An Army of Normal Folks - What If We Stopped Treating People Like Mascots? (Pt 2)

Episode Date: February 17, 2026

What if the problem isn’t a lack of compassion—but a lack of expectation? Ruth Thompson was preparing for retirement when a literal dream led her to open Hugs Cafe, an incredible restaurant in McKinney, TX that employs adults with intellectual and developmental disabilities. In this episode, you’ll learn why lowering the bar hurts people, how raising it changes lives, and what happens when normal folks decide to stop clapping for effort—and start training for excellence.Support the show: https://www.normalfolks.us/#joinSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey everybody, it's Bill Courtney with an army of normal folks, and we continue now with part two of our conversation with Ruth Thompson, right after these brief messages from our generous sponsors. Segregation and the day integration at night. When segregation was the law, one mysterious black club owner had his own rules. We didn't worry about what went on outside. It was like stepping on another world. Inside Charlie's place, black and white people danced together, but not everyone was happy about it. You saw the KKK?

Yeah, they were dressed up in their uniform. The KKK set out to raid Charlie, take him away from here. Charlie was an example of power. They had to crush him. From Atlas Obscura, Rococo Pai. punch and visit Myrtle Beach comes Charlie's Place. A story that was nearly lost to time. Until now.

Listen to Charlie's Place on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. The more you listen to your kids, the closer you'll be. So we asked kids, what do you want your parents to hear? I feel sometimes that I'm not listened to. I would just want you to listen to me more often and evaluate situations with me and lead me towards success. Listening is a form of love.

Find resources to help you support your kids and their emotional well-being at soundedouttogether.org. That's sounded outtogether.org. Brought to you by the Ad Council and Pivotal. And the winner of the IHeart Podcast Award is You can decide who takes home the 26 IHeart Podcast Awards Podcast of the year

by voting at IHeart Podcast Awards.com now through February 22nd. See all the nominees and place your vote at iHeartpodcastawards.com. Audible is a proud sponsor of the Audible Audio Pioneer Award. Explore the best selection of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals all in one easy app.

Audible. There's more to imagine when you listen. Sign up for a free trial at audible.com. You know Roldall, the writer who thought up Willie Wonka, Matilda, and the BFG. But did you know he was also a spy? Was this before he wrote his stories? It must have been.

Our new podcast series, The Secret World of Roldoll is a wild journey through the hidden chapters of his extraordinary, controversial life. His job was literally to seduce the wives of powerful Americans. What? And he was really good at it. You probably won't believe it either. Okay, I don't think that's true.

I'm telling you. I was a spy. Did you know Dahl got cozy with the Roosevelt's? Played poker with Harry Truman and had a long affair with a congresswoman. And then he took his talents to Hollywood, where he worked alongside Walt Disney and Alfred Hitchcock, before writing a hit James Bond film. How did this secret agent wind up as the most successful children's author ever?

And what darkness from his covert past seeped into the stories we read as kids. The true story is stranger than anything he ever wrote. Listen to the secret world of Roll Dahl on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Okay, now you're open. That's right. So I read that once you open, you started to notice changes in the people. who worked there. Tell us about that.

Yeah, Miss Tamika. I'm going to go back to Miss Tamika. Was she one of the first? She was one of the first. Got it. Absolutely. I'll give you a little background of what our business model started off as and how it changed. Okay.

Our business model was going to be that we will hire them, employ them for a year to give them great experience. and then we would help them get a job somewhere else. I cannot tell you the number of staff who sat across from me after a year with tears in their eyes and said, you're not going to make me leave, are you? Our business model changed. And Ms. Tamika is one of them. Again, she was so, so, so quiet. but she got in that kitchen and she took charge.

A fun story that I love telling about her. She just wouldn't engage and she still won't engage, just start a conversation. She does her work and that's what she is supposed to do. And she loves her work. If I get in... Socialization is an issue for autistic folks. It is. It is.

If I get in the kitchen, she's really funny. She'll roll her eyes at me because she knows I don't know what I'm supposed to be doing anymore. I don't go in the kitchen anymore. But a fun story about her is everybody had my phone number. And our restaurant manager at the time, His name was Maria. And I got a phone call one day from Tamika. This is a woman who would not engage in conversation.

Hi, Ms. Ruth. This is Tamika. I just want to let you know that I left my pay stub on the table that's near the front door. Would you please take care of that for me? I know that your listeners may think, well, okay, that's a conversation, not a conversation she would have. And I'm going, oh my gosh, somebody else has got to hear this. And I told her, I said, I'm not at the cafe. You'll need to call Maria and let her know. And I'm so excited that this woman is now taking charge of her life. and calling to let her know, let somebody know that something was left there.

That is, this is huge for someone on the spectrum. And as soon as she hung up, I quickly dialed Maria and I said, you're going to get a phone call and you're not going to believe who it is or what it's going to be said, but just listen. She immediately, after she talked to to me, because she called and we're both crying on the phone. Because this woman has taken charge of her. her life. I read, confidence doesn't come from someone telling you, you're amazing. It comes from

doing something hard over and over again and realizing you can do it. That kind of speaks to exactly what's been, what started going on there, is that, like you said, you didn't treat these folks like mascots. Right. You trained them. You held them accountable. You trained them for excellence. and you had them repeat over and over again until they mastered something. And so their confidence as a result of being managed, treated, and cared for that way manifested itself in self-confidence that they probably have never had. Never. It's such a broad term folks with intellectual disabilities.

I don't even know how to have. say this right, but there are levels of folks with disabilities. So what disabilities are we talking about and what levels of disability? Because there's a broad range of folks that are really, quote, high functioning, but can't function completely alone down to folks like the 12-year-old you saw in the stroller. What kind of what's the spectrum of folks that work for you and what do those disabilities look like? Sure, and that's why it's called a spectrum, because it is very broad. And we don't look at what they can't do.

We look at what they can do. The biggest concern that we have to look at when we're hiring someone new is behaviors, which sometimes does go along with someone maybe on the autism spectrum. And what we do is we do get references from previous teachers or therapists or things like that. We do have some who, rather than saying lower functioning, we say needs more support. We do have some that, and my husband calls some of them. legacy employees because they were part of my class and I couldn't say no when we started hiring everyone. We have one young man who works only on Saturdays, but he, and he's been with us for 10 years,

he repeats the same mantra every Saturday. I had fun at my house last night. I'm going to watch a movie tonight. I'm going to go to the movies with my sister. This is my first time working this day. And so that's his mantra all day long. We do have community volunteers, and he has to have a community volunteer with him at all times. But he buses tables, and he knows what he's supposed to do. He just needs more support.

So from there, all the way up to pretty high-functioning folks like Tamika. Tamika, Danny, who can go out and speak like nobody's business. We had him speak. We just opened in Dallas, but we were introducing hugs to Dallas people last year. and we had a luncheon in Dallas and we took Danny with us. I spoke, my husband Chris spoke, our CEO spoke, and Danny spoke. And Danny started off with, and he has this monotone voice, okay, so I'm going to try to do Danny, but he says, okay, folks, I don't know what kind of audience I have, so I'm going to start off with a joke.

and then I'll decide what I can say for the rest of the time. That in and of itself was hilarious. Exactly. I don't remember his joke, but everyone laughed and he said, okay, I got a pretty good audience. He is hilarious. He is hilarious. And he will start telling his story.

And while Danny has been working for us, His mother passed away. And he talks about that and how much it means to him to have a job and how much it means to him to be an ambassador. He will tell everyone that he's the number one ambassador. We don't have a number one. But if Danny wants to be... Yes, Danny. He's number one.

He's number one. That's funny. Yes. Here's a thought. I grew my business from nothing. Literally started in 2001 with $17,000, wing in a prayer and, dare I say, also a dream. Something I learned pretty quickly is success brings its own issues. You think you've got issues when you start, then you have some success, and then there's more issues.

One of the issues I read that you had with your success is that you had more after. applicants, then you had spaces. Tell us about that. We did. We hired everyone, and then we started getting more applicants and more applicants. The special needs world is very close-knit, and we were getting applications from people down in Dallas. We're 45 minutes from Dallas, but people who wanted their loved ones. to have a job, or loved ones who wanted to have people with autism, people with Down syndrome,

who wanted to have a job. We had a stack a mile long of applicants. That's when we said, we've got to do more. What can we do? So in 2018, we started Hugg's Greenhouse. I can't believe that. That's so funny. So I visited an organization down in near Katie, Texas, which is near Houston.

And it's called Brookwood. It started out as a little day program, but now it's a huge residential. I think they've got like 70 acres. It's been in existence for 50 years. and they have day programs where anyone with a disability, regardless of what the disability is, they do pottery and they have a horticulture program. And they make things by hand. So it's kind of like a workshop, but because they're not with the public, we are public-facing, which, makes us not a workshop. But I got dead and visited them and saw that they had this incredible

horticulture program. Well, why can't we do that? And so I, okay, I decided let's, I don't know how to grow things. I did grow up on a farm in Georgia, but I have killed plants more than, not. My poor daddy would just roll over in his grave the way I kill plants. But somebody out there has to know how to do this. I put a Facebook post out that this is what I want to do. I want to start a horticulture program with hugs. I don't know how to do it, but I'm going to have a meeting. I'm going to have a meeting on this night at this time at the cafe. And I'm I hope that somebody somewhere wants to help us with this and will join me. I had three people who provide flowers to the Dallas Arboretum show up.

I had another gentleman who had a, was fourth generation flower grower. He was there. And then our handyman showed up. And I'm asking them, what do I need? And they're telling me, okay, first of all, you need land. It needs to be zoned agriculture. It needs to be outside of the city limits. It needs to be here and you need to do this.

Okay, well, where are we going to find that? Give me some ideas. Our handyman said, our house is on 32 acres in the country, zoned agriculture. We're in no one's ETJ. We want you to put it there. $0 a year. Unruh. Yes.

So, hugs greenhouse, or I think that's what it's called. Hugs, Greenhouse, and then, okay, well, I don't know how to grow flowers. But the point is, some of these applicants you couldn't put to work in the restaurant. Exactly. Greenhouse. Right. They need a job. Which led to?

Well, let me finish telling you about the greenhouse. I'm sorry, but yeah, I'm going, okay, at a restaurant, you've got to have someone there at all times with a manager's certification. Do you need something like that in a greenhouse? You do. You need someone who is an insecticide and pesticide certified. Okay, where are we going to get this person, Texas A&M? And they were going to, okay, yeah, maybe you need somebody a new graduate from A&M. Bill Crump, who was a fourth generation nursery grower or flower grower, had retired, sold all of his.

And he said, Ruth, I'm tired of being retired. I want to run it for you. Unbelievable. I said, thank you, God. Yeah. So the greenhouse started on free land and a free operator who had all the stuff you needed. We do pay Bill a salary. Probably, I'm sure.

Probably not. what he's worth. Right. Unbelievable. Unbelievable. And that led to, I don't know, did that hugs home cooking? Is that what was next? That's when we started Hugs Home Cooking because there were other, you know, we've got this list

of people who want a job. We don't have any other opportunities for employment. We don't want to get into the day program. situation, but what we can do is offer a class every now and again. So we have others that come in now once a month and take a cooking class from a classically trained chef. Wow. I know.

I know. It's beautiful. They love it. I mean, they learn how to do chicken cordon blue. and they love it. We'll be right back. Segregation and today, integration at night. When segregation was the law,

one mysterious black club owner had his own rules. We didn't worry about what went on outside. It was like stepping on another world. Inside Charlie's place, black and white people danced together, but not everyone was happy about it. You saw the KKK? Yeah, they were dressed up in their uniform.

The KKK set out to raid Charlie, take him away from here. Charlie was an example of power. They had to crush him. From Atlas Obscura, Rococo Punch, and visit Myrtle Beach, comes Charlie's place. A story that was nearly lost to time. Until now, listen to Charlie's Place on the Iheart Radio, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. The more you listen to your kids, the closer you'll be.

So we asked kids, what do you want your parents to hear? I feel sometimes that I'm not listened to. I would just want you to listen to me more often and evaluate situations with me and lead me towards success. Listening is a form of love. Find resources to help you support your kids and their emotional well-being at soundedouttogether.org. That's sounded outtogether.org.

Brought to you by the Ad Council and Pivotal. And the winner of the IHeart Podcast Award is, you can decide who takes home the 26 IHeart Podcast Awards Podcast of the year by voting at IHeartPodcastawards.com now through February 22nd. See all the nominees and place your vote at IHeartPodcastawards.com. Audible is a proud sponsor of the Audible Audio Pioneer Award. Explore the best selection of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals all in one easy, App. Audible. There's more to imagine when you listen. Sign up for a free trial at audible.com.

You know Roaldahl, the writer who thought up Willie Wonka, Matilda, and the BFG. But did you know he was also a spy? Was this before he wrote his stories? It must have been. Our new podcast series, The Secret World of Roll Doll, is a wild journey through the hidden chapters of his extraordinary, controversial life. His job was literally to seduce the wives of powerful Americans. What? And he was really good at it. You probably won't believe it either. Okay, I don't think that's true. I'm telling you.

I was a spy. Did you know Dahl got cozy with the Roosevelt's? Played poker with Harry Truman and had a long affair with a congresswoman. And then he took his talents to Hollywood, where he worked alongside Walt Disney and Alfred Hitchcock before writing a hit James Bond film. How did this secret agent wind up as the most successful children's author ever? And what darkness from his covert past

seeped into the stories we read as kids. The true story is strange. than anything he ever wrote. Listen to the secret world of Roll Dahl on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Okay. So,

here you go. You've got your cafe. You've got the greenhouse. You've got the home cooking thing. Your dream is turned into reality. Yeah. Certainly now it's time to kind of chill. No.

No. So, I don't know what's next, but I think the training academy is next. Is that what's next? The first training academy. The first training. Okay. Take us through that.

Yeah. And why and what it means and all that. Okay. And we're talking last year. Actually, the training academy, that's 22. We started the first training academy. Okay. And why did we do that?

Because we had this long list of applicants, and we can't just keep saying no. I was asked. Well, actually, you could. No. I was, I joined the board. I was asked to join the board of directors of the Greater Dallas, Texas Restaurant Association. And I keep hearing the number one challenge from other restaurants. is staffing.

I said, guys, I can train them. I can train my people. All you have to do is treat them with kindness and respect, not hell's kitchen, but kindness and respect. And you've got an employee for life. And I said that before I open a training again. Well, I've got to ask something. Yeah.

Pragmatically. I'm running a, restaurant with fire and gas and hot grease and knives and slippery floors and hot steam and a public that all of that screams liability to me. And then, yeah, I need staff and I need well-trained staff, but did any of them, did you get any pushback on can quote that? and, quote, really handle this kind of work and some fears? I mean, I can see pragmatically that you might get pushback from that initially.

I still do. Yes, I got pushback. I still do. But we do have our job placement people who love what we do. I will name some, Jason's Deli, loves what we do and hire our people. There's a convention center, Irving Convention Center, They hire our people. We have found that schools, school cafeterias, hire our people.

Oh, that's interesting. So you're part of this thing. Yes. This greater, you're on the board of greater something restaurant associate. Sorry. Texas Restaurant Association, yes. Got it. They say they need help and you say, well, all these people that I can't hire, let me start

a training academy, I'll train them and then find them jobs elsewhere. Yes. In the same thing. So how to go? didn't have one person that said, I want to be your first. Yeah, I can imagine. It is still a struggle, and I've been on that board for three years now. It's still a struggle.

I'm also on the Texas Restaurant Association Board. It's still a struggle, but I'm not giving up. I'm not going to give up. But it's happening? It is happening. Yes. There are restaurants. who are hiring them.

Yeah. And, but they're not just rolling silverware now. Right. We hire, we train them with, in the training academy. They leave there with their food handler certification certificate. Do they really? They leave there knowing, having been trained by the local fire department, how to put out a fire.

I didn't know how to do that until we started at Hugg's train. training academy. And they learn knife safety. How many people in this hugs training academy? Yeah, right now, our one in McKinney can only handle six students per semester. We're building a building, then that's great to change. Yeah, but the funny thing is the one in McKinney. So that's the 2025 thing, I guess.

Uh, 2020. Okay, 2020, we started the one in McKinney, 2020, I think. 2025 is when we started building a building. Um, we started Huggs Training Academy in Dallas in 2020, I believe it is. What are you building? We're building a world headquarters. That's,

Polarious. What is a world headquarters for? What do you need a world headquarters for a cafe? Oh, my God. Well, tell us. Okay. So we have, okay, now we've got Huggs Training Academy in McKinney, six students, Hugs Training Academy in Dallas. How many students are? We can have up to eight there. Okay. When we open Hugs Training Academy in our new building, we will be able to train up to 30, students per semester in this building. We will move our

restaurant into the building that we will own outright. We're now paying rent. We will own it. So the cafe will be there. Still in McKinney? Still in McKinney. Cafe will be there.

Training Academy will be there in a different. We'll have a training kitchen. And we can do 12 in the kitchen. We can do 12 in the kitchen. can do three classrooms with 12 in each one, and they'll move back and forth between the classrooms. And we'll have our corporate offices in this building. It's a 13,000 square foot building. Good grief. Yeah. And a restaurant. And it'll have a restaurant. That sounds expensive.

$10 million. Where's the $10 million coming from? Oh, it's coming from individuals, corporations, grants, foundations. That's a hell of a long way from $8 grand from a bake sale. Isn't it, though? But we right now have 650,000 left to raise of that $10 million, and we'll have it. We've got to have it by March 1st. And we opened a cafe in Dallas. How many people with disabilities are now being served by this dream?

Yeah, we have a total of 107 employees. 91 of them are mission-based employees. 170. 70%. More than, yeah. 107, 91. 90%? 91, yes, our mission-based employees.

Yeah. How busy is the... So when I was reading about you, I got online. Okay. And I just Googled Hugs Cafe McKinney. Okay. So I don't even know what your website is, which you'll tell us later. It's www.

It's not something. But I just Googled it. Yeah. You came right up. I hit website. And the first thing I went to, because I'm a fat. This is the menu. Yes.

Yeah. The sandwiches look great. I mean, the food looks really, really good. I actually wondered what the soup of the day was. Yes. I said soup of the day. And I'm like, I wonder what the soup of the day is today. and I was hoping it was something like corn chowder or potato soup because I love those.

Okay, well. Or maybe gumbo. And, you know, it had, it looks like you're open for breakfast and late lunch up until like three. Yes. So it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a breakfast lunch type place. The food looked fantastic. You had pictures of your employees up there. I assume someone employees, I think they were all employees.

I assume some had disabilities and some did not. I don't know. There was a video of a dude very meticulously chopping an onion, which kind of went to my head was, you know, so many people would not even let this guy dirt near a knife thinking he cut his fingers off, but your idea is, no. Let's teach him how to do this. Yes.

Let's raise the expectations. And so as I'm looking at this whole thing. He built one thing. What's that? Haiti, Beth, Peach, Gobbler. Did you see this? Oh, you've just looked at it up. Yeah, yeah.

You got me curious. So there, there you go. Alex, Alex looked up. Turkey, bacon, cheddar cheese, and house-made peach chutney. I know. That sounds good. So as I'm looking at all this, what came to my mind was my roots. I'm a business owner.

Yeah. Profits are a necessary measure of any organization's success. and I'm just in dying to know, how many people eat here daily? Is it profitable as a standalone business? How do you drive traffic? I'd love to know the business side of just the cafe, not the rest of the stuff, but just the cafe. Sure. We are a 501C3 organization.

Right. We do need donations to keep us sustainable. That being said, I can guarantee you, 2026, we will be sustainable without donations. But you can be a nonprofit and still make a profit as long as you put that profit back into the nonprofit. Yes. So you can make money. Yes.

We have not made money in the sense of making a profit today. On just the restaurant. Just the restaurant. That being said, with all of our other entities, mentoring other organizations across the country. We have affiliates and I'm sure we're going to talk about that. That adds to our revenue. But the cafe, we know will be sustainable this year.

On its own. Did you hear cafes they have one in Dallas too? Yeah, we're getting there. So in 2026, the cafe itself will pay its own. employees handle its operational cost and turn a profit. Yes. Yes. It's a win-win.

You're helping people who otherwise would have almost nothing to do in their lives. Yes. And under the guise of raising the bar, these folks are actually going to be not only doing jobs, but running a profitable business. Yes. That's astounding. That's pretty incredible because I've talked to a lot of people who've done a lot of things and they do things to raise revenue but it's very rare that those things actually can stand on their own.

Right. And so many restaurants in order to raise revenue, they'll cut employees. You're not doing that. No. That's your whole point for existing. That's why we're there. You're right. We'll be right back.

Segregation and the day, integration at night. When segregation was the law, one mysterious black club owner had his own rules. We didn't worry about what went on outside. It was like stepping on another world. Inside Charlie's place, black and white people danced together. But not everyone was happy about it. You saw the KKK? Yeah, they were dressed up in their uniform.

The KKK set out to raid Charlie, take him away from here. Charlie was an example of power. They had to crush him. From Atlas Obscura, Rococo Punch, and visit Myrtle Beach, comes Charlie's place. A story that was nearly lost to time. Until now. Listen to Charlie's Place on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. The more you listen to your kids, the story.

kids, the closer you'll be. So we asked kids, what do you want your parents to hear? I feel sometimes that I'm not listened to. I would just want you to listen to me more often and evaluate situations with me and lead me towards success. Listening is a form of love. Find resources to help you support your kids and their emotional well-being at soundedouttogether.org. That's sounded outtogether.org. Brought to you by the Ad Council and Pivotal.

And the winner of the IHeart Podcast Award is, You can decide who takes home the 26 IHard Podcast Awards Podcast of the year by voting at IHeartPodcastawards.com now through February 22nd. See all the nominees and place your vote at IHeart Podcast Awards.com. Audible is a proud sponsor of the Audible Audio Pioneer Award. Explore the best selection of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals all in one easy app. Audible. There's more to imagine when you listen.

Sign up for a free trial at audible.com. You know Roaldahl, the writer who thought up Willie Wonka, Matilda, and the BFG. But did you know he was also a spy? Was this before he wrote his stories? It must have been. Our new podcast series, The Secret World of Roll Doll, is a wild journey through the hidden chapters of his extraordinary, controversial life. His job was literally to seduce the wives of powerful Americans. What?

And he was really good at it. You probably won't believe it either. Okay, I don't think that's true. I'm telling you. I was a spy. Did you know Dahl got cozy with the Roosevelt's? Played poker with Harry Truman and had a long affair with a congresswoman. And then he took his talents to Hollywood,

where he worked alongside Walt Disney and Alfred Hitchcock before writing a hit James Bond film. How did this secret agent wind up as the most successful children's author ever? And what darkness from his covert past seeped into the stories we read as kids. The true story is stranger than anything he ever wrote. Listen to the secret world of Roll Dahl. on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Okay, so Cafe, originally Cafe was singular now, cafes is plural. So where else? Okay, we just opened in December of 2025 Hugs Cafe in Dallas. How many people work there? I'm so excited. There's 23 that work there. Where? Where in else?

Yes, there is an organization called the Meadows. Foundation and they're very, very supportive of lots of nonprofits in the Dallas area. In fact, they have this huge campus. I don't know how large it is, but they have offices and buildings. They're old homes that have been restored on their campus, and that's the office for these different nonprofits. One is treasured vessels, which is helps women who have been, trafficked. There, all sorts of things. They came to us, they have given us several grants.

They came to us and said, we have a building, an empty building on our campus. We would love to have a Hugs Cafe there. We need this in Dallas. And we're paying nothing for rent for 10 years. and we open up and get going and now people on the campus have a place to go to lunch. Absolutely. It's gorgeous. And I know you know about Cafe Momentum.

They're going to be building right across the street from us. Yeah, it's interesting. It's interesting that Chad and Cafe Momentum, for those of you listening who haven't watched that episode, just go back to Chad Hauser, Cafe Momentum, who also has a restaurant. He is a classically trained chef. Yes, he is. And his place is staffed by justice-involved youth. Yeah, juvenile offenders.

Juvenile offenders who have found their way out of difficult circumstances through a love of the culinary work. And Chad's restaurant is amazing too. And now he's going to be operating near you. Yes. That is phenomenal. On the same campus. Yes. Actually, cool update.

given we've not updated listeners on it. He's now in Atlanta, Denver, Pittsburgh. He's all over the place. He is. And it's so sweet. He was at our grand opening of the Dallas location and gave me a big hug. I said, you know, we just have different populations. We do the same thing, just different populations.

And he said, Ruth, you wouldn't believe how similar our populations are. Oh, that's interesting. Yes. Because of, yeah, that's interesting. Because they get in trouble. Maybe there's a reason some of them get in trouble, but they've never been diagnosed. So now we're Hugs McKinney, Hugs Dallas, Hugs Greenhouse, Hugs Training Facility, and Hugs, like, home cooking. Does I say that right?

Yes. And then you said something about, what's that? And now Hugs World Headquarters. Where the Hugs McKinney will be located. Yes. But you also said something about a phillardquarters. Yes. It almost sounds like Chick-fil-Ais franchising over here. Tell me what is an affiliate and tell me what they are and where they are and what's developed there, because that's incredible.

Yeah, I can't tell you the number of people that have found out about us across the country that have called me over the years. Can I visit with you? Can you tell me how to do this? How did you do it? And I would spend hours on the phone. People would come and visit. I'd let them, you know, stay in, work in the cafe. And we decided, you know, we can help more people. We can't be everywhere. We would love to be everywhere.

We can't be everywhere. But we can help others. I mean, I was getting questions from, how do you put together a board of directors? How do you file for a 501c3? How do you decide what you're going to sell or produce? Every single question that there is. So what we're doing now is we're licensing our, we wrote our own curriculum,

we're licensing our curriculum, we're also licensing how we did everything. And this is another revenue stream for us. We have affiliates now. We have Lily Pad in Ridgland, Mississippi. We have... Lily Pad in Ridgeline. Yes. And I know of...

So Jackson, Mississippi, folks, you go there. Yes, yes. Gosh, I can't remember the names of all of them. There's one in Arkansas. They have not opened yet. I think they're in Fayetteville. They haven't opened yet. They wanted a hugs there.

But now it's a... husband and wife. Pathway Cafe Cafe. That's it. And Springdale. That may be, yes. Fayetteville, Springville. Yeah.

Okay. Northwest Arkansas, same thing. Neat couple. Then we've got Illinois. For people just listening, Bill's now going in for a second. I don't need the rest of it while you're, while you're, shut up. Go ahead. You keep talking.

Not you shut up. Alex, shut up. You talk. I'm listening while. I'm eating my cake. Okay. I'll talk since you have cookie in your mouth. We have kiss.

Chet, K-E-S-H-E-T in Chicago. They have been around, they're an organization that's been around for years and years and years. They have a kitchen, but they never used it or a restaurant kind of space. And they came to us and said, how do we do this? So we're mentoring them. We have a gentleman in Colorado who uses that F-word.

franchise. And we're still trying to figure out, you know, how do you govern? I mean, Chad and I are going to have a long talk about this. But how do you govern a nonprofit that's in another state? And, I mean, this gentleman came to us and he said, I've got the money. I don't want to run it. But, well, okay. So we're working on that.

You were supposed to be retired 10 years ago. Yeah, I know. It's incredible. Looks like Tallahassee. Oh, yes, yes. And then what's the super duper cookie in Dallas? Okay, super duper cookie company. It's right off of the SMU University, SMU campus, and that is a gentleman who wanted to do, make these cookies and hire our

population. But he didn't know how to work with them. They're an incredible family. They opened this super duper cookie company and ran it for a few months. And now they've come to us and said, can you run this for us? And so that's what we're doing with them. Wait, one more. My possibilities is on your, who's been on the podcast. Yes. Germain was here. Oh, Charmaine was here. Wonderful. They had this beautiful campus. I've known Charmaine forever and a day. In fact, my possibilities before they had their big, beautiful building, used to bring students to take cooking classes from me.

That makes sense. Yes. Everybody needs to go to that episode, too, if you want some perspective on that. It's crazy how some of these things are intersecting. I didn't really know that before I mentioned. Why not work together? A lot of nonprofits, just look at other nonprofits as competition. Especially for funding.

Yes. But why not work together? Especially when it comes to grants, because you're asked, who do you collaborate with? Well, my possibilities has this beautiful kitchen, and they were doing nothing with it. They came to us and said, you know culinary. We don't. We don't even know how to hire for culinary. We're now running there.

It's called Hugs Cafe at My Possibilities. That's unbelievable. I know. And we're training their people. It's a college campus for people who haven't heard. Yes. Yes. So, yeah, the curriculum at My Possibilities is insane.

They've got like many different classes. I remember going down the curriculum, actually, on the podcast and just reading some of them. was flabbergasted at what my possibility. They have a fabulous program. So the culinary thing is no hugs at my possibilities. Yeah. Why wouldn't it be? So over the next five years, your plans are to serve more than 650 individuals,

establish 25 nonprofit mentorships, create 10 curriculum licensing partnership, and open three new hugs cafes. Yeah. Where? I can tell you. You're not going to tell me? Why not? Well, actually, I do.

think we'll be in Colorado. Probably Colorado Springs. That's phenomenal. We will probably be somewhere in northwest Florida. Got it. And we're working on another one. That's phenomenal. I know.

Do you pinch yourself a little? I do. I do. I will tell you, I'm, and I don't mind saying it to the world. I'm 71 years old. No, I'm 72. Crap. I was a little more energetic when I was younger.

We have a CEO. Her name is Lauren Smith, and I can't say enough about her. Do you feel like you're letting your baby go? No. I feel like I'm now able to walk side by side with her. And because she has the energy, she has the quick thinking.

She has all that we need. I told her one day, you remind me so much of myself when I was in my late 30s. You know, I've been sitting across from me for an hour and 43 minutes so far. And it's not like you ain't spraw. You're doing all right. I hope it's 72. I'm rocking like you are. Thank you.

Yeah, big smile and you are quick thinking and all of that. But I get it. You have to plan for succession. You do have to plan for succession. And she's got it. And she leads this organization. She has been the one. So five years from now.

Yeah. Maybe you actually do take your. overdue retirement that you were supposed to take a decade ago? Maybe not. Maybe you've at least just worked four hours a day. But at whatever point you are sitting in your recliner in your great room with Chris, five years from now, what will success look like to you for this enterprise that was a dream only 10 years ago? What do you want from it?

What is your dream now for it? I want to be making a change in lives across this country. Well, actually, I've already reached across the world. I helped a young man in Kazakhstan. Are you kidding? No. His name is Malin, M-A-U-L-I-N, and I just reached out to him again. I haven't heard from him for a while, but he now has three,

and I forget what they're called. but he started, he heard about us through Upworthy, did a story on us. He heard about us, and this is like the year after we're open, and he wanted to do something in his university campus, same thing. And we spent hours upon hours on the phone, probably in the middle of the night, night because it's a different type of the other side of the world. It's literally 11 hours away. Yeah. And he started something on his university campus. One thing he did is he called me one time and we were talking. He said, do you pay them? And I said, absolutely. Their jobs. Yes. We pay them.

And we're very proud of the fact that we don't just pay them minimum wage. We pay them high because many states you can pay them sub-minimum wage. Most states, you can pay people's disability. And the intention there is to have something for them to do and to be employed. But if you take a page from your book, you would argue that you're patronizing them and you're only asking them to roll silverware. You would say from what I've met you now is that pay them above minimum wage and expect more from them and watch them grow. Yes.

Yes. So I told him, I said, will you not pay them? And his reply was, you have to understand in our country, a person with a disability has fewer rights than a criminal. They have the right to work. They do not have the right to get paid to work, which is a thing. Anyway, I also helped a young woman in Egypt open something. No kidding. And there was someone in Ireland that I have helped.

So in five years? Five years, there should be somewhere in every state in these United States that's employing people with disabilities and giving the meaningful employment, not rolling silverware. And I'll rest easy and learn to knit. I get that you what you did in Colorado and I get the, I get the grocery store experience that kind of led to all of this. But is there something in your, you mentioned earlier,

you didn't have anybody in your family that has intellectual disabilities? where does this sense of service come from for you? You know, that's interesting. My mother was a nurse. I think I told you I grew up on a farm in south central Georgia. She was a nurse. Daddy was a farmer. And she was always giving back.

But it was a small town and everyone was always helping each other. I think I just have that instinct. I just think it's there, that that's what we're supposed to be here to do is help others. That's where my passion is. We'll be right back. Segregation and today integration at night. When segregation was the law, one mysterious black club owner had his own rules. We didn't worry about what went on outside.

It was like stepping on another world. Inside Charlie's place, black and white people danced together. But not everyone was happy about it. You saw the KKK? Yeah, they were dressed up in their uniform. The KKK set out to raid Charlie, take him away from here. Charlie was an example of power. They had to crush him.

From Atlas Obscura, Rococo Punch, and visit Myrtle Beach, comes Charlie's Place, a story that was nearly lost to time. Until now, listen to Charlie's Place on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. The more you listen to your kids, the closer you'll be.

So we asked kids, what do you want your parents to hear? I feel sometimes that I'm not listened to. I would just want you to listen to me more often and evaluate situations with me and lead me towards success. Listening is a full of, form of love. Find resources to help you support your kids and their emotional well-being at

Soundedouttogether.org. That's sounded outtogether.org. Brought to you by the Ad Council and Pivotal. And the winner of the IHeart Podcast Award is you can decide who takes home the 26 IHard Podcast Awards Podcast of the year by voting at IHeartPodcastawards.com now through February 22nd. See all the nominees and place your vote at IHeart Podcast Awards.com. Audible is a proud sponsor of the Audible Audio Pioneer Award. Explore the best selection of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals all in one easy app. Audible. There's more to imagine when you listen.

Sign up for a free trial at audible.com. You know Roldall, the writer who thought up Willie Wonka, Matilda, and the BFG. But did you know he was also a spy? Was this before he wrote his stories? It must have been. Our new podcast series, The Secret World of Roldall, is a wild journey through the hidden chapters of his extraordinary, controversial life. His job was literally to seduce the wives of powerful Americans.

What? And he was really good at it. You probably won't believe it either. Okay, I don't think that's true. I'm telling you. The guy was a spy. Did you know Dahl got cozy with the Roosevelt's? Played poker with Harry Truman and had a long affair with a congresswoman.

And then he took his talents to Hollywood, where he worked alongside Walt Disney and Alfred Hitchcock, before writing a hit James Bond film. How did this secret agent wind up as the most successful children's author ever, and what darkness from his covert past seeped into the stories we read as kids. The true story is stranger than anything he ever wrote. Listen to the secret world of Roll Dahl on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You've always been clear that the work did not begin with expertise. You didn't know anything about it, which we talked about earlier. But you don't have a background in restaurants. You didn't have really a plan.

But there's a quote here that Alex provided that I love, and I want you to talk about it. People assume someone else is going to do it. Something we say all the time is, you know, when you see all the abject despair and loss, and you think, boy, somebody ought to do something about that one day, we ask who that was somebody. What's wrong with you? And you say, people assume someone else is going to do it. When everyone assumes someone else will handle it, nothing gets handled. You don't have to open a cafe.

You don't have to start a nonprofit. You can look at what's in front of you. You can decide not to ignore it. People wait until they feel ready. Responsibility doesn't wait for permission. Are you willing to step in even if you don't know how this ends? When we stop expecting people to contribute, we shouldn't be surprised when communities are fractured. If you expect nothing, you'll get nothing.

When you expect someone to show up to contribute to matter, something changes. That is dead right, in my opinion. And you and all sing off the same sheet of music. The way we sing the song may sound a little different, but it's the same thing. To me, it sounds like you feel a responsibility because you see a need. can you just kind of speak to that at the end of our conversation here so that our listeners maybe can grab some of your passion and your conviction and now after 10 years some of your wisdom it took me years to find what my passion was and i was uh for many many many years i was always

saying god what am i here for i've got my wonderful family beautiful children, wonderful husband, but why am I here? And just being around people with disabilities, the last job I had in Colorado, I knew that was it. And somebody had to do something. And then when we moved to Texas and there were so few opportunities, There are many ways that people can help others. And, you know, there's the homeless.

There are food insecurities. And so many people are seeing that, which is wonderful. But sometimes you've got to step out of that box and see what other needs there are. and when I saw this need and God said you've got to do it, nobody else is going to do it unless that one person does. And I just knew and felt that in my gut and my heart. One person.

It's impossible not to hear your story and admire it. Thank you. It's impossible not to meet you and admire you and be taken with the fact that you're 72. You carry 72 extraordinarily well. Thank you. I don't know who wrote this. Maybe it was Alex, but it is so true that admiration can be a way of opting out. In other words, so many people have told me that, you know, the work I've done in inner city

football and whatever's inspiring and blah, blah, blah, blah, as if those words, as if admiration or accepting inspiration is enough. And by just saying something nice, they opt out of the work. And that may sound a little tough to some people, but I do feel that way. When I read that, I thought that's interesting. Who wrote that? Did you write that? Honest answer?

ChatGBT, GBT did. Who? Chat GPD did. Chat GPD. T. wrote that. Yeah. And I mean, another extension of your line, too, we feel like it erases our own responsibility. That's what I mean. Yeah. Is, and so while I appreciate the kind of comments and stuff, it is tempting to hear a story

like yours and admire it and maybe write you a $100 check and assume that that means you're part of the process of doing something good because you say, wow, that's nice. Yeah. But nothing replaces action. And this whole show, if anything, is a call to action to normal people by highlighting stories like yours and hopefully inspiring people to not just be inspired, but to act, to not think because they listen to this show that it allows them to opt out of, the actual work.

Yeah. Do you have a call to action for those that are hearing you today? How would you inspire people to get off the sidelines? Just get off your butt and do it. And I make it sound so easy. No, it wasn't easy. Have there been times over these years that you would find me in the corner in a fetal position? Absolutely.

But, you know, you've just, especially those of faith, trust, trust, and get up and do it. You've told me you felt people all over the world and you keep doing stuff and you've got the new, younger version of you come along that you're mentoring and training. I know there's a website because I looked at it, but what's it called? hugs cafe.org or G-U-G. H-U-G-S-Cafe.org. Yes, and hugs is hope, understanding, grace, and success. Hope, understanding, grace, and success. Cool acronym.

Do people give hugs to? Oh, we have mission-based staff that chase you down the street if you walk out the door without a hug. Oh, my gosh. If somebody wants to get in touch with you, and wants to be one of these new locations or work with you or support you or hear more, how do they get in touch with you? The website, which is hugscafe.org.

Can they find you there? There is a info at hugscafe.org, actually, if they want to send an email, that goes to someone and if they want to talk to me, they will let me know. Ruth Thompson, everybody. the founder of Hugs Cafe in McKinney, Texas, who clearly is willing to talk to folks and help them out. So that's how you get to them. Ruth, close us out with, you've told us about, who's the speaker?

Danny. You told me, it told us about Daniel. Yes. And you've told us about in the kitchen. Tamika. Yes. Give us one of the stories that when you're laying in bed and your head's pounding, you've had enough still makes you smile.

I've got a great one. Her name is Kathy. Kathy has cerebral palsy. Kathy started with us, and what could Kathy do? Kathy has the constricted muscles in her hands, a little problem with her gait at the time that she started with us. All of our sandwiches are toasted. She would man the toaster.

And her job, some of our jobs, Some of our jobs, we carved the jobs to meet a person's abilities rather than expecting Kathy to toast the bread, make the sandwich, put the sides on. Tamika can do that. Kathy's job was to toast the bread. She coined herself the bread queen. And when we first started training, I got a stool for Kathy to. sit on. And Kathy looked at me and she said, nobody else in here has a stool. I'm not going to have a stool.

And she worked. She no longer works for us. She's now moving to Tennessee, I believe, to be near her brother. But she said, nobody else has a stool. I'm like everybody else. I'm going to do my job standing here. Kathy and Tamika and Danny make me smile and cry at the same time. That's phenomenal. You know, there's one other thing I want to say that I'm going to ask you to speak to a little bit is people with intellectual disabilities are a blessing and a joy. Ben, my brother-in-law has taught me that. Yeah. It's also taught me there are a lot of work.

I have to believe that not only is this therapeutic and amazing for the confidence and abilities of people with disabilities that can find a purpose and work for you and make an income and be proud and learn and all of that, but oh my gosh, it must be heaven sent for their families. Have you gotten that, have you had those type of conversation with family members? Most definitely. Tell me what that looks like. We have a mother who came to me three years in. Her son had been working for us and sobbing, absolutely sobbing. And she said, Ruth, I never thought there was ever going to. to be anything for him.

His name is Marcus. I always wondered what's going to happen to Marcus. And she said, now, maybe we can think about getting Marcus an apartment. She said, there's, he has a purpose. He gets up. His dad makes his lunch the night before to take to work. Marcus, with his dad, makes his lunch at night to take to work. He has a purpose.

Not only does Marcus has hope his parents do. Exactly. We have Jerry, who is this big teddy bear with Down syndrome. And Jerry, you can't always understand what he says, but his mother, he's been with us from the beginning. His mother, Sherry, said, whenever he's, they go anywhere, Jerry will tell people he has a job. And that just changes her life. Ruth Thompson, everybody, founder of Hugs Cafe in McKenzie, Texas, and now World Headquarters and all of the other things you heard about. An extraordinary woman with an extraordinary

story, doing extraordinary work and changing lives of not only the people that she has of disabilities with those in her family, and I assure you the volunteers who interact with her population. Ruth, I can't tell you how much I appreciate you coming to Memphis and sharing your story. You are an inspiration, and it's an honor to meet you. It's a pleasure to meet you, and now I'm teary night. Thank you. I don't know how you could listen to this and I'd tear up a little bit, Ruth.

Amazing story. Not bad for 72. You can come back when you're 140. Thank you. Thank you. Bye-bye. Can you order them cookies online? Yes, you can. Oh, heck yes. You hear that listener? You get those cookies online. I guess we're not signed off yet. Do you go to the website? Go to the website. You can order cookies online. Well, let me just tell you, the wedding cake cookies are worth ordering. I'm taking my backs home to Lisa. She's going to eat one. I know she's going to love it. Awesome. All right. Thanks for being here. Thank you. Thank you so much.

And thank you for joining us this week. If Ruth Thompson has inspired you in general or, better yet, take action by visiting Hugs Cafe, donating to them, rallying an army of normal folks to start something like it in your community, or something else that is entirely different but you feel convicted about, let me know. I really want to hear about it. You can write me anytime at Bill. at normalfolks. Us, and I will respond. If you enjoyed this episode, as Alex likes to say, share with friends and on social,

subscribe to the podcast, rate the podcast, review the podcast, join the army at normalfokes. And join the 10 Level Challenge and get a T-shirt at 10-levelchallenge.org. Do this stuff, any and all of these things that will help us grow an army of normal folks, because the more of you working, the more impact we're going to have. So get involved. I'm Bill Courtney. Until next time, do what you can. When segregation was a law, one mysterious black club owner, Charlie Fitzgerald, had his own rules.

Segregation and the day integration at night. It was like stepping on another world. Was he a businessman, a criminal, a hero? Charlie was an example of power. They had to crush you Charlie's Place From Atlas Obscura and visit Myrtle Beach Listen to Charlie's Place on the Iheart radio app

Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts You know Roll Doll He thought up Willie Wonka and the BFG But did you know he was a spy? In the new podcast, the secret world of Roll Doll I'll tell you that story And much, much more What?

You probably won't believe it either Was this before he wrote his stories? It must have been. Okay, I don't go. I think that's true. I'm telling you. I was a spy. Listen to the secret world of Roll Dahl

on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The more you listen to your kids, the closer you'll be. So we asked kids, what do you want your parents to hear? I feel sometimes that I'm not listened to. I would just want you to listen to me more often

and evaluate situations with me and lead me towards success. Listening is a form of love. Find resources to help you support your kids and their emotional well-being at soundedouttogether.org. That's sounded outtogether.org. Brought to you by the Ad Council and Pivotal. Saturday, May 2nd, country's biggest stars will be in Austin, Texas. At our 26, I-Hart Country Festival presented by Capital One.

Tickets are on sale now. Get yours before they sell out at Ticketmaster.com. That's Ticketmaster.com. This is an I-Hart podcast. Guaranteed human