American History Hit - Jamestown: The Journey To America

Episode Date: February 3, 2025

In May 1607, over 100 English settlers arrived at Chesapeake Bay on the East Coast of North America. Traveling 50 miles inland along the James River, they established what would become the first permanent English settlement: Jamestown. But what motivated their journey? Why was Chesapeake Bay their chosen destination? And how much do we know about their voyage.For this first of four episodes, Don is joined by Mark Summers, Educational Director of Youth and Public Programmes for Jamestowne Rediscovery. Don and Mark explore the roles of the Virginia Company, the British crown and individuals like Captains John Smith and Christopher Newport. From mutiny at sea to sealed instructions, this is the first step in a journey that echoes to this day.Produced and edited by Sophie Gee. Senior Producer was Charlotte Long.Sign up to History Hit for hundreds of hours of original documentaries, with a new release every week and ad-free podcasts. Sign up at https://www.historyhit.com/subscribe.  You can take part in our listener survey here.American History Hit is a History Hit podcast.All music from Epidemic Sounds. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Want to explore even more history? Sign up to History Hit, where you will discover history from around the world. From the American Revolution to prehistoric Scotland, there is plenty to discover. With your subscription, you'll unlock hundreds of hours of exclusive documentaries with a brand new release every week, exploring everything from the ancient world to World War II. Just visit historyhit.com slash subscribe to bring the past alive. Three ships sit motionless in the waters of black wall docks in London. Shielded from the Thames fierce winds by the horseshoe bend in this stretch of the river,

the vessels are utterly still in waters spattered by an insistent wintry sleet. Any reflections that might otherwise be shimmering on the currents are only broken shadows on the dark dappled water. It is morning in December 1606. The cruise of the Susan's... The Susan Constant, the Godspeed, and the Discovery are readying their ships to be boarded. The sailors on the Godspeed and discovery cast envious glances at the Susan Constant, a ship twice the size of their own. But together, in just a few days, these vessels will embark westward, into the unknown, crossing the wide Atlantic.

Blackwall, the Thames' greatest shipyard, has awakened. Local men leave their homes nearby and head for the docks. Others who've traveled to. distances shuffle out of ends. All of them, voyagers awaiting transport to the ships, mulling about busy wars and alleyways. It's all a far cry from the long, lonely months ahead for them. 100 men who will very soon have only the ocean and each other for company. Welcome to American History Hit. I'm Don Wildman, and it's great to have you aboard. 1606, London, King James the 6th of Scotland, the first of England and Ireland, sits on the throne. It is the year the Dutchmaster Rembrandt is born.

Fashion favours high waistlines, full sleeves, and tall, brimmed hats for both men and women. Shakespeare's Macbeth will premiere this year, and later on December 26th, King Lear will make its recorded debut at Whitehall Palace. In April of this year, the Virginia Company receives its charter to colonize a portion of North America's eastern coast. By this time, of course, the Spanish have already established their presence to the South for a hundred years. The Portuguese have made landings in what will become Canada and across South America. The British, too, have ventured across the Atlantic to Newfoundland and the ill-fated colony of Roanoke off the coast of today's North Carolina. Now they will attempt colonization once again, but this time determined to make it stick. I am joined in this episode by Mark Summers, educational director of youth and public programs from Jamestown Rediscovery.

Together we will travel to London to uncover the story behind this expedition, who backed it, who boarded the ships, and why Jamestown, this specific spot on the North American eastern shore was chosen. Mark Summers, welcome to American history. History hit. Nice to meet you. Well, it's pleased to be here. Enjoy your show. Mark, where we begin this conversation about Jamestown is really back in England and, in a broader sense in Europe. This is the tail end of the age of discovery. I mean, you've got Spain in South America, Portugal's been around. Even the Dutch are doing their own beginnings of things. Why is England so far behind at this point in this endeavor? Certainly. I mean, I sometimes refer to England at the eve of 1607 as the sun has not yet risen under Bradenstown.

empire. Yes. We have a situation where England is rather second rate compared to their rivals. Of course, Spain and Portugal, as you mentioned, the Dutch are getting involved. France is a far wealthier country. And England is in Northern Europe, having failed, depending on how you count them, seven to nine times before Jamestown, including the famous lost colony of Roanoke to establish a colony. It's embarrassing. There is resource issues. We have a lot of poverty in England, a lot of, you know, Land enclosures. Trying to sum up two, three hundred years of English economics, but obviously there's a lot of problems going on. And I think, you know, we're breaking down what a colony is, you know, in simplest terms, it's a way for a country to make money, taking resources away

from another. And England is a resource poor country compared to others. Yeah, they are heading for bad times. Civil war and all the rest is going on over there. Nonetheless, they are prompted to do this. For what reason? What does get them into the race? There's multiple motivations. I I could argue that if we were to do a pyramid of English society, a good deal of the population, over 90 to 98% are poor. But there is two groups of people who are well to do, the nobility who owns almost the entire country. But this rising, you know, in history, it's a cliche to say the middle class is always rising. But there is a business community in London and other poor communities that is doing quite well and sees America as an investment opportunity. Yeah, I mean, we think of colonization on this side as this.

really glowing, righteous thing because we got here for that reason, the pilgrims and all the rest. But it was a largely money-driven endeavor. I mean, these were companies that were being formed in order to exploit resources in these new lands, this new world, especially gold for the Spanish. And that word had gotten around, obviously. This was an amazing thing that Spain had accomplished by doing what they did in South America. England wants their piece of the action. Yeah, I sometimes tell the public, it's shockingly disappointing. everybody wants this idealistic founding of what becomes the United States. But it really was created as we know it in a boardroom in London with a bunch of rich guys who wanted

to get richer. Now, they're wearing lace collars and poofy pants, so it's the 1600s. But the business and economic interests are actually shockingly like today. Right. What is the Virginia company? Because that's who's going to be heading over to Virginia. Correct. So this has already been done in England before, the Muscovy Company investing in Russia and other places. It is before they use the word capitalism. You have a business community. They're already wealthy. They're going to get wealthier. And what makes the Dutch and English different than their continental neighbors is the idea of using the business class to fund these colonies. It's like space travel. I mean, without mentioning names, there are at least three corporations a day that are

investing in outer space. It's actually very similar. This is their version of going outer space. It's very expensive. It's very dangerous. It needs a lot of capital to get off the ground. And don't bother to ask King James for any money. Right. And let's get the notes of the monarchy straight. So we had Queen Elizabeth. She is succeeded by James I, who is also James the 6th of Scotland, right? Well, there's a couple of things going on geopolitically. First of all, Elizabeth, the Virgin Queen dies without children, so we get our name, Virginia from her four years before James said in 1603. Now most kings and queens in Europe are cousins. It's not too hard to find someone who can take over. But getting Scotland and England to join their monarchies before they join their parliaments means you keep Scotland from being

an enemy and you bring them into the fold. So you have this Scottish king who's relatively poor, very intelligent. He likes to write about religion and politics. He would love the internet today. He'd be typing away on Reddit or something, but he has a reputation of being cash poor and disagreeable. So, you know, if you're the king of Scotland, you're now the king of England, you've watched England fail multiple times to start a colony. So he's not going to fund this, but he needs to give his permission. So when you're talking about the Virginia company of London, officially the book answer is there are a joint stock company, but to cut to the chase, it's a corporation. Already wealthy people, they're investing their money, but you cannot leave England without

the King's permission. If you do so, you forfeit your assets, your family can get in trouble. So they have to get a charter, a permission slip, a contract, written by the King's lawyers. So the first charter of Jamestown was given in 1606. Right. And spoil alert, it's to be called Jamestown for that reason. Correct. So, yeah, so I will say that technically it's a charter for Virginia, and this is a little in the weeds, but there were two different Virginia companies. There was a branch in London that was supposed to go to the southern part of Virginia, what he now called Virginia. And it was a lesser-known northern branch out of Plymouth, England, the West Country, that attempted to settle what is now

Maine and didn't even last a year. But we'll focus on the, what they call the Virginia Company of London, and they are focused on the 38th to 41st parallel. So basically, New York City to South Carolina, shooting for the Chesapeake Bay, looking for resources. And at the time, of course, we have Florida, which is belonging to the Spanish. We have the Spanish big time down further south from there. The French are up north. How is it that this big chunk of the eastern seaboard of North America is available for colonization? Well, it had already been claimed as early as 1497.

So Giovanni Kabati, the English column John Cabot. They claimed Newfoundland back in 1497. Now there's this big gap between 1497 and 1607, and that's because him or the 8th spent most of his resources, not exploiting America, but trying to recapture France and failed to do so. So it's now a couple of generations later. There's been a few, of course, earlier attempts that all failed. The Spanish still claimed Virginia as Florida del Norte. So that's a fear the English have. So this will play into when we get into some of the instructions the colonists get when they actually get here.

But the charter spells out where you can go. The other thing the charter does, a couple other things, is it grants the people from England the rights of English when they get here. So no one's going to leave England if they don't have the English rights. But actually, the document is somewhat humorous. You can tell it's written by lawyers because the king isn't investing any money. He's not risking anything. You can't sue him or blame if anything goes wrong. He's not going to age you if you get caught by the Spanish.

But he requires 20% of the profit if you find gold and silver or precious minerals. Okay. And that's why I'm investing. I'm expecting to get gold and silver, or at least the payments for that. I'm letting you go, but I get to benefit and nothing goes wrong. It's going to be tied to me. Very, very, very slick. And how do they do the nuts and bolts of this thing?

How do they find the sailors and all that? Well, obviously, there's a long recruiting period. And one of the things, you know, we could get bogged down into, but they have a difficult time getting people willing to rent their ships. We like to give these ships, these names and think they're these glorious things, you know, the Susan Constant, or in Massachusetts, the Mayflower. but they're no different than a cargo plane. You don't remember the name of the plane you were last on.

It drops people off and it goes back on other missions. So part of it is a lot of merchants aren't necessarily going to want to rent their ships out for this potentially dangerous voyage. Yes, they're going to recruit sailors and common people, but almost half a colonists are younger sons of gentlemen. Cash poor, people who grew up privileged because their families can afford the ticket. And the Virginia company doesn't have to put up all the money. This company is trying to do things as cheap as possible. And it's going to cause problems when they get here. Interesting.

Obviously, their water route to the Pacific is the essential goal here, right? It's a, it is a goal. I mean, there's a lot of things to cover it. One of the things they were supposed to find was a northwest flowing river because assuming they could get a shortcut or what they call the northwest passes to China. They say cathay, but that's what they mean. That's certainly a goal. Precious minerals.

I mean, they look at a map and I say, well, you know, Virginia and Spain are kind of parallel. The climate should be the same. there should be all these precious minerals here. We just got to get out there and establish essentially what we would call a beachhead. Right. And it makes sense. You know, we kind of roll our eyes and make fun of these people, mistaking it for India and all the rest of it. But when you see the Chesapeake Bay, it's a huge piece of water even today.

And you can only imagine somebody sailing in one of those tiny little ships saying, okay, good, this is the way to India. It's right here. And no wonder they would head off that way. Who are going to captain these ships? Well, they managed to get a very experienced mariner to be the Admiral, the fleet. So they get three ships. His name is Christopher Newport. And he had experiences as a private tier. So obviously they know they're going to be going to be going to be

question. They're going to try to take the same route pioneered by Columbus, which is to be pushed, the way hurricanes form pushed up from Africa towards the Caribbean. So they want somebody knows how to fight. He'd already lost his arm to Spanish chain shot. So he'd been experienced. Gosnold is one of the captains of the ships, Bartholomew Gosnold. He'd actually been to America earlier in one of those failed colonies, Cape Cod. Martha's Vineyard. That's him. And the other one is John Rackleff, a shady fellow living under an alias, John Sicklemore,

that we know very little about. Well, those are your three captains. My guess is they were picked because of their military and sailing experience. So the Susan Constant is the flagship. It's a merchant ship. Christopher Newport is the Admiral and the captain of the ship. Bartholomew Gossnell is the captain of a medium-sized ship called the Godspeed.

He had been to America before. and John Rackcliffe is in charge of a small ship, a pennant, which is going to be the one of the three ships left behind because it's small enough for bay voyages. That's John Rackcliffe that's actually captain. And again, he's the one we know the least about, a very mysterious fellow. Do they always go in threes, these famous voices? Seems like it. It does seem like it. I mean, you will see later fleets of Jameson. Well, they have five, six, seven, up to nine ships.

But this particular one, my guess is it's just coincidence, but it's also probably the amount of ships that they can actually get a hold of. Yeah, and I'm sure there's how much supplies do they need, et cetera, et cetera. I'll be right back after this short break. Meantime, if you'd like us to cover anything specifically, if you have any ideas of subject matter, we should be looking at, send us an email at ah-h at history hit.com. We'd love to hear from you. So I want to get a little nautically in the weeds here.

How do they choose the time of year to go? How much strategy did they understand about what they were doing? I do think there's this idea of trying to leave in December. Ideally, the journey should take, you know, over six weeks. It takes a lot longer. So they left in December 1606. They didn't get here to April 1607 because they spent several weeks with Contrae wins in the English Channel. So they're not really leaving as early as possible.

So they're delayed. And, of course, these delays eat into the supplies and is going to cause, you know, problems on board the ships. I will state, too, that they only rounded up 105 people out of a country of 4 million, 98% of whom were poor. think the silence of most English people is telling you most average Joe's don't think this is a good idea. Interesting. And they would have seen ads for this in the broadsides. I mean, how is this even Oh, there are times when they put up posters around London. In some cases, they don't even have words on them. They just show these nice, breezy ships. I kind of jokingly refer to them as bad timesure ads. I mean, this is a company wanting to make money, cheap as possible, trying to get people

to go when there's already a track record that people know in the street, hey, this isn't always going to work out. So let me be clear. Let me summarize. This corporation has organized itself for a departure at the end of 1606. They understand that they are looking for this North Earth passage, but they're going to be happy if they create a colony that finds gold, ideally, silver, of course, but also, you know, farms things and sends it back to England, right?

All these things are gold. They're all in the charter. it's a matter of what can we do to make money. And the reason why the Spanish, who are the I call Elefonte in the room, the Spanish have already been into Chesapeake earlier. They got here as early as 1535, and they didn't find any gold and silver.

So they suspected any English colony in the Chesapeake will be used for piracy purposes. So that's another thing going on here. That rival with Spain, the English have been picking off Spanish convoy. So there's always that aspect, too. There's a lot of things. There's a military aspect.

there's a political one, there's a financial one, there's also a religious component, since they're a Protestant and the span is Catholic and they both think the world's apocalyptic. All these are issues. Yeah, and it hadn't been too long before that Roanoke did not do well. Correct. How many years between this and Roanoke? It's a good 25 years. Okay, but that is now a fable in the streets of London. This was a big mystery, how that even happened and all the stories are not good in terms of success at this point. Right, and there's even lesser known colonies that failed. I mean, most of these colonies, they don't disappear. They don't do anything mysterious. They simply run out of money or the people rebel and they leave.

So this is definitely a country who's just not won yet at this game. So they have to first head for the Caribbean and then head north. They get pushed up, right. Yeah, exactly. Are they heading for what is eventually named the James River? Yeah, they definitely, well, they're heading for the Chesapeake Bay. They already know of it. During the Roanoke colony, there was an attempt.

Some of the Roanoke colonists explored what is now the city of Virginia Beach. in the Chesapeake Bay. So they were aware that there was all these water, deep rivers, and they should head there. In fact, I think one of the Roanoke voyages was supposed to go there anyway, but their pilot dropped them off in North Carolina. So they'd already known decades earlier to shoot for that area. They saw it as strategic, the English, the Spanish, the Dutch, the Native Americans, today, the United States military.

The Chesapeake Bay already had a reputation of being very financially and militarily strategic. Sure. I mean, and that's important. You've got Spain not too far away, so they have to be prepared for attack, really. Correct. This will lead into the instructions to the colonists, too. The charter mainly spells out the financial and big picture goals. But when they actually land in Virginia in April, they don't go to Jamestown right away.

They land 60 miles to the east next to the ocean and what's now called the city of Virginia Beach, Cape Henry. They named it for the Prince. And they actually opened up instructions. And these instructions were not to be. read until they landed. It spelled out who was in charge. They didn't want to open those instructions in London because if your name wasn't on the list of leaders, you might have quit. And it actually spelled out some rules. And one of the things that shows you the strategy is in the instructions. The first rule they had to follow was to not see next to the ocean. They didn't

want to be killed by the Spanish. They referenced this earlier French colony in Florida called Fort Caroline that was wiped out by the Spanish. So sail inland. They're supposed to go 100 miles inland. They don't go that far. But that was one of the first things, northwest flowing deep river for shipping purposes, and to find the land where they didn't see what they called naturals or Native Americans. So they definitely have a fear of the locals, a fear of the Spanish, and also recognizing the instructions, try not to make the same mistakes that other colonies made before you. Like die. Die. Die, disappear, get blown up. Yes. Real fierce. And this is how they end up 50 miles up the river. Correct. And find what is essentially a peninsula or, or, or

or an island. It's confusing because today because of erosion it is an island, so you'll hear people call it Jamestown Island, but it was actually a peninsula. At high tide, it temporarily became an island. What they're looking for is they have a river channel, which is still there today, it's 35 feet deep. So they can test the waters and know it's deep. They were supposed to find high ground, and that's kind of laughable because our part of Virginia is very flat. But there's a big hill where they build the fort, well, they will build the fort. And the other thing, it's far enough away where they feel like they can't be caught by the Spanish, and they don't see any Native Americans living there.

So to them, it checks all the boxes. And I always like to remind folks, well, if it looks too good to be true. That sure is. So to review, we've got 104 settlers coming in. They arrive. All these people are men, right? Right.

They didn't bring women and children. There's four teenage boys, but these are all over 13. So that's considered more adult than today. All men. No, they did have women. Women in children at Roanoke. And now this is just conjecture on my part,

but perhaps losing so many civilians in the Roanoke colony meant that this time they're going to mostly focus on soldiers and laborers. I liken it to the civilian space program was cut after the Challenger in 1986. I feel like a similar thing might be going on here. Bring the women later. Right. Too dangerous. I suppose they've all been interviewed and they're all useful employees of the company.

Yeah, there's a lot not written on this. that what we can conjecture on based on where most of the colonists were from. We do know where these men were from, is there's three what I'll call circles of recruitment. Nearly half come from London, so they're recruiting people from the city. Most of your laborers are coming from there. There's a chunk coming from Lincolnshire in the East Midlands, but that's where John Smith is from. So he must be the mover behind that. And there's a bunch from what's called East Anglia, Norfolk, Suffolk, where Gosnold is from.

So it seems to be that some of the major players are actually responsible. responsible for recruiting people and they're recruiting the servants, the other gentlemen, and labors from their local regions. But almost every colonist is from those three places. Had this been a horrendous voyage? I mean, this always just boggles the mind to think of these people heading off for their first time on the ocean, never mind crossing it, something I will never do in my lifetime. It's just astonishing.

It's horrific. I mean, you're jamming, you know, I work with children and I will tell you, I mean, what's not taught that they've been school is that you're stuck. I mean, these are people who wouldn't want to be stuck on a bus or a plane or a car from war in three or four hours. You're talking a three and a half month journey stuck in these ships. It's going to smell bad. People are going to bump into you. How many times can you play the same card game? How many times can you hear the same guy tell jokes? I'm sure these things they don't write down. We do know there's a bit of a mutiny on board with John Smith. Yeah, tell me about that. Well, he's actually arrested by Captain Newport

on the charges of a forming mutiny. My guess is he's just a, telling people, they're taking us the wrong place, it's taking too long, they're not the right people in charge. It just to me, rather than getting too into what we don't know, it seems to me there's obviously a lot of stress, there's a lot of sea sickness, there's a lot of anger, which I think would occur even today when you put a lot of people of different backgrounds in tight spaces for too long a journey. And in those days, you're a tiny ship on a big ocean. You go backwards at times, sideways at times. I mean, finding the path is a confusing and difficult thing. That's why it takes so long. And so you can only imagine from day to day how much argument there was,

you know, about where the hell are we, you know, let alone is our food going to last? And my child is sick or whoever, you know, I'm talking the other voyages. So the mutiny happens in the middle of the ocean. Yeah, from what I can tell, I think it's sort of John Smith must be talking a little too much. And he is, we'll get into him a little bit, but he is a soldier of fortune, a self-made man, somebody that many Americans admire because he seems so American. but he is somebody who's pulled himself up from a lower rank in society being given a high position that has a high opinion of himself. So he will talk.

And he is seen as obnoxious to the leadership. So there's obviously must be some tension. And they do stop in several islands, for example. But clearly the long voyage, the chain of command not being understood. Because remember, other than Captain Newport, nobody knew what their position was in the colony until they landed and read the instructions. So there's obviously some political jockeying going on too. So, Mark, were journals kept on this voyage?

Do we know the details of their experience? We have a couple of written accounts. They're written after the fact. John Smith writes a version of the voyage, and so does his arch enemy George Percy. And these are from two different social classes. They do agree on the route of the journey. They don't agree on the numbers of people.

We presume it's 104 based on counting the people whose names we know. It could have been more. They use this phrase a lot, diverse others. So always catch that when you're looking at a ship's record. There's unnamed people. But nevertheless, I think based on the size of the ships, that's about right. Again, they kind of both reference some tension on board. They reference the length of the journey.

They reference the storm. They reference, you know, kind of fine, which I speak by accident. And everyone kind of is awestruck at the trees and the landscape. And they refer to Virginia as kind of a Garden of Eden. It's a very different experience than what they're coming from. England. So they arrive somehow, some way, April 26, 1607. A holy day for these people, I'm sure, when they somehow find their way pretty close, right? Right. They actually found the Chisbee Bay somewhat by accident. They got pushed into the Bay by a storm. So I'm sure they see this

is providential. The very first thing they do when they land is the minister actually offers a prayer. They erect a large cross. You know, they claim the land in the name of their king and they unload their supplies and then to read the instructions. And it lists Captain John Smith as one of the actual leaders of the colony while he's due to be executed for mutiny. So that's one of those snatch from the jaws of death. Yeah, right. Big relief for that, ma'am. They finally land on what will become Jamestown, the island, May 14th, 1607, as we said, after searching up river to sort of qualify for all the criteria there. At that point, we are on our way to a successful colony. Everything easy, right? right see this is what they assume and then right away it goes wrong one of the things you have to

keep in mind is although they're supposed to build a fort they don't do so right away and you know there's lots of reasons one that stated is when they or landed the actual president or the head of the council's the guy named everett maria wingfield he's an aristocrat he sounds like an aristocrat he was the only investor who showed up in the first voyage so he got to be the boss now he had some military experience. He had connections, but he doesn't want to build a fort right away. He feels like it will intimidate the local Native American people. The other thing is, I also have to assume that these people are also very tired after this long journey. They're spending all this time, you know, pushing big barrels and unloading crates and chopping down trees and putting up tents.

So that takes a while. And I think, you know, fatigue is a factor as well. Had they lost anybody on this voyage? So they do have originally 105. There's a guy called Edward Brooke who dies not at sea, on one of the islands. The best way to say it, as they said, is fat melted within his armor. So my guess is he had heat stroke. Oh, wow. He was an older man. He had been in the Caribbean.

He was probably wearing armor, wool clothing. He dies of heat stroke. But to land 104, 105 is a testament to the one thing in the English are very good at doing is sailing. That's right. This is not their problem. You can only imagine. I mean, that's another thing to sort of take yourself out of your modern day view and realize at that time, these lands have not been forested.

These are gigantic trees. These are old primeval forests and beautiful, incredible wild lands for people who had come from a place that had been completely forested. Like there was none of that going on in England for a thousand years. And so this is really important to keep in mind how awestruck they would have been. Explain when they first get off that ship. How are they going to face the task at hand, which is we got to make a home here? That's a great question because I'm not sure. a lot of doubt creeps in when they land.

They have to have the memories of failed colonies. Of course, they're being given advice. Don't make the same mistakes, but they're all struck by the land, by the size of the rivers. They just don't see this kind of water. When you go to the Chesapeake Bay, I think even today,

you know, they're referencing an area today where we have the United States Atlantic Fleet is there. I mean, this is an enormous waterway. It makes sense, even today when you go there, well, perhaps the Pacific Ocean isn't far away. The very, as you said, size of the trees, the land itself, the flocks of birds that would cover the sky. We just haven't seen that in hundreds of years. They refer to it as this wonderful place.

But I think in a way, there's a sort of fear and danger that creeps in that wonder. How are we going to do this? How are we going to get to work? How do you find gold and silver? Where is it? How are you going to make a profit here? So all these wonderful plans, now you get here, and who got to be the boss and who didn't? And, of course, there were people disappointed that they weren't on the list.

You see, what I think is very important here is, although, yes, they should be focused on the task at hand, political infighting is actually going to rear its head very quickly. And they will be resisted very quickly by the rules. For having, you know, in their minds, fortunately chosen a place where the naturals, as you call them, the native population isn't existing. Boy, is it ever. And it's not very far away and they are watching. Thank you so much, Mark.

Mark Summers is the educational director of youth and public programs for Jamestown Rediscovery. What is Jamestown Rediscovery, Mark? It's the name of the archaeological team that takes curators, historians, and scientists and archaeologists to work together to find the historical records, but also the physical evidence of Jamestown. So it's a fun team to be a part of. This is a gigantic day if one did spend a day there because there's so much to see in this place, isn't there? There's so many things. There's lots of artifacts you can see. see during the warmer months you can watch archaeologists find things that we usually do about

two tours a day historical archaeological we have so many different interests if you're more scientific more historical political whatever size you're on whoever you are you existed 400 years ago here and that's why it's a good place to begin your American journey what's the website www.w.w.jamestown with an e on the end of it dot org there you go check it out folks thanks mark i appreciate it thank you so much Hey, thanks for listening to today's episode of American History Hit. Check back in a week's time for the next installment of this special Jamestown series. The meantime, have a gander at our back catalog.

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