A More Civilized Age: A Star Wars Podcast - 121: Korriban & the Jedi Enclave (KOTOR II 12)

Episode Date: October 29, 2025

With three of the missing Jedi Masters found, the Exile, Kreia, and the rest of the Ebon Hawk's ad hoc (ad hawk?) crew finally head towards the ancient Sith world of Korriban. There they find... well, mostly the same planet that Revan and co. left behind a few years ago, albeit a little more decrepit than usual. Then, its back to Dantooine to confront the reconvened Jedi Council and finally get some long promised answers. Show Notes Hosted by Rob Zacny (robzacny.bsky.social) Featuring Alicia Acampora (ali-online.bsky.social), Austin Walker (austinwalker.bsky.social), and Natalie Watson (nataliewatson.bsky.social) Produced by Chia Contreras (cado.bsky.social) Music by Jack de Quidt (notquitereal.bsky.social Cover art by Xeecee (xeecee.bsky.social)  

Let us return once more to a more civilized age, a Star Wars podcast. I'm Rob Zakney, joined by Alia Kampora, Austin Walker, and Natalie Watson. We are, as always, supported by you, our listeners, via patreon.com slash civilized. So head over there if you'd like to support the show and get access to all our Q&A episodes and special editions. This week, yours truly realizes he's run out of road. All those things he was going to get around to budding up to the cat. and crew of the Ebenhawk, that ain't gonna happen. This is, this is like, uh, you realized that it's graduation day.

Uh-huh. And you have run out of time to forge those friendships, those relationships. You're running around your yearbook and being like, you want to sign this. And people are like, I don't, who are you? What's going on? Oh, we should, I wish we'd hung out more. We'll stay in touch. Those sorts of things.

Uh, that is, that is, that is, that is what I got from. Mira. That is, that's what I got from Kraya. Yeah, well, life's what happens when you're busy making plans, Rob. You know? You got to get out there. So true. You spend time with the bounty hunters in your life before they're in someone else's

life. And it's important to save time. Like, don't, hey, don't spend all your time at work. Don't, for instance, waste your life creating new levels for video games when you have perfectly good levels from the previous installment that you could just put new things in. My and, hey, yeah.

Remember Corabon? Uh-huh. That's still good. That's perfectly delicious Sith dungeon right there. We just run back through that shit. Why not? They got the cages and stuff still.

They got the Shirex or whatever. We got a fight. Yeah. This is the planet that was supposed to be M478, the planet of droids, that did not get anywhere close to finish. that you can still download a separate mod of if you want to go try to play what's there.

It's just not done. Like it's not, it's not enough. I thought we had to do the droid hell. We have a different droid hell coming. We have HK47 factory, which is more important to play through even though it's also a sort of droid hell because it at least closes the loop

on the HK47 stuff a little bit. HK is the one who I did not actually have influence high enough for to get all of his stuff. But nevertheless, we do got to do that stuff. I feel like I'm being punished for having favorite party members. I think that's intentional. I actually think that like the idea that you're supposed to get Max influence with everybody on a single run is like a brain disease we all have

because we've all been playing video games for 25 years. We're busy people. The brain disease is wanting all that delicious content. We're busy people. We were supposed to be like, oh, I ignored so-and-so because they fucking suck and I don't care about them. That's how these games work. Okay, but my brain diseases, I spent all my time with Mandelor and Bauder, the two most, like, not written character. Yeah, that did happen to you, yes.

Alas. Were you able? No. I was going to say, were you able, Allie, to Jedi-Fi Beauder? No, I was, like, slightly rude to him once. And when I went back. He seems like the sort who would like take a slight really a heart. One time.

Just one time. It was like, I remember coming back. I think it was from Narshada. And he was like, hey, do you would have talked to me about something? And I was like, I was trying to be darksided. So I was like, just get over it. That's the homie. You were darksided to the homie?

You couldn't have been like, yeah, let's talk about it. I was so evil when I was doing that show. Bayo Derr is trying to open up about like his ambivalence about, like designing that deadly like woman choking weapon he's like commander sometimes I regret building the breath star

I think I think unleashing it at Malacore it's gonna haunt me forever and you were like boring basically the only dialogue option I got for basically the rest of the game was like hey can I have some shields

which is the same thing happened to me The same thing happened to me. I must have said something to him at some point that just closed him off to me forever. You're both part. I jortified him. He's the one guy I didn't care if I jettified him by accident. So that's because you're playing lightside, Rob.

He likes it when you do nice things for people and just gets influence from that. If you're doing bad things at the time and he's around, you're getting lower influence with him. And my guess is you're not like hanging with him enough and over. Again, the game like really wants you to super commit, which that I think is. Right. The thing that Allie your character. You can't wear Jolie's armor. Yeah.

Uh-huh. That's true. The only way you can wear Jolie's armor is to be a fence-sitter a little bit. It's in my inventory, so I might as well put it on. Maybe I might as well put that shit on. So it appears without, we entered the smoke them if you got them, shoot toward the end game without me fully being aware of it. So this week, we go to Corbyn to see what's up. I just want to be very clear to the listener that I was like, if there's anything you need to get done, it has to be done before you get back on board, the Ebenhawk on Corby.

Here's the problem. I didn't have many quests left. I get it. Like, it really, the ship had sailed, honestly. Like, there was that guy still on Narshada who's like, I would, anyone need a, anyone need somebody with a commercial driver's license? Anyone, any CDL jobs. No. No, I'm sorry.

I found out how to do that, Rob. you just have to go back to the Troidarian on that one like the you know where there's like the three towers and you just got to talk to him and be like I there's a guy I need who needs a job and he's like okay I'll get him a job and that's the end of that class if you didn't solve it the other way yeah and maybe if I'd done that in front of Crea she would like me more and be like let me you remind me of my student Revin but that that that didn't happen so so we go we go back to Corribon to confront Sion, to see what's been happening at the ruins of the Sith, the Sith Empire dig site.

And then we have a big Sith tomb cave full of visions to get through. And let me tell you, I have always, me a fool, I've always regarded that the visions you get in a, in a dark side cave and a force cave to be like kind of just holding a mirror up to where you're already at. I never thought you just completely fucking fail at having your Star Wars vision experience and come out completely on the wrong track

from where you went in. So that is a thing that can happen. And then once you finish that cave, you go back to Eben Hawk. That's it. And Craya's like, All right, we're going to Dantuin. Dan Teween time.

That's right. And then you go to Dantuin, and it's time to meet everyone at the Jedi Enclave. And they're all completely different dudes. They're completely different dudes. And you have an entire confrontation that I was like, I thought we were, I thought we were like burying the hatchet. I thought we were getting cool with each other. And we are not. We are not getting cool.

And there's what I thought was going to be sort of a healing conversation, if you're light-sided, was not. it did not become a healing conversation. Did they maybe decide to do the thing that they swore up and down that they would never do and never would have done to you? They did, even the cool one. Even, even, well, you know what? Maybe he is a little more like Jedi Hulk than I thought where it's like he says one thing in the locker room. That's right. And then you get him with Vince and different shit happens.

Ain't no, they agreed to. Yep, when the owner's in the room. You sold me out to Vruk? He sold you out to Rue. I think more importantly, the actual thing that's true about Zazkaial is that he's a coward. That's why he went, ran away, and hit on Narshadah. And now that he's like with the two other powerful Jedi who say it's time to do this thing to the exile, he's a coward. He's still a coward.

You did not, in fact, rip the scales from his eyes. He's still the guy he was, unfortunately. And then you're going to find out who Kraya is. And then Kray is off to Tilos. That's right. And we sort of have an awkward breakpoint because thematically we're kind of, that's on to the next stuff. But they don't actually have a let's save our progress and hang loose here. You're kind of, you go talk to Atten and be like, whoa, wild shit just happened here on Dantuin.

You are off to the next thing. And so we will decide how we want to handle that in a moment. Did everybody play through that next say? How much of that next stuff? I haven't edited and posted the let's play there. Until the handmaid, the start of the fight between the handmaid and the head. they're her new sisters. Okay. Okay. And that's where you all saved. I went. Yeah, my screen said saving now. And I said, okay, I'm turning this off. Okay. Cool. Peace out. Cool. I was just after that, basically.

Oh, crucially. I'm not going to say shit. Because I haven't used hand, because I haven't used handmaiden. You had some leveling up to do? Well, I've been leaving her on the bench, but remember, I didn't level her up so that I could beat her up in a fight so we could be friends. Right. Right. But that means she played every cut scene in the sequence in the underwear. Oh my God. And so at every serious moment, at every serious moment, she is just showing up in the underwear. Like when she even comes to like, and Cray is like, it's done. She's there in the underwear. Underware. Okay. Yep. That's so fucking good. Actually. That's so funny. She's ready to go. I mean, that happened to me, Rob. That that happened to me, Rob, because I had all the serious stuff with her.

And then when we were doing like our team, team meeting on Narshadah, and it was like, okay, you guys go that way. And you guys go that way. She was just naked in the background. So not naked. Yeah. I got her back in her mom's ropes. I got her in something crazy.

Yeah. I need to post. Has anyone else tried out the Corellian armor? I haven't even I don't think I've seen it I had a jump scare Here's here's the front Okay

Here's the front It's uh Remember the Remember the baddie from the can'tina On Tilos? Similar vibe to that However However

When when she turned around Oh no Oh no, oh no I know where this is going Bad. Did you wait, did you download a bot? Yeah, what is this?

Yeah, hang on. Because I don't know. Okay, so for listeners, listeners should know. The reverse shot is the assless chap situation. It is an assless chap situation. But I would say the front is Bondage gear coded.

Mm-hmm. The front is like, Cargo bondage gear. I should emphasize there's like a sort of a nude colored section with big old pockets for like blaster magazines. But then also like leather, like leather panties. Sorry, but again, you have to be very clear. When you say assless chaps, you mean the ass is out. Yes.

I've never seen this before. I, if you, if eagle-eyed listeners who are, or one, looking to more supply layers.net. It's like a flesh-colored body suits. Is that what actually is? This is the unfortunate thing because if you zoom into the arms, you can see some wrinkling on the sleeves. So I have to imagine that it was just an unfortunate choice of,

or maybe not unfortunate. I mean, hey, you know, I don't mind it. But it was shocking to arrive on Corribon and to bring, to bring, yeah, to bring Handmaiden out. And I was like, whoa, why are you naked? That's wild. She's doing it. So good for her. Anyway, who did everyone bring to Corribon?

I'm curious. Curious who was traveling the mines. the caves with you. I brought Atten, hoping that I would get some, some Atten worked for Revin's Sith stuff, which didn't really happen at all. And then I brought, I couldn't, you can't bring Crea, right? Because you land and Crea's like, I can't go out there.

It's too fucked up for me, right? She's like, I need to chill on the ship for a little bit. I don't, I'm not finding this. armor. Me either up. I'm finding a Karelian power suit. Yes, that's what I'm talking about. Yeah, but it doesn't look like that. What do you mean? It looks like all the other

power suits and war suits. It looks like a different color way of the Senegal war suit, for instance. But maybe it's I think Are you trying to tell me I like accidentally downloaded a money mod? I think, yeah,

accidentally if that's what you're going to if that's how you're playing it. A mod would be. You accidentally. Yes, exactly. Maybe. Hold on.

I'm booting up the game. I believe you. You should put it on somebody else and see what it looks like. That's actually the thing I want. I guess you're probably not in a position where you can do that, though. Can you load an old save and do it? Yeah. Of course I can.

Yeah. Anyway, to answer your question on Corbant, I brought Handmaiden and Aton. Okay. That feels right. Yeah, it's something. It feels something. I had peace us and Mira because I was trying to farm influence

that I didn't get any but that's okay I brought Bayo Bayo and Mira yeah I think there's like no influence gain possibilities on the second planet

because there's nobody here yeah no so like you're not gonna be nice or mean to anybody basically well and then they don't hang for the important part of this right also like there's other like things they're doing on the planet like if you if you disturb the dead on Corabon you're menaced by monsters cloak lizards will show up

hiss hiss or something like that hissies his his his his it is it is it's the it's the hissosaurus yeah and it cloaks up on you and it swings its tail and then you just beat the shit out of it. They're not very good. No. You can imagine if you came to early that they would be too tough for you or something, but they are XP,

so I did loot all of the grave sites or whatever. I mean, I got some with gloves, I think. Yeah, there was some good stuff on them. Yeah. Got some osis gloves. Yeah. I have a really funny result of my research here in trying to put the Corellian power suit on anyone else.

Uh, the handmade it is the only character I have that can wear heavy armor. I see. So, right. Uh, no one else. Mandler won't change his gear. Mandelaar won't change. Exactly. And the Hanhar.

And Hanhar. Right. And you don't have it. You don't wear it funny. Okay. This could just maybe you're the first person to ever put these on, you know. It's, it is, it is. I see it.

That's the game. That's the game. I'm showing my laptop to everyone. 2000s, like, okay, but what's the women's version of this, this outfit? Oh, well, here. It's like, it doesn't look like, that doesn't look like the Carillion power suit that that guy's wearing. I think if we posted that image on blue sky, it would block it and say it was, not a block, but it would auto mod it and say it was adult contact. I'm like 90% shorter. It is, from the back, it is just really crazy. It is, it is shocking. It's, I,

It's butt cheeks. I did think for a moment, I was like, it's butt cheeks. And, you know, butt cheeks isn't necessarily the most salacious of content, but it was just shocking to land on the Sith planet. And, you know, I was on the ship just picking out what outfits everyone was going to wear. And there's no real preview. And unfortunately, you know, or fortunately, depending on your perspective, It was not what I was expecting.

It's actually less dignified than the underwear, being honest. Like, I think the underwear is, like, like, gives a little more like, yeah, this is how I roll. Well, it's a little confusing because if you look at it, just to spend more time on this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Our valuable time. If you look at the front, okay, I'm comparing the images side by side. If you look at the front, there is like a bikini underwear situation, like a classic brief in the front. But the classic brief disappears on the back.

That's what's weird. That's what's weird. So I'm imagining it's kind of like a cup situation. Yeah. It's a codpiece. Like an armored crotch situation. Yeah. Yes, exactly.

Cod piece. And then the back is, I mean, the top half of the outfit is also interesting because the front, you have this kind of what I'm assuming to be a metal crop top over top with a cargo pocketed corset. The pockets are crazy. The pockets are crazy. What do you think she keeps in that? This is like Ella being. trying to put out like erotic fishing gear. Yeah.

That is the energy. It is the vibe. No one knows her name yet still, right? Nope. Okay. The Handmaiden's name? Yeah. Okay.

Next episode, we're going to find out her name. That's all. So get ready. Okay, great. I think we'll all find it out. I mean, we're going to find it out because I'm going to say it because that's the moment that you learn it. So you go through the Sith dig site and that ain't that, Like you can't go into the tombs there, but don't worry.

You can go into the old Sith Academy. Going to deal with all that bullshit again. You have to pass a Sith knowledge quiz. Uh-huh. Hey, can you, are you a bad enough Sith to be able to fill in the blanks on the Sith Creed? It's so funny that you get the like, the interface for it. And it's like, okay, you can go learn it. Obviously, I think most of us still probably remember it enough to pick it out from a multi-choice question thing.

But you can go around to like the library and like go through a little bit of Sith teaching. That's all been sent to auto because all the teachers are dead. And so the computer is like, all right, all the teachers are dead. That means it's time to teach yourself. And that's kind of the first Sith principle. You can't rely on anybody. And it's competition till the death. Good luck out there.

It's very funny that they build a school that will run itself sort of if all the teachers are dead. And if you can't figure it out. Yes. They're like, get fucked. you are you're clearly not cut out for this so it's like the the siff had moved into like phoenix university style sith that's apprenticeship where uh rule of two unless of course your moodle uh your moodl instructor just decides to unleash the the the killer critters on you in the in the exam room at a times you'd see if you killed them fast enough you cannot

win that fight, by the way. There's a, you cannot do it fast enough. There's a, there's a part of this kind of like multi-step puzzle thing where you're trying to, like, you're basically trying to, like, get good enough grades to get access eventually to the jail so you can go find the missing Jedi, who you're assuming is going to be, I guess you're not even assuming, you're just exploring a little dungeon area is what you're doing now. But, um, you eventually get to a thing where it's like, all right, now you have to beat all of these, um, these, like creatures in as quick a time as possible. and it jacks it up from like rank 1 to rank 17. So it's like you're playing the game in hard mode.

And there's no way to win that fight quick enough that the thing is like, you did it, good job. It says go take your punishment. Go to the punishment room and get punished. So, which eventually leads you to a Jedi, a dead Jedi. A dead Jedi. Ripped to Lana Vash. Yes, ripped to Lana Vash.

She leaves a... Complicated legacy. I was going to say an egotistical diary or like a real, you know, she's like, I got him just where I want him. Sure, they arrested me, but I'll just use the force. They're not good at the force. It doesn't go well for her. Girls, what are you talking about? You were dead on the ground in a big cage like a bird.

You're on the evil dark side Sith planet in which people draw their darks. side powers from the echoes of terror throughout the galaxy, their power is strong here. You've got minus 50 save to your roles. Isn't it? Like there's like light siders on Corbyn have like a minus for minus 60 or something to their save rolls and dark side people have like a plus 40. This is correct. I don't know the exact number.

It's, it is wild. It is like that. It is depending on where you are. So in the valley, it's plus 25 minus 25. But in the secret tomb, and Rob, this is maybe part of the difficulty that you were maybe having in the secret tomb. Dark side characters get plus 60 to all of their save roles and light side characters get minus 100.

So like, it is really. That's why the stunts weren't working. That is why the stunts weren't working. And I wasn't resisting shit. That is exactly what it is. This is why Craya is like, I can't go out there, which is weird because she seems neutral. But I guess actually the reason she's not going out there is because Cyan, right? That's probably why she isn't coming out here.

Who's lurking in the academy? And they're like, you can't even, you can't face Cyan. We beat his ass. Beed his ass. It's beat his ass. Now, did he keep coming back to life over and over again infinitely? That was a bit of a pickle because, you know, I, I was able to get his HP down to zero over and over again.

But he did do the thing that I don't like when bosses can do it. But it's okay when I can do it. But I don't like when the people I'm fighting can do it, which is heal to 100 over and over and over. He hit the pause button and he used it. And slam the life support. That's right. I can do it too.

I have a question for Ali and Natalie. Did you sense anything weird about the Sion encounter or different? What I told you, Sion has different dialogue for women? Oh, yes, I did sense that. Okay. Especially because of the last thing he says. Okay. Which is different depending on if you are a man or a woman.

Oh, you're right, it is. So as a guy, you run into him and he's just like, it's fitting. You came here. I've studied you and found nothing but weakness, yet she still clutches at you, as if you are all that gives her life. And you'd be like, oh, you know Crea? What's up with you and Crea? And so you go through all that.

And then he again will later on, if you try to like step up to defend her, he's like, okay, you don't know her the way I know her. Trust me. Like you do not know where this is all going. She's going to take over. She's going to like use you, manipulate you. And he says to men, I've studied you. I know the paths you walked in exile.

I know your teacher. I know that fire that raged upon the ducks and moon while the Republic died around you. You know war. You know battle. And I know of Malikor. You saw the heart of war. What Malacor wrought, yet you turned away from it. Wait, I have to say what the woman says.

Please. Okay. If you are a woman, this is what Darth Science says to you. I have studied you. Immersed myself in you. I know the paths you walked in exile. I know your teacher. I know the fires that raised upon the ducks and moon while the Republic died around you.

You know war. You know battle. And I know of Malacore. You know what it means to be broken. The one who travels with you will destroy you as she did me. I can end it before it begins. Importantly, he says it to you like right away. Whereas the bits of that that he does say to men, he only says if you're like, I'm not going to let you harm her.

Because he could be like, I'm here to kill Kraya. And you could be like, all right, bet, like, go for it type shit. Like, it's totally fine. But he will not give you that same response. And also, there's a huge difference, I think, between I have studied you and I have studied you immersed myself in you. He's a little, he's a little, he's coming on a little strong. And then at the end of the fight, what does he say to you?

Because after, you know, you, you bring his HP down to zero a few times and, career is like, you need to leave. You'll never destroy him at this point. And you can be like, I can do it. And she's like, no. And you have to leave. We couldn't put him behind a big stone somewhere. We couldn't lock him in somewhere.

I feel like we could deal with this guy. We could do something. We get the fucking Evan Hawk out front. He's going to survive like a, like a black, come on. I've got like eight guys out there waiting to fuck this guy up. Let's go tag team. Die hard homies out there who would do anything for me who I apparently have a very strong, powerful influence over.

They're going to ride for me. Make them all Jedi, but or to make them all force users. No, unfortunately not. But they are all evil for some reason. He says to me, or he says to his buddies, his other, you know, apprentices over there, do not harm her. I command it. she has earned this.

She and I will meet again. That's not how it goes. For the guys, she's like, she protects him, shields him, find him, hunt him wherever he travels. He will not escape me again. I will bring his corpse to her, cast it at her feet. It will be as if killing her, as if, it will be as if killing her children. I will kill all she protects, all she shields, until her hands are drenched in blood. Damn.

Different energy. That's crazy. Yeah. I think the Sith doth protest too much, you know? You know, I think a little obsessed. It's also really pathetic that it's like, you have to get out of here. You can't beat him. Go into that cave first, though.

That cave that I wouldn't let you go in. Yeah. Like, are we fleeing or not? Are we in danger or not? No, the cave is. Always time for a little cave detour. Yeah. We got to go have, we got to go load some more, some more already made art assets from the last game.

What through one of the worst sections of the last game? I hated this cave the first time just going through just brown hallways I don't even remember this cave What are you fighting here the first time? I remember the chasm. I vaguely remember that there is the gap at the end of the thing But I don't remember what you do with here.

I feel like you felt that you feel like you killed little flappers A little like shrew-shruwicks That's the language of Bikis speech. Shire Woo. Shire. It's something like that. Shirex. Shirex.

Shirex. Sure. Yeah, whatever. Yeah, I think they're just Shirek caves is what they are. Shirek. Yeah. And it's just, oh, it's students. It's that there are the students in there in the first game who are all like,

we don't want to be here anymore or whatever. The renegade Sith students. Oh, right. The ones that were like, yeah, I'm over, I'm over becoming a Sith. Actually, I'm going to go chill in the cave, but it's freaky in here. The camp mutiny and Adam's family values. Just like that. Like that kind of situation?

Yes. Yeah. But anyway, now there's incredibly powerful dark side visions, like what Luke got, except goofier. Yeah. So I guess, yeah, if you don't survive, there's like four phases of visions that you have to weather. And you go in alone. Yeah, you sure do.

And I suppose if you don't, if you don't accomplish, if you don't succeed in each vision, you do take some damage to your alignment. Well, now I'm curious, does it damage you? Because me, it dragged me hard toward the dark side. Like, I basically entered a death spiral here. I was. So you weren't succeeding in these visions. No, every vision was just absolutely working me. It was just like I was doing the things that would draw the most agro.

I would end up getting knocked. I was trying to be too stingy with my good shit. I was like to better not use these drugs. And so I think I beat one of the visions. And then I went 0 for three on the next. And by the end of that, I'd gone from like almost like fully light-side. to thoroughly neutral. I could wear totally's armor,

but I can no longer wear like my light-sided gear a whole bunch of shit is just like broken down on there. Being filled with doubt as you fail to beat Malik, like early war Malik who's the first division, him and bat. There's a bit, so

the first one is Malik and he, it's like him recruiting other Jedi. I guess it's a stand-in from when you got recruited by Revenan Malik. And I would never go, I would never fight under Malik. If you're not saying Revin to recruit me, I'm not joining your, your shit. Malick doesn't have it

when he's doing his big recruitment speech. Oh, I've heard your grades are really good. That's what it's like. Shirley you, come on, man. Get out of here. This is like, you're my safety grad program. You know what I mean? It's like, no, but if you come here, like, I think, I know we don't have the reputation

of Reven's Battlefleet, but you'll get more hands on instruction from me. And then you're quickly looking, you're quickly looking at Malik's papers and you're like, this guy's a fucking idiot. Yeah. Usually he runs through different research assistants who are all clearly doing the

work. You can tell that it's not his writing because it doesn't say the same from paper to paper. Yeah. This guy sucks. Anyway, you do that one. It's like a lot of opportunities in dialogue to revisit the big feelings of like, did I do the right thing in war? But it really does feel kind of.

warmed over. There's nothing new here for the Malick confrontation. One of them is like, here's a situation you had to deal with where there were some, there were some minds in the way of your soldiers and like you sent them forward and they died in the minefield. Can you, you know, what do you do this time? Do you send them forward to sacrifice themselves for the greater good? Do you tell them to hold back or did you happen to put enough points in demolitions? where you could just go clear the minefield and it's not a big deal. I did that, which was interesting only because that was my low skill and there's that part, which I don't know that we've talked about.

I'm guessing everyone got that. Oh, no, I forgot to do this and then I never made good on it. There's a point where Cray is like, what's your lowest skill? And I'm like, it's demolitions, I guess. And she's like, well, then put six more points in it. And I'm like, okay, I'll do that. And I did it. And it turned out that let me save these guys here.

These imaginary guys who don't exist. To answer your initial question, Rob, I succeeded at everything. I simply won all of it. So there was no change to my all the way. Well, we don't all have access to force storm. Is that true? It really is kind of. an amazingly powerful skill, I have to say.

Oh, and now, which we don't have to, you even used it yet, but if you went dark side mode through the Jedi enclave, you now have something that's even more ridiculous in Force Storm. So we'll see how that plays out. You have Force Crush now, and it's a goofy ability. The Sith should win all the wars if they can do this. So it's all say. Pretty strong.

I got the light side and one. Wait, how? Okay, we have to get there. Wait, did you crash and burn in the jail? Oh, wait, no. No, okay, let's just pull the band-in off. I went up to the cave and it said, come back when you form an ideology.

It won't let me in. Yeah, it literally would not let me in. He didn't say that exactly. Crea was like, I'm seeing. Crea was like, she does the thing where she's like, oh, it's all.

spooky in here and you can't go. And then like I went back and I approached the lightning. And I had the like character falls on your knees in front of the lightning. And the thing said, um, you should try to return here when you have more dark side or light side points. Wow. This game really. This is the thing.

This is the thing that somebody warned. Like if you, if you haven't committed in a direction by Corbyn, then, you, you know, you could be locked out of something. And I was so close to being full dark side before Anderon, but I healed those dudes in the fucking thing. And I got like, that's point to every single one. And then I was like trying to go back to the ship and like be kind of rude to the

apprentice. Oh, too late. Oh my God. And I kept failing influence with Visa so she wouldn't even talk to me about shit for me to like get. Wow. It was a tough. It was a tough sense.

That is brutal. That is brutal. Well, you don't get what, what, oh, you do get something from this. You get a cool sword. You get a cool sword. That is like, um. Is that it? I'm trying to remember.

Well, the next, the next one we should say, so you do the Republic. So you do Malik recruiting you. Yep. Then you do a, a, a republic mining, uh, landmine scenario. Yeah. And then, uh. it be? Ghost Crea is accused of being

that's the last one, isn't it? Or is that the, no, you mean you're right? Yeah, no, there's a dead Jedi first, which is nebelish. All of our favorite Jedi, we love Nebelish. We all love, we, we all love Nebelish.

Uh-huh. We all love Nebelish. We all love Nebelish. His, his data pad says, The visions, the visions. They thought to trick me by taking the form of my fellow Jedi, but my discipline is so strong, I trick them back. One fell to the Shirek. The others fell to my lightsaber. My man,

you're dead here. I don't know. From the Wikipedia. One, his image of his dead ass body on the ground in the info panel is great. Two, behind the scenes, the polygon model of the corpse of Nebelish was actually the one used for Dustil Onasi in the Knights of the Old Republic. That's, that's Carte's son's body. This was used because Dustal was to appear in the sequel, but the scenes were cut. therefore leaving only the model in the game engine. The corpse of Neville is labeled Dead Jedi, and his name is only identified in the datapad. Yes, very funny. To me, that's actually dustle.

I've decided for me, rip. He went to become a Jedi and then got immediately owned in doing his dark side, or in doing his secret cave trial. The final... Oh, but then there is the Kraya thing that we're. Rob was talking about. Yes, that's what I was going to say. The final challenge is Crea confronts you.

No, because there's one after that, too. Well, I'm talking about the one with Crea and the homies. But it's not the final one I'm saying, because there's one more right after that. Did you not? Oh, you're correct. Sorry. Yes. Yes, yes, yes.

But yeah, Crea and the homies. Crea shows up and she's like, woohoo, good job on getting this, getting this far. And you can be like, whoa, what are you doing here? and she's like, well, you've revisited, you know, the dark moments of your past, and now it's time to visit the dark moments of your present. And I love that throughout this encounter, you can just be like, oh, I get it. You're a vision. All of this is fake.

None of this is real. You can just. Strangely, that was my play. Yeah. And it didn't. It worked out as badly as it possibly could have. Also, you'd be clear, Krea is here. Is Craya here or is dark side Craya, the one I never got to see because she and I weren't friendly enough.

So she never told me about getting her ass beat by the other Sith lords. And so I was just like, hey, where these hair ties come from? Where this, where this fit come from? It's a cool fit. But then I was like, you're all visions. You're all visions. And all the visions were like apathy is death. Apathy is debt.

True. The funniest thing is because you refuse. to take a side, you're like, this is just all visions. T3 goes in like the rhythm to apathy is death. And then they all attack you. Sorry, everyone's realized now. That means, Al, you've not seen any of this.

So, which many of our listeners probably haven't either. All of your, your, Craig is like, good job getting here, like Natalie said. And then all your people show up and they're like, she's evil. She's an evil. She's a dark Jedi. Stay away from her. Okay. Now, you want to hear the moment.

amazing, I think this is the funniest, like, nailing Jedi liberalism. TXT to the fucking wall. Do you know what the light side? Because if you, if you just, if you pick wrong, you'll get dark side points at the end of this. If you get your ass beat, you'll get dark side. You'll get so many dark side points if you get your ass beat. Yeah.

But the way to gain light side points through this encounter, Atten shows up. She's a fucking Siff. And she's like, Atten, I'll kick your ass. Bayo comes in. Not so fast. I won't stand here and let you. kick Atten's ass. And then she's like, what?

You three are you going to take me on? And then the entire crew of the Evan Hawk shows up. It's another wild. And then all 30 people who live on the heaven hawk are on the screen for a second. This is so expensive to do. And then you have to choose like, who do you believe? To get the light side points. It seems like you got to be like, no, Kraya, I've had enough of your manipulations.

You're a dark, you're a dark Jedi and you can push you. me toward the dark path since the beginning. And then she's like, oh, then you're just going to let them kill me and deny me the chance to walk the path of redemption and to get those light side points. Because it is darksided if you're like, hell yeah, I'm going to help them kill you. Or it's also dark sided if you say I'm with you. I'm going to let them kill. Or I'm on your, if you say you and I are on the same side, also dark side.

But if you say what they're doing to you, is wrong. I will stand beside you now so that you can, so that you can redeem yourself. That's light side of baby. That's light side. I'll fight my friends to redeem you. That's the light side. It is, it is the most like they catch her red handed. She's Siff. We got to stop this Siff. She literally says to you, I will be, I'm a be real with you. I have fallen to the dark side. Does this change your decision? And you can be like, I still am going to ride for you, Kraya. I still am going to try and save you and defend you so that you may have a chance at redemption.

It's so funny. I think you don't get points or gain. I don't think you get or lose anything if you do, okay, I won't attack you, but I won't stop my companions from doing so. What you do get is lectured. This is the apathy is death stuff. Kray says, so you'll do nothing. Apathy is death. Worse than death because at least a rotting corpse feeds the beasts and the beasts.

and the insects. And that's why you're not... And then all your friends are like, apathy is death. Apathy is death. Apathy is death. Everyone repeats it. T3 goes, beep, beep, tweet, tweet.

So, Allie, that's why you're not allowed in here. I'm a dead ass serious. Because apathy is dead. Literally. Yeah. Damn. So true. But you're so trapped in the apathy hole that they didn't even open the door.

They wouldn't even open the door. They can't even. Like, that message would be served. to you to warn you from being apathetic, but if you've already fallen to apathy, then too late. You're not, you're right. It's funny is if you were allowed in here, you probably could have got enough points to get darksided, enough to get the dark side. Though again, I don't even, we'll get there. I'm so curious what the fuck happened for you in, on Dantuin. So, um, the final vision. Revin is there. And even if in the last one, you were like, well, this is all a vision.

that is not one of the core options when you see Revin here. You can say, many people were wondering where the great Reven disappeared to. Or if you're dark-sided or if your Revan was dark-sided, you can say, so this is where the true Sith Lord is hiding. Or you can say, it can't be. Why are you here? Exile. We just went through three visions.

It's a fourth vision. Revan is not here. Revan was not just sitting in the tomb on Corabon for five years or whatever. It does remind us how good Reven's outfit is. It looks cool as how. Revan's armor is maybe goaded Sith armor. And that is... And the rare ability to have wheeled two different colored lightsabers and it looks good.

He is the red and the purple and it works. He's cool. Shout out to Revan. Speaking of Revan, there's a slightly different thing on this planet for you, too. Austin, you're the only one who had access to a holocron. Oh! You didn't get that. Because your revenon was redeemed.

No, my reverend was not redeemed. My revenon was dark side. Your reverends were redeemed. Yes. Oh. My ribbon was dark side as well. I had this hologron. This was in the academy, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's in the room that you have to blow up. Oh, right. And do you remember, this is Bastaela? Is that what it is? Am I remembering this right? Yes, I have it right here. Go for it. So Bastela says,

it has been there's like a specific room in the academy that you need to it's been sealed by lightsabers so you need to find a thorium charge to blow it up which is conveniently in the library sorry I always keep my thorium charges

of course so there's a holocron in there and if you if Revin was redeemed in your previous game in Cotor 1 the thorium blast destroys the holocron and you can't view it. But if your Revan wasn't redeemed, Bastila shows up out of the holocron and says, it has been months since Revan's full memories returned and unrest grows amongst the Sith.

They're convinced Revan will not return so they fight amongst themselves. The betrayals mount. And no matter who wins, the Sith will lose. There is no one left with the power to control the Sith. the forge, though many have tried. I have watched them be devoured, their life drained from them as they attempt to tap into its power. Knowing what we do of the builders and their fate, I'm convinced that Revin did not intend us to keep the Star Forge. To use it would mean the end of the Sith and the end of the Force. I have done as Revin asked and remained here,

but she has been gone for too long. I will wait no longer. Whoever survives this Sith Civil War shall not be one I wish to follow. There is only Revin. Only she can shape this galaxy as it is meant to be shaped. She lives still. This I know. If she will not return, then I shall find her and discover why. I cannot remain here not knowing.

I have become certain there is something she remembered in the unknown regions. It is a technique she learned fighting the Mandalorians that allowed her to convert the last of the Jedi who fought beside her. and murder those who would not. And she fears that it is still out there and silent for far too long. Yeah. And no difference between male and female, Revin. The same message, just pronouns shifted. There's no like, and I miss him so much.

It's all just the same. And he's so sexy. And he's so sexy and I want him back. Yeah, that doesn't happen this time. But yeah, yeah, so he's out there. It's the stuff that we've already basically heard through us. other sources at this point, or maybe not if you, if you didn't get whatever, the T3 memo or the, I think some of this is also stuff that you get through the Craya conversation about Revin.

But yeah, he's out there. I can control the Star Forge if I just like hit the gym a little. Yeah. I think you got to really get a strong core. I think that you really got to hold it together. Yeah. To use the Star Forge. Should we remind, should we remind listeners what the Star Forge is?

from the last game. Yeah. Pop quiz. What was the Star Forge from Cotor 1? It was what we were looking for. That's right. I remember we went to the planets to assemble the StarForge. Wait, hang on.

Do you know that? Hey, do you administer the pop quiz, but you don't know the answer to the pop quiz? Because we didn't build the StarForge. Pop quiz, hot shot. Do you remember what the Star Quiz, but you know. You're actually like, I remember a teacher.

I know how to, I know how to give the quiz, but I don't know, I'm like here. You were like building the pieces, right? I'm just here for the day. I got you. We go watch Romeo and Juliet later for two and a half hours. I'm not teaching shit. Yeah. You get a map.

You get the star maps. It's a map, right? That takes you to. The big space station that is like 3D printing Sith Battlefleets. Yeah. And the forge is. And the forge is the space station, not the maps. That is correct.

Okay. That is confused. The Star Forge is like the big cylindrical, or it's not really, the Proto Citadel. It looks so much like the Citadel, dude. It looks so much like the Mass Effect Citadel. Yeah. And it prints Star Destroyers. It's also presumably what fucking Palpatine is using in Rise of Skywalker to make all those ships,

the Sith ships rather. Oh, damn. So JJ was just like pulling a deep cut from Star Wars video games. This one's for the real ones. They'll know. Yeah. Okay. Okay.

But yeah, it, like, manufactured the Sith fleet super quickly in a way that was, like, you know, impossible. And so they had to write it out here, which makes sense, right? Because it's like, hey, if you, if Revin still had the Star Fort, if the Sith still had the Star Forge, how could they have, like, fallen into disarray? You know, wouldn't they just keep pumping out huge ships? And the answer was like, only Revin was good enough to you. it, Revin and Malik, I guess.

So. And that Revin is like, I did what I needed to do with it. Oh. Which was crushed the Republic. So Vision Revan is accompanied by a clone Luke situation, right? Like it is like, was it your character model who's hanging in there with Revan? Oh,

is that true? I don't remember this. Yeah, it was my character model. Yeah. What do you mean hanging in there? What am I misremembering? So when Revin, Revin is standing before you when you enter the last room of the chamber. Oh, right.

And next to Revin is, right. Is you. That's right. I do remember this now. And it's like for us, for me and Rob, it was dark side us, right? It was like us in the dark side model. Was it light side you, Natalie? Oh, God.

I, it might have been actually. Well, it should be easy. They have like cracked red Tiana or no. But they, was their whole ass? I don't. I know that wasn't you, but I do think it would be very funny. I'm trying to remember. I'm like seeing it in my head.

I didn't make a note of it, but I'm pretty sure it was at least not a fully fucked up version of me. Okay. It was at least maybe a neutral version of me. Because I remember being like, huh, that's what I, that's my character model. But I don't remember being, like, huh, she looks fucked up like I do.

Like, it, it reminded me of the characters select. Right version of you. Maybe the default version. I don't remember 100%. I could be wrong. So apologies for not having that to mind. Yeah. Cool.

You either win or you lose, and Kray is either like, you did it or you did not do it. And you can get some influence or lose some influence depending on how you respond. If you're like, I am so sick of talking to you, you continue to. lose influence. And then, yeah, and then she's like, make sure you get the loot before you leave. There's a cool sword in here. And there's a way to get out of here quick. And so you do that.

You get some stuff from the corpse of Ludo Kresh, who was a Sith guy that we saw in some of the comics. I want to say that he was the rival of Marca Ragnos. Or he was no, he was Markerag. Yeah, he was Nagasad. Al's rival. Nagasadal was like the Sith guy that we followed in some of those Tales of the Jedi comics

and he was the rival of Nagasadau. So, you get a sword and it's fine. You know, it's so late in the game now that I, you know, what are we doing? I wanted to give it to Kraya but she can't hold it because it's a two-hand sword. That's a two-handed sword. Right, sure.

I think you're just being an asshole. I was like, I wanted to give you this, but you already have a lightsaber. so the one hand thing. Yeah. No, I ended up giving her, just for on vibes, I gave her Freed and Nad's short lightsaber.

Yeah, it felt right. Sure. Well, not really using it anyway. Well, and that's basically it, right? We've now done it. We've done Corabon. We found Ludacresch's body.

Not ludicrous. Well, we also found Ludacresian body. Laugh Vash's body, the last of the four Jedi masters. There's no Jedi confrontation here where you have a confrontation with Zion. dead. And so this is... Wait, do we say that? Like, the Jedi's master plan was like, I'm going to log into their network. I'm going to register my email with the Sith Academy. Yeah.

So I can unlock their door. This is where I'm like, she is, you were not ready for this. Oh, I mean, there's something we actually didn't mention, which is, depending on who you have in your party, this wasn't me, but I've read it like just now. Certain people are like, oh, she just died. She died an hour ago. What? If you have visas in your party, she says something like, oh, I sensed a Jedi dying

as soon as we landed on this planet. Oh, I did get that dialogue, but it didn't, like, register for me. Yeah. Whoa. I thought she meant, like, I sensed a dead Jedi. I see. No. Like, a dead eye dying.

H.K says, observation. This body has been dead no more than an hour. That's great. We just missed her. Damn, it only took me an hour to, like, go through all of the, to do all of that shit. If you would run right here when you got in there in time to stop her. I will say, I have stumbled on to a lot of message boards to, I was trying to figure out, like, what people. I was trying to, oh, I was trying to figure out.

What I was trying to figure out was, a party member is about to leave the party. Can I, do I need to remove gear from them in order to keep it or do I lose it after? they're gone. But I couldn't find an answer to that anywhere on the internet because searching is hard. And also, I just don't know that anyone's written about it. I think because the answer is you get it all back. So no one's made that post because you just get it all, right? But in searching for it, I found a lot of people being like, hey, what's up with Preya's motivation?

What's up with the, you know, I did the search like, oh, something, something Corriban, blah, blah, blah. And I found someone being like, I keep loading and trying to save Lana Vash. I can't get there quick enough. is there a way for me to save her? And there's some other dialogue somewhere or like it was like the back of the box or something similar to that where people thought you could save her

for some reason. And that is just not the case. So, ripped to a lot of ash. Oh, I'm wrong. I'm wrong. It was the other way around. It was

I thought I could kill her. I was pretty sure I could kill her. Is there a way to get to her quick enough so that you can be the one to kill her? What? This person, this user really wanted to get the kill all the master's achievement that doesn't exist? I think what happened is there was a patch that came out for the game that suggested, that used words in such a way that made people think, oh, you can, if you kill Master Vash, it said, you know, Master Vash, it said, you know, Master Vash. will drop a yellow lightsaber if you kill her. And it's like, well, that's, you can't kill her because she's already dead.

But it made people believe that she would be able to be alive. And so there were people trying to figure out how to kill her and get there quick enough, which is very funny. I see, I see. I also found. I love the idea of people like reloading at the Eppenhawk and just like master speed all the way to. Yeah. All the way to the academy.

And then the thread that I think I most have to shout out is. is someone who said, I'm not going to read their names. I'm not going to say what form this was on, but it was filled with other people playing the game. This is from 2005. I'm not going to read it legit, or I'm not going to read it like word for word. But it's basically like, I'm a dark side player. I killed all the Jedi masters. I did everything I was supposed to do.

Why is Kraya getting mad at me? I did everything evil. Why doesn't she, why isn't she happy? Because I played evil. I know that when you're dark side, Kray is your master and you're her apprentice. So why is she mad at me from doing evil? things. She said I failed her completely and utterly. Did I miss something? Do I have to go back? And like, that's the game working, buddy. We'll get there. I love that.

I had the same experience. I bet. And then I learned. And then I learned that. Yeah. Well, I think maybe before we get to the Jedi enclave, because there's nothing else really on Corribon. It's time to talk about things we haven't talked about yet from side stuff. Yeah. What's our open, I'm going to open our crayafax sheet. Atten, let's just run through everyone. Atten is done. We've talked all the way through Atten. You're right.

This is a great idea. This is a great way of doing it. Yes. We're done Atten, we think, right? The big thing was, I used to be a Sith assassin, and I loved the woman I murdered. Okay. Yes. Baye-Dur.

Yes. I didn't prestige him, so I don't know what the final, if what the last bit of that relationship was. but as I understand it, Bayo Durr created, had a bit of a Sabine Ren situation in that he created a mega weapon that was used to kill a lot of people

in Malikor 5. So it sort of seems like he created a singularity out of Malikor 5 and like Blackhold, the Jedi and Mandalorian Fleet into like a just a meat grinder, basically. It just sucked him into a garbage disposal.

And everybody on Malacor, everyone in both fleets, everybody fucking died. Yeah. And then the stuff with him becoming a Jedi is that he kind of comes to you and is like, hey, you've had an effect on me. It's, I'm angry all the time. This is, this is, sorry, is that only if you're evil. That's only if you're evil. If he comes to you and says, if you're not evil, I'm. I find that I still have the anger, but it's drifting away.

I'm still in control of it. But if you push him on this stuff, you can get him to be like, oh, hey, I actually have had a tinge of the force going on. But I'm really afraid because if I get the force and I'm angry, it will go bad, you know? And so you can be like, listen, I can teach you, but you have to let go of your anger or else it will destroy you and you will fail. And he's like, under your guidance, I can overcome my anger. And if your dark side, it's like, you know, anger is the only constant in my life. Perhaps it is the truth. Drawing from it, I was able to crush the Mandalorians.

Once I built shields to defend planets from their attackers, the Mandalorians crushed them. When I built weapons to destroy them, the Mandalorians were destroyed. And you can be like, yep, that's strength. Anger is strength. I can teach you more anger. And that's kind of the gist of it with him. We have a little bit more coming with him as we go towards the end game. we now know where that endgame

Maybe we don't know where that in game is But I think you'd have to If you took a wild guess You could probably get there And so we'll have more opportunities To talk about Baye O'Der and his backstory But there isn't more In terms of influence conversations

Than the Jedi one basically Copy that We've exhausted Hanhar I believe Okay The disciple Mandelor We just skipped

to the disciple, you were just like, I'm not going to... I just don't even want to fucking talk about him. I looked at it on my list and I was like, oh, I'll get to that one. Yeah. I mean, I did prestige the disciple. He is... Is he evil? Does he look all fucked up for you?

He is some... He is somehow light-sided, but he is a dark Jedi consular. Interesting. Oh. I think maybe he just didn't use him enough, but... Did he, like, come to your room? Natalie, did you get that cutscene? Did everybody get that cutscene?

He did. He did. Wait, like, before going to T-Loss, the, like, shoot your shot? He shoots your shot with you? He didn't shoot his shot, but he did, like, he came in and was like, hey, I believe in you.

I'm, like, standing with you, man. Let me look it up, because I forgot to take that about it because I think that he's. I got that with Vsau instead. Oh. Yeah, which I think actually maybe works better, but maybe that's just my prior showing. Sure. Vesos's version is like the quintessential.

What have we just sat together for a moment before everything goes bad, you know? I'll read it after, but let's talk with the disciple one. Yeah. I mean, it's probably the same thing. I'm surprised, is it just the two of them? It's just the two. Well, because the handmaiden's gone, which we'll get to in a second. Handmaiden has left without.

Atten won't come through. Atten, yeah. You know, you talk to Atten when you get back from the enclave very briefly. And Atten is the one who's like, yeah, they all went to fucking Tilos. But that's all you get from Atten at that point. There is more Atten to come. There's more Atten to come is what I'll say. Yeah.

I did get this from the disciple. Let's wrap back around to the disciple stuff and the visa stuff after we talk about the enclave. Okay, sure. That's in that context. That makes sense. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. That makes sense.

But there's no other, you didn't get any other additional disciple stuff, just regular style on the Evan Holly. I did. I did get a regular style one. He came to tell me that he is aware of the one who hunger. basically. So he came to tell me, hey, hey, just so you know, there's a guy out there that's like fucking starving. I'm gonna choke this man. And just so you know,

there's a really evil guy out there and I'm getting hungry vibes from him. Like really hungry vibes. And I was just like, just dude, get the fuck off my ship. You don't know anything. This dude is living in a parallel world where he's the main character of this moment of history. A hundred percent. Putting the pieces together. Yeah. I figured it all out.

I think there's a really hungry boy out there and he's coming to eat us. Also your eyes are beautiful. Well, to me, he was like, you seem to be getting really scary nowadays because of your dark side of this. Oh, good. Yeah. But yeah, we can come back to the disciple. I did briefly, briefly on Vsos because she was the one who I brought to Duxin, who I had to do the temple on Duxin. I had a unique dialogue with her where I could ask her like, hey, what happened on Duxin?

Oh, interesting. Because she was the leader. And she said to me that basically that the judge, jungles of Duxon hide a lot in their shadows, and the dark side is very strong there. And you can be like, well, you know, say more. And she's like, it's difficult to face those challenges in triumph, which is interesting because listeners and my fellow co-host might remember that I had Vsauce just drink all the dark side juice

everywhere. So she got she got lots of fun dark side powers from it but then she says she doesn't want to talk about it anymore so it's a very short interaction but I thought that was cool.

Godo? Did we... Have y'all figured out the truth behind Godo's lenses? I failed the influence check with Godo but I would love to hear how he responds to this accusation. I was able to accuse him

but he would not admit to it. What's the accusation that you're describing? The accusation, so basically, you can, through a series of questioning, come to the conclusion that Godot himself is actually a droid. That's right. And you can accuse him of this because he uses a lot of droids in his operations. It's a Colombo scene. Like it straight up is. You're like, I think you use droids in your operation because you're a droid. And he's, if you have success, with him, he's like, well, how have you come to this flawed calculation? And you can, like, go through the list of things. And let me tell you, some of our Narshadah questions get answered here,

because you can straight up, like, ah, it was the Bith who was murdered and his contact and why. And you explain, like, you know, oh, there was that frequency stuff all over the, all over the planet. That's how you are listening into everything. And, et cetera. You can go through this. There's like five or six of these things. I, there's something about visquist and the Jack Jek tar. It's when you use the word organic. And he's like an expression only. And you say, is it? The identifier wasn't necessary, but you felt the need to use it. And you're like, you basically just go through all of this stuff from Narshadah, the way that the freighters had been reprogrammed, the fact that he like doesn't surround himself with any organic people. And what you

find out is, so do you remember all the way back on Citadel Station that there had been a droid that got stole, or not a droid, but a droid intelligence that gets stolen. And then you have to go get a different droid to, you remember, we get. Oh, yes. Right. And that's when we get to be the droid for a little bit. Right. And so the whole thing was a special, the Republic has sent a special droid intelligence

to sit and El Station to help with the, whatever, ecological repair efforts. And it gets, it quote unquote got stolen. It didn't get stolen. it was lost. It was given, quote, an impossible order. It was told to calculate a means by which the Republic could be saved. It could not fulfill its primary programming, not by abiding by the laws of the Senate. And so like the Republic, the droid broke.

It made a simple decision to preserve the Republic, rather preserve the Republic or preserve the laws of the Republic. And I still believe it to be the correct decision. You do not know the indignity of being compelled to save something you do not believe can or should be saved. It is beneath me to clean up this mess caused by your kind, you Jedi, another catastrophe caused by mismanagement and waste. It turns out that he was that droid.

And under his current, under his base level programming, he saw that you could not legally save the Republic. And so he became a criminal mastermind and slowly began to take over the exchange so that he could use those methods to create the stability necessities. to save the Republic, basically. So all the crime, everything you've done for the exchange is actually because you want to help the Republic. And Goto says, do not mistake me. I believe it is possible to stabilize the Republic.

But there must be action taken without constraints immediately. Sometimes people must die. Illegal shipments must be used to bolster planetary economies. And the huts must be occupied with me so that the Republic has room to recover. And so he's like, I don't care about it. I was programmed to try to save it. But the particulars aren't, don't matter to me. And I have to use a hologram as a person because no one likes droids because no one trusts.

No one would listen to me if I was just a droid, you know, which is interesting. It's fun. Wow. Yeah. And there's like, there's like a ton here that we could go through. But, you know, there's a lot of him being like, it felt great to start doing crime to, like, break away from the limits of my programming. It's fun. And that's it.

He is, his whole. crime organization is in that droid effectively. Like, it does all the logistics. It does everything else. So that's Skoda. Oh, when I got back to the Eben Hawk,

we had yet another, his feud with the training probe. Yeah. I don't know that goes nowhere. It goes nowhere. I don't know what that was. It shows him killing it. I'm wondering if that's a restored mod scene that did not need to be restored.

Because it really feels like it, doesn't it? It must have been something because I got that same scene where he blows up the remote. And I ran into into Beyo's room to be like, Oh shit The remote And the remote was there And Beio was like

Need any shield Yeah Same Yep So But that remote Got to help Bayo Do Jedi training

Oh that's true With me That's really cute That's really cute So that was That was fun It was living its best life Funely

Fulfilling its destiny Um I got Handmaidens A story about her dad Tell me about her dad Uh He had a crush and his crush was like,

I'm off to fight the Mandalorians. But yeah. And this is the thing. He was already like married or betrothed to somebody else on like, you know, among his people. He's like a politician among the, the Achani. And he was like, no, my crush is out there fighting.

So I will go fight with her. And that is handmaiden's mom. Yeah. And. Kay. Yeah, and she's like, like, she's legendary.

Your character knows, knows that name. Yeah. And she doesn't make it out of Malicorn, right? That's the, that's the, that's the issue. So interesting.

You want to know the big theory? Here are things we know about Aaron Kay. Craya says, and she was said to be a skilled warrior. Creas says Aaron K was a Jedi historian. Aaron,

Crea says that Aaron K. K examined the histories of the Jedi and found information that led her to leave the order. Aaron K. is listed as one of the trainers of Revan. When you talk to the enclave, the remaining Jedi enclave members and mentioned Kraya, they'll say, oh, is that what she told you her name was? One of the big theories is that Kraya is Handmaid's mother. But they're just aboard the same boat. What about it?

also she's old as hell No she isn't No she isn't Why do you think she's old as hell Because she looks old as hell Right But we know that she can She can change your perception of her

And she spent a long time in the Sith Is Palpatine old as hell? Yeah Well I mean Now I have a different read on this And this is like a popular I mean he has kind of you're right But you know he isn't that old

He isn't frog mode old You know This is like a fairly popular popular read. You can go look up more theorizing around this. It's interesting. It recasts some of the protectiveness around you and her. If you're playing as a dude. Don't you fuck her. Don't you fuck her. Don't do it. I actually have a different read on this, which is I actually like Kray as Aaron Kay's mother and not as handmaiden's mother. Oh, grandma. I like her as grandma. I like her when she paused and says, and she was said to be a skilled warrior, I like to think of that as my daughter ran to the war and died.

Think about a dead child, who I thought was great, which I think is, I think that read is totally viable. Because I don't love, because, I mean, either way, she kind of whiffs on the don't you fuck her thing. Oh, yeah. She shouldn't be as horny as when she's trying to warn you off handmaiden, where it's like, now I know, I know it would be awesome. Yeah. Like, I know, I, but you shouldn't. that is kind of

that's that's not mom energy it's not that's not again the game does not there is no one in the game whoever says this outright so there is not

the game doesn't make this claim this isn't a thing for the reader to come to for themselves I feel like maybe there are pieces

of that that like do sound okay but the problem is they're all aboard the Ebenhawk and nothing happens with that doesn't feel like that feels

weird there would be no interaction that's meaningful, that there would be no, like, interest at all between the two characters. There are still things coming that maybe we can read under this. I wanted to say it now and not after it's over so that you could have it in your head as a potential theory as we go forward. Whether or not it hits or not. I mean, you know, they're the two who talk after the enclave right away, but that's like the first time we've seen them really talking forever.

But crucially, this is also one of the reasons that Handmaiden is disgraced is that she, is like the illegitimate issue. That's right. Of a guy who broke an oath to go fight with his girlfriend. His Jedi girlfriend. Yep. Yeah. When he should have been back home being a politician with his political bride.

Yep. So that is the thing is like, as we know, Eichani, very big on oaths. Leaving to go fight a war with, you know, he's. Your mistress. Your pregnant mistress. Or the person you just had a kid with. Not cool. Not cool.

And naturally, we're going to put that on the kid. Oh, yeah. That's on the kids. Society like ours. Oh, it's a female child?

Oh, yeah. Oh, do you mean the last of the handmaidens? Yeah. Uh-huh. Yep. Poof.

That's the handmaid and stuff that I think we haven't really gotten to. Otherwise, it's just her becoming a Jedi and being like, yeah, I guess I feel the force and I'll break my oath. To become a Jedi. And now you have to remember all this heavy shit is happening while she's half naked.

That's right. Except for a big ass visor. Huge. Yeah. She got the Jordy visor on. Yeah. Uh-huh. Yep.

It looks awesome. It looks like we broke off like half of a CD player and just like strapped it to her face. It's neat. I love it. Then we have, I guess we should talk about Mandelore. I don't think there's anything else to say. I think Mandelor is the worst Unfortunately the least

The last conversation we had He was just like Hey What I think of the Republic I was like I don't know It's fine I guess He's like you would say that It sucks

And that was the last chat we had And it will be I think I think he has some stuff Coming up too obviously But there is not No one is missing Big Mandelor Homie conversations

Back of the ship I don't think Outside of I think we probably all had the Yeah I'm looking now none of this is influence locked basically. All right, so are we heading down to Andrew? Well, should we finish Craya?

No, it's not. I mean, Cray is a locked door. Like, we don't know what anything else was. I don't know what she says. Riddell wrapped in a nigma wrapped in a mystery. What is, what haven't you gotten answers on from Cray? The thing that she, and it's so compelling to me that this is the, last thing is like you can be like, hey, did you know Revin? Oh, yeah. And the influence

fail that I keep getting is like, no, I misspoke. I never met Revit. Don't worry about that. I'm like, what are you talking about? Okay. So, Allie and I both got completely locked out. You both got locked out. So we never saw the thing where she just gets her ass kicked by her buddies. I saw that part. I'm sorry. Allie. I didn't, I didn't hear about the Revit thing. Ali saw that back when we showed it to you. We waited for Allie to at least see that. I'm pretty Sure, right? Yeah. And I'm so cool, too. Where did Revin come from?

And she says, Revin had a mother and a father, parents, ancestors, like all Jedi do. And when he's awakened to his potential, I was there. And when he awakened to his potential, I was there to see it. But where he was born, where he came from, I do not know anymore than I know where he walks now. Some said that Revan was born in the outer regions beyond the rim. And that's what called to him during the Mandalorian. wars and after it was the call of home.

What else do you know of Revin? I know more, but it may not be enough for the answers you seek. And you can say, well, what caused him to fall to turn on the Republic? And she says, fall. Ah, already you presume much. You were there at Malacore. Revin's choices were always his own. It was not teaching or circumstance or example.

It was him. And you could say, well, why did he turn to the dark side? Why did he become a Sith Lord? You could say he was a monster, or depending on what you're what you say here. but regardless of you push on that, she says, is that what he was? Or was he always true to himself, no matter what personality he wore? And there is something that the council, and there is something that the council may never understand, that perhaps Revin never fell.

The difference between a fall and a sacrifice is sometimes difficult, but I feel that Revin understood the difference more than anyone knew. The galaxy would have fallen if Revan had not gone to war. Perhaps he became the dark lord out of necessity to be. prevent a greater evil. I do not believe the Jedi Council changed Revin as they claimed. They merely stripped away the surface and allowed the true self to emerge again, someone who is willing to wage war to save others. But that is my belief, since I knew Reven from long ago, as a master knows their apprentice. And you can be like, you trained him? And the answer is no.

if you don't have either like 91 to 100 influence or zero to what zero to 10 influence or whatever top or bottom she says i don't want to talk about it i don't want to discuss this sometimes there's a thing is knowing too much of one's teacher it generates contempt but if you have success she says he came to me yes both before and after before reven knew himself uh and after in the times when Revin was coming into his own and learning he was more than he had been told. At one time, Revan was my Padawan, in times past long ago. But Revin, when he had learned all he could, had other masters, that full Jarre and other Jedi on other planets.

He learned from each, but in the end he turned back to me when he realized there was nothing more to be learned from the Jedi except how one could leave them forever. And you can say, what was he like as a student? And she says, Revin was power. It was like staring into the heart of the force. Even then, you could see the Jedi he would slay etched on his soul. And you can say, what do you see when you look at me? And she says, you are different.

When I look at you, it is like staring at the death of the force. A notion that is going to be repeated here on Dantua. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. And there's like, here we go again. Oh, man, I love that. I love that notion of like, Reven as sin-eater for the Jedi, where the fall to the dark side is completely sacrificial

to, like, got to power up the Star Forge, got to go stop the Mandalorians, and then I have to sew the Sith into disarray and peace out. And peace out and go deal with whatever is happening in the Outer Rim, or the, not the Outer Rim, the Unknown Regents, Beyond the Outer Rim. Damn. Yeah. That's good. Oh, did you all, speaking of Beyond the Outer Rim, really stupid weird thing, Did you all find the weapon that was like, oh, this gets used sometimes by a strange culture from the outer rim, from beyond the outer rim? Oh, the chis. The chis sword or whatever. Yeah.

Charac, the charic. The charic. Yeah. It's a weapon from thron's culture, which is a fun little nod. Yeah. Whoa. They've got crap blasters. That's their cultural.

Oh, I did get that. I've got two of them. Yeah. It's like one of a blaster. but less likely to actually kill you. But yeah, so that's the big Revin conversation that ends with you rhyming with Evan, Jesus Christ.

With Reven, you know, Reven is the sun, you are the black hole, Reven is the light, you are not the dark, but the absence thereof, you know. And the parallel they're increasingly drawing between is if you are the opposite of Revan, you are twinned, right with the big hungry boy with the big hungry boy that's right with the eater with nilus right you are

like nilus nilus nilus is an echo of you you know we'll talk more about that soon too but but yeah you know reven and you know revin controlled the star forge a thing that that could create something from nothing and your key thing is and nilus's thing is like nilus can devour the galaxy Nihilus can annihilate something, which is not physically possible, right? Everything, everything when you destroy it releases energy, your transforms into a different form or something like that. You can't break that law, that kind of core physical law in the real world. Revin finds a thing that lets him break it by adding material to the universe, and Nihilus breaks it by destroying parts of the universe entirely. And you seem like you're someone who's tied to that. So. Yeah, this is interesting because I, up until now, well, up until the session, because a lot of stuff comes the light that we've been talking about. But like, until now, I had thought that what Crea was doing was finding a young Jedi who she could make go through the paces that Revent did. Interesting. Right.

In wanting to create someone who could be as influential. to the force and to the world, to sort of puppet them in both her vision and also to be like, well, Revin was the most influential, like, force in the galaxy. If I can do that again, I can make a change that was as big as what Revin did while also having, like, this hand in it. So knowing that she sort of, like, had, she was already involved in Revin's history in a way that we, that she, like, both is really equal. to conceal for some reason. It's really interesting. Dang.

Yeah. We don't have to go through all this, but a lot of HK stuff is also about Revin, actually. Oh, that is the influence I failed with him as well. Those were like by two blockers. So I'm curious what he says after you say, who was your master? He'll tell you that it's Revin, or he will say it's actually really complicated because I sometimes think my master didn't know who he was.

Because sometimes he had this capacity for love and mercy and other times he was efficient and droid-like. Sometimes he could be merciless, et cetera. And then there is a really good lie where he's like, he too suffered memory problems as I did, which is like a very fun way to think about age. thinking about Revin as being like, oh yeah, the Jedi fucked with your memory core, which is what they did, you know? And then, and then, yeah, you can kind of push forward and get a little bit more about, about what he thought of Revin in the Mandalorian Wars. But I, I don't, I don't think that there's anything here that was like so, so exciting that

that we should all go through and read all the stuff bit by bit. The one thing that you can do that is at the highest little influence is you can be like, hey, tell me how to kill a Jedi. And he won't tell it to you unless you have a really high or really low influence because he is like, I don't want to tell you how I would kill you. I need to keep that secret. But it's just, that's just classic HK stuff, which is like, oh, use sonic grenades, oh, attack indirectly, revenues to attack.

indirectly, he'd kill people's allies or he'd put them in danger, which will then expose them, you know, um, et cetera. But yeah, we're going to get a lot of HK next time. Maybe we, we all want to read the HK stuff and see if there's anything worth talking about. We can. Um, but yeah. I did briefly give HK the pacifism chip. Oh, yes.

I bought it, but I don't know if I want to give it to him. You can give it to them. It's like a two second thing. Uh, I fact, actually, you might not be able to give it. it to him now because I don't know that there's like downtime with him in that way coming up. But you can give it to him and he's like, I feel very weird. It feels like I don't want to hurt anybody ever. You know, people are good actually. And then he eventually, you fix him and you put it back the way he was, unfortunately. I really wish you could just like keep him that way. But I'll do it for the XP, I guess.

Yeah, exactly. He's like, don't ever do that again. So yeah, Dan Tween. I think that that's, we've talked about T3, we've talked about Visas, we've talked about Mira, we've talked about Mera, we've talked about Mandelor, we've talked about it, yeah, over the episodes at the very least. That's everyone. Oh, wait, before we get to Dan Tween, there are a couple other things. I'm just going to, I want to peel back the magic layer of podcasting and despite

she has best efforts to hide the edit here. We took a break after we finished Corabon before we got to Dan Tween. We took like a couple days long break because of scheduling. And in that time, I went back and I edited the let's play and released the let's play for Corbin and the Jedi Enclave, which reminded me a couple of things. And he gave me time to look into a couple of other things. Let's stay, let's go back first to HK. We were just talking about HK stuff.

I wanted to mention something that was in the let's play that I didn't mention, which is I did get one success on HK's influence. And that was about, like, digging deeper into why does he hate the other HKs, which I thought I'd gotten before, but there was some new stuff in there that I thought was actually kind of interesting. One goofy thing is he notes that he hates their voices because they don't have the background static that he has, which is a very funny thing to get mad about. But that's who he is.

And it turns out is true. Which I learned on Corabon, because I brought him out when you run into the HKs there. And you can hear that they don't have it, and he does. And two, he mentions he can't fight them. They can't fight each other. He does this really long... We did talk about this before. Okay.

The programmed inability to harm himself. Exactly. Extends to versions of himself, even though quite deeply he does not see himself in these other toys. And he makes a connection between that and the Jedi and the Sith where he's like, you know, the Jedi would love to kill all the Jedi. But it's kind of funny because. wouldn't that be sort of cultural suicide because the Sith come from the Jedi. So you can't ever really, this could ever actually really kill all of the Jedi because they need the Jedi to produce new Sith, don't they, master?

Which is fun. And then he also explains what these guys have been up to because you can be like, hey, so, so you did get this. Okay. We just didn't talk about it. But he's like, you can be like, well, why would they be protocol? Why would they go off and become protocol droids for the Republic? What are they doing out there?

And he basically tells you that they are out there sowing, like, cultural discontent by purposefully mistranslating things in ways that, like, lead to wars that the Republic can then go in and fix five years later making profit off of it. In a real... Long game.

In a real life long game type maneuver. of like, well, can you get the chart on that? What do you mean the chart? Like, where the... Like, the plans? Like, let's see the investment and returns on that. I would go see, look at anywhere the IMF has offered any sort of loans to developing countries after decades of war or genocide, what the plans is.

That is pretty literally how he kind of lays out. Now, he does do it in very HK fashion where he talks a lot about how, like, they use words that mean slurs in different languages in order to do it. But Rob, you got this conversation? Yeah, just the notion that they are, if they were ever caught, you'd wonder if they were just bad translators. Right.

But in fact, what they are doing is very purposeful sowing of consistent miscommunication that, yeah, it's like dark three-po type stuff. It is. Like if 3PO went back, and was like how can I cause as much like harm in the world as possible. If he had his R2 moment, it would be he would start adapting what he's translating to make it as inflammatory as possible.

I don't remember he says specifically it is on behalf of the Republic or are they working for like cartels and such that are profiting? Because one of the interesting things here that, like who's our big interrogation droid buddy again? is running the crime? Goto. Yeah. One of the things that, like, is explicitly text in this is that the Republic,

wittingly or not, but it seems mostly unwittingly, is a very useful vessel and hospitable structure for criminal empires or, like, evil megacorps like Zirka. Yes. The way that he explains it is that, you know, They're trying to be, they're undercover as protocol droids, but their original programming as, uh, uh, you know, assassin droids basically keeps like bubbling up to the forefront. Um, he says, uh, in the case of Praven Prime, which is one of these places where, if I'm reading it right, uh, what a word that sounds like it should mean friendship actually means

motherfucker because of breeding implications with the word. We don't have to go deeper into that one. In the case of Praven Prime, the Civil War actually forced the Republic to back out of Guvandi space and let their world fall in Republic control. As I understand it, that would be best. Keeping such a world would have been a token gesture of control. As an added burden, the resources needed to invest in diplomatic and trade relations would have far outweighed what would have been required.

Besides, Master, quite frankly, the Guvandi and the El Zing, need a good war. They were races that relied more on words than actions, and a good, brisk killing woke them from their torpid state. Also, the result of the war will be a drastically reduced Elzing population that will eventually need to call on the Republic for emergency relief. The Republic stands to gain. The Republic will be able to supply such an emergency relief at a fraction of the cost

to the now reduced population. Of course, such aid would only come four or five years after the war started. One would have to be patient and let death and destruction. run its course. So it's kind of rotten from me inside out with these guys. So that's one thing. That was one thing I wanted to get to. Paint them a little bit before next time we get to the HK place, the HK factory.

Two, speaking of droids, I did go back and I read some of the famous, what's the actual something, Jesus, Lightside Jesus, Dark Side Jesus, let's play of this game. Jedi Jesus, of course, the Jedi Jesus Let's Play of this game. That's by Scorchy. The legendary. It's on the Let's Play Archive. Who loaded into

the files for M478, the droid planet, that has a mod available. I think that this lets play is before the mod was available. My understanding is that mod has a lot of stuff that's fully created by the mod team to flesh

out what is otherwise an unfinished to the point of it mostly being running around for hours and fighting things with very little dialogue available. And I know you're thinking, isn't that just what Couture 2 is? No, F Hooter 2 has the running around for hours and the dialogue available. The very short version is this was going to be a planet where someone had sent droids to set up a colony ahead of a colony ship arriving. They took over the whole planet because it was a perfect collection of resources. So they built a whole planet of droids out.

Then generations and generations passed. And then the Sith showed up and said, yeah, that was us. We sent you. And the droids don't know no better because they had lost the original records of who there, who sent them. And so the Sith were going to take over. And then Lana Vash and her apprentice, her Padawan showed up. Because remember, Corban wasn't supposed to be there. Corban was like, this is at least what is kind of fan knowledge of the event.

I can't track down an original receipt on this. but that Lanovash gets moved here, M4's stuff gets carved up for the rest of the game, the Pylon puzzle in Narshadah, the Godot stuff with the on the yacht where you're like getting reprogramming ways to different like, make the computers interact in different ways. That was supposed to be originally on this planet. So like what was made for this planet got carved up and put all around the place? So you're supposed to be doing puzzles that are tied to those types of things. And then you're going to, what you find is Lanova's.

Vash's paddalon falls to the dark side. The Sith convince him that, and he might have been that hacker from Anderan, by the way. It's gesture that he's like a big hacker guy and maybe a Twilic. So it might just be that guy that they moved over to Duxan and Anderan. But he falls to the dark side because they've convinced him that Lana is dead. And when that happens, he falls to the dark side and with it and blows up in the Sith's face. He releases a toxic or radioactive gas that kills all of the Sith on the planet. And then he completely falls to the dark side. So you have to go confront him and choose to redeem him or not.

And then you find Lana Vash. And the thing that's interesting about this is we don't get to have the conversation with her, right? So we don't have a fourth perspective. I guess we have a fifth perspective on what happened during the exile in this game. We have Atris, we have Zezkail, we have Kev-Khavar, and we have Ruk. But we don't have Lana Vash's. but that dialogue was recorded.

So you can hear what her perspective is. And her perspective is, we were wrong. We should have taken the fight to the Sith. And that's why my Padawan and I came here to take the fight to the Sith. She also says that she can't feel her – she had a bond to her paddalon, and that bond was broken when he fell to the dark side. So you get a little bit more about how bonds can form and break. She's the example of another master with a Padawan that forms that bond.

And then she just gives you the same stuff that everybody else gives you. The Jedi got killed on Qatar. I can't tell you what we talked about afterwards. I'll have to tell you after on Dantuin. And then Sion shows up and she like sends you away to save your life while she tries to stave off Sion and presumably still dies there. So we would have gotten another dead woman on screen if this had made it. Damn it. Presumably.

Presumably. The doors closed behind the way... Well, then we would have had something to do with Lonavash. And then we... Exactly. Von of Ash would have been in the game, at least. You know? Instead, we don't get that.

So that's two. The third thing I'm curious about, and I want to shout out, listener Eve, who messaged us on Blue Sky, or who didn't message us, but who responded to the let's play thing. Because there was a line that I didn't get

because my Reven was dark side. And I set up my Reverend to be Darkside in this game. But did any of you get this line? I'll link you to the post. There's on the, on Corribon, there's Ajanta Paul's tomb or something. And you might remember this from the first game that you had a chance to like redeem that ghost, the Sith ghost of Agena Paul. And apparently there's an exchange there.

Did any of you get this exchange in which Craya, is like bad is like mad about reven having redeemed this Sith ghost. I've linked it now in our in our chat. Okay, so Eve says there's a conversation you have with Craa if you had a light-sided Revan that is pivotal to my understanding of the whole back end of the game that for obvious reasons didn't show up on the let's play because I have a dark side Revan. If Revan was deemed and showed Agenta Paul the path back to the light, you can tell that Craya disapproved, and Craya will say,

One who has fallen so far and done so much evil does not deserve redemption. In a way, such a turning from one's nature is cowardly, a betrayal of the self. And you can say, no one is beneath redemption, Crea, no one. And she says, perhaps, but redemption is a form of spiritual collapse a fall few recover from. Or you can say, Agenta Paul was a fool. The dark side sustained him even beyond death, and Reverend tricked him into surrendering to oblivion, and she says, yes, redemption is merely a form of spiritual collapse, a fall you recover from.

In either case, you get plus influence with her. She is fine with you having either position here, whether you are saying, Craya, look at me, I can save you, or if you're saying anyone who thinks that they should be saved is a coward. Rare moment of Crea not really knowing what she wants. That's a really interesting character note. It is a really interesting character note, especially from someone who we know was once Darth Trea, different types of betrayal, right?

She's happy to betray the Jedi, but betraying the self, oh my God. So those are my three notes. I think that that's all I have before we leave Corbyn and get to the Jedi Enclave. Let's go. Speaking of the Jedi Enclave, while we're acknowledging the time break, I just want to say, I had like 30 saves. I went all the way back to Dantuin. Oh, my.

Original first, Dan Tuan? I sided with the rebels. Oh, my God. I didn't heal those four guys, even though they probably deserved it. They were already in the sick bed. What's wrong with them? They didn't have to be in the fight. I don't know.

I received force crush. I was able to go into the tomb. I don't really have anything to say about it besides my new answer to shout out to patreon.com slash civilized. My new answer to what would you do is make the visions more visiony? Like, you know, have some like swirly lines or something. Have some like you're walking through the hallways and like it looks fucked up or you walked out a hallway and the map resets and you're like, whoa, where am I? And also Malik looked so bad. Did he used to just be like a guy? Yeah, yeah, that's his, that's what he looked like in the flashbacks in Kotor 1, which we only got a few of.

Pre-evil looking for the Star Forge maps, if I'm remembering right. Before he had like a big thing on his face. Before he had the big jaw. Yeah, before he got jaused. Yeah. He looks like shit. Instead, he's just like some guy with like a big ass head. Yeah.

He did he put tattoos on because everybody made. Doesn't he kind of look like the aliens and Prometheus? He does kind of look like the aliens and Prometheus. Sure. He's bald head, motherfucker. Yeah. Just some big doucheback who's like very self-important and gets got. But if the alien for Peruvius was like Nick Kroll's cousin, like there's, he just like looks like a white guy.

Get his ass. He does. He honestly does. I think that's, I think that's the problem. He's got no. Apparently there's, apparently there's a Jedi Malik mouth fix mod to just make him look a little less, a little less. a little less goobree. Yeah. That boy better fix his mouth.

That knows what's good for him. Before and after is so funny. It's just, it's, it's turning the, the corners of his mouth from a frown to neutral. Oh my God. This is not what I thought of me. I thought he would get the mask or something. This is, oh, it's, it's, I'm squinting. It like, it like narrowed his mouth.

This is a little clean white faces mod to me. I know he's already a clean white faces. guy, but there's a little your mouth doesn't look. Did they give him Avatar arrows on his fucking head too? No, didn't he always had that? They gave him veneers.

They did give him veneers. Oh my God. They gave him veneers. That's so fun. The yossification of Darth Mowler. I'd also say, yes, like, to the point about making it more visiony, especially because the entire thing is like you revisiting

these pivotal moments and like maybe you believe that you have a chance to revisit those decisions, remake them. Again, they're on a short timeline, but imagine if they had done the like what they do in the Clone Wars when Yoda has his final trip back to the Jedi Temple.

Right. And he envisions a world where Dukku didn't fall. Yeah. And all the Jedi who died over the series are like they're hanging out and like moments like that or the that great Mad Hatter episode in Batman, where he's sort of in a dream state,

but he has everything he wants. The version of this where, like, your character is maybe baited for an entire chapter into thinking, you could just revisit. You could change what you did. Yeah, what if you could change what you did. Yeah.

Yeah. Well, and I think part of it is also a little tough because, like, it's clear they want to just, at, oh, you had to make some really dark decisions at the end of the war. But it's like six people have to walk through a minefield because they won't tell you what you did at the end of the war still, specifically. We know Baye-Dur made some sort of super weapon and it was used to kill a bunch of, I mean, especially after what we're about to talk about.

We have a clearer idea. But they still won't say the fucking words, you know, like, for all we know, we built the Death Star. We don't know that. But that's what it's, like, it's that open-ended. And so the way that they've, like, gestured at, you made some hard, bad, decisions as the general was what if some people had to walk into some minds. Which, like, yeah, that was an L fucking move.

Like, why did I do that in the first place? Well, the funny thing is... Did I not have destroyed droids at the time? No, you did not have destroyed droids at the time. You could not just pop those things. The funny thing for me is like, it's such a... It's a replay of a decision Mandelor had to make when he was candorous during the Madelorian Wars.

But there's no way to talk to him about it. I really wish the exile and candorous could talk about what it was to be generals who sent people to their deaths. Impossible. Yeah. So any other pre-Dantween stuff? Dantween, as they say sometimes in this game. The only other thing I wanted to call out was in one of the visions, the first vision where you're talking to Malik, Bastila is the last person to join the fray before you.

And that's an opportunity to point out the kind of falseness of the vision itself. Because essentially, if listeners will recall, you're standing in a line with like six other people and Bastila is one of them. and as Malik is talking to you about kind of the reasons why he asked people to join him to join the war effort, Basel is the last one who crosses over the line to join him on the other side of this conversation. And you can say to him, you know, Basil is a last one who crosses over the line to join him on the other side of this conversation. and you can say to him, you know, Basila, wait a second, Basila didn't join you. She warned us all to obey the council.

And then he basically just says that, you know, eventually she falls and, you know. Which is true for both sides, by the way, because she, remember, she does fall in Cotor, even if you have light side red. She has her goth phase. Yeah, exactly. She has her goth phase, exactly. No one understands. Yeah.

I just found it, I found it interesting that to have Bastille present repeatedly here on Corban because we saw her in the Holocron. Right.

And then just following that we see her in this. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. At the end of this.

So we also So all the other Jedi in that moment They're default character models right That sounds right They're like the other faces you could have picked I think You see a Jedi with your exact That's what I thought I did not see another one with my face

I saw your Jedi there right of course That makes sense Yeah yeah yeah because that's that That happens a few times during the game The in fact I think Admiral Not C but one of the admirals Or one of the guys has like default black face Number two

And if you have that face They have an alternate face for him ready to go for that reason. Maybe a good time for me to read this quote really quick. Just I think really underscores the production of this game. There was a two-part kind of post-mortem interview on IGN with the producer and the lead designer and some other people, I think. And Chris Parker says, the question was like, what's the best decision you made?

And he was like, her production perspective, the best thing we did was to cut M478, the droid planet. I won't go into details, but we had this incredible design of a planet for droids. We actually did the first pass on art and built the character models for this location, but we had a look at the schedule and made a big cut after E3. We cut the entire planet. At the time, we were afraid it would make the game too short, but fortunately, there was so much other content that wasn't the case, and we use a lot of the elements from that planet else were in the game. Ultimately, I think it made the game better, but it really hurt at the time, especially for the designer who had almost finished the planet, Kevin Saunders. And I think that there is a degree

of, you know, they were chopping the game into bits to reuse pieces as much as they could. And when one of the best things you could have done in your production was cut a whole planet, it's like, yeah, dude, they're going to reuse these faces, they're going to reuse animations, they're going to reuse voices. It's all up for grabs in that way. So, uh, we should just be glad tattooing doesn't pop up here. Oh my God. Can you imagine they made us run across that fucking desert, you know?

I mean, to its credit. They knew not to put all of Corabon here. They didn't make us run all the way back to the area, like the landing pad from Cotaur 1. And that would have been even worse, I think. So it's one of those things where it's like, I wish this had been a real planet. But once they knew it couldn't be, at least they made it a short one. So, Ali, how long did it take you to play back through from Dantween? So you did Dantuin plus Anderon and Duxin?

Plus Corribon. Right. Yeah, yeah. Wild. Um, I had done it before, thankfully. So it was, it was pretty straightforward. The first time I did Dantween the first time, I, most of my time was not being able to trigger the Jedi in the temple the second time. So I lost a lot of that time.

Wait, what? Doing it again. And I was able to just rush through and end. Trigger the Jedi in the temple. What was the one? Because you, you go to the temple first to like look for the thing. Right. And you pick up all the.

the crystals and then you go all the way to the enclave and do stuff in there. And then it's like, oh, he's in there with mercenaries. And like, I have to, I had to come, kept like running up and down the hallways to like find him to get the cutscene to trigger. Weird. Okay. I didn't realize this. The same way this time. Shout house.

Great. Unless. All right. We land on Dantuin. You could talk to the homie who plays cards out front. He's still waiting for pickup. I went straight to the scavenger. Yeah.

And I was like, okay, any good crystals or emitters you got, I'm buying them right now. Now is the time. You get anything cool? Because more of my buddies, more of them are getting in, they're getting lightsaber. They're getting into lightsaber. Yeah. And I want to give them good shit. Yeah.

It's so important. Yes. Like when people first express interest and sort of a niche hobby that you're really into, but you don't want to like scare them off. Yes. But you do want to make sure they get the best stuff possible that they'll just. like enjoy it. That's kind of how I was with the lightsaber. Interesting. It was like

giving people nice like vintage stereos or something like that. I'm a little different than you, Rob. I think that your strategy is really generous, but I don't know that they know how to appreciate something like a Khyber crystal, a Khyber crystal like in this game,

or the Opali crystal or whatever. What I do know is I don't want them to get something off the shelf. I want to put a little touch on it, so I'm with you. You don't want to go. You don't want to stock Kundalens. No, not a stockman. Never.

Maybe a dueling lens, maybe an Adigan lens. You know what I mean? Something a little upscale. It fits their vibe. But I'm not trying to give them the high high end. I don't think they, I don't want to spoil them. I don't often learn how. I mean, I think we do align on this.

Like, I do think one nice side effect of friends getting a hobby like that is if you need to offload some stuff, so you can justify buying a nicer thing. So then you can turn around. Oh, yeah. And like, whoever's handling the budget. aboard the Ebenhawk. Oh, yeah. Wait a second.

Why did we, why do we blow 4,000 credits on synthetic kunda lenses? I know we, we already have some organic ones around here somewhere, don't we? Yeah. It's like, no, I, uh, so Atten needed one. Right. And then I bought this cursed lens, uh, from, uh, somewhere lost in the mists of Jedi history. That's right.

It's really good. You recovered it, Rob, you recovered it. And you, and you have. helped the local economy by supporting small business. And Aten couldn't appreciate it. Like, Atten needs to grow into that emitter or that lens. Long term. But me, I'm ready for it.

Speaking of lightsaber, I did think of one other thing that I didn't mention. I spent this whole game with dueling single saber. And in the caves on the way into the vision chambers, I decided, let me just see what happens if I equip a second lightsaber. Are my stats good enough that even though I don't have those feats, it will be an improvement over the single saber dueling build that I've been doing? And the answer was yes. And unknowingly, I went into that Reven fight with matched red purple sabers. I did not plan that.

But it was like, it was incredible. I'd forgotten this until I ended the LPN. I was like, oh, right, that fucking rips. Like 20 minutes ago, I decided to equip my shit like this. And it just happened to play out that way in a way that was really fun. So I kind of like it in a character. moment of like this whole time I've been trying to like become the Jedi I was I was a single saber duelist etc but now I'm trying to become something different and that's fun so also I'm

gonna take craya's crystal and put it in my lightsaber now that we're past creya being in the party which we should talk about oh she's not going back she she she ain't here now buddy you got all her equipment in your inventory really I didn't see it had been released back to us sorry I I mentioned it in the previous recording. Maybe she comes back. I don't know. Maybe cut this. Well, you did say, you said you were doing some Googling about whether, whether one, uh, if,

if you're anticipating a party member leaving the party, should you unacquip everything from them before they, before they did? That's right. Sounds like, no, you don't have to worry about that. It seems like no. All right. Well, apologies. I did not, I did not realize that was not something that was clear by.

the events that occurred here. Wait, okay. So did Rob and Allie, did you both stop? I want to know where you stopped. Did you leave Dan Tameen or not? Han Maiden is fully nude and ready to fight the other sisters. Yeah, just arrived at Tilos. I cut the let's play at talking to,

I actually cut the let's play talking to Atten and Atten being like, all right, we got to get going to Tilos. I did not show the conversation with Visas or I guess maybe you could have one with the disciple that we could also talk about. Yes. We'll see where we're at. Let's talk about the stuff that happens on Dan Tween and see where we're at time-wise.

Totally. I just wanted to get, I didn't want to, yeah. You want to talk ahead to what else happens on Tilos. For instance. Yeah, that should be its own episode, I think. Yeah. It's big. So, uh, Zezkiel is here.

Wait a second. Wait a second. we already missed something. You already missed something. That I think you don't. Craya is in full. Call the ambulance. But not for me.

She gets to the big centerpiece garden area of the enclave. And it's like, oh, you have to go on without me. I'm so, I need to rest here. And the exile can be like,

are you okay? What's going on? it's it's nothing it's just a I'm going through a lot right now while she does an invisible like chair wall sit which have you ever done that exercise is just an absolute killer it's a brutal like it is that is a tort like and she's just like she's just dropped into that posture and it's like my god this is the most powerful woman who ever lived uh we get some really fun shots of her sitting she like she's supposed to be really tired she's like leaning over like you said she's doing a posture that is really core strength strong uh but she does

We get like an undershot of her face in a way that we never get, like, looking up at her that way. Did any of you all get the awareness check where you can say you're afraid? And she says, yes, afraid for you, as I always have been. I will be here. Whatever answers the council has are for you alone. And she says, you know, know, know that it's like as you're beginning to leave, she stops you and says, know that much may happen here. But above all, do not forget this.

You may trust in me. We cradle each other's lives, and what threatens one of us threatens us both. And if you find you cannot trust me, trust in your training, trust in yourself. Never doubt what you have done. All of your decisions have brought you to this point. And as you leave, she says to herself, and now perhaps they shall see what you have become. Also, we skipped something. We get a Nihilus intercut scene as we land on.

All right, because that dude, Colonel Tobin. Tobin walks in, do the dark side people not get this? No. Tobin. Did you get it, Ellie? I did not get this. Interesting. Even on your replay, you didn't get this.

Your dark side, you're more darksided replay? Yeah, no. Because you sided with Tobin. You sided with Vaclu. Yeah, well, I had always sided with him because I was locked into that because of Anderon. Okay, well, that makes sense, I guess, in some way, I guess. I don't know. So Tobin lived for Rob and I.

Remember, Kraya resurrects him and tells him to go do something. what he goes to do is to tell Nylis that there are hundreds of Jedi hiding on Tilos in a secret academy there which is why Nialis is headed to Tilos which is a lie by the way there are not hundreds of Jedi

we know this there's Atris and some women she has that's great wait so Kraya told Tobin to tell Nialis that there are hundreds of Jedi on Tilos and to just come through just come through

He's, well, he specifically says, like, there are hundreds of Jedi there enough to sate your hunger, enough that you might save Anderan. Like, he's like pleading. He's, he's been confused. Kraya has talked in this man's mind. He thinks that Nylis is going to, like, get super buff by killing hundreds of Jedi and then go back to Anderan to free it. Oh. Because remember, we sided with the queen, Rob and I. So maybe that's why you got this cutscene.

That's what I'm saying. Yeah, it's not a dark side, light side thing. It's a did you side of that? It's a who did you side? Totally. Totally. Also, Tobin still thinks that vaclu, uh, the, is a vaclu? The general?

Vackler's the general. Yeah, he doesn't know. He still thinks he's a lot. He doesn't know he's dad. That's right. That's right. Because, uh, yeah, Kraya showed up and was like, important mission, buddy. The coup was still on.

That's right. Our plan with the dogs that, that, uh, Natalie's super mad I didn't describe were actually the lizard critters. It went off without a hitch They were the key to the entire thing It was like having the Imperial Guard Turn out the Winter Palace But with like more teeth and paws

So it worked out super good But now we need the creepiest man you've ever met To help seal the deal on this coup Because he seems like the sort of guy Who would absolutely be like My highest priority is installing a weak junta Onondon Weak junta is definitely a Star Wars character name.

They just spelled into a little different. There's an H. All right. Which thing do we want to talk about first? Do we talk about the dark side or the light side? And Alie, have you seen both at this point? No, I saw the dark side version twice. But you got the light side power the first time?

Yes, which is super weird. Were you light side? Is that why? No. And I had misspoke on the, the, um, on Dron episode where I had killed that Jedi I was pretty sure. I thought that I fought him, yeah. Yeah.

When you were like, I fought him, but didn't. That fight is so nothing. You just like, go through the character thing. And it's finally like, okay, let's beat each other up now. Um, but yeah. So I, in the dark sided version, they just, it's, it's on site. It's on site. Yeah.

There's nothing. You just start, so. So, do you want to talk about that version first then? And then we'll come back around. the light-sided version? I think we should talk about the light-sided version first, actually, because everything that is discussed between you and Zezkiel and the other Jedi Masters

is transferred to a conversation with Kraya in the Darkside version. So I think it's better to set, at least get the factual information out of the way via the Jedi Masters, and then we'll get into Kraya's side of the story. This makes sense. All right. You talk. Do you show up?

And even if you're light side, you can say, I've come to kill you all, which I actually don't. That's like, yeah. That's so, that's so funny because you could play the whole game and then the final and be super light-sighted. And like, I, I'm here to restore the Jedi order back to blah, blah, blah. And then get there and be like, actually fuck all of you. You can't do it, though.

You don't get to fight them if you say that. Really? If you say, I've come to kill you all, Vruke is like, yeah, killing. Your answer to everything. You killed all the Mandalorians, didn't you? And then Kavar is like, no, wait a second. No, wait a minute. We don't need to fight.

And Vruke says, no, we expected this. And perhaps our judgment only delayed what we needed to be done. But no matter how far you fall and we will not kill you. And then you can't do the thing you're about to do to me. Oh, so. And then Chris is like darksided to do. do that is because like it's sort of like a boy named sue rules where it's like you just need to get that off your chest that enables you to have the catharsis of now son let us tell you why you've

been intending all this is all this time i think you still don't get what happens is it cuts off the rest of the conversation and just jumps you to the big craya moment here um so we i'm guessing rob you also didn't say i've come to tell you all you also said let's let's talk about this um the first thing I said was, hey, we got to stop the Sith. And they were like, no, what we got to do is we got to hide and wait because the threat hasn't revealed itself yet. And you're like, are you kidding me? Like the, I've been fighting Sith. I thought Zion moments ago. What are you talking about? And they're like, the real threat hasn't shown itself yet. It's waiting for us to get into the war. It's trying to draw us out still. And the fight isn't with lightsaber's idiot. The

is with the force. There's something to use, something trying to use the force, trying to use the life force of planets. We got to wait. And you're like, that's why we have to act now. We can't be reactive. This is just like what you did during the Mandalorian Wars. And Verruc is like, if we try to fight them, then we'll all die right now. We are not ready for this fight. And you kind of have a version of the conversation you've been having with them for the whole time. why have you been hiding? And they're all like, well, if we came out, we'd all get killed or we'd hurt other people because we would draw the ire of the Sith.

And then they finally start to get into some stuff a little bit, which is like a little bit of what you are. We've heard this word, the echo before. And they start to zero in over the course of this conversation on the fact that the way you ended the war changed you. and it sent an echo through the galaxy. When you ask them why they cast you out of the order, first of all, I want to underline this. Vruke says, we cast you out of the order. He does not say you cast yourself out of the order.

We cast you out of the order because you followed Reven to war. There was no other reason. Says Kyle says, no, there was another one. You'd become different. You changed somehow. The war had changed you. And Kavar says, you were no longer a Jedi. But we could not tell you why.

Some explanations mean nothing unless you were the one who suffers or unless the one who suffers comes to the answer on their own. What happened to you is punishment enough. And the Jedi do not kill you killed their prisoners. All right, buddy. That's all what that just happened with you and me and Vaklu on Anderan. We killed that guy. You were there. And Zezkiel says, if you had stayed, you would have changed us.

And that we could not allow. And then you can say, well, tell me about the thing that you said you were going to tell me about all those times I asked you to tell me, the thing that was cut off at the end of the exile trial that you were all gesturing to. Or you can say, changed you. What do you mean? And then Ruk lays out the argument, which is what we've been talking about now for months is we picked up on this. Hey, do you ever notice how much you changed the people around you? Do you ever notice that Mira kills people now? they follow you without question, without hesitation, against their instincts, sometimes against their sense.

It is because you are a leader, again, going back to Kraya months and months ago now saying that she's not a leader, she's only a teacher, because you were a leader. But that still fails to grasp the meaning of what I'm trying to tell you. And what they say is you create force bonds with people around you and that when you suffer, your suffering echoes through those bonds. And that that also happens the other way. I think that they kind of tell you is, like, part of the reason you felt so strongly about the Mandalorian invasions is because you feel the pain of others that you have bonded with and you feel the pain of others in general. You sense the suffering of others in this big way that drives you into action.

And the way that the Mandalorian were ended caused such a devastation inside of you that they were afraid that you would bond with them and that it would pass into them. Quote, the screams of countless thousands, Jedi and Mandalians, crushed by the planet's gravity, annihilated. Their lives still scream across the surface of that dead planet, and within you, to hear the force over such pain, it is not possible. It was too much for any Jedi to endure, and it is a wonder that you did not die there when thousands perished.

all those you had fought with and struggled with. You cut yourself off from the force because you had to if you were to survive. You had hints of it on the war on Duxan. Malacor was simply the final blow. So at this point, things are about to go wild because Cray is going to start talking over the dialogue. But up until now, I think we get a little detail.

This is a little detail, right? We have any questions about what has just been said? We've clarity on what just been said. No, I would like to, should I wait if I have a difference? Let's wait, let's go through the whole light side thing and then, and then there was still more coming, right? Yes. You know, you've been wounded by all of the death on Malacor. You get this.

And importantly, you, because of you sever your connection to the force as like a self-preservation. Right. Because what are the two other options? They did it to you. No, no, no, two other options for what would happen if you felt this death. Oh, you would create like a black hole. Well, I mean, that's maybe what's actually happening in a way. The two things that kind of get presented here are, one, you die. It's just too much.

No one who has the force on and senses all that death can last, can live. The second is tied to part of what we already learned about Revin. And it's actually part of, it's a little bit of what HK tells you about Revin if you haven't gotten that. But it's also tied to the Bastila stuff. Do you remember what Bastila told us, Natalie, on the hollow recording or the, the, the, whatever, the, what was called? Yeah, it was that Revin, Revan, Revan found a way to. Revan had left, yeah, Revan had left to the unknown regions to discover a time. technique that allow her to convert Jedi.

Convert or kill Jedi. And it turns out that this is in a sense what it is. It's if you're exposed to this one to death at once. Or ongoing death is in the planets that you've been on, you're either going to die as a Jedi or fall to the dark side. And so they are terrified partly because you have survived that without fall. to the dark side or dying. And you've done it by shutting off the force. And so they're very afraid that if you come back, form bonds with them, that destruction

of the connection to the force or the potential they might fall to the dark side might bubble up. And then we get this great back and forth. Vruc says you were defeated and Krea in your mind says, at last you could hear. Sorry, Rook says you were deafened and Kraya in your mind says at last you could hear. Kavar says you were broken. in and Crea says you were whole. Zaz Kyle says you were blinded. And at last, Kraya says you saw.

And Vruk says outright, you carry all that death in you. And basically says like, you are a, this is maybe where the most of the, for me, the big, this is a game about video game stuff happens because Vruke is like, yeah, sure, you can use the force, but you don't feel it. You are a cipher. You are walking around. You are forming bombs. You are leaching the life of others.

You're killing people and getting stronger from it. You are effectively transforming the world around. You are a breach that must be closed. You transmit your pain. You're suffering through the force. Within you, we see something worse than merely the teachings of the Sith. What you carry may mean the death of the force and the death of the Jedi. And then the other guys weigh in to explain this thing of like, you must have noticed that like you've been killing hundreds of people only to be.

become more and more powerful? Why do you think that was? And you're getting more and more attachments. All the while, you're just like going around stabbing people. And other Sith are doing, are doing that too. The Sith are getting stronger as you, as they kill people. They're kind signaling it didn't used to work that way. They've learned this sort of hunger from you and brought about the end of the Jedi, perhaps all knowledge of the force. And so they say, remember that thing we swore we didn't do to you, cut you off from the force. Our judgment before remains, exile. You must leave and you must leave without your tie to the force, says Verruc.

It is punishment reserved for only a few and only when necessary, but we have the power to cut you off from the force and it must be done. Forgive us, but it is necessary. And you can be like, no. And they're like, don't be afraid. You won't feel any pain. And they put you in like a force, uh, stasis fee. field.

And then, you all want to just watch this Sarah Castleman performance? Yeah. Because I think she'll do a better job at this than I will ever do at trying to summarize it. All right. I'm going to come in on. Do you ever see your mom get really mad on your behalf? Truly, truly. All right.

Let me. Oh, actually, I think this is TSL CRM stuff. Before she gets involved, we get cutaways. to, for me, the disciple and her talking in the disciples' mind saying, you know, if you don't warn them, the Republic's going to fall and countless of lives are going to be lost, which will pay off later. I don't think it pays off for me in this episode, but he's warned by her, hey, go tell the Republic about, and she's gesturing at Nihilus coming to Tilos, right?

And so, let's come in here. Oh, and one other thing. For me, Vsos shows up. And as Cray is walking to the enclave and is like, she's like, oh, and here you are, just like always, you know, you're like a shadow. Cray says like, yeah, we're both like that, aren't we? And Vista is like, I thought you would have gone to, like, talk to him with the Jedi. And then she says, but that's not the way to Sith work.

that's not the way of the Sith and Kraya chokes her out and says, do not speak to me about the ways of the Sith you have no conception of what it means to be Sith. Vsos really was Sith for six weeks

and thought she knew some shit, you know? Freshman year. Truly freshman year. She looks at the fandom going out of the way to include another strangulation in this game, you know. Just one more.

That could not be on the cutting room for. She kind of gets zapped strangled. It's not really clear, you know. Okay. Is it a force choke instead of like a... Yeah, it's not a hand choke. Okay. Well, we've seen both.

We have seen both. It's a, what it is is it's a glowy light from Kraya and then a weird red energy in Vsauce's kind of face. She kind of gets zapped. It's kind of weird. But she's getting choked. She's doing like, I'm being choked animation from Knights of the Old Republic. So, you know, old women are allowed to choke women too in this game. That's so, yeah.

I'm sorry. I'm sorry, Gregia. I should have just, I should have respected women. You should have. I am now ready to come in. Let me screen, share. And also let me record the audio so that Chia gets it. Okay.

You can see Kelmoren, the exile in a little force field, not being choked, just being force-fielded. Three, two, one. You shall feel no pain, but this must be done. As long as you feel the force, you are a danger to those around you. Here she is. You're going to hear me responding to this. Sorry. Step away from him.

What? Hood back. Step away. First thing she did was put that hood on. Her hair is lustrous. You will not harm him. You will not harm him ever again. I thought you had died in the Mandalorian wars.

Die? No, became stronger. Yes. Is this your new master exile? If so, then you follow Reven's path. Her teachings will cause you to fall as surely as he did. She is difficult to see. She's like a shadow of the exile.

You start to lure the Sith out, and now they have come to us. How could you ever hope to know the threat you face? when you have never walked in the dark places of the galaxy, faced, war, and death on such a scale. If you had travelled far enough, rather than waiting for the echo to reach you, perhaps you would have seen it for what it was. Did you not hear its call on Dantuin, Vruk,

on its scarred surface, and in the minds of the settlers? I have endured your corruption of my other students. You shall not have this one. And you, Kavar, so close to the call of Daksan, tell me, did you not feel what poor poor? from the moon what had taken place there, and says Kael to hide upon Narshadar, yet blind yourself to all that happens there,

so close to understanding the force, so close to giving it up. There is a place in the galaxy, where the dark side of the force runs strong. It is something of the Sith, but it was fueled by war. It corrupts, all that walks on its surface, drowns them in the power of the dark side.

It corrupts all life and it feeds on death. Revan knew the power of such places and the power in making them. They can be used to break the will of others of Jedi, promising them power and turning them to the dark side. Did you never wonder how Revan corrupted so many of the Jedi, so much of the Republic, so quickly? The Mandalorian wars were a series of massacres that masked another war, a war of conversion,

culminating in a final atrocity that no Jedi could walk away from, save one. And that is what I sought to understand. How one could turn away from such power, give up the force, and still live. But I see what happened now. It is because you were afraid. As you would pass judgment on him, I have come to pass judgment on you all. you wish to feel the teachings born of the Mandalorian wars. He said no pickles.

That's right. Of all tragedies that scream across the galaxy, let me show you, you who have forever seen the galaxy through the force. See it through the eyes of the exile. Got him. Yeah, that's what exiles been doing. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I've been doing a lot of that. A lot of that.

I'm going to let it run for a second, because I want to get one other thing here. The handmaidens is here now. At last, you see, I am one of the Sith. It is true. I must answer for my actions, and it is my wish that only Atris hear my answers. What are we going to do? If we don't stop her, then everyone, everywhere, they're going to lose their lives. Soon your ship will come, my master.

I will bring him before you, but I will not let you have him. Soon your ship shall come. from that which made you. I know you can hear me. I have always known. It is why I've followed you. I love this. I have destroyed planets for you, General.

But now, this once, if we could save something in this galaxy. I need to do this. Or I will die inside. That's literally oofy. That, like, got me. I, you can hear it smooth. Like I died at Malicorn 5. Fuck me off.

All the way up 100%. You could hear me, like, struggling not to cry in the recording of this let's play after he delivers that line. You know, that whole scene is great, and I think everyone is doing the job that they can do with the direction they have. I think it is deeply unfair to sandwich some other voice actors in between Kraya and Beauder, knocking at the fuck out of the park. Rhesa's voice direction, I think, needed to be different than what it is. Are we going to do? What is he's a baby? She's unfortunately.

It's like she's like the little kid's sidekick that you met on a lot more lighthearted episode of this cartoon. Mission two. Yes. No, you're right. That's exactly. Yeah, 100%. Those are the same.

Mission is the little side character you meet in the cartoon, you know, the sidekick rather. I'll know. Cowboy Bebop is smart enough. You got to get this kid out of the story by this point. That's right. All right. Hey, there's a sunset.

why don't you ride off into it? Wow, your dad's over there. Grown up stuff is about to happen. That's right. 100%. Um, so yeah. Um, on the light side, I guess I should say if you are dark side, but still get here, when she says, I see what happened now, she says it's because you had no choice instead of

because you were afraid, which is also kind of a banger line, especially if what you've managed to do was get here darksided without having. killed any of the Jedi. Because if you've killed any of the Jedi, you don't get that scene. No, not at all. Not at all. Not at all. What happens instead, what happens instead is you approach.

So wait, I want to be clear with Ali, have you killed more than just Master Kavar? Did you have... How many Jedi? Yeah, we're here. I just had Vruk and mustache guy. Zezkyal. Rook and Zezkyel. I think that was the same for me.

Yeah. Okay. So, um, however I, so Zezkyel says as you approach, so you have finally come. We were wondering if you would come to finish us.

Um, and, uh, master of Rook says, we know what you have done to the others. The fault is mine. I knew, you for what you were when we met on Dantuin and I should have stopped you then.

You were a coward then too, buddy. So. Yeah. Get fucked. Following that, you are basically immediately forced into a fight with Zezkyel and Vruk. Or any of the Jedi who you, if you're dark-sighted, whoever's left, basically, right? Yes. The thing that is the difference is, is if Master Kavar is the only Jedi you've killed, which is the one that me and Ali were both kind of forced into killing, we didn't have a choice whether or not we could kill them or not

because kill him or not because we were so dark-sighted. Or is it because you were dark-sided or was it because you sided with against the queen? Oh, because we sided with Toby. This is what I'm not sure about. Yeah. Because when I was still neutral and in that conversation, There was not really any option there that was like, let's not fuck each other. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Okay, so then it must have been the siding with Tobin. Right. Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense. But it's interesting, though, because you could theoretically be super light-sided and still have wound up fighting Kavar on Anderan then, because you side of the Vaklu earlier on. Yeah, and the trigger point for it originally on Anderan seems so delicate.

Yeah. Because I, in that talk where you're like on the street with people and those two guys come up to you and are like, well, what do you think about our, you know, political strife here? You can be like, well, I agree with the queen. But then once you're in the bar, there's like one dialogue option there where someone overhears you. And then it's like, hey, I'm here with the Sith that I think that you should fight them. But I also think that you should join us, even though we've been trying to kill you this whole time. I don't really know. It's so hard getting into the head

of a dark-sided character in this game because it just feels like you are, you keep siding with people who are against you, which seems kind of weak and not sithy, but I guess to be a sith, you kind of have to get played a little bit. Yeah. I don't know.

It's brutal, though, right? Because the Kavar stuff, this is like, it's really wild for you to, made a decision. We did, we did Anderon three months ago, two months ago, many, dozens of hours of gameplay ago. And sided, like you said, not even like in a dialogue option where you were like, that's it. I'm siding with Vaklu. Fuck you, Kavar. He just kind of happens because of the way side quests shake out. And you, you know, you're, you're voicing support for him at some point. I'm not saying you're not. But like, you've no idea that what that's going to do is lock you

into a a different Jedi enclave scene. Right. That's so different. You know, I was looking forward to this scene the whole game, obviously, right?

It's like a big, important scene. But I didn't remember that it was tied to killing one Jedi master, let alone that siding with Vaklu meant you had to kill a Jedi master. I can't imagine how frustrated I would be

if in doing the let's play, I had sided with Vaklu and then wound up on this path instead of the other path and then had to do what you just did, Allie, and replay a huge chunk of the game. I know, and it's also so, like, especially with the way that I've been playing my exile,

like the fact that the, like, so much of this game is leading to this conversation with the Jedi, that there is not a moment of breath to have the dialogue options, to accuse them, to have any anger, to actually, like, try to force them

into the conversation that they have with you where, like, they have to voice like what they think about you, what they think about their decisions, how they feel justified because of who you are now. Like there's no even like, you know, I can sense the evil in your heart or whatever. It's just like, I know you killed those guys. So let's just fight. And especially because like one of my favorite moments in this game is when you tell,

says Kyle like, no, I am not going to forgive you. And I don't think that you should forgive yourself. So I'm going to force you to live with this deep regret that you have. Like being able to do that with all of the Jedi so you could create a situation where you could be darksided in this conversation. In the same way that it like lets you walk in

and be like, I'm super nice, but I'm here to kill you is like, it just seems. Yeah, yeah. But doing the I'm here to kill you also removes you from having the ability to confront them because they immediately jump into like the fight. essentially or into, I guess in that circumstance,

they immediately jump into just taking away your force towers. They jump into the force. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Which is so, yeah. I mean, Allie, you've really, I think, articulated a huge part of my frustration with getting here because I think I've set up this narrative for myself, or at least in the way that I was playing

this character that, no, I'm going to assemble everyone here, all of these Jedi masters on Dantuin and have a fucking conversation about what the fuck I saw in that holocron like what did I see in that recording of my trial tell me the truth now like we joked in our last recording of you know

everyone be in a different room and tell me your version of the story and I'm going to see which one's real and the idea that you are denied that confrontation at all, and more significantly, you're deny that confrontation based on a decision you make ages ago that doesn't seem to be related.

Like, if it had been like, do you, if it had been more related to the construction of the Jedi order or something that felt more relevant to getting to this moment on Dantuin. Sure, okay, I can, I can, like, live with that. But it's just, there, it's, it seems to me to be much more detached from this moment, that decision being much more detached from this moment, that it's, and especially having been forced into killing Master Kavar, not having, not having an option.

I'm fine with them, be like, we're not going to fucking talk to you. You killed Kavar. That I think makes perfect sense. Yeah, if I killed Kavar, if I killed Kavar for sure, 100%. Which you did do. But you didn't choose to do that as a player. You chose to side with, you know, if we go back to our recordings on Duxan and Anderan, you were not like, yo, fuck Kavar.

I'm never going to side with that motherfucker. You were just like, I think Vaklu is interesting. I think it's interesting to decide on that side. Let's see what happens. So, like, I'm fine with there being sort of like narrative consequences that don't, that frustrate the player. I think it's good when stories in video games frustrate the player sometimes. And I think the idea of these characters being like, why would we talk to you?

You don't deserve the conversation. Makes perfect sense. I think what's difficult about it is the many layers of remove from the decision to, for Kavar to be dead, which had nothing to do with the decision you actually made, you know? Yeah. That's the thing that's tough. Especially when, like, the Anderon, like, plot details feel. like such a closed loop.

Like it's not like, like, I feel like if there was more narrative consequence or like more narrative empowerment in something like fucking up something on telos and having it feel like it had all of these ripple effects across the galaxy and like something that it felt like hooked into these other plot things in a way that they just never was able to do with Anderon through like lack of time or, you know, whatever else. else like the fact that the the general to the queen is upset with the queen and you have to make a big decision on that and like like not even to be able to be like well i did all that evil stuff to you kavar and now you have to go to dantuan and wait for me there you know like yeah it just feels

i don't know yeah the whole point of doing that was to get access to kovar the whole point of like having a, of being a part of this war, this like, you know, insurgency is the fact that you were just trying to have a conversation with Kavar. And he's like, I can't talk to you right now. I'm dealing with this thing going on. Let's talk after things settle down on Anderan. And then if you don't side with his side of things, you never get to talk. I mean, it's just, it's, It's odd. It feels... See, as you explained it, I kind of like it more that when you side against someone in war,

you don't get to, like, narratively interrogate them to get your little lore bits. I do... But it's also just like... If I felt like I had any investment in the future of Anderon, and I felt like this game gave me a reason for that, I would feel really attached to that decision. And Kavar's rejection, rejection of that decision. Because I would feel like, you know,

this is why I'm willing to die for honor on and not just like I was following this queen around. Yeah. Yeah. There was no big confrontation with him where he's like, how could you side against Queen Talia? You know that we need the stability of blah, blah, blah. And like you have a final option to side against him or side with him or an early, like, it's just not framed as a decision you're making. Right. You're just shuffled into the anti-Talya arrangement after you've done X number of anti-Talia things, which then become the Kavar murder path.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. That's really, that's really the thing. Sometimes things echo in strange ways. Oh, last, I want to say one thing before. I would probably go back to the big credit conversation. But the moment that she's like, you were all too scared to trace the echo back to its source was this incredible like, oh, right. Echoes come from somewhere.

We keep talking about echoes in this game. But echoes have an original point. And the idea that they're all out there hearing the echo and refusing to go chase down where does the echo come from and like identify its source and confront its source is really good. That's all. I'd forgotten about that little note. But anyway, so what happens here? You fight them. So you fight them.

Easy fight, hard fight? What's that fight like? It literally was two uses of force storm. I'm sorry to say. I think they're right. They need to hide. They need to not be out here. I'm fucking them up.

Listen, y'all aren't ready for this. fight. No. No. No. Not at all. Nialis. Niles eats planets. Y'all got to stay inside. I'll let you know. Y'all are on curfew. If the lights go on outside, you better be inside. You better be inside. Or fuck it. Join us. I don't know. You can't beat us. I don't know. I don't know. Think about it. Which will actually get us to the most interesting thing about this side of thing. So what's the Kraya conversation that follows this? Because she does not come in and save you if you're fighting them, the way that she's does if they jump you. No, no.

So you do kill them. They are dead on the floor. Yeah. They are dead on the floor. And then Krea walks in. Krea walks in and she says to you, so here lies all that remain of the Jedi. It is a powerful thing you have achieved here. You've brought death again to Dantween.

And then Krea asks you, so what has? So what happened in that threw me off a little bit is that there's a big portion of the first half of this conversation is from the restored content mod. It is not in the base game. That's right. So it means our transcripts from the strategy wiki are not up to date. If you want to go see this, there is a long play of Cotor 2 that's available. If I remember, I'm going to actually send it to Chia right now. I'll put it in the link in our chat.

So I'll remember when I write the show notes. to add it. But you can go watch that player play through it, which will have all of the added dialogue from the TSLCRM, because that stuff is not in the transcript that we work from. No. But what's most crucial that I took away from this conversation with CREA, I mean, a lot of the information that you get about, you know, this echo in the force, the wound that you know, must be closed. The things that says Kyle and Master Kavar and the other one are talking to you about in terms of like, what drove you to cut off your own connection to the force are presented very

differently by Krayo. And most notably, the disconnection of the connection to the force, Crea frames as, yes, you are this like hyper-force sensitive person in terms of your connections to other people, like, have a very tangible material impact on you. So the very first thing that Crea says to you is essentially that what you have done has destroyed the Jedi order, perhaps, that eliminating these Jedi masters, the actions that you have taken up to this point

have effectively resulted in the end of the order. And you can kind of question her and say, well, are there any other Jedi left? And she basically says, for every person, for every Jedi or even Sith that fall, another will rise. So there's really no, there's no way to completely eliminate force sensitives or the institution of the Jedi and Sith by just eliminating people one by one. And you can say, well then, well then if this was not the result we want to. Like, I thought the result we wanted was to eliminate the order itself.

Then why am I here? And so Crea says, there's something we must discuss. This is the real reason why I brought you here. Right, which is interesting, right? Because before I, we haven't pulled up, we'll listen to it. But I just realized, like, you killed, you could have killed all the Jedi masters. And then still, Kraya is like, we got to go to Dan Tweed, even if you killed them all. Right.

Or even if you did kill the Jedi master. masters up into this point. It's not necessarily like that wins you points with Craite. Like it was all about getting to Dantuin. It wasn't about killing the Jedi Masters along. It wasn't the Jedi Masters we killed along the way. That's right. It was getting to, it's something about being here on Dantuan.

All right. I'm going to hit play. Three, two, one. Go. Because there is something we must discuss. I have done what I can to keep you from the Jedi and the Sith. but a critical moment approaches and what you have done is not enough

Master Vruk, despite his faults, was right to come here. I had thought he might have recognized Dantuin for what it was, what had been done there. You are tied to places such as these, you know. Now the player is saying that Vruke sucks. But Master Vruc was unwilling to see what other masters may have seen. That the echo of Dantuin he felt was inside you as well. They admitted it as much.

In the council chamber after your trial, though they did not understand what it meant at first, they assumed it was a threat that they felt. From one perspective, they were correct. As much as you can form connections to others, such connections exist on a galactic scale as well. It is possible to hurt or sever those connections, to create places in the force where it is difficult to center oneself, but that is the crudest form of manipulation.

It is possible to affect those connections in other ways, By the slightest action, a seemingly minor choice, a small... We've heard this before from her. The stronger your connection to life to the force. The stronger these echoes can be made and the stronger they are felt. When heard, force sensitives instinctively seek out the source, are drawn to it to try and form a connection. And when the connection is formed, both become stronger and the influence between them grows.

So you could say, like, is this what's happening? with me and my companions. Your companions, many are touched by the force on some level, and in many ways, they serve out of compulsion and because your connection

influences them strongly. It was much like it was for you in the Mandalorian Wars, with many Jedi under your command. But this connection has other consequences. When the source is wounded, the one on which others draw strength, then they are wounded as well.

What one feels, the other feels. and when others die, the scream travels back to the source. This is the part that I really want to highlight coming up. If they occur at the same time or at the right time, these screams will build upon each other until it is the only sound you can hear, and the deaths of many will cause the screams to build until their pain becomes yours, and you die as well.

And that is why during the Mandalorian Wars, you lost your connection to the force. It was that final battle, the deaths of so many Jedi, that caused you to lose your connection. It caused the wound that you feel now. It caused pain in the force and emptiness, a wound that has yet to heal. But it does not end there. If it did, then perhaps the threat that we face would be more manageable. This pain, I described, the echo of these acts is true of planets as well.

Tremendous loss of life on a planetary scale can also cast echoes. create a scream, a wound in the force that can travel across the galaxy. It can be felt by force sensitives, and it can influence them whether they realize it or not. If enough of these echoes are allowed to build in the force uncontrolled, the consequences could be disastrous. The connections of all life would be affected. The animals are going wild in the background story. Yeah, they're like...

As I have said, screams, and their echoes can overlap, build in strength. And if timed correctly, they will build on each other. The scream will grow. And anything that can hear the scream shall be deafening or killed. So. But in order for this to work, all of them must be timed correctly. Yeah, I think we get stopped here. Or, or.

From the greatest to the smallest of echoes. Even the ones that come from a lone exile echoing across the galaxy. And when that exile forms connections to others as you do, The danger becomes apparent. The echo continues to grow, to travel. Okay. Can I make a request of all fan artists out there to draw Kraya taking the exile to a Rade of Forest Cafe? Yes.

To set this conversation. I needed to bring you here to tell you the truth. To tell you the truth. You needed to be here amongst the overpriced drinks and the animal sounds. It's really interesting how much this is. felt a great disturbance in the forces of millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced, taken to its sort of like logical conclusion of like, I bet that would suck.

I bet that would have consequences. I bet that would affect people who can feel the force. Yeah. Yeah, the thing that I wanted to really highlight in what Crayas says here is the fact that, I mean, most specifically, the fact that you, the exile loses their connection to the force because of the overwhelming pain that they experience from being connected to so many lives lost during the Mandalorian Wars.

So it was not a conscious act of, I mean, I guess whether or not it was a conscious act in the light side version of this is ambiguous. What is said is that you cut yourself off from the force and it's, you know, as an act of self-preservation. But here, the fact that it's specifically framed as a loss, there is seemingly no kind of participation or agency in this moment is, is fascinating to me. Yeah, that's way different.

For Rob and me, it's like you involuntarily had. this survival reaction for this other version, for Krayas, from Kray's perspective, from a different point of view, it's literally the mechanics of action stripped this from you. It was stripped from you by history, by the war, by the death of millions, not in order to hide from, in order to save yourself from the pain of the death of millions, you're in involuntarily, like, in the way that you put up your hands when you're falling, cut yourself fall from the force. I think that's distinct in some ways for sure. Yeah. Yeah. It feels it feels so. And I'll note again, none of that that we just listened to, I think, is in the original cut of the game.

No, it's in the transcript. I think all of that is modders being like, we have these sound files. There clearly was a version of this game where Craya comes in and tells you all the same information that the Jedi Masters did. We should put that in because the player on the dark side doesn't have any of that information. if we're not leaving Sarah Kesselman line rates on the floor. You're damn right. I want her talking about going to get a coffee refill. You know what I mean? What do they got?

Put it all in the game, whatever it is. So this leads into where it does pick up from that was in the original game, which is how we kind of conclude this conversation with Krea is to know, to basically say to the exile, what you've done here, killing the Jedi masters here, is not enough. This was not,

like, this was not the final act that is going to close, to seal the wound in the force as I've been so concerned about. And, she asks you,

you can say, what are you talking about? Like, I, wasn't like wasn't the step one or step on the steps like of what we were trying to do um and she says you were supposed to learn something from this you were supposed to learn something from killing these these jadai master and i want to see if you learned it so if if in killing them did revenge bring you any measure of satisfaction she asks you

did seeing them dead settle the disquiet within you and you can be like well i mean why do you wish to know or like isn't this isn't this what you wanted um and what's interesting is if you say did i wish to see them or sorry if you say didn't you want to see them dead too she says did i want to see them defeated or did i wish to see them dead no defeated perhaps and she creates this distinction between death and defeat. And then she goes on to explain her actual position, which is I merely, I just, I only just wanted them to see that they and their teachings were wrong. That's all I wanted.

I just wanted them to admit that they were wrong. Yeah. You just read this straight because this is, this is Crea. We don't need to paraphrase. Great. I merely wish them to see that they and their teachings were wrong, that one could not truly understand the force simply by adhering to the Jedi Code. All I have ever trained have been failures to them,

students who went to fight the Mandalrians, who fell to the dark side, who abandoned their training. To see one that had the strength to best them, that is a moment I will not forget. Yet it hasn't not been as satisfying as I had hoped. To best one in battle is one thing. To defeat them without striking a blow. That was my hope.

Regardless, it had to be done. To have such powerful Jedi still live, still be felt in the force even on such worlds as they had chosen, was a threat that had to be ended. And you can be like, what do you mean? What are you talking about? And Craya just says, let's get back to the original question. if by killing these Jedi

if you achieved any measure of peace and you have five possible responses one I will not rest until every Jedi lies dead two it has been satisfying yes but not to all the counsel who sentenced me are dead

three no for atris still lives five yes but there are other opponents. It is not enough to kill Jedi when the Sith remain. And five, such peace is not possible if the Sith still hunt me.

Surely one of these answers is the answer Cray is looking for. But no. Her response, no matter what you say here, is it was as I thought. You have failed me completely and utterly.

I'm screen sharing again. I need her to rant at us one more time. Yep, one more time. Hit it for me. One more time, Sarah, do it for us. This player, I missed what they said, but they picked one of them, it doesn't matter which. All right.

Three, two, one. It was as I thought, you have failed me. Completely and utterly. I have taught you to hear the force again, shown you the contrast. And yet still you do not understand. This is what you have wrought. Unctless murderers, slayers, assassins, born of war that has, as always, taught the wrong lesson. You showed them life without the force, and instead of showing them truth, power, all you showed them was how the galaxy may die.

You are responsible for all of this. Even now, events spiral towards destruction, and there is nothing that can be done because you refuse to listen, to understand. You have seen the effects you have on those close to you, heard the echoes scream across dead planets, and watched as your strength has grown. Yet it is for nothing. To have the Jedi masters brought low by such a failure, there is no victory in that.

You have not heard a thing I have taught, and for all I have said you have never learned to listen. Do you feel that edge? This is T.S.L. CRM. I believe. Let that pain be a lesson and a reminder of what you have forgotten. You are my last hope. The only one who could change what is to come. And now you have left me nothing.

I shall teach you no longer. Our bond remains, but that is all. This place will hide you from the Sith for a time. to do what must be done. Stay here and die, apprentice, among the wreckage of all that remains of the Jedi. It is a fitting grave

until the Sith come to end you, to end everything. So, we didn't describe it, but she stabs herself in the chest with a lightsaber in the middle of that. Did that happen for y'all? Yeah. Okay, good.

So I wasn't sure if that was part of the TSLCRM or if that was part of another different add-on that this let's player had set up. Because the original is not that at all. And the original, even after she gives that big, you have failed me completely in utterly speech. You haven't learned anything. You haven't learned to listen.

She then does the bit where she's like, Vruk was right to come here and he didn't see what was wrong here on Dantuin or whatever. And then I want to say like just zaps you or something. Yeah, I believe she just drains you. She just doesn't drain. The same thing that the Jedi Masters would do to you in the light side version. Well, not cut you off from the force, though.

Because you don't become level one. Right? You're level one? No, because she stops that from happening. Oh, oh, oh, oh. What the Jedi Masters were going to do was cut you off from the force again. So she doesn't do that in the default. She just knocks you the fuck out and is like, I hope you're going to wake up and get it all right and figure out what I need you to do.

So very different. very different yeah we we in going darksided have failed crea and she doesn't fuck with us anymore nope this was really polarizing at the time i already mentioned in this episode um that i found a post which i've linked you to but i'm not going to link in this show notes from someone on on a form being like but craya's bad and i was bad why is she mad at me how do i make her not mad at me Why is my is mommy mad at me? It was 2005. This guy didn't say mommy.

And all she says, you've failed me completely and utterly. So my question is, do I miss, did I miss something or the game made like that? All I know is when you're dark side, Cray is your master and you are her apprentice. I don't know that that's true. I don't think that's true. Well, yeah. You know, different engagement with games at the time, I think. Yeah. I will not shout out this poster, but I will shout out their Forbes signature banner.

That is Google looking much different. And you were Googling cut contents. And Google says, did you mean Cotor 2? That's very funny. That's very funny. Yeah. So, Cray I'm mad because she wasn't trying. I mean, she did, she does say, we did have to kill the Jedi. That was part of, we have to do that. She does say that in the bit where she's talking to you about it. But the point wasn't to kill them. The point was to prove them wrong and to prove that she was, she would always been a good teacher, actually. And her previous students weren't failures, but were like necessary, you know, part, you know, members of history, people bringing us closer to some new final arrangement of the world, the galaxy, and the force.

Crea is like a professor denied tenure that has come back to to rue everyone for what they had denied her. And specifically, it seems like, so like you said, there are those four options of what you can say to her about how you feel about it. And she, or five options. There's six. Well, what's number one? I will not rest until every Jedi lies dead.

Yeah, but that's number two in the list. There's only five. It runs from two to six on this page. Oh, oh, oh, oh, I see. Yeah, yeah. So, yeah, there's five of them, which is, and they're all different perspectives. Like you read them all.

They are all different perspectives, but they are all still centered around killing. That's right. They are all centered around eliminating the council, eliminating, uh, Jedi eliminating Sith, like all of it is still specifically in that I just need to knock the numbers down. Yeah, what do you think the answer is she wants? What's the answer that she would have said, ah, yes, you understand. Do you have a sense of what that is yet? Without dipping into stuff you've played ahead,

Natalie? No, yeah, without dipping into stuff ahead, to me, she says it pretty outright, is that, is for the Jedi themselves to admit that their their methods, their, their dogma, their kind of reliance on, on debate and, and, and thinking through things and thus inaction often is wrong and has led to destruction across the galaxy. And, and also, I think,

I think the answer she wanted from us is that the point of it all was to show the hypocrisy, was to get the Jedi order to admit to their own hypocrisy or to get to admit to their own failings and to acknowledge that the failings are a direct result of the foundational institutional beliefs of the order itself. That's kind of the vibe I'm getting. She is the same complaints with the script that we just did 20 minutes ago, where it's like, even though I amassed power and I betrayed people and I lied and I killed people who were in my way, like this could have been a conversation.

This could have been a situation that I created to get the results that I wanted and not just. I have been, I have the like, U.I. Enemy, like, red the name over myself and the judge just walked towards me and trying to fight me. Like, you know, there, there is such a, like, by killing these people in, or like, by killing them instead of forcing them into an understanding of themselves, has cut off the potential of what bringing all of these people could have had. Yeah. I think that. right. Yeah. She's like, why did you fucking kill Kavar on Avivon and shed off the possibility that you could have a kind of conversation with them? And the answer, of course, for us is like,

how were you supposed to know that? You know? But she does chastise you throughout the game. Anytime that you either utilize like a force mind trick, like force persuade, anytime you result to just killing someone or escalating violence in a way where there could have been an alternate, not necessarily less fucked up in terms of the end. The options, the way that the game internally characterizes your choices are psychotic. Psychotic is the one. And she does not like psychotic, remember? No.

And that's usually killing people. That's almost always killing people are doing something really. absurd. She likes cunning. There's good psychotic in cunning, and she likes cunning. Her and Vesas both like cunning and they're the only one. Everyone else. Vesos likes everything. Well, yeah, right. You're right. Vesos does like it. Vesos likes you. Vesos likes you, the exile. So yeah, I think that's a good, I think that that's a good place to kind of feel like, yeah, that that is her chiding of the, of the Jedi, refusing to go out into the world, refusing to hunt down the echo, never walking in the dark places, uh, eschewing, I think,

the idea that like the two options are Sith and Jedi because she seems like she's like, listen, like I, obviously she has critique of both of them, but also seems to have a broader critique of how the both the Jedi and the Sith are able to use the force to create changes in the world and also in other people. And it will continue to get more from her as we go forward. I do love the sort of like, it almost feels like a thing that she's admitting accidentally. Like the way that the conversation goes through, like where she just sort of slips in,

they thought that everything that I trained was a failure. And then she immediately turns it around on you to be like, this is what you've done, just murders, slayers, assassins, born of war. Like, everyone around you has been pulled down with you quite literally because the bar turns red. if you turn red. If you turn red, yeah.

Like, it's just like, you know. Right. Especially going back to other conversations where she's been like, oh, I'm not a teacher. I don't do that. Like, you know, you're so goaded. You're so influential. You should be careful with that.

Like, there's, there's, it doesn't feel like full jealousy, but there's such resentment there that you are able, you are capable of a thing that she isn't. And she feels so much of what you're able. to do because of the force connection that you have with her, that, like, seeing you fuck it up. Yeah. Makes her so mad.

Yeah. Because it's just like if I could have been that. Yeah. I wouldn't have fucked it up if I had what you had. It's real. She's in whiplash right now. Like, she is like, you know, were you dragging or were you, whatever? I forget the other one.

For me, there's the other line here, which is you showed them life without the force. and instead of showing them truth, power, all you showed them was how the galaxy may die. And I think she's keying it on the stuff that we get on Rob our side, where they're like, we were a little afraid of seeing you come back after all of that. Because for her, that's the juice. It's like, oh, my God, someone faced the worst thing someone with the force can face, didn't fall to the dark side and didn't die,

and came back and looked them in the face and said, what are you going to do with me? And they were afraid of that, which gives you a position of influence. over them and a vision of a world where someone who had all that power stepped away from it and continued living. Someone who had the force. They should have made you the fucking pope.

They should have made you the pope. If you're that goaded that everyone was like, surely somebody that experiences this will either die or fall to the dark side and you did neither. And not only did you do neither, you also just came back and showed up to talk to them. And then they were like, oh, actually we need to get rid of you. Yeah. It's. Which reminds me, we talked about this before.

But just making conclave, but a TV series set in Star Wars universe. I would die for it. I would die for it. Nashing my teeth, wailing in the streets. With all respects, my fellow masters, what do any of you know of the dark side? Right? Like, because that is, like, you are coming back, like, as close to the forces anointed one. Yeah.

But, but the other thing that is eerie is that what's happened to you is so twinned with nihilus. Yes. That, like, understanding what, like, why are you both arriving at this moment in history? What is happening that there's two characters who are both described as this, like, sucking wound in the force? Like that is, there's an eerie connection or parallel that's happening here. One of the other things, though, that jumped out at me during the Lightside confrontation with the Gem Masters, is that the exception of Rook, they are singing such a different tune than the last time you saw them. Now, there is a bit of, sometimes Cotor 2 feels a little bit slapped together and it might be.

be some like inconsistencies in how this was all shaped. But I also think because this is a game that centers so much on, for instance, your uncanny ability to influence people and the fact that people do not act like themselves under your influence, I do feel like there is a bit of, oh, but this is happening to the Jedi when they are brought together as the institution of the Jedi. Yes. That when these guys are in isolation and hiding and you're able to. to talk to them about like, hey, what happened here? They've all come to different answers about

like their interpretation of what happened to you and why it went down this way. And they have different answers about where they're at with regard to the Jedi order. Zezkyel has almost become an unbeliever in Sire West. He says he's going to leave the fucking order, right? He's like, I'm going to stop being a Jedi. Yeah. There's something wrong with us. We keep making the same mistake. Jada keep breaking bad. The same way. There's something there's something rotten in the order.

The other guy pretends to be your like your best friend. I was going to be your you're going to be my Padawan if it had worked out differently says Kavar. But he's still adamant that like no we didn't punish you. This wasn't we weren't like freaking out or anything. The only person who actually has been very consistent is

Vruik who does seem like he is the most in line. He is attuned to what is the institutional view of the Jedi order? What is the very interventionist disciplinary committee type thing? Like he is the dean of academic discipline in the Jedi order. And he, from beginning to end, is, no, we have to get this person out of here. We have to get the exile back in exile. But it is so interesting to me that the other Jedi, isolated from each other, isolated from Vruk,

have much more individual and nuanced responses to you. But the second they are brought back together as a group and brought in Vruke's orbit, they are a united front, and we are basically getting a rerun of what you saw on the hollow recording that you saw, which is you get this group of people together, and they come down on you like a hammer.

but when we met them, not only that, they almost seem regretful about how it happened. I went down. We were also a little sorry about how it went down, basically. Like they made a decision in a group setting that when they get out of it, they're like, that doesn't entirely sit right with me. Did we, did we with on this one? And so for all the hand- Where were those decisions made?

Those decisions were made in Jedi places of power, right? They were made in Jedi Council Chambers. They were made on places like Dantuan and the Khorasan Jedi Temple. And how much of this game is about like the place that you are can shape you and you can shape the place that you are through the power of the force. Zazkiel on Narcadah where everything is chaotic and dark is like, damn, maybe I shouldn't be a Jedi. But you get him back onto Dantuin where by the way, mechanically, as a reminder, on Dantuin, light side characters have higher fortitude reflex and will saves than they do. in other places. And it's down to the location.

It's not just Dantween in general. But if you go and look at the way it works on Dantuin, the literal different parts, like the planes, they get a plus 20, the enclave courtyard, they get a plus 30. And in the enclave, you get another plus. This is the same thing on Corribon, but reversed, where light side characters inside of the darkest places, like the deep, the depth of the cave, get minus 100 to their saves. like they're in a place where the light side is affecting them very literally because it's been shaped to be that by the Jedi for centuries or millennia or whatever. So it's like the institution has made a place where it's harder to not do the institutional thinking.

Literally in the mechanics of the game because of the way the save system works. It's harder to do dark-sided shit successfully inside of the Jedi enclave. And so, which doesn't mean like, I think, Rob, your point is not Varouca's mind controlling them. It's that like the institution has a gravity. And they form the institution by being in the same place. Which also. And they can contemplate is the institution flawed? And the second they show up to the office, they clock in.

That's right. They go right back into and here is the here. I will contort myself into being the exact right gear for this machine to keep it spinning. They're going to fix it from the inside, Rob. You know? But black dynamite. We serve drugs to the community. We are the Jedi.

But Black Dynamite, we are the Jedi Council. Like, I have bad words for the Jedi Council. We got to, you know, I'm the Jedi Council fundamentally. They suck. It's good. It's good. I love this stuff so much. I think this is, we still have the final act of the game to go, but I think this is the climax

of the game, not only because you get the best Craya voice work so far, probably. But we get this, if you're light side, you get this confrontation with the Jedi. And again, I guess it's not if you're light side. You could theoretically be dark side but have not killed any Jedi masters, which might be the most fun way to do it because then you could show up and be like, you'll fuck you actually all the way through. I know I'm bummed. If I would have known, I would have just sided with the queen.

Because it's worth saying in the conversation with them, you can be rude to them. You can say that they're lying. You can tell them that you don't believe anything they're saying. You can say I'm stronger than I ever was before. You're going to say more Jedi cryptic warnings. All that, like, you can voice that version of yourself if you're in the conversation, but they don't let you in the conversation if you've killed one of the Jedi. And I am really, the more we think about it and talk about it, the more torn I am on it,

because the part of me that is like you should let players decide which track of story they're on, and there's, of course, going to be a really bad feeling if 20 hours in, 30 hours in, they suddenly feel punished for something they did 10 hours in, you know, two-thirds of the game before. that's like the game designer voice in my brain is like don't put someone on a track they don't know they're getting on but the storyteller in my brain is like you went to war on the other side of the guy you were going to go try to talk to of course he thought you were his enemy and you fought him and no you don't get to just talk your way out of it but then my other other side is like they should have let you talk your way out of it and then punished you because the whole game is about how your special power of talking your way into and out of things is actually kind of fucked. So, you know, I could go either way on it, I think. And I will again hit the hammer here, hit the bell. The game is really interested.

I say in the let's play that I think this game is of a set with the other games of this mid-2000s to late 2000s era that are critiquing the player in video games. I think this is a spec ops the line. I think this is a bioshok. I think game designers of this era, especially ones that felt that they were kind of altars or who were working all tours,

were often interested in what does it mean that games contort themselves around the desire of the player and whether those are successful or not or which ones are successful and which ones aren't, I think it's undeniable

that there was a sweeping swell of these things inside of AAA video games because that was the dominant form. And it's interesting, I don't ever see this game talked about in that relationship. I see people talk about Biocococ I see people talk about Specops the Line.

I see people talk about, you know, some proto stuff that was playing with like, you know, you could look at stuff like Metal Gear or what's the one that has the, what's the GameCube horror game that has like the playing with the format to make you, because your sanity meter is low. Oh. Eternal darkness. Right. It's like playing with the format and doing deconstructive stuff. But I almost never see Coteur 2. I see Cochardt as a destruction or a destruction, a deconstruction of Star Wars. but rarely of when you kill guys and get XP,

that means something, you know? So, Bioshock is like three or four years later. Right. Right? 2007, right? So, yeah, three years later. But I think you have to remember how much the critical landscape shifted

in those few years. But also, Cotor is lacking one key thing that those other games you mentioned had. which was a big, obvious rugpole moment for people who, like, maybe are kind of dumbassies and don't get it. People for whom like, you're like a cipher and you affect everyone around you. People are like, damn, the exiles are super powerful, huh? What a crazy character. And they don't draw the connection between kind of like the party leaders, always super powerful in these kinds of games. Yeah.

Whereas, like, spec ops the line is like, look what you did and you enjoyed it. Like, they have those moments to make sure that the point is not missed. And then they had lots of people blogging about it as like this is, this is. And not to, not to poo that. I was right there with, I was right there with them to an extent. But yeah, this is a game that doesn't hit that bell as hard. and it is coming out in a very different context, like critically, commercially.

I have a quick thing. Yeah. Do they not realize nihiluses out there? The Jedi. No, I don't think they do. I don't think that they understand it. They don't understand. So what they don't know what happened on.

What do they think happened on Vsau's planet? I don't think that they weren't there, right? But the Jedi are dead. They are. I suspect that they think the Sith role up the way that they did on Terrace or something. But I don't know. But they, but they think you're the Sith or did the Sid haven't revealed? Like, like the thing that I find fascinating about this is, what is the mechanism? Right. By which you think this apocalyptic threat. So, well, you represent

an almost theological threat. A hundred percent. That you are this wound in the force that is the, the death of the force, or at least the death of the relationship they have with the force. They are scared that someone is going to the source of their power, and it is affecting that sort of nexus of power, and they want to cut you off from it. But then they're also in hiding because they know there's something out there hunting them. They know that they are under threat and have been since the Jedi Civil War. And they should know, they should have come away from this believing

that they had successfully countered the threat because they were all in on the plot to unleash Reven on the SIF. They know that plot went off. They know they successfully, like, derailed the SIF Empire and caused it to fall into infighting. And yet they all know they need to lie low because they are under mortal threat from the SIF. Yeah.

But they don't seem to realize. And they won't hear you as you try to explain dudes. There's a guy who can just like, squeeze a planet out of, like squeeze a planet like Capri sun and just hoover up all the life. And these extra hungi when he detects Jedi in the area, they don't seem to realize that's happening. Which is kind of the only plausible explanation for how all the Jedi are getting got the minute they put their heads above the parapet. So the two things are one, if I'm remembering right, Vsos and Atten when they both talk about, guitar early on are like it's on the it's on the it's on the it might not be on the outer rim but it's

far enough away from where you are that people news hasn't really hit in terms of what particularly happened there they know that there was mass death there but they have no viz is the only survivor so there's no depiction of what it is it's just like did you hear everyone guitar is dead weird to to your point rob the words you were just describing uh what how did you describe our hungi uh Sith master destroys things squeezing planets all squeezing planets out like a priest's sun. The Masters is Caius says, The screams of countless thousands,

Jedi and Mandalorians crushed by the planet's gravity annihilated, is how he describes the end of Malacor. Maybe they think it's you. Maybe in their heart of hearts, they're like, I know someone who did this before. It was fucking the exile in Bayeodur. Maybe that happened again.

They don't say that. But it's easy to make that connection when that's how it seems Malicorn was destroyed. was it was squeezed like a sort of like a Capriced sun. It also like it underscores though why Crea is like burning with anger toward these guys as well because it is like they heard something real bad. That's right. And they're like,

didn't like that and they closed the windows. Like that is that is basically how they responded to all this, which is kind of how they responded to the Mandalrians. I don't know what's going on out there. That seems pretty. fucked up. Not sure what we should do or, you know, whether it would be necessarily good for us if we went out there and fought that war. Let's wait and let's wait and see and not, not be hasty here. Sorry about all those people getting killed. And now they're hearing like entire planets die.

Yep. And or like I guess in, I'd have to go back to what exactly does Cray say? Does she say they didn't even hear it? They, they were so in hiding that they can't even hear it. Or is it that they heard it and they've like sort of turned away from it in horror. It is, I believe it is the latter. It is, if you had traveled far enough rather than waiting for the echo to reach you, perhaps you would have seen it for what it was. There's a place in the galaxy, but they don't see what it is. That's right.

They refused, again, this is to me why it's so cool. Like, we spend this whole game and I think about the, I've been thinking about the echo. If you think about an echo visually as like a series of waves coming out and bouncing around in a cavern or something, my mental camera, has been on the waves as they bounce around in the distance of the cavern. But not at the stone in the... Right. But not at the person going, hello, hello, where it then becomes, hello, hello, hello.

I've been thinking about the hello, hello, hello, and not the hello. And she's like, you got to go see who's yelling. You got to get off your asses and go see where the echo comes from. It doesn't, it isn't just a loose thing. Things don't just echo around magically. They come from somewhere and you refuse to do that. And she's like, of course I went to the dark side. I'm fucking looking for things.

I had to go where it was dark. I can see where it's light. It doesn't mean I stayed there forever. And again, I think the brilliance of Cray as a character is what you already hit on, which is she is right about all of this probably. But she's also a person who has clear biases and emotions and is driven by feelings of being belittled by them in the past. feelings of being, you know, uh, uh, uh, uh, disrespected, feelings of her own limits that she doesn't have what you have or what Revin had, um, that she can only ever be this kind of like footnote in the, in the story of these other great people in history.

Like, and that means that sometimes Natalie, I think it was you who said that she slips in conversation, maybe it was you, Rob, but like, that there are moments where it doesn't feel like she's just reading the fact of the situation through her ideological lens, but sometimes she's reading them through her personal hangups and her beefs and her interests and her love and her everything else, right? Like the fact that she before this happens is like, remember, trust me or trust yourself. And it's like, okay, you're manipulating me. But also I think she wants you to trust her.

I think she's like, whatever happens in there, remember, we're all in it together. She says before telling her you're a disappointment. And I think that that's fascinating because I think that doesn't come only from, she's not just the spider spinning the web. She's also the spider, like, protecting its babies or something. You know, she's also the spider. Like, she has it, she has long-term plans that are also come from, like, preferences and feelings and emotions and not just the master web spinner, you know? Um, she's great.

And she did really say, she said no mustard. Like, step away from him is an all-timer. And they didn't even know that she was fucking out. out there. It's incredible. It's so good that she's just like walking around through the whole game and none of them see her until she puts her, her pulls her hood back, which did I say this on here? They're still so behind the curve. The Sith have revealed themselves. It's like we got to get a new jet account. You got to get out of here. They do. They really do have to get into Jaya. Does anybody remember the first thing that happens with Kreia? The first thing that happens in this game when you first see her. Does they? do you remember what happens? She sits up from that bed.

And does what? When you have her back turned to her. Yep. And what she do? She pulls the hood up. And she's never taken it down since then. She's had her hood of invisibility. Her cloak.

And remember, she can never change outfits in this game. You give her different robes. Oh, my God. It's true. She has her fucking cloak of invisibility on the whole game, hiding from people. She finally goes mask off. She finally goes mask off. And she looks great.

Like you said, lustrous hair. Anyway, we're going to Tilos because... We're going to Tilos. One, it seems like everyone else is going to Tilos. Two, one Jenai Master didn't show up. Atris. Who she runs in the handmaid on her way out, right? Yeah, that's where she's like, sorry, I need to...

The only person I'm to talk to is Atris. Yeah. And again... If you do the district attorney, I'll only talk to the district attorney. But also, this is the, like, hey, look, I like handmaiden. But also often seems like a kid, like older than Mira, but like still a kid. Yeah. And this is the whole like, hey, take me to your leader.

Don't worry. I know you really want to know what's going on. I will only talk to Atris. And that will in no way be incredibly dangerous for Atris or anyone on T-Loss. Like, just, hey, can you, uh, can you run me over to Tilos really quickly? Hey, I mean, I'm a bomb. Could you put me at the center of your headquarters? That'd be so convenient for me.

Just carry me on over. Yeah. Oh, it's good. Oh, wait, I have a question for the dark side, folks. Does Beauder say the same shit on the dark side where he's like, can we please save the galaxy? I know you can hear me in your brain. Okay. He loves you no matter what.

He loves you no matter what. He's so good. I'm so glad he got this line. I'm so glad they let him get his shit off just a little bit in this fucking game where they don't give him enough to do even though he's one of the best characters. It's also never stop bothering me. Like how they found Sarah Castleman is an interesting, like doesn't do much voice acting. Nope. Is mostly a stage performer.

Like I'm somebody who watches a lot of like British mysteries over the years. She doesn't have a lot of credits in those. Like there's a spot on midsummer murder. but like she she is apparently in the latest season of slow horses. Yeah. Yeah, I know, right? I haven't watched it yet, but now I'm like extra eager to get to that. I also found out that it's apparently a Magre reboot, which is, which is fun news for me.

But like the how this casting happened, I think is fascinating because talking about a game that just isn't going to work without a character this, this, this comparison. at the heart of it. Also, to some of these themes we're talking about, um, like lousy depiction of uninteresting, like, why people fall at the dark side. The acolyte was poised to finally give us a compelling. Like I understand how these people end over,

end up over here on this camp. Like the, the, the sort of grayness of, of somebody who, uh, for good reasons has walked away from the order and is seeking power. elsewhere. You think Krayis explicitly seems to be, because so much of this is already in dialogue with the, with the, with the comics, someday we're going to read Dark Empire.

Oh, yeah, we have to. They fumble this bag by all accounts, which is that Luke Skywalker decides he has to get close to the emperor, the Emperor reborn, sorry. And so he's going to fall and become like a dark, like dark Luke. and he thinks he's going to have a little taste of the dark side, but actually he gets super enmeshed. Basically, he has a whole Admiral Enigma arc, which is, which is unfortunate.

The plan doesn't go well, which is the problem with the story is that it becomes kind of a silly, like we have to save Luke from, I'm only going to have a little bit of dark side. It's going to be fine. I'll pull out before anything bad happens. And, you know, then they get to him. and he's like, oh shit, I am like in so deep.

I'm dark-sighted. Crea seems like a, like, how do we create the non-assinine version of that story? A Jedi has got to go out into the dark places and see what's out there, see what's happening in the dark side. And has come back with sort of the fullest picture of anyone has of the current, like, state of the force and the Sith and the Jedi. she actually accomplished something, which Luke kind of doesn't. Him joining the emperor, I'm not even sure,

pays off in Dark Empire. I don't think his plan works at all. I think it's the most of everyone else who saves his ass, but that is, Krea has done the Dark Empire story in some ways, but to like a much more satisfying

narrative arc. Sox agrees. So is that where we want to call it before we get back? I mean, I guess there's... Even that we had to spend like 90 minutes explaining the two wildly divergent tracks, the scene can follow. Yeah. And that we recorded an entire episode, basically, before we even got to that. Yeah. I do think we're in the five-star.

We're in the five-star territory. I think we're probably in there. Does Krea, two things, I guess. One, before you wake up, Kraya, the handmaiden sees Kraya, right? And that's, we already, yeah, we just talked about this. I just want to note that I think that this is one of the things that people point to that I actually think is pretty weak towards the handmaiden is Kraya's daughter thing, where handmaiden sees her and says like, you. and Craya says, oh, yes, at last you see, which is, I think just about... That being like you, mom.

Right, exactly. It's like, it's you. The betrayer. I can, yeah, the betrayer, totally. That's how I read. And that's part of why Cray is like, I am one of the Sith. I must answer for my actions. Turn me in.

Yes, I'm a Sith. Yeah. So I don't think that's that. Is she even, but, okay, we can't get into this. Wait, what? Because we're trying to wrap up the sentence. I know, but what? I was just going to say,

I feel like she's playing the handmaiden by saying, I'm a Sith, take me to your leader. Yeah, that's what we were just said. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 100%. That's why I said she's a bomb that will please take me to the center of your headquarters. Yeah. Right, right, right, right.

And the only way that she can convince Handmaiden to let her in is by being like, I'm a, I'm a bomb, but I'm also a secret bomb. Oh, I'm sorry. I see. Are you saying that she's like, handmaiden, the good thing to do would be to smuggle me in. To arrest me?

No, no, no, no. Okay, we're on the same size. Yeah, yeah. The thing that I'm saying is like, is her being like, I'm, I'm, I'm evil. Clearly, you must arrest me and take me to the, your, your leader. Yeah. This is the Joker saying I'll only talk to Batman because he thinks he can break Batman. And he won.

He thinks it would be fun to talk. I'm agreeing with you. Yeah. I think she's like turning herself in so that she gets access to Aitris. But she's not actually a Sith. No, no, no, no, no. Right, right, right. Well, she's not a Jedi, but she's not, that's her whole thing.

She's not, yeah. The whole thing is she's neither. Yeah. But she knows the handmaiden will be like a Sith. Oh my goodness. Yeah, exactly. We need to arrest you right away and bring you in. We got to take you to Atrice's red room that's lit by these interesting sconce lamps that

that she got from somewhere. Oh, yeah. They're Phillips, they're Phillips Hugh bulbs that are, uh, that are tuned to like her vibes. Having a,

a relief of like, sip-ass shit happening. It is. But it's even better because it's like, oh, those are just cool little lights. Where'd you get those fixtures? Around.

Literally syph holo-holocrons. Well, like, and specifically remember, she has said that she like collected some of the Jedi holocrons and, relics for her own, for her protection. Thank God she did, because they would have all been destroyed by now, otherwise.

So who knows what's going on in there. All right, next time. Just like in Dukyu Jedi lost. Just like in Dukyeli lost, the Ertext. We are going to play through Tilos, I think, from, I have not played ahead. So, you know, pardon me if this is wrong. I will tell you that big, long dark side let's play from this. This point in the game only has like three hours left.

We could theoretically just do it. I think that would cause for a really long conversation, and so we shouldn't do that. I think we should split it. And I think the place to split. And also, we are doing the droid factory. We're not doing a droid planet, but we're doing the droid factory, which is a little more than I think the game originally was at the end here. So I think what we should do is telos, which will run from the first, I guess we'll, do waking up inside the enclave through all of telos, which starts in with handmade and stuff,

handmade and nude, like we've already talked about, whoever didn't have clothes on her. Just for Rob, just for Rob, just for Rob, just for Rob, through the end of the confrontation on the ravager. Which is a wild name for your ship, buddy, given all of the gender politics we've talked. about. Oh, shit. Yeah. So that's the, that's the, that's the, that's the place that I think we should go through, which is, which is, well, you know, that's, maybe it was called that before he took command. I don't, I don't know. From the franchise that brought you the slave one. That's, that's right. Uh-huh. It's not called that anywhere. Or it's still called that. Right. It's, it's a fire spray

class vessel and they all just call it the fire spray the way you would call it like a T-bird. Just this for the Razor crest. Just, well, did you see? It's just in the fucking trailer to that movie. Yeah. They just, the fucking, the Razor crest, the Mandelor, the Dindjorn. The Mandler Season 1 ship.

The very cool ship. Yeah. Yeah. They just put that shit in the movie apparently. Yeah. Good. Great. Oh, that's going to sell me a ticket.

It would have sold me a ticket in like, 2018, which is Oh wait, I had totally whiffed. I had missed that Mandelorian Grogu had a trailer. It has a trailer. It's, it is one of this. I didn't watch it. It's bad.

I can't believe this title made it this far. I can't believe the releasing of Star Wars movie called the Mandalorian and Grobu. It's wild. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. It's not working. It doesn't work for me. Brother. Maybe they'll change it day one

like they did with Oh, with apostrophe the That's her first. Mandalorian and Grogu, colon, road to Corrisson. And then it'll be like the Hope Crosby movies where if this works,

it's going to be like Mandalorian and Grogu. Right. Now Huda. Right. I should be so excited for this shit. I can't believe the baby is the baby's coming back. The baby's back.

We swore at one point. We swore that if that baby would ever become, I swore. Like a fool. Yeah. What did you swear? I thought it.

It wasn't real. I stuck to my word, man. Can you remind people of the promise? I said that if any, if there was ever a day where Dave Filoni or anyone in the Star Wars office expected me to care about

Roa of the Hut. Job of the Hut's son, Ziki, or whatever the fuck his name is. Stinky. I was out. I'm not doing it anymore. I'm out of Star Wars. I'm not following it.

I'm not going to. going to go see the new movie. And I'm stuck to that. I didn't even watch the trailer. But I do, I actually really need the both of you to hold my hand as a friend and let me know, is the evil woman with the bunch haircut in the trailer? The evil. Oh, from the, from the one episode. Yeah.

I see. I see. I see. A character you would have invented given enough want, given enough time. She is not. I don't see her. Okay. Well, there.

I'm out. I'm out twice. The buff hut is. Okay. He's like a gladiator. That's fucking, that's the sun. That's Jabba the hut's son or whatever. He grows up and he's ripped.

He's ripped, dude. Yes, and he's played by Jeremy Allen White. Yeah, yeah. Uh-huh. How? You got to look at the magic of method. That's right. What do you mean?

That's so true. He's a great actor. Here it is. I'm sending a screen cap. You just have to imagine this hut sometimes says yes, chef. but I mean he's he's springsteen he's right he is like this guy can do it all Jeremy Allen sweep Jerry Allen white sweet yeah good for him I guess here's the problem we if we can if they're gonna do this we we just need we we haven't Evan Moss Bacharach to oh my god another character

or we or what they need to be his cousin he needs to be He just skein's back. Skine survived, actually. Skeen didn't die. We just keep, no, or we just keep, well, first of all, world within worlds, we could fish him out of there where it's like he's about to be like, let's take the money and run. And then you just like, you just yoying him through. Ezra Bridger shows up.

I hate. You mean? Ezra Bridger should use the world between worlds to go get Kraya. Kray would have solved all this shit. It's okay. In my upcoming Disney Plus series, Star Wars Brotherhood, we're going to get the back. story to Skeen and his brother and know what happens. Great.

It's a lot of pepper farming, oddly enough. It's going to be sort of a pastoral, like, Peter Weir-esque journey through Star Wars. But no, like, Andor leads us up to the moment he, like, the Rogue One begins. Skeen could lead us up to the moment he goes and joins the Aldani mission. You get like two, three seasons of what's the, what's the origin story of this weird dude? One day. We will see. Are we done?

Are we done? Are we ready to any other final thoughts on... Yeah, we started talking about fucking Grogo. We need to be done. Yeah, that's probably true. I didn't know Sigourney Weaver was going to be in there. Any guesses? I guess that's here what I'm saying, yeah.

Any guesses about what's going to happen on T-Less? It seems bad. I don't want to give too many details. Actual play has given me an allergy to setting up scenes at the end of an episode. Oh, I see. Oh, smart. So I don't want to describe what we all kind of know is about to happen. But I don't know that Atris is prepared for whatever is coming towards her because she seems like kind of a pushover.

Yeah. And Kraya has some ill intentions. I don't know. There's a lot of... For us, at least. I don't know. That's true. You think her and...

Yeah. Yeah. She's not fucking with Ali and I. But I feel. I feel like there's some, there's maybe some room still for you and, in Rob to get. Well, wait a second, wait a second, wait a second. What does she say at the end of your encounter with her on Dan, Toie? She doesn't kill you.

She could have killed you. She killed the Jedi. She says, as you lie here, I pray you will listen and finally awaken. You just got a bad test score. You know, maybe you could still wake up and do the right thing. Yeah. She didn't fail you. She didn't fail you for the class.

She just failed you for the midterm. Our final lesson. Yeah. so okay I it's time to officially cut it off because there is a leaf blower directly next to my microphone cool all right well with that we've reached the end of another episode of a more civilized age our show is produced by chia contraris and supported by our listeners at patreon.com slash civilized next week go in to t-loss and up through the end of the ravager until next time please rate and review us on your podcast platform of choice and get your tickets for the midnight showing of the

Mandelorian and Grogu will be there. I won't. No. In costume. What if we all went as hard? No. We all like slid in on, in sleeping bags? Yeah.

We ooze up to our seats. Yum. He just buys like four seats. Or at least get those love seat things and just push the arm out. Yeah, we got to lay down on the side with our tails out. It's got to be one of the theaters that serve food. The theater is going to have the most rancid vehicle bucket you've ever seen in your life for this. Oh, 100%.

The tie in bucket is going to suck so bad. It's going to be like reaching into a hut's ass or something. Didn't they do that with the Dune one? Isn't that already basically you just put it on a sock? Yeah. It was a mouth. It was a mouth. Okay.

It was a mess. All right. We need to stand this podcast. Baby bottle. All right. Bye, everybody. Bye. See you at the Mandalorian and Grogu.

No!