An Army of Normal Folks - Jeff Deskovic: The Wrongfully Convicted Man Freeing Others Just Like Himself (Pt 1)

Episode Date: April 30, 2024

At 16 years old, Jeff was wrongfully convicted of raping and murdering a classmate. And after sixteen years in prison, he was finally exonerated. Rather than being dominated by victimhood that no one would have blamed him for, Jeff went to work fighting to free others who’ve been wrongly convicted and he's already freed 11 folks! Support the show: https://www.normalfolks.us/premiumSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

They took the crime scene DNA evidence, which didn't match me, and put it in the DNA data bank and it matched. And it hit. It hit. It matched the actual perpetrator whose DNA was in that data bank because, left free, while I was doing time for his crime, he killed a second victim just three and a half years later who was a schoolteacher and had two children. The very thing we talked about happening

happened which is by railroading you they ignored that there was a murder on the loose and he did it again. Oh my goodness. So on September 20th 2006 the convictions overturned. I was released. I went back to court November 2nd 2006 at which point all the charges were dismissed against me on actual innocence grounds and he was subsequently arrested and convicted of the crime. Welcome to an army of normal folks I'm Bill. I'm Bill Courtney. I'm a normal guy. I'm a husband, a father, I'm an entrepreneur, and I've been a football coach at inner city Memphis.

And the last part, it accidentally led to an Oscar for the film about our football team. It's called Undefeated. Guys, I believe our country's problems will never be solved by a bunch of fancy people in nice suits using big words that nobody ever uses on CNN and Fox, but rather by an army of normal folks, us, just you and me deciding, hey, I can help. That's what Jeff Deskovec, the voice we just heard is done. At 16 years old, Jeff was wrongfully

convicted of raping and murdering a classmate, despite overwhelming evidence that he was innocent. And after serving 16 years for a crime that he did not commit, Jeff was finally exonerated. And rather than being dominated by anger or, as he puts it, victimhood, that no one would have blamed him for at all, he went to work. Fight him for the freedom of others who've been wrongfully convicted. He has already freed 11 people. I cannot wait for you to meet Jeff right after these brief messages from our generous sponsors I'm Hannah storm and my podcast NBA DNA with Hannah storm digs deep into the history of professional basketball

Along with my own as one of the first female sportscasters. Now let's get you up to speed on what else happened around the NBA today. We talked to all sorts of people I interacted with, from Dr. J to Charles Barkley, and recap iconic moments. Yes, he's got it. Here he comes. Way rock the baby to sleep and slam dunk. As well as some of the wild stories behind the scenes. We were like, what? What are we in for?

The scoreboard crashes before we even tip a game off. Today, the NBA is a global sports and entertainment giant. Players are multimillionaires and cultural icons. Igadala to Curry, back to Igadala, up for the layup. Oh, blocked by James. LeBron James. And these stories are about how we got here, both on and off the court. And what's next? Listen to NBA DNA with Hannah Storm on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. My name is Johnny B. Goode, and I'm the host of the new podcast,

Creating a Con, the story of VidCon. Over this nine part series, I'll explore the life and crimes of my best friend, Ray Trapani. I always wanted to be a criminal. If someone's like, oh, what's your best way of making money? I'm like, oh, we should start some sort of scheme. You see, Ray has this unique ability to find loopholes and exploit them.

They collected $30 million. There were headlines about it. His company, Centratec, was one of the hottest crypto startups in 2017. It was going to change the world until it didn't. I came into my office, opened my email, and the subject heading was FBI request. It was only a matter of time before the truth came out. You can only fake it till you make it for so long before they find out that your Harvard degree is not so crimson.

How could you sit there and do something that you know will objectively cause more harm in the world. Listen to Creating a Con, the story of Bitcoin on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Every family has skeletons in their closet. Mine certainly does. Ones that go back a hundred years and reach thousands of miles back to our hometown in Sicily. Ever since I can remember, my relatives told the story of my great, great grandmother who was killed by the mafia. I'm Jo Piazza, and in my new podcast, I'm taking on a generational vendetta, visiting the scene of the crime, confronting mafia experts, tracking down Italian officials, and even consulting

mediums to set the record straight on my great-great-grandmother's mysterious disappearance. And in between the fact-finding missions, I'll be drinking a lot of wine and eating all of the pasta. Come to Italy with me to solve this 100-year-old murder mystery. Listen to The Sicilian Inheritance on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Jeff Deskovic from the Bronx, all the way from New York, down here to Memphis. How are you? I'm great. Glad to be here.

How was the flight in? Scary. I thought I was going to die on it. The plane, like for about what seemed to me to be 10 minutes is, you know, up and down movement on the plane. And, you know, I thought it was close for 10 minutes and I thought I was gonna die. My stomach got upset then I felt too hot so I turned on double air you know for me and the passenger next to me and that helped the warming part but then I quickly got cold.

So it was short of fatality this was like the airplane trip from hell. We were 76 degrees yesterday and we're going to be 33 today. So I guess the high-low pressure systems probably created a lot of turbulence on the way down from New York and you're the beneficiary of all that. Well, thanks for making it. Absolutely. You didn't have to use a little bag in front of you, did you? No, thank God it didn't come to that. Although I felt I wasn't that far away from it either

though, just to be clear. Don't know if you paid any attention while you were getting over your green gills coming into the Crosstown Concourse, but you're in the Memphis Listing Lab, which is a cool thing that goes back to, as you know, I assume you know, Memphis is Elvis Presley, Jerry Lee Lewis, and a lot of rich Memphis heritage music. And Memphis Listening Lab is where we're recording from and kind of cool digs. It really, really is. I'm kind of, I'm a historian and I'm also nostalgic. So I'm kind of in awe right now. That's cool.

What you walked in, this was the Southeast region Sears Tower. And it was, when Sears went down, it became empty, and this place was dilapidated and completely empty, and homeless people living in it only 10 years ago. Wow. And this whole area around it was suffering.

And some investors in Memphis came together, refurbished and repurposed this entire building and Memphis Listening Lab is only one of a thousand tenants in this massive building that there's a school here, there's a grocery store here, restaurant, businesses, all kinds of things. So kind of a cool revitalization project and one of the places is this Memphis Listening Lab. So, anyway, welcome to Memphis. I'm glad you could see a little bit of our history. RG Thank you very much.

AC Your story is amazing and it really starts when you're 16. But just quickly, how did you grow up? Did you grow up in the Bronx? RG No, I grew up in Peekskill in Westchester County. I grew up in an apartment complex known as Crossroads. I would describe Peekskill as a middle-class, ethnically diverse city with a population of approximately 25,000 people. How far is that, you know, geographically so I can picture it on the map from like New York, Manhattan? One hour.

Peekskill is one hour north of Manhattan. Okay. It's suburbia. Middle class suburbia. Correct. Got it. What did your mom and dad do for a living? Yeah, my mother was a typist.

My father was actually never in my life in any aspect. Before I was even born, he wanted out of financial responsibility, so he denied that I was his. So I grew up really with my mother, my grandmother serving, who lived with us, served kind of like the second parent, but she was in a way a combination of both dad and mom. So she was mom because mom was the breadwinner, so grandma stayed home to care,

but grandma was also like the father in the sense that she was the disciplinarian who kept me and my brother who's three and a half years younger than me in line. Got it. I think many of us have had grandmothers like that. And in the South in particular, those grandmothers are not to be trifled with. Exactly. Neither was mine back north, so I can relate.

I got it. And so I guess you went to public high school and public schools? Dr. Justin Marchegiani I did. Well, I went to Catholic school from grades two through eight. The Peekskill High School, which was public, actually literally was across the street from the apartment complex that I grew up in and hence my deciding to go there rather than the... My mother wanted me to go to Catholic high school, but they had like the high school version of an entrance exam. And you know, being smarter than my parent, not. I decided to purposely flunk the entrance exam so that I could go to the public high school. And as a story will unfold, I mean, that really kind of shaped

my life and everything that happened after that. Of course, I had no way of knowing that. You purposely tanked the test because you wanted to go to public school, not Catholic school. Correct. Yes. Well, kids will do what kids do, right? That's right. If your grandmother had found that, she'd have probably whooped your butt. Exactly right. Exactly right.

Okay. So until you're 16, I guess in 16, are you a junior in high school? Well, I would have been. So, you know, I wanted to go to public high school, not just because of the geographic locale, but in the apartment complex where I grew up at, there were a lot of kids that lived in the buildings and in the surrounding areas. I was kind of like one of the main kids so that whatever I suggested would generally be what I would do, what we're going to do. We're going to play basketball, stickball, Monopoly, it's movie night, or half dozen games we made up and we even play tackle football without pads on the grass.

But whatever I would suggest would generally be what we all did. But that was my life after school, my life in high school. I thought that I was going to be mixed in with those kids since they all went to public school and not the Catholic grade school. But actually they were not. They were kids that were one or two years older than me. I had skipped first grade and I kind of caught up with me in going to high school. So everybody was like older than me. So I didn't quite fit in. I was kind of caught up with me in going to high school, so everybody was older than me. So I didn't quite fit in. I was kind of on the fringes of society.

And so my first year as a freshman, really I was kind of picked on in school. And so my grades suffered a lot. And it came to the point that I had to go to summer school to do two classes in order to pass. But I knew that if I did, then I would be in with these same kids again. And so I didn't go to summer school. I got left back. So I repeated freshman year. So at 16 years old, I was a sophomore, not

the junior that you correctly point out. Mathematically, I should have been. Okay, so what were you into in high school? Your freshman and sophomore year? Yeah, I mean I played basketball, I liked video games. I was kind of an athlete but not in the school, not in organized sports, not with the kids there. It was after school. I was into all those games that we used, you know, but loved playing kickball, for example. I liked playing basketball. I lived in the swimming pool.

We had a 12-foot pool with a diving board in it, you know, so that was available on the summer. I would describe myself as pretty athletic, pretty energetic after school. So what you're describing is a kid. Correct. Just a kid. Exactly. From're describing is a kid. Correct. Just a kid. Exactly. From a middle class neighborhood.

Yes. No affluence whatsoever. None whatsoever. But you had food on the table. Correct. You had a mother and a grandmother that cared for you, loved you and disciplined you and kept you straight as they could.

Yes. You weren't in a whole lot of trouble. Absolutely not, no. Did you do any drugs? Never, not a day in my life, not even now as an adult. Did you ever get picked up for shoplifting? Not even. Nothing.

Nothing. You're just a blue collar New York kid. Yes, exactly. Nothing really remarkable and nothing really, you're just a normal folk. Exactly, yes, that's true. And then your life changed. And then your life changed. And then my life changed. So on November 15th of 1989, your classmate, Angela Correa?

Correa. Correa was murdered. Yes, she was. And they found her strangled and raped, I believe. Yes, they did. Two days later on November 17th. How did that affect the school and a community of only 25,000 people? It rocked the community because murders were very rare. There were periodic town hall meetings where safety tips and progress on investigation

were held. Many people, you know, there were four sessions of Wake, many people attended three or four of them. It impacted everybody so much to the point that free mental health counseling was offered to everybody in Peekskill who wished to avail themselves of it. Do you remember her family? I do. I met the family afterwards.

So I went to wig sessions. I went to the funeral, the cemetery, and there was an announcement made at the cemetery grounds that anybody that wished to come back to the Correa home, have coffee, there would be some cookies and talk to the family was free to do so. And so I availed myself of that. And so I met the family, free to do so. And so I availed myself of that. And so I met the family, but that was afterwards. They seemed like a really tight, warm, close-knit family. There was a stepfather in the home, which was a new thing, just the idea of living with

an adult male. And to me, it all seemed to work and click. And it was something foreign to me somewhat, because again, I didn't have a father in the household. And it was sad. It was very sad. Yes, it was. And I was a sensitive teenager, and this did affect me emotionally.

This was my first real brush with death, and I did have an emotional reaction to that. That's important in the unfolding of the story because so it was one of the factors that put me on the police radar. So the police interviewed many students from the high school and some of them told the police they might want to talk with me because I didn't quite fit in. I guess the theory in their head was people that are quiet to themselves are more likely to commit a heinous crime. So I was suggested to the police to look at

for that reason. And secondarily, the police thought that, you know, given my actual relationship with the victim, which is to say really no relationship, she was in two of my classes of freshmen, one is a sophomore, I knew her name, she knew mine. The police interpreted my being emotional as some sort of outward sign that I was sorry for what I had done. So those two factors put me on the police radar and that was buttressed by a psychological profile that the Peekskill Police obtained from the NYPD, which purported to have the psychological characteristics of the actual perpetrator. And I had the misfortune of matching that. What was that?

Somebody that knew the victim, that was in high school, and that was a loner. Well, congrats, you really narrowed that down quite a bit, right? I can't believe I'm laughing. No, it's okay. We do dark humor and we laugh at stupidity and other stuff. So that's what got to be on the police radar. And so for about six weeks the police play this cat-and-mouse game with me in which half the time they would talk to me like I'm a suspect. And when they would push too hard

and I'd become frightened and I'd wanna get away from them, they would switch up the conversation. And Jeff is this junior detective helper theme was developed. Somehow or another, they learned that prior to being a teenager, the career that I dreamed about having was to be a cop.

So they would say things like, well, the kids won't talk freely around us, but they will around you. Let us know if you hear anything. Stop in from time to time. They did the, they would ask me opinion questions and congratulate me that my opinion was correct. They made me feel important. They did the good cop, bad cop routine and that intersected with growing up without a father or stepfather in the household. I began to look up to the cop who was pretending to be

my friend as a father figure. And thusly you trusted him. And thusly I trusted him. figure. And thusly you trusted him. And thusly I trusted him. So how long did this cat-and-mouse game go on? Six weeks. So six weeks after this girl's rape and murder they had solved nothing. Right. And I gotta believe in a town of 25,000 with grief counselors and a very rare murder and everything else, there was enormous amount of pressure on the police to figure out who did this thing. RG 1 Correct. And I want to add that beyond that general pressure, another element of that was that

the Correa family didn't think the Peekskill police knew what they were doing. And so they went to the state police and asked the state police to take over the investigation. The state police did not but they let that be known to the Peekskill police so that ratcheted up the pressure to solve. And I want to add also talking about how this impacted the community. Peekskill for most intents and purposes, shut down. I mean, parents were driving their kids to school, picking them up right after school,

you know, bringing them straight home. There was a general atmosphere of fear, rumor, and to some extent paranoia in Peekskill. Were you, your your mom and your grandmother scared a little bit yes we were we were my mother didn't want me to go out for a while and if I was then eventually when she let up a little bit and allowed us to go out you know I had to go out with my brother or or with another one of my friends she didn't want me to go outside or go anywhere by myself.

It's a bad time. It was a very bad time, yeah. During the six weeks of the cat and mouse, were you discussing these conversations with your mom or grandmother? I was not. I knew that, so I knew that my mother didn't want me to talk or interact with the police. So I told her about- Did she not trust him?

She didn't. She did not. No, she did not trust him. I told my mother about my first encounter with the police. And then she made clear to me that she didn't want me to talk to them because she knew that they were asking me questions and then they wanted me to try to help them with the case. But then that they also were asking me questions that suggested that I was a suspect.

So she didn't want me to have anything to do with them. But I was also 16 years old, and that's an age where many people, we start to think that we know everything, we know more than our parents are stupid. And to my way of thinking, well, I don't understand what your concern is They telling me that they want me to help them solve the crime. I didn't do anything What could possibly go wrong with my interacting or helping the police? so I hid that from them and the Pacekill police also knew that That my mother didn't want to have anything you me to have anything to do with them, but they

facilitated that. How is that legal for a police department to mess with a minor without their parent? Well, I mean, at 16, you're considered to be an adult for purposes of waiving your rights and speaking to the police without a parental authorization. Does that start at 16? Yes. Is that right? Yeah, that's right.

I didn't even know that. Yeah. So, eventually, I understand they said, you know, why don't you take a polygraph test and just go ahead and rid yourself of any suspicion? Correct. Exactly right. And they also added that once, not only that, but that they had some new information that they'd come into their file and they wanted to share that with me. And that sounds like BS. It was, of course, but I

didn't realize that. So both of them, why don't you just rid yourself of the suspicion and also let us be able to share this extra info with you and that's going to allow you to be more helpful to us. Yeah, you're going to be a better junior cop when we share this with you. Correct. So you go in to this polygraph test kind of thinking, I'm going to help out and I'm going to go ahead and remove myself from the name and that way I can really be good junior cop Exactly. Yes all fed to you by this

Father figure cop that you're beginning to trust. Yes Having not had a father in your home as a child Exactly, right all behind your mother and grandmother's back because they didn't trust them and you didn't want to let your mom know what you're doing Yeah, you've got it. right. What could go wrong? Right. And now a few messages from our generous sponsors but first I hope you'll follow us on all your favorite social media channels where we share more powerful content from the Army. Search for at Army of Normal Folks on every channel. We'll be right back.

I'm Hannah Storm and my podcast, NBA DNA with with Hannah Storm digs deep into the history of professional basketball along with my own as one of the first female sportscasters. Now let's get you up to speed on what else happened around the NBA today. We talked to all sorts of people I interacted with from Dr. J to Charles Barkley and recap iconic moments. Yes, he's got it. Here he comes. Way rock the baby to sleep and slam dunk.

As well as some of the wild stories behind the scenes. We were like, what? What are we in for? The scoreboard crashes before we even tip a game off. Today, the NBA is a global sports and entertainment giant. Players are multimillionaires and cultural icon. And these stories are about how we got here, both on and off the court. And what's next? Listen to NBA DNA with Hannah Storm on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

My name is Johnny B. Good, and I'm the host of the new podcast, Creating a Con, the story of Bitcoin. Over this nine part series, I'll explore the life and crimes of my best friend, Ray Trapani. I always wanted to be a criminal. If someone's like, Oh, what's your best way of making money? I'm like, Oh, we should start some sort of scheme. You see, Ray has this unique ability to find loopholes and exploit them. They collected $30 million.

There were headlines about it. His company, Centratec, was one of the hottest crypto startups in 2017. It was going to change the world, until it didn't. I came into my office office opened my email and the subject heading was FBI Request it was only a matter of time before the truth came out You can only fake it till you make it for so long before they find out that your Harvard degree is not so crimson How could you sit there and do something that you know will objectively cause more harm

in the world? Listen to Creating a Con, the story of Bitcoin on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Every family has skeletons in their closet. Mine certainly does. Ones that go back a hundred years and reach thousands of miles back to our hometown in Sicily. Ever since I can remember, my relatives told the story of my great-great-grandmother who was killed by the mafia. I'm Jo Piazza, and in my new podcast, I'm taking on a generational vendetta,

visiting the scene of the crime, confronting mafia experts, tracking down Italian officials, and even consulting mediums to set the record straight on my great-great-grandmother's mysterious disappearance. And in between the fact-finding missions, I'll be drinking a lot of wine and eating all of the pasta. Come to Italy with me to solve this hundred-year-old murder mystery. Listen to The Sicilian Inheritance on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Tell me about the day you took the polygraph.

So it was a school day and rather than go to the high school, I went to the police station for the test. I expected the test to be at the police station because number one, they kind of implied that and number two, the rumor mill in Peaskill was that a few other people had been polygraphed at the police station. So I'm expecting it to be at the police station. So I'm expecting it to be at the police station. I go there with one of my best friends because it's a school day. My mother and grandmother think I'm in school. They don't have a clue that anything's wrong. Therefore, there is

no phone call or comment to my rescue or intervention that's off the table because they don't know. I got to the police station. The police lieutenant told my friend just to go home, get out of there. And... What was your friend going to do with you? Well, he was, I wanted him to go with me while I, I had this idea that he could sit next to me while I was being tested. That was not... More 16 year old thinking, but I get it.

Yeah. Right. So when they sent him off, do you think just Hearing that Do you think somewhere in the deepest recess of your mind? You were worried about getting set up, which is why you had your friend go with you. Yeah, I was that was without being maybe Consciously cognizant of it. Yes. Why else would you have a friend go with you except that you had this tinge of fear? Correct. Yeah, you're right. No one's ever brought that out before, but yes, you're right.

Well, just listening to you, that kind of... Yeah, it's true. And so therefore, when the lieutenant told him, you know, go ahead, get out of here, I briefly entertained the thought of not going ahead with things at all. But then I thought, well, the idea of being an even better junior detective cop. talking about. Plus, if you say no, you probably think, well, that makes them suspicious of me. Yes, that's true too. Yes.

So you go with this friend and the cops tell your friend to beat it. Yeah. What's he going to say? They're the cops. Exactly. And now you're there. Right. You can't exactly beat it. I can already feel the grip of this happening. I'm putting myself in a 16... Well, you know, I'm 55 years old, but I've got about the mentality of a 16-year-old,

so I'm relating real well to all of this right now. But I mean, I can almost... I feel that. So I learned quickly, well, in fact, the test is not going to be at the Peekskill Police Station. Why? Well, they're bringing me to the, well, I know the answer now, but I didn't at the time. So they told me, look, we're going to stop in at a diner and eat something.

And then I was going to be brought to the location for the polygraph I realized now the reason for that is so the Polygraphist was a Putnam County Sheriff's investigator named Daniel Stevens, but I didn't know he was a cop He was dressed like a civilian. He never identified himself as law enforcement. He never read me my rights In terms of transportation the psychological intrigue continued, so they put me in the car by myself with the good cop. The bad cop and the lieutenant were in a different vehicle, so they're conti... He reads me my rights again, but I don't understand them because I'm 16.

And plus, you're telling me that I'm here to help you, so that, to the extent I could grasp anything at all, that was all here to help you. So that to the extent I could grasp anything at all, that was all completely out the window. So we get there, I just described the polygraphist. There's no, I'm not given anything to eat the entire time I'm there. There's no lawyer present. He gives me a four page brochure which explains how the polygraph works, but it has a lot of words in it that I don't understand. But I figure, well, I'm here to help the police. So what does it matter? Let's just get on with it. Why did they drive you somewhere else?

To bring me into his hands. He carried out this procedure, which he testified to was called GTC, Get the Confession. And, you know, he had a knack for getting confessions all over the place. And that was why they brought me to him. So what was the polygraph like? They put me in a small room and he get first the polygraphist gives me countless cups of coffee. Oh, great. Get jammed up. Correct. And then he wired me up.

Are you serious? Yes. A 16-year-old, a bunch of coffee? Yes. No sooner would I finish one cup that he was up here pouring away, do you want another one? And I think he gave me between six to eight cups. It was a lot.

Then he wires me to the machine. And then he launches into his, well, first, he pretends as he's turning the dials, oh, I'm going to fine tune the machine into your body's biofeedback, right? He does that routine for about five minutes. And then the nature of the beast comes out and he launches his third degree tactic. So he invades my personal space. He raises his voice at me. He's asking me the same questions over and over again.

And it's really frightening. I mean, I'm not, he's a mountain of a man. I'm 16, I'm 150 pounds. I'm not used to talking, much less interacting with an adult male, much less one who's carrying on in a ferocious manner like he is. And each hour that passes by with him doing this... Each hour? How long were you there? Six and a half to seven hours. Towards the end, I guess he had had enough of my denials and he said, you know, he said, what do you mean you didn't do it?

You just told me through the polygraph test result that you did. We just want you to verbally confirm it." And when he said that to me, that ratcheted my fear up. And that's when he left the room and the cop pretending to be my friend came in the room and said, look, they're going to harm you. I've been holding them off. I can't do that any longer. They're going to harm you?

Yes. In other words, they're gonna beat you? Well, yeah. I mean, harm is what it is. I mean, yeah, they're gonna beat me. I don't know that it would be limited to that. I don't know how far they're gonna go. I have no idea of where I'm at. No one else knows where I was at. I felt in fear of my life and I felt intimidated. So I felt like everything was on the table in terms of that. And then he says, just tell them what they want to hear. You can go home afterwards. You're not going to be arrested.

So being young, naive, frightened, 16, I wasn't thinking the long term. I was just concerned with the safety in the moment. I was overwhelmed emotionally and psychologically. And so I made up a... And then on one hand, this possibility of harm and on the other, this false life preserver that he threw me. And so I took the out which he offered and I made up a story based on the information he gave me that day and that I received in the six weeks run up to everything. By the time it was all said and done, I had collapsed on the floor

into a fetal position crying uncontrollably. Obviously I was arrested. I was charged with the murder and rape. This whole thing was not audio taped. It's not video taped. It's no signed confession. It's all just the cop's word. And that would be a crucial factor later on because when the case went to trial,

they left the threat and false promise out of their testimony. And it's your word against theirs. Right. And who's gonna believe a raping, murdering 16 year old over a good old cop? Right. So that's the arrest. I've been in business since 2001, so 23 years. When I first started in business,

I didn't have any money. I didn't come from anything. And so I started my business literally money. I didn't come from anything. And so I started my business literally, writing up whatever little money I could and buying used equipment. Literally the first line, the first line of chain, lumber comes down what's called a pull chain. And it's just big heavy chain that lumber comes down that you pull boards off of. I literally drug out from behind out of some weeds behind an old furniture plant in North Carolina and paid like $500 cash for it and brought it back to Memphis and put it together. I put my plant together those first five, six years with used equipment, whatever I could buy and I needed a front end loader and they're expensive. I mean, a new one today is 130 grand. Back then, a really

good two or three year old one was $75,000. I couldn't afford that. And this guy who was a truck driver said he had some used equipment that he was getting rid of. And he said he'd bring them down for me to look at on his flatbed. It was this old backhoe, it was a Ford backhoe that didn't look like much. And he sold it to me for like $6,000. And that was a good deal. And I needed it. So I bought it.

Six months later, members of an FBI task force showed up at my office unannounced with guns on their hip and badges and said, we need to speak to you in private. And we went in and they said, how long have you been trafficking stolen equipment? And I said, how long have you been doing what? This truck driver apparently had been stealing equipment from used rental equipment places all over the United States. He would take loads to their destination. And then on the way back home to Tennessee, during the night, he would pull over to rental companies and steal stuff and put it on his truck.

And he had a ton of stolen stuff out on some land somewhere and then he would just sell it as used equipment to guys like me. And I was like, what are you talking about, Trav? I don't even know what you're talking about. And I didn't know that this guy, I didn't know. And they showed the VIN number and sure enough, it was stolen from somebody in Alabama and this guy had been selling used equipment all over the place and everybody that had been buying it, me, you know, by the letter of law, broke the law because we were buying stolen

equipment but I wasn't trafficking in it and once I finally convinced them, showed them the paperwork, had a bill of sale and everything else, they switched gears immediately. It's like look man, we see now that you're not trafficking this stuff and you're not part of this ring But you're out 6500 bucks because that's not yours and we've got to take it right now And I said better yet. I'll return it to the owner I mean I'll I'll pay to have it freighted down which is exactly what I did whole reason I'm telling this story is the hour that those men were my office office. Now I'm a grown man at 38 years old, doing my own business and you know I've been through a lot in my life. I remember trembling talking to those guys because it never really dawns on you until

you're in the position. You're staring at a person that could take away your liberty. until you're in the position, you're staring at a person that could take away your liberty. You're staring at a person that has all the power in the world to slap handcuffs on you, take you out of your home or your business, put you in a car and throw you in jail. Whether you, they prove you've done anything or not, they have that ability because if they have suspicion,

they can do it and it can upend your life. And I remember just in that situation, how scared I was. I was frightened. I didn't know whether to call a lawyer. I didn't know who to talk to. I didn't, I searched every word very carefully because I didn't want them to speak.

I didn't want to give these men any reason to doubt me. I knew I'd done nothing wrong. I didn't intend to buy somebody's stolen equipment. I trusted the guy that sold it to me. And it was terrifying. I cannot imagine what it must be like for a 16-year- old kid with no parent, no lawyer, no friends for six and a half hours being drilled by grown adults who you think are there to protect and serve you and trust. I'd imagine you'd have done anything to get out of that room. Yeah, I would have. And you did.

And I did. We'll be right back. I'm Hannah Storm and my podcast, NBA DNA with with Hannah Storm digs deep into the history of professional basketball along with my own as one of the first female sportscasters. Now let's get you up to speed on what else happened around the NBA today. We talked to all sorts of people I interacted with from Dr. J to Charles Barkley and recap iconic moments. Yes, he's got it.

Here he comes. Way rock the baby to sleep and slam dunk. As well as some of the wild stories behind the scenes. We were like, what? What are we in for? The scoreboard crashes before we even tip a game off. Today, the NBA is a global sports and entertainment giant. Players are multimillionaires and cultural icons.

Igadala to Curry, back to Igadala. Up for the layup. Oh, blocked by James. and entertainment giant. Players are multimillionaires and cultural icon. And these stories are about how we got here, both on and off the court. And what's next? Listen to NBA DNA with Hannah Storm on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. My name is Johnny B. Good, and I'm the host of the new podcast, Creating a Con, the story of VidCon. Over this nine-part series, I'll explore the life and crimes of my best friend, Ray Trapani. I always wanted to be a criminal.

If someone's like, oh, what's your best way of making money? I'm like, oh, we should start some sort of scheme. You see, Ray has this unique ability to find loopholes and exploit them. They collected $30 million. There were headlines about it. His company, Centratec, was one of the hottest crypto startups in 2017.

It was gonna change the world until it didn't. I came into my office, opened my email, and the subject heading was FBI request. It was only a matter of time before the truth came out. You can only fake it till you make it for so long before they find out that your Harvard degree is not so crimson. How could you sit there and do something that you know will objectively cause more harm in the world? Listen to Creating a Con, the story of Bitcoin on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to season nine of Next Question with me, Katie Couric. It is 2024 and we're going gonna get through this together, folks.

My campaign promise to all of you here on Next Question is going to be a good time the whole time, we hope. I have some big news to share with you on our season premiere featuring Kris Jenner, who's got some words of wisdom for me on being a good grandmother, or in her case, a good lovey. You know, you start thinking of what you want your grandmother name to be.

Like, are they gonna call me grandma like I called my grandmother? So I got to choose my name, which is now Lovey. I'll also be joined by Hillary Clinton, Renee Flemming, Liz Cheney to name a few. So come on in and take a break from the incessant negativity for a weekly dose of fascinating conversations. Some of them, I promise, will actually put you in a good mood.

I loved it. Your energy and joy. I'm squeezing every minute I can for you out of this season of Next Question. Last question, I promise. You have to go, I have to go. But it's been so fun. And I can't wait for you to hear it. Listen to Next Question with me, Katie Couric, on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

["Darkness"] I didn't ever even actually realize I was under arrest until I got back to the police station. So when we, once they obtained this confession, I was crying uncontrollably. They finally calmed me down and at that point they gave me something to eat and it was time to go back in the car and they put handcuffs, they had rear cuffed me and I asked, well, why are you putting me on handcuffs? I was told that I wasn't gonna be arrested and lieutenant just said safety and

They put me in the car and they drove me back to the police station. The good cop disappeared lieutenant disappeared They said they were gonna call ahead and get order pizza at the at the police department And so I'm eating pizza at the police department. And so I'm eating pizza at the police department and periodically I'm interrupted by a uniformed police officer that's carrying out different facets of the processing. And eventually he did the fingerprints and put the ink on my fingers.

And I remember being pretty angry at that point. And I just saw the cop that his role had been like the bad cop. And I just said, you know, what is he doing? I've got ink on my fingers. I'm over here trying to eat pizza. And he said, well, oh, he has the right to do that. And I said, well, what do you mean he has the right to do that? I was told I wasn't going to be arrested.

And he said, oh, you are being charged with a the crime and that was how I realized I was under arrest. So the police called my mother from there and she came down to the police station. This how old was this girl? 15. And she was raped? And she was raped and murdered. Okay. Ned and the first reader, didn't they have DNA? They did. They did. And so before I went to trial, the results of the DNA came in from the FBI lab, which showed that seminal fluid found in and around the victim didn't match me.

It did not match you? Did not match me, no. So to explain away the DNA The prosecutor got this medical examiner to commit fraud and commit perjury So when there's an autopsy done there, they take the written and audio notes as they're making their findings So it was only six months after doing the autopsy hundreds of autopsies later only after the DNA doesn't match me There's this medical examiner suddenly says, try to follow this now, he remembers that he forgot. He remembers that he forgot.

This is such a heavy topic, I feel like an a** for laughing. It's okay. No, it's okay. It's not okay. But he remembered that he forgot. To document medical evidence, which he claimed. That is almost like it depends on what the definition of is is. It's the most ridiculous thing.

And he claimed that that, yeah, he forgot to document that. And so he's saying he found medical evidence to show the victim had been promiscuous, which was a lie. They made that up. How can you find medical evidence that the victim had been promiscuous, which was a lie. They made that up. How can you find medical evidence that the victim had been promiscuous before she died when she was raped? That is stupid. He claims that on a slide, he saw a perforated hymen. She was raped!

Right. And that's what opened the door for the prosecutor to argue, aha! That's how the DNA doesn't match Deskovic and yet he's guilty. Oh, insinuating that she had consensual sex before she was raped. Correct. This 15-year-old. Correct. So he's stolen the victim under the bus too. Yes, he is. And then he took it a step further and mentioned another youth by name that he claimed had

slept with the victim. But he never had a DNA test performed to prove that. He didn't even call him as a witness to give verbal testimony. He just made... Why didn't the defense say, if that's who had sex, we're calling that witness and we're going to get a DNA test from them to disprove that. Because of a conflict of interest. What conflict of interest?

The other youth that the prosecutor was falsely saying had slept with the victim was represented by another member of that public defender office. Oh no. And specifically by a lawyer that was supposed to be supervising him on my case. And so that conflict prevented the defense from asking him for a sample or prevented the defense from calling him as a witness. I got to say this to you. So far, hearing this story sounds like a non-affluent far hearing this story sounds like a non-affluent kid living in an apartment without a father or without the means to defend himself. Simply checking a box as someone to prosecute for this crime to get everybody off.

So we settled it. I agree with that. His... I mean, socioeconomics has something to do with this too. 100% because the lawyers that we spoke to wanted $50,000 as a retainer just to get started. And that was... There's no way. There is no way. There is no way.

There was no way. Your grandmother and mother had to have been... Oh, first of all, wow, I'm going 90 different ways right now, but was a medical examiner proficient enough to establish a time of death? Yeah. Where were you during the time of death? You had to have just an alibi. I did. I had one. I told my public defender I was playing wiffle ball with one of my friends at the time of the crime.

Okay. And he never interviewed or called the person as my alibi. He never introduced the evidence to court. Why? I asked him that after I... I don't get too far ahead, but I asked him that after I lost my job. the person as my alibi. He never introduced the evidence to court. Why? I asked him that after I... I don't get too far ahead, but I asked him that after I lost the trial, and he said, oh, well, I don't prosecute... I don't do cases like with a shotgun approach. That was his answer, which didn't really make any sense. This lawyer essentially didn't defend me.

So quickly, he rarely met with me. When he did meet with me and I tried to explain to him that I was innocent and what happened in interrogation room, he was always shutting me up. One time he told me he didn't care if I was guilty or innocent. He never explained to the jury the significance of the DNA not matching me. He never used that to argue that that proved that this confession was coerced and false. When it came time to cross-examine the medical examiner, my lawyer stood up in open court and with a big smile on his face, like they were friends from back in the day, said to

him, you're going to be pleased to know that I don't have a single question for you. He wouldn't allow me to testify either. He said that his personal one loss record was significantly better when his clients didn't testify compared to when they did. That's probably true, but most of his clients probably have a record, and if they took the stand,

they could be asked questions about that. But I had never been arrested for even a violation. And the other quick thing that he said to me was, and this is a very naive way to practice law, it's not up to me to prove that you're innocent. It's up to the prosecution to prove that you're guilty, and I don't think they did that. to prove that you're guilty and I don't think they did that.

Did the judge not see the lack of defense and the inequity that was happening here? I think that he did because when I was found guilty and I was at the sentencing hearing, I begged him to overturn the verdict because I was innocent and I referenced the DNA and he said to me, maybe you are innocent. But instead of him overturning the conviction, he took the easy way out, which was to give me a 15 to life sentence. I had been charged as an adult and sentenced as an adult and sent to an adult prison.

So first of all, polygraph test results are not admissible because it's not scientific and you know, it would be prejudicial for a jury to hear. I'm a psychology major and I will tell you that polygraphs are around 78% accurate. You can't take somebody's life away from them on 78%. They should be inadmissible. And if you happen to sweat a lot, they'll give false readings. And if you're nervous, they'll give false readings. And if you're cold hearted and don't get nervous, you can also beat them on the other way. You can be trained to beat polygraph tests. There's a reason they're inadmissible.

And one of them should be a scared 16-year-old curled up in a fetal position has no business plugged up to a machine that's going to say whether or not he's lying because it's going to register everything you're saying is lying. you're saying this line. So you having said that, the judge let the polygraphist repeatedly tell the jury that I failed the polygraph and that I lied when I denied committing the crime, while at the same time, he prohibited my lawyer from asking him questions about the methods he used to arrive at his opinion. So you're right, the polygraph is inadmissible unless both sides agree.

We didn't agree, but the judge created this backdoor rule. He said, well, this alleged confession took place while you were being polygraphed, so it's coming in that way. So that was an irregularity. And I got one that's arguably better than that. So the victim's clothes, including her bra, had been entered into evidence by the prosecutor. The jury asked to see the bra. And that was important because that was one of the statements that the cops coerced out of me was I said that I ripped her bra off.

So when the jury asked to see that, I mean, we thought they were thinking like we wanted them to think there's some bras that you can't rip the way that they're made. And it was at that moment that the judge announced, he said, well, the bra and the rest of the victim's clothes had been left in the courtroom over the weekend. And apparently the janitors thought it was garbage. So it's been thrown out. It's not available anymore. And he substituted the bra with a photo in which he said, you can almost see the bra in the photo. Unbelievable. This is a kangaroo court. The last thing is on the third day of the jury deliberation, they sent out a note asking if we can't come up with a verdict, are we going to be kept sequestered over the Christmas

holiday? And the judge said yes. And I learned many years later at that point, it was 11 to 1 for a conviction in the jury room. But there was a holdout juror that thought I was innocent, but they were all pressing him. And when they found out that they would be sequestered, nobody wanted to be sequestered and he didn't either.

So that ratcheted the pressure up and then he switched his vote based on that. And I was found guilty of a murder and rape, which I didn't commit. Have you spoken with that juror? I haven't, but he spoke to my civil rights lawyers. He had saw on the news that I had been exonerated and released, and he said, well, I'm glad, because I never thought he was guilty. And so my lawyer asked him the obvious question,

which, well, why did you vote that way? And then he told you that story. Correct. And that concludes part one of my conversation with Jeff Deskvick. And you do not want to miss part two that's now available to listen to. The redemption part, it's coming soon and it will floor you. Together guys, we can change this country, but it starts with you. I'll see you in part two. cover the stories behind what's moving money and markets. And help you understand what's happening, what it means, and why it matters every afternoon. I'm Sarah Holder.

I'm Saleh Emosen. And I'm David Gura. Listen to the big take on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Saleh Emosen, and I've covered economic policy for years and reported on how it impacts people across the United States. In 2016, I saw how voters were leaning towards Trump and how so many Americans felt misunderstood by Washington. So I started The Big Take DC. We dig into how money, politics, and power shape government and the consequences for voters. With new episodes every Thursday, you can listen to The Big Take DC

on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to season nine of Next Question with me, Katie Couric. I've got some big news to share with you in our season premiere featuring the one and only Kris Jenner. Oh my gosh, congratulations.

That is very, very exciting. And that's just the beginning. We'll also be joined by podcast host, Jay Shetty, Hillary Clinton, Renee Flemming, Liz Cheney, and many more. So come on in, take a break from the incessant negativity for a weekly dose of fascinating conversations. Some of them, I promise, will actually put you in a good mood.

Listen to Next Question with me, Katie Couric, on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.