American Thought Leaders - Shocking Number of Excess Deaths, Disabilities, and Injuries Revealed: Edward Dowd

Episode Date: April 29, 2024

Sponsor special: Up to $2,500 of FREE silver AND a FREE safe on qualifying orders - Call 855-862-3377 or text “AMERICAN” to 6-5-5-3-2“Every regulator, every health authority, every government should be screaming from the top of their lungs: ‘This is a problem. This is a national [and] global crisis. We should look into it.’ But there’s silence on it, and I believe they’re silent because they know the answer.”Edward Dowd was a Wall Street executive working as a growth portfolio manager for BlackRock. Utilizing his skills in recognizing fraud and interpreting statistics, he started compiling and analyzing data on injury and death associated with the COVID-19 genetic vaccines.“We applied what we did in finance to what we’re seeing in the populations across the globe in disability. So, we’re just measuring using our statistical tools to figure out when trends change. We saw excess death trend up in ‘21 and ‘22 and ‘23, and disabilities just really take off in ‘21,” says Mr. Dowd.He recently testified in the Senate about his findings, which are documented in his book, ‘“Cause Unknown:” The Epidemic of Sudden Deaths in 2021 & 2022.’“If you look at the the stock prices of Pfizer and Moderna ... they’re at critical junctures in their technical stock prices,” says Mr. Dowd. “In fact, Pfizer, I think, is now below its pre-COVID price.”How have the number of excess deaths and disabilities changed given the low booster uptake in America today? What about in other countries?“The booster uptake in the U.S. is quite low now. So, the good news is there seems to be a declining trend in excess mortality—not [in] disability so much, unfortunately,” says Mr. Dowd.Views expressed in this video are opinions of the host and the guest, and do not necessarily reflect the views of The Epoch Times.

Every regulator, every health authority, every government should be screaming from the top of their lungs, this is a problem, this is a national, global crisis, we should look into it. But there's silence on it, and I believe there's silence because I know the answer. Edward Dowd was a Wall Street executive working as a growth portfolio manager for BlackRock. Having the skills to recognize fraud and interpret statistics, he started compiling and analyzing data on injury and death associated with the COVID-19 genetic vaccines. We applied what we did in finance to what we're seeing in the populations across the globe.

So we're just measuring using our statistical tools to figure out when trends change. We saw excess death trend up in 21 and 22 and 23, and disabilities just really take off in 21. Edward Dowd recently testified in the Senate about his findings, which are documented in the book Cause Unknown, The Epidemic of Sudden Deaths in 2021 and 2022. If you look at the stock prices of Pfizer and Moderna, they're at critical junctures in their technical stock prices. In fact, Pfizer, I think, is now below its pre-COVID price.

This is American Thought Leaders, and I'm Jan Jekielek. Before we start, I'd like to take a moment to thank the sponsor of our podcast, American Hartford Gold. As you all know, inflation is getting worse. The Fed raised rates for the fifth time this year. And Fed Chairman Jerome Powell is telling Americans to brace themselves for potentially more pain ahead. But there is one way to hedge against inflation. American Hartford Gold makes it simple and easy to diversify your savings and retirement accounts with physical gold and silver. With

one short phone call, they can have physical gold and silver delivered right to your door or inside your IRA or 401k. American Hartford Gold is one of the highest rated firms in the country, with an A-plus rating with a Better Business Bureau and thousands of satisfied clients. If you call them right now, they'll give you up to $2,500 of free silver and a free safe on qualifying orders. Call 855-862-3377, that's 855-862-3377, or text AMERICAN to 65532. Again, that's 855-862-3377, or text AMERICAN to 65532. Edward Dowd, such a pleasure to have you back on American Thought Leaders. Jan, great to be here. Thank you.

So you were on the show about a year and a half ago, and we talked about some astonishing data that you'd put together around the rise in excess mortality and a number of other related issues. You were just recently testifying in Congress. What's the bottom line of what you've found now? The bottom line is this. There was a tremendous amount of excess deaths that really peaked in 2021 and started coming down again in 22 and 23.

But the excess death toll since the vaccination rollout is about 1.1 million Americans excessively died. 300,000 of those were between the ages of 15 and 64. And that compares to 2020, where 458,000 people died. And that was mostly older Americans. Only 27% were between the ages of 15 and 64, and that shifted in 2021 to about 47%. In fact, the absolute number was 124,000 in 2020

between the ages of 15 and 64, and that went up to 215,000, a 74% increase from 2020 to 2021. and that's striking to me because we were told the virus mostly killed older Americans with comorbidities so why then was there a mix shift in 2021 because an equal amount of Americans died excessively each year but we then shifted to about almost half of those Americans being a working age. Yeah, and of course, we would be expecting that these people would be protected in 2021, 2022, and years onwards.

If I was to measure the effectiveness of the vaccine just based on that alone, that's an epic fail. We know that these vaccine products, they do cause injury. They cause it more often than many past vaccines have in the past. We don't know the exact numbers. There's been some attempts to estimate this. But there's also this effect from 2020 of the lockdowns themselves. For example, cancer is not being screened because people didn't go to the hospital to get their regular screenings. There's all these sort of effects that you would actually expect to start manifesting

later. I'm wondering if you've thought about, included that in your analysis. Well, so we started as time rolled on, we got access to more data and we did some studies in the UK where we examined excess cancer deaths between ages 15 and 44. And what we found is in 2020, there was no signal, meaning versus the expected trend line, there was actually a slight decrease in 2020 in cancer between 15 and 44. Then in 2021, there was a rise.

And then in 2022, an even greater rise. The standard deviation that was signal was 16 times so 16 16 standard deviation just to give your audience an idea what a three standard deviation event is that happens point uh three percent of the time a 3.8 standard deviation event is the chance of lightning hitting you at least once in your lifetime and the further up you go the more improbable it becomes and on wall street and in medicine and science, when you get 16 standard deviations above trend, we call that a signal.

So there's a signal of cancer that started after 2020 in the UK. We're going to be releasing fairly shortly a similar study done in the US using CDC data. And we'll talk about that once we release it. And we're finding it's corroborating what we saw in the UK especially amongst younger age people where cancers are not supposed to happen. There's things that happened in 2020 by

people being basically you know the economy being shut down the way people behaved changed dramatically and there's all these different new variables that were introduced in the process right and and some of those will only manifest maybe a year later, maybe two years later, maybe three, maybe longer. We don't know. I don't know exactly. I'd have to go through it in some detail. And I'm wondering, is there a way?

And we know there's some effect of these shots, for sure. We know that. I think that's been demonstrated for sure. The question is, is there a way to tease those things apart in the methodology which you're using? DAVID FREEMAN, Well, so we do agree at Finance Technologies that I'm a co-founder of the firm and the research we do on the vaccines.

We do agree there are co-factors. And not necessarily every excess death is attributable to the vaccine. But there's enough evidence to suggest that a lot of the damage we saw is correlated to the vaccine. Excess deaths is just one small part of the equation. There's three categories we're tracking, excess deaths, disabilities, and injuries. And disabilities are in far greater population numbers and easier to analyze. And in 2020, there were no excess disabilities. Disabilities started to rise starting around February of 2021. And if we ran the correlation

versus the vaccine uptake in the U.S., it was 0.92. Now, they'll say correlation is not causation, but at the very least, and as I said in my testimony today, to prove it's not the vaccine, we need to undertake studies of vaccinated versus unvaccinated. And the mere fact that the authorities have no interest in that or are boasting about the pandemic scorecard, which is quite grim. I told you that about 500,000 people died in 2021. Total excess deaths as of the end of 2023 are 1.1 million. Total of 300,000 ages 15 to 64 and about 800,000 of 65 plus. And just to be clear, are there any of those attributable to COVID itself,

or is this outside of that? That's just excess above trend line. So obviously, like I said, there's some co-factors, but we think the vaccine is the majority of what we're seeing in excess deaths. Clearly, there are co-factors, lockdowns, maybe a slight increase in suicides, maybe some fentanyl, maybe some COVID, but not the numbers we're seeing that seem mysteriously to be correlated with the vaccination program, especially in disabilities.

There were no disability increases in 2020. JOHN MCWHORTER- How is that defined, a disability? It's like a sudden? DAVID SHULTZ- So this is the Bureau of Labor Statistics. This is a household survey that's done every month. It's the same folks who deliver the employment numbers. So they also, in the survey, ask you, are you disabled? And if so, are you unable to work? And those numbers were running around 29 to 30 million the prior five years.

They started to rise at a 45 degree angle beginning of February of 2021. And now we have about 34 million disabled Americans. So we gained about 4 million disabled Americans in a very short period of time. And the rate of change that took off in 21 correlated with the vaccine uptake was a three standard deviation event meaning the rate of change was so out of the norm. It was more than three.

It was about four standard deviations above the trend in 2021. Now the good news is the rate of change was so out of the norm. It was more than three, it was about four standard deviations above the trend in 2021. Now the good news is the rate of growth in disabilities has slowed, but we did have a step function up in June of 2023. We added another million. So it rose into September of 2022, about 3 million, went sideways for several months,

but then jumped up again, about a million. It's come back down since, but it's still showing that the trend's not broken. I understand when looking at, you know, trying to establish causation, right? If you, for example, I've seen some studies that I didn't fully, I guess, accept when I saw them first, but there was this idea that the moment that the next booster is introduced, right, there's another jump in excess death or something. We need very fine grain data to see this sort of thing, right? And if you see the effect is introduced and you see a jump in, for example, excess death or disability or something like that, and then it happens again,

and then you see that same jump, and it happens again, and you see that same jump, that is one of the steps that can be used to establish causation in a situation where you're looking at correlations. So have you seen any of that? Yeah, so at our firm and on our website, we've tracked many different countries, excess mortality, UK, all of Europe, Australia, Ireland, Germany, not Canada because their death data seems to be lagging quite a bit, but we've seen in country after country where exit deaths occurred it was it was very well correlated to vaccination uptake. So there seems to be a pattern. Let's put aside the fact that it is the

vaccine because that's controversial. Every regulator, every health authority, every government should be screaming from the top of their lungs, this is a problem, this is a national global crisis, we should look into it. But there's silence on it, and I believe there's silence because they know the answer. So I just want to highlight how unusual these sorts of jumps in both access to disability and your third factor are? JOHN MCCUTCHAN- Yeah, so standard deviation is a measurement around averages.

There's a normal distribution curve. So there's an average trend line or event or population characteristic. And then there's the tail events. And one or two standard deviations is within the realm of normal. Once you get to three and above, it's called a tail event or a signal, and it happens 0.3% of the time.

And just to give the people watching this an idea of what that means, as I said earlier, 3.8% standard deviations is the chance of lightning hitting you at least once in your lifetime. Five standard deviations is the chance of you giving birth to a seven-foot human that grows up to be a seven-foot human. And 10 standard deviations is the probability of you giving

birth to a nine-foot giant, much like the same height as Stannis in the Marvel movies. Billions to one type of thing. In other words, that there's something happening that's having a profound effect. I mean, that's one type of thing. PETER LUBBERSON, In other words, there's something happening that's having a profound effect. I mean, that's the kind of corollary here. JOHN MCCUTCHAN, That's it. There's a signal something's happened, and at the very least

needs to be investigated and should send alarm bells throughout the health world. PETER LUBBERSON, What about insurance companies? You would think that insurance companies, and we've talked about this a little bit on past shows, but would be incredibly concerned about this because they're going to be impacted, obviously. Yeah. So at the end of 2020, 2022, or 2021 going into 2022, Scott Davison, the CEO of One America, highlighted something that the whole industry saw. He was the first to say it. They were

experiencing 40% excess mortality in their group life policies, which are policies given to those employees who join up to Fortune 500, medium-sized, mid-sized companies. And it's a benefit you get when you sign on to the company. And it's one or two times your salary. It's not underwritten.

What that means is you don't go to a doctor. They just give it to you because they have very good statistics on people with these types of jobs, the rate at which you die. It's very profitable for them. And he experienced 40 percent, and the industry experienced 40 percent excess mortality in that age group, 25 through 44. Yes. Which is profound. 2021.

He said 10 percent would be once in a 200 year flood which is a three standard deviation event so again rare just three standard deviation event 40 he said is off the charts he didn't want to he didn't even want to put a number on it so and as we roll forward through time the insurance companies have raised prices on group life policy so they're they're not losing the money like they used to. But if you talk to some people in the industry that are still kind of behind the scenes, I call them whistleblowers, but they tell me that excess mortality is continuing,

especially amongst the 25 through 44 category, depending on the quarter, between 13% and 25%. What data would help you, I guess, understand these phenomena better? DAVID SHULTZ, Well, the insurance industry definitely wants access to the vaccination data, but they won't be able to get it. And they know that.

If we had access to that, we could solve this problem pretty quickly. But that data is not forthcoming. Vaccination status, track that versus disabilities, excess deaths. I kind of lose track of what vaccination status actually means because there's all these multiple boosters and presumably at some point it runs out.

How does that work? I think the easiest way to do it would be doing studies on those who are unvaccinated at all versus anybody who got the two original doses. And I think that would be the cleanest way to do it. Obviously, there would be an add-on study that looks at the number of boosters you got to see if there's any other effect going on there. So you also described this situation where it seems like that excess mortality is starting to come down more recently and what how do you explain that the booster uptake in the u.s. is quite low now so the good news is there seems to be a declining

trend in excess mortality not disabilities so much unfortunately and in countries that seem to have continued on with the booster program are experiencing not as good results as the US. For instance, the UK has seen a rise in excess deaths in 15 to 44, actually hit new highs in 2023, so around 20%. PAUL SAXMAN. OK, so that's interesting, because you're getting different trends in different places. DAVID CHANDLER. Different countries, different trends,

depending upon what we think is booster uptake. We haven't done a study on that yet, but people tended to booster themselves more in the U.K. than the U.S. The booster uptake, as we heard today in the testimony, was abysmal, 3.4% in the U.S., the last recommended booster dose. So, you know, another thing that I've only actually recently learned is that in Romania, the vaccine uptake was actually quite low. So I'm kind of curious about what, you know, have you looked at that data? We have to be careful when we talk about Romania, because most of the Eastern European countries did not get COVID in 2020. COVID hit their populations in 2021, concurrently with the

vaccine uptake. So they saw excess mortality, even though the vaccine uptake was lower. But as we roll through time, they now have negative excess mortality, as you saw today in the testimony. So again, we have to be careful when it's apples and oranges because COVID didn't really hit them until 2021. Well, and so, and this is, you know, as we discussed a little bit before, the challenge is in a way to figure out what other, you know, factors there are, right, that might be influencing things. So we're analyzing just excess deaths, counting ones and zeros, dead, not dead. And excess mortality is all-cause mortality. So clearly, we can't attribute 100% of that excess to the vaccine if that's our thesis which it is so there's co-factors but there seems to be high correlation with the disability data

and the vaccine and the disability numbers are you know we in our research for every one excess death there's about four to five disabilities in in these populations so the numbers correlate more closely with the vaccination uptake for the disabilities because there's just more data to analyze. Can you remind me what the third factor was that you looked at? You looked at death, disability, and injuries. Okay. So what about the injury data? So the injury data manifests in what we call lost work time, which shot up incredibly in 2020, obviously from the lockdowns,

but it then continued into 2021 at about the same rate, but then took off in 2022. It's come back down in 2023, but it's still a standard deviation from the 20 year trend line, which had been trending down over time. So this is an indication that something's going on in the health of the population. And we also came up with a figure of about 28 million people are currently injured,

and we get that number from the Pfizer clinical trials, the incidence of non-severe adverse events. So we combined the work time lost with the Pfizer clinical trials to come up with an estimate of the injured in the US. And we come up with about 28 million. And that's sort of any injury from tinnitus? Tinnitus, yes. Or anything that might cause you to miss work

more than you normally would had you not had the vaccine. And work time lost in 2022 was 16 standard deviations above trend, 67% above the trend in 2019. So it just took off in 2020, went up a little bit in 2021, then it just shot up in 2022. So there seems to be a lagging effect, a downstream effect, where some doctors are saying, as we heard in the testimony today, it suppresses the immune system, which could cause chronic illness and absences. So 16 standard deviations.

I'm not going to get you to tell me how significant, how unusual an event that is. But that's sort of a miracle, almost, or something like that? Yeah, it's very rare. In finance and Wall Street, when we see what we DAVID KUETTELMANN Yeah, it's very rare. In finance and Wall Street, when we see what we call in the financial markets three standard deviation events, that's getting close to a black swan event.

It doesn't happen all that often. When it does, we take note. And we take note because it might signal a trend change, violent price moves in one day. For instance, let's say the US dollar goes up 1.5%, that is more than a three standard deviation event. Currencies don't move that fast, that quickly. So that's a signal for us to take a look at what's going on. Has something changed? So we applied what we did in finance to what we're seeing in the populations across the globe and in disability. So we're just measuring

using our statistical tools to figure out when trends change. We saw excess death trend up in 21, and 22, and 23, and disabilities just really take off in 21. So you're using this data for your clients, right? We've been doing this research for free. We're going to have clients. Eventually, we're in the process of raising capital for a hedge fund. And the vaccine work we do will be implemented into our economic analysis,

which we're already on record saying in some of our research that the Federal Reserve is making a policy error, keeping interest rates too high for too long, because one of the metrics they look at is employment numbers. And if there's a lot of disabled people, it makes the denominator smaller. So we think the 3.8% unemployment that we're currently seeing as headline is being underestimated by 1.5%. So the real unemployment number is 5%. So if it's 5%, the Fed still thinks the economy's super

strong, but it's not. It's because there's fewer workers in the labor pool. PETER MOSKOV. But, like, if they're not seeing the same numbers you are? No, they don't analyze disabilities. Yeah. We're making an adjustment to the unemployment rate. This is not calculated into the unemployment rate that the BLS does. That's fascinating. Hold the presses. Isn't this a headline? No, not really, because a lot of people have been questioning the job numbers for quite some time over the last year. They put out a jobs report number for the month of January, and then several months

later they'll revise it down. So some other people have done analysis of the last, in 2020, through the last 12 employment reports, and it's been revised downward to the tune of a million jobs that really didn't exist the headline looked good but if you look at the revisions they're down well except you're kind of postulating a cause here right for for well at least part of that at least part of that error yeah part of that error and we're we're saying we're saying that the federal Reserve and other economists that aren't taking into account the newly

disabled, which is a lot of people. The civilian labor force is 164 million people. There's probably about 100 million full-time jobs. So if you add 4 million disabled people, or 2 million, because let's say half of the 4 million are employed, what the numbers show. Two million US citizens are kind of working, either not working or working half time.

And that makes the unemployment number look way better than it should because it lowers the denominator of the equation. So the employment rate is biased lower. So we think the Fed is probably making a policy error. So these things not only have health issue, they have economic issue impact as well. Absolutely. Tell me a little bit about your background.

Of course, we've talked about this before, but I'd like our viewers to understand where you're coming from here. So my career has been on Wall Street. I started off at HSBC, which is a Hong Kong Shanghai bank. I was an institutional fixed-income salesperson, so I learned all about the credit markets, the interest rate markets, currency markets, derivatives, you name it. And I learned about macroeconomic analysis. I then went back to business school, got my MBA, then went on to Wall Street at Donaldson, Lufkin, and Genret, which was an investment bank that did equity research. I became an electric utility equity analyst. And I was there in 1997 through 1999, and I saw the dot-com fraud.

And that fraud was perpetrated within the investment banks. They did what they used to do was called due diligence. And they were supposed to only issue new companies that had something called revenues and cash flows. Well, they disregarded that. And if you remember back then, a lot of companies had eyeballs as the metrics. I remember because I suffered from that particular bubble.

And then we saw several 12 to 15 months later, corporate fraud, Enron, WorldCom. So I saw a lot of fraud early on in my Wall Street career. So I know what it looks like. The fraud back then in Enron and WorldCom and other companies was classification fraud. So they were reclassifying expenses, which should have hit their cash flow, as capital expenses, which you can amortize over time. So it made their cash flow look way higher than it was supposed to. So that's called classification fraud.

And they fooled debt investors and equity investors until it was supposed to. That's called classification fraud. They fooled debt investors and equity investors until it was exposed. Then I saw the great financial crisis when I was at BlackRock. I eventually went to BlackRock, became a growth portfolio manager investing for our clients. We grew the portfolio from $2 billion to $14 billion. I saw the great financial crisis, and that was banking fraud. The the frauds just seem to be getting bigger and bigger. You roll forward to the COVID fraud, I'm just applying the skill sets I used then to see kind of the bigger picture. We can't prove it, but we think there's been a lot of reclassification of death codes in the CDC. And when our CDC report comes out, we'll show you

why we think that. So when is that coming out again? Next couple weeks. Oh, wow. So I'm doing this interview too early. Well, I'll come back. I don't see too many BlackRock portfolio managers or ex-BlackRock portfolio managers talking about these things. Why do you think you're the only one?

Well, I left BlackRock in 2012. And BlackRock underwent a fundamental shift. They used to be, in their early days, they were what's called active investors, where human beings picked the portfolios. And then through acquisition, they acquired Barclays, which was a quantitative ETF creation shop. So they started creating passive investment vehicles.

So most of their assets under management since these mergers are about, I think, $6 or $7 trillion with assets under management. Most of them are passive. So there's not a lot of people like me analyzing stocks anymore at BlackRock. So all my colleagues that I used to work with are no longer there.

So I don't know anybody at BlackRock anymore. I guess what I'm trying to get at is, you're a rare person to be talking about this stuff publicly. Yes, that's just because that's my nature. When I see fraud, I speak about it. And I saw it early. Everyone thought I was crazy. But as time rolls on, we're getting proven

more and more right. And there's a saying on Wall Street, be right, be early, be loud, and that's what I've been doing. PETER LUBBERSON, Do you think there's people that understand that this sort of thing is happening and are looking to kind of financially benefit from that themselves? JOHN MCCUTCHAN, I'm pretty sure there are, because if you look at the stock prices of Pfizer and Moderna,

they're hitting 52-week lows. They're at critical junctures in their technical stock prices. If Pfizer doesn't hold its current price level and breaks down below, I think, 2120, it breaks a long-term trend line. So, we're getting close to big, big problems for Pfizer and Moderna, technically. And they've retraced a lot of their COVID gains. In fact, Pfizer, I think, is now below its pre-COVID price. But they're acquiring, I think, they're doing like massive acquisitions, like this cancer research company, for example.

They paid a huge premium for a cancer company. And what was interesting about that is they're now marketing that in their annual reports and in their earnings reports as one of their big growth engines. So if you want to be very cynical, you could say they had insider information and they know that cancer will be the growth opportunity. The other thing that's very interesting is since 2021, dollars spent on cancer treatments has grown 14% ex-inflation and inflected up. So more people are getting cancer, more people are getting treated, and it's reflected in the dollars being spent.

So money talks, BS walks. Have you looked at all about which age groups this is happening in? Is it in the so-called expected groups? It's accelerated in all. The older people are still getting hit hard by this and there's some excesses going on there. But cancers are not supposed to occur between age 50 and 44 in general. They're just off the charts growth we've seen.

And that's what I talked about, what we saw in the UK. This ethical skeptic account, do you follow that at all? DAVID CHANDLER, Yes. We don't work together, but his results corroborate ours. PAUL IRISHONAKER, That's what it seems to me now that I think about it. DAVID CHANDLER, And he and I have been in

contact on Twitter. He has his own ways of doing it. We have our own ways. And for the pandemic scorecard, I came up with about one, including 2020, about 1.6 million dead. He came up with almost essentially the same number using his own methodology. So what exactly is this pandemic scorecard? We should really measure the authorities and how they did.

And if it was a success and the vaccines worked, excess mortality should have really started coming down in 2021 and continued down in 2022. And disabilities, which only started in 21, should never have existed at all. So by coming up with a scorecard, you're just measuring the policymakers. How did they do on the policies they implemented? And what I testified to today was an epic fail. Since 2021, including the years 21, 22, and 23, 1.1 million Americans perished above and beyond. If you include COVID, it's about 1.55 million people died in the U.S. Combined COVID, lockdowns, and vaccination solutions. So that's not a good scorecard. And about three and a half million excess disabilities, most of them, all of them starting in 2021. So the scorecard,

it's a fail. More people died with the measures than didn't. So I understand, and we've talked about this before, that there's some adjustments being made to how some of these numbers are being calculated. Can you tell me a bit about that? JOHN MCCUTCHAN- Yeah, so in September of 2022, my team and I, Carlos and Yuri, decided we should publish some methodology papers on how we calculate excess deaths so it's transparent.

And we have three different methodologies because you can use a simple average, you can adjust for population, and there's another method that escapes me at the moment. But we have all three on our website. So you can go into any country and you can use our different methodologies and see the differences in excess mortality. We like to adjust for population because that makes other countries comparable. You can compare a fast-growing population country versus a declining, and you can see what's really going on. The ONS in the UK has decided recently to change the methodology on how they calculate excess deaths.

And apparently it's bringing those excess deaths numbers down. So whatever methodology they're using is probably a combination of including post-pandemic years in and doing some other things. Our cutoff is 2019. We normal pandemic. We think they're doing something else. And that's why we publish those papers, to make it a level playing field. And other people out there in the world are coming up with

similar results to us that are independent. PETER LUBBERSON, Right. Any final thoughts as we finish? PETER LUBBERSON, As I stated at the end of the testimony today, let's put aside the controversial, well, for me, not controversial anymore, today let's put aside the controversial well for me not controversial anymore but let's let's pretend it's not the vaccine these numbers are real they're abysmal and they they they show a chronic health problem that results in death

disability and injury to the tune of about 33 million Americans since 2021. So regardless of cost, as a nation and our political leaders and all the health authorities should be interested in this, and we should all want to know why it's happening. Now, we believe it's the vaccine, but regardless of that, this should be investigated. Well, Edward Dowd, it's such a pleasure to have you on again. Thank you, Jan. Good to be here. Thank you all for joining Edward Dowd and me on this episode of American Thought Leaders. I'm your host, Jan Jekielek.