An Army of Normal Folks - Autism Acceptance Month: Erin's Hope for Friends (Pt 1)

Episode Date: April 29, 2025

April is National Autism Acceptance Month. And in honor of it, we wanted to bring back to you one of our most compelling episodes about autism, with Army member Stacy Horst. Her daughter Erin was bullied and excluded by her peers because she had autism, which led to taking her own life at 17 years old. Only four days later, Stacy and her husband Darren heroically decided that they would do everything in their power to prevent any other family from going through this. Their non-profit, Erin’s Hope for Friends, opened a physical location called “e’s Club” where more than 400 teens and young adults with autism go on the weekends and build friendships.   Support the show: https://www.normalfolks.us/premiumSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey everybody, this is an episode that we originally ran on October of 2023, but April is National Autism Acceptance Month. And in honor of that, we wanted to bring back to you one of our favorite episodes, which happens to be about autism, with Army member Stacey Horst. And it's kind of that epiphany moment that either we're going to do something or this might kill us and we have another child and we can't do that. So we sat and talked about all those times when Aaron didn't get invited to birthday parties and didn't get the invitation to go to the football games and didn't get asked to do things and realized that if she had had somewhere to go where she felt safe and could have fun and it had absolutely

nothing to do with therapy, just fun, just fun to be with other kids and meet other kids and create friendships that she probably would still be with us today. Welcome to an Army of Normal Folks. I'm Bill Courtney. I'm a normal guy. I'm a husband. I'm a father. I'm an entrepreneur. And I've been a football coach in inner city Memphis. And the last part, it unintentionally led to an Oscar for the film about our team, which is called Undefeated. I believe our country's problems will never be solved by a bunch of fancy people in nice suits talking big words that nobody really ever uses or understands on CNN and Fox, but

rather an army of normal folks, us, just you and me deciding, hey, I can help. That's what Stacey Horse, the voice we just heard, has done. Stacey's daughter, Erin, was bullied and excluded by her peers because she had autism. And tragically, that isolation led to her taking her own life at only 16 years old. Stacey and her husband Darren chose not to be victims and they started the non-profit Aaron's Hope for Friends to create physical clubs where kids with autism can hang out

on the weekends and just be buddies. You know, enjoy friendships as we're all meant to. I can't wait for you to meet Erin, right after these brief messages from our generous sponsors. In 2020, a group of young women in a tidy suburb of New York City found themselves in an AI-fuelled nightmare. Someone was posting photos. It was just me naked. York City found themselves in an AI-fuelled nightmare. Someone was posting photos.

It was just me naked. Well, not me, but me with someone else's body parts on my body parts that looked exactly like my own. I wanted to throw up. I wanted to scream. It happened in Levittown, New York. But reporting the series took us through the darkest corners of the internet, and to the front lines of a global battle against deep fake pornography.

This should be illegal, but what is this? This is a story about a technology that's moving faster than the law, and about vigilantes trying to stem the tide. I'm Margie Murphy. And I'm Olivia Carville. This is Levertown, a new podcast from iHeart Podcasts, Bloomberg, and Kaleidoscope. Listen to Levertown on Bloomberg's Big Take podcast. Find it on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

In 1978, Roger Caron's first book was published, and he was unlike any first-time author Canada had ever seen. Roger Caron was 16 when first convicted. He spent 24 of those years in jail. 12 years in solitary. He went from an ex-con to a literary darling almost overnight. He was instantly a celebrity. He was an adrenaline junkie and he was the star of the show. Go-Boy is the gritty true story of how one man fought his way out of some of the darkest places imaginable. I had a knife go in my stomach, puncture my skin, break my ribs. I had my feps all in my hands. Only to find himself back where he started. Rod, you're saying this, I've never hurt anybody but myself. And I said, oh, you're so wrong.

You're so wrong on that one, Rod. From Campside Media and iHeart Podcasts, listen to GoBoy on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Here's the deal. We got to set ourselves up. See retirement is the long game. We gotta make moves and make them early. Set up goals.

Don't worry about a setback. Just save up and stack up to reach them. Let's put ourselves in the right position. Pre-game to greater things. Start building your retirement plan at thisispretirement.org brought to you by AARP and the Ad Council. And the dream season is now complete. The Golden State Warriors are the 2015 NBA champions.

On the new limited podcast series, Dub Dynasty, it's been 10 years since their shocking run to a championship. We examine the controversial move that made it possible. It's never a great conversation as a player when you hear that you're being benched. For the entire behind the scenes story of Golden State's incredible 10 year run, listen to Dub Dynasty on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on Good Company,

the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi, for a conversation that's anything but ordinary. We dive into the competitive world of streaming, how she's turning so-called niche into mainstream gold, connecting audiences with stories that truly make them feel seen. What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core.

It's this idea that there are so many stories out there, and if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen. to curate and help the right person discover the right content. The term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen. Get a front row seat to where media, marketing, technology, entertainment, and sports collide. And hear how leaders like Anjali are carving out space and shaking things up a bit in the most crowded of markets. Listen to Good Company on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay.

Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay.

Okay. Okay. Okay. Stacy Horst, how are you? I'm good, how are you? I'm good. How are you? Good. Welcome to Memphis. Thank you.

I, before we even begin, I've got to, I got to give you props. You're one of what I hope is the first of many, but you're a groundbreaker for an Army of Normal folks. Did you know that? No, I did not. You are. And here's what it is. So far, every guest we've had, Alex, our producer and Ironlight Labs, and the people that make this show happen have worked really hard to find compelling

stories of normal folks doing extraordinary things all over the country. And they found them through pouring through media and articles and I guess it's good we're talking about this because one of the questions I get often is how do you find all these people and that's how they've done it, but You are the first of the organic what I'm gonna call the organic guest in that We didn't find you that way, you found us. I remember opening an email from you not that long ago. What was it? A month ago? A month

and a half? How long ago? Probably two, two and a half months ago. You think so? Yeah. Early on in our release. And Stacey Horst is our first organically grown Army of Normal Folks guest. I wish I had a belt around. I was just going to say woohoo! Yeah, you are a woohoo. This is a woohoo moment for us. And really, you exemplify a microcosm of what the whole idea is. We're trying to grow a community that celebrates and listens

and learns and grows off one another. And so you are the first of that community. And so you will always hold a special place in the history of an Army of Normal Folks being the first organic guest we have. So in a very real sense, welcome. And thanks for being here. Well, thank you. Thank you for what you're doing. Oh, well, thank you for what you're doing. And I got to tell you, when I read your email, and we're not going to get to it yet, wow, my heart skipped a beat. And I find the work that you're doing to be remarkable, frankly. The depth of the person you and your

husband are is immeasurable in my opinion and we're going to share all of that. So tell me about Rachel. Not now. Rachel coming up. Rachel coming up. Oh, wow. Um, she's a lot of fun. She loved fun. No, she's just she was a very fun kid, very sassy, but very sweet. She was a good older sister. She, you know, just she liked it. She loved the arts. Both of our girls did everything. They played sports, they did arts, involved in church. And Rachel ended up, both of the girls ended up finishing school in Atlanta because that's where we ended up last.

And she ended up going to Savannah College of Art and Design. Oh, cool. And she's a photographer. That's very cool. Yeah. And she's married now? She is, she's married. Her husband also went to SCAD, and that's where they met.

Wow, that's the artsy family. Do they have kids? They have one little boy who just turned two. He's probably a meathead football player player and he'll never do the arts. That'll probably what'll happen. I don't know. We'll see. We'll see.

Pretty artsy group. Yeah, we'll see. All right. And so tell us about Erin. Oh, Erin loved animals. Erin was a very sweet little girl. As we'll talk about, she was diagnosed with autism when she was three and really her passion was animals. She also played sports. She played every sport known to man and she loved to give away her stuff.

Nothing that she had was hers. Everything she had could be somebody else's. If she saw that somebody needed something, she would come home and get it and go give it to them. And without telling us, by the way, she played the drums. She was an awesome drummer. She was in a band and one of the kids at school who was also in the band and played the drums needed a kick pedal. And she had two. Don't know if you have kids that played musical instruments, but this stuff is not cheap. It's expensive. Yes.

And she came home and took the kick pedal back to school the next day and gave it away. And we found out weeks later. So she's a sweet kid. Oh, yeah. And loved animals. Yes. And had a big heart. Yes. and had a big heart. I gotta ask you, how, you know, people listening to us are gonna

hear this whole story in depth. But I gotta, I gotta get to get a face on both Erin and your family. Three. Now when you say she was diagnosed with, you said level one autism, is that how you say it? I think that was formally referred to as Asperger's. Am I right about that? Why don't we call it Asperger's anymore? That's a good question. I'd like to know that myself. They chose to change the DSM-5,

which is where you go for diagnoses. And they lumped everything under ASD, which is Autism Spectrum Disorder. Why they did that, I don't know. Because these teens, young adults, children who are in level one or Asperger's are and can be much different than what level three would be which could be nonverbal. having tantrums. How many levels are there? Three. There are three. So I'm assuming then one is the slightest level, then two, then three is the deepest level. I'm asking. I don't know.

Is that right? Yes, that's right. So many people are blind to autism that they don't really understand. I mean, you know, is a level one person functioning in a way that maybe you wouldn't know unless you just got up close and talked to them. Because I hear you say, she loved animals, she played sports. Was she, you know, mainlined in school? You see what I'm saying? Explain that existence. 05.00 I think that it's, yes, I think that you can look at people in level one, and unless you go up to them

and have a conversation with them, because basically one of their biggest deficits is their social interactions. Like you and I are sitting here looking at each other in the eye having a conversation where they find that extremely difficult to look you in the eye and to have a conversation on point. For example, if Erin was in a group and they're talking about going to a football game and they were having a conversation

and she wanted to add something to the conversation, she would be standing there thinking about what she wanted to say for probably 60, 90 seconds before it would come out of her mouth. Well for us, 60 or 90 seconds is a long time and we've already moved on. We're not talking about the football game anymore. We're talking about where we're going to have dinner or what we're going to eat. So when they choose to say something, then they're behind. And sadly, that's where a lot of them get ridiculed or bullied because they're trying to fit in and yet they're behind the eight ball in terms of the conversation. And it's really a social thing, but their, you know, their brilliance is amazing. Could Erin verbalize the world she saw differently than everybody else to you? And would she

do that with you? Oh, absolutely. What would she say? What would the, what did the, how did the world look different to Erin as a child with autism level one than it would to you and me? Can you give me an example to help me and the listeners kind of go, oh, you know, I didn't realize that they would see it that differently. I mean, how would she verbalize that she would see things that were different than the way you would see them? would see things that were different than the way you would see them. I think the biggest thing is the level of compassion, the level of emotion. So how she felt and saw in certain situations, whether it's at school, whether it's at home, in

the neighborhood with friends, it's like a richer emotion, if you will, of caring for other people. Where I would say, I don't want to say like we're more crass and we just go about our day and do what we want to do, but she, you know, we do sense other people, but she would sense other people's emotions and especially in the essence of someone was sad, if someone was hurt. And now a few messages from our generous sponsors. But first, I hope you'll consider following an army of normal folks on all of our social media channels for more powerful content, which is also great for sharing to help grow the army.

Our handle is at army of normal folks on all of them except Twitter, which I guess is X these days, which is interesting because everybody says X formally called Twitter. So we might as well just call it Twitter. Whatever. At Army Normal Folks. We'll be right back. In 2020, a group of young women in a tidy suburb of New York City found themselves in an AI-fuelled nightmare. Someone was posting photos. It was just me naked. Well, not me, but me with someone else's body parts on my body parts that looked exactly like my own.

I wanted to throw up. I wanted to scream. It happened in Levittown, New York. But reporting this series took us through the darkest corners of the internet and to the front lines of a global battle against deepfake pornography. This should be illegal, but what is this?

This is a story about a technology that's moving faster than the law and about vigilantes trying to stem the tide. I'm Margie Murphy. And I'm Olivia Carville. This is Levertown, a new podcast from iHeart Podcasts, Bloomberg and Kaleidoscope. Listen to Levertown on Bloomberg's Big Take podcast.

Find it on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. In 1978, Roger Caron's first book was published and he was unlike any first time author Canada had ever seen. Roger Caron was 16 when first convicted. Had spent 24 of those years in jail. 12 years in solitary. He went from an ex-con to a literary darling almost overnight.

He was instantly a celebrity. He was an adrenaline junkie, and he was the star of the show. Go-Boy is the gritty true story of how one man fought his way out of some of the darkest places imaginable. I had a knife go in my stomach, puncture my screen, break my ribs. I had my feps all in my hands. Only to find himself back where he started. Roger's saying this, I've never hurt anybody but myself.

And I said, oh, you're so wrong. You're so wrong on that one, Roger. From Campside Media and iHeart Podcasts, listen to GO! Boy on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. just save up and stack up to reach them. Let's put ourselves in the right position, pregame to greater things. Start building your retirement plan at thisispretirement.org, brought to you by AARP and the Ad Council.

And the dream season is now complete. The Golden State Warriors are the 2015 NBA champions. On the new limited podcast series, Dub Dynasty, it's been 10 years since their shocking run to a championship. We examined the controversial move that made it possible. It's never a great conversation as a player when you hear that you're being benched. For the entire behind the scenes story of Golden State's incredible 10 year run, listen to Dub Dynasty on the iHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. We ready to fight? I'm ready to fight. Is that what I thought it was? Oh, this is fighting words. Okay. I'll put the hammer back.

Hi, I'm George M. Johnson, a bestselling author with the second most banned book in America. Now more than ever, we need to use our voices to fight back. And that's what we're doing on Fighting Words. We're not gonna let anyone silence us. That's the reason why they're banning books like yours, George. That's the reason why they're trying to stop the teaching of black history or queer history, any history that challenges the whitewash norm. Or put us in a box. Black people have never, ever depended on the so-called mainstream to

support us. That's why we are great. We are the greatest culture makers in world history. Listen to Fighting Words on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. I said earlier when I got your email that, you know, it resonated with me deeply. So my wife is, she might kill me. She's 51 and she has a sister that's in her forties and that's the youngest, actually late thirties, she has a brother that's in her 40s but when I met Lisa her little brother was eight and his name's Ben and he's special needs and his special needs is a result of him having encephalitis when he was an infant. Ben is highly

functional but has the mental capacity of you, maybe a first grader in that range. And one of the beauties of Ben is that he can go to Florida on trips, right? He can ride an airplane and we can go with us to family vacations and go out to eat and eat well and he can feed himself and dress himself and bathe himself and all of those things. But I have watched my in-laws spend the last 32 years of their life caring for Ben in a way that is, um, heroic. Um, they gave him every opportunity that they could give him within his capabilities to have as normal life as possible while also protecting him from the things that he can protect himself from.

He's been beaten by staff, care staff before. He's endured trauma. And he has at times expressed his deep sadness and grief that he wasn't normal. Heartbreaking. his deep sadness and grief that he wasn't normal. Heartbreaking. But in the same respect, a real blessing to our family, when I read your email, I felt you deeply. And the reason I wanna know what you felt like when you found out that at three that

Aaron had, I don't know, I want to call it Asperger's, but I think that's woke and correct level one, whatever. Was a child with level one autism. I think that's why I'm supposed to say it properly. I mean, no disrespect. I think I know a little bit about what kind of shock that was to your family dynamic. And it is, to be perfectly candid, gut-wrenching, but it's also what God's put in your life and it's a blessing you've been giving and you go to work. Absolutely.

So, what that work looked like from three to call it eight or nine years old for you and Darren and why I asked so much about was Rachel because I also understand the dynamic of my wife when she was a teenager trying to figure out her stuff, having a special needs brother, and that's tough. So tell me about that dynamic. Well, like what you said, you go to work. I mean, you find out whatever interventions you can do, whatever treatment you can do, training, anything to try and give them. I mean, she went to speech therapy, occupational therapy. I mean, I think we did every kind of therapy known to man. Then you're driving her all over the place?

Uh-huh. Doing everything you can. Yes. And there was, if it's anything like my experience, there was no thing that might make her life a little bit better that you wouldn't drop and go to. Yes, absolutely. And y'all did that? Oh yeah, 100%.

How did it affect Rachel? That's a good question. Now, I think that it's, I mean, I saw as you're talking about your wife, Lisa. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, you're a teen who's trying to figure out your own way in life and you have a special needs sibling. sibling, and I know that a lot of time and energy is spent trying to, I don't want to say make that right, but to help Aaron. And so therefore, you know, there is time that I think that's taken away from the other child.

And then it's hard when Rachel's trying to figure out her own thing and she has a sister that wants to come with. Everywhere. Everywhere. And, you know, Rachel would have people over to the house and they'd be down in the basement. And, you know, of course, Aaron wants to be a part of it. One of the beauties of Asperger's, and I call it that because that's what she was diagnosed with. Good. If you call it that, I can. Yes, you can. You know, she would... Now I lost my train of thought because we talked

about that. But you know, Rachel, Erin wanted to be everywhere. Oh, I know, the blessing was that Erin got along really well with people older than her and young kids. It's the peer-to-peer relationship that is the struggle. So all of Rachel's friends, she loved them. Oh, and she loved him because she could go over and she could talk to them. And I'm sure for her, it was like being normal, what she thought normal was like. But that also got in Rachel's way. So... Well, and the reason I ask is, you know, again, I think it's really important for people listening to us to understand that when an Aaron or a Ben come along in your life, it's a family occurrence.

It is a life altering and many times for the better, I don't want to make it sound like it's all negative because...but there is. But, you know, frankly, people cringe when you say there's negatives, but there is negatives. It's just the reality of it. There's difficulties. It's tough. It does change family dynamic. It doesn't mean it's all bad and it doesn't mean you resent. But the reality is there's some tough things that come along with all of it. And it's important for people to understand that parents and families with kids like Ben or like Aaron with Asperger's are going through their own difficulties to try to make the

best life they can for their child. And a little understanding and support not only for the person with Asperger's but the families caring for them is really important. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. Did you have that? Um, I think in the beginning, you feel like you're on an island. Exactly why I asked. Yeah. Like, you know, you feel like you're on an island and you're trying to figure out how to get off and what's going to be the best way to get off.

And, um, through time and being involved in different things, I think that you acquire that group or that support. But in the beginning, you definitely feel like you're out there all by yourself. Which we will come back to in terms of the importance of the work that you're now doing. Because I think the work that you're now doing is not only really vital for people with Asperger's but also for the family surrounding them. So as a parent with a kid struggling with this and you're struggling. And I know you gotta be proud. I mean, she's sweet, she's cooking,

she's caring for kids, she's playing sports, she's doing all these things. But then she's also a kid with autism. And I'm not making excuses, but I remember Ben. And you can't really expect 12, 13, 14, 15-year-old kids to really deeply understand someone who's not like them. And I'm not excusing bullying or being off-putting, but I've seen it, you know, and did Erin feel different? In what way?

Well, did she get invited to birthday parties? Ah, no. Oh, absolutely, they feel different. Yeah, no, they don't. And did she verbalize how that hurt her? In the essence of saying, you really found out about it more after the fact. Mm-hmm. Because you wouldn't really know as a parent if my child's not invited, I don't know that

that's happening. She's not invited. Right. I don't know that that's happening, right? Until she finds out that so-and-so had a birthday party and she wasn't invited. Well, then you find out. Did she ever come to you and say, Mom, why am I not getting invited to the birthday parties? Did she ever verbalize that kind of thing? I, you know, I think that she did. I'm trying to remember one specific occasion, but I can tell you with the beginning of social media, I mean, that's made it. Oh, because she's seeing all our friends on Facebook at parties and stuff, or not our

friends, but her classmates or peers. Right. And she's not there. Correct. Didn't hurt her. Yes. on Facebook at parties and stuff, or not her friends, but her classmates or peers, and she's not there, then it hurt her. Yes. And you knew it. We knew it. And she would say stuff, but I can't remember one specific situation where she came to us. I can't imagine.

But yes, I mean, the social media, although it can be beautiful, it's awful. I can't imagine. I mean, you had to have just, your heart had to have broke for her. It breaks now. Just thinking about it. I'm sorry to take you back through it. I just want people to understand why you're doing what you're doing and until people really get the depth of this and I understand the depth of it.

I've watched it. I've watched people do the making fun of by jerking hands or whatever. I can't even verbalize what I'm saying, but the, you know, people will do certain things that simulate or articulate non verbally special needs people. And I've watched them do that behind Vince back back before and frankly I've wanted to beat their... I'm right there with you. So I said earlier, nobody better give me a gun. Yeah, I mean...

It will not end well. It's wrong on so many levels but what it is, is it's a lack of maturity and understanding again of what an entire family goes through. We'll be right back. In 2020, a group of young women in a tidy suburb of New York City found themselves in an AI-fuelled nightmare. Someone was posting photos.

It was just me naked. Well, not me, but me with someone else's body parts on my body parts that looked exactly like my own. I wanted to throw up. I wanted to scream. It happened in Levittown, New York. But reporting the series took us through the darkest corners of the internet, and to the front lines of a global battle against deepfake pornography.

This should be illegal, but what is this? This is a story about a technology that's moving faster than the law, and about vigilantes trying to stem the tide. I'm Margie Murphy. And I'm Olivia Carville. In 1978, Roger Caron's first book was published, and he was unlike any first-time author Canada had ever seen. Roger Caron was 16 when first convicted. Had spent 24 of those years in jail.

12 years in solitary. He went from an ex-con to a literary darling almost overnight. He was instantly a celebrity. He was an adrenaline junkie, and he was the star of the show. Go-Boy is the gritty true story of how one man fought his way out of some of the darkest places imaginable. I had a knife through my stomach puncture my screen, break my ribs, I had my guts all in my hands. Only to find himself back where he started. Roger's saying this, I've never hurt anybody but myself. And I said, oh, you're so wrong.

You're so wrong on that one, Roger. From Campside Media and iHeart Podcasts, listen to GoBoy on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Here's the deal. We got to set ourselves up. you get your podcasts. ourselves in the right position, pregame to greater things. Start building your retirement plan at thisispretirement.org, brought to you by AARP and the Ad Council. And the dream season is now complete. The Golden State Warriors are the 2015 NBA champions.

On the new limited podcast series, Dub Dynasty, it's been 10 years since their shocking run to a championship. We examine the controversial move that made it possible. It's never a great conversation as a player when you hear that you're being benched. For the entire behind the scenes story of Golden State's incredible 10 year run, listen to Dub Dynasty on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Are you ready to fight? I'm ready to fight. radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

We ready to fight? I'm ready to fight. Is that what I thought it was? Oh, this is fighting words. Okay. I'll put the hammer back. Hi, I'm George M. Johnson, a bestselling author with the second most banned book in America. Now more than ever, we need to use our voices to fight back.

And that's what we are doing on Fighting Words. We're not gonna let anyone silence us. That's the reason why they're banning books like yours, George. That's the reason why they're trying to stop the teaching of black history or queer history, any history that challenges the whitewash norm. Or put us in a box. Black people have never, ever,

depended on the so-called mainstream to support us. That's why we are great. We are the greatest culture makers in world history. Listen to Fighting Words on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. I think that it's, and I say this because for anybody who hears this podcast, if you're having struggles with a child, regardless of whether they have autism or not, if they're being bullied, you have to, have to, have to just make sure that you are alert.

Erin was bullied at church. She was bullied at school. She was bullied in sports. Did you see it? Did you see it happen? Again, you find out after the fact. But how can you go, you know, and at church she went on a camp retreat, and she was in a cabin with three other girls and the three other girls went to the counselor, sorry, and asked if they could leave the cabin and they let the other three girls leave the cabin and left our daughter there by herself. On a camp. Mm-hmm. At church. So it can happen anywhere. It can happen online,

which it did. It happened through email and all these things. And to your point, when you asked me if she told us before, when that email came to her, she walked downstairs with her computer and showed us what it said. What'd it say? Said basically that she was horrible and she should kill herself. And it came from a classmate? Three classmates at school. And she went to a school for children with disabilities. Oh my gosh. school for children with disabilities.

Oh my gosh. So nowhere is safe, I guess you could say. And I hate to say that, you know, it breaks my heart, but it's true. So anyway, these things were happening and she had talked prior about not wanting to live and we had been going to the counselor and a psychiatrist and put her on antidepressants because she was obviously not happy and didn't want to be here anymore. And that's when we went through the big snowstorm in Atlanta that shut the world down and we were actually looking at different schools to move her to a different school. And she had gone and tried a new school the day before and I think that she was scared

to death that she was going to have to go back to the other school that she was currently at. And she made a huge thing of lasagna. We were having the neighbors over because everybody was stuck in their houses because it had snowed. And I went to pick up one of our elderly neighbors in my car across the street because you couldn't walk, it was so icy. And unfortunately, Erin went upstairs and took her own life in her room. own life in her room. I'm so, so sorry.

I cannot imagine that pain. And I guess you come home to that? Yeah. My husband was at home. He found her and then I came in and we tried to call 911 and tried to resuscitate her. Nobody deserves that. Um, I, uh, do you need to take a break? Are you good?

I'm fine. Strong woman. So that's what happens when people get bullied. And that's what happens when kids with special needs have to live in a world where people are too uninformed and too selfish to care beyond themselves. And like I said before, we heard the outcome of Aaron's life is that this is a thing that an entire family deals with in life and in death. And I think we can all agree it's one of the worst things in the world is the thought of a parent outliving a child and the trauma that that causes a family. You, however, have managed to figure out a way to turn that on its head, which is what we're going to get to and celebrate. But one last thing before we get there. What happens next? Before you go to work?

You're dealing with grief, you've got your kid's belongings, you've got another daughter, you've got a husband and a wife who are both traumatized and both feeling all of their own stuff, probably, oddly, including maybe even some guilt and what ifs and all of that crap you got to go through. How long did that last? What's today? Yeah. Seriously, it hasn't stopped. You know, it's I don't.

How long ago was this? I haven't met another parent who's lost a child that still, to the day that I meet them, you still are going through all that. You still go through the what ifs. You still go through the guilt. You still wonder what could I have done? What could I have done differently? So, I don't think it's, there is no end to that. There won't be an end to that until I see Aaron in heaven.

So you carry it with the rest of your life? I think so. So, when I was in ninth grade on daddy number four, I got into a fight that I started. I didn't really start it. He was kind of a jerk, but I got started. I started the fight part and it was an unwise decision by me because he dotted by pretty good. But anyway, I had to go to the coach's office because back then if you were a football player and you got into a fight that incidentally, you went to coach's office. And coach Spain, who's past now was my coach and he took a pretty special interest in me. He was a guy from a little town called Milan, Tennessee, where they go cotton, no nonsense,

old school raw bone guy. And was that way as a coach, but was one of these guys who had the ability to really be in tune with not just the football player, but the person, you know, and he took he was really a Mentor somebody I just I think every high school kid kind of worships their football coach at least they did back in my day, but There was on another level with him and so I was in his office at the door closed and He asked me why I did what I did and I just told him I was angry and he said well you got a lot to be angry about. He said you know I understand you're going through a lot of stuff and he said um and he said but you know you're you're

a strapping young guy and he said you really have a decision to make Billy back then I was Billy So you really have a decision make Billy said you can decide to be a victim of All of the chaos and trauma and Dysfunction that's in your life and Be just like them. Or you can denounce it, recognize it's a wonderful illustration about how not to live your life,

and you can be a rock that other people break themselves on. I love that. And he said, you can decide. And he said, and I can tell you this right now, you at your age can't control any of the dysfunction you're dealing with in your life, but you can absolutely control what you decide to do about it with it. And I'm not going to say it was that very instant that I had an epiphany, but it was the beginning of me deciding that I was going to denounce victimhood of my circumstances

and be a rock other people are going to break themselves on. And that I was going to rise above it and quit feeling sorry for myself and recognize that everybody has trauma, everybody has problems. The level of the difficulty in some people's lives are certainly more than others, but everybody experiences stuff. And I could either fall, pray to it and be a victim of it and feel sorry for myself and end up just like them, or I could be a rock other people are going to break themselves on.

And I think there's certain times in our life that we all have an opportunity to demonstrate our willingness to be a victim or a rock. Absolutely. When is it you decided to be a rock? Four days after she passed away. Tell me about that day. As you were talking about before, we, about before, you were obviously living in the house and all of Erin's belongings are there and she passed away in her bedroom.

So we were going through her stuff. Oh gosh, I'm sorry to interrupt you. How do you do that? I don't know. Four days after your child's gone and you're going through her stuff in her room. We just went in and sat on the floor. And it's kind of that epiphany moment that either we're going to do something or this might kill us,

and we have another child, and we can't do that. So we sat and talked about all those times when Aaron didn't get invited to birthday parties and didn't get the invitation to go to the football games and didn't get asked to do things and realized that if she had had somewhere to go where she felt safe and could have fun, and it had absolutely nothing to do with therapy. Just fun, just fun to be with other kids and meet other kids and create friendships that she probably would still be with us today. So, with Aaron still heavy on their hearts and minds, Stacey and her husband Darren created that place and she tells that incredible story in part 2, which is now available.

And I'm telling you guys, you do not want to miss it. But if for some strange reason you do, make sure to join the Army of Normal Folks at NormalFolks.us and sign up to become a member of the movement. By signing up you'll also receive a weekly email with short episode summaries in case you happen to miss an episode or you prefer reading about our incredible guests. Together guys, we can change this country. And it starts with you. I'll see you in part two. In 2020, a group of young women found themselves in an AI-fuelled nightmare.

Someone was posting photos. It was just me naked. Well, not me, but me with someone else's body parts. This is Levittown, a new podcast from iHeart Podcasts, Bloomberg and Kaleidoscope, about the rise of deepfake pornography and the battle to stop it. Listen to Levittown on Bloomberg's Big Take podcast. Find it on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on Good Company, the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode,

I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi. We dive into the competitive world of streaming. What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core. There are so many stories out there, and if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen. Listen to Good Company on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Sam Mullins, and I've got a new podcast coming out called Go Boy, the gritty true story of how one man fought his way out of some of the darkest places imaginable. Roger Caron was 16 when first convicted. That spent 24 of those years in jail.

But when Roger Caron picked up a pen and paper, he went from an ex-con to a literary darling. From Campside Media and iHeart Podcasts, listen to Go Boy on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This season of Revisionist History, we're investigating everything from the secret behind the perfect nooks and crannies in Thomas's English Muffins to the merits of Paw Patrol against its critics. There's some things that really piss me off

when it comes to Paw Patrol. It's pretty simple, it sucks. If my son watches Paw Patrol. I hate it. Everyone hates it except for me. Listen to Revisionist History on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. My name is Brendan Patrick Hughes, host of Divine Intervention. This is a story about radical nuns in combat boots and wild-haired priests trading blows with J. Edgar Hoover in a hell-bent effort to sabotage a war. J. Edgar Hoover was furious.

He was out of his mind and he wanted to bring the Catholic left to its knees. Listen to Divine Intervention on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.