All About Change - Season 3, Episode 5: Emmy Award Winning TV Host Zuri Hall talks Inclusion in Hollywood and the Journalism Industry

Episode Date: June 21, 2020

On this episode of All Inclusive Jay talks to Emmy Award winning TV Host  from Access Hollywood and Ninja Warrior, Zuri Hall. Jay and Zuri discuss inclusion in the entertainment industry, what it’s like to work in journalism, and the future of the industry.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Journalism has changed a lot in the last decade with the boom of social media. Our guest today knows that better than anyone. All Inclusive, a podcast on inclusion, innovation, and social justice with Jay Ruderman. Hi, I'm Jay Ruderman. And on today's show, we're excited to have Emmy award-winning TV host Zuri Hall. Zuri, thanks so much for joining us today on All Inclusive. Zuri, you've been covering the Black Lives Matter movement and interviewed people like Dr. Melina Abdullah, the co-founder of Black Lives Matter in Los Angeles.

What were your takeaways from that interview? My biggest takeaway from talking with Melina is just that there's movement happening, but there's still so much change to be had. And what's really encouraging is the fact that so many people now are getting on board. You think about the time, maybe two, three years ago, and just the phrase, the sentence, the hashtag, right? Black Lives Matter had such a charge for certain people

who were offended by it or couldn't understand why someone might say something like that, as if that's such a radical statement. And I think now people are realizing the essence of the movement, the truth of it, which is all lives can't matter until Black lives matter. And that's what this movement is about. And that's what Melina made really clear in our interview. So that was important to get across. Well, there's obviously something happening in our country. I've been to a couple of protests locally. Even this weekend, I was driving with my wife in rural Massachusetts, and we were stopped by a protest. And this was a town that probably had almost no Black residents. And there were hundreds and

hundreds of people out there protesting for Black Lives Matter. So I think, you know, in the United States, in almost every city and town and around the world, people have reacted to the injustice of the murder of George Floyd and other Black people who've been killed at the hands of the police. So I think that there is something bubbling up to the country. Unfortunately, it took several really terrible murders for this to happen, but I do sense that there is a social justice change happening in our country right now. Oh, 100%, I totally agree.

This shift is definitely happening. I hope it continues with this momentum. It definitely feels as if we're moving forward together for the first time. It's encouraging, it's motivating, it's great to see that. And I hope we see more of it. But this definitely feels like a shift that will be permanent. And I'm grateful to be a part of reporting on it. You report mostly on the entertainment industry. Do you feel that the entertainment industry is waking up? I mean, they've had other instances in the past with Oscar So White, and

there's been, you know, other movements. Do you feel that there is a wake-up call where corporations and studios are now saying, okay, there's something happening in America that we need to respond to? Yeah, I do feel like Hollywood is waking up. I mean, even the stories that we're telling are changing and evolving and shifting. Even here at Access Hollywood, we're having the conversations of how can we be a part of amplifying those Black voices, of sharing Black stories,

and not just Black stories. This moment is ours. This is a moment that we need to be focusing on. But diversity and inclusion transcends us, transcends just black people. This is a fight that's extremely important. And there are other fights too. And I think our industry is finally waking up to that. I think the industry has known for a while, but you can be aware of a problem and still not be committed to really fixing it. And these marginalized populations, Black people included, but other marginalized groups, I think are just really tired of the lip service, tired of the poster boy or the poster girl that says, there's our checkmark. We hit our diversity or inclusion quota for the day, the quarter, the year. And we're really wanting fundamental change from the top down. And it's been encouraging to see vice presidents, executives who have advocated for diversity

inclusion for a while in our industry be promoted, have talent who have fought for diverse and inclusive stories, have their voices really heard and their pitches really considered in a different way now. So the needle is definitely moving. That's awesome. I hope it continues. Can you tell us a little bit about where you grew up? Did you have any role models when you were younger that sort of inspired you to take the career that you assumed? Yeah, so I grew up in Toledo, Ohio. I went to the Ohio State University, go back. And immediately after graduation, I jumped right into local news and kind of just climbed up the local newsletter for a few years before getting my big break,

my first national gig at 25 out in New York for Fuse TV. Growing up, role models, I mean, it was really my family that motivated me. I know that's kind of a little bit cliche, but I never really had a poster on the wall of anyone that, you know, was my North Star when it came to navigating through the industry that I knew I wanted to be in. It was the hard work that I saw my mother and my father put in, my mother's father, my papa. They just taught me the value of ambition. They taught me the value of education, especially higher education and integrity more than anything. The value system I inst value system I was instilled with, that's really been the North Star through this industry for me.

And so I'm grateful for that. The biggest role models I've had are just, you know, my parents loving me and supporting me and letting me do all of the crazy things I wanted to do as a kid. I was just like, I'm headed to Hollywood. I'm packing up. I'm going to L.A. do as a kid. I was just like, I'm headed to Hollywood. I'm packing up. I'm going to LA. And they're just like, okay, how do we support this girl in her dreams that are so different from maybe what they were expecting? It sounds like you had a really supportive family and you've entered into an industry, which is not an easy industry, as you know. Was journalism

something you were always interested in? Was it a passion of yours? I was always interested in the truth and in what was just and right and fair from a very early age. I'm talking like six, seven, eight. I didn't necessarily think that it would steer me into journalism in the sense of covering truth and really pushing for honest and real coverage of stories that are affecting us. To be honest, I kind of fell into it. I've always been passionate about entertainment, about being on stage. I'm a theater geek, so I grew up in theater. When I won my first position in television presenting, it kind of happened by chance.

I fell into a role after competing for my first job out of college. And I got a one-year deal with that local TV station. And I realized, well, this is really fun. You know, I've always loved singing and acting and producing and writing. But I've never thought about covering people who do this also as a livelihood. And it was a place for me to show my personality. I got to entertain people still, but also inform them. And then when I moved to Dallas, Texas, to anchor for the evening news down there for the CW affiliate, that was my first encounter with hard news. And I wanted that

experience. I wanted to be at an anchor desk. I wanted to be covering important stories and current events in a factual, unbiased way. And that's where I got to work that muscle. So I kind of went with the momentum and over time fell into journalism. And it's been great because even now that I've, you know, come back to Hollywood, which was always the end goal, I see a lot of what's happening and try to report a lot of what's happening through that journalistic lens that I developed when I was doing hard news back in Dallas, Texas. So when you were in Dallas, were there ever any stories that you were covering where you're like, oh my God, this is just really difficult to cover? I used to be an assistant

district attorney. There were cases that came into court that were just heartbreaking, or maybe it struck you in a personal way that you were just like, this is just too hard? You know, overall, I think just the general death and destruction and corrupt nature of humans at times was disillusioning to me there for sure because you're taking those stories home with you every day. You don't just shut off your empathy or your human emotion because it's time to check out. So that did

cause a bit of emotional exhaustion. But I would be honest in saying there was no one story that I can think of quickly. I'd have to really rack my brain. That was probably about seven years ago, up quickly, I'd have to really rack my brain. That was probably about seven years ago, eight years ago that I was down in Dallas. But it was just the overall feeling of reporting on really difficult things that kind of took a toll on me. Journalism in general is a very dangerous profession. You know, people who are out there, whether foreign or whether local, I mean, I've been watching many of the protests and there's been several journalists who've been detained and arrested. I mean, it can be a very dangerous profession. It is. It can be dangerous. And that's why I feel like, you know, the media personalities, the hard news personalities who commit to doing that work, they're putting themselves literally

on the front lines of these important stories to get us the information that we need. And I respect that so much. I was honored to be a part of it for a short amount of time, but that one year in Dallas really just made me gain an entirely new level of respect and admiration for the journalists who are committed to doing that work because it's important. And especially in a day and age of, you know, fake news and crazy headlines, and people are so quick to get things out and be the first to a story that they're not even operating with the journalistic integrity to get the story right. And so the people who are committed to doing that are more important now than ever. How do you think that social media has changed journalism? Do journalists have to be very active in social

media in order to raise their profile, in order to move ahead in the industry? You know, that is a question I ask myself sometimes. You know, it's almost like we have to live these double lives at this point. I think we all do. This transcends, by the way, entertainment industry or hard news journalists or even TV personalities. It's like we have our day-to-day on the ground life. And then we have this digital paper trail that we have to curate because if it's not on the internet, it didn't happen. And I do sense a shift. I hesitate to say it because I don't, I wish it didn't have to be true, but I do sense a shift towards personal branding online being really essential to showing people who you are,

because, you know, I'm, I'm noticing people really want to get behind people, places, and things that they can believe in. If I'm going to support your business at this point, I need to know what your business stands for. Who are the people in positions of power at your business? What causes, nonprofits, or foundations are you supporting or working with? What value system does that corporation operate with? And so we feel the same about our public figures now. There was a time when musicians and actors and actresses, it was like, entertain us, give us the show, give us the song. And that's all we want from you. We don't want you to get political. But in the last five years, what's been really interesting about

my work in entertainment news journalism is I was starting to cover actors, actresses, singers, who were either speaking up because they just couldn't stay silent anymore. That's just how big this bubble of tension and political tension, social justice, et cetera, was becoming, or they were being pressured by their fans to be held accountable in a way that they never had before. When you are a journalist, it's difficult because especially in hard news, your job is to report it unbiased and just give the information as it is.

But we're in such a polarizing world. Even with our journalists, you start to get more commentary, which I think people appreciate. You're listening to All Inclusive with Jayay ruderman you can learn more view the show notes and transcripts at rudermanfoundation.org all inclusive please remember to subscribe rate and review us wherever you are listening i mean i don't want to put you on the spot but have there been any interviews that you've had that were particularly interesting or your favorite people that you've interviewed in the past?

Because you've interviewed so many people. Oh, my gosh. Oh, gosh. There are a ton. I mean, Oprah. Just Oprah, Oprah, Oprah. I love that woman. I've loved her before I met her.

I have had the pleasure, the honor of interviewing her three times now. And what I love most about her is they sometimes say don't meet your idols, but she just lives up to everything you might expect. She has such a gift for making people feel seen. And upon meeting her, you immediately realize how she became Oprah. She's giving you all of her Oprah energy. And it's like you two are the only ones in the room. I'll always appreciate any time I get to talk to her. Well, she's certainly one of the most respected people in America and probably around the world. Where do you think journalism is going in the future? How do you think it's going to change?

What I actually think when it comes to changes and journalism is I think the change will come from the consumer and the viewer. because we have had a lot of time where we don't know what the truth is. And because of the way social media is going, because of the way our platforms have just become algorithm-fueled echo chambers of whatever we consume, whatever we want to hear, there is even more need for personalities, anchors, reporters operating with journalistic integrity. When things get real, you know, we're coming out of a global pandemic. There were so many facts intertwined with, you know, myth. And we went to the people who we could trust to disseminate, you know, fact from fiction. And so the change that I see and I'm encouraged by is the fact that those people who deserve that acknowledgement

and that respect are starting to get it again. Right, that's so true. You hosted a show that was called What's Good with Zuri Hall, which was an E! News original series that takes bite-sized, deep-dive look into pop culture topics that celebrities explore diversity in Hollywood. Speaking of diversity and inclusion, what can the entertainment industry do to be more inclusive and more diverse? A lot of times I think people see us, the talking heads, if you will, or the faces, the hosts, the actors, the actresses, and let that be the only reflection

they need to see to decide if a company or a production or a studio is diverse or inclusive. But I think we need to do it from the top down. We need executives. We need people in positions of power. We need producers and writers who also reflect the talent who are advocating for or talking about diversity and inclusion. If we can make that top-down shift happen, that'll be the biggest way to do it, honestly. The power is behind the scenes. We need to make sure diversity and inclusion is reflected there too. You emceed a program for our foundation many months ago before COVID where we honored the Farrelly brothers for including people with disabilities in their films and really taking a leadership role. Do you see a point where

our society is moving in the direction of becoming more inclusive for all different types of people in our society? Whether it is people living with disabilities, whether it is indigenous populations, whether it is the LGBTQ community, we all need to be each other's allies. There is not one cause and then we're done. And what's exciting about this time is I think people are really opening themselves up to humbling themselves and learning that they have so much more to learn, myself included. Like that is so important for me to say. I can't overstate it enough. The one thing I know is that I do not know much. And the blessing is we are all starting to have these conversations together and creating safe spaces to learn. So I know I'm committed to being a better ally, to learning how I can advocate more for marginalized communities, whether it affects me or not, because I hope that people are doing the same for me. So yeah, I'm very hopeful. In April, you hosted the Alpha Babe Power Planet panel. We had some of the leaders in the entertainment industry join you to talk about their advice and stories in the industry. And it

raised thousands of dollars for COVID-19 relief. Can you talk a little bit about that and what gave you the idea to do it? And do you think you'll do it in the future? Alpha Babe was a concept that came to me many years ago, probably six or seven years ago. And it was just at the time, a social media platform to empower young women, especially to one, embrace their ambition, not shy away from it, to embrace the quote unquote alpha in them. I think traditionally women who are labeled alpha, it's a bad thing. They try to imply, you know, oh, we'll never get a man as if we need one to go through life happily. If we want one, that is also awesome. But there was just such a negative connotation to that world. And it was

before the shifts that I've seen in the last six or seven years. So even though we still need it, I'm happy to say that in the six or seven years, since I came up with the concept, we're seeing way more of this energy and this narrative being pushed to the forefront. But it was just a way for us to celebrate our duality. You know, you can be strong, you can be alpha, and still embrace your femininity and the things that make you soft and sometimes vulnerable. And I really wanted to use the platform to cater to career centric women and help equip them with tools and resources to kind of boss up to their best life and, you know, go after whatever their goals are with full speed.

And when the pandemic hit, it was this bittersweet realization, I think, for a lot of us that, hey, we don't have to necessarily be in person to affect change, to move the needle in the way that we'd hoped. I'd been putting off hosting an Alpha Babe event for so long to raise money for various initiatives that I was passionate about, because I think, oh my gosh, it's going to take so much money, or I need to get sponsors, or what about a venue? I'm working full time, two jobs sometimes, like just how, how, how? And, you know, quarantine forced us all to slow down and sit down, And we all wanted to help however we could. And being in Hollywood, I have amazing relationships that I'm so grateful for. And I have young women who

ask me and men who ask me all the time for career advice. And I help one on one whenever I can. But I just thought this is a really great opportunity to reach a bunch of people because everyone's sitting at home if they're lucky enough to be able to quarantine at home. And we can raise money for an important cause, which is relief efforts for COVID-19. So I got together some of my industry friends, recognized media personalities, hard news journalists, et cetera. And we hosted a virtual event and sold tickets. And we had hundreds of men and women on there soaking up our knowledge and our wisdom from, you know, decades combined in the entertainment industry. And then we donated 100% of those net proceeds to COVID-19 relief efforts across the country. So that was really encouraging for me

because it made me realize doing good and helping doesn't have to be so hard, you know, like with a little bit of creativity and effort. It really is. It can be easier to do the work than maybe we sometimes realize. And that was encouraging. So I'm looking forward to doing more events like that.

Right. Well, congratulations on that. So many people know you from Access Hollywood covering, you know, red carpets from the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade and many other shows and events. And you were also on American Ninja Warrior. Have you tried the course? Oh my gosh, I am smart enough to not try that course. Jay, if you ever want to tried the course oh my gosh i am smart enough to not try that course jay if you ever want to try the course you let me know we'll get you up there you can let me know how it is it looks pretty difficult yeah it's just it's a massive it's a an entirely different beast and it's one thing on tv but i'll never forget the first time i walked up to the because i thought i might try it honestly but the first night i walked up to the course and saw it in person, I was like, absolutely not. I value my limbs. I value my

motor functions. I value the fact that right now everything is intact and with me and how clumsy I am and not athletically gifted is just probably a recipe for disaster. So I'll stick to the sideline reporting. I think the men and women who go through that course are exceptional athletes and have something that most of us don't. Oh, 100%. They're great. You have been a guest star on several shows and you also studied improv in New York City. Do you like improv and do you think it made you a better reporter? And do you think that you would ever consider going into acting?

I do like improv in the way that you like anything that's extremely uncomfortable in the moment, but you feel good for having done it on the other side. It's like working out for me because I hate working out. Every session is torture. But after I'm like, I should do more of that. Improv is the same thing. And I would love to do more of it. You know, I think it helps me in hosting and the conversations that I have that I moderate, whether on camera or on stage, to just kind of be able to go off the cuff and feed off of the person. Acting, yes, I would like to actually. It was my first love. I minored in theater when I was at university. I've done a lot of stage work and a couple guest appearances. I did an appearance on The Morning Show, Jenny Aniston's project with Reese Witherspoon over at Apple TV. And that just kind of reignited my acting bug. So maybe we'll see some more in the future. Never say never.

How long did it take you to get comfortable in front of the camera? I think I was always a bit of a ham when the camera came on, even when I was really young. And I think it was because I was so shy. I was painfully shy, super reserved through high school, pushing into college to the point I sometimes I would feel uncomfortable looking people in the eyes. I remember my granny always kind of like gently scolding me and saying, when you speak to someone, you look them in the eyes. It's a sign of respect for them. It's a sign of respect for yourself. And that was just so hard for me to do. So the camera was always my permission to be a thing

that I didn't feel I was naturally in everyday life. So if I was on, you know, a stage acting or talking into a camera, it was like this automatic permission to just be who I knew I could be. You've been very involved and very social conscious and volunteering. What are some of the causes and organizations that are important to you? I'm really passionate about inner city youth and single mothers, especially those raising underprivileged youth. I've done a lot of work with the Alexandria House here in Los Angeles, which is a transitional home for single mothers and their children. And what I really love about that home specifically is they let children come who are young girls and boys up to the age or through, I think, about 17 years old. So I volunteered there and help when I can. I've been an advocate and a part

of the Know Your Girls campaign in association with the Ad Council, which has helped raise awareness for Black women and breast cancer, which is, you know, a disease that statistically affects us at an alarmingly higher rate than it does our white female counterparts. And now I'm looking for more ways, you know, like starting the work, being able to share space with everyone at your event for inclusion with the Ruderman Family Foundation was really special for me and really eye-opening for me and really kind of lit a fire in me to do more work in that space also and learn how to become a better ally in that space. So I use my platform in the ways that I can. I'm really open to people reaching out to me and sort of presenting ideas about how

I can use my platform better. Because like I said, I'm still learning and there's still so much to be open to. So that's been a really exciting thing to commit to, especially in the last two to three years. But continuing to do that work is something that I'm really committed to. Yeah. Well, I want to thank you because at our event, we highlighted the dearth of people with disabilities in front of the camera. And there are plenty of people with disabilities who are talented. And I think that, you know, people like yourself and the Farrelly brothers and other people in the audience like Larry David have the power to really, you know, we will get to the point where it's going to seem unnatural to have disability played by someone who does not have that disability. So I want to thank you for, you know, being interested in that. Finally, I just want to ask you, your partner, Sean Culkin, who plays for the Los Angeles Chargers, and he played at in during college at the University of Missouri, and you are from a graduate of Ohio State. If the two schools were playing in a national championship game,

who would you pick? Way to raise the stakes, Jay. I did not expect national championship title on the line here. Oh, man, that's a house divided. I know that for sure. I'm a Buckeye through and through I gotta be honest the the question would be if in some impossible world Sean were still playing for you know Mizzou who would I be cheering for and then I might have to sleep on it I'd have to meditate I'd have to figure out, you know, where my loyalty lies. Oh goodness.

Can I plead the fifth on this one? Can I exercise my rights? I don't want to get you in any trouble. And you know, he's a wonderful guy and you're really lucky and he's lucky. So, um, you know, it was just a hypothetical. I didn't want to put you on the spot. But anyway, Zuri, it's been a pleasure speaking to you. You recently had a birthday and I want to wish you a happy belated birthday. I'm sure it wasn't easy celebrating a birthday

during COVID-19. It's not like, you know, every year. But you're doing fantastic work in the entertainment industry. And I think you have an amazing future. And on top of that, you have a conscience. You care about your community, which not everyone in the industry does. So, you know, it's been a pleasure getting to know you. And I really appreciate you appearing on our show today. Jay, thank you so much for taking the time. The honor was all mine.

And this is great. So awesome to talk with you a little bit more. Thank you. Take care and be safe and be healthy. You too. All Inclusive is a production of the Ruderman Family Foundation. Our key mission is the full inclusion of people with disabilities in all aspects of society. You can find All Inclusive on Apple Podcasts, Google Play, Spotify, and Stitcher.

To view the show notes, transcripts, or to learn more, go to rudermanfoundation.org slash allinclusive. Have an idea for a podcast? Be sure to tweet at Jay Ruderman. Thank you.