that doesn't really fit technically, what you do have is once you're done with the burger, you have a little bit of that bread left, there's still cheese and you've got a grilled cheese. Exactly. Perfect. You want a grilled cheese, order a grilled cheese. No, what do you want a burger? I respect. I want a hamburger inside of my grilled cheese. We have a burger on the menu that's actually the burger I grew up with. It's called a Chester. And it's actually, I'm sorry, it's actually not on the menu.

It's on the off menu. You can always ask for an hamburger America, but it's called a Chester. And a Chester is basically a patty melt, but it's not. It's a white bread, American cheese grilled cheese, which is two pieces of cheese, and with a burger patty inside. And that's it. And it's kind of perfect. I don't know, man.

There's something about having, like, once you finish the, like, meat of a patty melt and then having a little bit of stone ground mustard. and a little bit of Thousand Island and a little bit of ketchup and whatever hot sauce they have at the diner and just swiping the crust through that melange of sauces that just it's like

it's another part of the dish it's like another part of the meal I accept that both of you can have your opinions and I accept that I can be perfectly wrong on this I will say ironically one of my favorite fast food burgers growing up like I love the idea of these regional burgers

they eventually like influence fast food restaurants Jack in the Box had a butter burger on their menu, the buttery jack for a while. But Carl's Jr. had something called the Frisco Burger. Right. And the Frisco Burger was on, I suppose, what they technically called sourdough rounds, but it wasn't a burger bun. It was rounds that were...

It was a bull. Oh, dude, I remember this shape so... It is so ingrained in my brain from seeing those commercials. The Frisco Burger is such... They're beautiful. There was no lettuce on it. It was just like tomato and like a warm orange mayonnaise. They're gorgeous.

That bun... Would you consider it a... bun, it's a slice of bread. It's a slice of bread. But also, I know, so Alvin Kailan, who's done a lot of work with George on First Week East, he specifically gets a round, it's like a round, whatever a round polman loaf would be called. So he can slice it and make burgers like that with round bread that you can get that toast on the outside. Yeah. Really? Yeah. I love you. I need to eat a burger repeat. Nicole, you had a Southern California regional burger for the first time, I believe, a week and a half ago. When? You went to a spot that you'd never been to.

Me? How do you know so much about me? What's going on? You brought it. You offered me some of your fries. Oh, what did I do? You went to Tommies. I went to Tommies for the first time.

Oh, my gosh. What an experience that was the Little Red. I love the Little Red Hut. It was so iconic. I had chili cheese fries, and I had a chili cheese burger. The chili cheeseburger had to make, I put tomato onion lettuce on it. I don't think I'm ever going to do that again, though. The tomato lettuce onion on the chili, it's too hot, and it's, and it wilts and then not

so pleasant way. The chili lubricates everything, too, so it slides off each other. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it was a great first experience. Will I go to Tommy's again? Maybe. But I'm really glad I got to try it for the first time. I felt like I checked something off of the L.A. Girl list that I always wanted to.

Yeah. Yeah. What are some off the beaten path, like, regions that have burgers? Like, I know Minneapolis has the Juicy Lucy, which I think is everywhere. Juicy of, yeah, of Minneapolis

Well, this is fantastic. That's a good one. Also, yeah, the Frita, which is the regional specialty of specifically Little Havana in Miami. You actually can't even find the real thing in Cuba anymore because there's 20 ingredients, you know, that go into that burger. It came with the people who were escaping the revolution in 1958, 1959, and landed in Miami and basically stay there and flourished. It's a beautiful burger. It's wonderful, wonderful burger. Really is great. There's so many. The Slug Burger is also fantastic. Northern Mississippi. That has a long, sordid tale attached to it, which no one likes me to tell the story from Mississippi. You know, he's got it wrong. I don't have it wrong.

I know what I'm talking about. I know what you're hiding. Nicole, if you had to give your ultimate burger, you're calling it the patty melt, regional burger. I'm sorry to upset you like this, Josh, but for me, it's a patty melt. I accept you. I accept you.

All regional burgers are beautiful, and there's so many international burgers that we could talk about, too. But to me, nothing. I'm giving it to the Pueblo Slopper. Give it to the Slopper, for one. George, I know you're not going to pick your favorite, but if you just want to shout out,

shout out a couple that you enjoy. I would say that the Oklahoma Frat Onion Burger is probably the one that's made me the most famous, so that really should be appreciated that more than I actually do. I have one yesterday, you know. But I really do love the Green and Schley Cheeseburger just for its basic simplicity. And to me, honestly, I like what I like what's called

the original American hamburger, which is a smash patty with nothing more than mustard pickle onions. That to me is kind of perfect. You know, it's kind of a perfect ideal, the platonic ideal for a burger. And sometimes you travel the entire world just to come back home. The first thing I do when I travel and I come home is that I go to my own restaurant, I need a burger. I feel so patriotic right now.

Only because I just, I need to have, I need to have that. We spend so much time just trying to get it right, you know, that they get on the road and like, kind of got it right, sort of. Okay, I need a burger. kind of reset. The first thing I do when I go home is go reset at the restaurants. Which one of your kids do you love the most? I love him equally.

What's the world? It's Von Miller, Super Bowl MVP, chicken farmer, and now host of Free Range. This is a show where I go off the field and off the script. We're talking what's hot in music, film, trending news, and everything blowing up your feet. If you love football, you'll feel it home. But if you're here for the vibes, the internet deep doves, the conversation, this is your podcast.

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All right, Nicole and George, we've heard what you and I have to say. Now it's time to find out what other wacky ideas are rattling out there in the universe. It's time for a little segment we call Opinions are like casseroles. George, first up, we have to get your opinion on something. It's the namesake of the show. Is a hot dog a sandwich? No. Good enough for me, Nicole.

Let's get to that first opinion, shall we? Is that the right answer? I don't know. I think there actually is, from what I understand, there's really no right answer. But I truly believe that, no, it's a hot dog's a hot dog. I could ask what you think about a hamburger being a sandwich. Hamburger is a sandwich. Wait, why is a hamburger a sandwich?

We don't have time for this. No, we do. We do, real quick, George. This is a bread or separate, like a sandwich. That's why. Okay. Unless you go to Shake Shack where they keep the hinge, but it's a long, that's a different story.

Hinge. I thought he's going to talk about because the original. Is it at Louis's lunch where they called it a hamburger sandwich? They did, exactly. So that's really, I think, where a lot of it comes from in history. But also, they called it a hamburger, a hamburger steak sandwich. Okay. Or hamburger steak sandwich.

So. Hamburg steak. I have newspaper records dating back. 1849 calling a hot dog a hot dog sandwich but that's fine that's fine that's fine nobody wants to believe me nobody wants to believe the guy with the receipts i'm just screaming into the void yep uh the earliest known in print by the way um of the hamburger sandwich was 1893 and the el and the reno not el rena but the reno evening gazette reno nevada yeah renavada 1893 which obviously predates by the way it predates louis lunch so they hate me for this but it's true they

this is this their claim is false what's there's the the one the ones in texas who add coffee and sugar to their burger yeah uh yeah no that's not a ragged so they they also make a very i can't remember what they're called but somebody who worked there showed up to a meet and greet once and like gave me their like seasoning packet and they're like this was the original burger in america i couldn't tell you davis that whole thing it's like nine different claims the invention of the hamburger but he my when the hamburger was invented there was no there was no It wasn't like a media sensation. It was actually ethnic food from Germany.

It was not seen as anything. It's like talking about like if we talked about pupus today, you know, whoa, but new papusa just came on the scene, nobody really cares, you know, but maybe 100 years from now they'll care about papuces and tacos, you know? Oh, the Mench's brothers. The Mench's brothers. Yeah, there's all. Oh, there's so many.

Everyone's making a claim. Everyone's making a claim. You remember all those claims happened after the fact. They were making claims in the 50s and 60s about, oh yeah, my grandfather did this at 100 years, you know. I invented chili crisp. Do you want to get sued?

Yeah, go ahead. Okay. So Nick on Twitter says, fried egg is the best burger topping of all time followed closely by fresh-sliced jalapenos. What do you feel about that, George? Whoa.

I think fresh-slice jalapinos are a problem on a burger. Oh, okay. They're just too much. I'd rather have pickled. I think a lot of people would enjoy pickled jalapinos. They have a little bit less of a bite. They can be crunchy. But there's something about the pickling process,

which makes them a little more palatable, I think. Raw fresh is a little bit odd to me. I'm not a big fan of the flavor. And then I was the other thing. Egg is great. Eggs are actually fantastic. If you cook the egg correctly, it's a great. It's a great addition to a burger.

And pretty much every country outside of the U.S. puts them on their burgers regularly. So especially in the forest. How do you feel when the yolk drips down on your, like, wrist and whatnot. Is that an enjoyable experience for you? No, it makes me sad because it should be in my mouth. Yeah, I know.

I agree with you that the egg needs to be cooked very, very properly, almost like that. I want to slap every single person on Instagram who takes a picture of the yolks shooting out of the plate. It's like, yeah. Yeah. What are you doing? Just ruin the burger. I think you and I, so, like, Nicole and I both came of age. We both turned 18 in 2010, which was the rise of like the, the, the, the, the, the, at the time, $16

gastropub burger. Now they're $25 gastropub burgers. Yes. And I still have a deep love for a lot of those burgers, the father's office, the plan check.

Even like early umami burger was I think really good. But so many of them had unnecessary fried eggs on it, which I'm always happy to get a fried egg. I love eggs. And I love it on a lot of burgers.

I love eggs on burgers. But there was a, we dealt with a lot of extraneous egg situations on burgers growing up. Yeah. You definitely did. That's fair.

I have some scars from that era. And they were all sitting in little tiny cute cast irons or like on a cutting board, you know what I mean? With the knife pumbled through it. And getting like a smoked bourbon, old-fashioned, fat-washed with pork lard. I'm so sorry about this. It was a moment in time.

I'll say this. Mumford and Sons were all on the way. Hey, boom, hey, stomp, clap music. Is that what they call it? I love fresh sliced jalapinos on a crispy chicken sandwich. I will say on a burger, I agree with you. It needs that pickle. It needs that, like, that sharp asses.

it to kind of cut through, which I like, as opposed to that fresh green flavor from regular sliced jalapenos. And I love pepper. Peppers have, when you cook a pepper, what they call the flesh, the flesh, the pepper, it gets a really great texture once it's cooked and the skin is off. Agreed. There's something very special about a roasted red pepper. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. That's special. That is a really, really special moment. But you have to leave to roast it or cook it somehow to get the flesh to break down so that it's a taste a little bit, a little softer. I agree. This is an opinion that I really respect.

This is from at Funny Fish 21, the taller the burger, the worse it gets. If I can't comfortably bite down from top bun to bottom bun, it is immediately a terrible burger. Yes, this is true. It's absolutely true. This is the truth because hamburger architecture is of the utmost importance. When you build a burger, it has to be able to fit in your mouth. If it's not going to fit in your mouth, you know, how can you possibly, how can you possibly? You should be able to get every single flavor in that burger in the first bite, period.

I have a question, George, what do you think about burgers that the diner has to smash down with their hands to get to a place where it can be eaten? I mean, I'm not a big fan of that, and I understand why. Sometimes if you have crispy bacon, that's blooming, you do have to squish it down. So that doesn't really bother me too much, but I don't like the fact that there's a moment when it all started. on Instagram where all these influencers were taking pictures of these tall burgers because the restaurants wanted them to. The restaurants wanted to say, wow, look at that burger. And no one cared to fit in your mouth or not.

They just, they only care does that look great. Right. It literally fills up an Instagram frame better. Like everybody knows if you try and take a picture of like it's like literally, yeah. That's why even so many smash burgers are photographed with all the meat just hanging out of the bun. What a shame.

I know. I know. The onion burger, look at the two burgers you make in the restaurant. We make a classic smash all the way, which is a bunch of pickle onion. We also make an onion burger. They look identical when they're on the plate. They look kind of sad, actually.

And I see people take pictures of all every day. People will take pictures and post on Instagram. And I just go like, like, sorry, it looks so sad. But everyone knows that it tastes great. And it's hard to, it's hard to explain to people, you know, that you don't, it doesn't have to look like an Instagram ready photo for it. It tastes fantastic. Agreed.

I agree. What do you guys feel about whenever they have? have like open face burgers, you know, whenever like you're at a diner and it's like one side of the bun has the cheese and the meat and the other side has all of the, uh, let's say the colds. Yeah, the L top. So you can like, so you can like customize it. Is that way they do it? So you can like remove. That's the main reason. Yes, just so you can swipe some mayo on that or something. Yeah. So you basically build it yourself, you know. That pisses it. You know, I mean, that's a

diner thing. Yeah, I've always been just a weirdly ethically opposed. I think a burger, like the marriage and needs to sleep when you know, you got to sleep in the same bed. You know, you got to sleep, everything's got to sleep together in the burger. It's like serving your pepperoni on the side for pepperoni pizza. Exactly. Why are you doing that? What was the opinion? I'm sorry, I don't remember. Oh, tall burgers. Oh, yeah, F a tall burger. I don't like them.

There's another good one here. Go ahead. In Canada, medium rare or pink burgers is not the norm. Usually here, it's always cooked well done. Even though I know medium rare burgers are delicious, every time I see one on TV or a movie, it weirds me out a little. Yeah, if people do get. weirded out by by seeing like pink in meat, you know. Some people don't know how to cook a burger

and they think, oh, look, it's like bright, dark red. And that just, is that the way it's supposed to be perfect, rare? No. Now, it's one of those weird things. And I understand why some, especially if you grew up not eating pink centered meat, they understand why people get weirded out by that. But I always tell people that if you're looking at a burger and you take a bite and it tastes a little cold inside, like, you may want to, you may want to, like, you know, this person didn't go far enough in the rare and if you can see white flecks in the grind, which means

the fat didn't render out, therefore it is officially undercooked and it's probably not going to taste great. The beauty of the of a hamburger and all the flavor really does come from the rendered fat. If you don't render fat, it just tastes different. Yeah. Yeah. I've had some undercooked burgers in really good burgers. Like the father's

office burger was the one that sort of kicked off this fancy burger revolution. The bleeding bun, as I like to call it. Oh my God, it is. I've gone back there and had it where if you get like tartar in France, I'll ask if you want it like seared, right? Right.

It literally was, I've had it where it's just a seared tartar sandwich, which again, I do love. It wasn't a burger, but it was a nice tartar sandwich that I had a good time. I've had a kifto sandwich before at Lila Bella. Have you ever had this before? No. There's an Ethiopian restaurant on Fairfax where they take

Kifto, which is like this Kifo, sorry, I was saying it wrong. That's like this delicious, like, it's like a buttered, super spiced tartar it's hot butter on cold tartar and it's so good and they put it in like a deli roll and oh my god

you can either get it rare or you can get it raw rare or well done or something and she looked at me she's like I'm going to give it to you medium I'm like I want it rare she's like I'm going to give it to you medium I'm like okay no problem

so in that aspect delicious but with fathers you're talking about two different things though is you're like apples and airplanes here we are talking apples and airplanes Apples and airplanes. Because what's happening is when you have that dish, they're adding butter because there's no fat in there.

The zero fat. But most of the tartars you have, like the famous French tartar, there's no fat in it at all. When you make a burger, you eat fat to make the burger. So you chop it up and then you have the combination of the fat and muscle fibers together. And that's why the rendered fat's better than the other ones. I'm simply that there's no actual fat in the stuff you're talking about. What you're really tasting is the steelyness of the muscle. fibers without the fat. Has anybody

ever tried to order a smash burger medium rare? Yes. That's like not even that's like the it's like it's impossible. You have a you have a point two second window Yeah it's It is actually it is possible for the professionals out there

It's definitely possible. I had a culinary school teacher that went to Denny's one time and He asked for his burger medium at Denny's and they're like sir we don't do that. It's Denny's. And he's like, no, no, no, I need you to do this medium. And he had to sign a waiver saying he will not claim it. Denny's will not claim any responsibility for him getting sick. And he signed it and he ate it. And he's still alive today. Still live and kicking. Jack in the box killed a few kids in the 90s. And suddenly the government freaks out and won't let you serve ground beef under 165. Yeah. You know. It's true. Yeah. They revamped the pork recommendations, though. Because there's a big trichinosis outbreak that killed people in the 70s. For 40 years, people were not allowed to serve pork under 165 until 2008, I believe. Wow. Look at us. 145 now, right?

145? 145, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Their advertising campaign is a rosy blush to your pork. Right, which is nothing wrong with that at all. That actually tastes better. I love a creed. We all grew up on the driest pork chop.

Well, not you. The driest pork chops imaginable. And now we fixed it. Bryn says, best burger I've ever had was a capraise salad burger, balsamic glaze, whole basil leaves, thick, homegrown tomato slices, thick slice of fresh moths. Oh, I believe there was also garlic.

Incredible. I think that person needs a salad. I'm sure they're fantastic. They don't want a burger. They want a salad, which is also fine, sure. Have a salad. There are a lot of burgers that take, like, big creative swings.

And frankly, like, I love the classics. I love a lot of Kraft and a Burger. But I do kind of miss this era where people, like, really, really played with the burger, right, and really tried to get crazy with the combinations in a really smart way. But there are so many times where, like, this caprize salad, where I'm like, that becomes a better dish if you take the burger patty out of it.

I would just get a steak. Then you have a lovely mozzarella and tomato sandwich. That's, you know, you could be in a seaside tour in Italy. Like, the burger detracts from that. I agree with you. I totally agree. It's a temperature thing, too. I don't know.

Is the temperature of the burger cold? I mean, otherwise you're going to just have this weird. melange of like half-melted mozzarella and wilted lettuce. Oh, you know that's all room temp. You know that's room.

I'm not going to, let me tell you. I'm not going to yuck somebody's yum, but I do think I would probably, if I saw this on the menu, I would probably pass on it. What I would do is I would get a capraise salad and a steak, and I would do a little Thai beef salad

situation at that point. You know what I mean? One of the greatest sandwiches, I think, in the whole world, by far, is the simplicity of mayonnaise tomato and white bread. Yeah. It's perfect.

What's your mayonnaise? What's your mayonnaise of choice? Specifically, I like helmets. I like duke. I also like homemade mayo. Homemade mayo is great, too. I do make homemade mayo. But I like Helms.

Dukes is also pretty good too, but you know. I have a BLT once a year, and I put Dukes on it, and it's one of my favorite eating experiences. And I make my beer. It's so good. I do a turkey bacon BLT once a year. Why are you so similar to me? Growing up Jewish turkey bacon, it's a weird thing where I crave.

I can't have anything. I have an ancestral craving for turkey bacon. I eat a lot of pork. I ate a lot of bacon. No, I'm just saying. Well, anyways, we're going to fight this one out. On that note, thank y'all for listening to a hot dog as a sandwich. We got new audio-only episodes every Wednesday, video version here on YouTube every Sunday.

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