American Thought Leaders - The Dangers of DeepSeek and Chinese Drones: Army Captain Florent Groberg (Ret.)

Episode Date: May 2, 2025

“They picked me up, and I’m hopping on one leg. And I saw Commander Griffin, Major Gray, Major Kennedy, and then USAID [officer] at the time, Ragaei Abdelfattah, were all killed by the same bomber that didn’t kill me,” said Florent Groberg.Groberg is a retired U.S. Army Captain who fought in Afghanistan and was severely injured attempting to thwart a suicide bomber. For his actions, he received the Medal of Honor, America’s highest award for military valor.“Everything that we have in this nation is because of men and women who put their lives on the line and didn’t come home. And their families—they have to live with the consequences of that,” he said.I spoke with Captain Groberg on a wide range of topics, from DeepSeek AI and swarming drones to the war in Ukraine and the threat from China’s communist regime.“When I first heard about DeepSeek and its battle with Open AI ... I saw it as an opportunity for the Chinese government to have free access to all of our data as they see fit,” said Groberg. “The Chinese have been developing the majority of the world’s small drones. I believe that the majority of the Russian [drones] come from China. ... I know that Ukrainians are also using their own specific drones, and they’re creating as much chaos on the other side. So, it really has changed the landscape of warfare.”Views expressed in this video are those of the host and the guest, and do not necessarily reflect the views of The Epoch Times.

They picked me up and I'm hopping on one leg. I saw Commissar Major Griffin, Major Gray, Major Kennedy, and Reggie Abdel Fattah were all killed by the same bomber that didn't kill me. Florent Groberg is a retired U.S. Army captain who fought in Afghanistan and was severely injured attempting to thwart a suicide bomber. For his actions, he received the Medal of Honor, America's highest award for military valor. Everything that we have in this nation is because of men and women who put their lives on the line and didn't come home. And their families have to live with the consequences of that.

I spoke with Captain Groberg on a range of topics, from DeepSeek AI and swarming drones, to the war in Ukraine and the Chinese communist threat. When I first heard about DeepSeek and its battle with open AI, I saw it as an opportunity for the Chinese government to have free access to all of our data as they see fit. The Chinese have been developing the majority of the world's small drones. They're cheap and they're effective,

so it really has changed the landscape of warfare. This is American Thought Leaders, and I'm Jan Jekielek. Loryn Goper, such a pleasure to have you really has changed the landscape of warfare. This is American Thought Leaders, and I'm Jan Jekielek. Lauren Grober, such a pleasure to have you on American Thought Leaders. Thank you for having me. Excited. You've been recently writing about DeepSeek. It's available basically to any American to be used in whatever way. Why is this a problem? It's a very important topic in my personal opinion when

it comes down to national security. When I first heard about DeepSeek and its battle with OpenAI, the concept of doing it a lot cheaper, just as well in regards to accuracy, if not better, and that a lot of people here in the US had access to it, all you had to do was just download it, it scared me, personally it scared me. My first thought is, why would anyone here

in the United States download this application? Specifically because it's owned by a Chinese company. And my second thought was, what does it do that's much better than Chai GPT, Grok, Clode, the other applications that would entice you to download this one and put your property, your IP, your personal private information at risk? And then I started to peel the onion back and realize, people don't know.

They just think that this is a new application that's available for them, for cheap, for free. And it's better than the rest, because it's a lot cheaper, and you can do things faster. Whatever the story was sold to them on the media, and they're going to use it. But they forget it's a Chinese company that has to abide by the 2017 Chinese international law in terms of regulations for companies to have to provide their data to the Chinese

government. So in essence, I saw it as an opportunity for the Chinese government to have free access to all of our data as they see fit. Because people are utilizing it to do everything, from asking normal questions, to planning their day, to financial questions, to doing their taxes, to potentially putting the IP of their own businesses and products that they're developing to get a better understanding or maybe a competitive advantage.

And all this is now being just transferred over at the mercy of whatever the Chinese government wants to make out of it. The thing that was really astonishing to me was this hype that was created. Look, they did it so cheap, it was so good, and they did it so cheap without really any evidence provided. No evidence, no facts. We don't even know where the chips come from. Do they come from Nvidia or not? We had no data. There was actually no proof of what they were claiming they were able to do. Finally, now we've had the ability to sort of take a deeper look into it.

And, you know, it's nothing special. It's not better than anything else out there already on the market. They just can do it at a fifth or an eighth the cost supposedly. I have a question in regards to this. How much is the Chinese government actually paying for that? What's the government's involvement in terms of the financials to make this company go forward?

Does that change the math there? Maybe, maybe not. I have no idea. These are questions we should be asking ourselves. But instead, I think a lot of us just jump right to the conclusion, cheaper, better, faster. We really need to start pointing fingers at OpenAI, what do you do, and Nvidia, what are you doing, and things like that. What is the full nature then of the China threat? And when did you first become aware of this? Well, I've served in the military. I've served in the intelligence services for a little bit of time.

I am a de facto, not well versed historian. I'm also paying attention to what's going on around the world. And look, the Chinese, they made a commitment in 1949, a 100 year commitment, to really become the sole world power when it comes to economics, military, technology. And they're working really hard at that mission. And that mission requires passing the United States on many different facets.

And so to do so, you need to invest, you need to capture, and you need to lead. It's a massive threat to our way of life, United States specifically, the free world in essence. And so when I see the opposition taking advantage potentially of our own way of life and the way we decide the freedom of press, freedom of speech, our ability to utilize these type of platforms with no consequences in extent versus the way they operate.

It worries me a little bit because I'm also understanding that they're trying to become, you know, trying to pass us and we're giving them a free pass. And they're making massive investments on the technological side. You've seen the military grow. They're capturing a lot of territories around the world, Africa, South America, Europe. They're bailing out Russia. And so that worries me a little bit for the safety of national security. Well, and I guess the unspoken thing is that it is a totalitarian dictatorship after all. Someone was basically commenting that they perceive America

as being responsible for the Opium War and treat Americans as such. We're talking about the fentanyl crisis and a lot of the precursors and even actual fentanyl basically being facilitated by the Chinese regime. My comment and response was, yeah, but that's true. But even more important is that they treat their own people worse than they treat the people responsible for the opium. Well, yeah, and listen, to me, when it comes down to the opium world, there's a lot of responsible parties. We need to figure out a way to stop it. I've lost, unfortunately, friends recently that I served with, unfortunately, who were using.

And one of them specifically was using a different drug that was laced with fentanyl and passed away. He was struggling. He was a medic, a great, great kid. But it's a problem that we really need to fix. And there is responsibility here in our own country, obviously. There's a heck of a responsibility over there. This is one of those situations where I believe this should not be a competition. This should be a partnership. It benefits all parties for it. be a competition, there should be a partnership. It benefits all parties for it. Well, I think the only way that the Chinese regime can be encouraged to actually stop the

flow of fentanyl is if there's some kind of leverage that can be used that will cause them more pain than the actual military benefit they get out of letting the fentanyl flow and facilitating the fentanyl flow. Your thoughts? In a perfect world, I would say this, I would love to be no war. I've been at war. I've seen how horrible it is, the idea and the concept of having to take someone else's life. More importantly, it's your friends that don't get to come home and the families that have to deal with the consequences on both sides. War is the worst potential outcome out there.

But I'd love to have a partnership with everybody. I'd love to be able to have dinner with Chinese counterpart, Russian counterpart, French counterpart, British counterpart, and all of us be peaceful and talking about how can we better this earth and do better things to support each other's economies and communities. But unfortunately, from my understanding and my personal experiences, we face too many individuals who don't think that way. Well, and I think many would argue that, let's say some less benevolent forces took advantage of exactly the kind

of sentiments and the kind of desires that you just described, which of course, many Americans share. Of course, you did serve in the military, you received the Medal of Honor. I think we should talk about that and how that happened. received the Medal of Honor. I think we should talk about that and how that happened. I did. I served in the army. I joined in 2008 infantrymen. I joined at Fort Benning, Georgia, and was stationed in Colorado Springs, Fort Carson. Two tours to Afghanistan, one in 2009 and 2010, as a platoon leader in the Kunar province, led a very specific team of 24 Americans

in remote parts of eastern Afghanistan. Learned a lot about being a man and a leader, but also a follower. Learned a lot about myself in those mountains. Faced some pretty difficult enemies. But most importantly, I was surrounded by some of the best people I've ever met in my life. Second tour, 2012, back in Afghanistan, I was running the specialized security team

for the brigade commander, now who is the vice chief of staff of the army. And we were about six, seven months into the deployment, we were targeted by a suicide bomber in Asadabad, again, eastern Afghanistan again. My job was to lead that security team. Luckily, I was close enough to the suicide bomber. I saw a suicide bomber come out of a structure after they created diversion with motorcycles. I couldn't see a weapon on him.

I saw him as a threat, couldn't confirm he was a threat, so I couldn't engage him with my rifle or my service weapon. So I did my own made up escalational force, which was run at him, say a lot of words at him, hopefully he responds, confirm that he's a bad guy, and if he's a bad guy, do your job. So I ran at him, I hit him, I grabbed him, hit him,

confirm he was wearing a suicide vest. And the only thing I could think of at that moment was I gotta get him away from the team as quickly and as far away as possible. I was followed by one of my guys, Saul Mahoney. So I threw him and Mahoney was right behind me, just ready to roll. And he landed on the ground, detonated. I don't know how, call it grace of God, luck, whatever you want to believe.

But I lived. I was thrown 30 feet. My foot was facing me. I had blood everywhere. I lost hearing. My head was spinning. My number two came out of nowhere, grabbed me by the hand on my plate carrier dragged me into a ditch my 22 year old medic at the time who's had a torn MCL PCL Saved my life because he applied a tourniquet my translator Helped him and say helped save my life and so

it was Probably one of the most difficult moments of my life personally on a physical sense. But what made it worse is that when I came to my senses, a couple minutes into it, my number two came to me and said, hey, just wanna give you a sip rep. I asked him, what's the status of my World War Six, which was a colonel? He said, my World War Six is okay. What's the status of my World War Seven,

which is a command sergeant major? He said, we lost command sergeant. What's the status of my war seven, which is the commandant sergeant major, he said, we lost commandant sergeant Griffin, and we lost three others. And I said, get me out of this hole. They picked me up and I'm hopping on one leg, and I saw commandant sergeant Major Griffin, Major Gray, Major Kennedy, and then USAID at the time,

Reggie Abdel Fattah, we were all killed by the same bomber that didn't kill me. A few minutes later, I was put into a vehicle on top of ammo cans, and I was cast back to New York's military hospital where my war ended. So I received the Medal of Honor on November 12, 2015, from President Obama for actions on. And I tell people, there was no heroic act that day. It was just, literally, it was, my entire team did their job.

And unfortunately, we still lost Americans. The fact that I was recognized as a hero for that was a really tough pill to swallow. It was a really tough one for me to swallow to this day. But I've also understood that this is an opportunity for me to have a platform, to continue serving, to say the names of my friends who didn't come home, highlight the true heroes of my personal story, and also just to remind people that everything that we have in this nation is because of men and women who put their

lives on the line and didn't come home. And their families have to live with the consequences of that. Yeah, we are the greatest nation in the world, hands down without a doubt. That's because we bleed for it. And that's because we have individuals who put on that uniform and are willing to deploy thousands of miles away, years at a time, to make sure that we get to keep this way of life. And I don't take that for granted. In reading about your case, I understand there was a second suicide bomber who was basically also going to detonate, but because of your action, they were kind of prevented from that detonation actually having any impact on the two. Correct. So I did not know this, but there was a second one, he was still in the building.

What we understand based upon forensics and the storyline is that, because we got there so quick on the first one, it prevented the second one from actually exiting. So their goal was boom boom. He gets in the middle of it, detonates, second one finishes the job. But because we got there so quick, and because I got to throw him so quick, the first one detonated, and the second was still in the building,

and so the first bomb caused him to detonate, probably shocked him. And so he detonated inside the building. But I thought, for a long time time that the second bomber was the bomber that killed Commander Saunders-Greerford, Major Graham M. Kennedy, and Raegabdoll Fata. It wasn't until I actually read the report, maybe a year later, actually it was after Sergeant Mahoney received a Silver Star, my teammate, that I realized, hold on, you're telling me that the guy that blew up on my feet

is the one that killed my friends, 30 feet away, and then I really threw me for a twist. Because you start replaying the scenario over and over again, you start thinking, how, like how, why am I here, how did did I live and then one day you start to realize stop asking those questions one day you'll figure it out you'll meet the maker and someone you know and you'll get your answers hopefully in the meantime do something about it be a better person serve your community, honor those guys that didn't come home, do your job as a father,

do your job as a husband. And that mindset sort of gets you back on track, if that makes sense. It makes a ton of sense. Was there a moment when you realized that this could be the end, and you still chose to act? I guess that's what I'm curious about. I get this question all the time. Once you're scared, how do you react this way? Don't you know you're going to die? You don't think that way. In combat, I call it the power of love.

You love your brothers and sisters so much that you're willing to do the impossible for them. And you're willing to die day in, day out, night in, night out for them. That this whole concept of dying, even though it is always in the back of your head, it is shelved because the concept of protecting them becomes the priority. So for me, I didn't go into this situation

doing a calculation of like, okay, here we go. I'm probably going to die right now. I went in with, he's going to kill my friends. And my job is to protect them. Literally my job, that tour, was to protect Command Sergeant Major Griffin and at the time Colonel Mingus. And so if I died and they lived, then that's my job. Yeah, it's not a great way of putting it, but that was a reality.

And so I'm already designed that way. And as a warrior, you then have to trust your instincts, your training, and then your love of brotherhood and sisterhood. And then you just allow it to just develop. And so I'm blessed that I've been in combat before. I'm blessed that I was serving alongside some fine people. I'm also blessed that I had really good training and that allowed me to make a decision.

And then the last piece is a piece that we all wonder, who am I in that moment? I don't know. You think if you would have asked me, would you bum rush a suicide bomber? Before that I'd probably say, I don't know about that one. That sounds a little stupid.

When the situation happened, you have to do your job. I just did my job. And Mahoney followed me right into it. It just tells me, I'm not the only one. And I tell people, you guys don't understand. When you're in the moments in combat, I've seen so many heroic acts. We're all ordinary individuals.

But we become something special to each other in those moments because you'll see people running to burning buildings or vehicles, middle of an open ground to go pick up their friends and put them on their shoulders and run them while being hit. Story of Sal Junta, when he was in a corngull, seen his buddy dragged, running across enemy line, taking out the enemy corn goal Seeing his buddy dragged running across enemy line taking out the enemy picking up his buddy

Put him on his shoulders and running back through enemy lines things like that, but you think wow How would you ever do this? That's simple to us. It's our job, and we love each other enough that if we're gonna die trying That that's our duty. I think that's what makes the professional so different and special. The only way I can think of that comes as close to it, and it's still different, is firefighters. I have so much respect.

The idea of just running into a burning building day in, day out, night in, night out to go save complete strangers or your friends, it's unbelievable. As I listen to you speak about this, I can't help but wonder if, at least at some maybe lesser level, you're seeing or hoping the same exists in America writ large among Americans, despite this increased polarization that we absolutely see and in some cases is being fueled by nefarious parties. Listen, I believe that if we spend a little bit more time willing to actually have a conversation with people who defer in ideas from us, that we will go a lot further than we possibly could ever imagine in terms

of bridging that gap. I ask questions to my family and my friends. I didn't live in the 60s and 70s. I've watched a lot of reports, I've seen movies, you read books, you learn about it in history, and it sounds like those days were pretty tough too. We had a very unpopular war, we had a hippie movement, we had a lot of racism in this country, we had an impeachment in a president, we had the cold war, we had a lot of issues, a lot of changes in our society,

we're technologically growing. I wonder and I asked these questions, I said, did you guys think it was the end of the world at that moment? The way we think about it today? So I look at those moments and I look at the concept of this nation, and one of the beauties to me is the idea of freedom of speech. Because freedom of speech doesn't mean that we're all going to have great conversations with each other and listen to each other. Freedom of speech means that we're going to very much disagree, and at times it's going to be very notorious, nefarious

as well. And that's going to create this concept or this idea, specifically to our enemies, that we don't like each other very much, that we are a country that is on the brink of civil war. No. We are a country that is utilizing our God-given rights and our constitutional rights to disagree. Sometimes we take it too far. We are taking it too far right now, 100%. But to me, that's human nature. It's a cycle.

I hope that we find a way over the next couple years to say, okay, this is a little bit too much. I really want to better understand why you're thinking that way, and maybe we find a little bit of common ground. Will it happen? I don't know. I mean, I'm not, you know, I'm not an astronomers. I don't have a crystal ball. But I do know one thing. If someone else decide to mingle in and really take a shot at us, you will do the job for us. You will bridge that gap rather quickly and

You will do the job for us. You will bridge that gap rather quickly and You know, I hope that doesn't happen that way. I hope that we were able to do it internally But it does it does create a little bit of worry for me because I don't want another war I don't want my son to have to make a decision when he's 18 19 20 years old Well, my country's at war is in I turn and put the uniform on like dad did, like grandpa did, like my uncles did around the world. I don't want that. I want him to think about how do I become, how do I go to Mars, right?

I hope actually he doesn't go to Mars because he'd be gone for a long time and I'd be scared, I'd have to go too. But, you know, I want him to think, how do I become a doctor? How do I do whatever he wants to do instead of going to war? And I hope that by the time he's 20 years old, and I really hope we fix this a lot sooner,

that he lives in a nation where people start to listen to each other a little bit more. And so there's a lot of responsibility to go around. Right here on the hill, that's a big responsibility. But it comes down to our communities. It comes down to people just like you and I. We have a responsibility to do our part. Why should I expect anyone else above me

to do the job for me if I'm not willing to do it myself? And so I challenge myself, my friends, and my community around me to be a little bit more open-minded, to potentially grasp the concept that hey, I might not be right. Or, if this person is thinking complete opposite of me, why? What am I missing?

Curiosity a little bit. And then have conversations. No, it doesn't mean that you're going to agree with them. Doesn't mean you're going to solve all the world's problems. I'm not saying it will happen overnight. But I do believe that we have the opportunity here to be just a little bit more mindful that if we're willing to have a conversation and not be judgmental from the onset, that potentially we have an opportunity to heal a little bit faster. But I'm an

optimist at trading. I can get that. Like people who are listening to this, some people are going to dismiss me some people are gonna dismiss me, probably call me an idiot for even thinking that way. What country you live in, you're not seeing, you're not reading the sea leaves, whatever. That's fine. I'm the dude that sat there at the bottom of a drawer with three enemy firing positions on top of me,

and everybody else probably thinking we're dead, and my mindset is if I take this one out, then I'll be able to take these two out. So I'm an optimist by trade. I'd rather be an optimist than a pessimist, personally. What is that line? Is it how you eat an elephant? It's one bite at a time. The message I hear you telling me is that at the grassroots level, at the person-to-person level, we absolutely have to talk to each other or try or do our best trying or maybe die trying. I don't know. Maybe that's what you're saying. You mentioned, of course, that

you're an immigrant like me. How was that growing up as an immigrant in America? How was that growing up as an immigrant in America? It was awesome. I don't come from anything. I was lucky enough to have parents that loved me and cared about me. So that's a huge benefit for whether you're an immigrant or not. But I came to this country and I speak English and I learned it really rather quickly. and I learned it really rather quickly. And I had friends from the moment I got here. I was never judged, you know, for who I was and who I wasn't. I was embraced by the community.

And it helped me, made my life, my life decision to join the military really, really easy because I felt American. And that, that to me is why I'm an immigrant that loves this My life decision of joining the military really, really easy because I felt American. And that to me is why I'm an immigrant that loves this country more than anything else in the world. Because I understand what this country gave me and the opportunity to become one of its own, to become one of its sons, one of its citizens. And I'm blessed.

And I would never take that for granted. And that's why I'm always committed to serving our nation. No matter who's in power, that's my commitment. I think seeing some friends die too, serving this nation, sort of changes your mindset a little bit. It definitely, it can make you more or less patriotic. However you deal with it, it 100% made me more patriotic, in a sense that I wanna make sure that I continue

and be in a positive influence in my community, for my country, and for the people around me. And that's why I think I'm more open-minded. That's why I'm willing to have those conversations with everybody and learn more. You've been writing quite a bit on a number of issues. You know, of course, deep-seek, that's where I noticed you. Also about unmanned aerial drones.

And this is a technology which has been rapidly, rapidly growing, especially in the Russia-Ukraine war. I've been learning about how, you know, even though we're the course of two years, the entire systems is this kind of evolution of systems as they're fighting each other. What is the situation right now? Specifically, the China threat here? First of all, the situation is that the concept of warfare has changed. We have probably one of the most fascinating battlegrounds that you could have ever imagined

in this day and age happening in Ukraine, which is a World War I style trench warfighting with the utilization of technology, specifically drones. So Group 1, small, Group 2, mid-range, and the devastation of these capabilities. The concept of terrorizing your enemy is what I see from these small drones. That you're in a trench or you're hiding in your bunker or whatever it is and you hear that zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz that zzzzzz sound coming up and you don't know if it's coming right for you, if it's watching you, it's been watching you, attracting you, and then you see it,

and if it's on you, you try to run away, try to shoot at it, whatever it is, and next thing you know, you have a small type of explosive just detonated on you. And the sheer chaos and fear it creates is gotta be terrifying. I didn't have that issue when I was fighting the war. It would have been a pretty significant change

in our battle concepts and our tactical concepts to fight this type of warfare. So it is absolutely imperative for our military, and we are doing that as a nation, and I'm sure others are doing as well, to identify ways to, one, employ these types of technologies to protect our troops, but more importantly, also on the counter UAS side.

How do we stop these swarm of drones? How do we stop these one-off drones? How do we pick up a drone that's 10,000 meters in the air, looking at us, utilizing ISR type of capabilities through their gimbals? What can we do for that? And so it's something that I've obviously been really interested in and work across

with some of my companies. But then I also study it. And yes, you're right. The Chinese have been developing the majority of the world's small drones. They believe that the majority of the Russians, and you guys can fact check me on that, come from China. They're cheap, they're effective, they do their job.

You know, they don't have a ton of technology on them, but they do enough to really make a difference on the battlefield. I know that Ukrainians are also using their own specific drones, and they're creating as much chaos on the other side. So it really has changed the landscape of warfare. And now the question is, what is the counter solution for that?

So counter-U.S. is a big, big topic of conversation. It's probably across the world right now to identify how do you protect your assets? How do you protect your tanks? How do you protect your people? How do you protect your infrastructures? How do you protect your utilities? But also, if your potential enemy is actually making these things, it may offer them vast advantages. I'm talking about Communist China here. Yeah. Of course, it offers them a lot of advantages. I believe that we have a government, we have an administration right now that is taking this very seriously. I am a firm believer in our armed forces and the direction that they're going in this space for counter UAS and the whole UAS platform, whether it's air or sea.

They're experts now, the Chinese, at these small drones warfare. I'd say we're pretty good at this whole counter piece. We're going to get much better. We've at this whole counter piece, we're going to get much better. We've made significant investments in this nation and with our allies as well, in different types of drones capabilities that some of them I can't really talk about. But let's just say I'm pretty confident in where we're at. Well, because I mean, a major, major push of this administration obviously is to build the manufacturing sector. And so it seems to me like there's a huge opportunity here for manufacturing growth. First of all, I am a 100% firm believer that we need to bring back a lot of manufacturing

to the United States. We have incredible talent here. Yes, it's more expensive, right? But there's ways to get United States. We have incredible talent here. Yes, it's more expensive, right? But there's ways to get around it. Some people are misunderstanding the concept of what this specific administration, and previous one as well, but it's really this administration trying to do

in terms of bringing back American jobs and manufacturing. On a national security side, it should be an absolute requirement. Because you're exactly what you're talking about. There are technologies that need to be built here in our four walls, right? So in our country and our borders. Because of national security and the implication of that, you're right. You know, we should not be utilizing any type of Chinese drone to protect our streets or our people. Look, there are certain laptops

that I wouldn't recommend to buy, you know, just because of, you know, just do a little bit of research whether I'm right or wrong. I just't recommend to buy. Just because of, just do a little bit of research. Whether I'm right or wrong, I just don't feel comfortable. I'll say it, Lenovo, yeah. There's certain laptop that I wouldn't recommend to buy. And so, you have great products here. I'll plug to Microsoft, used to work for Microsoft. There's some really good laptops, HPs, Apple,

whatever you want to call it. I would say that we got to be smart. And what you're seeing here on the national security side, on the manufacturing side, it is, we have massive opportunities to bring a lot of jobs, a lot of concepts, and build up our industries within the United States, and doing our costs. We're going to pay a little bit more, but I'd rather pay a little bit more

and be safer down the road. Does that make sense? Like I'd rather have a little bit of pain now, but it'd bring jobs and opportunities back into this country and be safer and protect our national interests versus getting a little bit cheaper today, but selling to someone that's gonna do me

a lot more harm in the future, potentially. That's just not a risk that I'm willing to take. So, you know, I'm hopeful that over the next couple of years we're gonna see a pretty drastic change in that. I'll be part of that solution, hopefully. So tell me more about what you are working on right now. So I'm working on the national security side,

some of the things we just talked about. Another aspect of my business that I'm standing up with some really good teammates is the concept of what's happening in Europe, the war in Ukraine, and not the war itself. I'm talking about post-war. There's a requirement there to rebuild. It's disastrous what has happened to Ukraine. Whole community, cities have been completely leveled. History has been leveled over there.

And so there's going to be a requirement to rebuild. And I think this is going to be a pretty big endeavor. And I want to be a part of that. And I know my company and the groups that I work with want to be a part of that solution. We want to allow these 10 million plus refugees who left Ukraine to come back home and have the opportunity to rebuild, restart. So an example of something that I know is imperative to the rebuilding of Ukraine is partnerships with different

European countries and then bringing in a is something that I know is imperative to the rebuilding of Ukraine is partnerships with different European countries and then bringing in companies like heavy-lift helicopters. We own one heavy-lift helicopter that's the best in the world. I just think about the reality. Out of Poland, there's about eight border crossing points. It's already hard to get through today. Imagine when you bring all these people back and bring all these companies that are gonna wanna be a part of the rebuilding.

It's gonna take days to cross the border potentially when you can have, once they open up the airspace, you can have these heavy lift helicopters lifting 10, 20, 30,000 tons, 10, 15, 20, 30 people at a time, cranes, be able to move what would take days and hours, potentially. That's going to help the country rebuild a lot faster. So these are concepts that we sat down

and trying to figure out how do we play a part in the rebuilding of Ukraine. And it's by bringing American jobs to Europe. It's by bringing American companies to Europe. It's by partnering with good European companies, by partnering with good European companies, by partnering with good European governments. It's the other exciting part of my job is I get to work on national security, but also get to work with, you know, build up some great American companies who are doing a lot of good around the world. So this has been an absolutely fascinating

conversation. Any final thoughts as we finish? I'm an optimist, right? I'm not looking to go pick fights with anybody around the world. I'm looking to bridge gaps and heal. That's what I want. I've done enough fighting. Too much in my life. But in this country right now now I'm excited to be a part of this what I could what I see as the bridging that gap and I'm gonna make a commitment for as long as it takes to be that individual that's in the middle trying to listen to everybody and bring everybody together because that to me is too important. There's no way you're gonna sell me on picking one side

because it doesn't make sense and I think think we're going to be just fine. This is not the end, folks. Sometimes it's good to take a step back and appreciate what we have, to remind ourselves of how hard it is, how hard we've worked to be where we are and who we are, and that we got to continue earning every day. It's not free. Well, Florin Groberg, it's such a pleasure to have had you on. Thank you. Thank you all for joining Florin Groberg and me on this episode of American Thought Leaders. I'm your host, Jan Jekielek.