Adeptus Ridiculous - DA BIG DAKKA | Warhammer 40k Book Club

Episode Date: May 11, 2024

https://www.patreon.com/AdeptusRidiculoushttps://www.adeptusridiculous.com/https://twitter.com/AdRidiculoushttps://orchideight.com/collections/adeptus-ridiculousOut of options, Ufthak leads his Waaagh! through the mysterious webway, to a place where kunnin’, sneakin’, and thinkin’ are the name of the game. A place with little truck for muscle and brawn – Commorragh, the Dark City.Here, where kabals and haemonculus covens pump psychic viscera into the warp, Ufthak is thrown into gladiatorial combat and soon finds himself up against an archon who will stop at nothing to prove she deserves to rule the Dark City – even if it means bringing Commorragh down around her.But the Drukhari are about to discover that while orks may be simple, very little about them is ever straightforward.Written by Mike Brooks. Narrated by Harry Myers.Support the show

to another book club episode of Adeptus Ridiculous. I'm Bricky. My co-host is D.K. And we chat about the lovely novels that come out from the Warhammer Black Library. Before we start, if you want to check out the awesome podcast, go to patreon.com slash adeptus ridiculous. Get Discord, bloopers, posters, ETC, great stuff. And support us because that's awesome too. And check out the merch at Orchidate.com.

link in the description. I go to Patreon specifically for the ETC. The big DACA. The big DACA. The big DACA. All right. So this novel is written by Mike Brooks, narrated on the audiobook style of side of things

by, I believe Harry Myers was the name. And also is the third, in a sense, basically the third book in the brutal Cunnen's, series, Uftok Blackhawk series, kind of... Continuation of war boss. Well, war boss doesn't really have Uftak in it, but it has snaggy, which is important. So we'll say it's the third in the series, more than anything.

Before we get to started, Shai has a review for the book. Of course. Love to hear it. Oh, you want me to read it or are you good? I can do it. I can do it. You want to do it? Yeah, I got this.

I got this. You do a lot of talking, usually. I'll hit this one. All right. Overall, I enjoyed the big docker. What does the title even refer to? Just orc guns in general or the big gun they capture at the end of the book. Spoiler!

God. It starts off strong, saggs in the middle, and the last 3.5 hours are an absolute joy. On the orc side, see how boy moving to become war boss, how that starts affecting him from getting bigger and faster, but also smarter, which allows him to understand various previously wild concepts like not rushing enemy with suicidal frontal assault, and how that actually disturbs the orc because it goes against his nature and how he tries to adapt to his new smarts to warfare instead of paranoia and doubting himself. Ork portal shenanigans are great and how they terrify the dark Eldar recklessly using warp for the memes. Ork back and forth with

Dark Eldar at the end is an absolute banger, where we see both sides' morals and philosophies clash. Overall, Ork Side is pretty much nailed. Dark Eldar offers really good depiction of them how their society functions or doesn't, through the rise of would-be Archon's rivalries and temporary alliances with various cults, Covens, Arcon, Homunculi, ETC! Love that ETCC. Great look at the Dark City and how weird it is even to the Orcs. how much it sucks and how much it sucks living there. And some hints on how much Rukar hate their own existence,

endless fear of death and infinite torture by Slanesh, which will follow. Always fearing betrayal at every step and being forced to torture others, whether they like it or not to even survive. Weird, but kind of cute. Love story between two backstabbing, lying, cheating, murder, tortures as well, and that was unexpected. Great voice acting by Harry Myers. What I hate!

I don't, fucking grots. Wait, I want to do the, I want to do the what I hated part. Oh yeah, oh yeah, go for it. I just feel like, you know, I got to get some venom out myself. Hell yeah. You know, you know? Yeah, 12 inches of venom. Well, what I hate it.

Fucking grots. I can't stand snaggy and knew from the goddamn start that just like in war boss, the story was leading fucking nowhere. I know it's a running gag that has one of be read Gobbo Gras is trying to become war boss and constantly fails, but I don't find him or his adventures funny or interesting. Honestly, you can just cut him the fuck out of the story and you wouldn't miss anything. Yeah. Lies.

To me, book been sold like sort of gladiator or captioned and being forced to find the arena by Dark Eldar has to figure out how to get out. Here is from the book's description. Out of options, Ufftok leads his wath, the mysterious webway to a place where Cunnen sneaking and thinking are the name of the game. Here where cabals and homunculus covens pumped psychic viscera into the warp, Uftok is thrown into gladiatorial combat and soon finds himself up against an archon who will someone nothing to prove she deserves to rule the dark city, even if it means bringing

Kamarag down around her. Wow, you are actually totally correct. Whoa, that's the book's description? That's a terrible description of the book. That's literally, yeah, that's literally like the last two hours of the book. That's also not even true. Uftok wasn't out of options. He followed them into the webway because he felt like it. Yeah. Because he thought it'd be funny. And he wanted to... Wow, that's a horrible description of the book. Yikes, that's actually terrible. That's genuinely...

That's genuinely misleading. Oh, yeah. A million percent. I mean, it does eventually happen, but wow. Wow. You know, okay. Interesting. So, so Shai says, close to a seven out of ten, but ending three hours, put it up to an eight out of ten.

All right, so eight out of ten. Shai, of the three books in the Orch Trilogy, where is this one place? in between brutal cunnen war boss and, you know, the big DACA. Yeah, yeah, which one was your favorite? And where does this one sit? That's a good question. Because shy is the resident orc fiend. I mean, we all like, we all like orcs, but shy is like, you know.

She's orc-coded. Orc-pilled what might even say. She's orcified. She's fungified be cappin. She's fungus-pilled. She's fungus-pilled. I just make it You make it sound like she doesn't bathe.

Like something about your fungus spilled. It's like, well, it's the fungus beer. I took, I know. Say brutal cunning the most,

then Big Dhaka, then War Boss. All them had their issues, though. I was going to say the same. Well, not exactly the same. I definitely like

Brutal cunning the most. And then I would probably go Warboss. And honestly, I think I might have liked Big Dhaka the least. Really? Out of all three of them. This is a fascinating spread.

I like the big, big docker the most. Oh, and then I probably put, probably, maybe Brutal Cunnen second, and then War Boss third, I think they're about equal.

Okay. Okay. This is fascinating. We're all, we literally hit every part of the spectrum. I mean, I would still give it, like,

I think I'd still put it at like a seven out of ten. Like, it was still enjoyable to read, but I don't know. Interesting. Okay, so, so for the plot synopsis, for the most part, snaggy little tooth after war boss has been thrown into Uftox gang with the Mech Lord. And they are dealing with some spiky gets, as they call them,

and chase them into the Webway because they need to get more loot for the Mechlord and also want some good crumping. For the Tequah. For the Tequah. And then they arrive there. And in there, Dinaris, I forget her name, Master Archon of the Drucari is attempting to gain power over her area, which is Port Tavard of Kamara. And in order to do so, she is making alliances and causing issues with some various other folks like some witches, homunculi, and so on. Yep.

And then she, because Dracari, you know, don't like the orcs, they get at odds with the orcs. and in pretty classic fashion, they underestimate the orcs, and things go sour. Yep, that's, I think that's one of the things I didn't like is it was just another case of like, oh, look, it's another race that have underestimated the orcs, and now their actions have consequences.

And that's literally like every orc book. And it's like, like, do we have nothing else to go with for that? Like, every orc book is like, oh, wow, why did we underestimate the orcs? You just can't ever tell, what they're doing. And it's just, I don't know, that whole like every book treating the orcs the same way in that respect is kind of a, I thought it was kind of a drag. So that's actually interesting you say that because I thought that the non-orc stuff in this one was the best

non-orc stuff of the three of the three books. I like, I think this kills the ad mec and Iron Warriors in the brutal cunning and it like, I mean, there are barely any humans in Warboss, but it like completely bodies that too. Yeah. I'm, I'm weird. Because like one of the reasons I kind of didn't like give this like a 10 out of 10 is because it, it almost feels like it didn't know what kind of book it wanted to be. Like it really wanted to show off the, the Dracari, which it does really well. But then it's like, oh, but we got what this, this is, this is an Uftak book. So we kind of got to show him off and we kind of got to do stuff with him. And then Gratz.

And it's like, I kind of wish it would just like pick what it wanted to be. And like, you know, because it felt more like a dark Eldar book than a, than a big DACA book. Right? And this is fascinating. I got to be honest. I'm, okay. So I will, I want to point on something that Shai talked about, right?

Okay. So Mike Brooks is. our resident orc writer. He has done three orc books. He has. And they're all minimum good. They're minimum B minus. They're in the B's area.

Like I said, I still give it a seven out of ten. Sure. Sure. So I guess that's a C. But like, you know. Yeah. Above average, right? Above average, yeah.

I am very happy with that. I also want a huge shout out to Harry Myers because Harry Myers absolutely slaps the vocals. The dude is like, terminally British. He's so thick on his accent, and even the Dark Eldar sounded like humans a little bit because they've had

like the British accent. Yeah. Can I... Okay, so I loved his depiction of the orcs. But I found that like every Drukari ended up sounding exactly the same. Like Damaris and her rival, um, Ventris, I think was his name. The one that she eventually kind of

sort of falls in love with, but oh no, I'm just doing this to gain power. They literally sounded exactly the same. I don't know if I agree with that at all. Ventress had a very, a very deep talk like this. Yeah, Ventress kind of had that same, oh, well, I'm Ventress. And Demeris was like, oh, well, I'm Demerreux. And it's, I don't know. It just like, it felt like they kind of melded a little bit to me.

Okay. I mean, sure, you know, that's how it was heard. I disagree. They sounded very different to me. Well, I am the stupid one of the group, so... I don't think this has anything to do with intelligence. I think it's just maybe his fears. Maybe.

My old age, I need to put the hearing aids in, dude. I will agree. Sertz and Dark Eldar did sound similar to each other, but the rival guy had this really breathy, like, Oh, this we're going with the icons. And it was pretty distinct for me. Like, the master homunculus, for example, was very clear. True.

The homunculus was very clear. clearly a different voice. Speaking of voices, going, yeah, you okay, dude? I can hear that. Yeah, I'm trying to clear my throat. I don't know what is going on this morning. But yeah, the homunculus was like suitably different,

but I don't know, like, most of the Drukari voices, aside from the homunculus, sounded like really similar to me. And apparently that's just me. My issue more ran towards the fact that the Drukari voices sounded like they could basically just be human voices.

They're basically just various types of like commissars and aristocrats. Yeah. But I mean, that's less of a that's just like a vocal thing. Personal preference, yeah. Well, yeah. I mean like Harry Myers every time there was an orc on screen

and even like even though the Grots parts we have to take some issue with his voices for all the grots I think they're still fantastic. Oh yeah. I loved like because with the grots they were all so very different, like kind of towards the end,

like all of the grots, even if they're just showing up for the first time, all had like a different inflection. Some of them talked fast. Some of them talked slow. Some of them were low. Some of them were high.

And I love his orc voices. I have nothing bad to say about his orc voices. Wasn't a huge fan of the Dracari voices, though. I do very much appreciate that in his voice acting, when he reads the book, he knows what parts of the book. are supposed to be funny. And so very often he'll,

like there's a part, okay, there's a part where Snaggy is talking to a grot. And, and he's like, he says something on the lines of like, well, yeah,

I'm the top cry, don't shast that! And he like screams because he's about to grab something. Yeah, because it's launched in the Trebusha thing. It genuinely like, like,

jump scared me when I was listening to the book. It was really funny. There's a, there's a lot of, like, he knows, how to do the humor really, really well when it comes

to the orc stuff. And I think like, okay, so there was something, it was the, oh, so okay, I was, I'm starting to read like, this is so off topic, I'm starting to read Blood Meridian. What's that? It's just a really, really, really

awful and crazy, dark, Cormec McCarthy book. Oh. But it's not even a 40K book. No, it has nothing to do with it. But the writing the writing of the book is so specific and like and kind of hard to digest that without a VA to like read alongside it's kind of hard to understand it you need to kind of like go back and reread it and so I think uh harry Myers's VA work of this book really helps sell that humor

that the orcs are trying to go for if that makes any sense I would agree there are definitely like moments where his voice acting helps sell the humor so much for sure. Can we also talk about how they meme the, is it a black and gold sky or a blue? I was just say that too. I had a fucking double take. I was like, did they actually do that?

Did they actually do that? Rewind, I must have misheard that. What the, I was like, did you actually make a goddamn, like, the dress meme? I was, I felt like I was living in the twilight zone. Yep, I was, I was floored a little bit.

Yeah. So. God damn, that threw me off so much. Yep. Like I was like, rewind, rewind. There's no way they just did that. Yep. They did that.

Yep. It's the dress meme. Holy. Holy. All right. All right. Insane. So, okay.

So I want to talk. So let's talk about the Grots. I do not naturally dislike Snaggy. I like Snaggy. I like Snaggy. I like Snaggy's concept. I thought this book, they were going to do something with it.

And then they didn't. And then I immediately hated Snaggy again. I think that's the main problem with Snaggy in like all of the books is you think they're going to do something with him. You think they're going to do something with the Grot Revolution. And part of you like I think like there was a part of me that actually started hoping that like he would succeed because he's trying so hard. His stuff is kind of funny.

Oh, it's gross and everything. But it just never goes anywhere. and it just ends up being like useless like maybe kind of pseudo comedy relief because at the end he just gets dunked on again. And like shy said in her like shy said in her little review, like you could completely take out all of the grot stuff. You would miss nothing. That's that's the biggest thing is that I like I had we had the whole snaggy little tooth stuff in Warboss. And it was I was good with it because it looked like they were going to lead somewhere. And then when they didn't, I was like, okay, kind of disappointing, but like, I get what he's going for.

He's going for the Grot Society versus the Ork Society. Bring him in again. Do it again. And I'm like, okay, now we're actually going to do something, aren't we? Because you're setting it up again. And then they didn't. And I was like, okay, you literally wasted maybe five chapters entirely dedicated to this same gag. Yeah.

And I don't know. I thought like, because I thought they were going to do something with it. And I'm a little shocked they didn't. If anything, I feel like they need to make a book that's actually just called the Grot boss. And they actually just fucking do it. Yeah.

Like he just gets his own ship or he gets his own planet. And they actually make a Grot revolution where they actually succeed at making a proper Grot war band. Some kind of short story where like snaggy escapes the new ship that, that oof talk has. And then just like, get him out of there. And then like it's done.

Because it's like, you know, fool me once, shame on me. Fool me twice. Stop it. Fool me twice. You don't,

you don't fool me again. Yeah. And just have him be his own separate thing. And then you can literally start like a whole like anthology of just, just this grot war band that just goes around thinking they're, they're super hot shit. and just look at the shenanigans they get into when they find some tyrannids or when, uh-oh, we've, we found a space marine, this isn't good.

Like, I think that would, I think it would be amusing to see the Grots, this Grot War Band that thinks their hot shit actually interact with, like, other factions and see what sort of, like, you know, haphazard mischiefs they get into. Because in this book, it felt like if you took it out, you could have focused, like, you could have, like, lasered in so much more on, like, orcs versus Drukari and really, like, just zoned in on it.

I mean, it already does, but, like, yeah, all the grot stuff just kind of feels like a waste of time. I would, I would absolutely, I had this mindset, this thought process later on, right? I was thinking,

so we're in spoiler territory at this point. Big spoiler territory. Yep. I kind of thought that, like, the next book was going to be Uf Talk attacking the mech lord. I didn't expect it to just, like,

That kind of felt a little off to me. I was like, we already had the climax of the book. I'm a little shock that we would just get rid of the mechlor right at the end like that. Yeah. It seemed a little bit random, a little like, I didn't hate it. I was just like, oh, we're still going? Okay. Yeah.

But I had the thought process like Snaggy gets his Grot boss and they go live in this place. And then they become like, you know, because Grots operate tanks and kill a cans and stuff. And I can totally see this fun idea where they do a short. story like this and Snaggy gets like this big kill a can for himself and all this kind of stuff. And they get their own little society and then Ufftok maybe like goes to, you know, like runs into them later and they can't really kill each other because now Snaggy's got this like actually decent fighting force. You know?

Yeah. Especially with Uptok specifically saying never put Snaggy in a kill a can. Yeah. I can see this kind of fun idea where like you do a sequel and and Daeneris is like getting revenge and all this kind of stuff. And Uftag is like, you know, dumb spiky gets really came in full force. And then Snaggy's there. And he's got like his big mass group of like grot tanks and Killikans. And they have to do like a begrudging alliance to deal with the Jukari. Like that kind of idea sounds fun. Definitely. But then they just did absolutely nothing and wasted like four

chapters of the book. Yeah. I like that idea that like the grots are just like, oh yeah, well, we fix everything. We handle the ammo. Let's just get our own Killikans, our own tanks, we might be small outside of them, but as long as we're in our kilican, we can totally tangle with the orcs. That would be really dope, actually. But yeah, I wasn't expecting at the end for them to just be like, oh yeah, I'm going to fork to Mechlor, and I'm juiced up on, like, Drukari drugs that inflated me a little bit, so I'm super juiced. And then, yeah, I killed the Mecklord. And now it's the, uh, that did seem to happen, like, really quick. It felt really quick, but maybe it's just because you remember the mechelord so fondly from Brutel Cunnen.

Yeah, yeah. And for the warboss, just get tossed that quick is kind of just like, whoa, okay. Also, no degeneral. I kind of thought we would have the general, you know? There was no degeneral. Yeah, because he was the surviving war boss in Warboss. Yeah, he was the sole survivor, wasn't he? Yeah, well, he was the sole boss, the war boss.

Right, right, right, yeah, yeah. Huh. You know, I hadn't even thought about that until you said it. And now I'm just like, huh, you think he would at least get like a cameo? Yeah, I don't know. He was mentioned once or twice by Snaggy, but that's about it. Well, anyway, those are the parts that were, I think, the biggest issues with the book. Yeah, definitely.

I very much liked Dinaris and her parts. I liked the Jukari stuff a lot, actually. I was not a... upset when they cut to it like I was with every other orc book. Yeah. It's so weird because, like, I, I, too, enjoyed the Dracari parts. And, like, this feels more like a Dracari book. It doesn't, like, it's so weird because, like, it's pitched as, like, this orc book.

And, like, the orcs are a big part of it. Sure. But it just, it feels like a Dracari book. Oh, I think that's the struggle that you run into when you make an orc book, though, is that orcs are so one note. You have to have. Something that's not one note. Yeah, you need to have some other type of thing.

Like, that's, that's kind of the, is it true though? I think it's, I think it's true, Shai. I think, you know, like, if you're going to do a comedy orc only book, no, Gassbook wasn't orcs only. It was the had the Inquisitor and stuff interrogating, and they had that whole thing with the psycher ogren and stuff. Yeah, I mean, I guess that's true. The orcs are so one-note, oh, you don't go get a bit of crumping, that, like,

you kind of need to see how other factions are, like, reacting to their, like, desire to just get into a fight with everything. I guess that's kind of true. Like, you can't have a specifically 100% orc book. I mean, I guess you could, but it'd be weird. So, okay. So I'm thinking, I'm thinking of it like this. You know what? Okay. Here's something that's, like, really, I think we can all agree with. And it's actually something that I think is really genius. Um, I'm, I don't fully remember if we ever like 100% confirmed

that the bigger the orc gets the smarter the orc gets. I know that like gas is really big but gas is really smart. And I thought that was more of a gas thing than it was an orc thing. Yeah. Gas was always smart because he heard,

because he could hear the, the gods talking to him, right? So we all was kind of yeah, but now we have an actual genuine canon metric that or that orcs that become, yeah, me too, dude. I transferred it to you, sorry. But we have an actual metric that orcs that get bigger from their fighting get stronger also.

And that specifically is really fascinating because, and in my opinion, a bit genius if it wasn't actually the case before. Because the biggest problem with orcs is that you couldn't really make really fascinating orc characters outside of a couple funny gimmicks. Captain Badruck is fun because he's a funny pirate. And that's like his schick, right? But now if you make orcs smart by making them big, then you basically get the Necron effect where you can have great characters, but only a few great characters as like the major overlords and stuff.

So you have a few real... Because Uftok, like the part when he talks to Dinaris near the end of the book is like the best part of the entire book. It's great. Oh, yeah, when he's in the cell? Yeah, it's like, it's honestly the best. part of the book for me. Yeah, when they actually start to like understand each other. Like each of them is kind of getting a better girl. Like, DeNaris is, I keep calling her DeNaris.

Her name is not, she's not the queen of dragons. Anyway, um, wait, what's her name? It's, it's like demer. Demerit. Is it not DeNaris? Yeah, DeNaris is the queen of dragons in Game of Thrones. The Arcon is like DeNiris. It's close. Okay, it's close. Yeah. It's close. But anyway, we know who we're talking about. Yeah, but it's, it's like they start getting a grasp on each other and like she's just like oh you love fighting and you get bigger and well i'm just going to leave you in the cell because f off like whatever i'm not dealing with your your shit and it's like oh damn like she's actually that that is a great part of the book i think it's not just that i think it's i think droucari what is probably the best because okay

brutal cunning the the point of it was like okay the ad mech are the most logical and they're fighting a completely illogical enemy, right? Yeah. The Jukari are a different psychological concept, which is they spend their entire lives trying to be as, live as long as they possibly can because death is the most horrifying outcome they could possibly experience. While orcs have no fear of death whatsoever,

they're completely, like, existentially complete. Deneres being so jealous of that, too. like you don't care if you die like what what do you what she was furious about i spent my whole life trying not to die in fearing death i live forever and i worry about that and these simpletons that are just teleporting around all willy-nilly don't care this is bullshit that that i really liked it was a great contradiction between how the orcs feel and everyone else feels. It added

so much so much depth to that whole concept, you know? Definitely. And I think it's one of the reasons why Drew Kari were a really good choice for this book. For all that kind of... Yeah, yeah, you want to go

into the arena and fight powerful monsters until you die. Oof Tuck, don't threaten me with a good time. She is so befuddled by that. She's like, you know you're going to die, right? And he's like, oh, if it's funny or violent, it's good with me. Yeah, like, it's also that that's, it was fascinating because Uftok got even bigger from some homunculus injections or whatever it was.

Yeah. And so, like, when he was talking in the cell, I kind of started thinking to myself, damn, Uftock is sounding like, maybe a bit too intelligent for the orc right now. Yeah, he was shockingly smart. I was like, oh shit, wait, hold on. He's actually like smarter now. Because the first orcline of the entire book was Uftak's head was hurt him, probably from doing all that thinking stuff.

He had to get used to the fact that his brains were actually working. Right. And so just the idea that he got so smart from that and was able to, also I love the fact that was it a Death Watch Marine that he just yeated into the stands? And Death Watch Marine was like, let's go. I was going to ask you, like, what chapter he was from? Because weren't they like, oh, yeah, it was

Blue Armor and its gauntlets were red. And I was like, there's no way that's like a, a Nightlord crime ganger, right? There's no way the Dr. Carrey would have a, right? No, ultramarine then. Okay, gotcha. Or Crimson Fist. That's true.

Yeah, they specifically said Red Fist, and the only one I could remember was like, because you paint your night lords with the with the with the with the with the with the red hair yeah and I was like there's no way there's no way they got a nightler so yeah had to be an ultraman or a crimson fist and and Ovetack tried to reason with him he's like you won't go crumbace guys yeah well what and they made the the lovely thing which is uh he's like seems that sometimes beikies actually will refer if there were no other gets to fight how weird Ah, the beekies. Ah, the beekies. Gotta have a little space marine representation in your war hammer book, right? I just love the idea that he just eats him into the crowd and the space marine just starts laying into people. Sometimes you don't give him a choice, you know? What if he had no choice but to help me get rid of all these guys?

Yep. But no, the Dukhari stuff was really, really good. It was a great juxtaposition. to, and contradiction to the orcs, like philosophically, conceptually. I really like the master homunculus. I'm very sad. He, he, he died. I mean, he might, maybe he'll regrow. I don't know. I mean, he could be in a vats and where surely homunculus or homuncular, I have to have like, contingency plans for if they die, right? They said he died, like, but, you know, maybe they didn't die. Him specifically is, is great. I really, I really,

liked I don't know I mean there were some parts that I was iffy on like I didn't like her brother he was just kind of like a plot device

at the end that they didn't really care about yeah I mean they revive him at the beginning and then he shows up and then they kind of like

oh you're not and yeah he kind of just gets used as the fuel source for the uh Drukari ship that of text deals

also what kind of ship is that and what's that big ass gun at the bottom is that like a dark lance a dark lance a dark land

So a dark lance is basically like an Eldar Las Canaan. It's a, it's a dark Eldar carry, regular Eldar have bright lances. It's dark elder have dark lances. It's basically just an anti-tank gun, but it's a massive one. On a massive scale. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a, it's a void battle dark lands. Okay.

Right. Yeah, so the ship was just like a dark Eldar craft. It's a, okay, it's just a ship. Gotcha. But, but no, they were all fun. I, I enjoy. I actually had no idea that they, that they had that as the name for the book. Because I would argue that the Coliseum part was like that whole section was the most fun part of the book.

Yeah. I really liked, I loved how they had a Eldar strapped to the table and then the succubis just walked up and like carved a piece of the thigh off and started eating it. Like, would you like to try some? Yeah. Just awful, awful dark Eldar crap. Yeah, very casually, very casually does it. And they have him strapped to the table so tight that it's like, oh yeah, he tried to squirm, but, mm-mm, nope. And yeah, it's such, like, I feel like the description of the book and the name of the book are all wrong.

Like, the description Shai showed us is all wrong, calling it de big DACA all wrong, because it only shows up kind of sort of towards the end when Oothack just wants to nick the shit, because it's got the biggest gun on it. Like, it feels like there was a little bit of a, a problem in actually, like, marketing the book. Yeah, it's shy. I made a good point.

You want to make people mad, mention the Suckiebus lady was trans. Oh, yeah, because they can be male, female. They're not like, that's, that's true. That was, that was actually a bit of an interesting thing. So, so I guess the way that they do the whole, like, the muse of the Eldar is like,

okay, Banshee, you are like a feminine character. Whether you start an office feminine doesn't really matter. But you make your way to fit that mold because the Howling Banshee is an aspect warrior that represents like an Eldar god in a way. And I guess a succubis and the witches and like the Hecatrix blood brides are in a bit of a similar kind of style. It's kind of a fascinating concept. It's a nice little, you know, it's a nice little point to put it. in. Again, it's just a nice little

view of like the Drukari. Like, it felt like this should have been like, it feels like this should have been marketed as a Dracari book. See, I'm not, in that case, then every single one of the Ork book should have been marketed as a other book. Well, maybe not, maybe not War Boss, but.

Yeah, war boss, you kind of, yeah, that did. But, but like, I don't know. Like, I get the reason for it. I get why you want to have the various, why you need the other perspectives. Especially if you take those four Grot chapters out and it's like, look, we put in more Jukari stuff and you make it. Like, I don't know.

It's just, I don't know. Honestly, if you pulled the Grot chapters, I think you extended the Coliseum stuff by another chapter, give or take, because Uf Talk only fighting two people in the Coliseum was kind of bull. I expected like minimum five. Yeah. But he himself is like, great. You know?

Yeah. He does fight off five of the greatest Drukari fighters that exist. So. I must say, I found the entire Drukari stuff to be really good. I also am very happy that whatever the fuck, Queen of the Dragons. I'm glad she lived. I think, I'm very glad she lived. I genuinely think that she could be a really good villain in the,

the future. I just liked her, her story. You know, I would have enjoyed it if they maybe worked that romance in there a bit more seamlessly. They only, it was a little like random at the end. That could have like a little bit more.

The, the romance definitely felt like, oh yeah, we're in the heat of combat. Oh my, you're so cute. Oh, do you really think so?

Oh, I really do. Ooh. And it's like, where the, did this come from? It kind of came out of nowhere. I won't,

yeah, it kind of came out of nowhere. I was like, wait, all right, cool, but like, okay, whatever. Cool, but where? Yeah, but what? Don't these two, like, hate each other? Haven't they been looking for a reason to backstab each other?

Like, the whole, well, I guess that's kind of height. They still might. They still might. I was going to say, well, in Drukari culture, that might be the way to hit on someone. Like, I really liked how Uftak was looking at the audience. And there was a statement where he was like, people were cheering and doing stuff. And some people were doing things that they probably would have assumed that no one was around to see them doing.

But in the Jukkri, like, no, no, no, we hope more people see us. Oh, yeah, everybody watched this. Yeah. Yeah, like, if we, we had like three to four Grot chapters. If we took those chapters and we, like, added one to the Coliseum, one more to Jukari, and one more to Uftak and the boys, I would have been pretty all right. Yeah, it would have been, if that was the case, I probably would have bumped it up to like an eight, maybe a nine.

You know, I will admit, though, they revealing that other little tidbit of Drukari lore, the tidbit where Drucari children are not naturally indisposed to torture. Oh, right. They have to learn how to love torture was actually like, you know, whenever you think about Dracari, you think, oh, we're going to make it more and more screwed up. But normally you think of it in like a dumb way where it's like, oh, we're going to do like a demon children. Lbasa thing where it's like, oh, look how horrible it is. They actually made them more awful by going with a, like a philosophical section of it, like an existential bit to it. I was like, oh, damn, that's screwed up.

Yeah, it's that idea of like, no one is born evil. You have to be taught evil. And like the Dracari really teach them young. And it's just, okay, I didn't always hate everyone. And then I just grew to love it because mom was always torturing someone. Yeah. That, that was really, that was really fascinating to me because they were like, oh, if you, uh, if you don't, if you don't do that, you leave and you go with like the, the craft worlds or the,

um, uh, or the exudites. Mm-hmm. I don't, that, that was really good. I don't know. I, I liked the big docket the most. I think because we needed, we, like, of all of the non-orch characters, I think Drucari were the best fit and the ones I actually cared about the most. Like I would have been sad if What's Her Buckets died at the end.

I was hoping that she wouldn't. And that's more than I can say for the brutal cunning ad mech folks, for example. Yeah, I really like the Dracari parts. Definitely, like you said, they're the best foil so far for the orcs. So you can't really disagree with that. Also kind of loved how shocked the. your car were that the orcs were just teleporting like it didn't matter. I like that too with like, oh my God, you're opening us to the warp.

What are you doing? Are you crazy? She who thirst is going to see that. And yeah, they still just willy-nilly and, you know, yeah. Damn. Yeah, no. And wasn't it like at the end they were like, oh, we see a bunch of chaos stuff forming around Kamran and Port Tavern?

Should we go back and deal with him? He's like, nah. Nah. They're not going to have fun with that, but ah. That is, shy makes a great point. It's like, OofTog is like,

I like teleporting because everything gets all weird and purple with big teeth. Sometimes the teeth try to bite you. And that's fun. Orks would probably love transitioning through the immaterial. That's fair. I did, I did find the, okay,

even though all the grot stuff was off, was not great, which is unfortunate because like, the writing of it is like, fine. Like the humor I'm okay with. Yeah. Nothing happens with it. It just doesn't lead to anything. Like the grot stuff is fine. It's amusing.

It's hilarious. It's well written. It's well voiced. But it just, it's a big nothing burger. I gotta be honest, I think it's hilarious that us as org fans are like typical grots, the worst part of the story. Truly, we are all orc built. But the, I found the end, even though the grot stuff was all a little bit annoying, The ending bit where they leave all the grots at the end And all the Jukari like pull out their shanks with these big ass grins

I find that to be both a humorous and horrifying visual Just for them to be like oh boy But then the idea of like certain wounded cabalites being teleported with the orcs of the ship and like freaking the fuck out Because it's like no no no no don't teleport me no no no no no and they like scream and just disappear It's like ooh Yeah spooky We've got plenty of fuel for that Dracari ship now.

It's good stuff. You know, there's a lot of, I don't know, I liked the big DACA. I did not realize that that was the description because holy hell. That is so not correct. Yeah, it's really bad. If anybody's still watching this, listening to this, don't go by the description of that book. I mean, of course, if you've made it to this point, you've already been spoiled on the whole thing anyway, so who cares? But yeah, that's awful description. Still kind of think it deserves a

different name, too, because the big DACA as a name for the book kind of sort of doesn't make any sense either, but, you know, still enjoyed it. Wasn't my favorite. Still enjoyed it. Seven out of then. All right, fair. I would probably give it like an eight. I give it like a B. I, the last ending, the ending in the beginning, I really, really liked. Cut the Grott stuff out. I'm pretty, I'm pretty happy with it. I would not hate a future book either with... Did they say they're doing a Droukari-led book soon? Ooh, they should.

I mean, especially... You've got the perfect duo for it. And now you've really expanded on Drucari lore and shown what they were like. They absolutely should. I thought that there was right. Oh, that's right, that's right. Okay, so Mike Brooks is writing a Lelith Hesperax novel. that's right.

Leeleth Hesperax. She's the name desucubus. Oh, okay. Got you. Yo, okay, hold on. This book cover goes so hard. Whoa! That's the cover?

Yo, okay. When this comes out, I think I have to buy the physical copy just for that. Sorry, that's the special edition. Here's the normal book. Oh. Which is also fine, but the special one. Dude, when does that special one go on sale? Is it on sale?

Can I pre-order it? Like, I literally want to just display that on my shelf. I have no idea when this is coming out. But it's done by Mike Brooks, and obviously, you know, he's on his good or. Droucari stuff was great in this book. So love that. I'm curious. Okay, so Lelith is like the named succubis.

So there's like, the, the name. Named Archon would be like Asdrabeil Vect, even though you can't play as him on the tabletop. And then the named homunculus would be Uri and Rackarth. This is the named succubis. Gotcha. Okay. I wouldn't, I mean, I wouldn't hate if perhaps, you know, Dinaris Queen of the Dragons was interested in getting her part of Kamaraw set up and she has to broker a deal with

Leleth or something. That'd be kind of... Oh, yeah. I mean, I would love it. I mean, having a Hesper,x book, great. Honestly, I think you could do a whole anthology of books just based on Queen of Dragons and her boy toy.

Oh, interesting. So what have we got here? So, Leelith is, it isn't long into her journey away from Comerog that Leelth narrowly dodges in Assassin's Blade and the great political games of the Dark City reel her back into the very life she was looking to escape. Unfortunately, as long as just any foe that's taking her shot at the Queen

and missed, all signs point back to the living muse himself as Drabail Vect. And the nominal ruler of Kammerich, and the nominal ruler of Camarog is only too ready to ensnara Lilith in his schemes. All right, all right. Okay, okay. I like Vect. I love me some Vect. All right, all right. And hey, again,

I'm down for more Drucari books. You know? And Mike Brooks seems to know what he's doing when he's writing the Dracari. So, hey, we're all eating good in the neighborhood. It's very fascinating. Mike Brooks is a great author. He's clearly, like he did Son of the Full.

forest, which is amazing. And he's had three orc books and all the orc parts have always been good. The Grot stuff, not as fun sometimes. And, you know, he struggled with like ad mec a little bit back in Brutal Cunning. Yeah. But I would make me laugh so hard if Leleth Hesperax is like a lion's son of the forest level written book. And then it's just like, damn it, is it the orcs that are the problem? Is this the issue? Yeah. I, we'll see. We'll see how, how, how. the Lelith book goes, but if Lelith ends up being Lion's Son of the Forest thing, it's like, well, maybe stop, like, you know, as much as it would pain me

to not have funny orc books, it's like, well, your non-orc stuff is pretty, as the kids say, it's pretty poggers. It's pretty pogg-woggy, so, you know, maybe. I'll see. Anyway, Shai, did you have recommendations for another book of any kind that you want to think you should listen to?

Right. What are our options for the next book club? She has an idea. Oh, it's an orc book. Well, hopefully not. I would say no to that then. It's shy. Like, it's an orc book. Correct. I would be like, please no, not again. Are there any more orc books? There are, but I haven't liked great things.

Those are the only three that I've heard anything about. Brutal Cunnen was the one I heard the most about. And obviously, Boer Bossin, the Big Dhaka was through Shy. So I had no idea there were other. The Big Docker. You know, it really, like, that's a good point. What even is the goddamn The Big Dhaka? It probably is just the giant Darklans on the ship that he wants, that he wants to steal to get out of Kamara.

It doesn't really have any, like. Yeah, that's the only big DACA that really grabs him. Yeah. It's the only one. It's not the right name for the book. It needs to be literally anything else. Yeah, that's true. We just talk about Armageddon, have lots of requests for Hell's Reach.

Or maybe we can do the fate. Wait, was that your idea with those three? I thought you had like a specific book in mind. I mean, those are still ideas. Oh, nah. Let's see. So what was the book we did before this again? So this was, this is a Wormos before this.

Oh, was it Warboss before this? Oh, was it Warbos? I thought, yeah, wasn't it? We did Warboss, and then it was like, well, you know, big DACA is basically a sequel to that, so we went right into that, right? I guess that's, okay, so we did two Zenos books. What book do we do before those two? Was that, oh boy, I do not remember what the book before that was.

I'm trying to think, like, okay, if we did an Imperium book before that, we can do like a chaos book next, basically. It wasn't, it wasn't a assassin-oram, was it? That was a while ago. No, God, no, that was a while ago. I can't remember what we did before Warposs. Oh, I think it was Eisenhorn. Oh, or was this, or was the lion's son of the forest.

Right, right, right, right, right, right. Maybe I thought it was Eisenhower. God, Son of the forest was so good, too. How did I forget that that was the last one we did? Well, in that case, we've done, we've done two Zenos books and then an Imperium book. I think it's only right that we do a chaos book next to that case. Ooh. You know what?

Should we just do it? Do it? Let's just do Horace. Let's just do Horace Rising. Horace Rising. Okay. Let's just do the first book of the Horace heresy, the original, the OG. The OG.

All right. I think that'll be a popular choice. It's Dan Abnett, who's an amazing writer. It's Toby Longworth, who is an incredible VA, one of my favorites. Okay. It's 12 hours, so it's a bit chunkier. Yeah, not too bad, though. Still pretty, you know, it's not like it's a 24-hour epic or something, right?

On the list of, like, new books that people should read. Like, this is the first of the Horace heresy. So, like, this is your first one. And honest to God, I've heard that as amazing as it is, like, it would not be the same. Like, 40K as a genre would not be the same if Horace Rising was not as good as it was. because it starts out like this is the first book of space marines for a lot of people and it's it opens very very strong okay i i've i've never read any of it i i um yeah i i i'm excited you're really hyping this up though i'm really hyping this up for me a little bit so i'm excited and i

i i hope it fits the bill all right same well then everyone Thank you for listening. Appreciate you very, very much. Thank you for supporting our podcast. And we'll see you next month with, uh, shit, horace rising. Horace rising. Hell yeah, brother. Let's go.

That horacee. Oh, God.