American Alchemy with Jesse Michels - Are “Aliens” Just Future Humans? Ft. Mike Masters

Episode Date: October 5, 2024

Michael Masters is a biological anthropologist at Montana Tech University. He’s written 3 books: Unidentified Flying Objects, The Extratempestrial Model, and Revelation: The Future Human Past. His arguments that aliens are just humans from the future who have figured out time travel are compelling and thorough. Please enjoy this episode!! And buy his books if you do :) Find Mike Masters' books here: https://amzn.to/3QBgaPx *** AMERICAN ALCHEMY is an original series hosted by Jesse Michels that explores the frontier of science and tech. INSTAGRAM ➤ https://www.instagram.com/jessemichels TWITTER ➤ https://twitter.com/AlchemyAmerican EMAIL/BOOKINGS ➤ [e-mail] SUBSCRIBE TO OUR CHANNEL: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7eOJzNRWY4l2UTDvIquxYg?app=desktop original music: https://open.spotify.com/artist/6LlLRudDi60Uy4jcmOSEs1 - Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Fit for your ambition for Citizens Bank. Why would the government even be allowed to have this stuff in their possession if a higher sentience, you know, either didn't want it or wanted it back? And I'm just like, I kind of went, I'm like, well, but the fact is we do. Do you believe the U.S. government is in possession of time machines? craft. I think if these things that crashed are time machines, then absolutely. And you think they're a time machine?

I do. Aliens could potentially be us in the future. Do you believe in aliens? And we are fucking aliens. All the time. They can breathe our air. They can have sex with us. They can speak our languages. They're just this suite of characteristics that scream time traveling future humans.

Dr. Michael P. Masters is a biological anthropologist and professor at Montana Tech, He's written three books, identified flying objects, the extra tempestrial model, and recently, Revelation, the future human past. In these works, he lays out a theoretical framework that he's been developing for his entire life in one that, in my opinion, best explains the UFO phenomena, that aliens are humans from the future who figured out time travel and are coming back to visit us.

If you think about how we're actually evolving as a species, their eyes are sort of slits. you know, have more screen time going forward. Senses essential for hunter-gathering like smell and hearing matter less than ever. And the gray aliens have very small noses and ears. There's even an evolutionary concept called neotony, where a species' distant descendants look like its current children. And gray aliens are constantly described as childlike. They were about the size of the kids.

They were, you know, about three feet tall. What's more? The list of credentialed UFO researchers that that believe the time travel hypothesis is endless. Navy Commander George Hoover, who held the top secret clearance for most of his life, admitted that the beings in the Roswell crash were just time traveling humans.

And Herman Oberth, the father of German rocketry and Werner von Braun's mentor, said that UFOs likely don't traverse large distances in space, they jump from one time space coordinate to another. Even Spielberg may have included a couple of time travel related hints in close encounters of the third third kind. Because at the end, you see the World War II pilots come out. They haven't aged at all.

That's true. It's a subtle little, hey, these guys are time travelers. Einstein was right. According to Deadpool creator Robert Leafield, Spielberg said to Robert in 1993, what's easier to believe that we are being monitored by aliens from another world, or that we are monitoring ourselves and studying us from the future? And in a recent Newsweek article, Blink 182 Frontman and to the Stars Academy founder Tom DeLong said, These things aren't coming from other planets. These things might be coming through time. Paul Heinek always said, one of Jayonne, Heinick's sons,

how would they find us and why would they care? They would find us because we're their ancestors. Why would they care about this planet unless they're said to inherit it? As for the craft, UFOs themselves may simply be time machines. Experiencers almost always report missing time or time anomalies. Strong electromagnetism comes on. off the craft, which as we'll get into, makes sense if these crafts are time machines. And finally, many contactees report having to take chemical rinses in what's speculated to be

antiseptic liquid, perhaps so they don't contaminate the future with a pathogen that's already been wiped out. I don't think they're necessarily doing anything to us. I think it's for them. I think it's self-preservation. That something in the future requires them to sample gametes from the past. In this interview, we cover it all, how we might be understanding. unwitting participants in an intertemporal breeding program, how the phenomenon relates

to biological evolution, and how the crafts would work as time machines in a conventional physics framework. We talk about the nature of time, time loops, timeline wars, psychic remote viewing, and Mike even shares his own personal experience with the future human visitors. My eyes went black and all of a sudden I feel all of this information coming in my brain. The other individual standing to my left, occasionally I would say, did you get that? Did you get that? I'm like, uh-huh, uh-huh.

And I can see it coming in. I have no idea what it is. And I've talked to people that have expoused it. It was almost like a QR code. Download it in their brain was the communication. Along the way, we dropped new revelations from David Grush, the UFO whistleblower from my last video that blew the cover on UFO reverse engineering programs. I talked to people who really did analyze the stuff from the real deal stuff.

And it's super weird. It's like heavy element, Europium, Californium stuff. It's like in these atomic arrangements that make like no sense. So on that note, hit subscribe and converge with your feature self as you watch today's American alchemist,

Dr. Michael Masters. Different parts of the brain have different activities. But you know that, don't you? Maybe you should interview me. This place is interesting. Where are we? Would you bring me back in time for this conversation or something, man?

It feels like it. Trippy. I'm excited to speak with you. Yeah, same, man. Yeah. Even if it isn't a tripped out 1950s dying. I don't know what happened. We just ended up here.

So you wrote, you've written three books now, two of which I've read and are fantastic. Identified Flying Objects and the Extra Tempestrial Model. And in the second book, you really prove out kind of the theoretical framework for how a lot of what we consider extraterrestrial visitors are actually just humans from the future. I think one of the most remarkable things from your book is you cite the free Edgar Mitchell study. It's the largest study of contactees, abductees, experiencers in general. The time they published that study I was referencing, I think they had about 3,500. Yeah. And it's up about 5,000 now.

So they're continuing to bring more data in, and then further analyses might change some of the ways that we look at these things. Yeah. And you say that 52% of the respondents, contactees, experience hominid-like creatures in their kind of contact experience. And then 85% of those cases, this is what I find fascinating,

have a friendly or neutral experience, which might show that if they are sort of future or trans-temporal, humans or something, they show a care for us in a way that will maybe help us sort of ascend into them or ensure their own sustenance in a way. Yeah, and what's another interesting thing you can tease out of that is the ones who did interact with less human forms had a more negative experience. And so you kind of have to break that down. Is it because it was scarier? Is there more ontological shock when something that looks like a giant bug is abducting you that can

control your mind and interact with you telepathically? and give you images and all of these crazy downloads. But it is interesting that the most reported form is human. Yeah. And you might expect that. I think we talked about this previously, where you might expect that based on where we are in time, because in the same way that, you know, here in Los Angeles

or wherever the hell you took me, you have people that you interact with more who are local, who are here. Yeah. Because they're just there. They're closer to you in proximate geographic space. But it may be similar with time where you expect to see people from closer to your relative time because you're closer to them, whereas these ones that are more distant, maybe the praying mantis-looking humans, because I don't think they're

actual insects or they would have six legs by definitions. One caveat. But we expect to see them less because we're one tiny blip on their radar. It's just we're less likely to run into someone from Malaysia or South Africa and Oklahoma, but we see Oklahomans all the time because they're just there. North Sentinel Island is a remote island off the coast of India, and its people have had minimal contact with the outside world, save for a few encounters with anthropologists and Christian missionaries. Fully clothed, pale-skinned, and speaking of foreign language, these people must seem like aliens from another planet to the North Sentinelese.

And if you're the majority of North Sentinel natives who didn't interact with these visitors personally, you probably wouldn't believe the ones who did. Over time, these contact stories would get relegated to mythology and lore. We might be making the same wrong assumptions when it comes to UFOs and alien contact experiences. We have our own mythological contact stories that half the population believes while the other doesn't. And we assume these alien contact experiences are interactions with beings from another planet. But maybe our so-called alien visitors aren't from far away, they're from far ahead. Just probabilistically, the idea that life and another, in a completely foreign, you know, planet would evolutionarily converge to look exactly like us or very similar to us, speak our language in many cases, as you know, talk about a lot of these abduction experiences, breathe our air, breathe our air, all of that.

It just feels super unlikely. And maybe the one argument to that is that, you know, Dave Grush talked about this. They could somehow, they're so advanced that they could program. something like us. It's either extraterrestrial, and we're seeing bioengineered beings that look similar to us for ease of communication and acceptance, maybe, and that is almost like an avatar

for the intelligence behind, you know, the ghost behind the machine or whatever. There's that possibility, I suppose, and that actually would make more sense that they were engineered specifically to look like that and it wasn't natural. they're trying to make something that's less jarring to us that looks and acts more like us, just make it like us.

Just make it look like what we're going to look like in another 20, 30, 40,000 years. Totally. But I have thought about that idea of avatars before, and it's actually a big part of the storyline in my most recent book, Revelation, the Future Human Past, where there is some indication that they're making sort of robotic, droid avatars, whatever you. want to call them, but potentially, and we're not far from this technology now, biologically constructed ones, where we move away from moving parts and things that need oiled and can break down to using that advanced knowledge of genetics and genetic manipulation, something probably

centuries beyond CRISPR technology and creating forms that can perform certain tasks. So I would agree with Grush in the sense that some of these could be created, but then the question is who's creating them? A quick word from our amazing sponsor for today's episode. If you've seen our episode are Mushrooms Aliens, you'll remember the Finnish Mushroom Master, the guest of that episode,

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It'd be a big support to the show if you did that. Now back to the show. As a species, we are becoming domesticated. The average male sperm count is just 59% of what it was in 1973. And testosterone has been dropping 1% year over year since the 80s. So I picked four cities in the United States that had different environments. And we showed that pesticide was significantly related to. the men's sperm cat.

A wolf is to a dog what a 19th century human will probably be to a 22nd century human. So infertility may become a concern in the future. And consistently, these aliens seem very interested in extracting human gametes. You have Antonio Vios Boas, which you write about in 57, describing kind of mating with the future human or extraterrestrial being, fully doing it.

Yeah. Getting busy. Getting busy. And you also, you talk about Barney Hill reluctantly saying that semen samples were taken from him. Jim Penniston, Rendell Schumforist incident in 1980. He recalls a contact experience with extraterrestrials or future humans that say they want to maintain genetic diversity and not get wiped off the planet. And so they specifically need, you know, genetic samples from current humans. So what's going on? Are we in some sort of bizarre intertemporal breeding program or something?

I mean, you're right. That is one of the most common themes. It's ubiquitous across these abduction cases. And seemingly, mostly throughout the 70s, 80s, 90s, you don't really hear about it as much anymore, but almost every male that was taken would have sperm extracted. Females have developing fetuses implanted, taken out, eggs being taken. So you have to ask why. You see these patterns emerge and you have to ask why. And I think a lot of what I've tried to do with my research is not speculate about what's going to happen, where we're going. I went out of my way to avoid that in all of my books.

But we can look at what's happening now and what's happened in the past. And we see a 60% reduction in sperm counts in males, and only the last 40 years in the developed world, up a 50% reduction across the entire world. A 2011 study showed that average sperm count is down to 47 million per milliliter. Below 40, you start having trouble conceiving. Jesus. Yeah. There's all of these things that are happening

that could contribute to problems with genetics in the future. I think that's what they specifically told Jim Penniston. They said, we're you. We come from 8,000 years. in the future. And yeah, that they're having problems with reproduction and they're taking these gametes. And I think not only that, but also the fact that Antonio V.S. Boas had physical intercourse with this woman, who he describes as a woman. She looks a little bit different than women that he knew, slightly higher cheekbones, point of your chin, but all of the same parts that you need to

have sex with someone. Would you get those with a species that evolved on a different planet? Would they even have anything close to DNA? Could you take DNA from them? So I think all of these things together indicate that we are the same species. If this hybridization program is real, you have the ability to reproduce. So it does feel like humans are becoming sort of domesticated a la your, you know, the sperm count stats that you've cited. We are. We know we've been becoming domesticated for about the last 30,000 years, especially since agriculture, we have a selection for more pro-social behaviors. When we were nomadic hunter-gathers, we could just move around.

It's always being an asshole. You just go somewhere else. But once we started to settle down in cities, there's obviously a lot of conflict. We can see that in the archaeological record. It's an aspect of biological anthropology called bioarchiology. And we still go to war with each other, but we seem to be moving away from that. A lot of it's because we're domesticating ourselves through the selection for more pro-social behaviors where we can just get alone. We have to because we have nukes.

You know, it's just mutually assured destruction. It's cataclysmic if we continue. our sort of ways. Over the years, humans have collected satellite data of electromagnetic and geomagnetic anomalies on Earth. And when you start to cross-reference these electromagnetic anomalies against the significant UFO instances over the last 200 years, you start to see a ridiculous correlation, according to UFO researcher Steve Mera.

Now, we want to try and promote the fact that uphology consists of so much more than just a light in the sky. Not to mention, if you could create a traversable worm, that allowed for time travel, you'd see a ton of electromagnetic fallout around it. As future American alchemy guest Eric Wargo writes, a portal or UFO itself, as shown by the intergalactic wormhole in interstellar, would appear visually as a convex three-dimensional object, having volume, not as a hole or doorway. And I remember being at Skinwalker Ranch, which is this famous kind of paranormal hotspot

in the, you went to, you know, basin in Utah. and a tri-field meter going off. Right before we left, we grabbed the trifield meters. It had full battery. It's flashing. It's now dead. Because there was a lot of electromagnetic activity. Historically, there's been a lot of electromagnetic activity there.

And so, are we just witnessing wormholes? I kind of get the sense that many of these craft are time machines themselves. A lot of the saucer-shaped, disc-shaped craft have a form consistent with the function of manipulating space time. So maybe it helps in moving through space time in some way, if they are, in fact, our time-traveling descendants. But there might be more going on. It could have something to do with energy sources

or drawing energy from the environment that helps power the craft. So maybe portals like Skinwalker Ranch and others with high electromagnetic and nuclear activity are the launch and landing pads for UFOs, not the White House lawn, Vandenberg, or the tarmac at LAX. If UFOs were simply entering our atmosphere from space, you'd probably expect some sort of electromagnetic superhighway coming to and from Earth.

But if you talk to any setty scientists trying to pick up communication signals from space, they'll say the same thing, that space itself is remarkably quiet. When I started interviewing people that were totally genuine and, of course, uncovering the kind of legacy program that I've talked about, I mean, I lost a lot of sleep. I couldn't even like conceptualize stuff. I mean, even for me, my worldview, which I consider myself an open person, I had trouble even understanding it. And I went back to the Fermi paradigm.

I'm like, well, why isn't there an overt presence? Why would the government even be, this is how deep I went. I'm like, why would the government even be allowed to have this stuff in their possession if a higher sentience, you know, either didn't want it or wanted it back or, you know, whatever. You can make up a bunch of notional scenarios that, you know, kind of sounds sci-fi. But, and I'm just like, I kind of went. I'm like, well, but the fact is we do.

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makes the pizza. Copilot handles the spreadsheets. Learn more at M365 copilot.com slash work. Do you believe the U.S. government is in possession of time machine craft? I think if these things that crashed are time machines, then absolutely. And you think they're time machine? I do. Yeah. Again, just the disc-shaped craft. Because we have this expression in biology that form follows function. Yeah. And the form of these machines seems to indicate the function of manipulating space time and traveling forward and backwards. I list. And that's just based on Frank Tipler's work?

Not just. It's this whole line of evolution stemming from Einstein's original 1915 paper. You have all of these solutions to as field equations. You have lens and theory, frame dragging. You have these solutions that show you can tip over those light cones through the rotation of massive objects. We've tested this and shown that even the Earth is extremely small. planet relative to other exoplanets also creates this frame dragging effect. Not long after that,

you had Van Stockham, you had the Godell universe where you imagine this infinitely large disk, like imagine a galaxy that's infinitely large, where it's creating that same rotational frame dragging and bending over a light cone so that you can move into the past. And then importantly, in the 1970s with Frank Tipler, that's all shrunk down to the size that's, finite, and it's a rapidly rotating ring, sphere, or disk, as he said. And he shows that you can have all of these same frame-dragging, light cone bending over properties with something that sounds exactly like a UFO. They're seen rotating, they're seen popping in and out of space time.

I mean, I'm not saying our theoretical frameworks are correct, but we really do have physics explanations on how the UAPs jump around or whatever. That's totally an effect of an Occupier-style warp bubble. So that would be light being blue-shifted into the ultraviolet as its lens across the bubble that the craft creates. It's a blue shift not just in light that takes it up into that short wave radiation area that causes temporary damage to people. But also time is shifted as a result of that. Like everything within that region in and around this. what Jim Penniston called a sphere of influence, where he felt like he was walking through water.

Like everything within proximity to that craft was different. It was shifted. So there's a lot of things like that that indicate that in proximity to these craft, they are manipulating the rate at which time flows. And if you have that ability, what's stopping you from going back through it? But then we take seriously the accounts, these contact cases, where you have things like Corporal Armando Valdez in Chile in the 1970s, where he disappears entirely from the six men in his platoon. 15 minutes later, he reappears, but five days passed for him. It's indicated by the wristwatch, which reads five days in the future.

His beard has grown out. He was just shaven before that. Travis Walton wakes up after his abduction experience, and he has a fully beard or whatever he had shaved right before his experience. Yeah, and he may have been gone for five days. That one's harder to corroborate, but it was shown that the trees in and around the place he was. taken, the ones facing that side grew faster. Linda Jones in Manchester, UK, she was running with

her children away from this UFO, and the grass was growing rapidly under her feet as she's running. The grass seemed to move at the side of us and at the front of us. Amy Rylance is probably one of my favorite cases in this regard, because she was taken. Her friend Petcher watched her being taken through the window. All of a sudden, they get this call that she's been found at a petrol station, 790 kilometers away. But what's interesting is she claims to have been on board that craft with a man. She said specifically in interview,

I don't call him an alien, I call him a man. He had all of the same physiological characteristics of a man. She claims she was with them for five to seven days. Clearly, they traveled 790 kilometers to drop her off, but also seemingly went back in time to drop her off closer to the point at which she was taking and likely because her friend's freaking out, her husband's freaking out, the cops think she was murdered.

One case, one of my favorite Udo Wartena, he got a tour. He didn't know shit about UFOs or electromagnetics, of course, because he's a minor. But they explain that there's these counter-rotating flywheels. So it's like where you have those maglev trains, where it sits above, it's a frictionless surface, which is why they can go so fast and use less energy, where they're spinning these fly-wheels, and then these magnets, these electromagnets are forcing those around. And something about the counter-rotation of those creates this electrical. electromagnetic field, which I think is important for their anti-gravity propulsion and importantly the

The manipulation of space time. So do you have a sense of the current engineering limitations on our own ability to build these time machines? A if these are time machines B, if we've received them as crashed or Landed vehicles, which was an interesting thing to hear that's come out of David Grush's testimony is that seemingly some of them are gifted in intact objects that sort of gives us a leg up. But then it's still this question of what is time if there's time travel? I talked to people who really did analyze the stuff from the real deal stuff. And it's super weird.

It's like heavy element, you know, Europium, Californium stuff. It's like in these atomic arrangements that make like no sense. You know, this is through X-ray diffraction where they can image the shell. of the atomic pairs and stuff. And it's like, why is all these crazy heavy elements in this like weird ceramic metal hull structure? And it doesn't, we don't understand the emergent metamaterial properties.

And we can't configure atoms. So you can get down to what, 0.2 nanometers or something as far as anything? Yeah, I mean, there's certain techniques out there that they're augmenting some X rate of fraction technologies where you can get down to sub-angstrom. but most techniques are like two to five angstrom, which you can't directly image the atoms,

but you can see the shadows and some of the configurations. But we're getting to where we could actually image the atoms. It's interesting. What comes to mind when you say the UFOs themselves are a time machine, I've been kind of really researching this mid-century inventor named Townsend Brown. And he was super into anti-gravity. It was kind of the nominal story of, you know, he'd create these like super high electrical charges over short distance

He was funded by a guy named Agnew Bainson, and Bainson is quoted as saying, very weird effects occur with high electricity over short distances. And, you know, what's funny is if you, the deeper cut on Townsend Brown is he was super into time travel. And he would talk about it with his daughter, Linda, and he even had a confidant, who I think is written about pseudonymously

in this great book called The Man Who Mastered Gravity by a guy named Paul Schatzkin. And his name is Morgan. And Morgan becomes a source for the book. And he's writing to Paul Schatzkin. And Paul's being a little thick-headed about what is the actual machine, what are these gravitators? And at some point, Morgan kind of blows up. And he goes, it's a fucking time machine.

And so you think that maybe past scientists have actually figured out time time? Yeah. Well, I think they figured out that these machines are time machines. Herman Oberth said the same thing. You have General George Hoover, who also said, these are time machines. These are future humans, specifically. In the 1940s, we didn't have the technology. We didn't have the comprehension of material sciences and the physics in order to do this.

But what I feel is happening is that the visitors themselves are pushing us in this direction, or rather polling maybe is a better word for it. Well, you have all of these Congress people who really, weren't paying attention to much of this. And I think it's going to be disclosure from the ones that have been hiding from us this whole time. Yeah, I was on the phone yesterday with Robert Hastings, who wrote UFOs and nukes. And he's telling me that he feels like he's being subliminally guided, you know, towards disclosing and doing his work. And I'd be lying if I were to say, I didn't have sort of similar experiences personally. Have you had any experiences like that?

I don't think many people are deep into this unless it stems from something. Whether that be a light in the sky they can't explain or some obscure memories from childhood of a craft outside their window or a shadowy figure at their bed. I got into this when I was eight years old because I had, what I now understand was a moment of conscious precognition where I visualized together. I talk about this to begin, both my books,

an early human, a modern human, and this archetypal gray alien. And then the thoughts that came with that, which I feel is just now me, putting that information back and past me. Because I would eventually do that. And then it's this closed time-like loop of sorts. So that was kind of my motivation.

And I've been driven to study physics and astronomy and then changed my major to biologicoanthropology to study the humanoid form associated with them because I was led to do that. I remember the exact moment standing behind Morton Hall at Ohio University. There was his little voice in my head that said, maybe we should explore it this way.

Maybe we're all experiencing that. You just don't notice it until you really start to reflect on the way everything's connected and start to put those pieces together, especially with regard to the synchronicities and who you meet and when you meet them. Can you say at all when you had your,

future human contact experience, what was communicated to you? Well, it's interesting you asked that specifically because it was an intervention. I didn't tell anybody this. I was washing dishes at my sink. My wife's sitting on the couch. And I just thought, you know, I'm tired. I don't want to do this anymore. Yeah.

I just want to get this last book done and just kind of slowly back away from all of these conversations. I was traveling a lot, conferences, TV shoots. I was exhausted. UFO topic specifically. UFO top. I mean, I wasn't like gonna go blow my brains out in a closet or something. I was just, I was tired of this.

I've had that experience many times, man. You feel it. It's taxi. Yeah. So, yeah, and I didn't tell anybody. I thought about telling my wife. I thought about being, you know what, I didn't tell her. I didn't say anything to anyone.

When they approached me physically, face to face, this individual, there were two individuals present. One, pulls up. a chair so close that his knee goes into my crotch and I have a very strong fight or flight response and it was very much fight and he looks at me in the eyes and says I can tell you're very upset about this but I need to be this close for this to work and all of a sudden happiness returns next thing he said is what got in my head a little he said actually he's not the right pronoun day it's all day that's the only pronoun they ever used we in that

There was never a sense of ego or individualism at all. In fact, I came away with this with no sense of ego, or at least a very diminished form of it. But they said, we know you've been thinking about quitting lately, and we'd really prefer you didn't do that. And I said, how could you possibly know that? I never told anybody that I never even spoke those words out loud. It was a thought in my head. They said, once you know who we are, you'll know how we know that. And then telepathically, I communicated future humans.

And they said, so you know how we did that? I said, uh-huh. And then the conversation went in a lot of different directions. The vast majority of it was entirely telepathic. At some point, we just stopped using vocalized speech. And even though there were two individuals, all of the voices, were the same voices, and this is the thing that blows my mind the most. And I remember Terry Lovelace talking about this when he met Betty Rubble. He just heard her voice in his head in the same voice.

If you're not articulating something, it's not vibrating your Malius Incas and Stapies to send this signal. Why does it still sound like that individual? It's mind-blank. But the three of us are communicating telepathically over the course of, I would guess, another 10, 15 minutes. A lot of other things are exchanged. I had questions. They had questions. But the main point of it was that they wanted, if I was okay with it, they're very polite, extremely polite. If I was okay with it, they said, we'll black your eyes out and give you three things that will be important at a future time. What were that? I don't have access to it. They told me I wouldn't have access to it. They said, we need to put this information in your brain. If you're okay with it,

it and by this point it was very clear who they were, their abilities, hive mind consciousness, interacting in this way. I trust them and also realized that in various ways I had been interacting with them the whole time. That little voice in my head when I changed majors, a conversation they referenced. Right before I went to a conference at Rice University, where I thought it was just all in my mind, they referenced that conversation that we had just prior to a conference at Rice University, where I thought it was just all in my mind, they referenced that conversation that we had just prior to, to me going to this conference.

So I agreed, and that's exactly what happened. My eyes went black. I'm still staring at the same individual. In fact, by this point, it got very difficult to turn my head. I was kind of just mesmerized. I think that's the word some use. My eyes went black, and all of a sudden, I feel all of this information coming in my brain.

And the other individual standing to my left, occasionally would say, did you get that? Did you get that? I'm like, uh-huh. And I can see it coming in. I have no idea what it is. Wow. It's in there.

Yeah. I can't access it. I agreed to have it put there. It's like you were partitioned or something. Yeah, maybe. But what's crazy is the reaction. I, this was at the beginning of a conference. There's a lot going on.

There's a party, Halloween party. Some of my best friends from the UFO community are there. We're going to jam tunes, play music. Yeah. Been wanting to play Travis Walton's guitar with Mike at Hanks for all this time. And I stood up, once they released me from this, slowly I could see this individual again or them in this manifested form. I turned, I get up, I walk through what's now a very crowded room of people from this balcony. A woman puts her hand on my arm and says, are you okay?

I was going on. Like I couldn't lift my head. It felt like it was a 50-pound weight tied to my forehead. I walk out of the VIP room where this had happened on the balcony, down to my room, which is about five doors away. Where is all this? At a conference hotel in Phoenix. Phoenix.

Almost exactly one year ago. Yeah. Lay down on the bed, lay down backwards, feet still on the ground, and slept for 13 hours straight. Wow. Wake up, still with my feet on the ground, still with all my clothes on,

and just started crying uncontrollably. Not because I was happy, sad, confused, nothing. Like whatever happened. Did it feel cathartic? Did you feel like you were letting out pain or anything? No. It was just, I just couldn't control it. Interesting.

I cried for. hours. I had to be on a panel the next day with a bunch of people. How was that? Fine because I controlled the crying. I went and got breakfast. Unfortunately, it was set right by the cash register where all of these people gather for their Sunday brunch. And I'm just losing my goddamn mind at this point. And there's all these people coming walking right. I was hoping to be like back in a corner or something. Didn't get that. Come back to my room, still crying, go down to give a book to an individual who was working at the registration table and all of a sudden the same individual kind of materializes in this empty hallway walks past and he put his hand on my shoulder and says are you okay

i go uh-huh that's all i could say uh-huh and all of the time this has happening is uh-huh like i'm processing i'm doing what i'm supposed to i'm getting the individual's name or yeah yeah yeah i know both of their names but again these aren't this is what I mean when we talk about reconceptualizing what it means to be human. Yeah. It's not as simple as who is this individual. You think of them as almost... I wasn't talking to that individual.

Their generic emissaries. I was talking to the same day that knows my thoughts enough to reference to very specific moments of interaction. Or one wasn't. I was just thinking, I don't want to do this anymore as I'm washing my damn dishes. they knew that thought. Yeah. So we're not talking about individuals, but that individual who's a part of this reappeared as I'm walking through this hallway takes that residual whatever it was. Again,

it wasn't negative. I wasn't scared by this. I wasn't upset by it. I just couldn't stop crying, but I needed to because I was on an important panel about two or three hours later. Yeah. So it was an effort to sort of well the ontological shock. If, If there was a part of that, it's hard to say there wasn't, but also just whatever was happening, whatever reaction my brain had to being force-fed information in this way in a very short period of time in a little primitive monkey brain. Yeah. I couldn't handle it.

So then you think they're walking among us? They absolutely are. Yeah. That's pretty wild. Yeah, it is. That one gets a little deed with people. I think there'll be a guttural response to everything. I just said.

Yeah. The walking among us thing, I think, is a trigger point for a lot of people. Yeah. Maybe that happens at a later time. Yeah. Sure. But I think it's an obvious realization. I don't think we even need to say it.

Yeah. Here's where things get really trippy. Everyone always asks, what's the connection between UFOs and psychic remote viewing? Now I know what you're thinking. A lot of the same people that are into one crazy thing, psychic research, are going to be into another. aliens. But hear me out. There was actually a CIA psychic spy program to find Russian nuclear bases and American hostages that ran from 1972 to 1995. It was called Stargate. How do you think

you developed your skills for, because you really seem to be the best remote viewer, you know, maybe ever. Certainly remote viewing is a thing. I mean, you saw the government from the 70s to at least the 90s when it was declassified, you know, Stargate. Russell Targ and, you know, Hal put off. And they, so the psychic spying thing was the thing, and they had. And I've talked to the, you know, Hal and those guys. And they seem to have, you know, many, many cases of their intel basically being confirmed by traditional intel methodologies, modalities. A lot of these psychic spies started to pick up imagery and communications from what they considered alien beings.

But there's actually a decent theoretical framework that connects remote. viewing to Mike Masters' future human hypothesis. What's going on in our heads is not an algorithm. It's not following rules. Nobel Prize winning physicist Roger Penrose hypothesized that maybe the brain is just a room temperature quantum system. And that's how it collapses probabilistic quantum reality into the macroscopic, discrete, classical reality that we see every day.

We basically kind of collapsed Schrodinger's wave equation into a specific eigenstate, state and that's done by the brain. Room temperature quantum system. And yeah, shout out to a friend of mine who's super into Roger Penrose and his theories on this. Shout out, a friend. Shout out for the friend who loves weird consciousness suit. Love it. You got to introduce me.

You've been holding out on me, man. He's a good guy, yeah. In one interpretation that's gaining momentum, quantum computers might be able to send information back in time. In other words, they can access their future knowledge states. There's even been a lot of research into research. reversing cubit positions in quantum computations. So maybe these remote viewers' brains were just super robust quantum computers. And maybe they were sending their future UFO sightings back in time.

Maybe you have sort of pre-memory of your future knowledge state, and you're glitching into that with these UFO experiences and sending the information back in time. And memory works both ways. Yeah. That kind of explains maybe the manifestation stuff too, because it's already... Wow. Totally. It's already preordained. Or it's like a time loop. So like a classic example of a time loop is like Carl Jung had this patient who is completely kind of materialist and inaccessible, not woo-woo at all. And she comes in and she goes, you know, I had this weird dream last night. It was this golden scarab beetle was given to me as a gift. And as she's telling the story, he sees a scarab beetle come down the window sill. He takes it and he gives it to her as a gift. And it. And it's, and he gives it to her as a gift. And it. And it. And it. and it opens her up and it makes her, you know, believe in magic and in the subconscious and in the power of, you know, this bigger self. And that's the classic example of a time loop because it's something that shifts your attentional patterns in a slight way in a way that causes the thing to manifest. If she hadn't had said the scar beetle story, he wouldn't have given her the stare beetle and then it caused the thing to actually happen.

So maybe the UFO experience, because it happens in this dreamlike state, you're sort of a little bit of a scaremedle story, you're sort of. sort of glitching into the future, this thing kind of happens to you in this sort of weird quantum reality or whatever. Yeah. But it affects your life at the margins in this way that might cause something else that's beautiful to manifest. Oh, interesting. Yeah, I've never heard it put that way.

That's pretty cool. Yeah. I don't know. Many argue, again, Eric Wargo argues this in his book, Time Loops, that remote viewing is really just precognition. That they always want that deliverable, that end thing. They always need to see that, and are they just taking that information and relaying it back to their past self? You have to go up a level.

You know, go up a level. It says, you're wrong about time. You're wrong about space. Right. You don't know where you are. You don't know what time it is. In fact, you don't know what time is. Yeah.

Okay? Now, when I talk to a physicist like Eric Davis, that's what he tells me. He says, you know, those dimensions like space and time, they're arbitrary. Yeah. You know, there's something deeper. that creates the illusion of space and time in humans. Your books are so well argued and so laid out, and you have all these case studies of contact experiences,

and you show how the kind of future humans hypothesis is probably much stronger than extraterrestrial hypothesis, than sleep paralysis or hallucinations, or all these other sort of Occam's razor explanations. The only issue that I take with it is this idea of future. almost feels like based on our current kind of biopic understanding of time. And when I went to Jacques Valais' place, he had books about the ability to sort of manipulate

time and travel through time in the fourth dimension and the fifth dimension. And so are these being sort of trans-temporal in nature? And maybe they're ascended versions of us where time doesn't just work the way it does, you know, in our case, and I hate using the word quantum is so overused. But there is this idea of sort of Hilbert space and all the subatomic spookiness, if it does have to do with time weirdness, is there some layer that we don't quite have access to and we're living in a kind of a classical compressed form? And so it's not really future humans, it's like ascended humans or something. Well, yes, I think so. And I don't know if those are necessarily

mutually exclusive. And it could come down to, I'd never thought about this before, but listening to you say this would kind of make sense that maybe the same dichotomy where time doesn't work or exist the way we think it does because our evolution has forced us into this pigeonhole reality, where we can only experience it linearly because we have these brains that have to exist in these environments that have been trained to do so. But maybe that exists at the macroscopic level, too. You know, granted millions of people have purportedly either seen something or have had some kind of interaction, which, you know, I can't tell you either way if that happened,

but they believe it, right? John Mack's stuff, right? And so it's like prevalent, but not prevalent at the same time. And it's this like little shadow game of like showing a little bit, but most of the activity is kind of below the noise floor. and it like drove me crazy trying to understand like, well, what is going on here? Reports of flying saucers are nothing new. From the beginning of recorded time, men have been seen unexplainable things in the sky. From Mesopotamia to Egypt to Roswell,

people have seen unexplained objects in the sky throughout human history, which makes sense because if time travel is possible in the future, that means it's always been possible. Past primitive rituals and tribes, often, deal with sort of cranial deformation to make a person look a little bit more like a gray alien or something. Yeah, intentional cranial modification. It's ubiquitous throughout the world. You're binding their head with the cranial wrapping or the cranial boarding, like the Maya would just stick the kid's head between two boards and squish it. There was even one group, a paper by

Geertzen and Geertzen from 1995, where they interviewed them and said, why do you do this? And they said because our ancestors were instructed by the gods to do this, to look more like them. So, yeah, you have to wonder, is there a connection? Because the cranial facial form that you get from this is very reminiscent of what we understand as part of our cultural knowledge now as being a part of this great alien physiology. You know from what you're saying. Are we safe like a human species?

I mean, I might have watched too many movies. But like, let's say we do have a captive non-human species somewhere. We don't know. I don't know if it's confirmed or not, but let's say we do. How do we know that they're, like, kind is not coming back to. Yeah, I mean, we can only, you know, through external observation in a humanistic lens, kind of in, you know, see intent of its malice or benevolence. I mean, I mean, if the universe certainly has a yin and yang, so they're certainly dark with light,

so there's certainly going to be some malevolence and at least some of the things that some of my, interview subjects told me about sounded malevolent to me but there seems to be a lot of neutrality and benevolence as well so i think it's a mixed bag it's just like humans right our humans are generally kind but we also kill animals for food and like if you were a cow you'd be like these evil humans are going to chop me up and like you know eat me so it's but we're not actually benevolent or excuse me malevolent as a whole but some lower sentient species would see us as malevolent intent is really difficult to pin down, especially because as we were talking about earlier, you're talking about intent with a lot of different groups. I think I mentioned earlier, what's the intent of humans?

You know, you can't just group us together as one entity and say we all have the same reason for doing things and the same behaviors. And you multiply that across time, and there's going to be a lot of different reasons for doing things. Maybe we're in the middle of a cosmic timeline war. On the one side, we have an advanced civilization who have ascended from us in the future. They live in a trans-temporal dimension, a dimension beyond the bounds of time, and are struggling to communicate with human beings. On the other hand, you have forces wanting to mine human consciousness like a natural resource through distractions and engineering tribalism.

To enslave us, keep us violently scapegoating each other. The cycle continues, and they continue to mind. That is, I would say, the principal theme in the most recent book is that exact question. The different timelines, the intent. who's benefiting from that timeline over another one. There's a lot of really interesting questions that stem from that. And then you have, you know, for the last couple years, you had Ross Coulthard and Frank Milburn talking about this cataclysm thing.

You've got the continuing nut job in North Korea, where he's trying to demonstrate a capacity to launch ICBMs of the United States. And then you've got China. You've got the ever-present risk of China. Also, UFOs showing up more around the creation of our nuclear programs and attempting to monitor shutdown, or in certain cases activate nuclear facilities, would make complete sense in the context of future humans

trying to maintain their ideal timeline and maybe even ensure their own existence. Every generation thought it was the last. It always thought that the end times are coming, the end is nigh. It's sort of this epic cliche throughout human history. But there does seem to be almost a need for it. And I can't all but wonder if we're on the precipice of, of a massive revolution in human consciousness.

Where we either evolve there together or we bifurcate and still evolve there, but in a very different way. The sacred knowledge has never been lost, only been covered with myriots of confusion and complicated whatever is going on, but it is still here. Humans tend to report seeing UFOs when they're in certain heightened states of consciousness.

Maybe that's when they're closest to their future selves. It's like Michelangelo's Sistine Chapel. God's finger is extended to its maximum, but Adam's finger is slightly contracted. The point is that God is always there, but the decision is left to man to reach out. Maybe we have the same relationship with our future selves, and it's on us to reach out. The fact that it recorded Staticism would interest me. Continue. What interests me.

is that it recorded approximately 18 hours of it. That is interesting, isn't it? Enjoy more ways to save at Ralph's, like low prices in every aisle. And when you download the Ralph's app, you can clip and save more with digital coupons every week. Plus, you can earn fuel points to save up to $1 per gallon at the pump. At Ralph's, you can enjoy more ways to save

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