American Alchemy with Jesse Michels - Something Big Happened in 12,000 BC (ft. Matt LaCroix)

Episode Date: November 9, 2024

On today's episode of American Alchemy we are joined by author Matt LaCroix. Enjoy! Support American Alchemy by Becoming a YouTube Member: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCuG2KzrIMe3qoNcuDVpwnXw/join Matt LaCroix is an author and researcher specializing in ancient civilizations, particularly Egypt, exploring lost knowledge, mythology, and the mysteries of human origins. Matt's YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/@UC65XXzhHyH3BKZ72Q1eKF8Q Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 02:19 - Matt’s Interest in Ancient History 06:50 - Underneath the Pyramids 16:04 - Lost Civilizations 23:04 - Evidence for Lost Civilizations 43:05 - Plasma / CME Events 01:03:30 - The Sun’s Dead Binary Star 01:14:52 - Ancient Underground Networks 01:23:44 - Formation of The Solar System 01:34:07 - Matt’s Current Research 01:46:38 - Noah, Gilgamesh, and the Flood 02:20:42 - The ‘Old Holy Land’ 02:29:21 - Esoteric Knowledge 02:35:04 - Evidence 02:39:29 - Mystical Experiences in Pyramids 02:44:02 - Ancient Shared Symbols 02:48:28 - UFOs SPOTIFY ➤ https://tinyurl.com/jessemichelsspotify DISCORD ➤ https://discord.gg/jessemichels INSTAGRAM (Personal) ➤ https://www.instagram.com/jessemichels INSTAGRAM (Show) ➤ https://www.instagram.com/jessemichelsofficial TWITTER ➤ https://twitter.com/AlchemyAmerican EMAIL/BOOKINGS ➤ [e-mail] Original music: https://open.spotify.com/artist/6LlLRudDi60Uy4jcmOSEs1 *** AMERICAN ALCHEMY is an original series hosted by Jesse Michels that explores the frontier of science and tech. Each week, we bring you exclusive interviews with some of the leading thinkers of our time. #history #ancienthistory #documentary #podcast #mystery #egypt Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

We look at the Giza Plateau and we look at the pyramids and we think, wow, that's incredible. Look at the achievements. But what about under the ground? There was a whole network of rooms and cavities underneath the sphinx. The entire area of Giza may have an entire subterranean area underneath it. You realize the implications of what you're saying. You're saying that NASA figured out that we're actually living in these sort of civilizational cycles and they're hiding it. And in order to cover it up, they blocked all knowledge of the binary star companion so that that whole cycle would not be understood.

You're of the opinion that this dead star is headed towards the sun now. Yes. When do you think these underground cities were built? That's the ultimate question. Nobody knows. And it was sealed and buried and concealed by the flood. I think this is what we call Atlantis? I would say that it's what we're looking for for the lost civilizations.

Matt LaCroy! I could not be more excited to have you, man. This has been a long time coming. I've seen a couple of your episodes with Julian Dory. And it's really serendipitous because I'm in L.A. I interviewed Graham Hancock two days ago, and I feel like he takes things to a certain point. He's done an amazing job along with Randall Carlson and many others as far as, I think, really proving out the Younger Dryas impact theory, this idea that at the latter end of the last ice age, there was maybe this comet airburst from the toward meteor stream that wiped out some proto-civilization, some civilization that existed prior to ours. he speculates as to what that civilization is.

He talks about the Atlantean myth, which comes from Plato. But I think where Graham falls short and he'll admit he falls short at times is actually proving out that that proto-civilization definitely existed, characterizing them, who were they? What did they do? What were their mythologies? How did they live? What technology did they have? And I think you're sort of taking things to a whole other level, which. with your work as far as, you know, really discovering what this civilization was all about and,

you know, what they were building. And you're figuring out conflations that were made between this civilization and other civilizations that are much less old. And so I couldn't be more excited to have you, man. Thanks, Jesse. It's great to be here. I'm looking forward to this conversation, definitely. Yeah, it's going to be a blast. So, okay, I want to start in the most basic possible kind of starting point. Sure. And so how did you get into the idea that there's sort of this big civilizational cover-up? There's, you know, the civilization before ours, it got wiped out. How did, how did you get into that idea to begin with? Well, I've had this natural curiosity for a lot of my life, you know, seeing early movies that show lost civilization type of concepts and advanced things that were

long ago, long before we're told. And I have to give a lot of credit to Graham Hancock and Reynold Carlson. And they definitely spearheaded me a lot of early on in my journey of understanding this and kind of doing that wow factor of like, wait a minute. So things perhaps are very different than we're taught in school and in which archaeology positions themselves on giving an idea of what our history looked like in what's called a gradualism kind of way, right? Where we were primitive once, long ago, hunter gatherers, and then our current era of going from iron, age, bronze age, you know, up until our current age, is just linear growth. And that's all we've been taught. But really, to me, if you look at all the evidence that's been mounting, right, I just got back from Turkey with Dr. Robert Schock, who is one of the main players that was brought over by John Anthony West to go investigate the Sphinx enclosure to see if it is truly wind erosion

as archaeologists and geologists had postulated, or whether or not it's really water erosion. because that really matters because it takes that whole dating of the idea of the Sphinx being created at a much, much earlier time. And that's where a lot of this blossomed is those kinds of things. Let's set this up for the audience real quick. So if you were to talk to like the Egypt Ministry of Culture, they would tell you, you know, that the Sphinx was built in, you know, modern Egyptian kingdom. Yeah. And in fact, what people like Robert Schock and John Anthony West have found is that there's water erosion, damage on the nose of the limestone of the sphinx and that this would show that there's some

sort of maybe tropical climate that it originally existed. And people like Graham Hancock have followed up on this to say that maybe actually it was a lion to begin with fully. And so this lined up with the Leo, which was the constellation. That was the Vernal equinox shift occurring in 10,500 BC around the time maybe it was actually built. And that much later, it was sort of retrofitted with this pharaonic headdress. Exactly. And that's actually one of the themes that we're going to be discussing throughout this talk is the idea that you have a civilization emerge at a later time period. We'll call it, we'll start by saying the dynastic Egyptians, okay? Kufu and Ramsey's and all these others

that actually found and emerged out of what was a much earlier civilization that had been there. And what they did and it looks like increasing evidence of showing that is that they adopted those sites, but not only adopted them, they tried to claim them that they were basically the ones who built them and recarved certain things. Like what you said, as I believe 100%, that if you look at the way that the body of the sphinx is versus the head, the head's too small. Because the head was never supposed to be that size. It was built in proportion with the body. And like you said, I believe as well, it was a line. lion and that it was basically what we think of as a guardian. The ancients believed that if you created something to be this certain types of spirit

animals like lions and eagles and different things, they embodied this protective aspect. And so they would create, and we're going to get into that, a lot of stuff with Turkey, is that they created these artifacts in these symbols and murals and statues that shows these protector creatures that were basically part of guarding things like ancient libraries and underground areas. And that's what I believe the sphinx is, is essentially it's guarding an entire subterranean area underneath it, that we look at the geese plateau and we look at the pyramids and we think, wow, that's incredible. Look at the achievements. But what about under the ground? How do you think there's something under the ground there? Well, again, I was just in,

just with Dr. Robert Schock in Turkey, and we were talking, extensively over dinner about how he was part in spearheading these sonar, these readings, basically ground pending trading type of radar sonar under the ground looking at voids underneath the areas in seeing these massive, massive voids with actual objects present. So, for instance, what objects are present? Well, you can have, you can have cavities that water can naturally erode, right? Something where it's like, oh, it's like a cave underneath. Well, no, because they look like they're clearly been cut with tools or whatever they used to cut them.

And there are, again, like I said, there are objects down there that have, like blocks or things like that are not natural. And so we know that. And we picked that up with sonar. Has anybody gone down there and tried to verify? Well, this is the story. And like I'll tell the story is that when the, in the 90s, when they found these massive voids, and it's not just under the Sphinx, it's under the Great Puritan. as well. They all connect with these like subterranean underworld type of areas. They found that there was a whole network of rooms in cavities underneath the sphinx as the first area that then

led to literally all the entire area of Giza may have an entire subterranean area underneath it. Now, we're told by things like Edgar Casey and others that there was like an ancient library that was supposed to be underneath the Great Sphinx that had the records of, you know, ancient, ancient times in all these secrets and things like that. They called it, like, they was called the halls of Amente that led to this ancient library. Now, when they found these voids, we know that there are four entrances, four underneath the sphinx. There's one under the left paw. There's one on the top of the head. And you can actually, if you go online right now and look up, like, tunnel on top of the head, you can see it.

It's capped off on top. There's one on the back side. And then there's another one on the one of the other sides of the Sphinx. So there's three to four entrances that are known about. So is the Sphinx hollow? No, it's made out of actually the bedrock. So it was an entire section of bedrock that they took all the sides away. But when you say an entrance coming from the head,

Where do you enter? It's carved down into this bedrock body. Okay. The entire Sphinx is not made out of stones put together. It's made out of a bedrock foundation body. So it's just cut out of the bedrock. And so they have tunnels, especially Robert Schock, determined that the one under the paw, I think it might actually be the right paw. So the Sphinx is like a gate.

It's like a gateway. It's like a guarding, that's guarding these entrances that go into like ancient libraries. Wow. Okay. Now, why can't we go down there? Well, this is what happened. When they determined in the 90s and they had these basically types of ground penetrating radar, like different types of ways that they were determining it to find the voids,

they published them and they kind of went viral. And everyone's like, oh, my God, what's down there? And the Egyptian authorities came through and they boarded up the front of the paws with boards, literal boards, and blocked it off. And then what they did is very clever. They ended up drilling down to prove to the public that there was no void. but they purposely went where that wasn't entrances, just drilling down into rock and say,

look, there's nothing here. And it was very, very misleading and clever. So that people were like, oh, shoot. So there weren't really voids down there. It was just like an opening nets from rainwater or something. And they tricked people. Do you think there's simultaneously going down there and excavate? Question is, have they ever been down?

There's really no answer to that to know. But if that was, if you knew about that and you deliberately didn't go down and then you literally boarded up, the whole front of the Sphinx is now boarded up, that would to me be something where you're trying to kind of silence that whole story. Who took the first sonar readings? It was Robert Chalk was part of a team, a whole team that was basically looking down and taking this type of ground penetrating radar to. Is he not campaigning and outraged and saying we should be going down there? There are steps that need to happen. There are many, many, many millions of dollars that need to be obtained and then universities that have to be brought into this.

It's something that I know that he would potentially be interested and we would like other groups and others that are interested to come together to try to bring this back again and reignite this underground exploration of the subterranean areas of Giza. And I think it will happen to the future. And I get maybe this types of conversations are what's needed to get that started again. Do you have a hypothesis as to what might be down there? I think there are entire chambers and I think there probably is a library. Now, if that library was made out of paper, it wouldn't exist anymore because paper only survives for 500 to a thousand years,

which would mean that it had to be something like tablets with like type of kineiform or hieroglyphics carved into it. Whatever it is would have to be able to survive literally 10,000. thousand years underground, which is not, again, paper would never be able to, so you'd have to have other means. So if the Sphinx were actually built around 10,500 BC, what sort of writing would you expect to find down in these tunnels? Well, that's the question is whether or not a hieroglyphics like we see in any dynastic Egyptians was even the type of language that they used. And that's going to come up again when we talk about kinaeiform, it's a writing style that we see out throughout Mesopotamia. Now, to be very clear, if you were not to carve some kind of writing

into stone or clay, there would simply be no method that we know exists for how to leave a message. Now, I'll give one caveat to that. There could be some type of technology that they incorporated into stone that could have a way to record information that we don't understand yet. Because I say, that because there was a very specific reason that these civilizations would get certain kinds of stone. So they would not be like, oh, hey, look, there's some bedrock to our right or left. Let's go cut those blocks out of that. They didn't do that. That didn't seem to matter to them. In fact, the distance that they're willing to go to obtain certain stone was even irrelevant to them. But give you an example, all the pink granite we find throughout the Giza Plateau came from

500 miles away to the south in the Aswan quarry. That was your only source of this type of pink granite, which, of course, is extremely high in silica quartz, which is the same substance that we use for watches. So is there something there with keep recording messages in that that we don't understand? I want to throw that out as a possibility so that I don't say that the only form of writing would be like kinaeiform or hieroglyphics in stone. Do you think that the great pyramids of Giza were also built around that period much earlier than this? Well, and this is an interesting dilemma is that, first of all, we know they're at least 10,500 BC.

And that's the first thing to point out because, number one, that's when we have these alignments with different star constellations. There's something called the King and Queen's Chamber that face different constellations, right? the queen's chamber faces Sirius. It's like a feminine energy, and the king's chamber faces Orion. The problem is based on what's called the procession of the equinoxes, which is how the earth wobbles and looks at different ages and constellations, that could not have happened in modern history all the way until you get back to 10,500 BC. The problem is that that was an extremely volatile time for Earth's history.

That was during this period of the older and then the younger, Dryas, which is basically when our Earth went from the Pleistocene epic to the Holocene Epic, and we went through these catastrophic periods. Now, we can get into what caused them, because I personally don't believe it was an impact, and we can get into some of the implications of how there's correlations between both and have similar evidence for what, you know, they could lead to that. But the problem is, if you have extremely volatile periods on the Earth, it wouldn't make sense to me to be able to build these massive structures during that. Now, John Anthony West,

and I know that Robert Schock and him had a lot of conversations around this, John Anthony West believed that it was a previous age in which the sphinx was built, and I do as well. Well, the thing that never made sense to me about, you know, some of the extrapolations of the kind of Hamlets Mill thesis, this idea that we would build, you know, architecture specifically around the great procession, you know, the vernal equinoxes, you know, it's 26,000-year cycles. Yeah, that's a great year. That's what's called the great year. Right. So, like, the idea that, like, you know, in 10,500 BC, that civilization that's building specific megalithic architecture would have the cosmic understanding of, you know, 26,000

years prior. Like, you know, they really understand these sort of macro cycles. when it comes to, you know, cosmology and astronomy. Yeah. That seems hard for even me to believe. And so that makes me think maybe it is old. Look, I believe that simultaneous to what I'm saying, to play devil's advocate, you know, I do think ancient civilizations had precocious understanding of the stars. And they had, you know, like you could see, look at Sumerian architecture where, you know,

feels like they understand the heliocentric universe and they have like all the, you know, planets and their rough alignment. And having said that, you know, 26,000 year cycles, that feels really crazy. But what do you think? I think we shouldn't underestimate the knowledge that these lost civilizations. And I say that. That's when quotes, lost civilizations understood. And that we were completely reset, just like Graham Hancock says, right, a species with amnesia.

We don't remember who we are. We don't remember what we once were and what we once understood. And I think that these monuments that basically are evidence, I think, left behind to be the test, the last the test of time, built out of the hardest stones in the world would be the perfect way to be able to have their memory and their knowledge be preserved so that someday in the future, humanity could finally find their way back. And I say find their way back because I believe that they had sophistication and knowledge that we simply don't have even now. Well, do you, have you watched the movie Stargate? In fact, when you asked me that question of how I got into this, I would say Stargate was the first movie that truly awakened me and encapsulated me at a young age to, in wide wonder. Yeah. To be like, wait a minute.

Yeah. There's something else going on here. Well, what's always interested me is you have Aztec kings, you have Nebuchadnezzar, you have King Judea, Sumaria, you have all these sort of. story of pharaohs with similar stories where they get these downloads. And it's like you have to build this structure that's astronomically aligned in a specific way. And Graham Hancock talks about this as well. He says probably had more to do with some sort of afterlife ritual. I mean, traditionally, even in a lot of esoteric versions of modern religions, your soul ascends

through Orion's belt. And there's some sort of weird ascension path. And so is the specific geometric structure of the pyramid somehow this conserved version of that where, you know, when you die, you go there and you sort of, it's this portal to some other world. So it's this concept and it's echoed throughout hermeticism and others. It's known as the law of correspondence. Okay. And now the specific science behind is called geodesi. Now, geodesi is basically creating structures in very specific positions to not only match things like.

like cardinal points and different ratios of like the earth, sun, and the moon, but also star constellations. And the ancients, I believe, had mastered that knowledge and that concept in which if you build something that mirrors the stars in an exact way, ratio-wise on our earth, and you also incorporate in the corresponding aspects of Earth, sun, and moon, that you create like a synergy. And it's, and that may be this concept. we think about with like a portal. It's some kind of a synergy because the earth, listen, it's a giant, it's like a crystal magnet, okay?

It's a crystal that's vibrating at a certain resonant frequency that has these geomagnetic poles that use this concept of magnetism. And of course, Nikola Tesla believed that not only was vibration, frequency, and magnetism, like a core of understanding everything in the universe, but he believed that even crystals have like a form of sentient life, that they vibrate in a way that other minerals and other stones don't, and they have some kind of an intelligence or something that we don't understand. And if that's the case, it means that our earth is literally alive. It's a living thing. And it's like a being, but it's unlike us. And that the sun and the moon are also like that. And that we all have this

connection that is deeper than we perhaps understand. And that constellations, like Orion played a very pivotal part in understanding, again, like you mentioned, if you create that synergy between the heavens, are you creating something between like a portal between souls and different incarnation cycles and things here? And of course, we can get down that road as well. But Geodesi, for instance, I want to go back to that really quick, a lot of these structures on the earth, like the Great Pyramid of Giza, as well as things like Eridu and ancient sumer and other locations are built on what's called the 30th parallel. It's just part of the earth that is in this quadrant zone that is basically part of like a hemisphere ratio of the earth and other aspects.

And when you look at the positioning of these structures all around the world, you realize that they were perfect in their time. But the very interesting thing that we can get into when we're talking about the civilization that I'm studying even to a greater degree in eastern Turkey is you find out that there's these type of sui, of temple called a Susi Temple, S-U-S-I, that had openings that faced only the, based on solar aspects of the rising and the setting sun. The problem is none of those Susi temples face directly west or east anymore. They're all off. And if you look around the world, you can see that many of these structures no longer are perfect in their cardinal points or their direction anymore, showing us that during these volatile times, I believe the Earth's axis shifted. And that would be ultimately one way you were asking earlier before we started the show,

how could you date these? Well, one way you could date them is by looking at when they were aligned. And if they're not aligned now, it means that something was very different because they didn't make mistakes. If I were making a counter argument, I might say we can't carbon date the stuff, which would be the most scientific thing to do, but you can't carbon date stone. No. And so, you know, we are then just retrofitting this current, you know,

observed megalithic architecture, which is impossible to build kind of currently. Like there's nobody can really argue with that. The civil infrastructure and engineering necessary is just like we don't have it currently. But we're just finding the time when it lined up astronomically, and we're saying that's the time that we built it. Do we have more evidence that it's definitely older than is conventionally understood? We do.

And there's, I can give a couple examples of that. One of them, and again, I just got back from with Dr. Robert Schock from Turkey, and there's a site called Kef Kalesi, very mysterious and enigmatic site with these giant square basalt blocks. And basalt is one of the hardest stones in the world. It's seven on the most hardness scale out of ten. Very, very hard stone. It has these machine cuts and all of these levels of sophistication that are bizarre and mysterious, but on the surfaces of many of them, and only on the surfaces that face above, we find

melting that has taken place, literal melting of a stone. And Dr. Robert Shaw confirmed on numerous stones that it is indeed vitrification. And to obtain that, you would have to have temperatures that exceeded 2,000 degrees to be able to melt this. of assault into basically like glass, obsidian on the surfaces, which is what we're seeing. Now, some are going to argue right now at this point, and I want to play devil's advocate, they're going to say, well, fires can do that. Well, if you go to that area of the world that I'm talking about around Lake Vaughn, there are no trees.

There are no, there's no wood. Right? So if they had built, they built at a mud brick on top of these existing structures, okay, and they incorporated them in, and we're going to get much more deeper into this as we go along, but it's say you had timber and things built into the mud brick, still, how would you have enough heat to be able to do that? You're talking about extreme, extreme temperature gradients, but also the stones are severely degraded, severely weathered and degraded from these events. Now, it's either things like a plasma event we could talk about, and you mentioned an impact,

and I won't completely throw that out the table. But there's a third way. a massive, massive volcanic eruption. And that very same thing happened with a mountain called Mountain Nemrutt just to the southwest of Lake Vaughn, which is where all these sites are surrounding, which is not the same mountain emirut that has all the statues on the summit. There's actually two mountain nemrots in Turkey, which is a little bit frustrating. This is a different mountain emirut that doesn't have any ancient stuff within it, but it has a giant, giant crater in which it exploded. And you learned that that mountain last exploded during the end of the Pleistocene during the younger and older dry.

Really? And theoretically, a volcanic explosion could layer the earth in this sort of sheath of, you know, black smote and block, you know, cosmic rays and, you know, cause all sorts of geological and environmental changes. Is that right? That on top of, if you're close enough to the explosion self, you could have unbelievable amounts of heat get expelled from massive eruptions like that. I mean, have you ever seen, if you watch documentaries on Mount St. Helens, right, when it erupted, people were five, ten miles away observing it, and some of them were like died from the heat. Yeah. completely died trying to trying to photograph it as that plume

of super, super heated air, like thousands of degrees was thrust down and spread around the environment. It was enough to literally kill people and burn them, vaporize them partially. So did that get us out of the ice age? What we're looking at is a series of two major, major events, and you have a sheet right in front of you.

Now, the younger dryass is, consistently talked about by Graham and Randall and others, but I would like to point out that I believe equally as important is the older dryus. Now, it's part of the same time period. Now, the older dryus was around 14,000 and a half thousand years ago, whereas the younger dryus is like 12,000 years ago. But they're within the same time period, but I think they play together in a very specific way where the younger dryus is more like huge impacts on the end of a cycle. And the older dryas are these huge impacts on the beginning of a cycle. And they both played critical, critical roles in ending the last ice age, which was very, very extensive in places like North America and parts of Northern Europe with both the Eurasian and Laurentide Ice Sheets.

How long was the Ice Age just for the audience? Well, the Ice Age was well over 20,000 years. Now, contrary to what some might believe, there wasn't ice just covering the entire Northern Hemisphere. In fact, one of the anomalies that I want to point out that's very interesting is that the ice was centralized around areas that you would never imagine. Like, for instance, northern Siberia was ice-free, right? One of the coldest places on Earth that we have today was completely ice-free. The ice was focused around, if you were to say a focal point, would have been Greenland. Now, that has led to a lot of theories and hypotheses.

regarding that the North Pole, the pole was actually over Greenland and not where it is in the Arctic now, which would mean that we had a different type of hemispheric effect where the ice sheets and where different things were. And that may have been part of what shifted the axis of the Earth. Do not underestimate the weight of miles of ice. I mean, the Laurentide Ice Sheet in North America is estimated to have been somewhere between two and three miles deep, covering all of cancer. Canada down into parts of the northern United States. And, of course, continuing up into Greenland and then you had the Eurasian ice sheet. But these ice masses are some of the largest that Earth has ever had.

And when you have that much weight, you can actually cause enough to not only depress, suppress surfaces down into the ground, but you can cause so much weight that it's like, it almost causes like a spinning, you know, sphere to cause to almost almost water. wobble on itself because it has too much weight on the northern on the on the on the top side. Interesting. And so this you had this ice age for 20,000 years. What exactly happens in the older dryness and then what happens in the younger dryness in your assessment? Well, what we, and I've, I'm someone that spent the last 10 years extensively studying climatic events, geologic climatic events, but specifically through two things. The Antarctic ice cores,

which, by the way, you can go back to 450,000 years on those ice cores, which is insane to see that. That's the oldest ice cap on earth bar none. And that's why I don't believe the civilizations were into Antarctica. Because we have ice courts showing how old that ice cap is. Okay. And that is why I think mountains look like pyramids there is because there's been almost, there's been little to no erosion by wind or rain or anything. They're almost like these giant mountains made out of certain stones that have been almost stuck in an ice cap and haven't been able to weather. Now, the Antarctica conspiracy theories are going to be very disappointed.

I know. They'll be sad about that one. Yeah. But you know what we need now? We need real science being brought into this. And that's what I would like to bring to this conversation. Now, Greenland, the Greenland ice cap is only 20,000 years old. Hence, the last ice age around 20,000 years.

during that is that formed 20,000 years ago, which means that we only have ice records from Greenland cores for 20,000 years. But we get a snapshot of it to look back and see what it was like. Now, what we find is that 14.5,000 years ago, carbon spiked astronomically on the planet. And this is again getting into when we look at modern times of people talking about how humans are the only reason why the climate and carbon is increasing, that's absolutely not the case.

If anything, we had carbon spikes 14,500 years ago that completely dwarf the time we're in right now. And how that could happen is, I think, based on increased massive amounts of sunlight, hitting the earth, melting things like, you know, increasing, letting methane off in the atmosphere, increasing plant growth and other things. We create a lot of different, you know, carbon,

creating this carbon dioxide increase. And also what we found is that in Antarctic ice cores, every single time that these massive spikes of carbon occur, we get temperatures that then follow right after. Right after. Now, 14,500 years ago, we had a spike in which temperatures went from some of the coldest we've ever seen. And you can see it right in front of you on that sheet.

Some of the coldest we've ever seen to levels that were even warmer than we are now. Whoa. But in only like a couple hundred years. So how does that happen? A coronal mass ejection? Is the magnetosphere of the earth, which protects us from the sun?

Is that weakening? Is there a pole shift that causes the magnitude of the earth to weaken? There are all sorts of theories. What do you think? I believe that a massive CME event, unlike anything that we've ever seen

in modern human history, hit the earth. Why do you think that? Well, because, if you look at the spike, it's immediately, at 14,500 years ago, during the older dryus, it's immediately followed by a drop so drastic that it ends up being colder than even the ice age. So you're talking about temperatures that go from an ice age that rise warmer than even now, but only, that only remained for, let's say, 100 years or less,

and then drop colder instantly. So colder than even the, then even the, ice age was. Why would that point to a coronal mass injection? Because if you have a huge amount of heat that hits the earth, and again, that could also potentially argue an impact. But let's say one of the two, okay? You would, what could only thing that could cause that to happen is if you have an enormous amount of fresh water from glaciers, right, hence the ice age, that melts instantly into the oceans, disrupting ocean currents across the world and basically collapsing things like the Gulf Stream.

The Gulf Stream, for those who don't know, is this unbelievably warm current of water that comes off of the Caribbean and off of Florida, and it dives northeast and then basically rides over the Atlantic. And it's the only reason why people can live in Iceland and in Scandinavia. That area would be a complete barren ice wasteland if it wasn't for that. It's a warm propeller of energy, right, that rides up, and we have ocean currents all over the world. And ocean currents play a very pivotal role in moving heat around the planet and also stabilizing things like the climate. In fact, I think one of the things that's most not understood about our climate is the role that currents play with the oceans in our weather, in our climate of the Earth.

And that's why, if, for instance, we had enough fresh water melt into and shut off the Gulf Stream, it would be enough to destabilize basically the entire planet. It's a very fine-tuned system of heat being driven down and moving up through. And it's a whole system. But if an asteroid, you know, if we hit a comet from the Torrid Meteor stream and that would also cause some, you know, quick heat up versus the coronal mass ejection, why are you waiting it, you know, in favor of coronal mass ejection? Well, I've never seen. seen, I've never been able to find any evidence of any impact craters, anywhere in the

earth that are from that age. Now, Graham had brought up the one in Greenland, but we know that one is over a million years old underneath the ice cap, right? Because the Greenland ice cap is 20,000 years old, so that would take that one off the table. Now, that doesn't mean that a torrid meteor shower couldn't have explosions midair, right, like we see in Tungusta in the early 1900s. That's possible, too. but the reason I lean towards CME events,

Coral mass ejection events, is based on these areas of vitrification, and what we believe, I believe is evidence of plasma discharges all around the world. And that's how you would essentially get poles moving from Antarctica, or sorry, from the Arctic, over to Greenland,

is you would have these events where the entire magnetosphere of the earth basically gets severe, really weakened. And then holes open up and then you get these vitrification types of events and others. And that, to me, the evidence is much more leaning towards a CME event than an impact, which would be more localized to certain areas of the earth, not on this global scale. Makes sense. Where do you see the plasma all over the world? We see plasma events, again, some of the best evidences out of Bolivia, out of Turkey,

around Kev Kalesi and others, and we see it in Egypt as well. There are these giant statues. They're actually the largest stone statues in the world called the Colossi of Memnon, and they have burn marks only on the northeast side, which it lends us to the possibilities that these massive heat areas that opened up with the ozone may have come from the northeast. But we still can't date the plasma, right? No, of course we can't.

We can't date that. we can potentially start to date other things. Like, for instance, maybe we can date soil cores from Lake Vaughn. Or maybe we can date cores of some of these stones. Because if you can bore into, you can't date a stone from the outside. But if you can bore into it, you can potentially find things like organic matter deep, deep within very microscopic cracks. and you have more of an ability to date them. That's how Gobeckli-Tepe was dated.

The only reason they were able to date Gobeckley-Tepe is because the site was believed to be buried. You can only date organic matter if it's covered up and concealed. Because if it's out and it's being exposed to the elements, it alters its entire chemistry, and you can't date it the same way. And what we're looking at right now is the potential that places like Kef Khekolesi and even ionis,

and we can get into that as we go along may have been deliberately buried at a later time. Interesting. So are you hopeful that we can date parts of these monuments that have been covered up because you can, it seems like, date organic matter that's been buried? Yeah, I think that we're going to be having increasing capabilities revolving around being able to date these and then using all the... What are the capabilities? How do you do that?

Well, we have new technologies coming out that enable us to be able to look at these things in a different way. There's always new things happening with understanding the breakdown of carbon organic matter based on radioactivity and other things to find dating. But I also think that maybe some of the techniques that we're just coming into is understanding where certain sediments in different cores can help us with dating. And I think that those technologies and things, and I'm not an expert in that. I don't want to pretend to be to be to be able to understand that those things can potentially be dated, but only if, They come from specific environments in which something unique occurred in which they were protected. Does Robert Schock agree with your coronal mass ejection theory? That's Robert Schock, actually, that he's the one who really was one of the top pioneers.

His book Forgotten Civilizations is the basis behind almost the entire book was that, and I can go into it briefly, is that when they were in Easter Island, his wife, Katie, they were looking at, at this what was thought to be a writing called Rongo Rongo. Okay, it's a type of writing out of Easter Island. And when they were comparing it to things, even like the NASCAR lines in Peru and other areas like maybe Mahendra Daro and other types of mysterious writings that don't look like writings, one of the theories that they came up with is that they're not actually writings at all.

Their plasma discharge designs in the sky. Because we know that electricity follows. very specific patterns. Well, wait, you're saying that the NASCAR lines were like burned into the surface of the earth? No, they were imitating potential plasma discharge events in the sky. Really? Because maybe they believed that those areas were touched by these events and maybe they thought they were sacred or they were showing them. If these things, plasma discharges in the atmosphere, let me give some background of this for a second.

And also just for the audience's sake, NASCA, I believe, was like 200 BC to 600 AD-ish or something. It's in Peru. And you have all these amazing, it seems like artwork that only makes sense from an aerial view. Yes. Yes. You know, over wide distances. And it seems, you know, like it would involve some sort of precocious astronomical or artistic knowledge to make. And it's this big sort of mystery that will play endlessly on Gaia and, you know,

history channel. Yeah, I used to work a guy for two and a half years. Did you really? Yeah, yeah. Interesting. I worked on shows like ancient civilizations. Check out season, season four and five, if you want to see some of me in that.

I will. That explains you're kind of like, you have the trippiness and then you also have the, you know, hardcore, you know. I think what's really important is marrying stuff that comes from instinct to research and empiricism. And that's, I think, good science. And I think it's kind of an alchemical process because it comes from the inside, but then it's being extremely rigorous about, you know, I had this intuition, but I'm not superimposing that onto reality.

Well, and also the aspect of the metaphysical nature of reality, right? I think that's a very, it ends up being not really married together with the science aspect. They tend to be very separated, right? Oh, the science aspect, we're going to look at only the physical third dimensional aspects of science and evidence. But really, there are like a lot of things that are disconnecting is how, metaphysical sides of the universe and our spirit, right? Yeah. And those concepts have to have to connect and play in.

Yeah. And we paint over the past with our modern epistemic brush. And we say, you know, these sites were just, you know, they were built in these sort of materialist reductionist ways and they were used for sort of prosaic reasons. We have no idea how these people from the past actually thought. And that the word guy actually, you know, I like it in the kind of. context of Gaia theory, you know, James Lovelock, you know, late 19th century, that the earth itself is somewhat alive or just at least extremely resilient.

That's what the ancients believed. They called it Tiamat or Gaia. Gaia was the Greek term, but they believe that it was a living type of being that's not like us. And they also believe that the sun is just the same thing. They're like entities. And then ancient cultures had names for them like Utu. was the name for the sun god, an ancient sumer.

But let me get back to something that we were talking about. I think it's important. Yeah. The plasma events, okay? When you, if the earth was going to get hit by one of these massive CME events, which we've, it's interesting how the Aurora Borealis is further south than we've seen it in a very, very long time right now. People are freaking out.

Right. And that's potentially. You know this guy on Twitter, space weather news? Yeah. You know what I'm talking about? Yeah. He's freaking out about, you know, and I never know how seriously. I mean, clearly we've seen more solar activity this year than ever, and it seems to be ramping up,

and you have all these flares. And he attributes that to a weakening of the magnetosphere of the Earth. And I agree. And because if you look at the great year... Should we be freaked out, Matt? Or is the world about that? If you look at the great year, which, again, is about 25 and a half to 6,000, 26,000 years, right? Half of that is...

Because it's like, it's, you call it 25,000, but it's like 24,600. half of that is 12,000's with change. These events that occurred during the younger dryest with what I believe was the last CME event was 12.5,000 years ago. So we're literally exactly in that time period. We're seeing these extreme warming and these plasma-like type of weakening

of the magnetosphere type of events just like we saw then. This is not at all scientific. This is purely my own, like, you know, it's like asserting free will or something like that. something I sort of refuse to go outside the bounds of. So I'll admit this is kind of dogmatic. But like, I just don't believe that every 12,500 years, there's just a hard reset button.

Like we've got to have some sort of agency around this. Well, let me, I can go into that if you want to. I actually have some evidence you probably haven't heard of yet that might blow your mind on that. Please. Okay. So again, like I mentioned, there's always indications that these things are going to happen way ahead of time. Yeah. Right.

CO2 spikes. Temperatures spike. Yeah. You get these geomagnetic events with these aurora borealis, right? You see them. Now, the next level, and if we start seeing this, we need to worry, is plasma discharge designs in the sky, which is what I was just talking about with what was Dr. Robert Schock's theory on like a Rongo Rongo text. And even potentially the NASCAR lines is that they're actually these geometric formations that occur in the sky based on massive amounts of what are called charged solar particles. that come into our upper atmosphere, and they create these very interesting

electromagnetic designs. Okay. Now, I want to discuss something that might be new to you. And if you're interested in seeing an image of what I'm talking about, it's on the bottom of my main page of my website, the stage of time.com. In 1987, there was an encyclopedia that came out called a new science encyclopedia. Okay. And this is back before computers really up and running or we didn't have that capability.

So information you really got through like encyclopedias, right? That's where things came through. Well, it had this unbelievable image on, I think, page 2488, if something like that, where it showed, and it didn't say really much about it. All it said is the following image is a diagram based on Pioneer 10 and 11 probes. and then it said like, oh, we sent out a plaque on it, blah, blah, blah, well, what it shows, and I can get into what Pioneer 10 and 11 found, because it directly relates to this entire great year, this entire cycle and how might help you understand why this stuff keeps happening

at 12,000 to 12,500 years every time. Interesting. Okay? Yeah. Is that what they found, and this may be new to people, and it may blow a lot of minds, and I would, again, encourage people to go to my website and see that image, by the way, which is very hard to find online. It seemed like it was scrubbed.

Where was it taken? Exactly. I ended up digging in and finding a PDF version of it that was like somebody might have emailed it to me or whatever, where I got a high-deaf definition version of it and then I scanned it and then I uploaded it. And I, so, Michael, we need to preserve this, right? Where was it taken exactly? Well, okay, I'll go back and tell you how this started. Yeah. In the 1970s, there were the first.

first probes ever in history that were sent out in deep space. It's funny to me how people have only heard of Voyager. They're like, oh, Voyager, Voyager. No, Pioneer. Pioneer came before Voyager, hence the name Pioneer. It was the first deep space probes we ever sent out into interstellar space. Okay. You have, if you think about neighborhoods of space, the area between us and the sun is this actually quite small little neighborhood. Our outer solar, system is this whole other vast area beyond the sun that then basically is bordered by what's called the Kuiper Belt, right? I'm sure Graham talked about that being impacted by the Torrid Meter Shower, right?

Torrid meter shower comes through and one of the theories is it can bump around some of these Kiper Belt objects, which are giant, giant asteroids and comets in the outer, outer part of our solar system that basically dwarf our asteroid belt around Mars that is like, come nothing compared to this. Okay? Well, Pioneer 10 gets sent out one direction and Pioneer 11 gets sent out another direction. And they were basically sent out to study gravitational protrusions on the outer planets of Uranus and Neptune. They wanted to understand, wait, what the heck? Why are these giant gas planets tilted on their axis? And then as you get closer to the inner solar system, and I'm not an astrophysicist, but I can fill in some blanks here.

why they would be tilted on their axis, something gravitationally is affecting them, right? Is it our sun? Wait, it can't be our sun. How can they be tilted like that? And in fact, our entire solar system is tilted slightly on an axis. So what happened is they send out the probes

in the early, during the 1970s, both of them they send them in completely different directions. Remember, space is 3D, so it's not like a linear paper. It's got mass, it's got everything. So you have to go different directions to try to understand how to create like a model, right? Well, in the early 1980s, Pioneer 10 and 11 made history

because they were the first probes to leave our inner solar system. Okay? So they get out past the gravitational influences of the sun, and they start passing out, passing beyond the Kuiper Belt. And when they do that, boy, did they find something. Now, you, I'm surprised, I'm not surprised you haven't heard of it. actually very few have. What are they fine?

Well, the thing is funny about it is that if you go and look up Pioneer 10 and 11, you're not going to find very much information. And I don't want to necessarily just spend a lot of time going down a conspiracy road here, but I will tell you that it seems apparent that the Internet was scrubbed of information regarding Pioneer 10 and 11. What evidence do you have? Well, there was an astronomer out of NASA. Yeah. Actually, out of, yeah, named Thomas, two astronomers, one named Thomas Van Flantern, and the other named Robert Harrington.

Robert Harrington was a very, very important astronomer who worked for the Navy. Sorry, not NASA, for the Navy. He was a chief astronomer for the Navy. Well, he's studying the outer solar system. He gets a call one day from Thomas Van Plander. Thomas Van Flandern. Thomas Van Flander is an astronomer as well, who's actually a very interesting man. and I wish he got more attention.

Very smart. Used to talk about even things like ancient history being different than we're told and things like that. Cool. Very smart guy. He calls up Robert Harrington. He's like, hey, Robert, you got to check out this data from Pioneer 10, right? There's something going on in the outer solar system. And Robert Harrington's like, okay, I'll look into it.

And they look into this new data that's coming back from Pioneer 10, and their minds were blown. Okay. What Pioneer 10 found and 11 was not only a planet. Okay. Now, I don't want this to be confused with things like Zecharii Sitchin's idea of Nibiru. Yeah. That was actually a whole other story in itself of something I think was maybe even created to mislead this whole thing. Okay.

There's no planet that comes through our inner solar system that would destroy everything. No. But what they did find is a. large planet beyond the Kuiper Belt, okay, part of what is called the outer solar system, not something that has a lot of information. In fact, the Kuiper Belt wasn't found until the early 1990s. It's relatively new that we even knew that, again, based on a lot of the data coming back from the Pioneer probes, which started to leave that area in the early 80s and through that

period. Now, in the 90s, there was an announcement by NASA. And I do believe this was a real announcement where they did announce this planet. And they called it Planet 9 or Planet 10 based on before Pluto got demoted. And they actually – and anybody listening to this might remember that. It was actually pretty widespread on the news. They're like, oh, there's this large planet beyond our sun that is very mysterious. It seems to have a mass based on gravitational influences of four to five times the size of Earth.

massive, huge planet, okay? Very weird and mysterious. Wait, where is it positionally? It's beyond Pluto? Yes, way beyond Pluto. Okay. It's way beyond our inner solar system, and it's not part of the rotation around the sun at all.

Wow. It's very, very mysterious, okay? So what sort of gravitational pull is it following? Well, wait until you find out. Oh. This is where it gets wild. This is where it gets wild. on this in the same analysis and I remember pioneer data was coming in in increments over time

as you're going further out you get more data so it's not like you know everything right away it's like you're figuring things out so the first thing they found was this planet and they initially announced it okay and everyone's like oh whoa how that how that be possible um well the interesting thing was that the even the kuiper belt a lot of the objects in the kuiper belt were being warped in their, in their, the way that they rotate, their mass was being warped by something else. And they, some postulated that this planet was enough to even impact and affect some of these hyper belt objects.

But there's more, though. The planet seems to be, seem to be revolving around something. Okay? And again, I very much encourage people to go and see this diagram so they don't think I'm full of crap in what I'm saying right now. because, again, this 1987 encyclopedia showed the entire diagram. But the weird thing was, it was the only place that it ever existed ever again. All the data from Pioneer was essentially scrubbed after.

What was it orbiting around? Well, when scientists have studied the known universe, okay, I'll say that because we only have a limited view of what we can see with distant stars. But when they've studied other stars like Sirius and other ones, Keynes Major, they find out that Asian, percent of all known stars are binary or trinary, meaning that having a single star, our sun, is actually far more rare. You would have an 80 percent chance that wouldn't be the case. Are you saying we are in a binary solar system? There's another star that we're not aware of with another sun?

But the thing is that when, okay, when Pioneer 10 and 11 got far enough out beyond this planet that they detected, and if you can't see it. It's just based on its gravitational influences. Again, you can't see like, oh, there's a bright planet flying by. It doesn't work that way. Planets, if planets are not illuminated by some kind of an object, they're black. Yeah. It's just a space is black and you don't even know, except the influence it has.

Wouldn't James Webb pick it up? Well, again, the space is infinitely difficult to pin down a very specific part. And I can get into all the Caltech studies after that support this. Okay. Okay. So this is not just one area. Caltech has since jumped on top of this. You can go on Caltech's website and read all about how this planet is.

What's the name of the planet? One of the, well, they don't have a name. They call it Planet 10. Originally now Planet 9 based on Demotion of Pluto. Okay. Caltech actually, one of the astronomers there was basically said that he believes is 99% 9-9 chance that it exists based on its effects on the Kuiper Bell and other gravity. gravitational effects.

And it's four to five times larger than the heart. Okay. So NASA announces that. Yeah. Then they go completely quiet. They never announce anything else ever again from Pioneer 10. In fact, all data on Pioneer 10 and 11 passed the Kuiper Belt beyond this Robert Harrington's work and Thomas Van Flandern and 1987 Science Invention Encyclopedia became

the only sources. It was very bizarre. If you have something of that much importance that finds things to not have any information, again, screaming towards some kind of a scrubbing of information in hiding. Why would they cover this? Well, because they found something. What'd they find? Well, according to the diagram in 1987 encyclopedia, the way that Pioneer 10, and by the way, Pioneer 10 had these spectrometers on board that were literally made to detect objects, which is very interesting because if they're investigating a tilt on Uranus and Neptune, clearly they're looking for something. Okay?

Well, they detect a signature of that was undeniable because there's specific wording in that diagram and it says, and I will quote, remember, Tyenor 10 and 11 went completely different directions in our solar system. They say they found equal pull. It doesn't matter where they were in our solar. system. As they left, they found equal pull of something massive on our entire solar system. Something gravitationally is so powerful that it was basically influencing our entire solar system, including the sun. Okay? And what they found, they called it a dead star.

Okay. Now, it's not a brown dwarf. It was a dead star that had essentially maybe super Novod long ago, whatever happened to it, it no longer had the fusion of a star like our sun, which is why you can't see it. It literally, now you know, there's only two things that can happen to a star when it dies, right? It either explodes or it shrinks down into an unbelievably dense object. But that object still has very, very powerful gravitational influences. Black hole. Well, but not everything does that.

Not everything just becomes a black hole. In fact, some scientists believe that those are more like at the center of galaxies and different things like that. Instead, this object was identified as a dead star, not as – but in they determined that the distance – ready for this? Based on its influence at the time, and this is like 1984 or 1983 that this date, that this date, came back because the encyclopedia came out 87. They determined at that time that it was 50 billion miles from the pioneer probes. 50 billion miles, okay? Now, when that occurred, Thomas Van Flander and Robert Harrington found out about that.

Now, all I will say is that they both died of Thro-Camp. cancer, not within a few years of each other, but they both died of throat cancer. They didn't smoke. And they, it was a very mysterious thing because they were the only two people that were investigating this outer planet and potentially this binary star companion. And then there was a man named Miles Standish, who was that head of, became a very prominent astronomer in the department. And he was like, everyone's like, wait a minute, what about this planet and all this stuff, right? Miles Sandish did a bunch of calculations mathematically and was like, you know what? We made a mistake.

Robert Thomas Van Flander made a mistake. Robert Harrington made a mistake. Turns out all the data was wrong and there's no planet that's out there. Boom. The thing just disappeared. And it was and it like went completely silent. Everyone's like, okay, never mind. What's the motive to cover this up?

Because I believe it's the entire reason why the Great Year exists and why. and why we have resets of civilizations and why we have entire cycles of catastrophes and which is based, I believe, on what are known as the Yuga cycles out of India. Right. The call the Kali Yuga cycles based on civilizations rising and falling. Well, we're in the Kaliuga, right?

But there are various Yuga cycles. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So the Yuga cycles track the cycles of basically civilization, rising and falling based on these ages during the Great Year. So you go from, right, you rise up to a golden age, you get wiped out, you fall back, and then you have to start up again from like an iron and bronze age and then a silver age and then a gold age, and then it resets itself.

Well, what could possibly exist to keep a consistency of these cycles other than this? Now, think about this for a minute. If anyone's ever seen it, there's a documentary you highly recommend called The Great Year. amazing. You can go actually watch it on YouTube. Amazing, amazing documentary has a great narrator who just passed away recently, very well known. I can't remember his name off my head. But in that documentary, I believe they got one thing really, really wrong, but they got everything else right. They postulated that the great year was based on a dance of our binary companion. But they thought it was serious. Now, that makes no sense.

sense to me at all because first of all, seriously is so far away. It makes 50 billion miles of this binary look like it's in our backyard. So that makes zero sense to me that that's related to the great year and the dance of our sun. So I want to just point that out. However, what does make sense

is that this dead star having this massive dance called perihelian and apahelian. Parahelian is when something comes the closest and apahelian is when it's leaving. Well, it turns out that in the great year documentary, ancient civilizations believed that that entire dance was based on, they called it our black son. They called it. You ever heard of black hole?

Black son, David Bowie, right? Black son's also kind of this age old occult symbol. Well, that turns out there's some truth in this, that there was knowledge of a dark star. A partner star to our own son. some say the binary model confirms all of our celestial observations without the need for excessive torque or epicycle type explanations. While the concept of a second sun challenges our present understanding of the solar system, it is hardly a new idea.

There's one sun which is part of the planetary system and there's one sun outside the solar system. And this allows Mithras to both be the sun and also seem to be operating for the sun or on behalf of the sun. The ancients had some knowledge on it. There's different areas. There's a whole bunch of areas. That would be a whole part of the show.

But I just want to say, and not getting that, but just say that basically that there seems to be a dance between this dead binary star with our son. And every time that dance is based on a 25,000, approximately 25,000 year full cycle. Now, half of that during period helium is 12,500 years when it comes the closest to our sun in which I theorize that that is the reason why our sun goes through these massive, energetic explosions of if you have an object like our sun that is very, very powerful with like almost a nuclear fusion type of energy, right? If you have

a lot of energy coming towards it and gravitational influences, the only way it's going to be able to maintain itself is to be able to exhaust that energy, which is why I believe that this binary is the reason why these consistent events every 12,000, 1,000, 500 years or so, you know, even 14, they're all in that realm are occurring on a consistent basis. But the Uyghas are different lengths, aren't they? They're based on the rise and fall of civilizations consciously. And there's other, that's not the only factor that goes into the yugas. There's galactic center alignments.

There's planetary alignments. It's not just one thing. And so it's not the weakening of the magnetosphere of the Earth necessarily. It's the need for the sun to expel mass to a gravitational object moving towards it. Which then weakens. Which in turn then weakens. And I believe that is what caused the entire destruction of Mars. Because Mars used to.

clearly have water, clearly had life, right? You can actually see some images, if the rover images are actually even from Mars, that have trilobites in some of the areas on there. And one of the very well-known and accepted theories is that Mars once had an atmosphere. It took the brunt of a massive CME event that stripped the entire atmosphere and then basically had the water evaporate out in a space and then it turned into this barren, planet, but not only that, but it may have been based completely on a plasma events. And now, I want to just mention that is that there is a trench, a gorge on Mars called Vias Marinaris, okay?

That is like five times deeper than the Grand Canyon, okay? And it is, the feather design of it may actually be based on a massive type of plasma-like events, which can literally. impact entire planets if it's bad enough and create scarring and even mountains based on if you they've shown studies with how electricity impacts things they create like a feather-like environment or they even create bulges almost like types of emergencies of land moving up and down by the types of energy that can impact it now mars is covered in billions to trillions of just these rocks scattered across the planet all over the planet like they were thrown out in a lot left

in the atmosphere but then others literally fell back down onto the planet and it looks like that that planet is is a perfect example of how these CME events can destroy an entire planet. So you realize the implications of what you're saying. You're saying that NASA figured out that we're actually living in these sort of civilizational cycles. We really have no control over. They're kind of these hard reset. Exactly. Maybe we're headed towards one right now. And in order to- And they're hiding it. And in order to cover it up, they blocked all knowledge of the binary star companion so that that whole cycle would not be understood. That's insane. Is it though? I don't know. I mean, I need to, I need to be

diligent the details. And I'm not, I'm not saying this in apocalyptic way because I would actually, the next part of this is we should talk about how I believe we may be able to prevent that. Okay. But what I mean is if you knew about, if governments knew about a giant asteroid coming towards the Earth or a comet, would they tell everybody? Maybe not. Maybe not. Widespread panic. Sure.

Complete society collapsing. And you're of the opinion that this dead star is headed towards the sun now. Yes. And so do you have, you know, based on your cycles of what we see in ice cores throughout Antarctica. and Greenland of a consistency. And what's your model of how much time we have left based on that? We're right in it right now. So like...

Very interesting how consciousness seems to rise at the same time that the sun starts to emit more energy. And this gets into like, again, lost civilizations, what they knew. Yeah. Right? I actually believe that part of the function of the Great Pyramid of Giza and other structures was balancing the energy. Yeah. of the earth.

Yeah. And that maybe they had understood that these cycles exist. Because, okay, let me give me an example. Yeah. In hermeticism, one of the core, there's these laws that exist. Hermeticism is ancient Greek knowledge from Hermes, which is basically just Egyptian knowledge as well. It's the same thing.

They believe... Because Hermes was based on... Both. Exactly. So... The Emerald tablets. They believed that cycles govern everything. Okay?

that the law of correspondence covers everything, that there are these core concepts, right, that are woven into everything. They're just, that that's the way it is. That's how it's designed, right? And we can even get into the nature of that. I've known of a problem with that, but that there is an actual,

very intelligent design behind our universe and that the earth is actually a lot more important than we know. That it's part of, again, we are talking about like a soul incarnation, nation place through Orion and that it's not just necessarily happening everywhere else, but that it's, this is a very important place and that we are not the only ones that are governing that.

That there's something higher that's governing the cycles here and balance, because that's everything that's shown in these artifacts and things that we're about to talk about from around Lake Vaughn is it literally shows the same thing over and over and over again. And it shows this balancing of everything, balance, and basically teaching humanity about the nature of who we really are. And bringing us back to the light. Like if we were, if our soul journey was like basically starting at a higher place and then wandering through the darkness and then eventually returning back to the light, again, everything's based on cycles. And it seems like we are the microcosm. Our journey here is like a microcosm of the entire macrocosm.

And so we are playing a bigger role than we know. And at the same token, I believe that also lends itself to not having us be as afraid, that we could just poof, be wiped off and never exist again, and it doesn't matter. Well, you just implied that maybe the pyramid was some sort of possible preventative measure. I mean, are you familiar with Christopher Dunn? Yeah, I am. Very much so. So does that relate to this?

Because he has this theory that, you know, the pyramid was maybe kind of an energy generation machine. He went on Rogan. I thought he made a pretty good case for himself. Oh, I support those connections in many ways. For instance, under the Great Pyramid and under many of these structures, we have subterranean water like aquifers, right, that are basically as a conductor and they were covered in limestone and they had granite, which has a quartz in it.

It seems very much a function of geometry and physics to create something. So, but how would that save the Earth? Well, it didn't. this massive death star. Well, it didn't. Yeah. And you give me an example. If you go to Sakara, Egypt, right?

You can go down to what's called the Serapium. I'm sure you've heard of that, right? I actually do. Okay, so the Serapium is this subterranean area. You can go there today as they do tours down there. And you walk down in, these, all these steps to go down in there, and you have these chambers under the ground that were carved out. And in those chambers are these giant granite boxes, okay?

Built out of granite. that came from Aswan. And the granite is so large that it's bigger than the entrances to even go down in these places, which is completely mysterious on how they carved them, moved them, because these granite boxes weigh up to 100 tons. One ton is 2,000 pounds. They're very, very mysterious. But anyway, there's a whole multitude of these down there,

and they have no evidence of any pharaoh or anyone being in them, like finding a mummy or anything, right? These chambers are mysterious. But what is interesting about them is that many of them were found blown up, like exploded, like a lot of energy had surged through and blown them up. And if that's the case, then one of the things we're discussing is that maybe Egypt played a really pivotal role. in trying to balance energy somehow. Now, that's based on, well, that's based on what are called laylines. Now, Geodesi is also based on that concept,

is that the Earth is what's called the terroial field of energy, okay? So the energy of the Earth, based on its magnetism properties, the energy flows out from Antarctica, down and comes up, and in from the Arctic up in the north. So it's like this, right?

Comes down like that. And that if you were able to understand the properties of Geodesi and properties of laylines, that you could somehow build in specific places and maybe even balance them, harness them, have a way to building coherence with the Earth and the stars. But if you have a massive coronal mass ejection heading towards the Earth, how much balancing can save you? Well, I mean, perhaps they tried or they just were trying to survive understanding that there was a previous event that their ancestors had known about. And that gets into the entire discussion of Darren Kui and K. Mokli.

Okay. Do you know what Darren Kuyu and K Mokli are? No, who are they? Well, they're locations. Okay. Okay. So this again gives the evidence for that the ancient people knew about these events. Okay.

Oh, Darren Kuyu is the underground tunnels in Turkey. Yeah, yeah. So. Yeah, which, and Hancock even talks about how, you know, possibly a civilization went underneath there to protect themselves. A lot of people don't talk about K. Mockley, and I want to talk about both because they're very, the connection they have is absolutely fascinating. In southern Turkey, there's an area of soft volcanic stone. Now, most of the time, volcanic stone is hard, but this area was like a type of very soft kind of volcanic porous type of material that was actually really easy to carve. And it seems as though ancient civilizations, if they were global, which I believe they were,

seemed to know that was the only place in the earth based on its elevation, its location, and the stone that they could easily, well, we say easily, but relatively easy compared to other environments, create massive subterranean areas. And I mean massive. And so within the last 40 years, there was a man in the city that became the underground city of Darren Cuyu, because there's this modern city built right on top of it. That's what's wild is that they're like living right above it, and they didn't even know.

He's basically working on his apartment, and he knocks a wall down accidentally, and he opens up this doorway opening that he was like trying to figure out what happened because he had chickens that wandered in and disappeared. It was really funny, actually. And he didn't understand where they were going or whatever. And so he went down in,

and he ends up going and, you know, calling and like, I found something, archaeology, you've got to come see this. So they come over and they were stunned to find the largest subterranean underground city. We call it a city, but subterranean area in the world. It had something like 30 levels of these interchanging tunnels, but like rooms that had air shafts, had entire ways to block off and seal the outside with these multi-toned stones that were basically fitted so you could roll them in front of the door. And they had areas for animals and animals, places for like education, like schools. And they had places for bedding and living and food storage.

And they went to such great lengths that they built these underground cities so big that they could house over 20,000 people. That's crazy. At one time. How big are they? They're basically kilometers down. Wow. They're enormous. And kilometers down, how far? Like, wide kilometer down. I don't have the exact dimensions of it. They're enormous, though. Okay, and you can still go there today, and there's a tourist attraction where you can

obviously go down into Darren Kuyu, but they only let you see a couple levels. Now, here's the wild thing. Who figured out that 20,000 number? They went in archaeologists that have access to all the levels have basically determined how many people could live in all of them. They mapped them out. You can actually find online diagrams. where they show all of them interconnected,

but it gets even more wild than that. Darren Kui is not the only one. Turns out there's a whole bunch of underground cities in that region, but there's two main ones. The sister city to Darren Kuyu is called Kaimakli. Okay. Now, Kaimakli was found just a few years later, but here's the wild thing.

It's five and a half miles away. Okay? Why is that wild? Because underneath Daryankuyu is a main corridor. There's like a main corridor, like if you had buildings attached to each other, right? And there's a tunnel that goes from Darren Kuyu all the way to Kymakli, whoa. Five and a half miles underground.

Crazy. Which means that those people knew enough about how they couldn't go above ground. Hey, I want to go see your cousin John and Kay Mockley. I mean, Darren Kooeyu, right? I haven't visited him in a long time. Why wouldn't they just go up and go around? Instead, they literally travel underground between them. And the only reason you would do that is if it wasn't safe to be above ground.

And now, why wouldn't it safe to be above ground? I don't think it's based on flooding. I think it's based on the concept of like a nuclear winter. Right, where you would basically be so volatile, not only like potentially radioactivity, but even things like a catastrophic climate that was just dip in all over the place. And like it was almost completely in. hospital to live out there. And the idea is that they built these to survive these events. And that the only reason they did that is because a previous event, their ancestors had survived through.

And then they told them, and like, you know, hey, we're going to survive the next one. We need to build these underground cities, which that area of Turkey is literally in the center of the ancient world. When do you think these underground cities were built? That's the ultimate question. Nobody knows. And here's the weird thing. None of the material for from these giant underground cities that they excavated has ever been found. It's not like they went up to the front and they found this huge pile of rock. Weird. Like, hey, look at that.

We can, because they can help. Why wouldn't some of, you know, their tools and stuff be preserved given that it's underground? Nothing has ever been found. Why is that? Well, because things degrade. We have to imagine geologic time. Underground, though, you'd assume maybe so. You still have mice and rats and things and you have water dripping and you, it's, we need to try to,

imagine, it's been 500 years, right, since, you know, we went through the industrial revolution and back to medieval times, back to then, and look at all we've achieved in that, okay, that 500-year period. Now imagine thousands and thousands and thousands of years, you know, potentially 10,000 years. I believe that those were built well over 10,000 years ago, well over. I mean, they had to, to me, they had to have been built before the young. or dry as catastrophes because there'd be no other, because we haven't had anything like that since. Well, that would be my, again, I'm not, I'm a total amateur when it comes to this stuff, but I would guess that a greater percentage of things would be preserved if the thing, it's an

underground city and if it's above ground. It's just less environmental kind of erosion. Well, but the problem is they were reused. Okay. And this is where scientists are, what I believe, have gotten the dating completely wrong. How do you know that they were reused? Because when they went down, when they first found them and they went to, and they went down in. They did find stuff. They found evidence of Hittites and evidence of ancient cultures that are

not like ancient ancient. They're like mid-ancient, right? So, you know, Hittites in a different time period of that were talking like, you know, maybe 2,500, 3,000 years ago, right? They found evidence of residency from them where they were maybe hiding from armies or going under there for many reasons. It was a very dangerous time. Much of the world, the Assyrian and Uraltian and Medes culture and the Babylonians and all of these cultures were battling, fighting. It was a very volatile time period in history. And so, yeah, you could have cultures try to hide down there. It wouldn't be the best idea, but I'm sure some did. And so that may have actually been one of the reasons why it was kind

of covered up and not found for a long time. was because they were, it was one of those places they were kind of like hiding out or something, right? But scientists and archaeologists have determined based on finding that, that's who built it, which is kind of silly, right? If Jesse goes over to an ancient monument and puts his name on it, and then a thousand years later, we find that Jesse's name is still like carved into it. Did Jesse build it? Not necessarily.

No, if, like, it doesn't, it's kind of a silly. But we can't know that it was built earlier. also. Well, but the thing is, why would they do that? Why build a giant underground city and go to that kind of length of work if you're just doing it to hide from an army somewhere? Yeah, fair enough. Which they could literally just starve you out and like block, it doesn't make sense. No, you could literally, they could, like, pour oil and then just like set the whole inner place on fire, all these different means they could have done, all various different horrible things they could have done. But the only thing that makes sense, if you look at the concentration of these underground cities and how it was the center of the ancient world. world is that they would have had pilgrimages knowing and reading the stars. Now, that gets back to Glebeckle-Tepe. Because look at the pillars of Gle-Tepa, have their just basically star constellations. Isn't it like a sun calendar? It's a calendar. It's an astronomical calendar. I believe its purpose was, my personal opinion is its purpose was to track the great year, to track cycles.

And it was an astronomical spot that that was its purpose is to track cycles. What is the great year? Just the concept of a year? No, no, no, no. Okay, so the great year is based on what's called the procession of the equinox. Okay. It is how the earth wobbles because of the gravitational influences of this binary companion. I told you the entire, the entire solar system is influenced, okay?

What's the, this is fascinating. So basically this 26,000 year cycle where True North involves a different star right now, it's Polaris. Yeah, other times it involves. But what's the convention? astronomical, you know, explanation for why, you know, all these planets, you know, have kind of wobbling gravitational orbits and how the entire axis of the solar system is actually on kind of a wobble. It's tilted. Not a lot of people talk about it. You know.

Is it literally just dismissed? Is there not some convention? Because, like, there's certain things like how the moon was formed. Yeah. Yeah. Which is really mysterious, actually, by the way. It's such BS. When you hear, like, the conventional explanation.

Oh, it came together perfectly and a perfect ratio between the sun and the moon and the earth. It's like an asteroid like hit the earth. And then part of the earth came out of the earth into this perfect, you know, thing. It's impossible. Makes no sense. It's impossible. Into this thing that, you know, you never see the dark side of it. It's perfect, you know, and it's one four hundredth the size of the earth.

And it's 400 times closer to the earth than the sun. And it just doesn't, yeah. The conventional explanation that you can kind of definitively say is wrong. And then I think where you have to be, epistemically humble to me, at least I don't have a great theory. Maybe you do. is like, I don't know what formed that thing. But what's the conventional explanation for, yeah, the wobbling gravitational axis, the slanted gravitational axis of the entire solar system?

I think some kind of a Milky Way interaction of outer things and inner things with the sun. I've never heard of anything definitive that's come from to explain that. If anything, I told you that Miles Standish had said mathematically, like, they were like, oh, they miscalculated all these things. and then people are like, oh, never mind. Like, it's been really weird. Can we track the emergence of the conventional explanation? Because I often think that's like a really important.

Again, I'm not, I'm not an astrophysicist. So, like, that would be a good question for others to bring up with that. You said there was somebody at Caltech who's sort of convinced about. Because I want to interview that person. I don't, I actually emailed him and he never got back to me. I know if he's listening to this, I'm still open to that reply. Let's figure out how to get in touch with it. There's a number of, uh,

experts at Caltech that use mathematics and based on data from probes to study the outer solar system, okay? And they determined that based on the movement of Kuiper Belt objects, that they're being super skewed and perturbed by something, okay? And that the way that Caltech, and again, if anyone wants to look, just look up Caltech in Planet 10 or Planet 9. It used to be called Planet 10. Then they demoted to Planet 9.

look into that, they have extremely compelling data that backs all this up, that mathematically planet 10. I'm going to call it 10 because I think Pluto is, we should just keep it, whatever it was, but we'll call it planet 10, that it absolutely exists. And again, why would you have a planet that's completely rogue that's not part of another system? Well, I'm just even thinking, again, my stupid math, right, like the sun only has so much gravitational pull. Pluto is part of the sun's gravitational. field of influence because it's so small.

Well, it looks like it was a moon of Jupiter that got thrown out beyond that area. Right. But things, you know, like my guess would be that something four to five times the size of the Earth that's beyond the perimeter of Pluto even. Oh, way beyond. Might have trouble being part of the sun's... Why would it be part of, exactly? It makes no sense. In fact... I don't know, but I need to...

The sun plays... Exactly. There's no influence that far out. at that point. We're talking about something that would be like, it doesn't make any sense that it would be having a consistent type of elliptical orbit. Do we know the conventional explanation there? Well, no, they've tried to deny that it exists. As I've said, Caltech is the only modern institute that's important.

So this thing gets announced in the 90. I just sorry to harm on it. I think it's so important. I know. It's incredibly interesting. So he announced in the 90s, NASA's like, this is this thing, you know, planet 10 or whatever. And then, okay, it's Standish comes in.

And then he's like, actually, forget about it. So Planet 10 goes away too? Yeah, let me show you. Yeah, let me show you. Like people forget about Planet 10? Yeah, exactly. Because of, I'm telling it's because of Miles Stanish with this whole idea that mathematically they made a mistake and then it never existed. And Pioneer never shot Planet 10.

It was just, they never got footage of it. It was just based on these, it was just based on these, the wobbling, you know, the gravitational influence. Yeah, and data is very easy to, here. Wait, but. Take a look at this. I think it would probably be helpful for you to look at that. That's the. page from it. I think it would be cool for you to see it.

Yeah. Yeah. Pioneer 10 became the first craft to pass into interstellar space in 1983. The diagram shows the path of the two pioneer probes. On the right, the pictorial plaque carried by Pioneer 10 contains information about Earth and humanity. But it says nothing about the diagram, which is so wild. You see that?

So I'm looking at the diagram. If you read the article. 10th planet, 4.7 billion miles. And then look at the diagram. dead star. Do you see how it says equal gravitational pull on there? Equal pull, yeah. Whoa.

Right? That's really trippy. And this is an official NASA release? This is from. Again, the science invention of cyclopedia was at a very prominent in acyclopedia series. Some listening to this probably still have some of their basement. They used to come out with volumes every year.

And they would update them. And it was like a very, very prestigious. It's not like an obscure encyclopedia. It was a very prestigious encyclopedia set, and they're becoming very rare now. But some people still have them, and if you do, I would recommend holding on to that. And if, so in a binary star system, these stars often, like, move around each other. Like, they dance. They dance.

Now, the great year, again, I highly recommend people watch that documentary called The Great Year. It shows that dance beautifully. Now, this dead star seemed to have a massive elliptical orbit. I mean, we're talking an elliptical orbit so big that we never can observe it, ever. We can never see it. Are there any big proponents of this theory now that have tons of data behind it? Very strange that all I've seen is Caltech investigating this planet, but there's been, from what I gather, very little on anything else. And that's why I wanted to preserve that image on my website.

So that something like that couldn't die because it looked like. like it was being like completely scrubbed. And I'm telling you the weirdest thing about it is you saw that diagram, right? Showed the weird thing is that article, even in the encyclopedia, says nothing. Why would you include a diagram that has information that would completely blow up all of science itself and not say anything? To me, the only thing that makes sense, the only one thing, is that somebody wanted to keep that in there, but they weren't allowed to say anything. Well, how else does that make any sense? I mean, that would be an entire article itself.

Who were these two astronomers again? Thomas Van Flandern and Robert Harrington. Yeah. They were the ones who spearheaded looking into this planet, and I believe even the binary star. They both die of throat cancer. And they both died of throat cancer. What years did they die of throat cancer?

I don't remember off my head. They died in the 90s, though. Okay. Right after this discovery, pretty much. Right, basically. And then Miles Stand is like, hey, by the way, everything's mathematical and miscalculations, and it's all wrong. And everyone's like, okay, never mind.

Oh, man, that's so crazy. Isn't that wild? Yeah. And so it's when I, in my last book, the stage of time, I end up, I mentioned in there that they're sort of like unsung heroes that are forgotten and that I think deserve to be remembered. Were they trying to get this out as they're being kind of marginalized and mild standish? I believe they were writing a whole series of scientific papers in collaboration with each other. Anybody in touch with their families or something? You know, I'm not sure.

If anyone's listening to this that knows, I know. I know that they had stumbled onto something very, very major. And it's just, I'm not saying that necessarily, I don't want to come across as like they were murdered necessarily, but it was very mysterious how they both died. Fascinating. And then after Miles Stannis just proves the whole thing mathematically, nobody ever investigates it, it just dies out. What's his background, Standish? He became a prominent astronomical figure within the NASA community. Before we go on, I should say that personally, I have a.

seen an abundance of evidence for this binary star system theory that Matt's proposing. But there are ancient civilizations that echo this belief, and even some pretty credible modern astronomers who believe it's possible. Roughly half of the stars you find in the universe are alone, and the other half are in groups, and often the groups consist of two. One of the stars might have evolved enough so that it has died and has become a white dwarf, and then lost a lot of its heat and became faint as well. If it's sufficiently far away and sufficiently faint,

then it would just sit there and maybe orbit the sun within a few thousand years. Who knows, I cannot have any positive opponent about this, but I would not rule it out. Perhaps we've already seen our sun's binary companion, the clinging to old theories kept us from realizing it. If the Earth were a perfect sphere, there would be no procession,

because there would be no way to apply their torque on the Earth, but since the Earth spins, it makes itself oblate, by that spinning so it has bulges on the equator. So this leads to a net force which would want to put the Earth upright. That's what the Earth doesn't allow it to do, but the Earth cannot completely escape that pull from the Moon. And instead of being positioned upright, it will shift the orientation of the axis.

In other words, it will cause this procession. All of that's to say, I would maybe hold this theory as somewhat low probability, but incredibly impactful, if true. and I would urge every audience member to please research this, the possible scrubbing of the Pioneer Mission from NASA, and the important stories of Thomas Van Flandern and Robert Harrington. Okay, I want to get into some of the similarities. I know we got off on like a crazy tangent,

and I know that's not what you spend all your time on. So you've uncovered some amazing ancient architecture and Eastern Turkey, and this architecture seems to comport with all sorts of sites all over the world. So it is kind of proving out this Graham Hancock. hypothesis around this proto-civilization that may have existed because you say that a lot of the techniques are in terms of how they build the structures and the motifs and symbols the motifs and symbols themselves line up perfectly so yeah exactly what evidence do we have of this so you have that in front of you and you want to pull that up and you can look at it while I'm talking to you

yeah um so i to start with my expertise uh primarily had been focused a lot of my life for the last 20 years with really becoming a try to be as much of an expert as I can on ancient cuneiform languages. Now, cuneiform is not a language. It's a writing style. It's a type of wedged writing style that was adopted or emerged out of the Mesopotamian region. So if we think of languages like Sumerian is the first language that we know ever existed on earth, right? It's a type of cuneiform language. And that survived because they etched in these symbols into clay and stone, which,

can last enormous amounts of time, thousands of years, in comparison to paper, which only lasts 500 to 1,000 years. It's a much more efficient way to record information. Now, when I was studying the ancient Sumerian civilization, who, by the way, invented nearly everything. They invented astronomy, animal husbandry, agriculture, mathematics. They were the ones who first came up with, like, trigonometry, and understanding the solar system.

Oh, yeah. It came out of Babylon, but Babylon got it from Sumer. That's where if you saw that recent... And what's your line between... Because I know people talk about just the fertile crescent being the cradle of civilization, but what's your line between Sumer and Babylon? Babylon had what was called an old kingdom and a new kingdom. So it looks like there was an older, even an older part of Babylon as well.

I want to point out that most ancient places in the world, if they weren't buried under some pile of debris or something like that, they were rebuilt upon because it seems like the predecessors that came always knew there was something sacred and special about them. And that was something we see all over the world, which is why so much confusion exist in the archaeological world for who originally built them. And that came out of that region. Now, I was particularly interested in the Sumerians because the Sumerians had all these mysterious designs, which, by the way, their Sigurots look exactly like that step pyramid design. Okay, it's basically the same design. I thought Ziggurats had seven levels.

Well, they're not the step pyramids can have more than three levels. Some of them can have seven. It's based on that step design, though. Okay, now we see those seven levels in things like Medan Salae in Saudi Arabia, which I showed you images from that as well. But the original teaching seems to have come out of this concept of these three levels, and I can talk about that concept of three as we go forward. However, so when I was studying the ancient Sumerian stories,

one of the things I focused on is what was our ancient history? Like these are the oldest writings ever written. They have these incredible stories in these cuneiform tablets, okay? Things like the Atrahas, the enumeralish. I'm sure you've heard of the epic of Gilgamesh. And all these stories, many, many more, right? Erudigenesis, myth of Adoppa, Legend of Atana, but they all have these like nuggets of truth within them.

Now, a lot of archaeologists would tell you that those were just based on myths. And you even find out that a lot of the Christian stories like the deluge and the Noah story where it's nothing to do with original Christianity. It was adopted from these ancient Sumerian stories. And you can see the comparisons, right? If you read the Epic of Gilgamesh, the Atrahasis, and then you compare the flood story, it's like literally almost identical to Genesis. It's clearly it came from that, okay?

Now, if you want to get to the core of something, you need to go back to the earliest form of it. If you want to understand that story. Now, I became pretty obsessed with understanding who are the best translators in the world, what the forgeries were, the false stuff, which exists too. Real quick, what gives you confidence that the epic of Gilgamesh was actually the inspiration for the story of Noah and the ark and the floodman? Well, because the epic of Gilgamesh contains the original flood story, but it's from Gilgamesh. who was from a later time period, he's from this second iteration that emerged out of that region, not the original Sumerians, but he's from a civilization that emerged out of the Ure. They call them like the Oer civilization or Oer the second.

It's an area that he was basically a king or a tyrant, the king of the city of UR, okay? Or an Uruk in that area. Now, he writes from an earlier time period because in the epic of Gilgamesh, he's trying to find the secrets of immortality by going to find a very specific character. And this is what I traced and tracked across all of these texts. But not coming from the lens of like hearsay, I found the best translators in the world who had translated them, such as George Smith in 1875, and then Stephanie Daly and others who have come along like Samuel Kramer, who are the best as serialologist in the world. A seriologist is a term that is a blanket term that includes Sumerian, though. They just

called themselves a serialologist. George Smith was like the first person who was the first. He was the one who cracked the Sumerian code. Now, to give people some understanding, we had this time period of not knowing at all what these texts said. Okay, so Sumerian is what's called, it's called a language isolate. It doesn't share an alphabet or similarities, many similarities, very, very small similarities with any language on the earth. It's basically like an alien language.

And a man named Austin Henry Laird came along in 1848, and he stumbled across this ancient library called the Royal Ashabonapal Library. Okay? The Royal Ashabonepal Library is very unusual in the case that it doesn't get a lot of interest. You know, a lot of people talk about the Library of Alexandria. But really, I feel like the library of Ashraf Bonapal should get a lot more interest, along with even the great libraries of Ebla, which is another ancient city in Syria. But these were libraries that had massive amounts of cuneiform tablets that weren't just from that civilization, but they were from many, many civilizations. Asherpon Paul was a very, very powerful king, but he was also a priest. and he existed during what we think of is the Assyrian time period, okay?

So he was in Assyrian king, but there were earlier time periods before him. There was an Acadian time period. Then there was a Sumerian time period. So if we were going to look at it in like a timeline, there was the emergence of a Sumerian civilization, then an Acadian, then an Assyrian and a Babylonian, right? So we have this time period that is around four to six thousand years. years old. And in that time period, Asher Bonapal comes into power, and he's like, these stories are incredible. They're connected to my ancestors, Sinoccuriv and my father, Tigris and all these other guys.

And I want to understand, like, the most important stories of mankind, right? He recognizes that they are, bar none, the most important stories. And I agree with them. And so what he did is he amassed these armies, thousands of people, and he goes out to every part of Mesopotamia, to every ancient city, gathers all the tablets, all together. He brings him back, creates the greatest library ever known to man, called the Royal Ashurbanopal Library. So in 1848, 1849, Austin Henry Laird is excavating the ancient city of Nineveh. And what today is Mosul Iraq. And they're digging down, digging down and they find like those huge La Masu statues and everything and they find which by the way are 40 tons each they find this royal library with thousands and thousands of kineiform tablets specifically 40,000 to be exact. Okay. Now they're not all like the same level of importance. Some are like talking about laws and governing and you know like shekels and how much a bushel of wheat of wheat would cost and Because agriculture was their basis of currency.

By the way, that was where currency came from. The first currency on Earth came from the Sumerians, and it was called a shekel. It was based on a bushel of wheat. Because they were an agricultural civilization who would actually were the founders who created civilization itself. So Austin Henry Laird finds this library, okay? Finds thousands of tablets, including the epic of Gilgamesh. And he finds like Sumerian kinglist, and he finds Atrahas, and he finds Atrahas, all these things, but they had no idea how to read it.

Because the Sumerian language had died out over a thousand years before. Imagine a thousand years going by where nobody remembers how to read something. Okay. And so they have no idea what it says. Here comes George Smith. George Smith gets a hold of these. He brings it back to the British Museum. He spends the next 10 years, 10 years, study.

them trying to understand how to read this language. George Smith is a hero. He's one of the greatest unsung heroes of history that the world does not know. George Smith ends up doing something brilliant. He realizes that he's never going to crack the Samarian code on its own. So what he does is he backtracks. He goes to the only known language that has even somewhat similarities in its way. And that's Assyrian and Acadian cuneiform. So he goes back to those stories and he basically takes and understands some of the similarities with things like the occur, which means mountain house and other things, and he backtracks and he figures out how to, he cracks the Sumerian code essentially.

And it's described that when he cracked, the first tablet he ever, this first set of tablets he ever cracked was actually the epic of Gilgamesh, which brings us full circle back to where we started. Anyway, he figures that out and he starts reading and you get these fantastic stories, right, of massive floods and ancient kings who ruled for enormous amounts of time and disasters that wiped out a previous age and then there's another emergence of civilization that comes after all these stories. Now, when archaeologists, and now, by the way, was like 1875, when archaeologists get

a hold of this, they are like, there's no way that these things were real. Not only did they believe that the stories were just allegories, because there's allegorical nature of them, right? Gilgamesh is talking about fighting the bull of, right, the bowl of the, of tourists and everything. Those are metaphysical journeys that have astrological connections. Okay, agreed, of course. But then it mentions that Gilgamesh is a king of the city of Iraq. You're like, wait a minute, Iraq was found. It's a real city and other things. And you, the, part that I come in is in studying these, in finding the best versions possible, and then saying, well, what aspects of truth and aspects of literalism are in here?

And can they help us piece together our ancient past? And that's where this whole story of connecting to Eastern Turkey came from. Because as I'm studying all the tablets and then cross-referencing saying, like, look, Atana, the legend of Atana, he's, it describes that he emerges after the great deluge and builds the first city called Kish that's after this great, time period of when the original five cities were built. When's the Legend of Atana? The Legend of Atana is like say 4,000 years ago, 3,500 years ago, right? And then what specifically, but why are you high conviction that the Noah thing is connected? Okay, so let me get to that.

Yeah. So in that, there's these moments where they have distinctions of events occurring and things happening, okay? Gilgamesh was not part of the Sumerian time period. Again, he's from the Uruk-Uro time period. but he knew about his ancestors, and he knew about that to such a degree that the entire premise of the epic of Gilgamesh is him going to seek immortality because his friend Enkidu dies, and he ends up being worried about his own mortality, okay? So what he does is he specifically goes to find a man, a man named Uttandapishdam. Okay?

Now, that character, it was also called Zayasudra, an ancient Sumer. You find out that he's the original hero, what's called the Atrahasis. He's where the whole Noah story came from. You can cross-reference those stories, they're nearly identical. And it's not just one. It's you have the legend of Itzubar, you have the myth of Adapha, you have Eriduginesis, you have Sumerian kinglist, you have Atrahaelius, you have Atraha in Epic of Gilgamesh that all mention the same flood, the same characters, and the same cities.

Okay? Now, that's amazing. Oh, and that's where I funneled into this. And I became... The epic of Gilgamesh is the first that mentioned. The first one was translated, not the oldest tab. Not the oldest tab. Yeah, it was the verse translated.

But the reason why it's so important is that for a great deal of time for the last 120, 130 years, archaeologists have been under this impression that the cities mentioned, the very early cities mentioned, were a myth. Okay? Weren't real. Something like Troy, right? Troy was considered a myth that Greece never fought Troy and that it was just an allegorical story, kind of like the whole Plato thing. And yet, in the 1871, they find Troy. Yeah.

I love these stories because it's like, yeah, we just, we take everything as allegory and myth. and, you know, whatever. But it's just painting over our modern kind of ideas with, you know, the past with that sort of, you know, myopic brush. Exactly. And you don't need to be, and the expert sort of defends that. And then, like, the kind of amateur can stumble into the actual truth, actually, which is a beautiful thing.

And that's, I became obsessed with these tablets. Every single one I could read, every version, because it was different versions of them. For instance, the Babylonians wrote a version of the Anoumela Lish that the original Sumerians and Acadians had written. And there was slight deviations in the story based on the greatness of Marduk, who's the patron god of Babylon versus Enki was the patron god of Eridu. But you can weave those out by saying, oh, I know this is the earlier version, so I can understand how this got a little bit altered, right? So that's what I do. I've been doing that for 20 years.

So in my investigations, I found that the original city of Eridu is described as the first city ever created on Earth. Literally the first city created. Well, late 1800s, they find Erudu. Okay? Very mysteriously, there's a Zygirot that's an entire mountain of Eridu that has this city below it, right? They usually had a temple with a city below it. What modern day country is Erdog? It's in Iraq.

Okay. So it's in the whole war-torn region that I can't get to. And I have a whole campaign on my website. It's near the confluence of the Euphrates and Tigris rivers in southern Iraq. Okay. west of, you know, west of Baghdad. So in the late 1800s, they find Eridu, and they only excavate the main part of the city.

They find tablets and everything. They bring them to the British Museum. They never excavate the Erudu Zigerod. And then, and I ended up just to give a little sidebar, I ended up going on this campaign that's on my website called the campaign to say it Eradu, because I end up finding all these photographs over the last 10 years of locals going in and just pillaging the site. And literally there's tablets sticking out of the ground.

And they're just like selling them in the black market. And the whole site has no fences, nothing protecting it. And it's like it was abandoned. Is that still the case now? Yeah, it is. It's completely, oh, God. It's very, very sad. And they end up going in during World War II in 1940s.

And your belief is that's the first city on Earth ever, which was considered a myth. Well, not ever, because you think there was maybe a situation. civilization prior. Well, no, this is the thing is that I'm believing that Sumer was not when we're told. Okay. Is that what we think of as the time period of Sumer is actually a far later time period of the Assyrians and Acadians. Okay. Not the same time period at all. So how old do you think Sumer actually was? I think the ancient Sumerians are well over 12,000 years ago, which is why they essentially invented everything. So when do you think? Or is it just impossible to say? Based on geodesi in aligning temples of in ancient sumer, like in Iraq and different, and erudu in different things,

I've had people email me and there's been studies done online using geodesi, alignments with cardal points and different things where it no longer has any connection to like the, like true north at all. And that where it's aligned, true north was like I said in Greenland, which was, you know, well over 12,000 years ago, which then gives its potential age. just being, you know, maybe 20,000 years old or more. Whoa. Yes. And that's why I...

Do we have anything beyond... Because I know the critics are going to say you need more than astronomical alignment. Oh, of course. And do we have anything beyond that? Well, we have these sets of teachings and motifs that seem to emerge and then spread around the world. Like core knowledge. It's very important about us and our solar system and different things. and that's one of the things we can use.

But again, there's more evidence we'll get into in a minute. Let's just, we'll put a pause on that for a second, okay? Now, they find Erudu, and it's like all of a sudden it's not a myth anymore, and that's pretty mysterious and not super super cool in the whole understanding of ancient history. And it was a very, very sad story with Erudu, and it's how it was abandoned, and the Ziggurat was like very, like literally never excavated. Now, and I got a chance of, go to the Penn Museum this past year and see a lot of those artifacts from Eridu in their

original form. And I'm writing a book right now on this whole Turkey connection with Sumer and in the middle of it called the Missing Key of History, the Lost Era civilization. I have the whole connection back between that. So they ended up not excavating the Ziggurat at all. And it was a very sad story, as I had mentioned, where they sort of move forward and they They come back previously during World War II, and they're shown, like, walking around Eridu, and we have – if you just go on Wikipedia and you look up Eridu, you can see – excuse me – hold on a second. Yeah, no worries. If you go on Wikipedia and you just look up Eridu, you can see basically the photographs of it

and how they're walking around, there's bricks sticking up out of the ground and everything. But the reason I mentioned is – that is that previously that city had been considered a myth. Okay? It was like, oh, that, that's not real, and then they find it. Well, how do we know that that's erudu? Oh, they established they found tablets that actually said the name erudu on it in many, many places. So that's not disputed.

They know they found erudu. Now, now this is where the next part of this comes from. I had been studying this particular aspect of the tablets that is one of the core values of all of them, which is this original Noah flood story, right? Gilgamesh going to seek the flood hero, as he calls it in there. Okay? And his name in Epic of Gilgamesh is Unta Pishdom. But his original Sumerian name is Zayasudra.

Now, they had different names and different eras, but it's the same person. Now, you learned that Zayasudra was, and there's Sumerian kinglist that has the whole breakdown, and you can go through all of this. So, like, that's established. If you want to look, you could find it, is that. turns out he was a son of the last king that ruled these first five cities existed. Erudu was the first. Sharupak was the last city, okay?

And you find out in the Sumerian king list that it was ruled by a man named Ubaratutu. Now, Obarotutu's son was the Noah figure. It was his name was Zaiasudra oruptuishdom. Now, for ease of all this, let's just call him Noah, okay? Because that way people can understand what I'm saying easier. from now on. That was his original names. Now, you learned that in those stories that Ubarotutu had stepped down at the end of his reign,

and this figure had come in and ruled over Shurupak very briefly. He was both a king and a priest, okay? Not like the Russell Crow version where they show where he's like some primitive Stone Age man or something. He was actually a very high priest in a safe. and very, very wise and knowledgeable, which is why the actual tablet that he supposedly wrote, called the Atrahasus, literally means very wise. Okay?

So he was a great sage, very, very knowledgeable. Now, it's described in this that in the stories, again, like the allegorical stories, the myths that they say, that number one, Shrewpac wasn't real. And number two, that this figure was never real. Both were not supposed to be real at all, okay? except that in 1931 Shrewpec was found. Now, before I go into that story, I will start by saying that this figure, in the stories

in all the tablets, it discusses how this Noah figure, a sage, Zayasudra, he ends up learning that there's this great deluge coming that's going to wipe everything out. He was warned, hit through this various means that, and you can keep. get into the tablets how they were supposedly there was a pact where they weren't they weren't supposed to warn humanity they um where zayas who was warned and in the story he is just told to build this massive cedar craft boat it's very very explicit details on how long the plan should be and how it should be sealed what's called bitumen now bitumen is something we use in construction even today it's a type of epoxy like type of adhesive

that's very, very, very strong. And he was told to build something and seal it off. They say like the ab zoo. The ab zoo is like the underworld. So completely seal it off. Bring just your animals and your family. Okay, so then the horse Christianity turns it into like two animals of every kind and all of this stuff.

And it completely derails from what the original story that's echoed throughout Mesopotamia is the core of this, is that he was told to basically. your family and you are going to help be part of the seeds of humanity in the future. Because there's going to be an event that comes through that's going to basically wipe everybody out, okay? So that story is that he builds it. He doesn't tell anybody. Everybody knows dies. His family gets on.

They just have like their goats and their whatever and they survive a certain amount of time. And they ended up landing in the Mount Ararat region, okay? of Armenia-Turkey area. That is where the tablets sort of end because a lot of them were broken and damaged. And when George Smith translated the epic of Gilg mentioned others, there was areas where they have like, line is missing, line is missing, line is missing.

That's what it literally says. Where they had no idea what it says. The only thing we know is that there were these, they described them as anuna gods, the ancient gods of that time, that descended down to the Mount Earat or wherever he is and basically get into this argument over how humanity was supposed to be destroyed

and how Enki had warned the Noah figure and that eventually they come to an agreement that this is what it says, is that because this figure had survived and his sons had survived and that they would repopulate a lot of the world, that he would be given immortality. That's essentially what the story,

stories end with is that the Noah figure gets immortality. Now, let's go forward. Thousands of years. Now you have the Ekeba Gilgamesh, which has the flood story rewritten in it. But in that, you learn that Gilgamesh is very interested in understanding how to obtain immortality. The reason is, is that there's an obscure tablet called the Death of Billagames. And it is a tablet, and Billelgames is another name for Gilgamesh. And you find out in that that these Anuna God, had given the Noah figure, Zayasudra, he was the last man ever to get immortality. They said that no human will ever get immortality again,

and we essentially will have to die like mortal beings, okay? That's how you know that. That's how you know that that's the last figure in history that gets immortality, okay? So again, going forward, there's these elements of truth in that it's like, it's like wild to try to be like, wait a minute, so did these things actually happen? Is that an analysis?

allegory? Well, there's a clue that's in the epical Gilgamesh that's on like tablet 10 that almost nobody gets to because they have to wade through all the astronomical things and him fighting the monster and like his journey with Enkidu and they're like, oh, that's, none of that makes sense of her is real. And you're like, well, no, it's probably not. It's an allegory, except until you get to a certain part. In that, buried in that tablet is a moment where, you get to Gilgamesh going to, he says he wants to seek out the flood hero, Unta Pishdom, to learn the secrets of immortality. Then you're starting being like, wait a minute.

So there's some real aspects to this, right? And so what happens is, you know the Greek ferry boatman, fairy man of the underworld, right? Sharon, have you seen that where he's got the staff and he's got the hood? And he's like, you're going to put two gold coins on to ferry and the underworld? The river sticks. That came from the epic of Gilgamesh. That was the oldest recorded record of that. I think the Greeks came later.

This was an earlier time period where that first iteration of that concept came from. And in that, Gilgamesh seeks out and finds the fairy man. Again, this is a weird concept to think, like, is this a metaphysical journey? How is this even possible to be in the underworld and do this? That part is mysterious. of course. And I think we still don't understand

certain aspects of reality. Well, yeah, I mean, that would be like the Persephone's quest. Exactly. You know, kind of proverbial mystery ritual or something. Well, and then there's this part, though, that comes up that's key to this whole thing. It's key. And in that, Gilgamesh

goes to Sharon and gets on the boat and he pays him and he ferries him into the underworld because it turns out, no being can be immortal and live in a mortal world, in a material world, all organic matter breaks down. And so the only way that Unta Pishhtam, the Noah figure, the only way he could ever be immortal is to live in the underworld.

Okay? So that's essentially where that comes from, and the idea of Ishtar is to send the underworld and all those ancient Sumerian stories. Now, so Gilgamesh travels in the underworld to go and find Zayasudra. He finds him on this like island it describes. Okay. He goes there, and he seeks him out, and there he is. And he has, anybody can go and read this, especially in the latest book I just published

called The Epic of Humanity. I have the whole translation of this in there. If they want to, because sometimes these tablets can be hard to find the right versions. So one of the things we did with the Epic of Humanity is we included all the most important passages from the best translators in there. You can read, and you can find that on Amazon and on the stage of time. Anyway, he finds the Noah figure, and he asks him, how did you obtain immortality? I wish to know.

And I'm paraphrasing here. And the Noah figure says, oh, Gilgamesh, I will tell you an ancient story. He says, there was once a city called Cherupak, far older than your time. So old that when Gilgamesh is alive, which I do believe is the time. period that we're told he's alive, right? 3,500 years ago, whatever it is, 4,000 years ago, somewhere in that

region, that he knew about something extremely ancient, and that's what he was going there for. So he says, oh, Gilgamesh, let me tell you about a city, an ancient city of Shrewpac, that, remember, that's supposed to be the last city created with the first five that was destroyed,

where the Noah figure came from. So it makes complete sense that he would have all the knowledge of Shrewpac because he was the last king and sage of that city before it was all destroyed. Makes sense? So he says, let me tell you a story of this ancient city of Shrupak long before you. It's so old that the gods were once in it. Those are quotes that he says were once in it.

And you're like, that's weird, right? So go forward. By the way, he doesn't seek immortality. Ointepisham tells him if you can. dive down and get this rare plant, or if you can try to stay awake for seven days, he gives them these tasks to try to do, and Gilgamesh fails all of them, and then it's going back empty-handed to Iraq. So it ends up kind of sad, right?

But that doesn't really matter because you find out something really strange. So Shrewpak was a real place, and this figure was a real person that was there, and these events, some of them are real. That's where I started getting more interested. And I started studying it. It turns out they found the city of Shrewpec in 1931. In that area of Iraq, just they had this hunch they believe based on data and information where they thought it was. It was below this modern, well, modern day village called Tel Farah.

Okay? Telfarah. And so they dig down below Telfarra and they end up hitting these different. layers of civilization, not just one, but three. And they called them strata one, two, and three. Now, strata one was the deepest, two being the middle, and then three being the more recent, okay? So they start down, they first hit strata three. They call it strata because it's different layers. Strata three was the much more recent time period of that region where they had tablets still, but the pottery was actually kind of a primitive. It was an interesting culture that had come after Gilgamesh. Right. So there's like another

culture after Gilgamesh that ends up living in that region. As they get down further and they dig down to like six to eight feet, right? They hit what they call the Uruk or Uri-C civilization. And they find tablets related to Gilgamesh. And they find, well, this is when Gilgamesh lived. And they acknowledge that. They call it Strata 2. So here's Gilgamesh's time. They're writing all the tablets. They're writing about the floods and all these different events. So that's 3,500 to 4,000 years ago. Now, if you were a civilization writing about a previous event, it would make sense that the people that had the event occur to them would not be the ones writing about it, right?

Because they'd be gone. Yeah, of course. So it would be like stories and things that would be woven down and then you would write their stories, right? How old is Tier 3? Well, so they – well, this is what's wild. After they hit Strat of 3, because archaeology – isn't supposed to exist before that. 80% of the entire team left.

They all left. They're like, you guys are wasting your time, basically. I'm paraphrasing. And you can go on, and this is a big part of the new book I'm writing. The new book is going to be called the Missing Key of History. It details all of this. So if you go on Penn Museum Archive, you just look up the city of Shrewpak. You can read this whole thing I'm telling you right now.

Okay, it's very beautiful, beautifully laid out, very great. great document that has all the information and diagrams and stuff, okay? So in that, they hit this strata two civilization, which is when the known Acadians and Assyrians and all these guys are supposed to live. And they start digging down further and they find no more human remains, no human activity at all for three feet, four feet, which is a long way to go. And everyone's like, you know what? This is a waste of time. And like not 70% of them or so, something like I'll leave. Except some of the archaeologists in some of the better workmen stayed.

They're like, why do you think they stayed? They're like, we haven't found Cherupak yet. Okay? We haven't found Shrewpac yet. So they continue digging and they find this layer underneath Strata 2, as I said, that is three to four feet thick, okay? Like pretty sizable layer. no signs of human activity, no fragments of any kind other than just alluvial material.

Lovial means river, like, or flood deposited, right? Just like the stories of the great flood, okay? Like Atrahas and the stories of Shrewpac being wiped out by a great flood and being buried and sealed, okay? While they stick around, it's the British and the Germans digging, okay? and they dig further and further because they just had a hunch and at 16 feet down, 16 feet from the top. Now two civilizations above them, they all of a sudden hit something. They hit areas of scattered tablets and scattered fragments of stuff, and they find tablets right above it and below that show, because they actually found a tablet above in Strata 2 that said, Shrewpac was here, but they didn't find Shrewpac.

So they're like, it's got to be down there somewhere. So they end up finding this base layer, and it's total anarchy from what they can see. Most of the belongings have been removed, have been, like, taken. Something, it looked like they had, the people had, like, left is what they came to the conclusion of. And they find some beautiful, beautiful pottery. They actually found this really weird diorite hand. Diorite's one of the hardest stones on earth that has six fingers.

And as there's an image of that, I'm including the book, and it's in on the pen excavation report. So weird, it's a hand, but with six fingers. Very bizarre, whatever that means. But anyway, diorate's an extremely hard stone. So no primitive civilization can carve things like that. Very well carved diorite hand. And they find all this beautiful, beautiful pottery. And they find these tablets and different things.

And they're like, oh, my God, we found shrewpack. Okay? 16 feet to 22 feet down. massive amount of area, and they have, of course, right on top of it is this four-foot alluvial flood layer sitting on top of it. Now, in that article, I highly recommend people read it, there's this whole conclusions part at the bottom, where they end up discussing how there are very, very interesting similarities from the ancient Untipishdom Zayasudra story that match what they found. However, at the very end, they say, this is, I'm paraphrasing, this is

simply a playoff of thoughts and off of words. We don't really think that this could actually have existed like they said, but it is interesting nonetheless. They do any sort of dating? Well, the dating is very, yeah, it's very difficult to date things like that. Okay, but you have this flood layer above tier three. So they see the similarities and this is where I get on board. I find that article, study the hell out of it, realize, okay, this might be like real evidence to prove that these things really happened and that this is actual archaeologists saying and pointing towards something mysterious. And that's where it led to all of this.

Okay? Because now I'm like, okay, so Shrewpak was real. Erudu was real. Zayasudor was real. Oh my God, did they really land in the area of mountains? Okay? Right. So it all starts to unfold.

So I start studying that region. It's Eastern Turkey. Today it's Eastern Turkey. It used to be Armenia. So I'm looking around, looking around, and I stumble across. Why do those civilization? So Cherupac's real, Erdus real, all of that stuff's in Iraq and the Fertile Crescent. What does that have to do with, you know, anything?

Because the stories state that they landed in the Arab Mountains. So you're saying, let's try to figure out whether that's true to you. Exactly. Yeah. Now, I initially wasn't necessarily being like, okay, I'm going to find evidence of that. In fact, it sort of fell in my lap. I was just looking around that area, and I stumbled across these very mysterious sites that were brand new. The world has really never even heard of.

Some of these sites are found in 2017, 2001. We're talking about, you think, we think Gobeckley-Tepe's new. That was found in the 1800s and then fully excavated in the 1940s. We're talking about something way newer than that stuff. And when we're saying, so Gilgamesh is the king of Urdu, when we say... Oh, Uruk. In Ura. Oh, there's so...

So Aradu is related to a previous king, not related to Gilgamesh. It's a totally different time. That's right, Iraq. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. So Gilgamesh is the king of Uruk, and the epic of Gilgamesh says that he is landing in modern-day Turkey or who is... He seeks out the flood hero to learn about the secrets of immortality from that figure. Yes.

From the ancient Sumerian figure of... Zayasudra Umpitim, who became the Noah figure in Christianity. But then what's the connection then between that and Turkey and modern day

because in the stories that Zayasudra and his family, they land in the air rat mountains. Okay. After the flood, they land there. Yes.

Got it. And I believe that flood was not Younger Dryas, but actually a completely different event way before it. Because we had this whole time period

of an emergence of something that happened. Now, Christianity, early Christianity in Hebrew traditions already state this. It already state that the sons of Noah repopulated and traveled around the world. That's Japith, Shem, and Ham. They already state that. There's like biblical, all kinds of ancient knowledge around this,

except they don't believe that it was before 6,000 years ago. What's your best guess as to the date? Could be up to 40,000 years ago. Based on looking at ice core sampling and previous climatic events of when floods could have occurred, and these things on the earth. Again, studying Greenland and Antarctic ice cores and then studying alignments with Greenland when North was in that position

and different things like that. So would the implication then be that Cherupac is... Yes. It would be like the oldest cities on Earth. Wow. And it was sealed and buried and concealed by the flood. And then other civilizations ended up building right on top of it.

But there was so much flood debris and material that they never even reached it. It was like sealed off. We've got to get these dating techniques better. It's so frustrating when you find all this stuff. And then it is above a flood. It's below a flood layer. So, like, that should be, you know, some decent evidence that, you know, this stuff is older than.

Well, archaeologists say that it was a local river event of flooding because the Euphrates is prone to some flooding events. However, in pictures of Eridu, I was able to identify ocean shells that are still on the Ziggurat summit that would have been more inclined. to have like a Persian Gulf flood from the ocean and maybe even the Black Sea that engulfed that entire region. That's wild. Well, yeah. I mean... They're not river shells, they're ocean shells.

Uh-huh. And what's the... Well, there's freshwater snails. Sure. There's freshwater things like that, but these are ocean shells that are sticking out the ground. That would be some evidence to potentially prove that or at least suggest or point towards that this was a flood that it was related to the Persian Gulf and not.

just like the Euphrates River flooding during seasonal rises. But do you really believe that at that time, technology could have even possibly existed to get into a boat and then land, you know, pretty far away? Well, it's described that very, very extensively that the details of how to build it and how to survive were told, like, so that humanity could survive. It's, again, if you want to read the tablets, you read the Epic of Your community, they're all in there and it's very detailed with like the amount of bitchamon and the type of wood, because cedar is the toughest wood on earth.

It's a very specific type of wood and how to build it and how to seal it off and that they did survive this event and that they landed up there and that's why there's so many ancient traditions that say that that happened. Now, this leads to everything else that is right at the core of all this that you have in front of you and that we were talking about before. When I was studying these brand new sites around Lake Vaughn, now Lake Vaughan is not that far from

the area. It's relatively in the same area, except that the reason I think they pick Lake Vaughan is that it is, for instance, by the way, it's the fourth deepest lake on Earth. It's 1,500 feet deep. And it has volcanoes all around it. When you have that, you create a very,

very fertile soil for growing and creating agriculture the perfect place to create a new civilization, new civilization. And that is what I believe potentially happened in that region was that those, that group who were very, very wise sages who were literally being helped by the gods, as they describe it, created something there that potentially has traveled and became maritime and maybe the answer to Peru and Bolivia and even like Egypt and basically this lost key to the lost civilizations of earth. And I can go all into the details of why I would make that very, very bold statement. Okay, go for it. So when I was studying these sites, again, very new, like Ionis and Kef Kolesi

and Shavus Tepe and Khorazut and Azvinaepe, all these different sites. You find all these similarities between them. The first thing that's very strange is they have extremely sophisticated stonework. Like, I mean, megaliffs, multi-ton blocks that are carved at a very, very hard stone. And they only used three types of stone. They never used anything even local. For instance, a lot of that region is actually limestone that has volcanics around it. But the areas they built these temples on were usually limestone.

But they didn't use the limestone blocks. at all. In fact, some of the basalt that they used in this construction is considered to possibly come from 350 miles away. Because of the quality of it, there's nothing in the region that has quarries that supports that. And some of it even came from volcanoes like Mount Sufon, like at Keff. But again, we're talking about a civilization that mimics like what we're seeing in Egypt with this idea of a lost civilization before the dynastic Egyptians that had gone to great lengths to create massive things with stones that they didn't care where they came from, but there was energetic reasons that they were very important to them, where they would go and obtain them to build these

things, and then they seemingly were wiped out, and then another culture came later. Now, that dynastic equivalent of Egyptians would be what I believe are called the Uyartians. The Uraltians in this region, 200 BC, about 3,000 years ago, they share a lot of similarities with the Assyrian civilization of the north. Remember I said there was a re-emergence of civilization in Mesopotamia during the time of Gilgamesh, right? You had the Acadians and Assyrians that reemerge out of the ashes of the Sumerians. They then know about the stories and things, but they're like a kind of a warlike culture a bit. Ashraphanapal is collecting all these tablets and creating these libraries. But what you have is, I believe, a branch of the Assyrians that moved into what I'm calling this old

holy land, right, that went up in that region and created a completely separate civilization, right? Hundreds of years go by, they build this civilization, and then the Assyrians and the Babylonians invade and destroy them and wipe them out, right? Poof, they disappear from history. But they leave behind all of these mud brick castles and all of these crude stones. and all of the stuff that's built almost entirely on, or in many cases, on these older foundations, just like in Egypt. Make sense? So when I stumble across this and I see sites like Ayonis and Kev-Kalesi with these machine-like cut stones,

but not just the precision of their work, the fact that they were sun temples, aligning to either the rising or the setting sun, but also having motifs and specific symbols that then we find. all around the world. And what those motifs represent and those symbols, I believe, became the core of ancient secret societies in things like the Knights Templar and things like the triptych doorway knowledge we see all around the world. This idea that they're like the Trinity, right? The Holy Trinity and Christianity, the Father's Son, the Holy Ghost.

But what does it really mean? I think it represents the three sides of us, right? We have the mind, the body, and then the spirit. And if those three things are balanced, we essentially ascend into this higher form. Right? I think Jesus and Buddha and all these individuals in history have just basically been sages trying to teach us that very same thing. And where did that knowledge come from? I believe it was lowered at these sites because all of the symbols all come back to here.

All the building styles seem to be traced back to here. All of the ancient traditions say that these three sons travel around the world and then provided the knowledge. It all seems to come back to one place. And what you have in front of you is a giant basalt, what's called a ba relief. And it is these massive three foot by three foot by four foot stone column block that has all these sacred teachings that literally became what I think is the basis of hermeticism itself. You have the concepts of the law of correspondence. You have the concepts of feminine and masculine. You have the tree of life that we find throughout Assyrian civilizations and others.

You have even the passing of the pine cone, which we see all around the world of civilizations. And remember with the handbag and the pine cone, you see the first, what I believe is the first iteration on that anywhere in the world. Wow. And not only that, but the original. sun cross that became the Knights Templar cross, all from the same locations in this part of Turkey that just happened to correspond to where these divine sages were supposed to have landed. So you think they had sort of ancient hermetic wisdom that then has only been conserved via secret societies since? Yeah. And so what do you think these symbols mean?

So, like, you know, we talked about the, you know, Trinity. What about the cross? Well, the Sun Cross represents what I believe is this balance of all harmonic things, everything. And I think it goes back to this idea of source or God, the balance of all things, right? And that's why the cross became such an integral part of Christianity, but not that cross. What's interesting is that Christianity's cross is not shared by that cross except for the Vatican, And like the Pope and the Vatican have that very same cross. Not only that, the Pope has it on its cloak and in front of the Vatican is a giant pine cone.

Yeah, I've seen it. It's amazing. Very same symbols that come from this region. Yeah. And that's why I believe, for instance, these sites were visited by Xerxes, Alexander the Great, and many, many other great people throughout his. History. So Xerxes, Persian, Alexander the Great's Roman.

It's like they're all going back to somewhere. You think they're trying to find something special at this site? Exactly. What do you think they're looking for? I think they're looking for the holy knowledge of, you want, you ready for this? Take that other one on, the big one underneath there. Yeah. Look at what he's holding in his hand.

Looks like maybe an acacia leaf. No, not that. The other thing. Oh. Like a little. Like a cup or a chalice. Yeah, like maybe a Holy Grail or something. Exactly.

Really? Exactly. Interesting. And if you look up what that means, it means, we know what some of these things mean, right? If you look up what a cup means in religion, it means the passing of a spiritual or religious doctrine. Okay? He's now holding a pine cones for knowledge that is coming off of the central tree of life in the center that has three different ones with balancing of the center. Now, if you look at the top, do you see?

You see the three step pyramids with the two eagles on either end. Yes. Now look at what the flowering of the center that comes right off of where he's basically his head is pointing towards. You see that? Now that consists of seven rays, which I believe correspond to the seven colors of the visible light spectrum. Interesting. And we also have seven chakras inside us that has talked about during kundalini and ancient. Well, seven comes up a lot.

Seven Hecolo. Seven sages. Seven are Rite in the Egyptian. These are palaces that you go through sort of copulistic protocols where, yeah. Okay. So I think what we're talking about right now are literally some of the most holy sites on earth. With knowledge that's then passed around the world. And archaeologists have severely gotten this wrong.

It's fascinating. I mean, when you talk to Brian Murrescu who wrote the immortality key, he talks about the El Eucinian Mystery Rituals, much later, obviously, in Greece. But when you go deeper with him, he'll say, no, this stuff has actually been going on well before the L.E. You had Menoian and Misenian proto examples of these sort of mystery rituals. And so conserved knowledge via, you know, specific rituals and symbology, you know, kind of makes sense that it would go back, you know, well before. And maybe these things are, you know, can't be taught via transfer. of documents and, you know, just, you know, pure, you know, just teaching semantic knowledge.

Maybe it's something that needs to be activated within a given individual. Right. And now, if you look at the other image to your right there, you can see the Griffin that became one of the core symbols of Greece, of ancient Greece. And I think, I believe, based on the trajectory of where these different groups went, that were part of the same area, the Suns, is that even ancient, ancient Greece, just like Plato and Plutarch discuss has an earlier history than just they're called the ancient Athenians or Proto Athenians. In those, they describes it actually fighting against Atlantis. This, yeah.

And so what we could be looking at is the implications of the emergence of a global golden age that may even connect to the ancient Athenians in Atlantis. It's really fascinating. So what would the Griffin, why would the Griffin point? It's a guardian. It's an ancient guardian in Greece. And it is guarding what I believe is the symbol of time. Oh, yeah, the hourglass, yeah. And I believe that they're talking about guarding time for eternity.

Basically, what they're guarding is, I believe, is this concept of balance and harmony in all things. That's so interesting. Well, you know, the Templars supposedly had the secrets of time travel. You know, if you read the Imberto Echo, Foucault's pendulum, you know, there's a part where they had these sort of rituals that they would do. and it's sort of related to Kundalini. And then, you know, at the very end of this crazy, long description of the history of the Templars, and Berto Echo says, you know, maybe they even had the secrets of time travel. Well, it's mind-boggling to consider, like, the connections, because let me give an example.

Yeah. In South America, in Bolivia, we have Viracotia holding the two condors on either side, which I think is the same concept you see in front of you of the pillars of holding balance. And that that God, Haldi, you see in front of you, is the same thing as Viracosha. And that what we're seeing around Lake Tidicaca, with the emergence of the pre-Tewanaku civilizations in Pumuponku, and around Peru,

is like a mirror civilization that was created. They were very much the same. Lake Tidicaca is one of the deepest lakes, just like Lake Vaughn, surrounded by volcanoes. And they both built out of the same and a site basalt work that we see. mimicking each other, the same symbols. So you have the same materials.

Same symbols. The Chicana symbol, the cross. Yeah. The Viracosha, we see the same type of building style. I show pictures from Kef Kalasi. Where is that? That's in Peru. Yeah. How many sites do we have like this that we can correspond as far as symbology, materials, structures?

I'm tracing them all around the world. How many? How many? At least half a dozen. For instance, that step pyramid design. I've also seen an Angkor Tom in Cambodia. In other places. Do we have any sense of how old Angor Tom is?

That's another thing. It's another mysterious site where we had other cultures that adopted it later on and then it kind of just disappeared into history. But the point is that we may be looking. Is that it older than Angkor Wat, though? They're part of the same complex. Angor Wat and I was just looking it up and it was like, you know, past 1,000 AD. And I was like, that doesn't make sense to me. It's got to be older.

They have no way to date things like that. Right. Just because someone comes along and writes something into something else, it doesn't date it. Now, give you an example. Now, archaeologists believe that all of these ruins, all of these artifacts, all these symbols came from the Uartians. Because the Urahtians wrote cuneiform into some of the temples. Just little spots here and there. Like, I, King Minoara or Rousseau II built this.

And that's what their basis for it being the Uartians, except the Uartians had none of the same incorporation of these. these motifs into their, their artwork was quite primitive. They built on top of all the base stonework with mud brick. And then they crude stonework. None of the teachings were part of any of their culture at all. And furthermore, they didn't seem to have any kind of respect for any of these ancient teachings. they actually turn some of these gods into war gods. And it makes sense if you're during a time of war

that you're going to use them in very different ways than they were before. Now, my theory behind that is that this civilization left no writings. Like, for instance, in the Great Pyramid of Giza, there are no writings anywhere, okay? A lot of these ancient sites, like, give an example too, like if you go to Puma Pumku, there's no writings anywhere. That's interesting because you would, if it were really from, you know, what we consider one of the ancient Egyptian kingdoms, you would expect more hieroglyphics.

Except that the hieroglyphics were maybe all come from the dynastic Egyptians. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. So maybe this civilization. Yeah. That's just another point. You know what their language was? What was their language?

Symbolism. That, yeah. Wow. And that their literal way of passing knowledge, why would you do that? Let me tell you why you would do that. Manly P. Hall discusses in his amazing work. that the ancient's language was symbolism because that way it couldn't be interpreted, misinterpreted by those who are not adepts in sages.

You need the ears to hear or the eyes to see. Well, you're just not going to understand what you're looking at. If you're not a sage that has any kind of knowledge of it, it literally won't make any sense to you. This is true of all secrets to say, you know, pre-masonry or, you know, anything. And so I believe that their language may have been symbolism, and these motifs represent divine knowledge that is at the very heart of two, things. One, an understanding that we're part of this balance and harmony of the earth and that everything is connected. Okay? That's one. And that those things are actually maintained. And then the

two is the knowledge of the divine side of ourselves and how to reach these higher states of consciousness like all the great sages have always been trying to tell us all along. And that those two are the core concepts of teaching. Some of these are even like universal. law and in with woven into these and I believe that's why

so many of these civilizations built out of the same stone had the same symbols all over the earth and just

mysteriously disappeared because I believe that that civilization then traveled around the world and I have

evidence for that where I found sites there's a site called Alton Tepe you ready for this

425 miles away from the other sites enormous distance that was as the same symbol, same temple design, all of it's the same, and it shows this migratory root that they were making, and it heads right towards the Mediterranean and the Black Sea.

I believe that that civilization became maritime, and then influenced the pre-Greeks, influence the Egyptians, influenced the ancient Peru and Bolivia, and maybe even other places like Cambodia and India. Do you think this is what we call Atlantis? I would say that it's what we're looking for for the lost civilizations. Why can't you, you know, the more conservative thing would be to say this is just one of these like proto examples of the mystery rituals and we don't know, you know, and they were, the mystery rituals themselves are conserved all over the world. And that's pretty fascinating. But we don't know exactly what civilization it came from.

The problem is, though, that any civilizations that are credited with the world. this time period are considered iron or bronze age, okay? Iron or bronze age means that you only have tools made out of iron and bronze and bronze in your capabilities. Right. Iron age is the one that they created that your RTNs. Yeah. Now, Iron Age tools.

Bronze age is like 1,000 BC-ish. That came after Iron Age. Yeah. Now, if you have Iron Age tools, how can you ever manipulate? First of all, move stones, hundreds of miles. Okay, let's just start there. Yeah. If you were an Iron Age civilization, first of all, how could you move gigantic blocks?

Why would you even do that? When you have local stone right in front of you that's like limestone or something softer, why on earth would you ever go to those lengths to go and get those stones? First, if you're a primitive culture, how would you even do it? So I agree with you that the conventional narrative is off. It has to be. Makes no sense, doesn't it? It makes no sense.

And then drawing conclusions from this. So it's like, okay, so we have like six or so All over for a minute. Turn that, I'll flip it around. Yeah. Now, flip the other way around. Yeah. Now, you see the base stone that's the, that's the, like the darker, like the stone you can see in the bottom?

I do. That's the foundation of ionis, okay, you're looking at. Yeah. Now that is built out of anisite, one of the hardest stones on Earth. Same type of stone we see all way across the world in Tijuana, Pumu, Pumu. Okay? Wow. Now, look on top.

That entire mass you see on top is not during. dirt. It's mud brick. You can actually see the bricks sticking out some. Now, if the Eurartians were able to build at a stone, then why would they all of a sudden only use mud brick on top of it? No, it's almost like you see this regression of humanity. Exactly. Like embodied in the sediment layer of actually really advanced stuff going on at the lowest levels of the sediment layer. That's exactly the point. Okay. Now that's the first thing. Now, why? First of all, how would they able to move these multi-ton stones? from enormous distances, one, two, how could they cut them anywhere near what are like laser cut cuts, right? They look machine cut.

I have examples from Kef, excuse me, from Kef Klesi that have cuts that are so sharp, you can still cut your finger on them. And you can see the same thing in Puma Pumku, that are so unbelievably perfect that today we wouldn't be able to do it by hand. we would use a machine to cut those, right? We have no idea how they cut them. Secondly, some of these symbols, turn that around for a second and flip it around. Some of the symbols of the crosses actually go between blocks seamlessly. How would you do that? How would you cut these symbols in utter precision beyond comprehension and never make a mistake?

And put those in there like that. Now, that altar in front of you is made out of golden calisite alabets. right? And they don't even know where it came from. Okay? They seem to be going to great lengths to create these unbelievable temples aligned with sun movements for very specific energetic reasons. And I think it goes way deeper than that. You look at the designs of ionis, the way that there's this pillar design, a basalt with an antisite central Susi temple, that they all have these connections in this square around, and that they have these extended periods of stone. extend off of each corner, it's like there's some kind of an energetic, metaphysical

response that we have no comprehension about it all. Like, for instance, I don't think this is anything about just tracking movements of the sun. I think the actual sun and the energy may have created something within this that human beings have no concept of yet. Well, have you heard of certain people lying in... Like sacred geometry, is what I'm trying to say. You know, I get it. or, yeah, theories of, you know, resonance or fractal geometry.

Right, right, right. So, yeah, have you heard of rumors of sort of elite people, you know, spending time in granite chambers in some of these pyramids, like modern day, like this happening now? Because I've heard of this. Yeah, yeah. You know, this idea of, you know, certain people going into granite chambers and then having sort of out-of-body experiences,

of course. Of course. And, you know, coming back. feeling sort of, you know, like they have... I think that was one of the purposes behind them. Yeah. And why do you think that? I think that these were temples that were related to like ascension temples, if I want to

to call them that, okay? Yeah. Ascension temples that were designed around not only human conscious harmonics, okay, frequency and vibration, but also this fusion between, again, like the earth, moon, the sun, and also constellations. And all of those had that concept of the law of correspondence that created. created a synergy and that may perhaps humanity forgetting that when we create these beautiful spaces of energy, right?

Temples of certain kinds of stone align in a certain kinds of way, often with gardens or flowing water or different things that it's like a magic is unlocked, if I can describe it that way. Yeah. It's like some kind of a magic is unlocked and we become a conduit to be able to reach higher states. And I believe that was one of their functions for why they were created the way they were. and that we have literally forgotten all of it.

It's really fascinating that you have pink quartz in Egypt. You have granite in Egypt. You have, what do you call this? It's golden. It's golden calisite. In all these cases, materials that don't exist locally in the immediate surrounding environment, they're sort of going out, getting them. Then they're using seemingly techniques when it comes to building these geometric structures,

creating these stone carvings that we can barely do today, or if we would need heavy machinery. We don't even know why they did that. And let me give you a reason why this has been missed. This is a big point I want to get across. Yeah. Yeah, why is archaeology so awful? When archaeologists came into this region, there was a man named Charles Bernie,

who was like the, you could call him the grandfather of Eurtean history. He kind of put a lot of the Eurtean history together, and then a lot of the archaeologists that came later wrote in papers that a lot of their understanding came from him, and then it kind of trickled around. It trickle down. It's called the ivory tower. It's this idea that well-established prestigious people come before, and then others are not willing to go outside of that narrative because it's like this established doctrine, right? That gets firmly established, and then it almost gets built off each other.

Now, go back to that sheet underneath, the big one. Now, you see what's in his hand, and you see how in the center there's a cypress tree of life. You see that? Yeah. They believe, based on the... the Eeyrartians being warlike, that what Haldi is passing at Tshiba there, Tshiba and Haldi, one is a storm god and one is a god of preservation. We see that in the, in the, what's called the trimurdy in ancient India, with Shiva, right,

Vishnu, Brahma. I'm sure you've heard of that, right? Yeah. It's this idea of a creator, a preserver, and a destroyer. Okay? That's very much the same concepts we see here, except for because the Eurartians were warlike, they believe, archaeologists believe firmly that what they're passing in their hand is a spearhead,

a spearhead, and that all those T windows up above are false windows in a castle. So much so that these sites are actually called Kaleses, meaning fortresses, because the Urarthians built fortresses on top of them. They are literally looking through everything from the lens of a war culture.

Right. Everything. Right. So none of them come back to being like an ancient mystical sage teaching. They're like a war symbol. And because of that, all of these, I believe, are basically misinterpreted. Now, you see that teapillar? So if these aren't spearheads, what are they?

They're the seeds passing the seeds of knowledge. Basically like we see all around the world. Now, I want to show you. So what are examples of the... That's so interesting. Let me give you an example. I'm going to pass this over to you. That's fascinating.

I want you to see something. So they just assume it's a spirit because the Uraltaritan's World Warlike culture. Exactly. Now, let me pass something to you that I think will help you understand this in a greater way. That's so fascinating. Take a look at this. Yeah. Okay.

Now, that is that Shavuz Tepe is made out of assault. That's Robert Shock, right? That's Robert Shock right there. We were all there just recently. Now, look at the T pillars on the box right, the ball relief right in front of you. Uh-huh. No, right here on the paper. Oh, okay.

Now, look at the T's. Oh, I see. You see that? Yeah, I did. It's the exact same thing. Whoa. So where is this? That's at a site right in the same region called Shavus Tepe.

That is these mysterious tea pillar, which then mimics things like Menorca Spain and Gobeckley-Tepe. And we see the same tea concept in Pumapuncu as well. This is crazy, man. So it's everywhere. It's like this ancient teaching that was being passed around. And now they believe that those are false. doorways, except they have no hole in the back. They're solid. That weighs right in front of you, that weighs 7 to 10 tons. And there's no basalt local to that area. It also, it makes sense

archaeologists would be way off on this because you have like this national pride thing and you just want to like say that it was like this modern, you know, like, or whatever, whatever modern thing. You would never want to predate it to some antecedent global civilization. Oh, exactly. That, like, you know, is the proto layer to everything. Like, that would suck, right? Especially if you're like the minister of culture for like a specific region, you would never want to do that.

So it makes sense, like incentive-wise, why you would like ignore all of this. Or you would say, you know, this is a tip of a spear when it's, in fact, the seeds of knowledge. Like, that's really interesting. Now, let me show you one more image really quick. To compare to that, I think you're going to really like this. Take a look at this one right here. So this is from, that's from the back of the sungate in Tijuana, Bolivia. Yep.

And it's the same concept of the three doorways. Yeah. You see that? Yeah. Now look at closely at the left and right side of those doorways. Do you see the T-pillar design? It's got the same top. I do.

Oh, I see. I say, yeah, yeah. Perfect. With the three levels within it, just the same as the T-pillar. Now, watch this. I want to show you one more. Okay. And where is that?

That's in Tijuana, Bolivia. Bolivia. Jesus. That's so interesting. This is Puma Punku. There's your key. Do all of these have astronomical alignments to you? All of them.

Now, do you see the T again? This is crazy, man. Do you see the T again? I do, yeah. That's Puma Punku in Bolivia. And so, and thousands and thousands of miles. Okay, so now I think the astroco- Now I'm higher conviction that the astronomical alignments matter.

Yeah. Because, like, if they all lined up at a specific time. So when, okay, and then can we get a little more precise about the timing given the astronomical alignments or these could be broad ranges. There's different times when they can align. The one thing I can say is I'm very compelled with the research that's done with Geodesi looking at where the North Pole was in relation to true north. Yeah.

And also where, for instance, I was mentioning these Susie temples, they faced either west or east, but not anymore. They're offset. So for instance, let's say this is east, right? Yeah. This is west, right? Instead of being east, they're like that. And instead of being west, they're like that.

And so it's like, well, when did the earth, when was the tilt different so that they faced east? And same thing as when did the temples face true north, not, you know, when was the North Pole? You know, true North not where it is now. Right. So those are ways that we can start to understand these a different way. And I'll make sure we put all those images online so people can see what we were looking at during this. And so the big dipper is like seven stars, right? Is that right?

Two, three. I'd have to add them up again. I think it's seven. And I think Polaris is considered. Well, it's one of the stars of the Big Dipper. It's the end of the ladle. Yeah. And it's considered, I think, in, you know, like I think Ezekeel's chariots go towards

that, like, you know, the North Star Polaris. And so I do think in a lot of these hermetic traditions, right, like you go towards, you know, the, the North Star. Well, I think by doing that, again, it's that constantist of geodesy. Odessi. If you align yourselves, could cardinal points of the earth, both solar and magnetic, you create something. Do you, like something special? Does any of this relate to the modern UFO phenomena? I know it's a really weird question. I think, I think, I would just, I'll throw out that I think a lot of UFOs are based on, like, secret government technology. Yep. And then what percentage are, do you think any of them are not, or do you think all of them are based on secret government

tech. I will tell you that I think the concept of ancient aliens has been a bit skewed. From what I look at with these gods like Haldi, it seems more like some kind of celestial intelligence that is far more powerful than that concept, related more towards a greater concept than someone coming here in a ship. In fact, the nearest star system to us would take like a hundred light years to get to It's really, I mean, light years, if we could travel at the speed of light, it seems to me. I think it would take 80,000 years with chemical combustion, proxma, and Tauri.

It seems to me that, yeah, I probably didn't get that number quite right. But it seems to me that we were maybe misinterpreting our way of looking at the influences of these. And I'm not saying it's just, man. I don't think that. I think that there's something greater and higher. And I think they're what has been confused with being angels and demons throughout history. Do you think angels and demons are still with us at all? I don't think they ever leave.

I think there's some kind of being bound to this reality. And that's why they seem to show that they're the guardians of balance here. So you think they're guardians coexisting with humanity right now? Yeah. And then we somehow have a connection to them in a way where we are almost like children of that. and that we're growing up to learn our true potential and that they're like the teachers. Where are the guardians? I believe that we're now supposed to find our way back on our own.

Interesting. And that we are given the keys there? Yeah. That's why I think all that happened is that we were given the keys there and that we lost them. And now it's our turn to find our way back. Do you think the guardians are physical beings or non-physical beings? I think they can be physical if they want to. Okay.

But they seem like they're very, very powerful celestial being. In hermeticism, they call them the second mind. Yep. I do think about, like, where humanity could head. And you have, like, two paths, right? Say we have to inflect down or up. And down is, like, we are extremely resource-constrained. We go through some Malthusian cycle.

We live in this totalitarian world. We're all microchipped. Yeah. We have to, you know, we barely have access to clean water. And then the other feature is, like, a ton of resource abundance via, you know, technology or whatever. So I think in both cases, you'd end up in some sort of simulation because you're going to have, like, you know, the increase of, you know, IT, you know, like, high fidelity, like simulations all of VR or whatever, neuralink, you know, higher bandwidth relationship with computation, you know, that that's probably just going to increase. But that's our path.

That doesn't mean that that was their path. Well, where I think it gets interesting is even if we inflects downwards, so if you inflect downwards, like ready, place. layer one, like you want to opt into the simulation. If you inflect upwards, it's probably through tech that's a dual use. So it's like controlled, you know, nuclear fusion creates clean energy for all. Uncontrolled nuclear fusion creates the hydrogen bomb, right? And so like basically like a kid in his bedroom could like blow up the world at some point in the future probably. And so you'd need, if you were a guardian of that civilization, you would need people to be perfectly altruistic.

And so maybe you'd give them some sort of simulation test, you know, a la like contemplation. of virtue to like get outside of their simulation or cave if you're using the Plato analogy. And so I think there's probably a version of the future in either scenario where we end up in a simulation. And then it's like, why aren't we already in that future? Why aren't we, you know, maybe these are like biological meat suits and we're in a cave right now. And there's, you know, these guys, the guardians are like literally like outside us, goading us with little symbology here and there and, you know, helping us throughout our lives. But, you know, we have to sort of seek, seek the knowledge ourselves.

Well, there's this idea that if we can be tricked, then we're not ready. Okay. And so I want to get to that idea of these building styles. Why they do all that stuff? Yeah. Why build all that, like these things like this? Why out of those types of stones? Why do that?

I think it was a completely, the other path that humanity can take. What I have studied is that there's only two real paths. Yeah. That civilization can take. What are there? There's one that is a very organic natural path, and some might see that as being primitive, but I think that's what this other civilization took,

building out of giant stones, understanding the potential of the human energy field and the human mind to unlock abilities that we no longer remember any longer. Telekinesis, potentially levitation, things that we don't understand, where they seem to be in harmonic resonance with the,

earth and the universe. Yeah. And I think that path is the complete opposite from what we took. I agree. And then there's the other path, which is like a cheating system, which is where you, you piggyback off of fossil fuels and then have like this massive jumpstart by getting ahead in your civilization by kind of polluting the world and getting further and further away from spirit and source, though.

Yeah. It's like you get there kind of quick. Look what happens in the last 500 years. I think there's this addiction to, you know, the Kardashev scale. So this is this idea of, you know, I think it's like 70s, like Soviet astronomer or something, this idea of like levels of energy, you know, ability to manipulate levels of energy allow us to kind of travel at, you know, at different levels, interstellar. And so, you know, there's a single planet civilization, multi-planet civilization, you know,

multi-galactic civilization. And you get to higher levels. And I think we're sort of addicted to this idea of like getting to, you know, increased, increased levels of kind of energy density. concept though. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. I think there's something actually very magical about human biology and the Earth and the Earth itself. And there's a technology involved in like the construction of us and life and biological life.

That is, I'm sort of a biological exceptionalist. Like I think there's something very uniquely special about biology that we don't understand. 100%. And, you know, there are all these examples. So like the emerging, you know, we're trying to build quantum computers right now. And, you know, the bottleneck is keeping the chips in these extremely cool environments. It's really energy intensive. You know, it's a material science problem as well.

And, you know, increasingly you have this field of quantum biology where we're actually finding out all sorts of quantum processes in the human body and other animal organisms, whether it's Robbins kind of navigating home via the magnetosphere of the Earth. Yes. And the CRY4 protein or, you know, enzyme creation via quantum tunneling or photosynthesis. You know, all of this stuff is kind of emerging. And then I think there's an interesting, you know, quantum mechanics interpretation, which gets so overused to be honest on channels like Gaia and in the self-help community. But that actually was pretty well studied in the form of parapsychology where, you know, this idea that, you know, wave function collapses, this completely random process that has nothing to do with the mind.

All of the people who created this stuff, Schrodinger himself probably would have, you know, what did entertain the idea that the mind was. is part of weight function collapse. Yeah. Yeah. And the Copenhagen school is completely consistent with that interpretation. Yes. And so, yeah, totally. So I think there is something very unique and special about consciousness that materialist production is scientists.

100%. Yeah. That's the big piece I think that's missing. Yeah. Is that we are far more powerful than we realize. Oh, way more. And that we, our consciousness is not localized and that we have this idea that we want to physically travel somewhere, but perhaps we're looking at it in the wrong way.

100%. In two ways, both in the form of chemical combustion rockets. Yes. And then also in the form of this Silicon Valley cult of transhumanism, where we need a higher bandwidth relationship with classical computers. You know, I think our brain is actually sort of a quantum computer, and it has some sort of tesseract holograph component in a higher dimensional space. I believe that we're like antennas.

Yeah. And if we can tap into this certain frequency, we tap into this sort of. all knowing. This type of like Akashik record, almost like source energy, and that we are a very, very special and very divine being. We just don't remember.

Yeah, I agree with that. Well, I think the, and that's what mystery rituals do, is they, so like, the idea that the body and the brain is actually a collapsing function. It's a narrowing valve,

a filtering of something that involves greater omniscience beneath it, is this age-old idea, and it's completely unfalsifiable to say that consciousness is locally produced and not actually transmitted in some... I can't wait until that goes away. I'm so frustrated by that. I think it will because there's more evidence.

Think about it even phenomenologically. Brain does not create consciousness. When you are daydreaming, where is that the content of your thoughts? Where is that being produced? William James, you know, in Aldous Huxley, all these people were big fans of this transmission theory of consciousness. And you have this binding problem. of consciousness where you have no idea how the disparate parts of our brain, you know, you have very mysterious.

Yeah, meld together. Yeah. You would have a binding problem over radio. You need to know that it has an antenna that is transmitting a signal to know that why it's playing, you know, Vivaldi's four seasons or Tupac or whatever. And so it's like this really important question. And yeah, I mean, I can get into even crazier theories around, you know, an extended version of electrodynamics that might involve.

I don't, we haven't figured it out. scientifically. But mystery rituals point to this because if you look at the L. E. Sunian mysteries or any of these other rituals, they involve the temporary killing of the physical body through a near-death experience.

And then you remember your, it's called noesis is the Greek. You remember your primordial soul self. Yeah. And then you come back with this knowledge of your own immortality and this sort of renewed confidence in your life. Yeah, because energy can't be destroyed. It can only change

state, which means that if our spirit is connected to a reincarnation system of our soul, then it means that we never truly die. Right. And that the fear of death is actually just to keep us trapped here. Yeah. And there was that Greek cathedral that said, if you die before you die, you won't die when you die or whatever. And that's, that really is the kind of underlying principle behind all of these rituals. Yeah.

And, you know, whether it's in the Amazon, putting your hands. hand in a glove full of 20,000 bullet ants, you're kind of switching the thing off, and that's an act of faith, because you then realize that the world is much more expansive. And if you look at the neoplatonists, like, Plotinus, for example, would say that, you know, simulation is used all the time in today's world, but it's used in this sort of nihilistic, postmodern, you know, bottler, you know, simulacra, you know, it's just a video game, right? but there's this platonic sense that like in platinus would say like we are we are as a souls porting ourselves into a low level reality yes and that's probably i don't know that's the journey

that's the journey that i told you it's that starting from a higher place and then ending up having to go through the wandering of the darkness of a lower state and then finding our way back i think that's the game yeah and along the way we learn incredible lessons about how to exist from I think what starts as a metaphysical existence into this physical reality and then having to learn real consequences and lessons about growth, the growth of our soul, the growth of what kind of a being we want to be and how our collective consciousness can rise up and be raised by that growth. So why do you feel like you're driven to uncover kind of the secrets of ancient civilization? I have believed, based on certain experiences I've had, that I probably had a life in one of these ancient civilizations with some of these things because they feel, a lot of it feels very driven and very important to me in this life to uncover these and connect them.

And I feel like it's more of, sometimes it almost feels a little bit like remembering, but not in the sense where I'm trying to claim. that I'm, you know, tapping into something. For instance, I'm not trying to say like, oh, I remember all this stuff and I haven't done the research. It's more like as I'm going along and connecting all these dots, you sort of have like a knowing. You're like, oh, shoot, like, of course, right? Yeah. And then also what happens is then you, like, go deeper and then you get to another layer.

It's like an onion. And then it's like, oh, hey, by the way, you were right before, but that's not the same. there's like a more expansive way to look at it. And you say, oh, I get it. Like, I didn't see that before. And then it keeps going. And there's these like steps and levels to understanding this nature of reality. Well, I think, you know, there's a Plato dialogue, you know, Meno, where he says

all knowledge is recollection. Yeah. And I think the idea that we are just running some like local optimizer to like learn random things to just lead a good life or whatever. It's total BS. You are, when you learn something that sticks with you, like how does memory work? It's the reinforcement or articulation of probably latent knowledge inside of you. And you see it and there's some resonance.

And you're like, this is really interesting. I have to focus on this and I don't know why. Yeah. And then that leads to other things. And if you were, if people were honest about their own epistemics, that would be how everybody would describe how they navigate life and they wouldn't be able to navigate life otherwise. I'm telling you, that's the future. Is this, is, here's the thing. I see that it's actually unlocked a lot of this is that your intuition is your guidance.

Get out of your brain. Use that for things like silly, figuring math stuff out and bills and things like that. But when you want to make really important decisions or paths in life, get out of this. Yeah. Get into this. Yeah. Trust. Trust yourself.

Trust that you're more powerful that you've been told. And trust that you're being guided. And I'm telling you the doors just unlock. And all of a sudden, these divine things. synchronicities happen, right? You're like, you trust, like, you give it a little bit of trust, and then something happens, and then you're like, whoa, and then it leads to something else. Yeah. And you're like, how did that even just happen? And then it blows your mind, and then you start being like, well, this is like a trippy thing. And then you, the more you go down it,

the more you realize that we're definitely part of this like guided divine story. And you can play a part in that. You can either, right, you can either, like Shakespeare said, right, all of the world is a stage. What, what part do you want to play? Do you want to play the hero? the antagonist, do you want to play just someone kind of neutral, like an MPC in the background? But at any point based on free will, you can decide to kind of wake up and start that journey. Using your intuition, where do you think that next big breakthrough is going to come from? And I'll ask it differently because I think a lot of times people in your position, Robert Schock's position, Graham Hancock's position, you end up in this sort of liminal space

where like half of the people that like resonate with your stuff you know all these people who like hear you out really agree with you and they're like this makes so much sense this is right we've been lied to about ancient civilization do you think there's a point in our lifetime or at any point in the near future where this flips into oh this is the consensus

like all of these you know fertile crescent is the cradle of civil and all of these kind of like hypernationalized stories are just kind of BS. And a lot of this ancient architecture all over the world comports with universal symbology. I think that the reason it hasn't come out yet is that humanity wasn't ready. It's like a mystery school. It's like the adepts are ready when they're ready.

And we as a collective have not been ready yet. We've been governed by lower consciousness in different aspects of energy. And that's why these things have been able to be held back. Because we allowed it. But there's a tipping point. Like Graham says, I believe our entire history has been built on a foundation of sand. And that tide is coming in right now. Well, I think, I mean, just thinking, again, using my left brain logical, like how most people think out there, I think the way to tip the scales here would be to come up with some new age dating method beyond carbon dating.

If we could somehow do that for any of these structures, and then if we could find more of them. You mentioned like maybe a half dozen. If we could find more of them and we could date them all, I think we get to this point of this critical threshold of it's beyond a reasonable doubt. Well, let me add something to that. I guess this would probably be helpful for you. I am part of a very significant documentary that I'm leading. Awesome. With some very interesting individuals around the world, including some of the ones we've already mentioned, that we are trying to do that very thing.

thing right now. Epic. And we're right in the middle of that. Those trips I mentioned to you, we're scouting trips that are out in advance of something much greater that we are building for a documentary that we hope helps to shift, that an entire narrative. Super exciting. Well, if I can join for any leg of that trip, count me in, man.

I'm serious. I'll fly wherever and just be a fly on the wall and, you know, it'd be awesome to witness history. It's very exciting. The documentary goes for. from these sites in Turkey that includes Peru and Bolivia and Monarcha, Spain, and will potentially expand on other things. But let's just say that some of these secrets are, we have some very compelling data and

some very interesting things that I can't share everything yet, but stay tuned because things are about to get exciting. Anything you can hint at and anything mind-blowing that we missed? There's some very interesting, there is some potential dating. stuff that I can't talk about yet. Really? Yes. That's going to, smoking gun, that things are older than we think.

Yeah. So stay tuned. I've had to have a vow of secrecy on that one. That's really exciting. Yeah. Wow. Well, if we could get that, man, help me break. I mean, let me help you break it.

Come back and we'll talk about it. I will. I will. , it's an ongoing project. We are, we want to make sure we do our due diligence to explore all the places before actually filming so we can make sure that we tell the story and present the evidence in the best way possible. Very cool.

And is it, it's you, Robert Schock, anybody else? We have a whole team. And again, some, I want to, I don't want to say that just because everyone's involved in it, that they have to have a certain perspective. I want to just throw that out there that all the people involved in this are experts in their field and they are just bringing their expertise and we are investigating these mysteries. but it doesn't mean anyone necessarily be on board to anything. But yes, we have experts like Robert Schock.

We have Robert Edward Grant. We have archaeologists. He's a symbolologist? Polymath. We have archaeologist Hans Orheim. We have sacred geometry expert Arturo. Arturo Ponce de Leon. And we have Lidio.

Ponce de Leon. He must have changed that name. And then we have we have. We have Lydia, Lydia de Leon. So we have some really, really interesting. We also have Paul Wallace, who's a biblical expert. I don't know if you've heard of Paul Wallace. I know.

And some others that we're putting together to investigate some of these mysteries right now. Fantastic. Well, I'm super excited to see what you guys dig up. I think it's a really interesting time. It's a convergence of the world kind of waking up to a lot of this stuff, this collective amnesia, possibly, as well as just, new tech that where, you know, ideally we can sort of date these things. Absolutely. And if you want to support that, the stageof time.com, you can go to documentary

on the tab, the tab there, and we have all that information there for what we're doing. Awesome. Have you ever read a book called Forbidden Archaeology by any chance? I have. If you're familiar with it. So they talk about a lot of these, you know, like the Antic Theorem mechanism, you know, that was found on this island in Greece, you know, where it's basically you can predict. Yeah, I'm well aware of it. Planetary alignments and positions.

via this like early computer or something. Do you think that a lot of this theory that you're kind of stumbling into explains a lot of that, you know, astronomically and technologically precocious? Because they had mastered those things. And the reason why we don't find much of it is because if you have enormous amounts of time that go by with catastrophes, there's very little that can survive a civilization. and I would bring up, what would survive our civilization? Yeah.

I mean, if you think about it, wood would just rot, metal would corrode, glass would just break off and disappear and round out into what looks like, you know, quartz almost and then shatter into smaller pieces. Yeah. Things like what do we actually have that would survive? Digital records would all be gone, paper gone in 500 to 1,000 years. All we would have is getting back to what they did is the stonework from churches and chapels and things that would literally be gone.

be all that would survive us. Yep. Maybe humans are storage mechanisms. Exactly. So I think that's the thing that really needs to be iterated here is that we look at so little that's left, but really like there's quite a bit considering how much time has gone by. So many thousands of years.

And yet structures like we just pointed out, like Ionis, just remain the test of time. And their teachings survive until. we're ready to finally understand what they really mean. Fascinating, man. Well, Matt, I really appreciate your time. This was awesome. You too, Jesse. I enjoyed that conversation.

It was great. Yeah, well, I feel like we're just on the precipice of, I'd love to help in any way push this forward because I think it's like really important stuff. And I want to get to the bottom of it. If we could somehow figure out that all of this was older, there were more than what we have now and that you have still, you have consistent symbology across all these sites. You know, that's just this massive exciting. That's what we're working to do right now.

And I feel like we're at that precipice right now where that old foundation is collapsing, the sand foundation. And we're at the edge where it's going to be a tipping point where all of a sudden, once we bring out some of this good evidence and some of these new things emerging, that it's going to just shift like dominoes. Yeah. Well, look, like, I think instrumentation is really crucial for ontological understanding of truth. So it's like Galileo needed a telescope to tell us that we didn't live in a heliocentric universe.

And there's so many examples, the discovery of like bacteria in the late 19th century, you know, whatever. Electrons, you know, via, you know, microscopy or whatever. That perceptual hacking or whatever is like how we understand the true world that we're probably swimming in and living in outside of our... It's called awareness. Yeah, it's awareness. You increase your awareness of everything. So the idea that like we won't. have a profoundly different understanding of the origins of humanity near-term, even, given that

archaeology is in its modern form, only sub-200 years old, is actually, I think, involves a lot of hubris and is probably just completely wrong. You know, there's a great book called the Half-Life of Facts by a guy named Samuel Arbusman, and he talks about facts and consensus being like, almost acting like radioactive isotope decay, where like half of the facts slough off and we overturn them constantly. I see this as having a, I just want to say this and we can end out, is that I see it as being this enormous shift that all of a sudden just pivots. Yeah.

I have, I have archaeologists that email me all the time. Young guys in school, young girls in school, like wanting to, like learning about archaeology or they're new to archaeology, they're just starting out. And they're like, I want to make a difference, but I don't want to follow the old narrative. So, once it shifts, once we see that shift. and all of those listening to this, imagine what we can accomplish if we're all in the same team.

Totally. Open-minded, objective, science like it was supposed to be all along. Just the facts, look into what's there, have no biased. And that's a broad spectrum across everything. What could humanity do if we were under the lens

of like trying to better ourselves and understand who we really are? What could we unlock and achieve together? I think it's Assylla and Carybdis. And on the one hand, you have new agey magical thinking, but on the other hand, you have equally dogmatic skepticism.

And if right now we have too much skepticism, and it's this citadel, this priestly citadel of expert, you know, class or whatever that's trying to keep everybody else out. And I think there's a beauty of the internet, because the internet is more of a true marketplace of ideas than sort of legacy media. And you can see Graham Hancock debate Flint Dibble,

and then you can fact-checked Flint Dibble and realized that he got all his shipwreck data completely wrong and he lied about it. And like, it's this beautiful collective kind of Socratic process of like accessing truth that's kind of, you know, despite back doors into social media platforms a Twitter files or whatever. It's kind of hard to shut down. Like it's this. It's growing and it can't be stopped. It's this octopus. That's just growing.

You can't take it back out of the, once the box is open, right? It's like this is all opening up right now. You can't put it back. You can't put it back. It's only going to grow to a greater understanding, and eventually it's just going to tip the scales. And I encourage all archaeologists and scientists, whoever you are, free thinkers of the world, to understand that, you know, this is about to shift and just imagine what we can all accomplish together on that kind of mindset. I would love that, man. Well, let's do it.

And, okay, final question, any of these sort of ancient, you know, symbolic structures, whether it's the Ark of the Covenant, the Holy Grail, like some of these, you know, things that we've quested for for thousands of years, do you have high conviction that any of these exist? And if so, what's the thing that your highest conviction in and where do you think it's located? One of the things that may happen with this shift is during transparency. we may end up realizing that there are things that have been hidden deliberately, things that have been hidden in certain parts of the world. I'll just say this, certain ancient temples that have been dismantled

and things that have been removed. And I have found very, very compelling evidence that that has happened. Temple. Which temple? Some of the ones that we are just referring to in that region. And that there are, and other things that have been deliberately hit. And for instance, the 40,000 Qaeda form tablets at the Ashibuna Pau Library, around 150 have been translated at a 40,000. Wow.

We have to start asking about bringing together a global awareness of what has happened to all these things, where they have gone, and what maybe we can gleam from them. And so I would just say that this shift over to a new paradigm of thinking, an open-minded objective science to understand who we really are and what has happened to us in the past will also on. unlock some other secrets regarding things that had been hidden from us for a very long time. And I think the bifurcation of mythology and quote unquote history is ridiculous because a lot of the past comprised mythology and religion. And so you have, you know, Heinrich Vines Sleiman in 1871 being motivated by Thucydides and Homer. Everybody was saying that was just mythology and then he finds Troy. And then now we see Erudu-Ru-Pak? Like we just went over to this, right? Do you and Shrewpac. We're finding that out now.

You know, Plato saying, you know, at Temeus and Cretaceous, you know, at this mythos festival, saying that 9,000 years ago we fought against Atlantis, the Athenians did. And so increasingly, and then maybe that's meltwater Pulse 1B or maybe that's some other thing. We can have another conversation about that. I can bring some stuff to that next time. We can talk about it. Oh, really? Oh, yeah. Oh, interesting.

The Plato? Yeah. I think Plato has been overly, and I believe what he's saying, but I mean, I think there's even better evidence for Atlantis besides that. Well, tell me. No, you got to this is totally relevant to our conversation today. You've got to tell. Okay, I'll just, I'll say this and then we can end out.

Yeah, cool. But for instance, Plato, of course, is Socrates, his mentor was murdered and poisoned during that time period because he spoke out. Not necessarily about lost civilizations, but he just spoke out. He drank a poison. He was forced to drink hemlock. He was forced to drink hemlock. It was his choice to die. his choice of death because he had to.

It was like you can do this, this, or this. The problem was Plato was very concerned about speaking openly about things because of, again, his mentor was killed. He was devastated. Others couldn't speak out. So I think that's why he took all those things and put him into allegory. Okay. However, the thing that I think people miss is that there's another poet and philosopher called Plutarch. There's also Diodorus, but Plutarch never gets talked about.

Plutarch. I have his book. Plutarch's lives. Well, in Plutarch, he describes how there was a very specific elder priest at the Temple of Seis in Egypt named Sanchis. And he describes him in great detail. And I realize that if we look at that on paper, having an individual called out that has a name that has a standing as a certain elder priest of an actual temple that they found, and there's pictures of, brings it the whole thing out of allegory into a realism sense. Plutarch describes Sanchez in great detail as being the elder priest of the Temple of Sace, and therefore, I think, justifying that the story was not allegorical and was actually real.

Oh, interesting. So he talks about him as like a historical figure. Yeah, exactly. And was he the one that relayed that Solon? He was the one that Solon learned the entire story from Atlantis from. It is a very specific – so what I mean is – you think about something like, oh, that sounds fun. Like meeting up with hypothetical priests down in Egypt, okay? But how about Plutarch's version where he actually describes a specific individual in history

that is the elder priest of the Temple of Sasei named Sanchis, who is the one who had all the knowledge because he was the elder priest and all the other ones were supporting of him? Oh, why does nobody bring that up? That's wild. That's what I think too. And we know that Sontius went to Egypt? No, Sanchis was the elder priest of the Temple of Sase that Solon went down to meet. and that's who told him the entire story of Atlantis.

And ancient Athenians. So Solon never went directly to Egypt. Santius. No, no, no, no, no. Solon learned the story from Sanchez. Ah. He was the elder priest of the Temple of Seis of these other priests. So when Plato talks about it in like a hyperfet...

Did Santius go to Egypt, though? Or, like, was this... Sanchez is the elder priest of the Temple of Seis. So I get that. Temple of Seis is Egypt. Oh, that's in Egypt. Okay, got it. See what I'm saying?

Got it. So it's no longer a hypothetical place that Solon goes to to find out a story. Wild. It's a very specific place that was, number one, verified. And number two, now we have an historical figure who was the elder priest that knew all the knowledge and talked about how that literally was the purpose of the Temple of Sase was to be a record-keeping location for ancient history. We know that.

And it was destroyed at some point within the next 500 years to 1,000 years, it didn't exist and we never saw it again. Have we dug it up at all? No, no, it was like wiped out and just disappeared in history. The Temple of Sixth. We have paintings made from it from descriptions of those who saw it. How do we know that it was this historical record-keeping place? Because Plutarch goes into details of talking about Sanchez as being the elder priest of that entire temple

who was basically giving descriptions of it in a way that Plato doesn't even do. That's wild. Yeah, it's like another layer to it if people want to go down as Plutarch. Fascinating. Well, there you get. hidden between the lines a little bit if you're paying attention. I love it. Mystery continues.

Well, Matt, really appreciate it, man. This is a wild. You too, Jesse. That was a great conversation. Yeah, learned so much. Yeah. To be continued. To be continued, my friend.

Awesome, man. Cool. Well, thanks so much. And if you want to see my work, my YouTube channel is Matthew LaCroix. My Instagram is The Stage of Time and my website is the stage of time. Go check it out. Subscribe, like, and yeah, watch all your awesome videos. and yeah, I hope, you know, a lot of people come out and support you because I think you're doing really important work.

And sometimes work like this, you know, is not, it's an ex, it's, lies external to our, you know, capitalist system or whatever. Right. But it's like extremely important. Yeah, I agree. And, you know, Carnegie Gospel of Wealth sense, it should be like where the excess proceeds, you know, flow directly to immediately. Like, it should be the first place we fund is these, our understanding. of ourselves and that should inform our culture and everything. We'll get there, Jesse.

I appreciate it. It was a great conversation. Thanks, my friend. Awesome, man.