Adulting - #16 Dating, Boyfriends & Female Sexuality with Olivia Petter

Episode Date: September 9, 2018

This week I speak to one half of the independent's @millennial_love podcast, and also one of my best friends of over 10 years; about dating, female sexuality, how family relationships effect romantic relationships and lots more. I hope you enjoy- as always please do rate, review and subscribe! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Gambling problem? Call 1-866-531-2600. Or visit connectsontario.ca. Select games only. Guarantee void if platform or game outages occur. Guarantee requires play by at least one customer until jackpot is awarded or 11pm Eastern. Research and supply. See full terms at canada.casino.fandu.com. Please play responsibly. Hi guys and welcome to Adulting. This is the podcast where we try to figure out what it means to be a grown-up and today I am joined by one half of Millennial Love, Olivia Petter. Hello! And Livvy also happens to be one of my best friends of like over 10 years. Is it over 10

years? I think so because we're 24. How old were we when we went to prep school? 13. Weren't we 11? No we were 11. Yeah I think so. That's more than 10 years. Yeah. Wow. That is a long time. So we thought we'd talk about today like dating, relationships and love because everyone's always asking about this. Obviously Libby's podcast is about dating and Livvy and I have had the most disparate loving adventures over our lives. Loving adventures? Yeah we've had very different experiences with dating. So like I think I've had like maybe like three big relationships starting like my first proper relationship was from the age of 14 and it was like really serious like I thought I was going to get married. Oh my god yeah it was really intense sorry my brain is a bit slow today we're both slightly hungover yeah no it was really intense wasn't it how long were you together I always thought it was like three years but I'm sure it can't have been that long god that is that is long when you're that age though when you're 14

14 15 16 17 that's those are really like transformative years to be in a relationship with someone what's your dating history my dating history is basically i have been single for my entire life um um no i have i only really started dating properly in the last year i think i kind of there was a guy at school that kind of screwed me around for ages um and that I think really messes you up when you're that age because when you're 15 16 17 18 the people that you like then I think you like a lot more intensely than you would as an adult because hormones and you know you're a bit more of a fantasist about it it's the first person you get feelings for it's it seems so much more romantic in your head than it actually is and you just project all these feelings onto

that person that aren't necessarily real yeah i think it's also because it's like your first experience of like having a like do you remember having a crush at school oh my god it's like painful yeah it's all consuming and and there's something quite like sadistic about being in that yeah like longing state and you're like oh but it's something really like artistic about this is oh my god i was actually thinking this when i was watching a film with our other friend bethany the other day and there was a bit where there was like heartbreak and i actually for a split second was like i actually think i like being heartbroken because there's something really romantic about that like despair and like i basically thought to myself i was like that's when you feel alive and I was like what is wrong with

me I know when you're really sad and like really upset that's when you feel like life is so like real yeah because you're like god I'm so tortured but we're really similar in this way because we're both like massive romantics oh my god yeah but I think it's actually really damaging it's quite damaging for me and it's it's I mean that's why like I never really dated anyone until I you know even through university um which is when most people start dating properly I had like a few weird flings with people but you know like two or three dates and that was it nothing ever happened I think our friendship group is actually really evenly split between people like me who start having boyfriends quite early and then

people who just never really started dating until like now in the past few years yeah i guess so yeah i think most people in our friendship group they have had relationships i don't think there's actually that many people aside from i mean that's why rachel and i do the podcast like we're you know she's one year older than i am also never been in a relationship when you when we were growing up and when you didn't have a boyfriend Did it make you feel a kind of way Like were you like Did you want one

Or were you just like This isn't for me Or No I mean The boys that I liked Never really seemed to like me back To be completely honest with you I think had they liked me back

I probably would have Wanted a relationship I mean I screwed my one chance At a relationship up with this guy that then Screwed me over for four years Like that was my one shot And I screwed it up By getting with his best friend

At a party And then when I realised Like can I swear Oh shit I really like him And then I remember coming back To school and Being like yeah I remember coming back to school and being like okay yeah I'm actually ready to give this a go and like he really liked me before for like you know six months or something and I was kind of like oh no you know I'm just gonna flirt with you and

enjoy the attention and then I got back to school I think for sixth form and I was like yeah really like this guy and he started dating someone else yeah Yeah, that I totally remember so vividly. And it was, it crushed me because, I mean, crushed me more than it should have done. And it really, really threw me. And then he continued to mess me around for the duration of his four-year relationship. But I think, do you know what else with you? I think it's so, like, what's the word?

Because of your personality, Livvy does things so well I don't know anyone that works really hard she's like really good like you're really good at doing things well

so I think when you want something like because it didn't work that killed you whereas I'm quite good at being like oh well yeah no I'm terrible

whereas you like you achieve you work really hard and you achieve things and you do you're really like she's really successful and she does things

very well so I think like that translates into a relationship so when that didn't work out with him you were just like what the fuck I think I failed yeah that's it I think I think that's what it is you have a really like you really like high achiever yeah but it's it's it's affected me even even in relationships now like that so when I started dating someone uh in like October last year only for like three months and and then when

that ended that was him ending it with me I was completely devastated because even though I knew the whole time like you know this isn't really he's not a great guy he's not really treating me very well you were always telling me he's so awful and all my friends when it ended they were like well thank god it's ended because had we met him we all would have hated him i know because he treated you like shit um but when that ended i was like oh my god what is wrong with me and i feel like it's such a personal attack and it makes me think what am i lacking what's not good enough about me and it's and it's awful because no one should ever mean to feel like that but it's just your natural reaction when someone says I don't want to see you anymore you're like what have I done rejection's awful

but also I think when it was we started doing that way younger so I started going through rejections or getting like difficult times or people didn't act like from 14 but you're doing it now so I actually think it's almost it's almost harder and also when you're little I think you're a bit more resilient like because you've only just started doing the same thing you've got a whole this is like whenever you want to do something I want to be like no you shouldn't do something I can't say that because I was the most wild child so I had to like hold back and be like no you just have to do it but it's like what did it when when we were in relationships did it make you feel like you were left out not really no um and because because I never wanted a boyfriend just for the sake of having a boyfriend

I only ever pined for specific people which makes me sound like a sad little dude no that's good you're not meant to just go out with anyone no no because like I I don't know I never I just no I didn't really feel left out and to be honest I don't really think I was ready yeah I don't think I was emotionally mature enough I still don't know if I'm emotionally mature enough to be honest I don't really think I was ready yeah I don't think I was emotionally mature enough I still don't know if I'm emotionally mature enough to be honest like I'm seeing a guy now who is a bit more into things than I might be and I'm not I'm not sure how I feel about it it's freaking me out I don't think it's that you're not emotionally mature enough I think it's that you are mature when I was this and I got into that relationship I literally used to come to think of like topics that we could speak about because we just weren't like in any way shape or form really that compatible like think about him now

and yeah but I was so little I was like oh this is my boyfriend now great and then we just literally stayed together I loved his mum as well so much that's why I stayed with him do you remember I was like obsessed with his mum she was such a babe so I like never really broke up with him that wasn't emotional maturity that was immaturity not realizing that I was just with a person like you said in your episode the other day like for the sake of having a relationship yeah so i wouldn't do that now but i think actually what it is now is you're almost so hyper aware of things and because you haven't had a relationship yet you're being like really cautious about it yeah i am cautious but equally i hate it when people tell me oh you've never had a relationship is it because you're too picky yeah because that's that's a really negative comment and it shouldn't be a negative thing

like to be picky we should be picky well exactly you should be picky but it but it implies that you're being picky on a superficial level like when you say picky it sort of implies that okay I have a checklist they need to be tall they need to have dark hair they need to be funny they need to do this for a living. They need to do this. And really, I'm picky about the relationship with the person. Yeah, but I think that could be picky because I think that's you inferring that. Because obviously you're like,

if you ask someone what their type is, I remember asking Matt what his type was and waiting for him to say what they look like. And he was like, loud, opinionated. Do you know what I mean? It's not, a type isn't necessarily, it's what you think. But I don't think pickiness is a bad thing but also maybe it's a um people might be saying that as a deflection of themselves like other you might make other people feel like the other way

around like shit am I just settling you know yeah I know what you mean but I don't know I guess I've never really felt like I've never really felt peer pressure to do anything yeah to be honest with you and now you haven't even though I used to like run off and smoke at school everyone would get really annoyed at Livy because she wouldn't come we'd be like Livy we'd all be like getting drunk in the Indian and like smoking behind bike sheds and all of our group would go and Livy just be like I'm not gonna come no I kind of just do what I want to do which is which is good and bad yeah it's good and bad because then if someone tries to make me do something I don't want to do I'm like no I'm such a walkover I literally I'm like okay yes i'll come whereas i'm like no no

i'm not drinking tonight like for example alcohol yeah it's really true with alcohol so i will often go out and maybe not drink and you know my friends will be like why aren't you drinking that's so weird and it like it brings out an insecurity in them yeah which i just think is so bizarre this is what i used to do we talked about this like not that long ago but years ago i'd always do this i'd try and like force livy to drink with me because i'd be so pissed off that she didn't like why do you not want to drink with me and then i realize now that i'm older because sometimes i now actually have grown up out of drinking don't want to do it i'm like i'm so sorry i understand now but what my point is that it's similar to the to the boyfriend thing yeah like you know yeah all my friends have had boyfriends I've never felt that I'm necessarily left out or in any way I just and you know I like talking

about dating obviously I have the podcast I love listening to people and absorbing their you know concerns and trying to give them advice because I feel like I know my friends very well and I can give them advice based on you know what I think is best for them it wasn't a loaded question it's more because I feel like I get people messaging me quite a lot being like I've never been in a relationship what's wrong with me or like people can feel like if you're one in a group of people that are doing something maybe that doesn't apply to you because as you say you're quite headstrong and you do what you want to do but I know that a lot of insecurities that I get from girls and women that listen is that like when is there

going to be a right time why haven't I been from girls and women that listen is that like, when is that going to be a right time? Why haven't I been the one? And I was just interested to see whether or not you felt like. No, I have definitely had those feelings. I've had those feelings of, that's not necessarily about other people though. That's more about me feeling unwanted. Yeah. And feeling like I've always liked these guys that aren't interested in me.

What am I doing wrong? And I don't want to lower my standards and I don't want to you know necessarily go for the guys that maybe like me but I'm not attracted to yeah I don't want to settle for less just for the sake of it but I think you know for people who are listening that are like oh god I've never had a boyfriend what's wrong with me it just feet it's just it's it feeds into the general stigma of being single that we spoke about on the podcast the other day it's like we are conditioned to think that being single is a problem that needs solving if you're a woman if you're a woman yeah not whereas if you're a man you're a bachelor and you you know you can sleep with whoever you want and it's fine

whereas if you're a woman it's like no you must find someone and have babies with them yeah and it's it's just ridiculous but i do think that is that's fading and i think if you're single and you're happy being single make the most of the spare time that you've got to just indulge yourself in the hobbies that you like and and you know training going to the gym like seeing your friends because frankly if you're in a relationship even if you're just dating someone it takes up so much of your time and the other thing is i have to say like i it does make me feel like it's like having a pet or a child that you can't just want what if i just wanted to go not that i would do this but i was thinking like if i wasn't out on that i would have probably gone traveling this year yeah no you look yeah you do you lose you lose a sliver

of your autonomy yeah you do when you're in a relationship and i think that you know it's important just to prioritize yourself because you know you're not gonna the truth is you're not gonna get yourself into a relationship if you're not feeling confident and I think the other thing with relationships and like meeting people that people it's I think sometimes what happens I feel like maybe sometimes with you is that you're like so ready to kind of like you sometimes I think you just have to experience I know you've had bad dates and stuff so maybe not necessarily you but people feel like they'll know when you know but actually I think you just have to kiss lots of different people date lots of different people I agree because

sometimes I've there was a guy that I did at uni once um but it turned out he was a Jehovah's Witness that didn't work out I love I remember that story and I really liked him and he was so not anything about my type but I just really fancied him really and he's like smoked loads of weed and like it's so random like it so wasn't my type but yeah it had to end because um I went around to his house and I was like why don't you have a Christmas tree and it was like really no Christmas not that you would have a Christmas tree either because my religion I was like oh you're Jewish he was like no I'm a Jehovah's Witness I started laughing and I was like what's your parents like going knock on people's doors sorry if anyone's Jehovah's Witness listening it's just I'm quite atheist so it just didn't match up and then we started talking about like brad

transfusions and i was like would you take one and he said no and i was just like i don't think i can do this and then i left yeah and we talked about evolution he was i don't believe in evolution yeah he was like that didn't happen yeah but an enriching experience really interesting but the point was that like i would never fancy him he just happened to live with one of my girlfriends from uni and then i used to go around and i'd like speak to him notes and after a while i really fancied him but if you'd put if you'd put him on a dating app or if you'd put him in a bar i would never ever have either swiped right or like gone up to speak to him so it's really interesting how much we presume we know about what we want yeah well that's why dating apps

are so problematic because so much so dating apps are obviously purely aesthetic platform even if you're you know even if you read the bio and you look at the height and all that shit it's still aesthetic because it is a curated profile it's false it's completely artificial that is a person on a screen that is not a real person standing in front of you whose expressions you can interpret whose voice you can hear whose mannerisms you can observe like those are the things that attract you to someone definitely so it's so difficult like there are so many people i'm sure i've swiped left on dating apps too who if i met in real life i'd find like really charming and attractive it's it's really difficult and i've been on dating app

dates quite a few of them that have been complete disasters yeah but it's weird because you get on with them so well when you're chatting because obviously when you're chatting just on a phone texting someone that person has the time to consider your message and yeah after very witty clever response this is what's so funny so I've actually never really used dating apps there's only like a tiny bit uni and I remember speaking to the guy that I ended up going out on I know it wasn't even on dating but it was on Facebook and I remember I used to write I've made myself so funny I wrote the funniest shit I've ever written in my life I even used to read them back and be like god I'm hilarious and then I was like that's I'm not I remember then when we went to go on the date I was like fuck I'm not I'm gonna have to like practice things I'm gonna say because

I've made it so funny like you couldn't talk like that out loud yeah you wouldn't be just that funny I don't think I've ever been that funny since to be honest but i'd really i'd really think about it i really it was quite actually it's quite manipulative because i really understood his sense of humor and i really like changed my language and the way that i spoke to be like that it is though it is manipulative because i think subconsciously you're always trying with dating apps you're always trying to craft the best version of yourself in order to attract that other person and you really have the power to do that on a dating app like i said you can spend ages you know dissecting every message and thinking okay i think he'll find this funny you can't do that in real life no not at all and and it's a totally different way of interacting

with someone like it's it's not natural even the idea of meeting someone off a dating app it's forced from the beginning yeah and I've had it before I've had I've had maybe one good um dating app story but it ended badly because he he ended up just treating me like crap yeah because he felt validated to do that because we had no ties to one another and I think because of the way that we met he always viewed me as disposable like when you meet someone on a dating app you can you know you can sleep together you And I think because of the way that we met, he always viewed me as disposable. Like, when you meet someone on a dating app, you can, you know, you can sleep together, you can go on dates, whatever. Ultimately, at the end of the day, you met this person in an artificial way. It's not going to be the same as if they were a mutual friend.

I literally have a guy friend who would go on dates just because he wanted to eat in different restaurants. So he'd, like, literally take a girl on a bumble date just because he'd, like, want someone to go to a restaurant. And he was, like, basically doing it as, like, a social experiment. Right. Do date just because he'd like want someone to go to like. He was like basically doing it as like a social experiment. Right. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. Which is really funny.

I think the other problem is with dating and stuff is we think like we're so busy to create this person we think everyone's going to fancy. And like that was always my thing that I'd want them to fancy me. The guy I'm going out with now who's also like one of Livvy's like best friends has known me the almost same amount of time as Livvy. And I was such a shit at school. Like he knows everything I've ever done in my whole entire life like all the bad things about me and he still quite likes me so fine but that really shocks me because I remember I'd meet people and I'd try and think about all the things that they probably wouldn't like about me if they found out or you know and actually people aren't that black and white and it's not that simple and the problem with dating

apps and stuff is you present this version of yourself that isn't you at all so even if they fancy you from that that's not even who you are yeah it's like really hard to make it work and you're never because you're never going to feel comfortable around that person because you met them in this weird way when you were behaving not yourself like it's just it's not the good basis for any relationship but saying that some of our good friends are in very good relationships from meeting or dating apps so there are anomalies to it it's just I think it's more and more common now um but i think it also really depends how you're coming at it what it's the same with anything in a relationship though it's like what point in your life you're in because the other thing is like you could meet the most perfect

person but if you're not in the right place it just won't work i've had relationships work but i thought they were dicks but actually they were probably dicks and i wasn't ready to be the right kind of person either so like it's really i think you have to be really fierce like I think you have to be really fiercely independent have your whole like your personality and yourself ready to have someone add to your life yeah you do but it's hard to to you know I like like you said I'm a pretty headstrong person yeah the guys I've seen in the past and the guys I've dated, have made me feel so small and so bad about myself. And feel like, you know, I've been made to feel like I'm chasing after them the entire time. And that I will change my personality to fit into their mould of the kind of girl that they're looking for.

Yeah, well I think the other issue is that we're, in society, like the kind of men we are normally told to find attractive from films and books and stuff. Are the bad guys, the sexy guys, the ones with a bit of edge, the ones who, so we then tend to go for them and then want to change them. I will tell you this for a fact, you can't change anyone. Even if they're like 18 to 27, you just can't change someone. Once someone's aware,

and they can change themselves if they want to, but there's no, you just, people are just how they are. So there's no point getting with someone and being like, I'm going to make them change. Like you just have to, you have to find the right kind of person for the right reasons and i think sometimes we date people because they're a projected image of what society has told us is the right person and you almost know they're going to hurt you because that is exactly what that kind of person is yeah but that's what you've been conditioned to find attractive exactly because you're like i need you know it's masochistic You chase after someone that makes you feel like they need to be chased.

And also. Because you're like, it's going to be so much more gratifying when I get them. Yeah. And also as women, we're conditioned to think that like, we can't be too vocal because it'll be bossy. Yeah. Or we can't be too opinionated because they'll get scared off. So I think other things you'll find is that women will like mute down their personality

to not offend or to make sure that they're, this guy doesn't run off. When actually, if you're going to start dating someone, you should like look this is how i feel about xyz i want this this this because otherwise you set a precedent and you could be hiding in this like fake personality for like a year and then suddenly you're like oh my god i hate it when you do this i hate it and you'll have just done yourself a disservice yeah and men i think there was what was that i was listening to maybe it's on the receipts podcast but saying how like this guy was on there and they were like people want opinionated women. I don't know why we're taught that women are supposed to be, like, the fairest sex. It's such an old trope,

and, like, that women are supposed to be docile. Yeah. I know, but it's so true. Like, I think I told you this story when I was dating the guy who I met on Bumble, and we were on a date, and he was talking about his ex-girlfriend, and he was, he was quite rude about her, and he was like, oh, yeah, you know what? She was just a really angry person oh my god yeah and i remember in my head my reaction was like okay don't be angry don't ever be angry how awful is that but that was the first thing i thought of i was like i took that as like an instruction when actually first of all he should not have been speaking badly about his ex-girlfriend in front of a girl who he's on like what a third date with that's a really bad sign yeah for someone speaks badly about exes like you

know obviously we've all got bad experiences but it's it's your own business at that point you know and like don't start slagging off someone and also if she's angry maybe he was making her angry exactly exactly now i'm like what the hell were you doing to make her angry i see why she was angry you're an arsehole yeah he is an arsehole but this happened to me I remember had an awful ex in my like first year of uni and he told me always went on about he had a psycho ex-girlfriend it turned out he was literally like the most awful person you've ever met and I was like he's the psycho but I and then I felt so sorry for this girl because in my head I'd imagine he told me these stories and then it just turned out and I've had another friend who had a boyfriend a bit like that and he always went on about the psycho ex-girlfriend, and at the end we were like,

he's the psycho. But when people are like that, they project it, and they, it's normally when someone's very narcissistic, and like really can't see how toxic their behaviour is. And they, they perceive other people's reactions to them as like, their fault, but they don't realise it's a reaction to their actions. Yeah, and how would you know that, because you're just taking what he says at face value. The psycho ex-girlfriend thing Really bothered me

Because I think that's such Like a sexist trope Isn't it It's so bad No man's ever called a psycho No never Ever It's really

It's massive Have you seen that thing It's so bad I remember laughing in it Like three years ago When I wasn't very work When I wasn't very work It's like the hot crazy scale

And it's like The hotter they get The crazier they get And then it's like a box So it's like And it's a guy On a whiteboard And he's like

So between like a seven and an eight They're like super high But they have to be below The line I can't remember And then it gets like Really high in the and then it's like a box so it's like and it's a guy on a whiteboard and he's like so between like a seven and an eight they're like super high but they have to be below the line I can't remember and then it gets like really high in the corner and he's like

and at the top we have unicorns they don't exist this video still goes on on Facebook all the time and it was a joke but it's like men would literally post this

it's ridiculous but it's even like people don't expect everyone's obsessed with like a mild Clooney because she's beautiful and a lawyer they're like

they can't believe that she's beautiful and likes fashion yeah and she's a lawyer like every single man in the world you would never question no that yeah whereas it's like oh my god oh successful woman who's also like conventionally beautiful yeah wow i remember even at school my our teacher one of our head of years ones i got caught smoking i think and he was like um why would you do this you're so pretty and I was like really what's this got to do with anything yeah why did you do this you're so pretty he was like you're a really beautiful girl and like you got so like be like you're doing really well in school like you're a singer that's part of him like admiring

not admiring like congratulating you almost yeah but he should have been like you're a singer you know like don't smoke not like you're really beautiful as if that was my only worth that I had yeah at school I was like in sixth form I was like 16 17 god it's so I had two teachers at school telling me that I was pretty when I was in a detention as like a reason as to why I shouldn't misbehave it's like it's some sort of currency yeah exactly like it was a currency exactly that like girls are pretty and boys are smart yeah which was really bad it's horrific isn't it i think now we notice it but it was massive when we were little yeah well we do notice it but i think it's actually still it still goes on for a lot of people our age just doesn't get people they're just you know it's so entrenched it's so ingrained

you just accept it because i think i used to see stuff as compliments as well and now i find it insulting you said this before though do you remember remember when Watts' face said to you, you're really hot and funny. And you're really funny. And Livvy was absolutely fuming. She rung me and she was like, you said I was hot and funny. I'm so annoyed.

Let me explain. Let me explain. So this was the guy that I was seeing for three months who dumped me. And this was in like January. And when he was dumping me, he was like, so yeah,

I just don't think we really have anything in common um but you're really hot and really funny and that was like his sort of way of you know yeah trying to you know alleviate the I don't want you but you've got this yeah I don't want you but by the way like well done you're hot and funny and to me all I heard from that was you're not intelligent you're not interesting you're not intelligent, you're not interesting, you're not, you know, you're not interested in the same things as I am, you're inferior to me, you're, you're super, you're these things, which are very vapid, superficial qualities. Funny's good. Yeah, funny's okay, but, but like, you know, I don't want to be, I, I am so much more, like, I feel

so much more validated if someone tells me, think you're so intelligent or if someone says that article you wrote was so insightful yeah or you know just that kind of stuff i appreciate so much more than if someone says oh you're really hot yeah you're really fun like i don't give a like maybe you've got hot privilege though because you are really hot so maybe you're like i know that's quite funny i do not have hot privilege but i just think this guy was just an arsehole yeah no he was an arsehole and was trying to trying to make me feel better about the situation and it annoyed me that he felt that that would make me feel better about it because that's almost also an insult but on the flip side another thing i was going to say was we were also

talking about how guy was like really complimentary towards you and you were like oh my god i can't believe he said this i was like lily meant like you should if you're dating someone they should make you feel like you're the best person they've ever seen you should wake up in the morning with like morning breath and look like a mole rat and they should be like oh my god like a freshly baked loaf of bread yeah so I didn't people would always say that to me you would always say this like that's just not ever gonna happen like boys are so mean to me boys will never say that to me like I need to you know if I wake up in bed with a guy I'm gonna run to the loo and put makeup on before they wake up because they're gonna think i look like crap but recently i have been seeing a guy who is very very complimentary and i can't

really take it i'm not used to i don't know what to do it's quite stressful yeah and he's like you're so you're so cringe and so awkward and stop being so embarrassed but i just can't take it so bad because i think we're conditioned like to think that they're just going to treat us badly or like for instance when i was in that like quite emotionally abusive relationship he would kind of make me feel like shit so that the only validation that really mattered was his because it didn't matter what anyone else said because he was so kind of rude to me all the time well like tell me like maybe you should go to the gym or you could look a bit better if you did this or you should do this have you seen how fit this girl is all the time she looks really good all the time and then if he said once in a month like you look pretty that would literally i'd be like

because he was so mean to me and didn't matter if my friends were like you look amazing or anything else but that's i think we're kind of taught to believe that that validation is like something you need to fight for yeah or like it's and that they mean so much Whereas if you're quite confident in yourself And you feel happy like they should make you Feel even better it should never be like A tug of war And it should also never feel like you don't feel good enough If you're in the presence of someone

And they make you feel uncomfortable in your skin That is a space that you just shouldn't be in Absolutely and Rachel always says this to me She's like you need to be with someone who makes you feel like a priority Not an option I have a priority not an option yes I have always felt like an option yeah

always with every single guy I've dated it has been a case of oh I'm kind of busy this week I could squeeze you in here yeah or like can you just come to mine

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p.m eastern research and supply see full terms at canada.casino.fandu.com please play responsibly like never really going above and beyond to make any effort for me yeah and you know i i you i don't realize that that's a problem because i'm just like well this is just how it is like we did we did this before i remember once we went for a walk and i got really annoyed about something he said and you honestly for the life of you like i don't understand why you're so pissed off of it i can't really remember what it was and i was just like because they should never make you feel like you're just you're like pandering to them or that like you have to change your ways about but on the flip side of that it's a hard thing to do but it's kind of what i was saying before is you do have to

be quite like we're're going to do this, or you can come to me, or just as opinionated and as strong as they are, because then they're like, oh, okay. But if you're like, oh my God, it's fine, and then you keep doing that, then after like four weeks, and you're going, obviously they're going to expect you to always do what they ask you to do. So it is quite hard, especially in those early stages, especially as a woman, because you feel like you want to impress them,

you want them to think you're the cool girl who's really chilled and like oh my god yeah let's do whatever i don't mind i'll drink beer actually i like that now though do you yeah that's such a random segue um no i i yeah i just feel like i'm really nervous about being sassy with boys even though i'm sassy with everyone else i'll be like do you want to come to me and she's like no it's too far yeah literally i'll be like there's a party in clapham i live in north london but i'm there i can't go sorry no but if honestly if it was a guy i was dating yeah yeah they'll be there be there in a second good i'm glad to sing this out loud yeah no i have to i think i have to because i'm sure so many other women do this it's awful though you need to you need to be aware of

yourself doing it and catch yourself doing it and be like this isn't okay like this isn't me this isn't me being true to who I am I don't want a guy to think that I'm just gonna you know drop everything to do what he wants that's not the kind of relationship relationship I would want anyway and do you know what it is you're being true to though it's society's ideal woman which is servile and maternal and kind of like there's always that idea that we're going to look after you and we'll come to you and you poor thing you must have such a hard day's work and like I even do it with Matt sometimes like oh my god you're dangerous I'll cook for you I'm like wait a minute I'm gonna work but like

that's just you know I think something inside us is very like nurturing and caregiving much more to men than we are with our friends yeah I know what you mean actually i am like that with my friends as well though but i'm just really quite smothering i am too but like um there was a situation with a guy uh recently and he he i was dating him he got quite upset about something and we were standing outside and in a group big group of people and i could see that he was but i just i just grabbed his hand and just held his hand i just felt like really like i feel like really bad for you but I need to do something yeah but we're like surrounded by a group of people so I can't really do anything I'm just gonna hold your hand that's so sweet yeah I'm really sweet but yeah I think it's just

it's interesting because everyone's at such different stages like there are I do you know what I still can't get over is people that start dating when they're 14 and stay together till they're 28 do people do that yeah but they do and I think if I hadn't had more wits about me I literally could have actually stayed with that guy that I was like just out of pure ease and then once you're I think once you've been in it for like six years must be very hard to turn your back yeah but I think that's quite bleak in a way oh for sure yeah because what if you get to a point where you feel too comfortable you don't fancy them anymore but you're too comfortable to leave I think it's very scary to leave yeah I'm sure it is if you've if you've

been with them since you're 14 it's all you know yeah especially if you live with them you know you share a mortgage or whatever like there's all these complicated grown-up things there's a really interesting thing that Jess Oli said on one of my podcasts recently and she was like um she was like i'm so different from the girl that i was five years ago i don't even recognize her anymore and that's okay and i think that's so true i'm not the same person i was when i was 18 at all and i think sometimes we think that you know why aren't we in relationships and why aren't we doing that we're growing there's so much passion growth that happens even in the past year i think i've grown up so much I can

even look back at things I said six months ago and I'm like I can't believe I said that I think so much happens especially in your early 20s that if you aren't in a relationship and you feel like why aren't I in one there's you're probably just doing a hell of a lot of growing which takes up so much time in of itself yeah definitely I mean I I think I have grown up I don't think I think I've only really started growing up in terms of relationships in the last year like that really so that's what I mean everyone does it at different stages yeah I think I grew up like maturity wise like now I'm starting to do a lot of growing in a different sense whereas maybe I did my relationship growing up younger and everyone grows up and some people are really good with money management some people

get really good jobs from 21 other people will have the most amazing relationship but won't be in their like stable career till they're 30 I think we all just either prioritize or we just naturally fall into a position where like your your job is one of the coolest ones out of all our friends she literally writes in the independent which is incredible she's 24 that's sick like I think that's amazing so like all of us are doing whereas I've got another friend who's still doing a master's at uni but she's like you know so I think we forget it's very easy to focus on the things that we don't have and not really look at the bigger picture not that you think that but I'm saying like as a general no but I do and I the thing that's why like dating has always been my biggest insecurity because it's the one it's the one area of my life I feel like I've never ever had any

success in yeah whatsoever like obviously never having had a relationship but you know that's society's definition of success yeah is having a relationship but actually i think now it's more about being comfortable in your own skin and then you attract the right kinds of people you know that saying that's like the first thought you have is the one you're conditioned to have and the second one you have is your opinion when i imagine success the immediate thing that pops up it's really weird it's like a house a family and like a blabber door I don't even want to really but like without meaning to like if you say success I imagine like a big car and a house then if I think about what success is it would be like um doing something that would be like fundamentally important to society or like

changing something positive or doing something like something to with a career that wasn't about money at all but more about like a legacy well do you know what I mean that's what I think actually success is but when I think of success like just without meaning to think about it like subconsciously I imagine like a master car the master house and a dog god mine's so different I just thought I just I was like okay what's my subconscious first thought for success and it's it's like a woman really successful on her own in a high-flying job that's no family no man nothing that's so interesting what does that say about me what's your second one what do you actually think what do you consciously want success to be consciously i i don't know if it involves a family either mine wasn't about family

mine was about career yeah i think mine would still be career but maybe maybe less about myself maybe more like in a team doing something like uh of value yeah that's what i mean something valuable like for society yeah doing something that means i don't know something about to do with the environment or something to do yeah that's what i think maybe like i mean i love my job but something maybe like investigative reporting and yeah that's cool exposing you know people who are doing very very bad things yeah i think mine would be something to do like feminism or like helping but yeah mine doesn't my success isn't also it's not money which i think a lot of people fault back on success is money but i don't know if that's no well obviously

it's not money for me because i'm a journalist if you want if you want to make money you don't be a journalist ladies and gentlemen yeah that is true but then i don't know if also we're from a point of privilege where we probably never really, truly wanted for anything. True. Compared to a lot of people. No, that's very true. That's very true.

And journalism is a very privileged career. Yeah, like the people in journalism. Yeah, the people in journalism. I mean, it's written about all the time. Yeah. How journalism is like a whitewashed industry. It really is. And that's because

in order to get jobs in journalism, you need to do unpaid work experience. Yeah, and people can't afford to do that. People can't afford to do that. And people don't live in London. Quickly back to the women in a you need to do unpaid work experience people can't afford to do that people can't afford to do that and people don't live in London quickly back to the women in a high-flying career thing question do you think that also like with dating do you think that comes back to like family and stuff I think I have issues with family yeah to be completely honest with you because of my family because your parents split up when you were little my parents split up when I was little my dad moved to to the States. Have quite a fractured relationship with him.

Wouldn't say I have like daddy issues in a sense, which is also a term that I have a real problem with. Yeah, that is awful. Can't bear that. So bad. I think it's really sexist. But I would say that it has affected my perspective on relationships because it's just me and my mum.

And that's it. yeah and even even that is fraught sometimes so a lot of the time I feel like a single unit yeah in a sense and that is something that actually gives me quite a lot of sadness quite a lot of the time but and it's bad because I think I sort of instinctively push people away that care about me we sometimes we talk about this a lot because we're both really like I do we just have very similar thoughts on like romanticize and like just talking about family we don't mind talking about things but what's really interesting is Livy and I have had such a similar upbringing like we literally went to the same school we have the same friends we did the same course at uni and we have the most different

different um because it's not opinions it's like the way that we would deal in a situation is so different and this is what people i think don't get is like your friends around you could have the most exact upbringing and like you would get a text and read it in one minute i would get it and read even just small things and it's so interesting because we actually think the same things but you don't realize how many environmental factors will affect everything that happens to you whether that's your parents whether it's something you saw at school, whether it's watching a friend's relationships, your siblings, the relationship with your mum,

the relationship with your dad, like all of those things will affect how your friendships, relationships, and everything else around you works. God, yeah. I think particularly romantic relationships with your family because the first romantic relationship

you are exposed to is your parents' relationship. And I think if from birth, pretty much as it was with me, that relationship is instantly not non-existent yeah of course that's going to affect you yeah like of course it will and then you know you see your parents sleeping around when you're a child like that's it's not a normal environment to be in and people really underestimate the impact of coming from a broken home yeah it's

really not talked about very much and very few of our friends actually have divorced parents yeah that's true my parents they always argue with younger and even me and my sister had to say to my mom recently like me and my sisters used to fight like screaming to my mom like why do you don't we're like we grew up watching you and dad argue yeah so we just did that as well and thought it was normal and i've had to retrain myself to like look at realize that it's sometimes i'll react to something how my mom reacts which isn't always like my mom's the most amazing person ever but she just has certain ways of reacting to things and i've had to unlearn her behaviors that i'd picked up and i think people don't realize that sometimes you think that's a really normal way to react to something or you just something pisses you off but actually it's just how you're conditioned to react by your parents um kind of

years and years of whatever things they've been through you know yeah of course it's going to impact you it's so interesting to think about it like that and you don't unless unless you really actively think about it and you stop and take a step out and you're like okay well why am i why am i behaving like this towards this person in a relationship and then you think well is it because of the way that my mum did this or the way that my dad did this and often you can find links like it's not that hard even thinking about like sex and stuff because i i had sex with my boyfriend when i was like 16 the first one but i that's quite young and i was quite happy to do it but whereas i think you didn't maybe because of your like mum you didn't

yeah maybe i mean i i was i was 18 when i lost my virginity but i don't think i had sex again until i was 21 yeah after that that's a long time I don't think I had sex again until I was 21. Yeah. After that. That's a long time. Yeah. I might as well have just waited until I was 21.

But it's interesting because all of those things, I think people are like, oh my God, there's a set age to do it or there's a reason, and there's always, there's no right or wrong reason

to do something, but there will be a reason why you've decided not to do something. So don't do or not do it because you think it's right or wrong. No, and also, God, if people call you frigid, tell them to fuck off. Oh at school they'd be like are you frigid i cannot bear that and now i think no one would ever say that because in the

sort of post weinstein landscape where things like conversations around consent are so prominent yeah and thank god that they are someone calling you frigid is just, is just like, sort of trying to elicit non-consensual sex out of you. It's kind of violent. Yeah, it is, it is violent.

It's also, it's emotionally manipulative. It's, it's almost like gaslighting in a way, because it's making you doubt your own, your own like, you know, sexuality,

and you know, it's like, oh God, am I, am I frigid? Do I just not want to have sex? It's like, god am i am i frigid do i just not want to have sex and also of course you do you just don't want to have sex with this person and that's fine oh my god absolutely fine and slut shaming as well is slut shaming at school was so it was

so bad even if you snog someone i remember i'd have snog someone at a party and i'd be so then i wouldn't tell anyone this i always get told because i keep it a secret and then it would come out like three weeks later which make it so so much worse and they'd be like you snuck it whoever's 18 it's awful but it's still bad like in Love Island when Megan yeah that was awful

yeah she'd had sex with what 55 people or something I can't remember and she was all over the tabloids for it and it's just like oh my god sod off

like this is I thought she was great this is a woman embracing her sexuality does not give a shit like we never see this on screen no she was amazing there was a such a good article that she actually like we never see this on screen no she was

amazing there was a such a good article that she actually shared that someone wrote about her about why she was like the perfect villain not actually villain on vice yeah did you read it it's so good really good i actually listened to a really good episode of ways to change the world you know the channel four podcast we listened to it and there's a i can't remember the name she's an 89 year old what's the dissident because they kept saying it like just the dissident she's a dissident a dissident yeah it sounded like um it just meant that she was like a rebel let me find what her name was i'm not gonna i'm gonna butcher this because okay i want to know nawal el saadawi uh-huh she's a revolutionary addiction feminist feminist and she talks about the injustice of the patriarchy and what inspires her to write and why she thinks

democracy doesn't exist she's like 89 she's on this podcast and he was like why do you think that female genital mutilation is a thing and she was genitally mutilated and she writes about it a lot and campaigns against it and she was like the reason is because women and men are designed to be polygamous to give women female genital mutilation is to make sure that the woman is monogamous and the man can be polygamous that is the whole point of it and that is how society's worked forever because we live in a patriarchy women aren't supposed to be women have as much sexual desire as men but years ago in countries where they still do female genital mutilation that is so that you don't get those sexual desires or they hope you obviously still get them it's just not you don't get the feeling oh it's painful yeah but it happens all the time

in lots of um middle eastern countries and stuff And they still do it to young girls, like, from when they're, like, five. Awful. So they literally, like, cut the top of your clit off. And that is so, because they're so scared of female sexuality. But women and men, women have just as much sexual pleasure as men. And that's a real massive, weird issue that we, like, shave in female sexuality. As if it's, like, why would you be at school? We'd never talk

about like sex in terms of our sexuality never and a lot of women i think are repulsed by their own sexuality yeah and that's why a lot of women actually can't orgasm from sex yeah well they just don't know how their body well do you know even when i spoke to anita meet you we were talking about putting a menstrual cup in she was like i'll have older women who are like i can't do that they won't touch themselves to put a menstrual cup in really and then these are like 50 year old women like it's it's because I think years ago as well especially with like Catholicism and religion and like shame around female sexuality was huge I think it's I think also the younger generations I think like 16 17 18 year old girls now are incredible yeah they are they are but I think there's still a lot of work to be done and

a lot of that I think actually is down to popular culture I think if you think about film and tv and you think about how many times you see a woman masturbating yeah on screen and we spoke about this we did an episode about the taboo surrounding female masturbation with Scarlett Curtis a few months ago it was great and we spoke to her about it and there's this scene in black swan oh yeah where natalie portman masturbates and and it's very much done in a way where she clearly is like doing it very sneakily i can't remember it doesn't she's very ashamed isn't it really scary that bit it is it's quite dark i mean the whole film is like a psychological thriller but it's very much done in a way that like oh my god this is so naughty and this is so um you know scandalous and whereas

guys are seen tossing themselves off in every episode of the in-betweeners yeah like i don't know if something i've got every tv show that's like a sitcom there's always a bit where someone gets caught or the kid is like and everyone finds it really funny yeah it's a very like oh what a lol coming of age thing for a guy to do whereas for women it's like embarrassing and i remember even when we were younger if we would speak to people about um you know if people would have conversations like i found a dildo under her bed oh my god it's so funny oh my god it would go around the whole school i remember that i literally remember it was blue yeah i know who you're talking about yeah so-and-so's daughter

exactly and you just you just shame yeah shame people for doing something that is so normal and so natural and so important because if you are not as a woman if you're not masturbating you are not going to have good sex but oh no but not because you're not going to know what works for your body and then it also just it gives you much i think you just need to be in control of your sexuality and what you're comfortable with that you don't have to do anything you don't want to do no absolutely not but i just think it's about it's about embracing your sexuality and not ever feeling ashamed by it I think I think it's so important that we realize that our sexuality is

ours because I think what happens is when you realize sex is about you it gives you that control to realize when this isn't for me so I'm not going to do it was when we were younger it was always about the guys so it didn't matter what I was thinking and I think there's so many situations that I've spoken to friends about where no one's saying it's not consensual because it was and it wasn't rape and it wasn't sexual assault but it also wasn't about wasn't it was just about the fact that you were going to have sex then with this person and that was just something that you did and it was never about your your own experience or you getting your kicks it was always about the guy it wasn't about like the guy was forcing them into it it was just no one had been taught that sex is is between two people and it should be like a really wonderful I also don't know why it's

shameful I think it's it's such a beautiful thing it's like the ultimate culmination of like emotion and love and feeling and it should feel like ecstatic and beautiful and wonderful and also it doesn't look like porn no but there's so many there's so much sexism surrounding sex like you know men are supposed to be stoic and emotionally detached and you know stick it in as many girls as they want without ever got like you know getting feelings whereas women it's like oh your body produces oxytocin after you come and you're gonna instantly feel more attracted to someone after you sleep with them that is so not true that is so not true and i know from experience that's not true i don't know i think i've fallen in love with everyone that i've ever slept with

really oh god i definitely haven't i definitely haven't i don't think i've oh no but i don't i don't mean literally fallen in love no but you've always had feelings yeah guys you slept with so i don't think i have but i think that's me though because i just think i'm like in terms of even talking about relationships again i'm someone who like i'm not quick to fall in love but I'm much more open to it than you are I think yeah well this is this goes back to my family shit is what I'm saying I push I push all that stuff out I'm very good at blocking it away interesting is this is like a therapy session yeah it always is but even even though you and your mum really get on my parents don't necessarily have like they're together they're fine but they're not like i they would i wouldn't look at them like

oh my god they're so in love but i'm so in love with my mom like so i've always been very talked about love and known like felt love as a very close to home thing whereas i think as much as you love your mom obviously you did like your relationship was hard so that makes complete because i was trying to go like but my parents like, like, it isn't a perfect family home, but that's so true now, you just said that, I think you just have to have an experience of like, safety and love, like just a feeling that you know that you'll be safe and loved. Oh god yeah, there has never, my family situation, there has never been any stability. Yeah.

Ever. And I think that's where it comes from, so I think it's like, if you don't feel like you could ever trust another person with you, no matter what, even in what capacity it is, even if that's your sister, or even a teacher a teacher to someone gave you that then I think you can be open to falling in love or like trust someone else with your feelings which is a really difficult thing to do to trust someone else to take not to take care of you but like it's a massive thing to do really difficult particularly if you're stuck in a rut and interestingly that the time that I started dating was when I moved out of my mum's flat, which was a very, very small, claustrophobic environment. Me, her and her boyfriend.

Great flat that I always thought was going to live there when I was older. You did. You always had these weird fantasies about it. But my point is that I never dated anyone there because I don't think I ever felt comfortable. Yeah. I don't think I ever felt like I could be myself. And I was in this like quite volatile atmosphere the whole time. You were very much treated like a child though.

Yeah, and I was in this like quite volatile atmosphere you were very much taught like treated like a child though yeah and I was completely and now I live in my aunt's house where I'm you know much more autonomous and feel much more comfortable and that's when I started dating people and I think there's definitely something to be said with that like I feel more free and I feel like I can actually you know yes there's still those feelings of isolation and being a single unit and whatever. And that's always sort of an unfortunate undercurrent for me. But I definitely feel way more liberated than I have felt before. I also actually think like what we talked about with family, I even, you're quite good at talking about it.

I'm actually quite bad. Not that, honestly, my family like love each other, but my parents just aren't that like perfect parents. And I didn't know this because no one talks about it. No one's are. So yeah, but I didn't know that. So I remember when I i was younger i'd go around to people's houses and be so jealous like why are the parents obviously when your friends are there they're not going to start like arguing about the washing machine or whatever it is but i then it's only now that we've got older and everyone talks about like um like we found out like someone's

dad mom's something's happened like someone's life whatever and you're like oh fuck no one's parents are perfect apart from maybe matt's just very annoying it's so cute but like you don't i don't think anyone talks about it now so everyone's walking around like carrying this baggage from the age of like five thinking i'm so different yeah my experience is so much worse than everyone else's and that obviously exacerbates those feelings yeah no one has a perfect family unit you'll find this even your friends that you think have the most perfect lives they'll always be some weird family member or something that's. Even your friends that you think have the most perfect lives, they'll always be some weird family member or something that's happened in their family

that you just can't talk about. Because I think there's just a lot of shame around. Because I think it is the ultimate. Do you know what? I think it goes back to... God, we've covered so many things. I think it goes back to success. I think in our society, in the Western society,

a family strong unit, think about every advert on TV, every single aspirational thing is like a perfect family unit. So I think there's a huge shame to admit that it's not working or that it's breaking so no one talks about it i think even as a child you understand that you can't tell i wouldn't tell my friends i was upset my parents were arguing or something i wouldn't talk about it you know from a very young age that just isn't that's not anyone else's business and it's not but it's i think it can be very damaging if when you're older you don't try and address things that have happened however little they are yeah no I think honestly the most important thing is to talk about talk about it talk about it talk

about talk about it like I have been through some shit this year yeah and I have spoken about it to anyone who will listen because I want to a reduce the stigma surrounding the things that I've been through and b it helps me yeah anything it helps me feel less ashamed it helps me feel less alone and it just gets it off my chest otherwise this is when you know I'm on the tube and it will really always cry on the tube I don't know why I see you're like just cried on the tube yeah I don't know why it always comes out I feel like I'm bottling stuff in Christ I'm I'm getting so, I'm so open. I can't believe this is going to go out live.

You can take stuff out. But it's because like if I'm on the tube, it feels like you bottle stuff up and then suddenly you're surrounded by people, but you feel more alone than ever because you don't know any of these people. You're in a tiny dark tunnel, quite claustrophobic. And that's when I'm just stuck.

And I'm usually listening to music yeah music's very triggering for me as it is for a lot of people yeah and then you just and then just all comes out whereas if you speak to people it doesn't whereas if you feel like you're bottling stuff up i mean for me at least it just it just comes out like that you'll just be so surprised when you go to a friend and say like do you know what actually i think that i feel like this might have affected me they are 100 times out of 100 will be like oh my god i feel exactly the same way and there's just all those things that you think are shameful pretty much at least one of your friends in your friendship group would have been through it yeah and even if they haven't if they're your really

good friend no one is going to judge you nothing i've ever said to libya olivia's ever said to me either of us have been like oh my god i don't want to be your friend now no but that's the most important thing in in friendship particularly female friendships i think is not being judgmental oh yeah you have to just you have because this thing i'm i don't want to be judgmental but i try and like protect you and it's not sometimes you just you can't you just can't be judgmental when we were younger though i think we were a lot more judgmental yeah i think i think it's because you're figuring out who you are yeah but also because of the school environment i think everyone's a bit judgmental everyone's figuring out who they are everyone's a bit on edge and everything anyone did was like almost

like a threat so if someone did something everyone's backs would get up whereas now that we're older we're like oh well done good for you like it should be a celebration even if a friend has a one-night stand like great times i'll take you to the clinic or like whatever it is you have to be really supportive because women in society are shamed by magazines media men movie every single thing in the world shames pretty much any action or any rebellious technically action that a woman makes so within your friendship group you've got to make sure that you're the one that's like no this is fine yeah and go to the clinic go to the bloody clinic like that's another thing that people think is so shameful is stis and stds and it's just like nope it's very normal it's very healthy it's

very responsible go and get tested me and Anit talked about this because we used to do it all the time but I'm like such a hypochondriac I used to order them online all the time yeah you can order them online and they come within like two days it's very easy I just would I just like I'll just do another one just just for fun but that was like pregnancy tests I do them all the time just for fun it's great I don't know why oh my god that's that would be so anxiety inducing I always used to but I used to stress myself out even if I was on the pill that I'd got pregnant so I'd like convince my boyfriend that I was pregnant and then I'd have to take the pregnancy test then once I took it I'd get my period because I'd obviously stress myself out

it would stop it so literally there was a time where I had to do a pregnancy test to get my period oh my god it's so funny how powerful the mind is i remember i once took a pregnancy test in a bathroom of a gym and i i had worked myself up so much my whole body instantly went hot and i was sweating profusely in this tiny tiny cubicle it was not it was not hot there was air in this changing room and i just remember i nearly fainted and i hadn't even taken the test yeah and i think i was waiting for the result and I nearly fainted I was like honestly it's nuts

I plan exactly what I'm going to say to Matt and then do you know what happens but then I did one the other day and then a little bit

of me because I had to I had to have the marina call like you have to have it like a week after a little bit of me was a tiny bit

I do not want a child I think I just I just was like maybe it's going to be positive and I was like I wonder what I'll say I was like oh

it would be quite cute and then it wasn't no way a little bit I don't want a child at all I did not want to be positive but I think just in that moment I kind of got a bit confused about what was going on and I felt just a slight like oh that's so funny it was so funny so your maternal instinct being like oh no this is what I'm I've been born on this earth to do just to procreate so oh god yeah it's just stressful yeah we've covered so many oh my god we've covered so much i don't even know what the title of this is gonna be now

i know you need let me just have a catch up yeah no if you're really hung over had two hours sleep yeah i'm literally recording this in my dressing gown liby's had two hours sleep i opened the door with the face mask on liby's like oh serial killer. Oh my god, she did. It's really funny. Your skin is glowing though, may I say. Oh, thank you so much. I've got a head to a bottomless punch now actually. That's fun. I know.

I can't really be bothered. I want to go to sleep. I'm exhausted. You can do that. Well, thank you so much for listening guys. Where can we find you, Olivia? You can find me on Instagram and Twitter. My Twitter is OliviaPetta1. My Twitter is OliviaPetta1.

My Instagram is OliviaPetta8. Or if you want to listen to my lovely podcast, it's Millennial Love. Millennial underscore love on Instagram. Amazing. It's great. I definitely recommend listening. They have lots of tips on dating

and different things that affect dating as a millennial. It's amazing. Thank you. It's very enjoyable. Thank you so much for coming on. Thank you for having me. It's been thrilling. Amazing. Bye. Amazing.

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