After Party with Emily Jashinsky - Cringe CBS News Reboot, Awful Crockett on "The View," with Glenn Greenwald, and MN Shooting Video Breakdown

Episode Date: January 8, 2026

Emily Jashinsky begins the show with an in-depth look at Wednesday’s shooting of a woman in Minneapolis.  She shows various angles and explains the policies that helped lead to the woman’s death. Then Emily is joined by Glenn Greenwald, Host, “System Update,” to discuss the latest developments involving Venezuela, including the U.S. seizure of two Venezuela-linked oil tankers. They also discuss TX Senate Hopeful Jasmine Crockett and former GA Rep Marjorie Taylor Greene’s appearances on “The View” and why Glenn believes Crockett showcases what’s wrong with the Democratic party, while MTG resonates with so many average Americans. The pair also has a funny discussion on what would happen if they were forced to watch “The View” every day. Then the conversation turns to CBS News’ awkward rebrand and the Tony Dokoupil clip that left Glenn stunned. Emily rounds out the show with a look at the meltdown over a benign segment on CBS about January 6 and Spencer Pratt’s announcement he’s running for L.A. mayor following the devastating aftermath of the 2025 California fires. Masa Chips: Ready to give MASA a try? Get 25% off your first order by going to http://masachips.com/AFTERPARTY and using code AFTERPARTY Stash Financial: Don't Let your money sit around. Go to https://get.stash.com/EMILY to see how you can receive $25 towards your first stock purchase. Cowboy Colostrum: Get 25% Off Cowboy Colostrum with code AFTERPARTY at https://www.cowboycolostrum.com/AFTERPARTY Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey, everyone. Welcome to another edition of After Party. Thank you so much for joining us tonight. Our guest is the one and only Glenn Greenwald, the host of System Update on Rumble. I pre-taped with Glenn earlier in the day. We have a very long conversation to bring you in just a few moments where Glenn reacts to the news, huge news, that we seized a Russian oil tanker off the coast of South U.S. America today. We have a deeper conversation as well with Glenn about the constructive or not so constructive geopolitics of continuing policies of regime change in the hemisphere in Latin America going back into some of the history. And it's a really interesting conversation to have with Glenn. So I hope that you'll enjoy it. We'll get to that in just a moment. I also discussed with Glenn Jasmine Crockett's campaign. He loves Jasmine Crockett so much. You're going to

want to hear that. We talk about Marjorie Taylor Green and Tony DeCopal's first couple of days at the helm of CBS's nightly news program. He's also being pushed as the main new face of CBS in this moment of transition and change over there. So we talk about all of that. Obviously, this has been a busy breaking news day to say the very, very least. It is the anniversary of the Palisades fire. An incredible tragedy that we don't talk about enough, frankly. And guess who announced he's running for mayor of Los Angeles today? Spencer Pratt. If you're my age, that name means a lot because you watch Spencer Pratt on the hills.

Then you saw him in his hummingbird Snapchat phase. And now he is running seriously, apparently as a Republican, for the mayorality in Los Angeles against Karen Bass. So I'm going to bring you updates in that case. And we're also going to talk a little bit about Tony DeCopal and Larry Sabado. There was a very interesting, I mean, people were furious about a snippet. And we're talking like 15 seconds of the CBS Nightly News yesterday on January 6th. And I think there's something super interesting to be gleaned from this. It's a little bit separate from the conversation.

Actually, it's a lot separate from the conversation that I have with Glenn. And of course, as I mentioned, very, very busy breaking news day, I'm going to start in just one moment here with the news out of Minneapolis, which I've been watching very closely all night. As I know, many, many of you have as well. It's a very fluid situation. Hopefully, Minneapolis doesn't see riots on the scale of 2020. There are crowds gathered across the city right now at this moment. So far, again, it's early in the night. But so far, nothing so bad.

Let's start with the big news out of Minneapolis, where we now know Renee Nicole Good, who is a 37-year-old, mother of a six-year-old, was killed in a confrontation with ICE earlier today. You may have already seen the video, or I should say the videos, because the national media right now is deep in analyzing this from every possible angle. There was a protest happening on the ground in Minneapolis this morning over the ice surge that was sent by the Trump administration. So there were a whole lot of people out there with their camera phones pointed at this interaction. I mean, you'll see I'm going to show just two angles right here. But people are slowing this video down on a Zepruder level already to try to analyze exactly what the ice officer who shot at Renee Nicole Good. Again, as I mentioned,

now deceased, what might have been going through that agent's mind, what might have been going through goods mind. So let's go ahead. I also have, by the way, breaking reaction from the vice president that I'll get to in just one moment. So let's go ahead here and take a look at the first video, this around 9.30 a.m. local time. Apparently ice vehicles were stuck in the snow. That's when all of this happened. We can roll the clip. No! No! Shame! Oh my fucking God! Oh my fucking God! Oh, my fucking God! Now, what the fuck? You just fucking, what the fuck? Now, what did you do? No, if you were listening very closely, you may have heard what sounded like one of the officers say, get out of the fucking, car. I actually think this is part of what's getting, or part of the video, the confrontation that's

getting under discussed right now. So as we roll the second clip here from an angle that's higher up, this angle made people believe, actually some people say they're more comfortable taking the officer's side after seeing the clip. Let's go ahead and take a look here. Okay, so we can probably cut it here. I think, you know, the rest of that clip is you see the officers trying to catch up to the vehicle, which went several feet. Obviously, the driver was shot and had her foot on the gas pedal and was no longer steering the car. So the car, if you were just listening to this and you haven't seen the video yet, plowed straight ahead and hit what looked like another car and a telephone pole in a bank of snow off to the side. So all of that is to say, this is already an inkblot test.

That's where we are right now. Jacob Frye, Tim Walz, so Jacob Frye, obviously, Minneapolis Mayor, Tim Walz, obviously governor of Minnesota, have already come out, as have many other national political figures and slammed. slammed ice. That's not surprising at all. They were already slamming ice going into this for being in their sanctuary city. On the other hand, here's reaction from J.D. Vance. I can put this up on this girl here that's already up on the screen. He posted, actually, just less than an hour ago, moments ago, I want every ICE officer to know that their president, vice president, and the entire administration stands behind them. To the radicals assaulting them, doxing them, and threatening them, congratulations we're going to work even harder to enforce the law okay as i mentioned already we can see

this being an ink block test where people are slowing down the video and i've done this myself frame by frame to see exactly what the officer was thinking and when what the driver was thinking and when so if you believe that ice is out of control you see excess force here and you see an agency that shouldn't have even been there in the first place. If you believe that ICE is good, what you see as an officer trying to do his job, making the country a safer, more just place. But even as somebody on the right, I have been critical of ICE from a civil liberties perspective, like in cases where American citizens have been detained, that has happened, on what I feel are thin predicates. And I don't like security theater. I don't like armed officers of the state,

wearing masks, though I sure would want to be a mask if I was a nice officer in this climate. I would want to be wearing a mask if I were in their shoes. I get that. And that's really the big picture here. We have a country where at least eight million, eight million people came in in the course of about three years. That's the New York Times number. A lot of people would say that's a low number, but that's at the lower range of the estimates here. Eight million people. We're talking about multiple states, multiple states combined together, added to the country. people added to the country in about three years with a little vetting, thousands of which, thousands of those people, of the eight million, were people convicted of violent offenses who

are now roaming our streets thanks to sanctuary cities like Minneapolis, which acted as magnets. Of course they acted as magnets. There were places where the local officials were not cooperating and continued to not cooperate with federal law enforcement officials. So you can go to a sanctuary city if you are here without documentation or if you are, you know, trying to evade an asylum hearing and you can have a reasonable assumption that it's going to be pretty easy to, again, evade deportation. So in this case, my reaction to Jacob Frye, looking like he was auditioning for higher office, telling ICE to get the F out of his city, is like, how dare you? How dare that be your reaction? When you are defending your own policy,

defending your own policy that makes it easier for criminals who should not be in this country. I mean, I'm not even talking about immigration from a labor perspective right now or a law and order perspective. I'm talking about it purely from the question of public safety. I mean, I heard David Axelrod on CNN, which I was watching all night, say, the terror being visited on these communities is coming from ICE. I'm paraphrasing him. It's not an exact quote. That's basically what he said. I think Jacob Fry said on Anderson Cooper, quote, they're causing so many problems in our city, and this is referring to ICE, tearing families apart. Well, I think Lake and Riley's family and Jocelyn and Garay's family would hear Jacob Fry saying that

ICE is the only agency here tearing families apart and be furious, furious with that point. Because Democrats who defended a lenient border policy and defend sanctuary cities are also tearing families apart. That goes both ways. That goes both ways. And that's why ICE is there in the first place. I mean, I'm going to read some of these numbers from the Biden ICE. This is the Biden For 24, over 81,312 of the 11321431 arrests were of non-citizens with criminal convictions or pending charges. They had a combined total of 516,000 charges and or convictions, and that included 57,000, 57,000 assaults, 18,000 sexual assaults and actually more like 19,000 sexual assaults

and sex offenses, 13,000 weapons offenses. 3,000 homicides. I'm rounding up here. There's 2894 homicides, 2,766 kidnappings, 5,462 robberies, 11,822 burglaries. That's Biden. Those were arrests of non-citizens with criminal histories under Biden. That means tens of thousands of people. Tens of thousands of people are in this country. And that's dangerous. That is dangerous. And do not care what party you support. or ideology you support, that is dangerous. And so if we are only talking about ICE's reaction as being dangerous, we are not zooming out properly to get the full picture. And I say that as somebody who is concerned that ICE's response to all of this could potentially be dangerous

and has been dangerous in a couple of cases. Trump is obviously now hyperboizing and Democrats and pundits are having a field day with that. They're basically declaring the case close. Andy McCarthy has already written, though, in National Review, saying it is settled Fourth Amendment law that a police officer may use deadly force against a fleeing suspect if he has a good faith belief, good faith belief that the suspect poses a significant threat of death or serious physical injury to the officer or others. Here, I believe the driver was in the act of committing a dangerous assault when the agent opened fire, and the driver's reckless operation of the vehicle coupled with the fact that she was heedless of harming armed law enforcement agents

as they were carrying out their official duties, underscores that it was reasonable to believe she posed a serious threat to the agents and others. Now, on the other hand, people on the left, some people on the center are saying that law enforcement is trained to avoid shooting at moving vehicles or that the officer could easily have sidestepped, gotten out of the way of the car. My two big questions right now are whether good was getting conflicting demands from officers. And I mentioned that at the top while we were showing the video. You can hear someone say, get the F out of the car. seemingly an officer say get the F out of the car

and you can see the officer actually try to open the car door which was locked. Now, Minnesota Public Radio is reporting that an eyewitness told them ICE agents, quote, gave conflicting orders to a driver in South Minneapolis on Wednesday with one agent ordering her to drive away from the scene

where an ICE vehicle was stuck in a snowbank while another yelled for her to get out of the car as he reached for the door handled. Okay. So, all that is to say, think about this. I mean, if you, if she was being told to stop and being told to go, you can see how from Goods perspective, you'd be trying to leave to comply and maybe confused and potentially unaware that there's an officer in front of you.

This is a possibility. I'm not saying it's what happened, but it's obviously a possibility if you're getting two different directions and you're paying attention to the guy who's trying to open your door and is trying to tell you to get out, or maybe you only hear someone saying leave. I honestly have no idea if either of those were the case, but when you have an eyewitness saying that, I think it's something that we can take seriously. But I'm also curious if she was using threatening language, if she was exhibiting any threatening behavior or not leading up to that final moment of her life, what I see in that vehicle is somebody who backs up, is not complying with an officer that does say to open the door, but then backs up and accelerates in the direction of an officer.

Now, the use of a gun obviously feels disproportionate when you see the car going, the speed that it was going. I mean, my estimate is like 10 miles per hour, something like that. But when you are an officer, just because it looks disproportionate to us, you're an officer, you have this massive SUV coming at you. You have no idea in that moment how fast that car is going to exist. accelerate. Maybe she slams the gas and throws you up into the air and you die. So all of these are possible scenarios. And honestly, the very fact that we're analyzing multiple angles

and freeze frames speaks to the problem with just declaring what happened in Minneapolis today, a black and white, black and white or one direction or the other declaring it to be black or white or one direction or the other. Did the officer really feel like his life was endangered? Was there a better way or better instinct? Or the driver here at command to leave? These are a lot of the questions that I'm going to be thinking about and looking at as more and more evidence emerges. I imagine we'll get body camera videos. Right now, I think the single biggest problem, though, on a macro level is thousands of convicted criminal migrants are taking sanctuary in cities, literally sanctuary, in cities like Minneapolis, and one political party is almost entirely opposed

to efforts to deport them or other illegal migrants. And yeah, I worry that in the face of that opposition, ICE is going to be more and more inclined to impede on our civil liberties. You can do both at the exact same time. This is a very, very 2026 disaster, unfortunately. So it's okay to be slow in these news cycles. I've learned that a million times, it feels like over the last 10 years where we get cell phone videos of a confrontation

with police and law enforcement. And as more and more, Jacob Blake is such a good example. The Kenosha 2020 case is such a good example of you not knowing what you don't know because you weren't there, you don't know what's quite literally cropped, you don't know what happened before or after. And so it's okay. I think it's genuinely okay and sometimes important to be slow in news cycles like this one. That's my reaction as of right now. But it's, this is not going anywhere. This will be in the news with us and this will loom large over our politics, certainly into the future. On that note, I'm about to bring

you my nice long conversation with the great Glenn Greenwald, which I'm really excited for everybody to watch because we had a very, very, I got to pick Glenn's brain as somebody who lives in South America, who's covered the South American left about how in the long term our strategy here could backfire or not, or not. You'll see what you'll see. you think. But before we bring Glenn in, first, you know, we got to talk about Masa chips. It's 2026. It's a new year. A lot of people are focusing on practical changes, nothing too extreme. So one easy win for you might be replacing processed snacks with Masa chips. It's clean eating and it doesn't feel restrictive, which is amazing. Masa keeps it real, no seed oils or

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delicious offer. And if you don't feel like ordering online, good news. Masa is now available nationwide at your local Sprouts supermarket. So stop by and pick up a couple of bags before they're gone. Now, I'm going to hop into the chat. So if you're watching this live, you'll be able to chat with me live for this lengthy conversation that I got to have with Glenn earlier in the day. Please make sure to subscribe, subscribe wherever you get your podcast, subscribe on YouTube. It's so helpful for us. And without further ado, here's the one and only Glenn Greenwald. So happy to be joined once again by what, top three favorite after-party guests. I don't know, top one favorite after-party guest, Glenn Greenwald, Pulitzer Prize winning journalist, also the host of

the great show, one of my favorite system update. Glenn, thanks for being here. Thank you, Emily. You have no idea how close I was to hanging up and disconnecting when you said top three. I was like, who were the other two? And then you corrected yourself immediately and made it clear it was top one. I was like, all right, I'm going to stay. Okay, but you have to think of it. Like, Megan probably has to be one. Okay. A lot of people don't know this because Megan has a successful show, blah, blah, blah. I'm the godfather of that show. I don't know if you know that I was the very first guest. I launched that show. You know, you know how it is when you launch a show. The first guest often determines whether your show will be a success or not. She chose perfectly.

I've been on more times, I think, than any other. So she would be happy to take the number two spot as a result. So, I think that's fair. I hadn't considered that. I forget how instrumental you are in the success of the Megan Kelly Show. Instrumental, central. Critical, but critical.

Oh my gosh. All right. Let's, I guess we can talk about the news, I guess. There's not much going on. Actually, to the contrary, we have seized a Russian oil tanker that was evading the blockade outside of Venezuela. So why don't we start there, Glenn, because Lindsay Graham and Rand Paul are going back and forth. Once again, on Rand Paul's birthday of all days, Lindsay Graham posted on X today, to Senator at Rand Paul.

Happy birthday. I hope today is full of family friends and good cheer. Oh, by the way, as a birthday president, we have seized yet another oil tanker trying to transport sanctioned Venezuelan oil. I hear Russia isn't too happy. Next year to celebrate, maybe we can go do a golf outing to Venezuela and Cuba. Should be good to go by then. Meanwhile, Glenn, even people are on the right, are on the right are uncomfortable with how happy Lindsey Graham is about all of this

because it always makes them feel nervous that something's going deeply wrong when Lindsay Graham is happy. Now, most of the right still pretty much in support of what's happened in Venezuela, but now that you have the seizure of a Russian oil taker, let me just, it's not surprising, but let me just get your reaction to the geopolitics, the potential ramifications of that seat. Sure. Well, first of all, on the Lindsey Graham issue, I mean, it is, you know, something that you can kind of talk about as a personality component to the story, but I think there's a huge ideological revelation in there, which is that, you know, if you had gone even a year

ago and asked Maga about Rand Paul and Lindsay Graham, most people would have said Rand Paul is a very close representative of what the America first foreign policy is, opposed to foreign interventions, someone who doesn't want to go and fight wars unless the United States is being attacked first. ways. His father, Rand Paul, was the predecessor. He laid a lot of the groundwork for Donald Trump's ability within the Republican Party

to rail against neoconservatism and Bush and Cheney adventurism. This is what Ron Paul did very successfully in 2008, 2012, and then it led to Rand Paul and Malgo loved Rand Paul, and by contrast, Lindsey Graham was the everything anathema. You know, he was the person who was

running around with John McCain and Joe Lieberman, like a representative of neoconservative ideology, which, if anything, if nothing else, the Maga Movement said that it wanted to vanquish and bury. And so it's not just that Lindsey Graham is happy. He's happy because his vision of the world is being completely fulfilled. We bombed Iran. We're closer than ever to Israel.

We're threatening Cuba. We're threatening Colombia. He won, Trump said that unless protesters are treated better in Iran, we're now going to attack Iran, is that we're the guarantor now of civil liberties in Iran. And then, of course, Venezuela is a long-term project of neo-conservatives, or Rubio like Lindsay Graham. And then when you add on to that,

so, you know, I think the issue up until the moment has been, Emily, that in terms of politics, it's been a very confusing situation because when Maduro was first taken from Venezuela and brought back to the United States, a lot of people, I think most people, foreign against, assumed that the government was going to collapse and we were going to then empower the opposition, Edmundo Gonzalez, who was declared the winner,

of the 2020-5 election or a 2024 election or Maria Machado who just won the Nobel Peace Prize. And that was where you heard all these, you know, kind of effusive narratives about Venezuelans have been liberated. We freed the country of Venezuela. That's all now fallen by the wayside because we don't have any intention at all of doing anything to the government of Venezuela for the moment at least, except taking out Maduro. The whole regime is in place. And if anything, there's greater crackdowns. So then the question becomes, well, what is this about? Now we're focus more on oil. And this tanker was one that the Russians had decided that they were going to protect because they get a lot of their oil from Venezuela. And I think this is such an important

point, Emily, they don't get their oil for Venezuela because they steal it. That's not how China gets oil from Venezuela. They buy it on the open market. Venezuela has always been and remains more than happy to sell its oil to the United States. The problem is that the United States has tried to choke off the Venezuelan economy like it's done with the Cuban economy, their own economy, with sanctions but if we wanted access to their oil all we had to do is buy it on the open market the way that everybody else does so even this makes very little sense to me

in terms of oh we're going to go and take their oil right we want it on our own terms I guess but that's let's push like let's pull at this sort a little bit more too and in terms of what this is actually about because listen I mean it's I forget who said this but someone made a joke about how this may be the first time in history that a presidential administration used the pretext of oil like actually just use the excuse of oil as a pretext.

They were just like, yeah, this is a war about oil when it's actually about like Iran, Russia and China. Now, a few people who comment on this in America are as familiar with South American politics as you are, Glenn. Chinese influence in South America is obviously a real thing. And Venezuela is obviously a real thing. It may be overstated by certain people who are affiliated with the intelligence community

and the Pentagon in one way or another. but that is real. So is that ultimately, I mean, that's my best guess. I mean, I think that's what the root of all this is when you hear Marco Rubio really talk about it. And he's the one making these decisions for the most part. It sounds like that's what this is really about. Do you think that's what it's really about? Am I wrong?

I think it's very hard to say this was the cause. We can, you know, 20 years ago or more, when we invaded Iraq, people were debating, Why did we really invade Iraq? Was it because George W. Bush wanted to avenge his father who we said Saddam Houtin tried to kill? Was it for oil? Iraq is a very wealthy, oil-rish nation. Was it because of Israel?

Was it because we really did believe the intelligence? They were developing weapons of mass destruction. I would hand them in al-Qaeda. I don't think people to this day can say, this is why we invaded Iraq. Probably different factions had different motives. I think the same is true here. Marco Rubio, and I think this is such an important point,

and it's like an uncomfortable one to make, but we make it all the time. in the context of Israel, so I don't think it should be uncomfortable. Marco Rubio has wanted to overthrow the governments of Venezuela and Cuba and other left-ling governments in Latin America for many, many years, well before the Chinese really had a foothold in Latin America. And the reason is that he grew up in a Cuban community, an immigrant community.

I grew up in South Florida, very close to them. I understand this community very well. And now there's a big Venezuelan component to it as well. These people have always looked at Latin America as kind of the region that they have the greatest interest in. Like a lot of American Jews, look at the Middle East and Israel as the area they have a lot of interest in.

And they've always wanted the U.S. government to go up and kind of fix that region for them. overthrow Castro, overthrow Chavez. I think a lot of that from Marco Rubio and other Latin American members of Congress from Miami, that's a big part of it. As for China, let me just say this. Chinese influence in Latin America

is basically composed of the Chinese trading with these countries. For example, the United States and Brazil have always had a very close relationship. Brazil is the largest country in the hemisphere after the United States, by far the most influential in Latin America. And yet right now, China has surpassed Brazil

as their most important and largest commercial trading partner. And one of the main reasons for this is, and you see this in Africa as well, with countries where traditionally the United States had a big influence, is because a lot of these countries are starting to turn anti-American.

and they're turning anti-American because they perceive that we go around and just bully everybody and we throw our weight around and we give them orders there's that kind of famous quote from a leader of a western african country that says when the americans come we get a lecture when the chinese come we get a hospital all of this is soft power and so to watch all these maga people suddenly saying like yeah we're going to dominate the world we do what we want we take what we want yes you can do that to some extent i mean the united states does have the most powerful military in the world Chinese have a pretty powerful one, too, probably can't do it in their region. But there's a huge cost to it, which is this is what makes these countries want to go elsewhere

and trade with other countries and depend on other countries. People don't like being bullied. They don't like being bombed. They don't like being invaded. They don't like being dictated to. They don't like this arrogant imperialist attitude. And the Chinese, although they're very aggressive about their region, go out of their way not to do that. There is a different relationship and posture that the Chinese have.

And that's the reason why so many traditional American partners are moving toward China. So if we're worried about Chinese influence, we probably should stop engaging in the behavior that drives countries into their arms. I was just going to go in that direction, Glenn, because you posted on X. Some can't seem to fathom that most people don't want foreign countries bombing their own country and dictating who their leaders are. Earlier this year, when Trump imposed sanctions and tariffs on Brazil to prevent Bolsonaro's imprisonment and their censorship regime, many Brazilians who dislike Lula became enraged at the US on sovereignty and self-governance grounds. You go on to say, even if they don't like their leaders, they also often don't like the U.S. And thus won't always welcome us as liberators, especially when we invade with bombs and guns and orders.

It's just basic human nature. And so I think that's a really big point, like a very profound point, actually, because I sound like a broken record. There is literally a Sandinista in charge of Nicaragua right now. If you want some evidence of how well the Cold War allowed us. to maintain hemispheric control. We act as though that battle is won. Like, it was definitively won. Panama, big celebration.

Everything is great, even though we literally just had to convince China to, like, sell a port in Panama in, like, the year of early 2025. And, Glenn, again, just please speak to this because you've covered the Latin American left. There is favorability towards the U.S. in some of these countries, Chile, Ecuador, certainly right now.

but not among everyone. And the reason that these pink-tide leftist movements are still successful in Latin America and are favorable to places like China, it's actually because they care about their own sovereignty. So there's a pretty decent argument that even from the MAGA-hemispheric control perspective, this is counterproductive.

Yeah, so let me use Brazil as like a kind of laboratory test case just to illustrate your point and to answer your question because even though a lot of people now in the understanding, United States who don't know much about Brazil, think Brazil is some sort of like left-wing, repressive, like, communist regime or whatever. Brazil has never been a communist regime. Brazil has an extremely powerful banking sector, very powerful oligarchs, many, many Brazilian billionaires. It's a capitalist country. The president, Louis de Silva, was like kind of, he grew out of the Brazilian left. He was a labor leader. He was a factory worker. It came from a very, very poor background. But he tried to run for president three times as a left. couldn't win and then he only was elected in 2002 because he selected as his vice president this kind of like very wealthy pro-business type he wrote a letter to the Brazilian people saying

I'm gonna be a president for everybody including the witch including banks and so Brazil grew rapidly economically it passed the UK and became the sixth largest economy in the world Brazil is not a left-wing country and even now his vice president is this guy who is kind of like a Mitch McConnell Paul Ryan type like known for austerity kind of like a never Trumper, but I never will snarro. So Brazil is a very, like, it's not like Venezuela or Cuba or even Colombia. It's a much more pragmatic country, and it has very deep ties to the United States. It always has. The Brazilian U.S. relationship has always been very good. That said, in 1964, the United States worked with generals in Brazil to overthrow their

democratically elected government because he got a little bit too left wing in the eyes of the Kennedy and the Johnson administration and then imposed a 21-year military dictatorship. on Brazil and there's a lot of people who are alive then who are steeped in that history who are very weary of any attempts to by the United States to kind of control Brazil or the region and even though that ended in 1985 Brazil re-democratized in 1989 so you're talking now about you know 25 30 years it's still very much part of the national identity so when you have what Trump did earlier in that treaty reference where he came in and said I don't like you putting Bolsonaro in prison even though it went through a whole due process trial and I'm I have

question about that, but that's Brazilian justice. And even though I don't like how you're censoring, because I don't like how you're censoring, I'm going to impose sanctions on your leaders. I'm going to put tariffs on you until you change. Rula, who had been a pretty unpopular leader, you know, he's almost 80 years old. He's, you know, been around since 2002. He's in his third term. There's an election this year.

It's going to be his fourth term. He's going to be 85. You know, he was very unpopular. He picked up this banner of nationalism and said, nobody tells Brazilians how to live except Brazilians. Brazil is for Brazilians to decide and I watch huge numbers of people

who are sick of Lua, who hate his workers' party, unite behind him and say FU, the United States and his polling increased dramatically and he looks pretty decent by no means a lot, but pretty decent for re-election because he rode that wave.

This is just how we all respond. Omlo and Shinebaum have done the same. Yep. look in Canada when Trump started threatening Canada and it was almost a certainty that the conservatives were going to win in Canada and then suddenly the conservative party

was deemed too close to Trump and they united behind the liberal party and then Mark Carney picks up this huge hole up by Justin Trudeau and easily wins the election this is how human nature we evolved to survive in tribes we have tribal identity and we especially have it

when we perceive that there's some other tribe attacking us or trying to dictate to us or take things of ours. So if you think about what's being said about Venezuela, we're going to take their oil, we're now governing it. What do you think the people in Venezuela, even the ones who aren't pro-Moduro,

are going to be thinking and doing and how they're going to be reacting? Well, yeah, okay, so Marco Rubio, just in the last several hours, came out and said, we have a three-fold process in Venezuela. Step one is the stabilization of the country. We are going to take between 30 and 50 million barrels of oil. The second phase will be recovery,

ensuring that American, Western, and other countries have access to Venezuelan markets, the third phase will be one of transition. Now, obviously, Delsi Rodriguez remains sort of in charge of the country, even though Trump says he's in charge of the country in the oil and all of that. So this hasn't quite been like a Pinochet, Allende situation, or Aende to Pinochet situation, where a right-wing person is installed by the United States immediately.

There's something, it feels, Glenn, like there's a new playbook being written right now. So as we're in the middle of that, trying to understand what's happening and what could happen in the future, future. What do you make of this moment that we're in after Rubio now says this is the three steps to look ahead to? Yeah, I think it's a good point. And, you know, a lot of the discourse has been very binary, like, oh, either Trump is anti-war or he's a kind of like Bush-Cheney figure. But if you look at the critiques that a lot of people are making of what Trump is doing in Venezuela, both in the sort of neocon wing and in the kind of liberal establishment media wing, they are

kind of criticizing him like well what do you mean you took out maduro but you left the entire regime why didn't you go and get everybody and it's like the iraq war never happened it's like the vietnam war never happened it's like not the bombing and regime change we did in libya never happened where we left these countries in complete shambles we were required for years to keep our military there or to just walk away and leave them uh wrecked and i think one of the things they're trying to do and it's exactly what you just alluded to and i think it's an important nuance to observation that's being missed i don't know what it's going to work but this what they're trying to do is they're trying to have their cake and eat at two.

In other words, they don't want to get involved in a civil war and a quandary in Venezuela, which is exactly for sure what would happen if they tried to remove the entire government, the military. So you have to remember, the communists, you know, through Hugo Chavez and now Nicholas Maduro, have been in power for almost three decades. These people are indoctrinated to hate the United States, to believe their system of government is right. They would go to war. They're very armed.

They would go to war for a long time if we tried to. do what we did in Iraq, which is deconstruct the military, de-bathify, put in our own leaders. And so what they're trying to do is say, we're going to keep the regime in, but we're going to have a gun to their head. And we're going to say, you're going to do what we want. You can be repressive. You can, you know, they don't care about that. They're not trying to free the Venezuelan people. They want, as you said, like, more favorable access to oil. And they're basically saying to Delci Rodriguez and the rest of the Venezuelan regime, either you allow Exxon and Chevron and Conosco and the rest to go in

and rejuvenate your infrastructure and we take it on our terms or you're going to suffer the same fate as Maduro. I think it's a lot of questions of doubts about why that would work. But I also just, this is the key thing I think is, you see this triumphalism like, yeah, we're taking their oil. Tell me who's going to benefit if we get Exxon and Chevron and the rest to go in. and, first of all, it's extremely expensive

and a long-term project to rejuvenate the oil infrastructure of Venezuela, which has been very neglected. It's not the easiest, most easily extracted oil either. But let's say you go do that, you think the people of Ohio and Pennsylvania and Wisconsin and the Rust Belt and Appalachia are going to benefit from oil company profits, which is what the core promise of the Trump movement was?

Or that it's depriving, is the argument to steal man that they're depriving Russia and China of the oil. But the thing is, like I said before, Russia and China are buying the oil. We could buy the oil also. And Trump said, Trump was in the White House, like three months ago was talking about it as well because this is not just like a sudden thing that happened.

We've been building up our military there for months. We've been bombing off the coast. As you know, Trump authorized the CIA covert destabilization and regime change program by the CIA. This is many, many months in the making. And Trump said in the White House several months ago that Maduro called him and said, look, let's do a deal, whatever you want,

we'll give you, the oil, anything you want. So if this is really what we were after, if we really just wanted access to the oil, if we wanted them to sell the oil to us, we wanted them to do deals with our oil companies, we would have done that. The reason there's a problem between the U.S. and Venezuela is because we are sanctioning

and trying to choke their economy. This is the issue is when we don't like a government, like in Venezuela and Cuba, we try and emiserate the population. But we've been doing this for decades, and it doesn't change the government. All it does is amissorate the population. So all you have to do is restore normal relations,

and they'll allow the oil companies in. Why wouldn't they? Everybody would benefit that way, but that isn't really the goal here. Yeah, if you doubt that's an intentional U.S. tactic, look no further than the memo of what Kissinger said to, it was to Nixon about Chile, make their economy scream.

Make their economy scream, and the rhyme there is with the Cold War Soviet influence, potentially creeping into our hemisphere. And if your argument is that China, Iran, whatever, is creeping into the hemisphere, then you should also consider this, perhaps, again, counterproductive. Glenn, let me get your take on this Dave Smith clip about the MAGA base, because I'm very curious what we talked about a little bit earlier, but I'm very curious what you make of how this has played out so far. Let's go ahead and roll this. Like a year ago, Donald Trump had his highest approval ratings that he's ever had. He was the greatest political comeback story in American history. And now, you know, he's totally, like, divided his base. There's an infight in the repose, all this stuff.

But anyway, so a year ago, when people were so excited about Donald Trump coming in, you never met one Trump supporter in your life who went, now we're going to get regime change in Venezuela. That's why I'm excited that Donald Trump's here. Maybe in Miami. I mean, people wanted no new wars. They wanted the border secure. They wanted the economy turned around.

They wanted inflation dealt with. There was never. There was no demand from Trump's base. And so this is like one more example of Donald Trump just siding with the warhawks over his own people. So, Glenn, I think you and I probably agree with what Dave Smith is saying there. But I don't know that I've seen it in public opinion. or in the commentariat so far? I have a hard time believing that people are going to be excited about this.

I think one of the things we've seen is that if you're not sending American troops into a conflict, if they're not returning in body bags, people don't like it. People are like, why are we spending all this money there? But, you know, like when Trump spent all of 2024 criticizing President Biden for bombing the Houthis in Yemen saying it was totally unnecessary, it was pointless, and then he got into power and started bombing the Houthis. It was talked about among the political elite, but most people didn't even know, they didn't even care because there's no, their sons and daughters aren't being drafted, they're not coming back dead. I'm not saying this is going to be some, if this is

all it is, I'm not saying it's going to be some big albatross around Trump politically, but I also don't believe that there's some, as Dave Smith was saying, there was some eagerness. And this is the part that really bothers me most, Emily. We just had this, like, major 18, month election, right? And the idea of an election is the presidents, the parties say what they believe, what they want to do, and then you get to vote. And there's a very third grade, sixth grade kind of model of how American democracy works, but this is the idea in theory. And you listen to both sides. You know, I go, I prefer this one. Never once during the campaign did Trump even allude to the fact that we were going to do a regime change war or regime change

operation in Venezuela or abduct Maduro. To the extent we talked about what is really a problem, which is the flow of fentanyl into the United States. And I actually think the bigger problem is why Americans are so eager to consume it, but that's the demand problem that people are bored by. So even if you're looking at this supply problem, like, oh, all this fentanyl is coming to the United States. So I really don't understand how if this was such an important policy, removing Maduro for our national security or economic prosperity.

Why was this something that was never mentioned or discussed, let alone advocated during the campaign? I do think that's what Dave Smith is saying. this wasn't anything anybody was craving or asking for other than maybe this immigrant community that Marco Rubi represents in South Florida. Right. Yeah, and as the, you know, 2026 campaign cycle goes on, and the question of affordability is on the table, Democrats, if this roiling chaos in Venezuela is continuing into this year and

into the fall, you can certainly see how there would be a damaging juxtaposition with that and take a quick break, but we'll be right back with the great Glenn. Greenwald in one moment. First, you don't need to overhaul your life to start investing. Just automate it. With Stash, your new year, money goals can quietly run in the background while you focus on everything else. Stash isn't just another investing app. It's a registered investment advisor that combines automated investing with expert personalized guidance, so you don't have to worry about gambling or figuring it out on your own. Now, Stash is simple, smart, and stress-free. Choose from personalized investments. Let Stash's award-winning

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greenwald who is of course the host of system update over on rumble great show make sure to watch it i know everybody watches it already Glenn thanks for joining us i'm going to make you talk about Jasmine Crockett, because why wouldn't I make you talk about Jasmine Crockett? She stopped by the view on the sacred anniversary of January 6th, of course. I'm going to make you respond to this clip. Let's take a look. Everyone wants to talk about how Maduro was illegitimate. As we sit here on January 6th, I do want to be clear. Somebody else was trying to be a Maduro of the United States. Somebody else wanted to do the exact same thing. The difference is Maduro was successful, because it's my

understanding that when he went into that press conference, he said at least 20 times, oil, oil, oil, oil. He sure did. Listen to him when he speaks. He's telegraphing. And so, Jack Smith, I hate that he did not get his day in court. I hate that for the American people. Glenn, like you, Jasmine Crockett is a lawyer. I'm not sure who I would hire. Like me, just like me, Emily, just exactly like me. It's one of the many qualities you two share. It's such a, it's almost, I thought I was watching you on the view, actually, in that moment. She's running in the Democratic Senate primary, of course. And so there's no real surprise that she's going pedal to the middle of this. But the politics are going to be interesting because even just invoking January 6th, I guess she's in the primary. So it makes sense. But I don't know if. if you saw the video of Democrats with the, like, silent memorial on the steps of the Capitol singing America The Beautiful yesterday, and there's so much media coverage of it. I was

reporting live there. It was like one of the worst things I've ever seen. It was horrible. We don't even need to get back into what happened on January 6th, just to say that she's running in the state of Texas. Is she really still think it's a good idea to be talking about January 6th? here's the thing and I mean this is I know it was a joke and I like did all

it took all my energy to treat this joke when he said I was just like Jasmine Crockett because I really abhorred Jasmine Crockett and I mean personally I don't know her

I'm just saying like if you were to ask me what is everything rotted and broken and just repellent about Democratic Party politics I would have many people I could point to

but one of them immediately would be Jasmine Crockett and I'll tell you exactly why this is your person who has yeah Well, first of all, she's black, and I am anti-black racist. She's also a woman. I hate women.

So there's that, obviously. But then on top of that, like, she has no ideology. She has, like, no, like, did you hear her talking about Venezuela? She has nothing to say about Venezuela. The only thing she has is she hates Republicans and she hates Donald Trump. Like, and all these liberals go wild for hers. Like, this is who we want as the Democratic Party. What does she think about bombing Iran?

What does she think about Israel? what did she think about Wall Street? What did she think about banks? She's like very, you know, I'll tell you quickly, one of the things that before Marjorie Taylor Green had her transformation,

I've always liked Marjorie Taylor Green, I've had her in my show, I've talked to her a lot. And one of the things that she once said, oh, this was a while ago, that was like, this shows how smart Marjorie Telegreen is and people, every liberal will be like, oh, she's very stupid.

Whenever conservatives talk about AOC, they're always like, oh, she's a radical, she's a communist, she's an extremist. Marjorie Telegreen understand exactly what AOC is. is. Marjorie Taylor Green doesn't attack AOC that way. Marjorie Taylor Green says AOC is a fraud. She's a partisan hack. She's an establishment tool.

This is what Jasmine Crockett is. This is all she is. She like, you know, has this like demeanor and comportment that draws attention to herself. She seems like she's feisty and radical to like a dumb liberal. But she's completely empty and vacant. And so, you know, I don't know if you saw but George Conway, who is the husband

of Kelly Ann Conway, is now running for Congress. And it's like very liberal New York 12th congressional district that represents Manhattan that used to that was occupied for many years by Jerry Nadler who's now vacating it you know George Conway was like a hardcore far-right

Rush Limbaugh Republican operative his entire life. Him and Kellyanne were the people behind Whitewater they used to like work with Matt Drudge to do all that dirt on Bill Clinton. He was a hardcore pro war on terror conservative love George Bush and Chick Cheney. I worked at the same law firm as

George Conway. I know exactly what his politics were. He never changed. All that he has, though, is that he hates Trump. And all these liberals love George Connolly, like they love the bulwark and Bill Crystal.

This is Jasmine Crockett. This is all she is. Of course she's going to talk about you anywhere he's six. And if you ask her about Venezuela, she's going to be like, I don't see the difference between Maduro and Donald Trump.

This is a completely vacant Democratic Party that's elevating these people who they think capture what made Trump popular, this kind of like very aggressive, you know kind of like rhetorically unrestrained style

Trump had an ideology to him he had like political beliefs that he hammered over and over about immigration, about trade, about the United States and our foreign policy. These people have nothing. They don't believe in anything

and exactly you're going to run for the Senate in Texas six years after January 6 don't give us a crap about January 6 anymore and that's what you're going to be babbling about on the view if you're asked about Venezuela Of course it is. Yeah. But I mean, that's the thing. It's the packaging that they're trying to fool people with. We saw it in the 20. I mean, Democrats did really well with it in 2018 in those midterms. I expect they'll be probably fine in 2026. The bigger question is what happens in the presidential primary and in downvote races, downvout races. Are there Jasmine Crockett's on the ticket or are there people with more populist substance? Big question. And for Republicans, they got an answer to this question somewhat. from Marjorie Taylor Green announcing,

obviously she was leaving Congress that happened finally this week. Now, Marjorie Taylor Green also went on the view. All of our favorite people are going on the view. I don't know, Glenn, we should just watch the view together every day. Yeah, we should pause our days. We should live stream the View, and we should do a podcast where we just watched the View and coming up a view.

The View reaction show. I would kill myself after about four episodes, but we would have four really good episodes that we would be able to do. I would be so drunk by like noon or whenever that She'll end every day. I would just have to. Could you imagine having to listen to, like, Joy Behar and Sunny, whatever her name is, like, every day? I mean, I don't know.

I don't think, like, no. But it was a good idea. But we love the view. So, okay, Marjorie Taylor Green went on the view. Sorry. No, no, no, no. Glenn, that was, I think, a very appropriate tangent. Here's Marjorie Taylor Green talking about kind of what ended everything for her.

Let's roll the clip. The straw that broke the camels back for me was the president calling me. me a traitor for standing with women who were raped when they were teenagers. One of MAGA's big campaign pledges was to release the Epsine files. And then having to say, am I going to have to be the next Charlie Kirk? Is my son going to get murdered because I'm trying to continue to do this job? I think that's a bar that's too high for anyone. And it's real.

Political violence is real and it's so sad. and the politics is so extreme and divisive and I just don't want to be a part of that anymore. So there's something interesting in that, Glenn, where she's not just saying, I mean, obviously she had substantive policy breakdowns with the president and those were a critical part of what ended their relationship as well.

But she's also making a different point there. And it's not dissimilar, I guess from what we were talking about with Jasmine Crockett in a very odd way, which is that there are packages, like political packages for messaging that even Trump can be guilty of. And I say even Trump because he's just such a different character in our politics. Like he could literally shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and get away with it.

But even Marjor Taylor Green was uncomfortable with the level of like rancor that the populist messaging from Donald Trump is packaged. And I thought that was kind of a new point to hear. I mean, she's been making that point since it happened. but it's actually kind of a new point in the bigger conversation. You know, I said earlier that I always liked Roger Tellegrine, like way before this. Yeah, you're an early, like, apologist for MTG. Yeah, I mean, to be perfectly honest, I do think Marjorie Tellegrine has this kind of, like,

iconic, kind of like, campy appeal that a lot of gay men love. I was very surprised that she ended up, like, best friends with George Santos and being his primary advocate for a pardon that all makes total sense to me. But in any event, that's a whole separate issue. The Brazilian gays, they are just clamoring for more MTG. Totally, totally. But, like, the reason why I always liked her is because I generally hate, like, gay icons. But the reason why I really love Marjoriello Green is because she's always been so authentic.

Like, what she is is a person who wasn't that political. She wasn't, like, trained to run for, you know, like, state representative and work her way up to the state Senate and then get groomed by the GOP. She really is somebody who genuinely got inspired by Trump and the America First Movement. Like it drew her into politics in a very passionate way. She ran for Congress. She won.

She was very unpolished when she got there. She didn't, there's a lot of things she didn't know about. And I watched her kind of learn the ways of Washington, like learn more and more. And one of the things she really tried to do, and I think she succeeded was always make sure she kept a big foot back in her constituency. like a lot of these members of Congress who are there for a long time they don't even live in their constituents

in their districts anymore they live in Washington and they go back there when they have to you know in between trips to like Jerusalem for like some two-day town hall meeting or something Marginle Green like is a she's from northern Georgia

like this suburban northern Georgia she really I'll just give you I don't I'm sorry to talk so much about but you asked me about Jasmine Crockett and Marginal Green I have a lot to say about both but I remember when Trump started bombing the Houthis in Yemen and Roger Taylor Green said

and there was all these debate about doing it and this was by far the most insightful comment to me she's like when I go back home nobody in my district talks about the Houthis nobody even knows what a Houthi is why are we bombing them like what do they have to do with the American people

and it sounds like the kind of thing that if you're a political elite if you're paid to talk about foreign policy you dismiss as being simple-minded but in reality it's much more insightful than 99% of what we hear and a discourse. And she's speaking for most people, like, why do I care about the Houthis? Why are we spending billions on the Houthis? And I think as Donald Trump's second term unfolded,

she had an expectation about the things that America First was supposed to promise. And instead, she watched Trump spending all his time and all American resources, arming and funding Israel, meeting with Netanyahu, constantly bombing Iran, threatening a whole bunch of other countries, now doing regime change in Venezuela, covering up the Epstein files. And she was one of the very few people in the Republican Party in Washington who have both the integrity and the courage to say, you know, this isn't what we were supposed to be doing. This isn't what we were told this movement was about.

And that's the reason why Trump has to try and destroy the people, the few people who do like Thomas Massey and Rand Paul and now Marjorie Taylor Green. And of course, when Donald Trump calls you a traitor, I'm not saying, you know, that if you run for Congress, that's something it should drive you out of Congress. It's a very personal choice. But I do think that is a concern.

very real like she's not it's not neurotic it's not hysterical it's like it's very reasonable to me that that would be something that you would just i can imagine what the the pushback to her was on that you republicans and democrats should both bear in mind that marjor taylor green was the single highest small dollar donor in a recipient of small dollar donor cash uh in congress and that is for a reason let's move on to cbs because glen i i think probably like you have mixed feelings about the entire takeover. Given that, Barry Weiss has some directional instincts that are absolutely accurate about the media.

Tony de Cople came out before he started hosting the nightly news show and made, you know, what on paper, if I saw it written down and, you know, was in the mouth of a Glenn Greenwald, that would be like, oh, yeah, this is a good point. Like, journalists listen way too much to corporate interests and their advertisers and elites. So he comes out, makes that statement. People on the left freak out,

and even on the center freak out, and they're like, this is gonna be more like both sidesism, blah, blah, blah. And I don't think that statement in and of itself on paper reflected that, on paper it reflected pretty, I think, trenchant criticism of what the media has become. And yet on the other hand, we know that the entire merger of the free press

and the installation of Barry at the top of the news division over at CBS came for a pretty obvious political reasons from the purchase of Skydance and the merger and all of that. So we don't have to go too far down that rabbit hole again, because I think everybody's familiar with the story now, to take a look at this clip of one of Tony DeCopal, the new nightly news anchor who they've been pushing hard as a kind of branding figure for the new CBS, he signed off with a literal salute to the Secretary of States in a recent broadcast. Let's roll the clip.

He's now the face of U.S. foreign policy and President Trump's point man on Venezuela, all in addition to his roles as Secretary of State, interim national security advisor, and acting national archivist and U.S. AID chief. Whatever you think of his politics, you've got to admit it's an impressive resume. And now AI memes have added to that portfolio, casting Secretary Rubio as the new governor of Minnesota, the new Shah of Iran, the prime minister of Greenland, the new manager, of Manchester United, the head of Hilton hotels, and highest of high honors of all, the new Michelin Man. Now, back in real life, of course, these memes may not add up to much, but for

Rubio's hometown fans, which are many around here in Miami, it is a sign of how Florida, once an American punchline, has become a leader on the world stage. Marko Rubio, we salute you. You're the ultimate Florida man. Okay, the meme is now dead. And obviously, that was a joke when he was. He said, Marker Rubio, we salute you, you're the new Florida man. But Glenn, the guy had a teleprompter meltdown on night one that was brutal to watch. I'm sure you saw it and enjoyed every minute of it. We have another clip of him.

Why don't we just roll this right now? Falling into tears over Miami, which is also your hometown, let's roll S6. You said this is your favorite place in the world. Why? Why South Florida and Miami? It makes me emotional. It's so funny. I didn't mean anything.

Just say the coffee. Oh my God, you just see this. You haven't seen this yet. Because you only have one childhood, right? So. It's where I would have spent all of my childhood, but we left. Because of my father, he got in some trouble with business. It's like, we laugh about it now, but he was a drug dealer.

His dad was a drug dealer. He was a drug dealer. with the jail. It's kind of a ha-ha thing that we say now, but the reason it's so emotional for me is because I feel like I was robbed at the full Miami experience.

Mm-hmm. So when I come back, I'm always like... I'm sorry, that's really pathetic. I'm not somebody who mocks or like demeans men who display emotion in public. I think that's

acceptable. to do but not like over that like you know i mean he wasn't talking about like a family member who passed away or like someone who's sick or some like person who meant a lot to me he was talking he was talking about south florida like also it went on for so long like he just it wasn't like he just had a momentary loss of emotional control and then he just like composed himself it like was sustained it was like enduring he was like weeping practically over Miami. Have you not done that?

I weep in private every night about Miami in my closet which is why I don't do it on camera. Yeah, I mean, we have to cry over Miami, just not in public. Who doesn't cry over Miami? I mean, we all do. We get very emotional. It's such a moving, inspiring spiritually.

It's such a spiritual place. Oh, it's nothing but like, everyone knows. You go to Miami and it's just pure spirituality. You get to really escape, like, the material world, like all these, you know, rich influencers that dominate our culture. Nothing in Miami like that is just all, like, meditating, you know, thousands of years of, like, really rich culture. I'd get moved emotionally, too. I'm just saying I compose myself as hard as it is when I talk about it on camera, and it's just kind of odd that he couldn't. Yeah, no, I mean, I could not agree more.

He also went to Grand Central Station, and I don't know if you saw this video, but held, like, a little influencer microphone out and stopped passers-by to ask if they could pronounce the name DeCopal. And the big joke here was that, listen, I'm an important person. Like, this was the punchline. I'm an important person, but nobody knows me. Nobody knows how to pronounce my name, which I found fascinating because it's this idea that what Barry and the new leadership over at CBS are trying to do is restore credibility in the brand to something that existed in the era of mass media.

And at a time, though, when even by their own admission, because they're out there with influencer mics and had him in street clothes, mass media. It's like they're trying to do the sentiments of mass media in a new media packaging. And that absolutely does not work because it doesn't feel real to people. And that's what people want. They are like, we're smart enough to make up our own minds

about what's happening in the world. Just tell us what your bias is, where you're coming from, and we'll make up our own minds, but don't pretend that you're just the voice of God every night. You know, first of all, I mean, I'm a media professional like you. I mean, we work in media and journalism. I honestly had no idea who this person was, Tony Dacopal, and still... Married to Katie Turr, by the way.

And this is obviously, in Barry Weiss is mine. Married to Katie Turr, exactly who... Okay, and so she's, like, another capable personality. And I didn't be... I wasn't aware of Tony Dachapal until he interviewed Tana Heise Coates and called him basically a terrorist for having written a book that was critical of Israel and very empathetic to the plight of the Palestinian people. And he was like, it sounds like you, like...

the kind of thing that would be, you know, found in the scribbles of a radical in a backpack. So that made him a star in very... It's like straight from Glenn Greenwald's block. Yeah, I mean, exactly. Because I mean, it could have said that. But it was even, you know, he wanted to make sure it was more like Muslim,

like he's not like a Muslim terrorist. And that's why he fell into favor. And I think the big issue is, is that CBS News is not coming back. You know, you can turn it into like a Maga, which is what they're trying to do or at least show that it has conservative values so that people trust it who have written it off. I just think our viewing consumption or the way we get news, the people we trust,

it comes from personalities, it comes from, you know, internet, it comes from podcast, it comes from people we trust. I think the days that where anyone under 60 or 70 goes and sits in front of CBS News for 30 minutes because there's some Walter Cronkite figure like that telling us the news, those days are long gone and it is so bizarre to watch them. revitalize what seems so obviously to be a dead model. As you said, thinking they're using some sort of like

Barry Weiss sort of like pseudo edgy. There's anything edgy about Barry Weiss either, but like they think they're, they think she's like the new media maven. And I don't know, it just seems like, I would watch if they promised me that every night they would like screw with his teleprompter and leave him like stuttering or if he had to talk about Miami and would

weep and cry again. But other than that, I just can't imagine everyone watching CBS News. It just seems like no matter what they do, it's a project destined to fail. oh my gosh yeah maybe that's what they did on purpose with the crying they gave him like a little onion to put in his pocket and he cried so that people actually would watch because or very's like hey screw with screw with his teleprompter every night so that we get like viral clips where he's humiliated at least people are talking about CBS news yeah I mean listen that would be clever I'm going to be paying close attention to see if the teleprompter fails again because it's always entertaining Glenn Greenwald speaking of always entertaining what a pleasure to have you here thank you you so much. Always good to see you, Emily, off-camera, on-camera, wherever. Happy to be here. Love it. So much fun to have Glenn. It was so much fun to be with all of you in the chat. Absolute blast. Now, since I ended talking a little bit about Tony DeColpool and CBS News, Barry Weiss,

all of that with Glenn, I want to actually look a little bit closer at what's been going on over at CBS. right now, because I have complicated feelings. I mentioned this in our conversation with Glenn. I genuinely have complicated feelings about what's happening at CBS. I'm going to play for you a video clip that CBS News put out a couple of days ago. You may have already seen it. It was about a week ago. They have Tony DeCopal without a jacket.

He's in the newsroom. He's stripped down. I referenced this in my conversation with Glenn, but it actually sent the left and kind of the center. insane, going crazy. Take a look at S-11 here. A lot has changed since the first person sat in this chair, but for me, the biggest difference is people do not trust us like they used to. And it's not just us, it's all of legacy media. The point is on too many stories, the press has missed the story because we've

taken into account the perspective of advocates and not the average American. Or, We put too much weight in the analysis of academics or elites, and not enough on you. And I know this because at certain points, I have been you. I have felt this way, too. So here's my promise to you, today and every time you see me in this chair. You come first, not advertisers, not politicians, not corporate interests. And yes, that does include the corporate owners of CBS. Okay. Well, that's obviously amusing coming from the man who is now the head. I mean, he's really become the face of CBS News. Like, that's how they are marketing Tony DeCopold, who's the anchor of CBS Evening News, but they're putting him forward as the face of this new project. I think it's pretty clear from their advertising campaign that they've done around the launch of CBS Evening News. Given that, you know, it's amusing given that, of course,

this merger just happened in a way that was Trump was cheerleading it. These are people who have been saying nice things about Donald Trump before the merger. That's a great way to get a merger through now. By the way, I don't need to go down the antitrust rabbit hole. I will refrain myself. But that is like actually what was happening. So in some way, it's amusing to hear Tony DeCopold say that. But if you read what he just outlined on paper and you had no idea,

like if you showed it to someone on the left and said, this is what Glenn Greenwald just said. Or if you showed it to someone on the right and said, this is what Tucker Carlson just said. On paper, it's a really trenchant, accurate criticism, the likes of which you very rarely ever see from corporate media figures. And this is where, again, I have fairly complicated reactions to what's happening over there. I want to roll this clip of Tony DeCopal reading prompter on January 6th, so yesterday,

that sent Larry Sabado and others reeling. I mean, even that clip I just saw, I just showed. Like, people like Denver Wrigelman, former congressman, were losing their minds over it, and basically saying, like, oh, so you're going to both sides, you know, cranks, like MAGA cranks. And the honest answer to that is media trust, which Gallup has tracked every year, every year, going back to the mid-70s, is that tied right now for a record low. I thought when that happened in 2017, it made perfect sense. I still think it makes perfect sense. But when it happened in 2017, when it hit the first record low,

you're like, okay, this is, you know, the host of Celebrity Apprentice just won the presidency over the former Secretary of State, rock bottom. Media said it would never happen. You would think that now they're going to do better. And you would have maybe thought at the time, they would sound more like what Tony DiCopo sounded like in 2026. But 2026, it's too late because the media splintered into a million pieces. The trust is so completely obliterated and there's so many more options that it just doesn't even make sense for mass media. We talked about this with Glenn. It doesn't make sense for mass media to try to act as it did in a prior technological environment. So on that note, Larry Sabado, somebody who holds himself forward as I think a pretty

neutral observer of American politics, and as many neutral observers do, I think pretty clearly leans left. Here's, I want to first roll the clip of DeCopold, and then I'm going to show you how Sabido and others responded. This is from yesterday's CBS evening news. It's very short, but boy, did it cause a stir on X. Also tonight, five years after the January 6th attack, a group of pardoned defendants marched through Washington. President Trump today accused Democrats of failing to prevent the attack on the Capitol, while House Democratic leader Hakeem Jeffries accused the president of, quote,

whitewashing it. Okay, that's it. That's it. This was enough for Larry Sabinor to say, no, never again. Let's put F-13 up on the screen. He said, in a brief, both sides are equal report on January 6 at the end of CBS EV News, anchor said President Trump accused, okay, he goes on quote, you just heard it. Sabado, all caps, shameful. My family watched CBS and Cronkite from 1963 on no more.

Sadly, that's the way it is, January 6, 2026. He goes on to say CBS didn't want to report the truth, just please their new lord and master in the Trump era. Ambition beats integrity more times than not. Well, of course, in that brief report, Sabineau was reacting to, he, DeCopal called it an attack. He referred to January 6th as an attack, which is perfectly accurate. He described Hakeem Jeffrey's reaction. He gave the position of Republicans and he gave the position of Democrats. And if you are a CBS evening news viewer, you walked away from that, what, like 15 second

proctor read with a pretty deep. decent understanding of how both the Republican Party, we have two major parties in this country. So you walked away with a pretty decent understanding of how Republicans spent the day talking about January 6th and how Democrats spent the day talking about January 6th. And to level this both sides are equal criticism of that report is to demand CBS News lean left, plainly, lean left. And that's why we've seen, you know, it gets back to why the Tom Cotton op-ed was retracted by the New York Times, right? they're now more responsive to a smaller cluster of the public. And so when that's the case, if you want to win the late night ratings with or the evening

news ratings with a few million viewers as opposed to what that number used to be in the Cronkite days, then you need to cultivate a more loyal, meaning more ideological, following. And that's how, again, that's why the New York Times retracted the cotton op-ed. And so, listen, like, I'm as skeptical as any media critic of billionaires clearly snatching up media properties to, I mean, help their pet causes. I think that much is pretty obvious in the case of David Ellison, who, you know, oversaw this merger between Skydance, his company and Paramount. His father is Larry Ellison, very Trump-friendly Republican donor, billionaire. And I think there's plenty of evidence that that's what's happened. At the same time, at the same time, Barry Weiss has had trenchant media critique.

She is the head of CBS News with a group of people who do understand and do share genuine structural critiques of what's happened inside of corporate media. So it's going to be a mixed bag. And I think that's kind of interesting, right? So, like, on the one hand, we're going to see, you know, to say that that J6 report reflected, like, fealty to the president when it called it an attack on the Capitol is insane. Like, Trump would watch that and be pissed. I think we all know Trump would watch that and be like, what are they talking about? But it's going to be, I think what we're going to see is more and more of this, like, just by doing normal journalism, it's a stress test of the reaction from people who consider themselves fans of normal journalism. And what Larry Sabato should come out and say, frankly, is that he wants center-left journalism,

that he believes neutrality is actually how the center-left sees some of these huge political topics. And that's what engenders trusts. And I honestly think that's what CBS is getting wrong now, is that people just want you to be, they don't want you just take your jacket off. They want you to take your metaphorical jacket off, right? Like DeCople took his literal jacket off, but take your metaphorical jacket off and tell them where you're coming from and treat them as smart, intelligent people who can make up their own mind based on their understanding of your bias and where you're coming from. So I think

that's what they're kind of missing here. But it is funny to be in a position where you're kind of skeptical of the takeover, then also be in a position where two things are true. Like the takeover is problematic and the critics of the takeover are problematic. Those are the two Those are the two pillars that are holding up my current reaction to the transition over at CBS News. All right, finally, before we go, I want to talk about Spencer Pratt, who announced that he is running for Los Angeles mayor in, he announced it in a speech today on the anniversary of the Palisades Fire, which took his home in Los Angeles. So stick around for that. First, though, we have to talk about, guess what we have to. to talk about. You probably know what we have to talk about. We have to talk about cowboy colostrum.

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and no artificial flavors. You simply add a scoop of their chocolate, Madagascar vanilla, matcha or strawberry, and your coffee or smoothie, and you feel great the entire day. I like strawberry and a glass of milk. Super good. So for a limited time, our listeners get up to 25% off their entire order, just head to cowboy colostrum.com slash afterparty and use code afterparty at checkout. It's so easy to remember. That's 25% off when you use code afterparty at cowboy colostrum.com slash after party. All right, let's talk about Spencer Pratt. Let's roll this clip, actually, of Spencer Pratt at a, it was at a rally to remember what happened in the Palisades just a year ago, which frankly, I don't think as a country we talk about enough.

What happened was nobody there needs me to remind them, but what happened there was so horrific and so reflective of an incompetent, ideologically corrupt state and local government. And the story, I mean, let me just read some of these numbers. This is from an ABC 11 piece from yesterday. that basically added up some of the numbers or broke down some of the numbers. This fire, between the Eaton Fire and the Palisades Fire,

31 people died. 31 people died. The federal disaster aid that the governor, Governor Newsom has requested, is 33.9 billion. 16,000 structures were destroyed. That's about 9,000 homes in Altadena, Pacific Palisades and Malibu, about 6,800 buildings, and those were mostly homes. Right now, 10 houses have been built so far, rebuilt so far.

Ten houses. This is what ABC 11 says, quote, most are in the Altadena area with one in Pasadena and two in Pacific Palisades. none are finished in Malibu I mean billions of dollars in property damage billions of dollars of property damage thousands of homes destroyed 31 people dead

and boy did this story fall out of the news cycle quickly and now Gavin Newsom is very clearly mounting a bid for president well Spencer Pratt who if you're my age is a very familiar name because of Hills, which was the Laguna Beach spin-off and Spencer Pratt on the Hills was pretty roundly accepted to be a massive villain. He, I think, even went on shows like House of Villains. He's still married to Hadi Montag. He was going very viral. I think he has a crystal business.

He was going very viral for his love of, his very amusing love of hummingbirds back in like 2018 around that time period is, you know, not a, by any means, a traditional Orthodox politician. But here's part of his announcement video in Los Angeles today. On January 7th, 2025, Heidi and I lost our home. We lost every material possession we owned. My parents lost their home, too, and with it, decades of memories made inside those walls. I grew up in the palisades. I moved through these streets thinking my two boys would grow up here just like I did.

With that same hometown feeling, then right before my eyes, the future I envisioned from my family burned to the ground. I have to tell you, the most heartbreaking part of the past year wasn't being displaced or losing everything I own. It was the realization that all of this was preventable. As state and local leaders, let us burn. Let us burn. And he's basically right about that. Elsewhere in the speech, he said, quote, this is not just a campaign, this is a mission.

And we are going to expose the system. He said, quote, business as usual is a death sentence for Los Angeles. I'm done waiting. waiting for someone to take real action. He's gotten supportive shoutouts from Republicans like Steve Hilton, Rick Rinell, Rick Scott in just the last day or so. Now, the California Republican Party said they haven't had any contact with him about this bid. He's posted pictures of himself filing the paperwork. As sensibly, he's running as a Republican. He's been aligned with Republicans, interestingly enough, on a number of issues over recent years.

But this is a very, very interesting political story because Spencer Pratt is the perfect Trump-era candidate, meaning he has been. I mean, he goes fairly viral often with political commentary. And obviously, both he and Trump are reality stars, reality television stars. Like, that's the obvious point to make. But there's something deeper about the epistemology of social media, as Neil Postman might have said. Like, Neil Postman was upset about Ronald Reagan in the mid-80s being an actor and being president because Ronald Reagan was great on TV.

And Postman said that's different than coming across well in print and that you lose something when you move from print, the slower, more thoughtful medium to television, which is a much more aesthetic medium. And you can understand where that's coming from. I mean, you could write a full book about disagreements to that. On the other hand, the epistemology of the algorithm is a very different place to live in. And it has advantages and disadvantages. But one of those obvious advantages is that those of us who, I mean, it's everyone, the social media algorithms, which I personally detest,

But what they do, for all of us, as they influence the big narratives because journalists and politicians get their news from social media and those narratives migrate into all of the other coverage and the big picture conversation, that comes from people at least appearing to be more authentic, right? more authentic than someone who does well in the epistemology of cable news. As Postman might have said, the epistemology of cable news is somebody who performs, whereas on social media algorithms, you don't want to look like you're performing at all. Have you noticed how many commercials recently are filmed like vertical video on iPhones? Because it makes it more compelling for the viewer who right now is looking for authenticity, and it's not always going to be authentically authentic. But that's where Spencer Pratt can genuinely be dangerous, right?

He's different than a Rick Caruso, and Rick Caruso's probably running for governor. That's what it seems like. But Pratt is different than a Rick Caruso, who obviously lost to Karen Bass. I had a lot of money, but lost to Karen Bass. Because Pratt knows how to connect with people in an environment that is so low trust that people are drawn to what feels like reality, even when it's not. reality, by the way. Because again, he was on the hills, which is scripted reality. That in of itself is sort of the perfect illustration, encapsulation of where our politics are and tells

you how dangerous he could potentially be to Democrats in Los Angeles. Now, I don't know how dangerous Spencer Pratt could potentially be to Democrats in Los Angeles as a, like on the substantive questions. But as a media figure, he knows what he's doing. And it's so fascinating, you know, I just was listening to Tucker Carlson's episode with Mike Sernovich that dropped this week. And Sernovich goes on this rather hilarious, like 25-minute monologue about his many ayahuasca journeys, as he puts it. And I was thinking to myself listening to it. You have the formerly bow-tied Tucker Carlson, who is, of course, the first guest on this show, talking to Sernovich about ayahuasca and the spiritual journey of it.

And it's so, you know, I remember being at the, I was at a Maha rally before the 2024 election. And I was watching, you know, my evangelical friends with the barefoot hippies that were, you know, like Ralph Nader types. And Spencer Pratt is totally in the middle of that Venn diagram. And that on the margins, you know, it's not every American, it's not a majority of Americans, but it's enough people to make a political and cultural difference. And Pratt is a representative of that fascinating new community. And even just in those quotes that I read in the video you saw,

he's saying, this is not just a campaign, this is a mission, and we are going to expose the system. Business as usual is a death sentence for Los Angeles. I'm done waiting for someone to take real action. That's a message. If you get it to enough people that, resonates. If you get it to enough people with some sense of credibility, it resonates. All right. This shows keeps getting longer and longer because I keep rambling on and on and asking

clash questions to people like Glenn. But I appreciate you all being here. As a reminder, you can email Emily at devilmaicaremedia.com. I'm going to check that inbox tomorrow because we will be taping in addition of half the hour. You can only get that on your podcast feed. We dropped a couple on the YouTube feed during the on the YouTube feed during the holidays. But we will be putting that the podcast feed. So if you haven't subscribed on the podcast feed, go ahead, do that. Help us out, subscribe on YouTube, comment, like, that is so useful. We appreciate it. Appreciate it. Appreciate it. Appreciate it so much. Thanks for being here. We'll see you next week with more after party. Have a great one.